Scottie Pippen: Ultimate Defender

[Fatal9]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=N9vFHYVXtRk&feature=sub

Been looking for a video like this for so long. The greatest perimeter defender ever :bowdown:

[nnn123]

It is impossible to make a video highlighting someone like Pippen's defensive strengths. It goes way beyond the blocks or the steals, or the individual plays......what sets him apart is his super quick defensive rotations (difficult to show in a 10 minute video). Every single time one of his teammates gets beat, Pip's there in a heartbeat denying penetration, forcing an outside jump shot..not allowing anything easy. Which tends to take its toll on the offensive player in a 48 minute game. This is what made Pippen and Jordan such a lethal combo (in their defensive primes)...their super quick defensive instincts and rotations. Not allowing penetration. And then you combine that with stifling one-on-one D, the steals, the blocks.....and you got some damn good defense.

[Myth]

Cool video. Pippen is one of my favorite players of all time. They should have left the part at 6:10 out though. That was clearly a blocking foul on Pippen that was incorrectly called as a charge.

[lilgregoden]

very coool video, pip is great.

[KenneBell]

Great video.

[97 bulls]

i dont see how anyone could look at videos of pip in the open court and not believe he could be a 25 ppg scorer

[GP_20]

Greatest Perimeter defender? 0 DPOY? Accomplishments are part of being the greatest. He never won DPOY.

I'd take Payton and Jordan over him.

[FinalCountdown]

Jordan was a better defender.

[CB4GOATPF]

Jordan was a better defender.

:roll:

Age Limit Please...

[Abraham Lincoln]

The greatest perimeter defender ever :bowdown:

http://www.nba.com/media/pistons/drodman_225_080408.jpg

[CB4GOATPF]

[B][U]Pippen

[BankShot]

[QUOTE=CB4GOATPF][B][U]Pippen

[CB4GOATPF]

Lets not get ahead of ourselves here with the "Defensive Rating" statistic... unless you understand what it means you have no business submitting it.

Also, any metric that has Tyrus Thomas being the best defensive player in 2007 loses practically all credibility with me.

This was for the Play-Offs

He is a Great Defender you might not like him or his style of play but thats another matter...

Is is it a coincdence that Dwight Howard this time...correctly named the Best Defender in the Game for Last Year also had the Highest DRT? :confusedshrug:

How about Ben Wallace? :confusedshrug:

Or the disgrace in Duncan not having a DPOTY Award?

2009 NBA Dwight Howard 98.35 ORL
2008 NBA Tim Duncan 98.51 SAS
2007 NBA Tyrus Thomas 92.52 CHI
2006 NBA Alonzo Mourning 95.13 MIA
2005 NBA Ben Wallace 93.48 DET
2004 NBA Ben Wallace 83.91 DET
2003 NBA Ben Wallace 90.51 DET
2002 NBA Ben Wallace 86.38 DET
2001 NBA David Robinson* 92.42 SAS
2000 NBA David Robinson* 84.01 SAS
1999 NBA David Robinson* 87.33 SAS
1998 NBA David Robinson* 93.42 SAS

:no:

[BankShot]

This was for the Play-Offs

He is a Great Defender you might not like him or his style of play but thats another matter...

Is is it a coincdence that Dwight Howard this time...correctly named the Best Defender in the Game for Last Year also had the Highest DRT? :confusedshrug:

How about Ben Wallace? :confusedshrug:

Or the disgrace in Duncan not having a DPOTY Award?

2009 NBA Dwight Howard 98.35 ORL
2008 NBA Tim Duncan 98.51 SAS
2007 NBA Tyrus Thomas 92.52 CHI
2006 NBA Alonzo Mourning 95.13 MIA
2005 NBA Ben Wallace 93.48 DET
2004 NBA Ben Wallace 83.91 DET
2003 NBA Ben Wallace 90.51 DET
2002 NBA Ben Wallace 86.38 DET
2001 NBA David Robinson* 92.42 SAS
2000 NBA David Robinson* 84.01 SAS
1999 NBA David Robinson* 87.33 SAS
1998 NBA David Robinson* 93.42 SAS

:no:

Who's a great defender, Tyrus Thomas??? :roll:

Are you seriously shaking a finger at me for questioning the a metric that has Thomas the #1 defensive player of the year?? :no:

Also, stats generally only measure what is quantifiable, which is only a small part of being a great defender.

[CB4GOATPF]

Who's a great defender, Tyrus Thomas??? :roll:

Are you seriously shaking a finger at me for questioning the a metric that has Thomas the #1 defensive player of the year?? :no:

Also, stats generally only measure what is quantifiable, which is only a small part of being a great defender.


Those here for the PLAY-OFFS

He is a Great Defender atleast for that play-off run if not he would not be right up there with guys like Rodman, Laimbeeer, Robinson, Pippen, Hakeem, Patrick, Wallace or Tim ALL CONSIDERED GREAT DEFENSIVE PLAYERS AND STOPPERS or NOT?

Now i will put the ones for the whole season:

http://www.basketball-reference.com/leaders/def_rtg_yearly.html

Season Lg Player DRtg Tm

2008-09 NBA Dwight Howard 94.56 ORL (Coincidence?=
2007-08 NBA Kevin Garnett 93.85 BOS
2006-07 NBA Tim Duncan 94.45 SAS
2005-06 NBA Tim Duncan 94.41 SAS
2004-05 NBA Tim Duncan 93.17 SAS
2003-04 NBA Ben Wallace 87.48 DET
2002-03 NBA Ben Wallace 89.99 DET
2001-02 NBA Ben Wallace 92.89 DET
2000-01 NBA Marcus Camby 90.56 NYK
1999-00 NBA David Robinson* 92.22 SAS
1998-99 NBA David Robinson* 87.94 SAS
1997-98 NBA David Robinson* 93.61 SAS
1996-97 NBA Alonzo Mourning 95.31 MIA
1995-96 NBA David Robinson* 96.45 SAS
1994-95 NBA Scottie Pippen 98.25 CHI :sleeping:
1993-94 NBA Patrick Ewing* 92.88 NYK
1992-93 NBA Patrick Ewing* 94.34 NYK
1991-92 NBA David Robinson* 94.38 SAS
1990-91 NBA Hakeem Olajuwon* 93.39 HOU
1989-90 NBA Hakeem Olajuwon* 93.43 HOU
1988-89 NBA Hakeem Olajuwon* 94.86 HOU
1987-88 NBA Hakeem Olajuwon* 98.05 HOU
1986-87 NBA Hakeem Olajuwon* 98.75 HOU
1985-86 NBA Bill Walton* 97.49 BOS
1984-85 NBA Mark Eaton 96.50 UTA
1983-84 NBA Alton Lister 98.63 MIL
1982-83 NBA Marvin Webster 95.72 NYK
1981-82 NBA Jack Sikma 97.23 SEA

Notice how Scottie Pippen is the Only Small Forward in NBA History to Lead the NBA in Defensive Rating?

Where PFs and Cs have the Most Defensive Impacts in a Game Ofcourse...since they Play in the Frontline of 3 Player not 2 the Backcourt (before Stern Puss-ied Out the NBA ofcorse)

Also:

And You are talking about a Point - Forward who also had Game Creating, Scoring and Rebounding Responsabilities at the same time as Being the GOAT Perimeter Defender? He wasn`t just a Role Defensive Stopper but a Versatile Star and At the Same Time a Defensive Stopper :confusedshrug:

A Coincidence Again? U Blind? :violin:

[juju151111]

[QUOTE=CB4GOATPF][B][U]Pippen

[Bigsmoke]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=__CbYpgot9o&feature=related

[97 bulls]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=__CbYpgot9o&feature=related
man get the fxxck outta here. one play is supposed to be convincing? what a joke.

[97 bulls]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=__CbYpgot9o&feature=related
and actully, it looks as if pips expecting help cuz grant rotated late..

[1987_Lakers]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=__CbYpgot9o&feature=related

:applause:

[Bigsmoke]

and actully, it looks as if pips expecting help cuz grant rotated late..

my 90's Bulls had a sh*t load of defenders. I mean how many teams where u have 3 players that were on the NBA All-Defensive Teams?

back to the subject. Charles is one of the best offensive players so that youtube clip was a joke. and it did looked like Pippen thought Grant would contest his shot.

Pippen is one of the greatest defenders along with others But why are people looking at Pippen as this... all time greatest defender? he's not.

[824]

Those here for the PLAY-OFFS

He is a Great Defender atleast for that play-off run if not he would not be right up there with guys like Rodman, Laimbeeer, Robinson, Pippen, Hakeem, Patrick, Wallace or Tim ALL CONSIDERED GREAT DEFENSIVE PLAYERS AND STOPPERS or NOT?

Now i will put the ones for the whole season:

http://www.basketball-reference.com/leaders/def_rtg_yearly.html

Season Lg Player DRtg Tm

2008-09 NBA Dwight Howard 94.56 ORL (Coincidence?=
2007-08 NBA Kevin Garnett 93.85 BOS
2006-07 NBA Tim Duncan 94.45 SAS
2005-06 NBA Tim Duncan 94.41 SAS
2004-05 NBA Tim Duncan 93.17 SAS
2003-04 NBA Ben Wallace 87.48 DET
2002-03 NBA Ben Wallace 89.99 DET
2001-02 NBA Ben Wallace 92.89 DET
2000-01 NBA Marcus Camby 90.56 NYK
1999-00 NBA David Robinson* 92.22 SAS
1998-99 NBA David Robinson* 87.94 SAS
1997-98 NBA David Robinson* 93.61 SAS
1996-97 NBA Alonzo Mourning 95.31 MIA
1995-96 NBA David Robinson* 96.45 SAS
1994-95 NBA Scottie Pippen 98.25 CHI :sleeping:
1993-94 NBA Patrick Ewing* 92.88 NYK
1992-93 NBA Patrick Ewing* 94.34 NYK
1991-92 NBA David Robinson* 94.38 SAS
1990-91 NBA Hakeem Olajuwon* 93.39 HOU
1989-90 NBA Hakeem Olajuwon* 93.43 HOU
1988-89 NBA Hakeem Olajuwon* 94.86 HOU
1987-88 NBA Hakeem Olajuwon* 98.05 HOU
1986-87 NBA Hakeem Olajuwon* 98.75 HOU
1985-86 NBA Bill Walton* 97.49 BOS
1984-85 NBA Mark Eaton 96.50 UTA
1983-84 NBA Alton Lister 98.63 MIL
1982-83 NBA Marvin Webster 95.72 NYK
1981-82 NBA Jack Sikma 97.23 SEA

Notice how Scottie Pippen is the Only Small Forward in NBA History to Lead the NBA in Defensive Rating?

Where PFs and Cs have the Most Defensive Impacts in a Game Ofcourse...since they Play in the Frontline of 3 Player not 2 the Backcourt (before Stern Puss-ied Out the NBA ofcorse)

Also:

And You are talking about a Point - Forward who also had Game Creating, Scoring and Rebounding Responsabilities at the same time as Being the GOAT Perimeter Defender? He wasn`t just a Role Defensive Stopper but a Versatile Star and At the Same Time a Defensive Stopper :confusedshrug:

A Coincidence Again? U Blind? :violin:

You're more annoying than like hawkfan or pleezebelieve with your stupid colorful full of nothingness posts of dumbassery.

[97 bulls]

my 90's Bulls had a sh*t load of defenders. I mean how many teams where u have 3 players that were on the NBA All-Defensive Teams?

back to the subject. Charles is one of the best offensive players so that youtube clip was a joke. and it did looked like Pippen thought Grant would contest his shot.

Pippen is one of the greatest defenders along with others But why are people looking at Pippen as this... all time greatest defender? he's not.
so if i show a clip of magic turning the ball over or jordan missing a shot or mutombo getting dunked on does that mean they werent the best ever? like i said your clip is a joke. not to mention it was more grants fault than pippen

[robertshaw_1]

Pippen is the all time greatest defensive player ever.

[DuMa]

Pip is a natural born defender but Michael taught him a lot of tricks as well.

[AlThornton]

Pippen is the all time greatest defensive player ever.

Bill Russell

[Toizumi]

Greatest Perimeter defender? 0 DPOY? Accomplishments are part of being the greatest. He never won DPOY.

I'd take Payton and Jordan over him.

:no: DPOY is nice but Pippen, Bruce Bowen and Tim Duncan, some of the greatest defenders ever never won one. Duncan made 12 all defensive teams and never won DPOY - is Dwight Howard a better defender than him?

Payton, Jordan and Pippen were all great and I find it hard to rank them. Pippen never won DPOY but he did make 10 defensive teams (two 2nd teams). He's not a notch below Jordan and Payton, what do you base that on? Just the award?
:violin:

[L.A. Jazz]

MJ, Pipp and Rodman... what a defensive team... wow

[FinalCountdown]

Bill Russell
Thank You.

[CB4GOATPF]

People are so brainwashed by the Media and Hype

Ok Jordan Was a Better Defender...There :rolleyes:

[allball]

Great perimeter defenders (in no order):

Walt Frazier
Gary Payton
Michael Jordan
Michael Ray Richardson
Bruce Bowen
Scottie Pippen
Joe Dumars
Sidney Moncrief
T.R. Dunn
Don Chaney
Lindsey Hunter
Don Buse

If we're talking purely "perimeter" defense any of these guys is as good as Scottie.

[FinalCountdown]

Pippen was more versatile as a defender, Jordan was more effective.

[Dizzle-2k7]

Pippen :bowdown:

An irreplacable piece of the Bulls Dynasty..will probably never get the props he deserves because he played with the GOAT.. but hands down one of the greatest players EVER. Top 3 SF only behind Bird and Bron.

:bowdown:

[gotbacon23]

[QUOTE=CB4GOATPF][B][U]Pippen

[L.A. Jazz]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MtdoUrcnjD4

in this clip you can see that Pipp was doing everything: man on man, stealing, helpD, blocking, leading fastbreak, dunking in Mourning's face,...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YjcB6ji1ewg

also a nice game with some good footage of what Pipp did: D (steals and blocks), bringing up the ball, pick and rolls with Jordan, nice assists, facial dunk,...

MJ is GOAT and on the same page as defender as Pipp. Both could do nearly everything. but some players Pipp defendet better, others MJ. Sure Pipp did normally take the opponents best offensive player, because MJ had to do most of the scoring. But with switching, helping and all MJ took little timeouts on D compared to other great offensive players. Thats why he is so great.

[Johnni Gade]

Steal the ball, run down the field and hit a three. Thats cold.

[CB4GOATPF]

pippen is one of the GOAT perimeter defenders ever, its a fact.

however, stop using defensive rating as evidence of this when the following perimeter players have been career defensive ratings that scottie pippen:

manu ginobli 97.68
john havlicek 98.71
rick barry 99.44
charlie ward 99.91
julius erving 100.89
quinn buckner 101.09
robert horry 101.19
bonzi wells 101.32
larry bird 101.44
scottie pippen 101.51

the stat is somewhat useless because it depends soo much on your teammates. not that the guys i listed are "bad" defenders, but honestly the stat tells us little when it ranks bonzi wells (101.32) as having a better defensive rating than scottie pippen (101.51), bruce bowen (102.25), ron artest (102.27) and michael jordan (102.83).

i'm not disagreeing with you in principle, pippen is one of the GOAT defenders, i just disagree with the using defensive rating as evidence.

If have to take into count Eras and Competition Faced..in The Time Pippen Played... Contact and Real Defense Was Allowed in the Perimeter...Unlike Today....

Pippen is the GOAT Perimeter Defender

Only SF to Lead the League in Defenive Rating...The Rest PFs and Cs...And he Did it While Being the Best Game Creator, 2nd Leading Scorer, Top 2-3 Rebounder...Simpley an Insane Overwhelmin Task..and All For His Club

Pippen is Also Among THE GOAT TEAM PLAYERS...

[gotbacon23]

If have to take into count Eras and Competition Faced..in The Time Pippen Played... Contact and Real Defense Was Allowed in the Perimeter...Unlike Today....

Pippen is the GOAT Perimeter Defender

Only SF to Lead the League in Defenive Rating...The Rest PFs and Cs...And he Did it While Being the Best Game Creator, 2nd Leading Scorer, Top 2-3 Rebounder...Simpley an Insane Overwhelmin Task..and All For His Club

Pippen is Also Among THE GOAT TEAM PLAYERS...

the players i listed played in an assortment of eras from the 1960s through the 2000s, so your point about taking into account the eras and competition is pointless. And, if contact was allowed on the perimeter when pippen played, wouldn't that make it EASIER for defenders in his era cause they could bump the offensive player and HARDER for defenders in the 2000s era after the rule changes, thus making it MORE impressive that Manu and Bonzi had better defensive ratings. (i'm trying to prove that d-rating is a horrible stat- i know pip is a better defender, but i think you get my point).

[CB4GOATPF]

the players i listed played in an assortment of eras from the 1960s through the 2000s, so your point about taking into account the eras and competition is pointless. And, if contact was allowed on the perimeter when pippen played, wouldn't that make it EASIER for defenders in his era cause they could bump the offensive player and HARDER for defenders in the 2000s era after the rule changes, thus making it MORE impressive that Manu and Bonzi had better defensive ratings. (i'm trying to prove that d-rating is a horrible stat- i know pip is a better defender, but i think you get my point).

[B]True that is why through eras one should compare...according to their eras...

But one must remember Offensive Players back then Also Had Superior Offensive Fundamentas: that to To Resist Contact...Fakes, 1st Steps, Les Traveling Allowed..etc...today very few SG have Great Post Games or Ideal Shot Selections...Very Few...The Game i Watch is like a mid 90s College Game with Better Athleticism.

I think it is important to Mention that Pippen was the only SF to Lead th League In Defensive Rating prior to DR J (ABA)...Bird was close (came 2nd once) but he had a Better Defensive Team too. Usually PFs and Cs have the Biggest Defensive Impact in Games while Pippen had the Same or even More than Those Big Men of his Time while having insane responsabilities as an Anchor:

The Responsabilities Pippen had for the Bulls where Hilarious: Combining Creative Game Creating and being the Best Perimeter Defender/Defensive Stopper For The Other Teams Best Offensive Players, 2nd or 3rd Leading Rebounder and 2nd Focal Scorer....Big Time Overwhelming Tasks...that neither Ginobili or Bonzi had...especially how easy it gets when you have 2 Dominant Big Men in D-Rob and Tim Duncan who make it easier for Assists on them making Higher % Shots Easier or Free Yourself Do To Their Double Teaming for your Drives and Open Shots.

Pippen could Guard pretty well guys that where 6

[gotbacon23]

[QUOTE=CB4GOATPF][B]True that is why through eras one should compare...according to their eras...

But one must remember Offensive Players back then Also Had Superior Offensive Fundamentas: that to To Resist Contact...Fakes, 1st Steps, Les Traveling Allowed..etc...today very few SG have Great Post Games or Ideal Shot Selections...Very Few...The Game i Watch is like a mid 90s College Game with Better Athleticism.

I think it is important to Mention that Pippen was the only SF to Lead th League In Defensive Rating prior to DR J (ABA)...Bird was close (came 2nd once) but he had a Better Defensive Team too. Usually PFs and Cs have the Biggest Defensive Impact in Games while Pippen had the Same or even More than Those Big Men of his Time while having insane responsabilities as an Anchor:

The Responsabilities Pippen had for the Bulls where Hilarious: Combining Creative Game Creating and being the Best Perimeter Defender/Defensive Stopper For The Other Teams Best Offensive Players, 2nd or 3rd Leading Rebounder and 2nd Focal Scorer....Big Time Overwhelming Tasks...that neither Ginobili or Bonzi had...especially how easy it gets when you have 2 Dominant Big Men in D-Rob and Tim Duncan who make it easier for Assists on them making Higher % Shots Easier or Free Yourself Do To Their Double Teaming for your Drives and Open Shots.

Pippen could Guard pretty well guys that where 6

[Fatal9]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gcKdynM8feU

^ Gotta love having the only guy who can shut you down on your own team.

Edit: well I guess not "only"...considering Ehlo has shut down Jordan in his prime.

[OldSchoolBBall]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gcKdynM8feU

^ Gotta love having the only guy who can shut you down on your own team.

Edit: well I guess not "only"...considering Ehlo has shut down Jordan in his prime.

What a freaking JOKE you are. :oldlol:

lol @ both your claims, btw. Nice to show a clip of MJ out of basketball shape and retired playing in a charity game against game-shape Pip. Jordan routinely lit up Pip in practice by his own admission, and Ehlo is, well, Ehlo. MJ having one average series against him doesn't change the 3-4 other monster series he had against him, to say nothing of countless regular season games.

[juju151111]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gcKdynM8feU

^ Gotta love having the only guy who can shut you down on your own team.

Edit: well I guess not "only"...considering Ehlo has shut down Jordan in his prime.
LOL Here the rest of the gm http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=I9ch835Zi1E MJ had 53pts and he was not even in NBa shape.This is during his first retirement. He didn't play BB for months good try tho Faketal. OWNNNEEDD:roll: :roll:

[Fatal9]

Yea, being out of game shape didn't stop Jordan from putting up 45+ shots in a CHARITY game. He was 4-5 months away from coming back I think and was training all summer. BTW Ehlo shut down Jordan at will. Cleveland newspapers started calling him a soft creampuff after game 1, and then he goes out the next night and absolutely embarrasses Jordan (and contains him to 42% shooting for the rest of the series...which btw is almost the same % Kobe shot vs. Boston last year). I'm sure if it was the other way around, Jordan fans would find a way to glorify it...call it the famous "Craig Ehlo game" :oldlol:

[juju151111]

Yea, being out of game shape didn't stop Jordan from putting up 45+ shots in a CHARITY game. He was 4-5 months away from coming back I think and was training all summer. BTW Ehlo shut down Jordan at will. Cleveland newspapers started calling him a soft creampuff after game 1, and then he goes out the next night and absolutely embarrasses Jordan (and contains him to 42% shooting for the rest of the series...which btw is almost the same % Kobe shot vs. Boston last year). I'm sure if it was the other way around, Jordan fans would find a way to glorify it...call it the famous "Craig Ehlo game" :oldlol:
You lying sack of ****. MJ wasn't training all summer before that gm. LOL Who cares wat he shot for the rest of the series??? Wat is his overall FG% Your logic is beyond stupid. MJ shot 40 % if you take out gm1,2,5:wtf: :banghead:

[Showtime]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gcKdynM8feU

^ Gotta love having the only guy who can shut you down on your own team.

Edit: well I guess not "only"...considering Ehlo has shut down Jordan in his prime.
It's too bad the only reason you give props to other players is to further your own anti-Jordan agenda.

[Fatal9]

MJ, Pipp and Rodman... what a defensive team... wow
Yep. The only reason Jordan could shoot around 42% year in year out during the finals (in the second three peat) and still win.

[juju151111]

Yep. The only reason Jordan could shoot around 42% year in year out during the finals (in the second three peat) and still win.
I seem to remember MJ having to hit gamewinners.

[AirJordan23]

You lying sack of ****. MJ wasn't training all summer before that gm. LOL Who cares wat he shot for the rest of the series??? Wat is his overall FG% Your logic is beyond stupid. MJ shot 40 % if you take out gm1,2,5:wtf: :banghead:

:roll:

[Fatal9]

Forced into reading jubjub's post after it was quoted by "airjordan". The point is that after game 1, Ehlo received heavy criticism and was called soft by all the local newspapers. He then came out and shut down Jordan at will for the rest of the series (holding him to 42%), so no, this isn't taking out game 2,3,5.

[OldSchoolBBall]

Yep. The only reason Jordan could shoot around 42% year in year out during the finals (in the second three peat) and still win.

LMAO @ this clown. :oldlol: He shot 46% in 1997, for starters. He shot 41.6% in 1996 and 42.6% in 1998, and in each instance he actually shot roughly equal to or better than the rest of the team did excluding him (+/- .5%). Unlike, say, another star SG who's had a lot more poor shooting performances than Jordan, and who always shot significantly worse than his team did.

[juju151111]

Forced into reading jubjub's post after it was quoted by "airjordan". The point is that after game 1, Ehlo received heavy criticism and was called soft by all the local newspapers. He then came out and shut down Jordan at will for the rest of the series (holding him to 42%), so no, this isn't taking out game 2,3,5.
What about the thread you made before saying take out gm1,4 and Mj shot 40%?? You say these things all the time. You also said Mj didn't guard Magic in 91 and i showed you the tape.(He then proceeds to block me):roll: :roll: :roll: :roll: :roll:

[OldSchoolBBall]

Forced into reading jubjub's post after it was quoted by "airjordan". The point is that after game 1, Ehlo received heavy criticism and was called soft by all the local newspapers. He then came out and shut down Jordan at will for the rest of the series (holding him to 42%), so no, this isn't taking out game 2,3,5.

LMAO @ "shut him down at will."

The very notion that Craig Ehlo of all people could shut down Jordan just exposes you for the hater you are. Jordan did have two bad shooting games (games 2 and 5), but that happens to everyone. Can we say that any time a player has two poor shooting games in a series that their defender "shut them down at will"? Is that the criteria?

[Showtime]

What about the thread you made before saying take out gm1,4 and Mj shot 40%?? You say these things all the time. You also said Mj didn't guard Magic in 91 and i showed you the tape.(He then proceeds to block me):roll: :roll: :roll: :roll: :roll:
Fatal probably never watched Pippen or Jordan in a bulls uniform anyway. Ignore that troll.

[CB4GOATPF]

GOAT PERIMETER DEFENDER

http://frankthetank.files.wordpress.com/2009/05/scottie-pippen-hue-hollins-hubert-davis-foul.jpg

http://i4.ytimg.com/vi/wbjBJy6AWQA/default.jpg

GOAT SF DEFENDER

http://2.bp.blogspot.com/_HvnrtGqYrfY/RicynBykebI/AAAAAAAAAbU/vkITNp4-zXI/s400/Scottie.jpg


THE 90s BULLS ANCHOR

http://www.plu.edu/~absherlt/anchor.jpg

THE 90s BULLS GAME CREATOR ORQUESTOR / TIMER / CLOCK

http://www.nba.com/media/act_scottie_pippen.jpg

BULL WITH THE HIGHEST WINNING % OF ALL TIME AS THE GO TO GO GUY

http://4.bp.blogspot.com/_gpcTzSodYto/SJUAe3tV2HI/AAAAAAAAAEE/TIREmrUHFZw/s320/scottie_pippen_patrick_ewing.jpg

ULTIMATE UNSELFISH - BOTH ENDS OF THE FLOOR - TEAM PLAYER

http://chicago.sportsthenandnow.com/wp-content/uploads/2009/08/jordan.pippen.jpg

http://blogs.suntimes.com/sportsprose/michael-jordan-scottie-pippen.jpg


http://farm1.static.flickr.com/35/71156325_d0d857d6f3.jpg

http://farm1.static.flickr.com/34/72817330_2ff8b36377_o.jpg

[gotbacon23]

jordan's h2h stats vs ehlo:
http://www.basketball-reference.com/fc/h2h_finder.cgi?request=1&p1=jordami01&p2=ehlocr01

allowing 33.7 ppg on 54% fg over 38 games is shutting down?

mj shot 7-20 against him in one game in 1991, and 5 for 12 against him in one day in 1996, but besides that, every game MJ shot at least 45% from the field. i know the playoffs aren't included, but 38 games is a huge sample size..

[OldSchoolBBall]

Can we say that any time a player has two poor shooting games in a series that their defender "shut them down at will"? Is that the criteria?

Fatal, can we say that any time a player has two bad shooting games in a series, that their defender "shut them down at will"?

[guy]

LMAO @ "shut him down at will."

The very notion that Craig Ehlo of all people could shut down Jordan just exposes you for the hater you are. Jordan did have two bad shooting games (games 2 and 5), but that happens to everyone. Can we say that any time a player has two poor shooting games in a series that their defender "shut them down at will"? Is that the criteria?

What series are we talking about? 1992?

[OldSchoolBBall]

What series are we talking about? 1992?

Yeah, I think that's the series Fatal cited as evidence of Ehlo "shutting down Jordan at will." MJ had two poor shooting games in that series (7-22 and 10-27), the rest were in the 46-52% range. I'm just curious to know if a player having two bad games in one series is enough to say that someone "shut a player down at will".

Never mind that fact that Jordan had a 45/6/5/52% series, a 40/5/10/53% series, his career high game of 69/18/6/70%, numerous other games of 40-50+ etc. against Ehlo. Just in general: is the criteria for "shutting a player down at will" simply them having two poor shooting games in a series?

[magnax1]

These guys

http://forum.connpost.com/my2cents/rodman.gif\

http://blogs.phillyburbs.com/news/bct/wp-content/blogs.dir/3/files/00russell.jpg

http://jehingr.files.wordpress.com/2008/12/joe-dumars.jpg

Are on another level to Pippen in the matter of Defense (Others are too, but these are the three that came to mind when you said ultimate defenders)

[hitmanyr2k]

Ultimate defender Part II...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=g1YchiFv-5M

[Roundball_Rock]

Why does every Pippen thread have to devolve into a Jordan thread? :rolleyes:

Great video, great posts CB4, great--GOAT perimeter defender, and one of the 20 greatest players ever.

[branslowski]

I find it really sad that a guy who was a very important part to the Bulls winning titles gets bashed by The Jordan Boys ala Alleged Bulls fans of the world...Disgusting..:ohwell:

[spursdynasty420]

Greatest Perimeter defender? 0 DPOY? Accomplishments are part of being the greatest. He never won DPOY.

I'd take Payton and Jordan over him.

accomplishments in the NBA dont mean a GOD DAMN THING. bruce bowen should of won DPOY a couple of years and he never did because its a big man award. all nba awards are TRASH

[Roundball_Rock]

I find it really sad that a guy who was a very important part to the Bulls winning titles gets bashed by The Jordan Boys ala Alleged Bulls fans of the world...Disgusting..:ohwell:

Strange, isn't it? Is there a similar dynamic anywhere in the sports world? There isn't one in the NBA for sure. Magic fans don't diss Kareem at every opportunity or vice versa, Bird fans don't claim McHale was overrated, Russell fans don't call Cousy a fraud, Garnett fans aren't always diminishing Pierce or Allen, and Kobe fans actually overrate Gasol and Bynum (compared to how they are rated by non-Laker fans)! What I don't understand is why this is the case. Jordan is the consensus GOAT. So why the insecurity? Legitimately you can place him no lower than #3 all-time and even his biggest detractors consider him top 5 all-time. Aside from Gretzky, there is no other GOAT who is rated more highly in his sport. Who is the GOAT QB? There will be partisans for half a dozen QB's. Who is the GOAT golfer? Nicklaus vs. Woods is a close debate right now. GOAT tennis player? Sampras or Federer. GOAT NASCAR driver? Earnhardt Sr., Petty, or Gordon. GOAT F1 racer? Schumacher, Senna, Prost, or Fangio. Only Gretzky and Jordan stand a cut above every other person to play their sport. So why the insecurity?


accomplishments in the NBA dont mean a GOD DAMN THING. bruce bowen should of won DPOY a couple of years and he never did because its a big man award. all nba awards are TRASH

Yeah, DPOY is a joke award because it is reserved for centers and PF's. Pippen carried scrubs to the #2 defense in 1995 (no Grant, no Rodman, and MJ for only 1/5 of the season) yet Mutumbo, on a mediocre defensive team, was given the award over him because he was over 6'10". :rolleyes: Bowen not winning a DPOY was similarly a joke. There should be two separate defensive awards: one for centers and PF's and one for perimeter players. Right now the "Defensive Player of the Year" award is merely a "Defensive 6'10" or Taller Player of the Year" award.

[raptorfan_dr07]

I find it really sad that a guy who was a very important part to the Bulls winning titles gets bashed by The Jordan Boys ala Alleged Bulls fans of the world...Disgusting..:ohwell:

Funny you should mention this cause all you Kobe fans have no problem bashing the man responsible for winning LA 3 straight titles in the early 2000's, Shaquille O'Neal. Now that's disgusting. :rolleyes:

[Roundball_Rock]

As if the Jordan-Pippen relationship is comparable to the Shaq-Kobe one. :rolleyes: They separated on bad terms. Of course Kobe fans will hate Shaq and vice versa. Jordan loved playing with Pippen so much that he refused to play if the Bulls did not keep Pippen. What is the source of MJ fan hostility toward Pippen? Why is it endemic to MJ fans? Even in other sports you don't see this. For instance, Joe Montana fans aren't obsessing with diminishing Rice or vice versa, Jimmie Johnson fans don't call Chad Knaus overrated, Gretzky fans don't attack Messier, and on and on.

[juju151111]

As if the Jordan-Pippen relationship is comparable to the Shaq-Kobe one. :rolleyes: They separated on bad terms. Of course Kobe fans will hate Shaq and vice versa. Jordan loved playing with Pippen so much that he refused to play if the Bulls did not keep Pippen. What is the source of MJ fan hostility toward Pippen? Why is it endemic to MJ fans? Even in other sports you don't see this. For instance, Joe Montana fans aren't obsessing with diminishing Rice or vice versa, Jimmie Johnson fans don't call Chad Knaus overrated, Gretzky fans don't attack Messier, and on and on.
Kobe fans use it to cliam MJ sucked. It's simple haas that. If Kobe fans didn't do this, nobody would would talk down to Pip.(I don't BTW)

[Da_Realist]

As if the Jordan-Pippen relationship is comparable to the Shaq-Kobe one. :rolleyes: They separated on bad terms. Of course Kobe fans will hate Shaq and vice versa. Jordan loved playing with Pippen so much that he refused to play if the Bulls did not keep Pippen. What is the source of MJ fan hostility toward Pippen? Why is it endemic to MJ fans? Even in other sports you don't see this. For instance, Joe Montana fans aren't obsessing with diminishing Rice or vice versa, Jimmie Johnson fans don't call Chad Knaus overrated, Gretzky fans don't attack Messier, and on and on.

Because we still have people "praising" Pippen by saying this...



P.S. how many playoff games did Jordan win without Pippen? Well, when he actually made the playoffs since he usually struggled to even make them without Pippen...

So, of course, fans are going to come in and add some context these types of blanket statements.

[Roundball_Rock]

That is because people say Pippen never won a ring without Jordan (although he came within minutes of doing so in 2000 and won 19 playoff games without MJ). Of course Pip fans are then going to point out that Jordan never won without Pippen. Besides, what you said doesn't fully explain it. In NASCAR many people say Chad Knaus (JJ's crew chief) is the real reason Jimmie Johnson has dominated NASCAR lately. This seems to happen whenever a driver dominates NASCAR: detractors of the driver say it is all car and that without the crew chief the driver would be average. Yet you don't see JJ fans diminishing Knaus all the time or Jeff Gordon fans doing that to Ray Evernham for their mid-to-late 90's dominance. How about another sport? Jerry Rice's detractors say he looked great because he had great QB's Joe Montana and Steve Young throwing to him. Of course, Rice fans say one reason they looked as good as they did is because they had Rice. Do you see these fans at each other's throats? Returning closer to home, just yesterday we had KAJ=GOAT say Magic never won anything without Kareem. Did you see any Magic fans rush to diminish Kareem after he made that statement two or three times? Something is rotten in Jordan Nation.

[L.A. Jazz]

in the 90s: MJ and Pipp. (Jordan is GOAT, but i like Pipp more)
next year: DWade and L-Train. (just thinking about it)
both highly illegal. simply unstoppable.

[Disaprine]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=N9vFHYVXtRk&feature=sub

Been looking for a video like this for so long. The greatest perimeter defender ever :bowdown:
great vid, top 5 defender of all time :cheers:

[Bigsmoke]

yea Pippen is the greatest defender ever.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0ySvyx2cMPY

[triangleoffense]

Being 6'8 or 6'10 and leading the league in steals for 5+ seasons is god damn impressive. The fact that the video doesn't do his defensive greatness justice speaks for itself.

[Roundball_Rock]

yea Pippen is the greatest defender ever.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0ySvyx2cMPY

Yeah, as if Duncan has never been dunked on or Jordan never crossed over. :rolleyes:

Edit: :oldlol: I just looked at the "related videos" tab and there is a Grant Hill crossover over MJ, the second or third best perimeter defender ever, on it. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kg5Wr7kgrwM&feature=related

Here are some dunks on Tim Duncan:

Lebron http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=r0GiPPR_pG8
Kobe http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cCzsd0PgViI
NBA legend Jordan Farmar http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5oW3spPmRKs
Wade http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jcm4Bb6kwig
Kobe again http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Blql71YbH60
Top 10 dunks on Tim Duncan http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Cb_gnvjkEg0

[Bigsmoke]

Yeah, as if Duncan has never been dunked on or Jordan never crossed over. :rolleyes:

and Antawn Jamison has never gotten a block or j.j. ridick never accomplished a steal before :confusedshrug: