An unnecessarily long Kobe video and a shorter but still excessive post.

[Kblaze8855]

I get several messages a week on youtube asking why I never made a Kobe video...when I have in fact made 3. I just made them in 2002 and 2003 back when 600 of them were not made a week. But I got sick of explaining that...plus....Kobe does deserve some attention for the last 6 years(not that he doesnt get it).

I split it into 4 parts becaused really...who is watching 40 minutes of anyone in one sitting? Thats right. Its 40 minutes long. It was 10. That left too much out. Then 20....still left too much out. Then it was likely to approach an hour and a half and that was my "**** that...." point. settled on 4 10 minute parts which I feel cover enough.


Part 1

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JV4q_XX6-y8
^
Age 16 to mini fro dunking on everyone showboat Kobe.

Part 2
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=59o2YYh8AS0
^
Threepeat era Kobe and....the unpleasantness...

Part 3
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7RcnfN4OzBQ
^
Post shaq scoring crazy Kobe.

Part 4
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cBX-p8jwHdc
^
MVP/mature/winning Kobe.

As I do not expect anyone to just sit and watch these back to back to back...to back...I wont bother writing out all I think about each era of Kobe right now. Instead ill space it out over the course of the day likely throwing them together in halftimes and pregame shows. The more I think about it ...in a combo of legacy and skills? Kobe is rapidly approaching the point you can justify calling him top 10 all time. Used to be something only idiot kids could think but when you really reeeeeally look into it?

What has Oscar Robertson done that Kobe has not?

Yes yes. We know the triple double season. But if we are gonna rank him over Kobe because of the stats we would likely have ot rank him over Jordan, Bird, and Magic too and it seems few wish to do that. Guy put up like 31/12/10. Hes got better numbers than anyone but Wilt and Baylor. But few really rank him where those numbers would plae him(top 3-4 all time). Nobody sure as hell ranks Baylor where his numbers put him all time(second...he was a 38/19 player you know?). So why make Kobe the modern exception to that?

Kobe even in an era with far less offense scored more than Oscar. Both have an MVP. Kobe has 3 rings as a #2 while Oscar has 1 as a #2. Neither won as best player. Oscar has more all NBA first teams but after this year Kobe is only 2 short. If not for the lockout year Kobe has the same number of all star games as Oscar.

My point isnt exactly that Kobe is the equal of Oscar....but...you cant call it a blowout accomplishment wise. You really cant. Kobe has climed the ladder that fast. Oscar? baylor? West? Hondo. Even Isiah. Plenty of guys to be called top 10 all time and have it accepted.....have not done much Kobe has not. And Kobe is in or near his prime and could realistically win 2-3 rings more. I wouldnt bet on it. But it wouldnt shock me either.

Why shouldnt the Lakers win it all? How often is arguably the best player in the league(not that I think it...but its a reasonable opinion) on the most talented team in the league? Gasol...Bynum...Odom...Ariza..Walton(people dont seem to like him but I love his game)...Fisher. coach with 9 titles already who if not the best x and os guy sure as hell is a great motivator and manager of egos. Team has it all. And they are young. No reason they shouldnt win a title. Or two.

And if it happens Kobe haters beware. Kobe with 5 rings and 7 finals? you know what will happen. A few people were saying he was as good as Jordan when I first got here(01-02 season). I will leave it at that.

Now...

Young Kobe.

Kobe in high school and his first year or two in the league was hard to call for me. Virtually every NBA player looks like a god in high school. Anyone ever see Tim THomas high school highlights? Guy was like 6'8'' with an insane shooting touch and was seemingly everywhere at once. Or Vince Carter. Same there. Good NBA players wreck it in high school. SO I dont know what exactly people saw in Kobe to make them so sure of his future greatness.

Or really I should say what Jerry West saw. Though him seeimg Kobe eating guys like Michael Cooper in workouts no doubt factored in.

Im gonna stop here because frankly I dont care enough about Kobe to look away from a Bulls playoff game but ill get back to this later.

[detroitdogg]

Im not even saying that you're wrong, but to compare Kobe to any player that put up big numbers in every stat, that is kinda foolish. I watched 1 of your long ass videos, nice work fella, but you gotta be more realistic when looking at Kobes career.

[Kblaze8855]

You can call it foolish if you wish. But we both know that in 5 years Kobe will retire considered at or above the level of guys like Oscar even if he isnt. Most people put him top 10-20 all time right now and hes not even old enough to get that living legend status that gets guys overrated towards the end of their careers. Plenty of people argue his Jordan good right now. So why would him being considered Oscar good be odd to you?

[StroShow4]

When youtube blocks the audio try Yahoo video. Works great for me.

[Mdog1]

I agree Kobe will retire as top 10 AT, but if he fails again this season I am not sure if they can ever win another title unless he ring searches.

[v-unit]

IMO-there is so much to be said about him. I think he is the second greatest shooting guard, but he will NEVER be better then Jordan. This is something that is answered by watching them play. He could have 5 rings in 7 finals appearances, finals mvp, scoring titles, the works. But when you look at how he plays at that same position as Jordan...

Jordan CONTROLLED games and you could tell he had everyone mentally and phyically shook in every way possible. Kobe is AMAZING when he is on but he is really capable of being stopped (Same as LeBron) when compared to Jordan. I just think that Jordan was ahead of every other play in every aspect, awards, skills, domination in every way possible

[artificial]

I've only tried to watch the last vid, and maybe it's just me, but it looks as if it was made in cheap stop motion; no part of it runs smoothly although the song (time) runs normally.

[All Net]

I agree Kobe will retire as top 10 AT, but if he fails again this season I am not sure if they can ever win another title unless he ring searches.

Don't see that logic at all, with a possible dominant big man in Andrew Bynum..Kobe will have plenty of chances to win several more titles If Bynum continues to develop and stays healthly....this Laker team is still very young.

[detroitdogg]

You can call it foolish if you wish. But we both know that in 5 years Kobe will retire considered at or above the level of guys like Oscar even if he isnt. Most people put him top 10-20 all time right now and hes not even old enough to get that living legend status that gets guys overrated towards the end of their careers. Plenty of people argue his Jordan good right now. So why would him being considered Oscar good be odd to you?Good point, and that is the truth like a motha****a, I 100% agree with you. Thats the thing with sports though, its all opinions when considering who is top 10 or whatever, that is basically built off of who was the most hyped player of your era, Kobe has been that for a while so some people decisions are already established, reguardless of the fact that the numbers or accomplishments makes him look a lot less great than he is considered. I believe if Kobe retired today thousands of people would still say he is top 10, that dont mean they are right, its just what they know to their personal knowlege, thats why I choose to judge players off of skills I see on the court, numbers, accomplishments, and highlight reels, and honestly, I cant even say Oscar was the better player cause I havent seen enough in game footage or looked at enough stats.

[SCY]

Don't see that logic at all, with a possible domiant big man in Andre Bynum..Kobe will have plenty of chances to win several more titles If Bynum continues to develop and stays healthly....this Laker team is still very young.

Even as a Laker hater, I have to agree. Added to that, every team in the West besides Denver/Portland seems to be on the decline right now (obviously other teams can make trades/FA moves to improve).

[detroitdogg]

IMO-there is so much to be said about him. I think he is the second greatest shooting guard, but he will NEVER be better then Jordan. This is something that is answered by watching them play. He could have 5 rings in 7 finals appearances, finals mvp, scoring titles, the works. But when you look at how he plays at that same position as Jordan...

Jordan CONTROLLED games and you could tell he had everyone mentally and phyically shook in every way possible. Kobe is AMAZING when he is on but he is really capable of being stopped (Same as LeBron) when compared to Jordan. I just think that Jordan was ahead of every other play in every aspect, awards, skills, domination in every way possibleI 100% agree with everything you said, and it is the personal reason that im so hard on Kobe, cause I know how good he is, but when compared to MJ, he falls short badly. And of course Kobe is 2nd best 2guard, but that can easily be passed by Wade through 10 more years. When thinking about MJ, he was no doubt the best player in the NBA while he played, no of the other perimeter players stopped or scared MJ, everybody knew they had no chance.

[Bodin]

I agree Kobe will retire as top 10 AT, but if he fails again this season I am not sure if they can ever win another title unless he ring searches.

Took the words right out of Barkley's mouth :lol

That doesn't make sense at all, they rank up there with the Cavs. I see a 7 game or less final goind either way (Cavs vs Lakers) and experience is in favour of the Lakers. What makes a big difference a year or 2 away? If the Lakers have a completely healthy season they are just as much competing for the finals as the Cavs and Celtics.

I hate the Lakers, and am not nor never will be a Kobe fan but I can't help but realize they have an amazingly talented team. And for Barkley to spew that garbage analysis... and have people regurgitate it all over the place is utter nonsense.

[The Magic Man]

he will NEVER be better then Jordan.

I always laugh when I see quotes like this. Not saying he will ever be better but damn, you guys just have your mind made up huh? Lol, let's say he averages 40 ppg, 10rpg, 10 apg for the next 6 seasons and wins 6 titles and 6 MVPs. I bet half the people on ISH would say, nope, MJ was better. Lol, not trying to stir things up, it's just funny that people are so arrogant or ignorant enough to say something will NEVER happen. News Flash. There's a baby being born right now who's gonna shatter everything MJ, Kobe, or LBJ has ever done. If we, as humans, can not evolve and build on the groundwork laid by our forefathers then what good are we?

MJ was the most outstanding player ever. His resume is gonna be hard for any player to top but it's not out of the realm of possibility is it? Op, I'm not saying you fit this mold, but the statement just got me thinking about this. Can you honestly sit there and say Kobe has no chance, with at least 5 more years of high level ball left in him, to be the best ever? Lebron James, who, at this age, has accomplished more than MJ? Dwayne Wade? Kevin Durant? Derrick Rose? OJ Mayo? Little Billy in Anytown, USA? Man, MJ was amazing and I feel privilaged to be able to say I've seen him play but the MJ > Food, Water, and Sex talk is just getting out of hand.

This is gonna fall on deaf ears and I'll be called a homer for having a Lakers avi but I guess it just ultimately shows who the real homers and fanatics are.

[Godfather]

Don't see that logic at all, with a possible dominant big man in Andrew Bynum..Kobe will have plenty of chances to win several more titles If Bynum continues to develop and stays healthly....this Laker team is still very young.


How can you be dominant when you are only out on the court half the season.

The Lakers team outside of Bynum isn't that young in the top position.

Farmar has declined, Ariza is a defensive player only, and Sasha's game is limited to chucking.

[Scott Pippen]

I always laugh when I see quotes like this. Not saying he will ever be better but damn, you guys just have your mind made up huh? Lol, let's say he averages 40 ppg, 10rpg, 10 apg for the next 6 seasons and wins 6 titles and 6 MVPs. I bet half the people on ISH would say, nope, MJ was better. Lol, not trying to stir things up, it's just funny that people are so arrogant or ignorant enough to say something will NEVER happen. News Flash. There's a baby being born right now who's gonna shatter everything MJ, Kobe, or LBJ has ever done. If we, as humans, can not evolve and build on the groundwork laid by our forefathers then what good are we?

MJ was the most outstanding player ever. His resume is gonna be hard for any player to top but it's not out of the realm of possibility is it? Op, I'm not saying you fit this mold, but the statement just got me thinking about this. Can you honestly sit there and say Kobe has no chance, with at least 5 more years of high level ball left in him, to be the best ever? Lebron James, who, at this age, has accomplished more than MJ? Dwayne Wade? Kevin Durant? Derrick Rose? OJ Mayo? Little Billy in Anytown, USA? Man, MJ was amazing and I feel privilaged to be able to say I've seen him play but the MJ > Food, Water, and Sex talk is just getting out of hand.

This is gonna fall on deaf ears and I'll be called a homer for having a Lakers avi but I guess it just ultimately shows who the real homers and fanatics are.I must agree there will probably be someone better someday at the SG position than Jordan. But regarding Kobe this would be an excellent post had it been made 6 years ago. :applause:

[andgar923]

I love all these "what if" scenarios.

Honestly..... there might be somebody that comes along that's better than MJ. But I don't see that happening with any of this era's players.

There might be a kid in high school or a 6 year old playing right now, that might be it.

As far as Kobe..... I don't have a problem with him being the 2nd best shooting guard or a top 10 player right now.

But the door for him to dethrone MJ was closed a few playoffs ago and was completely shut in the Finals.

[The Magic Man]

I love all these "what if" scenarios.

Honestly..... there might be somebody that comes along that's better than MJ. But I don't see that happening with any of this era's players.

There might be a kid in high school or a 6 year old playing right now, that might be it.

As far as Kobe..... I don't have a problem with him being the 2nd best shooting guard or a top 10 player right now.

But the door for him to dethrone MJ was closed a few playoffs ago and was completely shut in the Finals.

So there is just no way on God's green Earth Lebron, Rose, Durant, or Wade can be better? Dudes with like 10+ more seasons to play in the league? Lol, ok.

[andgar923]

So there is just no way on God's green Earth Lebron, Rose, Durant, or Wade can be better? Dudes with like 10+ more seasons to play in the league? Lol, ok.

Nope

Seriously..... MJ wasn't about solely stats. The man changed the game!!!

He was at a completely different level, mentally, physically, talent wise, etc.etc.

And he was like that from "day one."

It wasn't something that he obtained as he played, he was great from day one.

Sure...... there's qualities that other players have that are very similar, some have similar style game, some have a similar mentality, etc.etc. But they don't have everything that MJ had combined, let alone better than him.

What you guys have to understand is.....

The way Wade is playing right now in his 6th season..... MJ was doing in his 2nd or 3rd (minus the 3pt shot). Same with Bron and Kobe.

The way Kobe was playing a few seasons ago, is the way MJ was playing in his 3r-4th season, but at a higher and more "consistent" level.

And like many have noted..... playoffs are were you make yourself a legend and set yourself apart from the others. And only Wade is even close, but he's still distant.

Rose...... he had a great game, but he doesn't post like MJ, and he never will due to his size. So he's basically disqualified, unless he completely changes the point guard position which he hasn't done.

[The Magic Man]

Nope


Rose...... he had a great game, but he doesn't post like MJ, and he never will due to his size. So he's basically disqualified, unless he completely changes the point guard position which he hasn't done.

Sorry man. You aren't even making sense right now. Rose played one of the greatest playoff games for a rook ever. MJ never did what he did. He has an entire career ahead of him and he's dq'd from being the GOAT because he doesn't post up? lol, ok.

[andgar923]

Sorry man. You aren't even making sense right now. Rose played one of the greatest playoff games for a rook ever. MJ never did what he did. He has an entire career ahead of him and he's dq'd from being the GOAT because he doesn't post up? lol, ok.

How doesn't that make any sense?

That's like saying that Mayo is gonna be better than Kobe, even tho he doesn't post up. Which means, he's not as a complete player as Kobe right?

So if he's not as complete, how can he be better?

So because he had a great game he has a shot? because he had a great game?

The dude will never be a post up player, its that simple. And he aint gonna change the game or revolutionize the point guard position.

[andgar923]

Back to the main topic......

Kobe's biggest problem is his inability to be consistent and to f*ckin learn.

He STILL makes stupid rookie mistakes.
He STILL forces shots and goes away from the system.
He STILL doesn't trust his teammates.
He STILL tries to hard to take over.

And that's something that always bewildered the sh*t outta me.

I also see Wade possibly surpassing him. Aside from the stats, Wade has the right approach to the game and could "possibly" be better than him.

People can point out to the difference in Wade and Kobe's points.

Well... Wade passes alot more and shoots less. He also has a better shooting percentage. So honestly..... if he were to shoot as much as Kobe and pass less, he could match Kobe's numbers.

But that's not his game, and that's what I mean by "approach."

But Wade "got" the game when he was a rookie. While Kobe is still struggling with that. Wade's skills still have to develop (slightly) for him to catch up to Kobe. But that's not far away, and when he does, there would be no doubt that he'll be better than Kobe.

[juju151111]

How doesn't that make any sense?

That's like saying that Mayo is gonna be better than Kobe, even tho he doesn't post up. Which means, he's not as a complete player as Kobe right?

So if he's not as complete, how can he be better?

So because he had a great game he has a shot? because he had a great game?

The dude will never be a post up player, its that simple. And he aint gonna change the game or revolutionize the point guard position.
I don't agree, Rose has alot of time to get post moves, but you don't need post moves to become the goat if you can score other ways. He doesn't need to revolutionize the PG position. Just Play amazing and win chips,be clutch etc......

[Showtime]

With Kobe, the cart has always come before the horse IMO. His legacy and reputation were almost created by the media and his fans before his play got a chance to provide the basis for it.

He was traded to LA because he refused to play for bad teams in the draft. He was voted in as a starter to the west all star team in his second season despite being an inconsistent reserve for LA. On any other team, that never happens.

He developed into a great player, but his reputation was always one step ahead of his actual play.

He will probably retire as the second best SG ever, but I have no doubt in my mind that he would have been another McGrady had he not become a Laker.

[andgar923]

I don't agree, Rose has alot of time to get post moves, but you don't need post moves to become the goat if you can score other ways. He doesn't need to revolutionize the PG position. Just Play amazing and win chips,be clutch etc......

We're talking about GOAT tho.

Like I mentioned..... MJ's stats aren't indicative of why he's considered the GOAT.

He literally changed the game, in more ways than one.

He did things on the court that people have yet to do.

I mean.... people look at the stats and think that was it..... far from it tho.

Does Rose have a shot at being a great player? sure

But its still very early to tell if he can be the best pg let alone the best "player" of all time.

[juju151111]

We're talking about GOAT tho.

Like I mentioned..... MJ's stats aren't indicative of why he's considered the GOAT.

He literally changed the game, in more ways than one.

He did things on the court that people have yet to do.

I mean.... people look at the stats and think that was it..... far from it tho.

Does Rose have a shot at being a great player? sure

But its still very early to tell if he can be the best pg let alone the best "player" of all time.
I am not saying drose will be the Goat, but you don't have to revolutionize a position to become the goat. MJ is far ahead of everyone and a player already has there hands full in catching him so having to revolutionize a position too would be to hard lol. Kobe ain't catching him tho lol.

[The Magic Man]

I am not saying drose will be the Goat, but you don't have to revolutionize a position to become the goat. MJ is far ahead of everyone and a player already has there hands full in catching him so having to revolutionize a position too would be to hard lol. Kobe ain't catching him tho lol.

Same here. I'm not saying Rose will be the one but it's asanine to sit here and proclaim a rookie, who has maybe 15 years ahead of him will never be better than another guy.

[momo]

Man, that's just great. X lent work Kblaze. I feel sorry for the kids that had to try and check him in HS. They should have made KB wear weights.


(Can we just leave the KB >/=/< stuff for another thread people? Seriously, it is debated to DEATH already. Talk about the videos... Or just give Kblaze props and STFU)

[Mdog1]

Took the words right out of Barkley's mouth :lol

That doesn't make sense at all, they rank up there with the Cavs. I see a 7 game or less final goind either way (Cavs vs Lakers) and experience is in favour of the Lakers. What makes a big difference a year or 2 away? If the Lakers have a completely healthy season they are just as much competing for the finals as the Cavs and Celtics.

I hate the Lakers, and am not nor never will be a Kobe fan but I can't help but realize they have an amazingly talented team. And for Barkley to spew that garbage analysis... and have people regurgitate it all over the place is utter nonsense.
I will not quote you all but I will respond to this one. They can of course make a surprise run and win a ring next season or a couple seasons after, but after this year there is just to many good teams that will only get better with the improved superstars they will have. Cleveland for one will improve, and with the addition of whichever player they trade for they will only be better. Orlando will get better with the re addition of Jameer and Dwight as well as Turk and Lewis improvement, and then you have Miami improving with Wade getting deeper into his prime and Beasley being a better player.

Basically what I am getting from you guys saying that they have a better chance in a couple of years is that you are saying Kobe is the least important part to a Lakers championship team and Bynum/Gasol will be more important. I agree, but as Kobe gets older I expect Gasol/Bynum (who is always injured) to be less effective.

[OldSchoolBBall]

Sorry man. You aren't even making sense right now. Rose played one of the greatest playoff games for a rook ever. MJ never did what he did.

Jordan averaged 29.3 pts/5.8 reb/8.5 ast/2.8 stl/1.0 blk in his first playoff series as a rookie. Not one game, 4. Pretty poor shooting by Jordan's standards (44%), but he was being guarded by two-time DPOY Moncrief and tons of help.

Tremendous game from Rose, but it was just one game.

[v-unit]

I always laugh when I see quotes like this. Not saying he will ever be better but damn, you guys just have your mind made up huh? Lol, let's say he averages 40 ppg, 10rpg, 10 apg for the next 6 seasons and wins 6 titles and 6 MVPs. I bet half the people on ISH would say, nope, MJ was better. Lol, not trying to stir things up, it's just funny that people are so arrogant or ignorant enough to say something will NEVER happen. News Flash. There's a baby being born right now who's gonna shatter everything MJ, Kobe, or LBJ has ever done. If we, as humans, can not evolve and build on the groundwork laid by our forefathers then what good are we?

MJ was the most outstanding player ever. His resume is gonna be hard for any player to top but it's not out of the realm of possibility is it? Op, I'm not saying you fit this mold, but the statement just got me thinking about this. Can you honestly sit there and say Kobe has no chance, with at least 5 more years of high level ball left in him, to be the best ever? Lebron James, who, at this age, has accomplished more than MJ? Dwayne Wade? Kevin Durant? Derrick Rose? OJ Mayo? Little Billy in Anytown, USA? Man, MJ was amazing and I feel privilaged to be able to say I've seen him play but the MJ > Food, Water, and Sex talk is just getting out of hand.

This is gonna fall on deaf ears and I'll be called a homer for having a Lakers avi but I guess it just ultimately shows who the real homers and fanatics are.

Fact is you have to be realistic, and you aren't. Me saying Kobe will never be better then Jordan is more realistic then you saying he would average 40, 10, 10 with 6 championshpis/finals mvps.

Also, your whole post is deemed incorrect for the simple fact that I didn't talk abuot young stars, I was talking soley about Kobe (he is 30, not 20 like the younger stars).

Another reason your post fails is because I'm not a Jordan groupie like you think I am ("I'll be called a homer for having a Lakers avi but I guess it just ultimately shows who the real homers and fanatics are" :hammerhead: yeah I'm such a homer and fanatic of Jordan, think this is the second time I ever wrote about him on ISH.

Another reason why your post fails is because you are assuming that I said NO ONE would be better then Jordan. Again, I say something against Kobe and assume that it applies to everyone. Maybe you ARE the homer and fanatic?

Final grade: 0/10

[momo]

(Can we just leave the KB >/=/< stuff for another thread people? Seriously, it is debated to DEATH already. Talk about the videos... Or just give Kblaze props and STFU)

Great advise ...

[YAWN]

When youtube blocks the audio try Yahoo video. Works great for me.

cant you just write the song credits either on the info or add a pop up on the video that credits the song?

[The Magic Man]

Fact is you have to be realistic, and you aren't. Me saying Kobe will never be better then Jordan is more realistic then you saying he would average 40, 10, 10 with 6 championshpis/finals mvps.

Lol, yea, I totally predicted him to average that. :rolleyes: You know damn well what I meant by that scenario. Well, I need to stop assuming guys around here have common sense. My point was that many people here hate Kobe so much that if he was to average ridiculous numbers like that MJ would still be regarded as the GOAT.

Also, your whole post is deemed incorrect for the simple fact that I didn't talk abuot young stars, I was talking soley about Kobe (he is 30, not 20 like the younger stars).

Another reason your post fails is because I'm not a Jordan groupie like you think I am ("I'll be called a homer for having a Lakers avi but I guess it just ultimately shows who the real homers and fanatics are" :hammerhead: yeah I'm such a homer and fanatic of Jordan, think this is the second time I ever wrote about him on ISH.

Another reason why your post fails is because you are assuming that I said NO ONE would be better then Jordan. Again, I say something against Kobe and assume that it applies to everyone. Maybe you ARE the homer and fanatic?

Final grade: 0/10


As for the rest of this tirade, whew! You are all fired up! Okay, based on the part where I had to "explain" myself in red, you obviously didn't read my post thouroughly. I never named names. I even said the post wasn't directed towards the op (although I dont even know who the op was). Actually the I'm not assuming anything about you. And calling me a homer and fanatic? What's that all about? A homer for who? I brought Kobe, LBJ, Mayo, Rose, and Wade into the fold. My overall point is that it is pretty crazy to say no one will ever be better than MJ. I bet no one ever thought they'd see someone close to being on Wilt's level back in the day.

Dude, you should seriously calm down. Lol @ my final grade. don't even get points for filling out my name?

[PleezeBelieve]

lol @ the andgar dude acting like Jordan not only walked on water but hovered over it for sh*ts and giggles.

LeBron will be the GOAT. F*uck all that nonsensical babble you talking. LeBron is walking a path that leads right to such a status.

You're appalling.

[v-unit]

I'm being calm. It's just that you assumed way too much. You said at the end of your post "I guess it just ultimately shows who the real homers and fanatics are" and that sounded like you called me a homer of Jordan (Something I definatly am not).

All I said was that right now, Kobe isn't close to Jordan and has no more chance of being greater then him. It's too late, he isn't going to win 6 more times as the man while averaging crazy numbers. He'll still be a beast though.

I didn't say anything about Rose/LeBron/Mayo/etc that you started talking about.

[andgar923]

Same here. I'm not saying Rose will be the one but it's asanine to sit here and proclaim a rookie, who has maybe 15 years ahead of him will never be better than another guy.

Rose will never be better than MJ.

But I also said that we might see somebody better than him.

[nnn123]

Lol, yea, I totally predicted him to average that. You know damn well what I meant by that scenario. Well, I need to stop assuming guys around here have common sense. My point was that many people here hate Kobe so much that if he was to average ridiculous numbers like that MJ would still be regarded as the GOAT.


I think that a lot of the hate towards Kobe is a direct response to people overrating him earlier during the Lakers 3-Peat year (by overrating I mean saying he's better than Jordan). However, if he was to come into the league and start doing that crazy sh!t that you mentioned at such a young age, then he would be more accepted and less hated. The fact that he won 3 championships created a massive overrating rampage by certain people that I think pissed off Jordan fans, thereby leading to the hate.

Now think about this....In my strong opinion at least, LBJ's career has been more impressive than Kobe's, from ages 18-24 compared to Kobe's 18-24 (yes Kobe won 3 championships, but Lebron also got to the finals, showing he had the potential to win like crazy if he had Shaq and co. on his team. It just seems that LBJ is more individually dominating). Since LBJ's rookie season, his numbers have been off the chart. Because of this fact, I think Jordan fans find LBJ to be more "worthy" of the comparison. I can GUARANTEE that LBJ will never get as much hate (directed from MJ fans) than Kobe, even though it appears that he is the greater threat to surpass Jordan's legacy. So my point is MJ fans hate Kobe not necessarily because of jealousy/fear - although that may be some of it - but that they feel he is unworthy of the comparison. If he was to come into the league and immediately put up the ridiculous numbers that you mentioned then he would be much more accepted.

[andgar923]

I think that a lot of the hate towards Kobe is a direct response to people overrating him earlier during the Lakers 3-Peat year (by overrating I mean saying he's better than Jordan). However, if he was to come into the league and start doing that crazy sh!t that you mentioned at such a young age, then he would be more accepted and less hated. The fact that he won 3 championships created a massive overrating rampage by certain people that I think pissed off Jordan fans, thereby leading to the hate.

Now think about this....In my strong opinion at least, LBJ's career has been more impressive than Kobe's, from ages 18-24 compared to Kobe's 18-24 (yes Kobe won 3 championships, but Lebron also got to the finals, showing he had the potential to win like crazy if he had Shaq and co. on his team. It just seems that LBJ is more individually dominating). Since LBJ's rookie season, his numbers have been off the chart. Because of this fact, I think Jordan fans find LBJ to be more "worthy" of the comparison. I can GUARANTEE that LBJ will never get as much hate (directed from MJ fans) than Kobe, even though it appears that he is the greater threat to surpass Jordan's legacy. So my point is MJ fans hate Kobe not necessarily because of jealousy/fear - although that may be some of it - but that they feel he is unworthy of the comparison. If he was to come into the league and immediately put up the ridiculous numbers that you mentioned then he would be much more accepted.


I think that for the most part that seems to be the case.

I don't think most Jordan fans hate Kobe or think he's a bad player. They hate his fans and think he's a notch or two below MJ which isn't a bad thing. But most do think the hype he's received is bigger than his game.

I think MJ fans for the most part love Bron and Wade.

[gts]

gee another kobe thread, and here's andgar/bruceblitz as always trying to make sure nobody forgets MJ.. it's ok buddy nobody will forget about him if you don't pop into every thread to remind us...

nice job kblaze as always your videos are top flight

[nnn123]

I think that for the most part that seems to be the case.

I don't think most Jordan fans hate Kobe or think he's a bad player. They hate his fans and think he's a notch or two below MJ which isn't a bad thing. But most do think the hype he's received is bigger than his game.

I think MJ fans for the most part love Bron and Wade.


Yeah....and needless to say not all MJ fans hate Kobe of course, some love him....like my brother for example who was a huge MJ guy back in the day...but now cheers for Kobe because he reminds him of Jordan.

[The Magic Man]

I'm being calm. It's just that you assumed way too much. You said at the end of your post "I guess it just ultimately shows who the real homers and fanatics are" and that sounded like you called me a homer of Jordan (Something I definatly am not).

I didn't say anything about Rose/LeBron/Mayo/etc that you started talking about.


Dude! I wasn't even talking about you. I only used the quote. It wasn't geared towards anyone in particular.




Rose will never be better than MJ.

But I also said that we might see somebody better than him..

How can you say that? You have no idea what that man is gonna do in the future. What if he's the one to put up 40/10/10 and win 6 titles and MVPs in a row? Would that not make him the best? I know its a ridiculous analogy but it's like your being very close minded right now.

[Stringer Bell]

Nice video, and nice songs.

Guru sounded less monotone than usual on Work.

[andgar923]

Dude! I wasn't even talking about you. I only used the quote. It wasn't geared towards anyone in particular.





How can you say that? You have no idea what that man is gonna do in the future. What if he's the one to put up 40/10/10 and win 6 titles and MVPs in a row? Would that not make him the best? I know its a ridiculous analogy but it's like your being very close minded right now.

I'm not being closed minded, I'm being realistic.

If he did that than sure...... but that's not being realistic.

I also mentioned that MJ's game was more than stats, so even if he doesn't avg those numbers, but he (or anybody) changes the game, then yeah he's worthy of that.

From what I've seen of Rose during the season, that doesn't seem to be reality.

[andgar923]

gee another kobe thread, and here's andgar/bruceblitz as always trying to make sure nobody forgets MJ.. it's ok buddy nobody will forget about him if you don't pop into every thread to remind us...

nice job kblaze as always your videos are top flight

And here you are complaining as usual.

FACT is.... I wasn't the one that brought him up.

[LA_Showtime]

gee another kobe thread, and here's andgar/bruceblitz as always trying to make sure nobody forgets MJ.. it's ok buddy nobody will forget about him if you don't pop into every thread to remind us...

nice job kblaze as always your videos are top flight

Michael who?

[v-unit]

Dude! I wasn't even talking about you. I only used the quote. It wasn't geared towards anyone in particular.



lol if you quote someone it's understood that you are talking to them or about them

[LA_Showtime]

lol if you quote someone it's understood that you are talking to them or about them

Is that a rule?

[raptorfan_dr07]

lol @ the andgar dude acting like Jordan not only walked on water but hovered over it for sh*ts and giggles.

LeBron will be the GOAT. F*uck all that nonsensical babble you talking. LeBron is walking a path that leads right to such a status.

You're appalling.

As far as basketball's concerned, he did.

And if shooting something like 25% against Boston as well as mailing in one of the worst finals performances in history constitutes "walking a path that leads right to such a status" then I guess I need to change my definition of what being the GOAT means :ohwell: Lebron's one of my favorite players in the league and an amazing player but don't go overboard.

[v-unit]

No. I said it's understood. It's just a natural habit all people create. Doesn't make it a rule. Tipping isn't a rule, but you do it because of what is understood as "right".

****ing laker fans lol

[joe]

Michael Jordan's numbers were absolutely breathtaking. His number of titles, awards, and the way he revolutionized the 2-guard position are unchallenged by any other player.

However..

Lebron can pass him. Not saying he will. Not even saying there's a good or even a mediocre CHANCE that he will. But he has the numbers, which is the first part of the GOAT equation.

Think of it this way. If Lebron maintained his current averages (28-7-7-2) For several more years, all the while increasing his efficiency, you'd probably agree that his statistics are on par with Jordan's. Now, say he does that while winning several championships, making the all-defense teams, collecting MVP's like their Pokemon cards, and simply dominating the league. Well, what can you say?

This scenario is of course unlikely, but it's not THAT unlikely. And if he does it, he might overtake MJ as GOAT. He'd have to obviously DOMINATE though. Like, 6 titles in 7-8 years, to go with 4-5 MVP's. Make every Cavaliers (or Knicks) game unmissable TV. He'd have to force ESPN to create a new network just to showcase his classic playoff performances.

Will it happen? Probably not. There's a reason that Michael Jordan is one of the most recognizable figures in all of sports, or all of the United States for that matter. He dominated like no one else ever has.

But to say that no one has a chance to do it, when Lebron is standing right in front of you? I'd need a word that'd only appear as a series of asterisks to describe you.

[Aussie Outcast]

Whats the last song in part 4?

[Prodigy]

I hate to go through a long post and only pick out one part but the one thing that struck me odd was you saying that Kobe's accomplishments exceed those of Isiah's. That might be true on an individual basis but until Kobe leads his team to two straight titles while being the best player don't you think that's a bit premature?

[rawimpact]

Finnished watching all four of your videos, they were great! I enjoyed the first two, especially since it was almost a biography on his career. But the last two lacked some, but VERY good stuff.

Repped

Raw

[Kblaze8855]

Ok...moving on to phase 2....seen here:

http://video.yahoo.com/watch/4893670/13040611

Often when Kobes legacy is brought up the fact that he won 3 titles as #2 is used to kinda suggest he shouldnt get full credit. And of course he never will get the credit Shaq did. But the guy was an elite player even back then. Kobe was playing at a legit all star level at 19. People were upset he was an all star when he was coming off the bench in 98...he only put up 14-15 a game on the year....but before the ASG? He averaged 18 a game. He was like half a point behind Eddie Jones. He was an 18ppg 6th man on a team on pace for 61 wins(and they ended up winning exactly 61). Mo Williams, Jameer Nelson, Ray Allen, and many other all stars had similar first half and made all star games. Didnt start. But really...you could argue he belonged there.

And by the time they got to finals? Kobe was one of the best defenders in the league, best scorers, and was already one of the more clutch players in the league. One thing that I never liked about the idea that anyone(any star guard) could stand in for Kobe and win it all with Shaq...

A lot of things had to happen for them to win. They were down 15 in the 4th of game 7 vs the Blazers. They were a couple shots from losing in the 02 WCF. Kobe took over with Shaq out vs the Pacers. A lot of things had to happen for them to win all those rings. Can never say anyone does them.

Thats why John Havlicek is always gonna rank over Chet Walker. Why we all know Bob Cousy and few know Guy Rodgers. Maybe Michael Ray Richardson wins rings with MVP level Kareem like Magic did for his first 2 rings? Who knows? Hypothetical is just that.

For all we know AI couldnt function with Shaq as long as Kobe did. Kobe didnt get that Shaq level love till about 2001 or 2002. Maybe Vince Carter comes in and takes LA by storm....his flashy(even compared to Kobe) style gets him more fan love than Shaq earlier. Maybe Shaq gets jealous early and the team breaks down before they get to 3 ringgs. Tmac couldnt get out of round one with Yao. Yao is no shaq...but when he was traded there damn near every Kobe haters was saying now we could see what one of Kobes fellow star guards could do with maybe the best center in the league.

Maybe a bunch of guys oculd win with Shaq. Maybe Mitch Richmond had 6 rings in Pippens place. Maybe Maurice Stokes on Boston stays healthy and wins 11 rings. So what? Too much happened in that stretch to just say anyone could do it. And even if anyone could...they didnt. Why make Kobe the only guy in history who doesnt get credit for what they do because maybe someone else could have too?

Kobe earned all 3 of those rings and being likely to end up with at least 4? I think in the end he gets nearly full credit for all of them. As he should. "As best player" matters...but it doesnt make the other 7-8 years of his career irrelevant.

He was out there putting up 50....having 32/5/5 months at like 21...locking guys down...taking over late.

He earned my respect in the title years...even if Lebron would have likely won them too.

[rawimpact]

completely agree, i remember having a basketball card with shaq and kobe averaging 29ppg both in a LA uniform!

If those idiots say kobe didn't earn those rings than neither did pierce and ray.

[Kblaze8855]

Id compare it more to like....Moses and Dr.J.

[momo]

Id compare it more to like....Moses and Dr.J.

Yea, I think about that combo a lot as a historical parallel. Most or one of the most dominant big's of the era and one of the most dominant wing guys...

~~~

Great stuff again. Nice seeing all the dimes from KB to Shaq... I think people forget how much they hooked each other up on the hardwood.

I love this one bit in #3 with D fish on the wah-we-awhs and checking KB for a step or 2... and then just lets the big deal with getting posterized. You can almost hear fish thinking " noooo, not me, I have watched this too many times" :P

[bokes15]

I 100% agree with everything you said, and it is the personal reason that im so hard on Kobe, cause I know how good he is, but when compared to MJ, he falls short badly. And of course Kobe is 2nd best 2guard, but that can easily be passed by Wade through 10 more years. When thinking about MJ, he was no doubt the best player in the NBA while he played, no of the other perimeter players stopped or scared MJ, everybody knew they had no chance.
I agree that MJ was better, but to be fair, MJ didn't have a Lebron and a Wade in his era. I don't think that if lets say a prime MJ, Lebron, Wade and Kobe all played in the same era there would be as great as a separation as what he had.

[OldSchoolBBall]

I agree that MJ was better, but to be fair, MJ didn't have a Lebron and a Wade in his era. I don't think that if lets say a prime MJ, Lebron, Wade and Kobe all played in the same era there would be as great as a separation as what he had.

My ass. Jordan wasn't just better than the wing players of his era, he was better than EVERYONE -- centers, PF's etc. And lol @ you if you think that guys like Kobe/Wade/Lebron have more impact than guys like Magic/Bird/Hakeem/Barkley/DRob (and in the cases where they do, e.g. Lebron having more impact than, say, DRob, it's close enough).

Jordan would easily be considered the best player today, posting PERs of 31+ as well as being the best defensive wing in the league and the clutchest player in the league. Jordan was clearly considered better than Magic by 1989 -- is Kobe or Wade better than Magic? :oldlol:

[unbreakable]

Good stuff, Blaze.

[Brunch@Five]

Jordan was clearly considered better than Magic by 1989

Is that why Magic won back2back MVPs in '89 and '90?

[kap]

i watched the whole thing in 1 sitting :P thanks kblaze that was entertaining

[OldSchoolBBall]

Is that why Magic won back2back MVPs in '89 and '90?

Keep telling yourself that Jordan wasn't considered better than Magic by at least 85% of people by 1989. :oldlol:

[LAClipsFan33]

Is that why Magic won back2back MVPs in '89 and '90?

So I guess Steve Nash was a better than Kobe from 2004 - 2006

:confusedshrug:

[Brunch@Five]

Keep telling yourself that Jordan wasn't considered better than Magic by at least 85% of people by 1989. :oldlol:

why did Magic win back2back MVPs then?

You remember he averaged 23/8/13 on 50/90 shooting in '89, do you?

also, a big lol at the guy above me comparing Magic to Nash :oldlol:

[dynasty1978]

Keep telling yourself that Jordan wasn't considered better than Magic by at least 85% of people by 1989. :oldlol:

How old are you Loki? Most fans I knew at this time referred to Jordan as a domininant individual player, but also a stat stuffer who couldn't lead a team to a championship, while Magic was considered the ultimate winner, and still capable of dominating most facets of the game.

[dynasty1978]

and only a lunatic MJ fan would cite 85%....are you Brian Fantana? 65% of the time, it works every time.

[Kblaze8855]

I dont know about 85%. Jordan didnt get that "The best....period" status for a little while longer. In 89? I think magic would have had more behind him than 15%. People were calling MJ the GOAT in like 89 but Magic and Bird still had people saying they were the best because they could win.

[lxlHoTsAuSelxl]

So I guess Steve Nash was a better than Kobe from 2004 - 2006

:confusedshrug:


:eek: :eek: :applause: Congrats, first time ever giving props to Kobe even though you'll jump off the bandwagon soon.

[Kblaze8855]

Team has it all. And they are young. No reason they shouldnt win a title. Or two.

And if it happens Kobe haters beware. Kobe with 5 rings and 7 finals? you know what will happen. A few people were saying he was as good as Jordan when I first got here(01-02 season). I will leave it at that.

Ok...

5 and 7 finals. Im gonna give it a few days to sink in....

On one hand...hes John Havlicek. On the other....hes Magic Johnson.

[zizozain]

any Dirk vids.?