Four-team trade sending Hedo Turkoglu to Raptors and Shawn Marion to Mavericks done

[depletedW]

It was actually a 4-team trade that sent Hedo Turkoglu to the Raptors and Shawn Marion to the Mavericks

The Orlando Magic have acquired a trade exception and cash considerations from the Toronto Raptors, and cash considerations from the Dallas Mavericks as part of a four-team trade, General Manager Otis Smith announced today. As part of a sign-and-trade deal, forward Hedo Turkoglu was traded to Toronto (http://www.insidehoops.com/forum/../blog/?p=4537). InsideHoops.com (http://www.insidehoops.com/forum/../blog/?p=4537)

Also included as parts of the deal - Toronto sends Shawn Marion, Kris Humphries, Nathan Jawai and cash considerations to Dallas, while (http://www.insidehoops.com/forum/../blog/?p=4537) also sending a future second round draft pick to Memphis; Memphis sends Greg Buckner to Dallas; Dallas sends Jerry Stackhouse and cash considerations to Memphis, while also sending Devean George and Antoine Wright to Toronto. InsideHoops.com (http://www.insidehoops.com/forum/../blog/?p=4537)

[phoenix18]

How does this help the Mavericks? I dont see a defender on that starting line-up?

[miles berg]

Jason Kidd, Josh Howard, Shawn Marion, & Marcin Gortat are all excellent defenders.

[knickballer]

This article doesn't prove **** and doesn't give any new info.

[knickballer]

Jason Kidd, Josh Howard, Shawn Marion, & Marcin Gortat are all excellent defenders.


Jason Kidd gets exposed by the quicker PG's...

[miles berg]

PG-Jason Kidd | JJ Barea
SG-Josh Howard | Jason Terry
SF-Shawn Marion | Josh Howard
PF-Dirk Nowitzki | Shawn Marion
CT-Marcin Gortat | Erick Dampier

Thats your basic 8 man Dallas Mavericks rotation.

[D-Rose]

Great acquisition.

I'm happy Cuban didn't sit around twiddling his thumbs this off-season. :applause:

Still got Damp's contract for the deadline to get even better if needed.

[knickballer]

PG-Jason Kidd | JJ Barea
SG-Josh Howard | Jason Terry
SF-Shawn Marion | Josh Howard
PF-Dirk Nowitzki | Shawn Marion
CT-Marcin Gortat | Erick Dampier

Thats your basic 8 man Dallas Mavericks rotation.


Quintin Ross at the 3 also and Wright will get some minutes at the 2/3. Good depth on that roster.

[1~Gibson~1]

PG-Jason Kidd | JJ Barea
SG-Josh Howard | Jason Terry
SF-Shawn Marion | Josh Howard
PF-Dirk Nowitzki | Shawn Marion
CT-Marcin Gortat | Erick Dampier

Thats your basic 8 man Dallas Mavericks rotation.
What about Hollins and Wright?

[LBJames2010]

What about Beobois? isnt he coming over to play this season?

[raptorfan_dr07]

What about Hollins and Wright?

Hollins is a free agent I think?

[Luigi]

Jason Kidd, Josh Howard, Shawn Marion, & Marcin Gortat are all excellent defenders.

This is right. I have been interested in seeing what adding Gortat and Marion will do defensively for Dallas. It basically duplicates two already strong defensive spots (Howard/Marion and Dampier/Gortat), but it does help them cover more of the floor.

They will always have a strong perimeter and a strong interior defender on the floor at the same time.

[1~Gibson~1]

Hollins is a free agent I think?
oh yea. he's restricted though.

[#1SportsFan86]

Jason Kidd gets exposed by the quicker PG's...


The Mavs already got a young PG in the draft named Rodrigue Beaubois who's just as fast as Devin Harris.

[1~Gibson~1]

Marion is also good at guarding quick guards isnt he? he usually guarded Tony Parker when the Suns/Spurs met, but then again that was some year back and he's aged :confusedshrug:

[triangleoffense]

PG-Jason Kidd | JJ Barea
SG-Josh Howard | Jason Terry
SF-Shawn Marion | Josh Howard
PF-Dirk Nowitzki | Shawn Marion
CT-Marcin Gortat | Erick Dampier

This is another dumb move by Cuban. I find it pretty amazing that Cuban has totally destroyed his 06 Finals roster. Thats not even counting his trading of Nash to Pheonix. He first dealt away their young all-star PG that was suppose to be the future of the franchise. Howard never became the superstar that everyone was hoping he'd be and then Cuban sealed the fate of the team by firing Avery Johnson, which has the highest winning % ever by a head coach in NBA history. Now all the Mavs have is pretty much a plethora of forwards that can all do the same thing except dominate the paint. Marion was never a post up player and Howard should be played at the 3 rather than the 2, he feels way more comfortable there. And its' not like Dirk likes to take it to the paint all that often either. Its sad when your best post player is either Gortat, Bass or Dampier.

[1~Gibson~1]

This is another dumb move by Cuban. I find it pretty amazing that Cuban has totally destroyed his 06 Finals roster. Thats not even counting his trading of Nash to Pheonix. He first dealt away their young all-star PG that was suppose to be the future of the franchise. Howard never became the superstar that everyone was hoping he'd be and then Cuban sealed the fate of the team by firing Avery Johnson, which has the highest winning % ever by a head coach in NBA history. Now all the Mavs have is pretty much a plethora of forwards that can all do the same thing except dominate the paint. Marion was never a post up player and Howard should be played at the 3 rather than the 2, he feels way more comfortable there. And its' not like Dirk likes to take it to the paint all that often either. Its sad when your best post player is either Gortat, Bass or Dampier.
Dirk is their best post player :hammerhead:

[HaNdLe ThE RoCk]

Bye bye to Antoine Wright's minutes

[#1SportsFan86]

This is another dumb move by Cuban. I find it pretty amazing that Cuban has totally destroyed his 06 Finals roster. Thats not even counting his trading of Nash to Pheonix. He first dealt away their young all-star PG that was suppose to be the future of the franchise. Howard never became the superstar that everyone was hoping he'd be and then Cuban sealed the fate of the team by firing Avery Johnson, which has the highest winning % ever by a head coach in NBA history. Now all the Mavs have is pretty much a plethora of forwards that can all do the same thing except dominate the paint. Marion was never a post up player and Howard should be played at the 3 rather than the 2, he feels way more comfortable there. And its' not like Dirk likes to take it to the paint all that often either. Its sad when your best post player is either Gortat, Bass or Dampier.

Hating at it's finest

[depletedW]

This is another dumb move by Cuban. I find it pretty amazing that Cuban has totally destroyed his 06 Finals roster. Thats not even counting his trading of Nash to Pheonix. He first dealt away their young all-star PG that was suppose to be the future of the franchise. Howard never became the superstar that everyone was hoping he'd be and then Cuban sealed the fate of the team by firing Avery Johnson, which has the highest winning % ever by a head coach in NBA history. Now all the Mavs have is pretty much a plethora of forwards that can all do the same thing except dominate the paint. Marion was never a post up player and Howard should be played at the 3 rather than the 2, he feels way more comfortable there. And its' not like Dirk likes to take it to the paint all that often either. Its sad when your best post player is either Gortat, Bass or Dampier.
Nash wasn't traded he left in free agency. You can diss the move all you want but at least try and get your facts straight.

[triangleoffense]

Hating at it's finest

How is it hating? It's my own opinion that this was a dumb move by the Mavs... everything is still subjective until the regular season starts.


Nash wasn't traded he left in free agency. You can diss the move all you want but at least try and get your facts straight.

Ah thats right, sorry my mistake. Either way... Cuban didn't want to hand out Nash the cash necessary because he thought Nash wasn't worth it.. Nash received the leagues MVP twice in Pheonix as well as leading them to what was then the best turnaround season ever in the NBA (currently belongs to the 08 Celtics).

[Mr Know It All]

This is another dumb move by Cuban. I find it pretty amazing that Cuban has totally destroyed his 06 Finals roster. Thats not even counting his trading of Nash to Pheonix. He first dealt away their young all-star PG that was suppose to be the future of the franchise. Howard never became the superstar that everyone was hoping he'd be and then Cuban sealed the fate of the team by firing Avery Johnson, which has the highest winning % ever by a head coach in NBA history. Now all the Mavs have is pretty much a plethora of forwards that can all do the same thing except dominate the paint. Marion was never a post up player and Howard should be played at the 3 rather than the 2, he feels way more comfortable there. And its' not like Dirk likes to take it to the paint all that often either. Its sad when your best post player is either Gortat, Bass or Dampier.

You know Dallas actually got BETTER when Nash left right? Devin Harris was never going to be the future of their franchise, hell he was a fourth option on a team that was quickly losing its will to compete. Howard was never expected to be anything more than a suitable 2nd option, the fact that he tried to be more than that actually created problems for the team and he became a black hole. Avery was simply not the right coach after the 2006 Finals, he was a motivator and good for a young team, but he was severely outcoached in 2007 and the team had tuned him out.

All in all, this post stinks of hate and anti-Mavs bias. This is a solid pickup. They got Marion, a good defensive player and someone who should be able to flourish with a PG like Kidd. Especially considering they gave up Stackhouse (Who is done and didn't play one minute for the Mavs during their playoff run). Depending on how Howard adjusts to playing at the 2 spot, this could be the move that puts the Mavericks back into contention into the West.

[MrEncinas]

Looks like I'm in the minority but I like this move for the Mavs. Nice mix of perimeter and interior defense and they still have excellent offensive players in their rotation. Not saying this team is going to win it all but I believe they can certainly contend.

[ElPigto]

They have a nice running team going for them here. I hate the Mavs but they are going to be challenging for the Southwest division. Should be fun watching Mavs and Spurs duke it out.

[kentatm]

Jason Kidd gets exposed by the quicker PG's...

ALL PGs get exposed by the quicker PGs.

[MrEncinas]

ALL PGs get exposed by the quicker PGs.
:applause:

[ZHAKIDD532]

Wright and Stackhouse are both leaving in the deal apparently. And Dallas seems to be getting a bargain contract wise. 5 years about 39 million for Marion? What a steal...

[TMT]

Great pickup by the Mavs.

[miles berg]

This was what JES from DB.com said the salary for Marion looked like:

2009-10 = $6,265,200
2010-11 = $6,920,063
2011-12 = $7,646,669
2012-13 = $8,449,569
2013-14 = $9,336,744
Total........$38,615,575

[triangleoffense]

All in all, this post stinks of hate and anti-Mavs bias.
Why? Because I don't agree with your argument?


They got Marion, a good defensive player and someone who should be able to flourish with a PG like Kidd.
His man to man defensive is ok... his help defensive is acceptable at best. Marion might be an ok fit but I just don't see him as the piece that puts Dallas into one of the western powerhouses. To truly become a title contender a team has to have no weaknesses from players 1-12. Look at how the Lakers are still aggressively pursuing Odom, their front office knows that chances are the Lakers are not going to get it done without Odom. When the Lakers won the finals this year they had players 1-12 step up in crucial points in their playoff run. Shannon Brown's energy off the bench is what turned the tide against Denver in Game 4 (or was it 5). Fisher's jumpers is what got the Lakers through game 4 of the Finals. Odom's play, although inconsistent is what propelled the Lakers through the playoffs when he was playing good. Ariza, Walton, Bynum, Farmer all contributed at various points in the playoffs as well as the finals.

The Mavs have too many issues. Howard is going to have to adjust to a position he's not use to. Jason Kidd is past his prime and can be a liability at times on defensive just like Fisher was.. the difference is that the Lakers have Brown and Farmer to make up for Fisher's defensive woes as well as his offensive woes. The Mavs have a bruiser at the C position in Dampier that will put in the dirty work but his age is becoming a big issue. Bass is another promising C/PF that looks like he has potential yet hasn't really stepped up for the Mavs when it really counted. Like I said already Dirk and Marion have no real inside game and really can't dominate the ball in the paint like the team needs them to.

I really like that kid Jason Terry though.. especially coming off the bench. He averaged 20 points off the bench last season and lead the team in 4th quarter scoring. Too bad they can't get a starting SG thats half as good as him.

[D-Rose]

Deal is agreed on!

Mavs get:
Marion
Humphries

Raps get:
Devean George
Antoine Wright

Grizz get:
Stack
cash

http://sports.espn.go.com/nba/news/story?id=4314637

:applause:

EDIT: Ric bucher's twitter also has Greg Buckner to Dallas and Quincy Douby to Memphis.

[depletedW]

I'm glad we threw Devean George in there too. So damn sick of him.

Possible rotation as of now:

Kidd/Barea
Howard/Terry
Marion/Ross
Dirk/Singleton (maybe Bass)
Gortat/Dampier

[kentatm]

Buckner has the exact same type of contract as Dampier

The Mavs can now offer a full on max contract for a player next summer in a sign and trade. Some team is going to lose their star for nothing and Dallas will be able to step in and give them instant and significant savings with two completely non guaranteed contracts.

[D-Rose]

Buckner has the exact same type of contract as Dampier

The Mavs can now offer a full on max contract for a player next summer in a sign and trade. Some team is going to lose their star for nothing and Dallas will be able to step in and give them instant and significant savings with two completely non guaranteed contracts.
In Cuban we trust? Damn, I just wanna see Dirk win it all, and with the Mavs not anywhere else.

[ElPigto]

Wow they even get Humphries out of the deal.

[T-Low]

I don't know why but I can see a 2nd rounder thrown to TO for some reason. In these types of trades, there is usually a draft pick somewhere...

[Mr Know It All]

In Cuban we trust? Damn, I just wanna see Dirk win it all, and with the Mavs not anywhere else.

Lebron may have some thinking to do. Dallas is a far bigger market than Cleveland, not as big as New York though. However, with their roster intact apart from Howard and Dampier leaving Lebron would have a terrific chance to win with Dirk, Kidd, Terry, and the rest. Wade is another guy who you could bring up, but I question how deep the hate really runs between Dirk and him. Their mutual dislike seems pretty genuine.

The guy I look at is Joe Johnson, he could fill that 2 guard spot and would compliment Dirk well. Ah well, let's not get ahead of ourselves.

[LALakerFan4Life]

Jason Kidd and Shawn Marion are reunited once again.

[JoshCoward]

Whatever with Marion, I'm just glad that Devean George is gone.

[Twiens]

Deal is agreed on!

Mavs get:
Marion
Humphries

Raps get:
Devean George
Antoine Wright

Grizz get:
Stack
cash

http://sports.espn.go.com/nba/news/story?id=4314637

:applause:

EDIT: Ric bucher's twitter also has Greg Buckner to Dallas and Quincy Douby to Memphis.

How good is Wright? Possible starting SG for the raps next year?

[IamSofaKing]

^I'd rather start Derozan than Wright, though we havent even seen how Derozan plays, i bet they will average around the same numbers... Around 7.3 PPG same as Wrights average last year

Why dont Mavs fans like Devean George? :confusedshrug: Are you gonna tell us or are you gonna let Raptors fans find out...

[JoshCoward]

How good is Wright? Possible starting SG for the raps next year?

Inconsistent.

Offensively, when he's on fire, he's on fire but that rarely happens. Can drive to the basket (occasionally) but gets caught out by the defenders easily + unable to create contact or force a good shot. He is a shooting guard that can't shoot. I lost counts on how many open shots he missed last season.

Good defender though, I believe he defended our oppositions best wing player occasionally. Didn't do too bad of a job. I guess that's all lol.

Who's your projected starting SG?

[kentatm]

How good is Wright? Possible starting SG for the raps next year?

Wright is a solid defensive role player. You really don't want to have to start him unless you have 3 solid starting scorers though.

He has a really nice don't F with me mean streak too.

We don't like George b/c he is the devil. For every good play he will make two bad ones. Ok but overrated defense. Loves to take stupid fouls once he gets beat or feels he was fouled on the other end. Takes bad three pointers all the time. If he drives, 90% of the time it ends in a charging foul.

[IamSofaKing]

Wright is a solid defensive role player. You really don't want to have to start him unless you have 3 solid starting scorers though.

He has a really nice don't F with me mean streak too.

We don't like George b/c he is the devil. For every good play he will make two bad ones. Ok but overrated defense. Loves to take stupid fouls once he gets beat or feels he was fouled on the other end. Takes bad three pointers all the time. If he drives, 90% of the time it ends in a charging foul.

Bargnani, Bosh, Turkoglu... I'd rather Derozan start at least he can knock down mid range shots...

[Beebo]

Good defender though, I believe he defended our oppositions best wing player occasionally. Didn't do too bad of a job. I guess that's all lol.

Who's your projected starting SG?

Thats all raptor fans want to hear. :cheers:

Oh and I guess Derozan will be starting for us at the 2 spot.

[Twiens]

Bargnani, Bosh, Turkoglu... I'd rather Derozan start at least he can knock down mid range shots...

I kinda agree. Might as well give the rook a chance, see what we have there. I actually think Wright should play big minutes though. Raps bench is horrible and if he's a good defender like said above then he'll be needed. Not much D in Toronto :oldlol:

PS: Devean George has been trash for 5+ years, I bet he'll get cut.

[br3akdwon]

I'm not really sure with this one. Yes, the Mavs do get a former all-star and a very capable player however I do not see how everything is going to mesh. Hopefully they do. Props to Cuban and the whole Mavs organization for pulling this out. By the way, How did Dallas get Quinton Ross? I really like this guy. He's a very solid defender back when he was a Clipper.

[hassano]

Somehow apparently BC got Orlando into the deal so miraculously Toronto gets to keeep their MLE according to this http://sports.espn.go.com/nba/news/story?id=4314637
:bowdown: BC

[Pistol Pete]

Jose Calderon | Roko Ukic
Demar DeRozan | Antoine Wright
Hedo Turkoglu | Devean George
Chris Bosh | Reggie Evans
Andrea Bargnani | Patrick O'Bryant

We really could use Pops Mensah Bonsu to back up the five spot.

[macmac]

Somehow apparently BC got Orlando into the deal so miraculously Toronto gets to keeep their MLE according to this http://sports.espn.go.com/nba/news/story?id=4314637
:bowdown: BC

yeah dude its been reported like an hour ago. BC just pulled a rabbit out his sleeve on this one

[kentatm]

I wonder if Orlando getting involved means the Mavs and Magic will have a wink wink deal where they help each other getting Bass and Gortat?

[kentatm]

http://images.yuku.com/image/jpeg/f4426a749f6d9952d3204d8eb59c55a80e564ebf.jpg

[visirale]

I wonder if Orlando getting involved means the Mavs and Magic will have a wink wink deal where they help each other getting Bass and Gortat?
Nah, Olrando got an 8 million dollar TPE, nothing else.

Word on the street is that the Magic might match Gortat then trade him to Houston for some more pieces... The Magic could sign Bass beforehand. It'd be screwing over Dallas, but hey, this is a business :).

Bass wants 4 mil and the Magic are offering 3.5... I am sure they will get something worked out... unless the Magic decide to get something new with their TPE.

[Mr Know It All]

Nah, Olrando got an 8 million dollar TPE, nothing else.

Word on the street is that the Magic might match Gortat then trade him to Houston for some more pieces... The Magic could sign Bass beforehand. It'd be screwing over Dallas, but hey, this is a business :).

Bass wants 4 mil and the Magic are offering 3.5... I am sure they will get something worked out... unless the Magic decide to get something new with their TPE.

Gortat would have to agree to a S&T, since you can't trade signed players until 4 months or up or until December (Something like that).

[danumber88]

Jose Calderon | Roko Ukic
Demar DeRozan | Antoine Wright
Hedo Turkoglu | Devean George
Chris Bosh | Reggie Evans
Andrea Bargnani | Patrick O'Bryant

We really could use Pops Mensah Bonsu to back up the five spot.

Looks horrible right now - just needs tweaking. We have MLE now so B.C should be getting Delfino or even Kleiza.

[coin24]

I think its a good deal for the mavs, they should go alright next season...

Wonder where stackhouse will end up?

[A.M.G.]

Wow, if all this is true than BC just made this whole signing Hedo scenario a lot more palatable. I'm impressed.


Obviously the deal is good for Dallas because it potentially makes them contenders out West, replacing the now Yao-less Houston, with a veteran core of Dirk, Kidd, Marion, Josh Howard, and Jason Terry. Enjoy Marion, Dallas fans, he's not washed up like people say, he will still score in double figures, still a tenacious rebounder, still a versatile, athletic, and competent defender, still a monster finisher on the break, still a veteran locker-room presence, still potentially an All-Star with Kidd handling him.

Here are the good things about this deal for Toronto:

Wright gives us a SG who can either start and provide good defence and decent offence, or if Derozan shows early Wright can easily play backup. At least we're not going to be paper-thin on the wings like it looked like we might be.

Devean George can hopefully be waived or bought-out or whatever, or else wear a groove in the bench for one year, but the fact that there is only one more year on his contract makes it acceptable either way. ****, if we don't sign Delfino or some other wing, he might even see some minutes.

Douby is gone. Good dude, but not a good enough player that I want him around.

Hump is moved. He's a live body in the paint, and will help Dallas with depth if Bass leaves. He can be very good when he knows his role, or very dumb when he tries to score. But the Raptors had too many damn PFs, Pops is our primary backup PF, Reggie will get minutes, and Hump was the odd man out.

Perhaps best of all, the fact that Hedo is now a sign-and-trade acquisition, meaning we get to keep our MLE, LLE, bird rights on players, it just makes things so much easier. If we manage to sign a player like Kleiza or Marvin Williams with that MLE, all of BC's failings will be forgiven for a while. Frankly if we sign anyone useful it will be nice, considering that until like a day ago I thought we were totally screwing ourselves in terms of flexibility by signing Hedo as an unrestricted free agent.




BC shows that although he might be too focused on building a team of Euro jump shooters, he knows what the **** he is doing as a GM, which is more than you can say for some GMs. Now we need to pursue Kleiza hard, offer him everything you can. Getting him would potentially make the Raptors the fourth best team in the East, behind the Cavs, Celts, and Magics.

[Tips4]

Wow Bryan Colangelo just shutted alot of doubters. He is shutting up alot of people.

[Big#50]

This is another dumb move by Cuban. I find it pretty amazing that Cuban has totally destroyed his 06 Finals roster. Thats not even counting his trading of Nash to Pheonix. He first dealt away their young all-star PG that was suppose to be the future of the franchise. Howard never became the superstar that everyone was hoping he'd be and then Cuban sealed the fate of the team by firing Avery Johnson, which has the highest winning % ever by a head coach in NBA history. Now all the Mavs have is pretty much a plethora of forwards that can all do the same thing except dominate the paint. Marion was never a post up player and Howard should be played at the 3 rather than the 2, he feels way more comfortable there. And its' not like Dirk likes to take it to the paint all that often either. Its sad when your best post player is either Gortat, Bass or Dampier.
Hate much?

[amfirst]

Mavs did this to counter the Spurs.

Lakers > Mavs > Spurs > Nuggets :lol

[raiderfan19]

the thing no ones mentioned is how good a rebounding team this makes the mavs. kidd josh marion dirk damp/gortat is one hell of a rebounding lineup. Also in a little circle of life story marion ended up being the draft pick that the mavs traded the suns to get steve nash.

[chains5000]

the thing no ones mentioned is how good a rebounding team this makes the mavs. kidd josh marion dirk damp/gortat is one hell of a rebounding lineup.
That's exactly what I was thinking.
They could even try to get Curry for Dampier to get a low post scoring option without giving up much on the rebounding departament.
(Curry's contract sucks, I know)

[fos]

the thing no ones mentioned is how good a rebounding team this makes the mavs. kidd josh marion dirk damp/gortat is one hell of a rebounding lineup. Also in a little circle of life story marion ended up being the draft pick that the mavs traded the suns to get steve nash.

It's a small world :)

Kidd was also part of the trade that brought Fin to Dallas. Crazy stuff.

[Finn T-Mac]

How does this help the Mavericks? I dont see a defender on that starting line-up?

Right now, Marion is their best defender on perimeter and inside. So a good trade for Mavs and for Marion to get out of Toronto. I just hate to see him with the Mavs.

[mrhoopfan]

How is it hating? It's my own opinion that this was a dumb move by the Mavs... everything is still subjective until the regular season starts.



Ah thats right, sorry my mistake. Either way... Cuban didn't want to hand out Nash the cash necessary because he thought Nash wasn't worth it.. Nash received the leagues MVP twice in Pheonix as well as leading them to what was then the best turnaround season ever in the NBA (currently belongs to the 08 Celtics).

Uhhhh....Dallas went to the Finals when nash left, to my knowledge, phoenix hasn't been there since he's been the pg

[dirkdiggler41]

Hmm. I doubt Howard will play a lot at the 2-guard. Jason terry plays a lot of minutes there, and you have to add that Howard never plays at the 2-guard. What I like about the trade is that we get a player that does not need the ball in his hands to be effective like Kidd, Howard and Dirk. Marion is the kind of player who scores on the fastbreak, on offensive rebounds, backdoor-cuts etc, while Dirk and Howard usally create their own shots. Kidd just runs the offense and Terry is also able to create his own shots.

The starting lineup will have Howard at the two guard, but we will see this lineup a lot

Jason Kidd
Jason Terry
Josh Howad
Shawn Marion
Dirk Nowitzki

[triangleoffense]

^ Uh what?? Do you want Marion at PF and Nowitzki at C or the other way around?

[triangleoffense]

Uhhhh....Dallas went to the Finals when nash left, to my knowledge, phoenix hasn't been there since he's been the pg

Your speculating. No one knows how Dallas would have fared if they would have kept Nash. Both Nash and Nowitizki has had different forms of success but I don't think many people could deny that both are perennial all-star hall of fame type players. Nash is going into the hall of fame for sure and I'm pretty sure that voters will have a hard time keeping Nowitizki out of there as well.

[hawkfan]

The Raptors could use a portion of their MLE on Marquis Daniels at shooting guard, or even go small ball with Allen Iverson at the 2 guard position.

[ALBballer]

Damm Marion's barely shot the 3 once he left Phoenix. It's going to be an interesting lineup but atleast it gives the Lakers a player to put on Kobe.

[triangleoffense]

From what I can see everyone is giving the Mavs a thumbs up on this acquisition? For whatever reason I just don't see Marion being capable of getting a team over the hump, even if he's just a complementary piece. This guy reeks of an overpaid athlete who comes up small in big moments. This was a guy who had a legitimate shot at an NBA title but had to b1tch about his contract which got him sent to Miami.

[bagelred]

This deal is getting really complicated. Apparently Orlando is in this mess with Hedo being SnT.

Turns out 11 teams are involved in the deal. Sick.

[ALBballer]

Marion will not be the piece that puts them over the top, but he's a good 3rd option that provides an array of skills. He can play defense, rebound, block shot, run the floor and he has a decent midrange game. Look for Dallas to either trade Dampier's contract, which will be a valuable asset since teams will look to get under the cap for 2010 and for luxury tax purposes if the decrease in capspace is true, for a legit 2nd option (Rip Hamilton.) Mavs could even package Dampier alongside Howard and get themselves a better player.

If one of these trades fell through, one of their starters might have to come off the bench for the good of the team.

[Mr Know It All]

From what I can see everyone is giving the Mavs a thumbs up on this acquisition? For whatever reason I just don't see Marion being capable of getting a team over the hump, even if he's just a complementary piece. This guy reeks of an overpaid athlete who comes up small in big moments. This was a guy who had a legitimate shot at an NBA title but had to b1tch about his contract which got him sent to Miami.

Why are you still whining? Marion isn't coming in as a 1st option kind of guy, hell he isn't even going to be the 3rd option. He did fine in Toronto and he should be able to flourish once again with a Nash-like point guard in Kidd. I don't recall him coming up small in any big moments, as he isn't the guy with the ball in his hands in big moments. Your arguments have been very odd in this thread, as is your constant negativety.

Oh, and one more thing. As far as their career's are concerned: Nowitzki >> Nash. Nowitzki is the lock for the HOF, not Nash.

[Molson]

Talk about a win/win deal across the board for everyone involved.

Dallas gets the man they wanted in Marion plus a capable PF with a good motor in Hump to replace Bass if he leaves.

Toronto gets sorely needed depth at the wing spot and their MLE back when they were about to get nothing at all for Marion if he just signed as an FA.

Orlando gets a massive Trade exception of 8M or something.

Memphis gets a couple of cheap g's and some goodwill for doing bascially nothing.

Marion gets the money he wanted that he would not have gotten as a Free Agent.

And of course Fegan gets a bigger commission cheque. :)

Very creative deal.

[sunsfan1357]

I think this could be good for Marion to revitalize his career for a bit after the past couple seasons. He has the type of PG that he needs and is used to playing with (Kidd) and he is playing with the superstar first option (Dirk) that puts less pressure on him to produce offensively. Good acquisition for the Mavs.

[dirkdiggler41]

From what I can see everyone is giving the Mavs a thumbs up on this acquisition? For whatever reason I just don't see Marion being capable of getting a team over the hump, even if he's just a complementary piece. This guy reeks of an overpaid athlete who comes up small in big moments. This was a guy who had a legitimate shot at an NBA title but had to b1tch about his contract which got him sent to Miami.

Its a great deal for the Mavs becaus they dont trade away a lot, and gain a lot based on what they give away. I doubt we will become as good as some posters here say, but we a better chanse this season, but not really enough to be a true condender.


ps. Dirk at C and Marion at PF

[Molson]

I like the flexibility this gives Dallas as well.

If they want to run they can put Kidd/Terry/Howard/Marion/Dirk on the floor and that's about as good as it gets in the NBA for a run n gun team.

If they want to slow it down to a half court set they put

Kidd
Terry/Howard
Howard/Marion
Nowitzki
Gortat/Dampier

All depending on matchups.

Dallas will be a very good team this year.

[magnax1]

Is Marion still a really good passer? He used to be the suns secondary ball handler, but somebody told me his handles and passing have been hit just as hard as his athleticism and scoring.

[bagelred]

OK, I finally understand why the Grizzlies are involved. I couldn't figure it out.

Greg Buckner and his $4 million salary is now off the books. Grizzlies get Stackhouse, who is only guarantteed $2million, which I assume is all being paid for by Dallas.

So essentially, this trade saves the Grizzlies Buckner's entire $4million salary. Now I get it.......:applause:

Stackhouse adds more salary to Grizz's cap space number, but I guess they really don't care at this point.

[DuMa]

deal made my head explode

[bagelred]

What's up tweeps its official ur boy is a maverick that's what's up

http://twitter.com/matrix31

Some guys are so lucky. Marion had no options but somehow still manages to get paid and get to a contender.

[T-Low]

Some guys are so lucky. Marion had no options but somehow still manages to get paid and get to a contender.

Thank Cuban and BC for that...

[ronnymac]

Lakers
Spurs
Denver
Portland


Are all better then dallas. ok portland is a little iffy, but if they get hinrich or andre miller then they are certianly better

[brwnman]

Thank Cuban and BC for that...

Straight up. Cuban had interest in him, and BC held off the Turk signing just to accommodate Marion; saying he'll do what's in the best interest of the player. In this deal, everyone came out as winners.

Dallas gets their man and also replace Bass.

Toronto gets turk to replace Marion, and can now use their exceptions.

Memphis saves a bit of money as they'll waive Stackhouse.

Orlando get a trade exception so they don't end up with nothing from Turk leaving...

[visirale]

TPE will be great insurance for Orlando. If anyone gets injured or we need to add another X factor before the trade deadline, we basically will have free choice of expiring contracts among non-contending teams. Great instead of letting Turk walk for nothing.

[Hawker]

Its a great deal for the Mavs becaus they dont trade away a lot, and gain a lot based on what they give away. I doubt we will become as good as some posters here say, but we a better chanse this season, but not really enough to be a true condender.


ps. Dirk at C and Marion at PF

No. We already saw what happened when Dirk played at C and Jamison at PF.

[Scottish Pippen]

As said before, Marion got lucky.

I don't really like Josh Howard and Marion together in the same team, although Marion plays great off Kidd as they showed before. At least I (hopefully) won't have to see JJ Barea starting and playing 20+ minutes anymore.

Although on paper they improved, I am not sure if Dallas surpased any of their rivals in the West. Lakers, Spurs, Nuggets and Blazers are still better teams to me.

[kNIOKAS]

howard and marion are both bumdasses, i don't know if this will ever work.

[Brunch@Five]

IMO that puts Dallas on Denver level. 2nd tier in the west

[insidehoops]

The Orlando Magic have acquired a trade exception and cash considerations from the Toronto Raptors, and cash considerations from the Dallas Mavericks as part of a four-team trade, General Manager Otis Smith announced today. As part of a sign-and-trade deal, forward Hedo Turkoglu was traded to Toronto (http://www.insidehoops.com/forum/../blog/?p=4537). InsideHoops.com (http://www.insidehoops.com/forum/../blog/?p=4537)

Also included as parts of the deal - Toronto sends Shawn Marion, Kris Humphries, Nathan Jawai and cash considerations to Dallas, while (http://www.insidehoops.com/forum/../blog/?p=4537) also sending a future second round draft pick to Memphis; Memphis sends Greg Buckner to Dallas; Dallas sends Jerry Stackhouse and cash considerations to Memphis, while also sending Devean George and Antoine Wright to Toronto. InsideHoops.com (http://www.insidehoops.com/forum/../blog/?p=4537)

[Brunch@Five]

already a thread on it

[Mississippi]

Dallas got Jawai in the deal as well? Wow, they got loads of depth at the 4 behind Dirk now.

[kentatm]

No. We already saw what happened when Dirk played at C and Jamison at PF.

Jamison mostly played SF that year. The Mavs were rolling with Danny Fortson, Antoine Walker, Eduardo Najera and an injured Shawn Bradley for defensive purposes that season.

[dirkdiggler41]

No. We already saw what happened when Dirk played at C and Jamison at PF.

If you read the whole thread you would understand. Anyway, Dirk will play C when they use their most effectiv lineup in kidd, terry, howard, marion and nowitzki to run and gun. Dirk will start at PF

[kentatm]

Although on paper they improved, I am not sure if Dallas surpased any of their rivals in the West. Lakers, Spurs, Nuggets and Blazers are still better teams to me.

How are they not better than a team that they beat 4-1 in the playoffs w/o home court? At the very least they equaled the Spurs moves.

[niko]

How are they not better than a team that they beat 4-1 in the playoffs w/o home court? At the very least they equaled the Spurs moves.
Because the spurs were missing Ginobili and Duncan was slowed by injury. Now they are (in theory) healthy plus the got Jefferson. If you put a gun to my head and asked me who is better, I'd say SA.

[kentatm]

Because the spurs were missing Ginobili and Duncan was slowed by injury. Now they are (in theory) healthy plus the got Jefferson. If you put a gun to my head and asked me who is better, I'd say SA.

The Spurs got that third seed with Gino hurt all year anyway. I am tired of hearing about Duncan being slowed by injury as an excuse when the Mavs beat him. If you watche dhim played he was hurting no worse than guys on every other team by that point of the year.

Besides, you really think Manu will suddenly have a fully healthy year? Never gonna happen with the way he plays.

Jefferson is easily canceled out by Marion's defense BTW.

[Hawker]

Because the spurs were missing Ginobili and Duncan was slowed by injury. Now they are (in theory) healthy plus the got Jefferson. If you put a gun to my head and asked me who is better, I'd say SA.

Ok...maybe the Ginobili thing can be used as an excuse but whenever the mavs beat the spurs Duncan happens to always be "slowed by injury."

What a joke.

[niko]

Ok...maybe the Ginobili thing can be used as an excuse but whenever the mavs beat the spurs Duncan happens to always be "slowed by injury."

What a joke.

i'm no spurs fan. But Duncan couldn't move well at all. Do you think he suddenly forgot how to play defense? The reason when the Spurs lose that there are injury excuses is because they always have someone hurt. its no knock on the mavs, they beat SA down like a dog. But Duncan WAS hurt.

I'm hardly the only person who thinks SA is better. It's because you can see how SA's pieces fit and Dallas, you are still not sure.

[kentatm]

Jeff the post whore :oldlol:

http://www.insidehoops.com/forum/showthread.php?t=139076

[IN-PAX-WE-TRUST]

IMO that puts Dallas on Denver level. 2nd tier in the west

ehh.... Marion and Howard are the same player... where are they going to play them? Dirk at C??

[Hawker]

I think there's still another move left from Cuban and hopefully it's for a true SG.

Maybe Redd or Rip? Which one would work better? I think Rip.

[kentatm]

i'm no spurs fan. But Duncan couldn't move well at all. Do you think he suddenly forgot how to play defense? The reason when the Spurs lose that there are injury excuses is because they always have someone hurt. its no knock on the mavs, they beat SA down like a dog. But Duncan WAS hurt.

I'm hardly the only person who thinks SA is better. It's because you can see how SA's pieces fit and Dallas, you are still not sure.

What are you kidding? Duncan has never defended well against Dallas. Thats why the Spurs are consistantly scared of hitting the Mavs in the playoffs. The Mavs were built to specifically to beat the Spurs and it shows when they match up. They have never solved Dirk and now they traded away the one guy that ever had any success against him.

[Brunch@Five]

i'm no spurs fan. But Duncan couldn't move well at all. Do you think he suddenly forgot how to play defense? The reason when the Spurs lose that there are injury excuses is because they always have someone hurt. its no knock on the mavs, they beat SA down like a dog. But Duncan WAS hurt.

I'm hardly the only person who thinks SA is better. It's because you can see how SA's pieces fit and Dallas, you are still not sure.

Duncan has been "hurt" the past few years. It's not gonna change

[niko]

Duncan has been "hurt" the past few years. It's not gonna change

He was in a lot of pain during that series. Yes, he's always got something or another but his movment was hampered during that series. Dallas fans want to rewrite history and say Duncan was 100% and Dallas just kicked their ass, go ahead. I still say SA looks a bit better than Dallas. Dallas we don't even know if they get Gortat, who will start in their lineup, can their two SF's coexist, etc, SA - its basically plug Jefferson in, less defense, more offense, hope everyone is healthy.

[D-Rose]

I think Dallas is above Denver and Portland or at least on their level now.

Depending on if San Antonio stays healthy (unlikely), Mavs could surpass them.

[niko]

I think Dallas is above Denver and Portland or at least on their level now.

Depending on if San Antonio stays healthy (unlikely), Mavs could surpass them.

But its close right? It's not a slam dunk. That's just my point.

[bagelred]

"OK, let's just recap what's going on, so we're all up to speed......."


Dallas "So we're all in agreement!!! We get Shawn Marion, sounds good."

Orlando "Trade exception for us.....great."

Toronto "Get Turkoglu and young players....we're happy."

Memphis "Stackhouse, save some cash, draft pick....let's do it."

New York "Curry on the move....save some cap space....fair enough."



"OK, everyone let's call it a night....we'll make it official in the morning by calling the league office and then- WAIT A SECOND....Donnie Walsh, who let you in here!!!!!"

[Interminator]

Jawai also goes to Dallas, will his heart condition allow him to play?

[Brunch@Five]

He was in a lot of pain during that series. Yes, he's always got something or another but his movment was hampered during that series. Dallas fans want to rewrite history and say Duncan was 100% and Dallas just kicked their ass, go ahead. I still say SA looks a bit better than Dallas. Dallas we don't even know if they get Gortat, who will start in their lineup, can their two SF's coexist, etc, SA - its basically plug Jefferson in, less defense, more offense, hope everyone is healthy.

I'm not rewriting history. Fact is, Duncan hasn't been 100% for quite some time. It's neither valid as an excuse nor a reason to rate the Spurs higher for hypothetical "if healthy" reasons. Most likely Duncan's health won't change, so anything else is speculation.

[kentatm]

He was in a lot of pain during that series. Yes, he's always got something or another but his movment was hampered during that series. Dallas fans want to rewrite history and say Duncan was 100% and Dallas just kicked their ass, go ahead. I still say SA looks a bit better than Dallas. Dallas we don't even know if they get Gortat, who will start in their lineup, can their two SF's coexist, etc, SA - its basically plug Jefferson in, less defense, more offense, hope everyone is healthy.

Know who else was in a lot of pain in that series? Josh Howard. Dude was playing on two gimped ankles.

Dirk plays hurt all the time and NEVER uses it as an excuse for losing.

I am sorry but the Mavs were just as banged up and its weak sauce to say "Oh well the Spurs were hurt".

They were "hurt" for most of the year and STILL won the SW, still got the 3rd seed, had homecourt, was predicted by most to beat Dallas and still got rocked.

[IamSofaKing]

Wtf is this? Raptors get scrubs for Marion? :banghead:

[visirale]

Wtf is this? Raptors get scrubs for Marion? :banghead:
No you get Turkoglu and get to keep your MLE and LLE. This was a great move by your GM.

[1~Gibson~1]

Wtf is this? Raptors get scrubs for Marion? :banghead:
its better than nothing right? :confusedshrug:
and i think it was done to get more money for marion

[Mr Clutch Melo]

Do you guys think Marion can close out Melo?

[bteambomber]

man i wish the bulls got hedo...we need another scorer after ben gordon left...unless there is someway we sign a big name in 2010 da bulls won't contend for the title for awhile.

[kingmob]

Do you guys think Marion can close out Melo?

What does close out means? Shut down? Of course not.

[1~Gibson~1]

Calderon
DeRozan
Hedo
Bosh
Bargnani

:pimp: nice job mr. GM

[red1]

Plus MLE and LLE! :banana: GET TO WORK ON THAT BENCH BC

[catzhernandez]

Nice job by Dallas here. :applause:

[niko]

Know who else was in a lot of pain in that series? Josh Howard. Dude was playing on two gimped ankles.

Dirk plays hurt all the time and NEVER uses it as an excuse for losing.

I am sorry but the Mavs were just as banged up and its weak sauce to say "Oh well the Spurs were hurt".

They were "hurt" for most of the year and STILL won the SW, still got the 3rd seed, had homecourt, was predicted by most to beat Dallas and still got rocked.
it's nto an excuse, you kicked the crap out of them. We are talking about this year and i think spurs from last year + healthy duncan + healthy ginobili + changes > (by a small mount) mavs + new players (all healthy). You disagree. :confusedshrug: not sure what you want...

[IamSofaKing]

No you get Turkoglu and get to keep your MLE and LLE. This was a great move by your GM.

Well at least now we can sign Delfino hopefully... and dump Devean Georege :violin:

[Gregsguys]

Nice job by Dallas here. :applause:

I would say good deal all the way round. Can't see anyone who got ripped off and it looks positive for all four teams!

[Silent Mav]

Devean George, the gift that noone wants.

[Gregsguys]

Wtf is this? Raptors get scrubs for Marion? :banghead:

Uhhhh are you kidding. The huge benefit to this deal isn't who they got its what they got. they get Hedo PLUS the MLE which allows them to choose who else. George and Walker may hang around but they are simply occupying spots that would otherwise have been filled by guys making the minimum.

Very good move by BC.

[IamSofaKing]

Uhhhh are you kidding. The huge benefit to this deal isn't who they got its what they got. they get Hedo PLUS the MLE which allows them to choose who else. George and Walker may hang around but they are simply occupying spots that would otherwise have been filled by guys making the minimum.

Very good move by BC.

Read my post above.... :rolleyes:

At least Raptors have soom room to get some depth into their bench:cheers:

[1~Gibson~1]

So what is their depth chart looking like right now?

All i know is....

G- Calderon
G- DeRozan
F- Turkoglu
F- Bosh
F/C- Bargnani

[Gregsguys]

So what is their depth chart looking like right now?

All i know is....

G- Calderon
G- DeRozan
F- Turkoglu
F- Bosh
F/C- Bargnani

Thats the start, for now the backups look like this:

PG - Ukic, Banks, Delfino?
SG - Walker, Delfino, _____
SF - MLE?
PF - Evans, Pops
C - OBryant, Evans

Not top bench in the league but much better than it looked like it would be!

[IamSofaKing]

Thats the start, for now the backups look like this:

PG - Ukic, Banks, Delfino?
SG - Walker, Delfino, _____
SF - MLE?
PF - Evans, Pops
C - OBryant, Evans

Not top bench in the league but much better than it looked like it would be!
SG & SF-Delfino, Wright, and George considering that they can play both positions...

[Gregsguys]

SG & SF-Delfino, Wright, and George considering that they can play both positions...

Maybe but I am not sure we will see George actually stay in TO.

[IamSofaKing]

Maybe but I am not sure we will see George actually stay in TO.

Yeah, BC should dump his contract and use the money to sign Delfino and Rashoooooo :banana:

[Gregsguys]

Yeah, BC should dump his contract and use the money to sign Delfino and Rashoooooo :banana:
Definitely

[Doomsday Dallas]

Must get Bass back.

[Quata]

Hoping Jawai can get some game time in dallas, kid has potential, he is sort of like brandon bass....bit bigger with a little bit of a worse jumper, not a bad one for his size though.

[Human Error]

How does this help the Mavericks? I dont see a defender on that starting line-up?
Josh Howard are Shawn Marion are both good defenders.

[IamSofaKing]

Hoping Jawai can get some game time in dallas, kid has potential, he is sort of like brandon bass....bit bigger with a little bit of a worse jumper, not a bad one for his size though.

He has a decent post game, give him a few years and he will develop

[wally_world]

so why does Toronto do this again?

[IamSofaKing]

so why does Toronto do this again?

To get rid of Marion, get some cap space and strengthen up thier bench...

[Toizumi]

I hope Gortat doesn't flop this year, he showed some promise in ORL but I think the Mavs overpaid him... Their only weakness is at the center position..1 trough 4, they're set...
Imagine them going small with a line up of:

1. J-Kidd
2. Terry
3. Howard
4. Marion
5. Dirk

That's killer. All guys can run the floor and Kidd is still one of the best at finding the open man. Marion did good when playing with Stephon, Kidd and Nash in PHX. I thought he'd be good with Calderon as his PG, but he wasn't.. hope this gets him back on track a bit.

[kwajo]

Marion did good when playing with Stephon, Kidd and Nash in PHX. I thought he'd be good with Calderon as his PG, but he wasn't.. hope this gets him back on track a bit.
To be fair to Marion, Jose isn't anywhere near the same level as Kidd, Nash or a prime Starbury, and was injured a bunch last season to boot.

[greensborohill]

so why does Toronto do this again?

They benefit by being over the cap and making the trade b/c it allows them to have a MLE. If they had renounced Marion & others, they would have had room for just Hedo.

[Gregsguys]

so why does Toronto do this again?

Toronto does it to free up the two exemptions which would allow them to add possibly Rasho, Delfino and/or others.

While getting rid of Jawai and Hump shrinks the bench the gain of Rasho and others would strengthen the whole team.

[Pain of Thought]

I haven't been keeping close tabs on Bosh, but has he publically implicated he wants to leave Toronto after this season? Will Toronto even have the cap space free to offer Bosh the contract he'll be worth?

:confusedshrug:

If Bosh stays with the Raptors and plays along side Hedo, that's certainly noticeable. I'm not a big fan of Jose Calderon, but he's a serviceable PG.

[u83]

You don't need cap space to re-sign a player who's already on the team.

[It's A VC3!!!]

mavericks r just getting olderby completing this trade..:roll:

o well theyll still make the play-offs now with shaq out of pheonix

[kentatm]

mavericks r just getting olderby completing this trade..:roll:

o well theyll still make the play-offs now with shaq out of pheonix

you math sucks. They got younger.

They traded a 34 year old Stack for a 31 year old Marion.

Also, I think that by adding Orlando into the deal they probably have a wink wink deal where the Mavs left Bass alone and the Magic won't match Gortat. (who will make the Mavs even younger)

http://i447.photobucket.com/albums/qq200/stereolith/Gortat.png

[LA_Showtime]

This is a great move but it could turn out to bite them in the ass if Dirk, Kidd, etc start showing their etc. This is an old team.

[bballnoob]

This is a great move but it could turn out to bite them in the ass if Dirk, Kidd, etc start showing their etc. This is an old team.

The trade does not affect the age/health of Dirk or Kidd at all.

[Mr Clutch Melo]

Josh Howard are Shawn Marion are both good defenders.

The problem is that none of them can shut down players like Melo,Durant,James and Pierce.

[Mr Know It All]

The problem is that none of them can shut down players like Melo,Durant,James and Pierce.

There's a very short list of players who can even keep up with those guys anyway. Marion is athletic and long, he's guarded smaller players before and if Gortat improves the Mavs interior D like he should their defence will improve.

[kentatm]

The problem is that none of them can shut down players like Melo,Durant,James and Pierce.

NOBODY can shut those guys down when they are on.

[Maniak]

Nice Trade For All The Teams Here. Good Job Guys.

[Red-Head]

Jason Kidd gets exposed by the quicker PG's...
Some of the best defenders in the league can't always stay with a quicker point-guards, so that's no reason to bash him. Kidd keeps the offense effiecient and organized, he rebounds, gets steals, and always makes sure his team gets a high-percentage shot. Would you trade all that for someone who can keep his man in front of him sometimes?

[ukplayer4]

Some of the best defenders in the league can't always stay with a quicker point-guards, so that's no reason to bash him. Kidd keeps the offense effiecient and organized, he rebounds, gets steals, and always makes sure his team gets a high-percentage shot. Would you trade all that for someone who can keep his man in front of him sometimes?




this, and kidd is still a solid deffender on most players, too many people round here think that the second you hit 30 you cease to be able to play deffense.

[Smokee]

Yeah i think Marion fits in real well on paper with the Mav's. Its not like he needs the ball to be effective and now they are long and way more athletic. If any team got jipped it was Toronto, Hedo is overrated for the amount of attention he's getting. Anyways Mav's looking really good right now...

[Finger Roll]

Regardless of what people say, Marion wasn't a good fit in TO and was hardly utilized to his potential.

Raptors have a strong starting lineup, but to be brutally honest their D will probably still be pretty weak.

Surprised no one is really talking about Jarret Jack going their, they have plenty of cap room to go after a couple good guys to make the bench stronger.

Either way, the Raptors will make the playoffs this year...at least they should.

But if they don't....at least will still have that 3 pointer streak record still going :rockon:

[Arti]

This is a great move but it could turn out to bite them in the ass if Dirk, Kidd, etc start showing their etc. This is an old team.
I think Dirk showed in the playoffs that he has more than enough left in the tank. And as long as Kidd continues to play within his element as he did last season (obviously he can't physically do everything he used to, but he's still a smart player, great passer, and a leader), I don't think he's that big of a question mark.

I'm most worried about Howard's health. If we have the athletic, slashing, and finishing Josh from 2005-2007, I think we're a contender. If not, then we're just another team in the West.

[kentatm]

I'm most worried about Howard's health. If we have the athletic, slashing, and finishing Josh from 2005-2007, I think we're a contender. If not, then we're just another team in the West.


A healthy Josh is essential for the Mavs to be a serious threat.

[gcfeldma]

Jason Kidd, Josh Howard, Shawn Marion, & Marcin Gortat are all excellent defenders.

Jason Kidd is too slow to defend the younger, quicker point guards.

Gortat is a solid defender, but he will be exposed by more polished big men with smoother moves around the basket.

Howard and Marion are both good defenders, but the team lacks an elite defensive presence. Kidd is on the way out, and trading for him was not a good idea.

Check out this blog I found. Hilarious sports section.
http://popcornmuscles.com/

[yonkon]

what happened ??

[Mavwreck]

The Mavs will be a bit better, but no way they get past the Spurs again this year.

Marion was a beast in Phoenix when Nash was tossing him alley-oops and leading the break. He's proven since then to be a questionable player in terms of creating offense on his own.

And the departure of Bass... that's what concerns me. Where is the bench low-post scoring going to come from?

I'm sure more moves will be made, but Dallas will simply be another 48 to 52 win team this year.

[moatsman007]

I don't get why Hedo Turkoglu left Orlando. You ride the big man to a title. He'll regret the Toronto move.

[#1SportsFan86]

The Mavs will be a bit better, but no way they get past the Spurs again this year.

Marion was a beast in Phoenix when Nash was tossing him alley-oops and leading the break. He's proven since then to be a questionable player in terms of creating offense on his own.

And the departure of Bass... that's what concerns me. Where is the bench low-post scoring going to come from?

I'm sure more moves will be made, but Dallas will simply be another 48 to 52 win team this year.


Some ol talk from Spurs fans.....If Duncan and Manu are not 100% healthy the Spurs are not beating anybody come playoff time, the Spurs team last season would have beat most teams in the playoffs besides the Mavs and Lakers, the Mavs still give the Spurs match up problems and I dout the Spurs wonna see the Mavs with a healthy Josh Howard and Shawn Marion in the playoffs.

[1~Gibson~1]

I don't get why Hedo Turkoglu left Orlando. You ride the big man to a title. He'll regret the Toronto move.
he wanted $$$ and Orlando wouldnt give it to him. I think he should've went to Portland, but the wifey wanted to live in Toronto :confusedshrug:

i think with Hedo, the Raps are a playoff team and maybe a 6th man away from being a contender.

[mamba24]

please kill this thread...its well overdone....nothing more to discuss...