Mark Cuban yells at K-Mart's Mom...

[niko]

Mark Cuban getting into the spirit of mother's day a day early...

http://sports.espn.go.com/nba/playoffs/2009/news/story?id=4157481
BEGIN
The NBA is reviewing a postgame confrontation between Mark Cuban and the mother of Denver Nuggets forward Kenyon Martin during which the Dallas Mavericks owner referred to Martin as a "thug" or a "punk," according to a report in The Denver Post.

Cuban told the Denver newspaper by e-mail that as he walked off the court after the Mavericks' Saturday night loss in Dallas, he saw Martin's mother, Lydia Moore, as a fan was yelling that the Nuggets were "thugs."

"That includes your son," Cuban said to Moore, according to his e-mail to The Post.

Martin's agent, Brian Dyke, had a different take on the incident, The Post reported. According to Dyke, an unprovoked Cuban told Moore, "Your son is a punk."

Either way, NBA spokesman Tim Frank told the paper the "situation on the floor postgame is being reviewed."
END

Fun Stuff. What the NBA should really review is what drug Antoine Wright is taking that putting two hands up in the air in the NOT ME position signifies that you took a foul.

[SRZ66]

cant say i disagree with puban

[BirdNasty]

HAHAHA, great stuff. Cuban and his Mavs should stay home....This series is over. Sweep that court

[GOBB]

Now if Kenyon Martin punches Mark Cuban out then what? Thats someone mom. You dont disrespect mothers. Cuban was wrong. His version doesnt even seem accurate. Kmart mom was yelling "Nuggets are thugs!". Huh? Shut up. Cuban was obviously pissed off when the game ended. Even shoved a camera man and you can see him mouthing off to someone off in the stands.

[fatboy11]

He was right, but you don't say that to the guy's mom. That's pretty disrespectful. I know Cuban is an emotional, passionate owner, but he messed up there.

And for the record, yes, I do think Kenyon Martin is a "punk" and a bit of a "thug", but honestly, his team needs that. You need that to go deep in the playoffs. Just ask the Knicks when they had Anthony Mason and Charles Oakley. You need those guys. Cuban really doesn't have one right now and I'm sure he wouldn't be throwing those words out if someone like that played for his team.

[GOBB]

Oakley is never called a thug tho on this site. How is Oakley not a punk nor a thug. But Kmart is. I'm lost. People embrace the days of the Bad Boys. Featuring dirty players. Yet when todays players mimick it they are punks and thugs? Why couldnt they be considered the same things you called Oakley and guys of his caliber back then. Lets keep in mind Oakley couldnt do what he did in todays game. He took would have to have some form of resistence given consequences, punishments.

Just curious.


Sidenote: The things that irked me about Kmart was much like Alonzo. This flexing of the bicep and mean muggin. Kmart would often catch an ally oop then throw punches at the ball as it bounced. Cant stand that. lol

[niko]

Now if Kenyon Martin punches Mark Cuban out then what? Thats someone mom. You dont disrespect mothers. Cuban was wrong. His version doesnt even seem accurate. Kmart mom was yelling "Nuggets are thugs!". Huh? Shut up. Cuban was obviously pissed off when the game ended. Even shoved a camera man and you can see him mouthing off to someone off in the stands.

What you said. K-Mart's mom yelling WE THUGS WE THUGS and then Cuban makes a witty comment on it to her. WTF....sounds fishy...

[Toizumi]

What you said. K-Mart's mom yelling WE THUGS WE THUGS and then Cuban makes a witty comment on it to her. WTF....sounds fishy...

Lol nah it's just a strange sentence


he (cuban) saw Martin's mother, Lydia Moore, at the same time some random fan was yelling that the Nuggets were "thugs" and that was when he said: "that includes your son"

... I didnt get it either at first..

Gotta show some respect to mothers. :rant I think that was pretty fckn low by Cuban..

[Sanity]

So was Martin's mom saying her son's team was playing "dirty" or thugz as in my sons team consists of Tupacs?

Edit: never mind it was another fan who said it. Yeah thats a weird sentence

[Valliant13]

I'm not a K-Mart fan...but if he smashed Cubans bloated face for that I'd consider it wholly justified. There are lines you don't cross...Cuban's pansy tantrum crossed one of the biggest ones.

[GOBB]

Lol nah it's just a strange sentence

and that was when he said: "that includes your son"

... I didnt get it either at first..

Gotta show some respect to mothers. :rant I think that was pretty fckn low by Cuban..

:roll: Damn good catch.

[phoenix18]

I would tear Cuban up. He think he is the ish when all he is, is a buff nerd.

[OneMoreSucka]

Stay classy Cuban! :applause:

Still can't believe he wasn't fined for shoving the cameraman.

[Younggrease]

Cuban should get fined for pushing the cameraman doing his tirade.

[niko]

I just thought the whole thing was a lot of fake anger on Dallas's part, because honestly, i would be pissed at Antoine Wright cause he went out of his way to make it look like he DID NOT FOUL (he also didn't tell the refs the team planned to foul, no one did) and then they got all upset, and then after the game all the hysterical bull**** they pulled, it was ridiculous.

[fatboy11]

Oakley is never called a thug tho on this site. How is Oakley not a punk nor a thug. But Kmart is. I'm lost. People embrace the days of the Bad Boys. Featuring dirty players. Yet when todays players mimick it they are punks and thugs? Why couldnt they be considered the same things you called Oakley and guys of his caliber back then. Lets keep in mind Oakley couldnt do what he did in todays game. He took would have to have some form of resistence given consequences, punishments.He's not called a thug on this site because he doesn't play in the NBA anymore, and most of the people that post here probably weren't old enough to know the Charles Oakley of the Knicks days.

But whether or not he is called a thug or a punk doesn't change the fact that he was. And so were guys like Rick Mahorn. And when I say "thug", I don't mean in the literal, street sense. He's not stealing old ladies' purses or robbing liquor stores. I mean on the court. But like I said, there's nothing wrong with that. That's his role. He plays exactly the way I'd want him to play if he were on my team.

[GOBB]

He's not called a thug on this site because he doesn't play in the NBA anymore, and most of the people that post here probably weren't old enough to know the Charles Oakley of the Knicks days.

But whether or not he is called a thug or a punk doesn't change the fact that he was. And so were guys like Rick Mahorn.

Ok that makes sense.

You come out of your hole when Hou ties it up? j/k lol

[fatboy11]

Ok that makes sense.

You come out of your hole when Hou ties it up? j/k lol:roll:

Nah, they're still going to lose. I hope they don't, but I know better.

[NugzFan]

real classy cuban!

[StroShow4]

That's pathetic, Cuban.. Like Gobb said, you need some guys with attitude like KMart to get anywhere in the playoffs. The Mavs really could use some "thugs" on their roster.

[Sonic R]

Damn Cuban… I've always been a fan of him but going a bit too far here… Leave Kenyon's mom out of it.

In other things, I cannot group K-Mart in the same class of guys like Mahorn, Oakley, Mason, X-man… they were some real ruff necks. K-mart is a different generation of "tough guy" but not a ruff neck like the olden days… Guys like Oak and Mahorn were enforcers.

I think K-mart get some of his "thug" label from being insubordinate… clashing with Karl and authority… :confusedshrug:

[StroShow4]

[QUOTE=Sonic R]Damn Cuban

[fatboy11]

[QUOTE=Sonic R]In other things, I cannot group K-Mart in the same class of guys like Mahorn, Oakley, Mason, X-man

[fatboy11]

I still don't understand why KMart is labeled by many as a "fake thug" whereas these other guys are considered real enforcers. What makes Kenyon fake and these other dudes real?Well, for one, Charles Oakely has been arrested on multiple occasions. Once for refusing to put on a shirt while dancing in a Miami night club.:oldlol:

I wouldn't really call Rick Mahorn a thug. He was more a bully-type. Anthony Mason got into some legal trouble, too. I'd group him in with Oakley.

I can't think off hand of anything Martin's gotten into off the court. I wouldn't call the guy a "fake thug". I think it's just that players in the league aren't as hard as those guys of the late 80s/early 90s were. A lot of that societal and such.

[Sonic R]

Well, you are right. Kenyon is a bit more skilled than those players (save for X-Man and maybe Mason). Guys like Oakley and Mahorn were out there specifically to be enforcers and be rough, and I don't think K-Mart is has that type of a role. You really can't have that Oakley/Mahorn-type in the NBA anymore, like GOBB said. Why else does Danny Fortson not have a job? :confusedshrug: The NBA phased his type out with the way the game is officiated now.

Those guys would smack K-Mart around, in my opinion. But players like K-Mart or Kendrick Perkins are about as close as you'll get to an "enforcer" these days.

For sure.
The pussification of the league essentially phased out the old ruff necks.
Guys like K-mart and Perkins are the new generation of enforcers.

[GOBB]

Danny Fortson shoutout. Man i forgot all about dude.

[Sonic R]

I still don't understand why KMart is labeled by many as a "fake thug" whereas these other guys are considered real enforcers. What makes Kenyon fake and these other dudes real?

I never called K-mart a "fake thug"

[nbastatus]

not surprised, cuban just being himself.

[StroShow4]

[QUOTE=Sonic R]I never called K-mart a "fake thug"

[icemanfan]

Oakley is never called a thug tho on this site. How is Oakley not a punk nor a thug. But Kmart is. I'm lost. People embrace the days of the Bad Boys. Featuring dirty players. Yet when todays players mimick it they are punks and thugs? Why couldnt they be considered the same things you called Oakley and guys of his caliber back then. Lets keep in mind Oakley couldnt do what he did in todays game. He took would have to have some form of resistence given consequences, punishments.

Just curious.


Sidenote: The things that irked me about Kmart was much like Alonzo. This flexing of the bicep and mean muggin. Kmart would often catch an ally oop then throw punches at the ball as it bounced. Cant stand that. lol
Oak is just a bad mother ****er. Oak would not look to fight some one weak or small he would go after the biggest badest mother on the court and kick their ass. Oak was the man. K-Mart is a wantabe and Cuban is a straight up punk ***** for going to the guys mother. Personally I would kick his ass and if K-Mart truly was a thug he would too.

P.S. whats up GOBB been a while.

[GOBB]

Oak is just a bad mother ****er. Oak would not look to fight some one weak or small he would go after the biggest badest mother on the court and kick their ass. Oak was the man. K-Mart is a wantabe and Cuban is a straight up punk ***** for going to the guys mother. Personally I would kick his ass and if K-Mart truly was a thug he would too.

P.S. whats up GOBB been a while.

I will have to agrew with everyone. It seemed Oak was cut from a different cloth. :oldlol:

Whats up iceman. Been awhile indeed. What do you think about your team this season and any changes/wants next season besides being healthy of course.

[StroShow4]

Nope, I guess you didn't. But I have seen alot of posters here say things like that about him.

Exhibit A:


K-Mart is a wantabe

:confusedshrug:

[Sonic R]

Exhibit A:



:confusedshrug:
:confusedshrug: :confusedshrug:

K-mart is straight in my book

[KRAYZIE]

What's a wantabe?:confusedshrug:

[StroShow4]

What's a wantabe?:confusedshrug:

Wantabe = Wannabe/Fugazy/Wankster/Poser/Etc. :lol



Basically someone who desires/pretends to be something that they are not.

[KRAYZIE]

Wantabe = Wannabe/Fugazy/Wankster/Poser/Etc. :lol



Basically someone who desires/pretends to be something that they are not.
Oh, thought he made it up. Sounds corny.:oldlol:

[GOBB]

Kmart said he will approach Cuban personally. Said he will meet him face to face and that its personal. Uh oh

[fatboy11]

Kmart said he will approach Cuban personally. Said he will meet him face to face and that its personal. Uh ohYeah, I hope the cameras catch this.

http://sports.espn.go.com/nba/playoffs/2009/news/story?id=4158987

[KRAYZIE]

"Don't say nothing to my kids or my family," Martin said, according to The Post. "If you got something to say, say it to me. But I'm going to take care of it. I'm not going to do the whole media thing, back and forth. That's his thing. I'm more of a face-to-face type of dude."

But when the game is over, you don't say nothing to nobody's parents; especially mine. My mom or my kids, you don't have no words for them. I'll take care of it."

Cuban just crapped his pants.:roll:

[oh the horror]

Well Cuban was extremely out of line. Wtf was he thinking when he said that to his mother?

[lolwut]

K Mart is right next to Artest on the list of humans on earth NOT to mess with.

I don't dislike Cuban, but this was a really stupid move.

[bdreason]

I think it would be hilarious if Kenyon did confront Cuban... and Cuban whooped his a$$.

You never know, Cuban could be training MMA behind closed doors... he does promote MMA events under HDNET.

[CroqueMort]

His mother should have shut the **** up in a first place.

[fatboy11]

His mother should have shut the **** up in a first place.I don't see any evidence that she actually said anything.

[mlh1981]

What a jerk. I appreciate his passion as an owner, but this was a really stupid thing to get involved with. I could tell he was pissed when he was leaving the court. He had every right to be angry, but as the owner of a multi-million dollar corporation, he needs to conduct himself in a professional manner. Stuff like this is absolute horsesh!t.

[Big#50]

Cuban is a spoiled flamboyant gay man, leave him be.

[StroShow4]

Handle your business Kenyon, just try not to get suspended from any games. :oldlol:

[reppy]

There are times when you love Mark Cuban.. this is not one of them.

[beasly15]

it is always a beautiful thing seeing dallas go home, but i would rather them win and see cuban get his ass whooped..

[utahjazzrock]

Lol nah it's just a strange sentence

and that was when he said: "that includes your son"

... I didnt get it either at first..

Gotta show some respect to mothers. :rant I think that was pretty fckn low by Cuban..
Good catch.
I though K-Mart's mom was yelling it.
That makes much more sense now but it was dumb of him to say it.

[miniharrison37]

Mark Cuban has some major problems.

[BallPhunk]

I just thought the whole thing was a lot of fake anger on Dallas's part, because honestly, i would be pissed at Antoine Wright cause he went out of his way to make it look like he DID NOT FOUL (he also didn't tell the refs the team planned to foul, no one did) and then they got all upset, and then after the game all the hysterical bull**** they pulled, it was ridiculous.

+11

The more I heard them complain, the less I cared.

And I welcome getting to see this freakin face again:

http://latimesblogs.latimes.com/photos/uncategorized/2008/11/18/cubannov18.jpg
http://mavsblog.dallasnews.com/cubannotimetotalk.jpg
http://images.usatoday.com/sports/_photos/2006/05/17/cuban.jpg
http://www.thebettyfactor.com/wp-content/uploads/2008/11/markcubanhidingfaceinhandsphoto5-1-07-reuters-jessicarinaldi.jpg

:cheers:

[BRabbiT]

http://www.thebettyfactor.com/wp-content/uploads/2008/11/markcubanhidingfaceinhandsphoto5-1-07-reuters-jessicarinaldi.jpg


this is hilarious. the ref's weren't responsible for playing D.

[Mile High Crew]

Mark Cuban......an example of a classless owner.

[godofgods]

Cuban said the honest truth.

But really, this is just a bad matchup for the Mavs. KMart is a fake tough guy and a punkassbeyotch, but if a team beats you 7-0 in one season, they got your number.

[tontoz]

Kmart is in an awkward spot. He definitely wants to beat his ass in a bad way but there is no way to do it without it becoming public.

Cuban deserves whatever he gets.

[OneMoreSucka]

I still can't believe Cuban gets away with all the **** he does. No other owner is this moronic.

[Solid Snake]

Cuban. What a classic, gay man.

Homosexual.

[StroShow4]

Update from the TNT crew: Cuban says Kenyon's mom can sit next to him any time she wants.

[Diesel J]

Cuban. What a classic, gay man.

Homosexual.

:oldlol:

[miniharrison37]

Cuban is a spoiled flamboyant gay man, leave him be.
lol:oldlol:

[nbastatus]

im pretty sure he said "happy mother's day" after his homo speech.

[InspiredLebowski]

Update from the TNT crew: Cuban says Kenyon's mom can sit next to him any time she wants.

Like they were saying, Cuban needs to man up and apologize. Whether you agree with what he said or not, you don't say that to the dude's mom, especially not in the way he did by pointing a finger in her face. I'd have no problem with it if Martin knocked him out.

[shadow]

Like they were saying, Cuban needs to man up and apologize. Whether you agree with what he said or not, you don't say that to the dude's mom, especially not in the way he did by pointing a finger in her face. I'd have no problem with it if Martin knocked him out.

well said.

[yeaaaman]

I just thought the whole thing was a lot of fake anger on Dallas's part, because honestly, i would be pissed at Antoine Wright cause he went out of his way to make it look like he DID NOT FOUL (he also didn't tell the refs the team planned to foul, no one did) and then they got all upset, and then after the game all the hysterical bull**** they pulled, it was ridiculous.

Yes I agree I think it was out of anger but more so towards the refs and the fact they lost the game in such a tough manner. I mean if the NBA came out and said the officials made a mistake I think it's safe to say he fouled him.

Second, I think once Wright saw the ref wasn't going to call the foul he put his hands up so he didn't get called for a 3 shot shooting foul and just hope melo would miss the shot. And you don't tell the refs, they know you have a foul to give and with Carlisle standing there yelling "get him get him" or whatever, I think the refs should know what was going on. Yes it sucks for them and I guess he should have fouled harder but I don't understand the hysterical bull**** they pulled, I mean they were upset on the court who wouldn't be? If your not upset you shouldn't be playing. If you hear Carlisle he took it well all things considered. Again, the league came out admitting a mistake so I don't understand why you think the Mavericks aren't going to be upset. That's their season right there.

[InspiredLebowski]

Cuban's apology (http://blogmaverick.com/2009/05/12/an-apology-to-kenyon-martins-mom-2/)

[halffttime]

Cuban's apology (http://blogmaverick.com/2009/05/12/an-apology-to-kenyon-martins-mom-2/)

that nice of him to finally man up..


When the series comes back to Dallas, your family, and the family of other Nuggets players are welcome to stay in my suite, with my family.

lol he's so sure that the series is coming back to dallas.. :oldlol:

[godofgods]

Cuban's apology (http://blogmaverick.com/2009/05/12/an-apology-to-kenyon-martins-mom-2/)

Great. Now if only Big Baby will do the same.

[32jazz]

Oakley is never called a thug tho on this site. How is Oakley not a punk nor a thug. But Kmart is. I'm lost. People embrace the days of the Bad Boys. Featuring dirty players. Yet when todays players mimick it they are punks and thugs? Why couldnt they be considered the same things you called Oakley and guys of his caliber back then. Lets keep in mind Oakley couldnt do what he did in todays game. He took would have to have some form of resistence given consequences, punishments.

Just curious.



The same reason Charles Barkley is able to spit on a 8 or 10(?) year old child/fan,spoke of generally hating white people,whine about his contract/money,etc., ......but people just laugh at the old chuckster. Now let any post 80's/Dream Team star try & get away with half the stuff(except Shaq)many of the troubled stars of the 80's got away with.

There is this sickening media/fanboy love affair with the 80's & the Magic/Bird era & an unending outpouring of goodwill which is also apparent here on the ISH. In general it seems 'most'(not all) NBA stars of that era can get away with behavior that today's players can't & that goodwill has evaporated as evidenced by outright hostility towards the 2004 Olympic team.

[CroqueMort]

We all know the spitting incident, and that he aimed another jackass but unfortunately spat on that little girl. They say that they have a good relation now.

Anyway it was a good decision from Mark Cuban to apologyze, even if He was not guilty at 100%.

[niko]

Yes I agree I think it was out of anger but more so towards the refs and the fact they lost the game in such a tough manner. I mean if the NBA came out and said the officials made a mistake I think it's safe to say he fouled him.

Second, I think once Wright saw the ref wasn't going to call the foul he put his hands up so he didn't get called for a 3 shot shooting foul and just hope melo would miss the shot. And you don't tell the refs, they know you have a foul to give and with Carlisle standing there yelling "get him get him" or whatever, I think the refs should know what was going on. Yes it sucks for them and I guess he should have fouled harder but I don't understand the hysterical bull**** they pulled, I mean they were upset on the court who wouldn't be? If your not upset you shouldn't be playing. If you hear Carlisle he took it well all things considered. Again, the league came out admitting a mistake so I don't understand why you think the Mavericks aren't going to be upset. That's their season right there.

no, you are wrong. it is not the ref's responsibility to track number of fouls, the number of fouls should not impact a call. and it is an established nba tradition to let the refs know you are fouling intentionally, so they call it quicker and don't think you are trying to rough someone up when you grab them. so basically, i am speaking from fact and you are speaking from what you think.

i don't care what anyone says, two hands up in the air like the cops are pointing a gun at you is not a sign for I FOULED, it's a sign for NOT ME.

[John Smith]

Well, Kenyon Martin is a thug. So is half of Denver's roster. Martin can get all pissy but his momma must be somewhat f'd up herself to raise kenyon to be who is today which is an overgrown ten year old with wack tats and a thug mentality. you can take the thug out the ghetto but you can't take the ghetto out of the thug. sadly, you see this with a TON of nba players today.

on a side note, cuban doesn't look the same. he looks like a mutant clone compared to how he did 3 years ago. I think he's had a face lift and some other gay sheet done.

[Toizumi]

no, you are wrong. it is not the ref's responsibility to track number of fouls, the number of fouls should not impact a call. and it is an established nba tradition to let the refs know you are fouling intentionally, so they call it quicker and don't think you are trying to rough someone up when you grab them. so basically, i am speaking from fact and you are speaking from what you think.

i don't care what anyone says, two hands up in the air like the cops are pointing a gun at you is not a sign for I FOULED, it's a sign for NOT ME.


:applause: First thing I thought when I saw that play. Terribly stupid by Wright. I just dont get it, I know he was trying to foul.. but it just looks like he's throwing his hands up as a way of saying: no foul here, I didnt touch him :wtf:

[32jazz]

Well, Kenyon Martin is a thug. So is half of Denver's roster. Martin can get all pissy but his momma must be somewhat f'd up herself to raise kenyon to be who is today which is an overgrown ten year old with wack tats and a thug mentality. you can take the thug out the ghetto but you can't take the ghetto out of the thug. sadly, you see this with a TON of nba players today.


First of all, why would you continue to support/care about these 'tons' of 'thugs' in the NBA?

Funny how David Stern & I rarely hear the term 'thugs' thrown around at clowns like Roger Clemens & MLB Players who routinely get into brawls.


And people still foolishly/naively wonder why the League has cracked down on the hard fouls(which leads to fights/brawls).:confusedshrug:
This guy represents what Stern feels many people feel about his Players.

[John Smith]

First of all, why would you continue to support/care about these 'tons' of 'thugs' in the NBA?

Funny how David Stern & I rarely hear the term 'thugs' thrown around at clowns like Roger Clemens & MLB Players who routinely get into brawls.


And people still foolishly/naively wonder why the League has cracked down on the hard fouls(which leads to fights/brawls).:confusedshrug:
This guy represents what Stern feels many people feel about his Players.

I liked the NBA when there wasn't the thug/rap mentality. You know, before Biggie. Before every nba baller thought they could rap too (yeah you ron artest). i'm not going to quit watching the game because of a few bad apples.

Roger Clemens is not a thug. He may cheat but he keeps his mouth shout and doesn't act all fugazy on the field. He went about his business with respect for his opponents. Unlike the big headed kenyon martin. When the Nugz had Camby and no Billups, they were 100% thugz. I guarantee George Karl blows blunts with Melo and the Birdman.

[32jazz]

I liked the NBA when there wasn't the thug/rap mentality. You know, before Biggie. Before every nba baller thought they could rap too (yeah you ron artest). i'm not going to quit watching the game because of a few bad apples.

Roger Clemens is not a thug. He may cheat but he keeps his mouth shout and doesn't act all fugazy on the field. He went about his business with respect for his opponents. Unlike the big headed kenyon martin. When the Nugz had Camby and no Billups, they were 100% thugz. I guarantee George Karl blows blunts with Melo and the Birdman.

Again why still watch/support these millionaire thugs? I would never knowingly support anyone I have that big of an issue with.:confusedshrug:


Roger Clemen's menacing on the mound & throwing broken bats at the heads of his opponenents is him just being a good old boy right:rolleyes: So Martin running his mouth is a problem for you although trash talk has been part of the NBA since forever ,(especially in the 80's/90's with Bird/MJ/Payton,Barkley,etc.....) ,but I have never seen him assault anyone.

The posters who get on here & whine about the NBA's crack down on hard fouls & fights(Flagrant fouls/ejections) have people who think like Joh Smith to thank.

[John Smith]

So Denver now represents the entire NBA? My team doesn't have thugs. And I support my city and my city's teams no matter how bad they may be. Always have, always will. I don't go to the games, I don't buy jerseys with other men's names on the back. I don't support the NBA, I just watch it. I'll DVR the games and then watch them later. So i can fast forward through the commercials, free throws, etc. and just watch the final two minutes of each quarter or just fast forward the entire game if it is super boring like the last Cavs game.

Get this...I want Denver to win it all. I like Chauncey Billups. He represents what is good with the NBA and pro sports as a whole. I just call a spade a spade or in this case a thug a thug.

[32jazz]

So Denver now represents the entire NBA? My team doesn't have thugs. And I support my city and my city's teams no matter how bad they may be. Always have, always will. I don't go to the games, I don't buy jerseys with other men's names on the back. I don't support the NBA, I just watch it. I'll DVR the games and then watch them later. So i can fast forward through the commercials, free throws, etc. and just watch the final two minutes of each quarter or just fast forward the entire game if it is super boring like the last Cavs game.

Get this...I want Denver to win it all. I like Chauncey Billups. He represents what is good with the NBA and pro sports as a whole. I just call a spade a spade or in this case a thug a thug.

Supporting one team is doing your part in supporting the Leagus as a whole. :applause:


Interesting how Clemens meanacing players on the mound & throwing broken(sharp edged) bats at other players heads is overlooked by you & those of your ilk. He is defensible ,but a few trashtalking NBA players(in the mold of Bird/Barkley/MJ/Payton,etc....) are instant 'thugs' yet you don't personally know these people.


Thanks for helping to prove what David Stern feels many in the general public think about his players. The more you post the more you prove my point why the NBA is justified in getting rid of the physical garbage that was once played by teams of the blindly beloved late 80's/90's(Bad Boys/Knicks) which had begun to infect the entire League & ruin the game.
Glad the League decided to bring that nonsense to a end.

Kenyon Martin I'm sure thanks you for your support.

[John Smith]

Your obvious hate for Roger Clemens has no place in this thread or on this board, you boston red sox fan you. #1 he is white. How many white thugs do you know? seriously, stats don't lie like % of the prison population. #2, clemens doesn't walk around with a terrible disposition/body language. #3, Clemens actually knows how to use the english language when 99% of thugs do not know anything besides ebonics (white ones too/if you grow up in the gutter you are going to talk like you are from the gutter). and #4, Clemens isn't tatted up like most thugs/kenyon martin is. it really is foolish of you to bring up clemens. take your red sox hat off already...

[BeebCats]

Your obvious hate for Roger Clemens has no place in this thread or on this board, you boston red sox fan you. #1 he is white. How many white thugs do you know? seriously, stats don't lie like % of the prison population. #2, clemens doesn't walk around with a terrible disposition/body language. #3, Clemens actually knows how to use the english language when 99% of thugs do not know anything besides ebonics (white ones too/if you grow up in the gutter you are going to talk like you are from the gutter). and #4, Clemens isn't tatted up like most thugs/kenyon martin is. it really is foolish of you to bring up clemens. take your red sox hat off already...

How would you define thug?

Thug: A cutthroat or ruffian; a hoodlum.
Hoodlum: A gangster; a tough, often aggressive or violent youth

Being tatted up doesn't mean you are a thug.
Trash talking doesn't mean you are a thug.
Ebonics doesn't mean you are a thug.
Being black doesn't mean you are a thug.
A "terrible disposition/body language" doesn't mean you are a thug.

I hate when people try to say "____ is a thug" when really, unless there has been publicly announced crimes or something to that effect, people have no clue. We don't know these players personally, all we can do is make assumptions based on their looks; but then again, I'm sure everybody's heard "you can't judge a book by it's cover".

I'm not necessarily referring to K-Mart in this, I'm just saying in general.

[John Smith]

I define a thug as a criminal who acts and behaves like one. plus, they look like a thug/criminal. in american society, most criminals tend to be black, poorly educated, tatted up, and can't use the english language properly. Yeah, that sounds like Kenyon Martin. besides, think about what group of people glorifies the movie scarface and his way of life...there is certainly one group that does it more than the others. That right there lets you know which group has more thugs and the more thuggish ruggish mentality. and we all know which group dominates the NBA opposed to MLB or the NHL. Thus, the NBA having a ton of thugs or people who think they are thugs/act like they are thugs through communication (both verbal and non-verbal) as well as their actions (such as getting a ton of tattoos and being ill tempered/emotional/non-intellectual) like Kenyon Martin.

[Mor'Fiyah]

I define a thug as a criminal who acts and behaves like one. plus, they look like a thug/criminal. in american society, most criminals tend to be black, poorly educated, tatted up, and can't use the english language properly. Yeah, that sounds like Kenyon Martin. besides, think about what group of people glorifies the movie scarface and his way of life...there is certainly one group that does it more than the others. That right there lets you know which group has more thugs and the more thuggish ruggish mentality. and we all know which group dominates the NBA opposed to MLB or the NHL. Thus, the NBA having a ton of thugs or people who think they are thugs/act like they are thugs through communication (both verbal and non-verbal) as well as their actions (such as getting a ton of tattoos and being ill tempered/emotional/non-intellectual) like Kenyon Martin.


Holy crap! Put another coat or ignorance on your post why don't you...

[BeebCats]

I define a thug as a criminal who acts and behaves like one. plus, they look like a thug/criminal. in american society, most criminals tend to be black, poorly educated, tatted up, and can't use the english language properly. Yeah, that sounds like Kenyon Martin. besides, think about what group of people glorifies the movie scarface and his way of life...there is certainly one group that does it more than the others. That right there lets you know which group has more thugs and more thuggish ruggish mentality.

But has he actually committed any crimes? I'm asking because I honestly don't know.

Well, I just did a quick wiki search... I don't see any criminal activity, but I noticed:

A) Kenyon graduated with a Bachelor's Degree in Criminal Justice.
B) [...] Martin's speech impediment and eye twitching tic [...]

I dunno, but a guy with a degree in criminal justice wouldn't seem like someone to go out performing criminal activities (and I just noticed you edited your post to say "non-intellectual"; graduating from college requires a little bit of intellect I would think). The speech impediment is something that may contribute to his speaking like a thug? I've never heard him speak tbh.

[John Smith]

Holy crap! Put another coat or ignorance on your post why don't you...

What does the truth hurt or something? Do you know prison population statistics? Do you deny the criminal problems that plague certain group's neighborhoods? it's the facts. it is 2009. a half black man is the president. if we can't talk about it now, then we never will be able to.

[John Smith]

But has he actually committed any crimes? I'm asking because I honestly don't know.

Well, I just did a quick wiki search... I don't see any criminal activity, but I noticed:

A) Kenyon graduated with a Bachelor's Degree in Criminal Justice.
B) [...] Martin's speech impediment and eye twitching tic [...]

I dunno, but a guy with a degree in criminal justice wouldn't seem like someone to go out performing criminal activities. The speech impediment is something that may contribute to his speaking like a thug? I've never heard him speak tbh.

He acts like one and that is enough for me and Mark Cuban. He probably acted that way for self preservation growing up. That's understandable but he needs to become a man and shed that gutter mentality. Obviously, he never will but that's what he should do.

[Mateo]

I don't want to defend someone who shouts are people's mothers, but there is a huge difference between talking about someone's mother and talking to someone's mother. Cuban did the latter. Barkley accused him of doing the former. Let's criticize what actually happened here.

[BeebCats]

He acts like one and that is enough for me and Mark Cuban. He probably acted that way for self preservation growing up. That's understandable but he needs to become a man and shed that gutter mentality. Obviously, he never will but that's what he should do.

To me, the player would have to actually do something off the court to earn a thug reputation. I know for a fact some people have VERY different personalities on and off the court, and personally I like to base my opinion of a player on their "off the court" actions. I guess that's the difference?

[John Smith]

To me, the player would have to actually do something off the court to earn a thug reputation. I know for a fact some people have VERY different personalities on and off the court, and personally I like to base my opinion of a player on their "off the court" actions. I guess that's the difference?

Probably. thanks for approaching the situation with an open and able mind. that is refreshing to see.

[Mor'Fiyah]

What does the truth hurt or something? Do you know prison population statistics? Do you deny the criminal problems that plague certain group's neighborhoods? it's the facts. it is 2009. a half black man is the president. if we can't talk about it now, then we never will be able to.

I have no problems talking about it. In fact... the only way we will get rid of your ignorance is to educate you.

So lets talk prison population. So your claim is that since blacks and hispanics have proportionally higher numbers in prison it goes to say that being black or hispanic contributes to one looking like a thug? Right? Well what proportion of people who live at or below the poverty line are in prison whether they be black, white, hispanic, asian etc.? Once you answer that you will see that people aren't in prison because of their race but because they are poor. Rich people generally don't commit crimes because they don't think they have to. They are already rich. Equating skin color or race to being more likely to be a criminal is the heights of racism.

[NuggetsFan]

To me, the player would have to actually do something off the court to earn a thug reputation. I know for a fact some people have VERY different personalities on and off the court, and personally I like to base my opinion of a player on their "off the court" actions. I guess that's the difference?


Good call. I wouldn't judge a person by how the play basketball, but I guess everyone has a different opinion on the matter.

[Mor'Fiyah]

He acts like one and that is enough for me and Mark Cuban. He probably acted that way for self preservation growing up. That's understandable but he needs to become a man and shed that gutter mentality. Obviously, he never will but that's what he should do.

Is Rob Dyrdek (skater) or one of those rock band drummer or guitarists thugs because they have tattoos? Or do you have to have a combination of tattoos and also be black to be a thug?

[Mor'Fiyah]

Probably. thanks for approaching the situation with an open and able mind. that is refreshing to see.

So his approach is in stark contrast to your approach which is to use a close and disabled mind to label people based on your prejudices?

[Mor'Fiyah]

Good call. I wouldn't judge a person by how the play basketball, but I guess everyone has a different opinion on the matter.

It actually wouldn't be so bad if he were just judging them on how they play basketball. He is actually judging them on their race, speech, and skin art. Its actually pretty offensive.

[32jazz]

To me, the player would have to actually do something off the court to earn a thug reputation. I know for a fact some people have VERY different personalities on and off the court, and personally I like to base my opinion of a player on their "off the court" actions. I guess that's the difference?

Chris Andersen(White) of the Nuggets is certainly a 'thug' isn't he? I mean with his intimidating,in-your-face style of basketball, Tattoos all over his body & being expelled from the League for several years for drug abuse:rolleyes:

This Smith guy is a pea brain & his ilk are responsible for the League going away from the hard fouls ( flagrant 1 & 2 rules)to prevent fights & brawls that are commonplace in Baseball. Where there are no thugs:rolleyes:

[Blue&Orange]

Oakley is never called a thug tho on this site. How is Oakley not a punk nor a thug. But Kmart is. I'm lost. People embrace the days of the Bad Boys. Featuring dirty players. Yet when todays players mimick it they are punks and thugs? Why couldnt they be considered the same things you called Oakley and guys of his caliber back then. Lets keep in mind Oakley couldnt do what he did in todays game. He took would have to have some form of resistence given consequences, punishments.

Just curious.

If you're comparing Oakley to Kmart is obvious that you will never understand why Kmart is called a thug and Oakley isn't. Not even MJ would call Oakley fugazzi, Kmart was called by... Tim Thomas :roll:

[Mor'Fiyah]

Chris Andersen(White) of the Nuggets is certainly a 'thug' isn't he? I mean with his intimidating,in-your-face style of basketball, Tattoos all over his body & being expelled from the League for several years for drug abuse:rolleyes:

This Smith guy is a pea brain & his ilk are responsible for the League going away from the hard fouls ( flagrant 1 & 2 rules)to prevent fights & brawls that are commonplace in Baseball. Where there are no thugs:rolleyes:

Dude. Hockey has the least amount of thugs.

[yeaaaman]

no, you are wrong. it is not the ref's responsibility to track number of fouls, the number of fouls should not impact a call. and it is an established nba tradition to let the refs know you are fouling intentionally, so they call it quicker and don't think you are trying to rough someone up when you grab them. so basically, i am speaking from fact and you are speaking from what you think.

i don't care what anyone says, two hands up in the air like the cops are pointing a gun at you is not a sign for I FOULED, it's a sign for NOT ME.

I'm not saying it doesn't happen, but yes it is the refs responsibility to track fouls they have to know when a team is in the penalty or not, so you're wrong on that. Since it's fact please show me some documentation that it is nba tradition to let the refs know you are fouling. I'm not saying it isn't but I haven't heard that and since it's fact it should be easy for you to support.

Like I said earlier, at that point he probably was thinking they didn't call it yet so let them know I'm not fouling him now when he's in a shooting motion where if melo misses the shot and then he ends up getting three free throws, unfortunately for him melo made an amazing shot. He had no choice but to back off, plus was out of position from trying to foul anyways.

[John Smith]

Is Rob Dyrdek (skater) or one of those rock band drummer or guitarists thugs because they have tattoos? Or do you have to have a combination of tattoos and also be black to be a thug?

What % of blacks are thugs/criminals/in prison compared to say asians or whites? Answer that but you're too afraid to.

[John Smith]

I have no problems talking about it. In fact... the only way we will get rid of your ignorance is to educate you.

So lets talk prison population. So your claim is that since blacks and hispanics have proportionally higher numbers in prison it goes to say that being black or hispanic contributes to one looking like a thug? Right? Well what proportion of people who live at or below the poverty line are in prison whether they be black, white, hispanic, asian etc.? Once you answer that you will see that people aren't in prison because of their race but because they are poor. Rich people generally don't commit crimes because they don't think they have to. They are already rich. Equating skin color or race to being more likely to be a criminal is the heights of racism.

We're talking blacks, not hispanics. Being black increases your odds of being a thug based off of prison population as well as the ill wills that plague the black communities. Are you not aware of this fact? It seems you are the one in need of an education.

Get outta here with that far left off the wall poor BS. what about affirmative action? what about the fact that for every 4 black females that graduate college, 1 black male does? what about the fact that 1 out of every 3 black males has a felony? blacks get free tuition and special treatment yet their problems remain the same. why is that?

[John Smith]

It actually wouldn't be so bad if he were just judging them on how they play basketball. He is actually judging them on their race, speech, and skin art. Its actually pretty offensive.

offensive or not, there are reasons for it. why do you think there is racial profiling? obviously, there is cause for it...

[32jazz]

We're talking blacks, not hispanics. Being black increases your odds of being a thug based off of prison population as well as the ill wills that plague the black communities. Are you not aware of this fact? It seems you are the one in need of an education.

Get outta here with that far left off the wall poor BS. what about affirmative action? what about the fact that for every 4 black females that graduate college, 1 black male does? what about the fact that 1 out of every 3 black males has a felony? blacks get free tuition and special treatment yet their problems remain the same. why is that?

Well I am sure the players of the NBA('thugs':rolleyes: ) would like to thank you for your obvious concern & loyal support of the NBA each time they cash their checks.
Every little bit helps.
You can certainly solve their problems with your ignorant rats on a message board.

Never understood someone who could loyally watch/support a League/Team where they generally dislike the Players & find they have 'tons' of 'thugs'.

A Blues/Jazz musician once said the same thing about people with your mentality when he said they like 'our'(Blacks) music, but they just don't like us.

[John Smith]

Well I am sure the players of the NBA('thugs':rolleyes: ) would like to thank you for your obvious concern & loyal support of the NBA each time they cash their checks.
Every little bit helps.
You can certainly solve their problems with your ignorant rats on a message board.

Never understood someone who could loyally watch/support a League/Team where they generally dislike the Players & find they have 'tons' of 'thugs'.

A Blues/Jazz musician once said the same thing about people with your mentality when he said they like 'our'(Blacks) music, but they just don't like us.

and why bring up music? My dougie...yeah that's going to go a long way to shattering the stereotypes...

rats? OKAY. I love blacks. I'm around them all day. The catch? They're educated and share a similar value structure that I do. It's the kind of people that make all the difference. Do you like white trash? I sure don't...

[Mor'Fiyah]

What % of blacks are thugs/criminals/in prison compared to say asians or whites? Answer that but you're too afraid to.

I already did answer it but your ignorance seems to not only be prejudice-based. You have some reading comprehension problems as well.

Let me break it down as simple as I can.

Blacks have more people in prison/thugs/criminals than whites or Asians proportionally.

Blacks also have more people at or below the poverty line than whites or Asians proportionately.

Most people are thugs/criminals/in prison because they are poor. Almost all whites in prison because they are poor. Almost all asians in prison are poor. Almost all blacks in prison are poor. It therefore stands to reason that prison population is predicated mostly on being poor vs race.

It just so happens that more blacks and hispanics are proportionally poor than whites and as a result there are more blacks and hispanics in prison (proportionally). But even those numbers are skewed by the strong racial bias of the justice system that imprisons more blacks for drugs despite the fact that studies show that whites use drugs 5x more than blacks or hispanics.

Now how does this pertain to your obvious bias in particular? Well its obvious that poverty is a bigger factor into prison population and criminality than race. Much bigger. So it would be asinine to say Martin is most likely a thug or criminal because he is black or has tattoos or any other physical feature or speech pattern. HE HAS MONEY. Which is to say he isn't poor. Which means he likely isn't a criminal or thug. You are simply stereotyping... and even your stereotyping is stupid since proportions shouldnt factor into whether someone is a thug or not based on skin color. Based on the percentages alone, there are pretty much just as many whites as blacks in prison and so a white guy is just as likely to be a criminal as a black guy just because there are more whites than blacks here.

[Mor'Fiyah]

offensive or not, there are reasons for it. why do you think there is racial profiling? obviously, there is cause for it...

There exists racial profiling because of ignorant people like you. We used to have slavery too... was it ok then? Just because something exists doesn't mean its right.

[John Smith]

There exists racial profiling because of ignorant people like you. We used to have slavery too... was it ok then? Just because something exists doesn't mean its right.

hahaha, no it exists because there are increased odds of certain groups engaging in criminal behavior based upon the enviornment in which they exist as well as other proven statistics. Is it right? Of course not. I'm not trying to be right here. I'm just explaining reality. Deal with it. Neither you nor I can change it even though it is 110% wrong!

Also, Mor'Fiyah, why do you think there are so many poor people from that group? Could it be that 70% of the males in that group abandon their baby's mamma and their babies as the stats say? What about unemployment rates of said group? Broken and 1 parent families lead to poverty. There are causes and reasons for everything. You just have to be man enough to face the facts. Certain men of certain groups need to quit acting like little boys. And certain women of certain groups needs to stop laying down with such losers.

[Mor'Fiyah]

and why bring up music? My dougie...yeah that's going to go a long way to shattering the stereotypes...

rats? OKAY. I love blacks. I'm around them all day. The catch? They're educated and share a similar value structure that I do. It's the kind of people that make all the difference. Do you like white trash? I sure don't...

Ah now we are getting somewhere. So you really like black people. Just the ones you know to be educated. So this is not really a race problem is it? You just believe that Martin is uneducated. Well someone just posted it... the man has a degree. So there goes your education theory. Your theory wilts even more when you actually look at the fact that there are white players in the league with no degree. Does that then make them criminals or thugs? Or is it the combination... no education + melanin = thug?

[Mor'Fiyah]

hahaha, no it exists because there are increased odds of certain groups engagin in criminal behavior based upon the enviornment in which they exist as well as other proven statistics. Is it right? Of course not. I'm not trying to be right here. I'm just explaining reality. Deal with it. Neither you nor I can change it even though it is 110% wrong!

Also, Mor'Fiyah, why do you think there are so many poor people from that group? Could it be that 70% of the males in that group abandon their baby's mamma and their babies as the stats say? What about unemployment rates of said group? Broken and 1 parent families lead to poverty. There are causes and reasons for everything. You just have to be man enough to face the facts.

We could go back and forth on why these people are poor and it wouldnt matter really (the answer is MUCH deeper than the one you gave). Who cares why they are poor... all that matters is that wealthy blacks do not commit crimes in much the same way that wealthy whites do not commit crimes. Martin, a professional NBA player, is not poor. Therefore how can you judge him as being a likely thug or criminal?! Unless you are racist... which is likely the reality of this situation. Racist pricks like you exist in the world hence things like racial profiling exist.

[John Smith]

Ah now we are getting somewhere. So you really like black people. Just the ones you know to be educated. So this is not really a race problem is it? You just believe that Martin is uneducated. Well someone just posted it... the man has a degree. So there goes your education theory. Your theory wilts even more when you actually look at the fact that there are white players in the league with no degree. Does that then make them criminals or thugs? Or is it the combination... no education + melanin = thug?

I live and work in chicago. if i hated all of a certain group, i'd be dead of a heart attack. I work for the government. I am out-numbered 5 to 1 by a certain group. But you know what? Most of them are more educated than me and more rich than me. Poverty could be the main problem but with Affirmative Action, why isn't it changing?

You are similar to kenyon martin that you act out of emotion opposed to intellect.

Why not address the broken families that plague that community? Obviously, that is where all of the problems arise from. There are no role models except for that gangster making fast loot, driving a nice car, and getting all the ladies. So, they try to be like him since their "father" thought all it took was 30 minutes to be a "man."

[32jazz]

and why bring up music? My dougie...yeah that's going to go a long way to shattering the stereotypes...

rats? OKAY. I love blacks. I'm around them all day. The catch? They're educated and share a similar value structure that I do. It's the kind of people that make all the difference. Do you like white trash? I sure don't...

The old "I have many Black friends" argument.:rolleyes:
Well I hope those 'educated' Blacks that you hang around with don't look down on you because of your obvious ignorance.

I have yet to hear you rant about Chris Andersen who has an intimidating in your face style,Tattos all over & was expelled from the Leagues due to drugs. It would seem you are supporting a Team of 'thugs' by your definition of the word.
Kenyon Martin(as far as I know) has a cleaner record in the League than Chris Adersen.

[Mor'Fiyah]

I live and work in chicago. if i hated all of a certain group, i'd be dead of a heart attack. I work for the government. I am out-numbered 5 to 1 by a certain group. But you know what? Most of them are more educated than me and more rich than me. Poverty could be the main problem but with Affirmative Action, why isn't it changing?

You are similar to kenyon martin that you act out of emotion opposed to intellect.

Because affirmative action is a joke. Whites are still uber times more likely to get accepted to a school or get a job despite having the exact same qualifications as a black or hispanic person. Clearly affirmative action isn't being enforced properly.

And you don't hate people of a certain group. You just tolerate them. But you do believe that their skin color directly correlates to them being a thug or not. I wonder what your educated black "friends" would say to you if they knew that. But I am sure that you don't go around spewing this nonsense to actual black people.

[John Smith]

Chris Andersen is a thug because that is the image he has taken on, yet the people love him because of his swag. Do the people love Kenyon Martin? Did Mark Cuban talk ish to Andersen's mother?

[John Smith]

Because affirmative action is a joke. Whites are still uber times more likely to get accepted to a school or get a job despite having the exact same qualifications as a black or hispanic person. Clearly affirmative action isn't being enforced properly.

And you don't hate people of a certain group. You just tolerate them. But you do believe that their skin color directly correlates to them being a thug or not. I wonder what your educated black "friends" would say to you if they knew that. But I am sure that you don't go around spewing this nonsense to actual black people.

I do and they bring up the N word. They say that's why they moved away from their neighborhoods. In fact, that is another problem. People of a certain group abandon their communities once they become wealthy and educated. They should stay and re-invest in their neighborhoods to give others, like them, a better opportunity. So maybe there would be more businesses instead of just strip clubs, liquor stores, and fast food chains. Although theft would be a concern...by both customers and employees.

[Mor'Fiyah]

Why not address the broken families that plague that community? Obviously, that is where all of the problems arise from. There are no role models except for that gangster making fast loot, driving a nice car, and getting all the ladies. So, they try to be like him since their "father" thought all it took was 30 minutes to be a "man."

Ok. Even if you are right... and you are not. But even if you were... what does that have to do with Kenyon Martin? He doesn't have a criminal record. He went to school. Has a degree. Is wealthy. Has a job. Has a wife and kids. Is a family man. All you did was look at him and label him a thug based on his race and tats and speech. You my friend are a plain out-and-out racist. Its that simple.

[oh the horror]

Im sorry, but we live in a society, where the "craigslist killer" is a clean cut med-student blonde haired, blue eyed white guy (google it, and see for yourself)


Yet, we judge people by the fact that they appear to be "thugs" - due to tattoos and funky hairstyles



Its idiotic at this point.

As FAR AS IM CONCERNED, the person that acted like the real thug here is MARK CUBAN. A classless one, at that.

[John Smith]

Im sorry, but we live in a society, where the "craigslist killer" is a clean cut med-student blonde haired, blue eyed white guy (google it, and see for yourself)


Yet, we judge people by the fact that they appear to be "thugs" - due to tattoos and funky hairstyles



Its idiotic at this point.

That's because most serial killing child rapists are white people. The facts are the facts.

[Mor'Fiyah]

Chris Andersen is a thug because that is the image he has taken on, yet the people love him because of his swag. Do the people love Kenyon Martin? Did Mark Cuban talk ish to Andersen's mother?

Is Derek Rose a thug? If not in what way is he different from Martin? And if he is why do you have a picture of him as your avatar?

And please don't use the word "swag" ... thats "thug" talk.

[John Smith]

Is Derek Rose a thug? If not in what way is he different from Martin? And if he is why do you have a picture of him as your avatar?

He is humble and uses the english language properly. His body language/disposition is 100% the opposite of Kenyon Martin's. This has nothing to do with race even though you seem fixated on it. That would make you the real racist. You hate white people, say it! :lol

[Mor'Fiyah]

That's because most serial killing child rapists are white people. The facts are the facts.

How comes we don't profile based on that then? Why don't we also use metal detectors and drug dogs in the white schools instead of the urban black schools since the white students are the ones shooting up the schools? Where is the racial profiling then?

[John Smith]

How comes we don't profile based on that then? Why don't we also use metal detectors and drug dogs in the white schools instead of the urban black schools since the white students are the ones shooting up the schools? Where is the racial profiling then?

Probably because even though a lot of white people rape little kids and kill more than 1 person, there aren't as many instances of it occuring as there are with shootings when it comes to other groups.

That's the thing, white people will be quiet with no swag and the next thing you know the quiet one goes off. There are no outward signs except that they are quiet. If we could figure out a way to catch these sick white devils before they shoot up a school, we'd all be better for it but so far no luck.

Plus, I'm sure most mothers of school children in the inner city would prefer that their schools get the metal detectors first. As they should. Chicago has had 32 public school kids shot dead thus far this school year. That's a whole classroom. These bright eyed, innocent youths show up to better themselves in August and the next thing you know they are dead before June...

[crisoner]

http://www.guitar.com/uploaded/profile_images/forum_53df766f_icy_Hot_Stuntaz.jpg

Real Thugs

http://www.masmenosuno.com/wp-content/uploads/2006/07/crip02.jpg

Fake Thugs



It has nothing to do with the way you look at all or what race you are see!!!

[Mor'Fiyah]

He is humble and uses the english language properly. His body language/disposition is 100% the opposite of Kenyon Martin's. This has nothing to do with race even though you seem fixated on it. That would make you the real racist. You hate white people, say it! :lol

You are a joke. Derek Rose doesn't even have a degree. You don't know him... Kenyon Martin for all his speech impediments is more eloquent than Derek Rose is when interviewed. And who is to say Derek Rose speaks like that all the time. He is from Chi-town right? Bet you he can use the old ebonics with the best of them...

You are racist. Every racist has his black "friends" or black people who are ok with him. The house negro if you will. I am done. Keep whatever broke mentality you have. I only hope one day you have a change of heart.

[John Smith]

So sad, you are stuck in a rut. You had potential More Fire. You had spunk and a curious nature. But your closed mind is holding you back. It's been real. One.

[32jazz]

Chris Andersen is a thug because that is the image he has taken on, yet the people love him because of his swag. Do the people love Kenyon Martin? Did Mark Cuban talk ish to Andersen's mother?

Well at least you believe a White player(Chris Andersen) on the Team of millionaires you support is a thug also. :rolleyes:

You are indirectly supporting/approving of their behavior, & the 'tons' of other NBA thugs ,by supporting the Nuggets(Jr Smith/Andersen/Martin,etc...) & the League.

No it's people like you who curiosly don't pre judge or have preconceived ideas stereotypes about other Whites like the once expelled/tattooed/ drug addict Anderson as oppossed to the College educated Martin who has never been in trouble.

David Stern & I have heard all this before:sleeping

Now go back to supporting your 'thugs' both financially & morally.

[Cavs2007Champs]

What proportion of people who live at or below the poverty line are in prison whether they be black, white, hispanic, asian etc.?


And in such a strongly driven capitalistic society like America, those that are placed in unequal or inequitable positions in society, will likely stay there since our political and social structure is created to keep those that are down at the bottom in there place.


Once you answer that you will see that people aren't in prison because of their race but because they are poor. Rich people generally don't commit crimes because they don't think they have to. They are already rich.

Rich people create crimes, for example, the act of stealing, which is taking something that is not yours.... here is how it plays out race/wealth wise...

Poor people(both black and white, but your local news station will only show you the black thieves) - they steal by robbing, mugging, or blatently taking money from someone.

Rich people (generally white) - they creatively acquire someone elses money, then after they leave with the money, the other rich and greedy person who was had, now wants to scream theft, robber, or whatever after their greedy ignorant self fell for it.

Rich people just go through a longer process to steal money and wealth, poor people just do it as quick as they can.

And rich people comprise of the largest amount of theft FINANCIALLY speaking... Bernie Madoff committed a larger crime in monetary value as oppossed to all of the thefts by petty criminals combined in Ohio.

Oh how we view things differently.

and to John Smith you are a perfect example of the word ignorance.

[Sammobile]

I do and they bring up the N word. They say that's why they moved away from their neighborhoods. In fact, that is another problem. People of a certain group abandon their communities once they become wealthy and educated. They should stay and re-invest in their neighborhoods to give others, like them, a better opportunity. So maybe there would be more businesses instead of just strip clubs, liquor stores, and fast food chains. Although theft would be a concern...by both customers and employees.

omg your such a hypocrite, your dancing around the questions

Why do you have locks on your doors in your good neighborhood, ITs because crime is everywhere regradless of people's races, you know nothing of the black commuinty yet your talking like you actually help people from poor backgrounds. your an embrassment :banghead:

[John Smith]

Cavs2007...This guy isn't dealing with reality. In Atlanta, for example, the local news stations NEVER mention the race of suspects in the stories that they air. Also, when rich people involve themselves in white collar crimes when they steal, they don't shoot people to do it! see the difference?


omg your such a hypocrite, your dancing around the questions

Why do you have locks on your doors in your good neighborhood, ITs because crime is everywhere regradless of people's races, you know nothing of the black commuinty yet your talking like you actually help people from poor backgrounds. your an embrassment :banghead:

At least I know how to use your and you're properly. Now who is the embarASSment? :cheers:

[Sammobile]

At least I know how to use your and you're properly. Now who is the embarASSment? :cheers:
again :hammertime: around the statement, sorry Ms. Wallace for the grammar didn't know you had a account on insidehoops :confusedshrug:

[Cavs2007Champs]

What does the truth hurt or something? Do you know prison population statistics? Do you deny the criminal problems that plague certain group's neighborhoods? it's the facts. it is 2009. a half black man is the president. if we can't talk about it now, then we never will be able to.

I don't mind the truth, I love giving people the truth. I believe America and everyone would be better off if they faced the truth and reality, but your truth is very skewed and ignorant. Your truth is based off of that of a Middle Class Ignorant Naive Prejudice(Not Racist, I believe people throw the word racist around to much) White Male, which is going to be a different truth than mine. I am also a middle class white male, but my education and understanding of TRUTH is different than yours, and that's the biggest determining factor in how truth is viewed between you and I and others.

Let's talk about those statistics and proportion...

Take a look at any "negatively viewed" statistic and you will see that everyone is unproportionally represented, Whites don't do as many crimes, and Blacks do all of the crimes, or that is what we are led to believe by the media and stats. How many more white people who commit petty crimes compared to black people are put onto house arrest? Or get community service? The punishments are handled differently which shows a prejudice judicial system.

Another example... Which is more publicized White people on welfare or Black people on welfare?

Look at the way laws are constructed, crack and cocaine are the same drug just different form, and someone who possesses a crack rock while being apprehended by the cops is given a lengthier jail sentence than someone with the same amount of cocaine, see how that works out?

I understand you think certain ideas are truth, but there are different ways of going about it, calling anyone with a tattoo and a walk different than yours a thug is complete ignorance.

You should read an excerpt by Michel de Montaigne, "Of Cannibals" was the name of the passage or book, I am not sure which one, it's a reading in my World Literature class. Read that and then see how you yourself, and many Americans, especially White people, and upper class folks view anyone else other than themselves differently, and always in a negative light.

[Sammobile]

I don't mind the truth, I love giving people the truth. I believe America and everyone would be better off if they faced the truth and reality, but your truth is very skewed and ignorant. Your truth is based off of that of a Middle Class Ignorant Naive Prejudice White Male, which is going to be a different truth than mine. I am also a middle class white male, but my education and understanding of TRUTH is different than yours, and that's the biggest determining factor in how truth is viewed between you and I.

Let's talk about those statistics...

Take a look at any "negatively viewed" statistic and you will see that everyone is unproportionally represented, Whites don't do as may crimes, and Blacks do all of the crimes. Which is more publicized White people on welfare or Black people on welfare?

Look at the way laws are constructed, crack and cocaine are the same drug just different form, and someone who possesses a crack rock while being apprehended by the cops is given a lengthier jail sentence than someone with the same amount of cocaine, see how that works out?

I understand you think certain ideas are truth, but there are different ways of going about it, calling anyone with a tattoo and a walk different than yours a thug is complete ignorance.

You should read an excerpt by Michel de Montaigne, "Of Cannibals" was the passage or book, I am not sure, it's a part of my World Literature class. Read that and then see how you yourself, and many Americans, especially White people, and upper class folks view anyone else other than themselves differently, and always in a negative light.

:bowdown: :bowdown: :bowdown: Thank you bro.

[NugzFan]

ill go back to another thread...what makes someone a thug? couldnt get an answer then, lets see if i get one now.

[Sammobile]

ill go back to another thread...what makes someone a thug? couldnt get an answer then, lets see if i get one now.

well according to John Smith anyone that is black, have tatoos, and doesn't talk like he wants them to is a thug

[Cavs2007Champs]

You are racist. Every racist has his black "friends" or black people who are ok with him. The house negro if you will. I am done. Keep whatever broke mentality you have. I only hope one day you have a change of heart.

You can't go around calling people racist if you don't truly know em Fiyah.

He may show a lot of prejudices but until he goes around calling out names, and truly discriminating against other races through his actions, then you can call him a racist, until then use prejudice as the word, since he obviously has a few of his own.

I'll just say that John Smith uses to much of the media to draw his conclusions about the Black race, and not enough of positive examples.

Mo'Fiyah, it's not his fault that only the "negative" Black celebrities or public figures are made to be the posterboard figures of the Black community.

American's love to debate the negatives, but rarely do we argue about the positive role models.

We will start a debate over who is a bigger thug, but not who is the bigger saint, see where I am going.

Message... as Damon Wayans would say in Don't be a Menace... Think about it.

[John Smith]

well according to John Smith anyone that is black, have tatoos, and doesn't talk like he wants them to is a thug

You forgot uneducated. And it does not mean they are a thug it means their probability of being one increases based off of the stats that anyone can find on google.


I don't mind the truth, I love giving people the truth. I believe America and everyone would be better off if they faced the truth and reality, but your truth is very skewed and ignorant. Your truth is based off of that of a Middle Class Ignorant Naive Prejudice(Not Racist, I believe people throw the word racist around to much) White Male, which is going to be a different truth than mine. I am also a middle class white male, but my education and understanding of TRUTH is different than yours, and that's the biggest determining factor in how truth is viewed between you and I and others.

The difference? Your holier than thou attitude won't get you laid by the same kinds of broads that I am nailing. Plus, I have real world experience growing up on the south side of chicago. I'd like to drop you off in the wild 100's and see how far your ability to read a book will get you. There are two kinds of smarts in this world, book smarts and street smarts. You lack the latter. You represent an ignorant youth who is both naive and impressionable. You probably still live with your parents and think you have it all figured out...



Let's talk about those statistics and proportion...

Take a look at any "negatively viewed" statistic and you will see that everyone is unproportionally represented, Whites don't do as many crimes, and Blacks do all of the crimes, or that is what we are led to believe by the media and stats. How many more white people who commit petty crimes compared to black people are put onto house arrest? Or get community service? The punishments are handled differently which shows a prejudice judicial system.

Another example... Which is more publicized White people on welfare or Black people on welfare?

Look at the way laws are constructed, crack and cocaine are the same drug just different form, and someone who possesses a crack rock while being apprehended by the cops is given a lengthier jail sentence than someone with the same amount of cocaine, see how that works out?

Rich people, such as judges and politicians, do cocaine more than they do rock. Obviously, they will have lighter sentences for things that involve them and their friends/families. Is it right? No, but it is reality.

Per capita, everyone knows which group has the most people on welfare. The most gets publicized.


I understand you think certain ideas are truth, but there are different ways of going about it, calling anyone with a tattoo and a walk different than yours a thug is complete ignorance.

You should read an excerpt by Michel de Montaigne, "Of Cannibals" was the name of the passage or book, I am not sure which one, it's a reading in my World Literature class. Read that and then see how you yourself, and many Americans, especially White people, and upper class folks view anyone else other than themselves differently, and always in a negative light.

I don't need to read your books written by some sissy frenchman. I am too busy reading my own, thank you ver much. And they include books such as the Tibetan Book of the Dead and other books regarding eastern philosophy.

[John Smith]

You can't go around calling people racist if you don't truly know em Fiyah.

He may show a lot of prejudices but until he goes around calling out names, and truly discriminating against other races, then call him one, until them use prejudice as the word.

I'll just say that John Smith uses to much of the media to draw his conclusions about the Black race, and not enough of positive examples.

Mo'Fiyah, it's not his fault that only the "negative" Black celebrities or public figures are made to be the posterboard figures of the Black community.

American's love to debate the negatives, but rarely do we argue about the positive role models.

We will start a debate over who is a bigger thug, but not who is the bigger saint, see where I am going.

Message... as Damon Wayans would say in Don't be a Menace... Think about it.

Funny how you think I use too much media. I appreciate your input as you are clearly educated. However, you have no idea the despise that I hold for today's media. It is nothing like the media that once informed the nation like it was in the Edward Murrow days...today's media is filled with tools for the CEO's of these large media corporations. Media today is meant to entertain instead of inform. I don't bother with the media...it is not serious.

And what about Chicago's very own Barack Obama? Isn't he a positive role model?

[NugzFan]

well according to John Smith anyone that is black, have tatoos, and doesn't talk like he wants them to is a thug

oh ok. :oldlol:

[NugzFan]

You forgot uneducated. And it does not mean they are a thug it means their probability of being one increases based off of the stats that anyone can find on google.

ok so black, uneducated and has tattoos = thug? just want to be sure.

if it increases their chances, then what DOES make them a thug? what makes one black, uneducated tattooed player a thug while another black, uneducated tattooed player not a thug?

[Sammobile]

The difference? Your holier than thou attitude won't get you laid by the same kinds of broads that I am nailing

:lol: internet player

[John Smith]

ok so black, uneducated and has tattoos = thug? just want to be sure.

if it increases their chances, then what DOES make them a thug? what makes one black, uneducated tattooed player a thug while another black, uneducated tattooed player not a thug?

Wow, can people read? The probablity increases if one is all of those things. Heck, sadly the probablity increases based upon race alone!

[Sammobile]

You forgot uneducated. And it does not mean they are a thug it means their probability of being one increases based off of the stats that anyone can find on google.

how is Kenyon Martin a thug when he is educated?

[John Smith]

how is Kenyon Martin a thug when he is educated?

Do you really believe schools don't give special treatment to elite athletes like Kenyon Martin?

[asu77golf]

Dude, I'm white. Really white. I have Asian friends, Hispanic friends, Iranian, Israeli.... but no black friends. There're like no black people in San Diego or Littleton where I grew up.

I can't stand 50 Cent. That whole culture. The 'Thug' culture.

I see it as something that keeps black people down.

I am in no way racist, but I am prejudice I suppose in that I probably group people into that 'thug culture' that I have no right doing.

But seriously, I hate 50 Cent.

And K-Mart is a badass. And Cuban should get his face beat in.

That's all.

[Cavs2007Champs]

The difference? Your holier than thou attitude won't get you laid by the same kinds of broads that I am nailing. Plus, I have real world experience growing up on the south side of chicago. I'd like to drop you off in the wild 100's and see how far your ability to read a book will get you. There are two kinds of smarts in this world, book smarts and street smarts. You lack the latter. You represent an ignorant youth who is both naive and impressionable. You probably still live with your parents and think you have it all figured out....

Why are you bringing up females that you are "nailing", and what a stupid word I might add, what does that have to do with anything we are talking about. What holier than thou attitude do I have? I am just trying to debate/argue with you in a more grown manner, not the way other ISH posters argue with the trolls here.

And speaking of street smarts and book smarts, how in the world do you know what I do and don't have? I'm not gonna question what you do or don't have based on 1 thread on an internet forum. Why would you claim I lack street smarts, when you know nothing of what I do, we are on the Web, so I guess we are talking about "Web smarts". Until you see and speak with me in the "streets" that is when you see "street smarts". I am trying to blend my "street and book smarts" together to talk with you and the other posters.

And why are you claiming I am an ignorant youth who lives with my mother? You know nothing about my education, intelligence, personal life, street or book smarts. This post shows your true ignorance when you resort to name calling on no basis, what in my previous posts leads you to believe that I am still at home with my parents and have this holier than thou attitude and am an impressionable youth? Where do you get those opinions? Because I sound more intelligent than you, so you go to weak personal attacks.

I called you ignorant after reading your first few posts, but I realized after a reading a few more that you started to change the way you were talking/discussing which gave me a different impression of you, a more favorable one I would add.

After this post I'm up in the air I guess. Some of the stuff you have been posing is the truth and reality but again there are other ways to go about discussing what you think the truth is.



I don't need to read your books written by some sissy frenchman. I am too busy reading my own, thank you ver much. And they include books such as the Tibetan Book of the Dead and other books regarding eastern philosophy.

Well great, I just wanted to recommend a book which could help you with the way you look at society. Maybe you would see it from another view as oppossed to the narrow view that you have of society now.

[John Smith]

It's not 50 cent's fault that the non-black CEO's in the music and entertainment industry choose to make him into a star. The real question is why do they choose to do so? They control the air waves and mtv so whatever they put out will be listened to and sold. But why do they choose to support 50 cent and soulja boy? Even Nas realizes what kind of "artists" these people are.

Cavs, I made those conclusions about you based on your post. You clearly were talking down to me. Even if it is deservedly so, you see why I made those conclusions about you. No need to get upset about it. that is not the ISH way.

[Sammobile]

Do you really believe schools don't give special treatment to elite athletes like Kenyon Martin?

:( my goodness you so prejudice you'd turn anything around, you don't know Martin or what happened in while he was in school(grades)
your so worried about other people you don't even see the problems in your own community

[Mor'Fiyah]

You can't go around calling people racist if you don't truly know em Fiyah.

He may show a lot of prejudices but until he goes around calling out names, and truly discriminating against other races through his actions, then you can call him a racist, until then use prejudice as the word, since he obviously has a few of his own.

I'll just say that John Smith uses to much of the media to draw his conclusions about the Black race, and not enough of positive examples.

Mo'Fiyah, it's not his fault that only the "negative" Black celebrities or public figures are made to be the posterboard figures of the Black community.

American's love to debate the negatives, but rarely do we argue about the positive role models.

We will start a debate over who is a bigger thug, but not who is the bigger saint, see where I am going.

Message... as Damon Wayans would say in Don't be a Menace... Think about it.

At first I made sure to call him prejudiced instead of racist... but the more we discussed the situation the more I thought maybe he is a racist. Sure I don't know him but he has made some extremely racist comments on here. It may be that we have different definitions of a racist... to me once you begin to consciously use skin color as a large factor into pre-judging someone then you become a racist. I certainly think, based on his comments, that John Smith is a being racist in doing so. Racists aren't just white supremacists after all...

[CrabDribble]

Cuban released his apology (http://www.nba.com/2009/playoffs2009/05/12/cuban.apology.ap/index.html?cid=playoff1)today on his personal blog. Never heard of a situation like this before.

[John Smith]

:( my goodness you so prejudice you'd turn anything around, you don't know Martin or what happened in while he was in school(grades)
your so worried about other people you don't even see the problems in your own community

come on now, just check out USC and Ohio State. Google:

"Maurice Clarett ohio state"

or

"OJ Mayo USC"

It's just the facts...sadly.

[John Smith]

At first I made sure to call him prejudiced instead of racist... but the more we discussed the situation the more I thought maybe he is a racist. Sure I don't know him but he has made some extremely racist comments on here. It may be that we have different definitions of a racist... to me once you begin to consciously use skin color as a large factor into pre-judging someone then you become a racist. I certainly think, based on his comments, that John Smith is a being racist in doing so. Racists aren't just white supremacists after all...

Did it ever occur to you that I am at work and engage in controversial conversation to help my day go by faster? It's working! :applause:

[Sammobile]

come on now, just check out USC and Ohio State. Google:

"Maurice Clarett ohio state"

It's just the facts...sadly.


what does that have to do with K-Mart? they have nothing in common

[John Smith]

what does that have to do with K-Mart? they have nothing in common

They kind of do though. If you are a star, universities will do whatever it takes to keep you happy. Even give you A's if you don't deserve it. That's just the tip of the iceberg. He's just one that got caught. Imagine all of the others that are not getting caught...

[Cavs2007Champs]

Funny how you think I use too much media. I appreciate your input as you are clearly educated. However, you have no idea the despise that I hold for today's media. It is nothing like the media that once informed the nation like it was in the Edward Murrow days...today's media is filled with tools for the CEO's of these large media corporations. Media today is meant to entertain instead of inform. I don't bother with the media...it is not serious.

And what about Chicago's very own Barack Obama? Isn't he a positive role model?

Ok we can agree on how the media is not doing anything that it could truly do, on a positive side that is.

I said it in a post already, I read your first few posts and you sounded very naive, ignorant, and young, then you changed the way you debated/argued, and I see a different person, but the same views. I just disliked the way you initially voiced your opinion, that's where I believed you came off ignorant, but then again what's the point of the internet if you can't speak how you truly feel?

I guess it's a backwards game.

On the behalf of Barack Obama, you are going with the American trend, assuming he should be the poster child for the positive Black man role model, BUT DAMNIT THE MAN IS BI-RACIAL, WHITE AND BLACK. America made him choose one, solely based on his skin color. The man was raised like a typical/ideal "white kid". Lived with his white family during his youth, worked hard to get him to where he needed to be in life, ivy league school and the list goes on.

So many people label him the "FIRST BLACK PRESIDENT" the man is bi-racial, what's the point of having an "OTHER" box or "BI-RACIAL" if it doesn't matter to America. People look at Barack and see brown skin, so if you are brown you're black.


Whatever I guess, America is crazy and F'd up.

Sorry for the rant, that's not directed solely at you, just the society in general.

But for every Barack Obama we have a lot of bad apples that are portrayed. America in general doesn't portray a lot of positive role models, think about it.

Like Chamillionaire said, "Controversy Sells"

[John Smith]

Again, every post I make on this board is to help my work day go by faster. Thanks for humoring me people. :cheers:

[Mor'Fiyah]

Wow, can people read? The probablity increases if one is all of those things. Heck, sadly the probablity increases based upon race alone!

Based on the defintion of "racism" and its associated adjective...

[I]rac

[John Smith]

Is it discrimination, More Fire, though if it is based off of facts and reality? I don't see it as such but maybe I am wrong.

[Cavs2007Champs]

Cavs, I made those conclusions about you based on your post. You clearly were talking down to me. Even if it is deservedly so, you see why I made those conclusions about you. No need to get upset about it. that is not the ISH way.

Ehh I still think you had some useless comments/conclusions based on my post, but whatever, we have different agendas.

Your view isn't a minority, but others aren't seeing everything that you are saying, a lot is true, but now you have the "racist" and "prejudice" label so others are going 2 take everything you say and overblow it.

I've seen Chicago, and it isn't pretty, I know that. I've been in Columbus, Cleveland, and Cincinnati, all have their bad areas, just not as large as Chicago. I was hoping to move to Chicago to teach in the Southside, but my wife hates the winter months there, she says they are horrible and brutal. We're looking at somewhere in the south now.

Now that we have met a middle ground, I see what you are saying. Enjoy work.

[Mor'Fiyah]

Did it ever occur to you that I am at work and engage in controversial conversation to help my day go by faster? It's working! :applause:

And? Aren't most of us doing the same? I certainly am... but even so... what does that have to do with your incessant racial posts?

[John Smith]

And? Aren't most of us doing the same? I certainly am... but even so... what does that have to do with your incessant racial posts?

Just in this thread about thugs and keyon martin. I said those things to spark a debate and I think I got more than what I was looking for. I know better now. :hammerhead: It turned into a wildfire before you could count to three.

[Mor'Fiyah]

Ok we can agree on how the media is not doing anything that it could truly do, on a positive side that is.

I said it in a post already, I read your first few posts and you sounded very naive, ignorant, and young, then you changed the way you debated/argued, and I see a different person, but the same views. I just disliked the way you initially voiced your opinion, that's where I believed you came off ignorant, but then again what's the point of the internet if you can't speak how you truly feel?

I guess it's a backwards game.

On the behalf of Barack Obama, you are going with the American trend, assuming he should be the poster child for the positive Black man role model, BUT DAMNIT THE MAN IS BI-RACIAL, WHITE AND BLACK. America made him choose one, solely based on his skin color. The man was raised like a typical/ideal "white kid". Lived with his white family during his youth, worked hard to get him to where he needed to be in life, ivy league school and the list goes on.

So many people label him the "FIRST BLACK PRESIDENT" the man is bi-racial, what's the point of having an "OTHER" box or "BI-RACIAL" if it doesn't matter to America. People look at Barack and see brown skin, so if you are brown you're black.


Whatever I guess, America is crazy and F'd up.

Sorry for the rant, that's not directed solely at you, just the society in general.

But for every Barack Obama we have a lot of bad apples that are portrayed. America in general doesn't portray a lot of positive role models, think about it.

Like Chamillionaire said, "Controversy Sells"

While I agree that society did indeed label Barack black it should also be noted that he also identifies as being black and married a black woman and has black kids. So I think its safe to say Barack is both percieved as a black man and identifies as a black man.

[32jazz]

what does that have to do with K-Mart? they have nothing in common

Absolutely nothing, but considering this idot has claimed or admitted to trolling for a response instead of a reasonable exchange of ideas says a lot about him.

Either he is an idiot who has obvious touched upon a subject upon which he knows little & is ill equipped to seriously debate or he his trolling.

He has never answered any reasonable questions with reasonable responses so to continue with this guy is futile.

[Mor'Fiyah]

Is it discrimination, More Fire, though if it is based off of facts and reality? I don't see it as such but maybe I am wrong.


There is no scientific or social proof that links skin colour to immoral or criminal behaviour. So yes, it is dicrimination. And discrimination based on skin colour is called racial discrimination. And people who racially discriminate are called racists.

[Mor'Fiyah]

Ehh I still think you had some useless comments/conclusions based on my post, but whatever, we have different agendas.

Your view isn't a minority, but others aren't seeing everything that you are saying, a lot is true, but now you have the "racist" and "prejudice" label so others are going 2 take everything you say and overblow it.

I've seen Chicago, and it isn't pretty, I know that. I've been in Columbus, Cleveland, and Cincinnati, all have their bad areas, just not as large as Chicago. I was hoping to move to Chicago to teach in the Southside, but my wife hates the winter months there, she says they are horrible and brutal. We're looking at somewhere in the south now.

Now that we have met a middle ground, I see what you are saying. Enjoy work.

I agree with much of what you have posted. Except for your insistence that a lot of what John Smith posted was true. I refuse to pass his prejudicial comments off as truth. Even if he comes to the right conclusion, but his path to said conclusion was completely wrong can we say its true?

[Da Black Mamba]

That's just Cuban being Cuban a tired ridiculous act and a post traumatic whiner disrespecting an opponent's player mom after results that didn't go his way (waa waa):cry: :cry: . Now the drama escalates to where the cry baby:cry: has to deal with a thug having personal issues out on him....do we smell blood on behalf of the thug or will it all be resolved with Cuban apologizing with some flowers and a dinner date lol.

[GOBB]

Kmart tried to confront Cuban who was shaking fans hands on the other side of the floor. As Kmart and Denver walked off he screamed to Cuban "You better walk that way! You better f*ckin walk that way!". If anyone knows his seat isnt too far from where Denver exited (which is past Dallas bench).

He made a blog apologizing but Kmart doesnt mess with the internet like that. Just kidding but I wouldnt be surprised. How do you apologize on a blog and expect someone to read if? Not like Kmart was reading your blogs as a fan.

[bdreason]

New reports claim a Mavs fan threw beer on KMarts mom last night.

:no:

[GOBB]

New reports claim a Mavs fan threw beer on KMarts mom last night.

:no:

When? Wasnt during the game. Camera focused on her alot. If anything went down it would have been captured or atleast mentioned. And no one reacted after the game as players left the court. I call BS.

[Mor'Fiyah]

Kmart tried to confront Cuban who was shaking fans hands on the other side of the floor. As Kmart and Denver walked off he screamed to Cuban "You better walk that way! You better f*ckin walk that way!". If anyone knows his seat isnt too far from where Denver exited (which is past Dallas bench).

He made a blog apologizing but Kmart doesnt mess with the internet like that. Just kidding but I wouldnt be surprised. How do you apologize on a blog and expect someone to read if? Not like Kmart was reading your blogs as a fan.

Yeah. I mean he said what he said in person to Martin's mother so the least he could do is apologise in person.

[NugzFan]

Wow, can people read? The probablity increases if one is all of those things. Heck, sadly the probablity increases based upon race alone!

ok ill try this one more time...

what makes a person a thug? i know those things increase the probability but what makes a person actually go from NOT a thug to being a thug?

[NugzFan]

Cuban released his apology (http://www.nba.com/2009/playoffs2009/05/12/cuban.apology.ap/index.html?cid=playoff1)today on his personal blog. Never heard of a situation like this before.

because there are no other owners in all of professional sports that act the way cuban does.

[NugzFan]

New reports claim a Mavs fan threw beer on KMarts mom last night.

:no:

yeah i heard this on the radio too.

[bdreason]

When? Wasnt during the game. Camera focused on her alot. If anything went down it would have been captured or atleast mentioned. And no one reacted after the game as players left the court. I call BS.

I'm just going by ESPN reports about 4 minutes ago. They also claimed extra security was placed around KMarts mom, and Melo's fiance after the event.

[Cavs2007Champs]

I agree with much of what you have posted. Except for your insistence that a lot of what John Smith posted was true. I refuse to pass his prejudicial comments off as truth. Even if he comes to the right conclusion, but his path to said conclusion was completely wrong can we say its true?

I think we are looking at what he is saying in 2 different ways now...

Some of the things he said were true in their terms, he just did not put the right qualifying words to go along with it, it was going beyond making generalized comments, and just labeling whole groups, he tried to doubleback and make them more specific.

Was he wrong in saying look at the prison population statistics? Are they or are they not predominantly black? Then in the second question how badly over represented are Blacks in prison? How skewed are the laws and court systems?

He agreed with certain comments.

The problem was the way he went about saying it, that's basically it. But hell we are on the internet and how often do we not catch sarcasm, or mistype a sentence, or leave out a word here or there.

Fiyah,

Basically, we have to say *** it, some people are naive, some are educated, some are stupid, some are open minded, some are closed, some are white, black, asian, hispanic, or bi-racial... But the point is we have them all in America so we deal with it you know? Some of J. Smith's comments made me think he was ignorant, but you have to read what he's saying and what type of person he is, and it's not hard to understand what he's saying. His view is not foreign to a lot of white folks.

[Cavs2007Champs]

While I agree that society did indeed label Barack black it should also be noted that he also identifies as being black and married a black woman and has black kids. So I think its safe to say Barack is both percieved as a black man and identifies as a black man.

Don't take this as ignorance on my behalf, it's a scenario...

If I marry a Black woman and my kids have brown skin I am black?

Ok let me put it this way then....

I married a black woman, and we have a brown skinned child, and I work in an all black school/community, and I can identity with the Black community more than the white, but I have white skin, am I Black?

When someone is raised Black, or if they are raised White, what does that mean?

I remember on a CNN special, they followed a mixed couple, White male and Black female, and they were having a problem because she wanted to raise them Black and he didn't get it. So my question does it mean to raise a child "Black"? How many modern people/children have been rasied "Black".

[oh the horror]

Cuban released his apology (http://www.nba.com/2009/playoffs2009/05/12/cuban.apology.ap/index.html?cid=playoff1)today on his personal blog. Never heard of a situation like this before.



Thats a cowardly way to offer an apology. Not to mention cheap. He should have confronted them face to face, and apologized to both of them. As a man, and a decent human being you face up to the things youve done, bad or good.

I have no respect for this man at this point. His antics have officially jumped the shark.

[Mor'Fiyah]

I think we are looking at what he is saying in 2 different ways now...

Some of the things he said were true in their terms, he just did not put the right qualifying words to go along with it, it was going beyond making generalized comments, and just labeling whole groups, he tried to doubleback and make them more specific.

Was he wrong in saying look at the prison population statistics? Are they or are they not predominantly black? Then in the second question how badly over represented are Blacks in prison? How skewed are the laws and court systems?

He agreed with certain comments.

The problem was the way he went about saying it, that's basically it. But hell we are on the internet and how often do we not catch sarcasm, or mistype a sentence, or leave out a word here or there.

Fiyah,

Basically, we have to say *** it, some people are naive, some are educated, some are stupid, some are open minded, some are closed, some are white, black, asian, hispanic, or bi-racial... But the point is we have them all in America so we deal with it you know? Some of J. Smith's comments made me think he was ignorant, but you have to read what he's saying and what type of person he is, and it's not hard to understand what he's saying. His view is not foreign to a lot of white folks.

We are going to have to disagree here. I am aware that many white Americans share those same opinions and that is why American society still has so many racial problems. Very few of his statements (if any were correct or true). Blacks only dominate the prison population in proportion to the overall population. But blacks and whites are within 4% of each other in prison population. Outside of prison there are likely far more whites who are criminals than blacks just because of the numbers alone. Proportions only mean that if you meet ten black people you are more likely to meet one who is a criminal than if you met ten white people. But it doesn't reflect on the likelihood of meeting a black criminal in the real world where whites far outnumber blacks. So his overall logic and argument is wrong. Just because he makes a statement that in isolation is true doesn't make the overall statement in context true.

In addition he repeatedly said things that were just blatantly racist. He literally said that just being black meant you were more likely to be a criminal or thug. He made a direct correlation between skin colour and crime. I don't know if one can be more racist than that. Its the view or acceptance that these statements have merit that cause much of the racial tension in America: the dynamic of minorities feeling that they live in a racially unequal environment and the majority thinking that this cry for wolf is over exaggerated.

What he said is very similar to the statement made in the media sometime ago where someone said that if you aborted all black babies you would eventually reduce crime. Is the statement itself in isolation true? Well yeah. But in context is it true? No. Aborting babies of ANY race will reduce crime. The race of the babies does not matter in the statement but by including it give the statement a different contextual meaning - that there is a relation between race and crime. There isn't.

[Mor'Fiyah]

Don't take this as ignorance on my behalf, it's a scenario...

If I marry a Black woman and my kids have brown skin I am black?

Ok let me put it this way then....

I married a black woman, and we have a brown skinned child, and I work in an all black school/community, and I can identity with the Black community more than the white, but I have white skin, am I Black?

When someone is raised Black, or if they are raised White, what does that mean?

I remember on a CNN special, they followed a mixed couple, White male and Black female, and they were having a problem because she wanted to raise them Black and he didn't get it. So my question does it mean to raise a child "Black"? How many modern people/children have been rasied "Black".

No you are not black. being raised black or being raised white means that you were raised to value and retain certain cultural DNA of those groups respectively. It does not play into your social identification though it may play a strong role in your self-identification.

In effect you are asking me what makes someone black or white right? You are black if you fit the social criteria for being labeled as being black AND you also identify as being black. Its the combination of social identification and self-identification (with the social identification having more weight perhaps - Tiger Woods is largely seen as a black golfer though he probably identifies as mixed based on his own comments).

Barack Obama both identifies as being black and probably culturally identifies as being black even if he was raised "white". I know this because of what he has said in his books and in his behaviour. Does he act like a middle aged white man to you?

[John Smith]

Well, i apologize if i offended you or anyone else. I was just trying to get some conversation going. I have learned from it now...

[Mor'Fiyah]

Well, i apologize if i offended you or anyone else. I was just trying to get some conversation going. I have learned from it now...

Oh its fine. In a weird way I actually respect you for saying what many white Americans are afraid to say. But unless people say these things and we hear these things then the discussion can't happen. Its all good bro!

[KRAYZIE]

Here's more on this situation:



Cuban apologizes to Martin & family

The treatment of Kenyon Martin's mother and the loved ones of other Nuggets during Game 4 was an embarrassment to the city of Dallas. Give Mark Cuban credit for recognizing that after seeing a scene in the AAC stands that took away from an otherwise sensational game. Cuban wrote a blog post that apologized for the comment he made to Lydia Moore, Martin's mom, and acknowledged the role that remark played in a situation that has escalated out of control. An excerpt from the post headlined, "An Apology to Kenyon Martin's Mom": When the series comes back to Dallas, your family, and the family of other Nuggets players are welcome to stay in my suite, with my family. Its amazing how tempers mellow when real people talk to each other and realize that its still just a game. If that isn't acceptable, I'm happy to provide a suite, free of charge to them as well and place whatever security is needed to make them feel comfortable. We tried to have enough additional security for them tonight as well, but I know your family and friends didn't feel as comfortable as they should. I apologize for that as well. This arena is my responsibility, we could and should do a better job. So if we can put this behind us, I will make sure when the series comes back to Dallas, your family and friends, and that of your teammates are very comfortable at our Arena. Then I hope we both take the advice of your coach and can get together this summer. Dinner for you and your family is on me.

[32jazz]

Oh its fine. In a weird way I actually respect you for saying what many white Americans are afraid to say. But unless people say these things and we hear these things then the discussion can't happen. Its all good bro!

It's always easier to say offensive things about an entire race of people behind a keyboard.

But you are correct that many hold these bias' & the League has stopped a lot of the physical play/fights & implemented a dress code because of it.

Although I understand the leagues/Sterns predicament there will always be idiots (like John Smith)who harbor these feelings no matter how the Players look/behave.

[Boris Pen]

Cuban Mark is a sexist racist 4 sure

[ZionDunks]

Cuban is such a communist