No triple-double for LeBron in NY: NBA rescinds that 10th rebound

[Istealfrombums]

"NBA has announced LeBron James was mistakenly credited with one of Ben Wallace's rebounds."

Somehow this is breaking news on Yahoo Sports!

UPDATE: Here is the story: http://www.insidehoops.com/blog/?p=3344

[lilojmayo]

Link?
http://sports.yahoo.com/nba;_ylt=Ai0u2z7aQ7Ghg8ACoo1XiE45nYcB

[Stacey King]

You're right, I'm looking at it too. While it's only one rebound, it really changes things- from a historical significance standpoint at least.

[eliteballer]

Serves his stat-padding rear right:roll:

[Prodigy]

****ing scrub that Lebron. How dare he fail at a triple double. Trade his overrated ass. Raptors will give you Jermaine O'Neal.

[lilojmayo]

Serves his stat-padding rear right:roll:

he did stat pad. It was obvious from his last rebound he got noticed how none of the cavs player even went for the rebound.

LeBron cares to much about stats he really does.

[barbaroi]

* Waits for Laker/Kobe Fans you say Kobe had the better Game Now*
It was the better game before the rebound was taken back and it is the better game after as well.
Lebron had 8 more minutes to play. Give Kobe 8 more minutes and he was on pace for 75. In addition to that Kobe's 61 led to the lakers blowing the knicks out, while Lebron's 52 had the game going down to the wire.

[Prodigy]

* Waits for Laker/Kobe Fans you say Kobe had the better Game Now*


Well no duh. One rebound can drastically change history. You think if the Shaq field goal that was blocked had gone into the hands of Bibby instead of Horry we'd be talking about "any SG + Shaq = 3 titles"? No. We'd be talking about "any SG + Shaq = titles in off years ala Duncan".

[andgar923]

Serves his stat-padding rear right:roll:

And Kobe going after the Garden record wasn't?

[Prodigy]

It was the better game before the rebound was taken back and it is the better game after as well.
Lebron had 8 more minutes to play. Give Kobe 8 more minutes and he was on pace for 75. In addition to that Kobe's 61 led to the lakers blowing the knicks out, while Lebron's 52 had the game going down to the wire.

I strongly disagree. Any idiot will be able to tell you that a triple double highly transcends a 52-10-9 performance. It's not even close. Even Ricky Davis would be able to tell you that. Don't feign ignorance with us young man.

[StroShow4]

if this is true, it's extremely lame. it's been days since the triple double, you can't take it away now.

[Stacey King]

Well no duh. One rebound can drastically change history. You think if the Shaq field goal that was blocked had gone into the hands of Bibby instead of Horry we'd be talking about "any SG + Shaq = 3 titles"? No. We'd be talking about "any SG + Shaq = titles in off years ala Duncan".

Not true, as the Lakers had already won two in a row ('00,'01) before that series against the Kings in '02.

[andgar923]

It was the better game before the rebound was taken back and it is the better game after as well.
Lebron had 8 more minutes to play. Give Kobe 8 more minutes and he was on pace for 75. In addition to that Kobe's 61 led to the lakers blowing the knicks out, while Lebron's 52 had the game going down to the wire.

Yet in 8 less minutes, Kobe managed to take more ft's and a few less shots.

[Prodigy]

Not true, as the Lakers had already won two in a row ('00,'01) before that series against the Kings in '02.

Damnit all.

[DuMa]

lebron will just have to go for another 50-10-10 game vs the Lakers :)

[barbaroi]

I strongly disagree. Any idiot will be able to tell you that a triple double highly transcends a 52-10-9 performance. It's not even close. Even Ricky Davis would be able to tell you that. Don't feign ignorance with us young man.
I'm not arguing that there's no difference between a 50+ triple double and a 50+/10/9. I'm saying Kobe's game was better than either so it's irrelevant. It makes a difference to the level of Lebron's game, but it spurs no change in the ranking of the two games.

[barbaroi]

Yet in 8 less minutes, Kobe managed to take more ft's and a few less shots.
He also shot 20/20 from the FT Line, nearly breaking the record for most consecutive in one game. And he shot a higher percentage from the field by 10%. You're going to say he had a bad game because he made his shots, and so continued shooting?

[andgar923]

he also shot 20/20 from the FT Line, nearly breaking the record for most consecutive in one game. And he shot a higher percentage from the field by 10%. You're going to say he had a bad game because made his shots, and so continued shooting?

When did I say he had a bad game or took anything away from him?

I just mentioned that since the "less than 8 minutes" was brought up, and that's sorta misleading.

Thus me pointing out the number of shot attempts and fts that Kobe took, in 8 LESS minutes.

[barbaroi]

When did I say he had a bad game or took anything away from him?

I just mentioned that since the "less than 8 minutes" was brought up, and that's sorta misleading.

Thus me pointing out the number of shot attempts and fts that Kobe took, in 8 LESS minutes.
Ya I shouldn't have said bad; I know you weren't arguing that. I should have said lesser game than Lebron. But still he managed to score more points in fewer minutes on a fewer amount of shots. And he made good on all of his FT attempts. Even though he had more attempts in fewer minutes atleast 6 of those attempts were knicks stopping an easy layup he'd have had.

[ScolaFan]

I hear the NBA is putting Lebron on suicide watch!

:lol

[DTD]

Crab Rebound.

[quasimoto]

If you listen closely you can hear Kobe fans having a collective orgasm.

[Showtime]

Isn't it still like 9 less points, but 9 more rebounds and 8 more assists? Still a better game.

[w00terz]

I'm really starting to get sick and tired of all these Kobe c0ckriders. Lebron had a better game, there is no discussion. "Buh-buh, teh 8 minutes moarr!!!"

[insidehoops]

Crab Rebound.

:lol

[Basketbolero]

:roll: They should do one of those "witness" commercials with this story and get Ricky Davis to participate. I can see "Which triple double was more lame" threads coming up soon.

[lilojmayo]

I hear the NBA is putting Lebron on suicide watch!

:lol

:roll: :roll: :roll: :roll:

[qrich]

I'm really starting to get sick and tired of all these Kobe c0ckriders. Lebron had a better game, there is no discussion. "Buh-buh, teh 8 minutes moarr!!!"

Even with 8 minutes(closer to 7 actually) more, I doubt Kobe dishes out 8 dimes and grabs 9 boards to come close to LeBron. Could he have scored 8 or so more points, sure. Still wouldn't change my mind that a 50/9/11 game > a 67/0/3 game. Those 11 dimes contributed an additional 22+points for the Cavs(idk how many of them, if any were treys).

[andgar923]

Ya I shouldn't have said bad; I know you weren't arguing that. I should have said lesser game than Lebron. But still he managed to score more points in fewer minutes on a fewer amount of shots. And he made good on all of his FT attempts. Even though he had more attempts in fewer minutes atleast 6 of those attempts were knicks stopping an easy layup he'd have had.

I know what I'm about to post may sound like I'm diminishing Kobe's performance, but I won't do so intentionally.

But here's something to consider......

Bron also missed some easy layups and at least 2 "And1's."

Bron managed to get 50 pts and he WASN'T in the zone, and his shot is nowhere near Kobe's.

And he was doing this almost at ease as well, with the Knicks defenders anticipating a big game.

Think about that for a second.

Now.... Imagine if Bron improves his jumper slightly next season, just "slightly."

And then gets in the zone.

How long til that 61 gets beat?

[barbaroi]

Even with 8 minutes(closer to 7 actually) more, I doubt Kobe dishes out 8 dimes and grabs 9 boards to come close to LeBron. Could he have scored 8 or so more points, sure. Still wouldn't change my mind that a 50/9/11 game > a 67/0/3 game. Those 11 dimes contributed an additional 22+points for the Cavs(idk how many of them, if any were treys).
Actually if Kobe kept his pace, even in 7 more minutes he puts up about 13 more points. So 74/0/3 is at the very least equal to 50/9/11.

[srekaL]

Actually if Kobe kept his pace, even in 7 more minutes he puts up about 13 more points. So 74/0/3 is at the very least equal to 50/9/11.

:roll: :roll: :roll:

74 points, how many times has that been done?

[Mdog1]

This is just petty by the league. Well at least we now know that they are going to go back and chekc every game and take back every single missed stat, and at least they can add mor FT attempts to LeBron each game because he is fouled every time he gets the ball.

[bisk]

Should've reduced CP3's assists by 50% last season then...:lol jk lol

unlucky for Bron, but time to move on, and get focused on the lakers game.

[Lamar Doom]

let me preface my complaint by saying how much i love Lebron, I'm a laker guy and i still love him. he is the 2nd best player in the league (with cp3 and wade nipping at his heels some nights) and he is a phenomenal and special talent, i absolutely love watching the guy play, absolute monster.

the national media is on this guy's nuts so hard is silly. the NBA needs a "jordan" desperately from a marketing standpoint and LBJ is the heir apparent to kobe. this is clear but it's crammed down our throats so much it's sick. they make it hard to root for him sometimes because it's so blind and contrived. if you watch a cavs game closely from tip to buzzer and keep your own stats you will see that lebron is given stats every night (LET this not take away from the fact that he IS the best statistical player in the league, i'm just saying watch how many times he's given the steal or the rebound or the assist when it really isn't his). you watch national telecasts and they're constantly talking about lebron's "hockey assists" (pass leading to assist by other player)... it feels really desperate and manipulative and for a real nba fan, it's infuriating. let the kid get there, the proof is in the pudding, we can see how special he is, you don't need to try to sell it to us or decieve us into believing the supernatural.

[chopchop20]

This is wach -- they shouldn't take it back

[Myth]

Actually if Kobe kept his pace, even in 7 more minutes he puts up about 13 more points. So 74/0/3 is at the very least equal to 50/9/11.

I'm sorry, but you can't just assume that he will score 13 points in 7 more minutes and claim that Kobe would have scored 74 total and therefore calling it equal with 52/9/11.

[Myth]

My only problem with this is that it took 2 days for them to correct it. Thats 2 days that the NBA let us believe history happened.

[bleedinpurpleTwo]

that blows. just give the man his triple-double. geezzz.
whoever posted that CP3's assists should be reduced...absolutely.

just give Lebron his TD, the guy earned it, so to speak.

[Mikaiel]

if you watch a cavs game closely from tip to buzzer and keep your own stats you will see that lebron is given stats every night

Well I've never seen anything like that. Maybe it does happen, but not more than with any other player. Are you sure you know how to properly give a steal or rebound ? For example if you tip the ball and a teammate comes up with it, you get credit, not your teammate. Or if you force a jumpball and your team wins it, you get a steal.


A release from the league said: “All NBA games are reviewed to ensure the accuracy of the game statistics.”

All NBA games are reviewed ? Yeah right ...

[Myth]

All NBA games are reviewed ? Yeah right ...

I cannot recall any other time that a stat was changed 2 days after the game. My guess is that Kobe supporters (of some sort) complained to the NBA to have the rebound removed, so the league looked at it.

[Tuvi]

Haha I love it

[lilmarcgasol]

he did stat pad. It was obvious from his last rebound he got noticed how none of the cavs player even went for the rebound.

LeBron cares to much about stats he really does.
it's really obvious. this is called karma that happens to fans who gloat over statspadders

[jamal99]

if this is true, it's extremely lame. it's been days since the triple double, you can't take it away now.
this^^

[lilmarcgasol]

that blows. just give the man his triple-double. geezzz.
whoever posted that CP3's assists should be reduced...absolutely.

just give Lebron his TD, the guy earned it, so to speak.
hello son he didn't earn a triple double if he only got 9 rebounds

[Da_Realist]

Everybody relax. IT. WAS. THE. KNICKS.

Let's see what happens Sunday when both players face a legitimate opponent -- each other.

[aznboy2k2]

Actually if Kobe kept his pace, even in 7 more minutes he puts up about 13 more points. So 74/0/3 is at the very least equal to 50/9/11.

But the thing is he didn't?
Whats not to say Kobe would have gotten colddd?

[dnyk1337]

Everybody relax. IT. WAS. THE. KNICKS.

Let's see what happens Sunday when both players face a legitimate opponent -- each other.

Everybody relax. IT. WAS. DA. REALIST.

Don't take that post too seriously. He loves to see how people react to his childish comments.

[Mr. Bryant]

Wow, Lebrick fans must be enraged. :oldlol:

[bleedinpurpleTwo]

hello son he didn't earn a triple double if he only got 9 rebounds

I know, I know, but you get what I'm sayin'

[lilmarcgasol]

I know, I know, but you get what I'm sayin'
Did you watch the game or any of Lebrons games? most of his rebounds he gets are just his teammates leaving the ball for him, rarely does he hit the boards, box out an opponent and rebound over people, he just gets rebounds from freethrows (which he allagedly told his teammates to leave for him) or when Z and Ben are the only other people there. His triple doubles he does get I don't think are very impressive because of this fact, so I don't see why he earns a triple double he didn't get even with his teammates leaving him rebounds.

[ZHAKIDD532]

LOL that's great.

[RedBlackAttack]

Did you watch the game or any of Lebrons games? most of his rebounds he gets are just his teammates leaving the ball for him, rarely does he hit the boards, box out an opponent and rebound over people, he just gets rebounds from freethrows (which he allagedly told his teammates to leave for him) or when Z and Ben are the only other people there. His triple doubles he does get I don't think are very impressive because of this fact, so I don't see why he earns a triple double he didn't get even with his teammates leaving him rebounds.
God, BruinLove... Could you be any dumber?

[Indian guy]

LeBron's still paying for criticizing the league's employees on getting his 'crab dribble' wrong. That's the only way to explain this move by the league; because the NBA credits the wrong players for steals/rebounds/assists/turnovers all the time. You never see them correcting it the next day. But they take away the triple double-making rebound from the face of the league? Weird.

[BigTicket]

LeBron's still paying for criticizing the league's employees on getting his 'crab dribble' wrong. That's the only way to explain this move by the league; because the NBA credits the wrong players for steals/rebounds/assists/turnovers all the time. You never see them correcting it the next day. But they take away the triple double-making rebound from the face of the league? Weird.

That's what I thought when I saw the news. I don't much care if they correct it or not, but its the first time I can ever remember such a thing happening, and its certainly not the first time they made a mistake, why make a point out of it now ?

[RedBlackAttack]

LeBron's still paying for criticizing the league's employees on getting his 'crab dribble' wrong. That's the only way to explain this move by the league; because the NBA credits the wrong players for steals/rebounds/assists/turnovers all the time. You never see them correcting it the next day. But they take away the triple double-making rebound from the face of the league? Weird.
I'd be interested in seeing just how often the league does this. I can't recall it happening... ever. But, maybe it is just that it doesn't draw as much attention in less epic performances? :confusedshrug:

You may be right, though. Ever since LeBron complained about that travel call, there was a string of games in which he couldn't buy a foul call, he was getting called for travels that were borderline at best, gotten And-1s waved off, inexplicably, and now this...

It seems that the idea of LeBron being the NBA's 'golden boy' has been greatly exaggerated.

[Mikaiel]

That's funny, I'm watching the game right now cos I couldn't watch it live, and they credited a rebound to Wally that should have gone to Ben Wallace. But they didn't change it :rolleyes:

[D-Rose]

:roll: :roll:

:applause:

[Mr. Bryant]

That's what I thought when I saw the news. I don't much care if they correct it or not, but its the first time I can ever remember such a thing happening, and its certainly not the first time they made a mistake, why make a point out of it now ?

Perhaps because a 50 point triple double is a pretty big thing and it wouldn't be right if someone was credited for one when he shouldn't have been.

[RedBlackAttack]

Perhaps because a 50 point triple double is a pretty big thing and it wouldn't be right if someone was credited for one when he shouldn't have been.
So... It is only after a great individual performance that every play gets reviewed and scrutinized? Can we go back and watch the tape of the 1975 game for Kareem and make sure that his 50/10/10 was legit? What is the grace period for changing a statistic?

Should the league have gone back and given LeBron and the Cavs an extra two points for the And-1 that he had against Detroit that was waved off due to a bogus 'travel after the foul' call?

[Lamar Doom]

Well I've never seen anything like that. Maybe it does happen, but not more than with any other player. Are you sure you know how to properly give a steal or rebound ? For example if you tip the ball and a teammate comes up with it, you get credit, not your teammate. Or if you force a jumpball and your team wins it, you get a steal.




precisely my point, you'll see Varejo or Ben Wallace tap the rebound to lebron and he's credited. (but when lebron taps it, he gets it too). seriously, sit down with a pad and pen and watch a game top to bottom, don't be overly nit-picky, give him the close calls, i bet you end up with less than the AP. I love the guy, but we're being force fed by the "what to think" networks who are making the news.

[barbaroi]

LeBron's still paying for criticizing the league's employees on getting his 'crab dribble' wrong. That's the only way to explain this move by the league; because the NBA credits the wrong players for steals/rebounds/assists/turnovers all the time. You never see them correcting it the next day. But they take away the triple double-making rebound from the face of the league? Weird.
I think it has more to do with the fact that it was front page news at yahoo for a while with a video showing Wallace getting the rebound. The NBA got called out on it :confusedshrug: .

[lilmarcgasol]

God, BruinLove... Could you be any dumber?
can you be less of a blind homer? If I knew how to make youtube videos I'd do them of Lebron games showing all of his reboundsso everyone can see how weal they are and how little he hits the boards. Also I'm not bruinlove. I haven't been called that name since I got banned for predicting Lakers would be #1 seed in the west in the beginning of the 07-08 season and everyone called me a blind idiot. Nope, I'm lilmarcgasol

[RedBlackAttack]

precisely my point, you'll see Varejo or Ben Wallace tap the rebound to lebron and he's credited. (but when lebron taps it, he gets it too). seriously, sit down with a pad and pen and watch a game top to bottom, don't be overly nit-picky, give him the close calls, i bet you end up with less than the AP. I love the guy, but we're being force fed by the "what to think" networks who are making the news.
I've done statistics for basketball many, many times. It is a difficult task and, sometimes, there are rebounds, assists, or steals that could go to several players... it is completely arbitrary and subjective.

It happens all the time in the league and I'm wondering why this one play (that I can remember) warrants being changed. Even the call that they overruled was an arbitrary call. Wallace was sort of juggling the ball and LeBron gained control.

Did this warrant a league review and overturn?

[RedBlackAttack]

can you be less of a blind homer? If I knew how to make youtube videos I'd do them of Lebron games showing all of his reboundsso everyone can see how weal they are and how little he hits the boards. Also I'm not bruinlove. I haven't been called that name since I got banned for predicting Lakers would be #1 seed in the west in the beginning of the 07-08 season and everyone called me a blind idiot. Nope, I'm lilmarcgasol
Saying that other Cavalier players PURPOSELY do not secure rebounds so that LeBron can stack up statistics makes you dumb. I'm sorry, but that is just the cold hard fact.

You realize that a lot of these guys have hefty incentives written into the contracts based on their numbers, right? It is just such a dumb premise, I don't see the point in discussing it further.

[lilmarcgasol]

Saying that other Cavalier players PURPOSELY do not secure rebounds so that LeBron can stack up statistics makes you dumb. I'm sorry, but that is just the cold hard fact.

You realize that a lot of these guys have hefty incentives written into the contracts based on their numbers, right? It is just such a dumb premise, I don't see the point in discussing it further.
Lebron told his teammates to leave freethrow rebounds for him. Do you really watch those Cavs games and not think that his teammates let him get rebounds? Seriously?

[leijamoosa]

Seems fishy. I actually believe it was on purpose called on LeBron insted of Ben Wallace so people would think he had a triple-double... You know nobody reads the corrections and I'm sure people will think it was a triple-double for a long time in discussions/arguments.
I admit it, I don't like LeBron but mainly because of the media making him to be more than he is. Always overrating him in any listings and such.

[RedBlackAttack]

Lebron told his teammates to leave freethrow rebounds for him.
What is your source for this claim?

[Lebron23]

It doesn't matter though LeBron is still averaging 28.5 ppg, 7.5 rpg, and 7.0 apg.

And I think he's going to score more than 40 plus points againts the Los Angeles Lakers this coming Sunday.

Don't expect your star player to attempt more than 10 Free Throws at the Quicken Loans Arena.

[1~Gibson~1]

it waz still a great performance though :applause:

[Fatal9]

I don't know why rebounding is used when people are comparing the two nights. Those 9 rebounds could really have been collected by any of Lebron's teammates. Kobe not getting boards (while Odom and Gasol were) had NO effect on the outcome of the game. In fact Kobe was leaking out for fast break opportunities which ended up extending the lead in some cases. So people here are complaining that because he had 0 rebounds Kobe should have hung around the basket, missed fast break opportunities, and competed for boards with his teammates. :oldlol:

FYI Lebron got 0 offensive boards (Kobe actually gets offensive boards as a greater percentage of his rebounds than Lebron...which is fishy).

In terms of assists, some one please review both games and compare the amount of touches Kobe and Lebron get in their offensive sets (and how long each touch is). If a player is going to control the ball, he's going to get more assists. Laker offense went through a stretch where Kobe was running most of the plays last month and he ended up averaging 10+ assists during all of those. In the playoffs for the first three rounds when Lakers went more and more to Kobe, he averaged 6.5 assists. More touches = more assists...it's simple. Lebron is not a better playmaker than Kobe imo, especially when he doesn't have lights out shooters.

Lebron's game looks better if you didn't watch the game and checked the box scores. I watched both games and am relatively unbiased (though I do enjoy watching Kobe more) and Lebron's impact on the game was not even close to Kobe's. Kobe killed every chance of a Knicks run and his performance was the main reason the Knicks never cut into a double digit lead by the Lakers from the first half onwards, even though the Knicks put up almost 120 points. There is a reason Kobe was like +20 and Lebron was I think +5.

Not only was it offensively more dominant, it was more entertaining, less forced and from a basketball standpoint more pleasing to watch. Plus lets not forget Kobe scored almost 10 more points while using up less possessions than Lebron (assists not included).

[RedBlackAttack]

I watched both games and am relatively unbiased
:roll:

[Jacks3]

Kobe:
31 shots 20 ft attempts 3 assists 2 turnovers = 46 possesions resulting in 67 points (2 pts per assist)

67/46 = 1.46 pts per possesion

+/- +19

Bron:
33 shots 19 ft attemps 11 assists 3 turnovers = 56 possesions resulting in 74 points (2 points per assist)

74/56 = 1.34 pts per possesion

+/- +7

Overal Kobe had the more efficient and effective night. What about the rebounds? Yes Lebron pulled down those 10 boards boards but take a closer look and you will see that they were out rebounded by NY meaning he as a forward HAD to get as many as possible. The Lakers on the other hand outrebounded NY by a wide margin and the forwards were gobbling up nearly as many as Cle had as a team. With Pau and Lamar getting 14 apiece there wasn't much for Kobe to grab. It was a strange night for him not to grab any but with LA getting 52 total and a +10 margin, he didn't have to at all.

Another thing I noticed is that LA had 25 assists total to 20 for the Cavs which tells me that despite all the assists he got, he was somewhat stagnating the offense and dominating the ball. Kobe on the other hand was getting his points in the flow of the offense, off ball movement and getting to his spots. I think that showed in the +/- and the closeness of the game.

Both were rediculously amazing performances, but I beg to differ with Spike Lee. Kobe had the better game, individually and team wise.

[lilmarcgasol]

It doesn't matter though LeBron is still averaging 28.5 ppg, 7.5 rpg, and 7.0 apg.

And I think he's going to score more than 40 plus points againts the Los Angeles Lakers this coming Sunday.

Don't expect your star player to attempt more than 10 Free Throws at the Quicken Loans Arena.
I think barring the refs trying to win the game for him, Lebron will get shut down by Kobe just like he was at staples and Cavs will go down at home.

[Mikaiel]

. I am relatively unbiased

:lol Yeah, totally unbiased. You just said LeBron getting 9 boards was not a good thing cos he didn't leak out for transition buckets. Really ? :oldlol:

[Lebron23]

I think barring the refs trying to win the game for him, Lebron will get shut down by Kobe just like he was at staples and Cavs will go down at home.


That's why LeBron is leading their head to head matchup, 6-4. The referees were biased last month, and this time the Cavaliers are going to destroy the Lakers at Home.

[Gunnin4HoLeS]

Well now ther will be an asterisk next to this game

[Indian guy]

I watched both games and am relatively unbiased (though I do enjoy watching Kobe more) and Lebron's impact on the game was not even close to Kobe's

Bwahahaha :roll: :roll: :roll: :roll: :roll: :roll: :roll:

You are the biggest LeBron hater I know of on the net, and that's something given the amount of LAKER fans out there. I think it's time you land on my IL. Good Bye.

[Fatal9]

Kobe:
31 shots 20 ft attempts 3 assists 2 turnovers = 46 possesions resulting in 67 points (2 pts per assist)

67/46 = 1.46 pts per possesion

+/- +19

Bron:
33 shots 19 ft attemps 11 assists 3 turnovers = 56 possesions resulting in 74 points (2 points per assist)

74/56 = 1.34 pts per possesion

+/- +7

Overal Kobe had the more efficient and effective night. What about the rebounds? Yes Lebron pulled down those 10 boards boards but take a closer look and you will see that they were out rebounded by NY meaning he as a forward HAD to get as many as possible. The Lakers on the other hand outrebounded NY by a wide margin and the forwards were gobbling up nearly as many as Cle had as a team. With Pau and Lamar getting 14 apiece there wasn't much for Kobe to grab. It was a strange night for him not to grab any but with LA getting 52 total and a +10 margin, he didn't have to at all.

Another thing I noticed is that LA had 25 assists total to 20 for the Cavs which tells me that despite all the assists he got, he was somewhat stagnating the offense and dominating the ball. Kobe on the other hand was getting his points in the flow of the offense, off ball movement and getting to his spots. I think that showed in the +/- and the closeness of the game.

Both were rediculously amazing performances, but I beg to differ with Spike Lee. Kobe had the better game, individually and team wise.

Assists are not factored in to counting possessions...

It's like saying a team that shot 100 times, with 20 FTA, 30 assists and 10 turnovers actually had 130 possesions, which is impossible.

[Diesel J]

wtf?????? When players do that tapping out techniques and another player on their team gets the ball, the guy that gets the ball gets credit for the rebound. I know this for sure because I've seen this happen numerous time with Chandler (batting the lose ball ) and CP3 coming up with the ball for the rebound.


key word...


The league said the rebound with 39.3 seconds left should have been credited to Cavaliers center Ben Wallace, who tapped a loose ball that James grabbed.

LBJ was robbed:rant

[lilmarcgasol]

Kobe:
31 shots 20 ft attempts 3 assists 2 turnovers = 46 possesions resulting in 67 points (2 pts per assist)

67/46 = 1.46 pts per possesion

+/- +19

Bron:
33 shots 19 ft attemps 11 assists 3 turnovers = 56 possesions resulting in 74 points (2 points per assist)

74/56 = 1.34 pts per possesion

+/- +7

Overal Kobe had the more efficient and effective night. What about the rebounds? Yes Lebron pulled down those 10 boards boards but take a closer look and you will see that they were out rebounded by NY meaning he as a forward HAD to get as many as possible. The Lakers on the other hand outrebounded NY by a wide margin and the forwards were gobbling up nearly as many as Cle had as a team. With Pau and Lamar getting 14 apiece there wasn't much for Kobe to grab. It was a strange night for him not to grab any but with LA getting 52 total and a +10 margin, he didn't have to at all.

Another thing I noticed is that LA had 25 assists total to 20 for the Cavs which tells me that despite all the assists he got, he was somewhat stagnating the offense and dominating the ball. Kobe on the other hand was getting his points in the flow of the offense, off ball movement and getting to his spots. I think that showed in the +/- and the closeness of the game.

Both were rediculously amazing performances, but I beg to differ with Spike Lee. Kobe had the better game, individually and team wise.
good post, droppin knowledge like gallileo dropped an orange

[shadow]

I've done statistics for basketball many, many times. It is a difficult task and, sometimes, there are rebounds, assists, or steals that could go to several players... it is completely arbitrary and subjective.

It happens all the time in the league and I'm wondering why this one play (that I can remember) warrants being changed. Even the call that they overruled was an arbitrary call. Wallace was sort of juggling the ball and LeBron gained control.

Did this warrant a league review and overturn?

To me wallace was not juggling the ball he had possession of it and flipped it to Lebron. The only reason I can think of to change it is the historic nature of the event. One less rebound doesn't make it a lesser performance but if you're going to tout something for the record books then it makes sense to do it right, especially since it got so much exposure already.

[RedBlackAttack]

Bwahahaha :roll: :roll: :roll: :roll: :roll: :roll: :roll:

You are the biggest LeBron hater I know of on the net, and that's something given the amount of LAKER fans out there. I think it's time you land on my IL. Good Bye.
The question now becomes, does Fatal actually BELIEVE that he is an unbiased source of information regarding LeBron? The guy enters nearly every Cavalier or LeBron related thread and attempts to downplay his role in games and diminish his impact as a player, overall.

Honestly... I can't think of a more biased poster that can actually formulate a discernible sentence and isn't a gimmick account.

[Mikaiel]

wtf?????? When players do that tapping out techniques and another player on their team gets the ball, the guy that gets the ball gets credit for the rebound.

I don't know, last time I checked, the guy who did the tapping out got credit. But I just watched that Cavs-Knicks game and Ben Wallace did that twice and Mo Williams and Wally got credit for the rebounds :confusedshrug:

[jrong]

wtf?????? When players do that tapping out techniques and another player on their team gets the ball, the guy that gets the ball gets credit for the rebound. I know this for sure because I've seen this happen numerous time with Chandler (batting the lose ball ) and CP3 coming up with the ball for the rebound.


key word...


Quote:
The league said the rebound with 39.3 seconds left should have been credited to Cavaliers center Ben Wallace, who tapped a loose ball that James grabbed.


LBJ was robbed

That's not what happened, though. He didn't "tap the ball". Wallace tapped the ball himself several times and had it under control. Then when the defender pressured him, he shovel passed it to LeBron.

[Indian guy]

The question now become, does Fatal actually BELIEVE that he is an unbiased source of information regarding LeBron?

Not unless he's retarded. The guy's entire life on this board has revolved around hating LeBron and protecting Kobe.

[Fatal9]

:lol Yeah, totally unbiased. You just said LeBron getting 9 boards was not a good thing cos he didn't leak out for transition buckets. Really ? :oldlol:
No I didn't?

I said Kobe NOT leaking out for fast breaks while fighting for rebounds with his own teammates is a bad thing. I watched the games and outside of maybe one or two rebounds, all of Lebron's were with his teammates around him. I'm not saying he is stat padding, which is an outrageous claim anyways, but his rebounding numbers don't really mean he is securing boards which his teammates wouldn't have gotten. Plus, he got 0 offensive boards so he didn't even end up adding any possessions for his team with those rebounds.

[Lebron23]

Not unless he's retarded. The guy's entire life on this board has revolved around hating LeBron and protecting Kobe.


F@got9

:oldlol: :roll: :oldlol:

[Diesel J]

I don't know, last time I checked, the guy who did the tapping out got credit. But I just watched that Cavs-Knicks game and Ben Wallace did that twice and Mo Williams and Wally got credit for the rebounds :confusedshrug:

Nope, they don't. I've seen this happen numerous time with Chandler and Cp3. let me see if I can find a video example

[Fatal9]

The question now becomes, does Fatal actually BELIEVE that he is an unbiased source of information regarding LeBron? The guy enters nearly every Cavalier or LeBron related thread and attempts to downplay his role in games and diminish his impact as a player, overall.

Honestly... I can't think of a more biased poster that can actually formulate a discernible sentence and isn't a gimmick account.
I never attempt to unfairly criticize Lebron. My main criticism has in the past been his playoff performances, which I reinforce with statistics and observations. I have always maintained that he is no worse than second best and that it is too close to call for the title of "best player in the league". I never said he was not effective, though I do admit his game and skills are not pleasing to my tastes.

I praise him when he does well in game threads and criticize the glaring weaknesses in his game. I certainly don't have this "defend Lebron at all costs" attitude like you and IG.

[RedBlackAttack]

They just showed the play again on NBA Shootaround and it was FAR from a 'shovel pass' by Wallace. Ben tipped the ball twice with one hand as a defender drew near and LeBron grabbed the ball after the second tip. I don't know what exactly the rule is on tipping a rebound and actually securing possession, but there is no doubt that Ben HAD NOT gained possession on that rebound and it may have gone out-of-bounds had LeBron not grabbed it after the second tip.

I had not really taken a close look at that play until after this announcement, but after seeing it several times minutes ago, I'm amazed that the league took the rebound away.

It should be noted that Legler and Avery Johnson both mocked the league for doing what it did.

[barbaroi]

They just showed the play again on NBA Shootaround and it was FAR from a 'shovel pass' by Wallace. Ben tipped the ball twice with one hand as a defender drew near and LeBron grabbed the ball after the second tip. I don't know what exactly the rule is on tipping a rebound and actually securing possession, but there is no doubt that Ben HAD NOT gained possession on that rebound and it may have gone out-of-bounds had LeBron not grabbed it after the second tip.

I had not really taken a close look at that play until after this announcement, but after seeing it several times minutes ago, I'm amazed that the league took the rebound away.

It should be noted that Legler and Avery Johnson both mocked the league for doing what it did.
Dunno about that: The contested rebound (http://sports.yahoo.com/nba/blog/ball_dont_lie/post/Video-Slap-an-asterisk-on-LeBron-s-MSG-triple-d;_ylt=AstYgTYo9NY1J3cCs5w4yks5nYcB?urn=nba,139191 ). Seems like a pretty clear hand off from Wallace to Lebron to me.

[Mikaiel]

Plus, he got 0 offensive boards so he didn't even end up adding any possessions for his team with those rebounds.

You don't add any possessions for your team with a defensive rebound ? Hmm ...

All this talk about LeBron's rebounding is ridiculous. I guess the ball just happens to bounce his way 7 times a game. He must be the luckiest small forward in the league, since the vast majority of the other SFs don't even average 6 a game. And even if your teammates can come up with it, if you're in good position, you don't think twice about it and you grab that motherf*cking rebound. The sooner you get the board the better. Seriously do you play basketball ?

[Diesel J]

That's not what happened, though. He didn't "tap the ball". Wallace tapped the ball himself several times and had it under control. Then when the defender pressured him, he shovel passed it to LeBron.

Wallace did tap it twice but from the angle that I've seen, he clearly didn't have full posession of the ball. He basically tapped it twice in the air and then did a third tap (not an actual hand off) towards Lebron (lebron gets full control of it after that).

[RedBlackAttack]

I never attempt to unfairly criticize Lebron. My main criticism has in the past been his playoff performances, which I reinforce with statistics and observations. I have always maintained that he is no worse than second best and that it is too close to call for the title of "best player in the league". I never said he was not effective, though I do admit his game and skills are not pleasing to my tastes.

I praise him when he does well in game threads and criticize the glaring weaknesses in his game. I certainly don't have this "defend Lebron at all costs" attitude like you and IG.
Are you f#cking kidding me? I call LeBron out for his bad games when they occur and I also have serious problems with his shot selection at times. I've also been a big critic of his free throw shooting throughout the years, although to a lesser extent this year since he has improved that area of his game.

I also absolutely slammed LeBron for discussing possible moves in 2010 during the season.

If you think that I defend LeBron at all costs, you haven't read many of my posts.

I've never seen you, on the other hand, miss an opportunity to take a position opposite LeBron on every topic. Saying 'good game' in a game thread (if you indeed did it, which I didn't see) does not cancel out five paragraph arguments against LeBron, which you have been doing for years.

[RedBlackAttack]

Dunno about that: The contested rebound (http://sports.yahoo.com/nba/blog/ball_dont_lie/post/Video-Slap-an-asterisk-on-LeBron-s-MSG-triple-d;_ylt=AstYgTYo9NY1J3cCs5w4yks5nYcB?urn=nba,139191 ). Seems like a pretty clear hand off from Wallace to Lebron to me.
So... you are maintaining that Wallace had full possession of the ball? I don't know how anyone could watch that play and come to that conclusion. He tapped it twice with one hand and LeBron grabbed it after the second tap. Is that not what happened? A handoff? Really?

[barbaroi]

So... you are maintaining that Wallace had full possession of the ball? I don't know how anyone could watch that play and come to that conclusion. He tapped it twice with one hand and LeBron grabbed it after the second tap. Is that not what happened? A handoff? Really?
Chill man lol. I'm just going by that angle. Another angle may tell a different story, but from that angle it does look like that was wallace's board.

[Fatal9]

You don't add any possessions for your team with a defensive rebound ? Hmm ...

All this talk about LeBron's rebounding is ridiculous. I guess the ball just happens to bounce his way 7 times a game. He must be the luckiest small forward in the league, since the vast majority of the other SFs don't even average 6 a game. And even if your teammates can come up with it, if you're in good position, you don't think twice about it and you grab that motherf*cking rebound. The sooner you get the board the better. Seriously do you play basketball ?
Kobe dropped 2 triple doubles a week after Lebron and Paul had theirs. This was not a coincidence, he hung around the basket more and racked up a lot of defensive boards. If you linger around the basket enough you'll have plenty of opportunities to collect boards as the other team is already heading back on D. Very easy to add about 3-4 rebounds to your total this way. Kobe, Paul and Lebron have all done this, especially on nights when you just know they are looking for a triple double.

[Diesel J]

Chill man lol. I'm just going by that angle. Another angle may tell a different story, but from that angle it does look like that was wallace's board.


They need to show a video of that play from the inner baseline camera view. IMO, Wallace never had full possession of that ball..he basically did a double tap before he stepped out towards Lebron and Lebron got control of it.

[OneMoreSucka]

A tap is a rebound.

[kkling]

So, Wallace had 1 rebound that game... He tapped the ball out at least two times and wasn't credited for the rebounds. What's the difference?

[Diesel J]

A tap is a rebound.

to who? The tapper or the guy that gets the ball? I just did a little detective work to prove my point that the guy doing the tapping doesn't get credit for the rebound (the tapper technically doesn't have full possession) but the guy that gathers the ball and has full possession does.

I mentioned a few posts back that I've seen this happen numeround times with Chandler (tapping) and Cp3 (gathering and getting credit for the board) so here goes some evidence.

Hornets vs. Mavericks Game 5 Playoffs 2008

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zOd9SfUPtVk

^^Look @ the video above from 1:14-1:19 (the score is NO 97 to 94 Dallas)

CP3 misses the jumper and Chandler taps it back out and the ball goes to CP3. CP3 gets credit for an offensive rebound on this play...

Now here goes the actual play by play to confirm this...

Dallas vs. New Orleans - Play By Play - April 29, 2008 - ESPN

http://sports.espn.go.com/nba/playbyplay?gameId=280429003

^^scroll down all the way to 0:08

0:33 New Orleans 20 Sec. timeout

0:08 94-97 Chris Paul misses 17-foot jumper
0:07 94-97 Chris Paul offensive rebound
0:05 Dirk Nowitzki personal foul (Peja Stojakovic draws the foul) 94-97


^^as you can see, Chandlers tap out to CP3 resulted in CP3 getting an offensive rebound, not Chandler!

[YAWN]

They need to show a video of that play from the inner baseline camera view. IMO, Wallace never had full possession of that ball..he basically did a double tap before he stepped out towards Lebron and Lebron got control of it.
yea id like to see that.

from that view its too hard to tell, but it looks like it should of been wallaces board. im sure the baseline view would be closer and more conclusive.

[Diesel J]

I don't know, last time I checked, the guy who did the tapping out got credit. But I just watched that Cavs-Knicks game and Ben Wallace did that twice and Mo Williams and Wally got credit for the rebounds :confusedshrug:


See my from above that I just made. Solid proof..

[amfirst]

I strongly disagree. Any idiot will be able to tell you that a triple double highly transcends a 52-10-9 performance. It's not even close. Even Ricky Davis would be able to tell you that. Don't feign ignorance with us young man.

Ur stupid, it doesn't matter what stats u have, if u have 40 rebounds and lose it means nothing. I matters how u impact the game and obviously Kobe had a bigger impact, no one can stop him and they got destroyed. Bron Bron deffered to his teammates with the 10 assist because he knew he couldn't win by himself.

[Mikaiel]

See my from above that I just made. Solid proof..

Yeah that's weird. I'm pretty sure I've seen guys do it and get credit for the rebound ... Ben Wallace does that a lot.

I'm 100% sure it works that way for steals though. It's weird it doesn't for rebounds.

[lilmarcgasol]

Ur stupid, it doesn't matter what stats u have, if u have 40 rebounds and lose it means nothing. I matters how u impact the game and obviously Kobe had a bigger impact, no one can stop him and they got destroyed. Bron Bron deffered to his teammates with the 10 assist because he knew he couldn't win by himself.
Lebron got 10 assists but his whole team inclding him got only 20 assists that game, meaning Lebron stagnated ball movement and ruined the team game to get his.

[Mdog1]

Ur stupid, it doesn't matter what stats u have, if u have 40 rebounds and lose it means nothing. I matters how u impact the game and obviously Kobe had a bigger impact, no one can stop him and they got destroyed. Bron Bron deffered to his teammates with the 10 assist because he knew he couldn't win by himself.
Steven A Smith is that you? God I am glad thet you don't represent the average IQ of the posters on ISH. Getting 60 points is great, but it is a once a year event. It has happened 5 times for Kobe in his career, MJ 5 times, Wilt over 15, and I am sure countless others. But a 50 point TD happens once a generation. The last one was in 75, 34 years ago. KAJ, You know how I said that Wilt had 15 + 60 pointers? Well he had two, two 50 poinnt TDs. And for the greatest statistical machine in history that means sometinhg. Also you point about Kobe not needing to rely on his team mates to carry his team to a win is rubish. He needed Gasol to get 30 points as well. Also LeBron was responsible for way more points in his teams win than Kobe was.

Point is that a 60 point game is not as, or even close to as special as a 50/10/10 game.

[Diesel J]

Yeah that's weird. I'm pretty sure I've seen guys do it and get credit for the rebound ... Ben Wallace does that a lot.


The tappers never get credit for the rebounds from what I've seen because they technically don't have full possession of the ball/rebound. The league clearly robbed Lebron of a TD based on that play. From that camera view, Wallace does a double tap towards Lebron without ever having full possession of the ball.

[1~Gibson~1]

Lebron got 10 assists but his whole team inclding him got only 20 assists that game, meaning Lebron stagnated ball movement and ruined the team game to get his.The Cavs average 20 Assists Per Game though :lol

Link (http://www.nba.com/cavaliers/stats/). It's 20.3 if you wanna get technical. :confusedshrug:

Next excuse please.....

[Mikaiel]

Wilt over 15

32 to be exact.

[lilmarcgasol]

The Cavs average 20 Assists Per Game though :lol

Link (http://www.nba.com/cavaliers/stats/). It's 20.3 if you wanna get technical. :confusedshrug:

Next excuse please.....
yeah and do you know what that means? Lebron averaging 7 a game STILL stagnates ball movement.

[1~Gibson~1]

yeah and do you know what that means? Lebron averaging 7 a game STILL stagnates ball movement.his 10 assists out of the cavs 20 makes his performance even better :confusedshrug:

[lilmarcgasol]

his 10 assists out of the cavs 20 makes his performance even better :confusedshrug:
no it means he holds up ball movement from his teammates and stagnates the team, did you watch the game did you see how the goddamn crap Knicks were keeping up score for score with the Cavs with Lebron taking 33 shots, and then passing for half the assists and his whole combined team only getting 10

[kkling]

no it means he holds up ball movement from his teammates and stagnates the team, did you watch the game did you see how the goddamn crap Knicks were keeping up score for score with the Cavs with Lebron taking 33 shots, and then passing for half the assists and his whole combined team only getting 10

He usually doesn't play that way anymore though.

[1~Gibson~1]

no it means he holds up ball movement from his teammates and stagnates the team, did you watch the game did you see how the goddamn crap Knicks were keeping up score for score with the Cavs with Lebron taking 33 shots, and then passing for half the assists and his whole combined team only getting 10So are you saying his 10assists werent impressive?

[Diesel J]

Why are yall still talking about which game was better?:oldlol:

50 point triple double is alot rarer than a 60 point game. It's not even debatable:confusedshrug:

[Mdog1]

32 to be exact.
I wasn't sure the exact number, but I thought it was only 17. 32 is extaordinary though.

[kentatm]

:roll: :roll: :roll:

******gers for Kobe and Bron both just had their blood pressure spike

[Lebron23]

Regardless, it was still a fantastic all-around game from LeBron. 1 rebound doesn't change a damn thing.



Rep :cheers:

[barbaroi]

"A release from the league said: “All NBA games are reviewed to ensure the accuracy of the game statistics.” Wallace benefited from a review in a game at Charlotte on Dec. 6, when a blocked shot originally credited to Zydrunas Ilgauskas was changed to Wallace."

http://sports.yahoo.com/nba/news;_ylt=Al6PuvgWuP_oXXzSknOugnU5nYcB?slug=ap-lebron-notriple-double&prov=ap&type=lgns

So apparently it's not just this one game that's reviewed.

[1~Gibson~1]

That's what that little ***** lebrick gets.LeBrick's Performance > Kobe's Performance

hahahahahaha

http://www.grundsteinlego.de/wp-content/uploads/2006/08/nelsonHaHa.jpg

troll :rolleyes:

[plowking]

I'm a troll because I think lebrick is a punk *****? Of course a lebrick dick sucker would think so.:roll:

I really shouldn't have been surprised to see you post in this thread.

[Meticode]

Guys stop arguing please.

[1~Gibson~1]

I'm a troll because I think lebrick is a punk *****? Of course a lebrick dick sucker would think so.:roll:Says the Kobe troll

[Odomize]

Does Yahoo fantasy NBA rescind that rebound as well? :lol

[Meticode]

Says the Kobe troll

Don't worry about it. Just ignore that man. No use in arguing with people.

[1~Gibson~1]

Guys stop arguing please.change the s to a z young man :no:

[1~Gibson~1]

This message is hidden because 243354 is on your ignore list. ...

[Lebron23]

Don't worry about me dude. Worry about your pathetic Heat team.

http://www.clap.name/images/blog/d_wade.jpg

http://withmalice.files.wordpress.com/2007/06/kobe1.jpg

[Meticode]

change the s to a z young man :no:

No thanks.

[1~Gibson~1]

No thanks.but Z'z are cool :(

[lefthook00]

That sucks for LeBron...he could have made history...can't they take his 11th assist or his last bucket and make it a rebound?:(

[Meticode]

but Z'z are cool :(

I'm not cool though. Come on man. You should know that by now about me at least.

[1~Gibson~1]

This message is hidden because 243354 is on your ignore list.


This message is hidden because 243354 is on your ignore list.


This message is hidden because 243354 is on your ignore list.


This message is hidden because 243354 is on your ignore list.


This message is hidden because 243354 is on your ignore list.


This message is hidden because 243354 is on your ignore list. :hammertime:

[Lebron23]

Hopefully Bron gets injured vs the Lakers. That would be sweet.

Shut the F*ck up you pathetic LeBron hater.

:lol :lol :lol

[AznTacoLover]

lol, wow. and after a couple of days then they announced it.

[Meticode]

Seriously, I hope he suffers some sort of career ending injury.That get rid of clowns like you.

Don't wish bad on anyone man.

[Meticode]

I just did.

Why do you have so much hate in your heart?

[Meticode]

:oldlol: ^

I know.

[gts]

A handful of quickie reactions and footnotes to the league's unexpected announcement Friday that LeBron James' epic triple-double at Madison Square Garden will now be recorded as a mere 52-point, 11-assist, nine-rebound classic:
•The league office actually makes after-the-fact corrections to box scores like this one  deducting one rebound from LeBron's stat line and awarding to Ben Wallace -- fairly regularly. Yet it rarely announces those changes.

• An announcement was made in this case, league officials said, because of the historical implications and widespread coverage of LeBron's feat. There hasn't been a player to post a triple double with at least 50 points since Kareem Abdul-Jabbar did it for Milwaukee in 1975.

• This wasn't the first time this season that the Cavs were hit with such a change. Zydrunas Ilgauskas was stripped of a blocked shot from a Dec. 6 game against Charlotte, which was also given to Wallace.

• The most recent example of such a high-profile ruling occurred in 1990, when Houston's Hakeem Olajuwon had a quadruple-double nullified after the league stripped him of an assist. The league also announced that box-score amendment via press release.

http://sports.espn.go.com/nba/dailydime?page=dime-090207-08

[bagelred]

I think there needs to be a Congressional investiagation on the matter.

[barbaroi]

http://sports.espn.go.com/nba/dailydime?page=dime-090207-08
Good find.

[raptorfan_dr07]

The Cavs average 20 Assists Per Game though :lol

Link (http://www.nba.com/cavaliers/stats/). It's 20.3 if you wanna get technical. :confusedshrug:

Next excuse please.....

Actually he may know what he's talking about, after all he's a Laker fan. He should know all about stagnant ball movement and ruining the team game to get stats seeing as how Kobe Bryant's on his favorite team. :confusedshrug: :lol :lol

[john_d]

hate what you love.

[jrong]

They just showed the play again on NBA Shootaround and it was FAR from a 'shovel pass' by Wallace. Ben tipped the ball twice with one hand as a defender drew near and LeBron grabbed the ball after the second tip. I don't know what exactly the rule is on tipping a rebound and actually securing possession, but there is no doubt that Ben HAD NOT gained possession on that rebound and it may have gone out-of-bounds had LeBron not grabbed it after the second tip.

I had not really taken a close look at that play until after this announcement, but after seeing it several times minutes ago, I'm amazed that the league took the rebound away.

It should be noted that Legler and Avery Johnson both mocked the league for doing what it did.

Watch it on the full screen so that you can see it better. Wallace didn't have the ball in both hands or even one hand, true. But, it was under his control. He tapped upward to himself at least twice from underneath the ball, but then all of the sudden the ball changed trajectory and proceed on a horizontal path toward LeBron. And this redirection of the ball coincidentally just happened to occur when Ben was pressured by a defender. That then bears a suspicious resemblance to a pass, I'd say.

[snipes12]

kobe>lebron

[Mikaiel]

Cleveland Plain Dealer ace reporter Brian Windhorst raises an interesting point in his coverage that the league has yet to explain. Windhorst wrote: "The ruling was inconsistent with the stat crew's tallies during the game. Wallace tipped a handful of rebounds to teammates, a tactic he's perfected during his career and has been dubbed the 'Ben back-tap' by Cavs play-by-play voice Fred McLeod. Most of the time at arenas around the league, Wallace gets credit for these as rebounds. Yet the stats crew gave Wallace just one rebound in the game before NBA intervention while Wally Szczerbiak, who grabbed several of Wallace's tap-backs, ended up with an anomaly of 13 rebounds, the second-highest total of his career. The review of the film by the NBA, though, did not change any other of Wallace's uncredited back-taps or Szczerbiak's rebounds.

http://sports.espn.go.com/nba/dailydime

So I was right, usually a back-tap IS a rebound.

[Diesel J]

http://sports.espn.go.com/nba/dailydime

So I was right, usually a back-tap IS a rebound.


A tap back is not a rebound. If it was, Tyson Chandler would have off the chart rebounding numbers since I've seen him tap back more loose rebounds than anyone right now in the NBA.

[Mikaiel]

A tap back is not a rebound. If it was, Tyson Chandler would have off the chart rebounding numbers since I've seen him tap back more loose rebounds than anyone right now in the NBA.

Well I think they're not consistent with their definition. I'm pretty sure Ben Wallace does get credit for it most of the time (although he didn't at MSG). I don't have any examples right now but I've seen it, and this writer did too. And usually he's a very reliable source.

[Diesel J]

Well I think they're not consistent with their definition. I'm pretty sure Ben Wallace does get credit for it most of the time (although he didn't at MSG). I don't have any examples right now but I've seen it, and this writer did too. And usually he's a very reliable source.

I gave the Chris Paul/Chandler example a few pages back but I'll see if I can find another example.

[Mikaiel]

I gave the Chris Paul/Chandler example a few pages back but I'll see if I can find another example.

You don't need to. All I'm saying is they're not consistent with that definition. On some nights, I'm pretty sure Tyson Chandler did get credit for the rebound.

[yobore]

Tap-outs are usually counted as rebounds if they are clearly to a teammate. If it causes a loose ball the one who recovers the loose ball will get the rebound.

[Mikaiel]

Lamar Odom rebounded that shot, made a layup, got fouled, missed the free throw but controlled the rebound after a back tap by Gasol. Odom was then fouled and he split the pair of free throws to put the Lakers up, 101-100.

Source : http://www.yardbarker.com/nba/articles/Kobe_and_LeBron_Are_in_Triple_Threat_Position/475297

Here's the play-by-play :

1:07 Odom Rebound (Off:3 Def:6)
1:07
[LAL 100-100] Odom Layup Shot: Made (16 PTS)
Howard Foul:Shooting (3 PF) 1:07
1:07 Odom Free Throw 1 of 1 missed
1:06 Gasol Rebound (Off:4 Def:4)
Howard Foul:Shooting (4 PF) 1:04
1:04
[LAL 101-100] Odom Free Throw 1 of 2 (17 PTS)

So it does happen.

[Mikaiel]

The Cavs' rebounding has been one of their hallmarks in recent years, and they showed it last night. The Bucks actually grab more boards per game on average (which may have something to do with their shot selection), but the Cavs dominated the boards last night, 53-38. In addition to Ilgauskas and his 17 rebounds, Ben Wallace (10 boards) made a strong showing.

It's always fun when the Cavs' announcers receive some new point of emphasis and are told to mention it twelve jillion times during a broadcast. Within the past week, somebody in the Cavs' production machine realized that a back tap (which is one of Wallace's weapons of choice) counts as a rebound. Consequently (I figured I'd get into character), Austin Carr and Fred McLeod have pointed out several times that "a back tap counts as a rebound".

Source : http://www.theclevelandfan.com/article_detail.php?id=3975