Kobe Bryant vs Oscar Robertson

[1987_Lakers]

Which player is better?

http://www.celebrific.com/wp-content/uploads/2007/05/kobe-bryant-traded-5-31-07.jpg

http://galobasket.files.wordpress.com/2008/03/4936.jpg

[ShowTime LA]

Kb24

[cotdt]

That was the 60's. I doubt anyone today even remembers the Big O.

[GreatGreg]

1971 Bucks>2009 Lakers.

[momo]

That was the 60's. I doubt anyone today even remembers the Big O.

R:roll: o:roll: f:roll:

Anyone who follows hoop knows about Big O. Even if they are not that old, they know or they are ignorant.

[cotdt]

R:roll: o:roll: f:roll:

Anyone who follows hoop knows about Big O. Even if they are not that old, they know or they are ignorant.

They might have heard about him and seen some short highlights of him, but few have watched his actual games. The ones who have just rely on 40 year old memory. Whereas Kobe Bryant, people have watched several hundred of his games. It's hard to compare the two from reputation/stats rather than watching the actual games from recent memory.

[andgar923]

That was the 60's. I doubt anyone today even remembers the Big O.

I agree

Its hard for the majority of us to really say who was better, since not many of us really saw them play enough.

The only positions that I think can be judged is the big men. Because big men today have deteriorated almost to the point of extinction.

[lbj23clutch]

Kobe Jelly-Bean Bryant.

[lakerfreak]

A walking triple double is nice to have, but Kobe brings more to the table and his offense is definitely better in a sense where he can score from anywhere.

[chitownsfinest]

Love Oscar but I gotta go with Kobe on this one

[andgar923]

A walking triple double is nice to have, but Kobe brings more to the table and his offense is definitely better in a sense where he can score from anywhere.

How do you know this?

[lakerfreak]

How do you know this?

I talk to people who watched the game from a while back and I take their word for it. Sound alright to you?

[ShaqAttack3234]

Kobe. They both have great stats, but Kobe is more of a winner. Kobe has won 4 championships, 3 of them as a second option and 1 as a first option. Oscar just has one as a second option.

[Lebron23]

Kobe Bryant

He already won an NBA Championship as the no.1 option of his team.

[1987_Lakers]

This was posted on RealGM by NeilsCeltics...


Overall, I personally believe that Kobe Bryant is a better player than Oscar Robertson.

- Why? He can shoot three pointers with a hand on his face, Oscar Robertson, I doubt he can do the same

- He can be an effective decoy, when he wants to, and when he becomes a decoy, his talented team wins game.

-Kobe Bryant is also faster than Oscar Robertson. From the accounts of Oscar Robertson fans, they said that he wasn't super fast, like Michael Jordan or Kobe, but he was very strong for a Guard, weighing 225 pounds of sold rock hard muscle. Oscar Robertson had the body of a power swingman, a swingman who bangs his way to the basket, and I am sure that he is stronger than Kobe Bryant. Kobe Bryant is a quick swingman.

-He plays better man-to-man defense. He plays better defense overall, and has 9 NBA First-Team Defense selections. Oscar Robertson was never as good as a man-to-man defender as Kobe Bryant is. Oscar Robertson fans agree, as far as I can see on these forums.

- He won his Chip' as the man

- Kobe Bryant has better off the ball movement than Oscar Robertson. Oscar Robertson had insanely high usage rates during his times at the Royals, along with the faster pace, the ironman era, and the lack of athletic frontcourt players, he grabbed 10 rebounds. In today's NBA, he wouldn't average 10. Somewhere around 7 or 9 at most. Seemed like Oscar Robertson padded his stats

- Kobe Bryant is a purer shooter than Oscar Robertson

- Kobe Bryant can attempt super crazy shots that will fall that Oscar Robertson can only dream of hitting

What Oscar Robertson has on Kobe Bryant is..

- He is more efficient than Kobe Bryant, and has a higher FG percentage, despite the fast rate of play and playing in the Ironman era

- He is less turn over prone, and had the mind state of a Point Guard, and a scorer's mentality. He is basically Paul Pierce and Kobe Bryant at the same time, Paul Pierce loved to bang inside the rim and score, Kobe Bryant likes to fake the socks off you with his basketball smarts, put them together, and you get Oscar Robertson's offensive style

- He is stronger than Kobe Bryant, he is made of 225 pounds of solid muscle

- He can run the point, while being a scorer at the same time

- He has a better post-up game than Kobe Bryant, he backed up his man and he was automatic once he got close, and if double teamed, he had extraordinary vision to pass to the open man

- Has better overall court vision than Kobe Bryant, as the result of running the Point often. Kobe has a Swingman's mentality, and is thus, more turnover prone, since he is more interested in scoring than running the offense

- Flawless fundamentals, and he made everything look too easy, he had no flash at all, he was brutally efficient that way

- He was always calm, and cold. Kobe Bryant gets angry, that is not good psychologically, and is not inspiring to you're teammates. Also, he gets bonus points for not cheating on his wife, not complaining about Airplane flights, and shooting himself out of the finals against Detroit Pistons

Overall, I'd take Kobe Bryant since he has more range, way better man-to-man defense, he is a purer shooter, he is much quicker, and he can shoot a three pointer with a hand on his face night in and night out. He also won his Championship as the man, Big O couldn't do the same.

What do you think?

Personally, I love Oscar Robertson and Kobe Bryant, but I'd pick Kobe Bryant.

[Duncan21formvp]

Which player is better?

http://www.celebrific.com/wp-content/uploads/2007/05/kobe-bryant-traded-5-31-07.jpg

http://galobasket.files.wordpress.com/2008/03/4936.jpg

Oscar

[gxL]

Kobe Bryant

He already won an NBA Championship as the no.1 option of his team.
this

[Duncan21formvp]

1971 Bucks>2009 Lakers.

That's not the comparison here.

[jongib369]

Oscar Robertson Highlights - THE LEGEND IN HIS PRIME

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4ee2Ag5GeMQ

http://25.media.tumblr.com/d4f36dc29c557d02c7f2021af19b1efc/tumblr_mhtz71M9Jx1r31jjho1_500.jpg

[9erempiree]

Oscar was the epitome of an Era-specific player. A great player during his era but his game doesn't transcend through out all other eras like Kobe.

[jongib369]

http://24.media.tumblr.com/4f243b84b7ffcea7567851dc7d398863/tumblr_mhk6id7vno1qcp1zao1_1280.jpg

[jongib369]

Oscar was the epitome of an Era-specific player. A great player during his era but his game doesn't transcend through out all other eras like Kobe.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wbIMeF6IZ8I

[CavaliersFTW]

Oscar Robertson Highlights - THE LEGEND IN HIS PRIME

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4ee2Ag5GeMQ

http://25.media.tumblr.com/d4f36dc29c557d02c7f2021af19b1efc/tumblr_mhtz71M9Jx1r31jjho1_500.jpg
Ehhhh.... I think I'm gonna make this video private until I make another Oscar video that better explains how/why he played the way he did (below the rim, with no style) and uses better highlights. It's subtle things like consistency, IQ, and strength that Oscar had that made him great which makes for very boring "unathletic" highlights. Oscar needs to be presented carefully or fans will get the wrong idea about him. I made that video before I had enough footage to really showcase Oscar.

[Gifted Mind]

Asking which player is better (comparing their primes) and which player is greater (comparing their careers) are 2 different questions. Most people fail to make that distinction. One may have accomplished more, while the other may have actually been a better basketball player.

[9erempiree]

Oscar needs to be presented carefully or fans will get the wrong idea about him. I made that video before I had enough footage to really showcase Oscar.

Great players don't need to be presented in a different way.:facepalm Now you are just trying to fool the public.

Let's face it, Oscar is an Era-specific player. Judging by the comments you made, I will pick Kobe base on that alone.

Kobe doesn't need to be presented in a certain way.

[pauk]

Never seen Oscar play, statistically he is much better though.

[CavaliersFTW]

Great players don't need to be presented in a different way.:facepalm Now you are just trying to fool the public.

Let's face it, Oscar is an Era-specific player. Judging by the comments you made, I will pick Kobe base on that alone.

Kobe doesn't need to be presented in a certain way.
So by making a new highlight video that contains more testimonial of peers and contemporaries explaining all the facets of his game that made him great - along with better examples of him in action I'll be trying to "fool" the public how exactly? :oldlol:

[IllegalD]

Kobe hands down.

Unless you're a hypocrite with an agenda.

Kobe gets shit for winning his first 3 with Shaq. Oscar has just ONE ring and he won it with prime Kareem.

Kobe has won 2 as the man.

No contest.

[Nebraskanball]

Kobe is the better player and had a MUCH better career.

With that being said, Oscar is the most underrated talent of all time. One of the greats.

[TheBigVeto]

BigO easy. He's inifinitely better than Kobe.

[senelcoolidge]

If I had to pick, Oscar easily. Kobe scores a lot but he's inefficient and turns off his teammates. Oscar could score a ton if he wanted to but he was a point guard. He was a pass first guy. He was great at posting his man and shooting that fade away. I love his jumpshot. A competitor. Unselfish. Did everything pretty much.

[Magic 32]

Never seen Oscar play, statistically he is much better though.

Spoken like a true Lebron fan.

[Magic 32]

I love his jumpshot. A competitor. Unselfish. Did everything pretty much.

Except winning.

[Unbiased_one]

Except winning.

Team game.

[pauk]

Spoken like a true Lebron fan.

Excuse me? Oscar had better stats... didnt say he is a better player, thats about it... never seen Oscar play (just highlights) so i cant determine if he was better than Kobe... and none of it had anything to do with Lebron... stop thinking about him all the time...

[fpliii]

:confusedshrug:

[Doctor Rivers]

Lebron... stop thinking about him all the time...

:roll::roll:

[pudman13]

Kobe doesn't need to be presented in a certain way.

He does need to be presented in a certain way--a way that doesn't show how many times he takes a shot rather than pass to an open teammate and doesn't show how many stupid shots he takes.

I'll present this: Bryant's career FG%: .454. Robertson's: .485. And, of course, Robertson averaged twice as many assists as significantly more rebounds.

[pudman13]

Ehhhh.... I think I'm gonna make this video private until I make another Oscar video.

What do we need to do to be able to watch it?

[pauk]

But to be honest, if Oscar was really as good (in any era) as those stats show i would take him not only over Kobe but probably over anybody in NBA history....

[KOBE143]

Kobe and its not even close..

Kobe is top 5 GOAT at worst..

Oscar is one the greatest era specific player of all time tho, right up there with Bird and Chamberlain..

[pauk]

:roll::roll:

No, i dont randomly bring in Lebron when the post or thread i am replying to has nothing to do with Lebron, unless its within the context... saying nothing else but that Oscar had better stats than Kobe and seeing somebody say it had something to do with Lebron doesnt make sense in any shape or form, which means that somebody (Magic32) is very obsessed with Lebron / Lebron fans (in a hater/butthurt type of way)....

[Magic 32]

No, i dont randomly bring in Lebron when the post or thread i am replying to has nothing to do with Lebron, unless its within the context... saying nothing else but that Oscar had better stats than Kobe and seeing somebody say it had something to do with Lebron doesnt make sense in any shape or form, which means that somebody (Magic32) is very obsessed with Lebron / Lebron fans (in a hater/butthurt type of way)....

:roll: :roll: :roll:

[IGOTGAME]

If I had to pick, Oscar easily. Kobe scores a lot but he's inefficient and turns off his teammates. Oscar could score a ton if he wanted to but he was a point guard. He was a pass first guy. He was great at posting his man and shooting that fade away. I love his jumpshot. A competitor. Unselfish. Did everything pretty much.

Didn't Oscar turn off his teammates too.

[chazzy]

If you're going to rank Oscar over Kobe because of his numbers, then why stop there? How high could he be ranked if we're just going by his raw numbers?

[gengiskhan]

I'll take a UNANIMOUS MVP winner on a "SCRUB" franchise when perimeter players were rarely given MVPs

over

CONSOLATION MVP winner on NBA's winningest franchise in last 17 yrs.


31+/11+/10+ for 6 yrs!!!!!!!!!!!! is not a joke. Magic & Bird tried their whole career.

Big O is Top 10 GOATs for a reason.

Kobe is Top 15

Only player better than Big O is LBJ now because of his individual accolades.

Championships are won by TEAM, coaching staff & team chemistry.

a reason why a scrub franchise like Cincinnati Royals never won one.

[tpols]

Didn't Oscar turn off his teammates too.
Yes he did. And thats the funny part:oldlol:

[gengiskhan]

Kobe is the epitome of an Era-specific player. A great player during his era but his game doesn't transcend through out all other eras like Oscar.

agreed.

Perimeter friendly rules. something Oscar never had. Imagine how close to 40 ppg oscar would've dropped if he is averaging 31+/11+/10+ in that era when rules are strictly against PERIMETER player.

Oscar still forced his way to MVP win on a SCRUB franchise as Royal. Kobe can never ever win MVP on scrub franchise. He is an era specific player who was given everything. winning coach, winningest frachise, best front court players, Best center in the league, DPOY winner.

Kobe was literally gifted teamates like no other.

[chazzy]

31+/11+/10+ for 6 yrs!!!!!!!!!!!! is not a joke.

Yup. MJ could never do that either. Big O >>>>

[PHILA]

As far as offense, I like Big O. He is like Chris Paul with Penny Hardaway's post up game and Jordan's strength (though not as explosive). Also Big O is a lot smoother than CP without all the herky jerky deceptive moves and he didn't flop around. He is the pick & roll master in a league that heavily favors P&R PG play and with all the spot up 3 point shooters to spread the floor out. Never mind that he is 6'6, 220 lbs and you can't touch him on the outside without a foul.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=U9Gbb9_XAtU&t=16m52s




In the video example below, look how he bumps off powerful forward Chet Walker with great ease and grace. In the following play, Wali Jones (the top defensive guard in the NBA) is completely helpless on the baseline against Oscar, who makes him look almost like a high school kid. Seeing as Wilt had to watch Dierking (who could shoot from the outside), once Oscar had him all by himself, it was over.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0aECiYcdvIE&t=3m16s





In keeping track of Bill Russell and Boston's defense (http://www.insidehoops.com/forum/showthread.php?t=302158) in the available game footage, the Royals with Oscar shot 7/8 (87.5%) in pick & roll plays where Russell was involved in the play. The other opponents shot 2/11 (18%) in the same situation.



http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HE6kIu34Qsc&t=22m45s

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HE6kIu34Qsc&t=12m55s

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HE6kIu34Qsc&t=11m10s

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HE6kIu34Qsc&t=14m07s

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HE6kIu34Qsc&t=24m47s *How many players today can make this shot from this close a distance and angle?








Sports Illustrated - October 24, 1966

CINCINNATI

The pick-and-roll is a simple play, even used by the kids at the YMCA in half-court games. With somewhat better personnel, the Royals dare you to stop it. Oscar Robertson gets the pick, and Jerry Lucas takes the roll (right). Lucas, guarded by a big forward, picks Oscar's man, or slows him down, to make the forward commit himself. If the big man switches to Robertson, Lucas has a smaller defender and rolls for the basket and a pass from Oscar. If there is no switch. Robertson zips past with at least a half-step advantage and a one-on-one situation with a guard down near the baseline. "If I can get him to that spot," says Coach Jack McMahon, "he's unstoppable."




The Big O: My Life, My Times, My Game - Oscar Robertson

http://i.imgur.com/HTDvDgD.png

[PHILA]

He had a very quick release on his shot as well.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OTs918TZ-qo&t=9m58s

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=buIzpvJDMis&t=18m15s

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HE6kIu34Qsc&t=12m55s

[gengiskhan]

Yup. MJ could never do that either. Big O >>>>

come to think of it.

Big O is the only one MJ feared according to his interviews.

Big O is the only one who never thought MJ is the greatest ever.

Kobe is of jerry west's calibre. Oscar is above kobe's league.

Kobe lacks strength & stamine of Big O & MJ for the beginners.

It all starts from here.

[Doctor Rivers]

come to think of it.

Big O is the only one MJ feared according to his interviews.

Big O is the only one who never thought MJ is the greatest ever.

Kobe is of jerry west's calibre. Oscar is above kobe's league.

Kobe lacks strength & stamine of Big O & MJ for the beginners.

It all starts from here.

http://www.nba.com/jordan/hoop_mjonmj.html


I would love to play against Jerry West.

[PHILA]

Jerry West

Look at these quick defensive hands.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AjwkiXiwzCY&t=3m10s

[gengiskhan]

http://www.nba.com/jordan/hoop_mjonmj.html

exactly my point.

Jordan LOVES playing against Jerry cuz he'll destroy his a55. same goes for Kobe.

Jordan HATES playing against Big O cuz of strength, athleticism, stamina factor. Big O can tire Jordan out offensively & defensively.

[Legends66NBA7]

Asking which player is better (comparing their primes) and which player is greater (comparing their careers) are 2 different questions. Most people fail to make that distinction. One may have accomplished more, while the other may have actually been a better basketball player.

So in this case, who do you have as the better player and who was the greater player ?


I'll present this: Bryant's career FG%: .454. Robertson's: .485.

One guy played in an era that had the 3 point line (and averaged about 4 attempts for his career) vs one guy that played in an era that didn't. Both went up against different defenses, which spans over 40-50+ year difference vs their primes. Totally different cases.


And, of course, Robertson averaged twice as many assists as significantly more rebounds.

Assists would be a given, since he was a more of natural point. Roberston rebounds, especially early in his career, are obviously more inflated. More pace plus a team that gave up a lot of points, he was going to get more rebounds. It doesn't take away anything of what he did at the time, but to put context into it and he's not averaging that in the modern era. He would still be a very good rebounding guard, but not by some significant advantage over any other guard.

[TheTenth]

Big O is the only one who never thought MJ is the greatest ever.

Not true. Many others have that same opinion.

[Doctor Rivers]

exactly my point.

Jordan LOVES playing against Jerry cuz he'll destroy his a55. same goes for Kobe.

Jordan HATES playing against Big O cuz of strength, athleticism, stamina factor. Big O can tire Jordan out offensively & defensively.


You know, I'm a competitive guy, and I like to play against competitive players and see what happens from there.

oh?

[gengiskhan]

BigO easy. He's inifinitely better than Kobe.

this.

stats.

individual accolades.

strength, stamina & endurance.

Big O has it all over Kobe.

also, "big booty" according to Kobe.