Pau Gasol = best low post player in the game

[Diesel J]

When it comes to offense, dude is a beast. When he's on the block, dude has a variety of different sweeps/running hooks and he does it wit both hands. he scores almost everytime he does that post up->finish with the left hand. Along with that, he also has a pretty automatic mid range jumper and shoot a high % from the FT line. He also has the highest Offensive Rating in the entire league:bowdown:


Gasol's Fg% compared to other top PF's

Dirk- 48%

Duncan- 50%

West- 46%

KG- 53%

Pau Gasol- 57%



Gasol = efficient:applause:

[thatoneblackguy]

http://img11.imageshack.us/img11/784/grizzlies15resize.jpg

[bdreason]

He's probably the best post scorer in the game.

[AJ2k8]

I dont know about best but it does seem like everytime he has the ball in the low post he'll get an assist or finish himself:applause:

[Allstar24]

I would appreciate this thread more if it wasn't started by a troll with an agenda.

[wozzler]

the most efficient?

[OldSchoolBBall]

He's incredibly skilled down there, can finish with both hands equally well, can face up or post up, and has THE quickest first step of any player over 6'10" in the league. Viciously underrated by many Kobe fans who have no idea what a luxury it is to have a 20/10/55+% FG level guy who can do all that plus is an exceptional passer, good post defender and shotblocker, and can play the low or high post and pick & roll game.

Walton is another guy who gets terribly underrated. Dude is always doing great things on the floor that helps the team win. I'd take Walton over a guy like Sczzcerbiak or Kapono any day of the week.

[Scott Pippen]

Walton is another guy who gets terribly underrated.

Now this I can agree with. I know he had a poor season last year, but some things I hear makes it seem like he is unable to even dribble the ball. And Gasol is maybe not the best post scorer in the league. Probably Yao, or still Shaq even today, Dwight, Big Al, and so on. But passing out of the post I would say yes. Best since C-Webb.

[Jailblazers7]

I would be more inclined to say the best high post player in the league. His rang, mobility, and passing make him very effective from the high post.

[bdreason]

Walton is terrible, and way overpaid.

Take this guy out of the triangle, and he'd be riding the bench on any decent squad in the league.

Walton doesn't shoot well, can't penetrate, and may be the worst post up SF in the league. Honestly, watch this guy post up sometime, it's hilarious.


The only thing he does well is pass (inside the triangle).... but even that's overrated because teams never honor him as an offensive threat.

[Diesel J]

The only person in Gasol's league on offense from both the high/low post is Yao Ming. Gasol is better though because he actually put the ball on the floor and take you off the dribble:eek:

[pete's montreux]

I guess, now that Al Jefferson is injured.

And even then, I'd take Shaq, and Duncan over him, too. He's top five.

[fiad06]

Gasol is talented... His release is so quick its unblockable. The way to stop him is to not let him get low post position.

[Carbine]

If he's the best post-scorer in the game then a championship has to be in the future for the Lakers. They would literally have the two most important things in the playoffs in spades (best post scorer who can slow the game down, and the best closer) and another important peice in Bynum with his shot-blocking/post defense abilties.

The last time a team had the best closer, post scorer and a viable post defender/shot blocker they won three straight championships.

[Mdog1]

If he's the best post-scorer in the game then a championship has to be in the future for the Lakers. They would literally have the two most important things in the playoffs in spades (best post scorer who can slow the game down, and the best closer) and another important peice in Bynum with his shot-blocking/post defense abilties.

The last time a team had the best closer, post scorer and a viable post defender/shot blocker they won three straight championships.
LeBron James: 17-50 (34.0%), with 6 assists and 4 turnovers.
Kobe Bryant: 14-56 (25.0%), with 1 assist and 5 turnovers.
Dwyane Wade: 11-40 (27.5%), with 3 assists and 2 turnovers.

Not only does LeBron have more game winning shots over these six seasons than Wade and Kobe, his 17th are the most in the league. Furthermore, his 34.0% shooting in these situations is higher than that of both Bryant and Wade (who both fall below the league average of 29.8% in game-winning shot situations). James also has more assists in such situations, and fewer turnovers than Kobe. Lastly, since April 13th, 2006, LeBron is an astonishing 13-30 (41.9%) in game winning situations.

http://82games.com/gamewinningshots.htm

Kobe is not the best closer in the game.

[Carbine]

Hey, I'm not saying it's true... but a lot of people have come to the conclusion that Kobe is the best closer in the game, period. Personally I don't think it's cut and dry who the best is, but Kobe is certainly up there and if one shot has to be made, I'd probably give the ball to him.

I just wanted to point out that with everything the Lakers have.... a dynasty or something close to it should be on the horizon. How can you have the best post-scorer, best closer and one of the top post-defenders/shot blockers and not be winning championships?

Kobe shoudl be expected to lead this group to a ring or two, maybe three. If he doesn't his legacy should take a massive hit.

[Mdog1]

His legacy will take a huge hit then. I think that that link should be forwarded to ESPN so they can shut up about Bryant being the best closer. Since he is actually below average.

[plowking]

LeBron James: 17-50 (34.0%), with 6 assists and 4 turnovers.
Kobe Bryant: 14-56 (25.0%), with 1 assist and 5 turnovers.
Dwyane Wade: 11-40 (27.5%), with 3 assists and 2 turnovers.

Not only does LeBron have more game winning shots over these six seasons than Wade and Kobe, his 17th are the most in the league. Furthermore, his 34.0% shooting in these situations is higher than that of both Bryant and Wade (who both fall below the league average of 29.8% in game-winning shot situations). James also has more assists in such situations, and fewer turnovers than Kobe. Lastly, since April 13th, 2006, LeBron is an astonishing 13-30 (41.9%) in game winning situations.

http://82games.com/gamewinningshots.htm

Kobe is not the best closer in the game.

As much as you love saying that, it's funny how the non biased fans always pick Kobe or Wade in those situations.

You know why? Because they've proven themselves on the big stage and in that situation. Furthermore, those stats are flawed. They count game tying shots as well.

[Mdog1]

As much as you love saying that, it's funny how the non biased fans always pick Kobe or Wade in those situations.

You know why? Because they've proven themselves on the big stage and in that situation. Furthermore, those stats are flawed. They count game tying shots as well.
Not if you know how to read they don't.

82games.com defines a "game winning shot" as a shot that occurs:


1. With 24 seconds or less, then it truly is a "last possession" situation potentially
2. With a margin from tied to down 2, the team can take the lead with a made basket (including 3's)
3. By excluding a down 3 situation, we don't have the "gimme two point buckets" that defenses will sometimes yield to the quick bucket/intentional foul strategy option you often see exercised.

I think it is funny to. I mean any educated fan would know which player to pick. Ignorance is not bliss in these situations. Spread the message Kobe=below average.

[211269]

LeBron James: 17-50 (34.0%), with 6 assists and 4 turnovers.
Kobe Bryant: 14-56 (25.0%), with 1 assist and 5 turnovers.
Dwyane Wade: 11-40 (27.5%), with 3 assists and 2 turnovers.

Not only does LeBron have more game winning shots over these six seasons than Wade and Kobe, his 17th are the most in the league. Furthermore, his 34.0% shooting in these situations is higher than that of both Bryant and Wade (who both fall below the league average of 29.8% in game-winning shot situations). James also has more assists in such situations, and fewer turnovers than Kobe. Lastly, since April 13th, 2006, LeBron is an astonishing 13-30 (41.9%) in game winning situations.

http://82games.com/gamewinningshots.htm

Kobe is not the best closer in the game.

This thread is about Gasol dumbass

[Mdog1]

This thread is about Gasol dumbass
Good argument. I was responding to a comment about /gasol/Kobe. He was wrong, I showed the error of his ways. No big deal.

[hack_a_shaq]

LeBron James: 17-50 (34.0%), with 6 assists and 4 turnovers.
Kobe Bryant: 14-56 (25.0%), with 1 assist and 5 turnovers.
Dwyane Wade: 11-40 (27.5%), with 3 assists and 2 turnovers.

Not only does LeBron have more game winning shots over these six seasons than Wade and Kobe, his 17th are the most in the league. Furthermore, his 34.0% shooting in these situations is higher than that of both Bryant and Wade (who both fall below the league average of 29.8% in game-winning shot situations). James also has more assists in such situations, and fewer turnovers than Kobe. Lastly, since April 13th, 2006, LeBron is an astonishing 13-30 (41.9%) in game winning situations.

http://82games.com/gamewinningshots.htm

Kobe is not the best closer in the game.

You're right. Stern should just look these stats over. Say to hell with a 7 game series or even the playoffs and just give Lebron the trophy.

In all seriousness...This is the worst argument ever.

Phil Jackson : Well guys...I've looked the charts and papers over. Lebron has hit 3 more GW than our boy Kobe' here. Not to mention he's been 9% better. Maybe next year...

If it is really that close...does it matter?

[SmackOrH.A.K]

When it comes to offense, dude is a beast. When he's on the block, dude has a variety of different sweeps/running hooks and he does it wit both hands. he scores almost everytime he does that post up->finish with the left hand. Along with that, he also has a pretty automatic mid range jumper and shoot a high % from the FT line. He also has the highest Offensive Rating in the entire league:bowdown:


Gasol's Fg% compared to other top PF's

Dirk- 48%

Duncan- 50%

West- 46%

KG- 53%

Pau Gasol- 57%



Gasol = efficient:applause:
Yao shoots 55% and is the number 1 option on his team's offense.

[Mdog1]

You're right. Stern should just look these stats over. Say to hell with a 7 game series or even the playoffs and just give Lebron the trophy.

In all seriousness...This is the worst argument ever.

Phil Jackson : Well guys...I've looked the charts and papers over. Lebron has hit 3 more GW than our boy Kobe' here. Not to mention he's been 9% better. Maybe next year...

If it is really that close...does it matter?
9% is not close at all. I am not saying that this is the reason the Cavs will win the championship, but I am tired of Kobe being touted as one of the best closers when in fact he is below league average. Let me repeat that Kobe is a below average clutch shooter.

[TheWitness]

Nope!

Timmy D. Is The Best!

[hack_a_shaq]

9% is not close at all. I am not saying that this is the reason the Cavs will win the championship, but I am tired of Kobe being touted as one of the best closers when in fact he is below league average. Let me repeat that Kobe is a below average clutch shooter.

Being a clutch shooter and being a good closer are different to me. A close, to my definition is someone who can rally their team for a 10-0 run late in the fourth when the game is tied. Now to me, that is a closer. A GW is a clutch shot, in my opinion.

Feel free to tell me your definitions. I'm not trying to attack you but I just get tired of seeing LEBRON > KOBE 10+ times a day. I'm not trying to dog you, just saying.

[jc23]

Dwight Howard is the best low post scorer. He can't score in as many ways as Yao or Pau but the difference is both Yao and Pau can both score from 10 feet out at the high post. Almost all Dwight baskets are put backs or dunks.

[211269]

9% is not close at all. I am not saying that this is the reason the Cavs will win the championship, but I am tired of Kobe being touted as one of the best closers when in fact he is below league average. Let me repeat that Kobe is a below average clutch shooter.

Lakers 2 Cavs 0
Lebron 14-45 in two loses

:lol

[dajadeed]

Kobe is not the best closer in the game.

Yes he is. What happens down the stretch isn't going to be broken down by some geek. Stats never tell the whole story, and "closing" a game is something that cannot be measured in an objective stat.

Anyone tells you they have a "stat" that tells you who the best "closer" is is a damn liar. Anyone who believe that damned liar, is a ****ing retard.

These basketball nerds with a hardon for baseball stats need to get the **** away from the game.

[dajadeed]

Not if you know how to read they don't.

82games.com defines a "game winning shot" as a shot that occurs:


1. With 24 seconds or less, then it truly is a "last possession" situation potentially
2. With a margin from tied to down 2, the team can take the lead with a made basket (including 3's)
3. By excluding a down 3 situation, we don't have the "gimme two point buckets" that defenses will sometimes yield to the quick bucket/intentional foul strategy option you often see exercised.

I think it is funny to. I mean any educated fan would know which player to pick. Ignorance is not bliss in these situations. Spread the message Kobe=below average.

It's pretty much a fact around the league of who the best closer is. The overwhelming majority of players, coaches, gms, scouts, analysts, and anyone with anything to do with the game will tell you that Kobe is unequivocally the best closer in the game.

Only a ****ing moron would believe some "stat" drudged up by some baseball duplicating dumbass.

[White Mamba]

Gasol's Fg% compared to other top PF's

Dirk- 48%

Duncan- 50%

West- 46%

KG- 53%

Pau Gasol- 57%



Gasol = efficient:applause:

So much easy when you are playing with KB24

Pau shooting 8% more as a Laker.

[fefe]

If we are talking about top5 low post players in the league right now, my order is:

1. Duncan
Duncan has it all: low post scoring, low post passing, some midrange "bank"shooting :) and really great post defense.
2. Gasol
He has everything Duncan has, one could argue that he is even more skilled than the big fundamental, but he surely is not as tough, or as good at defense, so that makes him nr 2.
3. Shaq
obviously, he doesn't have a midrange game :) but in the low post, he is nr1. he is still the most dominant post scorer, and a really great post passer. great post up defender (nobody can score on him one-on one in the post, not even the other 4 in this top5), but he is usually a bit slow on defensive rotations.
4. Dwight
Young man still has a lots of flaws as far as skills go, but he is the most athletic, and the best help defender of the crew. (no passing game, or midrange game yet whatsoever)
5. Yao
The least athletic of these 5, but being 7'6", it really doesn't matter.
he has a nice midrange jumper (unblockable), but he is a bit slow on his low post moves (very blockable). he is a good passer, but despite his huge size, he manages to be the worst defender of the top5 (still pretty good).

[Laker4Lyfe]

He's incredibly skilled down there, can finish with both hands equally well, can face up or post up, and has THE quickest first step of any player over 6'10" in the league. Viciously underrated by many Kobe fans who have no idea what a luxury it is to have a 20/10/55+% FG level guy who can do all that plus is an exceptional passer, good post defender and shotblocker, and can play the low or high post and pick & roll game.

Walton is another guy who gets terribly underrated. Dude is always doing great things on the floor that helps the team win. I'd take Walton over a guy like Sczzcerbiak or Kapono any day of the week.

:roll::roll::roll::roll::roll: You are joking right?????:roll::roll::roll::roll::roll:

[loot]

watch lakr fans blame it on their mediocre players (other than kobe) when they lose in the playoffs.

but for now. pau is the best low post player. :oldlol:

[Yung D-Will]

No one can stop Shaq in the low post even if he's a bit past his prime he;s still playing great basketball

[Rolando]

If we are talking about top5 low post players in the league right now, my order is:

1. Duncan
Duncan has it all: low post scoring, low post passing, some midrange "bank"shooting :) and really great post defense.
2. Gasol
He has everything Duncan has, one could argue that he is even more skilled than the big fundamental, but he surely is not as tough, or as good at defense, so that makes him nr 2.
3. Shaq
obviously, he doesn't have a midrange game :) but in the low post, he is nr1. he is still the most dominant post scorer, and a really great post passer. great post up defender (nobody can score on him one-on one in the post, not even the other 4 in this top5), but he is usually a bit slow on defensive rotations.
4. Dwight
Young man still has a lots of flaws as far as skills go, but he is the most athletic, and the best help defender of the crew. (no passing game, or midrange game yet whatsoever)
5. Yao
The least athletic of these 5, but being 7'6", it really doesn't matter.
he has a nice midrange jumper (unblockable), but he is a bit slow on his low post moves (very blockable). he is a good passer, but despite his huge size, he manages to be the worst defender of the top5 (still pretty good).

Right on the money.....

[twolvesfan]

ohh how quickly people forget about Big Al, his post moves > all

[stephanieg]

Yes he is. What happens down the stretch isn't going to be broken down by some geek. Stats never tell the whole story, and "closing" a game is something that cannot be measured in an objective stat.

Anyone tells you they have a "stat" that tells you who the best "closer" is is a damn liar. Anyone who believe that damned liar, is a ****ing retard.

These basketball nerds with a hardon for baseball stats need to get the **** away from the game.

Folk logic dies hard.

[Toizumi]

Already mentioned a few times, but the best low post player is Shaq IMO. He has no midrange game and he averages 18.2 ppg on .614 FG. All his scoring is done in the low post. He is not the most skilled, but he's the strongest/biggest and he utilizes that to the fullest.

[MMM]

Gasol is skilled but he does get a lot of open shots within 10 ft he also scores a lot of points off of put backs so I wont say he has the best low post game but he is within the top 5-10 post players.

[The Messenger]

Yes he is. What happens down the stretch isn't going to be broken down by some geek. Stats never tell the whole story, and "closing" a game is something that cannot be measured in an objective stat.

Anyone tells you they have a "stat" that tells you who the best "closer" is is a damn liar. Anyone who believe that damned liar, is a ****ing retard.

These basketball nerds with a hardon for baseball stats need to get the **** away from the game.
This man knows what he is talking about. How strange, logic on a basketball forum...

Stats ae mainly for people who can't play the game or don't understand the game, if you do, you don't need stats.

[Orlando Magic]

As much as you love saying that, it's funny how the non biased fans always pick Kobe or Wade in those situations.

You know why? Because they've proven themselves on the big stage and in that situation. Furthermore, those stats are flawed. They count game tying shots as well.

First of all, don't try to bring Wade's name into the discussion because he doesn't get a damn ounce of the hype/reputation that Kobe does when it comes to being a clutch shooter.

And secondly... the reason is not because they've proven themselves on the big stage in that situation. The reason is because every ****ing announcer was trying to force Kobe as the next Jordan down our throat for YEARS and they ALL overreacted to everything positive he did and STILL DO.

NOBODY remembers how many clutch shots you miss if you MAKE a lot, even if the amount you miss far exceeds the amount you make.

If a player took 100 game winning attempts and made 25 of them over the course of five seasons, nobody is going to remember the 75 times he failed. They're going to remember the 25 winners... thus delivering the false perception of reality that he is a super clutch player.

Kobe has made a lot of clutch shots over the years because he has attempted a lot. Granted... it takes a lot of confidence to take that many shots... but that's about it. He is a spotlight whore to the point where he blocks everything else out. But we already knew that.

[SoCalMike]

:roll::roll::roll::roll::roll: You are joking right?????:roll::roll:


actually, his comment is not that far off... compared to wally and kapono, walton is who i would pick too....



:pimp:

[shawbryant]

Kobe makes him better.

[Bean]

Thats why he's the MVP of the Lakers.

[Knoe Itawl]

First of all, don't try to bring Wade's name into the discussion because he doesn't get a damn ounce of the hype/reputation that Kobe does when it comes to being a clutch shooter.

And secondly... the reason is not because they've proven themselves on the big stage in that situation. The reason is because every ****ing announcer was trying to force Kobe as the next Jordan down our throat for YEARS and they ALL overreacted to everything positive he did and STILL DO.

NOBODY remembers how many clutch shots you miss if you MAKE a lot, even if the amount you miss far exceeds the amount you make.

If a player took 100 game winning attempts and made 25 of them over the course of five seasons, nobody is going to remember the 75 times he failed. They're going to remember the 25 winners... thus delivering the false perception of reality that he is a super clutch player.

Kobe has made a lot of clutch shots over the years because he has attempted a lot. Granted... it takes a lot of confidence to take that many shots... but that's about it. He is a spotlight whore to the point where he blocks everything else out. But we already knew that.

Great post. Unfortunately, many people have a sheep mentality mixed with hero worship. Therefore, they care more about the myth of a player rather than the truth.

[Lakas Fan Yo]

Yao is a better post payer and he's really the best in the league not anyone else mentioned in this thread. The difference is obviously that you have to double or triple Yao and he still creates a ton of open shots for his team and still can get 20 points. If you single cover him he will get 30 or more and can carry the team to a win.

Plus he's a highly efficient guy and his free throw shooting is far superior to any of these other guys. At the end of the game you can't even go to some of these other guys because they can't hit free throws.

[Diesel J]

By the way, Im only talking about on offense. Overall, that goes to Duncan.

[amfirst]

Game winning shots are a little bias, what about dagger shots within 20 secs or so? :confusedshrug:

[VCMVP1551]

Gasol is a ridiculously good player and the perfect team guy. He'll play any role. When Bynum started emerging he deferred to him and had no problem playing as the 3rd option and playing at PF. When Bynum got injured he instantly stepped up, switched to center and not only took the role of 2nd option, but played better than most 1st options.

In the 22 games without Bynum Gasol has averaged over 21 and 10 with 4 assists per game, 1.3 blocks and 1 steal per game while shooting 60% from the floor and almost 80% from the line. The Lakers have gone 17-5 during that time.

He can do so many different things on the floor. He's the best passing big man in the league, he's an excellent mid-range shooter, he's easily a top 5 low post scorer, he hits his free throws at a high rate, he's a good rebounder and he'll block shots. He's been the Lakers most consistent player this season.

[amfirst]

When it comes to offense, dude is a beast. When he's on the block, dude has a variety of different sweeps/running hooks and he does it wit both hands. he scores almost everytime he does that post up->finish with the left hand. Along with that, he also has a pretty automatic mid range jumper and shoot a high % from the FT line. He also has the highest Offensive Rating in the entire league:bowdown:


Gasol's Fg% compared to other top PF's

Dirk- 48%

Duncan- 50%

West- 46%

KG- 53%

Pau Gasol- 57%



Gasol = efficient:applause:

Gasol is good, but good team ball movement contributes to centers having high percentage as well. Plus, KG, Yao and Duncan are probably ahead of him.

[gts]

http://img11.imageshack.us/img11/784/grizzlies15resize.jpg i knew he had a little of the captain in him

[danumber88]

Pau Gasol = one of the scariest threat in the NBA when he has deep position

[amfirst]

Gasol is a ridiculously good player and the perfect team guy. He'll play any role. When Bynum started emerging he deferred to him and had no problem playing as the 3rd option and playing at PF. When Bynum got injured he instantly stepped up, switched to center and not only took the role of 2nd option, but played better than most 1st options.

In the 22 games without Bynum Gasol has averaged over 21 and 10 with 4 assists per game, 1.3 blocks and 1 steal per game while shooting 60% from the floor and almost 80% from the line. The Lakers have gone 17-5 during that time.

He can do so many different things on the floor. He's the best passing big man in the league, he's an excellent mid-range shooter, he's easily a top 5 low post scorer, he hits his free throws at a high rate, he's a good rebounder and he'll block shots. He's been the Lakers most consistent player this season.

The scary part is that Bynum will probably be better than Gasol when he gets back. Bynum is a physical player which is better suited for tough teams.

[Tainted Sword]

Leave it to the trolls to turn this into a Kobe/Lebron thread. Get a life, losers. :oldlol:

Anyway, Pau has silently become our best player. He’s been exceptional all season. Glad to see him get some appreciation.

[JJ81]

http://img11.imageshack.us/img11/784/grizzlies15resize.jpg

:oldlol:

[Mdog1]

Being a clutch shooter and being a good closer are different to me. A close, to my definition is someone who can rally their team for a 10-0 run late in the fourth when the game is tied. Now to me, that is a closer. A GW is a clutch shot, in my opinion.

Feel free to tell me your definitions. I'm not trying to attack you but I just get tired of seeing LEBRON > KOBE 10+ times a day. I'm not trying to dog you, just saying.
When I think of a close I think of the last shot, the person who closes the door on the opposition. IMO what you are talking about is a hero and not a closer. A hero is someone who rallys their team and gets them that W.

[Mdog1]

It's pretty much a fact around the league of who the best closer is. The overwhelming majority of players, coaches, gms, scouts, analysts, and anyone with anything to do with the game will tell you that Kobe is unequivocally the best closer in the game.

Only a ****ing moron would believe some "stat" drudged up by some baseball duplicating dumbass.
Maybe those people don't actually have a clue? Maybe they don't know what they are looking for or what they are looking at? I am not sure, but it is a common misconception that Kobe is the most clutch player in the game. It is not your fault, it is the medias. They have failed in bringing to you the stats, or rather facts that you need to decide for yourself.

[Mdog1]

First of all, don't try to bring Wade's name into the discussion because he doesn't get a damn ounce of the hype/reputation that Kobe does when it comes to being a clutch shooter.

And secondly... the reason is not because they've proven themselves on the big stage in that situation. The reason is because every ****ing announcer was trying to force Kobe as the next Jordan down our throat for YEARS and they ALL overreacted to everything positive he did and STILL DO.

NOBODY remembers how many clutch shots you miss if you MAKE a lot, even if the amount you miss far exceeds the amount you make.

If a player took 100 game winning attempts and made 25 of them over the course of five seasons, nobody is going to remember the 75 times he failed. They're going to remember the 25 winners... thus delivering the false perception of reality that he is a super clutch player.

Kobe has made a lot of clutch shots over the years because he has attempted a lot. Granted... it takes a lot of confidence to take that many shots... but that's about it. He is a spotlight whore to the point where he blocks everything else out. But we already knew that.
This right here is what I am trying to say. Kobe is clutch, but he is not as clutcch as he is percieved to be. I just want to get the ball rolling on the NBA truth movement instead of the lies that the "analysts" have been spreading for so long.

[dajadeed]

KOBE EFFECT :applause:

[Automajic23]

This right here is what I am trying to say. Kobe is clutch, but he is not as clutcch as he is percieved to be. I just want to get the ball rolling on the NBA truth movement instead of the lies that the "analysts" have been spreading for so long.

yo troll stfu please this is thread about paus post game, go troll about lebron and kobe in your own thread. :no:

Pau does have a very nice post game, I like the fact he can nail 10 footers no problem too. His hook shots and scoops amaze me sometimes

[Tainted Sword]

Don

[Thom.Yorke]

last summer in china vs spain when they caught up in the 4th who had the ball in their hands to rally up to win?. kobe hits shots in big games. lebron hasn't even played in that many big games.

I like lebron and all but damn can he first win something before we let him in the hall of fame.

anyways back to gasol......

[Mdog1]

[QUOTE=Tainted Sword]Don

[Tainted Sword]

Was I lying?

Well, you have to be either full of sh*t, extremely ignorant, or a flat-out homer to have that opinion. Lebron has done nothing so far to justify fans elevating him to an all-time great level. You complain when Kobe gets this treatment, yet you happily do the same with Lebron. In other words, you

[Sir Charles]

PauGasol = Great Player Skill Wise (not Athletic-Strength Wise) after Duncan the Best Low Post Player...Oldschool Style...same on with Paul Pierce...one of the very few reasons to still watch some NBA Ball today :applause:

[stephanieg]

The scary thing about LA is that Gasol is only 28. Bynum just grew pubes and his voice is starting to creak. Their roleplayers are all in their mid 20s. Farmar is their future point. This team should be good for a long time.

[TmacsRockets]

When it comes to offense, dude is a beast. When he's on the block, dude has a variety of different sweeps/running hooks and he does it wit both hands. he scores almost everytime he does that post up->finish with the left hand. Along with that, he also has a pretty automatic mid range jumper and shoot a high % from the FT line. He also has the highest Offensive Rating in the entire league:bowdown:


Gasol's Fg% compared to other top PF's

Dirk- 48%

Duncan- 50%

West- 46%

KG- 53%

Pau Gasol- 57%



Gasol = efficient:applause:

Gasol = Best Big in the game today. He has a 11.9 Win Share while Kobe has a 10.9 Win Share

[twolvesfan]

im still shocked no one mentions Big Al.

[FinishHim!]

Gasol = Best Big in the game today. He has a 11.9 Win Share while Kobe has a 10.9 Win Share
You've gotta be outside of your mind if you think that Pau Gasol even now, is better than Tim Duncan.

[number23]

His low post moves are really effective in the playoffs when he dissapears. This thread is funny.

[bada bing]

Pau Gasol is the best low post player to ever play the game!! Infact, he is better than everyone in history and the league should just disband in honor of Pau Gasol. He is bigger than the game itself. Go Gasol GO!!!!!

[211269]

You've gotta be outside of your mind if you think that Pau Gasol even now, is better than Tim Duncan.

Gasol is shooting a higher percentage and averaging the same points and rebounds per game. He definitely has a nicer outside shooting touch than Duncan, hes a better passer and has more low post moves than Duncan. I dont know if I would say hes "better" than Duncan, but hes right there with him.

[hito da god]

LeBron James: 17-50 (34.0%), with 6 assists and 4 turnovers.
Kobe Bryant: 14-56 (25.0%), with 1 assist and 5 turnovers.
Dwyane Wade: 11-40 (27.5%), with 3 assists and 2 turnovers.

Not only does LeBron have more game winning shots over these six seasons than Wade and Kobe, his 17th are the most in the league. Furthermore, his 34.0% shooting in these situations is higher than that of both Bryant and Wade (who both fall below the league average of 29.8% in game-winning shot situations). James also has more assists in such situations, and fewer turnovers than Kobe. Lastly, since April 13th, 2006, LeBron is an astonishing 13-30 (41.9%) in game winning situations.

http://82games.com/gamewinningshots.htm

Kobe is not the best closer in the game.
:rolleyes: there's more to closing a game than to hit a game winning shot. closing a game means stepping on your opponent's neck when you're up 10 with six minutes left in the game. nobody in the game does this better than kobe.

[LA_Showtime]

Gasol = Best Big in the game today. He has a 11.9 Win Share while Kobe has a 10.9 Win Share

Kobe is 20th all-time in win shares. Pau Gasol is 116th...

http://www.basketball-reference.com/leaders/ws_career.html

[Diesel J]

Just now he went for

36 pts 11 rbs 7 ast on 14/19 FG and 8/10 FT. How many big men in the NBA are seeing him on offense? The answer is ZERO

[MiseryCityTexas]

where were these statements about pau gasol when he played for the grizzlies? didn't gasol put up better numbers when he played in memphis?people only care about the winning team and sh!t.

[inclinerator]

very very underrated. He is also long as fu ck getting ez tip ins like z but more athletic

[inclinerator]

where were these statements about pau gasol when he played for the grizzlies? didn't gasol put up better numbers when he played in memphis?people only care about the winning team and sh!t.
believe it he is better now more efficient more understanding of the game

[YAWN]

His legacy will take a huge hit then. I think that that link should be forwarded to ESPN so they can shut up about Bryant being the best closer. Since he is actually below average.
send that to every coach and player in the nba while youre at it too. they all seem to be misinformed.

[Orlando Magic]

He is not the best low post player in the game.

He is not the most skilled low post player in the game.

He is not the best low post scorer in the game.

Stop overrating.

He's never averaged more than 20ppg and that includes when he was the main man on his team.

[211269]

He is not the best low post player in the game.

He is not the most skilled low post player in the game.

He is not the best low post scorer in the game.

Stop overrating.

He's never averaged more than 20ppg and that includes when he was the main man on his team.

Who is then? Wait, lemme guess....Dwight Howard? :oldlol:

[Orlando Magic]

Who is then? Wait, lemme guess....Dwight Howard? :oldlol:

Dwight Howard is a better low post player than Gasol. Dwight is not nearly as skilled, but it doesn't matter. Nobody would take Gasol over Dwight. Nobody.

Yao is a better low post player. Yao is more skilled, and a better low post scorer.

Duncan is a better low post player. Duncan is more skilled, and a better low post scorer.

Need I go on? Seriously..

[xtn5021]

I'm not being a hater. Gasol is good an all. But I still think the Big Fundamental is better. Plays better D and everything.

[bdreason]

Nobody would take Gasol over Dwight. Nobody.





I wouldn't be so sure about that.

[andgar923]

So much so little time...

A. Gasol is possibly the most skilled big man in the league. He's surpassed Duncan at this point in their career. Yao isn't as versatile as Pau and he's always getting hurt.

B. Pau benefits from Kobe, but he benefits from the triangle even more. Of course having a player that draws double teams helps him, but I think that if Kobe didn't play and he was the 1st option, his fg% might drop slightly, but he'd get more possessions which will increase his assists and point totals. And just how Kobe make Gasol better by taking away double teams, the same can be said in reverse. Gasol makes Kobe's job much easier as well, taking away many of the double teams and spreading out the floor.

C. KOBE IS NOT THE MOST CLUTCH!!!! the mythical exploits of his heroics are just an exaggeration of selective memory.

[giantgonzolez]

One thing Gasol has is TONS of height. Not only is he tall, but he has long arms too. Standing reach is WAY more important than Height. Elton Brand for example has way more standing reach than 7 footer Kevin Willis had.
Shaq has 9'8" standing reach which is THE SAME AS Yao Ming. If Yao Ming had long arms like Bradley or Bol, then he could average 4 BPG, average 30ppg, shoot 60% FGP, etc. I think Duncan, Dwight Howard, etc are still better low post players than Gasol. Duncan really doesn't care at all about individual stats and his stats would be a lot better if he cared about them.

[TheGreatDeraj]

Gasol is the best offensive PF in the game. Great post moves, up their with Al(there ya go twolvesfan), Shaq, Duncan. The second best passing big man after Shaq. Great in the high post, and his midrange game is incredible this year. He doesn't have the range of KG, but his accuracy out to 15 feet is unmatched by any other PF. If the triangle ran more through Gasol than through Kobe, the Lakers would be better off.

Also, the Kobe/Gasol pick n roll is nearly unstoppable with Gasol's versatility. Gasol may just be the best pick n roll PF in the game as well. I have no idea why Phil and Kobe don't use it more often. :confusedshrug:

With that said, as skilled as Gasol is, you have to give come credit to Kobe, because many of Gasol's looks are directly created by Kobe, or are a result of the defensive planning to slow Kobe down.

[godofgods]

Gasol is not the best low post player in the game. My goodness, this punk became so overrated ever since he joined the Fakers. He used to be one of the most underrated ever, then became one of the most overrated ever. Just like Ben Wallace.

[brantonli]

Wow, I remember very clearly in a thread a few years ago, when Gasol was on the Grizzlies, people ranked the top 20 players and Gasol was nowhere to be seen and Yao was consistently 10th to 15th. Now? Gasol is the best low post player, but nowadays, Yao is still ranked above him (see player rank thread), and since both are low post players, I wonder how do people rank Yao over Gasol?

BTW, I'm stilll of the view that Duncan is the best in the low post, then Yao, then Howard, then Gasol/Jefferson. It's amazing what winning can do to make your reputation shine.

[ronnymac]

Yao
Gasol

That if i wanna biased, but it's to close to say clearly one is better then the other.

[HANNIBAL SMITH]

:oldlol: I ****s with Gasol and all, but he aint seeing Tim, Shaq, Yao or Al Jeff in the post. Those guys can score over anyone, physical or not. All you have to do is get physical with Pau and his game disappears.Funny, we wasn't hearing this talk when he played in Memphis, ah yes, i see. This topic has more to do with "how much help Kobe has" then anything. Then have the nerve to Say that Luke Walton is underrated? Really? :roll:

[amfirst]

So I guess the Spurs and Celts, shoundn't have a problem trading KG and Duncan for Gasol. :hammerhead:

[pete's montreux]

Wow, I remember very clearly in a thread a few years ago, when Gasol was on the Grizzlies, people ranked the top 20 players and Gasol was nowhere to be seen and Yao was consistently 10th to 15th. Now? Gasol is the best low post player, but nowadays, Yao is still ranked above him (see player rank thread), and since both are low post players, I wonder how do people rank Yao over Gasol?

BTW, I'm stilll of the view that Duncan is the best in the low post, then Yao, then Howard, then Gasol/Jefferson. It's amazing what winning can do to make your reputation shine.

Howard over Al in the post?

Nah. Good joke, though.

[ElPigto]

Wow, I remember very clearly in a thread a few years ago, when Gasol was on the Grizzlies, people ranked the top 20 players and Gasol was nowhere to be seen and Yao was consistently 10th to 15th. Now? Gasol is the best low post player, but nowadays, Yao is still ranked above him (see player rank thread), and since both are low post players, I wonder how do people rank Yao over Gasol?

BTW, I'm stilll of the view that Duncan is the best in the low post, then Yao, then Howard, then Gasol/Jefferson. It's amazing what winning can do to make your reputation shine.

Wow, Howard? Really? He sucks in the post. He has nowhere near the skills of Duncan, Gasol, Jefferson, and Yao.

[brantonli]

Wow, Howard? Really? He sucks in the post. He has nowhere near the skills of Duncan, Gasol, Jefferson, and Yao.

Well, I guess when I really think it through, I don't mean Howard 1-on-1 with a defender, but Howard in a 5-on-5 situation.....it's sort of confusing, I just always had this notion of roughly Duncan, Yao, Howard as top 3 centers and the rest down there. But in terms of skills, or just 'best low post player' probably Duncan>Yao>Al Jeff/Gasol>Howard.
Yeah I think when I was writing that post I just thought of plonking the three best centers then Gasol and Jefferson, wasn't really thinking correctly at the time.

[Diesel J]

Gasol coming up big once again to save the day:violin:

21 pts

18 rbs

3 blks

..in game 7

[tastystaci]

So I guess the Spurs and Celts, shoundn't have a problem trading KG and Duncan for Gasol. :hammerhead:

What does Gasol having a better low post game have to do with his value as a player? I agree that Gasol has a solid post game, not better than Yao and Duncan, but probably a close third. I mean Gasol has a better post game than Dwight Howard by far, that doesn't mean anyone would trade Gasol for Howard. Your post is a failure IMO.

[OldSchoolBBall]

Gasol coming up big once again to save the day:violin:

21 pts

18 rbs

3 blks

..in game 7

That's a great performance in an elimination game. I think Kobe averages something like 23/5/3/44% in elimination games iirc. Maybe lower after today. Kobe: coming up big when it matters most. :D

[Peter Griffin]

:oldlol: I ****s with Gasol and all, but he aint seeing Tim, Shaq, Yao or Al Jeff in the post. Those guys can score over anyone, physical or not. All you have to do is get physical with Pau and his game disappears.Funny, we wasn't hearing this talk when he played in Memphis, ah yes, i see. This topic has more to do with "how much help Kobe has" then anything. Then have the nerve to Say that Luke Walton is underrated? Really? :roll:

This is a wise man!

[bleedinpurpleTwo]

Gasol is certainly a good offensive player in the post. AND has a decent shot from 12 to 15.

BUT

He is a HORRIBLE post defender. The guy was getting posted, regularly, by 6'8" Carl Landry. and by Scola. Before Yao went down, Gasol was getting burned by him, too,...at both ends.

I would take TD's post play over Gasol any day.
I would trade Gasol for a number of post players.

[Sir Charles]

Yao shoots 55% and is the number 1 option on his team's offense.

Exactly why Kobe needs to shoot less and sorround the whole offense to Gasol whom can also pass and game create for him and others. Kobe is more like a streak shooter than a consitant scorer: Dantley, Jordan, Barkey, Malone...he is more like Bird with ofcoruse NOT EVEN CLOSE to the GAME CREATION and PASSING ABILITIES..

*Phil must realise Kobe aint no Jordan and stop this Triangle Offense Carp...He Aint Jordan.!..Triangle OFfense works = when that SG is an Unstoppable Driving Forcing (which Bryant isn`t compared to Jordan) that forces double-triple teaming and you have a Point-Forward (Pippen,Hill,Bird,Lebron, Pierece etc)

They need to do what Stockton did with Malone...Gasol and Kobe need to be a 1 to punch (they must learn to live off each other) but that will be more possible when they get a more stable center than Bynum (hopefully he will get better as time passes and can play there more minutes)

Bryants FGAs per game should be around 16-18 at most and Gasols should reach the 20 mark per game

Bryant needs to lower his scoring FGAs wise and become more of an assiter but i don`t think he can do it: its not natural for him like it is for Wade to game create (it wasn`t for Jordan either at 1st but with alot of effort he changed) but he has to give it more of an effort and stop falling in love with himselfs offensive skills and jumpers ohhh my 81 pts on 40 FGAs from the perimeter :rolleyes:

If he could do that then he could become a top 15-20 Player of All Time which i don`t think he can: top 20-25 at best!

Anyhow i`ve been saying this like a year back:

Gasol = Today`s Kevin McHale..

[F.Sanford]

Exactly why Kobe needs to shoot less and sorround the whole offense to Gasol whom can also pass and game create for him and others. Kobe is more like a streak shooter than a consitant scorer: Dantley, Jordan, Barkey, Malone...he is more like Bird with ofcoruse NOT EVEN CLOSE to the GAME CREATION and PASSING ABILITIES..

*Phil must realise Kobe aint no Jordan and stop this Triangle Offense Carp...He Aint Jordan.!..Triangle OFfense works = when that SG is an Unstoppable Driving Forcing (which Bryant isn`t compared to Jordan) that forces double-triple teaming and you have a Point-Forward (Pippen,Hill,Bird,Lebron, Pierece etc)

They need to do what Stockton did with Malone...Gasol and Kobe need to be a 1 to punch (they must learn to live off each other) but that will be more possible when they get a more stable center than Bynum (hopefully he will get better as time passes and can play there more minutes)

Bryants FGAs per game should be around 16-18 at most and Gasols should reach the 20 mark per game

Bryant needs to lower his scoring FGAs wise and become more of an assiter but i don`t think he can do it: its not natural for him like it is for Wade to game create (it wasn`t for Jordan either at 1st but with alot of effort he changed) but he has to give it more of an effort and stop falling in love with himselfs offensive skills and jumpers ohhh my 81 pts on 40 FGAs from the perimeter :rolleyes:

If he could do that then he could become a top 15-20 Player of All Time which i don`t think he can: top 20-25 at best!

Anyhow i`ve been saying this like a year back:

Gasol = Today`s Kevin McHale..

BOLD IS HARD TO READ WHEN IT'S MORE THAN A SENTENCE OR TWO

Hope you didn't say anything important in there...

[Younggrease]

Gasol = Today`s Kevin McHale..[/B]

As the TNT crew would say...

"Kevin McHale is rolling over in his grave"