LMAO at Van Gundy saying Scottie Pippen is not a Hall of Famer

[PleezeBelieve]

:roll:

[TMT]

He said it's a decade later and he may no longer be a top 50 player all-time. Not saying I agree with him, just properly quoting his statement.

[oh the horror]

Yeah, Van Gundy is losing his damn mind on that one.

[juju151111]

:roll:
Even tho i don't agree with you on many things this is true. JVG took crack before this game.

[iTruWarrior]

He just added Kobe and LeBron over Pippen and Jordan. :no:

[Floppy]

Such a tool

[Indian guy]

He just added Kobe and LeBron over Pippen and Jordan. :no:

I believe he said he'd take them in a 2-on-2 game. I agree.

[iTruWarrior]

I believe he said he'd take them in a 2-on-2 game. I agree.
:oldlol: I'll take a guess and say you didn't watch either play.

Even with no hand checks, Jordan and Pippen would win.

[juju151111]

He just added Kobe and LeBron over Pippen and Jordan. :no:
He trying to downgrade pippen.lol That guy a idiot.

[PleezeBelieve]

:oldlol: I'll take a guess and say you didn't watch either play.

Even with no hand checks, Jordan and Pippen would win.
:rolleyes:

[JayGuevara]

I believe he said he'd take them in a 2-on-2 game. I agree.

I just don't know how I feel about that sentiment. I kinda wished when they said it I had Tivo so I could rewind it like, "Wait, what the ****?" to verify the statement.

[Indian guy]

:oldlol: I'll take a guess and say you didn't watch either play.

Umm, you'd be very wrong then.

[Floppy]

I believe he said he'd take them in a 2-on-2 game. I agree.

Why ?

Jordan and Pippen were better defenders.

[White Chocolate]

Was he actually serious?

[Floppy]

Was he actually serious?

yes :banghead:

[dafunkphenom]

Kobe and Lebron would win just because you can't compare today's athleticism with the early 90's. Back then a 6'9 260lbs man would be a lumbering Power Forward. They never scene any guy that size like Lebron. Face it, athletes have progressed alot in the last 15 years.

Put it this way, Lebron is the size of Karl Malone. Compare the athletic differences. Just the speed difference alone is shocking.

[Jordandunk23]

As years go by are people really starting to forget more and more of how phenomenal Michael Jordan and Scottie Pippen were?!.. are people that brainwashed by today's media hype over todays players??

its a scary thought 10 years from now on how underrated jordan and pippen would be on boards!

[darabzarrabi]

he said he wasn't sure if Pippen was a Hall of Famer...and to those of you who think you know more about basketball than him, get off mount pious.

[Indian guy]

Why ?

Jordan and Pippen were better defenders.

As a defender you can only do so much 1-on-1 against an elite offensive player. The guy with the ball will have his way most of the time. Especially with no help D involved. I'm picking Kobe/LeBron because you have 1 of the 3 greatest offensive playres of ALL TIME in Kobe, and another great scorer in LeBron. In MJ and Pippen you have the GOAT, and merely a good scorer in Pip. MJ/Pip's defensive edge isn't enough to overcome Kobe/LeBron's offensive edge. And it's not like Kobe/LeBron aren't very good defensively themselves.

[juju151111]

Kobe and Lebron would win just because you can't compare today's athleticism with the early 90's. Back then a 6'9 260lbs man would be a lumbering Power Forward. They never scene any guy that size like Lebron. Face it, athletes have progressed alot in the last 15 years.

Put it this way, Lebron is the size of Karl Malone. Compare the athletic differences. Just the speed difference alone is shocking.
I would put scottie on on him.

[White Chocolate]

yes :banghead:


Damn boy has lost his mind. You could tell by those giant bags under his eyes.

[Lebron23]

Kobe and Lebron would win just because you can't compare today's athleticism with the early 90's. Back then a 6'9 260lbs man would be a lumbering Power Forward. They never scene any guy that size like Lebron. Face it, athletes have progressed alot in the last 15 years.

Put it this way, Lebron is the size of Karl Malone. Compare the athletic differences. Just the speed difference alone is shocking.


Repped. :cheers:


And Scottie Pippen is a HOF because he's the greatest SF Defender in NBA History.

[bruceblitz]

Even worse yet, Van Gundy and Mark Jackson went on to claim that Kobe and LeBron could beat Pippen and Jordan in a 2 on 2 game.

Now first of all is that even a fair comparison? Hell no it isn't.

Take 2 different players from 2 different teams and compare them to 2 guys who were drafted by the same team. Just another way of trying to bury the Jordan legacy.

**** NBA announcers.

**** em.

How about this one? Jordan and Hakeem against any 2 players from this era you want to line up. Yeah, I like that comparison.

[Floppy]

Kobe and Lebron would win just because you can't compare today's athleticism with the early 90's. Back then a 6'9 260lbs man would be a lumbering Power Forward. They never scene any guy that size like Lebron. Face it, athletes have progressed alot in the last 15 years.

Put it this way, Lebron is the size of Karl Malone. Compare the athletic differences. Just the speed difference alone is shocking.

Rofl Lebron is not the size of Malone!

http://static.livesteez.com/img/admin/news/1209656376.jpg

The only thing that's improved in the last 15 years is doping.

[GOBB]

I thought when Mark Jackson asked him "Answer the question yes or no" his point was "I dont know". When Mark Jackson mentioned that he was selected as one of the 50 greatest players he implied that there were people who were voted he didnt agree with. Ontop of the fact that todays players some of them would make it so you gotta take out/add. For example Bron James would make it thus you must now take one off.

I didnt hear him say Pippen was not moreso that he didnt know. Mark Jackson said he was a lock, no debate.

[dafunkphenom]

Rofl Lebron is not the size of Malone!

The only thing that's improved in the last 15 years is doping.
Yes he is, They are both around 6'9 260lbs. That's how insane Lebron's athleticism is.

[dnyk1337]

MJ would beat Kobe and LeBron alone in a 2v1. You don't take God's name in vain kids. When people mention the basketball Gods, they mean MJ with minor roles by Magic/Bird/Kareem.

[oh the horror]

Kobe and Lebron would win just because you can't compare today's athleticism with the early 90's. Back then a 6'9 260lbs man would be a lumbering Power Forward. They never scene any guy that size like Lebron. Face it, athletes have progressed alot in the last 15 years.

Put it this way, Lebron is the size of Karl Malone. Compare the athletic differences. Just the speed difference alone is shocking.



Okay people do you see where this "era vs era" talk has gotten us?


We cant compare todays athleticism with the early 90s?????????


COME ON PEOPLE IT WASNT THAT GOD DAMN LONG AGO!

[bruceblitz]

Why are you people so damn stupid when comparing eras?

OK, SO IF YOU ARE THE TYPE OF FAN WHO THINKS PLAYERS TODAY ARE BIGGER FASTER STRONGER. THAT MEANS THEY WERE BORN LATER THAN THE PLAYERS OF OLD? AM I CORRECT?

SO, FOLLOW ME HERE, THE LEAGUE'S TALLEST YEAR FOR AVERAGE HEIGHT WAS IN 1987.
You can see the statistics right here on the bottom left of this link:
http://www.nba.com/news/survey_2007.html

Players weigh more now.

SO, IF YOU ARE ONE OF THOSE THAT THINKS PLAYERS TODAY ARE STRONGER AND FASTER, THAT MEANS IF PLAYERS FROM THE OLD SCHOOL WERE BORN AT THE SAME TIME AS PLAYERS TODAY, THEY WOULD BE BIGGER, FASTER, AND STRONGER TOO, AM I NOT CORRECT?

Discrediting the players of the old school is retarded.

Imagine Jerry West with the athleticism of a Brent Barry(in his prime)

Get the **** out of here with this bull ****.

Jordan and Pippen would school those two.

Also, quit acting like the athletes of Jordan's era were bums.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8uc465y2tl4

YOU ARE PATHETIC LOW IQ FANS WHO THINK THE WAY YOU DO ABOUT THE OLD SCHOOL.
http://2.bp.blogspot.com/_LuWNwQ8bVQ8/SJf5y6pZCaI/AAAAAAAADAI/_HoSSxfJ55Q/s320/way-to-use-your-head.jpg
USE YOUR HEAD!

[dafunkphenom]

[QUOTE=bruceblitz]Why are you people so damn stupid when comparing eras?

OK, SO IF YOU ARE THE TYPE OF FAN WHO THINKS PLAYERS TODAY ARE BIGGER FASTER STRONGER. THAT MEANS THEY WERE BORN LATER THAN THE PLAYERS OF OLD? AM I CORRECT?

SO, FOLLOW ME HERE, THE LEAGUE'S TALLEST YEAR FOR AVERAGE HEIGHT WAS IN 1987.
You can see the statistics right here on the bottom left of this link:
http://www.nba.com/news/survey_2007.html

You're an idiot if you think player's athleticism hasn't gotten better over time.

[GOBB]

Even worse yet, Van Gundy and Mark Jackson went on to claim that Kobe and LeBron could beat Pippen and Jordan in a 2 on 2 game..

Nothing wrong said. Just because you dont agree doesnt mean its stupid. I dont agree those two would win in a game of 2 on 2 but it would be an intriguing matchup and I'd pay $$$$ to watch it. Why do fans get bent out of shape when thier favorite players or players they hold high in the bball clouds are challenged? I dont agree with Mark or Jeff much but this isnt something to get your panties in a bunch.

2 on 2 is different from an actual 5 on 5 bball game. Not much help defense when you have just 2 players. Very nice matchup. And someone predicting the outcome doesnt damage, smear or hurt MJ's lagacy. His legacy wasnt established by playing 2 on 2 or in dream matchups. Fans act like its a cardinal sin of some sort. Fantasy matchup, we all have them. I'd love to see Wilt vs Shaq. But me predicting a winner would hurt either legacy to the game of bball? No. Its sorta like barbershop talk.

[bruceblitz]

[QUOTE=bruceblitz]Why are you people so damn stupid when comparing eras?

OK, SO IF YOU ARE THE TYPE OF FAN WHO THINKS PLAYERS TODAY ARE BIGGER FASTER STRONGER. THAT MEANS THEY WERE BORN LATER THAN THE PLAYERS OF OLD? AM I CORRECT?

SO, FOLLOW ME HERE, THE LEAGUE'S TALLEST YEAR FOR AVERAGE HEIGHT WAS IN 1987.
You can see the statistics right here on the bottom left of this link:
http://www.nba.com/news/survey_2007.html

You're an idiot if you think player's athleticism hasn't gotten better over time.

Reading and comprehension. YOU LACK IT!
http://3.bp.blogspot.com/_sVfuPBgdLI0/SHPHCNI5oEI/AAAAAAAAAcs/q7fMULnmW1E/s400/reading+comprehension.jpg

[OneMoreSucka]

he said he wasn't sure if Pippen was a Hall of Famer...and to those of you who think you know more about basketball than him, get off mount pious.
This. It's a shame everyone here makes such rash decisions.

[bruceblitz]

Why are you people so damn stupid when comparing eras?

OK, SO IF YOU ARE THE TYPE OF FAN WHO THINKS PLAYERS TODAY ARE BIGGER FASTER STRONGER. THAT MEANS THEY WERE BORN LATER THAN THE PLAYERS OF OLD? AM I CORRECT?

SO, FOLLOW ME HERE, THE LEAGUE'S TALLEST YEAR FOR AVERAGE HEIGHT WAS IN 1987.
You can see the statistics right here on the bottom left of this link:
http://www.nba.com/news/survey_2007.html

Players weigh more now.

SO, IF YOU ARE ONE OF THOSE THAT THINKS PLAYERS TODAY ARE STRONGER AND FASTER, THAT MEANS IF PLAYERS FROM THE OLD SCHOOL WERE BORN AT THE SAME TIME AS PLAYERS TODAY, THEY WOULD BE BIGGER, FASTER, AND STRONGER TOO, AM I NOT CORRECT?

Discrediting the players of the old school is retarded.

Imagine Jerry West with the athleticism of a Brent Barry(in his prime)

Get the **** out of here with this bull ****.

Jordan and Pippen would school those two.

Also, quit acting like the athletes of Jordan's era were bums.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8uc465y2tl4

YOU ARE PATHETIC LOW IQ FANS WHO THINK THE WAY YOU DO ABOUT THE OLD SCHOOL.
http://2.bp.blogspot.com/_LuWNwQ8bVQ8/SJf5y6pZCaI/AAAAAAAADAI/_HoSSxfJ55Q/s320/way-to-use-your-head.jpg
USE YOUR HEAD!

Once again, if players of "yesteryear", including the John Havlicek's of the world, were born today, they would have the same athletic advantages as players today you nimrods.

It's simple friggin logic.

If you think this current era is so much more athletic, that means players like Jordan would be even MORE ATHLETIC if they were born the same year as a LeBron James. Holy freaking chode batman these sports fans don't know how to use logic.

[iTruWarrior]

Question BruceBlitz, where would you rank Scottie Pippen of SF's of all-time.

[oh the horror]

Well, given Van Gundy's recent comments. I'd say that a lot of people here do in fact know MORE about basketball than him.

[juju151111]

[QUOTE=bruceblitz]Why are you people so damn stupid when comparing eras?

OK, SO IF YOU ARE THE TYPE OF FAN WHO THINKS PLAYERS TODAY ARE BIGGER FASTER STRONGER. THAT MEANS THEY WERE BORN LATER THAN THE PLAYERS OF OLD? AM I CORRECT?

SO, FOLLOW ME HERE, THE LEAGUE'S TALLEST YEAR FOR AVERAGE HEIGHT WAS IN 1987.
You can see the statistics right here on the bottom left of this link:
http://www.nba.com/news/survey_2007.html

You're an idiot if you think player's athleticism hasn't gotten better over time.
Watch the dunk video Bruce made. DR.j jumps from FT line with someone contesting him with no effort.

[oh the horror]

Its getting to the point where that era vs era argument in 10 years is going to completely discredit Jordan, because his era was completely weak.


Then....we'll go ahead and discredit Lebron, because his era was completely weak compared to the era in 2030....and so on and so forth.



Its a ridiculous argument.

[dafunkphenom]

Once again, if players of "yesteryear", including the John Havlicek's of the world, were born today, they would have the same athletic advantages as players today you nimrods.

It's simple friggin logic.

If you think this current era is so much more athletic, that means players like Jordan would be even MORE ATHLETIC if they were born the same year as a LeBron James. Holy freaking chode batman these sports fans don't know how to use logic.

Training and nutrition have made leaps and bounds in the last few decades. That's why records keep getting broken and people get bigger and more athletic in pretty much every sport out there. That's why the league never had a guy like Lebron 30 years ago.

[Juges8932]

Yeah, I was like :roll: to that. I still like that trio for commentary. I find them entertaining. As for Kobe/LBJ vs MJ/Pip, tough call. MJ/Pip played sooooo much with each other that their chemistry would be better probably.

[iTruWarrior]

Sometimes I want to know whether the guys on ESPN really think LeBron is that good, or they were paid to support and promote LeBron James.

[branslowski]

This isnt a game of accolades and legacy...2 on 2, no help D in the paint, and 1on1 type player in Kobe, and a Freak in LeBron James?...Kobe=6-5 215, LeBron=6-9 260, and has speed, who would gaurd LeBron? Pippen?..And as a 1on1 player, Kobe wouldn't be denied...not saying MJ wouldn't stop him a few times, but for the most part Kobe would score a few....LeBron would gaurd MJ, and since its a street ball 2 on 2, LeBron's power and muscle, would be able to stick with MJ...and Kobe would do an ok Job on Pippen...

This is an opinion...I take Kobe and LeBron...FYI..Opinions, doesn't mean you can turn your own opinion into a fact...

[bruceblitz]

Question BruceBlitz, where would you rank Scottie Pippen of SF's of all-time.

No particular order:
Larry Bird
Julius Erving
John Havlicek
Scottie Pippen
Dominique Wilkins
Elgin Baylor
Rick Barry
Connie Hawkins
Paul Arizin
Billy Cunningham
James Worthy
Alex English
Bernard King
Chris Mullin
Adrian Dantley
LeBron James
Dale Ellis
Glen Rice

Where would I rank Pippen? Somewhere on that list. Probably top 5. You put me on the spot there but those are some of the best players I can think of off the top of my head to play the small forward position. I'm sure I'm missing a few. That's a deep roster.

[bruceblitz]

Training and nutrition have made leaps and bounds in the last few decades. That's why records keep getting broken and people get bigger and more athletic in pretty much every sport out there. That's why the league never had a guy like Lebron 30 years ago.
Clearly you aren't comprehending what I said. I give up, you are dumb.

[dafunkphenom]

Its getting to the point where that era vs era argument in 10 years is going to completely discredit Jordan, because his era was completely weak.


Then....we'll go ahead and discredit Lebron, because his era was completely weak compared to the era in 2030....and so on and so forth.



Its a ridiculous argument.

I'm not discrediting Jordan's career. He is the GOAT! I'm just saying you can't compare ages and decades in a "If they were to play now" circumstance. I've been an avid hoops guy since 1992 and you can't even compare '92 to now.

[Floppy]

Yes he is, They are both around 6'9 260lbs. That's how insane Lebron's athleticism is.

course he is


http://cctvimedia.clearchannel.com/ktvx/malone.jpg

http://coedmagazine.files.wordpress.com/2008/11/lebron-james-yankees-game-8.jpg

[oh the horror]

The fact is, players look different now, but the reality is, they arent any bigger, or leaner than they were 10-15 years ago. Thats the funny part about it.

[bruceblitz]

This isnt a game of accolades and legacy...2 on 2, no help D in the paint, and 1on1 type player in Kobe, and a Freak in LeBron James?...Kobe=6-5 215, LeBron=6-9 260, and has speed, who would gaurd LeBron? Pippen?..And as a 1on1 player, Kobe wouldn't be denied...not saying MJ wouldn't stop him a few times, but for the most part Kobe would score a few....LeBron would gaurd MJ, and since its a street ball 2 on 2, LeBron's power and muscle, would be able to stick with MJ...and Kobe would do an ok Job on Pippen...

This is an opinion...I take Kobe and LeBron...FYI..Opinions, doesn't mean you can turn your own opinion into a fact...

They play to 21, let's say players today are a little bigger and more athletic, which the margin of difference is small. Pippen and Jordan both get an added 10-15 lbs, Pippen and Jordan show you why they won 6 championships, use their teamwork together to school the two new school cats. Pippen defends LeBron, locks him up and forces him to shoot jumpers. Jordan just shows Kobe what's up, takes Kobe in the post and abuses him.

Jordan and Pippen: 21
Kobe and LeBron: 17

Don't rain on the old school with piss.

[32jazz]

As years go by are people really starting to forget more and more of how phenomenal Michael Jordan and Scottie Pippen were?!.. are people that brainwashed by today's media hype over todays players??

its a scary thought 10 years from now on how underrated jordan and pippen would be on boards!
:violin:
No different than people forgetting how dominant & phenomenal Oscar Roberston, Wilt Chamberlain ,Kareem,etc....were. Maybe when someone foolishly attempts to trash players of another era(simply because they played in a certain era) fanboys of their washed up heroes(like Pippen/MJ) will take this into consideration.:confusedshrug:

Elvin Hayes was an NBA all star in 60's ,70's & 80's (so was Kareem technically),but you have some here who really believe those players couldn't play today:rolleyes:

[bruceblitz]

Why are you people so damn stupid when comparing eras?

OK, SO IF YOU ARE THE TYPE OF FAN WHO THINKS PLAYERS TODAY ARE BIGGER FASTER STRONGER. THAT MEANS THEY WERE BORN LATER THAN THE PLAYERS OF OLD? AM I CORRECT?

SO, FOLLOW ME HERE, THE LEAGUE'S TALLEST YEAR FOR AVERAGE HEIGHT WAS IN 1987.
You can see the statistics right here on the bottom left of this link:
http://www.nba.com/news/survey_2007.html

Players weigh more now.

SO, IF YOU ARE ONE OF THOSE THAT THINKS PLAYERS TODAY ARE STRONGER AND FASTER, THAT MEANS IF PLAYERS FROM THE OLD SCHOOL WERE BORN AT THE SAME TIME AS PLAYERS TODAY, THEY WOULD BE BIGGER, FASTER, AND STRONGER TOO, AM I NOT CORRECT?

Discrediting the players of the old school is retarded.

Imagine Jerry West with the athleticism of a Brent Barry(in his prime)

Get the **** out of here with this bull ****.

Jordan and Pippen would school those two.

Also, quit acting like the athletes of Jordan's era were bums.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8uc465y2tl4

YOU ARE PATHETIC LOW IQ FANS WHO THINK THE WAY YOU DO ABOUT THE OLD SCHOOL.
http://2.bp.blogspot.com/_LuWNwQ8bVQ8/SJf5y6pZCaI/AAAAAAAADAI/_HoSSxfJ55Q/s320/way-to-use-your-head.jpg
USE YOUR HEAD!

This quote sums up player comparisons cross eras.

[White Chocolate]

course he is


http://cctvimedia.clearchannel.com/ktvx/malone.jpg

http://coedmagazine.files.wordpress.com/2008/11/lebron-james-yankees-game-8.jpg


Not everyone has the same bone structure. LeBron probably has a larger bone structure, so he can carry more weight and still look lean. Malone's bone structure is probably smaller, but he has more muscle mass.

[bruceblitz]

course he is


http://coedmagazine.files.wordpress.com/2008/11/lebron-james-yankees-game-8.jpg

This is who I would put on LeBron prime vs prime, cross eras:
http://hoopedia.nba.com/images/5/5c/Larry-Johnson.jpg

[oh the horror]

I think the media plays a huge part in undermining players from the past in order to sell on the hype of players of today.


Players for the most part dont earn mega-star status as much as they're handed it, in order to sell sell sell...


Media market, and sneaker deals are in frenzy these days in this business first league where players make millions, and their agents make even more, and their franchises depened on their overly hyped legacies.


I mean look at players like Oden....sitting down with Legends before his career even began? Wtf was that?


His hype was LEGENDARY, and thus far, hes trying to live up to it, but it was an OBVIOUS thing to get people to BUY BUY BUY his merchandise.


I see more and more of this overboard hype around the league.


We are in the era of the created "legend"


Get your tshirt today, only for 19.99!

[juju151111]

Training and nutrition have made leaps and bounds in the last few decades. That's why records keep getting broken and people get bigger and more athletic in pretty much every sport out there. That's why the league never had a guy like Lebron 30 years ago.
Shawn Kemp and where is your Hakeem the dream of this era?? I seen everything being done know by players in the late 70s to the late 90s.

[Duncan21formvp]

Pippen is the most overrated player ever.

[branslowski]

They play to 21, let's say players today are a little bigger and more athletic, which the margin of difference is small. Pippen and Jordan both get an added 10-15 lbs, Pippen and Jordan show you why they won 6 championships, use their teamwork together to school the two new school cats. Pippen defends LeBron, locks him up and forces him to shoot jumpers. Jordan just shows Kobe what's up, takes Kobe in the post and abuses him.

Jordan and Pippen: 21
Kobe and LeBron: 17

Don't rain on the old school with piss.

No one's raining on old-school with piss..lol...Its called giving an opinion on who I think would win..I say:

Kobe and Bron:21
Jordan and Pippen:19

Just because Im giving an opinion on who I think would win, doesnt mean im ****ting on the old-school..you wouldn't say your pissing on the current era with your opinion, so why would it be me pissing on old-school if I give my honest opinion?...These things are up for debate, none are facts. Two different opinions, doesnt mean anyone is "disrespecting" anyone...

[iTruWarrior]

Omfg Jvg Just Said Lebron Is The Most Improved Player

[oh the horror]

Omfg Jvg Just Said Lebron Is The Most Improved Player


Whaaaaaaat? LOL Dude i think youre right, sometimes i feel like they're PAID to say these things.

[White Chocolate]

Omfg Jvg Just Said Lebron Is The Most Improved Player


He's lost it.

[bruceblitz]

No one's raining on old-school with piss..lol...Its called giving an opinion on who I think would win..I say:

Kobe and Bron:21
Jordan and Pippen:19

Just because Im giving an opinion on who I think would win, doesnt mean im ****ting on the old-school..you wouldn't say your pissing on the current era with your opinion, so why would it be me pissing on old-school if I give my honest opinion?...These things are up for debate, none are facts. Two different opinions, doesnt mean anyone is "disrespecting" anyone...

You are taking 2 guys who have never led teams to championships, and you are saying they would beat the greatest of all time and his sidekick from the 6 championships. That's the dumbest bunch of crap I've ever read. You also didn't watch basketball when the Bulls were dominating so I'll just take your OPINION with a grain of salt and leave it alone.

[Toizumi]

Pippen is the most overrated player ever.


:banghead:

[juju151111]

The fact is, players look different now, but the reality is, they arent any bigger, or leaner than they were 10-15 years ago. Thats the funny part about it.
True, but adding wieght doesn't make you more athletic. The whole league started major weight training in the early 90s. Go look at 80s pip,MJ,drod,etc.. to how they looked in the 90s.

[bruceblitz]

Look at all the nights that LeBron and Kobe have gone into the tank scoring, look at all of those nights compared to how few nights Jordan went into the tank scoring, and you are gonna put those two guys up against Jordan and his sidekick from 6 championships. That makes a hell of a lot of sense. 2 guys who only played together for 1 summer would beat 2 guys who won 6 championships together and played together for over a decade. **** this ****

[dafunkphenom]

Shawn Kemp and where is your Hakeem the dream of this era?? I seen everything being done know by players in the late 70s to the late 90s.
I'm not saying there were no athletic freaks back in the 90's. But player to player, today's athletes are a fair amount more athletic.

[Floppy]

Whaaaaaaat? LOL Dude i think youre right, sometimes i feel like they're PAID to say these things.

I'm pretty sure they are.

[indiefan23]

Kobe and Lebron would win just because you can't compare today's athleticism with the early 90's. Back then a 6'9 260lbs man would be a lumbering Power Forward. They never scene any guy that size like Lebron. Face it, athletes have progressed alot in the last 15 years.

Put it this way, Lebron is the size of Karl Malone. Compare the athletic differences. Just the speed difference alone is shocking.

Bron is amazing but Olajuwon was not lumbering. Neither was Rodman or David Robinson. At all. Don't compare him to Malone though. Christ, Malone.

Secondly, Lebron has really taken advantage of the rule changes to allow exactly his kind of slashing scoring. But there's no way they take Jordan and Pippen. Both Kobe and Bron are much lesser defenders and neither has Jordan's post-up OR mid-range game. Enough has not changed yet for the athleticism argument to be valid. At all. Up until a couple years ago the league was massively watered down compared to the 90's. Its great to see it coming back now.

Theres a Bill Russel thread on here though if you want to see your argument working in full effect. ;0 its ridiculous.

[bruceblitz]

I'm not saying there were no athletic freaks back in the 90's. But player to player, today's athletes are a fair amount more athletic.
Once again, your low IQ fails you again. So by your own way of looking at it, players of the old school would be more athletic if they were born at the same time as players today. About the 3rd or 4th time I've tried to get this guy to comprehend this.

[iTruWarrior]

According to ESPN

MVP: LeBron
ROY: LeBron
EOY: LeBron
MIP: LeBron
COY: LeBron
6th man: LeBron
Greatest Person: LeBron
Most Awesome: LeBron

[branslowski]

You are taking 2 guys who have never led teams to championships, and you are saying they would beat the greatest of all time and his sidekick from the 6 championships. That's the dumbest bunch of crap I've ever read. You also didn't watch basketball when the Bulls were dominating so I'll just take your OPINION with a grain of salt and leave it alone.

WTF does championships have to do with a streetball 2 on 2 basketball game?

Im Not saying LeBron and Kobe are the NBA GOAT players, and talking about a regular game of 2 on 2...At the end of the day...The **** wont happen, and opinion's are being argued...

[oh the horror]

According to ESPN

MVP: LeBron
ROY: LeBron
EOY: LeBron
MIP: LeBron
COY: LeBron
6th man: LeBron
Greatest Person: LeBron
Most Awesome: LeBron


And last but not least, LEBRON IN 2012!

[bruceblitz]

WTF does championships have to do with a streetball 2 on 2 basketball game?

Im Not saying LeBron and Kobe are the NBA GOAT players, and talking about a regular game of 2 on 2...At the end of the day...The **** wont happen, and opinion's are being argued...

Oh what would playing together for over a decade, being considered the best tandem in basketball history, and the fact that you were such a great tandem led your team to 6 championships, who gives a crap about that? I mean what the hell good would it do to remember how dominant they were together as a duo and how many times the two of them worked together to defeat entire 5 man teams while the rest of the Bulls stood there on the perimeter and watched? I mean what good would that do? What type of chemistry would two teammates from 6 championship title runs have over 2 guys who played together on one olympic team? Oh I don't know, you tell me.

[Floppy]

I'm not saying there were no athletic freaks back in the 90's. But player to player, today's athletes are a fair amount more athletic.

As said before, putting up weight doesn't make you more athletic. Todays players certainly aren't faster than players from the 80s or early 90s.

[dafunkphenom]

Let's face it folks. Kobe and Michael would battle it out all day long backand forth. Pippen would be running in fear of Lebron James.

Sorry Pip, I got love for ya but.....

[dafunkphenom]

As said before, putting up weight doesn't make you more athletic. Todays players certainly aren't faster than players from the 80s or early 90s.
Sorry, but I disagree. Players most certainly are faster today.

[bruceblitz]

Let's face it folks. Kobe and Michael would battle it out all day long backand forth. Pippen would be running in fear of Lebron James.

Sorry Pip, I got love for ya but.....
Just take it from the man himself, Kobe is no match for Jordan you goof.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EhCR72IfEqg

[Indian guy]

Athletically this matchup is a toss-up. LeBron's edge on Pip is similar to MJ's edge on Kobe. Kobe/LeBron would still win a 2-on-2(say they play 10 times, I see 'em taking 6-7 games) because they COMBINE to be better players than MJ/Pip. Especially in a 2-on-2 with no help D and offense rules.

[bruceblitz]

Sorry, but I disagree. Players most certainly are faster today.

You certainly have the historical perspective of the NBA in check don't you know,

now = better

old = worse

You really are a thinker aren't you now?!?! Go back and read my posts again, or better yet, have your neighbor read them to you and explain what it means.

[bruceblitz]

Anyone who watched 80's ball, 90's ball, and 00's ball knows Pippen and Jordan can and would defeat any two perimeter players in the history of the game that you match up against them.

Anyone.

[oh the horror]

Im 110 percent sure that players now are not faster than players in the 90s.

[juju151111]

I'm not saying there were no athletic freaks back in the 90's. But player to player, today's athletes are a fair amount more athletic.
Watch Bruce's dunk video and please calm yourself. HE posted it two pages ago. Player by player its the same. You just forget alot of people because they were not that good. Just like Josh smith,jr smith etc.. might get forgotten because they have not done alot.

[branslowski]

Just take it from the man himself, Kobe is no match for Jordan you goof.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EhCR72IfEqg

What would the finals score be in a Kobe vs MJ 1on1?...Just a man vs a man?...

[bruceblitz]

Watch Bruce's dunk video and please calm yourself. HE posted it two pages ago. Player by player its the same. You just forget alot of people because they were not that good. Just like Josh smith,jr smith etc.. might get forgotten because they have not done alot.

You can't ask people with no perspective to change their way of thinking.

[oh the horror]

As a matter of fact, the only differences between the 90s players and now, are the length of their shorts.

[Floppy]

=)

[bruceblitz]

What would the finals score be in a Kobe vs MJ 1on1?...Just a man vs a man?...

As Jordan said, Kobe wouldn't stand a chance.

Jordan 21
Kobe 14

Jordan's defense, Jordan's ability to limit his misses... ah **** I think it would look something like this:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HvJywRV9P0w
That's not even prime Jordan.

Prime Jordan vs Kobe would look like this:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=f6WQLvRvtjs
Kobe repping Jordan's Wizard years of course.

[branslowski]

Kobe and LeBron vs Pippen and MJ=Will never happen, its no actual proof aka fact that either team would win! If you wanna turn your opinion into a fact, then so be it...:confusedshrug:

[dafunkphenom]

You certainly have the historical perspective of the NBA in check don't you know,

now = better

old = worse

You really are a thinker aren't you now?!?! Go back and read my posts again, or better yet, have your neighbor read them to you and explain what it means.

Yes genius, I am saying that. Today's era teams would "generally" beat teams from 15 years ago because of the athletic differences.

Just like how runner's from the 1980's wouldn't compete against today's faster runner.

Wayne Gretzky would not be as dominant of hockey player if you were to insert him in the game today.

I could make 2 million comparisons to explain it to you but I feel my conversation with a rock on the side of the road would be more insightful.

[branslowski]

As Jordan said, Kobe wouldn't stand a chance.

Jordan 21
Kobe 14

Jordan's defense, Jordan's ability to limit his misses... ah **** I think it would look something like this:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HvJywRV9P0w
That's not even prime Jordan.

Prime Jordan vs Kobe would look like this:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=f6WQLvRvtjs
Kobe repping Jordan's Wizard years of course.

OK.....

[gts]

Look at all the nights that LeBron and Kobe have gone into the tank scoring, look at all of those nights compared to how few nights Jordan went into the tank scoring, and you are gonna put those two guys up against Jordan and his sidekick from 6 championships. That makes a hell of a lot of sense. 2 guys who only played together for 1 summer would beat 2 guys who won 6 championships together and played together for over a decade. **** this ****what do you consider "in the tank" scoring wise less than 15 points? worse than 40% shooting?

[bruceblitz]

Yes genius, I am saying that. Today's era teams would "generally" beat teams from 15 years ago because of the athletic differences.

Just like how runner's from the 1980's wouldn't compete against today's faster runner.

Wayne Gretzky would not be as dominant of hockey player if you were to insert him in the game today.

I could make 2 million comparisons to explain it to you but I feel my conversation with a rock on the side of the road would be more insightful.

Do me a favor, get your neighbor to read what I typed and explain it to you. You clearly don't get it. Clearly.

Like I already said before, if you say players today are more athletic because of a progression of society, the same players of the past would have the same progression on their side if they were born today, chode.

[juju151111]

Sorry, but I disagree. Players most certainly are faster today.
WTF AREyou on. Where the Magic of this era???LOL where the C with SG speed in this era?? WEAK era:eek:

[juju151111]

What would the finals score be in a Kobe vs MJ 1on1?...Just a man vs a man?...
21 o 15 MJ.

[juju151111]

Yes genius, I am saying that. Today's era teams would "generally" beat teams from 15 years ago because of the athletic differences.

Just like how runner's from the 1980's wouldn't compete against today's faster runner.

Wayne Gretzky would not be as dominant of hockey player if you were to insert him in the game today.

I could make 2 million comparisons to explain it to you but I feel my conversation with a rock on the side of the road would be more insightful.
I guest Magic,MJ,dr.j,Shaq,Dream,Pippen, drod,barkley( I have yet to see someone his height pull down 13rpg), etc... will struggle against your superior players.lollllllllllllllllllll:lol

[dafunkphenom]

Do me a favor, get your neighbor to read what I typed and explain it to you. You clearly don't get it. Clearly.

Like I already said before, if you say players today are more athletic because of a progression of society, the same players of the past would have the same progression on their side if they were born today, chode.

I can only go by comparing era's by their play of the day. You can't say the 80's players would be that much better if you were to give them imaginary enhancement.

I can only speak from the standpoint of the level of ball that we actually saw or are presently seeing being played. That's why I generally don't compare era's because it is a mute point.

That being said, on a team to team basis I still haven't seen a team that I could say would definitely beat the 72 - 10 Bulls.

[bruceblitz]

I can only go by comparing era's by their play of the day. I can't say the 80's players would be that much better if you were to give them imaginary enhancement.



You know why you can't? Because you lack logic. I'm just calling it how I see it, I'm not trying to be mean.

[stephanieg]

The funny thing is there are a lot of really bad basketball players in the HOF who are there because they played on teams which won a bunch of titles. So Pippen should pretty much automatically be a HOFer by these standards, even if you don't think he's that good compared to his peers.

[bruceblitz]

Why are you people so damn stupid when comparing eras?

OK, SO IF YOU ARE THE TYPE OF FAN WHO THINKS PLAYERS TODAY ARE BIGGER FASTER STRONGER. THAT MEANS THEY WERE BORN LATER THAN THE PLAYERS OF OLD? AM I CORRECT?

SO, FOLLOW ME HERE, THE LEAGUE'S TALLEST YEAR FOR AVERAGE HEIGHT WAS IN 1987.
You can see the statistics right here on the bottom left of this link:
http://www.nba.com/news/survey_2007.html

Players weigh more now.

SO, IF YOU ARE ONE OF THOSE THAT THINKS PLAYERS TODAY ARE STRONGER AND FASTER, THAT MEANS IF PLAYERS FROM THE OLD SCHOOL WERE BORN AT THE SAME TIME AS PLAYERS TODAY, THEY WOULD BE BIGGER, FASTER, AND STRONGER TOO, AM I NOT CORRECT?

Discrediting the players of the old school is retarded.

Imagine Jerry West with the athleticism of a Brent Barry(in his prime)

Get the **** out of here with this bull ****.

Jordan and Pippen would school those two.

Also, quit acting like the athletes of Jordan's era were bums.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8uc465y2tl4

YOU ARE PATHETIC LOW IQ FANS WHO THINK THE WAY YOU DO ABOUT THE OLD SCHOOL.
http://2.bp.blogspot.com/_LuWNwQ8bVQ8/SJf5y6pZCaI/AAAAAAAADAI/_HoSSxfJ55Q/s320/way-to-use-your-head.jpg
USE YOUR HEAD!

^^^No matter what anyone else posts, this was the most logical post of the thread^^^

You won't ever see me say that Oscar Robertson couldn't have put up a triple double in the Jordan era because if you gave Oscar Robertson-Len Bias's athleticism, he would have done the same thing in Jordan's era he did in his own. Maybe even more.

[GOBB]

I think the media plays a huge part in undermining players from the past in order to sell on the hype of players of today.


Players for the most part dont earn mega-star status as much as they're handed it, in order to sell sell sell...


Media market, and sneaker deals are in frenzy these days in this business first league where players make millions, and their agents make even more, and their franchises depened on their overly hyped legacies.


I mean look at players like Oden....sitting down with Legends before his career even began? Wtf was that?


His hype was LEGENDARY, and thus far, hes trying to live up to it, but it was an OBVIOUS thing to get people to BUY BUY BUY his merchandise.


I see more and more of this overboard hype around the league.


We are in the era of the created "legend"


Get your tshirt today, only for 19.99!

Yeah because the MJ hype didnt start until the Bulls won that 3rd title and he decided to play minor league baseball where he stunk ass. :rolleyes:

[dafunkphenom]

You know why you can't? Because you lack logic. I'm just calling it how I see it, I'm not trying to be mean.
I just go by the fact I have watched over 80 NBA games a year since 92, I'm not a homer of any team, and have made alot of money on this game. I have trust in my basketball IQ.

[bruceblitz]

Yeah because the MJ hype didnt start until the Bulls won that 3rd title and he decided to play minor league baseball where he stunk ass. :rolleyes:

MJ wasn't getting hyped in High School, or college as the next big thing. If he was don't you think he would have been a #1 draft pick? Don't go there. MJ had to earn his rep. In the 80's all they talked about was Isiah, Bird and Magic were the best in the game, how do I remember you ask? Because I was actually a true NBA fan in the 80's. Nobody used the word hater in the 80's, but if we did, Jordan had a lot of haters out there. A ton.

[bruceblitz]

I just go by the fact I have watched over 80 NBA games a year since 92, I'm not a homer of any team, and have made alot of money on this game. I have trust in my basketball IQ.

Really, I was born in the 70's and have been following the game intensely since the early 80's.

[dafunkphenom]

^^^No matter what anyone else posts, this was the most logical post of the thread^^^

You won't ever see me say that Oscar Robertson couldn't have put up a triple double in the Jordan era because if you gave Oscar Robertson-Len Bias's athleticism, he would have done the same thing in Jordan's era he did in his own. Maybe even more.
Wrong!

[D-Rose]

MJ wasn't getting hyped in High School, or college as the next big thing. If he was don't you think he would have been a #1 draft pick? Don't go there. MJ had to earn his rep. In the 80's all they talked about was Isiah, Bird and Magic were the best in the game, how do I remember you ask? Because I was actually a true NBA fan in the 80's. Nobody used the word hater in the 80's, but if we did, Jordan had a lot of haters out there. A ton.
There was loads of noise about MJ in college. The mentality in the 80's was to draft big and that's why Olajuwon and Bowie went before Jordan.

[dafunkphenom]

Really, I was born in the 70's and have been following the game intensely since the early 80's.
You certainly deserve credit for this!

[bruceblitz]

There was loads of noise about MJ in college. The mentality in the 80's was to draft big and that's why Olajuwon and Bowie went before Jordan.
My point is nothing like now, just look at all of the games LeBron had in high school that we got to see. The scouts start following players in junior high now. It's much different.

Also, they give people "Jordan status" without Jordan type domination. I don't recall anyone ever saying Jordan was on Magic or Bird's level until they themselves were saying it. He had to earn his reputation. Now you get the reputation first, and next you have to live up to the hype. It's backwards now. Anyone who disagrees, you just prove to me that you are a surface fan.

[andgar923]

Let me get this straight....

Some of you are saying that the two players that rely on mostly shooting jumpers, will beat the two that have a more multi faceted offensive game?

You guys are saying that the 2 greatest defensive players at their position (all time) will lose to players that get lit up consistently?

You guys are saying that two teammates of over a dozen years, will lose to 2 players that have played with each other for 3 months?

You guys are saying, that the more mentally and fundamentally sound players, would lose to players that are known to take atrociously questionable and inconsistent shots?

You guys are saying, that because two non post up players are bigger, they'll dominate one of the top 5 greatest post up players of all time and a good one?

FACT is...... Kobe and Bron's defense are weak and specially pathetic in comparison to MJ's and Pip's.

FACT is.... Kobe couldn't stop Pip in the post, so this nonsense of Pip not being able to score is nonsense.

Sure Kobe and Bron can get hot, but that's if MJ or Pip "let" them. Bron and Kobe won't be going up against Deshawn Stevenson or Bowen. They'll be going up against the smartest and toghest defenders they'll ever face. While Bron and Kobe will be nothing to MJ and Pip.

I bet MJ called up Pip after hearing that comment, and they're ROFL at it.

Basketball is about angles, timing and speed, NOT about big and strong, unless you're a post player.... which neither of them are.

So let me think for a second here......

Hmmm..... lighter, faster, smarter, tougher (mentally) "perimeter" players vs stronger and slower "perimeter" players?

Gee.... I wonder who'll win that one?

[Juges8932]

As Jordan said, Kobe wouldn't stand a chance.

Jordan 21
Kobe 14

Jordan's defense, Jordan's ability to limit his misses... ah **** I think it would look something like this:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HvJywRV9P0w
That's not even prime Jordan.

Prime Jordan vs Kobe would look like this:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=f6WQLvRvtjs
Kobe repping Jordan's Wizard years of course.

Using a '98 ASG coverage isn't a fair/accurate representation at all.

I think Jordan would take 6/10.

As for the 2v2. I think Jordan/Pip would take it simply because of chemistry of having played together for so many years. Also depends on who is guarding who. I think Kobe/LBJ could both guard Pip solidly. I think if LBJ was guarding LBJ, he'd just face him up and beat him off the dribble. As for Kobe, I think MJ would try to post him up. I think Kobe would face up both Pip and MJ. LeBron would just barrel through one on one and take it to the cup. If LeBron and Kobe had as much time together as MJ/Pip, I think they would take it, but since they haven't, MJ/Pip 21-19.

[Lodi Dodi]

Jordan and Pippen would win on chemistry alone. And lol @ ppl who think Pippen would be scared of LeBron. This is the same person who had to guard one of the greatest athletes with an offensive arsenal that is still unmatched to this day, and he's going to be afraid of LeBron?
:lol

[32jazz]

There was loads of noise about MJ in college. The mentality in the 80's was to draft big and that's why Olajuwon and Bowie went before Jordan.

Exactly.

MJ was NCAA College player of the Year in '84 wasn't he:confusedshrug: He's trying to make it sound like the guy slipped under the radar at #3. His teams just sucked horribly is why he got less hype early on ,but Michael & the Jordanaires was outselling the Showtime Lakers & the Celtics on the road by 87/88. Yet people claim fans want to see 'excellent' team ball over the more individual. The league hype up individual players because that's what fans pay to see at the arena & the television ratings concur.

[tontoz]

Being in the top 50 is different from being in the Hall of Fame. What did Van Gundy really say?

[tontoz]

Exactly.

MJ was NCAA College player of the Year in '84 wasn't he:confusedshrug: He's trying to make it sound like the guy slipped under the radar at #3. His teams just sucked horribly is why he got less hype early on ,but Michael & the Jordanaires was outselling the Showtime Lakers & the Celtics on the road by 87/88. Yet people claim fans want to see 'excellent' team ball over the more individual. The league hype up individual players because that's what fans pay to see at the arena & the television ratings concur.


Hakeem was a consensus pick over Jordan. Watching Hakeem in college he was definitely going number 1.

[Indian guy]

Let me get this straight....

Some of you are saying that the two players that rely on mostly shooting jumpers

I stopped reading here. Hopefully so did everybody else.

[Scott Pippen]

Let me get this straight....

Some of you are saying that the two players that rely on mostly shooting jumpers, will beat the two that have a more multi faceted offensive game?

You guys are saying that the 2 greatest defensive players at their position (all time) will lose to players that get lit up consistently?

You guys are saying that two teammates of over a dozen years, will lose to 2 players that have played with each other for 3 months?

You guys are saying, that the more mentally and fundamentally sound players, would lose to players that are known to take atrociously questionable and inconsistent shots?

You guys are saying, that because two non post up players are bigger, they'll dominate one of the top 5 greatest post up players of all time and a good one?

FACT is...... Kobe and Bron's defense are weak and specially pathetic in comparison to MJ's and Pip's.

FACT is.... Kobe couldn't stop Pip in the post, so this nonsense of Pip not being able to score is nonsense.

Sure Kobe and Bron can get hot, but that's if MJ or Pip "let" them. Bron and Kobe won't be going up against Deshawn Stevenson or Bowen. They'll be going up against the smartest and toghest defenders they'll ever face. While Bron and Kobe will be nothing to MJ and Pip.

I bet MJ called up Pip after hearing that comment, and they're ROFL at it.

Basketball is about angles, timing and speed, NOT about big and strong, unless you're a post player.... which neither of them are.

So let me think for a second here......

Hmmm..... lighter, faster, smarter, tougher (mentally) "perimeter" players vs stronger and slower "perimeter" players?

Gee.... I wonder who'll win that one?

:applause:

Of course it is hard to judge the outcome of 1-1 or 2-2, but this post should end some of the exaggeration going on here in this thread. :applause:

[andgar923]

I can also bet, that the "avg" age of those that actually think Bron and Kobe would win, ranges from :

16-22

And I can almost but guarantee, that those that actually "saw" Pip and MJ play in their primes and coincidentally choose MJ and Pip are around:

27-33

[andgar923]

I stopped reading here. Hopefully so did everybody else.


Are Bron and Kobe not primarily jump shooters?

Yes or no?

[bruceblitz]

Exactly.

MJ was NCAA College player of the Year in '84 wasn't he:confusedshrug: He's trying to make it sound like the guy slipped under the radar at #3. His teams just sucked horribly is why he got less hype early on ,but Michael & the Jordanaires was outselling the Showtime Lakers & the Celtics on the road by 87/88. Yet people claim fans want to see 'excellent' team ball over the more individual. The league hype up individual players because that's what fans pay to see at the arena & the television ratings concur.

This is what I want you to listen to, because obviously you guys don't remember the way MJ was locked out of being "the best player" because he didn't have MVP's yet, didn't lead his team to championships and all the other crap they held against him that they don't against today's players.

In Jordan's era Duncan would be considered the best in the game until he did the following that he states in this video at the 9:35 mark:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Q-uWw2auvyU

Now, watch that video I created, fast forward to the 9:35 mark, and get back to me.

"before I gained any credibility I had to win championships I had to win MVP's I had to make an impact for my team..." - Jordan

[branslowski]

Bias is a two way street..

Facts are Facts...Personal opinion's are Personal opinions..

Can we all just get along?...:rolleyes:

[bruceblitz]

Bias is a two way street..

Facts are Facts...Personal opinion's are Personal opinions..

Can we all just get along?...:rolleyes:

We are getting along branslowski. As I said to the guy who doesn't understand players of the past getting a boost in athleticism of they were born today, I'm not trying to be mean. It's just annoying explaining how great players of the past were to people who have only seen a few youtube highlight videos of them.

[phoenix18]

Once again, if players of "yesteryear", including the John Havlicek's of the world, were born today, they would have the same athletic advantages as players today you nimrods.

It's simple friggin logic.

If you think this current era is so much more athletic, that means players like Jordan would be even MORE ATHLETIC if they were born the same year as a LeBron James. Holy freaking chode batman these sports fans don't know how to use logic.
:cheers:
Thank you so much for being resonable. This is what I was about to say, lucky thing I decided to read the entire thread.

[bruceblitz]

:cheers:
Thank you so much for being resonable. This is what I was about to say, lucky thing I decided to read the entire thread.

:cheers:

[GOBB]

MJ wasn't getting hyped in High School, or college as the next big thing. If he was don't you think he would have been a #1 draft pick? Don't go there. MJ had to earn his rep. In the 80's all they talked about was Isiah, Bird and Magic were the best in the game, how do I remember you ask? Because I was actually a true NBA fan in the 80's. Nobody used the word hater in the 80's, but if we did, Jordan had a lot of haters out there. A ton.

Right coming out of UNC MJ didnt have hype and expectations. After his rookie year there still was none. And his bball peers adored him. No one disliked or had a bitter taste in thier mouths towards the 360 wave spinning, gold chain dawning, flashy player. :oldlol:

This is the part in the movie Ace Ventura where you stop talkin out your ass.

I'd appreciate it. Thank you.

[White Chocolate]

Are Bron and Kobe not primarily jump shooters?

Yes or no?


Kobe is a jump shooter. LeBron is a slasher.

[bruceblitz]

Right coming out of UNC MJ didnt have hype and expectations. After his rookie year there still was none. And his bball peers adored him. No one disliked or had a bitter taste in thier mouths towards the 360 wave spinning, gold chain dawning, flashy player. :oldlol:

This is the part in the movie Ace Ventura where you stop talkin out your ass.

I'd appreciate it. Thank you.
Another one with low comprehension skills. Gotta love the frustration level of communicating online.


This is what I want you to listen to, because obviously you guys don't remember the way MJ was locked out of being "the best player" because he didn't have MVP's yet, didn't lead his team to championships and all the other crap they held against him that they don't against today's players.

In Jordan's era Duncan would be considered the best in the game until he did the following that he states in this video at the 9:35 mark:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Q-uWw2auvyU

Now, watch that video I created, fast forward to the 9:35 mark, and get back to me.

"before I gained any credibility I had to win championships I had to win MVP's I had to make an impact for my team..." - Jordan

[Indian guy]

Are Bron and Kobe not primarily jump shooters?

Are you serious?

[andgar923]

And since some of you wanna base this argument on athleticism, I can play that game too.

BOTH MJ and Pip can dunk from the ft line.

Can we say the same about the other two?

Prime MJ and Pip are faster and overall more athletic than Bron and Kobe.

[bruceblitz]

And since some of you wanna base this argument on athleticism, I can play that game too.

BOTH MJ and Pip can dunk from the ft line.

Can we say the same about the other two?

Prime MJ and Pip are faster and overall more athletic than Bron and Kobe.

Don't do that, we can't use logic!

[AirJordan23]

Are Bron and Kobe not primarily jump shooters?

Yes or no?
Bron isn't. Kobe yeah. Bron's strength is his ability to penetrate and thats the main reason his FG% is so high. He penetrates a lot more than he settles for jumpers.

[andgar923]

Are you serious?



Do Kobe and Bron take more jumpers or do they drive more?

Do they do so more than PIp and MJ?

[bruceblitz]

Do Kobe and Bron take more jumpers or do they drive more?

Do they do so more than PIp and MJ?

Why are you gonna ask people who only watch youtube highlight videos of MJ and Pip? They didn't live here in Chicago like I do and watch all of the games.

[GOBB]

Another one with low comprehension skills. Gotta love the frustration level of communicating online.

Frustrated? :oldlol: You're the kid who entered this thread butt hurt because someone picked Kobe/Bron to defeat MJ/Pippen in a fantasy game of 2 on 2. Go nose dive into a pillow kid.

[andgar923]

Bron isn't. Kobe yeah. Bron's strength is his ability to penetrate and thats the main reason his FG% is so high. He penetrates a lot more than he settles for jumpers.

I'm not saying they don't, I'm saying that they shoot more than they penetrate.

And by comparison, MJ and Pip drive alot more and have more of a mid range game than either of the two.

Pip was a good post up player and neither Bron nor Kobe would be able to stop them.

Mj can establish himself in the post far more efficiently than either Kobe or Bron ever could. He doesn't need alot of time and can basically do so from any position in the paint with ease.

Kobe's post up game relies on the right block for 90% of the time. And he's very predictable with it and doesn't establish himself as efficiently and quickly as MJ or even PIp.

Bron isn't even a post up player.

Bron's mid range game is very inconsitent and suspect.

Kobe doesn't go to it as often as he should.

And compared to MJ and Pip, there isn't much of a comparison again. MJ made a living in the mid area, and Pip is also good and more efficient than Bron.

[GOBB]

Even worse yet, Van Gundy and Mark Jackson went on to claim that Kobe and LeBron could beat Pippen and Jordan in a 2 on 2 game.

Now first of all is that even a fair comparison? Hell no it isn't.

Take 2 different players from 2 different teams and compare them to 2 guys who were drafted by the same team. Just another way of trying to bury the Jordan legacy.

**** NBA announcers.

**** em.

How about this one? Jordan and Hakeem against any 2 players from this era you want to line up. Yeah, I like that comparison.

:cry:

:roll:

And I'm frustrated.

[xtn5021]

van gundy is losin his damn mind..

[D-Rose]

Pippen on who would win 2 on 2 (Pip&MJ vs. KB&LBJ)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lXM9nYhZHfA

[bruceblitz]

Frustrated? :oldlol: You're the kid who entered this thread butt hurt because someone picked Kobe/Bron to defeat MJ/Pippen in a fantasy game of 2 on 2. Go nose dive into a pillow kid.

I love how you call someone in their 30's, a kid.
http://www.horschgallery.com/admin/uploads/Products/Product158/2652_THAM.JPG
good stuff

[andgar923]

Why are you gonna ask people who only watch youtube highlight videos of MJ and Pip? They didn't live here in Chicago like I do and watch all of the games.

True.... true.

[32jazz]

"before I gained any credibility I had to win championships I had to win MVP's I had to make an impact for my team..." - Jordan

Hell , I don't have to watch a video to know that players,for the most part, have to win something before they are truly considered a all time great :confusedshrug:
MJ was the biggest draw in the the league also back in 87 at the peak of Showtime/Pistons (& twilight Celtics) & he had barely won a playoff series yet.
Young players today like Lebron have to go through the same stuff(x 10) & people will diminish him if he doesn't win also.

I forgot what we were arguing about:confusedshrug:

[bruceblitz]

http://www.nba.com/media/bulls/trophies_050217.jpg

Right now?
Let's see, Jordan and Pippen are in their 40s (Jordan smokes cigars)
I give the edge to Kobe and LeBron

Prime vs Prime
Jordan and Pippen defeat this era's most hyped up players
hands down.

:hammertime:

http://www.myteespot.com/images/Images_d/DSCF1389.jpg
Hate John Cena, but that's about right when comparing any tandem to Jordan and Pippen, just can't see them.

[andgar923]

Is it me, or does MJ look older than Ahmad?

[Hotlantadude81]

Kobe and Lebron would win just because you can't compare today's athleticism with the early 90's. Back then a 6'9 260lbs man would be a lumbering Power Forward. They never scene any guy that size like Lebron. Face it, athletes have progressed alot in the last 15 years.

Put it this way, Lebron is the size of Karl Malone. Compare the athletic differences. Just the speed difference alone is shocking.

Yet these guys struggle to beat unkown euro teams....

[bruceblitz]

Is it me, or does MJ look older than Ahmad?
I'd say you are about right.
http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/c/c6/Michael_Jordan_Ahmad_Rashad_eating_popcorn_at_MSG. jpg

[Mdog1]

Both Kobe and Bron are significantly better than Pip, but MJ was so good that he makes up for that. I think it would be a good game, but MJ and Pip would win. They actually would have chemistry and MJ is more self oriented as a player than Bron is. Kobe is self oriented as well, more so then MJ and that is what would kill them. But I believe that if you took any 4 players from MJs time and put MJ with them, and on the other team had the same 4 with James the game would be much much more interesting because James flourishes as a team player.

[andgar923]

For those of you that have never played basketball, this is what its like playing 2 on 2.

Lets look at it like a boxing match.

You start off the game feeling each other out.

This is where most of the scoring will be done.

Like boxing, you're gonna take a few blows and you'll adjust and wake up.

So mid way through the game, players start to make their adjustments. They start to sense what the player's habits are, what they can and cannot do and what they will do next.

Like boxing, the more experienced boxer usually wins. They're crafty enough to be mentally tough and make the adjustments when and how they need to be made.

When the game is nearing the end and close, the smarter, craftier, more experienced and team with the most chemistry will win.

I don't think its gonna be a landslide either way, but the more experienced, smarter, craftier, stronger (mentally) team will win.




On a personal note.......... I fu*kin miss playing :(

[Rondo]

Rofl I couldn't believe what they were saying about Pip, and how Kobe and LeBron would beat Pip Jordan. Amazing how they're the media guys that are supposed to tell us about basketball! and how Van Gundy was a coach!!!!! Scottie not a HOF, gosh

[GOBB]

:hammertime:

http://www.myteespot.com/images/Images_d/DSCF1389.jpg
Hate John Cena, but that's about right when comparing any tandem to Jordan and Pippen, just can't see them.

This is coming from someone in his 30's. :oldlol:

[bruceblitz]

For those of you that have never played basketball, this is what its like playing 2 on 2.

Lets look at it like a boxing match.

You start off the game feeling each other out.

This is where most of the scoring will be done.

Like boxing, you're gonna take a few blows and you'll adjust and wake up.

So mid way through the game, players start to make their adjustments. They start to sense what the player's habits are, what they can and cannot do and what they will do next.

Like boxing, the more experienced boxer usually wins. They're crafty enough to be mentally tough and make the adjustments when and how they need to be made.

When the game is nearing the end and close, the smarter, craftier, more experienced and team with the most chemistry will win.

I don't think its gonna be a landslide either way, but the more experienced, smarter, craftier, stronger (mentally) team will win.




On a personal note.......... I fu*kin miss playing :(

Oh come on when Jordan and Pippen were playing they were both skinny midgets who jumped from 5 foot free throw lines for their foul line dunks, on 7 foot rims, and won championships against short white guys. Screw those old bums.

[bruceblitz]

This is coming from someone in his 30's. :oldlol:

I was gonna put a picture of myself up with two middle fingers, but figured I don't need the ban. Clearly GOBB knows nothing about me.

http://www.youtube.com/bruceblitzconfession

I keep reading that there is an ignore feature on this website? I'm gonna have to figure that one out real quick for my homey GOBB.

[phoenix18]

Oh come on when Jordan and Pippen were playing they were both skinny midgets who jumped from 5 foot free throw lines for their foul line dunks, on 7 foot rims, and won championships against short white guys. Screw those old bums.
:violin: Do you want to write an eulogy for your credibility or should I?

[Mdog1]

I was gonna put a picture of myself up with two middle fingers, but figured I don't need the ban. Clearly GOBB knows nothing about me.

http://www.youtube.com/bruceblitzconfession

I keep reading that there is an ignore feature on this website? I'm gonna have to figure that one out real quick for my homey GOBB.
Go to your user CP and then at the very bottom of the page it says ignore/buddy list and click on that, type in his name BANG GOBB is gone.

[bruceblitz]

For those of you that have never played basketball, this is what its like playing 2 on 2.

Lets look at it like a boxing match.

You start off the game feeling each other out.

This is where most of the scoring will be done.

Like boxing, you're gonna take a few blows and you'll adjust and wake up.

So mid way through the game, players start to make their adjustments. They start to sense what the player's habits are, what they can and cannot do and what they will do next.

Like boxing, the more experienced boxer usually wins. They're crafty enough to be mentally tough and make the adjustments when and how they need to be made.

When the game is nearing the end and close, the smarter, craftier, more experienced and team with the most chemistry will win.

I don't think its gonna be a landslide either way, but the more experienced, smarter, craftier, stronger (mentally) team will win.




On a personal note.......... I fu*kin miss playing :(

andgar, you know the sad thing about these types of threads and some of the people we've debunked on youtube? We only bump into each other online when something totally off the wall has been claimed by someone. It's too bad that in the world of sports fans there is very little experience, very little perspective, very little research, and even less logic.

[bruceblitz]

Go to your user CP and then at the very bottom of the page it says ignore/buddy list and click on that, type in his name BANG GOBB is gone.

I went to his public profile and ignored him from there. Thanks for the heads up though. I appreciate it.

[Indian guy]

I'm not saying they don't, I'm saying that they shoot more than they penetrate.

The player who penetrates the least among the 4 is Pippen. Pippen was never much of a face-up break you down kind of a guy.


And by comparison, MJ and Pip drive alot more and have more of a mid range game than either of the two.

Good Lord. Just stop. Pippen has more of a mid-range game than Kobe? And drives more than LeBron? :oldlol:. You have no clue what you are talking about. Your ignorance would have to be off the charts to not know that Kobe and LeBron are FAR, FAR superior offensive players to Pippen. I'm not wasting my time here.

[andgar923]

andgar, you know the sad thing about these types of threads and some of the people we've debunked on youtube? We only bump into each other online when something totally off the wall has been claimed by someone. It's too bad that in the world of sports fans there is very little experience, very little perspective, very little research, and even less logic.

I sit back and think at times.....

"was I this ignorant when I was younger?"

And YES.... I remember making similar comments when I was 15 and still learning about the game.

But the keyword is "learning" about the game.

But I was also "16."

At times I think if I'm being a hypocrite for criticizing some of the posters online.

But.... most of these dudes are older than "18." So I guess NO.

So yeah.... I agree with you.

[bruceblitz]

The player who penetrates the least among the 4 is Pippen. Pippen was never much of a face-up break you down kind of a guy.



Good Lord. Just stop. Pippen has more of a mid-range game than Kobe? And drives more than LeBron? :oldlol:. You have no clue what you are talking about. If you can't even see that Kobe and LeBron are FAR, FAR superior offensive players to Pippen, then there's no point in me talking to you.

Ah yes, the post of someone who didn't watch very much Pippen. Pippen used rocker steps, ball fakes, was great in the post, had great dribble spin moves... ah hell, why am I wasting my time trying to show someone who didn't live in Chicago and watch my Bulls on a game by game basis something he doesn't know... just watch Pippen at an old age chew Kobe's ass up:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GnD67NnYir8

[gts]

This is coming from someone in his 30's. :oldlol:you should see his youtube of himself playing ball ya want a real laugh...lol

http://bruceblitzfanclub.bravehost.com/Bruce.html

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=D8x0t06KJFA&feature=PlayList&p=AA78794A6D1F3D79&index=0

[bruceblitz]

I sit back and think at times.....

"was I this ignorant when I was younger?"

And YES.... I remember making similar comments when I was 15 and still learning about the game.

But the keyword is "learning" about the game.

But I was also "16."

At times I think if I'm being a hypocrite for criticizing some of the posters online.

But.... most of these dudes are older than "18." So I guess NO.

So yeah.... I agree with you.

I know I was ignorant when I was younger. It took me years to realize that Sugar Ray Leonard was overrated, but that's another story for another time.

[bruceblitz]

you should see his youtube of himself playing ball ya want a real laugh...lol

http://bruceblitzfanclub.bravehost.com/Bruce.html

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=D8x0t06KJFA&feature=PlayList&p=AA78794A6D1F3D79&index=0
Why thank you. Coming from someone who shows no video of himself playing ball, and your opinions are bland. Thank you.

[GOBB]

I was gonna put a picture of myself up with two middle fingers, but figured I don't need the ban.

So long as you arent insulting Jews you wouldnt get banned for that. If you feel like flipping me off times two via a photo? By all means go ahead.


Clearly GOBB knows nothing about me

Yes I think a random poster could guess GOBB knows nothing about you. This is a msgboard that is geared towards basketball. The getting to know you personally part isnt a big thing here. What one could guess from reading your replies? You're a biased Bulls fan who types from his rectum more often than not.


http://www.youtube.com/bruceblitzconfession

I'll get around to clicking this. Right now I'm listening to music while watching tv.


I keep reading that there is an ignore feature on this website? I'm gonna have to figure that one out real quick for my homey GOBB.

:violin:

[bruceblitz]

I sit back and think at times.....



The more I think about it, the more sense it makes actually, Pippen and Jordan were superior post players compared to Kobe and LeBron. When you are playing 1 on 1 basketball, are not post moves the most effective way to score? hmmm.

[Indian guy]

Ah yes, the post of someone who didn't watch very much Pippen. Pippen used rocker steps, ball fakes, was great in the post, had great dribble spin moves
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GnD67NnYir8

Nobody's denying that Pippen was a great player, but he was NEVER a great face-up break the D down kind of guy. His scoring strengths lied in transition and in the post. He was a good offensive player, not an ALL TIMER like Kobe or a great offensive player like LeBron.

[bruceblitz]

Nobody's denying that Pippen was a great player, but he was NEVER a great face-up break the D down kind of guy. His scoring strengths lied in transition and in the post. He was a good offensive player, not an ALL TIMER like Kobe or a great offensive player like LeBron.

So you mean to tell me that in isolation, which a 2 on 2 game would feature a ton of isolation, that a great post player wouldn't dominate someone who would rather face-up a defense and shoot over them? Just a logical question.

[andgar923]

The player who penetrates the least among the 4 is Pippen. Pippen was never much of a face-up break you down kind of a guy.



Good Lord. Just stop. Pippen has more of a mid-range game than Kobe? And drives more than LeBron? :oldlol:. You have no clue what you are talking about. Your ignorance would have to be off the charts to not know that Kobe and LeBron are FAR, FAR superior offensive players to Pippen. I'm not wasting my time here.

Pip was more of a mid range player than Kobe. And since Pip usually saw plenty of mismatches and play the point forward, he penetrated more than Bron.

You either have a very short memory, you were too young to comprehend, or you haven't seen PIp play much.

Pip was excellent at pump faking and driving. He like most players from past eras made a living in the mid range area.

Now.... was he better than Kobe in the mid range? that's arguable, but I NEVER said he was better.

I'm not even sure I mentioned he was a more mid range player than Kobe, but sure why not. HE WAS MORE OF A MID RANGE PLAYER THAN KOBE. Players didn't take as many 3pt shots or shots from that distance overall. It was a completely different game back then, and PIp was a good post up player.

Far better than either Kobe or Bron.

Now.... I'm not saying (or did I ever) say that Pip was a better offensive player than both Bron or Kobe. I was just replying to those that think Pip would just sit there and solely play defense. I mean... they gave the illusion that Pip would be missing wide open shots as they doubled MJ all game long.

[GOBB]

Its funny to see someone in 1 post reply "You know nothing about me" but in 4-5 other replies tells the board what he knows about everyone else. Forgive anyone for even speaking on the Bulls, MJ or Pippen. All we have been privy too were youtube vids. We didnt experience them when they played.

Kid has a gift talkin out of his ass.


you should see his youtube of himself playing ball ya want a real laugh...lol

http://bruceblitzfanclub.bravehost.com/Bruce.html

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=D8x0t06KJFA&feature=PlayList&p=AA78794A6D1F3D79&index=0

:roll: omg

[bruceblitz]

Pip was more of a mid range player than Kobe. And since Pip usually saw plenty of mismatches and play the point forward, he penetrated more than Bron.

You either have a very short memory, you were too young to comprehend, or you haven't seen PIp play much.

Pip was excellent at pump faking and driving. He like most players from past eras made a living in the mid range area.

Now.... was he better than Kobe in the mid range? that's arguable, but I NEVER said he was better.

I'm not even sure I mentioned he was a more mid range player than Kobe, but sure why not. HE WAS MORE OF A MID RANGE PLAYER THAN KOBE. Players didn't take as many 3pt shots or shots from that distance overall. It was a completely different game back then, and PIp was a good post up player.

Far better than either Kobe or Bron.

Now.... I'm not saying (or did I ever) say that Pip was a better offensive player than both Bron or Kobe. I was just replying to those that think Pip would just sit there and solely play defense. I mean... they gave the illusion that Pip would be missing wide open shots as they doubled MJ all game long.

I think most true fans know that Jordan and Oscar Robertson are/were the best perimeter players of all time when it came to posting up. Now Pippen's post up moves are vastly underrated as well as his ability to take a defender off the dribble. His jumper was eh, well it was pretty good, but nothing to brag about. Jordan's jumper was like a Tiger Woods putt, automatic. I just don't think that LeBron and Kobe are efficient enough as individual scorers and effective enough to beat Jordan and Pippen in a 2 on 2 game. I actually would rather see Jordan and Pippen play Hakeem and KG before I would want to see them play Kobe and LeBron. I think that would be a more interesting matchup.

[Indian guy]

So you mean to tell me that in isolation, which a 2 on 2 game would feature a ton of isolation, that a great post player wouldn't dominate someone who would rather face-up a defense and shoot over them? Just a logical question.

Pippen was never a great scorer in the NBA, much less dominant, so why would he dominate in a 2-on-2 game? He was a good post player by the mid 90's, not great. And the fact that you and andgar continue to imply that LeBron/Kobe would do little besides facing up and shooting in this game tells me all I need to know. You spend hours watching and editing LeBron's games and putting up on YT...how can you be so ignorant about his abilities?

[bruceblitz]

Question for andgar, when you get a chance....




OK, SO IF YOU ARE THE TYPE OF FAN WHO THINKS PLAYERS TODAY ARE BIGGER FASTER STRONGER. THAT MEANS THEY WERE BORN LATER THAN THE PLAYERS OF OLD? AM I CORRECT?

SO, FOLLOW ME HERE, THE LEAGUE'S TALLEST YEAR FOR AVERAGE HEIGHT WAS IN 1987.
You can see the statistics right here on the bottom left of this link:
http://www.nba.com/news/survey_2007.html

Players weigh more now.

SO, IF YOU ARE ONE OF THOSE THAT THINKS PLAYERS TODAY ARE STRONGER AND FASTER, THAT MEANS IF PLAYERS FROM THE OLD SCHOOL WERE BORN AT THE SAME TIME AS PLAYERS TODAY, THEY WOULD BE BIGGER, FASTER, AND STRONGER TOO, AM I NOT CORRECT?

Discrediting the players of the old school is retarded.

Imagine Jerry West with the athleticism of a Brent Barry(in his prime)

Get the **** out of here with this bull ****.

Jordan and Pippen would school those two.

Also, quit acting like the athletes of Jordan's era were bums.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8uc465y2tl4



Do you comprehend what I'm saying with this andgar?

[andgar923]

The more I think about it, the more sense it makes actually, Pippen and Jordan were superior post players compared to Kobe and LeBron. When you are playing 1 on 1 basketball, are not post moves the most effective way to score? hmmm.

There's less players on the court which means more space. Also, the pace and type of play is much, much more different.

Another thing some people are missing......

THS IS A HALF COURT GAME!!!!

Some people give the illusion that Bron would be penetrating left and right, but that basically happens more on a break. If Pip is guarding him, he's quick enough to stay in front of him, and long/athletic enough to contest him.

*back to the original discussion*

So when people are in a 2 on 2 situation, there's usually a post up player. Because it works best that way..... why? its easier to run a pick and roll, or screens that way. Its harder to do that if both players are in the perimeter jacking up shots. If you take long distance shots and you miss, the defensive team will get the ball 8 outta 10 times due to all the space on the court. So its not smart to take a shot that's only 35% effective.

I can easily see Pip and MJ allow Kobe and Bron all the 3s they want. And since Bron really isn't a post up player, I can have MJ on Bron. If Bowen can do a great job Bron, imagine MJ?

So the players with the best post up game usually wins.

[bruceblitz]

Pippen was never a great scorer in the NBA, much less dominant, so why would he dominate in a 2-on-2 game? He was a good post player by the mid 90's, not great. And the fact that you and andgar continue to imply that LeBron/Kobe would do little besides facing up and shooting in this game tells me all I need to know. You spend hours watching and editing LeBron's games and putting up on YT...how can you be so ignorant about his abilities?

No, I'm not being ignorant, I was aiming that comment more towards Kobe, you are 100% correct in the assertion that LeBron would attempt to drive to the rim a lot. He's become more of a shooter this year, which personally, I don't like, I would rather see him attack the rim, but he's probably trying to prolong his career at this point and watch his "mileage". That being said, I think Pippen could contain him to the perimeter better than anyone today, that's for sure, which would limit his effectiveness. Pippen was great at contesting shots. I'm not saying they would roll over LeBron and Kobe, I'm just saying, the chemistry between Jordan and Pippen, combined with their own individual abilities would be too much for Kobe and LeBron to handle in a 2 on 2 game. I'm glad you found my LeBron channel, that's great. He's my favorite player today. The videos you see on youtube, well, that's just me getting up as much footage as I can. A lot of the time I just end up watching it streaming online (his games) as well as Kobe's. I record as many as I can, but I'm not a robot. That being said I've watched all 4 players's careers intensely. If you didn't live in Chicago it was impossible to watch an 82 games bulls season during Jordan and Pippen's primes. When I think about unstoppable duos I think of Jordan and Pippen and all the times I watched them impose their will, with their skills, on opponents. I just truly think they would be too much for Kobe and LeBron. Hey, it's a compliment to Kobe and LeBron to even be in this discussion and I truly believe they deserve considerations with this type of discussion. That being said, I also think D Wade and LeBron would be as much if not more of a handful for Jordan and Pippen, with Jordan and Pippen coming out on top in that matchup too.

[bruceblitz]

I think the one thing that would put Pippen and Jordan over the top against Wade/LeBron or Kobe/Wade or Kobe/LeBron in a 2 on 2 contest, it's simple quite actually. Jordan's competitive drive was borderline psycho. He just refused to lose. I don't care if it was cards, blackjack, basketball, golf, you name it, he had to win. Let's say Kobe and LeBron are tied with Jordan and Pippen at 14 points, first to 21. Do you really think at this point that Jordan wouldn't just go crazy and take that ball every play, doing whatever it takes to win?

[Bush4Ever]

I actually would rather see Jordan and Pippen play Hakeem and KG before I would want to see them play Kobe and LeBron. I think that would be a more interesting matchup.

The big guys would almost always win in that type of situation. The spacing of the floor in a 2 on 2 game really slants the game towards the bigs.

In the 1970s, the NBA had one on one contests, and the bigs nearly always beat the smaller players. Slightly different, but the main issue would be the same IMO.

[bruceblitz]

The big guys would almost always win in that type of situation. The spacing of the floor in a 2 on 2 game really slants the game towards the bigs.

In the 1970s, the NBA had one on one contests, and the bigs nearly always beat the smaller players. Slightly different, but the main issue would be the same IMO.

That's my point exactly. Pippen and Jordan were two of the best perimeter defenders of all time, if not the actual 2 best. Their offensive skill-sets were nearly unstoppable without the assist of help defense. It would be almost nearly impossible to match-up 2 other perimeter players who could beat them 2 on 2. That's not even talking about the chemistry, and Jordan's psycho-like competitive drive.

That's why I would rather see a KG/Hakeem matchup vs Jordan/Pippen. Could they overcome those types of odds? It's hard to say yes.

[andgar923]

Question for andgar, when you get a chance....



Do you comprehend what I'm saying with this andgar?

Yeah..... I never understood that argument.

I mean.... if Magic played in this era he'd also benefit from today's technology, training, etc.

Imagine Bird?

Like you mentioned, just imagine how freakish Wilt would be today?

Of course tho..... if they were born today, they'd be missing the fundamentals and small things that made past eras great.

So if Larry Hughes was born in 64, he'd be a completely different player. He would've gone to college, wouldn't be as physically big, maybe wouldn't be as selfish, possibly made better decisions etc.etc.

But the ONLY reason I even compare MJ and his generation is......

We got a glimpse of MJ in today's era vs today's athletes.

We get glimpses all the time with Mutombo.

We get glimpses with Shaq.

And these players are past their prime.

If it wasn't for MJ playing in his late 30s (early 40), then I don't think it any comparison or argument could be made.

But we saw Mj play in the 80s, with a crossbreed of players from the 70s, saw him play in the 90s and 2K.

[bruceblitz]

Yeah..... I never understood that argument.

I mean.... if Magic played in this era he'd also benefit from today's technology, training, etc.

Imagine Bird?

Like you mentioned, just imagine how freakish Wilt would be today?

Of course tho..... if they were born today, they'd be missing the fundamentals and small things that made past eras great.

So if Larry Hughes was born in 64, he'd be a completely different player. He would've gone to college, wouldn't be as physically big, maybe wouldn't be as selfish, possibly made better decisions etc.etc.

But the ONLY reason I even compare MJ and his generation is......

We got a glimpse of MJ in today's era vs today's athletes.

We get glimpses all the time with Mutombo.

We get glimpses with Shaq.

And these players are past their prime.

If it wasn't for MJ playing in his late 30s (early 40), then I don't think it any comparison or argument could be made.

But we saw Mj play in the 80s, with a crossbreed of players from the 70s, saw him play in the 90s and 2K.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xCRre3nX88g&feature=channel_page
A little past 1:55 of this video, I just love the moves he puts on Paul Pierce. Or how about that upload Hoops has where Minnesota decided to put KG on Jordan as the main defender, and Jordan was just torching him. I think a lot of these youngsters even missed those games man.

[GOBB]

I think the one thing that would put Pippen and Jordan over the top against Wade/LeBron or Kobe/Wade or Kobe/LeBron in a 2 on 2 contest, it's simple quite actually. Jordan's competitive drive was borderline psycho. He just refused to lose. I don't care if it was cards, blackjack, basketball, golf, you name it, he had to win. Let's say Kobe and LeBron are tied with Jordan and Pippen at 14 points, first to 21. Do you really think at this point that Jordan wouldn't just go crazy and take that ball every play, doing whatever it takes to win?

Oh dear how dare anyone challenge MJ's will to win. MJ would beat Kobe/Bron in these activities.

Who would win in NBA2k9 on xbox 360? MJ wouldnt lose. You think if he was down 5pts with 2mins left he wouldnt find a way to win? If MJ played NBA2k9 on xbox live he would be the #1 ranked player in the country. He simply couldnt lose. His comeptitive drive was borderline psycho.


Tiger Woods vs MJ in golf. Tiger is great and all but you think MJ would lose? Do you? Obviously you never seen him play outside of youtbue videos.

Hey andgar do you agree???????????? U there?

[bruceblitz]

This message is hidden because GOBB is on your ignore list.

[Mdog1]

Did anyone eelse get this great laugh from one of the guys during the Cavs game put LeBron as their MIP? Man I was like WTF is this guy thinking.

[bruceblitz]

Did anyone eelse get this great laugh from one of the guys during the Cavs game put LeBron as their MIP? Man I was like WTF is this guy thinking.
Yeah, that was pretty sad.