Better natural athlete Kobe Bryant, Ray Allen or Larry Hughes?

[IGOTGAME]

you pick who was born more naturally physically gifted?

[iDunk]

1. Kobe Bryant
2. Larry Hughes
3. Ray Allen

If you ever looked at Allen's body he's RIPPED and by that I mean ripped. The guy works on his body a lot, so its not natural. Larry back then made his dunks look easy, and Kobe.. well he's Kobe.

http://i29.tinypic.com/24pjxiq.jpg

[Juges8932]

Kobe
Ray
Larry

[nbastatus]

Kobe
Ray
Larry
:cheers: :cheers:

[MaxFly]

you pick who was born more naturally physically gifted?

I think they are all comparable...


sarcasm

[KenneBell]

sarcasm
Pretty much. I'd like to known what posters compared these players. I have a hunch at who they could be.

[bleedinpurpleTwo]

ray allen? really not even in their class.

[BallersTalk]

Ray Allen is a very underrated athlete. All those players in their primes are very comparable. It's not like Kobe is an out-of-this-world athlete in the mold of Carter, LeBron, T-Mac, or Jordan.

(I recognize the OP is a troll account. I'll just feed the troll then.)

[OneMoreSucka]

In before CantStop.

[BallersTalk]

People are confusing athleticism with skills. Kobe is a far more skilled player than both Allen and Hughes. He's also much more creative than the other two. But there's nothing he could do that they couldn't. Kobe wasn't even that great of a leaper. On average he probably jumped at 35" with 38" being his absolute max running vertical. Guys like Vince, Jordan, LeBron, etc.. all recorded 40+ inch verticals.

[CantStop]

I'll just quote Kobe:


"Don't even put me and dude in the same breath," he told a reporter

[BallersTalk]

I think the OP is that one Kobe homer polluting the internet under multiple aliases.

[IGOTGAME]

People are confusing athleticism with skills. Kobe is a far more skilled player than both Allen and Hughes. He's also much more creative than the other two. But there's nothing he could do that they couldn't. Kobe wasn't even that great of a leaper. On average he probably jumped at 35" with 38" being his absolute max running vertical. Guys like Vince, Jordan, LeBron, etc.. all recorded 40+ inch verticals.

what so your saying god granted Ray Allen and Kobe the same natural gifts and Kobe worked on his skills in order to become a much better player? thats insane, Ray Allen is susposed to have a legendary work ethic, am I missing something?

Is Ray underachieving or is Kobe just squeezing every once out of talent and working harder then Ray?

[BallersTalk]

The only real advantage Kobe has over Allen in terms of athleticism is a noticeably longer wingspan. Quickness, raw end-to-end speed, and leaping ability are all relatively even. Kobe may have a slight advantage in body control and coordination. That's about it. The reason Kobe's as good as he is isn't because of natural gifts. He had to work for everything he has. I don't get why Kobe homers think this is a knock on Kobe. It's a compliment if anything.

[IGOTGAME]

The only real advantage Kobe has over Allen in terms of athleticism is a noticeably longer wingspan. Quickness, raw end-to-end speed, and leaping ability are all relatively even. Kobe may have a slight advantage in body control and coordination. That's about it. The reason Kobe's as good as he is isn't because of natural gifts. He had to work for everything he has. I don't get why Kobe homers think this is a knock on Kobe. It's a compliment if anything.

so your saying that Kobe outworked Ray Allen by that much, is that possible?

Kobe must be one of the hardest workers ever because Ray Allen is no slouch?

If Ray Allen cared as much about the game as Kobe could he has been better? as good as Kobe?

[CantStop]

The only real advantage Kobe has over Allen in terms of athleticism is a noticeably longer wingspan. Quickness, raw end-to-end speed, and leaping ability are all relatively even. Kobe may have a slight advantage in body control and coordination. That's about it. The reason Kobe's as good as he is isn't because of natural gifts. He had to work for everything he has. I don't get why Kobe homers think this is a knock on Kobe. It's a compliment if anything.

Worst post EVER. Kobe and Ray's leaping ability is even?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-FS_tFGgEto

pause at 0:37

Ray could never do this even in his young rookie days so shut up.

Slight advantage in body control and coordination? http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=locj7xohyWw

When could Ray ever do?

Ban yourself.

[LA_Showtime]

The only real advantage Kobe has over Allen in terms of athleticism is a noticeably longer wingspan. Quickness, raw end-to-end speed, and leaping ability are all relatively even. Kobe may have a slight advantage in body control and coordination. That's about it. The reason Kobe's as good as he is isn't because of natural gifts. He had to work for everything he has. I don't get why Kobe homers think this is a knock on Kobe. It's a compliment if anything.

Sounds good to me.

Kobe was more explosive than Ray Allen in his younger days though.

[LAClipsFan33]

1A/1B Larry Hughes/Kobe

They have about the same level of god given athleticism

2. Ray Allen


Ray Allen has this though: Ray for 54 points 80% swishes

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Yzw_SUvLq4A

Larry Pre injuries when he could get up and change direction super quick:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Yzw_SUvLq4A

[BallersTalk]

so your saying that Kobe outworked Ray Allen by that much, is that possible?

Kobe must be one of the hardest workers ever because Ray Allen is no slouch?

If Ray Allen cared as much about the game as Kobe could he has been better? as good as Kobe?
Ray Allen never had the same mindset. He never developed his one-on-one game the way Kobe did. Allen was always concerned about the team aspect. That's why he's one of the greatest catch-and-shoot players ever. He spent most of his career coming off screens. Kobe spent most of his time refining his one-on-one game. He's a significantly better ball-handler and has better footwork. He just has more moves and counter-moves. That's the reason he can't be guarded 1-on-1. Not because he has blinding quickness and athleticism.

[LAClipsFan33]

Worst post EVER. Kobe and Ray's leaping ability is even?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-FS_tFGgEto

pause at 0:37

Ray could never do this even in his young rookie days so shut up.

Slight advantage in body control and coordination? http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=locj7xohyWw

When could Ray ever do?

Ban yourself.

That's not any harder than the rock the cradle back dunk...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WfPd76yKJRI

[BallersTalk]

Worst post EVER. Kobe and Ray's leaping ability is even?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-FS_tFGgEto

pause at 0:37

Ray could never do this even in his young rookie days so shut up.

Slight advantage in body control and coordination? http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=locj7xohyWw

When could Ray ever do?

Ban yourself.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wlPjWJ6yzCg&feature=related

[IGOTGAME]

Ray Allen never had the same mindset. He never developed his one-on-one game the way Kobe did. Allen was always concerned about the team aspect. That's why he's one of the greatest catch-and-shoot players ever. He spent most of his career coming off screens. Kobe spent most of his time refining his one-on-one game. He's a significantly better ball-handler and footwork. He just has more moves and counter-moves. That's the reason he can't be guarded 1-on-1. Not because he has blinding quickness and athleticism.

so you saying the Ray Allen decided to become an average ball handler for the good of the team?

[LAClipsFan33]

Ray Allen when he got to the league refined his game a lot to focus more on off the ball movement and jump shooting. You have to see him at Uconn to see him display his athleticism. He used to smash on people left and right along with the wicked jump shots.

[IGOTGAME]

Ray Allen when he got to the league refined his game a lot to focus more on off the ball movement and jump shooting. You have to see him at Uconn to see him display his athleticism. He used to smash on people left and right along with the wicked jump shots.

so he decided he couldnt work on all aspects of his game? Your saying he was too lazy to put in the extra time?

[CantStop]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wlPjWJ6yzCg&feature=related

Not impressed. He needs to reach Shannon Brown's leaping ability before he comes close to Kobe.

[Jacks3]

LOL is this a joke? Kobe in his prime was one of the best athletes in the entire league. Go back and watch some videos of him between 00-05.
Ray Allen and Hughes:oldlol:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uW5iQ16Nmx4
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rpOFDoL0IDQ
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fAGoCmnY778&feature=related
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9lA4gVPQaTY

:oldlol:

[LAClipsFan33]

so he decided he couldnt work on all aspects of his game? Your saying he was too lazy to put in the extra time?

No I'm saying he focused more on shooting and became on of the greatest shooters to ever hold a basketball. Get a clue...his game is not the dribble drive

[LAClipsFan33]

Not impressed. He needs to reach Shannon Brown's leaping ability before he comes close to Kobe.

Shannon Brown jumps WAY higher than Kobe EVER did

[BallersTalk]

so you saying the Ray Allen decided to become an average ball handler for the good of the team?
If Kobe spent 90% of his time on the court coming off screens, he wouldn't have this type of one-on-one game either. BTW, Ray Allen is not an average ball-handler. Ray practiced shooting, coming off screens, and just being an all-around team player. I doubt he put a lot of emphasis on isolation moves like Kobe did.

[LAClipsFan33]

LOL is this a joke? Kobe in his prime was one of the best athletes in the entire league. Go back and watch some videos of him between 00-05.
Ray Allen and Hughes:oldlol:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uW5iQ16Nmx4
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rpOFDoL0IDQ
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fAGoCmnY778&feature=related
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9lA4gVPQaTY

:oldlol:

Interesting that you show the dunk that Kobe tore his shoulder on mainly because he couldn't get high enough to safely dunk the ball down

[BallersTalk]

so he decided he couldnt work on all aspects of his game? Your saying he was too lazy to put in the extra time?
That's like saying, why can't Kobe shoot like Ray? Was he too lazy to put in the extra time to work on his 3-ball?

[CantStop]

Can't believe Kobe is being compared to Ray Allen. It's disturbing. Mods delete this thread. Only time Ray could ever win a ring is being 3rd option on a stacked team and yet he's being compared to the GOD?

[BallersTalk]

Not impressed. He needs to reach Shannon Brown's leaping ability before he comes close to Kobe.
Kobe can't even jump like Shannon Brown.

[BallersTalk]

Can't believe Kobe is being compared to Ray Allen. It's disturbing. Mods delete this thread. Only time Ray could ever win a ring is being 3rd option on a stacked team and yet he's being compared to the GOD?
Look up the stats to the '08 Finals.

BTW, nobody said Ray Allen was the absolute better player. That's not even the question posed by this thread.

[LAClipsFan33]

Can't believe Kobe is being compared to Ray Allen. It's disturbing. Mods delete this thread. Only time Ray could ever win a ring is being 3rd option on a stacked team and yet he's being compared to the GOD?

You need a psychiatrist

smh

Ray Allen embarrassed Kobe whenever he was brave enough to actually guard him in the Finals

[Mr_Basketball#1]

Can't believe Kobe is being compared to Ray Allen. It's disturbing. Mods delete this thread. Only time Ray could ever win a ring is being 3rd option on a stacked team and yet he's being compared to the GOD?
Yeah like Kobe won by himself. Didn't the Lakers miss the playoffs a couple years ago when Kobe felt the need to take every shot he got. :oldlol:

Fck outta here Kobe24

[Jacks3]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cwsUZztJuhw
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1kxlt-xLo4c

Not even close. People have forgotten how sick young Kobe was.

[BallersTalk]

Reason why Kobe and Kobe fans Ray Allen:

http://www.seattlepi.com/basketball/195189_sonx14.html

[Mr_Basketball#1]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cwsUZztJuhw
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1kxlt-xLo4c

Not even close. People have forgotten how sick young Kobe was.
Larry Hughes and Ray Allen both have similar highlight reels. Get off Kobe's nuts please.

[Jacks3]

Interesting that you show the dunk that Kobe tore his shoulder on mainly because he couldn't get high enough to safely dunk the ball down
He didn't tear his shoulder on that dunk. Very few in history have the necessary combination of strength/quickness/hops/body-control to pull the things Kobe did...especially on the baseline. Hughes and Allen aren't close.:oldlol:

[Jacks3]

Larry Hughes and Ray Allen both have similar highlight reels. Get off Kobe's nuts please.
Yeah, right.
****ing joke.:oldlol:

[CantStop]

He didn't tear his shoulder on that dunk. Very few in history have the necessary combination of strength/quickness/hops/body-control to pull the things Kobe did...especially on the baseline. Hughes and Allen aren't close.:oldlol:

It's disturbing man. They hate Kobe this much that he's being compared to Hughes and Ray. Next week he's gonna be compared to Morrison.

[LAClipsFan33]

He didn't tear his shoulder on that dunk. Very few in history have the necessary combination of strength/quickness/hops/body-control to pull the things Kobe did...especially on the baseline. Hughes and Allen aren't close.:oldlol:

He tore his shoulder trying to go baseline under the rim. He didn't get high enough so he didn't have the clearance to dunk it but did anyway and tore his shoulder up...

[Mr_Basketball#1]

It's disturbing man. They hate Kobe this much that he's being compared to Hughes and Ray. Next week he's gonna be compared to Morrison.
I bet you'd bend over and let Kobe stick it in huh? What's distrubing is the way you're sticking up for him. Be rational troll!

[Jacks3]

He tore his shoulder trying to go baseline under the rim. He didn't get high enough so he didn't have the clearance to dunk it but did anyway and tore his shoulder up...
You're just making **** up. The only time Kobe has tore his shoulder is when he was shooting a three-pointer.:rolleyes:

[Bodhi]

what so your saying god granted Ray Allen and Kobe the same natural gifts and Kobe worked on his skills in order to become a much better player? thats insane, Ray Allen is susposed to have a legendary work ethic, am I missing something?

Is Ray underachieving or is Kobe just squeezing every once out of talent and working harder then Ray?

If you read some of the things that people say about Kobe, he had absolutely no friends in the league until the Olympic team. You never hear of Kobe's high school friends. Compare that to pretty much any other NBA player who is always seen with an entourage of friends.

I remember seeing the pictures of the Lakers flying back after the finals and they show most of the team sitting around a table joking around. Kobe is sitting up in the front of the plane next to Sun Yue, who I think barely speaks English.

The guy does nothing, and I mean nothing but practice basketball and watch game tape.

[BallersTalk]

If you read some of the things that people say about Kobe, he had absolutely no friends in the league until the Olympic team. You never hear of Kobe's high school friends. Compare that to pretty much any other NBA player who is always seen with an entourage of friends.

I remember seeing the pictures of the Lakers flying back after the finals and they show most of the team sitting around a table joking around. Kobe is sitting up in the front of the plane next to Sun Yue, who I think barely speaks English.

The guy does nothing, and I mean nothing but practice basketball and watch game tape.
Exactly. Kobe had a unique approach to basketball when he came into the league. His goal was to be the best to ever play. Not to win a bunch of titles. He wanted to be recognized as the best to ever play. He breathed, ate, and slept basketball.

[chitownsfinest]

Exactly. Kobe had a unique approach to basketball when he came into the league. His goal was to be the best to ever play. Not to win a bunch of titles. He wanted to be recognized as the best to ever play. He breathed, ate, and slept basketball.
In order to be recognized as the best ever, you need to win titles so I don't see the point.

[BallersTalk]

In order to be recognized as the best ever, you need to win titles so I don't see the point.
I'm talking about when Kobe first came in. He didn't think like that. He just now realizes that's what he needs to do.

[CantStop]

If you read some of the things that people say about Kobe, he had absolutely no friends in the league until the Olympic team. You never hear of Kobe's high school friends. Compare that to pretty much any other NBA player who is always seen with an entourage of friends.

I remember seeing the pictures of the Lakers flying back after the finals and they show most of the team sitting around a table joking around. Kobe is sitting up in the front of the plane next to Sun Yue, who I think barely speaks English.

The guy does nothing, and I mean nothing but practice basketball and watch game tape.

LOL WTF. You judge a pic to say he has no friends. You're right. Kobe does not host superbowl parties every year at his house or the club and his teammates show up. Kobe does not watch soccer games with Pau. Kobe always sits in the back and so does Sun apparently. OMG, Kobe doesn't want to play cards after a long Finals. Wow, he has no friends. Even though Boozer, Artest, Lamar, Trev, Wade, Lebron, Redd, etc..... have said publicly that they are friends. Hell, Chris Paul said Kobe sends him pics of his daughters on holidays. Kobe hate has gone into another direction ever since he won his 4th. I guess you can't hate on his game anymore.

[Bodhi]

LOL WTF. You judge a pic to say he has no friends. You're right. Kobe does not host superbowl parties every year at his house or the club and his teammates show up. Kobe does not watch soccer games with Pau. Kobe always sits in the back and so does Sun apparently. OMG, Kobe doesn't want to play cards after a long Finals. Wow, he has no friends. Even though Boozer, Artest, Lamar, Trev, Wade, Lebron, Redd, etc..... have said publicly that they are friends. Hell, Chris Paul said Kobe sends him pics of his daughters on holidays. Kobe hate has gone into another direction ever since he won his 4th. I guess you can't hate on his game anymore.

So you don't think it's weird that you never see Kobe out doing anything? During their arguments, Shaq even mentioned that Kobe never went out to clubs or did anything with the team.

I think this is the right clip where Bill Simmons and some Laker's writer talk about Kobe's life: http://sports.espn.go.com/stations/player?context=podcast&id=4241630

And then think about how Kobe pretty much doesn't talk to or interact with people on his team. Or the whole Kobe doing work movie. I didn't watch all of it, but what I saw it seemed like his teammates were shocked that he was talking to them. Great player, I say top 10 all time, but he is really not a personable guy. I know it's hard for you to hear anything bad about him, and that's why everyone thinks you're an idiot.

[Jacks3]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CJZeIkTMcb8
:bowdown: at 1:01
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gDNdS43CK-Q&feature=related
Check out the 56 sec mark. The first step at 4:58:bowdown: Ridiculous quickness.

[CantStop]

So you don't think it's weird that you never see Kobe out doing anything? During their arguments, Shaq even mentioned that Kobe never went out to clubs or did anything with the team.

I think this is the right clip where Bill Simmons and some Laker's writer talk about Kobe's life: http://sports.espn.go.com/stations/player?context=podcast&id=4241630

And then think about how Kobe pretty much doesn't talk to or interact with people on his team. Great player, but he is really not a personable guy. I know it's hard for you to hear anything bad about him, and that's why everyone thinks you're an idiot.

That was before Kobe was the leader. Players have said it repeatedly that he hangs out with them more often. He brings them out to nice restaurants, buys them watches and you can tell he interacts with them more.



And then think about how Kobe pretty much doesn't talk to or interact with people on his team.

Seriously, shove this post up your azz. That's the dumbest thing I've ever heard based on one pic and quotes from 2004. Sasha says Kobe and him communicate in Italian and he communicates with Pau in Spanish, french with Mbenga. Shannon Brown says he improved so much because of Kobe. Ariza said Kobe helped him the most on and off the court... like what do you want this man to do?

[Bodhi]

That was before Kobe was the leader. Players have said it repeatedly that he hangs out with them more often. He brings them out to nice restaurants, buys them watches and you can tell he interacts with them more.




Seriously, shove this post up your azz. That's the dumbest thing I've ever heard based on one pic and quotes from 2004. Sasha says Kobe and him communicate in Italian and he communicates with Pau in Spanish, french with Mbenga. Shannon Brown says he improved so much because of Kobe. Ariza said Kobe helped him the most on and off the court... like what do you want this man to do?

What are they supposed to say when someone from the media asks them a question about Kobe? You have all these quotes about players saying things about Kobe, but you never see Kobe doing anything with anyone in the NBA. Even Carmelo Anthony who he was supposed to be great friends with went out to dinner with Fisher and Odom after the WCF. Kobe was nowhere to be found.

[CantStop]

What are they supposed to say when someone from the media asks them a question about Kobe? You have all these quotes about players saying things about Kobe, but you never see Kobe doing anything with anyone in the NBA. Even Carmelo Anthony who he was supposed to be great friends with went out to dinner with Fisher and Odom after the WCF. Kobe was nowhere to be found.

Hahaha. Carmelo said him and Kobe always chill when one comes to their city. Melo crashes at Kobe's house and Kobe crashes at Melo's place. Even their wifes are really good friends. They sat next to each every game at staples in the WCF. Ultimate fail post. If you don't believe me, look at Lala(Melo's girl)'s twitter and she speaks about Vanessa.

Kobe and Melo have the greatest respect for each other. Text each other on the regular.

But you're right, media asked about Kobe and Melo made that up on the spot and got his girl to be in on it right? Sh!t, hasn't been a good summer for Kobe haters.

[eliteballer]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aGxX80NHuRs&fmt=35

LOL...

[Bodhi]

Wow, just wow Cantstop. I'm a a Laker fan and even I think the way you defend Kobe when all evidence points to the contrary is downright creepy. You are a strange, strange person.

[CantStop]

Wow, just wow Cantstop. I'm a a Laker fan and even I think the way you defend Kobe when all evidence points to the contrary is downright creepy. You are a strange, strange person.

Haha, can't reply, that's what I thought. LOL @ you saying Kobe and Melo aren't friends when Melo and his girl say otherwise.

Now, do you have anything to back up what you said? No.

You're not a Lakers fan you idiot.


Hahaha. Carmelo said him and Kobe always chill when one comes to their city. Melo crashes at Kobe's house and Kobe crashes at Melo's place. Even their wifes are really good friends. They sat next to each every game at staples in the WCF. Ultimate fail post. If you don't believe me, look at Lala(Melo's girl)'s twitter and she speaks about Vanessa.

Kobe and Melo have the greatest respect for each other. Text each other on the regular.

But you're right, media asked about Kobe and Melo made that up on the spot and got his girl to be in on it right? Sh!t, hasn't been a good summer for Kobe haters.

Now debate it.

[QUOTE]Kobe’s wife and Carmelo’s fianc

[eliteballer]

You chumps really think Ray and Hughes were ever this athletic?:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aGxX80NHuRs&fmt=35


:roll:

[Bodhi]

Haha, can't reply, that's what I thought. LOL @ you saying Kobe and Melo aren't friends when Melo and his girl say otherwise.

Now, do you have anything to back up what you said? No.

You're not a Lakers fan you idiot.



Now debate it.


Uh, look at my posts, I've always been a a Laker fan. I have an account at Lakersground and I pretty much only post in Laker threads.

And there's nothing to debate because you aren't making new points. You just keep saying that once upon a time a player said they were friends with Kobe.

And I keep telling you that you never see Kobe actually doing anything, anywhere, with anyone. If Kobe and Melo are such great friends, why didn't he go out to dinner when Melo, Lamar, and Fish all went out with their wives/girlfriends?

Unless you can actually think of something new to say I don't have anything more to say.

[Bodhi]

You chumps really think Ray and Hughes were ever this athletic?:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aGxX80NHuRs&fmt=35


:roll:


Well Kobe's obviously the best athlete, but that may be just because he trains so hard and for so long and not because he was born with a perfect body.

[CantStop]

Uh, look at my posts, I've always been a a Laker fan. I have an account at Lakersground and I pretty much only post in Laker threads.

And there's nothing to debate because you aren't making new points. You just keep saying that once upon a time a player said they were friends with Kobe.

And I keep telling you that you never see Kobe actually doing anything, anywhere, with anyone. If Kobe and Melo are such great friends, why didn't he go out to dinner when Melo, Lamar, and Fish all went out with their wives/girlfriends?

Unless you can actually think of something new to say I don't have anything more to say.

Wow, Kobe didn't go out to dinner with them. Must mean they're not friends. Kobe def didn't have plans that night right? I said debate it, you couldn't. YOU bring up WEAK points. So if I refuse to go to dinner with my mom for whatever reason, does that mean I hate her or I love her less? :oldlol:


Kobe Bryant and Tracy McGrady are good friends off the court

http://findarticles.com/p/articles/mi_m0FCJ/is_2_29/ai_80553864/

http://a.espncdn.com/photo/2009/0521/nba_g_anthony_bryant1_576.jpg

They don't look like buddies at all. :rolleyes:


He almost didn't have a choice but to be cool and outgoing with us, the caliber of players we had on this team," Anthony said. "Off the court, we're all outgoing people, we all like to have fun. He came and fit right in.


Of all the bonds formed, Kobe and Carmelo's might be the tightest.

"He's like a brother to me," Kobe said. "I love him. We spend a lot of time together. He was the one I'm closest with on the team."

What did you say again?

[OneMoreSucka]

How did this thread go from athleticism to who's friends with who?

Only CantStop can form this bull**** :roll:

[CantStop]

How did this thread go from athleticism to who's friends with who?

Only CantStop can form this bull**** :roll:

Listen idiot, I didn't even start that. He did. I just proved him wrong. Go check for yourself you illiterate dumb sh!t.

[OneMoreSucka]

Still following me around I see. How's that working out for ya.

[NBASTATMAN]

you pick who was born more naturally physically gifted?


Come on kobe is better than both of these guys as a athlete..

[LAClipsFan33]

You chumps really think Ray and Hughes were ever this athletic?:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aGxX80NHuRs&fmt=35


:roll:

Larry Hughes pre injury could do anything Kobe could do in the air

[CantStop]

Still following me around I see. How's that working out for ya.

You're the one that mentions me in every thread you idiot. :oldlol:

[OneMoreSucka]

:roll:

[VeeCee15]

Ray Allen, in his prime, was a better athlete than Kobe.
ray was shorter but he could jump higher.

Lebron is most overrated athlete his leaping ability is not amazing.

[CantStop]

Mods, delete this thread. Kobe haters have gone from Kobe can't win MVP to Kobe can't get out of the first round without Shaq to Kobe can't win a ship without Shaq to Kobe can't win a Finals MVP without Shaq to Ray Allen is a better athlete than Kobe. Something is f*cked up with you guys. Seek a psychiatrist. This man done ruined your life.

[Jacks3]

Ray Allen, in his prime, was a better athlete than Kobe.

:roll:

[OneMoreSucka]

Mods, delete this thread. Kobe haters have gone from Kobe can't win MVP to Kobe can't get out of the first round without Shaq to Kobe can't win a ship without Shaq to Kobe can't win a Finals MVP without Shaq to Ray Allen is a better athlete than Kobe. Something is f*cked up with you guys. Seek a psychiatrist. This man done ruined your life.
But one thing is for sure. Kobe can't block PJ Brown to save his life.

[Juges8932]

LOL, haha, the argument is pretty funny. Also, whether Kobe does or doesn't have friends is completely irrelevant as this is a thread on who has more athleticism. But, just to argue, it's true, the first part of Kobe's career you didn't hear of him going out, hanging out with the boys, or whatever, but with the new Lakers team (His team), he definitely has changed. I don't see how anybody can argue otherwise. U see him coaching his team, going out to dinner with them. Hell, last year, he bought his team watches and took them out for dinner to thank them for helping him get the MVP award. At the press conference, they were clowning around and joking, hardly seems like something people that don't get along do. Ppl bring up him not going out to eat with Carmelo, Fish, and Lamar. Well, to me, he looked as focused as he ever has, he wanted the championship more than anything, and the way he acted and his demeanor denoted such. I'm sure he wasn't blowing them off as he and Melo have both said that they're good friends, but probably didn't want to get distracted from the mission at hand by going out or dining with his opponent. I just don't see how people still think he is a recluse and not social like he once was.

[MaxFly]

Can't believe Kobe is being compared to Ray Allen. It's disturbing. Mods delete this thread. Only time Ray could ever win a ring is being 3rd option on a stacked team and yet he's being compared to the GOD?

Nope, not deleting this... People are saying some hilarious things that deserve to be preserved for posterity... not for themselves, but for the general ammusement of others. :cheers:

[MaxFly]

But you're right, media asked about Kobe and Melo made that up on the spot and got his girl to be in on it right? Sh!t, hasn't been a good summer for Kobe haters.

http://i438.photobucket.com/albums/qq104/Tambracherie/KobeLala.jpg

I had to google this to verify... and you do seem to be right...


Meh, looks like hate to me...

[MaxFly]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aGxX80NHuRs&fmt=35

LOL...

Can someone post Ray Allen's?

Lol at the arm in the rim at 9:36.

[NBASTATMAN]

Man I thought I was a kobehater.. LOL... Kobe is a better athlete than either of allen or hughes... Speed, jumping and body control are all in kobe's favor over both of these guys.... Ray Allen could jump and at his best he may have been as good as Kobe..

[MaxFly]

And Denver can't beat a Kobe led squad in the playoffs. :oldlol:

Woah... flag on the play... low blow... that was unnecessary.

[chitownsfinest]

Can someone post Ray Allen's?

Lol at the arm in the rim at 9:36.
You can make the case that Ray Allen's and Hughes careers weren't nowhere near as documented as KB's so their highlights are in way less availability. Still, KB sh!ts on Hughes and Allen athletically. Allen was a good athlete and Hughes was a very good athlete in their athletic primes, but KB was in a level ahead of them.

A better comparison would be between KB and T-Mac.

[Mr_Basketball#1]

Can someone post Ray Allen's?

Lol at the arm in the rim at 9:36.


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WQAV9Lo1Bh8
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WfPd76yKJRI
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cbkzy6IkeWY
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-OvtSkU2uxQ
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=I4RKdH2GIcE
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=W8wDJqH_J40
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=a7PbPEC8hNk
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1ex4ZbINmok
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=paM-5TxEVzA (He's still got it)

Not saying Ray is a better athlete but don't act like putting Ray in the same convo as Kobe was an insult

[BallersTalk]

Can someone post Ray Allen's?

Lol at the arm in the rim at 9:36.
It's better to look at where his feet are. Despite what people think here, Kobe's vertical is not that extraordinary.

[CantStop]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WQAV9Lo1Bh8
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WfPd76yKJRI
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cbkzy6IkeWY
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-OvtSkU2uxQ
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=I4RKdH2GIcE
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=W8wDJqH_J40
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=a7PbPEC8hNk
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1ex4ZbINmok
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=paM-5TxEVzA (He's still got it)

Not saying Ray is a better athlete but don't act like putting Ray in the same convo as Kobe was an insult

Wait, are you trying to make a case with those videos? To me, those videos would greatly used in Kobe's favor. Considering he has 150+ dunks better than the ones you posted. Look at EliteBaller's video.

[BallersTalk]

You can make the case that Ray Allen's and Hughes careers weren't nowhere near as documented as KB's so their highlights are in way less availability. Still, KB sh!ts on Hughes and Allen athletically. Allen was a good athlete and Hughes was a very good athlete in their athletic primes, but KB was in a level ahead of them.

A better comparison would be between KB and T-Mac.
I disagree. T-Mac in his physical prime blows Kobe out of the water athletically. Not even comparable IMO. Ray Allen's the best comparison.

[KenneBell]

Gotta be one of the worst threads I've read in a loooooong time. :roll:

I'm glad MaxFly didn't close this. Some people in here are making themselves look like fools.

[nbastatus]

Can't believe Kobe is being compared to Ray Allen. It's disturbing. Mods delete this thread. Only time Ray could ever win a ring is being 3rd option on a stacked team and yet he's being compared to the GOD?
http://img361.imageshack.us/img361/2959/manbowingbeforejesusf.jpg

[CantStop]

http://img361.imageshack.us/img361/2959/manbowingbeforejesusf.jpg

You know how some pics are so badly photo shopped that it's funny? Well, that isn't one of them. Try again.

[bleedinpurpleTwo]

while it pains me to agree with CantStop, Ray Allen should never be compared to Kobe, unless its a discussion of outside shooting, at which Ray greatly excels. all other aspects, Kobe dominates.

[KenneBell]

Wait, are you trying to make a case with those videos? To me, those videos would greatly used in Kobe's favor. Considering he has 150+ dunks better than the ones you posted. Look at EliteBaller's video.
It doesn't make any sense. Ray and Larry are good athletes but they aren't on Kobe's level and most reasonable NBA fans know this.

Even throwaway dunks like this are above what Hughes or Allen can do. He did a similar one ingame vs the Magic last year at age 29. I don't think the same could be said for the other two.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=akMiX_FKCdQ

[CantStop]

It doesn't make any sense. Ray and Larry are good athletes but they aren't on Kobe's level and most reasonable NBA fans know this.

Even throwaway dunks like this are above what Hughes or Allen can do. He did a similar one ingame vs the Magic last year at age 29. I don't think the same could be said for the other two.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=akMiX_FKCdQ

Imagine if Kobe was a 1 footed leaper... that would be insane.

[KenneBell]

Imagine if Kobe was a 1 footed leaper... that would be insane.
That part of his jumping ability hasn't been the same since the knee surgeries. They took away a lot of his explosiveness off of one foot.

He used to do things in the early 2000's that he wouldn't even try to attempt these days.

[Abraham Lincoln]

Yet again, the Bryant fan who started this thread yet again certainly got his wish. Shame what this board has been reduced to. One could hold a damn online terrorist convention here and there would still not be a single ban or deletion.

[Killer_Instinct]

And Denver can't beat a Kobe led squad in the playoffs. :oldlol:


:oldlol: This thread is comedy.

[beasly15]

In before CantStop.

:oldlol:
i love a good roast.

[amfirst]

Kobe is probably one on the best conditioned athelete, but not the most atheletic.

[Killer_Instinct]

Kobe is probably one on the best conditioned athelete, but not the most atheletic.


I'm sure no one is saying Bean is a top 5 athletic monster. He is a better athlete than Allen and Hughes.

[Anti404]

I dunno', in Ray Allen's prime, he was a pretty fantastic athlete. I would put Kobe's prime above his, but not by the margin that many fans of him seem to think. as a natural athlete, he is probably a lot better than Allen, primarily as a result of his absurd body control. but as far as a purely conditioned athlete, Kobe is not miles away the better of the two(though he is better by some margin).

also, I think most have such a difficult time seeing the two player's athletic similarities as a result of their two totally different styles of play; Ray is primarily coming off of screens and doing quick jumpshots whereas Kobe focused more on dribble-drives and isolation plays.

[amfirst]

I dunno', in Ray Allen's prime, he was a pretty fantastic athlete. I would put Kobe's prime above his, but not by the margin that many fans of him seem to think. as a natural athlete, he is probably a lot better than Allen, primarily as a result of his absurd body control. but as far as a purely conditioned athlete, Kobe is not miles away the better of the two(though he is better by some margin).

also, I think most have such a difficult time seeing the two player's athletic similarities as a result of their two totally different styles of play; Ray is primarily coming off of screens and doing quick jumpshots whereas Kobe focused more on dribble-drives and isolation plays.


Players that come off screens just means that they can't beat the defender and needs a screen to get a head start.

[Lebron23]

Kobe Bryant

He was a former NBA Slamdunk Champion.

Ray Allen was very athletic in his early years.

[Anti404]

Players that come off screens just means that they can't beat the defender and needs a screen to get a head start.
...
seriously? did you honestly type that?

[andgar923]

I see people are still mad over the comment I made, when I mentioned Kobe and larry Hughes have similar style and athleticism.

I guess they couldn't let that go, so they felt the need to make this thread.

Pathetic

Even tho I never said that Larry was on Kobe's level.

And yes..... back in Larry's prime, he was very comparable to Kobe in 'style' and athleticism.

Check out how they moved and crossed people over, even how they dunked was similar.

[TryToBeUnbias]

same ole posters always pop up in kobe threads smh...

[IInvented]

Hahaha. Carmelo said him and Kobe always chill when one comes to their city. Melo crashes at Kobe's house and Kobe crashes at Melo's place. Even their wifes are really good friends. They sat next to each every game at staples in the WCF. Ultimate fail post. If you don't believe me, look at Lala(Melo's girl)'s twitter and she speaks about Vanessa.

Kobe and Melo have the greatest respect for each other. Text each other on the regular.

But you're right, media asked about Kobe and Melo made that up on the spot and got his girl to be in on it right? Sh!t, hasn't been a good summer for Kobe haters.

Im not surprised.. This mutha****a knows EVERYTHING about Bryant.. God dam you're a ****ing stan..

[IInvented]

Players that come off screens just means that they can't beat the defender and needs a screen to get a head start.
:wtf: :wtf: :wtf:

















































Did this bitch just say that? Did she really do it?? :wtf: :wtf:

[unbreakable]

Why is this thread so long? And how dare someone even bring up such a dumb topic.

No disrespect to Ray or Larry, they are both superb athletes, but comparing them to Kobe is like comparing Pippen to Jordan.

Kobe was a phenomenal athlete in his prime and he's done things that will never ever be done by anyone else. Truly a one of a kind athlete. Sure, he's no Lebron.. but no one is. Kobe is Kobe, The end.

[VeeCee15]

Kobe was never a phenomenal athlete.

There are tons of players more ATHLETIC than KOBE but aren't as good as him. Sure Kobe won the slam dunk contest..but that's right when people stopped watching; it was just so bad and devin ham was clearly superior.

Watching Kobe at age 30..he is moving like Michael Jordan was at age 36. Just a different class of athlete.

Kobe Bryant's athleticism is in the mold of Ray Allen and Larry Hughes; it is a very good comparison they all have similar verticals.

Guys like Ricky Davis is already much more athletic than Kobe.

[okayabc123]

Kobe never needed to be a phenomenal athlete to be the best player. He might not jump higher or run faster than the likes of Lebron, Wade, or even Whinsanity Carter.

Kobe heavily relies his game on footwork, positioning, and fundamentals. There is a reason why Kobe will be efficient well into his 30s. He can beat his man off the dribble, finish plays, and get open for his shot without being the best athlete.

[lefthook00]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vCrvCbh26K8

[Mr_Basketball#1]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vCrvCbh26K8
Yeah and while he was taunting Rashard Lewis scores the basket plus the Lakers lost. Everything Ray said about Kobe was true. :oldlol:

[wang4three]

When these guys entered the league all around the same time, I had my hopes high for Ray. He was so fundamentally sound at a young age and all he had to do was develop defense and maybe a bit stronger. He had it all, but he just cruised into being a better offensive player only. I still like him, but when I look at him I was thinking he had the potential to be a top 5 of all time. He really could've been something really, really out of this world special.

[Younggrease]

When these guys entered the league all around the same time, I had my hopes high for Ray. He was so fundamentally sound at a young age and all he had to do was develop defense and maybe a bit stronger. He had it all, but he just cruised into being a better offensive player only. I still like him, but when I look at him I was thinking he had the potential to be a top 5 of all time. He really could've been something really, really out of this world special.

Its sad when guys arent willing to put in the work to maximize their talent like Kobe did...

[Spudjjay]

I'll just quote Kobe:

Great quote. Kobe was speaking nothing but the truth.

[O.J A 6'4Mamba]

Shannon Brown jumps WAY higher than Kobe EVER did

this

[O.J A 6'4Mamba]

Ray Allen, in his prime, was a better athlete than Kobe.
ray was shorter but he could jump higher.

Lebron is most overrated athlete his leaping ability is not amazing.

FAIL, why are they so many haters on ISH.
inch by inch Allen vertical was comparable to Kobe, but that didn't translate into a game. Kobe has longer arms, slightly taller, has better body control, dunks more and with more viciousness. Kobe is faster also. Jumping is just a small part of what is is to be an athlete. Kobe is also stronger than Ray Allen he abused allen in the post.

LeBron is a freak 270 pounds of muscle 6'9, has lighting quick end to end speed, and can jump out of this building.

[BallersTalk]

Kobe was never a phenomenal athlete.

There are tons of players more ATHLETIC than KOBE but aren't as good as him. Sure Kobe won the slam dunk contest..but that's right when people stopped watching; it was just so bad and devin ham was clearly superior.

Watching Kobe at age 30..he is moving like Michael Jordan was at age 36. Just a different class of athlete.

Kobe Bryant's athleticism is in the mold of Ray Allen and Larry Hughes; it is a very good comparison they all have similar verticals.

Guys like Ricky Davis is already much more athletic than Kobe.
This.

[CantStop]

Yeah and while he was taunting Rashard Lewis scores the basket plus the Lakers lost. Everything Ray said about Kobe was true. :oldlol:

Wow, LA lost a preseason game. :oldlol:

Ray Allen is the career loser. How well did he do as first option? That's right, never made it to the WCF as a first option. Multiple lottery seasons as a first option. Cat wins one ship as 3rd option and all of a sudden we forget how terrible his career was?

[Real Men Wear Green]

This thread is pretty terrible.

The reason why Kobe Bryant has accumulated more dunk-ons than Ray Allen is because he's bigger (both in height as well as weight), a better penetrator and ballhandler, and also has greater upper-body strength. Young Allen was not as good an overall athlete, but just in terms of leaping ability he was the equal of anyone not in the Carter/Jordan/James category. Watch a UConn/Bucks highlight reel and you'll see that. There's a reason why his jumper was/is completely unaffected by the defender, and it's not just the quick release (although that helps). Kedrick Brown supposedly had a 45 inch vert but we never saw him dunk on anyone (or do anything else for that matter) and it's because he didn't have the skills. What has made Bryant a great scorer is his combination of size, strength, leaping ability, and ballhandling skills. Young Ray really only equaled Bryant in the leaping, so he was never the penetrator and thus, dunk-on artist that Bryant was. Still, he had his fair share.

Also, I find the criticism we see emerging for Allen for not somehow getting the most he could out of his talent to be amazingly stupid. 9-time All-star, 21 ppg career scorer, NBA Champion, one of the greatest clutch shooters the league has ever seen, about to enter his 13th season with a possible 15+ year career when all is said and done. A lock for the Hall of Fame. What's he supposed to do, be Jordan? A guy can be a hard worker and yet still never achieve GOAT status, whether you people realize it or not. It's funny, there are probably a number of posters on this board that would work on their game for hours a day and could achieve nothing beyond varsity (if that) and yet people have the gall to question Allen's ethic just because he was only the third-best SG of his era (behind Bryant and AI)? Just doesn't make any sense to me. Ray Allen got plenty out of his talent. Not his fault that some of you are too stupid and/or biased to see that.

[CantStop]

LOL @ this clown writing essays because Ray is a Celtic. I don't care for his stats, fact is he's a multiple lottery season player when he was first option and didn't accomplish much but then we're gonna act like all that doesn't matter because he joined two other notable lotterry season players to form a trio and win the ship?

[Real Men Wear Green]

Nothing that you say matters, actually. You're just another troll. I don't have to delete your post because anyone with any sense that read it would see through it. It's ignored simply because of it's author. And the fact that you addressed nothing that I wrote doesn't help either. Ok, you don't like me, I'm a "clown." And? If you never say anything of any relevance on a messageboard, your existence is, by definition, irrelevant.

[eliteballer]

This is getting stupid. Ray and Hughes CAN NOT, WOULD NOT WILL NOT EVER DO DUNKS LIKE THIS:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aGxX80NHuRs&fmt=35

The ONLY wing players in history who could put up comparable mixes to that are Carter and Jordan.

[BallersTalk]

This is getting stupid. Ray and Hughes CAN NOT, WOULD NOT WILL NOT EVER DO DUNKS LIKE THIS:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aGxX80NHuRs&fmt=35

The ONLY wing players in history who could put up comparable mixes to that are Carter and Jordan.
LOL at you putting Kobe in the same breath as those two. Those two are the athletic gods of the perimeter.

[VeeCee15]

Kobe has like a 35 inch vertical if not less.

He realy doesn't jump too high for a 6'6 - 6'7 guard

[BallersTalk]

Kobe has like a 35 inch vertical if not less.

He realy doesn't jump too high for a 6'6 - 6'7 guard
Yup, outside of his long wingspan, most of his advantages are skill based.

[wang4three]

Also, I find the criticism we see emerging for Allen for not somehow getting the most he could out of his talent to be amazingly stupid. 9-time All-star, 21 ppg career scorer, NBA Champion, one of the greatest clutch shooters the league has ever seen, about to enter his 13th season with a possible 15+ year career when all is said and done. A lock for the Hall of Fame. What's he supposed to do, be Jordan? A guy can be a hard worker and yet still never achieve GOAT status, whether you people realize it or not. It's funny, there are probably a number of posters on this board that would work on their game for hours a day and could achieve nothing beyond varsity (if that) and yet people have the gall to question Allen's ethic just because he was only the third-best SG of his era (behind Bryant and AI)? Just doesn't make any sense to me. Ray Allen got plenty out of his talent. Not his fault that some of you are too stupid and/or biased to see that.

I will assess Ray Allen the way I see fit the same way you have the "gall" to insult the rest of us. I'm not saying what he has done is lackluster or to be scoffed at, but is it really that bad to think he could do more? Is it all that terrible? Maybe you feel this is the best Ray could've been. I don't. He came into the league with so many skills and already a high level understanding of the game. I still like him a lot, but I will not apologize for wanting more.

[KB2009Champ]

Yeah and while he was taunting Rashard Lewis scores the basket plus the Lakers lost. Everything Ray said about Kobe was true. :oldlol:


What an epic fail. A PRESEASON game.

Try again.

[KenneBell]

Kobe has like a 35 inch vertical if not less.

He realy doesn't jump too high for a 6'6 - 6'7 guard
It's not about jumping too high, it's being more athletic than Allen and Hughes, which he is.

[justin43]

Is this another Kobe Hate thread?:violin: Seriously, Kobe. Too much agenda in this thread.

[BallersTalk]

Is this another Kobe Hate thread?:violin: Seriously, Kobe. Too much agenda in this thread.
The thread starter is a Kobe fan. He disappeared because this didn't go like he expected it to.

[justin43]

The thread starter is a Kobe fan. He disappeared because this didn't go like he expected it to.

That's interesting.:roll:

[Real Men Wear Green]

I will assess Ray Allen the way I see fit the same way you have the "gall" to insult the rest of us. I'm not saying what he has done is lackluster or to be scoffed at, but is it really that bad to think he could do more? Is it all that terrible?
Yes. I'm not a fan of ridiculous expectations.