Greatest single-game performance in the history of the 00s era

[Stiff #1]

9 choices:

Kobe Bryant:
- 81 points, 6 rebounds, 2 assists, 3 steals, 1 block, 28-46 FG-FGA vs. TOR in 2006
- 62 points, 8 rebounds, 0 assists, 3 steals, 0 blocks, 18-31 FG-FGA, 3 quarters vs. DAL in 2006
- 49 points, 4 rebounds, 10 assists, 1 steal, 1 block, 18-27 FG-FGA in Game 2 of the 2008 Western Conference first round

LeBron James:
- 52 points, 9 rebounds, 11 assists, 0 steals, 2 blocks, 17-33 FG-FGA @ NYK in 2009
- 51 points, 8 rebounds, 9 assists, 3 steals, 1 block, 18-28 FG-FGA @ MEM in 2008
- 48 points, 9 rebounds, 7 assists, 2 steals, 0 blocks, 18-33 FG-FGA in double OT @ DET in Game 5 of the 2007 Eastern Conference Finals

[B]Shaquille O

[quasimoto]

Didn't Shaq get that 61 point game on his birthday? That's what's really impressive about it.

[Stiff #1]

Didn't Shaq get that 61 point game on his birthday? That's what's really impressive about it.
That means he's a legend.

[hack_a_shaq]

I got shaq. 61-23 game.

[Mikaiel]

Anyone who picks a regular season game deserves to be banned.

And where the f*ck are Shaq's games in the Finals when he was a Laker ? And where the f*ck is Duncan's near quadruple double in the Finals ?

[nbastatus]

[QUOTE=Stiff #1]9 choices:

Kobe Bryant:
- 81 points, 6 rebounds, 2 assists, 3 steals, 1 block, 28-46 FG-FGA vs. TOR in 2006
- 62 points, 8 rebounds, 0 assists, 3 steals, 0 blocks, 18-31 FG-FGA, 3 quarters vs. DAL in 2006
- 49 points, 4 rebounds, 10 assists, 1 steal, 1 block, 18-27 FG-FGA in Game 2 of the 2008 Western Conference first round

LeBron James:
- 52 points, 9 rebounds, 11 assists, 0 steals, 2 blocks, 17-33 FG-FGA @ NYK in 2009
- 51 points, 8 rebounds, 9 assists, 3 steals, 1 block, 18-28 FG-FGA @ MEM in 2008
- 48 points, 9 rebounds, 7 assists, 2 steals, 0 blocks, 18-33 FG-FGA in double OT @ DET in Game 5 of the 2007 Eastern Conference Finals

[B]Shaquille O

[Myth]

61/23 please.

[jrong]

Michael Jordan dropping 51 at age 39
Michael Jordan dropping 43 at age 40

[Stiff #1]

Anyone who picks a regular season game deserves to be banned.

And where the f*ck are Shaq's games in the Finals when he was a Laker ? And where the f*ck is Duncan's near quadruple double in the Finals ?
Shaq was much better than Kareem.

[S13M]

Regular season: Kobe Bryant
81 points, 6 rebounds, 2 assists, 3 steals, 1 block, 28-46 FG-FGA vs. TOR in 2006

Playoffs: LeBron James
48 points, 9 rebounds, 7 assists, 2 steals, 0 blocks, 18-33 FG-FGA in double OT @ DET in Game 5 of the 2007 Eastern Conference Finals

[Stiff #1]

Tim Duncan's Game 6 of the 2003 NBA Finals:

21 points, 20 rebounds, 10 assists, 0 steals, 8 blocks, 9-19 FG-FGA

Great line.

[KobeRules24]

Kobe's 81 of course

[Kebab Stall]

Tim Duncan's Game 6 of the 2003 NBA Finals:

21 points, 20 rebounds, 10 assists, 0 steals, 8 blocks, 9-19 FG-FGA

Great line.
That's my favourite. I was just about to post it.

Shaq's 61/23 is also damn impressive.

[oh the horror]

And where the f*ck are Shaq's games in the Finals when he was a Laker ? And where the f*ck is Duncan's near quadruple double in the Finals ?


The point of the thread is to name the ones YOU remember.

[Stiff #1]

Really? Numbers say otherwise. Get back to me when he can do it without Garnett on his team.

http://www.basketball-reference.com/fc/h2h_finder.cgi?request=1&p1=cartevi01&p2=piercpa01
http://www.basketball-reference.com/boxscores/200504090NJN.html
http://www.basketball-reference.com/boxscores/199904080TOR.html

^^ As you can see, Carter has been shutting him down whenever the two have played each other.

[Myth]

There is also Shaq's near quadruple double in the 2001 Finals. The 76ers won a game, so Shaq came back to punish with 28 points, 20 rebounds, 9 assists, and 8 blocks.

[Se]

- 44 points, 21 rebounds, 4 assists, 0 steals, 7 blocks, 17-32 FG-FGA vs. SAC in Game 1 of the 2001 Western Conference Semifinals

[Stiff #1]

Here is how you break it down:

Regular season? Playoffs? It doesn't matter. The greatest performance of the decade will be one that everyone will remember. The obvious answer to the 80s GOAT performance would be Jordan's 63 in Game 2 of the 1986 Eastern Conference first round, not Magic's 42/15/7 in the 1980 finals. Nobody really cares about Magic's performance anymore, but everyone remembers Jordan's.

The obvious answer to the 90s GOAT performance would be Jordan's Game 5 of the 1997 finals (flu), his Game 6 of the 1998 finals (game-winner), or his 69/18/6 against the 1990 Cavs. Why? Because everyone remembers those. No one cares about Barkley's career highs, Hakeem's near quad double or any of that.

So the greatest performance of this era is one that nobody will forget. Good job. :oldlol:

[BallPhunk]

[QUOTE=Stiff #1]9 choices:

Kobe Bryant:
- 81 points, 6 rebounds, 2 assists, 3 steals, 1 block, 28-46 FG-FGA vs. TOR in 2006
- 62 points, 8 rebounds, 0 assists, 3 steals, 0 blocks, 18-31 FG-FGA, 3 quarters vs. DAL in 2006
- 49 points, 4 rebounds, 10 assists, 1 steal, 1 block, 18-27 FG-FGA in Game 2 of the 2008 Western Conference first round

LeBron James:
- 52 points, 9 rebounds, 11 assists, 0 steals, 2 blocks, 17-33 FG-FGA @ NYK in 2009
- 51 points, 8 rebounds, 9 assists, 3 steals, 1 block, 18-28 FG-FGA @ MEM in 2008
- 48 points, 9 rebounds, 7 assists, 2 steals, 0 blocks, 18-33 FG-FGA in double OT @ DET in Game 5 of the 2007 Eastern Conference Finals

[B]Shaquille O

[Mikaiel]

Nobody really cares about Magic's performance anymore, but everyone remembers Jordan's.

http://www.soonet.ca/images/smilies/Smile/suicide.gif http://www.soonet.ca/images/smilies/Smile/suicide.gif http://www.soonet.ca/images/smilies/Smile/suicide.gif

[JEFFERSON MONEY]

None of the above.

I select Jamal "Anklebreaker" Crawford's 52 points, 8 3PFGM against the then-powerful Warriors.

[Myth]

So the greatest performance of this era is one that nobody will forget. Good job. :oldlol:

Why didn't you ask 'Most memorable single game performance' then? Greatest and most memorable ARE different.

[Stiff #1]

- 61 points, 23 rebounds, 3 assists, 0 steals, 0 blocks, 24-35 FG-FGA @ LAC in 2000

I saw every second of that game and remember it well. It was one of those "men against boys" game. The Clippers had no one that could stop him, and he was camping under the rim and slamming it so hard in various Clippers faces that I actually felt bad for them.

I think Shaq is top 5 all-time, but this performance shouldn't win. Degree of difficulty was about a 2 outta 10.
Shaq is top 3 all-time, the greatest Laker ever (way better than Magic, Kareem, West), the greatest center ever (much better than Wilt, Kareem, Russell).

Since Kareem, Russell and Wilt couldn't dominate in the finals the way Shaq did, they don't deserve to be ranked over him. Could they ever drop 40+/20+ in consecutive games? Could they ever do this with 7-8 blocks? Obviously not, because they weren't on his level. No center deserves to be compared to Shaquille Rashaun O'Neal. They all suck compared to him.

[Showtime]

Webber - 51 points, 26 rebounds, 5 assists, 3 steals, 2 blocks

Arenas - crapping on Kobe and the Lakers:

60 points, 8 rebounds, 8 assists, 2 steals

[BallPhunk]

Here is how you break it down:

Regular season? Playoffs? It doesn't matter. The greatest performance of the decade will be one that everyone will remember. The obvious answer to the 80s GOAT performance would be Jordan's 63 in Game 2 of the 1986 Eastern Conference first round, not Magic's 42/15/7 in the 1980 finals. Nobody really cares about Magic's performance anymore, but everyone remembers Jordan's.

The obvious answer to the 90s GOAT performance would be Jordan's Game 5 of the 1997 finals (flu), his Game 6 of the 1998 finals (game-winner), or his 69/18/6 against the 1990 Cavs. Why? Because everyone remembers those. No one cares about Barkley's career highs, Hakeem's near quad double or any of that.

So the greatest performance of this era is one that nobody will forget. Good job. :oldlol:

I wish you could tag people's profile with certain comments so you know where they're coming from when posting and take it into account.

Although I guess it's sometimes not needed... If someone uses the term "GOAT" in a reply multiple times or they end every post with this: :hammertime: I have a pretty good idea how serious to take them...

[Stiff #1]

Why didn't you ask 'Most memorable single game performance' then? Greatest and most memorable ARE different.

The greatest and most memorable ARE the same thing. LOL!! :roll: :roll: :roll: :roll:

If a performance isn't great, will anyone remember it? LMAO!! OBVIOUSLY NOT!

Think before you post. :banghead:

[Stiff #1]

Webber - 51 points, 26 rebounds, 5 assists, 3 steals, 2 blocks

Arenas - crapping on Kobe and the Lakers:

60 points, 8 rebounds, 8 assists, 2 steals
Sh*tty performances. None of those deserve to be mentioned.

[c_az_a]

Kobe Bryant 3-1 series lead against the Suns only to blow it in seven games. Kobe was 1/4 the player he was in the regular season when he scored 81 pts against one of the worse defensive teams in the league (and perennial lottery team). In the regular season, Kobe shines (see 62 pts in 3 quarters). In the playoffs, he's not the player the media thought he were.

[BallPhunk]

Shaq is top 3 all-time, the greatest Laker ever (way better than Magic, Kareem, West), the greatest center ever (much better than Wilt, Kareem, Russell).

Since Kareem, Russell and Wilt couldn't dominate in the finals the way Shaq did, they don't deserve to be ranked over him. Could they ever drop 40+/20+ in consecutive games? Could they ever do this with 7-8 blocks? Obviously not, because they weren't on his level. No center deserves to be compared to Shaquille Rashaun O'Neal. They all suck compared to him.

Truer words have never been written. Kareem or Wilt could never have dropped 40+/20+ in consecutive games!! Especially against the crew Shaq did that against!!!!!! NEVER NEEVAAA NO! :rolleyes:

[Stiff #1]

I wish you could tag people's profile with certain comments so you know where they're coming from when posting and take it into account.

Although I guess it's sometimes not needed... If someone uses the term "GOAT" in a reply multiple times or they end every post with this: :hammertime: I have a pretty good idea how serious to take them...
Magic is overrated because people compare him to Jordan and Shaq.

Magic's 42/15/7? Big deal. If you are 6'9'' and given the opportunity to play center, you should grab double-digit boards. Rebounds are overrated. 7 assists? Pathetic for a PG.

42 points is decent, but nothing compared to 60+, playing 40+ minutes and dropping nearly 40 while feeling like absolute sh*t, or hitting a game-winner in the most important game of your life.

That's why we don't care about Magic "Mr. Overrated" Johnson's performance.

[Stiff #1]

Truer words have never been written. Kareem or Wilt could never have dropped 40+/20+ in consecutive games!! Especially against the crew Shaq did that against!!!!!! NEVER NEEVAAA NO! :rolleyes:
Are you telling me that Kareem Abdul-JabBUM and Quilt Chamberlain were better than Shaquille "I am the greatest finals performer in Western Conference history'' O'Neal?

If so, thanks for making me laugh. Shaq played the GREATEST and SECOND GREATEST group of centers ever. He killed them all.

To be honest with you, only Jordan deserves to be ranked ahead of Shaq. Everyone else? Garbage.

[Stiff #1]

Well, the obvious answer to this question that you've all been waiting for?

Here it is:

Either Shaquille O'Neal's 44/21/4/0/7 in the WC SEMIFINALS or Kobe Bryant's record-breaking 81 points in a single game.

I had to laugh when seeing other garbage performances like those from Webber, Arenas, Duncan, etc. being compared to what Kobe and Shaq did.

Hey genius, do you think anyone remembers Duncan's game? 20 years from now, nobody will even know who Gilbert Arenas and Chris Webber were.

I remember both Shaq and Kobe's games like the sh*t was yesterday.

[kap]

:bowdown:
Regular season: Kobe Bryant
81 points, 6 rebounds, 2 assists, 3 steals, 1 block, 28-46 FG-FGA vs. TOR in 2006

Playoffs: LeBron James
48 points, 9 rebounds, 7 assists, 2 steals, 0 blocks, 18-33 FG-FGA in double OT @ DET in Game 5 of the 2007 Eastern Conference Finals


i so agree. it's not all about the numbers. but lebron LITERALLY DOMINATED that game against the pistons, and willed his team to the next round. no stats can express the greatness of what he did.

[Stiff #1]

:bowdown:


i so agree. it's not all about the numbers. but lebron LITERALLY DOMINATED that game against the pistons, and willed his team to the next round. no stats can express the greatness of what he did.
Genius, do you think anyone remembers that game? :roll: :roll: :roll: :roll:

[Mikaiel]

Hey genius, do you think anyone remembers Duncan's game?

http://www.soonet.ca/images/smilies/Smile/suicide.gif http://www.soonet.ca/images/smilies/Smile/suicide.gif http://www.soonet.ca/images/smilies/Smile/suicide.gif

Yeah, who would actually remember one of the most dominating Finals perfomance of this decade ?

And btw, LeBron's game against the Pistons was sooooooo much better than Kobe's 81 it's ridiculous.

[nbastatus]

Genius, do you think anyone remembers that game? :roll: :roll: :roll: :roll:
i do..
one of brons greatest performance..

[halffttime]

got damn.. i forgot how good shaq really was.. dwight howard will never reach those numbers... quote me on that

[Showtime]

http://www.soonet.ca/images/smilies/Smile/suicide.gif http://www.soonet.ca/images/smilies/Smile/suicide.gif http://www.soonet.ca/images/smilies/Smile/suicide.gif

Yeah, who would actually remember one of the most dominating Finals perfomance of this decade ?

And btw, LeBron's game against the Pistons was sooooooo much better than Kobe's 81 it's ridiculous.
Somehow he forgets the Raptors all-time horrible defense, and that the Pistons had one of the best defenses in the game (the same tough defense that so many Kobe apologists use an excuse).

[BallPhunk]

Magic is overrated because people compare him to Jordan and Shaq.

Magic's 42/15/7? Big deal. If you are 6'9'' and given the opportunity to play center, you should grab double-digit boards. Rebounds are overrated. 7 assists? Pathetic for a PG.

42 points is decent, but nothing compared to 60+, playing 40+ minutes and dropping nearly 40 while feeling like absolute sh*t, or hitting a game-winner in the most important game of your life.

That's why we don't care about Magic "Mr. Overrated" Johnson's performance.

Thanks, you just proved my point. You don't like Magic and that drives your whack views.

He did it in the Finals btw against Darryl Dawkins, as a rookie.

[Stiff #1]

http://www.soonet.ca/images/smilies/Smile/suicide.gif http://www.soonet.ca/images/smilies/Smile/suicide.gif http://www.soonet.ca/images/smilies/Smile/suicide.gif

Yeah, who would actually remember one of the most dominating Finals perfomance of this decade ?

And btw, LeBron's game against the Pistons was sooooooo much better than Kobe's 81 it's ridiculous.
How so? He only had 48 points while playing 2 extra quarters. Kobe had 33 more points in just 4 quarters.

How is it so much better? He probably only had 30 something points at the end of regulation.

[Stiff #1]

Thanks, you just proved my point. You don't like Magic and that drives your whack views.

He did it in the Finals btw against Darryl Dawkins, as a rookie.
Who said I don't like Magic? I respect what he did for this game and have said in the past that he is probably a top 15 player in NBA history.

But what he did was really nothing special. He only got 42 points because the real team leader was injured.

Do you know how many people can pad their numbers when they're not forced to share the ball with an equally dominant or better player?

/thread.

[Showtime]

http://i.a.cnn.net/si/2007/writers/chris_mannix/01/17/clutch.arenas/p1.arenas.kobe.jpg

[Stiff #1]

By the way, I never even knew Duncan had a near quad-double in the finals until a few weeks ago.

Yeah, sounds like a legendary performance that none of us will ever forget! ROFL!! :roll: :roll: :roll:

[Silverbullit]

Well, the obvious answer to this question that you've all been waiting for?

Here it is:

Either Shaquille O'Neal's 44/21/4/0/7 in the WC SEMIFINALS or Kobe Bryant's record-breaking 81 points in a single game.

I had to laugh when seeing other garbage performances like those from Webber, Arenas, Duncan, etc. being compared to what Kobe and Shaq did.

Hey genius, do you think anyone remembers Duncan's game? 20 years from now, nobody will even know who Gilbert Arenas and Chris Webber were.

I remember both Shaq and Kobe's games like the sh*t was yesterday.

What record did he break exactly?

[Myth]

The greatest and most memorable ARE the same thing. LOL!! :roll: :roll: :roll: :roll:

If a performance isn't great, will anyone remember it? LMAO!! OBVIOUSLY NOT!

Think before you post. :banghead:

You are a moron if you can't see how they are different. They are certainly related, but they aren't the same thing.

[Stiff #1]

What record did he break exactly?
Most points in an NBA game that mattered. You think we give a sh*t about the garbage Wilt Chamberlain did back in the 60s? LOL!

What Wilt did in that game would be like me dropping 15 points on a bunch of second grade girl scouts. We don't take his achievements seriously, nor do we respect any of them.

Shaq > Quilt.

Kobe's 81 > Quilt's 100.

[c_az_a]

Most points in an NBA game that mattered. You think we give a sh*t about the garbage Wilt Chamberlain did back int he 60s? LOL!

What Wilt did in that game would be like me dropping 15 points on a bunch of second grade girl scouts. We don't take his achievements seriously, nor do we respect any of them.

Shaq > Quilt.

Kobe's 81 > Quilt's 100.

What's amazing about Kobe is that he couldn't pull an 81 when it actually mattered = playoffs. See game seven of that year. Why did he give 1/4 of the performance in a game seven than a regular season game. I guess regular season means more to certain players since they can't get the job done with it counts.

[Stiff #1]

You are a moron if you can't see how they are different. They are certainly related, but they aren't the same thing.
Then what's the difference between them genius? Why don't you tell us what the difference between "greatest" and "most memorable" performance is.

[Stiff #1]

What's amazing about Kobe is that he couldn't pull an 81 when it actually mattered = playoffs. See game seven of that year. Why did he give 1/4 of the performance in a game seven than a regular season game. I guess regular season means more to certain players since they can't get the job done with it counts.
Nobody drops 81 in the playoffs.

What did Kobe do in the playoffs that year? He killed Phoenix and dropped 50/8/5 in Game 6 (which should have been the final game, but Odom blew it for him) and proved to the whole world why he should have won the MVP over Steve "I score a pathetic 14 ppg" Nash.

Kobe had a legendary playoff series that year. He upset a 2nd seed with the worst team ever (Smush, Kwame, Odom, George, Bynum, Profit, Mihm, other scrubs).

[Huey Freeman]

Shaq was much better than Kareem.
N**** please

[Mikaiel]

How so? He only had 48 points while playing 2 extra quarters. Kobe had 33 more points in just 4 quarters.

How is it so much better? He probably only had 30 something points at the end of regulation.

1. It's not about stats

2. Kobe's perfomance was during the regular season against the 27-55 Raptors at home. LeBron's game was during a pivotal Game 5 in the ECF against the #1 seed in the East on their home floor. That win got the Cavs within 1 game of reaching the Finals, closer than the Cavs had ever been, with a home game coming up just after that. The Lakers win that night just got them one more W in the standings.

3. LeBron's perfomance was a once in a lifetime thing. The way he carried his team and the whole state of Ohio on his back during the game was legendary. He completely dominated the game when his team needed him the most, and he was at a level of dominance that virtually no player has ever reached. So many times it felt the game was out of reach but he would just come back and score, and sometimes he even made it look easy (see his 2 dunks back-to-back to tie the game at the end of regulation or his lay-up to win the game). There was just no way he was going to lose this game. LeBron was so incredible that perhaps Cleveland would have beaten any team in the league that day. That night he truly was King James. He scored his team's last 25 points, and 29 of the last 30. He was not human that night.


By the way, I never even knew Duncan had a near quad-double in the finals until a few weeks ago.

So basically you've just started watching the NBA and you didn't even care to look up the history of this game. Thanks for pointing this out.

[oh the horror]

Most points in an NBA game that mattered. You think we give a sh*t about the garbage Wilt Chamberlain did back in the 60s? LOL!

What Wilt did in that game would be like me dropping 15 points on a bunch of second grade girl scouts. We don't take his achievements seriously, nor do we respect any of them.

Shaq > Quilt.

Kobe's 81 > Quilt's 100.


Dude youre outrageous.


By that logic, that would mean that Kobe's 81 pts, arent going to be valid in about 30 years or so?

Wilt dropped 100 pts on grown men, playing professional basketball. Not children. You can downplay it all you'd like, but if youre discussing "greatest single game performances", then era has no meaning on the subject matter.


Single game performance would mean that indeed, it was a better feat to drop 100 in a basketball game, by a SINGLE player, than one who dropped 81.


Thats just simple logic.

[Stiff #1]

N**** please
Shaq dominated the GOAT crop of centers: Hakeem, Ewing, Sabonis, Robinson, Ostertag, Duncan, Divac, Mutombo, Wallace, etc.

What garbage did Kareem play? Do you think his sissy "sky hook" would be worth anything against Shaq?

Shaq would flatten Kareem's soft, goggle-wearing ass and send him to the ER if the two ever played.

Once again, Shaq > Abdul-JabBUM

[Myth]

Then what's the difference between them genius? Why don't you tell us what the difference between "greatest" and "most memorable" performance is.

Greatest - as in superior or better than all the others.

Most Memorable - as in it comes to mind more easily and the memory is more clear.

Its like your Magic Johnson vs Jordan comparison. What Magic accomplished could be argued to be just as good or better than what Michael did. Even if it was better, it still does not mean that people will remember it as well. The opposite could be true as well.

Another example: (I'm going to use 2 Finals series here just for example sake) For many people, the 2008 Finals could be viewed as a very memorable series. The Lakers and Celtics stir up a lot of emotions in people, and when emotions are high, things become more memorable. However, very few would actually say that was a "greater" series than the 2005 Spurs vs Pistons series. So for some 2008's Finals could have been "more memorable" without being "greater" than the 2005 Finals.

If this doesn't make sense to you, then I feel sorry for you as a human being.

[oh the horror]

Shaq dominated the GOAT crop of centers: Hakeem, Ewing, Sabonis, Robinson, Ostertag, Duncan, Divac, Mutombo, Wallace, etc.

What garbage did Kareem play? Do you think his sissy "sky hook" would be worth anything against Shaq?

Shaq would flatten Kareem's soft, goggle-wearing ass and send him to the ER if the two ever played.

Once again, Shaq > Abdul-JabBUM


Shaq dominated Hakeem eh?

You sure about that one?

[Killbot]

There is also Shaq's near quadruple double in the 2001 Finals. The 76ers won a game, so Shaq came back to punish with 28 points, 20 rebounds, 9 assists, and 8 blocks.

This is the one I pick.

[Scott Pippen]

Most points in an NBA game that mattered. You think we give a sh*t about the garbage Wilt Chamberlain did back in the 60s? LOL!

What Wilt did in that game would be like me dropping 15 points on a bunch of second grade girl scouts. We don't take his achievements seriously, nor do we respect any of them.

Shaq > Quilt.

Kobe's 81 > Quilt's 100.please stop trolling BULLS.

[Stiff #1]

Dude youre outrageous.


By that logic, that would mean that Kobe's 81 pts, arent going to be valid in about 30 years or so?

Wilt dropped 100 pts on grown men, playing professional basketball. Not children. You can downplay it all you'd like, but if youre discussing "greatest single game performances", then era has no meaning on the subject matter.


Single game performance would mean that indeed, it was a better feat to drop 100 in a basketball game, by a SINGLE player, than one who dropped 81.


Thats just simple logic.
Kobe's 81 came against the 2006 Raptors.

2006 Raptors = GOAT team of the 60s. I guarantee you those Raptors would rape any of the junk Chamberlain played in his prime.

What was so impressive about these grown men? Look at this LOSER! LOL!!!

http://www.nba.com/media/heritage1_627_071206.jpg


Wilt = 100 points in a sissy era full of midget Caucasians = 20 points in today's game.

Kobe = 81 in an era with the greatest athletes on the planet = 250 points in Wilt's pathetic era.

[jamal99]

Certainly not greatest but...


On November 14, 2006, Stojaković scored a career-high 42 points against the Charlotte Bobcats, and became the first player in NBA history to open the game with 20 straight points for his team.

[jamal99]

Kobe's 81 came against the 2006 Raptors.

2006 Raptors = GOAT team of the 60s. I guarantee you those Raptors would rape any of the junk Chamberlain played in his prime.

What was so impressive about these grown men? Look at this LOSER! LOL!!!

http://www.nba.com/media/heritage1_627_071206.jpg


Wilt = 100 points in a sissy era full of midget Caucasians = 20 points in today's game.

Kobe = 81 in an era with the greatest athletes on the planet = 250 points in Wilt's pathetic era.

We're talking 'bout Raptors?!

[Stiff #1]

Greatest - as in superior or better than all the others.

Most Memorable - as in it comes to mind more easily and the memory is more clear.

Its like your Magic Johnson vs Jordan comparison. What Magic accomplished could be argued to be just as good or better than what Michael did. Even if it was better, it still does not mean that people will remember it as well. The opposite could be true as well.

Another example: (I'm going to use 2 Finals series here just for example sake) For many people, the 2008 Finals could be viewed as a very memorable series. The Lakers and Celtics stir up a lot of emotions in people, and when emotions are high, things become more memorable. However, very few would actually say that was a "greater" series than the 2005 Spurs vs Pistons series. So for some 2008's Finals could have been "more memorable" without being "greater" than the 2005 Finals.

If this doesn't make sense to you, then I feel sorry for you as a human being.
He just said that Magic's finals performance is arguably better than Jordan's 63 on the GOAT Celtics team!! LOL!!!!!! :roll: :roll: :roll: :roll: :roll:

Did everyone here what this dude just said?

Magic Johnson's 42/15/7 was ARGUABLY better than Jordan's PLAYOFF-RECORD 63 points against one of the top 3 teams of ALL-TIME. LMAO!!!

[Laker4Lyfe]

Didn't Shaq get that 61 point game on his birthday? That's what's really impressive about it.

Yeah and against the Clippers.

[Stiff #1]

1. It's not about stats

2. Kobe's perfomance was during the regular season against the 27-55 Raptors at home. LeBron's game was during a pivotal Game 5 in the ECF against the #1 seed in the East on their home floor. That win got the Cavs within 1 game of reaching the Finals, closer than the Cavs had ever been, with a home game coming up just after that. The Lakers win that night just got them one more W in the standings.

3. LeBron's perfomance was a once in a lifetime thing. The way he carried his team and the whole state of Ohio on his back during the game was legendary. He completely dominated the game when his team needed him the most, and he was at a level of dominance that virtually no player has ever reached. So many times it felt the game was out of reach but he would just come back and score, and sometimes he even made it look easy (see his 2 dunks back-to-back to tie the game at the end of regulation or his lay-up to win the game). There was just no way he was going to lose this game. LeBron was so incredible that perhaps Cleveland would have beaten any team in the league that day. That night he truly was King James. He scored his team's last 25 points, and 29 of the last 30. He was not human that night.



So basically you've just started watching the NBA and you didn't even care to look up the history of this game. Thanks for pointing this out.
What was so great about that Pistons team? They were the same losers who nearly lost to the same Cavs team a year ago in the semifinals. They sucked compared to true finals contenders (aka San Antonio, Dallas, Phoenix, etc.).

[oh the horror]

Kobe's 81 came against the 2006 Raptors.

2006 Raptors = GOAT team of the 60s. I guarantee you those Raptors would rape any of the junk Chamberlain played in his prime.

What was so impressive about these grown men? Look at this LOSER! LOL!!!



Wilt = 100 points in a sissy era full of midget Caucasians = 20 points in today's game.

Kobe = 81 in an era with the greatest athletes on the planet = 250 points in Wilt's pathetic era.



Dude, your logic is damn near retarded.

Todays era doesnt consist of meta-bionic humans from another planet.

[Mikaiel]

BTW, let's just compare the Raptors team Kobe dropped 81 on and the Pistons team LeBron abused :

Record :

Toronto : 27-55 (12th best record in the East, 5th worst team in the league)
Detroit : 53-29 (#1 seed in the East, 4th best record in the league)

Points allowed per game :

Toronto : 104.1 (2nd worst in the league)
Detroit : 91.8 (2nd best in the league)

Defensive FG% :

Toronto : 49.1% (worst in the league)
Detroit : 44.5 (6th best in the league)

Defensive 3P% :

Toronto : 37.3% (5th worst in the league)
Detroit : 33.9% (4th best in the league)

Blocks per game :

Toronto : 3.3 (worst in the league)
Detroit : 5.8 (best in the league)

And Kobe's 81 during the regular season at home is supposed to be more impressive than LeBron's perfomance in the ECF with the series tied at 2-2 on the Pistons' court ?

[Stiff #1]

Shaq dominated Hakeem eh?

You sure about that one?
He held his own against Hakeem and dominated the rest. If you want to tell me Hakeem was better than Shaq, fine. But the other scrubs? Don't ever mention them in the same breath. Shaq would torture those clowns.

[oh the horror]

Im sorry, but that whole "era vs era" argument is truely the dumbest any fan has ever brought up.


Who came up with that point of view on sports?


So by this logic, and theory, a player that averages 10 pts today, could average 30 pts in the 60s?


You have to realize, that era to era, players played how they played for their era. You cannot compare the two, because it isnt reality.


Kobe would have played like a player in the 60s, with 1960s technology, shoes, and conditioning.


Wilt in todays game, would be awesome, with todays tech, shoes, and conditioning.


Why bring up a point, that has no meaning whatsoever? Its a stupid argument that only stupid people entertain.


Single greatest performance, in a game....era doesnt matter. Again....youre asking about the performance, in a game, by a professional basketball player.


How hard is this to grasp?


edit to add: the "era vs era" thing has ruined, and downplayed spectacular performances, and players in this game. Its silly, and SHOULD hold no real weight in a discussion of all time greats.

[Stiff #1]

Dude, your logic is damn near retarded.

Todays era doesnt consist of meta-bionic humans from another planet.
Yeah, today's era consists of guys who look like this:

http://weblogs.newsday.com/sports/watchdog/blog/bob_cousy1.jpg

http://www.tommcmahon.net/images/BobPettit.jpg

I'm sure those guys would make life hell for Shaq... just like they did for Wilt "The Quilt" Chamberlame.

Wilt might have been good enough to be Shaq's ballboy.

[Myth]

He just said that Magic's finals performance is arguably better than Jordan's 63 on the GOAT Celtics team!! LOL!!!!!! :roll: :roll: :roll: :roll: :roll:

Did everyone here what this dude just said?

Magic Johnson's 42/15/7 was ARGUABLY better than Jordan's PLAYOFF-RECORD 63 points against one of the top 3 teams of ALL-TIME. LMAO!!!

Notice how everybody here thinks you are retarded and nobody but you thinks what I am saying is ridiculous.

Btw, you completely overlooked the point. Either that, or rather than admitting you were wrong, you decided to knit pick at one of the comparisons I made.

[Stiff #1]

BTW, let's just compare the Raptors team Kobe dropped 81 on and the Pistons team LeBron abused :

Record :

Toronto : 27-55 (12th best record in the East, 5th worst team in the league)
Detroit : 53-29 (#1 seed in the East, 4th best record in the league)

Points allowed per game :

Toronto : 104.1 (2nd worst in the league)
Detroit : 91.8 (2nd best in the league)

Defensive FG% :

Toronto : 49.1% (worst in the league)
Detroit : 44.5 (6th best in the league)

Defensive 3P% :

Toronto : 37.3% (5th worst in the league)
Detroit : 33.9% (4th best in the league)

Blocks per game :

Toronto : 3.3 (worst in the league)
Detroit : 5.8 (best in the league)

And Kobe's 81 during the regular season at home is supposed to be more impressive than LeBron's perfomance in the ECF with the series tied at 2-2 on the Pistons' court ?
First off, scoring 81 points in 4 quarters requires a lot more energy and is much harder than scoring 30 something points in the same amount of time.

What is so hard about scoring 48 points? Nothing. I could probably name over 100 players who've done it in the past. Like I said, it was a good performance, but not something I'll remember for the rest of my life, not something that broke any record.

[oh the horror]

Okay? Bob Cousy was 6'1''

What is the point? He looks like a typical guy from the 60s.

[Stiff #1]

Im sorry, but that whole "era vs era" argument is truely the dumbest any fan has ever brought up.


Who came up with that point of view on sports?


So by this logic, and theory, a player that averages 10 pts today, could average 30 pts in the 60s?


You have to realize, that era to era, players played how they played for their era. You cannot compare the two, because it isnt reality.


Kobe would have played like a player in the 60s, with 1960s technology, shoes, and conditioning.


Wilt in todays game, would be awesome, with todays tech, shoes, and conditioning.


Why bring up a point, that has no meaning whatsoever? Its a stupid argument that only stupid people entertain.


Single greatest performance, in a game....era doesnt matter. Again....youre asking about the performance, in a game, by a professional basketball player.


How hard is this to grasp?


edit to add: the "era vs era" thing has ruined, and downplayed spectacular performances, and players in this game. Its silly, and SHOULD hold no real weight in a discussion of all time greats.

LOL! :roll: :roll: :roll:

So Kobe would dribble with his head down, go off the wrong foot for simple layups, throw up underhand garbage from the free throw line, and look like some goof who'd be good for nothing but picking his nose at the end of some team's bench in TODAY'S LEAGUE?

Kobe would look like this?

http://caimages.collectors.com/psaimages/3194/07124427/1971DaveCowens.jpg
:oldlol: :oldlol: :oldlol:

[KobeRules24]

Dude, your logic is damn near retarded.

Todays era doesnt consist of meta-bionic humans from another planet.

well, wilt did play in a pathetic era. that's why no one will ever again put up those kind of numbers, competition is better nowadays.

[Mikaiel]

First off, scoring 81 points in 4 quarters requires a lot more energy and is much harder than scoring 30 something points in the same amount of time.

What is so hard about scoring 48 points? Nothing. I could probably name over 100 players who've done it in the past. Like I said, it was a good performance, but not something I'll remember for the rest of my life, not something that broke any record.

1. GTFO with your stats, I already told you it's not about stats.

2. Did you at least watch that game ?

3. Kobe's 81 required more energy than LeBron's perfomance ? That game had 2 overtime periods. With playoff intensity. Everybody was exhausted after that game.

4. It did break a record, most consecutive points scored by a single player in a playoff game.

[Stiff #1]

Notice how everybody here thinks you are retarded and nobody but you thinks what I am saying is ridiculous.

Btw, you completely overlooked the point. Either that, or rather than admitting you were wrong, you decided to knit pick at one of the comparisons I made.
You just said what Magic did in the 1980 finals is arguably more impressive than Jordan setting a new record against the greatest team of his decade. :roll: :roll: :roll: :roll:

Oh man, I have to thank you making me laugh this hard. I don't think I've ever laughed harder.

[oh the horror]

well, wilt did play in a pathetic era. that's why no one will ever again put up those kind of numbers, competition is better nowadays.


I dont believe the competition is better. I believe the conditioning, personal trainers, athletics, payrates, and overall attention these players get now is better.

Do you think men in those eras actually had personal trainers?


This dude asked for a single greatest game performance, and hes disputing it based on era?


So on that logic alone, anything now, wont be worth a damn, YEARS from now because players will eventually "get better"

[Stiff #1]

1. GTFO with your stats, I already told you it's not about stats.

2. Did you at least watch that game ?

3. Kobe's 81 required more energy than LeBron's perfomance ? That game had 2 overtime periods. With playoff intensity. Everybody was exhausted after that game.

4. It did break a record, most consecutive points scored by a single player in a playoff game.
How is it not about stats? Because they don't help your argument? That's a weak reason.

81 in 4 quarters = 45+ more points than whatever LeBron had through 4 quarters.

81 in 4 quarters = 33 more points than 48 in 6 quarters.

I watched that LeBron game, and all I saw was a few threes and a bunch of drives against wimps like Billups and Prince. I saw SINGLE COVERAGE on him the whole time.

The energy and stamina it requires to take 35+ FGA and score 81 is ****ing incredible.

[Rockets(T-mac)]

Why are you guys taking this guy so seriously? He sounds like another account by BULLS, and most of us know better than to feed that troll.

Just let this thread die.

[NBASTATMAN]

[QUOTE=Stiff #1]9 choices:

Kobe Bryant:
- 81 points, 6 rebounds, 2 assists, 3 steals, 1 block, 28-46 FG-FGA vs. TOR in 2006
- 62 points, 8 rebounds, 0 assists, 3 steals, 0 blocks, 18-31 FG-FGA, 3 quarters vs. DAL in 2006
- 49 points, 4 rebounds, 10 assists, 1 steal, 1 block, 18-27 FG-FGA in Game 2 of the 2008 Western Conference first round

LeBron James:
- 52 points, 9 rebounds, 11 assists, 0 steals, 2 blocks, 17-33 FG-FGA @ NYK in 2009
- 51 points, 8 rebounds, 9 assists, 3 steals, 1 block, 18-28 FG-FGA @ MEM in 2008
- 48 points, 9 rebounds, 7 assists, 2 steals, 0 blocks, 18-33 FG-FGA in double OT @ DET in Game 5 of the 2007 Eastern Conference Finals

[B]Shaquille O

[Mikaiel]

There's only 3 possible explanations :

1. LeBron raped your dad and killed your mom.

2. You're Kobe or one of his relatives.

3. You're seriously retarded.

That was a f*cking regular season game. Basically all 30 point games in the playoffs are better than that sh*t. Are we supposed to bow down to Kobe because he had a 81 point against a horrible team at home during the regular season ?

LeBron's Game 5 isn't about stats. It's about how he carried his team and refused to lose. He basically told his team "Let me take care of this, there's no f*cking way we're losing this game". And he delivered. Big time. More than anyone of his generation has done/will ever will. Even MJ didn't have a game like that. Of course I'm not saying LeBron's the better player or even that you can compare them, but even MJ never did what LeBron did that night.

Or if you really want stats : He scored his team's last 25 points, and 29 of their last 30. How's that ? If Kobe had done this, I'm sure you wouldn't shut up about this.

[NBASTATMAN]

How is it not about stats? Because they don't help your argument? That's a weak reason.

81 in 4 quarters = 45+ more points than whatever LeBron had through 4 quarters.

81 in 4 quarters = 33 more points than 48 in 6 quarters.

I watched that LeBron game, and all I saw was a few threes and a bunch of drives against wimps like Billups and Prince. I saw SINGLE COVERAGE on him the whole time.

The energy and stamina it requires to take 35+ FGA and score 81 is ****ing incredible.


Weren't those the same wimps that put KOBE ON LD...LOCKDOWN.. That was a great game by James.. And I would have to put that up their too as a great game. But the one that stands out the most is Shaq in the finals vs Indiana... Pick a game , I have never seen a player so dominant.. Not even JOrdan

[Micku]

Casual opinions:

Of course 81 Kobe point game.

I think there was a time where Kobe scored 60 points in three quathers but sat out in entire 4th quather. Yeah, that Dallas game.

There was the great comeback from the Lakers in 03-04 (I think) when they were playing against Dallas. Was that the same game where Kobe scored 60+ points in three quathers?

Shaq got some good stats in the finals, 00-02.

There was that one game where LBJ went crazy against Detriot in 07.

Wade and his 17 straight points against Detriot, plus game winner and his playoff series vs Detriot. Shaq and Wade raped Detriot.

[Stiff #1]

There's only 3 possible explanations :

1. LeBron raped your dad and killed your mom.

2. You're Kobe or one of his relatives.

3. You're seriously retarded.

That was a f*cking regular season game. Basically all 30 point games in the playoffs are better than that sh*t. Are we supposed to bow down to Kobe because he had a 81 point against a horrible team at home during the regular season ?

LeBron's Game 5 isn't about stats. It's about how he carried his team and refused to lose. He basically told his team "Let me take care of this, there's no f*cking way we're losing this game". And he delivered. Big time. More than anyone of his generation has done/will ever will. Even MJ didn't have a game like that. Of course I'm not saying LeBron's the better player or even that you can compare them, but even MJ never did what LeBron did that night.

Or if you really want stats : He scored his team's last 25 points, and 29 of their last 30. How's that ? If Kobe had done this, I'm sure you wouldn't shut up about this.
How is this? I'm not even a Kobe fan and LeBron is one of my favorite players in the league. I'm just telling you that it wasn't as impressive as someone setting a scoring record as a 6'6" guard against players his own size.

I also had to laugh at you saying Jordan didn't have a game like LeBron's. He never scored 29 of his team's last 30, but he had a few playoff games that were better overall than LeBron's.

Now to your point:

LeBron James played a soft Pistons defense that has been overrated by basketball fans for many years. When people think Pistons, the reason they think "tough defense" is because of what they did in the 80s. The truth is that they were nothing but an overachieving team led by some very mediocre players (what kind of championship team's best player is freaking Billups?).

LeBron James didn't even drop 50 in double OT and you're telling me it's the greatest performance of the decade. :wtf:

[Stiff #1]

Casual opinions:

Of course 81 Kobe point game.

I think there was a time where Kobe scored 60 points in three quathers but sat out in entire 4th quather. Yeah, that Dallas game.

There was the great comeback from the Lakers in 03-04 (I think) when they were playing against Dallas. Was that the same game where Kobe scored 60+ points in three quathers?

Shaq got some good stats in the finals, 00-02.

There was that one game where LBJ went crazy against Detriot in 07.

Wade and his 17 straight points against Detriot, plus game winner and his playoff series vs Detriot. Shaq and Wade raped Detriot.
Wade had 17 straight against Detroit? When did this happen?

You see, nobody remembers that. All we remember is that he rode Shaq to his 2006 championship.

[Myth]

You just said what Magic did in the 1980 finals is arguably more impressive than Jordan setting a new record against the greatest team of his decade. :roll: :roll: :roll: :roll:

Oh man, I have to thank you making me laugh this hard. I don't think I've ever laughed harder.

Still avoiding my point I see.

[Brunch@Five]

No one but Shaq deserves a mention in this thread. What he did during the Lakers three-peat has been unparalleled this decade. We're talking about multiple 40/20 games in the finals and a 28/20/9/8 near quadruple double.

[hito da god]

[QUOTE=Stiff #1]9 choices:

Kobe Bryant:
- 81 points, 6 rebounds, 2 assists, 3 steals, 1 block, 28-46 FG-FGA vs. TOR in 2006
- 62 points, 8 rebounds, 0 assists, 3 steals, 0 blocks, 18-31 FG-FGA, 3 quarters vs. DAL in 2006
- 49 points, 4 rebounds, 10 assists, 1 steal, 1 block, 18-27 FG-FGA in Game 2 of the 2008 Western Conference first round

LeBron James:
- 52 points, 9 rebounds, 11 assists, 0 steals, 2 blocks, 17-33 FG-FGA @ NYK in 2009
- 51 points, 8 rebounds, 9 assists, 3 steals, 1 block, 18-28 FG-FGA @ MEM in 2008
- 48 points, 9 rebounds, 7 assists, 2 steals, 0 blocks, 18-33 FG-FGA in double OT @ DET in Game 5 of the 2007 Eastern Conference Finals

[B]Shaquille O

[Mikaiel]

I also had to laugh at you saying Jordan didn't have a game like LeBron's. He never scored 29 of his team's last 30, but he had a few playoff games that were better overall than LeBron's.

When did I say it was better than anything MJ has done ? I just said MJ didn't have a game like that. Learn how to read properly please. That reinforces my "you're seriously retarded" theory.




LeBron James played a soft Pistons defense

Points allowed per game :

91.8 (2nd best in the league)

Defensive FG% :

44.5 (6th best in the league)

Defensive 3P% :

33.9% (4th best in the league)

Blocks per game :

5.8 (best in the league)

OMG yeah, they were horrible. The Raptors' D was just sooooo much better I guess.

[Stiff #1]

Weren't those the same wimps that put KOBE ON LD...LOCKDOWN.. That was a great game by James.. And I would have to put that up their too as a great game. But the one that stands out the most is Shaq in the finals vs Indiana... Pick a game , I have never seen a player so dominant.. Not even JOrdan
And how does that change the fact that those Pistons were overrated? They were so weak and soft that they nearly lost in the semis to the same Cavs the year before.

Jordan's 55 in Game 4 of the '93 finals (finals record) was better, his 63 in Game 2 of the '86 first round (playoff record) was better, and his 6 threes and 35 points in the first half of Game 1 of the '92 finals (both records) was also better.

[Papaya Petee]

Wade had 17 straight against Detroit? When did this happen?

You see, nobody remembers that. All we remember is that he rode Shaq to his 2006 championship.


lmfao and you should go kill yourself.

[jrong]

:bowdown:


i so agree. it's not all about the numbers. but lebron LITERALLY DOMINATED that game against the pistons, and willed his team to the next round. no stats can express the greatness of what he did.

All right if we're going to factor in the "drama" of a performance along with the numbers, then Wade's Game 3 of the Finals has to be mentioned. In fact, I'd say it may trump both Bron's Game 5 of the ECF and Kobe's "81" in that case:

1. It was in the Finals
2. Miami was down by 13 with six minutes to go in the fourth.
3. Miami was half a quarter from going down 0 - 3 in the series
4. That game and performance literally turned around the entire Finals.


As far as the actual numbers, 42 pts and 13 rebs don't stack up with some of the other great statlines of the decade. But, as I said, if the the drama of the performance is part of the equation-- his 15 pt. fourth quarter, with 13 of them in the last six minutes, as well as having the game-saving block/ steal-- that ranks up there with the great individual performances in NBA history.

[Mikaiel]

Wade had 17 straight against Detroit? When did this happen?

You see, nobody remembers that. All we remember is that he rode Shaq to his 2006 championship.

It was a regular season game. You obviously have a very short and selective memory.

[Papaya Petee]

It was a regular season game. You obviously have a very short and selective memory.

From what I read from you your basketball knowledge is greater then mine, can you please explain to me how did Wade ride Shaq to the 2006 championship ?

[Stiff #1]

When did I say it was better than anything MJ has done ? I just said MJ didn't have a game like that. Learn how to read properly please. That reinforces my "you're seriously retarded" theory.




Points allowed per game :

91.8 (2nd best in the league)

Defensive FG% :

44.5 (6th best in the league)

Defensive 3P% :

33.9% (4th best in the league)

Blocks per game :

5.8 (best in the league)

OMG yeah, they were horrible. The Raptors' D was just sooooo much better I guess.

And yet they were so soft that they needed 7 games just to beat a weaker Cavs team the year before. That shows you how weak they were.

They were also a dumb team. On the final play of the game, they put Chauncey Billups (LMFAO!!!!) on LeBron James with no help at all.

They put a 6'2" PG on a 6'8" SF on the most important play of their entire season. What a great team that was. :applause:

[JJ81]

Kobe's 81 by far

then 61 points, 23 rebounds by Shaq on his birthday.

[Stiff #1]

All right if we're going to factor in the "drama" of a performance along with the numbers, then Wade's Game 3 of the Finals has to be mentioned. In fact, I'd say it may trump both Bron's Game 5 of the ECF and Kobe's "81" in that case:

1. It was in the Finals
2. Miami was down by 13 with six minutes to go in the fourth.
3. Miami was half a quarter from going down 0 - 3 in the series
4. That game and performance literally turned around the entire Finals.


As far as the actual numbers, 42 pts and 13 rebs don't stack up with some of the other great statlines of the decade. But, as I said, if the the drama of the performance is part of the equation-- his 15 pt. fourth quarter, with 13 of them in the last six minutes, as well as having the game-saving block/ steal-- that ranks up there with the great individual performances in NBA history.
Yeah, so great that NOBODY even remembers how many points he scored, which game of the finals it was, etc.

When people think of Wade and the finals, you know what first comes to mind? Referees.

I'm not saying he got many undeserved calls, nor am I saying he did... all I'm saying is that nobody remembers what Wade did that year.

[jrong]

Wade had 17 straight against Detroit? When did this happen?

You see, nobody remembers that. All we remember is that he rode Shaq to his 2006 championship.

First, if Wade "rode" Shaq to a title, yet his stats were much, much, much better than Shaq's, then I have a question. What does that say about Kobe who, over the course of three titles, had inferior stats to Shaq?

Second, can you please be banned for cumulative stupidity? This post is actually a relatively minor example of it. But, everything you write is stupid, and at some point enough is just enough.

[Mikaiel]

LeBron James didn't even drop 50 in double OT and you're telling me it's the greatest performance of the decade. :wtf:

Again, learn how to read properly please, I've never said LeBron's Game 5 was the greatest perfomance of the decade, I just said it was a lot better than Kobe's 81 point game.


From what I read from you your basketball knowledge is greater then mine, can you please explain to me how did Wade ride Shaq to the 2006 championship ?

What ??? I've never said that ... Obviously he helped him a lot, he couldn't have done it without him but it's ridiculous to say that.


all I'm saying is that nobody remembers what Wade did that year.

Maybe you don't, but that doesn't mean others don't as well. I remember exactly what he did and I'm sure the majority here does as well.

[Stiff #1]

First, if Wade "rode" Shaq to a title, yet his stats were worlds better than Shaq's, then I have a question. What does that say about Kobe who, over the course of three titles, had inferior stats to Shaq?

Second, can you please be banned for cumulative stupidity? This post is actually a relatively minor example of it. But, everything you write is stupid, and at some point enough is just enough.

Is this a joke? Shaq was nearly a 20/10 MVP candidate the year Wade won a title. He sacrificed his finals numbers for Wade so that he could win the finals MVP award.

Do you honestly believe the best Shaq could do against trash like Dampier was 14/10? :roll: :roll:

Dwyane Wade had the numbers and the finals MVP, but it was Shaq's team. Any unbiased fan will tell you the same thing.

[Myth]

Is this a joke? Shaq was nearly a 20/10 MVP candidate the year Wade won a title. He sacrificed his finals numbers for Wade so that he could win the finals MVP award.


You think Shaq did bad on purpose? :oldlol:

[Stiff #1]

Again, learn how to read properly please, I've never said LeBron's Game 5 was the greatest perfomance of the decade, I just said it was a lot better than Kobe's 81 point game.

Then who had the greatest performance of the decade?

[Stiff #1]

You think Shaq did bad on purpose? :oldlol:
How is 14/10 bad? Those are solid numbers, but they could have been 25/12 if Shaq wanted them to be.

Everyone knows it was Shaq's team. Why is this, you ask? Because it was SHAQ (not Wade) who was robbed of the 2006 MVP award.

Was Wade an MVP candidate that year? You ever hear his name? Because I didn't.

Shaq = 20/9 on 60%, the real regular season MVP of 06, Batman

Wade = better playoff numbers as a result of Shaq's unselfishness, Robin

[TmacsRockets]

Shaq's performance in the finals. He did it when it mattered most.

[jrong]

Is this a joke? Shaq was nearly a 20/10 MVP candidate the year Wade won a title. He sacrificed his finals numbers for Wade so that he could win the finals MVP award.

Do you honestly believe the best Shaq could do against trash like Dampier was 14/10? :roll: :roll:

Dwyane Wade had the numbers and the finals MVP, but it was Shaq's team. Any unbiased fan will tell you the same thing.

Shaq was nowhere close to an MVP candidate in 2006. He missed 20 games that regular season. And he didn't sacrifice anything. He couldn't stay on the court because of foul trouble, and even when he wasn't in foul trouble, Riley took him off the court in the fourth because he couldn't hit FTs and to prevent Dallas from Hack-a-Shaqing.

And Miami stopped being Shaq's team in March, 2005. That was when Shaq suffered the thigh injury which rendered him largely immobile in that year's playoffs. Frankly, Shaq has never been the same player since, even with the Suns.

Anyway, Wade took over the team down the stretch of the regular season and in the whole postseason, and he never gave it back. As I've told others before, you're not going to tell Heat fans what happened on their own team....

[Stiff #1]

Shaq was nowhere close to an MVP candidate in 2006. He missed 20 games that regular season. And he didn't sacrifice anything. He couldn't stay on the court because of foul trouble, and even when he wasn't in foul trouble, Riley took him off the court in the fourth because he couldn't hit FTs and to prevent Dallas from Hack-a-Shaqing.

And Miami stopped being Shaq's team in March, 2005. That was when Shaq suffered the thigh injury which rendered him largely immobile in the playoffs. Frankly, Shaq has never been the same player since, even with the Suns.

Anyway, Wade took over the team down the stretch of the regular season and in the whole postseason, and he never gave it back. As I've told others before, you're not going to tell Heat fans what happened on their own team....

Wade without a healthy Shaq:

2007 - Shaq injured, Wade loses in 4 games to the Chicago freaking Bulls! :roll: He was being defended by scrubs and shot under 40%. I think that should tell you how much he needed Shaq.

2008 - Shaq no longer on his team, worst record in the league.

But yes, I'm supposed to believe that Wade was the one who led Shaq. :oldlol: :oldlol:

[Mikaiel]

First, if Wade "rode" Shaq to a title, yet his stats were much, much, much better than Shaq's, then I have a question. What does that say about Kobe who, over the course of three titles, had inferior stats to Shaq?

Second, can you please be banned for cumulative stupidity? This post is actually a relatively minor example of it. But, everything you write is stupid, and at some point enough is just enough.

Don't act like Shaq didn't contribute anything ...

He averaged 19.8 points, 60.7 FG%, 10.8 rebounds, 2.0 assists, 2.2 blocks in the first round against Chicago, including a 30/20 game in Game 6 on the road to prevent a Game 7.

Then he averaged 20.8 points, 54.4 FG%, 7.4 rebounds, 1.6 assists, 0.8 blocks against New Jersey in the secound round.

And then 21.7 points, 65.5% FG%, 10.5 rebounds and 2.3 blocks in the ECF against the Pistons, including a 28/16 game on 12-14 shooting with 5 blocks in Game 6, which was the final game of the series.

Wade and Shaq were basically 1a and 1b during the playoffs. It was just during the Finals that Wade was clearly the best player.

[Stiff #1]

Don't act like Shaq didn't contribute anything ...

He averaged 19.8 points, 60.7 FG%, 10.8 rebounds, 2.0 assists, 2.2 blocks in the first round against Chicago, including a 30/20 game in Game 6 on the road to prevent a Game 7.

Then he averaged 20.8 points, 54.4 FG%, 7.4 rebounds, 1.6 assists, 0.8 blocks against New Jersey in the secound round.

And then 21.7 points, 65.5% FG%, 10.5 rebounds and 2.3 blocks in the ECF against the Pistons, including a 28/16 game on 12-14 shooting with 5 blocks in Game 6, which was the final game of the series.

Wade and Shaq were basically 1a and 1b during the playoffs. It was just during the Finals that Wade was clearly the best player.
Correction: Shaq let Wade LOOK LIKE the best player during the Finals.

Refer to my post on the last page to see what kind of success Wade has had without Shaq.

[jrong]

Wade without a healthy Shaq:

2007 - Shaq injured, Wade loses in 4 games to the Chicago freaking Bulls! :roll: He was being defended by scrubs and shot under 40%. I think that should tell you how much he needed Shaq.

Wade was the one who was seriously injured in that series, not Shaq. Wade had a torn shoulder which he rush-rehabbed, so he could make it back for the playoffs.


2008 - Shaq no longer on his team, worst record in the league.
But yes, I'm supposed to believe that Wade was the one who led Shaq. :oldlol: :oldlol:

Shaq was still on the team until February! And Miami already had by far the worst record in the league when he was traded.

Furthermore, it was Shaq who played without Wade for the first three weeks because Wade still hadn't recovered from his surgeries. And in those three weeks Shaq "led" the Heat to an 0 -8 record. Thanks for that, Diesel.

[B-Easy]

The greatest single performance...is either of Shaq or Duncan near quadruple double in the Finals. Or Wades Game 3 in the Finals.

[Inspector Rick]

Wade without a healthy Shaq:

2007 - Shaq injured, Wade loses in 4 games to the Chicago freaking Bulls! :roll: He was being defended by scrubs and shot under 40%. I think that should tell you how much he needed Shaq.

Pull your head out of the sand. Chicago was one of the best defensive teams in the league that year. And since when is Kirk Hinrich a scrub? Sure, he didnt pan out like a lot of us thought he would, but he's still a starting caliber point gaurd with incredible defense.

[Stiff #1]

Pull your head out of the sand. Chicago was one of the best defensive teams in the league that year. And since when is Kirk Hinrich a scrub? Sure, he didnt pan out like a lot of us thought he would, but he's still a starting caliber point gaurd with incredible defense.
One of the best defensive teams because you said so? Yeah, sure... whatever you say. And I do believe Kirk Hinrich is a scrub. He averages 9 ppg on 41% shooting. Those are scrub numbers.

Dwyane Wade had a poor series against a scrub team. The reason for this? No dominant 20/10 Shaq with him.

[Mikaiel]

Correction: Shaq let Wade LOOK LIKE the best player during the Finals.

Refer to my post on the last page to see what kind of success Wade has had without Shaq.

http://www.soonet.ca/images/smilies/Smile/suicide.gif http://www.soonet.ca/images/smilies/Smile/suicide.gif http://www.soonet.ca/images/smilies/Smile/suicide.gif

[Micku]

Wade had 17 straight against Detroit? When did this happen?

You see, nobody remembers that. All we remember is that he rode Shaq to his 2006 championship.

I don't know if you're being sarcastic, but here's the vid:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wrIaRKn-6ho

It was a intense game. Detroit was kicking ass that year, and they knock the Heat outt'a the ECF the year before. The Heat went through a lot of changes that year, so winning a team like Detroit boast up their confidence.




Don't act like Shaq didn't contribute anything ...

He averaged 19.8 points, 60.7 FG%, 10.8 rebounds, 2.0 assists, 2.2 blocks in the first round against Chicago, including a 30/20 game in Game 6 on the road to prevent a Game 7.

Then he averaged 20.8 points, 54.4 FG%, 7.4 rebounds, 1.6 assists, 0.8 blocks against New Jersey in the secound round.

And then 21.7 points, 65.5% FG%, 10.5 rebounds and 2.3 blocks in the ECF against the Pistons, including a 28/16 game on 12-14 shooting with 5 blocks in Game 6, which was the final game of the series.

Wade and Shaq were basically 1a and 1b during the playoffs. It was just during the Finals that Wade was clearly the best player.


Yup, Shaq was still one of the best center in the league. He wasn't as great as he was with the lakers, but he could still rake up points and still demand a double team. However, Shaq played less minutes and took less shots. Wade was under the radar until they faced Detroit in 05 in the playoffs. Wade started to get some light as being a great player.

Shaq did a lot of good in that team in the playoffs. Especially against Detroit. As you said, it was like a 1a and 1b thing until the finals.


Edit:

Yeah, I forgot about Jordan scoring 50 pts as a old man, lol. Seriously, when MJ came back I was like, "Again? Well, at least I get to see Jordan play." I didn't want him to do a miracle and win a championship against my team The Lakers. I wish I could've watch Jordan play in the 80s though. That would've been nice, but I feel I would look at today superstars with disgust like I do with the WWE superstars from the glory attitude days.

[jrong]

Don't act like Shaq didn't contribute anything ...

He averaged 19.8 points, 60.7 FG%, 10.8 rebounds, 2.0 assists, 2.2 blocks in the first round against Chicago, including a 30/20 game in Game 6 on the road to prevent a Game 7.

Then he averaged 20.8 points, 54.4 FG%, 7.4 rebounds, 1.6 assists, 0.8 blocks against New Jersey in the secound round.

And then 21.7 points, 65.5% FG%, 10.5 rebounds and 2.3 blocks in the ECF against the Pistons, including a 28/16 game on 12-14 shooting with 5 blocks in Game 6, which was the final game of the series.

Wade and Shaq were basically 1a and 1b during the playoffs. It was just during the Finals that Wade was clearly the best player.

I think you're overstating it. I'd say they were Batman and Robin throughout the playoffs, and in the Finals Wade was Batman and Shaq was, hmm, Alfred? Commissioner Gordon? No, Riley would have been Commissioner Gordon.

Anyway, Shaq's best series was definitely against Detroit. But, his turn-back-the-clock performance in Game 6 while invaluable, only took place because Wade spent all day in the hospital before the game. So Shaq was the first option that night and, all credit to him, he delivered. But, he wouldn't have been the focus of the offense if not for Wade's condition.

Similarly, his big moment or moments in the Chicago series came because the team ran the offense through him because of injury Wade sustained in the series....

If you read back a few posts and see what I wrote to troll-boy, you'll see that I pinpointed Shaq's thigh injury in spring of 2005 as a transitional moment in the Shaq-Wade era (it became the Wade-Shaq era at that point). It wasn't that Shaq was no longer effective after that. But, what he had instead of consistent effectiveness was "spot-effectiveness".

He could still have big games or even look like the old MDE for a few weeks at a time. But, age, wear-and-tear, and accumulated injuries prevented him from being able to play at this level all the time. So, anyway, this is what was evident in the playoffs. He came up very big at times when he was needed, but post-2005, he just couldn't summon that kind of quality up on a regular basis.

[Mikaiel]

One of the best defensive teams because you said so? Yeah, sure... whatever you say.

Points allowed per game : 93.8 (6th best)

Defensive FG% : 43.5% (2nd best)

Defensive 3P% : 34.9% (7th best)

Blocks per game : 5.3 (5th best)

Forced turnovers : 16.7 (2nd best)

And Kirk Hinrich is a great defender, he was an All-NBA Defender and he did a great job on Wade. Thabo Sefalosha also did a great job on him IIRC.

[Stiff #1]

I think you're overstating it. I'd say they were Batman and Robin throughout the playoffs, and in the Finals Wade was Batman and Shaq was, hmm, Alfred? Commissioner Gordon? No, Riley would have been Commissioner Gordon.

Anyway, Shaq's best series was definitely against Detroit. But, his turn-back-the-clock performance in Game 6 while invaluable, only took place because Wade spent all day in the hospital before the game. So Shaq was the first option that night and, all credit to him, he delivered. But, he wouldn't have been the focus of the offense if not for Wade's condition.

Similarly, his big moment or moments in the Chicago series came because the team ran the offense through him because of injury Wade sustained in the series....

If you read back a few posts and see what I wrote to troll-boy, you'll see that I pinpointed Shaq's thigh injury in spring of 2005 as a transitional moment in the Shaq-Wade era (it became the Wade-Shaq era at that point). It wasn't that Shaq was no longer effective after that. But, what he had instead of consistent effectiveness was "spot-effectiveness".

He could still have big games or even look like the old MDE for a few weeks at a time. But, age, wear-and-tear, and accumulated injuries prevented him from being able to play at this level all the time. So, anyway, this is what was evident in the playoffs. He came up very big at times when he was needed, but post-2005, he just couldn't summon that kind of quality up on a regular basis.

Shaq in 2006 against the Chicago Bulls and the greatest defensive player of the decade (Ben Wallace) = 19/11 on 61 FG%

Wade in 2006 against the Chicago Bulls and Kirk Hinrich and other guys I've never heard of = 44 FG%

Shaq = the reason Wade got out of the first round.

[highwhey]

Anyone who picks LeBron is a joke. The guy choked in the playoffs. Shaq's numbers are astronomical, he dominated on both sides of the court. I don't care if Kobe or LeBron score 90 points in a regular season game, it's all about the play-offs. Shaq did his best performances in the play-offs, defensively and offensively.

61 pts, 23 REBOUNDS(THATS 23 MORE OPPORTUNITIES)

The thing about players like Kobe or LeBron is that they can score any amount of points, but they usually end up shooting 50%, to me that's horrible, from 33 field goals, only 17 were made? That's a lot of shots missed. Of course, everyone misses, but at least Shaq grabbed huge amounts of boards to create more opportunities and recuperate the shots that he missed. Plus, all those blocked shots, wow, Shaq would shut the paint down anytime he chose to.

[Stiff #1]

Points allowed per game : 93.8 (6th best)

Defensive FG% : 43.5% (2nd best)

Defensive 3P% : 34.9% (7th best)

Blocks per game : 5.3 (5th best)

Forced turnovers : 16.7 (2nd best)

And Kirk Hinrich is a great defender, he was an All-NBA Defender and he did a great job on Wade. Thabo Sefalosha also did a great job on him IIRC.
What is all of this nonsense? Thabo Sefolosha? Who the hell is this guy? I've heard of Kirk Hinrich maybe once in my life... Sefolosha is probably in the D-League right now.

Wade in 2006 (when they won the title) against "Sefolosha" and "Hinrich": 44 FG%

Wade in 2007 against the same scrubs: 42.9 FG%

Shaq in 2006 against defensive monsters BEN WALLACE and TYSON CHANDLER: 19/11 on 61 FG%

Shaq in 2007 against BEN WALLACE: 19/8 on 56 FG%

[Mikaiel]

Wade in 2006 against the Chicago Bulls and Kirk Hinrich and other guys I've never heard of = [B]44 FG%

Yeah, don't mention the 24.7 points, 4.5 rebounds, 7.2 assists, 2.0 steals and 1.3 blocks ...


I think you're overstating it.

Yeah maybe, but I was just arguing your "Wade's stats were much, much, much better than Shaq's" statement.

[d-_-b]

Something else for consideration, maybe not for the stats but just the sheer determination and killing it...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ceLlz7dOOvY
T-Mac 13 in 33secs

This sequence is the difference between greatest and most memorable because it might not be the best game but it sure as hell is memorable.

[Micku]

Eh? This debate happen because I mention my opinion on that whole 17 point straight thing?


Yeah, don't mention the 24.7 points, 4.5 rebounds, 7.2 assists, 2.0 steals and 1.3 blocks ...


While injured.

Besides, it's not no other superstar had a bad game like that. LBJ usually shot bad with the Detroit Pistons or any good defensive team in the playoffs I think, correct me if I'm wrong though. Kobe shot badly against the Pistons too. Shaq played kind'a bad in the 06 finals.

If you guys are taking about the leader of that team, it depends what you mean about leader. Backstage, Shaq or Mourning were probably the leader IMO. Wade was young, Shaq and Mourning had the experience and they had the "toughness" to be the leader of that team. At least that's what it seems like to me.

If you're talking about the best player, then it depends on what you mean. Do you believe Kobe was the best player in 02-04 with the Lakers? Wade played a similar role. He put a little more points than Shaq on a very impressive FG in today's era. There were times where Wade step up during clutch time and put his team back and won the game for them. It's not like Shaq didn't help, but he helped less than he was with the Lakers. He didn't work as hard.


Something else for consideration, maybe not for the stats but just the sheer determination and killing it...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ceLlz7dOOvY
T-Mac 13 in 33secs

This sequence is the difference between greatest and most memorable because it might not be the best game but it sure as hell is memorable.

DUDE! I forgot about that. That was really exciting man.

[jrong]

Yeah, I forgot about Jordan scoring 50 pts as a old man, lol. Seriously, when MJ came back I was like, "Again? Well, at least I get to see Jordan play." I didn't want him to do a miracle and win a championship against my team The Lakers. I wish I could've watch Jordan play in the 80s though. That would've been nice, but I feel I would look at today superstars with disgust like I do with the WWE superstars from the glory attitude days.

The best part about the 51 pt. game was because, speaking of turning back the clock, he had a baseline drive and jam at 39 (kind of on somebody but not quite a posterization). It was vintage MJ.

And speaking of vintage-MJ, I actually prefer his "43 at 40" in the Garden because it came about the way so many of his memorable performances did--using something said or done by the other team to motivate himself. Shandon Anderson for some reason decided in the twilight of Mike's career it would be a good idea to talk smack to him.

What followed was predictable. Michael went insane and trash-talked at Anderson (who suddenly didn't have anything to say anymore) every time he scored another basket. MJ wouldn't stop scoring, and he wouldn't shut up either The MSG fans were going crazy-- I think they were actually rooting for Jordan. Spike Lee put his hands in his face and was just like "Oh no, Shandon!". It was the last classic moment of Michael's career.

[Dnn111]

It may not be much, but I like when Allen Iverson scored 48 points against the Lakers in Game 1 of the 2001 NBA Finals. Everyone thought that Philadelphia would get swept. The Lakers won, but I had TONS of respect for Philadelphia and of course Iverson.

[d-_-b]

Some other games for consideration, CP3 has come pretty close to a quadruple double twice this year...

Against Dallas- 33/10/11 + 7 steals
Against Philly-- 27/10/15 + 7 steals


and one of my favorite Jordan performances of all-time
http://www.metacafe.com/watch/2503882/michael_jordan_the_best_buzzer_beater_50pts_vs_buc ks_1989/
50 points plus the buzzer beater

[bleedinpurpleTwo]

81

that's a number that was unimaginable in the modern era of the NBA.
unimaginable.

[Kiddlovesnets]

Michael Jordan dropping 51 at age 39
Michael Jordan dropping 43 at age 40

This is why he's the GOAT...
:bowdown:

[NBASTATMAN]

And how does that change the fact that those Pistons were overrated? They were so weak and soft that they nearly lost in the semis to the same Cavs the year before.

Jordan's 55 in Game 4 of the '93 finals (finals record) was better, his 63 in Game 2 of the '86 first round (playoff record) was better, and his 6 threes and 35 points in the first half of Game 1 of the '92 finals (both records) was also better.



Wasn't this a 2000's thread. Let mj dominate the 90's. For my money Shaq has been the greatest in the 2000's. And lebron's 48 vs detroit, Shaq's finals vs Indiana, and Iverson's multiple 50 pt games in 2001 year are the best.... Regular season games really are not worth as much as playoff games.

[Stiff #1]

Wasn't this a 2000's thread. Let mj dominate the 90's. For my money Shaq has been the greatest in the 2000's. And lebron's 48 vs detroit, Shaq's finals vs Indiana, and Iverson's multiple 50 pt games in 2001 year are the best.... Regular season games really are not worth as much as playoff games.
Ok, fair enough.

The greatest playoff performance from a non-big in the history of the 00s era:

Kobe's 49/4/10 against the tank and lockdown defender Kenyon Martin vs. LeBron's 48/9/7 against the Pistons in 2 OT - which was the greatest?

^^ Debate of the year right here.

[Jacks3]

Kobe's 48 points/16 rebounds/5 assists/2 steals game in the WCF vs the Spurs in 2001. That was amazing.

[OldSchoolBBall]

Ok, fair enough.

The greatest playoff performance from a non-big in the history of the 00s era:

Kobe's 49/4/10 against the tank and lockdown defender Kenyon Martin vs. LeBron's 48/9/7 against the Pistons in 2 OT - which was the greatest?

^^ Debate of the year right here.

The game Jacks3 just posted from Kobe is more impressive than his game vs. Denver last year. Kenyon Martin hasn't been a lockdown defender for about 3-4 years now. Locked knees, maybe. :D

[c_az_a]

Kobe's 48 points/16 rebounds/5 assists/2 steals game in the WCF vs the Spurs in 2001. That was amazing.

That's the number you expect Kobe to post right now in his career. But i guess that game was dependent on a X-factor (X = Shaq).

[Jacks3]

That's the number you expect Kobe to post right now in his career. But i guess that game was dependent on a X-factor (X = Shaq).
Yeah, Kobe should drop 48 points and 16 rebounds every game. What's funny is that Kobe has had multiple playoff games similar to that game without Shaq. What's even funnier is that his playoff averages without Shaq are 31/6/5/2 on 48% shooting. What's even funnier is that he had his greatest playoff run (2008) and greatest seasons (07-08,05-06,06-07) without Shaq. Yeah, the guy is nothing without Shaq LMAO. Kobe haters make me laugh.
:hammertime:

[c_az_a]

81

that's a number that was unimaginable in the modern era of the NBA.
unimaginable.

It's unimaginable that he couldn't double that feat in the playoffs that very year. His game seven performance that year shows why he's 1/4 the player they say he is. And 4x the fluke he ever was.

[c_az_a]

Yeah, Kobe should drop 48 points and 16 rebounds every game. What's funny is that Kobe has had multiple playoff games similar to that game without Shaq. What's even funnier is that his playoff averages without Shaq are 31/6/5/2 on 48% shooting. What's even funnier is that he had his greatest playoff run (2008) and greatest seasons (07-08,05-06,06-07) without Shaq. Yeah, the guy is nothing without Shaq LMAO. Kobe haters make me laugh.
:hammertime:


Greatest playoff run that ended with a 39 point blowout. Two games before that, a 24 pt lead blown. WTF. His numbers in the finals symbolize Kobe hype. "Kobe the best player in the league." "For example: 2008 finals. Oh wait, we don't have evidence to prove that statement factual." Forget the NBA finals, let's only talk about the first three series just like we talk about the 81 point game. Did those produce championships during their run? No? Why not?

[Jacks3]

Greatest playoff run that ended with a 39 point blowout. Two games before that, a 24 pt lead blown. WTF. His numbers in the finals symbolize Kobe hype. "Kobe the best player in the league." "For example: 2008 finals. Oh wait, we don't have evidence to prove that statement factual." Forget the NBA finals, let's only talk about the first three series just like we talk about the 81 point game. Did those produce championships during their run? No? Why not?
I have no idea what you're ranting about.:oldlol:
He only had 1 bad game vs the Pacers in 2000.
He didn't shoot well against the Sixers in 2001 but how does that make him a ''choker''?? Dude put up 25/8/6/1.4/1.4 .He only shot 41%(32% from 3 and 80% from the line) but that doesn't mean he choked.Those are excellent all-around numbers.
In 2002 Finals he put up phenomenal numbers:27 PPG/6 RPG/ 5 APG/1.5 SPG/0.8 BPG 51%/54%/81%
He was horrible in 2004 true.
In 2008 Finals he averaged 26/6/5/3 against an All-Time great defense designed to top him. He wasn't great but he didn't choke either. He had games that series of 30/8/4/3, 36/7/4/2/1, 17/10/4/4, 25/7/4/5/.
Can someone explain to me exactly how he's a choker when he's had those type of Finals?
Kobe not playing well in the Finals=myth
You said he can't handle pressure but how can then be when you consider his solid Finals and the fact that he's been the best playoff performer of this era not named Shaq or Duncan??
31/6/5/2 in the playoffs without Shaq is living up to the hype. The only people who feel that Kobe doesn't live up to the hype are the idiots who insist on him comparing to guys like Jordan or whoever.

[Scott Pippen]

Kobe's 48 points/16 rebounds/5 assists/2 steals game in the WCF vs the Spurs in 2001. That was amazing.
:applause:

And also as mentioned before a number of Shaq's Finals games and Duncan's also. For Kobe I may also add Game 6 vs PHX Suns in 2006 when he scored 50.

[OldSchoolBBall]

The only people who feel that Kobe doesn't live up to the hype are the idiots who insist on him comparing to guys like Jordan or whoever.

Don't you yourself constantly do this? Pretty sure I've seen you make numerous "Kobe > Jordan :bowdown: " posts.

[Jacks3]

Don't you yourself constantly do this? Pretty sure I've seen you make numerous "Kobe > Jordan :bowdown: " posts.
No.

[gts]

81

that's a number that was unimaginable in the modern era of the NBA.
unimaginable.this one...
seeing how 81 is debated as the best game ever in the history of the sport it takes the 2000's hands down... there is no other performance that's even in the debate

[Scott Pippen]

this one...
seeing how 81 is debated as the best game ever in the history of the sport it takes the 2000's hands down... there is no other performance that's even in the debate
This was very nice but in my opinion it was not even HIS best game of the season (62 vs Dallas). I like to value playoff games more (50 pts vs PHX) and also all around contributions and big clutch moments. Also the same with Wilt Chamberlain's 100 pts. Or even Jordan's 69 or Robinson's 71, etc. Impressive, but not as impressive as some of their other games.

To me I prefer Kobe's 65 pt game in 2007. :applause:

[JustinJDW]

David Robinson's Quadruple-Double? 34 points, 10 rebounds, 10 assists, 10 blocks?

May I add that a Quadruple-Double has only been done 4 times in NBA History, with Davin Robinson's being the latest one in 1994. :confusedshrug:

[Jacks3]

David Robinson's Quadruple-Double? 34 points, 10 rebounds, 10 assists, 10 blocks?

May I add that a Quadruple-Double has only been done 4 times in NBA History, with Davin Robinson's being the latest one in 1994. :confusedshrug:
Thread is about performances in the 00's era...

[Mikaiel]

Seriously, how could a regular season game be possibly ranked as the top perfomance of the decade ? It doesn't make any sense ...

[gts]

This was very nice but in my opinion it was not even HIS best game of the season (62 vs Dallas). I like to value playoff games more (50 pts vs PHX) and also all around contributions and big clutch moments. Also the same with Wilt Chamberlain's 100 pts. Or even Jordan's 69 or Robinson's 71, etc. Impressive, but not as impressive as some of their other games.

To me I prefer Kobe's 65 pt game in 2007. :applause:
i take the 81 over the 62 because the 62 was done while the lakers were in the game...
the 81 was done just getting the lakers form a large deficit and was needed to win the game... the 62 is impressive because he did it in 3 quarters but still...

81... just think about that, 81, it's huge.... playoff games, high scores and everything else pales in comparrison to scoring 81 points...i think people have forgotten that night... the phone calls "dude are you watching this?" the e-mails "go to the TV kobe's on fire" the fact that cbs2 in LA broke in during a show to announce kobe was at 70 some odd points "beaking news"...lol
81, front page of newspapers, magazines and on everyones lips for days... people who don't even follow basketball talked about it...lol

81

[Tuvi]

I'm taking

Tim Duncan's Game 6 of the 2003 NBA Finals:

21 points, 20 rebounds, 10 assists, 0 steals, 8 blocks, 9-19 FG-F

[twolvesfan]

IMO its Lebron james vs the pistons in the 2007 play offs

http://sports.espn.go.com/nba/recap?gameId=270531008

double OT game with james scoring 29 of the final 30 points:eek:
48 points 9 rebounds 7 assists 2 steals all while shooting 18-33 from the field and 10-14 from the free throw.:hammertime:

[Silverbullit]

Dirk's 50/12 in the WCF 2006 game 5 vs. Phoenix.

[Inspector Rick]

What is all of this nonsense? Thabo Sefolosha? Who the hell is this guy? I've heard of Kirk Hinrich maybe once in my life... Sefolosha is probably in the D-League right now.

Wade in 2006 (when they won the title) against "Sefolosha" and "Hinrich": 44 FG%

Wade in 2007 against the same scrubs: 42.9 FG%

Shaq in 2006 against defensive monsters BEN WALLACE and TYSON CHANDLER: 19/11 on 61 FG%

Shaq in 2007 against BEN WALLACE: 19/8 on 56 FG%

You know its okay to be wrong. To call Hinrich a scrub defender is absurd. Under coach Scott Skiles the Bulls as a whole was one of the top defensive teams in the league. If you dont know this you should seriously think about hanging up your account bud.

[jrong]

Dwyane Wade, CHI @ MIA, 3/9/09

[plowking]

Seriously, how could a regular season game be possibly ranked as the top perfomance of the decade ? It doesn't make any sense ...

Umm why?

Sure its the playoffs, but if a game is better in the regular season then its better. Simple as that. The "but its the playoffs" line is overused.

Who cares? I'm talking about one game here and this player was at his best when he played at that given time.

[Lodi Dodi]

Dwyane Wade, CHI @ MIA, 3/9/09

:bowdown: :bowdown: :bowdown:

[Micku]

Seriously, how could a regular season game be possibly ranked as the top perfomance of the decade ? It doesn't make any sense ...

I agree with plowking. It doesn't really make sense of what you said, no offensive. Why are you rejecting the regular sesson? The greatest performance could range to pre-sesson to regular sesson to playoffs. It doesn't matter where it take place. If you feel that there is a great performance that should be acknowledge, then post it. Like the 81 point game was historical and it was one of the greatest shooting performances and it happened in the regular sesson. You can't just reject that.

Anyway, tonight was one of those nights. Mia vs Chi 3/9/09. D-Wade: 48 Points, 12 assists, 3 blocks, 4 steals, shooting over 70%, plus game winner shot.

[spursdynasty420]

no tim duncan games to be listed. what do you expect?? gotta love ISH


best player in the past decade not even getting listed

[Micku]

no tim duncan games to be listed. what do you expect?? gotta love ISH


best player in the past decade not even getting listed

*angry face* Grrrr....damn the spurs.

[plowking]

no tim duncan games to be listed. what do you expect?? gotta love ISH


best player in the past decade not even getting listed

Shaq is the best player in the past decade.

[HisJoeness]

no tim duncan games to be listed. what do you expect?? gotta love ISH


best player in the past decade not even getting listed

:roll: @ you getting upset at a BULLS thread.

[Lebron23]

Duncan's almost Quadruple Double performance in the 2003 NBA Finals

Shaq's Finals performance in 2000-2002.

LeBron James scoring 48 points vs. The Best defensive Team in the Eastern Conference.

[plowking]

It's easily Bryant's and Shaq's game.

[stephanieg]

They're going to be showing Kobe's 81 on TV or holographic goggles or whatever 50 years from now.

[Stiff #1]

Dwyane Wade, CHI @ MIA, 3/9/09
Wow! Against the incredible Ben Gordon and Kirk Hinrich. Really impressive performance right there...

Even I could drop 30 with ease against the weak Chicago defense.

Tell me when Wade drops 40+ on a good defensive team.

[Lebron23]

Even I could drop 30 with ease against the weak Chicago defense.




:oldlol: :oldlol: :oldlol:

[dreaming121]

Wow! Against the incredible Ben Gordon and Kirk Hinrich. Really impressive performance right there...

Even I could drop 30 with ease against the weak Chicago defense.

Tell me when Wade drops 40+ on a good defensive team.

? Its not about the stats...

Its about how it ended.

[Stiff #1]

? Its not about the stats...

Its about how it ended.
What does it tell you about Dwyane Wade's leadership skills when it takes him 2 overtimes and a miracle 3 at the buzzer just to beat a team whose second and third best players are John Salmons and Brad Miller AT HOME?

And don't tell me this is the first time. I'm going through Miami's schedule right now and seeing that they beat the same Chicago team by exactly 1 point the last time they met.

Dwyane Wade has...

Jermaine O'Neal (stud), Udonis Haslem (stud), Michael Beasley (stud, future 24/8 all-star), Mario Chalmers (lockdown defender, 3-pt shooter, perfect backcourt partner), etc.

Yet he can barely pull off a win against a one-man team led by a rookie? :roll: :roll: I didn't watch the game, but the box score is telling me that he let BEN GORDON drop 40+ on him? Come on... it isn't even a top 5 performance of THIS season.

[Stiff #1]

I agree with plowking. It doesn't really make sense of what you said, no offensive. Why are you rejecting the regular sesson? The greatest performance could range to pre-sesson to regular sesson to playoffs. It doesn't matter where it take place. If you feel that there is a great performance that should be acknowledge, then post it. Like the 81 point game was historical and it was one of the greatest shooting performances and it happened in the regular sesson. You can't just reject that.

Anyway, tonight was one of those nights. Mia vs Chi 3/9/09. D-Wade: 48 Points, 12 assists, 3 blocks, 4 steals, shooting over 70%, plus game winner shot.
You have to take into consideration the team/players he was playing against.

[TheWitness]

id have to say Lebron's 50+ points almost triple double performance against the Knicks...

[Aussie Outcast]

Not sure if its been mentioned But Shaq's almost triple double in the 01 finals was pretty beast.

[Stiff #1]

You know its okay to be wrong. To call Hinrich a scrub defender is absurd. Under coach Scott Skiles the Bulls as a whole was one of the top defensive teams in the league. If you dont know this you should seriously think about hanging up your account bud.
Scott Skiles makes everyone look better. Look at what he's doing to a Milwaukee team with 2 of its 3 best players out for the year. He has them at the same record as this "Kirk Hinrich" guy. That's because Scott Skiles is one of the top 5 coaches in the game. I'm sorry, but any dominant performance against a team like Oklahoma City, Minnesota, Chicago, etc. doesn't deserve much praise at all.

Again, it's like me toying with female kindergarteners.

[Stiff #1]

Duncan's almost Quadruple Double performance in the 2003 NBA Finals

Shaq's Finals performance in 2000-2002.

LeBron James scoring 48 points vs. The Best defensive Team in the Eastern Conference.
:roll: :roll: :roll: :roll:

[Mikaiel]

Umm why?

Sure its the playoffs, but if a game is better in the regular season then its better. Simple as that. The "but its the playoffs" line is overused.

Who cares? I'm talking about one game here and this player was at his best when he played at that given time.

So Wade's game last night was better than his Game 3 in the Finals in '06 ? :hammerhead:

[bence23]

:applause:

And also as mentioned before a number of Shaq's Finals games and Duncan's also. For Kobe I may also add Game 6 vs PHX Suns in 2006 when he scored 50.
and LOST....

:roll: GTFOH

[plowking]

So Wade's game last night was better than his Game 3 in the Finals in '06 ? :hammerhead:

Stats don't determine everything in a game.

[Stiff #1]

and LOST....

:roll: GTFOH
Lamar Odom lost that game. We all know that Kobe won it.

Kobe = 50-8-5-3 on 57% shooting in Game 6 against the girly Suns.

Kobe won that series and led his trash team to the Western Conference Finals.

Lamar Odom lost the series.

http://dimemag.com/wp-content/Images/players/Odom_Lamar/LamarOdom_30.jpg

^^ TRASH.

[Mikaiel]

Stats don't determine everything in a game.

And that's exactly why regular season games shouldn't count ...

[Stiff #1]

And that's exactly why regular season games shouldn't count ...
LOL!!!

So Iverson dropping 50 in a playoff game against the Raptors is a greater performance than Kobe's 81 or LeBron's 52/9/11 at MSG?

Good joke!! :roll: :roll: :roll: :roll:

[bence23]

Lamar Odom lost that game. We all know that Kobe won it.

Kobe = 50-8-5-3 on 57% shooting in Game 6 against the girly Suns.

Kobe won that series and led his trash team to the Western Conference Finals.

Lamar Odom lost the series.

http://dimemag.com/wp-content/Images/players/Odom_Lamar/LamarOdom_30.jpg

^^ TRASH.
Did he do that in nba 2k7 when he was fishing after the first round? :confusedshrug:

[cdbleb]

Kobe's 81 of course


The question was greatest GAME performance...Not greatest SCORING performance.

[Stiff #1]

Lamar Odom was the one who let Shawn Marion go over his back and grab the biggest offensive rebound of the entire 2007 playoffs.

Kobe? What did he do? Watched Odom and the rest of his TRASH teammates blow it for him.

I will repeat: Kobe made the WCF, but the Lakers lost in the first round. That is the truth (I'm not an LA fan, but I watched that entire series).

[Stiff #1]

The question was greatest GAME performance...Not greatest SCORING performance.
Scoring is the most important part of the game.

Assists and rebounds are grossly overrated by people on this forum and basketball fans in general.

How hard is it to record an assist? Not hard at all. Just make sure the entire offense is run through you and find open shooters. Chris Paul is the only player in today's league whose assists actually impress me. He has true vision and passing skills. The rest just pad their assist numbers by finding great shooters who are always left wide open.

I don't even want to get into how garbage of a stat rebounding is. LMAO... rebounding, the most overrated stat maybe in all of sports.

[Mikaiel]

How hard is it ro record an assist?

Ask Yinka Dare :roll:

[Stiff #1]

Boy with the Sonic avatar, why can't you answer my question?

Is Iverson's 50+ point playoff game greater than Kobe's 81 and LeBron's 52/9/11?

[PoGoMon]

Quote:
Originally Posted by plowking
Umm why?

Sure its the playoffs, but if a game is better in the regular season then its better. Simple as that. The "but its the playoffs" line is overused.

Who cares? I'm talking about one game here and this player was at his best when he played at that given time.

So Wade's game last night was better than his Game 3 in the Finals in '06 ?

A playoff game is almost always against superior competition - not against the worst or near worst team in the league at the given date. Kobe's "81" was against the WORST team in the league at that time.

The same is true of any record for the season against a SIMILAR RECORD IN THE PLAYOFFS.

WHEN THE LAKERS WENT 15/1 IN THE PLAYOFFS - that WAS MORE DIFFICULT THAN THE 72 GAME WIN BY THE BULLS BECAUSE OF THE competition

[Mikaiel]

Boy with the Sonic avatar, why can't you answer my question?

Is Iverson's 50+ point playoff game greater than Kobe's 81 and LeBron's 52/9/11?

1. Don't call me boy.

2. Yes.

[cdbleb]

Scoring is the most important part of the game.

Assists and rebounds are grossly overrated by people on this forum and basketball fans in general.

How hard is it to record an assist? Not hard at all. Just make sure the entire offense is run through you and find open shooters. Chris Paul is the only player in today's league whose assists actually impress me. He has true vision and passing skills. The rest just pad their assist numbers by finding great shooters who are always left wide open.

I don't even want to get into how garbage of a stat rebounding is. LMAO... rebounding, the most overrated stat maybe in all of sports.


Assists are a direct link to points, rebounds gain possession which in turn puts a team in scoring position. Team concept wins games and scoring 81 on that Raptors team is "grossly overrated". Basketball is a team game and Kobe got multiple points in garbage time. You want to see what a real team leader does in a situation against a terrible team like that?

http://www.basketball-reference.com/boxscores/198903130CHI.html

Triple double in 21 minutes of floor time and he sat out the entire 4th quarter...Notice the teams are very comparable from both sides and the end result is pretty much the same.

[dreaming121]

What does it tell you about Dwyane Wade's leadership skills when it takes him 2 overtimes and a miracle 3 at the buzzer just to beat a team whose second and third best players are John Salmons and Brad Miller AT HOME?

And don't tell me this is the first time. I'm going through Miami's schedule right now and seeing that they beat the same Chicago team by exactly 1 point the last time they met.

Dwyane Wade has...

Jermaine O'Neal (stud), Udonis Haslem (stud), Michael Beasley (stud, future 24/8 all-star), Mario Chalmers (lockdown defender, 3-pt shooter, perfect backcourt partner), etc.

Yet he can barely pull off a win against a one-man team led by a rookie? :roll: :roll: I didn't watch the game, but the box score is telling me that he let BEN GORDON drop 40+ on him? Come on... it isn't even a top 5 performance of THIS season.


And who did Kobe face in that Raptors team for the 81 points? Double standard much?

If you are going to throw other accomplishments under the bus, you should take a look at your picks. Quit being hypocritical.

Besides not every great performance is all about stats.

[ProfessorMurder]

Really? Numbers say otherwise. Get back to me when he can do it without Garnett on his team.

http://www.basketball-reference.com/fc/h2h_finder.cgi?request=1&p1=cartevi01&p2=piercpa01
http://www.basketball-reference.com/boxscores/200504090NJN.html
http://www.basketball-reference.com/boxscores/199904080TOR.html

^^ As you can see, Carter has been shutting him down whenever the two have played each other.

WHAT?????? No one even mentioned Pierce before you posted this.

[Stiff #1]

1. Don't call me boy.

2. Yes.
Incredible. You just said Allen f'ing Iverson's 50+ was more impressive than 81 or 52/9/11 because it was in the playoffs. :roll:

Then according to this logic, Paul Pierce's 38 points in last year's finals > Kobe's 81, Kobe's 62 through 3, LeBron's 51/8/9, LeBron's 52/9/11, Shaq's 61/23, etc. :roll: :roll:


Assists are a direct link to points, rebounds gain possession which in turn puts a team in scoring position. Team concept wins games and scoring 81 on that Raptors team is "grossly overrated". Basketball is a team game and Kobe got multiple points in garbage time. You want to see what a real team leader does in a situation against a terrible team like that?

http://www.basketball-reference.com/...903130CHI.html

Triple double in 21 minutes of floor time and he sat out the entire 4th quarter...Notice the teams are very comparable from both sides and the end result is pretty much the same.
Jordan is a bad example because he is, while being the most well-rounded player to ever live, also the greatest scorer ever. Even Jordan realizes that scoring is the most important part of the game. That's why he had his own personal stat-keeper telling him what his numbers were at the end of each quarter.

81 points against any team = legendary.

Points > Assists + Rebounds. Points are a result of hard work, elite athleticism, elite stamina, and true skill.

You want to know why scoring is far more important than passing and rebounding? Because they created a ball and a hoop and teach people to throw the ball into the basket. If you can't score, you can't lead a team to anything.

[Stiff #1]

And who did Kobe face in that Raptors team for the 81 points? Double standard much?

If you are going to throw other accomplishments under the bus, you should take a look at your picks. Quit being hypocritical.

Besides not every great performance is all about stats.
Well, Wade needed 2 overtimes just to score 48 points against a Bulls team that is much weaker than the Raptors team Kobe lit up for 81 and BLEW OUT.

Lakers blew a better team out and Kobe's line was more impressive.

Heat won in double OT against a much worse team and Wade had 48 only.

[jrong]

Wow! Against the incredible Ben Gordon and Kirk Hinrich. Really impressive performance right there...

Even I could drop 30 with ease against the weak Chicago defense.

Tell me when Wade drops 40+ on a good defensive team.

How about two-- Cleveland (41) and Orlando (50) in the last three weeks?

[Simple Jack]

Incredible. You just said Allen f'ing Iverson's 50+ was more impressive than 81 or 52/9/11 because it was in the playoffs. :roll:

Then according to this logic, Paul Pierce's 38 points in last year's finals > Kobe's 81, Kobe's 62 through 3, LeBron's 51/8/9, LeBron's 52/9/11, Shaq's 61/23, etc. :roll: :roll:


Jordan is a bad example because he is, while being the most well-rounded player to ever live, also the greatest scorer ever. Even Jordan realizes that scoring is the most important part of the game. That's why he had his own personal stat-keeper telling him what his numbers were at the end of each quarter.

81 points against any team = legendary.

Points > Assists + Rebounds. Points are a result of hard work, elite athleticism, elite stamina, and true skill.

You want to know why scoring is far more important than passing and rebounding? Because they created a ball and a hoop and teach people to throw the ball into the basket. If you can't score, you can't lead a team to anything.

Scoring requires athleticism? You mean like when Peja Stojakovic nearly led the league in scoring? Or like when Bird was dropping 25+ a game?

Are you aware that Rodman and Barkley were midgets in the 4 and 5 spot world? Rodman used to literally watch tapes for hours on his opponents to see any holes in their rebounding game and come up with a strategy on how to out rebound his match up.

Every part of the game requires a large amount of skill but putting up points isn't always the way to win. Look at Magic. Look at Russel.

I'm willing to bet my life you are NOWHERE near 50+ years old as you claim, and have never an actual game of anyone pre Michael Jordan.

[Stiff #1]

Notice how Dwyane Wade is only able to go off against the non-playoff teams or defensive sissies.

Here are the facts to prove it:

40 points vs. Toronto
43 points @ Phoenix
41 points vs. Charlotte
43 points @ New Jersey
41 points @ Sacramento
42 points @ Charlotte
48 points vs. Chicago

LOL!!! 7 of his 9 40+ point games have come against some of the worst teams in the league.

[PoGoMon]

Assists are a direct link to points, rebounds gain possession which in turn puts a team in scoring position. Team concept wins games and scoring 81 on that Raptors team is "grossly overrated". Basketball is a team game and Kobe got multiple points in garbage time. You want to see what a real team leader does in a situation against a terrible team like that?

http://www.basketball-reference.com/boxscores/198903130CHI.html

Triple double in 21 minutes of floor time and he sat out the entire 4th quarter...Notice the teams are very comparable from both sides and the end result is pretty much the same.

This is an interesting comparison to the Wade triple double game and to the Kobe 81 point game. The biggest difference is in the eye of the beholder.

Jordan is so far above Kobe, it is laughable that the Kobe entourage doesn't see it. Kobe has good taste - he chose the GOAT to try to imitate, but imitations wear thin - with time.

Jordan is far- far above Wade also....but at least Wade is one for one (NBA Finals MVP) in the finals, while Kobe 0/5 in the finals.:cheers:

[Stiff #1]

Scoring requires athleticism? You mean like when Peja Stojakovic nearly led the league in scoring? Or like when Bird was dropping 25+ a game?

Are you aware that Rodman and Barkley were midgets in the 4 and 5 spot world? Rodman used to literally watch tapes for hours on his opponents to see any holes in their rebounding game and come up with a strategy on how to out rebound his match up.

Every part of the game requires a large amount of skill but putting up points isn't always the way to win. Look at Magic. Look at Russel.

I'm willing to bet my life you are NOWHERE near 50+ years old as you claim, and have never an actual game of anyone pre Michael Jordan.
Yes, scoring requires athleticism. Dominique Wilkins, Michael Jordan, Kevin Johnson, Chris Paul, Dwyane Wade, Kobe Bryant, LeBron James, Hakeem Olajuwon, Shaquille O'Neal, David Robinson, Shawn Kemp and hundreds of others wouldn't be the scorers they were/are if not for their freakish athleticism. ATHLETICISM wins basketball games. Unathletic wimps are often found waving a towel or scratching their asses at the very end of the bench.

Michael Jordan is the greatest player/winner the game will ever see. Why is this? Because of his athleticism and scoring.

If your team's best player isn't an elite scorer, you will win nothing.

Tell me what Rodman would have won if he didn't ride the coattails of Jordan to 3 consecutive titles. The answer is NOTHING.

[Inspector Rick]

Scott Skiles makes everyone look better. Look at what he's doing to a Milwaukee team with 2 of its 3 best players out for the year. He has them at the same record as this "Kirk Hinrich" guy. That's because Scott Skiles is one of the top 5 coaches in the game. I'm sorry, but any dominant performance against a team like Oklahoma City, Minnesota, Chicago, etc. doesn't deserve much praise at all.

Again, it's like me toying with female kindergarteners.

You're just further illustrating my point. I agree, Skiles is one of the top coaches in the league and he absolutely does make teams better, especially defensively. WHICH IS WHAT HE DID WITH CHICAGO!!!!

[AznBBoyX]

Tell me what Rodman would have won if he didn't ride the coattails of Jordan to 3 consecutive titles. The answer is NOTHING.

Fail. Won 2 titles with the Pistons.

[Stiff #1]

You're just further illustrating my point. I agree, Skiles is one of the top coaches in the league and he absolutely does make teams better, especially defensively. WHICH IS WHAT HE DID WITH CHICAGO!!!!
You said that Kirk Hinrich isn't a scrub (which he is) or a bad defender (which he is).

I said that Scott Skiles makes everyone better. How do I know this? Because I look at and understand numbers (win/loss record with and without him, players' stats while playing for him, etc.).


Fail. Won 2 titles with the Pistons.

You honestly think I didn't know this? He rode the greatest scoring PG's coattails to his other 2 titles.

Bottom line? Scorers = winners.

[highwhey]

Anyone who picks LeBron is a joke. The guy choked in the playoffs. Shaq's numbers are astronomical, he dominated on both sides of the court. I don't care if Kobe or LeBron score 90 points in a regular season game, it's all about the play-offs. Shaq did his best performances in the play-offs, defensively and offensively.

61 pts, 23 REBOUNDS(THATS 23 MORE OPPORTUNITIES)

The thing about players like Kobe or LeBron is that they can score any amount of points, but they usually end up shooting 50%, to me that's horrible, from 33 field goals, only 17 were made? That's a lot of shots missed. Of course, everyone misses, but at least Shaq grabbed huge amounts of boards to create more opportunities and recuperate the shots that he missed. Plus, all those blocked shots, wow, Shaq would shut the paint down anytime he chose to.

Great post. Excellent points. You sir deserve rep.

:applause:

[Inspector Rick]

You said that Kirk Hinrich isn't a scrub (which he is) or a bad defender (which he is).

I said that Scott Skiles makes everyone better. How do I know this? Because I look at and understand numbers (win/loss record with and without him, players' stats while playing for him, etc.).

I honestly have no idea how you can sit there and call Kirk Hinrich a bad defender. I'm guessing you became a basketball fan this year? Your knowledge of the game is suspect dude.

Your a numbers guy eh?

Points allowed per game : 93.8 (6th best)

Defensive FG% : 43.5% (2nd best)

Defensive 3P% : 34.9% (7th best)

Blocks per game : 5.3 (5th best)

Forced turnovers : 16.7 (2nd best)

Understand that?

[Simple Jack]

Yes, scoring requires athleticism. Dominique Wilkins, Michael Jordan, Kevin Johnson, Chris Paul, Dwyane Wade, Kobe Bryant, LeBron James, Hakeem Olajuwon, Shaquille O'Neal, David Robinson, Shawn Kemp and hundreds of others wouldn't be the scorers they were/are if not for their freakish athleticism. ATHLETICISM wins basketball games. Unathletic wimps are often found waving a towel or scratching their asses at the very end of the bench.

Michael Jordan is the greatest player/winner the game will ever see. Why is this? Because of his athleticism and scoring.

If your team's best player isn't an elite scorer, you will win nothing.

Tell me what Rodman would have won if he didn't ride the coattails of Jordan to 3 consecutive titles. The answer is NOTHING.



If your team's best player isn't an elite scorer, you will win nothing.

Bill Russell won 11 rings. Enough said.

Magic wasn't an elite scorer when he led that team. They played great ball as a team.

And for me to prove you wrong, all I have to do is give you 1 example of a great scorer who wasn't athletic. You seriously need to stop trolling now.

[Stiff #1]

Bill Russell won 11 rings. Enough said.

Magic wasn't an elite scorer when he led that team. They played great ball as a team.

And for me to prove you wrong, all I have to do is give you 1 example of a great scorer who wasn't athletic. You seriously need to stop trolling now.
LMFAO at bringing up Bill Russell's OVERRATED ass!!! :roll: :roll: :roll: :roll:

Bill Russell played in a sh!tty era full of Caucasian midgets who moved like overfed elephants and had 10-inch verticals.

Bill Russell would be a scrub in the 80s, 90s and today's era.

Jordan, Duncan, Shaq, Kobe, Hakeem, Drexler, Bird, Magic, Isiah, Wade = elite scorers = NBA champions.

The goal of this game is to score... period.

[BULLZ]

LMFAO at bringing up Bill Russell's OVERRATED ass!!! :roll: :roll: :roll: :roll:

Bill Russell played in a sh!tty era full of Caucasian midgets who moved like overfed elephants and had 10-inch verticals.

Bill Russell would be a scrub in the 80s, 90s and today's era.

Jordan, Duncan, Shaq, Kobe, Hakeem, Drexler, Bird, Magic, Isiah, Wade = elite scorers = NBA champions.

The goal of this game is to score... period.


Just say it...........we are all waiting for it..........

it was a weak era

[Inspector Rick]

It's a weak era for posting thats for damn sure!

[Stiff #1]

I honestly have no idea how you can sit there and call Kirk Hinrich a bad defender. I'm guessing you became a basketball fan this year? Your knowledge of the game is suspect dude.

Your a numbers guy eh?

Points allowed per game : 93.8 (6th best)

Defensive FG% : 43.5% (2nd best)

Defensive 3P% : 34.9% (7th best)

Blocks per game : 5.3 (5th best)

Forced turnovers : 16.7 (2nd best)

Understand that?Are you related to the guy? Is that why you feel the need to overrate him?

If you are, just tell me right now... because there's no point in going back and forth with someone who refuses to accept obvious facts.

[cdbleb]

Scorers = winners.


Is that why Kobe averages 33 points per game in the games that LA has lost this season and 26.6 points per in games that LA has won?

All the excuses and examples can be made over and over for both sides of the debate but when it comes down to it a well rounded player, like LeBron or Wade, will have more success and more appeal than a pure scorer, like Iverson. Scorers DO NOT = winners, it takes a team to win a championship and assists and rebounds help a player keep the team concept in tact.

[Scott Pippen]

Bottom line? Scorers = winners.

http://services.bostonglobe.com/mas_assets/full/780639.jpg

[PoGoMon]

I honestly have no idea how you can sit there and call Kirk Hinrich a bad defender. I'm guessing you became a basketball fan this year? Your knowledge of the game is suspect dude.

Your a numbers guy eh?

Points allowed per game : 93.8 (6th best)

Defensive FG% : 43.5% (2nd best)

Defensive 3P% : 34.9% (7th best)

Blocks per game : 5.3 (5th best)

Forced turnovers : 16.7 (2nd best)

Understand that?

I love that and maybe he'll understand those numbers that were laid out so nicely for him.

Very nice reply!:bowdown:

[PoGoMon]

http://services.bostonglobe.com/mas_assets/full/780639.jpg

Russell's name alone speaks VOLUMES against scorers being on the same level with WINNERS!

Thank you!:bowdown:

[Stiff #1]

http://services.bostonglobe.com/mas_assets/full/780639.jpg
Bill Russell = loser, overrated, 40 FG% for a center (pathetic), ZERO titles in the 90s against the GOAT centers.

Michael Jordan, Kobe Bryant, Hakeem Olajuwon, Larry Bird, Shaquille O'Neal = 5 greatest players ever.

Jordan, Kobe = greatest scorers in NBA history.

Hakeem, Shaq = greatest scorers from the center position (Nobody cares about Kareem and Wilt).

Bird = greatest scoring SF ever.

[Mikaiel]

Scorers = winners.

Yeah, that must be why only 3 guys have won the scoring title and the championship in the same season (Kareem, MJ, Shaq) :hammerhead:

Take MJ out of the equation, and the scoring champion won the title only 3.2% of the time. Even with MJ it's just 12.9%.

[Stiff #1]

Russell's name alone speaks VOLUMES against scorers being on the same level with WINNERS!

Thank you!:bowdown:
Bill Russell was not a winner.

Kobe Bryant is a better winner than Bill Russell. So is LeBron James and Allen Iverson.

[Stiff #1]

Is that why Kobe averages 33 points per game in the games that LA has lost this season and 26.6 points per in games that LA has won?

All the excuses and examples can be made over and over for both sides of the debate but when it comes down to it a well rounded player, like LeBron or Wade, will have more success and more appeal than a pure scorer, like Iverson. Scorers DO NOT = winners, it takes a team to win a championship and assists and rebounds help a player keep the team concept in tact.
The year Kobe averaged 35 ppg+ and 32 ppg was when his team sucked. That's why they didn't win.

LeBron won 50 games during his best scoring season ever.

Scorers win championships. Passers and rebounders and other scrubs RIDE THE COATTAILS of elite scorers to championships.

[Stiff #1]

Yeah, that must be why only 3 guys have won the scoring title and the championship in the same season (Kareem, MJ, Shaq) :hammerhead:

Take MJ out of the equation, and the scoring champion won the title only 3.2% of the time. Even with MJ it's just 12.9%.
And what do you have to say about the following fact:

Bird = 25 ppg+ when he won, Jordan = 30 ppg+ during first 3-peat, Jordan = 28 ppg+ during second 3-peat, Duncan = 21 ppg+ when he won, Olajuwon = 24 ppg+ when he won, Shaq = 27 ppg+ when he won, Wade = 27 ppg+ when he won, Kobe = 27 ppg+ when he won...

THIS YEAR'S NBA CHAMPION = either Kobe Bryant or LeBron James. Both are top 3 in scoring.

[Mikaiel]

Bill Russell was not a winner.

Kobe Bryant is a better winner than Bill Russell. So is LeBron James and Allen Iverson.

Thinking the guy was a product of his era is one thing (although it's ridiculous and retarded) but saying he was a not winner is extremely retarded. The guy won 11 titles while Wilt was in the NBA. Wilt was a freaking beast, a God playing among insects and he still managed to beat him and come out on top. At least respect that. Otherwise you're just pathetic.

[Stiff #1]

Thinking the guy was a product of his era is one thing (although it's ridiculous and retarded) but saying he was a not winner is extremely retarded. The guy won 11 titles while Wilt was in the NBA. Wilt was a freaking beast, a God playing among insects and he still managed to beat him and come out on top. At least respect that. Otherwise you're just pathetic.
Yeah, he won 11 titles because he played in a league where the average player was 6'4" with a vertical leap around 15''.

Kobe Bryant in the 60s = 60 ppg, 15 rpg, 12 apg, 75 FG%, 15 titles.

Shaquille O'Neal in the 60s = 55 ppg, 35 rpg, 8 apg, 85 FG%, 15 titles.

Michael Jordan in the 60s = 65 ppg, 20 rpg, 15 apg, 80 FG%, 20 titles.

60s = garbage era for wussies like Bill Russell, Jerry West, John Havlicek, etc.

Bill Russell WAS NOT a winner. Get it through your head. He would win nothing if he played today.

[Mikaiel]

Scorers win championships. Passers and rebounders and other scrubs RIDE THE COATTAILS of elite scorers to championships.

http://jacklangstoninc.com/Tim%20Duncan.jpg

http://imagecache2.allposters.com/images/pic/PHO/929982~Chauncey-Billups-2004-NBA-Championship-MVP-Trophies-Photofile-Posters.jpg

http://blog.mlive.com/sports_impact/2008/06/medium_080618_kevin_garnett_championship.jpg

http://www.nba.com/media/pistons/thomas_931014.jpg

http://slog.thestranger.com/files/2008/01/p1.magic.jpg

Maybe with pictures you'll understand :confusedshrug:

[PoGoMon]

LMFAO at bringing up Bill Russell's OVERRATED ass!!! :roll: :roll: :roll: :roll:

Bill Russell played in a sh!tty era full of Caucasian midgetswho moved like overfed elephants and had 10-inch verticals.

Bill Russell would be a scrub in the 80s, 90s and today's era.

Jordan, Duncan, Shaq, Kobe, Hakeem, Drexler, Bird, Magic, Isiah, Wade = elite scorers = NBA champions.

The goal of this game is to score... period.

You obviously KNOW nothing about Russell and never saw him change this game.

You never saw him win 2 NCAA championships,
a gold medal in the olympics, or
his 11 rings in 13 years.
You never saw him block shots out on the perimeter on fast guards like OSCAR or West.
You obviously don't know that his opponents were NOT all white dudes with no talent. Ever heard of Willis Reed, Walt Bellamy, Wilt Chamberlain, Nate Thurmond, or Wes Unseld and Elvin Hayes? THEY ARE ALL BLACK, TALENTED HOFers!

You need to catch up on your homework, son.:no:

[AznBBoyX]

You obviously KNOW nothing about Russell and never saw him change this game.

You never saw him win 2 NCAA championships,
a gold medal in the olympics, or
his 11 rings in 13 years.
You never saw him block shots out on the perimeter on fast guards like OSCAR or West.
You obviously don't know that his opponents were NOT all white dudes with no talent. Ever heard of Willis Reed, Walt Bellamy, Wilt Chamberlain, Nate Thurmond, or Wes Unseld and Elvin Hayes? THEY ARE ALL BLACK, TALENTED HOFers!

You need to catch up on your homework, son.:no:

It's not use. The kid's just too narrow minded. Just let him believe what he wants to believe.

[Stiff #1]

You obviously KNOW nothing about Russell and never saw him change this game.

You never saw him win 2 NCAA championships,
a gold medal in the olympics, or
his 11 rings in 13 years.
You never saw him block shots out on the perimeter on fast guards like OSCAR or West.
You obviously don't know that his opponents were NOT all white dudes with no talent. Ever heard of Willis Reed, Walt Bellamy, Wilt Chamberlain, Nate Thurmond, or Wes Unseld and Elvin Hayes? THEY ARE ALL BLACK, TALENTED HOFers!

You need to catch up on your homework, son.:no:
I own TAPES of 60s hoops and have watched well over 100 games of Wilt Chamberlain and Bill Russell combined.

Willis Reed? Fat scrub. Walt Bellamy? Useless today. Wilt Chamberlain? VERY poor man's Dwight Howard. Nate Thurmond? Another scrub today. Wes Unseld? Short, fat, terrible. Elvin Hayes? Another scrub.

The reason why Bill Russell isn't a winner is because those were the scrubs he was competing against.

It is like me cloning myself five times and beating a wheelchair basketball team 21-0... IT MEANS NOTHING.

60s accomplishments = worthless. I could have averaged 30 ppg in the 60s.

[PoGoMon]

I own TAPES of 60s hoops and have watched well over 100 games of Wilt Chamberlain and Bill Russell combined.

Willis Reed? Fat scrub. Walt Bellamy? Useless today. Wilt Chamberlain? VERY poor man's Dwight Howard. Nate Thurmond? Another scrub today. Wes Unseld? Short, fat, terrible. Elvin Hayes? Another scrub.

The reason why Bill Russell isn't a winner is because those were the scrubs he was competing against.

It is like me cloning myself five times and beating a wheelchair basketball team 21-0... IT MEANS NOTHING.

60s accomplishments = worthless. I could have averaged 30 ppg in the 60s.

That is a lie - because if there were that many videos, they would then be able to count all of the blocked shots from the 60s - which they are UNABLE to do.

To say that all of those HOFers listed above were nothing shows that you shall from here on out be ignored by all who have an IQ that is higher than yours.:confusedshrug: :oldlol:

[Micku]

You have to take into consideration the team/players he was playing against.

I know. But it's not like Wade hasn't done this thing before. He scored against Orlando and Cav with 40+ points. He scored pretty good against Detroit in the playoffs in 05-06. He hit game winner shots in his first year too. I think he hit a game winner shot in the playoffs, correct me if I'm wrong though.

What made this game exciting is that Wade was doing a lot of things on the floor it seems. Both D and O. He shot over 70% and hit a game winner. It was a exciting performance. All game winner moments like that is exciting.

[branslowski]

Kobe in 2001 Western Conference Semi's. 48pts 16reb vs Kings, only to follow that up with a 45pt 10reb gm.

[cdbleb]

THIS YEAR'S NBA CHAMPION = either Kobe Bryant or LeBron James. Both are top 3 in scoring.

Have you ever watched the playoffs? A team like Detroit, Utah or Miami (Three hot teams right now) could do serious damage to your statement come playoff time if they hit another streak at the right time. And youre also completely overlooking other teams like San Antonio, Houston, Orlando, and BOSTON (Leading scorer last season when they won a title...Pierce with 19.6 ppg and only 4 players averaged double digits: http://www.basketball-reference.com/teams/BOS/2008.html )...Where is your proof that one of those two teams will win a ring this year?

[Stiff #1]

^^ Are you serious? :roll: :oldlol:

Detroit is a first round exit. Those fools have no chance.

Utah was raped by Kobe Bryant and his Lakers last year. What makes you think those chumps have any chance this year?

Miami? :oldlol: Atlanta will RAPE Miami in the first round.

The Cavs and Lakers will meet in the Finals. Nobody else is good enough. The Celtics won't win because their best player is a fatty and Garnett is on the decline.

Cavs = best team in the East.

Lakers = best team in the West.

Cavs vs. Lakers = 2009 NBA Finals.

[ukplayer4]

You see, nobody remembers that. All we remember is that he rode Shaq to his 2006 championship.




:roll: everything you ever post is always hilarious but this great stuff....

[oh the horror]

Bill Russell was not a winner.

Kobe Bryant is a better winner than Bill Russell. So is LeBron James and Allen Iverson.


Can anyone really take this person seriously after a comment like this?

I mean seriously?

[Stiff #1]

:roll: everything you ever post is always hilarious but this great stuff....
If only I knew who you were, or that you even existed...

But you'll always know who I am. :roll: :roll:

[big baller]

Shaq's 44 points, 21 rebounds, 4 assists, 7 blocks, 17-32 FG-FGA vs. SAC in Game 1 of the 2001 Western Conference Semifinals.

[Stiff #1]

Can anyone really take this person seriously after a comment like this?

I mean seriously?
Why not?

Allen Iverson, LeBron James, and Kobe Bryant are all much, MUCH better players than Bill Russell ever was.

Bill Russell was simply a one-dimensional Marcus Camby clone who won 11 titles because he had some sorry-ass competition.

Put Bill Russell in today's league? You get a shorter/worse version of Marcus Camby.

[ukplayer4]

Im sorry, but that whole "era vs era" argument is truely the dumbest any fan has ever brought up.


Who came up with that point of view on sports?


So by this logic, and theory, a player that averages 10 pts today, could average 30 pts in the 60s?


You have to realize, that era to era, players played how they played for their era. You cannot compare the two, because it isnt reality.


Kobe would have played like a player in the 60s, with 1960s technology, shoes, and conditioning.


Wilt in todays game, would be awesome, with todays tech, shoes, and conditioning.


Why bring up a point, that has no meaning whatsoever? Its a stupid argument that only stupid people entertain.


Single greatest performance, in a game....era doesnt matter. Again....youre asking about the performance, in a game, by a professional basketball player.


How hard is this to grasp?


edit to add: the "era vs era" thing has ruined, and downplayed spectacular performances, and players in this game. Its silly, and SHOULD hold no real weight in a discussion of all time greats.





this post needs to be put at the start of every "weak era" related thread as it is 100% truth. but if the idiots of this board could actually comprehend the logic here the actual number of posts on this forum would probably drop by 40%. such is the stupidity of most people on this board when discussing the greats and what they acomplished, it has almost become acceptable to say (any average player today) is far better than (any alltime great player from pre 2000) because of era.


this guy stiff 1 aka bulls/2333/5325 is one of those morons.

[ukplayer4]

If only I knew who you were, or that you even existed...

But you'll always know who I am. :roll: :roll:





spot on. i will always know who you are because you are the only person on this board capable of this level of stupidity and dellusion.

[Sneak]

81 in 4 quarters = 33 more points than 48 in 6 quarters.

6 Quarters? Really?

Wow, I'm lost for words.

And this wasn't even close to be the most stupid thing you've written in this thread.

[Godfather]

Shaq's 60/20, but his single game in the finals where he had 40/20 was the most impressive out of all of them imo.

[Simple Jack]

LMFAO at bringing up Bill Russell's OVERRATED ass!!! :roll: :roll: :roll: :roll:

Bill Russell played in a sh!tty era full of Caucasian midgets who moved like overfed elephants and had 10-inch verticals.

Bill Russell would be a scrub in the 80s, 90s and today's era.

Jordan, Duncan, Shaq, Kobe, Hakeem, Drexler, Bird, Magic, Isiah, Wade = elite scorers = NBA champions.

The goal of this game is to score... period.

Give it up man. You are the minority not just on this forum, but among all people who watch basketball.


NO ONE has "forgotten" Wilt or Russell. Any reputable person has both of them in their top 5 of all time.

Kobe doesn't belong in the same sentence as Jordan. It really is absolutely ridiculous how LITTLE one person can know about ball and make 20+ posts a day with extreme confidence of pure bull****. It's amazing man, you deserve a prize. Seriously.

[Stiff #1]

Give it up man. You are the minority not just on this forum, but among all people who watch basketball.


NO ONE has "forgotten" Wilt or Russell. Any reputable person has both of them in their top 5 of all time.

Kobe doesn't belong in the same sentence as Jordan. It really is absolutely ridiculous how LITTLE one person can know about ball and make 20+ posts a day with extreme confidence of pure bull****. It's amazing man, you deserve a prize. Seriously.
Trust me... today or tomorrow will be my last day posting here. Then it will be another 2 months before I even decide to read a thread on this forum. The reason I post here? Because I just broke my leg. Don't think I normally waste my time on you guys.

Now to your point... it's an absolute joke that you have Bill ****ing Russell in your top 5 all-time. If Bill Russell is top 5 all-time, guys like Kobe Bryant, Karl Malone, Charles Barkley, etc. are basketball demigods. Russell stinks compared to all of those three I just mentioned.

I never said Kobe was as good or ever will be as good as Jordan. All I said was that he's clearly top 10 all-time and a much better player than Bill Russell.

[BallPhunk]

The Celtics won't win because their best player is a fatty and Garnett is on the decline.

Nutty troll as he may be, he makes me laugh sometimes... :lol

[AMISTILLILL]

You are a moron.

Fixed.

Everything I've read in this thread thus far from this guy is "Shaq/Kobe Lakers was the best" worship.

[loot]

Not stat-wise but game wise this is the most impressive and crazy oen so far this season:


Dwyane Wade: I waxed poetic about Wade's amazing game at By The Horns, but now I'm gonna vent. What the hell? Seriously, what the hell?! The Bulls played one of their best games of the season, but Wade went all God Mode on them, scoring 48 points on 15-for-21 from the field [!!] and 5-for-6 from downtown [!!!]. And let's talk about those threes. One was a 32-footer to beat the halftime buzzer. One tied the game with 11.5 seconds left in regulation to force overtime. And his final triple -- which came off a steal that robbed the Bulls of their final possession and a chance to win it at the end of the second overtime -- was a crazy running lightning bolt of a buzzer beat that won the game. This wasn't just crazy, it was crazy-insane. Seriously.

http://basketbawful.blogspot.com/