Top 10 PFs in current NBA

[Kiddlovesnets]

Following this thread: Top 10 SFs in current NBA (http://www.insidehoops.com/forum/showthread.php?t=101494)

1. Tim Duncan: Though TD is considered a Center according to some ISH posters, he's actually a PF and is still the best player in this spot despite being 33 years old. Duncan's stats might drop a little bit this season but I'd rank him over Garnett again this time.

Predicted Stats For Next Season: 18.9 ppg, 10.3 rpg, 3.2 apg


2. Kevin Garnett: One of the most skillful PFs in NBA history. KG dominated Gasol in NBA(even TD failed to own Gasol in WCF) to lift the Celtics to their 17th NBA title and he's been long considered one of the best defensive players in this league.

Predicted Stats For Next Season: 19.6 ppg, 9.8 rpg, 4.7 apg

3. Dirk Nowitzki: Dirk is probably one of the best Big man shooter in current NBA, but he's regarded by many ISH fans as a soft player. However, Dirk's still the second Best international player in the league and the scoring leader of Dallas Mavericks team.

Predicted Stats For Next Season: 25.0 ppg, 9.5 rpg, 3.1 apg

4. Pau Gasol: Gasol is regarded as even a much softer player than Nowitzki and the reason why the Lakers lost in the final. Nonetheless, Gasol has proved how good he is during international B-ball tournament and no doubt he deserves the No.4 spot on this list.

Predicted Stats For Next Season: 18.3 ppg, 7.6 rpg, 4.0 apg

5. Amare Stoudemaire: Amare is actually a PF who was forced to play Center at some point of his young career. At 26 year old, Amare might be able to improve himself during the next two years to truly become a dominating PF. Defense, however, is what he needs to work on next.

Predicted Stats For Next Season: 26.2 ppg, 8.7 rpg, 1.4 apg

6. Elton Brand: I'd rank Brand to a higher position if he hadn't been injured last season, but he's still one of the best PFs in current NBA. As an undersized PF, Brand shows us how excellent his skill is and how to own taller and tougher opponent. Let's wait and see how good the 76ers can be with Brand.

Predicted Stats For Next Season: 21.5 ppg, 9.6 rpg, 2.0 apg

7. Chris Bosh: Bosh is the best inside scorer in Team USA and don't forget he's still young and hasn't reached his full potential yet. Bosh has developed accurate mid-range shot skills and toughened his defense in recent years. Bosh is the one who will decide how far the Raptors will go this season.

Predicted Stats For Next Season: 20.7 ppg, 9.9 rpg, 2.3 apg

8. Carlos Boozer: Boozer's defense is just as terrible as Stoudemaire and he's even shorter and unable to play C therefore. Nevertheless, Boozer is a fairly efficient scorer and lead the Jazz in scoring for the recent two years. Let's wait and see how good he'd be this season with Deron.

Predicted Stats For Next Season: 24.4 ppg, 11.2 rpg, 2.8 apg

9. Al Jefferson: AJ is probably one of the most underrated PFs in current league. He's proved that he's an elite Top 10 PF in this league by his outstanding performance in the Celtics w/o Paul Pierce and this young Timberwolves. Too bad most people can't see it.

Predicted Stats For Next Season: 22.5 ppg, 13.1 rpg, 0.9 apg

10. Antawn Jamison: Though shooting at a relatively low FG% for a PF, Jamison is still considered a top 10 PF in this league. He's capable of grabbing offensive boards and shoot accurate three pointers sometimes. He's one of the key player to lead the Arenas-less Wizards to play-off.

Predicted Stats For Next Season: 20.2 ppg, 10.3 rpg, 1.6 apg

Other Candidates: Rasheed Wallace, Kenyon Martin, David West, Emeka Okafor and Zach Randolph.

[Kiddlovesnets]

One thing I might forget to mention is that JO/Camby/Horford are considered as Centers so they won't appear in this list. The same goes for players like Josh Smith/Lamar Odom who are regarded as SFs.
:hammerhead:

Al Jefferson is a center isn't he? Or at least he's regarded as one.

[oldenpolynice]

I think Bosh and Stoudemire will do better than what you have them ranked. Pau will be good throughout the season. But I think Bosh, with JO in the lineup, will be better. Particularly on defense and on the boards.

[Darius07]

Duncan
Garnett
Amare
Dirk
Bosh
Brand
Boozer
Gasol
Rasheed
Jefferson

[Grinder]

Horrible list, Pau before Amare and Bosh, Boozer averaging 24/11? :roll:

[Rockets(T-mac)]

Duncan
Garnett
Amare
Dirk
Bosh
Brand
Boozer
Gasol
Rasheed
Jefferson
That looks about right. Bosh/Brand/ Boozer are inter-changeable, I might put Jefferson over Rasheed. Other than that good list.

[iggy>]

gasol is not better than brand.

[highwhey]

You got un-banned? :rant

[Godfather]

This is not as terrible as your SF list, but it is still sub par. Gasol is not the 4th best PF in the NBA and Tim Duncan in currently listed as a center.

http://sports.espn.go.com/nba/players/profile?playerId=215


You got un-banned? :rant

Apparently stupidity does not warrant a perma-ban.

[Kiddlovesnets]

You got un-banned? :rant

You're still not banned yet??
:wtf:

[Godfather]

Also how can Tim Duncan still be better than KG when KG has the ring and the DPOY award from last season?

[highwhey]

You're still not banned yet??
:wtf:
You should be banned for this list alone....


5. Amare Stoudemaire: Amare is actually a PF who was forced to play Center at some point of his young career. At 26 year old, Amare might be able to improve himself during the next two years to truly become a dominating PF. Defense, however, is what he needs to work on next.

Predicted Stats For Next Season: 26.2 ppg, 8.7 rpg, 1.4 apg

You serious?


:roll: :roll: :roll:

[Kiddlovesnets]

You serious?


:roll: :roll: :roll:

Amare has been averaging 25+ ppg after Shaq joined the Suns...

[highwhey]

Amare has been averaging 25+ ppg after Shaq joined the Suns...
and so his RPG and BPG will decrease?

[Godfather]

You should be banned for this list alone....


You serious?


:roll: :roll: :roll:

Lol that's the one stat line he might be right on...

[Kiddlovesnets]

and so his RPG and BPG will decrease?

Shaq will undoubtedly steal some of his rebounds so his rpg will decrease for sure. I'm not sure whether his bpg will decrease as well but impossible is nothing.

[highwhey]

Shaq will undoubtedly steal some of his rebounds so his rpg will decrease for sure. I'm not sure whether his bpg will decrease as well but impossible is nothing.
he averaged like 8 rpg since shaq came, but you have to consider his improvement...you never know, his bpg and apg might increase, when one window is closed, another one is opened.

[pete's montreux]

[1] Garnett
[2] Duncan
[3] Nowitzki
[4] Stoudemire
[5] Bosh
[6] Gasol
[7] Brand
[8] Boozer
[9] Jefferson
[10] Wallace
[11] West
[12] Jamison
[13] Okafor
[14] Randolph
[15] O'Neal

[stewen12]

Amare should be 3. Bosh 4. Duncan 5. Hes older now and not as productive. Also David West is in the Top 10

[plowking]

If you are going off greatness then Duncan is number 1 for sure. But I really don't think he's the best PF in the league anymore.

Furthermore, your list sucks. Just like all your other ones have.

1. Garnett
2. Duncan
3. Nowitzki
4. Stoudemire
5. Bosh
6. Brand
7. Gasol
8. West
9. Boozer
10. R.Wallace

I don't consider Al Jefferson a PF.

[Anti404]

Tim Duncan
KG
STAT
Chris Bosh
Dirk
Elton Brand(if he fully recovers from his injury he's above Dirk and maybe Bosh)
Pau Gasol
Carlos Boozer
David West
Rasheed Wallace/Emeka Okafor

[out|hoops|side]

For all of those who have Bosh 4th, are you basing this on his actual NBA performance last season, or on his Olympic performance this summer? I'm not saying it's wrong exactly, but it doesn't feel exactly right to me.
I am a Raptors' fan, but I didn't think Bosh was the 4th best PF based on NBA production of last year. I could see if this were supposed to be based on Olympic performance.

Yeah, I would say it could be Dirk or Boozer could beat Bosh out; however, which ever one ended up at the 4th spot I would then put Bosh 5th, which doesn't make a whole lot of sense but oh well.

[miles berg]

Duncan, Dirk, & KG are way above the rest of the list.

Amare is the closest to joining that list and then, if healthy, Elton Brand.

After that they are all way below those five guys, basically whoever has the best season. Boozer, Gasol, Bosh, etc...all of those guys are the 6-10 guys.

[Anti404]

For all of those who have Bosh 4th, are you basing this on his actual NBA performance last season, or on his Olympic performance this summer? I'm not saying it's wrong exactly, but it doesn't feel exactly right to me.
I am a Raptors' fan, but I didn't think Bosh was the 4th best PF based on NBA production of last year. I could see if this were supposed to be based on Olympic performance.
I'm basing it mostly on his performance in the season as well as including some of the potential he showed in his Olympic performances.
As a result of him playing quite a bit of Center last year, I think his defense/blocks/rebounds are a bit lower than they would be if he played nearly all minutes at PF. With O'Neal slotted in as the primary Center, I think Bosh's FG%/RPG/BPG will all go up, and he may even increase in PPG.
Dirk may be going downhill(though very slightly) and isn't as good on defense as Bosh. Brand is coming back from an injury. Boozer/Gasol just aren't as good, and West, though good and possibly getting better, has a much better supporting cast.

Dirk is no longer above Amare. What does he do better? Defending PFs, they're on the same level, rebounding is the same, Amare shoots a much better % and has added a decent jumper to his athletic off the dribble game.I guess you could say that he creates more matchup problems, but he's still less effective, and Amare is a nightmare anyways.

[miles berg]

Dirk is a better passer, defender, slasher, & shooter than Amare. Really, Amare is a better finisher and thats it. Dirk is hardly going down hill, he was #1 in the NBA Playoffs in PER, put up 27/12/4. IMO he is the 2nd best PF in the NBA after Duncan and, while I see Amare being the #1 PF in the NBA very soon, he isnt quite there yet. But damn he is coming strong.

[20 Dimes A Game]

Sheeeeeeeeeeeeeeeed

[PacerRaptor]

One thing I might forget to mention is that JO/Camby/Horford are considered as Centers so they won't appear in this list. The same goes for players like Josh Smith/Lamar Odom who are regarded as SFs.
:hammerhead:
probably wouldnt be good to mention JO since he really hasnt made any noise the past 2 seasons

[AItheAnswer3]

You smokin?
Pau over Amare?

[Kiddlovesnets]

You smokin?
Pau over Amare?

Pau is severely underrated since most people regard him as the softest big men in this league. What I perceived last season, however, was that Duncan dominated Stoudemaire as he always did but he just couldn't manage to own Gasol in WCF...

[Number21]

KG dominated Gasol in NBA(even TD failed to own Gasol in WCF)

Duncan's stats in 2008 WCF (5 games): 22.4 ppg, 17.4 rpg, 4.8 apg, 2.0 bpg, 1.2 spg

Garnett's stats in 2008 Finals (6 games): 18.2 ppg, 13.0 rpg, 3.0 apg, 1.0 bpg, 1.6 spg

Gasol's stats in 2008 WCF: 13.2 ppg (44.6 FG%), 9.6 rpg, 3.6 apg, 1.6 bpg, 1.0 spg

Gasol's stats in 2008 Finals: 14.7 ppg (53.2 FG%), 10.2 rpg, 3.3 apg, 0.5 bpg, 0.5 spg

[danumber88]

Pau at 4 is insane over Boozer, Brand, Stoudamire and Bosh, wth has he got to prove?

[SayTownRy]

Amare should be 3. Bosh 4. Duncan 5. Hes older now and not as productive. Also David West is in the Top 10

amare and bosh over duncan :roll:

[The GM]

This list is based on everyone being healthy and going into next season:

1. KG
2. Dirk
3. Duncan
4. Amare
5. Bosh
6. Brand
7. Boozer
8. Jefferson
9. Gasol
10. West

[danumber88]

1. Tim
2. KG
3. Dirk

--

locks.

4 and 5. Boozer/Bosh/Amare/Brand

--

6. Pau

[CakeorDeath]

For me, it is really quite simple. There are four tiers of PFs in the league.

Tier 1 includes:

Timmy, Dirk, and KG

Tier 2 includes:

Boozer, Brand, Amare, and Bosh

Tier 3 includes:

West, Gasol, Jefferson, J.O., and Sheed

Tier 4 includes:

Everyone else.

[AItheAnswer3]

Pau is severely underrated since most people regard him as the softest big men in this league. What I perceived last season, however, was that Duncan dominated Stoudemaire as he always did but he just couldn't manage to own Gasol in WCF...

I dont consider Gasol soft, he's skilled and thats just his style of play. But rating him over Amare is absurd. Rating players on match-ups isnt everything. Overall, Amare kills Gasol. Pau's not a very good defender. Same can be said about Amare. On offense Amare>Pau.

[highwhey]

wow, another sudden case of overrating a player...since when is Dirk on the same level as KG and Duncan?


:roll:

[Kebab Stall]

For me, it is really quite simple. There are four tiers of PFs in the league.

Tier 1 includes:

Timmy, Dirk, and KG

Tier 2 includes:

Boozer, Brand, Amare, and Bosh

Tier 3 includes:

West, Gasol, Jefferson, J.O., and Sheed

Tier 4 includes:

Everyone else.
Move Dirk into tier 2 and move West into tier 3.5 and you're spot on. Though where O'Neal sits might be arguable.

[AItheAnswer3]

Move Dirk into tier 2 and move West into tier 3.5 and you're spot on. Though where O'Neal sits might be arguable.

Isnt O'Neal gonna play C for the Raps?

[highwhey]

Isnt O'Neal gonna play C for the Raps?
ya, he's 6'11

[Kebab Stall]

Isnt O'Neal gonna play C for the Raps?
Well, since Bosh is a PF then I'd guess so.

Pau at 4 is insane over Boozer, Brand, Stoudamire and Bosh, wth has he got to prove?

Just 4 months ago this same message board was calling Boozer a laughing stock because he was struggling badly against the Lakers.

Now it's insane to call Gasol better then Boozer? A player who arguably played better then Boozer in that 2nd round while playing out of his natural position.

I'll take Gasol every single day of the week over Boozer. The other players are better then Pau though.

[miles berg]

wow, another sudden case of overrating a player...since when is Dirk on the same level as KG and Duncan?


:roll:

He's been on the same level as KG for the last 7-8 years. Duncan was a level above both of those guys but the popular consensus is that he has fallen off a bit and joined those guys. I still think Duncan is above Dirk & KG.

But Dirk & KG are as close as you can get. Neither is better than the other no matter what the haters try to say. Neither are quite good enough to win a title by their self but are both great, great, top 30 players all time. And both are way above the rest of the PFs not named Amare (and obviously Duncan who is a clear #1 to me).

[AItheAnswer3]

He's been on the same level as KG for the last 7-8 years. Duncan was a level above both of those guys but the popular consensus is that he has fallen off a bit and joined those guys. I still think Duncan is above Dirk & KG.

But Dirk & KG are as close as you can get. Neither is better than the other no matter what the haters try to say. Neither are quite good enough to win a title by their self but are both great, great, top 30 players all time. And both are way above the rest of the PFs not named Amare (and obviously Duncan who is a clear #1 to me).

Dirk aint top 30 all time

[miles berg]

Sure he is, he has basically dominated what is about to be a decade of basketball. Not many players put up 25/11/3 for their playoff careers. Even fewer put up 8 straight 50 win seasons. Even fewer do that with a grand total of 4 all star appearances alongside him over those 8 years.

For some odd reason people like to underrate just exactly what Dirk has done over his career in Dallas. Since '02, only Tim Duncan and Shaq have won more games and only those two have won more playoff games. Its funny how people dont notice what this guy does and continually underrate him.

[AItheAnswer3]

Sure he is, he has basically dominated what is about to be a decade of basketball. Not many players put up 25/11/3 for their playoff careers. Even fewer put up 8 straight 50 win seasons. Even fewer do that with a grand total of 4 all star appearances alongside him over those 8 years.

For some odd reason people like to underrate just exactly what Dirk has done over his career in Dallas. Since '02, only Tim Duncan and Shaq have won more games and only those two have won more playoff games. Its funny how people dont notice what this guy does and continually underrate him.

Ewing
Shaq
Hakeem
Robinson
Wilt
Russell
Dr.J
Elgin Baylor
Jerry West
Jordan
Kobe
Robertson
Bird
Johnson
Jabbar
Malone
Malone
Barkley
Duncan
Isiah Thomas
John Stockton
John Havlicek
Pippen
Drexler
Gervin

I just came up with this list on top of my head..I know i've missed some obvious choices

[RAPSCANWIN]

This list is based on everyone being healthy and going into next season:

1. KG
2. Dirk
3. Duncan
4. Amare
5. Bosh
6. Brand
7. Boozer
8. Jefferson
9. Gasol
10. West


This is about right, id just reverse Amare and Dirk.

[Silverbullit]

Dirk, Duncan, KG
.
Amare
.
.
.
rest....

[highwhey]

Dirk and KG on the same level?


Seriously, no he isn't. Hell, the #3 spot is very debatable. It can go ether way, to Amare or Dirk.

[Silverbullit]

Dirk and KG on the same level?


Seriously, no he isn't. Hell, the #3 spot is very debatable. It can go ether way, to Amare or Dirk.

Yes, Dirk, KG and TD on the same level.

[danumber88]

[QUOTE=

[ruslan]

how the hell is amare not better than pau or dirk....

[highwhey]

Yes, Dirk, KG and TD on the same level.
.....


more ............


and 1 of these: :banghead:

[Kiddlovesnets]

how the hell is amare not better than pau or dirk....

How's the hell that Amare is better?
:confusedshrug:

[Koop1]

Duncan
Garnett
Amare
Dirk
Bosh
Brand
Boozer
Gasol
Rasheed
Jefferson

:applause:

[Pandaemonaeon]

1. Duncan
2. Dirk
3. KG
4. Amare
5. Brand
6. Bosh
7. Gasol
8. Boozer
9. Sheed
10. Jefferson

[Lord Leoshes]

Dirk is a better passer, defender, slasher, & shooter than Amare. Really, Amare is a better finisher and thats it. Dirk is hardly going down hill, he was #1 in the NBA Playoffs in PER, put up 27/12/4. IMO he is the 2nd best PF in the NBA after Duncan and, while I see Amare being the #1 PF in the NBA very soon, he isnt quite there yet. But damn he is coming strong.



Thats not saying much, cause they both suck on defense.

[Lord Leoshes]

wow, another sudden case of overrating a player...since when is Dirk on the same level as KG and Duncan?


:roll:



Agree. Dirk? No way. They must be :pimp: that good stuff.

[Lord Leoshes]

He's been on the same level as KG for the last 7-8 years. Duncan was a level above both of those guys but the popular consensus is that he has fallen off a bit and joined those guys. I still think Duncan is above Dirk & KG.

But Dirk & KG are as close as you can get. Neither is better than the other no matter what the haters try to say. Neither are quite good enough to win a title by their self but are both great, great, top 30 players all time. And both are way above the rest of the PFs not named Amare (and obviously Duncan who is a clear #1 to me).



Yeah right.
KG >>>>>>>>>>>> Dirk. No defense, soft,does not pass the ball as good as KG, & takes to many out side shots for a PF.
Dirk showed his true colors when he played the Heat, & the game actuly mattered. :banghead: choker :hammerhead:

[Kiddlovesnets]

I'm sorry but when's the hell that Dirk is considered as good as TD and KG as a PF?:oldlol:

[plowking]

How's the hell that Amare is better?
:confusedshrug:

How about being more of a factor in games, and better stats.

[plowking]

Honestly what has Pau done that made him better then Amare? Amare averages better stats, bigger factor in games, isn't soft, etc. I don't see anything going in Pau's favour not even defense.

[Lord Leoshes]

Sure he is, he has basically dominated what is about to be a decade of basketball. Not many players put up 25/11/3 for their playoff careers. Even fewer put up 8 straight 50 win seasons. Even fewer do that with a grand total of 4 all star appearances alongside him over those 8 years.

For some odd reason people like to underrate just exactly what Dirk has done over his career in Dallas. Since '02, only Tim Duncan and Shaq have won more games and only those two have won more playoff games. Its funny how people dont notice what this guy does and continually underrate him.


If you just want a player that scores points, then you should love Mello. Cause thats all they do. When Dirk grows a pair, & learns to play defense, then you can compare him to TD, & KG.

[Kiddlovesnets]

Honestly what has Pau done that made him better then Amare? Amare averages better stats, bigger factor in games, isn't soft, etc. I don't see anything going in Pau's favour not even defense.

Amare got owned by Duncan constantly while Gasol survived in WCF...

[Lord Leoshes]

Amare got owned by Duncan constantly while Gasol survived in WCF...


Neither Dirk, Amare, or Gasol play any defense. Duncan, & KG do. Even Brand, Big Al, & Bosh play better defense then them. It's not all about scoring points.

[Anti404]

Amare got owned by Duncan constantly while Gasol survived in WCF...
Pau Gasol Conference Finals:
37MPG/44.6FG%/72.7FT%/9.6RPG/3.6APG/1.0SPG/1.6BPG/13.2PPG

Amare Stoudemire First Round:
40.8MPG/48.5FG%/63.3FT%/9.0RPG/.4APG/1.4SPG/2.4BPG/23.2PPG

Yeah, Amare definitely got owned in comparison to Gasol... @_@

Also, didn't Amare average well over thirty points per game versus Duncan in one of the Spurs-Suns' various playoff series?

[Maggot]

Duncan
Garnett
Dirk
Amare
Bosh
Brand
Boozer
Gasol
Jefferson
Sheed

[ronnymac]

KG>>>>>>>Dirk. after this year i think amare and KG. will be the best two.

[Kiddlovesnets]

KG>>>>>>>Dirk. after this year i think amare and KG. will be the best two.

So you don't consider TD as one of the best two PFs after next season?

[ronnymac]

So you don't consider TD as one of the best two PFs after next season?
Hes slowing down. i think KG is almost passed him now. and amare with he's continues growth might pass him in a year or two.

[G-train]

Amare had a case for the best player in the league post Shaq trade. check the numbers

[AItheAnswer3]

Hes slowing down. i think KG is almost passed him now. and amare with he's continues growth might pass him in a year or two.

I dont think Duncan's slowing down. I know he doesnt have the hunger to win another ring but he didnt show signs of aging last year. Both KG and Timmy D are 32. After 2 or 3 years, Amare will be the top PF in the NBA.

[ronnymac]

I dont think Duncan's slowing down. I know he doesnt have the hunger to win another ring but he didnt show signs of aging last year. Both KG and Timmy D are 32. After 2 or 3 years, Amare will be the top PF in the NBA.
KG's body is far more durable then duncan's. the injuries are starting to take it's toll on him. he's probaly just infront of KG, but KG will pass him this season.

[NotALakerTroll]

Pau Gasol Conference Finals:
37MPG/44.6FG%/72.7FT%/9.6RPG/3.6APG/1.0SPG/1.6BPG/13.2PPG

Amare Stoudemire First Round:
40.8MPG/48.5FG%/63.3FT%/9.0RPG/.4APG/1.4SPG/2.4BPG/23.2PPG

Yeah, Amare definitely got owned in comparison to Gasol... @_@

Also, didn't Amare average well over thirty points per game versus Duncan in one of the Spurs-Suns' various playoff series?

Yeah, to say that Gasol outperformed Amare is just retarded. BTW Amare averaged like 30+ points in the playoffs the year before he had microfracture surgery. Of course, it was well noted that the Spurs game plan was to limit everybody else and let Amare go off.

[Luigi]

KG's body is far more durable then duncan's. the injuries are starting to take it's toll on him. he's probaly just infront of KG, but KG will pass him this season.

plus they are virtually the same age, with KG playing more pro seasons and using his athleticism more. It could be argued that KG has more help and will show signs of aging slower that Duncan, but Duncan's game is all skill.

I hope they both take a major step down next year though. :D

[Kiddlovesnets]

KG's body is far more durable then duncan's. the injuries are starting to take it's toll on him. he's probaly just infront of KG, but KG will pass him this season.

But KG is just one year younger than Duncan...

[brwnman]

KG, TD and Dirk are not on the same level. Dirk isn't on par with the other two, stop the homerism. Just admit it, that they're not on the same level...

[Mr Know It All]

KG, TD and Dirk are not on the same level. Dirk isn't on par with the other two, stop the homerism. Just admit it, that they're not on the same level...

All stars playing with KG: Paul Pierce, Ray Allen

All stars playing with TD: Manu Ginobli, Tony Parker

All stars playing with Dirk: Jason Kidd, although he certainly didn't look like one


Dirk is clearly on par with them, and certainly on par with KG. KG is overrated, apart from his rebouding and defensive ability, he has never stepped up when his team needed it in the playoffs. Pierce is the reason that man has a trophy, he proved that he couldn't carry a team. Dirk carried an 06 Maverick team with no all star other than himself and was within two wins of the title. KG, on the other hand, padded his stats on what was a bad team for all but one year.

In Duncan's prime, there is no question as to who is better. Duncan destroys them both, but he's aged and not the dominant low post scorer or defensive player he used to be.

[pete's montreux]

I can understand why Duncan is declining physically these days. Think about it. He's played about 100 games each season for the last 10 seasons. Garnett, and Dirk can't say they've done that.

[Luigi]

I can understand why Duncan is declining physically these days. Think about it. He's played about 100 games each season for the last 10 seasons. Garnett, and Dirk can't say they've done that.

True about the post seasons, but Garnet was playing 82 game seasons in the NBA while Duncan was learning the fundamentals in college.

[pete's montreux]

Duncan's total games played [college, NBA regular season, NBA playoffs]: 1107 @ 32 years old

Garnett [regular season, playoffs]: 1071 @ 32 years old

So it seems you're right. Not much of a difference.

[Silverbullit]

I can understand why Duncan is declining physically these days. Think about it. He's played about 100 games each season for the last 10 seasons. Garnett, and Dirk can't say they've done that.

With Dirk's international play he does the same or even more.

[ZMonkey11]

This list has not been endorsed by Obama.

[brwnman]

All stars playing with KG: Paul Pierce, Ray Allen

All stars playing with TD: Manu Ginobli, Tony Parker

All stars playing with Dirk: Jason Kidd, although he certainly didn't look like one


Dirk is clearly on par with them, and certainly on par with KG. KG is overrated, apart from his rebouding and defensive ability, he has never stepped up when his team needed it in the playoffs. Pierce is the reason that man has a trophy, he proved that he couldn't carry a team. Dirk carried an 06 Maverick team with no all star other than himself and was within two wins of the title. KG, on the other hand, padded his stats on what was a bad team for all but one year.

In Duncan's prime, there is no question as to who is better. Duncan destroys them both, but he's aged and not the dominant low post scorer or defensive player he used to be.

KG was better when he was in his prime, he never had any help. And people act like Josh Howard and Jason Terry are nothing, and those are the same guys that Dallas went to the finals with and then won 67 games the next year. Dirk declined a bit last year, so have KG and TD, but they are still above Dirk in terms of skill and impact on the game...

[ronnymac]

But KG is just one year younger than Duncan...
But in terms of being healthy or durable, kg is alot better.

[miles berg]

KG was better when he was in his prime, he never had any help. And people act like Josh Howard and Jason Terry are nothing, and those are the same guys that Dallas went to the finals with and then won 67 games the next year. Dirk declined a bit last year, so have KG and TD, but they are still above Dirk in terms of skill and impact on the game...

KG has never in his career been better than Dirk was from 04/05 through 06/07. Ever. Its funny how people prop up Josh Howard & Jason Terry like they are Ray Allen & Paul Pierce. They aren't. You could offer Jet & Josh for Pierce and the Celtics would say no.

Dirk took a team that had ZERO all stars on it to the NBA Finals and lost in 6 games. For some reason, people want to crucify him in that series, he put up 28/15 in Game 6, 24/11 for the series. The guy showed up big time and lost. Nothing wrong with that.

Im sorry, I refuse to ever concede that KG was/is superior to Dirk. He isnt, hasnt been since 2000 and probably wont be in the future. Give Dirk a Pierce & Ray Allen and he wont need 7 games to beat Atlanta, 7 games to beat the Cavs, and 25 games to win the title. Its just the truth.

But, this board loves KG and he is playing for Boston so his cult status is huge right now. I get that. But there were alot of years that KG had talent on his team. He had Stephon Marbury and Tom Gugliotta. He had Terrell Brandon. He had an all star Wally World (hey if we are propping Josh Howard for his 1 all star...), he had future NBA Finals MVP Chauncey Billups and yet he never did squat. He got swept by Dirk in '01/'02, Dirk averaged 33 ppg and 15 rpg in that series, first time a player since Jabbar put up 30/15 in a series and it was Dirk doing it against KG. KG got his stats too, he is a great player, 24/19 or something like that.

Never said KG wasnt a player. He is an All Time Great. But so is Dirk. And while neither is a Tim Duncan, by the end of their careers they are certainly going to be in the same class as guys like Karl Malone & Charles Barkley. Dirk haters will now flood this thread, and thats fine, but if they do their homework they will see that few players have ever put up an 8x50 as far as wins while proceeding to drop 25/11/3 in the playoffs over that span.

But thats ok, Dirk is only 30 years old, he has alot of years left to build his legacy. Other than Allen Iverson & Kobe Bryant, I cant think of a NBA superstar that gets more unwarranted hate than Dirk.

[Maggot]

True about the post seasons, but Garnet was playing 82 game seasons in the NBA while Duncan was learning the fundamentals in college.

do you think that's bad?...maybe if KG went to college he would have won 4 titles

[brwnman]

KG has never in his career been better than Dirk was from 04/05 through 06/07. Ever. Its funny how people prop up Josh Howard & Jason Terry like they are Ray Allen & Paul Pierce. They aren't. You could offer Jet & Josh for Pierce and the Celtics would say no.


Are you serious that KG in his career has never been better than Dirk in Dirk's best years? Are you actually serious? Please tell me you're joking.

Also, I am not saying Dirk had a better supporting cast than KG last year, but before KG went to Boston, KG never had a better supporting cast than Dirk had in the seasons he went to finals and the year after...

[The GM]

KG was better when he was in his prime, he never had any help. And people act like Josh Howard and Jason Terry are nothing, and those are the same guys that Dallas went to the finals with and then won 67 games the next year. Dirk declined a bit last year, so have KG and TD, but they are still above Dirk in terms of skill and impact on the game...

did he really? he averaged a full point less from 24.6 to 23.6 and about 2 percent on his fg percentage from 50% to 48%, thats a decline for ya c'mon. 19 & 9 is a good season but hell David West had 20 & 9 last year which was BETTER numbers wise than KG. Dirk is a top tier player in the nba, a unique talent and hasn't even hit his prime yet, so you can't compare primes just yet between KG & Dirk. Now saying KG didn't have any help is false he had Spree, Wally & Stephon when they were all good and impact players and he couldn't do anything with it. It took KG to get 2 All-Stars, Probable Hall of Famers in Allen & Pierce and playing in the East to win a chip, please Kg is on the decline his numbers show it and duncan is slowing down as well but i'd say both Dirk & Duncan are better then KG at this point.

[drza44]

I'm seeing lots of double-talk in the KG/Dirk comparisons. First, saying that KG has had good support while Dirk has had none, then saying that Dirk's numbers in his top seasons were better than KG's.

In reality, Dirk played with dramatically more support than KG did in any season before he got to Boston. Even in the famed "Cassell/Spree" year, that was a very un-talented team for a contender. Cassell and Spree were a combined 67 years old, and Spree had obviously declined. Cassell was great support, but the rest of the rotation for the majority of that year consisted of Mark Madsen/Ervin Johnson/Olowokandi at C, Trenton Hassell and Fred Hoiberg at swing (both of whom had been cut from the terrible Chicago Bulls that offseason), and a series of NBDL-caliber point guards. Dirk's support of Terry, Howard, Stackhouse, Devin Harris, Dampier/Diop, Daniels and Van Horn in '06 was better from top-to-bottom, and that was the best support that KG ever had. And that's not even getting into previous years, when Dirk played with prime Nash and Finley (arguably better even than current Pierce/Allen) and a host of other talent that Cuban bought. Comparing Dirk's supporting casts with KG's through the years is a joke.

Then, for individual comparisons, it is disengenuous to look at only scoring or (especially) FG% and conclude that Dirk was better. Dirk is a bettter shooter/scorer than KG, especially from long range, and I don't think that many would argue with that. But when you factor in both points and assists at their statistical peaks (Dirk was around 25.5 points/3.5 assists from 04 - 08, KG around 22.8 points/5.2 assists from 02 - 06) you see that offensively they both directly generated similar numbers of points (roughly 33 points) for their teams.

So on offense, statistically they were close to a wash. But on Defense? KG is one of the best defenders and rebounders of this generation, whereas Dirk...isn't. So on one side of the ball Dirk and KG were similar, and on the other side KG dominated the match-up. I don't see any way to argue that individually Dirk was on the same level as KG, let alone that Dirk is better even if you only go by the numbers, as was suggested.

[brwnman]

^

thank you. Game. Set. Match...

[veilside23]

I'm seeing lots of double-talk in the KG/Dirk comparisons. First, saying that KG has had good support while Dirk has had none, then saying that Dirk's numbers in his top seasons were better than KG's.

In reality, Dirk played with dramatically more support than KG did in any season before he got to Boston. Even in the famed "Cassell/Spree" year, that was a very un-talented team for a contender. Cassell and Spree were a combined 67 years old, and Spree had obviously declined. Cassell was great support, but the rest of the rotation for the majority of that year consisted of Mark Madsen/Ervin Johnson/Olowokandi at C, Trenton Hassell and Fred Hoiberg at swing (both of whom had been cut from the terrible Chicago Bulls that offseason), and a series of NBDL-caliber point guards. Dirk's support of Terry, Howard, Stackhouse, Devin Harris, Dampier/Diop, Daniels and Van Horn in '06 was better from top-to-bottom, and that was the best support that KG ever had. And that's not even getting into previous years, when Dirk played with prime Nash and Finley (arguably better even than current Pierce/Allen) and a host of other talent that Cuban bought. Comparing Dirk's supporting casts with KG's through the years is a joke.

Then, for individual comparisons, it is disengenuous to look at only scoring or (especially) FG% and conclude that Dirk was better. Dirk is a bettter shooter/scorer than KG, especially from long range, and I don't think that many would argue with that. But when you factor in both points and assists at their statistical peaks (Dirk was around 25.5 points/3.5 assists from 04 - 08, KG around 22.8 points/5.2 assists from 02 - 06) you see that offensively they both directly generated similar numbers of points (roughly 33 points) for their teams.

So on offense, statistically they were close to a wash. But on Defense? KG is one of the best defenders and rebounders of this generation, whereas Dirk...isn't. So on one side of the ball Dirk and KG were similar, and on the other side KG dominated the match-up. I don't see any way to argue that individually Dirk was on the same level as KG, let alone that Dirk is better even if you only go by the numbers, as was suggested.

haters go away.. you mister is awesome :hammertime: repped

[Luigi]

I'm seeing lots of double-talk in the KG/Dirk comparisons. First, saying that KG has had good support while Dirk has had none, then saying that Dirk's numbers in his top seasons were better than KG's.

In reality, Dirk played with dramatically more support than KG did in any season before he got to Boston. Even in the famed "Cassell/Spree" year, that was a very un-talented team for a contender. Cassell and Spree were a combined 67 years old, and Spree had obviously declined. Cassell was great support, but the rest of the rotation for the majority of that year consisted of Mark Madsen/Ervin Johnson/Olowokandi at C, Trenton Hassell and Fred Hoiberg at swing (both of whom had been cut from the terrible Chicago Bulls that offseason), and a series of NBDL-caliber point guards. Dirk's support of Terry, Howard, Stackhouse, Devin Harris, Dampier/Diop, Daniels and Van Horn in '06 was better from top-to-bottom, and that was the best support that KG ever had. And that's not even getting into previous years, when Dirk played with prime Nash and Finley (arguably better even than current Pierce/Allen) and a host of other talent that Cuban bought. Comparing Dirk's supporting casts with KG's through the years is a joke.

Then, for individual comparisons, it is disengenuous to look at only scoring or (especially) FG% and conclude that Dirk was better. Dirk is a bettter shooter/scorer than KG, especially from long range, and I don't think that many would argue with that. But when you factor in both points and assists at their statistical peaks (Dirk was around 25.5 points/3.5 assists from 04 - 08, KG around 22.8 points/5.2 assists from 02 - 06) you see that offensively they both directly generated similar numbers of points (roughly 33 points) for their teams.

So on offense, statistically they were close to a wash. But on Defense? KG is one of the best defenders and rebounders of this generation, whereas Dirk...isn't. So on one side of the ball Dirk and KG were similar, and on the other side KG dominated the match-up. I don't see any way to argue that individually Dirk was on the same level as KG, let alone that Dirk is better even if you only go by the numbers, as was suggested.

I agree on the double talk, but I disagree on some fo your conclusions.

First, you consider the historical comparison of teammates. A good historical comparison for two players is extremely rare, because very few players have a background simialr enough to say player x is the reason for the different levels of success. The facts remain that Dirk has had a more consistent help over the years, while KG has had a run with Spree and Cassell and a run with Pierce and Allen. I don't think there is much you can conlude from that.

Numbers comparisons are pretty weak also. A good player without help will have inflated numbers. It takes some sophistication to make any sense of numbers. FG% is approaching this, but still doesn't make it. Scoring efficiency for the player with the most shot attempts on a team combined with that team's record is a good way to see how good a player is offensively. Even still, this approach missed the essence of the game (momentum changing buckets, ways to defeat a defense, etc...). But, if all you say is that player x hits more important shots and improves his teammates, you really don't have a leg to stand on other than opinion. Defensively, the best numeric measure would be the opposing player's fg% change from their average.

Basically, what I'm saying is, that saying player x is better than player y boils down to trust. When we say X>Y, we really mean, I like X more than Y. I trust X more than Y. I prefer X more than Y. I have more confidence in X than Y. And the poeple best at doing that are the ones that watch/understand ball more/better than everyone else, and they work as NBA scouts.

[Mr Know It All]

I'm seeing lots of double-talk in the KG/Dirk comparisons. First, saying that KG has had good support while Dirk has had none, then saying that Dirk's numbers in his top seasons were better than KG's.

In reality, Dirk played with dramatically more support than KG did in any season before he got to Boston. Even in the famed "Cassell/Spree" year, that was a very un-talented team for a contender. Cassell and Spree were a combined 67 years old, and Spree had obviously declined. Cassell was great support, but the rest of the rotation for the majority of that year consisted of Mark Madsen/Ervin Johnson/Olowokandi at C, Trenton Hassell and Fred Hoiberg at swing (both of whom had been cut from the terrible Chicago Bulls that offseason), and a series of NBDL-caliber point guards. Dirk's support of Terry, Howard, Stackhouse, Devin Harris, Dampier/Diop, Daniels and Van Horn in '06 was better from top-to-bottom, and that was the best support that KG ever had. And that's not even getting into previous years, when Dirk played with prime Nash and Finley (arguably better even than current Pierce/Allen) and a host of other talent that Cuban bought. Comparing Dirk's supporting casts with KG's through the years is a joke.

Then, for individual comparisons, it is disengenuous to look at only scoring or (especially) FG% and conclude that Dirk was better. Dirk is a bettter shooter/scorer than KG, especially from long range, and I don't think that many would argue with that. But when you factor in both points and assists at their statistical peaks (Dirk was around 25.5 points/3.5 assists from 04 - 08, KG around 22.8 points/5.2 assists from 02 - 06) you see that offensively they both directly generated similar numbers of points (roughly 33 points) for their teams.

So on offense, statistically they were close to a wash. But on Defense? KG is one of the best defenders and rebounders of this generation, whereas Dirk...isn't. So on one side of the ball Dirk and KG were similar, and on the other side KG dominated the match-up. I don't see any way to argue that individually Dirk was on the same level as KG, let alone that Dirk is better even if you only go by the numbers, as was suggested.

Nash/Finley arguably equal with Pierce/Allen? You're kidding right? Steve Nash averaged about 12 and 7 with the Mavericks over the years, decent numbers but certainly nothing to write home about. Finley was no way near Paul Pierce during the Maverick playoff years. I'd say he is more comparable to Ray Allen, but even Ray Allen demands more respect than almost anyone for his outside shot.

Fact is, KG has something Dirk has never and may never have. A near equal as a teammate in Paul Pierce. Kevin Garnett had OK numbers during his title run, but if it wasn't for Pierce that team would have been dead in the water. KG brough defense and rebounding, while Pierce brought the scoring, especially in late game situations. Hell, even during his Minnesota run KG had reliable playoff performers to turn to in Cassell and Spreewell. The closest thing to a consistent clutch performer Dirk has had next to him is Jason Terry.

Kevin Garnett will always get the votes as the better player simply because he is more popular. If Dirk gets a title or two things will obviously change, but it's a real shame he gets disrespected like he does.

[drza44]

Nash/Finley arguably equal with Pierce/Allen? You're kidding right? Steve Nash averaged about 12 and 7 with the Mavericks over the years, decent numbers but certainly nothing to write home about. Finley was no way near Paul Pierce during the Maverick playoff years. I'd say he is more comparable to Ray Allen, but even Ray Allen demands more respect than almost anyone for his outside shot.

OK, this is just purposefully misleading. 12 and 7? Nash averaged about 17 and 8 on excellent shooting over his last 3 years in Dallas, and finished top-2 in the MVP voting in his first 3 years out of Dallas. His game did not quantum-change between 2004 (his last year in Dallas) and 2005 (his first MVP), he just went to a more friendly system. Dirk was playing with an MVP-caliber point guard over those last few years, so yes, Nash in the Dallas years counts as similar caliber to Pierce right now. And Finley during that same stretch was a regular 20 ppg player who was a 3rd option of similar caliber to the Ray Allen that is in Boston now.


Fact is, KG has something Dirk has never and may never have. A near equal as a teammate in Paul Pierce. Kevin Garnett had OK numbers during his title run, but if it wasn't for Pierce that team would have been dead in the water. KG brough defense and rebounding, while Pierce brought the scoring, especially in late game situations. Hell, even during his Minnesota run KG had reliable playoff performers to turn to in Cassell and Spreewell. The closest thing to a consistent clutch performer Dirk has had next to him is Jason Terry.

Again, Nash was at least as close to Dirk as Pierce is to KG. And I have no problem giving Pierce props for his playoffs performance, but be accurate. KG was the leading scorer and rebounder for the Celtics throughout the playoffs. KG (not Pierce) led the Celtics in 4th quarter scoring throughout the playoffs, while also shooting a much better 4th quarter percentage than Pierce. So while I give Pierce props and he was definitely vital to the championship, let's keep things in perspective.

[miles berg]

I am flabbergasted at how overrated Kevin Garnett is here. I mean, thats fine, but to say he and Nowitzki is a wash offensively is just about the funniest thing I have ever read here. Much like you cant build a defense around Dirk, you cant build an offense around KG and hope to get anywhere. Neither is a complete player by any stretch, but they have both accomplished alot. KG is a four time 1st team All NBAer with a MVP in his pocket and a career 22/12/4 playoff player. In two less seasons, Dirk is a three time 1st team All NBAer with a MVP in his pocket and a career 25/11/3 playoff player.

Bottom line, neither is Tim Duncan, neither was Tim Duncan, and neither will ever be Tim Duncan. But neither is any better than the other. Again, put Ray Allen & Paul Pierce with Dirk and they are winning a title too.

[bladefd]

Hm, I would take Amare over all of those PFs(except TD). Honestly, somebody might argue that KG is a better PF than Amare but you have to look at the playing style. Amare is a true PF on BOTH defense AND offense. KG is pretty much a SG in the body of a PF so on the offensive end, KG actually shoots a lot more jump-shots than actually goes into the low-post.

[brwnman]

I am flabbergasted at how overrated Kevin Garnett is here. I mean, thats fine, but to say he and Nowitzki is a wash offensively is just about the funniest thing I have ever read here. Much like you cant build a defense around Dirk, you cant build an offense around KG and hope to get anywhere. Neither is a complete player by any stretch, but they have both accomplished alot. KG is a four time 1st team All NBAer with a MVP in his pocket and a career 22/12/4 playoff player. In two less seasons, Dirk is a three time 1st team All NBAer with a MVP in his pocket and a career 25/11/3 playoff player.

Bottom line, neither is Tim Duncan, neither was Tim Duncan, and neither will ever be Tim Duncan. But neither is any better than the other. Again, put Ray Allen & Paul Pierce with Dirk and they are winning a title too.

KG was better than Duncan in his short period of time. And you can build an offense around KG, especially when he was in his prime. Only player to put up 20/10/5 for 6 consecutive years. He was the complete player and the best player in the league during that stretch (well, most of it anyways)...

[miles berg]

No, he has never been better than Tim Duncan. Ever. Thats like saying because Dirk beat Duncan in the playoffs and then won the MVP he is better than Duncan, if just for a short period of time. No, he wasnt. And KG wasnt either. Its like comparing LaDanian Tomlinson and Clinton Portis.

[brwnman]

No, he has never been better than Tim Duncan. Ever. Thats like saying because Dirk beat Duncan in the playoffs and then won the MVP he is better than Duncan, if just for a short period of time. No, he wasnt. And KG wasnt either. Its like comparing LaDanian Tomlinson and Clinton Portis.

No it's not. Short period of time, it's like you're implying months or a year, I am implying like a good 4-5 year period where KG was better than Duncan. KG was the best and most complete player out there. He did everything. His defense was amazing, he rebounded well, he could score from anywhere and he was an unbelievable and a very willing passer, a fact most people either ignore or don't know about...

[A Roc 23]

1) Duncan
2) KG
3) Amare (sorry Miles, but I think Amare passed Dirk last season. Dirk had a nice playoff series but Amare had an even better playoffs in 2005 and Dirk was still easily rated better then him. This is based off of the predictions for next year,not the past 8 years).
4) Dirk
5) Bosh
6) Brand
7) Boozer
8) Gasol
9) West
10) Jamison

I consider Jermaine, D.Howard and Jefferson centers since that's where they start.

Rasheed just missed out.

Also to Kiddlovesnets

Gasol over Amare?
Gasol didn't get owned by Duncan but Amare did?

Newsflash:

- Amare averaged 23 points 9 rebounds and 2.5 blocks on 49% shooting in last years' playoffs.
- He also averaged 37 points and 12 rebounds against Duncan in the 2005 playoffs.

- Gasol averaged 13 points 10 rebounds and 1.5 blocks on 45% shooting in the WCF.

Not to mention based on your statistical predictions Gasol is no where near top 5. His defense isn't enough to make up for such poor stats.

[joshwake]

I agree with most, Gasol is too high.

[miles berg]

A_Roc, I can buy the Amare argument. I definitely buy it alot more than the silliness of someone trying to argue KG over Duncan for 4-5 years. The only place KG is better than Duncan is in fantasy basketball.

On the court, its no contest and hasnt ever been a contest, Duncan was on another level alltogether.

[Maggot]

A_Roc, I can buy the Amare argument. I definitely buy it alot more than the silliness of someone trying to argue KG over Duncan for 4-5 years. The only place KG is better than Duncan is in fantasy basketball.

On the court, its no contest and hasnt ever been a contest, Duncan was on another level alltogether.

repped :cheers:

[brwnman]

A_Roc, I can buy the Amare argument. I definitely buy it alot more than the silliness of someone trying to argue KG over Duncan for 4-5 years. The only place KG is better than Duncan is in fantasy basketball.

On the court, its no contest and hasnt ever been a contest, Duncan was on another level alltogether.

uh-huh. Just because of winning. Duncan always had better players and won and therefore "he was always better than KG" when that is simply not true. KG's skill-set is better than Duncan and he was the better player...

[drza44]

I am flabbergasted at how overrated Kevin Garnett is here. I mean, thats fine, but to say he and Nowitzki is a wash offensively is just about the funniest thing I have ever read here. Much like you cant build a defense around Dirk, you cant build an offense around KG and hope to get anywhere. Neither is a complete player by any stretch, but they have both accomplished alot. KG is a four time 1st team All NBAer with a MVP in his pocket and a career 22/12/4 playoff player. In two less seasons, Dirk is a three time 1st team All NBAer with a MVP in his pocket and a career 25/11/3 playoff player.

Again, it's a question of degree. KG is a lot closer to Dirk on offense than Dirk is to him on defense. Put it like this, over the last decade Dirk is a top-10 offensive player and KG is a top-20 offensive player (being conservative for simplicity sake...could probably make the case for both to be higher). On the other hand, KG is a top-5 defensive player and Dirk is what...top-100? To just make the blanket statement that Dirk is better on Offense while KG is better on defense doesn't even begin to capture it.

And "neither is a complete player by any stretch"? Good grief, man, what is your definition of "complete"? There have been few players in NBA history with the offense/defense balance that KG has, and all that do are considered among the best of all time. If KG isn't a complete player, they your list of complete players must be extremely short...

[veilside23]

A_Roc, I can buy the Amare argument. I definitely buy it alot more than the silliness of someone trying to argue KG over Duncan for 4-5 years. The only place KG is better than Duncan is in fantasy basketball.

On the court, its no contest and hasnt ever been a contest, Duncan was on another level alltogether.


LoL fact is you are from texas we all know who you would root for when dallas isnt playing so i cant blame you if you think kg is lightyears away from duncan. thanks for the laughter

[Nash-tastic]

Once Duncan and KG retires, I can see Amare and Gasol battle for top-place

[pete's montreux]

Once Duncan and KG retires, I can see Amare and Gasol battle for top-place

It'll be between Amare and Bosh, Gasol has hit his ceiling.

[ronnymac]

Once Duncan and KG retires, I can see Amare and Gasol battle for top-place
Gasol? how overrated is he?.
Currently better then gasol

duncan
Amare
KG
Dirk
Bosh
Brand
Boozer
Sheed

At best he is a borderline top ten PF. even alridge is just little behind him. he's a great scorer, but he cant play any defense and is a weak rebounder for he's size.

[miles berg]

Once Duncan, Dirk, KG, and even Brand all retire it will be Amare Stoudemire as the clear #1, ala Duncan, and guys like Aldridge, Bosh, & Jefferson battling for that #2 spot ala Dirk, KG, Amare right now, etc...

[AMERVET]

DAVID freaking WEST