Michael Jordan ran a 4.3 40 yard dash, and had a 48" vertical!

[bruceblitz]

"Smith says Jordan is the hardest worker he's ever coached. In high school Jordan hustled so, he was nicknamed The Rabbit. Rabbit, run. When he enrolled at Chapel Hill, Jordan ran the 40-yard dash in 4.6 seconds. This fall he ran a 4.3. By running and lifting weights he has substantially built up his upper body and gained 12 pounds in two years, most of it in the shoulders."
http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/basketball/nba/1999/jordan_retires/archive/831128/
Also Jordan was on a sports special on national TV in the early 90's with Deion Sanders and he was doing sprints with Deion and Jordan ran a 4.3 40 yard dash on TV. I would love to see that again!

Michael Jordan also had a 48 inch verical. Obviously he wasn't maxing out his jump on every play, but Michael Jordan's max jump was 48"!!
http://vertcoach.com/highest-vertical-leap.html

Fun video I made of LeBron James, the current game's best athlete, and Michael Jordan, dunking:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IyFMCnHxcxE

Real footage of Michael Jordan:
http://youtube.com/theAIRJORDANblitz
http://youtube.com/hoopsencyclopedia

Other footage of Michael Jordan can be found:
http://youtube.com/mustseebbtv

plus many more channels on youtube.

[inclinerator]

that means his head should have been 5 inches above the rim on his max jumps!

[OldSchoolBBall]

Yeah, I don't think MJ had a 48" vert, more like 42-44", which would put his head at rim level or slightly above.

[w00terz]

48 inch vertical my ass. He may be the GOAT, but he's not Jesus.

[bleedinpurpleTwo]

:roll:

rrriiiiight!

[Shepseskaf]

but he's not Jesus.
Shuttlesworth?

[gibbo3000]

the high vertical numbers that they use in the NBA aren't the actual vertical leap, they are with a step of run-up, not standing still and jumping vertically
Not to take anything away from a 48 inch vertical off one step

[Mdog1]

My freind has a 36 inch vertical is 5'9" and can run a 4.31 40 yard dash. Funny thing is he has no work ethic what so ever, he is just one of the most athletic people ever. He works out like 2 times a week, doesn't run at all unless it is during sports. He literally dunks a basketball in two steps. I hate him :(

[Scott Pippen]

48 inches? :ohwell:

[bruceblitz]

:confusedshrug: Kadour Xiani has a 60 inch vertical, I guess at 5'9" where does that put Xiani's head? Randy Moss has a 51 inch vertical. I posted the links for proof. These are verticals recorded without the ball. Jordan legitimately had a 48" vertical. I saw him run a 4.3 live on TV, he had a 48" vertical which he displayed live on TV, and he also threw a football over 60 yards.

It was a special event that was run by Deion Sanders. I guess a lot of you Johnny come latelys have a lot to learn.

Kids (sigh)

[Cyclone112]

assuming that list is right and that one dude has a 60 inch vert that is just ****ing nuts.

[OneMoreSucka]

Not a chance in hell he had a 48 inch vertical Not to mention the mathematical flaw in that his standing reach is 8'10 yet his highest reach is 12'6. If he actually had a 48 inch vert, he would reach 12'10......

Fail.

[Mdog1]

:confusedshrug: Kadour Xiani has a 60 inch vertical, I guess at 5'9" where does that put Xiani's head? Randy Moss has a 51 inch vertical. I posted the links for proof. These are verticals recorded without the ball. Jordan legitimately had a 48" vertical. I saw him run a 4.3 live on TV, he had a 48" vertical which he displayed live on TV, and he also threw a football over 60 yards.

It was a special event that was run by Deion Sanders. I guess a lot of you Johnny come latelys have a lot to learn.

Kids (sigh)
My freind can throw a football 73 yards, and can hit a reciever accurately for 57 yards. By accurate I mean like 50% or so.

[bruceblitz]

Not a chance in hell he had a 48 inch vertical Not to mention the mathematical flaw in that his standing reach is 8'10 yet his highest reach is 12'6. If he actually had a 48 inch vert, he would reach 12'10......

Fail.

You don't reach up in the air when you do your vertical jump, reaching up will diminish your vertical leap in most cases because you adjust the body in order to be able to reach, I also assume that you are a moron who thinks Jordan was actually 6'6".... anyways....

You might want to read this:
http://www.celebheights.com/s/Michael-Jordan-1482.html

[OneMoreSucka]

:roll: :roll: :roll:

[gibbo3000]

If those stats are correct, both vince and jordan and a few others could dunk a 12 foot ring without a run up, vertically, I find that questionable

[halffttime]

Shuttlesworth?

not shuttlesworth from coney island, he meant christ from nazareth..

[halffttime]

jordan having a 48 vertical is believable.. if you think about it we've seen him perform many in-game dunks where his head rim-level or close to.. if you think about he could probably jump a good 2-5 inches higher than that without a ball and a good run up...

[bdreason]

That's exactly what ISH needed, another Jordan groupie. :rolleyes:

[Myth]

My first thought was "no way" but after thinking about it, Jordan is 6'6". Jumping 48" would put his head 6 inches above the rim. I can believe Jordan could get his head that far above the rim.

[KenneBell]

Payton was right, he really is Black Jesus. :bowdown:

[OldSchoolBBall]

My freind can throw a football 73 yards, and can hit a reciever accurately for 57 yards. By accurate I mean like 50% or so.

If Bruce is referring to the segment on the video "Michael Jordan: Above and Beyond," they actually mark off 65 yards (not 60) and MJ clears it with room to spare.

Your friend sounds like a hell of a natural athlete, by the way. Some people just have it.

[gibbo3000]

My first thought was "no way" but after thinking about it, Jordan is 6'6". Jumping 48" would put his head 6 inches above the rim. I can believe Jordan could get his head that far above the rim.

But we're talking about standing below the rim and jumping straight up in the air and geting your head 6 inches above the rim

The highest I've seen jordan jump is on that alley oop from his first couple of years when he comes down the baseline and dunks it wth two hands, and his head was roughly ring height, with a run up, so I doubt he could jump vertically and look into the ring

[Mdog1]

If Bruce is referring to the segment on the video "Michael Jordan: Above and Beyond," they actually mark off 65 yards (not 60) and MJ clears it with room to spare.

Your friend sounds like a hell of a natural athlete, by the way. Some people just have it.
You have no idea. He works out like I said 2 times a week, but the last month he was in Cuba for a week, and was sick for one as well. So he hadn't worked out for 2 weeks. He comes back to the weight room with me, puts 280 pounds on the bench press and does it three times. 3 times he is 17 years old damn it. He deadlifted 410, leg presses 1500!, bicep curls (this is his weak one) 125 with an olympic bar not the easy curl, tricep presses 245 and then we went to the indoor track to do a run and he ran 4000 metres like it was 100 (not as fast, but he was hardly out of breathe). I hate his ability.

[AllenIverson3]

I know for sure Vince Carter had at least 50...

[inclinerator]

You have no idea. He works out like I said 2 times a week, but the last month he was in Cuba for a week, and was sick for one as well. So he hadn't worked out for 2 weeks. He comes back to the weight room with me, puts 280 pounds on the bench press and does it three times. 3 times he is 17 years old damn it. He deadlifted 410, leg presses 1500!, bicep curls (this is his weak one) 125 with an olympic bar not the easy curl, tricep presses 245 and then we went to the indoor track to do a run and he ran 4000 metres like it was 100 (not as fast, but he was hardly out of breathe). I hate his ability.
maybe he is a bodybuilder alot of teens in the bodybuilding forum has those kind of stats or better

[Mdog1]

No trust me he isn't a body builder. He isn't really defined he is just so damn strong. I honestly think that if he had my mindset he would be able to bench press 400 pounds. He can dunk so easily, one time he jumped over a bike lol. It was amazing, I caught it on video and was going to put it on youtube, but I then proceeded to drop my cell in the toilet when I got home. Needless to say the cell phone was useless, and video worthless.

[eliteballer]

Show me Jordan getting his head above the rim JUST ONCE by JUST AN INCH, and I'll even START to consider it. Go ahead, post a clip:roll:

[w00terz]

Show me Jordan getting his head above the rim JUST ONCE by JUST AN INCH, and I'll even START to consider it. Go ahead, post a clip:roll:


Even with that, it wouldn't even matter. Vertical is measured from a "flat-footed" jump (no run up) so even if he has gotten his head above the rim in a dunk, it wouldn't even count.

[DLeagueWannabe]

I believe it, I can hit my head on the backboard and I'm like 6'1 or 6'2. And I know Jordan has way more bounce than I ever had...Seriously, I bet at his peak he could bite the damn rim.

[OldSchoolBBall]

Show me Jordan getting his head above the rim JUST ONCE by JUST AN INCH, and I'll even START to consider it. Go ahead, post a clip:roll:

How did I know you'd make your twice monthly post in this thread. :oldlol:

That famous dunk contest dunk where he reverses it, he takes off and is gliding for quite some time, and on the descent still has to duck his head as he comes under the basket.

[bruceblitz]

Show me Jordan getting his head above the rim JUST ONCE by JUST AN INCH, and I'll even START to consider it. Go ahead, post a clip:roll:
http://www.nbaloud.com/images/michael-jordan-free-throw-line-dunk-.jpg
Jordan getting his head well above rim-level on long distance free throw line, distance and height.

http://img512.imageshack.us/img512/1152/meeeuu1.jpg
Notice Jordan's head over rim height even on "the shot".

http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2209/2195465200_27908cf511.jpg

Sorry you exposed yourself as a failure as a basketball fan. The "court level" views of the old school game weren't as prevalent as they are now. Jordan getting his head at rim height and higher would be most prominent in the 80's.

Thanks for playing!

http://image.blingee.com/images15/content/output/000/000/000/446/287221325_1841324.gif

[Gingereffic]

Yeah, I don't think MJ had a 48" vert, more like 42-44", which would put his head at rim level or slightly above.


Yea I don't see MJ jumping 48 inches more like 42-44.

[DLeagueWannabe]

How did I know you'd make your twice monthly post in this thread. :oldlol:

That famous dunk contest dunk where he reverses it, he takes off and is gliding for quite some time, and on the descent still has to duck his head as he comes under the basket.

Anyone who plays basketball at a semi high level knows Ur dunks don't prove the max height you can get. If you Jordan to just jump as high as he could to see how high he could get his head above the rim he would make all you guys who don't believe look like fools. Seriously.

[DLeagueWannabe]

http://www.nbaloud.com/images/michael-jordan-free-throw-line-dunk-.jpg
Jordan getting his head rim-level on long distance free throw line, distance and height.

http://img512.imageshack.us/img512/1152/meeeuu1.jpg
Notice Jordan's head over rim height even on "the shot".

http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2209/2195465200_27908cf511.jpg

Sorry you exposed yourself as a failure as a basketball fan. The "court level" views of the old school game weren't as prevalent as they are now. Jordan getting his head at rim height and higher would be most prominent in the 80's.

Thanks for playing!

http://image.blingee.com/images15/content/output/000/000/000/446/287221325_1841324.gif


Last pic in black in white looks crazy. that should be proof to anyone. I think him and Wilkins each had legit 45+ inch verts.

[BirdOverrated]

lolmao At 48 Inch Vert

[Cyclone112]

lolmao At 48 Inch Vert

laughing out loud my ass off?

god you really are retarded.

[eliteballer]

Still waiting for a CLEAR pic where his head is ABOVE the rim. No angles or BS like that. Real talk Jordan Jockers. Man up or shut up.

[bruceblitz]

http://www.nbaloud.com/images/michael-jordan-free-throw-line-dunk-.jpg
Jordan getting his head well above rim-level on long distance free throw line, distance and height.

http://img512.imageshack.us/img512/1152/meeeuu1.jpg
Notice Jordan's head over rim height even on "the shot".

http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2209/2195465200_27908cf511.jpg

The shutdown.

Jordan was a little over 6'4" true height, and clearly he had at least a 46'' vertical with the ball in his hands. 48" without the ball. Ran a 4.3 40 yard dash. Could throw a football well over 60 yards.

GOAT athlete!

[bruceblitz]

lolmao At 48 Inch Vert :cry: :cry: :cry: Kobe's is only 38"! :cry: :cry: :cry:
http://img206.imageshack.us/img206/4936/foolsjg9.jpg

[gibbo3000]

The closest in all those pictures has Jordan with the top of his head at teh bottom of teh ring at best

They are all taken from low angles and "the shot" is taken from the other end of the court, from a low angle, with the ring 15 feet past him, perspective puts his head below the ring on that one too

[eliteballer]

In NOT ONE of those pics his head clearing the rim. Real talk Jordan Jockers. Cut the BS. It wont change the TRUTH. Man up or shut up. WE'RE WAAAAITING.

[lefthook00]

I believe MJ had a 42+ vert for sure, but none of those posted pictures show the top of his head at rim level, except the black and white one, the one where he is J'ing it from the freethrow line. For the top of his head to be rim level, the top of his head MUST be displayed ABOVE the rim, top of head @ rim level doesn't cut it, since those are all photos from below.

Actually, in the black and white one, top of his head is at rim level, but shot is from below so take 1-2+ inches off...

For a legit photo, the angle of the shot has to be so that the arc of the rim is non-existant, meaning the rim would look like a straight line...for every inch that the back side of the rim is visible, you must draw the angle out...and every inch a player is further from the rim must be taken into account also...

[bruceblitz]

In NOT ONE of those pics his head clearing the rim. Real talk Jordan Jockers. Cut the BS. It wont change the TRUTH. Man up or shut up. WE'RE WAAAAITING.
http://img206.imageshack.us/img206/4936/foolsjg9.jpg


Get your eyes checked!
http://img.xcitefun.net/users/2008/04/81,xcitefun-get-your-eyes-checked.jpg

[abuC]

:confusedshrug: Kadour Xiani has a 60 inch vertical, I guess at 5'9" where does that put Xiani's head? Randy Moss has a 51 inch vertical. I posted the links for proof. These are verticals recorded without the ball. Jordan legitimately had a 48" vertical. I saw him run a 4.3 live on TV, he had a 48" vertical which he displayed live on TV, and he also threw a football over 60 yards.

It was a special event that was run by Deion Sanders. I guess a lot of you Johnny come latelys have a lot to learn.

Kids (sigh)

:roll: @ 60" vertical.

Also, Kadour is a one footed jumper, vertical is measured when you're jumping off two feet.

If you think he or anyone on this planet has a 60" vertical I'd like to sell you a bridge.

[BirdOverrated]

:roll: @ 60" vertical.

Also, Kadour is a one footed jumper, vertical is measured when you're jumping off two feet.

If you think he or anyone on this planet has a 60" vertical I'd like to sell you a bridge.

:roll: :cheers:

LOL bruce blitz reminds me of a little toddler or something.

Clearly the guy has a very low IQ, he watches wrestling and is just a log.

LOL at 60 inch vert for kador
LOL at jordan 48 inches.

[eliteballer]

No honestly. Cut the crap. Show me a pic of Jordan with his head above the rim. I'm sure it would be a treat for all of us. I'd actually like to see it. No BS needed here. We want the truth. No point in saying Jordan had that kind of vertical if he didn't. Post a pic.

[bruceblitz]

LOL at 60 inch vert for kador
LOL at jordan 48 inches.
http://vertcoach.com/highest-vertical-leap.html

[bruceblitz]

http://www.nbaloud.com/images/michael-jordan-free-throw-line-dunk-.jpg
Jordan getting his head well above rim-level on long distance free throw line, distance and height.

http://img512.imageshack.us/img512/1152/meeeuu1.jpg
Notice Jordan's head over rim height even on "the shot".

http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2209/2195465200_27908cf511.jpg

Sorry you exposed yourself as a failure as a basketball fan. The "court level" views of the old school game weren't as prevalent as they are now. Jordan getting his head at rim height and higher would be most prominent in the 80's.

Thanks for playing!

http://image.blingee.com/images15/content/output/000/000/000/446/287221325_1841324.gif

:wtf:

http://www.liverpoolmuseums.org.uk/walker/johnmoores/23/graphics/large/david_austen.jpg

[BirdOverrated]

http://vertcoach.com/highest-vertical-leap.html

LOL At posting a linK!!!:roll: :applause:

if its on a site, it must be true guys!

[abuC]

http://vertcoach.com/highest-vertical-leap.html
:roll: :roll: :roll: :roll: :roll:

Vertcoach is a reputable site, they have Carmelo's vertical listed at 41" yet it was only 33" at the draft combine.

A 5 foot vertical is not happening, I doubt world class high jumpers can do that, the simple fact that you think it's been done by some traveling dunker is hilarious.

[bruceblitz]

LOL Insane nutcase of a fan here for your amusement!
http://www.crazy-tattoo-designs.com/insane_big.jpg
http://media.rei.com/media/ss/f0b0ad13-3e5b-467a-8ea5-a4adfe5aadb4.jpg

:roll: :roll: :roll: :roll: :roll:

[gibbo3000]

http://vertcoach.com/highest-vertical-leap.html

Thats just a table some guy has put together for his vertical jump site, I could put a table together and put it on the internet, doesn't make it gospel

[shawbryant]

that means his head should have been 5 inches above the rim on his max jumps!
Technically, I think it's more than 5 inches, as when you hang in air, your body is totally stretched up.

[bruceblitz]

:roll: :roll: :roll: :roll: :roll:

Vertcoach is a reputable site, they have Carmelo's vertical listed at 41" yet it was only 33" at the draft combine.

A 5 foot vertical is not happening, I doubt world class high jumpers can do that, the simple fact that you think it's been done by some traveling dunker is hilarious.
Did you see Carmelo Anthony

[gibbo3000]

[QUOTE=bruceblitz]Did you see Carmelo Anthony

[bruceblitz]

To suggest that melo's vertical is one inch below 'niques is laugable, he is perhaps the best two foot dunker in NBA history
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CmMDe_HagnM

[OldSchoolBBall]

The reason you won't find conclusive pics/video is because everything was not as extensively catalogued as it is today. Watch this video:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=a2ajygPaNyE&feature=channel_page

Note that the video freezes slightly before the actual peak of the jump. And this one at the 5:03-5:05 mark:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WDrGTcQVn5c&feature=related

The only reason it's not conclusive is because they didn't replay it from 7 different angles like they do today. There are other vids too.

[bruceblitz]

Vertical jumps are done without the ball in your hand. Big difference to the jumps you perform when you are dunking a basketball. Wow are people shallow on here.

[abuC]

[QUOTE=bruceblitz]Did you see Carmelo Anthony

[bruceblitz]

http://www.nbaloud.com/images/michael-jordan-free-throw-line-dunk-.jpg
Jordan getting his head well above rim-level on long distance free throw line, distance and height.

http://img512.imageshack.us/img512/1152/meeeuu1.jpg
Notice Jordan's head over rim height even on "the shot".

http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2209/2195465200_27908cf511.jpg

Sorry you exposed yourself as a failure as a basketball fan. The "court level" views of the old school game weren't as prevalent as they are now. Jordan getting his head at rim height and higher would be most prominent in the 80's.

Thanks for playing!

http://image.blingee.com/images15/content/output/000/000/000/446/287221325_1841324.gif


I love those pictures :applause: :D

[andgar923]

Didn't anybody see the posts that I made a while back, that proved MJ's head above the rim? or at rim level while still ascending?

I posted video and pics to highlight this.

EDIT: they were on the "serious question about Kobe's jumping ability" or something like that.

For some reason I can't even look up my own posts, or search the board so if somebody can post the info for me, I'd appreciate it.

Thanks

[eliteballer]

Ya, we saw your crap and debunked it andgar. That alley-oop against Milwaukee that has the angle where you cant tell anything.

[DCL]

it's like watching retards fight.

[andgar923]

Ya, we saw your crap and debunked it andgar. That alley-oop against Milwaukee that has the angle where you cant tell anything.

No

It was actually Kobe stans trying to debunk.

Sure I and others debated over whether or not Kobe could dunk from the ft line, but they didn't disagree in regards to MJ's vertical.

But of course.... Kobe stans did.

I've said it time and time again.... I'll give Kobe his props if one can show me footage of him really skying, but he's just an above avg jumper. There's no evidence that suggests otherwise.

And as I've said many a time, Kobe ******gers are the biggest pieces of shyt in the world.

Kobe stans = Nazi SS pedophiles............... or maybe slightly worse.

[Godfather]

Those are over exaggerated by a lot...

Especially the 40 yard dash time...

[Myth]

But we're talking about standing below the rim and jumping straight up in the air and geting your head 6 inches above the rim


Oh, never mind then. I thought we were talking about running.

[Lodi Dodi]

Though there is numerous evidence, what do they do?

They doubt the facts. Always making excuses for everything. Since Jordan was from the '80s how could he have been faster than people these days?

If people would've known, the extremely athletic basketball players were built like track stars. And yes, Jordan was indeed that fast. They didn't call him Black Cat for no reason.

[DonDadda59]

How did I know you'd make your twice monthly post in this thread. :oldlol:

That famous dunk contest dunk where he reverses it, he takes off and is gliding for quite some time, and on the descent still has to duck his head as he comes under the basket.

One of the most underrated dunks ever- grace, power, hang time all personified in one.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-bPHIP8Td04

And it's hard for people who never saw Jordan play to believe everything that's said about him, they think it's all fluff and urban legend and can't believe that someone could actually be as great as MJ was because the best they've personally witnessed is a cheap imitation like Kobe. But He was that great. There's a reason he's as revered as he is and why they're still looking for the 'next Michael Jordan'. BTW, these sites confirms that, at worst, Jordan had a 44" vertical:

http://www.topendsports.com/testing/results-vertical-jump.htm

http://www.listafterlist.com/tabid/57/listid/6765/Sports++Recreation/Highest+Vertical+Leap+in+NBA+History.aspx

[Godfather]

Though there is numerous evidence, what do they do?

They doubt the facts. Always making excuses for everything. Since Jordan was from the '80s how could he have been faster than people these days?

If people would've known, the extremely athletic basketball players were built like track stars. And yes, Jordan was indeed that fast. They didn't call him Black Cat for no reason.

I don't care when he was born.

He was not faster than top gun NFL corners and he did not have a higher vert than Vince Carter.

I watched him for several years, just no way...

[Lodi Dodi]

The only athletes that come close are players like Randy Moss and Deion Sanders. MJ and these players are/were totally athletic freaks.

[Lodi Dodi]

And like posted before, that vert doesn't mean he could do it with a basketball. I'm sure Vince could get higher without a ball.

[OldSchoolBBall]

One of the most underrated dunks ever- grace, power, hang time all personified in one.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-bPHIP8Td04

That's an awesome dunk, but not the one I was referring to. I meant his cradle reverse from the right side of the basket to the left.


And yes, Jordan was indeed that fast. They didn't call him Black Cat for no reason.

I always wished that nickname stuck more. A lot of people know about that opposing players used to call him that, but imo it's the most perfectly fitting nickname for him, even more so than "Air." Dude was just liquid sped and explosiveness.

[Flightposite]

Nice collage. Too bad the understanding of perspective eludes you.

[andgar923]

That's an awesome dunk, but not the one I was referring to. I meant his cradle reverse from the right side of the basket to the left.



I always wished that nickname stuck more. A lot of people know about that opposing players used to call him that, but imo it's the most perfectly fitting nickname for him, even more so than "Air." Dude was just liquid sped and explosiveness.

I've always mentioned that he was a 6'6 version of Iverson in regards to his speed.

During the Space Jam filming sessions MJ was playing against local college, NBA and respected playground players from the L.A. area. One of them happened to be a college player that was on the team at my college. This dude was a very skinny 6'4 player with good speed. He told me that MJ was so good because he was extremely fast. Everything he did was at full speed and he was as fast if not faster than players 6 feet tall.

And when one looks at the vids, you can see how easily he gets up and down the court and how quickly he blows by defenders.

So even if we want to believe that he didn't run a 4.3 in the 40 yard dash, he was still alot faster than almost any NBA player above 6 ft.

[DonDadda59]

Still waiting for a CLEAR pic where his head is ABOVE the rim. No angles or BS like that. Real talk Jordan Jockers. Man up or shut up.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OmxJvWW5Ksw

Probably the most famous dunk in NBA history (in game). Notice how his elbow is above the rim and if it weren't for Ewing's arm pushing his head down and back, he'd be staring down at the rim. Now consider this all happens after beating multiple traps and doubles (I know what you homers are thinking, but trust me, double teams were not invented in 2001 :oldlol: ) AND dunking on a waiting 7 footer, one of the best defensive players all time. Now is it crazy to think that without all those distractions, just jumping straight up that he'd EASILY get his head over the rim? And maybe even dunk on a 12' basket just for kicks.

And no, it's not special effects or a camera angle trick, just a still shot straight at the rim. GOAT.

[andgar923]

What I don't get, is how some (mostly Kobe stans) can't believe Mj could jump 48 inches, or get his head over the rim, when he can dunk from the ft line with ease.

[andgar923]

So a while back I posted some pics along with video footage.

Apparently, Kobe STANS were claiming it was the "angles" that made it seem as if his head was above the rim (he was almost looking down at the rim), even tho he was right next to the rim and the camera angle was actually not showing how he actually jumped higher.

Here's one of these pics:

http://img.skitch.com/20090306-cmusud9p9n3pxthb57baj3w139.jpg

The image is kinda fuzzy, but I showed MJ's head in correlation to the rim. Also remember that he's jumping with "two" hands.

So.... of course.... Kobe STANS complained and said it was a bad angle.

Well... how do you explain this:

http://img.skitch.com/20090306-qa1tgk3rqj28831hagiaa96gb6.jpg

Same dunk, same clip just showed the overall pic instead of just focusing on the head.

Notice something?

Its not a camera trick or angle that shows how high his hands are (remember he's jumping with two hands).

Still not convinced? look at how HIGH HIS FEET ARE IN COMPARISON TO THE DEFENDER AND THE FLOOR.

I also gotta let you guys know, that its hard to pause exactly on YouTube. There was a point in that play that he was actually slightly HIGHER than the frame you see there.

[Sir Charles]

http://www.nbaloud.com/images/michael-jordan-free-throw-line-dunk-.jpg
Jordan getting his head well above rim-level on long distance free throw line, distance and height.

http://img512.imageshack.us/img512/1152/meeeuu1.jpg
Notice Jordan's head over rim height even on "the shot".

http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2209/2195465200_27908cf511.jpg

Sorry you exposed yourself as a failure as a basketball fan. The "court level" views of the old school game weren't as prevalent as they are now. Jordan getting his head at rim height and higher would be most prominent in the 80's.

Thanks for playing!

http://image.blingee.com/images15/content/output/000/000/000/446/287221325_1841324.gif

:oldlol: :applause:

[DonDadda59]

And for those particularly committed homers who are still not convinced despite all the evidence: Jordan's free throw line dunks from differing angles, pay particular attention to the slow motion shot at 2:13, direct shot at the basket, notice where Jordan's head is at (and remember where he took off from)...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-Mn1KSpLGsY

Don't forget to pick your bottom lip up off the ground when you're done. :bowdown:

[w00terz]

400 posts in less than a month? Ban this guy already.

Not a SINGLE picture you posted had Jordan above rim level. And even by slight chance that his head was over the rim, that doesn't mean anything. If Jordan truly had a 48" vertical, he would be able to get at least 3-4 inches above rim level on a flat-footed jump (without a running start). That's utter bullsh*t.

GTFO you trolling piece of sh*t.

[Lodi Dodi]

So a while back I posted some pics along with video footage.

Apparently, Kobe STANS were claiming it was the "angles" that made it seem as if his head was above the rim (he was almost looking down at the rim), even tho he was right next to the rim and the camera angle was actually not showing how he actually jumped higher.

Here's one of these pics:

http://img.skitch.com/20090306-cmusud9p9n3pxthb57baj3w139.jpg

The image is kinda fuzzy, but I showed MJ's head in correlation to the rim. Also remember that he's jumping with "two" hands.

So.... of course.... Kobe STANS complained and said it was a bad angle.

Well... how do you explain this:

http://img.skitch.com/20090306-qa1tgk3rqj28831hagiaa96gb6.jpg

Same dunk, same clip just showed the overall pic instead of just focusing on the head.

Notice something?

Its not a camera trick or angle that shows how high his hands are (remember he's jumping with two hands).

Still not convinced? look at how HIGH HIS FEET ARE IN COMPARISON TO THE DEFENDER AND THE FLOOR.

I also gotta let you guys know, that its hard to pause exactly on YouTube. There was a point in that play that he was actually slightly HIGHER than the frame you see there.

Game Over.

[Fatal9]

This guy is passing off some numbers he picked up off an amateur dunking program site as facts? :oldlol:

LOL at him getting rim level on the jumper over Ehlo. Why are people still responding to this guy?

[Fatal9]

So a while back I posted some pics along with video footage.

Apparently, Kobe STANS were claiming it was the "angles" that made it seem as if his head was above the rim (he was almost looking down at the rim), even tho he was right next to the rim and the camera angle was actually not showing how he actually jumped higher.

Here's one of these pics:

http://img.skitch.com/20090306-cmusud9p9n3pxthb57baj3w139.jpg

The image is kinda fuzzy, but I showed MJ's head in correlation to the rim. Also remember that he's jumping with "two" hands.

So.... of course.... Kobe STANS complained and said it was a bad angle.

Well... how do you explain this:

http://img.skitch.com/20090306-qa1tgk3rqj28831hagiaa96gb6.jpg

Same dunk, same clip just showed the overall pic instead of just focusing on the head.

Notice something?

Its not a camera trick or angle that shows how high his hands are (remember he's jumping with two hands).

Still not convinced? look at how HIGH HIS FEET ARE IN COMPARISON TO THE DEFENDER AND THE FLOOR.

I also gotta let you guys know, that its hard to pause exactly on YouTube. There was a point in that play that he was actually slightly HIGHER than the frame you see there.

Hey idiot, he is clearly on the far side of the rim so his head is going to appear as if it is on the same level as the rim.

It's the same reason this Lebron dunk looked like he was chest-level with the rim at first glance (Sportscenter actually tried to pass it off as a chest-level dunk).

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ve5lSjtmE4Q

Using your genius logic where we see the world in 2 dimensions, the first row in the crowd is also at rim level :oldlol:

[andgar923]

Hey idiot, he is clearly on the far side of the rim so his head is going to appear as if it is on the same level as the rim.

It's the same reason this Lebron dunk looked like he was chest-level with the rim at first glance (Sportscenter actually tried to pass it off as a chest-level dunk).

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ve5lSjtmE4Q

Using your genius logic where we see the world in 2 dimensions, the first row in the crowd is also at rim level :oldlol:

Can you please refrain from calling me names and have an adult discussion?

Apparently you didn't read my entire post.

But that's your problem.

[plowking]

Hey idiot, he is clearly on the far side of the rim so his head is going to appear as if it is on the same level as the rim.

It's the same reason this Lebron dunk looked like he was chest-level with the rim at first glance (Sportscenter actually tried to pass it off as a chest-level dunk).

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ve5lSjtmE4Q

Using your genius logic where we see the world in 2 dimensions, the first row in the crowd is also at rim level :oldlol:

Thank god someone pointed this out.

Do people have any idea that the angle makes him look a lot higher then they actually are?

Jordan could probably headbutt the ring without the ball, though with a ball in his hands he could probably graze the bottom of it.

I can't believe people are using the Jordan jumper as evidence he could get rim high, lol. This is getting beyond ridiculous. The bigger retards are the ones agreeing with one word answers. :oldlol:

Even on the free throw line dunk, the angle is slightly skewed to make him look higher then he really was. I doubt he was above the ring at any point on that dunk.

[plowking]

Can you please refrain from calling me names and have an adult discussion?

Apparently you didn't read my entire post.

But that's your problem.

How can he have an adult conversation with someone using that Jordan picture as evidence?

If you honestly think Jordan could get that high, why the hell did he not throw down any better dunks then he did?

Jordan might have gotten above the ring clearly on maybe a few dunks in his career at most.

[andgar923]

How can he have an adult conversation with someone using that Jordan picture as evidence?

If you honestly think Jordan could get that high, why the hell did he not throw down any better dunks then he did?

Jordan might have gotten above the ring clearly on maybe a few dunks in his career at most.

LOL

What are you talking about?

He used to dunk from the ft line at will.

He's probably dunked from the ft line distance more times than anybody in the history of the NBA and done so with EASE.

As far those pics....

You guys WOULD have a point if he was further away from the basket.

But he was right NEXT to the rim.

A. He was already INSIDE the paint
B. I pointed this out.... look at his hands and how high they are. Even if you wanted to claim "angle angle angle" he's clearly by the rim and inside the edge of the backboard. His hands are easily above the square painted on top of the rim.
C. Like I mentioned before...... take a look at the height of his jump. Look at how high his feet are in comparison to the floor and the defender.

48 inches is 4 ft..... are you guys telling me that the player is 3 ft tall or 4 ft tall but he's bending down to where he's only 3 ft tall?

And even if you guys wanna say..... "well Mj bent his legs" he didn't bend them to the extent where he bent them during the ft line dunk from the dunk contest. And even if the player is 6 ft TOPS, and the defender is bending down a bit and MJ is bending his feet a bit, its still not just 40 or 43 inches that he jumped.

There's dunks in which MJ has jumped from just inside the paint glided under the basket but had to literally DUCK his head, to keep if from hitting the rim, and this after making a move with the ball before gliding underneath.

[DonDadda59]

Ok, now to end this argument with Science since photographic/video proof is not conclusive enough for certain people. From an advanced motion study conducted at the University of North Carolina to test Michael Jordan's maximum vertical leap, 1983:


Abstract:

MICHAEL JORDAN=92S VERTICAL JUMP. =20
Krugh J, LeVeau B. University of North Carolina at Chapel Hill, Chapel =
Hill, NC.

PURPOSE: The purpose of this study, which was part of an advanced =
master=92s motion analysis class project in 1983, was to determine =
Michael Jordan=92s maximum vertical jump.
=20
SUBJECT: Michael Jordan=20

METHODS: Surface markers: Left lateral malleolus, left femoral =
epicondyle, left greater trochanter, left pelvic crest, and right distal =
phalanges of digits 2 and 3 of the hand.

Tasks (in order) were:=20
Vertical reach while standing flat-footed - baseline
Vertical reach during a jump from standing
Vertical reach during a jump from running
Vertical reach during a 1 hand dunk=20
Vertical reach during a 2 hand dunk

All tasks, except baseline vertical reach were done with free swing of =
the upper limb(s). Equipment / instrumentation: Camera, lighting, =
markers, meter stick, and standard basketball. Location: Fetzer =
Gymnasium, University of North Carolina at Chapel Hill.

DATA ANALYSIS:
Distance measurements were analyzed by comparison to a meter stick in =
view of the camera. Displacement measurements of reach (pelvis) involved =
measurement of vertical height to the tip of fingers 2 and 3 (pelvis) =
during a task minus vertical height to the tip of fingers 2 and 3 =
(pelvis) during bilateral flat-footed stance. Velocity measurements were =
analyzed by dividing vertical height distance traveled divided by time =
taken for the tasks. A VanGuard Motion Analyzer was used to analyze =
motion frame by frame.

RESULTS:=20
Maximum measurements:=20
Vertical reach while standing flat-footed 93.67 in.
Floor to pelvic crest while standing 49.00 in.
Vertical reach displacement during a jump from standing 35.93 in.
Vertical displacement of the pelvis during a jump from running 38.07 in.
Vertical velocity during a jump from running 701.00 o/sec.=20
Vertical reach displacement during a jump from running 45.76 in.
Vertical reach displacement during a 1 hand dunk 41.70 in.
Vertical reach displacement during a 2 hand dunk 40.93 in.

During the vertical reach from standing, push from the floor was with =
both feet. During the vertical reach during a jump from running, push =
from the floor was with one foot and momentum of the body, two upper =
limbs, and one lower limb was used to the maximum.=20

CONCLUSION / CLINICAL RELEVANCE: Maximum displacement for vertical reach =
was achieved with a jump from a running start, a 2 hand dunk, a 1 hand =
dunk, and a jump from standing, respectively. This is consistent with =
use of momentum of the body and limbs to assist with the vertical =
displacement. Michael Jordan=92s vertical jump ability during several =
tasks provides a standard with which athletic achievement by others can =
be compared.

So standing flat-footed without a running start, Jordan's vertical was 36". Using the NBA draft/combine running start w/o a ball in hand, his vertical measured at 46". This was during either his Sophmore or Junior year in College.

And some superfluous (but still cool) scientific musings about his pro vertical and hangtime...


JORDAN'S HANGTIME : HOW LONG DOES MICHAEL JORDAN HANG IN THE AIR !

Hanging with Mr. Jordan
What is hangtime? It's how long a bro' stays up in the air before his feet touches the ground. You ask why is Jordan so good at hanging ? Well, it's all an illusion. When Michael went for his freethrow dunk at the slam dunk contest in 84-85, 86-87 and 87-88, it seems that Michael flew all the way to the rim. His flight follows a parabolic motion (like a rainbow).

There are two forces at work, the vertical and horizontal component of the parabolic motion. What determines hang time is your vertical component of the leap. The higher you jump, the longer you stay up. The horizontal component of you leap does zippo to your hang time. All the horizontal component does is determine how far away you land after taking off.

Applying motion equations to the vertical component, we can calculate the time Michael is in the air. At the peak of the parabola, vertical speed is zero. Assume gravitational acceleration is constant 9.8 ms-2. Assume Michael's vertical is 48 inches (approx 1.20m).

Vertical speed at the apex of jump = v = 0ms-1
gravitational acceleration = a = 9.8ms-2
vertical leap height = s = 1.20ms-1

v2 = u2 + 2as
0=u2 + 2 (9.8)1.2
u2 = 23.52 ms-1
u = 4.85 ms-1
Fast-twitch muscle power
Michael's powerful hips, quadriceps and hamstrings and calf muscles pushes his lean, skinny body into the air with ease. He's black too and that helps because black people genetically have higher ratios of fast-twitch muscle fibres to slow-twitch. Fast-twitch muscles provide that explosive power but it runs out of energy (creatinine) very quickly. Lactic acid builds up and the fibers need time to get rid of it. But Michael doesn't tire easily because his leaness and high aerobic fitness assists in getting rid of unwanted lactic acid. In other words to be a good jumper, you need to be lean and aerobically fit. For basketballers, being able to run the mile in under 5 minutes is important. Guys like Jordan and Iverson can do it because they are lean and have big lungs and heart.
His high center of gravity also means that he doesn't need to jump high to get most of his weight off the ground.

Michael initial vertical takeoff speed should be at least 4.85ms-1. World record 100m sprinter, Tim Montgomery ran an average 100m / 9.78s = 10.22ms-1. Michael has to generate half that speed in the vertical direction in order to go up 48 inches (or 1.20 metres).
HANGTIME calculations :

v = u + 1/2at2
0 = 4.85 + 1/2(9.8)t2
t2 = 4.85
t = 0.49 seconds
Total time going up, then down = t X 2 = 0.49 X 2 = 0.98 seconds

Michael's estimated hang time is 0.98 seconds. But by moving his arms and bending his legs, he probably could stretch that to 1.50 seconds, sometimes 2.00 seconds. The additional upward momentum from pumping his arms and ball could provide that extra 0.50 seconds. Hand touching the rim could slow down his descent for about 0.15 seconds.


Jordan's hangtime is 0.98 second
Superman has entered the building.
Michael's jumping and leaping ability amazes many. When the tongue sticks out and then the femto-second explosion to the basket, ending with a dunk on some poor white-ass 7 foot center is a fearsome sight to behold. Skill, speed, and physics seems to allow Jordan to do the impossible. His powerful hip, thigh and calf muscles launch him 48 inches up into the stratosphere. See him pull off acrobatic reverse layups and jams, each one with that unique Jordan flair that no b-baller could ever hope to copy.
Poetry in Motion
Range of motion (ROM) of the joints = elasticity. Stretching to increase the ROM provides extra inches in vertical leap.

Have body will fly
At 6-6, Jordan's center of gravity is higher than that of the average person and his aerial acrobatics cause it to rise even higher during a jump. The terrific force he exerts on the floor gives him a quick takeoff and longer time in the air. Biomechanical researchers have concluded that a good jumper produces an average force of about two to three times his weight pushing off the ground.


Michael in orbit
Based on Jordan's 32,000 career total points, and about 16,000 jumps, we can estimate that Jordan has been airborne for approximately for 4 1/2 hours. That's like a flight from New York to LA or three low-altitude orbit around the earth in the space shuttle.

Jumping to the max...
On any given leap, Jordan, who weighs about 200 pounds is exerting 400 to 600 pounds of force on the floor. Compare that to Atlanta's Spud Webb, who at 5-7 and 135, jumps 42 inches vertically and exerts 270 to 400 pounds of force.

Moon Jumping
Since an object on the moon weighs one-sixth of what they do on earth, a jumper can rise six times higher and remain in flight six times longer than on earth. So weighing a hefty 33 pounds, Jordan would perform vertical leaps of 24 feet and hang in the air for 6 seconds. That's like jumping over a small two-story building in a single leap.

So I think it's pretty safe to say that he had AT LEAST a 46" vertical from a running start, 36" standing still and jumping flat-footed.

/Thread
/Argument

[andgar923]

Again..... he used to dunk from the ft line WITH EASE.

[andgar923]

Ok, now to end this argument with Science since photographic/video proof is not conclusive enough for certain people. From an advanced motion study conducted at the University of North Carolina to test Michael Jordan's maximum vertical leap, 1983:


Abstract:

MICHAEL JORDAN=92S VERTICAL JUMP. =20
Krugh J, LeVeau B. University of North Carolina at Chapel Hill, Chapel =
Hill, NC.

PURPOSE: The purpose of this study, which was part of an advanced =
master=92s motion analysis class project in 1983, was to determine =
Michael Jordan=92s maximum vertical jump.
=20
SUBJECT: Michael Jordan=20

METHODS: Surface markers: Left lateral malleolus, left femoral =
epicondyle, left greater trochanter, left pelvic crest, and right distal =
phalanges of digits 2 and 3 of the hand.

Tasks (in order) were:=20
Vertical reach while standing flat-footed - baseline
Vertical reach during a jump from standing
Vertical reach during a jump from running
Vertical reach during a 1 hand dunk=20
Vertical reach during a 2 hand dunk

All tasks, except baseline vertical reach were done with free swing of =
the upper limb(s). Equipment / instrumentation: Camera, lighting, =
markers, meter stick, and standard basketball. Location: Fetzer =
Gymnasium, University of North Carolina at Chapel Hill.

DATA ANALYSIS:
Distance measurements were analyzed by comparison to a meter stick in =
view of the camera. Displacement measurements of reach (pelvis) involved =
measurement of vertical height to the tip of fingers 2 and 3 (pelvis) =
during a task minus vertical height to the tip of fingers 2 and 3 =
(pelvis) during bilateral flat-footed stance. Velocity measurements were =
analyzed by dividing vertical height distance traveled divided by time =
taken for the tasks. A VanGuard Motion Analyzer was used to analyze =
motion frame by frame.

RESULTS:=20
Maximum measurements:=20
Vertical reach while standing flat-footed 93.67 in.
Floor to pelvic crest while standing 49.00 in.
Vertical reach displacement during a jump from standing 35.93 in.
Vertical displacement of the pelvis during a jump from running 38.07 in.
Vertical velocity during a jump from running 701.00 o/sec.=20
Vertical reach displacement during a jump from running 45.76 in.
Vertical reach displacement during a 1 hand dunk 41.70 in.
Vertical reach displacement during a 2 hand dunk 40.93 in.

During the vertical reach from standing, push from the floor was with =
both feet. During the vertical reach during a jump from running, push =
from the floor was with one foot and momentum of the body, two upper =
limbs, and one lower limb was used to the maximum.=20

CONCLUSION / CLINICAL RELEVANCE: Maximum displacement for vertical reach =
was achieved with a jump from a running start, a 2 hand dunk, a 1 hand =
dunk, and a jump from standing, respectively. This is consistent with =
use of momentum of the body and limbs to assist with the vertical =
displacement. Michael Jordan=92s vertical jump ability during several =
tasks provides a standard with which athletic achievement by others can =
be compared.

So standing flat-footed without a running start, Jordan's vertical was 36". Using the NBA draft/combine running start w/o a ball in hand, his vertical measured at 46". This was during either his Sophmore or Junior year in College.

And some superfluous (but still cool) scientific musings about his pro vertical and hangtime...


JORDAN'S HANGTIME : HOW LONG DOES MICHAEL JORDAN HANG IN THE AIR !

Hanging with Mr. Jordan
What is hangtime? It's how long a bro' stays up in the air before his feet touches the ground. You ask why is Jordan so good at hanging ? Well, it's all an illusion. When Michael went for his freethrow dunk at the slam dunk contest in 84-85, 86-87 and 87-88, it seems that Michael flew all the way to the rim. His flight follows a parabolic motion (like a rainbow).

There are two forces at work, the vertical and horizontal component of the parabolic motion. What determines hang time is your vertical component of the leap. The higher you jump, the longer you stay up. The horizontal component of you leap does zippo to your hang time. All the horizontal component does is determine how far away you land after taking off.

Applying motion equations to the vertical component, we can calculate the time Michael is in the air. At the peak of the parabola, vertical speed is zero. Assume gravitational acceleration is constant 9.8 ms-2. Assume Michael's vertical is 48 inches (approx 1.20m).

Vertical speed at the apex of jump = v = 0ms-1
gravitational acceleration = a = 9.8ms-2
vertical leap height = s = 1.20ms-1

v2 = u2 + 2as
0=u2 + 2 (9.8)1.2
u2 = 23.52 ms-1
u = 4.85 ms-1
Fast-twitch muscle power
Michael's powerful hips, quadriceps and hamstrings and calf muscles pushes his lean, skinny body into the air with ease. He's black too and that helps because black people genetically have higher ratios of fast-twitch muscle fibres to slow-twitch. Fast-twitch muscles provide that explosive power but it runs out of energy (creatinine) very quickly. Lactic acid builds up and the fibers need time to get rid of it. But Michael doesn't tire easily because his leaness and high aerobic fitness assists in getting rid of unwanted lactic acid. In other words to be a good jumper, you need to be lean and aerobically fit. For basketballers, being able to run the mile in under 5 minutes is important. Guys like Jordan and Iverson can do it because they are lean and have big lungs and heart.
His high center of gravity also means that he doesn't need to jump high to get most of his weight off the ground.

Michael initial vertical takeoff speed should be at least 4.85ms-1. World record 100m sprinter, Tim Montgomery ran an average 100m / 9.78s = 10.22ms-1. Michael has to generate half that speed in the vertical direction in order to go up 48 inches (or 1.20 metres).
HANGTIME calculations :

v = u + 1/2at2
0 = 4.85 + 1/2(9.8)t2
t2 = 4.85
t = 0.49 seconds
Total time going up, then down = t X 2 = 0.49 X 2 = 0.98 seconds

Michael's estimated hang time is 0.98 seconds. But by moving his arms and bending his legs, he probably could stretch that to 1.50 seconds, sometimes 2.00 seconds. The additional upward momentum from pumping his arms and ball could provide that extra 0.50 seconds. Hand touching the rim could slow down his descent for about 0.15 seconds.


Jordan's hangtime is 0.98 second
Superman has entered the building.
Michael's jumping and leaping ability amazes many. When the tongue sticks out and then the femto-second explosion to the basket, ending with a dunk on some poor white-ass 7 foot center is a fearsome sight to behold. Skill, speed, and physics seems to allow Jordan to do the impossible. His powerful hip, thigh and calf muscles launch him 48 inches up into the stratosphere. See him pull off acrobatic reverse layups and jams, each one with that unique Jordan flair that no b-baller could ever hope to copy.
Poetry in Motion
Range of motion (ROM) of the joints = elasticity. Stretching to increase the ROM provides extra inches in vertical leap.

Have body will fly
At 6-6, Jordan's center of gravity is higher than that of the average person and his aerial acrobatics cause it to rise even higher during a jump. The terrific force he exerts on the floor gives him a quick takeoff and longer time in the air. Biomechanical researchers have concluded that a good jumper produces an average force of about two to three times his weight pushing off the ground.


Michael in orbit
Based on Jordan's 32,000 career total points, and about 16,000 jumps, we can estimate that Jordan has been airborne for approximately for 4 1/2 hours. That's like a flight from New York to LA or three low-altitude orbit around the earth in the space shuttle.

Jumping to the max...
On any given leap, Jordan, who weighs about 200 pounds is exerting 400 to 600 pounds of force on the floor. Compare that to Atlanta's Spud Webb, who at 5-7 and 135, jumps 42 inches vertically and exerts 270 to 400 pounds of force.

Moon Jumping
Since an object on the moon weighs one-sixth of what they do on earth, a jumper can rise six times higher and remain in flight six times longer than on earth. So weighing a hefty 33 pounds, Jordan would perform vertical leaps of 24 feet and hang in the air for 6 seconds. That's like jumping over a small two-story building in a single leap.

So I think it's pretty safe to say that he had AT LEAST a 46" vertical from a running start, 36" standing still and jumping flat-footed.

/Thread
/Argument

good stuff... where'd you get this from?

[DonDadda59]

good stuff... where'd you get this from?

Good old fashioned detective work. The UNC study was recorded in a scientific research journal/publication. Doesn't matter though, just waiting for the inevitable homer response trying to dispute the facts. I'm interested in seeing how they try to weasel around this one.

[Fatal9]

AT LEAST 46" when his maximum recorded (without a ball in his hand) was 45.7? Would love to hear the reason behind this little theory :oldlol:

[DonDadda59]

AT LEAST 46" when his maximum recorded (without a ball in his hand) was 45.7? Would love to hear the reason behind this little theory :oldlol:

Hmmm, well try this one out for size- do you think he was at his full athletic facilities and capabilities when he was 19 or 20 and before he started weight training and professional workouts? Doubt his maximum vertical and overall physical capabilities tapped out when he was a Sophomore in college. Good enough reason?

[Fatal9]

Hmmm, well try this one out for size- do you think he was at his full athletic facilities and capabilities when he was 19 or 20 and before he started weight training and professional workouts? Doubt his maximum vertical and overall physical capabilities tapped out when he was a Sophomore in college. Good enough reason?
The best jumping years are usually around 20. With the Bulls his max running vertical was always reported to be 42".

I'm also slightly skeptic considering this study was done by UNC. There may have been a bias to amplify the stats (perhaps to impress scouts?).

I would also love to see this posted in a journal or on some sort of paper instead of you copying/pasting the "article" from whatever other forum you found it at. It is very possible this "study" is floating around the internet because some Jordan fanatic had way too much time on their hands.

[DonDadda59]

The best jumping years are usually around 20. With the Bulls his max running vertical was always reported to be 42".

I'm also slightly skeptic considering this study was done by UNC. There may have been a bias to amplify the stats (perhaps to impress scouts?).

I would also love to see this posted in a journal or on some sort of paper instead of you copying/pasting the "article" from whatever other forum you found it at.

Yup, conspiracy by the Advanced Master Motions Analysis class (no connection to Athletics Department) of UNC and myself to make Jordan look better than he really was. It's all smoke and mirrors, Jordan was actually 5'4" but the angle of the camera during games and post game interviews made him look much taller than he was. And the moon landing was filmed in a studio in Hollywood. It's all one big conspiracy.

[gibbo3000]

So his vertical leap is 36 inches
His running jump off one foot (not what we're discussing) is 46 inches

I'm pretty sure I've been saying all the long that his standing vertical leap is not 48 inches, and others have been arguing the contrary

At the draft camp they do two vertical tests, one the same as the one that jordan got 36 on
the other is a max vertical leap off two feet, the highest last year was Pattrick Ewing Junior with 42 inches, the third highest in NBA history

[Fatal9]

Yup, conspiracy by the Advanced Master Motions Analysis class (no connection to Athletics Department) of UNC and myself to make Jordan look better than he really was. It's all smoke and mirrors, Jordan was actually 5'4" but the angle of the camera during games and post game interviews made him look much taller than he was. And the moon landing was filmed in a studio in Hollywood. It's all one big conspiracy.
You ripped this off some forum. Find me a journal, a paper or anything that would tell me this isn't cooked up. This is about the least organized and most poorly written "scientific" report/experiment I have ever encountered.

Right now the only place on the net where you can find this is on a couple of forums.

[plowking]

So what people are saying is, Jordan could create a gap of 120cm from the floor to the bottom of his feet without his kness bent in the air?

Do you realize how big 1.2m is? There is no way in hell Jordan could get up that high, or anyone for that matter.

[vinsane01]

Damn, some people are really stupid.. do some fcking research before posting stupid sh*t. Not because you cant do it, or nba players these days cant do it doesnt mean nobody has done it. sheesh..

[OldSchoolBBall]

The best jumping years are usually around 20.

That's simply not true. For example, Kobe wasn't anywhere near the leaper in 1998 or 1999 that he was in 2002 or 2003. Ditto for Lebron -- he didn't get as high 3 years ago as he does now. I'd say it peaks between 23-25. Jordan was also still growing until his third year in the league.

[lefthook00]

That's simply not true. For example, Kobe wasn't anywhere near the leaper in 1998 or 1999 that he was in 2002 or 2003. Ditto for Lebron -- he didn't get as high 3 years ago as he does now. I'd say it peaks between 23-25. Jordan was also still growing until his third year in the league.

True...I'd say 19-25 though...

[asd]

Dont know if this pic was snapped at the apex of the jump. Nonetheless, a sick pic of an incredible leap

http://www.geocities.com/mjlove8687/love8687/8687GatoradeSDAirJordan.jpg

[bleedinpurpleTwo]

Is it true that Jordan could shoot lightening bolts out his arse?
and change the weather with a mere waive of his hand?

[KenneBell]

Is it true that Jordan could shoot lightening bolts out his arse?
and change the weather with a mere waive of his hand?
:roll:

It wouldn't surprise me.

[Lodi Dodi]

Hey idiot, he is clearly on the far side of the rim so his head is going to appear as if it is on the same level as the rim.

It's the same reason this Lebron dunk looked like he was chest-level with the rim at first glance (Sportscenter actually tried to pass it off as a chest-level dunk).

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ve5lSjtmE4Q

Using your genius logic where we see the world in 2 dimensions, the first row in the crowd is also at rim level :oldlol:

This clearly shows your lack of understanding of optics/imaging. As stated before, you would have a case with the angles but he is right next to rim. Another fact that is depicted in the picture is that he is STARING down into the basket. Regardless of any angles there is no amount argument of optical illusions that you can state that can refute this. The first row might look as tall as the rim from our perspective but they are still looking up at the rim(which is the reference point). The only way you can stare down at the rim is if A) You're on an elevated height or B) You jump higher than it. In either case you are still higher than the rim.

[asd]

Dont know if this pic was snapped at the apex of the jump. Nonetheless, a sick pic of an incredible leap

http://www.geocities.com/mjlove8687/love8687/8687GatoradeSDAirJordan.jpg

somebody photoshop a lightning bolt coming out of his ass!

[andgar923]

If one looks at around the 1:10 mark, we can clearly see that MJ's foot is on the paint.

His momentum is taking him closer to the rim as he gets higher.

I think that at the very height of this jump, his mouth is above the rim (just an estimation), but he's clearly NEXT to the rim and looking DOWN at the rim.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vwyqE22CSyM

[KenneBell]

I think that at the very height of this jump, his mouth is above the rim (just an estimation), but he's clearly NEXT to the rim and looking DOWN at the rim.

Seriously? :oldlol:

[andgar923]

Seriously? :oldlol:

Actually......

:oldlol: @ you

[reppy]

I looked at this image using state of the art imaging technology, and well...

http://dontclickme.info/shimmy-jordan.jpg

[andgar923]

I guess the angle of this dunk is giving the illusion that MJ had to DUCK his head under the rim as well right?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sdS-qvVqeDY

[andgar923]

Using state of the art imagining technology, I was able to break down this image further:

http://dontclickme.info/shimmy-jordan.jpg

Cute

FACT still remains.....

That argument would be reasonable if MJ was outside of the paint. But MJ is right next to the rim. So the depth of perception argument doesn't hold any merit.

And again.... you guys keep forgetting the other part of that pic that shows how high his feet were off the floor.

You guys would also have an argument if MJ was never known to jump head by the rim level. But the man is amongst the top 5 leapers in NBA history.

[reppy]

And again.... you guys keep forgetting the other part of that pic that shows how high his feet were off the floor.

Looking at the picture closely, it does not appear to me that his legs are straight. I don't think it's reasonable to use his feet position as an accurate way to gauge his height.

[KenneBell]

I looked at this image using state of the art imaging technology, and well...

http://dontclickme.info/shimmy-jordan.jpg
:roll:

I'm pretty sure Jordan could get the top of his head to the rim, probably did it frequently, but looking down at it? :roll:

[Fatal9]

This clearly shows your lack of understanding of optics/imaging. As stated before, you would have a case with the angles but he is right next to rim. Another fact that is depicted in the picture is that he is STARING down into the basket. Regardless of any angles there is no amount argument of optical illusions that you can state that can refute this. The first row might look as tall as the rim from our perspective but they are still looking up at the rim(which is the reference point). The only way you can stare down at the rim is if A) You're on an elevated height or B) You jump higher than it. In either case you are still higher than the rim.
Jordan's looking down at the rim in that pic? :roll:

[asd]

http://www.sneakerfiles.com/wp-content/uploads/2009/02/sprite-slam-dunk-contest-trendsetters-michael-jordan-2-1.jpg

[BirdOverrated]

Lebron to Jordan: "Tell me how my ass tastes."

http://img4.imageshack.us/img4/948/lebronheadatrimw.png

[OldSchoolBBall]

Is it true that Jordan could shoot lightening bolts out his arse?
and change the weather with a mere waive of his hand?

Funny how you act like a bitc* in Jordan topics but not "OMG KOBE IS SO WONDERFUL" topics. :oldlol:

[OldSchoolBBall]

I looked at this image using state of the art imaging technology, and well...

http://dontclickme.info/shimmy-jordan.jpg

Actully, all you really need to look at to determine if his head is at rim level in that pic (the clear version, at least) is to see if a line traced from the top of his head to the part of the rim his head is in line with (this would be more the front area of the rim, not the back) has any steeper of an incline than the top of the backboard, which we know is in a perfectly straight line. If it isn't, then he's at rim level. Eyeing it out, that's what it looks like to me.

[bleedinpurpleTwo]

Funny how you act like a bitc* in Jordan topics but not "OMG KOBE IS SO WONDERFUL" topics. :oldlol:

at least I contribute to the forum, Loki, unlike yourself who does only two things:
1. worship MJ
2. hate on Kobe

you are utterly useless to this forum.

[nnn123]

This is a quote from MJ in a game at NY in 87 season -

"I always spread my legs when I jump high, like on my Rock-a-baby, and it seems like I've opened a parachute, like, that slowly brings me back to the floor. I was really up against New York in our first game. On my last dunk I think I was close to eye level with the rim. Sometimes you just hit your wrists on the rim, but this time it was my elbows and everything. I almost overdunked the whole rim."

http://vault.sportsillustrated.cnn.com/vault/article/magazine/MAG1065465/index.htm

I wish I could see that dunk, it would be fun to see if he really got that high. But for some reason no one appears to have this game, even those people with massive DVD collections from the 80s/90s.

[Fatal9]

Actully, all you really need to look at to determine if his head is at rim level in that pic (the clear version, at least) is to see if a line traced from the top of his head to the part of the rim his head is in line with (this would be more the front area of the rim, not the back) has any steeper of an incline than the top of the backboard, which we know is in a perfectly straight line. If it isn't, then he's at rim level. Eyeing it out, that's what it looks like to me.
Yea, just make a line that follows the bottom of the backboard. That'll give you the angle caused by the depth. Move that line to Jordan's head and it'll show his head in relation to the rim.

I've seen many dunks on this angle where players seem eye level with the rim but barely even get there head to the back of the backboard. Very doubtful that he got there in this pic. Certainly not something Jordan fans (I am one) want to cling to as an example of him getting his head at rim level.

[OldSchoolBBall]

Yea, just make a line that follows the bottom of the backboard. That'll give you the angle caused by the depth. Move that line to Jordan's head and it'll show his head in relation to the rim.

I've seen many dunks on this angle where players seem eye level with the rim but barely even get there head to the back of the backboard. Very doubtful that he got there in this pic. Certainly not something Jordan fans (I am one) want to cling to as an example of him getting his head at rim level.

Actually, if you do that with the pic, it definitely looks like he's there.

[andgar923]

Again... i understand perception of depth, and this isn't the case in which an angle is misleading.

For that to be true, he'd have to be further away from the rim, but he's right next to it. I wouldn't put my money on this pic either if it didn't hold any weight.

And again.... look at all the other indicators.

At the very "least" at the peak of his jump his eyes are at rim level.

Is this pic misleading also?

http://img.skitch.com/20090306-jgbtj4x1sxawf8i3snqrfndxjq.jpg

There's no angle and that wasn't the highest peak of the jump either (he was slightly very slightly higher, but that's where I could pause the YouTube clip).

[Revelation]

I don't doubt that Jordan had a 46+ inch running vertical leap. With a running start Jordan was one of the most explosive jumpers ever seen.

Watch: 2:06 - 2:16:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-Mn1KSpLGsY#t=2m04s

Watch: 1:03 - 1:09:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rJ3K05G6QFY#t=1m02s

[F.Sanford]

http://www.geocities.com/jordanwallpaper/multimedia/1024X768AS9091SlamDunkSatelliteAgeThumbnail.jpg

If Jordan could jump over the moon while dunking, can you really not believe he could get to nose level? Sheesh

:no:

Interesting to see how two angles of virtually the same moment can make things look different.

http://img3.imageshack.us/img3/2990/8788behindtheglass.jpg

http://www.geocities.com/mjtime8892/time8892/time8892_files/8687mjreversejam.jpeg

Could Jordan, with no ball and from a running start get his eyes at rim level? I'm guessing he could. But nose level? And did he "look down at the rim" while dunking? I'm guessing not much.

Regardless, the man was sickness.

[KenneBell]

http://www.geocities.com/jordanwallpaper/multimedia/1024X768AS9091SlamDunkSatelliteAgeThumbnail.jpg

If Jordan could jump over the moon while dunking, can you really not believe he could get to nose level? Sheesh

Regardless, the man was sickness.
:roll:

Agreed on the last part.

[bruceblitz]

Again... i understand perception of depth, and this isn't the case in which an angle is misleading.

For that to be true, he'd have to be further away from the rim, but he's right next to it. I wouldn't put my money on this pic either if it didn't hold any weight.

And again.... look at all the other indicators.

At the very "least" at the peak of his jump his eyes are at rim level.

Is this pic misleading also?

http://img.skitch.com/20090306-jgbtj4x1sxawf8i3snqrfndxjq.jpg

There's no angle and that wasn't the highest peak of the jump either (he was slightly very slightly higher, but that's where I could pause the YouTube clip).

andgar923, bro, I'm glad there are realists like you and the other realists around. The speed of which Jordan ran up for that particular dunk was pretty quick, so by traveling so fast to the rim he actually creates a harder situation to show his peak jump, if you follow me, kind of like Wilkins when he got eye level to the rim on a windmill he would use a two foot gather and his forward momentum didn't work against his vertical momentum as much. Jordan was always moving so fast that his forward momentum actually worked against his vert. That is if you use common sense. So to get eye level to the rim with so much forward momentum is insane. Also, Jordan was able to get above head level with the rim on his "kiss the rim" dunk while jumping freaking sideways on a two foot gather, enough said.

[F.Sanford]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OmxJvWW5Ksw

Probably the most famous dunk in NBA history (in game). Notice how his elbow is above the rim and if it weren't for Ewing's arm pushing his head down and back, he'd be staring down at the rim. Now consider this all happens after beating multiple traps and doubles (I know what you homers are thinking, but trust me, double teams were not invented in 2001 :oldlol: ) AND dunking on a waiting 7 footer, one of the best defensive players all time. Now is it crazy to think that without all those distractions, just jumping straight up that he'd EASILY get his head over the rim? And maybe even dunk on a 12' basket just for kicks.

And no, it's not special effects or a camera angle trick, just a still shot straight at the rim. GOAT.

http://img5.imageshack.us/img5/6856/jordanewingdunk.jpg

Yeah - sure. At this point in the video his ascension had ended and he was just making contact with Ewing. But he was well on his way to being another full head length higher and looking DOWN at the rim. :rolleyes:

And have you ever heard of adrenaline?

[plowking]

Again... i understand perception of depth, and this isn't the case in which an angle is misleading.

For that to be true, he'd have to be further away from the rim, but he's right next to it. I wouldn't put my money on this pic either if it didn't hold any weight.

And again.... look at all the other indicators.

At the very "least" at the peak of his jump his eyes are at rim level.

Is this pic misleading also?

http://img.skitch.com/20090306-jgbtj4x1sxawf8i3snqrfndxjq.jpg

There's no angle and that wasn't the highest peak of the jump either (he was slightly very slightly higher, but that's where I could pause the YouTube clip).

Okay, do you honestly not understand perception and angles. He is not looking down at the ring. It is created by the angle and looks that way. Yes there is an angle there, it is taken from the floor. He is probably head level on that dunk though.

Look at this Lebron picture below. There is no angle. :rolleyes:

I guess Lebron can touch the top of the backboard, right? :rolleyes:

http://img4.imageshack.us/img4/948/lebronheadatrimw.png

[bruceblitz]

Okay, do you honestly not understand perception and angles. He is not looking down at the ring. It is created by the angle and looks that way. Yes there is an angle there, it is taken from the floor. He is probably head level on that dunk though.

Look at this Lebron picture below. There is no angle. :rolleyes:

I guess Lebron can touch the top of the backboard, right? :rolleyes:

http://img4.imageshack.us/img4/948/lebronheadatrimw.png
SO you use propaganda by trying to use a completely different angle in comparison to a side angle?
:oldlol:

[bruceblitz]

Again... i understand perception of depth, and this isn't the case in which an angle is misleading.

For that to be true, he'd have to be further away from the rim, but he's right next to it. I wouldn't put my money on this pic either if it didn't hold any weight.

And again.... look at all the other indicators.

At the very "least" at the peak of his jump his eyes are at rim level.

Is this pic misleading also?

http://img.skitch.com/20090306-jgbtj4x1sxawf8i3snqrfndxjq.jpg

There's no angle and that wasn't the highest peak of the jump either (he was slightly very slightly higher, but that's where I could pause the YouTube clip).

The dumb just keep getting dumber in the sports fan's world my friend. Like I said, at least we get it, a lot of them never will.

[plowking]

SO you use propaganda by trying to use a completely different angle in comparison to a side angle?
:oldlol:

How is it a different angle. Both were taken from the floor, yet you seem to acknowledge one but not the other.

If you draw a line from the angle the ring is going in the Jordan picture you will see there is still a gap between where his head is and where the ring would be.

[bruceblitz]

:oldlol: :roll:
How is it a different angle. Both were taken from the floor, yet you seem to acknowledge one but not the other.

If you draw a line from the angle the ring is going in the Jordan picture you will see there is still a gap between where his head is and where the ring would be.
:roll: :roll: :oldlol:

One is a side view, the other is from BEHIND LeBron. Nice try though.

[plowking]

:oldlol: :roll:
:roll: :roll: :oldlol:

One is a side view, the other is from BEHIND LeBron. Nice try though.


It doesn't make a difference. :rolleyes:


Here is James White, just getting rim level without the ball. His jump is easily better then Jordan's seeing as the guy can go between the legs on the free throw line and windmill from 3 inches behind the line.

http://img101.imageshack.us/img101/6995/jameswhitecb1.png



So you are telling me Jordan can get higher then White?

[bruceblitz]

It doesn't make a difference. :rolleyes:


Here is James White, just getting rim level without the ball. His jump is easily better then Jordan's seeing as the guy can go between the legs on the free throw line and windmill from 3 inches behind the line.

http://img101.imageshack.us/img101/6995/jameswhitecb1.png



So you are telling me Jordan can get higher then White?
:wtf: you just changed the subject. :oldlol:

fail

[plowking]

:wtf: you just changed the subject. :oldlol:

fail

How did I change the subject?

I'm using more evidence to show your 5 year old mind that there is no way in hell Jordan could get eye level to the ring.

Nice to see you have no argument and have completely been owned so you resort to "fail".

You have been owned, now leave the board.

[bruceblitz]

How did I change the subject?

I'm using more evidence to show your 5 year old mind that there is no way in hell Jordan could get eye level to the ring.

Nice to see you have no argument and have completely been owned so you resort to "fail".

You have been owned, now leave the board.
You tried to use propaganda by posting a behind view in comparison to a side view.

Even with the angle in James White's favor you can see that Jordan is higher than White:

http://ibbab.free.fr/Joueurs/Jordan/images/jo_slam98_jpg.jpg
http://d.yimg.com/a/p/sp/getty/0a/fullj.7ca6d60cdc07739d41e831f659a42949/7ca6d60cdc07739d41e831f659a42949-getty-84721185jm022_dream_factory.jpg
http://i.ehow.com/images/GlobalPhoto/Articles/2047458/michaeljordandunking_Full.jpg
http://bleacherreport.com/images_root/image_pictures/0103/7873/michael_jordan_feature.jpg

[bruceblitz]

http://img10.imageshack.us/img10/1784/0000l.jpg (http://img10.imageshack.us/my.php?image=0000l.jpg)



http://img10.imageshack.us/img10/687/0002mwl.jpg (http://img10.imageshack.us/my.php?image=0002mwl.jpg)

[gts]

how much more do the shots count for if the players head is above the rim?

[Cyclone112]

god did plow king ever own you blitz, then you post pictures with your own drawn in lines that are just retarded especially the first one. how do you possibly come up with that one

[plowking]

http://img8.imageshack.us/img8/2381/001wzq.jpg (http://img8.imageshack.us/my.php?image=001wzq.jpg)


http://img8.imageshack.us/img8/2240/0002uea.jpg (http://img8.imageshack.us/my.php?image=0002uea.jpg)


Once again you choose to pick the side closer to James, while you choose to draw the line from the middle which is further away. All very small things, but enough to make the difference. Jordan might have just got the bottom of his head in line with the ring.

I mean look at the picture I posted. This is James White going all out without the ball and just getting above the rim. Are you really trying to argue that Jordan got higher then White when it is a well known fact that White can get higher?

[db23]

Im as big a Jordan fan as anyone but Jordan never got anywhere this high above the rim, this video leaves no doubt to where James whites head was.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_dLGMTp_1Nk

[bruceblitz]

god did plow king ever own you blitz, then you post pictures with your own drawn in lines that are just retarded especially the first one. how do you possibly come up with that one
:wtf: :no: :no: :no:


http://img10.imageshack.us/img10/1784/0000l.jpg (http://img10.imageshack.us/my.php?image=0000l.jpg)



http://img10.imageshack.us/img10/687/0002mwl.jpg (http://img10.imageshack.us/my.php?image=0002mwl.jpg)

[bruceblitz]

James White is also 6'7"

Jordan is 6' 4.75"

http://www.celebheights.com/s/Michael-Jordan-1482.html

[plowking]

James White is also 6'7"

Jordan is 6' 4.75"

http://www.celebheights.com/s/Michael-Jordan-1482.html


You are beyond help.

You have an agenda, and you won't even accept science or facts themselves. That is not a true side angle. Look at the rim, it gives enough evidence that it is not a level height side on shot.

White can get higher then Jordan easily. Furthermore, Jordan is 6'6.

Here is a true side on angle of Dwight. Hardly any deviation between the ring. If anything its an angle not favoring how high Dwight is there.

http://bitcast-a.v1.sjc1.bitgravity.com/sportelligence/images/photos/photo_large/58/28358-30.jpg

[BirdOverrated]

Plowking>>>>>brucebitcl-l

[andgar923]

As I've stated before.....

Whether one wants to accept the head over the rim or the vertical measurements posted as legit, he's still been amongst the top 5 leapers in NBA history.

48 or 40 inches

Eye to rim level or head at rim level

He still dunked from the ft line with more consistency than anybody else in the history of the league.

[gts]

As I've stated before.....

Whether one wants to accept the head over the rim or the vertical measurements posted as legit, he's still been amongst the top 5 leapers in NBA history.

48 or 40 inches

Eye to rim level or head at rim level

He still dunked from the ft line with more consistency than anybody else in the history of the league.oh god... who cares?

seriously, you and brucey need to get a room... get yourselves a couple mj videos a tube of ky jelly and a room at motel 6 and get it out of your systems... you people are disturbing...i have never been creeped out on a message board but you two and your fanatical MJ love are down right strange

[F.Sanford]

The dumb just keep getting dumber in the sports fan's world my friend. Like I said, at least we get it, a lot of them never will.

Are you kidding me with all this crap? Yes, Jordan could get the top of his head about rim level. You and you're buddies have been talking about him looking down at the rim or his mouth being at rim level. Absurd

You said "Notice Jordan's head over rim height even on "the shot"." about his pic (which is beyond laughable). It so clearly shows you know nothing about perspective that the argument shouldn't even go any further.
http://img11.imageshack.us/img11/4536/theshot.jpg

You also said "Jordan getting his head well above rim-level on long distance free throw line, distance and height." about this pic:
http://www.nbaloud.com/images/michael-jordan-free-throw-line-dunk-.jpg
...again showing you're off your rocker. And the line you added to that pic is off. It's a straight line when it needs to be angled with the rim. Anyway.

[andgar923]

oh god... who cares?

seriously, you and brucey need to get a room... get yourselves a couple mj videos a tube of ky jelly and a room at motel 6 and get it out of your systems... you people are disturbing...i have never been creeped out on a message board but you two and your fanatical MJ love are down right strange

Excuse me?

I'm sure you'll get a few giggles but I'm just stating the truth.

And obviously YOU care, or you wouldn't have continued to post over and over.

[plowking]

As I've stated before.....

Whether one wants to accept the head over the rim or the vertical measurements posted as legit, he's still been amongst the top 5 leapers in NBA history.

48 or 40 inches

Eye to rim level or head at rim level

He still dunked from the ft line with more consistency than anybody else in the history of the league.

What has that got to do with anything? There are a lot of players who could dunk from the free throw line back then and even now.

No one is disputing Jordan can hit his head on the ring, because he most likely can. I remember Kemp grazing his head on the ring and having to get stitches.

Though there is no chance in hell Jordan ever looked into the ring. Or for that matter have a 48 inch vertical. I'd say the world record is probably 48. People don't realize how ridiculous it is claiming guys like Kadour and Air up There have 60 inch jumps. That would mean they could clear an average 10 year old child without bending their knees.

That is beyond ridiculous and no where near possible.

[plowking]

Excuse me?

I'm sure you'll get a few giggles but I'm just stating the truth.

And obviously YOU care, or you wouldn't have continued to post over and over.


Jordan never looked down in the ring on any of his dunks.

He is not superhuman and he isn't the best leaper in basketball history.

[andgar923]

Jordan never looked down in the ring on any of his dunks.

He is not superhuman and he isn't the best leaper in basketball history.

I NEVER said he was the best leaper in basketball history.

Please prove where I stated that.

[Scott Pippen]

Jordan never looked down in the ring on any of his dunks.

He is not superhuman and he isn't the best leaper in basketball history.
If anyone could, I may put my $$$ on Wilt Chamberlain. :applause:

[plowking]

Top 5 leaper in history and most consistent from the free throw line then anyone in the league.

Both false.

[DonDadda59]

What has that got to do with anything? There are a lot of players who could dunk from the free throw line back then and even now.

No one is disputing Jordan can hit his head on the ring, because he most likely can. I remember Kemp grazing his head on the ring and having to get stitches.

Though there is no chance in hell Jordan ever looked into the ring. Or for that matter have a 48 inch vertical. I'd say the world record is probably 48. People don't realize how ridiculous it is claiming guys like Kadour and Air up There have 60 inch jumps. That would mean they could clear an average 10 year old child without bending their knees.

That is beyond ridiculous and no where near possible.

Where are you getting your 'facts' from exactly? Several sources have claimed that Jordan had a maximum vertical in the 45"+ range. Who are you to say a certain veritcal is not possible? Might want to give this guy a look:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QoKhEiAHfYs

Let me guess, it's the angles right? He's not really getting that high and hanging in the air that long, it's all an opticall illusion.

[andgar923]

What has that got to do with anything? There are a lot of players who could dunk from the free throw line back then and even now.

No one is disputing Jordan can hit his head on the ring, because he most likely can. I remember Kemp grazing his head on the ring and having to get stitches.

Though there is no chance in hell Jordan ever looked into the ring. Or for that matter have a 48 inch vertical. I'd say the world record is probably 48. People don't realize how ridiculous it is claiming guys like Kadour and Air up There have 60 inch jumps. That would mean they could clear an average 10 year old child without bending their knees.

That is beyond ridiculous and no where near possible.

Why does it seem so ridiculous?

I'm not agreeing that they can jump 50 inches or 60, but somebody jumping eye level with the rim isn't as unfathomable as some of you think.



I also NEVER said that MJ was the ONLY or one of the few that could dunk from the ft line.

Again.... you're misquoting me.

Please read before posting.

[plowking]

Where are you getting your 'facts' from exactly? Several sources have claimed that Jordan had a maximum vertical in the 45"+ range. Who are you to say a certain veritcal is not possible? Might want to give this guy a look:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QoKhEiAHfYs

Let me guess, it's the angles right? He's not really getting that high and hanging in the air that long.

I know who Leonel Marshall is. Again I doubt he has a 50 inch vertical. He is probably at the peak of human jumping. Somewhere between the 44-48 inch range.

Think of it this way. The highest jumpers in the world will all be competing in the high jump competition. The high jump world record is 2.45m.
Seeing as in high jump the technique is to use the arch of your back and contort your body over accordingly. Now look at the arch of your back on your own body. If you are 1.8m tall, it's probably 60-65cm away from the top of your head.

Going by that, that would mean there is 1.2m difference between the arch of your back and the bottom of your feet. Now this is rough, but take that from 2.45 (which remember is the absolute highest anyone has jumped) and you are left with 1.25m. This translates roughly to 48 inches.

See my point? The world record holder is jumping 48 inches, and you are telling me there are 50 inch jumpers not competing in the Olympics?

[plowking]

Why does it seem so ridiculous?

I'm not agreeing that they can jump 50 inches or 60, but somebody jumping eye level with the rim isn't as unfathomable as some of you think.



I also NEVER said that MJ was the ONLY or one of the few that could dunk from the ft line.

Again.... you're misquoting me.

Please read before posting.

Well saying Jordan can look down into the ring puts him at the 45 inch vertical category, which he wasn't.

[plowking]

I know who Leonel Marshall is. Again I doubt he has a 50 inch vertical. He is probably at the peak of human jumping. Somewhere between the 44-48 inch range.

Think of it this way. The highest jumpers in the world will all be competing in the high jump competition. The high jump world record is 2.45m.
Seeing as in high jump the technique is to use the arch of your back and contort your body over accordingly. Now look at the arch of your back on your own body. If you are 1.8m tall, it's probably 60-65cm away from the top of your head.

Going by that, that would mean there is 1.2m difference between the arch of your back and the bottom of your feet. Now this is rough, but take that from 2.45 (which remember is the absolute highest anyone has jumped) and you are left with 1.25m. This translates roughly to 48 inches.

See my point? The world record holder is jumping 48 inches, and you are telling me there are 50 inch jumpers not competing in the Olympics?

BTW, this was all if the guy was 6 foot, though the world record holder is 6'5, so his jump wouldn't even be 50 inches like predicted if he was 6 foot.

[andgar923]

Top 5 leaper in history and most consistent from the free throw line then anyone in the league.

Both false.

Please name me another player that could dunk from the ft line more consistently than MJ.

And MJ not a top 5 NBA leaper in history?

Oh.... I'd really love to see that.

And why is it so hard for you to believe anything over 40 is a hoax?

Are you discrediting every measurement ever done? are you discrediting the measuring methods?

I've seen plenty of players with their head slightly over the rim or looking at the rim. You must not be a seasoned basketball fan if you haven't seen that or refuse to believe in that.

Have you even seen some of Ziani's dunks?

Your absolute belief that its beyond human's capabilities is extremely flawed.

[andgar923]

Well saying Jordan can look down into the ring puts him at the 45 inch vertical category, which he wasn't.

A. How do you know? There's more evidence that says he had a 48 inch vertical than a 42 inch vertical.

B. Even if he was measured at 44 or 42, don't you think there could be situations where he could actually jump that high? Lets take MJ out of the equation... are you saying that humans in general aren't capable of feats bigger than their norm under certain circumstances? such as adrenaline for example? It happens ALL THE TIME IN SPORTS where somebody performs better than they've ever done before. Ever witnessed any Olympic events?

C. You tried to compare a high jumper to a basketball player dunking. But here's where you show your lack of knowledge...... its two completely different methods of jumping. I do agree it ultimately takes raw jumping ability to jump high and dunk. But the motions for lift also have a good deal to do with that. A high jumper wouldn't jump how he would jump in a high jump competition. James White can jump very high, but that doesn't automatically mean he'd be breaking world records and vice versa. Just like a person that runs the 100 meters and the person that runs the 200 or 400. Also... a great high jumper doesn't guarantee he'd be a great long distance jumper and vice versa.

I'm still very confused at your adamant capping of how high a human's vertical can be.

48 inches isn't a superhuman feat dude.

[hateraid]

Link to vertical leap (http://vertcoach.com/highest-vertical-leap.html)

Although they posted Dr.J has a 41 inch vert and Julius Erving has a 43 inch vert somewhat makes this lose credibility.

[DonDadda59]

I know who Leonel Marshall is. Again I doubt he has a 50 inch vertical. He is probably at the peak of human jumping. Somewhere between the 44-48 inch range.

Think of it this way. The highest jumpers in the world will all be competing in the high jump competition. The high jump world record is 2.45m.
Seeing as in high jump the technique is to use the arch of your back and contort your body over accordingly. Now look at the arch of your back on your own body. If you are 1.8m tall, it's probably 60-65cm away from the top of your head.

Going by that, that would mean there is 1.2m difference between the arch of your back and the bottom of your feet. Now this is rough, but take that from 2.45 (which remember is the absolute highest anyone has jumped) and you are left with 1.25m. This translates roughly to 48 inches.

See my point? The world record holder is jumping 48 inches, and you are telling me there are 50 inch jumpers not competing in the Olympics?

You took a long time to say absolutely nothing. i asked you where your getting your facts from about the peak human vertical/world record. You're just guessing based on what you perceive, not on anything recorded or scientific. I posted a UNC study done in '83 that listed Jordan's maximum running vert at 45.7". There's a ton of sources that have his vert at anywhere between 45"-48". You can choose to believe these as fact or not, but where are the #s backing up your claim? And I've done high jump and played basketball and I will tell you that the mechanics are not exclusive to one another. My max high jump was 5'6" but I can grab a basketball rim one handed off of 2 steps (I'm 5'9 1/2" btw w/o shoes). Meanwhile, a teammate of mine could high jump 6'3" but could barely touch the rim running full speed from the 3 pt line despite being 6'1". So I'm POSITIVE there are 50" jumpers not competing in the high jump olympics and playing other sports, like oh say volleyball.

Again, where are the stats that show no one has ever had a max vert more than 48" or any proof that Jordan's max vert was any less than what has been recorded?

[plowking]

Please name me another player that could dunk from the ft line more consistently than MJ.

And MJ not a top 5 NBA leaper in history?

Oh.... I'd really love to see that.

And why is it so hard for you to believe anything over 40 is a hoax?

Are you discrediting every measurement ever done? are you discrediting the measuring methods?

I've seen plenty of players with their head slightly over the rim or looking at the rim. You must not be a seasoned basketball fan if you haven't seen that or refuse to believe in that.


Have you even seen some of Ziani's dunks?

Your absolute belief that its beyond human's capabilities is extremely flawed.

I'm saying 48 is probably the max we have seen to date. Look at plenty of the reasoning above.

You think there are higher jumpers then actual Olympic athletes who only train for that? You think there are players who can dunk the ball over a ten year old without any bending of the knees in the air?

There have been players with their heads above the rim, Jordan being one of them, but never looking into the ring. The biggest vertical I've seen is probably White or the team flight brother guy called Golden Child. Only legitimate guys I have seen look into the ring when dunking.

Vince Carter
Jason Richardson
Spud Webb
James White
Rodney Carney

All great jumpers this league has seen.

[plowking]

You took a long time to say absolutely nothing. i asked you where your getting your facts from about the peak human vertical/world record. You're just guessing based on what you perceive, not on anything recorded or scientific. I posted a UNC study done in '83 that listed Jordan's maximum running vert at 45.7". There's a ton of sources that have his vert at anywhere between 45"-48". You can choose to believe these as fact or not, but where are the #s backing up your claim? And I've done high jump and played basketball and I will tell you that the mechanics are not exclusive to one another. My max high jump was 5'6" but I can grab a basketball rim one handed off of 2 steps (I'm 5'9 1/2" btw w/o shoes). Meanwhile, a teammate of mine could high jump 6'3" but could barely touch the rim running full speed from the 3 pt line despite being 6'1". So I'm POSITIVE there are 50" jumpers not competing in the high jump olympics and playing other sports, like oh say volleyball.

Again, where are the stats that show no one has ever had a max vert more than 48" or any proof that Jordan's max vert was any less than what has been recorded?

All these street ballers are self proclaimed, even with the volleyballer it said reportedly.

[plowking]

Furthermore, high jump is about technique and max jump. You're friend obviously has technique but not jump, while you have jump but no technique.

It's a combination of the two.

[TearDrop]

somebody photoshop a lightning bolt coming out of his ass!

http://i526.photobucket.com/albums/cc344/libero_msia/Jordanfartkobe.jpg

[plowking]

Link to vertical leap (http://vertcoach.com/highest-vertical-leap.html)

Although they posted Dr.J has a 41 inch vert and Julius Erving has a 43 inch vert somewhat makes this lose credibility.

The difference in between Carter's standing reach and highest touch is the same as Jordan's, so how does Jordan have a 5 inch advantage?

[F.Sanford]

Link to vertical leap (http://vertcoach.com/highest-vertical-leap.html)

Although they posted Dr.J has a 41 inch vert and Julius Erving has a 43 inch vert somewhat makes this lose credibility.

Yeah - "jumping program" websites aren't rock solid on the truth (buy hey, maybe this once can increase my vert so I can dunk! :lol )

And if you think Carmelo Anthony has a better vert than Shawn Kemp... :cry:

[DonDadda59]

Furthermore, high jump is about technique and max jump. You're friend obviously has technique but not jump, while you have jump but no technique.

It's a combination of the two.

You don't have to tell me, I figured out that the 13+ step technique took away from my explosiveness because I burned off to much potential energy for no reason and I'm much better jumping after 2-3 steps than I am 10+. I've never measured my vertical but I'm guessing running max is in the 36" range, standing is 32"ish. But see that's just a guess so I have no idea. Just like you, you're guessing despite all the evidence to the contrary. It's ok to admit that you're wrong.

[Zak]

Isn't there a difference between a running vert and a standing vert? Which one are we talking about here

[F.Sanford]

You don't have to tell me, I figured out that the 13+ step technique took away from my explosiveness because I burned off to much potential energy for no reason and I'm much better jumping after 2-3 steps than I am 10+. I've never measured my vertical but I'm guessing running max is in the 36" range, standing is 32"ish. But see that's just a guess so I have no idea. Just like you, you're guessing despite all the evidence to the contrary. It's ok to admit that you're wrong.

OK for you to admit it too. You were the one who dropped this zinger, right?:


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OmxJvWW5Ksw

Probably the most famous dunk in NBA history (in game). Notice how his elbow is above the rim and if it weren't for Ewing's arm pushing his head down and back, he'd be staring down at the rim. Now consider this all happens after beating multiple traps and doubles (I know what you homers are thinking, but trust me, double teams were not invented in 2001 :oldlol: ) AND dunking on a waiting 7 footer, one of the best defensive players all time. Now is it crazy to think that without all those distractions, just jumping straight up that he'd EASILY get his head over the rim? And maybe even dunk on a 12' basket just for kicks.

And no, it's not special effects or a camera angle trick, just a still shot straight at the rim. GOAT.

http://img5.imageshack.us/img5/6856/jordanewingdunk.jpg

Yeah - sure. At this point in the video his ascension had ended and he was just making contact with Ewing. But he was well on his way to being another full head length higher and looking DOWN at the rim. :rolleyes:

And have you ever heard of adrenaline?

[plowking]

A. How do you know? There's more evidence that says he had a 48 inch vertical than a 42 inch vertical.

B. Even if he was measured at 44 or 42, don't you think there could be situations where he could actually jump that high? Lets take MJ out of the equation... are you saying that humans in general aren't capable of feats bigger than their norm under certain circumstances? such as adrenaline for example? It happens ALL THE TIME IN SPORTS where somebody performs better than they've ever done before. Ever witnessed any Olympic events?

C. You tried to compare a high jumper to a basketball player dunking. But here's where you show your lack of knowledge...... its two completely different methods of jumping. I do agree it ultimately takes raw jumping ability to jump high and dunk. But the motions for lift also have a good deal to do with that. A high jumper wouldn't jump how he would jump in a high jump competition. James White can jump very high, but that doesn't automatically mean he'd be breaking world records and vice versa. Just like a person that runs the 100 meters and the person that runs the 200 or 400. Also... a great high jumper doesn't guarantee he'd be a great long distance jumper and vice versa.

I'm still very confused at your adamant capping of how high a human's vertical can be.

48 inches isn't a superhuman feat dude.

Right. Everyone is doing it.

Patrick Ewing Jnr has a 40.5 and he is doing 360 behind the back dunks. Now do you realize how ridiculous 48 is?

[Lebron23]

http://i526.photobucket.com/albums/cc344/libero_msia/Jordanfartkobe.jpg

:oldlol: :roll: :oldlol:

[plowking]

You don't have to tell me, I figured out that the 13+ step technique took away from my explosiveness because I burned off to much potential energy for no reason and I'm much better jumping after 2-3 steps than I am 10+. I've never measured my vertical but I'm guessing running max is in the 36" range, standing is 32"ish. But see that's just a guess so I have no idea. Just like you, you're guessing despite all the evidence to the contrary. It's ok to admit that you're wrong.

What evidence?

You are showing me sites and self proclaimed videos of volleyballers and street ballers. There is no solid evidence to prove what you are saying.

But if you think Kadour Ziani can get 1.5m off the ground at the peak of his jump, then that is for you to believe.

[andgar923]

You took a long time to say absolutely nothing. i asked you where your getting your facts from about the peak human vertical/world record. You're just guessing based on what you perceive, not on anything recorded or scientific. I posted a UNC study done in '83 that listed Jordan's maximum running vert at 45.7". There's a ton of sources that have his vert at anywhere between 45"-48". You can choose to believe these as fact or not, but where are the #s backing up your claim? And I've done high jump and played basketball and I will tell you that the mechanics are not exclusive to one another. My max high jump was 5'6" but I can grab a basketball rim one handed off of 2 steps (I'm 5'9 1/2" btw w/o shoes). Meanwhile, a teammate of mine could high jump 6'3" but could barely touch the rim running full speed from the 3 pt line despite being 6'1". So I'm POSITIVE there are 50" jumpers not competing in the high jump olympics and playing other sports, like oh say volleyball.

Again, where are the stats that show no one has ever had a max vert more than 48" or any proof that Jordan's max vert was any less than what has been recorded?

for the fun of it ( I really don't have nothing better to do) I measured my wingspan. It was 7ft 2 inches (I have short arms and no reach), I used to stand still and jump straight up like you did, and grab the rim. For me to grab the rim I'd have to be at least an inch above the rim, so I'd say it was about a 34-36 inch vert.

But I remember a few times I grabbed it with ease and not just the tips of my fingers. How could that be? could it possibly be that I jumped higher than before? unthinkable!!!! I also remember jumping so high that I hit my head on the ceiling (I tried it a few times after that but was only successful once). Could it be some thing called "adrenaline?"

And this was BEFORE I started to run track and lift weights.

After that I used to get my wrist at least 2 inches above the rim (at times slightly higher).

My point is.....

There's times when adrenaline makes one jump higher

And

One can actually "increase" their vertical jump.

So like you, I don't get this nonsense of capping a vertical jump at 48 or people not looking into the rim. All one has to do is have their eyes at rim level or slightly higher.

[plowking]

Isn't there a difference between a running vert and a standing vert? Which one are we talking about here

Running.

It's still ridiculous to think that Jordan is able to get 48 inches off the ground.

[plowking]

for the fun of it ( I really don't have nothing better to do) I measured my wingspan. It was 7ft 2 inches (I have short arms and no reach), I used to stand still and jump straight up like you did, and grab the rim. For me to grab the rim I'd have to be at least an inch above the rim, so I'd say it was about a 34-36 inch vert.

But I remember a few times I grabbed it with ease and not just the tips of my fingers. How could that be? could it possibly be that I jumped higher than before? unthinkable!!!! I also remember jumping so high that I hit my head on the ceiling (I tried it a few times after that but was only successful once). Could it be some thing called "adrenaline?"

And this was BEFORE I started to run track and lift weights.

After that I used to get my wrist at least 2 inches above the rim (at times slightly higher).

My point is.....

There's times when adrenaline makes one jump higher

And

One can actually "increase" their vertical jump.

So like you, I don't get this nonsense of capping a vertical jump at 48 or people not looking into the rim. All one has to do is have their eyes at rim level or slightly higher.

How tall are you if your wingspan was 7 foot 2 inches? That is impressive.

[andgar923]

Right. Everyone is doing it.

Patrick Ewing Jnr has a 40.5 and he is doing 360 behind the back dunks. Now do you realize how ridiculous 48 is?

Please show me where he did a 360 behind the back dunk.

For you saying that its ridiculous for anybody to have anything close to 48, would mean that he's the highest jumper in the world, so if he's the best leaper in the world, than obviously nobody could jump higher.

BUT HE'S NOT

Behind the back dunks don't take the same about of vertical as dunking from the ft line btw.

[DonDadda59]

What evidence?

You are showing me sites and self proclaimed videos of volleyballers and street ballers. There is no solid evidence to prove what you are saying.

But if you think Kadour Ziani can get 1.5m off the ground at the peak of his jump, then that is for you to believe.




Abstract:

MICHAEL JORDAN=92S VERTICAL JUMP. =20
Krugh J, LeVeau B. University of North Carolina at Chapel Hill, Chapel =
Hill, NC.

PURPOSE: The purpose of this study, which was part of an advanced =
master=92s motion analysis class project in 1983, was to determine =
Michael Jordan=92s maximum vertical jump.
=20
SUBJECT: Michael Jordan=20

METHODS: Surface markers: Left lateral malleolus, left femoral =
epicondyle, left greater trochanter, left pelvic crest, and right distal =
phalanges of digits 2 and 3 of the hand.

Tasks (in order) were:=20
Vertical reach while standing flat-footed - baseline
Vertical reach during a jump from standing
Vertical reach during a jump from running
Vertical reach during a 1 hand dunk=20
Vertical reach during a 2 hand dunk

All tasks, except baseline vertical reach were done with free swing of =
the upper limb(s). Equipment / instrumentation: Camera, lighting, =
markers, meter stick, and standard basketball. Location: Fetzer =
Gymnasium, University of North Carolina at Chapel Hill.

DATA ANALYSIS:
Distance measurements were analyzed by comparison to a meter stick in =
view of the camera. Displacement measurements of reach (pelvis) involved =
measurement of vertical height to the tip of fingers 2 and 3 (pelvis) =
during a task minus vertical height to the tip of fingers 2 and 3 =
(pelvis) during bilateral flat-footed stance. Velocity measurements were =
analyzed by dividing vertical height distance traveled divided by time =
taken for the tasks. A VanGuard Motion Analyzer was used to analyze =
motion frame by frame.

RESULTS:=20
Maximum measurements:=20
Vertical reach while standing flat-footed 93.67 in.
Floor to pelvic crest while standing 49.00 in.
Vertical reach displacement during a jump from standing 35.93 in.
Vertical displacement of the pelvis during a jump from running 38.07 in.
Vertical velocity during a jump from running 701.00 o/sec.=20
Vertical reach displacement during a jump from running 45.76 in.
Vertical reach displacement during a 1 hand dunk 41.70 in.
Vertical reach displacement during a 2 hand dunk 40.93 in.

During the vertical reach from standing, push from the floor was with =
both feet. During the vertical reach during a jump from running, push =
from the floor was with one foot and momentum of the body, two upper =
limbs, and one lower limb was used to the maximum.=20

CONCLUSION / CLINICAL RELEVANCE: Maximum displacement for vertical reach =
was achieved with a jump from a running start, a 2 hand dunk, a 1 hand =
dunk, and a jump from standing, respectively. This is consistent with =
use of momentum of the body and limbs to assist with the vertical =
displacement. Michael Jordan=92s vertical jump ability during several =
tasks provides a standard with which athletic achievement by others can =
be compared.

Now your turn.

[andgar923]

How tall are you if your wingspan was 7 foot 2 inches? That is impressive.

I'm 5'7-5'8

Well.... I dunno if I measured my wingspan correctly.

I just got a measuring tape and put one end on the floor, stretched it out vertically and memorized where my fingers touched which was approximately 86 inches.

Like I mentioned tho.... not the most precise or scientific or possibly even correct of measuring.

[plowking]

Now your turn.

Who's a higher jumper? Vince or Jordan?

Just want to know your opinion.

[DonDadda59]

And Just to further the point, the Vertical results from last month's NFL combine (top results), there are 12 or so guys who recorded verticals of 40" or more.

http://www.nfl.com/combine/top-performers#tp-tab-set-1:tp-grid-container-vertical-jump

[plowking]

Please show me where he did a 360 behind the back dunk.

For you saying that its ridiculous for anybody to have anything close to 48, would mean that he's the highest jumper in the world, so if he's the best leaper in the world, than obviously nobody could jump higher.

BUT HE'S NOT

Behind the back dunks don't take the same about of vertical as dunking from the ft line btw.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ACR-9vrK09w

Here is a normal behind the back, haven't found the 306 yet, though I do remember watching it.

And LOL at you suggesting that more vertical is needed for free throw line dunks. Why weren't there players doing that dunk back then, though there were plenty who could do the free throw line dunk back then?

[plowking]

And Just to further the point, the Vertical results from last month's NFL combine (top results), there are 12 or so guys who recorded verticals of 40" or more.

http://www.nfl.com/combine/top-performers#tp-tab-set-1:tp-grid-container-vertical-jump

I never said over 40 wasn't possible. I said Jordan probably has about a 41 or 42 inch jump.

[plowking]

And Just to further the point, the Vertical results from last month's NFL combine (top results), there are 12 or so guys who recorded verticals of 40" or more.

http://www.nfl.com/combine/top-performers#tp-tab-set-1:tp-grid-container-vertical-jump

So who is the higher jumper?

Vince or Jordan?

[andgar923]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ACR-9vrK09w

Here is a normal behind the back, haven't found the 306 yet, though I do remember watching it.

And LOL at you suggesting that more vertical is needed for free throw line dunks. Why weren't there players doing that dunk back then, though there were plenty who could do the free throw line dunk back then?

Because they hadn't "come up wit it" perhaps?

Between the legs dunks aren't that hard either.

I used to dunk alot on 8'10 rims and I'm not saying that one doesn't have to jump high to do some of those dunks, but some don't require as high a vertical jump. Some rely more on flexibility than raw jumping ability.

[andgar923]

I never said over 40 wasn't possible. I said Jordan probably has about a 41 or 42 inch jump.

LOL

Wow

[DonDadda59]

So who is the higher jumper?

Vince or Jordan?

Jordan, even though I think Vince was the more creative dunker. But in terms of leaping ability, Jordan all the way.

You got any proof yet for your 41- 42" claim or are you going to keep trying to change the subject?

[andgar923]

And Just to further the point, the Vertical results from last month's NFL combine (top results), there are 12 or so guys who recorded verticals of 40" or more.

http://www.nfl.com/combine/top-performers#tp-tab-set-1:tp-grid-container-vertical-jump

Either Donald Washington isn't human, or the recorded 45 inch vert is completely flawed since no human can jump that high.

Either that or he has the highest vertical EVER and nobody can come close.

[Lebron23]

Michael Jordan's Vertical Leap


I came across a study done at UNC when Jordan was there. They measured his vert using a number of rather precise methods. Thought you'd like to see the resulting numbers.

"Vertical reach displacement during a jump from running 45.76 in.
Vertical reach displacement during a 1 hand dunk 41.70 in.
Vertical reach displacement during a 2 hand dunk 40.93 in."

Not bad for a skinny kid who couldn't make the high school team

http://forums.jpfitness.com/training-discussion/1944-michael-jordans-vertical-jump.html

[plowking]

Jordan, even though I think Vince was the more creative dunker. But in terms of leaping ability, Jordan all the way.

You got any proof yet for your 41- 42" claim or are you going to keep trying to change the subject?

Did Jordan actually record that 45 inch jump or is that based on the TV show that measured .92 seconds of flight time?

[plowking]

Either Donald Washington isn't human, or the recorded 45 inch vert is completely flawed since no human can jump that high.

Either that or he has the highest vertical EVER and nobody can come close.

Where did I say 45 was impossible.

You just seem to think Jordan was incredible at everything in life. I said 48 inches is probably the highest we've actually ever seen anyone jump.

[plowking]

There is yet one picture to show Jordan's head over the ring. Even the foul line dunk is taken from an angle which skews it and makes Jordan look higher then he is.

Like I said Jordan most likely could graze the top of his head on the ring, which would put him in the 41-43 inch range. 48. No.

[DonDadda59]

Did Jordan actually record that 45 inch jump or is that based on the TV show that measured .92 seconds of flight time?

Nope, study done by UNC's advanced motion analysis class in 1983. Dr. Barney Leveau, the same B Leveau whose name appears at the top of the study, was an associate professor in the Division of Physical Therapy, Chapel Hill. The original link of the study I posted won't open for me (an archived bio med journal)anymore but you can try:

http://isb.ri.ccf.org/biomch-l/archi...-05/00022.html


If that doesn't work and you're still not convinced, other studies/abstracts done by Dr. Leveau (he actually exists, not a camera trick or an illusion):

http://www.ptjournal.org/cgi/content/abstract/64/12/1812

http://www.ptjournal.org/cgi/content/abstract/65/4/474

[andgar923]

Where did I say 45 was impossible.

You just seem to think Jordan was incredible at everything in life. I said 48 inches is probably the highest we've actually ever seen anyone jump.

Yes..... that's exactly it.

I believe MJ is the resurrection of GOD himself, a divine entity that has risen to bring us all joy!!!!

So what you're basically saying is.....

You don't believe any of the evidence that states MJ jumped either 45 or 48.
You don't believe that one of the best leapers in NBA history, can jump higher than 42 inches even tho he could take off from the ft line with ease and consistency, which I'm assuming according to you, is easier than doing a behind the back dunk.
YOu don't believe that a human can have an increase of performance do to adrenaline.
You don't believe that a human can look at the rim or into a rim, even tho there's been people that have done so.

You provide no credible evidence other than your own personal belief, but you mock us.

Good job junior.

[plowking]

Nope, study done by UNC's advanced motion analysis class in 1983. Dr. Barney Leveau, the same B Leveau whose name appears at the top of the study, was an associate professor in the Division of Physical Therapy, Chapel Hill. The original link of the study I posted won't open for me (an archived bio med journal)anymore but you can try:

http://isb.ri.ccf.org/biomch-l/archi...-05/00022.html


If that doesn't work and you're still not convinced, other studies/abstracts done by Dr. Leveau (he actually exists, not a camera trick or an illusion):

http://www.ptjournal.org/cgi/content/abstract/64/12/1812

http://www.ptjournal.org/cgi/content/abstract/65/4/474

Right. So just asking once again, he didn't record that himself?

[andgar923]

There is yet one picture to show Jordan's head over the ring. Even the foul line dunk is taken from an angle which skews it and makes Jordan look higher then he is.

Like I said Jordan most likely could graze the top of his head on the ring, which would put him in the 41-43 inch range. 48. No.

Dude... honestly... Jordan's head grazing the rim was NOTHING!

Now... not to say that he's the only one, but at least for him, that happened on a constant basis, even while taking off from the dotted line.

[DonDadda59]

Right. So just asking once again, he didn't record that himself?

Who, Jordan? No, it's all in the study, if you'd just read it. So yeah, we know for certain that as a sophomore or Junior in college (probably ages 19-20) Michael Jordan had a recorded maximum vertical of 45.7". Unless you can find evidence to the contrary, your claim that his vert was 41" is unfounded and just a guess on your part. Thanks for playing though.

[plowking]

What evidence?

You have yet to show me a dunk where Jordan is above the ring. Show me one. Or all of them that you have for that matter.

I have said I have seen two legitimate looking into the ring players. James White and Golden Child.

Have you seen the video of James White getting eye level to the ring?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_dLGMTp_1Nk

That is without the ball, jumping the highest he possibly could and he has a 46 inch jump. Jordan could never get that high. Furthermore, White is only 1 inch taller then Jordan. So are you telling me Jordan could get two inches higher? Are you telling me Jordan could touch the top of the backboard?

I am not saying 48 is impossible. Though Jordan didn't have a 48 inch jump. That is fact.

[plowking]

Who, Jordan? No, it's all in the study, if you'd just read it. So yeah, we know for certain that as a sophomore or Junior in college (probably ages 19-20) Michael Jordan had a recorded maximum vertical of 45.7". Unless you can find evidence to the contrary, your claim that his vert was 41" is unfounded and just a guess on your part. Thanks for playing though.

You haven't proved anything. You have simply used some formulas and motion analysis which will never be as accurate as actually measuring the jump and Jordan actually doing it.

Answer me. Do you think Jordan could get higher then White? Especially in that video. That is all the proof I need.

First of all, he is a better free throw line dunker. More variations, and could jump further out. Now he has recorded a 46 inch jump. His max. Only an inch shorter. I have never seen Jordan get that high.

So you are telling me, he actually could get higher then what many people are calling one of the best dunkers ever in James White. Seeing as James White was only two inches off touching the top of the backboard, I'm guessing Jordan could also do that then.

[andgar923]

Though Jordan didn't have a 48 inch jump. That is fact.

Why don't YOU Prove it!





Here at 10 seconds:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rJ3K05G6QFY&feature=channel

Happy

[plowking]

Why don't YOU Prove it!





Here at 10 seconds:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rJ3K05G6QFY&feature=channel

Happy

WTF. He is no where near the rim there. Look at the damn still picture for proof. They are obviously taking over 20 motion shots in that second he is up there, and they are going to find the highest one. Yet he was not rim level.


AND WHAT MORE DO YOU WANT? I have showed you videos of higher jumpers then Jordan getting EYE LEVEL AT BEST. Like I said James White has a 46 inch vert, taking off 4 inches would put Jordan just a little above the ring or grazing the rim at his highest point. How is this not proof. Show me a dunk of Jordans at rim level.

I have shown you James White going all out WITHOUT THE BALL getting EYE LEVEL. Are you telling me Jordan could do better with a ball in hand? DO YOU HONESLTY BELIEVE THAT?

What other proof would you like? Why am I the one having to prove myself when you are yet to show me a legitimate head at rim dunk. I do believe Jordan could do this when all the muscles were pumping and he was fired up, though this would be his peak. 41-43 inches. Though you not being able to show me one goes to show how rare it was Jordan got up that high; or any player for that matter when dunking, so its hard to believe he had a 48 inch vertical, especially when he has never recorded such.

I really don't think you can argue the point that James White is a higher jumper and he only recorded a 46 inch jump. Are you saying Jordan can get higher?


Answer all the questions and you might convince me otherwise.

[DonDadda59]

You haven't proved anything. You have simply used some formulas and motion analysis which will never be as accurate as actually measuring the jump and Jordan actually doing it.

Answer me. Do you think Jordan could get higher then White? Especially in that video. That is all the proof I need.

First of all, he is a better free throw line dunker. More variations, and could jump further out. Now he has recorded a 46 inch jump. His max. Only an inch shorter. I have never seen Jordan get that high.

So you are telling me, he actually could get higher then what many people are calling one of the best dunkers ever in James White. Seeing as James White was only two inches off touching the top of the backboard, I'm guessing Jordan could also do that then.


First of all, James White isn't dunking in that video, so he has the advantage of not having a ball in his hands and running for the jump. He's a sick dunker, no question about that, but considering he has a greater reach and is taller than Jordan... eh, fcuk it I'll play your game.

Jordan DUNKING, head at rim:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=la5GJ-eaZFI&feature=related

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fuVcNsuG-vo

Had to duck in mid air so his head wouldn't hit the rim, and could've finished with his arm up to the elbow in the basket:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sdS-qvVqeDY&feature=related

Posted this already, but his elbow is clearly well above the rim and if his head weren't being pushed down and back (and not to mention if Ewing wasn't there), his eyes would be staring at the very least AT the rim, with the ball in his hand:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OmxJvWW5Ksw

And again, the free throw dunks, at 2:13 it's a straight shot at the rim from behind, no tricky angles and Jordan's head is clearly level with the rim... the other angles confirm, but this is indisputable:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-Mn1KSpLGsY

So good for James White that he can, as a taller man with longer arms not touching a basketball, get that high. There is absolutely no question that Jordan could do that, but he normally did better in landing dunks.

[andgar923]

WTF. He is no where near the rim there. Look at the damn still picture for proof. They are obviously taking over 20 motion shots in that second he is up there, and they are going to find the highest one. Yet he was not rim level.


AND WHAT MORE DO YOU WANT? I have showed you videos of higher jumpers then Jordan getting EYE LEVEL AT BEST. Like I said James White has a 46 inch vert, taking off 4 inches would put Jordan just a little above the ring or grazing the rim at his highest point. How is this not proof. Show me a dunk of Jordans at rim level.

I have shown you James White going all out WITHOUT THE BALL getting EYE LEVEL. Are you telling me Jordan could do better with a ball in hand? DO YOU HONESLTY BELIEVE THAT?

What other proof would you like? Why am I the one having to prove myself when you are yet to show me a legitimate head at rim dunk. I do believe Jordan could do this when all the muscles were pumping and he was fired up, though this would be his peak. 41-43 inches. Though you not being able to show me one goes to show how rare it was Jordan got up that high; or any player for that matter when dunking, so its hard to believe he had a 48 inch vertical, especially when he has never recorded such.

I really don't think you can argue the point that James White is a higher jumper and he only recorded a 46 inch jump. Are you saying Jordan can get higher?


Answer all the questions and you might convince me otherwise.

LOL

If you seriously don't think Mj was eye level at the rim in that link I posted around the 10-12 second mark, then you're completely blind.

And what does James White have to do with any of this?

"I" never argued that Mj could jump higher than James.

When I asked you to prove something, I meant you prove to me, that MJ didn't have a 48 inch vertical.

And again...... even if he had a 45 tops, I gave examples of circumstances in which a human can have an increase of performance due to their adrenaline.

So if MJ could consistently be head to rim level, why can't he at least once or twice in his life have a burst of adrenaline that gave him that extra burst and be eye to rim level like i posted in those links and pics?

We're talking about a top 5 NBA leaper of all time not some damn scrub or an above avg leaper.

Either way, I'm through debating with somebody that thinks Mj's top vert is only 41.

[plowking]

First of all, James White isn't dunking in that video, so he has the advantage of not having a ball in his hands and running for the jump. He's a sick dunker, no question about that, but considering he has a greater reach and is taller than Jordan... eh, fcuk it I'll play your game.

Jordan DUNKING, head at rim:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=la5GJ-eaZFI&feature=related

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fuVcNsuG-vo

Had to duck in mid air so his head wouldn't hit the rim, and could've finished with his arm up to the elbow in the basket:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sdS-qvVqeDY&feature=related

Posted this already, but his elbow is clearly well above the rim and if his head weren't being pushed down and back (and not to mention if Ewing wasn't there), his eyes would be staring at the very least AT the rim, with the ball in his hand:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OmxJvWW5Ksw

And again, the free throw dunks, at 2:13 it's a straight shot at the rim from behind, no tricky angles and Jordan's head is clearly level with the rim... the other angles confirm, but this is indisputable:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-Mn1KSpLGsY

So good for James White that he can, as a taller man with longer arms not touching a basketball, get that high. There is absolutely no question that Jordan could do that, but he normally did better in landing dunks.

Having longer arms? His standing reach is an inch shorther then Jordans. :roll:

I'm talking about him getting his eyes to the rim with a run up without the ball. Are you saying Jordan could do this?

That is honestly all the proof needed right there.

[plowking]

LOL

If you seriously don't think Mj was eye level at the rim in that link I posted around the 10-12 second mark, then you're completely blind.

And what does James White have to do with any of this?

"I" never argued that Mj could jump higher than James.

When I asked you to prove something, I meant you prove to me, that MJ didn't have a 48 inch vertical.

And again...... even if he had a 45 tops, I gave examples of circumstances in which a human can have an increase of performance due to their adrenaline.

So if MJ could consistently be head to rim level, why can't he at least once or twice in his life have a burst of adrenaline that gave him that extra burst and be eye to rim level like i posted in those links and pics?

We're talking about a top 5 NBA leaper of all time not some damn scrub or an above avg leaper.

Either way, I'm through debating with somebody that thinks Mj's top vert is only 41.

James White has a lot to do with this.

You by agreeing with Blitz, are saying that Jordan could jump higher then White. White has a 46 inch jump and can easlily get the FT line dunk legitimately. There is a video of him doing a windmill 3 inches behind the line. BEHIND THE LINE. Something Jordan has never done.

Now he also has a shorter reach then Jordan. So are you actually trying to debate that Jordan can jump higher then someone with a 46 inch jump, who can dunk better then him from the free throw line and has a shorter reach.

You can't argue facts. Sorry.

[DonDadda59]

Having longer arms? His standing reach is an inch shorther then Jordans. :roll:

I'm talking about him getting his eyes to the rim with a run up without the ball. Are you saying Jordan could do this?

That is honestly all the proof needed right there.

So you mean to tell me that with no ball in his hands, running full speed, and jumping straight up (no double pump, kick w/ legs, etc) that Jordan couldn't get his eyes past rim level? Simple math, 6'6"= 78" + 46" (his college vertical, rounded up from actual 45.7")= c. 124", so we can assume he can get his head a good 3-4" above the rim.

[plowking]

So you mean to tell me that with no ball in his hands, running full speed, and jumping straight up (no double pump, kick w/ legs, etc) that Jordan couldn't get his eyes past rim level? Simple math, 6'6"= 78" + 46" (his college vertical, rounded up from actual 45.7")= c. 124", so we can assume he can get his head a good 3-4" above the rim.

Hey buddy, don't stray from the conversation.

White a 46 inch jumper, with shorter reach can do better variations and longer dunks then Jordan.

Now the highest he could get without the ball, is eye level. Remember without the ball. One more time, without the ball.

Now Jordan can get as high as that despite me proving that White can jump from further out, doing more variations and with a shorter reach?

What is there to dispute here? You have the facts right in front of you and you choose to ignore them.

A player with shorter reach, is jumping from further out and reaching the rim easier then Jordan. How can Jordan possibly have the better jump. Explain this to me. I'm interested to know.


You basically wrote nothing in that paragraph I just quoted, and I know its not because you don't understand the question, simply because you are stumped and are ignoring the facts.

[andgar923]

James White has a lot to do with this.

You by agreeing with Blitz, are saying that Jordan could jump higher then White. White has a 46 inch jump and can easlily get the FT line dunk legitimately. There is a video of him doing a windmill 3 inches behind the line. BEHIND THE LINE. Something Jordan has never done.

Now he also has a shorter reach then Jordan. So are you actually trying to debate that Jordan can jump higher then someone with a 46 inch jump, who can dunk better then him from the free throw line and has a shorter reach.

You can't argue facts. Sorry.

I don't believe that's his vertical.

I think he can jump HIGHER than the 46 inches mentioned. Easily around 50, we've seen him increase his vertical jump throughout the years, so who's to say that measurement isn't outdated?

Before he was dunking from the ft line the normal way, not even like MJ used too.

Even in his between the legs dunk he wasn't getting as much lift.

Now we see him get his head above the rim when he does a between the legs and we see him do a between the legs from the ft line. Don't you think that his vert increased?

We've seen him basically get his chin at rim level (if not higher) I don't see why you can't believe MJ can't be at best eye to rim level.

So even if James White has a higher vert than MJ, MJ having an eye to rim vert max isn't that hard to fathom. And I've showed vids and pics to prove that. We've seen vids of MJ literally DUCKING and this is after "descending" after jumping from a distance equaled to outside the paint or the dotted line and doing other stuff with the ball.

And "I" NEVER mentioned that Mj could jump higher than James White.

[plowking]

I don't believe that's his vertical.

I think he can jump HIGHER than the 46 inches mentioned. Easily around 50, we've seen him increase his vertical jump throughout the years, so who's to say that measurement isn't outdated?

Before he was dunking from the ft line the normal way, not even like MJ used too.

Even in his between the legs dunk he wasn't getting as much lift.

Now we see him get his head above the rim when he does a between the legs and we see him do a between the legs from the ft line. Don't you think that his vert increased?

We've seen him basically get his chin at rim level (if not higher) I don't see why you can't believe MJ can't be at best eye to rim level.

So even if James White has a higher vert than MJ, MJ having an eye to rim vert max isn't that hard to fathom. And I've showed vids and pics to prove that. We've seen vids of MJ literally DUCKING and this is after "descending" after jumping from a distance equaled to outside the paint or the dotted line and doing other stuff with the ball.

And "I" NEVER mentioned that Mj could jump higher than James White.

So now you are disputing something that has actually been recorded unlike Jordans jump which is from visual studies and formulas.

:roll:

In that reverse cradel dunk, he does not have to duck, he would not have hit the ring.

Furthermore the jump was recorded 6 months before the Turkish Dunk Contest. So not too much change is going to happen.

The best James White could get is eye level (maybe chin) without the ball, so I have no doubt that Jordan couldn't get eye level on dunks seeing as a better jumper then him could just get there with the ball.

[plowking]

I don't believe that's his vertical.

I think he can jump HIGHER than the 46 inches mentioned. Easily around 50, we've seen him increase his vertical jump throughout the years, so who's to say that measurement isn't outdated?

Before he was dunking from the ft line the normal way, not even like MJ used too.

Even in his between the legs dunk he wasn't getting as much lift.

Now we see him get his head above the rim when he does a between the legs and we see him do a between the legs from the ft line. Don't you think that his vert increased?

We've seen him basically get his chin at rim level (if not higher) I don't see why you can't believe MJ can't be at best eye to rim level.

So even if James White has a higher vert than MJ, MJ having an eye to rim vert max isn't that hard to fathom. And I've showed vids and pics to prove that. We've seen vids of MJ literally DUCKING and this is after "descending" after jumping from a distance equaled to outside the paint or the dotted line and doing other stuff with the ball.

And "I" NEVER mentioned that Mj could jump higher than James White.

You did say he could jump higher then James White. James White has a 46 inch vertical and you agreed Jordan has a 48 inch jump as said by the OP.

Am I wrong there?

[Manute for Ever!]

There is some serious denial if you believe Jordan's vertical was only 41"

http://members.iinet.net.au/~jchong8/1987slamdunk/8687ASFreeThrowDunk32Dither.gif

http://members.iinet.net.au/~jchong8/1987slamdunk/8687ASFinalLeaner50.JPG
http://members.iinet.net.au/~jchong8/1987slamdunk/8687ASLeaner.gif

http://members.iinet.net.au/~jchong8/1987slamdunk/8687Superman.gif

[DonDadda59]

So short review, reported verticals that state Jordan's max in the neighborhood of 46"+ are invalid in your eyes, ok.

A biomedical study done by professors at UNC's Chapel Hill that list Jordan's max vert during college to be 45.7" doesn't count to you for some reason, check.

All video and photographic evidence that clearly show Jordan's head at rim level, along with arms and elbows well above the cylinder ALL have something wrong w/ them because every angle is invalid, bingo.

So let me throw one more out at you, see if this one does the trick:


"[Jordan], too, marvels at his gravity-defying feats, searching for an explanation. "I always spread my legs when I jump high, like on my Rock-a-baby, and it seems like I've opened a parachute, like, that slowly brings me back to the floor. I was really up against New York in our first game. On my last dunk I think I was close to eye level with the rim. Sometimes you just hit your wrists on the rim, but this time it was my elbows and everything. I almost overdunked the whole rim."

-Sports Illustrated Vault, 1986

So what's the beef with Jordan's own words? I'm sure you'll bring up some D-League scrub to try to get around this one. Maybe Demar Derozan this time?

[plowking]

So short review, reported verticals that state Jordan's max in the neighborhood of 46"+ are invalid in your eyes, ok.

A biomedical study done by professors at UNC's Chapel Hill that list Jordan's max vert during college to be 45.7" doesn't count to you for some reason, check.

All video and photographic evidence that clearly show Jordan's head at rim level, along with arms and elbows well above the cylinder ALL have something wrong w/ them because every angle is invalid, bingo.

So let me throw one more out at you, see if this one does the trick:


"[Jordan], too, marvels at his gravity-defying feats, searching for an explanation. "I always spread my legs when I jump high, like on my Rock-a-baby, and it seems like I've opened a parachute, like, that slowly brings me back to the floor. I was really up against New York in our first game. On my last dunk I think I was close to eye level with the rim. Sometimes you just hit your wrists on the rim, but this time it was my elbows and everything. I almost overdunked the whole rim."

-Sports Illustrated Vault, 1986

So what's the beef with Jordan's own words? I'm sure you'll bring up some D-League scrub to try to get around this one. Maybe Demar Derozan this time?

Studies aren't always correct... What is hard to understand?

You said it yourself, he never recorded that himself, but was simply a study.

Okay, now explain to me, what is hard to understand here.

James White has a 46 inch vertical. He can get, at the max of his jump, without the ball, eye level. He can also dunk the ball from 3 inches behind the line while windmilling it, something Jordan couldn't even do. Also James White has a shorter reach, thus making it harder for him, unless he had the bigger jump. :hammerhead:

So, going by the fact that he could jump more with a shorter reach, how is Jordan's jump supposed to be 48 inches or even 46 when White's is 46 inches and he is out jumping Jordan with a shorter standing reach.

Now. Explain to me, how Jordan can jump higher then White and if it was ever actually recorded like James White's jump was.

[plowking]

There is some serious denial if you believe Jordan's vertical was only 41"

http://members.iinet.net.au/~jchong8/1987slamdunk/8687ASFreeThrowDunk32Dither.gif

http://members.iinet.net.au/~jchong8/1987slamdunk/8687ASFinalLeaner50.JPG
http://members.iinet.net.au/~jchong8/1987slamdunk/8687ASLeaner.gif

http://members.iinet.net.au/~jchong8/1987slamdunk/8687Superman.gif

Jordan is 6 foot 6. To be getting his head at the top of the rim, that would mean a 42 inch jump. I said he most likely grazed his head on the bottom of the ring many times, though he never had to duck like many think in the reverse cradle he did.

I said his jump is anywhere from 41 - 43 inches.

In all of those pictures you posted, he is not at rim level in any of them. Like I said he probably has gotten that high, though only on a few occasions and I am yet to see visual proof, though on one of the free throw line dunks he doesn't seem to be far off.

Look at the James White explanation, if that doesn't make sense, I don't know what does.

Furthermore the argument isn't going there way so the posters start to not believe recorded stats which are facts of how high a player can jump.

Actual recorded statistics > some biomedical research estimation which probably has a high margain of era depending on the conditions which wouldn't have been that good at Jordan's UNC days.

[LJJ]

Check this video where they measure Jordan's vert: 44 inches:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Yu_moia-oVI

[bruceblitz]

http://img10.imageshack.us/img10/1784/0000l.jpg (http://img10.imageshack.us/my.php?image=0000l.jpg)



http://img10.imageshack.us/img10/687/0002mwl.jpg (http://img10.imageshack.us/my.php?image=0002mwl.jpg)

Jordan = 6' 4.75"
http://www.celebheights.com/s/Michael-Jordan-1482.html
White = 6' 7"
http://www.basketball-reference.com/players/w/whiteja02.html

Jordan has more space between his legs and the floor, more distance from hip to floor. You can clearly see he's higher on the long distance dunk.

[plowking]

Jordan = 6' 4.75"
http://www.celebheights.com/s/Michael-Jordan-1482.html
White = 6' 7"
http://www.basketball-reference.com/players/w/whiteja02.html

Jordan has more space between his legs and the floor, more distance from hip to floor. You can clearly see he's higher on the long distance dunk.

You are unbelievable. Honestly. Also you know nothing about dimensions and proportions.

First of all your line should be drawn from the top if anything, though its not a correct angle. So Jordan would not be above the ring.

Also, if you are comparing heights, use the same site to quote heights.

Secondly, did you notice that MJ's legs are say... way more bent then White's?

James White has a shorter reach by 1 inch and can dunk further out then MJ by about 3 inches.

So how does he have a bigger jump then James White if he can't even dunk it from the same distance White can with a shorter reach?

[plowking]

Now Bruce before you go quoting yourself again, just answer this one question.

How does MJ have a 48 inch vertical, when James White has shown he can easily jump from further out then MJ while having a 46 inch vertical and a shorter reach?

That is all you need to answer. With words, unless you have a video of MJ dunking from further out then White I will shut up.

But that is all you need to do, answer that question.

Once again, just that question.

Remember, don't quote yourself.

Just the question will do.

Question. Answer. That's it.




PS: Remember to answer the question.

[USAF_AMMO]

I'm 5'7-5'8

Well.... I dunno if I measured my wingspan correctly.

I just got a measuring tape and put one end on the floor, stretched it out vertically and memorized where my fingers touched which was approximately 86 inches.

Like I mentioned tho.... not the most precise or scientific or possibly even correct of measuring.

5'8 with a 7'2 wingspan is hilarious... Your hands would practically drag on the ground.

You had to have measured wrong. I was always under the impression that most peoples wingspan and height are proportionate.

[bruceblitz]

Jordan = 6' 4.75"
http://www.celebheights.com/s/Michael-Jordan-1482.html
White = 6' 7"
http://www.basketball-reference.com/players/w/whiteja02.html

Jordan has more space between his legs and the floor, more distance from hip to floor. You can clearly see he's higher on the long distance dunk.
:D

[plowking]

:D

Answer the question Bruce. Or you can't, because once again the facts have proven you wrong.

[gibbo3000]

5'8 with a 7'2 wingspan is hilarious... Your hands would practically drag on the ground.

You had to have measured wrong. I was always under the impression that most peoples wingspan and height are proportionate.

he is getting his reach(hands straight up) confussed with his wingspan

BTW - This thread is going waaaaaaaaaaaaaay too long argueing about a couple of inches, its going nowhere, nobody is gonna win, give up, someone be the bigger man

[bruceblitz]

Answer the question Bruce. Or you can't, because once again the facts have proven you wrong.
You have proven nothing, unlike me.

[UConnCeltics]

5'8 with a 7'2 wingspan is hilarious... Your hands would practically drag on the ground.

You had to have measured wrong. I was always under the impression that most peoples wingspan and height are proportionate.
Thats what I'm thinking. I'm 5'8 and my wingspan is 6'2 or 6'3. I don't believe someone with the same height as me would have nearly 6 inches more than me on each arm.

[bruceblitz]

http://www.nbaloud.com/images/michael-jordan-free-throw-line-dunk-.jpg
Jordan getting his head well above rim-level on long distance free throw line, distance and height.

http://img512.imageshack.us/img512/1152/meeeuu1.jpg
Notice Jordan's head over rim height even on "the shot".

http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2209/2195465200_27908cf511.jpg

Sorry you exposed yourself as a failure as a basketball fan. The "court level" views of the old school game weren't as prevalent as they are now. Jordan getting his head at rim height and higher would be most prominent in the 80's.

Thanks for playing!

http://image.blingee.com/images15/content/output/000/000/000/446/287221325_1841324.gif

plowking = fail

[bruceblitz]

http://img10.imageshack.us/img10/1784/0000l.jpg (http://img10.imageshack.us/my.php?image=0000l.jpg)



http://img10.imageshack.us/img10/687/0002mwl.jpg (http://img10.imageshack.us/my.php?image=0002mwl.jpg)

Jordan = 6' 4.75"
http://www.celebheights.com/s/Michael-Jordan-1482.html
White = 6' 7"
http://www.basketball-reference.com/players/w/whiteja02.html

Jordan has more space between his legs and the floor, more distance from hip to floor. You can clearly see he's higher on the long distance dunk.

plowking = fail

[bruceblitz]

Defending my good buddy andgar923, I am 6'0" and have a 72 inch reach

Tommy Hearns was with 6'1" a 78" reach
http://www.boxrec.com/list_bouts.php?human_id=303&cat=boxer

Derrick Rose is 6'2" with a 6'8" wingspan
http://www.hoopsfantasy.com/derrick-rose-official-measurements-2008-nba-draft/

Sugar Ray Leonard was 5'10" with a 74" reach
http://www.boxrec.com/list_bouts.php?human_id=269&cat=boxer


How to measure "reach": to measure a boxer's reach, measure the distance from finger tip to finger tip.
How to measure "wingspan": stand with your back to a wall arms straight out to the sides and have someone mark where the ends of your middle fingers touch the wall. Next measure the distance between those two marks.

Reach = wingspan

[gibbo3000]

Defending my good buddy andgar923, I am 6'0" and have a 72 inch reach

Tommy Hearns was with 6'1" a 78" reach
http://www.boxrec.com/list_bouts.php?human_id=303&cat=boxer

Derrick Rose is 6'2" with a 6'8" wingspan
http://www.hoopsfantasy.com/derrick-rose-official-measurements-2008-nba-draft/

Sugar Ray Leonard was 5'10" with a 74" reach
http://www.boxrec.com/list_bouts.php?human_id=269&cat=boxer

Read the strucutre of his post, he's talking about his vertical standing reach (hand in teh air) no his wingspan

[bruceblitz]

Read the strucutre of his post, he's talking about his vertical standing reach (hand in teh air) no his wingspan
If that's the case I misunderstood. I still posted valuable information.

[plowking]

You have proven nothing, unlike me.

What have you proven.

No one in this damn thread apart from two people agreed with you.

Even Loki (oldschoolbball) the most knowledgable Jordan fan here disagreed with you and estimated Jordan's jump at around 42 inch's like I said.

FFS, if you think Jordan got rim level on a jumpshot there is no use talking to you.

You have been owned and have no answer so like I said before, you were just going to quote yourself and not come up with a reply.

Another question. Do you actually think Jordan got head to rim on that jumpshot you just posted a picture of? Honestly?

Answer my two questions. That is all I want.

[plowking]

Now Bruce before you go quoting yourself again, just answer this one question.

How does MJ have a 48 inch vertical, when James White has shown he can easily jump from further out then MJ while having a 46 inch vertical and a shorter reach?

That is all you need to answer. With words, unless you have a video of MJ dunking from further out then White I will shut up.

But that is all you need to do, answer that question.

Once again, just that question.

Remember, don't quote yourself.

Just the question will do.

Question. Answer. That's it.




PS: Remember to answer the question.

Answer it.

How can Jordan jump more then White, when White is jumping from further out with a shorter reach?

[plowking]

plowking = fail

Looking at that black and white picture of Jordan which you claim that his head is at ring height. Think of it this way.


Knowing your lack of understanding of say, anything, you would say Jordan's shoulder is at backboard level, right? Seeing as you claim it to be a perfect angle.

Now think about this. Is the point from the bottom of the backboard to the ring the same distance as your shoulder to the top of your head? No. Your shoulder to your head is longer, meaning that the angle is not correct and Jordan's head is not at ring level.

Do you understand?

[bruceblitz]

http://www.nbaloud.com/images/michael-jordan-free-throw-line-dunk-.jpg
Jordan getting his head well above rim-level on long distance free throw line, distance and height.

http://img512.imageshack.us/img512/1152/meeeuu1.jpg
Notice Jordan's head over rim height even on "the shot".

http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2209/2195465200_27908cf511.jpg

Sorry you exposed yourself as a failure as a basketball fan. The "court level" views of the old school game weren't as prevalent as they are now. Jordan getting his head at rim height and higher would be most prominent in the 80's.

Thanks for playing!

http://image.blingee.com/images15/content/output/000/000/000/446/287221325_1841324.gif

plowking = fail

Once again, you will not change my mind, you = fail

[bruceblitz]

http://img10.imageshack.us/img10/1784/0000l.jpg (http://img10.imageshack.us/my.php?image=0000l.jpg)



http://img10.imageshack.us/img10/687/0002mwl.jpg (http://img10.imageshack.us/my.php?image=0002mwl.jpg)

Jordan = 6' 4.75"
http://www.celebheights.com/s/Michael-Jordan-1482.html
White = 6' 7"
http://www.basketball-reference.com/players/w/whiteja02.html

Jordan has more space between his legs and the floor, more distance from hip to floor. You can clearly see he's higher on the long distance dunk.

plowking = fail :confusedshrug:
http://rlv.zcache.com/im_not_stubborn_im_just_german_tshirt-p235290296688672087trlf_400.jpg
http://img5.imageshack.us/img5/2884/youtube4.jpg (http://img5.imageshack.us/my.php?image=youtube4.jpg)
http://img5.imageshack.us/img5/2874/radr.jpg (http://img5.imageshack.us/my.php?image=radr.jpg)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3IoBFrnbjb0

[plowking]

plowking = fail

Once again, you will not change my mind, you = fail

It's not about changing your mind. It's showing you the facts which you deny.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xgjEAV5w4sE


Show me Jordan ever getting this high or jumping from this far out. Pause it at 2 seconds and see where he takes off from yourself. Maybe even more then the 3 inch gap I claimed.

Go on. Just show me.


You are a fraud bruce who knows jack all about basketball if you cannot admit you are wrong or prove me wrong.

Just show me Jordan jumping from further out or getting higher then James did on that first dunk where he windmilled it from behind the free throw line and I will leave this site forever.

If not, admit you are wrong or leave forever.

[plowking]

What don't you understand about reach as well.

If I am 7 foot and have a 7 foot 5 reach, and there is a 6 foot guy with a 7 foot 8 reach, its still easier for the 6 foot guy to dunk it.

Jordan has a 1 inch reach advantage over White.

You have been owned. Admit you are wrong, or leave the board.

[twolvesfan]

What don't you understand about reach as well.

If I am 7 foot and have a 7 foot 5 reach, and there is a 6 foot guy with a 7 foot 8 reach, its still easier for the 6 foot guy to dunk it.

Jordan has a 1 inch reach advantage over White.

You have been owned. Admit you are wrong, or leave the board.
:wtf: you have 5 inch arms

[plowking]

:wtf: you have 5 inch arms

I'm trying to put it simply for the guy. Read the last 3 pages and you will see its like explaining something to a 4 year old.

He doesn't seem to understand that reach is more important then height in terms of dunking.

[bruceblitz]

http://www.nbaloud.com/images/michael-jordan-free-throw-line-dunk-.jpg
Jordan getting his head well above rim-level on long distance free throw line, distance and height.

http://img512.imageshack.us/img512/1152/meeeuu1.jpg
Notice Jordan's head over rim height even on "the shot".

http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2209/2195465200_27908cf511.jpg

Sorry you exposed yourself as a failure as a basketball fan. The "court level" views of the old school game weren't as prevalent as they are now. Jordan getting his head at rim height and higher would be most prominent in the 80's.

Thanks for playing!

http://image.blingee.com/images15/content/output/000/000/000/446/287221325_1841324.gif

plowking = fail

[bruceblitz]

http://img10.imageshack.us/img10/1784/0000l.jpg (http://img10.imageshack.us/my.php?image=0000l.jpg)



http://img10.imageshack.us/img10/687/0002mwl.jpg (http://img10.imageshack.us/my.php?image=0002mwl.jpg)

Jordan = 6' 4.75"
http://www.celebheights.com/s/Michael-Jordan-1482.html
White = 6' 7"
http://www.basketball-reference.com/players/w/whiteja02.html

Jordan has more space between his legs and the floor, more distance from hip to floor. You can clearly see he's higher on the long distance dunk.

plowking = fail :confusedshrug:
http://rlv.zcache.com/im_not_stubborn_im_just_german_tshirt-p235290296688672087trlf_400.jpg
http://img5.imageshack.us/img5/2884/youtube4.jpg (http://img5.imageshack.us/my.php?image=youtube4.jpg)
http://img5.imageshack.us/img5/2874/radr.jpg (http://img5.imageshack.us/my.php?image=radr.jpg)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3IoBFrnbjb0

[bruceblitz]

http://www.geocities.com/michaeljordangallery2/photo3/9596HoustonOlajuwon.jpg

Plowking = blind
http://www.geocities.com/michaeljordangallery2/photo3/8889DetroitSalley.jpg

http://www.geocities.com/michaeljordangallery14/photo14/8788BucksScottSkiles.jpg

[KenneBell]

:roll:

Unbelievable.

[JEFFERSON MONEY]

Look. I am 6 flat. I have gotten my head halfway up the rim, licking up the net off three steps. My no step vertical is 31" PERIOD. 48 is inhumane so stop making up that nonsense. i've busted my a$$ since grade school with a combo of plyometrics, fast squats, genetics, sprting, and meditation.

Carter, Nate Rob, Gerry Green, LBJ, J-Rich, Spud Webb, Jordan Farmar, have comparable verts to MJ. Not motherphucking Michael Wilson or Kadour Ziani.

[plowking]

Just answer the question bruce.

You've always said you provide facts, yet all you have done is provide pictures and somehow between the two, amazingly come up with Jordan being higher then White. All this, by just looking at the two pictures.

It's hard to believe you are what 30 years old? Kinda sad and pathetic that you hang onto everything that was said about your basketball hero. I understand that its hard to let go and admit that you were wrong for believing, but you are a grown man bruce and you should honestly be able to take this like one and not a 5 year old child which you are acting like.

[bruceblitz]

:cry:
:confusedshrug: