Jerry West: LeBron has surpassed Kobe

[eliteballer]

LeBron Surpasses Kobe as The Top Player: Jerry West

Published: May 18, 2009
Filed at 4:07 p.m. ET

Skip to next paragraph WASHINGTON (Reuters) - LeBron James is the best player in the NBA, surpassing veteran Los Angeles Lakers guard Kobe Bryant, 14-times All-Star guard Jerry West said Monday.

West, a shrewd judge of talent who brought Bryant to the Lakers when he was their general manager, said the Cleveland forward could become the league's next Michael Jordan.

"I look at Cleveland say to myself, 'How many games could they win without LeBron James?' West told Reuters in an interview. "That's how great he is.

"He has a chance to be arguably the greatest player ever to play the game."

West, the NBA's executive of the year with the Lakers in 1995 and the Memphis Grizzlies in 2004, said playing both ends of the floor was what made Jordan so great.

"Michael Jordan was the best defensive player in the league but he was also the best offensive player," said West. "It wasn't a one-year fluke, he proved it over time.

"LeBron James will do the same type of things because he's getting better. He's a much more effective shooter. When's he's making his shots from the outside, you can't play him.

"He's just too big, too strong, too quick. And he has incredible body control. But more than that, he's a great team mate. You can see his team mates love him."

James averaged 28.4 points this season and was named the NBA's most valuable player. But Bryant, a three-times NBA champion and 2008 MVP, still remains a force, said West.

"If I had to have somebody make a last-second shot, it would be Kobe Bryant," said West, architect of the great Lakers teams from Magic Johnson years in the 1980s through the Shaquille O'Neal clubs of the early 2000s.

"But even though it's hard for me to be objective, because I brought Kobe to Los Angeles, I do think LeBron has surpassed Kobe as a player."

West, 70, was in Washington attending a conference for atrial fibrillation, a condition he has that can cause a racing heart, sleeplessness, anxiety and depression.

The condition, diagnosed at age 42, forced him to leave the front office of the Lakers and then the Grizzlies in 2007.

West, a member of the Lakers' 1972 title team, said he does not think about how he would fare in today's NBA but added, "I would be competitive, trust me."

(Editing by Alison Wildey)

http://www.nytimes.com/reuters/2009/05/18/sports/sports-us-nba-west.html?_r=1

Et Tu, Jerry?:cry:

[1~Gibson~1]

I agree :pimp:

[Al Thornton]

Obviously Jerry is a smart guy and most people have known this.

[big baller]

psh, w/e

[Allstar24]

Uh oh wait till bruce sees this topic :oldlol:

[DuMa]

Jerry's eye for talent is greater than all you fools on ISH. but not greater than mines of course

[Lakerfan1-Iceland]

Well he's right. Thats just the way it is, good to have it come from someone like Jerry West who's opinion and insight is wery well respected.

I am a Laker fan for life and truly think Kobe is great and among the greatest SGs and scorers ever but Lebron man he's just this season and barring injuries at his age now, this big,strong,quick,fast,skilled etc etc it's just rediculus!!!!

He's on some Shaq ****, freak of nature there is no one like this kid! Ever.

[Diesel J]

This is no secret or anything new.:oldlol:

[NBASTATMAN]

http://www.nytimes.com/reuters/2009/05/18/sports/sports-us-nba-west.html?_r=1

Et Tu, Jerry?:cry:


WOW HUGE WORDS BY THE BEST JUDGE OF TALENT THE LEAGUE HAS SEEN.. I think Lebron is more dominant than Kobe but still the CAVS have no chance vs the Lakers in the finals... I willput money on this.... Like Jerry said how many games would that team win without Lebron.. And yes he is the only player who can supplant mj but he needs a better second best player.. Mo Williams is not that player... He is a nice player but a 13 pt career scorer really isn't the type of player who will help lebron win a finals...

[rezznor]

psh, w/e

But more than that, he's a great team mate. You can see his team mates love him."
hmmm...subtle dig? :oldlol:

[Lebron23]

:applause: :applause: :applause:

Can't disagree with Mr. West The guy won many NBA Championships as the Vice President and General Manager of the Los Angeles Lakers.

[Waking_Life]

Blasphemy!

[DANlEL]

Kobe>LeBron

[db23]

No ****, why is it nobody takes something as being true unless the media says it.So many people cant think for themselves, Kobe hasnt been better than Bron or Wade for a couple of seasons now (healthy wade).

[dyna]

Lebron>Kobe

[Showtime]

I thought every non-laker fan knew this was true since 2006.

[oh the horror]

Ever notice how the league always needs that difinitive ONE GREATEST PLAYER IN THE LEAGUE, ever since Jordan left?


Or were they doing that before MJ?


It just seems like SUCHHHH an issue now. Who really cares?

Does this fact bother some people?

[Cedar]

i think jerry west is saying this because he is one of the very very few people who gets to kobe. he's seeing how kobe has regressed in the playoffs and he's not playing with any fire. west knows kobe needs to be kobe to carry the lakers to a win in the next round. this comment will piss off kobe and he will come out with a chip on his shoulder. west is a genius, he made kobe into the player he is today and now he's playing mind games with kobe to fire him up for tomorrow night. why else would he make this random comment at this specific time of the year?

btw if anything wade has surpassed kobe. lebron got the mvp only because he has better teammates than wade.

[Lebron23]

i think jerry west is saying this because he is one of the very very few people who gets to kobe. he's seeing how kobe has regressed in the playoffs and he's not playing with any fire. west knows kobe needs to be kobe to carry the lakers to a win in the next round. this comment will piss off kobe and he will come out with a chip on his shoulder. west is a genius, he made kobe into the player he is today and now he's playing mind games with kobe to fire him up for tomorrow night. why else would he make this random comment at this specific time of the year?

btw if anything wade has surpassed kobe. lebron got the mvp only because he has better teammates than wade.


LeBron led the NBA in PER, Roland Ratings, Win Shares, Best Record in the NBA, and last year he was clearly robbed of the MVP trophy because the Cavs only won 45 games in the Regular Season.

LeBron will have more Regular Season MVP, and Finals MVP Awards than Kobe Bryant before he retires in the NBA.

[justin43]

i think jerry west is saying this because he is one of the very very few people who gets to kobe. he's seeing how kobe has regressed in the playoffs and he's not playing with any fire. west knows kobe needs to be kobe to carry the lakers to a win in the next round. this comment will piss off kobe and he will come out with a chip on his shoulder. west is a genius, he made kobe into the player he is today and now he's playing mind games with kobe to fire him up for tomorrow night. why else would he make this random comment at this specific time of the year?
btw if anything wade has surpassed kobe. lebron got the mvp only because he has better teammates than wade.

I can see how this can be the case. Anyway I have a feeling that this debate will be resolved at the finals.

[K.Koscik]

They are both great, great, players. We don't need a single best in the league. What we need is competitive rivalries to restore this league. Lebron is probably more effective, as Kobe is much more skilled than him offensively, and it's close defensively. Lebron is just so gifted athletically that his size and speed allows him to lock up opponents more. Lebron is probably better, but why do we all worry about it so much? Let's all just shut up and look at each player as a single player and stop comparing everybody.

[vert48]

I agree with Jerry.

[konex]

I love it. Eveyone's so ready to bury Kobe right now :rockon:

[nbastatus]

still hard for me to say that.

[shaoyut]

Lebron > Kobe

[Fatal9]

Tough being Kobe right now. 2 of his 3 idols (Magic/West) have already jumped on the Lebron bandwagon. MJ is the only one left and if he comes out with something along the lines of "Lebron > Kobe", it'll be absolutely soul-crushing for Kobe.

[bdreason]

Most people accept the fact that LeBron is the best player in the NBA.

[Showtime]

Tough being Kobe right now. 2 of his 3 idols (Magic/West) have already jumped on the Lebron bandwagon. MJ is the only one left and if he comes out with something along the lines of "Lebron > Kobe", it'll be absolutely soul-crushing for Kobe.
MJ already said Kobe is the best right NOW, but Lebron could be the best EVER.

[bdreason]

I love it. Eveyone's so ready to bury Kobe right now :rockon:

I don't think saying Kobe is the 2nd, 3rd, or 4th best player in the league is trying to "bury" him.

Everyone acts like being the 2nd best player in the world is an insult or something.

[Eldrunko247]

It's funny how this article and any threads posted about it has been removed from all Laker boards. Hilarious and sad at the same time.

[shawbryant]

Maybe, I'd say he's on the way to surpass KB. Let's see who will beat the other in the finals then make this decision.

[gxL]

No ****, why is it nobody takes something as being true unless the media says it.So many people cant think for themselves, Kobe hasnt been better than Bron or Wade for a couple of seasons now (healthy wade).
are you stupid or are you stupid?

[RoseCity07]

Way to catch up to last year Jerry.

[Duncan21formvp]

Lebron is clearly better than Kobe.

[artest 93]

Maybe, I'd say he's on the way to surpass KB. Let's see who will beat the other in the finals then make this decision.

So I guess Paul Pierce was the better player last year then.

Dude, go back to school.

[plowking]

So I guess Paul Pierce was the better player last year then.

Dude, go back to school.

Was Pierce ever in the discussion for best player in the league last season? No, didn't think so. This is much more viable.

Go back to school.

[artest 93]

Was Pierce ever in the discussion for best player in the league last season? No, didn't think so. This is much more viable.

Go back to school.

Idiot. Do you understand his logic? Or do you fail at that, too?

His point was that the team that won would have the best player in the league, but it's a flawed argument because one team may have more support than the other?

You need to go back to school.

[Diesel J]

Idiot. Do you understand his logic? Or do you fail at that, too?

His point was that the team that won would have the best player in the league, but it's a flawed argument because one team may have more support than the other?

You need to go back to school.


plowking just got owned:oldlol:

[JustinJDW]

Unit Lebron wins a Championship, he is no better than my left nut. :pimp:

[godofgods]

Where has he been for the past 6 years?

[imdaman99]

SO what happens when we find out that Lebron was on steroids? :roll:

[Torious]

God damnit, this constant back and forth of who's better is rather pathetic, what's the ****ing point? I couldn't care less if everybody thought that half the league is better then Kobe, the only thing that matters to me is to see them (you know, THE TEAM) win the 'chip.

[imdaman99]

Idiot. Do you understand his logic? Or do you fail at that, too?

His point was that the team that won would have the best player in the league, but it's a flawed argument because one team may have more support than the other?

You need to go back to school.
Don't come up with that p*ssy excuse. Not when this Lebron guy led his team to the most wins in the league. Let these Finals decide whos better. Until than stfu and keep your obsession for Kobe to a minimum.

[DCL]

the chosen one will bring light and glory back to the nba.

[lilgodfather1]

LeGOAT will win a championship this season and be on his way to GOATNESS.

[Juges8932]

I thought every non-laker fan knew this was true since 2006.

I honestly hope that you are kidding.

IMO, LBJ is more dominant, but Kobe is the better player.

[Foster5k]

MJ already said Kobe is the best right NOW, but Lebron could be the best EVER.

I'm sticking to what MJ said, until otherwise notified.

[LA_Showtime]

i give it another year or two before lebron james has a target on his back and people on ish are hating on him.

[Dave3]

I'm sticking to what MJ said, until otherwise notified.
You wait for other people to speak their mind for you to formulate your own opinion?

[Fatal9]

When will put the playoff competition of Lakers and Cavs be put in perspective? Kobe just went up against the toughest perimeter defense in the game and got 28/5/4/2 on 45.3% and only 1.5 turnovers per game. This is the same team Lebron put up 24/5/2 on 40.9% shooting this year.

[PleezeBelieve]

Really, how pathetic is it to watch Laker Fan almost in complete unison continue to perpetuate a fallacy (that Kobe is better or just as good as LeBron) that 95% of non-Lakers fans discounted atlest 15 months ago.

Disturbing.

[B-Low]

You wait for other people to speak their mind for you to formulate your own opinion?

:oldlol:

[guy]

I honestly hope that you are kidding.

IMO, LBJ is more dominant, but Kobe is the better player.

LOL are you serious? Well I guess there's a first for everything.

[Kingwillball]

I honestly hope that you are kidding.

IMO, LBJ is more dominant, but Kobe is the better player.

Correct me if I am wrong but isn't a player who is more dominant(hence dominates a gm more)considered a better player ? Kobe is great and still dominates at times but he isn't consistantly great like Lebron anymore and that is why Lebron has surpassed Kobe in many peoples eyes.

[JustinJDW]

Really, who gives a ****? The only thing that matters is Championships. Do you honestly think that Kobe or Jordan give a rat's ass if Jerry West, or all the nut lickers on this Forum, think that Lebron is better then them? Yeah, I am sure they are crying in the hands in which their rings are on.

[aznboy2k2]

i give it another year or two before lebron james has a target on his back and people on ish are hating on him.

Kobe Bryant isn't hated because of Kobe Bryant.
He's hated because of the dumass annoyinggg Laker fans that exist.

Cav fans, as hard as they can try, probably won't ever be half as annoying and ridiculously stupid as Laker fans.

[Eldrunko247]

I honestly hope that you are kidding.

IMO, LBJ is more dominant, but Kobe is the better player.
^^ Stupid. The more dominant player is the better player. That's like saying Shaq was more dominant than Kobe during the championship years but Kobe was the better player. At this point Lebron is the better player and has the potential to surpass Kobe's legacy.

[bisk]

Damn, anyone know what Oscar Robertson said about this?
He was on Mike&Mike this morning, but I just missed it.

[Darius]

I think most people agree with this now.

Last year it was debatable but LBJ really raised his game this year and Kobe is getting older (can't take it to the hoop as much anymore).

[guy]

Damn, anyone know what Oscar Robertson said about this?
He was on Mike&Mike this morning, but I just missed it.

Lebron > Kobe.

[lakerfreak]

lets be fair.

Lebron so far has done everything Kobe has done as the number one man.

Kobe won three championships with Shaq averaging like 36/16 lool.

Ever since Kobe became the number 1 option, him and lebron have both done the same exact things. They have both been the hottest superstars in the league. Kobe and Lebron both have 1 MVP a piece. They have both been to the finals and lost.

I say their careers are tied right now.

Now, some radio announcer made a great point. Kobe has been competing with guys like KG, TD21, Shaq, Nash, Dirk....for these MVP awards.

All these guys I mentioned above including Kobe are starting to get old.

In the future, who besides Dwyane Wade and Chris Paul are going to compete with lebron for the MVP award?

In the end of his career, Lebron could have 6 MVP's for that reason. Would it be fair to judge careers based on how many MVP's and other accomplishments one has, even if the competition level is different for both players?

[guy]

lets be fair.

Lebron so far has done everything Kobe has done as the number one man.

Kobe won three championships with Shaq averaging like 36/16 lool.

Ever since Kobe became the number 1 option, him and lebron have both done the same exact things. They have both been the hottest superstars in the league. Kobe and Lebron both have 1 MVP a piece. They have both been to the finals and lost.

I say their careers are tied right now.

Now, some radio announcer made a great point. Kobe has been competing with guys like KG, TD21, Shaq, Nash, Dirk....for these MVP awards.

All these guys I mentioned above including Kobe are starting to get old.

In the future, who besides Dwyane Wade and Chris Paul are going to compete with lebron for the MVP award?

In the end of his career, Lebron could have 6 MVP's for that reason. Would it be fair to judge careers based on how many MVP's and other accomplishments one has, even if the competition level is different for both players?

Howard, Melo, Deron, Bosh, Amare, Durant, Roy, Rose, Mayo, Rondo, etc. You might laugh at the last 3, but if someone had told me back in 2001, when Kobe became a top 5 player IMO, that Steve Nash was going to win 2 MVPs before Kobe wins 1, I would've laughed as well. My point is you can't really judge Lebron's competition now. All the players we both mentioned except for maybe Wade still have alot of potential to be even better, and there will most likely be players that aren't even in the NBA yet that can compete for MVPs. For example, after Kobe's 6th year, its not like everyone knew who Lebron was.

[Scott Pippen]

Kobe Bryant isn't hated because of Kobe Bryant.
He's hated because of the dumass annoyinggg Laker fans that exist. It's both in some cases. Also let us not group all Lakers fans together. It is not good idea to generalize a hug fanbase. On this site specifically it was/is just the idiots and the "Laker" fans who consistently came to their defense. But we will see soon considering the pro-Kobe trolls on this website now are damn near extinct compared with this time last year. The "Love Me or Hate" image he has portrayed in advertisements also has some effect on this. Also a combination of playing in Hollywood, the Shaq feud, the Jordan comparison, etc. I think he played it out the best he could and has really recovered his image after Colorado incident. But you are correct though some of the Kobe fans help fuel this hate and love to portray themselves as victims. They may relish the underdog role.

[The GM]

I believe he said this to fire Kobe up to light a spark under him because he hasn't been great this post season. LeBron this season has been better then Kobe overall as Kobe tailed off late in the season & in the playoffs but I wouldn't be surprised one bit if Kobe outdoes Lebron from here on in because LeBron is actually facing some type of competition this round in Orlando & not these JV teams like Detroit & the Hawks as Kobe & the Lakers have been playing very good teams from Round 1 as they have been tested, Cleveland hasn't.

[chopchop20]

I don't have a problem with what West said. I think he might be trying to motivate Kobe.

But how can you argue against Le Bronze. Dude is a beast with physical attributes that nobody else has. He's getting the job done on the court.

Kobe is still my boy, but you can't deny what the "Kang" is doing.

[Csmooove23]

Lebron cant be stopped and everyone knows this im sorry kobe will not win another ring as long as you have lebron and the cavs on the other side

[phoenix18]

I am not ready to say that Lebron is better than Kobe just yet. Kobe has the whole package, you have to play him tight everywhere on the floor. Lebron is more paint oriented with a decent jumper. Either way, it is very close.

[lilgodfather1]

I believe he said this to fire Kobe up to light a spark under him because he hasn't been great this post season. LeBron this season has been better then Kobe overall as Kobe tailed off late in the season & in the playoffs but I wouldn't be surprised one bit if Kobe outdoes Lebron from here on in because LeBron is actually facing some type of competition this round in Orlando & not these JV teams like Detroit & the Hawks as Kobe & the Lakers have been playing very good teams from Round 1 as they have been tested, Cleveland hasn't.
LAL was not tested in the first round. They beat themselves and not the other way around. It is the exact same reason they will not win an NBa championship with the inconsistancy of their team. The Jazz were a worse defensive team than Detroit and Atlanta so the Lakers didn't get tested until round 2.

[phoenix18]

Detriot and Atlanta didnt even try to play defense. Detriot quit, and Atlanta was afraid of Lebron.

[Da_Realist]

In the end of his career, Lebron could have 6 MVP's for that reason. Would it be fair to judge careers based on how many MVP's and other accomplishments one has, even if the competition level is different for both players?

It's never fair to use one metric to determine the better player.

[iggy>]

lebron is clearly the best player in the nba. the only ones who disagree are lakers fans.

[lazerface]

lets be fair.

Lebron so far has done everything Kobe has done as the number one man.

Kobe won three championships with Shaq averaging like 36/16 lool.

Ever since Kobe became the number 1 option, him and lebron have both done the same exact things. They have both been the hottest superstars in the league. Kobe and Lebron both have 1 MVP a piece. They have both been to the finals and lost.

I say their careers are tied right now.

Now, some radio announcer made a great point. Kobe has been competing with guys like KG, TD21, Shaq, Nash, Dirk....for these MVP awards.

All these guys I mentioned above including Kobe are starting to get old.

In the future, who besides Dwyane Wade and Chris Paul are going to compete with lebron for the MVP award?

In the end of his career, Lebron could have 6 MVP's for that reason. Would it be fair to judge careers based on how many MVP's and other accomplishments one has, even if the competition level is different for both players?

this may be true, they are probably tied right now. the difference is lebron is 24 and kobe is 31. that right there shows how amazing lebron is.

[lilgodfather1]

Detriot and Atlanta didnt even try to play defense. Detriot quit, and Atlanta was afraid of Lebron.
But their D was still better than Utahs. The Jazz gave up a lot more points then either of the teams the Cavs played. Even Houston gave up alot of points.

[lakerfreak]

this may be true, they are probably tied right now. the difference is lebron is 24 and kobe is 31. that right there shows how amazing lebron is.

Well thats one point of view.

The fact that Kobe can do this at 30 is pretty amazing. It makes me wonder, how many accomplishments Kobe would have had if he was the number one man since he would first enter the league.

He always worked hard on his game so I think he would have been just as good on a different team and he probably would have more MVP's. I dont know about finals appearances.

[chopchop20]

Jerry West also "implied" that he would do damage in the NBA today if he was playing. What do you guys think of that?

[lilgodfather1]

Jerry West also "implied" that he would do damage in the NBA today if he was playing. What do you guys think of that?
Possibly an all star player. If e grew up in this era why not? He would have the same advantages of every one else.

[db23]

Jerry West also "implied" that he would do damage in the NBA today if he was playing. What do you guys think of that?

He might do damage wearing down the end of the bench.

[imdaman99]

^^ Stupid. The more dominant player is the better player. That's like saying Shaq was more dominant than Kobe during the championship years but Kobe was the better player. At this point Lebron is the better player and has the potential to surpass Kobe's legacy.
Its kinda like Shaq being Lebron and Hakeem being Kobe. Whos better? Who really knows? Whos more dominant? Obviously Shaq and Lebron. But can you clearly tell me Hakeem in that Finals didn't embarrass Shaqs ass and sweep them? I really am tired of this. I guess I can care less about Lebron being better, as long as its Kobe holding the championship trophy. I'm sure Kobe feels the same.

[dr8ked]

He might do damage wearing down the end of the bench.
:oldlol: :oldlol: you sound Mad.

[guy]

Its kinda like Shaq being Lebron and Hakeem being Kobe. Whos better? Who really knows? Whos more dominant? Obviously Shaq and Lebron. But can you clearly tell me Hakeem in that Finals didn't embarrass Shaqs ass and sweep them? I really am tired of this. I guess I can care less about Lebron being better, as long as its Kobe holding the championship trophy. I'm sure Kobe feels the same.

Hakeem was definitely still the better and more dominant player when they played in the Finals.

[OldSchoolBBall]

Jerry West also "implied" that he would do damage in the NBA today if he was playing. What do you guys think of that?

You think he wouldn't? :oldlol: He'd be a 23/5/7 player with great defense at a minimum imo. Probably closer to 26-28 pts, actually.

[Scott Pippen]

You think he wouldn't? :oldlol: He'd be a 23/5/7 player with great defense at a minimum imo. Probably closer to 26-28 pts, actually.If that is his belief I would be surprised considering he is apparently Lakers fan. He did not clarify. But I must agree the league's rules today (3pt line, no hand-checks, etc) are almost tailor made for a player like Jerry West.

[rezznor]

I'm sticking to what MJ said, until otherwise notified.
compare mj's draft picks vs west's...ill take west's opinion

[Diesel J]

compare mj's draft picks vs west's...ill take west's opinion

:oldlol:

[plowking]

Its kinda like Shaq being Lebron and Hakeem being Kobe. Whos better? Who really knows? Whos more dominant? Obviously Shaq and Lebron. But can you clearly tell me Hakeem in that Finals didn't embarrass Shaqs ass and sweep them? I really am tired of this. I guess I can care less about Lebron being better, as long as its Kobe holding the championship trophy. I'm sure Kobe feels the same.

No Shaq and Lebron are more dominant and better (Lebron currently, not on Kobe's all time status).

Shaq didn't get embarrassed, he had equal if not better stats. The only stat Hakeem averaged more in were steals and scoring, though Shaq shot a massive 10% better from the field.

It's not Shaq's fault his cast didn't show up, while Hakeem's did. It's like blaming Jordan for the loss against the Celtics despite still scoring 63 points in the game. Not to that extent but you get the point.

[cavsfanatic]

MJ already said Kobe is the best right NOW, but Lebron could be the best EVER.Jordan picked kwame brown and adam morrison and sean may.....i think i'll go with west's opinion on talent

[guy]

Well thats one point of view.

The fact that Kobe can do this at 30 is pretty amazing. It makes me wonder, how many accomplishments Kobe would have had if he was the number one man since he would first enter the league.

He always worked hard on his game so I think he would have been just as good on a different team and he probably would have more MVP's. I dont know about finals appearances.

I think he might have 1-2 more MVPs with it being in 02, 03, 06, and/or 07 and thats about it. One thing people need to realize is that yes, being second to Shaq somewhat held Kobe back from winning MVPs, but not really that much. First of all, its a little far-fetched to think he would've had a chance to win MVPs from 97-99, and he wasn't injury prone, but he wasn't exactly durable in 00, 01, 04, or 05, when he didn't play 70+ games. And those injuries had nothing to do with Shaq. In the two years where he was a superstar and he did play a full schedule, in 02 and 03, its hard to assume he would've just won MVPs over Tim Duncan in his prime, and Shaq didn't play like 15 games both seasons, so Kobe did still have good chance to win MVPs. So regardless of playing with Shaq, he probably wouldn't have won MVPs during that time anyway. And in 07, Dirk had an amazing season leading a team to 67 wins with Josh Howard as his best teammate. We all know what happened in the postseason, but the way the award is handed out, he definitely deserved it that year. Its farfetched to assume Kobe would've done the same thing if he had better teammates then he had that year. He also definitely would not have as many titles right now. I highly doubt before 06, Kobe as the man of a team would've been able to lead a team past Duncan or Shaq led teams for titles.

[indiefan23]

You think he wouldn't? :oldlol: He'd be a 23/5/7 player with great defense at a minimum imo. Probably closer to 26-28 pts, actually.

Thats a joke. 6'2". Can't really run. Can't really dribble. Can't really jump. Can really shoot. He'd be a role player because its exactly how someone with his game is most effective. West said he's be 'competitive' and I'll give him that, but he's got self-respect, he didn't claim he'd be some kind of allstar. Steve Kerr was competitive. Ray Allen was an all star. Theres a big difference.

[indiefan23]

Jordan picked kwame brown and adam morrison and sean may.....i think i'll go with west's opinion on talent

Did someone claim that West was the best judge of talent ever? I don't buy that for a second. Picking Magic/Worthy and trading for Shaq are kind of no brainers. Bringing in phil jackson is a no brainer. Had PJ not come in, kobe shaq probably win nothing and West looks like a chump.

I dunno, picking high picks is hardly as difficult as picking the rough gems out of the second round. I think the best evaluator of talent is easily Darryl Morey and Bryan Colangelo. I'm also becoming a big fan of Presti for the thunder.

[OldSchoolBBall]

Thats a joke. 6'2". Can't really run. Can't really dribble. Can't really jump. Can really shoot. He'd be a role player because its exactly how someone with his game is most effective. West said he's be 'competitive' and I'll give him that, but he's got self-respect, he didn't claim he'd be some kind of allstar. Steve Kerr was competitive. Ray Allen was an all star. Theres a big difference.

West can't really run? :oldlol: Okay. He'd also list at 6'4" today (back then they measured w/o shoes, plus nowadays they round up. West was 6'2.5" tall). LOL @ thinking Ray Allen is better than Jerry West.

West was incredibly quick. I've seen court level footage of him executing a shot fake, taking one dribble and rising up for a shot, and it was INCREDIBLY quick.

[Showtime]

Jordan picked kwame brown and adam morrison and sean may.....i think i'll go with west's opinion on talent
Jordan didn't pick Kwame, his boss did. A link was posted here a while back with info on that situation. Get over that, because it's not true.

[Showtime]

Thats a joke. 6'2". Can't really run. Can't really dribble. Can't really jump. Can really shoot. He'd be a role player because its exactly how someone with his game is most effective. West said he's be 'competitive' and I'll give him that, but he's got self-respect, he didn't claim he'd be some kind of allstar. Steve Kerr was competitive. Ray Allen was an all star. Theres a big difference.
He could run, and is probably a better shooter than most of the league. Your problem is you want to put West in a Delorean with Doc Brown and put him in today's game. That's not at all an accurate evaluation for him, because this isn't the 60's. What we can see are two major things about him:

What he did in his own time against that competition in that environment...

...and what skills could translate into today's game if he developed as a ball player in today's climate.

Obviously he would develop more physically, and he was already a great athlete in his prime.

I would think he could be a Brandon Roy (who is only about 6'4'') level player who was solid on both ends, good leadership, could play both guard positions, and could raise his game in big moments.

[guy]

He could run, and is probably a better shooter than most of the league. Your problem is you want to put West in a Delorean with Doc Brown and put him in today's game. That's not at all an accurate evaluation for him, because this isn't the 60's. What we can see are two major things about him:

What he did in his own time against that competition in that environment...

...and what skills could translate into today's game if he developed as a ball player in today's climate.

Obviously he would develop more physically, and he was already a great athlete in his prime.

I would think he could be a Brandon Roy (who is only about 6'4'') level player who was solid on both ends, good leadership, could play both guard positions, and could raise his game in big moments.

I would agree that he would probably be a Brandon Roy. However, doesn't that show how much of an advantage older players get when comparing eras? Brandon Roy is a great player, but its highly doubtful that he will ever be considered the 2nd-3rd best SG of all-time and a top 10-15 player ever. The reason for that is he probably won't dominate his competition as much as West did because there is alot more competition (and more competition in theory should result in better competition.) This is why that although the whole idea that "we should judge players on what they did in their own era" is probably the easiest way to make comparisons, its highly flawed IMO.

[Allstar24]

Jerry West will always be a Laker at heart. While I agree with his comments (LeBron clearly had a better season), it's not a coincidence that he said this right before game 1 of the WCF. As much as Kobe tried to downplay it, his post game interview told the story...he was bothered by West's comment. Good thing is he did something about it and went out and won the game for LA.

[bleedinpurpleTwo]

there is no single person on planet earth who's opinion i value as much West

[Showtime]

I would agree that he would probably be a Brandon Roy. However, doesn't that show how much of an advantage older players get when comparing eras? Brandon Roy is a great player, but its highly doubtful that he will ever be considered the 2nd-3rd best SG of all-time and a top 10-15 player ever. The reason for that is he probably won't dominate his competition as much as West did because there is alot more competition (and more competition in theory should result in better competition.) This is why that although the whole idea that "we should judge players on what they did in their own era" is probably the easiest way to make comparisons, its highly flawed IMO.

I don't think that logic is highly flawed, because there are vast differences in the climate of the game and development of the players from different eras. The game has shown that it will always change and progress in some manner, so in that context, if we applied the thinking that "now is always better", then there would be no player who would stand the test of time, because the "now" would always be the measuring stick. In 40 years, people could be dismissing Kobe and Lebron, or Shaq and Duncan. Would that make sense? That logic I feel is highly flawed.

I don't think the best method of evaluation is "how would he do today?" because "today" is always relative and always changes.

[stephanieg]

In 40 years, people could be dismissing Kobe and Lebron, or Shaq and Duncan. Would that make sense?

Considering the stunning progress in genetic engineering, artifical tissue growth, and robotics, probably.

[Eldrunko247]

Its kinda like Shaq being Lebron and Hakeem being Kobe. Whos better? Who really knows? Whos more dominant? Obviously Shaq and Lebron. But can you clearly tell me Hakeem in that Finals didn't embarrass Shaqs ass and sweep them? I really am tired of this. I guess I can care less about Lebron being better, as long as its Kobe holding the championship trophy. I'm sure Kobe feels the same.
Whatever, it's a double standard. All the Kobe fan bois used to be in your face about who the best player in the league was. Quoting everyone and their momma's who said so. Now it's "logo is just motivating him" "you can't argue who's the best player in the league".

[franchise#3]

I'm sad to say this but LeBron is slightly better than Kobe right now.

[Fatal9]

West's midrange game (especially off the dribble) is unmatched by any current player. Very crafty when he was in the lane too with floaters and hook shots etc.

Brandon Roy comparison is pretty off considering Roy is the second best guard in the league at getting/exploding to the rim (behind Wade). Roy's shot is pretty good but his game is centered around getting at the rim to finish or draw fouls.

[Showtime]

Considering the stunning progress in genetic engineering, artifical tissue growth, and robotics, probably.
My point is, if by then you have genetically engineered and enhanced Spartan Super Soldiers playing in the league, would that diminish what those guys did in the time they played? Does it make their careers less impressive?

[db23]

West's midrange game (especially off the dribble) is unmatched by any current player. Very crafty when he was in the lane too with floaters and hook shots etc.

Brandon Roy comparison is pretty off considering Roy is the second best guard in the league at getting/exploding to the rim (behind Wade). Roy's shot is pretty good but his game is centered around getting at the rim to finish or draw fouls.

Any small whiteguy in the NBA can make midrange shots with awful dfense like the 60's and 70's.Throw JJ Reddick and Steve Kerr back then and theyd be nailing midrange J's no problem as well.

[nbastatus]

Any small whiteguy in the NBA can make midrange shots with awful dfense like the 60's and 70's.Throw JJ Reddick and Steve Kerr back then and theyd be nailing midrange J's no problem as well.
:lol :lol
JJ Reddick would be a legend then.

[chopchop20]

The board has fallen to an all-time low... comparing Jerry West to Brandon Roy
:roll: :roll: :roll: :roll:

[OldSchoolBBall]

I would think he could be a Brandon Roy (who is only about 6'4'')

Isn't Roy listed at 6'7"?

[eliteballer]

Jerry West will always be a Laker at heart. While I agree with his comments (LeBron clearly had a better season), it's not a coincidence that he said this right before game 1 of the WCF. As much as Kobe tried to downplay it, his post game interview told the story...he was bothered by West's comment. Good thing is he did something about it and went out and won the game for LA.

link?

[Allstar24]

link?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ORyek4X0Qdg

He looks pretty upset (around the 3:25 mark).

[Showtime]

Isn't Roy listed at 6'7"?
I'm sure he is, as most listings have him that tall or 6'6''. However, his draft measurements that I just checked has him at 6'5'' w/o shoes. West's frame had potential, and would have been an effective athlete by today's standards with today's climate IMO, especially with his length. My point was that he could compete while not having to be a 6'7'' guard. Wade, for example, is not quite 6'4''.

[guy]

I don't think that logic is highly flawed, because there are vast differences in the climate of the game and development of the players from different eras. The game has shown that it will always change and progress in some manner, so in that context, if we applied the thinking that "now is always better", then there would be no player who would stand the test of time, because the "now" would always be the measuring stick. In 40 years, people could be dismissing Kobe and Lebron, or Shaq and Duncan. Would that make sense? That logic I feel is highly flawed.

I don't think the best method of evaluation is "how would he do today?" because "today" is always relative and always changes.

I'm not saying thats the best way. There's not really a "best" way, because there all highly flawed. The logic your bringing up is highly flawed as well. If you think Jerry West would be a Brandon Roy type player today, which I would agree with, then thats a perfect example of how flawed that logic is. Because if you switched them around eras, then Brandon Roy would considered the 2nd-3rd greatest SG of all-time right now, and Jerry West would be a borderline top 10 player today. Brandon Roy would stand out more, like Jerry West did, if he played back then and he would get more recognition. If Jerry West played today, even with evolution, he wouldn't get as much recognition. It doesn't mean he (or Wilt, Russell, Oscar, etc.) doesn't stand the test of time, cause Roy is a damn great player. I just don't think he would be considered AS great. I just think we underappreciate today's players too much. It doesn't mean I don't think anyone from back then aren't great. I would say Wilt would be just as great or even greater then Shaq if he played in this era (cause he was a freak regardless of the time) and Russell would probably be Duncan. I consider Shaq, Duncan, Wilt, Russell all as top 10 players ever.

[Showtime]

I'm not saying thats the best way. There's not really a "best" way, because there all highly flawed. The logic your bringing up is highly flawed as well. If you think Jerry West would be a Brandon Roy type player today, which I would agree with, then thats a perfect example of how flawed that logic is. Because if you switched them around eras, then Brandon Roy would considered the 2nd-3rd greatest SG of all-time right now, and Jerry West would be a borderline top 10 player today.

That's not true. Roy has many more years of established progression of the game when he started playing ball that got him where he is from an individual development standpoint. Roy wouldn't be Roy, because he wouldn't have the decades of progression in the game that helped him become who he became. That's why you can't just transplant modern players to 40 or 50 years ago, because a lot happened in those years that impacts their development as basketball players.

[OldSchoolBBall]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ORyek4X0Qdg

He looks pretty upset (around the 3:25 mark).

LOL @ Kobe's remarks. "If I wanted to put up 35 points a night, I could do that, but that's not my mission." :oldlol: Can the dude be any more self-serving? I also love how he says he didn't hear West's comments yet somehow knows what the reporter is referring to.

I do think it's tacky of reporters to put those types of questions to Kobe or any player, though (that question and the follow up question).

[Younggrease]

LOL @ Kobe's remarks. "If I wanted to put up 35 points a night, I could do that, but that's not my mission." :oldlol: Can the dude be any more self-serving? I also love how he says he didn't hear West's comments yet somehow knows what the reporter is referring to.

I do think it's tacky of reporters to put those types of questions to Kobe or any player, though (that question and the follow up question).

people want him to be honest and that is the most honest you are probably gonna get...

[Scott Pippen]

LOL @ Kobe's remarks. "If I wanted to put up 35 points a night, I could do that, but that's not my mission." :oldlol: Can the dude be any more self-serving? I also love how he says he didn't hear West's comments yet somehow knows what the reporter is referring to.

I do think it's tacky of reporters to put those types of questions to Kobe or any player, though (that question and the follow up question).
To play devil's advocate he may just be referring to the perception of him being "the best", which more people than you can imagine believe is ONLY due to his points. 81 points, 35 ppg, etc. There are even some people I have met before who believe he magically improved from 2005 to 2006 THAT much more. Not to make an excuse, but this could be the way it was meant. :applause:

[plowking]

LOL @ Kobe's remarks. "If I wanted to put up 35 points a night, I could do that, but that's not my mission." :oldlol: Can the dude be any more self-serving? I also love how he says he didn't hear West's comments yet somehow knows what the reporter is referring to.

I do think it's tacky of reporters to put those types of questions to Kobe or any player, though (that question and the follow up question).

Give up now.

While you haven't completely embarrassed yourself.

[OldSchoolBBall]

Give up now.

While you haven't completely embarrassed yourself.

Uhh, no. "Give up"? :oldlol: Yeah, I mean, it's not like that wasn't a totally self-serving, self-enlarging comment or anything. :rolleyes:

[Allstar24]

LOL @ Kobe's remarks. "If I wanted to put up 35 points a night, I could do that, but that's not my mission." :oldlol: Can the dude be any more self-serving? I also love how he says he didn't hear West's comments yet somehow knows what the reporter is referring to.
There's nothing wrong with telling the truth. He can put up 35 points on any given night but he realizes that wouldn't be in the team's best interest...of course you would rather twist that comment into something negative, that's just sad.

[oh the horror]

As if he CANT put up 35 a night?

[Samurai Swoosh]

LOL @ Kobe's remarks. "If I wanted to put up 35 points a night, I could do that, but that's not my mission." :oldlol: Can the dude be any more self-serving?
That isn't self serving at all, Loki. It's the god's honest truth. Are you denying that fact? And it is a fact, he's backed it up before..


I also love how he says he didn't hear West's comments yet somehow knows what the reporter is referring to.
THAT however was funny, and I caught that too.

:roll:

[NBASTATMAN]

lets be fair.

Lebron so far has done everything Kobe has done as the number one man.

Kobe won three championships with Shaq averaging like 36/16 lool.

Ever since Kobe became the number 1 option, him and lebron have both done the same exact things. They have both been the hottest superstars in the league. Kobe and Lebron both have 1 MVP a piece. They have both been to the finals and lost.

I say their careers are tied right now.

Now, some radio announcer made a great point. Kobe has been competing with guys like KG, TD21, Shaq, Nash, Dirk....for these MVP awards.

All these guys I mentioned above including Kobe are starting to get old.

In the future, who besides Dwyane Wade and Chris Paul are going to compete with lebron for the MVP award?

In the end of his career, Lebron could have 6 MVP's for that reason. Would it be fair to judge careers based on how many MVP's and other accomplishments one has, even if the competition level is different for both players?


True but Mj went against better competition than Kobe for his MVP'S.. Lebron is going against kobe, nash, kg, duncan, wade, chris paul, in the future roy and deron williams as well as dhoward... You can also say Kobe and Shaq went against bad competition in their title runs.. Who besides Duncan on one of the good teams they beat in the playoffs during their run will we say was truly a great player..... Plus the Lakers titles all came when the opposing teams had injuries.. 2000 Duncan was injured, 01 d anderson tore his shoulder before the laker series, and mckie played with a broken ankle, 2002 they played the kings with three refs plus Stojavic injured... LOL...

[NBASTATMAN]

As if he CANT put up 35 a night?


That is what Kobe don't get... He has always been a me person instead of a team person.. That has hurt his career.. Kid was put into a position few have ever been put.. Playing for a great franchise with alot of talent around him.. I think Kobe would have more titles if his bball mentality was more focused on team... Duncan has 4 titles and has played with far less talent than kobe.... The best players Duncan has played with are parker and manu..

[NBASTATMAN]

I'm sure he is, as most listings have him that tall or 6'6''. However, his draft measurements that I just checked has him at 6'5'' w/o shoes. West's frame had potential, and would have been an effective athlete by today's standards with today's climate IMO, especially with his length. My point was that he could compete while not having to be a 6'7'' guard. Wade, for example, is not quite 6'4''.


Look if that Martin kid in Sac town can score in this league any old timer can... This league is soft and you cannot play defense anymore.. Jerry West knows that and that is why he said he would be competitive.. Ask him about playing in the 90's with defenses like the football knicks or dirty pistons...

[NBASTATMAN]

Lebron cant be stopped and everyone knows this im sorry kobe will not win another ring as long as you have lebron and the cavs on the other side


THE CAVS ARE GARBAGE.. The Lakers are much better and while KObe fans don't like to hear how great Lebron is they should be happy because if Kobe was Lebron he would never get the talent around him because of how dominant he is... THE CAVS ARE NOT SET UP TO PLAY PLAYOFF BASKETBALL

[Allstar24]

That is what Kobe don't get... He has always been a me person instead of a team person.. That has hurt his career.. Kid was put into a position few have ever been put.. Playing for a great franchise with alot of talent around him.. I think Kobe would have more titles if his bball mentality was more focused on team...
If he's a me person first, he would go out every night trying to "out-do" LeBron and Wade and put up a bunch of points and hurt the team. But he is more concerned with winning a championship right now. That's why it doesn't bother him if some nights Gasol or Bynum is our leading scorer...that's where he has matured. But on nights when his teammates don't show up (such as game one), he is still capable of putting up a lot of points (40 pts) and be our defensive stopper (slowed down Billups and Melo) at the same time.


Duncan has 4 titles and has played with far less talent than kobe.... The best players Duncan has played with are parker and manu..
Parker and Manu are less talented? :oldlol: Well you just lost all your credibility. Duncan wouldn't win two of his four rings if he didn't have those guys. Kobe isn't the only great player to have a lot of talent on his team, anyone who has ever won a championship did it with a lot of talent on their team...MJ, Shaq, Duncan...everyone.

[cotdt]

THE CAVS ARE GARBAGE.. The Lakers are much better and while KObe fans don't like to hear how great Lebron is they should be happy because if Kobe was Lebron he would never get the talent around him because of how dominant he is... THE CAVS ARE NOT SET UP TO PLAY PLAYOFF BASKETBALL

The Lakers have the same problem as the Cavs. You saw Game 1, Kobe's teammates sucked bad, they didn't even show up just like some of those games against the Rockets, and Kobe had to do everything.

Lakers DOWN by 13, Kobe has to carry his team in the 2nd half... and wins. Cavs UP by 16, Lebron has to carry his team in the 2nd half... and loses. That's the difference between Kobe and Lebron.

If you only watch these Playoff games, without any outside knowledge, you would think that the Nuggets and Orlando are the teams with more overall talent. Lakers and Cavs just have 1 superstar that the entire team gets built around.

[guy]

That's not true. Roy has many more years of established progression of the game when he started playing ball that got him where he is from an individual development standpoint. Roy wouldn't be Roy, because he wouldn't have the decades of progression in the game that helped him become who he became. That's why you can't just transplant modern players to 40 or 50 years ago, because a lot happened in those years that impacts their development as basketball players.

I know that. I'm saying Roy without the evolution since the 60s. Assuming he would be playing basketball still, I think he would be at about Jerry West's level in the 60s i.e. one of the best SGs in the game. Of course that is completely impossible to prove, but I think a Brandon Roy level player today would probably be a top 5 player back then, i.e. Jerry West level. You can say all of that about Roy, but competing with the likes of Kobe, Wade, and Lebron and with the slower pace, West probably wouldn't have as many All-NBA first teams, championships, finals appearances, or stats, even with the development of the game that Roy got. So West wouldn't be what he is today in most people's eyes. Jerry West definitely gets credit for influencing the game as much as he did, but there should be a limit IMO because as the game developed throughout the 1900s there becomes less and less room for more development. However, there seems to be no limit and many of these older players are put on a pedestal that makes some of today's players look like nobodies in comparison.

[juju151111]

The Lakers have the same problem as the Cavs. You saw Game 1, Kobe's teammates sucked bad, they didn't even show up just like some of those games against the Rockets, and Kobe had to do everything.

Lakers DOWN by 13, Kobe has to carry his team in the 2nd half... and wins. Cavs UP by 16, Lebron has to carry his team in the 2nd half... and loses. That's the difference between Kobe and Lebron.

If you only watch these Playoff games, without any outside knowledge, you would think that the Nuggets and Orlando are the teams with more overall talent. Lakers and Cavs just have 1 superstar that the entire team gets built around.
??? WTF if u only going by this playoff then i would say LA does have support. Gasol carried them in gm 7. This is last year, but still Kobe loss in the finals after being up 20. How quickly u forget that.

[LA_Showtime]

??? WTF if u only going by this playoff then i would say LA does have support. Gasol carried them in gm 7. This is last year, but still Kobe loss in the finals after being up 20. How quickly u forget that.

The Lakers are definitely a talented group, but they're really inconsistent and it's killing them. You could argue that every single player other than Pau Gasol & Trevor Ariza has had a subpar season. Honestly, can you name a player on the Lakers bench who's been consistently good this year?

[juju151111]

The Lakers are definitely a talented group, but they're really inconsistent and it's killing them. You could argue that every single player other than Pau Gasol & Trevor Ariza has had a subpar season. Honestly, can you name a player on the Lakers bench who's been consistently good this year?
True, but kobe has been inconsistent too. The whole team has been inconsistant, but even when kobe isn't playing amzzing they still some of the time.

[LA_Showtime]

True, but kobe has been inconsistent too. The whole team has been inconsistant, but even when kobe isn't playing amzzing they still some of the time.

lol yeah, that's why i said the lakers inconsistent.

the lakers are @ their best when kobe is creating opportunities for others. unfortunately he can't do that all of the time because pau gasol, andrew bynum, and lamar odom aren't aggressive on a consistent basis.

[OldSchoolBBall]

Lakers DOWN by 13, Kobe has to carry his team in the 2nd half... and wins. Cavs UP by 16, Lebron has to carry his team in the 2nd half... and loses. That's the difference between Kobe and Lebron.

No, it's not the difference between anything. It's ONE GAME. You act like Lebron has never carried his team in the second half to bring them back and win, and that Kobe has never played poorly and failed to get it done in the second half. Total bullsh&t.

[magi]

Game 1 felt like Kobe Vs Denver, with Kobe winning it.
Outside of Ariza and Fish, no one really did anything substantial to help Kobe win that game. I'd like to see how Denver fares against a complete Laker attack, please let that be tonight.

[LA_Showtime]

[QUOTE=magi

[cotdt]

[QUOTE=magi

[NBASTATMAN]

If he's a me person first, he would go out every night trying to "out-do" LeBron and Wade and put up a bunch of points and hurt the team. But he is more concerned with winning a championship right now. That's why it doesn't bother him if some nights Gasol or Bynum is our leading scorer...that's where he has matured. But on nights when his teammates don't show up (such as game one), he is still capable of putting up a lot of points (40 pts) and be our defensive stopper (slowed down Billups and Melo) at the same time.


Parker and Manu are less talented? :oldlol: Well you just lost all your credibility. Duncan wouldn't win two of his four rings if he didn't have those guys. Kobe isn't the only great player to have a lot of talent on his team, anyone who has ever won a championship did it with a lot of talent on their team...MJ, Shaq, Duncan...everyone.


Kobe gets so much help when he guards any other good player it is not funny... When Lebron played the Lakers phil jackson himself said Kobe got alot of help.. Odom said the same thing.. If you would like I can find that for you.. As for Carmelo , he was not stopped or slowed down by kobe. Kobe does a good job on billups because billups is not a player who can score on big players.. Billups picks his poison and goes at smaller players... Kobe has played with better players than any other player since Magic and Bird... Mj played with one perennial all star... Shaq has played with very good talent also.. True

[NBASTATMAN]

:lol
No, it's not the difference between anything. It's ONE GAME. You act like Lebron has never carried his team in the second half to bring them back and win, and that Kobe has never played poorly and failed to get it done in the second half. Total bullsh&t.


Don't even try with these laker fans.. Jerry west says lEBRON has passed kobe they argue.. Jerry West says Lebron has a team that without him would have problems winning.. The faker fans say he has great talent, lol.. Kobe had caron butler and lamar odom in 05 and couldn't win with that team.. Lebron would win a title with that team...:lol

[branslowski]

:lol


Don't even try with these laker fans.. Jerry west says lEBRON has passed kobe they argue.. Jerry West says Lebron has a team that without him would have problems winning.. The faker fans say he has great talent, lol.. Kobe had caron butler and lamar odom in 05 and couldn't win with that team.. Lebron would win a title with that team...:lol

Michael Jordan say's Kobe is the Best In The League...But that wouldn't change your opinion would it?? So, why would u try to use Jerry West to change opinions?..Thats the beautiful thing about The NBA and opinions, everyone can have different ones...So why try in make someone think the way you do?...

[NBASTATMAN]

Michael Jordan say's Kobe is the Best In The League...But that wouldn't change your opinion would it?? So, why would u try to use Jerry West to change opinions?..Thats the beautiful thing about The NBA and opinions, everyone can have different ones...So why try in make someone think the way you do?...


Actually I think Kobe is still a better all around player, I just think Lebron is way more dominant... Jerry said he doesn't know how The Cavs win.. And without Lebron they would struggle... Mj is a great player but not the best judge of talent.. Either way I respect kobe and his greatness.. I just don' t believe that he is what kobephiles say he is.. Great and possibly a top 12 player in the NBA at the end of his career but he needs at least 2 or 3 more titles since he has played with great talent around him.. As for Lebron you have to give the kid credit, he makes the correct play almost every time and he is taking a team deep into the playoffs that has no business being there.. Jerry West says this.. I agree...

[Indian guy]

[QUOTE=magi

[NBASTATMAN]

Err...this myth needs to end. Kobe had a great 4th qtr, but he struggled from qtr 1-3 - had 22 points on 9-22 shooting. LA only trailed by 2 points entering the 4th qtr, thanks to forcing turnovers and terrific offensive rebounding by their big men. Let's not make it seem like Kobe was carrying the team the whole night. LA had no problem staying competitive despite his mediocre play the first 36 minutes.

I can't even imagine the ass whooping Cleveland would've been getting if LeBron had 22 points on poor shooting the first 3 qtrs last night.


That is the same thing I was hearing when Kobe had shaq, payton , malone and shaq on his team...

[Duncan21formvp]

Ha must have forgot that Dwight beat Lebron and Kobe beat Dwight fully healthy.

[Wally450]

LeBron is better than Kobe.

[Mr Feeny]

Well, he is better. And probably surpassed him by around that time. Nothing about this is really that surprising. He's a better scorer than Kobe, a better rebounder than Kobe, a better playmaker, a better shot blocked,, better at playing the passing lanes, a better distance (3 point) shooter. There really is no comparison.

[SouBeachTalents]

Ha must have forgot that Dwight beat Lebron and Kobe beat Dwight fully healthy.
http://www.insidehoops.com/forum/showpost.php?p=3036524&postcount=34

[Hey Yo]

Kobe just needs to shoot the ball more, so that Gasol can get the offensive rebound and score.
:roll:

[SpaceJam]

http://www.insidehoops.com/forum/showpost.php?p=3036524&postcount=34

:roll: :roll: :roll:

[bison]

http://www.insidehoops.com/forum/showpost.php?p=3036524&postcount=34

ISH in a nutshell. Dick hopping trolls everywhere.

[LAmbruh]

http://www.insidehoops.com/forum/showpost.php?p=3036524&postcount=34
:roll: :roll: :roll:

My boy SBT always comes with retro throwback burns

[bison]

Finals losers recognize finals losers.