Bulls get B.Miller J.Salmons. Kings get A.Nocioni, D.Gooden, M.Ruffin, C.Simmons

[Reverend Hoops]

The Chicago Bulls announced today that the team has acquired center/forward Brad Miller and guard/forward John Salmons (pronounced SAL-mons) from the Sacramento Kings for forward Andr

[Interminator]

Kaboom!

Bulls don't improve at all.

What position does Luol Deng play?PF?

[John Dough]

Do the Bulls really need another guard/forward? Salmons is good, I admit, but they already have Rose, Gordon, hinrich, sefolosha, deng, tyrus

[Sanity]

I'm not sure how better it would make either team :confusedshrug:

[dak121]

Do the Bulls really need another guard/forward? Salmons is good, I admit, but they already have Rose, Gordon, hinrich, sefolosha, deng, tyrus

Hinrich is about to be traded. If not then Gordon goes somewhere else this summer.

Now the Thomas jockriders can be happy. The Amare deal is dead.(like it was ever going to happen anyways.

[Interminator]

Do the Bulls really need another guard/forward? Salmons is good, I admit, but they already have Rose, Gordon, hinrich, sefolosha, deng, tyrus
Hinrich-PG
Rose-PG
Gordon-SG
Sefalosha-SG/SF
Deng-SF
Tyrus-PF

I can understand them adding depth but I dont understand why they would make this move unless it is true that they plan to trade Hinrich,& possibly Sefalosha.

[The Magic Man]

Kaboom!

Bulls don't improve at all.



Lol, same thing I was thinking.

[Im so nba'd out]

i feel bad for larry hughes lol no 1 wants him it seems.

[John Dough]

Hinrich is about to be traded. If not then Gordon goes somewhere else this summer.

Now the Thomas jockriders can be happy. The Amare deal is dead.(like it was ever going to happen anyways.
Where is Hinrich going?

I'm a Thomas jockrider too; he went to LSU and I remember watching him play in every game while I was there. Dude has potential.

Hopefully he reaches it one day.

[Indian guy]

Good. I'll take it. We get rid of 2 on-court cancers for a couple of solid players. On positions we needed help to boot. Brad Miller can only help given our other big men. John Salmon assures we don't have to play that suicial Rose-Gordon-Kirk 3 guard lineup that VDN puts on so many times. Not to mention what he'll mean to us next season once BG leaves.

[John Dough]

Hinrich-PG
Rose-PG
Gordon-SG
Sefalosha-SG/SF
Deng-SF
Tyrus-PF

I can understand them adding depth but I dont understand why they would make this move unless it is true that they plan to trade Hinrich,& possibly Sefalosha.
Oh yeah, and how could i forget, Larry Hughes... :oldlol:

[NY Comeback]

WTF?!

WALSH, GODDAMNIT YOU WERE SUPPOSED TO GET MILLER!! :mad: :rant :mad: :mad: :banghead:


gahwddybzslg

[bonez26]

Not a bad deal for either side. straight Salary dump on SAC side.

Bulls:

Rose/Hinrich
Salmons/Gordon/Sefalosha
Deng
Tyrus Thomas/Noah
Miller/Gray

[D-Rose]

Good trade for the Bulls. A Tyrus-Miller frontline is solid. Salmons will allow them to be able to trade away Hinrich.

[Interminator]

Oh yeah, and how could i forget, Larry Hughes... :oldlol:
Larry Hughes will never play another game for the Chicago Bulls,He last played for the Bulls on January 12th.

Either the Bulls are going to move him or they are going to de-activate him for this season and 1/2 of next season.

[BasketballWiz101]

what would the projected starting lineups look for both the kings and the bulls?

[qrich]

Wow the Kings got raped here. I would have given Thornton and Ricky, along with some cash to waive Ricky for Salmons. At least they would have gotten a SF for the future to go alongside Thompson and Hawes in the front court :oldlol:

[Bean]

When will the Bulls pull their heads out of their asses and trade for A legit superstar who will compliment Rose. I would really hate to be a Bulls fan.

[Interminator]

Good trade for the Bulls. A Tyrus-Miller frontline is solid. Salmons will allow them to be able to trade away Hinrich.
Miller compliments Tyrus well.

But John Salmons is EXACTLY a SG that only played the 3 in Sacramento because they needed him on the court,similar to last season when Artest had to play the 4.

[John Dough]

what would the projected starting lineups look for both the kings and the bulls?
I'm just guessing... but here's my guess:

Bulls:
PG- Rose
SG- Gordon
SF- Salmons
PF- Tyrus
C- Brad Miller

Kings:
PG - Udrih
SG- Martin
SF- Garcia
PF- Thompson
C - Hawes

??

[NY Comeback]

Damn...Knicks were so close, I really can't believe this.

Knicks stay taking L's, man.

[BasketballWiz101]

I'm just guessing... but here's my guess:

Bulls:
PG- Rose
SG- Gordon
SF- Salmons
PF- Tyrus
C- Brad Miller

Kings:
PG - Udrih
SG- Martin
SF- Garcia
PF- Thompson
C - Hawes

??

wow that means the bulls would bench deng??? man bulls are in trouble instead of trading for these mediocre players they need a superstar to go with rose

[Interminator]

Wow the Kings got raped here. I would have given Thornton and Ricky, along with some cash to waive Ricky for Salmons. At least they would have gotten a SF for the future to go alongside Thompson and Hawes in the front court :oldlol:
You cant be serious.

Al Thornton>John Salmons.

[bleedinpurpleTwo]

If the Bulls are able to get some real substance out of Brad Miller, then its a win/win trade.

[John Dough]

wow that means the bulls would bench deng??? man bulls are in trouble instead of trading for these mediocre players they need a superstar to go with rose
I actually forgot about Deng .. My bad.

I guess then:

Rose, Salmons, Deng, Tyrus, Brad Miller

With Gordon, Hinrich, Noah off the bench

[Interminator]

I'm just guessing... but here's my guess:

Bulls:
PG- Rose
SG- Gordon
SF- Salmons
PF- Tyrus
C- Brad Miller

Kings:
PG - Udrih
SG- Martin
SF- Garcia
PF- Thompson
C - Hawes

??
Bench Luol Deng?

He's having a mediocre season so far considering how much was expected from him but there is no way the Bulls bench Deng in favor of John Salmons.

[John Dough]

Bench Luol Deng?

He's having a mediocre season so far considering how much was expected from him but there is no way the Bulls bench Deng in favor of John Salmons.
I forgot about Deng somehow... but yeah, he is having a less than average season. But they definitely won't bench him. I guess Gordon goes back to being a 6th man

[qrich]

You cant be serious.

Al Thornton>John Salmons.

Yes I can. Salmons fits in better then Thornton does as he doesn't need the ball in his hands to be effective and is a decent defender. Plus, getting rid of Ricky is great news and gives Steve Novak, Eric Gordon and Fred Jones the minutes that Ricky would have gotten

[Interminator]

I actually forgot about Deng .. My bad.

I guess then:

Rose, Salmons, Deng, Tyrus, Brad Miller
Bench Ben Gordon?

Ben Gordon worked well as a 6th Man a few years ago but with this current Bulls team he is the only player on that team that can score from at least 15 feet away from the basket.

[Sanity]

When will the Bulls pull their heads out of their asses and trade for A legit superstar who will compliment Rose. I would really hate to be a Bulls fan.

You don't need a superstar when u have the great one.

http://www.algierz.com/newzimages/LARRYHUGHESBONUS2.jpg

[John Dough]

Yes I can. Salmons fits in better then Thornton does as he doesn't need the ball in his hands to be effective and is a decent defender. Plus, getting rid of Ricky is great news and gives Steve Novak, Eric Gordon and Fred Jones the minutes that Ricky would have gotten
Eric Gordon is a stud.

[BasketballWiz101]

cedric simmons is also goin to the kings i thought he was goin to be a good player guess i was wrong :oldlol: :oldlol:

also the bulls traded michael ruffin to portland these trades seem minor but should help them

[John Dough]

Bench Ben Gordon?

Ben Gordon worked well as a 6th Man a few years ago but with this current Bulls team he is the only player on that team that can score from at least 15 feet away from the basket.
Well it would either have to be between Salmons & Gordon. I'd go with Salmons. He's having a solid season. Gordon has been a 6th man before...

Idk. It's a tough call.

[Venja42]

The Chicago Bulls and Sacramento Kings have reached tentative agreement on a trade sending Andres Nocioni, Drew Gooden and Cedric Simmons to the Kings for Brad Miller and John Salmons, ESPN.com.

One source said the Bulls players were pulled off the team bus Wednesday afternoon and were told they had been traded.

Michael Ruffin of the Bulls also was told be was being traded to Portland in a separate deal, the source added.

Another source said the trade was expected to be finalized by Wednesday evening.

Chris Sheridan covers the NBA for ESPN Insider.

So Kings get Simmons too and the Bulls are shipping off Ruffin.

I wonder who they got for Ruffin.

I don't think the Bulls are anywhere near finished.

[NOHCP3]

This helps the Bulls. Not a huge move but something that gives them a better 5. We all knew the Amare deal wasnt going to go down.

[Interminator]

Yes I can. Salmons fits in better then Thornton does as he doesn't need the ball in his hands to be effective and is a decent defender. Plus, getting rid of Ricky is great news and gives

Steve Novak
http://i238.photobucket.com/albums/ff298/palakea/Cat/funny-pictures-sarcastic-hairless-c.jpg




Eric Gordon
http://i238.photobucket.com/albums/ff298/palakea/Cat/funny-pictures-cross-eyed-tv-cat.jpg
and

Fred Jones
http://i238.photobucket.com/albums/ff298/palakea/Cat/funny-pictures-fat-cat-ate-book.jpg

[John Smith]

Outstanding trade for the Bulls.

[qrich]

I see a deal between the Clips and Bulls going down involving Kaman. Don't know why, I just do.

[Interminator]

I see a deal between the Clips and Bulls going down involving Kaman. Don't know why, I just do.
http://i238.photobucket.com/albums/ff298/palakea/Cat/funny-pictures-boss-cat-office-cubi.jpg

[D-Rose]

Chicago still has some jusicy contracts like Ben Gordon or Larry Hughes. And they want to get rid of Hinrich, or they should at least.

We'll see.

[BasketballWiz101]

I see a deal between the Clips and Bulls going down involving Kaman. Don't know why, I just do.

thats a bold statement my friend we'll see how it plays out

[Interminator]

Chicago still has some jusicy contracts like Ben Gordon or Larry Hughes. And they want to get rid of Hinrich, or they should at least.

We'll see.
:roll: :roll: this ***** misspelled juicy

You in second grade?

[D-Rose]

:roll: :roll: this ***** misspelled juicy

You in second grade?
:roll: :roll: I was in a hurry! :oldlol:

[Scott Pippen]

welcome back Brad Miller. :applause:

[Interminator]

:roll: :roll: I was in a hurry! :oldlol:
Dont make an excuse now.

Of all the words to misspell you misspelled juicy.:oldlol:

At least you could have typed it jewsy:roll:

[BULLZ]

Brad Miller and John Salmons are, by FAR, the best Bulls players not named Derrick Rose. This is one step closer to breaking up that weak core.

[mattreis62]

Wow, the Bulls finally trade for a big man and end up with Brad Miller :rolleyes:

Can someone please tell me how Paxson still has a job?

[John Smith]

With Larry Hughes and Brad Miller Chicago is going to have over $25 million coming off the books, next season, so they can potentially sign Bron or Wade or Melo or make a really good trade for a team desperate to attempt to sign Bron or Bosh. Chicago has positioned themselves perfectly.

[D-Rose]

Dont make an excuse now.

Of all the words to misspell you misspelled juicy.:oldlol:

At least you could have typed it jewsy:roll:

haha

And John Smith, Melo's not a FA in 2010.

[John Smith]

Only haters and idiots would say this is a bad trade for the Chicago Bulls. Bull fans love it and King fans hate it, 'nuff said!

http://www.kingsfans.com/forums/showthread.php?t=30821

[boozehound]

itll be funny seeing miller back in a bulls uni. Maybe we can get shaq to swing at him again! DIdnt know ruffin was still in the league, but isnt it a weird deal that they are sending ruffin to portland who sends diogu to sacto? Doesnt seem necessary for salary reasons, so Im not really sure what goes on. I guess sacto stockpiles more ****.

[J000]

Bulls Win.
They get rid of pathetic Nocioni who has been **** this year and get John Salmons a scoring monster this year, and a cnadidate for most improved this year. Miller for Gooden will be fine for both sides.

Bulls win!

[TheGreatDeraj]

Why are people saying this is a bad trade for the Bulls? Bulls get an actual starting caliber center in Brad Miller. This pushes Noah,Gray down the depth chart where they should be. Drew Gooden is traded which means more minutes for Tyrus Thomas. He is only in his second year, he will get better. Maybe not all-star, but better than he is now.

Nocioni is shooting 41% from the floor, no thanks. I'll take a more versitle(sp) player in Salmons, who has much better stats.

[boozehound]

Why are people saying this is a bad trade for the Bulls? Bulls get an actual starting caliber center in Brad Miller. This pushes Noah,Gray down the depth chart where they should be. Drew Gooden is traded which means more minutes for Tyrus Thomas. He is only in his second year, he will get better. Maybe not all-star, but better than he is now.

Nocioni is shooting 41% from the floor, no thanks. I'll take a more versitle(sp) player in Salmons, who has much better stats.
3rd year

[Jasper]

welcome back Brad Miller. :applause:

Problem is he doesn't have a whole lot left in the tank and I am sure he would of prefered going to a playoff team or for that matter 2nd stringer on a contending team , now he watchs the playoff's from his farm.

As for Nocioni - he just disappeared in the league. No where to be seen again or for that matter relavent until someone with a trade kicker gets him , so he can play a viable role in a playoff series.

Sometimes you got to feel for these players ...

[Meticode]

As for Nocioni - he just disappeared in the league. No where to be seen again or for that matter relavent until someone with a trade kicker gets him , so he can play a viable role in a playoff series.

He still played pretty regularly up until the trade, unless you mean disappeared as far as production like when when they made the playoffs.

[No.45]

Brad Miller Was Supposed To Go To The Spurs!! Nooooooooo

[J000]

Brad Miller Was Supposed To Go To The Spurs!! Nooooooooo

Last time I heard, they were good with Matt Bonner. Career year for the Red Rocket, and plus Brad Miller plays somewhat similar to Tim Duncan, why would you want two of the same, rather than having some variety with Bonner?

[1~Gibson~1]

Brad Miller Was Supposed To Go To The Cavs!! NoooooooooFixed

[ConanRulesNBC]

I'd say the Bulls improve with this. Brad Miller is way better than Noah, Gray and Drew Gooden. Nocioni is okay but it's not like he was the best player on the team.

Miller
Thomas
Deng
Gordon
Rose

That's a much more solid lineup than what the Bulls have had.

[ConanRulesNBC]

When will the Bulls pull their heads out of their asses and trade for A legit superstar who will compliment Rose. I would really hate to be a Bulls fan.

Like who? They wanted Amare but Kerr changed his mind. The Bulls can still try and trade Hughes and Kirk Hinrich and then re-sign Ben Gordon and try and sign Carlos Boozer during the offseason.

[ConanRulesNBC]

Brad Miller and John Salmons are, by FAR, the best Bulls players not named Derrick Rose. This is one step closer to breaking up that weak core.

Tyrus Thomas, Kirk Hinrich, Ben Gordon and Luol Deng > John Salmons.

[1~Gibson~1]

Rose/Kirk
Salmons/BG
Deng/Sefalosha
TT/Noah
Miller/Gray

solid lineup :applause:

[1~Gibson~1]

Tyrus Thomas, Kirk Hinrich, Ben Gordon and Luol Deng > John Salmons.:confusedshrug:

[hawkfan]

Too bad the Hawks didn't get Miller for Zaza and Speedy.

Maybe Zaza will take the most of the opportunity to be more consistent. One night 18 rebounds - outstanding. Next night. 5 fouls, 2 rebounds.

[ConanRulesNBC]

:confusedshrug:

He's a walking double double. He still has ways to go but he's improved big time in the past month or so. If he keeps this up I see no reason why he can't turn into a regular 20/10 player.

[All Net]

Big bad Brad back in Chicago? could be a good move. One of those deals that could help both teams.

[D-Rose]

He's a walking double double. He still has ways to go but he's improved big time in the past month or so. If he keeps this up I see no reason why he can't turn into a regular 20/10 player.
His recent defensive intensity has impressed me.

[John Smith]

I'd say the Bulls improve with this. Brad Miller is way better than Noah, Gray and Drew Gooden. Nocioni is okay but it's not like he was the best player on the team.

Miller
Thomas
Deng
Gordon
Rose

That's a much more solid lineup than what the Bulls have had.

Yeah, that's solid. It's not Celtics territory but playoff worthy. but you did the bulls an injustice when you did not list their 2nd team which is simply AMAZING:

Hinrich
Salmons
Sefolosha
Noah
Gray

nobody can touch that.

and just for the record, Salmons should start at the 2 and BG should move back to 6th man where he's won that award before.

[John Smith]

Too bad the Hawks didn't get Miller for Zaza and Speedy.

Maybe Zaza will take the most of the opportunity to be more consistent. One night 18 rebounds - outstanding. Next night. 5 fouls, 2 rebounds.

LOL @ this clown bringin up ZaZa. That femmy euro is only good for one thing and that's ticking off Kevin Garnett in the playoffs.

[GOBB]

Sources: Bulls, Kings pull off deal

By Chris Sheridan


The Chicago Bulls and Sacramento Kings have reached tentative agreement on a trade sending Andres Nocioni, Drew Gooden, Michael Ruffin and Cedric Simmons to the Kings for Brad Miller and John Salmons, front-office sources said on Wednesday.


The Kings would then turn around and ship Ruffin to the Portland Trail Blazers for forward Ike Diogu and cash considerations, sources told ESPN's Chris Broussard.

One source told ESPN.com that the Bulls players were pulled off the team bus Wednesday afternoon and were told they had been traded.

"I've been traded before and the way I look at it is it means somebody wants you," Gooden said, according to the Chicago Tribune. "Sacramento has been interested in me for a couple years, so maybe something can work out long-term there. If not, I'm an unrestricted free agent this summer, so I'm auditioning for other teams."

Talks between Sacramento and Chicago moved to an advanced stage this week, as ESPN.com reported earlier Wednesday, after the Kings were unsuccessful packaging Miller and Salmons in a deal with New York.

The Chicago-Sacramento trade is likely to be finalized later Wednesday, but one source close to the process cautioned that the deal could still be expanded to include additional players.

Another source indicated that the Kings had hoped to convince Chicago to accept center Mikki Moore instead of Salmons so Sacramento could trade Salmons in a separate move. The Bulls, though, want Salmons and the Kings did not oppose it because of long-term financial savings they're gaining from the trade.

Miller is averaging 11.9 points and 8.0 rebounds per game for the 11-43 Kings. One of the better passing big men in the league, Miller has made two All-Star teams and actually played for the Bulls from 2000-02.

This will be the third team for Salmons in his seven-year career. He is averaging a career high 18.3 points per game, well above his career mark of 8.3.

The gritty Nocioni has played his entire five-year career with the Bulls, averaging 11.7 points and 5.0 rebounds over that time bouncing between the starting five and the bench. He signed a five-year extension in 2007.


Gooden was traded to the Bulls last season in the deal that sent Ben Wallace to the Cleveland Cavaliers. He was averaging 13.1 points and 8.6 rebounds in an injury-plagued year. The number that likely interested the Kings the most, however, is the $7.2 million that will come off their books this summer since he has an expiring contract. Simmons also has an expiring contract, so the Kings basically traded the salaries of Miller and Salmons for Nocioni's.

"I enjoyed my time in Chicago," Gooden said, according to the Tribune. "It's a good bunch of guys and great management. They treat players with respect. I just wish we had won more and I had been healthier."

The Sacramento Bee reported on its Web site Wednesday that the Kings also offered Miller and Salmons to New Jersey in a deal that would net Ryan Anderson, Stromile Swift, Trenton Hassell and Eduardo Najera.

Chicago's ability to land Salmons would deeply disappoint two Southwest Division rivals -- Dallas and San Antonio -- which have been chasing the 29-year-old. Portland and Oklahoma City have also been frequently linked with Salmons.

With an offer of Bruce Bowen and Ime Udoka, San Antonio viewed Salmons as a far more affordable trade target for its perimeter rotation than Vince Carter. New Jersey's Carter has tempted the small-market Spurs for days but can be absorbed by them only in a hugely expensive and complicated deal.

The Mavericks have been offering Jerry Stackhouse's virtual expiring contract ($7 million this season, only $2 million guaranteed next season) to the Kings since this past summer, when Sacramento was shopping Ron Artest. The biggest obstacle for Dallas on a Salmons deal had been the Kings' insistence that the Mavericks -- lacking draft picks to sweeten the deal -- also take back guard Beno Udrih, who has four years and nearly $27 million remaining on his contract after this season.

There has been another complication for interested parties: Sources revealed Tuesday that Salmons has a 15 percent trade kicker in his contract that requires the team that acquires him to pay him a bonus of nearly $2 million and add that figure to its payroll. Salmons otherwise would rank as one of the league's better bargains, earning just $5.1 million this season while averaging 18.3 points and shooting 47.2 percent from the field and 41.8 percent on 3-pointers.


Chris Sheridan covers the NBA for ESPN Insider. Chris Broussard covers the NBA for ESPN The Magazine. ESPN.com's Marc Stein contributed to this report.

Espn News just reported it being official.

[bigkingsfan]

This trade is pending if the Kings can land anyone big this summer, otherwise it's a total failure. No picks, contracts are about the same, and 2 bench players in return.

[GOBB]

Kings landing someone big? lol Another funny by you. Keep em coming.

[Meticode]

Edited.

[bigkingsfan]

Kings landing someone big? lol Another funny by you. Keep em coming.
Eddy Curry might be available, so fk off.

[John Smith]

Eddy Curry might be available, so fk off.

You know the Bulls won the trade. It's a bad trade for the Kings, just admit it. It's cool.

[Jasper]

He still played pretty regularly up until the trade, unless you mean disappeared as far as production like when when they made the playoffs.

no I am refering to Nocioni going to the Kings .... he'll be long gone before the Kings are back in the playoff's.
He's got some years left on a contract and now he is stuck playing there.

[bigkingsfan]

You know the Bulls won the trade. It's a bad trade for the Kings, just admit it. It's cool.
When did I say the trade was a good one. This trade is bad, with potential to be horrendous, as previously explained.

[gutshot]

Excellent trade for the Bulls. Salmons is a very underrated player and Miller is a solid big guy. These changes will make Bulls a better team.

[Undisputed]

Love this trade as a Bulls fan. Miller will be solid playing with a PG that attracts as much attention from defenders as Rose. He'll get a lot of open looks from his sweet spots.

Everyone can talk trash and say this is a bad trade just because the Bulls couldn't grab a superstar. I wasn't expecting a blockbuster trade, this isn't the first trade deadline I've witnessed unlike a lot of others. This trade helps the Bulls. Noc has been killing us lately, I feel he'll do better in a new environment. Salmons is is averaging 18 points a game. I don't care what positon he plays, he brings much needed scoring.

This potentially puts the Bulls in the playoffs, but a sure first round exit. In my opinion, that's mission accomplished for this season. Coming into the season, everyone had the Bulls tanking.

Bulls will make more moves before the deadline.

[John Smith]

6 pages...lol. if this trade involved John Salmons (20 ppgs) and Brad Miller going to any other team than the Bulls it would have 12+ pages. It just goes to show how many Chicago Bull haters there really are reading this thread. F U! can't touch this.

:hammertime:

[John Smith]

When did I say the trade was a good one. This trade is bad, with potential to be horrendous, as previously explained.

Exactly, you just got Kenny Thomas Part Deux.

[Mississippi]

Gordon may move back to the bench now.

[GOBB]

6 pages...lol. if this trade involved John Salmons (20 ppgs) and Brad Miller going to any other team than the Bulls it would have 12+ pages. It just goes to show how many Chicago Bull haters there really are reading this thread. F U! can't touch this.

:hammertime:

Wow someone making up stuff. Bulls haters? Where? Not many here care for the Bulls team outside of Derrick Rose. Try again. :rolleyes:

[Undisputed]

6 pages...lol. if this trade involved John Salmons (20 ppgs) and Brad Miller going to any other team than the Bulls it would have 12+ pages. It just goes to show how many Chicago Bull haters there really are reading this thread. F U! can't touch this.

:hammertime:

I don't think they're Bulls haters, just Kings fans. They have a reason to be upset. Pretty bad move for the Kings aside from financial relief.

[Showtime]

I don't like this deal because of the money and length involved in Nocioni's deal. I don't see what he can do better than John Salmons, and I do see things John does that he doesn't. John comes relatively cheap by the league's standards, and that has two more years at around 11 mil left. Contrast that with Nocioni's 3 (with an option for another) years with 20+ mil left (although it is a declining contract with the money decreasing instead of increasing). So, he's making a few more mil a year for a longer period of time and isn't a better player.

In regards to the other pieces:

Geoff has coveted Gooden and tried to get him before. However, he's an expiring deal, and I doubt the Kings would try to re-sign him. Simmons has moved around a lot and isn't a relevant piece.

Overall, if the point was to dump salary, I don't see how this helps. Why not? Because Brad's deal is up after next season anyway, and John is cheap. I don't see why Miller would have to be moved NOW to save money when he could be moved next year in his expiring year, and if not then the team is rid of him because his contract is up anyway. The only reason for this was to save money this year instead of next year. I thought the point of trading a big contract and a quality player was to get something in return to help the future, not the same level of player (Nocioni) who gets paid MORE. I'm left scratching my head after this one.

[John Smith]

I don't think they're Bulls haters, just Kings fans. They have a reason to be upset. Pretty bad move for the Kings aside from financial relief.

Great point dude. The Kings would have been better not making a trade at all! :lol

[Jasper]

This potentially puts the Bulls in the playoffs, but a sure first round exit. In my opinion, that's mission accomplished for this season. Coming into the season, everyone had the Bulls tanking.Bulls will make more moves before the deadline.

who are you kidding ???
prior to the season when people were picking places for the end of the season , the Bulls were placed any where's from 4th seed to no lower than 7th.

Bulls were and still are grossly overrated.

[John Smith]

who are you kidding, im jaspa the 3 dollar bill ???
prior to the season when people were picking places for the end of the season , the Bulls were placed any where's from 4th seed to no lower than 7th.

Bulls were and still are grossly overrated.

how you can be 7 or 8 games UNDER .500 is beyond me. but we'll leave that to the HATAS...drink that gatorade it taste better, G.

[Undisputed]

who are you kidding ???
prior to the season when people were picking places for the end of the season , the Bulls were placed any where's from 4th seed to no lower than 7th.

Bulls were and still are grossly overrated.

Everyone who's not a moron had the Bulls not even making the playoffs. Coming into the season, this Bulls team was basically the same lottery team with a rookie coach and rooke PG. The popular opinion amoungst educated NBA fans was that Bulls would struggle to even get into the playoffs.

[Biddy77]

strooooong move for the Bulls. good in the short term with those aquisitions, and good in the long term with all the cap space they're going to have coming to them.

[John Smith]

strooooong move for the Bulls. good in the short term with those aquisitions, and good in the long term with all the cap space they're going to have coming to them.

D-Wade/Rose


You heard it here first . 2010 we bout it.


All Chitown backcourt baby :pimp:

[marny_navis]

Chicago Bulls

Projected 8-man rotation (with salary and years left)

PG: Derrick Rose (5 mil, 2 years)
SG: Ben Gordon (6.5 mil, 1 year)
SF: Luol Deng (9.5 mil, 6 years)
PF: Tyrus Thomas (3.5 mil, 2 years)
C: Brad Miller (11.5 mil, 2 years)

G Kirk Hinrich (10 mil, 4 years), G/F John Salmons (6 mil, 3 years), C Joakim Noah (2 mil, 2 years)

Notable: Larry Hughes (12.5 mil, 2 years)

I'm assuming Gordon starts, considering Salmons new to the system.

Short-term impact

Chicago gets a solid interior big man that can score, rebound, and pass. While Gooden's on the same level as a player, Miller's also 3 inches taller and fills a bigger need at center than Gooden at forward. This won't make a huge impact on the Bulls, but it makes them stronger in their weakest area. They're adequate inside now.

Salmons is versatile and scores well. At 6'7" he provides a lot more size than Gordon in the backcourt, which should help out on defense. He can play with Gordon and a point as a 3, or at the 2 with Deng at the 3 and Rose/Hinrich at point. Larry Hughes hasn't panned out, so Salmons fills a need here on the perimeter.

I don't see this trade having a big effect right now; Miller/Salmons isn't a huge upgrade over Nocioni and Gooden, though both are definitely better fits for Chicago. They could win a few more games with these two guys, but they're getting more out of the deal long-term.

Long-term impact

Luol Deng (6), John Salmons (3), and Kirk Hinrich (4) are now the only players on the Bulls whose contracts extend past two years (unlesss some young guys have options, which I expect they do), which adds up to about $25 million combined, around $30 mil if you add some options. I believe that puts them about $30 million under the cap, if the cap's going to be around 60 mil in 2010.

If this is the case, Chicago will have the opportunity to get a high-profile free agent in the summer of 2010 along with bringing back Thomas/Noah (if their contracts run out by 2010, they'll need to be re-signed; if not, they can have their options excercized for a few mil apiece). Getting a superstar next to Rose is important, and Chicago has a good shot of doing so.

The Bulls have two things that will work for them in free agency: a talented young core of players, and a strong history that will be sure to attract FA's over other market players like, say, the Kings (just using them as an example; don't know if they'll have the room but I assume they will). Most big time players aren't going to go to a team like Sacramento or Memphis, so Chicago's got that going for them with the whole 90s dynasty. Other teams like New York and New Jersey won't have a talented nucleus in place like the Bulls will with Rose, Deng, maybe Hinrich and Thomas if they stick, count Noah as a solid role player.

Overall

The Bulls have accomplished a tough thing: improving their team in the short term, while also being able to contend in free agency in the long-term. Good deal for them.

* I think they should work on trading Hinrich for some extra cap room, maybe a pick? That'd make it easier for free agency in 2010, assuring them they could bring back Thomas and Noah and still sign a top-tier free agent. Collins/Cardinal from Minny is a rumor I heard earlier.

Sacramento Kings

Projected 8-man rotation

PG: Beno Udrih (5.5 mil, 4 years)
SG: Kevin Martin (9 mil, 5 years)
SF: Francisco Garcia (2 mil, 5 years)
PF: Jason Thompson (2 mil, 2 years)
C: Spencer Hawes (2 mil, 2 years)

F Drew Gooden (7 mil, 1 year), F/C Mikki Moore (5.5 mil, 2 years), G Bobby Jackson (6.5 mil, 1 year)

Notable: F Kenny Thomas (8.5 mil, 2 years)

Short-term impact

The Kings take a small step back in the short term. John Salmons is a reliable 18 PPG scorer on the perimeter, and Brad Miller's good for around 10/10. Nocioni's a proven veteran scorer at forward, but not of Salmons's caliber. Gooden's a solid power forward, and could probably make an impact comparable to Miller. I think they stay the same, maybe lose a couple extra games.

Long-term impact

Someone earlier compared the acquisition of Nocioni to that of Kenny Thomas, and I agree. Noch is more useful than Thomas, but 5 years is a long contract for a role player. This gives them less flexibility via trade/free agency. They could have kept Salmons, who does more than Andres and only had 3 years left, and a valuable 6 mil.

Brad Miller didn't fit with the Kings' current direction, but I think they could've found a better trade offer. If they couldn't, they'd have his expiring contract next year, which would be extremely valuable. Gooden's a solid replacement, but he's likely only going to be around for the remainder of the season. Maybe they re-sign him in the offseason for a low price as a solid backup.

Not a bright future for the Kings. A lot of their young guys get significant playing time, but they have very little talent/starpower on the team. Maybe if they could somehow land a great big man (Blake Griffin in the draft; though it would be redundant getting all of these bigs in the lottery, he'd be a great complement to Martin) things could work out, otherwise I see this team being filled with a bunch of good role players, led by a guy I think should be a #2 option for a championship-contending team in Martin.

A touch on free agency: No one big's going to want to come to Sacramento. They'll have to build the team the hard way, via good trades and solid drafting.

Overall

They would've been better off keeping what they had and not going through with the trade. However, get a star down low, and the Kings have a shot at climbing back near the top of the Western Conference; don't, and they'll just be an average team for the next few years and start all over.

[A.M.G.]

The Bulls still need a star big man to pair with D-Rose. Maybe Boozer, maybe a 2010 FA. They still need to trade Hinrich, dump Hughes, and try to explain to Ben Gordon that he is best suited as a 6th man... with them. But they finally have an actual starting center, and Salmons is a legit scorer. Plus they get rid of Noc who they don't need.

As for the Kings, dag, why give up Salmons in a deal to move Miller? Dude was an absolute bargain, 17ppg. And no pick coming back in this deal? Man, they probably could have gotten a better deal from the Knicks or whoever else for Miller, maybe gotten Curry and whipped him back into a 20 ppg guy.

I guess they could commit to Noc as their starting SF, let Gooden expire and move on. It's nice they managed to trade Ruffin immediately for a somewhat more promising player in Diogu (why do the Blazers want Ruffi?). But again, the Kings should have been getting a first rounder back here.

[ConanRulesNBC]

who are you kidding ???
prior to the season when people were picking places for the end of the season , the Bulls were placed any where's from 4th seed to no lower than 7th.

Bulls were and still are grossly overrated.

Overrated how? Have you seen what the fans have been posting on the Bulls forum? No one is overrating this team at all.

[trig]

Brad Miller might not be a good defensive player but it sure is better than gooden. Plus he's a good passing center while Gooden doesn't pass at all. Salmons is better than noce and has a better contract. This certainly improves the team atleast on paper.

Long term, it gives chicago some additional cap space. Or they use Miller and Hughes as trade baits next season. Another option is to resign Brad Miller after 2010 if he's willing to sign a short cheap contract. Salmons gives insurance in case Kirk is traded and/or gordon signs elsewhere.

I was actually expecting chicago to take on Kenny Thomas contract in order to get rid of Noce. Good trade pax

[puppychili]

What happened to Noce? That guys was a good solid hustle player. I loved to watch him play under Skiles. But recently he's kinda fallen apart. Was it just the big contract or something else too?

[joe]

This trade is a complete slap in the face for King's fans. Not only did ownership worsen the team this season, but somehow, the long-term contractual implications are worse.

Does anyone realize that Andres Nocioni, all 10 PPG and 40% shooting of him, is signed on through 2012? It's a descending contract, but you're paying him at least 6 Million dollars for 3 seasons AFTER this one. So you lose Salmons, who is a much better and more efficient scorer, who also has a shorter contract at less money, for this guy?

For what? to unload Brad Miller's money off the cap, in exchange for Drew Gooden's expiring contract. I understand that the salary cap will decrease next season, but in a blatant salary dump, the Kings also managed to cripple their future, just so the owner doesn't lose money. This should be where the NBA starts drawing the line.

If these billionairre owners want to make money, go invest in something else. To sabotage a teams future to salvage your wallet is complete bull, plain and simple. The people of Sacramento should be rioting in the streets.

Sad thing is, we're going to see more and more of these types of deals, thanks to the worsening economy. This is just the beginning.

[Hans-Wolfe-#-17]

This is good first step forward for Bulls. Two more years and help is on the way to Chicago for post-player much needed.

[niko]

What happened to Noce? That guys was a good solid hustle player. I loved to watch him play under Skiles. But recently he's kinda fallen apart. Was it just the big contract or something else too?

i think all the argentinian players are like 3 years older than their listed age. i'm not kidding. that's why they all play like old men.

[Showtime]

This trade is a complete slap in the face for King's fans. Not only did ownership worsen the team this season, but somehow, the long-term contractual implications are worse.

Does anyone realize that Andres Nocioni, all 10 PPG and 40% shooting of him, is signed on through 2012? It's a descending contract, but you're paying him at least 6 Million dollars for 3 seasons AFTER this one. So you lose Salmons, who is a much better and more efficient scorer, who also has a shorter contract at less money, for this guy?

For what? to unload Brad Miller's money off the cap, in exchange for Drew Gooden's expiring contract. I understand that the salary cap will decrease next season, but in a blatant salary dump, the Kings also managed to cripple their future, just so the owner doesn't lose money. This should be where the NBA starts drawing the line.

If these billionairre owners want to make money, go invest in something else. To sabotage a teams future to salvage your wallet is complete bull, plain and simple. The people of Sacramento should be rioting in the streets.

Sad thing is, we're going to see more and more of these types of deals, thanks to the worsening economy. This is just the beginning.
Agree. It doesn't make sense to me because Miller was going to enter his expiring year next season, so he certainly could be moved during that time, and if not, then he would be off the books anyway. They made this deal just for one year of his salary, and in the process hurt them in the long run since John was a better player than Noc, and had a cheaper, shorter deal. Kings made the wrong choice for both the financial situation, and a talent/future success situation.

[joe]

Agree. It doesn't make sense to me because Miller was going to enter his expiring year next season, so he certainly could be moved during that time, and if not, then he would be off the books anyway. They made this deal just for one year of his salary, and in the process hurt them in the long run since John was a better player than Noc, and had a cheaper, shorter deal. Kings made the wrong choice for both the financial situation, and a talent/future success situation.

Ya, the thing is, if you have Miller on your team next season his contract counts towards your cap, and the Kings don't want to pay the luxury tax. They were probably first looking to just move Miller for an expirer, but couldn't find that kind of deal, so had to give up a young player to sweeten the pot.

But this move is absolutely dispicable. If they had made this trade to the Cavaliers, or some other contender, ESPN would be having a heart attack right now. Since it was just to the lowly Bulls, no one notices. But the Kings owner really gave a big "Eff You" to their fans with this one.

[TheBigAristotle1]

Noc is younger then Salmons and over his career has been a better player then Salmons. Noc never really got a chance with the Bulls, because the Bulls were so heavily invested in Deng, but Noc can play. When Noc was a starter he averaged better numbers then Salmons (about the same PPG, but w/more rebounds).

Subjectively I think Noc is actually a better player then Salmons, Noc has much better form on his jumpshot (believe me this matters), and more moves offensively. Neither Noc or Salmons are great athletes but Noc is stronger, and has better leaping ability (something that matters for a Forward). Salmons is a better fit for the Bulls because he is more versatile, and a more stable player, but Noc is overall the better player.

Brad Miller is a better fit on the Bulls (who need a scoring center), then Drew Gooden (a jumpshooting powerforward). What the bulls lacked was a big gaurd, and a legit bigman. They filled both of those needs.

[Showtime]

Noc is younger then Salmons and over his career has been a better player then Salmons.

They are very close in age, and John > Noc on both ends of the court.


Noc never really got a chance with the Bulls, because the Bulls were so heavily invested in Deng, but Noc can play. When Noc was a starter he averaged better numbers then Salmons (about the same PPG, but w/more rebounds).

And John wasn't successful in Philly with AI, and became a 20/5/5 level player with the Kings when starting, while shooting a better FG%, hovering around 50% FG and 40% from 3.


Subjectively I think Noc is actually a better player then Salmons, Noc has much better form on his jumpshot (believe me this matters), and more moves offensively. Neither Noc or Salmons are great athletes but Noc is stronger, and has better leaping ability (something that matters for a Forward). Salmons is a better fit for the Bulls because he is more versatile, and a more stable player, but Noc is overall the better player.

From what I've seen of both players, the only think Noc has over John is dunking ability.

[TheBigAristotle1]

Showtime,

This year no question Salmons has been better, over their carreers I think Noc is the better player, definitely on offense. Salmons is an excellent player, I'm happy to have him on the Bulls, I think Kings fans are underestimating Nocioni because he is having a bad year.


And John wasn't successful in Philly with AI, and became a 20/5/5 level player with the Kings when starting, while shooting a better FG%, hovering around 50% FG and 40% from 3.

Salmons is playing like a beast this year, no question. I prefer to judge players by their carreers not by how they are doing right now.

[TheBigAristotle1]

One more thing: I hope that Salmons continues to play as he does and eventually moves either Gordon or Deng to the Bench. My only objection is to Kings fans who feel that Salmons is worlds better then Noc, he's not. Both players are underrated, Noc is more underrated IMHO.

[Showtime]

One more thing: I hope that Salmons continues to play as he does and eventually moves either Gordon or Deng to the Bench. My only objection is to Kings fans who feel that Salmons is worlds better then Noc, he's not. Both players are underrated, Noc is more underrated IMHO.
Worlds better? Who said worlds better? He's just better, period. When starting, he can be a 20/5/5 level player (last season) and put up nearly that with 18/4/4 this year along with around 50% FG shooting and 40% from 3. That's far better production than Noc, and John is a proven defender who has even limited Kobe. Is he a star? Certainly not, but considering his superior play on both ends of the court and lower salary, it's understandable why many feel switching those two players was a loss for Sacramento.

[TheBigAristotle1]

Worlds better? Who said worlds better? He's just better, period. When starting, he can be a 20/5/5 level player (last season) and put up nearly that with 18/4/4 this year along with around 50% FG shooting and 40% from 3. That's far better production than Noc, and John is a proven defender who has even limited Kobe. Is he a star? Certainly not, but considering his superior play on both ends of the court and lower salary, it's understandable why many feel switching those two players was a loss for Sacramento.

As a starter Nocioni averaged (for his carreer), 13.9/6.1/1.5 while taking 11.2 shots per game, and averaging 29:30 mpg. Those are very solid carreer numbers.

Salmons for his carreer as a starter averaged 14.0/4.2/3.6 while taking 11.3 shots per game, and averaging 34:42 mpg.

Overall Salmons took .1 more shots per game and averaged .1 more points per game (making Noc carreer wise a more effecient scorer). Noc also scored more points per minute. Noc is clearly the better scorer and rebounder, and Salmons is obviously the better passer.

This year Salmons is averaging carreer bests, and has started all 53 games, he is averaging 18.3/4.2/3.7 while taking 14.0 shots and playing 37:23 seconds per game.

Noc at his best (as a starter) averaged 16.9/6.4/1.1 while taking 12.7 shots and playing 29:23 seconds per game.

You can give Salmons the edge because he has better carreer assist numbers and right now he is playing better then Noc. Or you can give Noc the edge because historically he did it on better teams, and for a longer period of time. Saying one guy is clearly better is ridiculous.

http://sports.yahoo.com/nba/players/3624/splits?year=career&type=Fielding
http://sports.yahoo.com/nba/players/3882/splits?year=career&type=Fielding

[Showtime]

As a starter Nocioni averaged (for his carreer), 13.9/6.1/1.5 while taking 11.2 shots per game, and averaging 29:30 mpg. Those are very solid carreer numbers.

Salmons for his carreer as a starter averaged 14.0/4.2/3.6 while taking 11.3 shots per game, and averaging 34:42 mpg.

Overall Salmons took .1 more shots per game and averaged .1 more points per game (making Noc carreer wise a more effecient scorer). Noc also scored more points per minute. Noc is clearly the better scorer and rebounder, and Salmons is obviously the better passer.

This year Salmons is averaging carreer bests, and has started all 53 games, he is averaging 18.3/4.2/3.7 while taking 14.0 shots and playing 37:23 seconds per game.

Noc at his best (as a starter) averaged 16.9/6.4/1.1 while taking 12.7 shots and playing 29:23 seconds per game.

You can give Salmons the edge because he has better carreer assist numbers and right now he is playing better then Noc. Or you can give Noc the edge because historically he did it on better teams, and for a longer period of time. Saying one guy is clearly better is ridiculous.

http://sports.yahoo.com/nba/players/3624/splits?year=career&type=Fielding
http://sports.yahoo.com/nba/players/3882/splits?year=career&type=Fielding
How is saying John is better being ridiculous? You said it yourself: right now at this very moment in their careers, John is playing better. Not only is he, at this point in his career, producing more than Noc offensively, he's better defensively as well, something you never addressed (probably because it's not all stats). You can keep bringing up career numbers all you want, but right now, both players are similar in age, and John is playing better at BOTH ends of the court. He is the better player.

[theballerFKA Ace]

Dude has potential.

Hopefully he reaches it one day.

Dude has less potential than Swift,Tim Thomas, and DMiles. If he was gonna be something we would have seen it by now.

A player, especially a non-center, needs at least 2 of these 3 things to succeed in the NBA besides athletic ability. Motivation, shooting and court IQ. So it looks like all signs point to dissapointment for Ty.

[smush=mvp!]

brad miller will not provide the inside scoring or boards that they need// not sure why bulls traded away the guy with most heart on the team nocioni

[El Kabong]

brad miller will not provide the inside scoring or boards that they need// not sure why bulls traded away the guy with most heart on the team nocioni
Even if he doesn't, having Brad Miller on the team is a hell of a lot better then having Noah or Gray who don't provide all that much offensively.

[sak]

Salmons Is WAY better then hes givin credit for... he was the deal maker... Bulls Are probably gonna move deng or one of there little guys they use as a 2guard in the off season.. salmons can fill both those rolls... chicago made out on this deal...Kings are throwing darts at a board... hoping something hits bullseye... For the first time I have no clue what there trying to do as a team.. Second worse trade i have seen them make... First of course the Webber deal.

[Undisputed]

Miller is averaging 12.4 points and eight rebounds in the 14 games of his second Bulls stint. Many of his contributions — setting proper angles on screens, tipping balls for extra possessions — don't appear in box scores.

"I'm not playing as many minutes, so it's like just fight like the younger days when I didn't have to worry about playing 40 minutes," Miller said. "I don't have to conserve as much energy. So it makes it easier."

Miller is averaging 27.5 minutes with the Bulls, but it's telling that he typically is playing in the fourth quarter.

The Bulls are 7-7 since Miller and Salmons started playing. With a three-game win streak and the playoffs in sight.

http://www.chicagotribune.com/sports/basketball/bulls/chi-20-bulls-chicago-mar20,0,6587248.story

[sak]

Conserve energy? Are u kidding me... thats the excuse... Dude... I dont know about anyone else but that drives me up the wall... Would anyone else want 27 good hard working min or 40 halfa$$ min? :hammerhead: Thats right... Any couch is gonna get you rest if your bustin your butt... Sad excuse miller.:( .. Everyone Knows he can play... He just didnt bring intensity every night... that comment proves it.

[emsteez forreal]

Kaboom!

Bulls don't improve at all.

What position does Luol Deng play?PF?

haha, it's so funny reading this now.

[GreatGreg]

How come this thread is still stickied? lol...