David Robinson was better than Hakeem Olajuwon

[iamgine]

Met head to head 42 times, Robinson held Olajuwon to a measly 44 FG% and won 30 games while being better or comparable at every other stats. Plus, he's a much better Christian.

http://i37.tinypic.com/ape93t.jpg

http://i.cdn.turner.com/sivault/multimedia/photo_gallery/0902/this.day.sports.history.feb17/images/david-robinson.jpg

:cheers: :cheers: :cheers:

[White Chocolate]

The only thing you could argue was that Admiral was better during the regular season, and even that is debatable. Once the playoffs arrived, Hakeem stepped up while Admiral took a step backwards.

[Bigsmoke]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hW4uXlRGAF0

[G.O.A.T]

I wouldn't say Robinson stepped back, more like Ewing where he just didn't have that ability to take it to another level in the clutch.

[Aussie Outcast]

David Robinson was better than Hakeem Olajuwon

No he wasn't.

[ShaqAttack3234]

:roll: Olajuwon was the better low post scorer, shot blocker, defender, rebounder and clutch player. Olajuwon was defintley the better player. Robinson wasn't even better than Tim Duncan, much less Olajuwon.

[White Chocolate]

No he wasn't.


Nice way to quote me and change my post, when I know for a fact Admiral was not better.

[Rekindled]

i think the op is 7 year old and never watched either play

[L.Kizzle]

Met head to head 42 times, Robinson held Olajuwon to a measly 44 FG% and won 30 games while being better or comparable at every other stats. Plus, he's a much better Christian.

http://i37.tinypic.com/ape93t.jpg

http://i.cdn.turner.com/sivault/multimedia/photo_gallery/0902/this.day.sports.history.feb17/images/david-robinson.jpg

:cheers: :cheers: :cheers:
FAIL.
Olajuwon isn't even a Christian.

[Bigsmoke]

this thread is stupid

David had Tim Duncan in his last 5 years in the league when Hakeem was declining so Robinson winning more is a bit pointless.

[Showtime]

FAIL.
Olajuwon isn't even a Christian.
What do you expect from a poster who doesn't know anything about Dream?

[noob cake]

Hakeem took 240 more shots in 42 games; that can easily discredit your FG argument.

You can't use team record to prove that Robinson > Hakeem when Hakeem has clearly established his dominance in the playoffs.

[Lebron23]

Hakeem Olajuwon > Tim Duncan >>>>>>> David Robinson.

[ashar008]

The OP is right, David Robinson always shows up in the playoffs. Remember how he owned Hakeem that one time they played in the playoffs. You know the year Robinson won MVP? Come on guys don't you remember that year?

[JayGuevara]

FAIL.
Olajuwon isn't even a Christian.

Well then obviously the Admiral is much better at kickin it with Jesus than Hakeem.

That part should have obviously been taken as a joke. Unless I'm the dumb one here and everyone else is correct. :confusedshrug:

[CB4GOATPF]

:roll:

Thou shall be stuping to even say such thing :rolleyes:

comparing a Healthy Hakeem to a Healthy Robinson...:hammerhead: :banghead:

Hakeem was 3 Years Older and injury prone after the 96-97 season.

Check Hakeem ages 22-33 and compare their matchups from 89-96 and see for yourself who was better when both where healthy

Robinson was only a Bettr Interior Shot Blocking Presence under the Rim (Away from the Rim Not Even Close)

While Hakeem Was Better than Robinson in All The Other Aspects of The Game..

[iamgine]

this thread is stupid

David had Tim Duncan in his last 5 years in the league when Hakeem was declining so Robinson winning more is a bit pointless.
Before TD came, Drob won 20 - 12 with Olajuwon shooting 44%. After TD came, he won 10 more straight.


Hakeem took 240 more shots in 42 games; that can easily discredit your FG argument.


Their PPG differ only by 3 points, while Robinson's FG% was 48% and had a ton more free throws. His TS% is a lot higher.

[Big#50]

Hakeem Olajuwon > Tim Duncan >>>>>>> David Robinson.
Duncan>Hakeem>DROB

[ShaqAttack3234]

Duncan>Hakeem>DROB

No amount of titles will make Duncan better than Olajuwon. Olajuwon was just better, he's as good or better at every aspect of the game except passing and he became above average in that area as he got older.

[momo]

http://i181.photobucket.com/albums/x127/fiascofreak/gtfo-take-fail.jpg

[JohnnySic]

This thread aught to be an automatic ban. I cant think of one thing that Robinson definatively did better than Olajuwon, especially on offense where Hakeem anihilates him.

[Toizumi]

Funny how the OP's only argument is based on head-to-head matchups only :oldlol:

Both are all time greats :bowdown: .. But Olajuwon was the better player, eventhough Robinson seems to have gotten the better of him in their head-2-head matchups (winning counts).

[NotYetGreat]

I would say no. Here's one reason why. (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jc02Z4-0wDM)

[iamgine]

This thread aught to be an automatic ban. I cant think of one thing that Robinson definatively did better than Olajuwon, especially on offense where Hakeem anihilates him.
Hakeem shot 44FG% while Robinson shot 48FG% while getting significantly more free throws and wins. If anything Robinson annihilate Hakeem throughout their career. Anyone can have one or two good games.

[Rocker09]

Hakeem definitely had the better offensive skillset.....He's also one of the best defensive players of all time.....

This is easy
Hakeem > Robinson...

[Big#50]

No amount of titles will make Duncan better than Olajuwon. Olajuwon was just better, he's as good or better at every aspect of the game except passing and he became above average in that area as he got older.
Shut up. Put a young Timmy in 80's basketball and he'd get 30/15/4 like it ain't ****. Hakeem was good but not that good. 4 titles>2 titles and it does matter. Hakeem outplays DROB in 3 games and all of a sudden he is the GOAT. GTFO with that silly **** you nostalgic fool.

[EricForman]

although i think hakeem is better, i too think this whole "hakeem owned drob" has become exaggerated over the years and has become an NBA myth.

you know, kinda like the myth that kobe was almost equally responsible for the first three rings as shaq. i mean during the first title, kobe wasnt even the second or third best player on the floor for most of the games.

[robertshaw_1]

David Robinson was better than Hakeem Olajuwon
:oldlol: :oldlol: :oldlol: :oldlol: :oldlol: :oldlol: :oldlol: :oldlol: :oldlol: :oldlol:

[HylianNightmare]

http://i304.photobucket.com/albums/nn200/nbacardDOTnet/zz%20NBA%20Photo%20Gallery/Hakeem%20Olajuwon/VS/David%20Robinson/th_EBA19CEBB988EC8AA8EB8C80_ED9598E-3.jpg (http://media.photobucket.com/image/hakeem olajuwon david robinson/nbacardDOTnet/zz NBA Photo Gallery/Hakeem Olajuwon/VS/David Robinson/EBA19CEBB988EC8AA8EB8C80_ED9598E-3.jpg?o=1)

http://i304.photobucket.com/albums/nn200/nbacardDOTnet/zz%20NBA%20Photo%20Gallery/Hakeem%20Olajuwon/VS/David%20Robinson/th_EBA19CEBB988EC8AA8EB8C80_ED9598E-2.jpg (http://media.photobucket.com/image/hakeem olajuwon david robinson/nbacardDOTnet/zz NBA Photo Gallery/Hakeem Olajuwon/VS/David Robinson/EBA19CEBB988EC8AA8EB8C80_ED9598E-2.jpg?o=1)

the dream

[HaNdLe ThE RoCk]

I would say no. Here's one reason why. (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jc02Z4-0wDM)

shook him out his draws

[Bush4Ever]

The players in the 99th percentile are usually separated by their playoff performances, not their regular seasons ones.

Hakeem won 2 rings with arguably as little help as any player since Rick Barry, while Robinson's FG and FT percentages dropped by 4 and 3 percentage points respectively (from the regular season).

Hakeem in an absolute walk.

[icemanfan]

this thread is stupid

David had Tim Duncan in his last 5 years in the league when Hakeem was declining so Robinson winning more is a bit pointless.
First let me say both are all time greats. As a Spurs fan I got to see these two play often. Hakeem, Tim Duncan , Jordan all have something that David did not. Its not something that can be found on a stat sheet or a piece of paper. They belong to that super rare top tier group of superstars who can force their will on a game when its really needed. The last year the Rockets won the NBA championship Hakeem did this pretty much the entire playoffs. No way they should have slipped past the Spurs. No way they should have taken the Knicks but they did because Hakeem changed the game by sheer force of will. David could never do this. For that he was called a choaker but that is not at all accurate. He was and is a great player, a HOF player but NOT on that very top tier like Hakeem, Tim Duncan, Jordan, Magic , Kareem, Larry Bird and the others who could change the outcome of a major game by taking the game over. So as one of the biggest David Robinson fans ever I must say no, he was not better than Hakeem at basketball. That is ok because damn few were.

Ice

[Big#50]

First let me say both are all time greats. As a Spurs fan I got to see these two play often. Hakeem, Tim Duncan , Jordan all have something that David did not. Its not something that can be found on a stat sheet or a piece of paper. They belong to that super rare top tier group of superstars who can force their will on a game when its really needed. The last year the Rockets won the NBA championship Hakeem did this pretty much the entire playoffs. No way they should have slipped past the Spurs. No way they should have taken the Knicks but they did because Hakeem changed the game by sheer force of will. David could never do this. For that he was called a choaker but that is not at all accurate. He was and is a great player, a HOF player but NOT on that very top tier like Hakeem, Tim Duncan, Jordan, Magic , Kareem, Larry Bird and the others who could change the outcome of a major game by taking the game over. So as one of the biggest David Robinson fans ever I must say no, he was not better than Hakeem at basketball. That is ok because damn few were.

Ice
Said the same thing many times. Robinson couldn't handle pressure like those you named. He stepped up a lot of times but vanished much more times.

[beasly15]

even david robinson would be like WTF at this...

[Da_Realist]

First let me say both are all time greats. As a Spurs fan I got to see these two play often. Hakeem, Tim Duncan , Jordan all have something that David did not. Its not something that can be found on a stat sheet or a piece of paper. They belong to that super rare top tier group of superstars who can force their will on a game when its really needed. The last year the Rockets won the NBA championship Hakeem did this pretty much the entire playoffs. No way they should have slipped past the Spurs. No way they should have taken the Knicks but they did because Hakeem changed the game by sheer force of will. David could never do this. For that he was called a choaker but that is not at all accurate. He was and is a great player, a HOF player but NOT on that very top tier like Hakeem, Tim Duncan, Jordan, Magic , Kareem, Larry Bird and the others who could change the outcome of a major game by taking the game over. So as one of the biggest David Robinson fans ever I must say no, he was not better than Hakeem at basketball. That is ok because damn few were.

Ice

Very good post :applause:

[guy]

I think Hakeem is better, but I don't think saying Robinson was better then Hakeem is as ridiculous a thing to say as people are making it out to be. For much of their careers, Robinson was considered the greater player. From 1990-1999, Robinson actually beats him in MVP voting 7 out of those 10 seasons, and one of the seasons he didn't beat him he was out of the entire year. Now, Hakeem obviously sets himself apart with his playoff performances, and cause of that plus the fact that he's better at most aspects of the game I say Hakeem is clearly greater, but I wouldn't say he is THAT much greater.

And as far as Duncan vs. Robinson goes, I would say Duncan holds the edge here, however, thats not as clear as people imply either. Robinson is arguably just as great of a scorer, rebounder, and defender then Duncan ever was. In fact, the main reason IMO that Duncan is clearly ahead is cause of his titles, which is the result of better teams. Duncan isn't winning titles in the 90s with any of the teams Robinson had, and I doubt that Robinson couldn't have won 3-4 titles in the 00s with the teams Duncan has had. But as unfair as it sounds, I'll give the edge to the guy who is more proven, even if he had a much better situation, cause I can't just give credit to someone who I THINK would've done the same thing and the only reason he didn't was cause he was in a worse situation. Anyway, Duncan also stepped up in the playoffs alot more, which I think does not have much to do with the teammates around him.

[bdreason]

No, he wasn't.

[Da_Realist]

I think Hakeem is better, but I don't think saying Robinson was better then Hakeem is as ridiculous a thing to say as people are making it out to be. For much of their careers, Robinson was considered the greater player. From 1990-1999, Robinson actually beats him in MVP voting 7 out of those 10 seasons, and one of the seasons he didn't beat him he was out of the entire year. Now, Hakeem obviously sets himself apart with his playoff performances, and cause of that plus the fact that he's better at most aspects of the game I say Hakeem is clearly greater, but I wouldn't say he is THAT much greater.

And as far as Duncan vs. Robinson goes, I would say Duncan holds the edge here, however, thats not as clear as people imply either. Robinson is arguably just as great of a scorer, rebounder, and defender then Duncan ever was. In fact, the main reason IMO that Duncan is clearly ahead is cause of his titles, which is the result of better teams. Duncan isn't winning titles in the 90s with any of the teams Robinson had, and I doubt that Robinson couldn't have won 3-4 titles in the 00s with the teams Duncan has had. But as unfair as it sounds, I'll give the edge to the guy who is more proven, even if he had a much better situation, cause I can't just give credit to someone who I THINK would've done the same thing and the only reason he didn't was cause he was in a worse situation. Anyway, Duncan also stepped up in the playoffs alot more, which I think does not have much to do with the teammates around him.

I think Ice Man said it best. In terms of skills, athletic ability and all the quantitative things you can measure, David Robinson can be placed near the top of any list. But Hakeem was able to use his abilities to control the game beyond what stats can measure. Lately I've been watching Hakeem play in the 94 Finals. He had Ewing so confused with his defensive play. Ewing actually averaged more blocks and rebounds (I think) but when you watch, there is no doubt the imprint Hakeem left on the floor defensively outshined what Ewing did. His timing and anticipation put himself in a position on the floor that bothered Ewing at all times -- even if he didn't get a block, steal or rebound. His presence pushed Ewing further and further away from the basket and forced the Knicks to play outside-in instead of inside-out. That cost the Knicks the series. Hakeem was the reason for this.

To make another comparison...Duncan has the same ability. I remember as a college student watching Duncan play in his first playoffs (97 or 98) and was amazed at how he was putting in work. It was very obvious that he was the best player on the floor, even in his rookie (or 2nd) year. David could do all things well, but he never controlled the game like that.

You have to look beyond head-to-head matchups because in my opinion David had better teams until maybe 1993 or so. The 95 series between the Spurs and Rockets is and should be the main reason people view Hakeem > Robinson. I know that it is only one series but Hakeem showed in these 6 games why he was a better player. When they had similarly talented teams facing each other for all the marbles, Hakeem embarrassed Robinson. That was an a$$ kicking that nullified all the other regular season games.

To use a tennis example... I'm a big Sampras fan, but Andy Roddick had his number for a number of years playing in minor tournaments on the tour. But when they faced off under the lights at the US Open (2001, I think) Sampras wiped the floor with him so bad that it left little doubt who was the smarter and better player. Roddick's game just didn't match up well to Sampras' when he was motivated. I feel the same way with Robinson in respect to Hakeem.

[ShaqAttack3234]

Shut up. Put a young Timmy in 80's basketball and he'd get 30/15/4 like it ain't ****. Hakeem was good but not that good. 4 titles>2 titles and it does matter. Hakeem outplays DROB in 3 games and all of a sudden he is the GOAT. GTFO with that silly **** you nostalgic fool.

Hakeem fominated the toughest era of big men. GTFO with this weak era BS. Hakeem won 2 titles and he had to outplay Ewing, Robinson and Shaq to do that. He averaged 33/10/4.5/3 in the entire 1995 playoffs! You're opinion doesn't count because you're a delusional Duncan fanboy. The only era Duncan could average 30/15/4 in would be the late 60's, maybe early 70's.



And as far as Duncan vs. Robinson goes, I would say Duncan holds the edge here, however, thats not as clear as people imply either. Robinson is arguably just as great of a scorer, rebounder, and defender then Duncan ever was. In fact, the main reason IMO that Duncan is clearly ahead is cause of his titles, which is the result of better teams. Duncan isn't winning titles in the 90s with any of the teams Robinson had, and I doubt that Robinson couldn't have won 3-4 titles in the 00s with the teams Duncan has had. But as unfair as it sounds, I'll give the edge to the guy who is more proven, even if he had a much better situation, cause I can't just give credit to someone who I THINK would've done the same thing and the only reason he didn't was cause he was in a worse situation. Anyway, Duncan also stepped up in the playoffs alot more, which I think does not have much to do with the teammates around him.

I defintley think Duncan could win a title with Sean Elliott, Avery Johnson, Vinny Del Negro and Dennis Rodman all in their primes. It wasn't like Robinson played with scrubs for all of his prime. Duncan's 2003 team had one of the weaker supporting casts of any title team as well. Of course teams were better in 1995 than 2003 so that has to be a factor as well.

[Big#50]

Hakeem fominated the toughest era of big men. GTFO with this weak era BS. Hakeem won 2 titles and he had to outplay Ewing, Robinson and Shaq to do that. He averaged 33/10/4.5/3 in the entire 1995 playoffs! You're opinion doesn't count because you're a delusional Duncan fanboy. The only era Duncan could average 30/15/4 in would be the late 60's, maybe early 70's.



I defintley think Duncan could win a title with Sean Elliott, Avery Johnson, Vinny Del Negro and Dennis Rodman all in their primes. It wasn't like Robinson played with scrubs for all of his prime. Duncan's 2003 team had one of the weaker supporting casts of any title team as well. Of course teams were better in 1995 than 2003 so that has to be a factor as well.
Duncan averaged 25 and 12 in a slow tempo team. He can get 30 and 15 in a different system. I wasn't calling the Hakeem era weak. Just saying Tim would get better numbers.

[ShaqAttack3234]

Duncan averaged 25 and 12 in a slow tempo team. He can get 30 and 15 in a different system. I wasn't calling the Hakeem era weak. Just saying Tim would get better numbers.

Even if you adjust for pace, Duncan's 2002 and 2003 seasons placed on Hakeem's 1993-1995 Rockets don't match Hakeem's numbers.

[Big#50]

Even if you adjust for pace, Duncan's 2002 and 2003 seasons placed on Hakeem's 1993-1995 Rockets don't match Hakeem's numbers.
1994-95
Rockets scored 106 allowed 101
Hakeem 27.8 on 21 shots. 10.8 rebounds and 3.4 blocks.
2002 spurs scored 96 allowed 90.
Duncan 25.5 on 18 shots. 12.7 and 2.5.
Adjust.

[Bigsmoke]

1994-95
Rockets scored 106 allowed 101
Hakeem 27.8 on 21 shots. 10.8 rebounds and 3.4 blocks.
2002 spurs scored 96 allowed 90.
Duncan 25.5 on 18 shots. 12.7 and 2.5.
Adjust.

Hakeem was hurt for 10 games and they traded their 2nd best defender Otis Thorpe for Drexler. Hakeem never had Bruce Bowen.

[Big#50]

Hakeem was hurt for 10 games and they traded their 2nd best defender Otis Thorpe for Drexler. Hakeem never had Bruce Bowen.
I used those numbers to show how slow a tempo Tim played in. Thanks for your input though.

[Bigsmoke]

I used those numbers to show how slow a tempo Tim played in. Thanks for your input though.

ok..

but anyway

Hakeem > Duncan

[G.O.A.T]

The Title of this Thread Should have been:

David Robinson Should have been better than Hakeem Olajuwon

He had more natural skill, was taller, had a better body for the game, more speed any more natural quickness (Hakeem more basketball quickness). Huge advantage in not having to adjust to a new culture as well as the best competition in the world like Hakeem had to do. Robinson had two extra years to prepare himself, learn the offense, work with the team etc etc etc. while fulfilling his Naval commitment.

Olajuwon had Sampson, but after he deteriorated never had much around him except role players until Drexler honestly. Robinson had little more but assuming he still gets hurt when he does and SA gets the #1 pick, He as he should have been and Duncan should have won 5 of 7 titles from '98-'04.

[Big#50]

ok..

but anyway

Hakeem > Duncan
4 rings>2 rings

[plowking]

Duncan is better than both.

[juju151111]

Duncan is better than both.
:lol :lol How could a fellow dwade fan be this crazy??? The dream>Duncan.

[CB4GOATPF]

If you wan`t to compare head to head matchups do it for both their primes

Till the 1995-96 season. After that Hakeem slowens down past age 33 (he was already 3 years older than D-Rob) and Robinson gets injured...never playing the same...after that 1995-96 season

1989-1996...would be the Real Comparisson.

[ShaqAttack3234]

1994-95
Rockets scored 106 allowed 101
Hakeem 27.8 on 21 shots. 10.8 rebounds and 3.4 blocks.
2002 spurs scored 96 allowed 90.
Duncan 25.5 on 18 shots. 12.7 and 2.5.
Adjust.

Ok I'll use the pace as a reference an use Hakeem's mid 90's peak and Duncan's 3 year peak(2002-2004)

Hakeem's numbers

1992-1993 26.1 ppg, 13 rpg, 3.5 apg, 4.2 bpg, 1.8 spg, 52.9 FG%, 77.9 FT%, 3.2 TO
1993-1994 27.3 ppg, 11.9 rpg, 3.6 apg, 3.7 bpg, 1.6 spg, 52.8 FG%, 71.6 FT%, 3.4 TO
1994-1995 27.8 ppg, 10.8 rpg, 3.5 apg, 3.4 bpg, 1.8 spg, 51.7 FG%, 75.6 FT%, 3.3 TO

1.049

Duncan's 2002 season adjusted to the 1993 Rockets pace- 26.7 ppg, 13.3 rpg, 3.9 apg, 2.6 bpg, 0.7 spg, 50.8 FG%, 79.9 FT%, 3.4 TO
Duncan's 2003 season adjusted to 1994 Rockets pace24.6 ppg, 13.6 rpg, 4.1 apg, 3.1 bpg, 0.7 spg, 51.3 FG%, 71 FT%, 3.3 TO
Duncan's 2004 season adjusted to 1995 Rockets pace 23.5 ppg, 13.1 rpg, 3.3 apg, 2.9 bpg, 1 spg, 50.1 FG%, 59.9 FT%, 2.9 TO

Duncan's 2002 season adjusted to 1993 narrowly edges out Dream in points and rebounds and assists, but that's evened out by the fact that Duncan was less efficient(without even adjusting his FG% which in all probability would go down given more shots) and Duncan's higher turnover average. So we can say that outside of blocks and steals, Tim and Hakeem are virtually even when comparing those seasons. However Dream slaughters Duncan in the blocks and stealsdepartment.

Plus it's not really fair to assume a player will score more at a slightly faster pace, particularly a low post player. Superstars scoring generally doesn't see that much of an increase in scoring at a faster pace because their system is already designed to have the ball go through them as much as possible. I don't have a problem with Duncan's rebounding being slightly higher at the faster pace, but really, how much of a difference does 0.6 extra rebounds make when comparing the seasons? It's safe to say that both are virtually even as rebounders anyway.

When comparing Duncan's 2003 to Hakeem's 1994, Duncan still falls short by almost 3 ppg(even though I explained the flaws when adjusting scoring to pace), he edges him by 0.5 apg and almost 2 rpg, still falls well short in blocks and steals, 0.1 less turnover and less efficient as far a FG% and FT%.

More of the same when comparing Hakeem's 1995 to Duncan's 2004. Hakeem slaughters him in scoring and steals while he was quite a bit more efficient due to his higher FG% and Duncan's sub 60% foul shooting, Duncan easily wins in rebounding, but loses in assists(although he also had fewer turnovers so that evens out) and Hakeem still blocked 0.5 more shots.

So I think we can agree that Hakeem was defintley the better scorer, Duncan was the better passer(something I said even before adjusting the numbers, Hakeem was the better shot blocker and better at getting steals while Duncan in his overall prime as a player was a better rebounder than Hakeem was in his overall prime as a player. But in Hakeem's rebounding prime('89-'91) he averaged 13.5, 14 and 13.8 rebounds respectively leading the league 2 times and Duncan's rebounding numbers adjusted for pace likely wouldn't be higher than that. So in their rebounding primes, Olajuwon was atleast as good of a rebounder as Duncan.

And as far as scoring even Duncan's adjusted 26.7 scoring average would fall short of 3 of Olajuwon's seasons including his '96 season when he played at a slower pace than any of the previous seasons(which also backs up my point about pace having very little to do with individual scoring).

[guy]

I defintley think Duncan could win a title with Sean Elliott, Avery Johnson, Vinny Del Negro and Dennis Rodman all in their primes. It wasn't like Robinson played with scrubs for all of his prime. Duncan's 2003 team had one of the weaker supporting casts of any title team as well. Of course teams were better in 1995 than 2003 so that has to be a factor as well.

No he couldn't. Not going up against teams like the 95 Rockets.

[iamgine]

If you wan`t to compare head to head matchups do it for both their primes

Till the 1995-96 season. After that Hakeem slowens down past age 33 (he was already 3 years older than D-Rob) and Robinson gets injured...never playing the same...after that 1995-96 season

1989-1996...would be the Real Comparisson.

1989 Drob was an NBA Rookie while Hakeem was at his prime.

Even then, head to head from 1989-1996, Drob won 20 games shooting 48% while Hakeem only won 12 games while shooting only 44%.

Robinson > Olajuwon.

[ShaqAttack3234]

No he couldn't. Not going up against teams like the 95 Rockets.

2003 Duncan might be able to with homecourt advantage. He was a monster that year, he averaged 25, 15, 5 and 3 in the playoffs on 53% shooting while knocking out the Shaq/Kobe Lakers. That'd be a great series IMO.

[juju151111]

Ok I'll use the pace as a reference an use Hakeem's mid 90's peak and Duncan's 3 year peak(2002-2004)

Hakeem's numbers

1992-1993 26.1 ppg, 13 rpg, 3.5 apg, 4.2 bpg, 1.8 spg, 52.9 FG%, 77.9 FT%, 3.2 TO
1993-1994 27.3 ppg, 11.9 rpg, 3.6 apg, 3.7 bpg, 1.6 spg, 52.8 FG%, 71.6 FT%, 3.4 TO
1994-1995 27.8 ppg, 10.8 rpg, 3.5 apg, 3.4 bpg, 1.8 spg, 51.7 FG%, 75.6 FT%, 3.3 TO

1.049

Duncan's 2002 season adjusted to the 1993 Rockets pace- 26.7 ppg, 13.3 rpg, 3.9 apg, 2.6 bpg, 0.7 spg, 50.8 FG%, 79.9 FT%, 3.4 TO
Duncan's 2003 season adjusted to 1994 Rockets pace24.6 ppg, 13.6 rpg, 4.1 apg, 3.1 bpg, 0.7 spg, 51.3 FG%, 71 FT%, 3.3 TO
Duncan's 2004 season adjusted to 1995 Rockets pace 23.5 ppg, 13.1 rpg, 3.3 apg, 2.9 bpg, 1 spg, 50.1 FG%, 59.9 FT%, 2.9 TO

Duncan's 2002 season adjusted to 1993 narrowly edges out Dream in points and rebounds and assists, but that's evened out by the fact that Duncan was less efficient(without even adjusting his FG% which in all probability would go down given more shots) and Duncan's higher turnover average. So we can say that outside of blocks and steals, Tim and Hakeem are virtually even when comparing those seasons. However Dream slaughters Duncan in the blocks and stealsdepartment.

Plus it's not really fair to assume a player will score more at a slightly faster pace, particularly a low post player. Superstars scoring generally doesn't see that much of an increase in scoring at a faster pace because their system is already designed to have the ball go through them as much as possible. I don't have a problem with Duncan's rebounding being slightly higher at the faster pace, but really, how much of a difference does 0.6 extra rebounds make when comparing the seasons? It's safe to say that both are virtually even as rebounders anyway.

When comparing Duncan's 2003 to Hakeem's 1994, Duncan still falls short by almost 3 ppg(even though I explained the flaws when adjusting scoring to pace), he edges him by 0.5 apg and almost 2 rpg, still falls well short in blocks and steals, 0.1 less turnover and less efficient as far a FG% and FT%.

More of the same when comparing Hakeem's 1995 to Duncan's 2004. Hakeem slaughters him in scoring and steals while he was quite a bit more efficient due to his higher FG% and Duncan's sub 60% foul shooting, Duncan easily wins in rebounding, but loses in assists(although he also had fewer turnovers so that evens out) and Hakeem still blocked 0.5 more shots.

So I think we can agree that Hakeem was defintley the better scorer, Duncan was the better passer(something I said even before adjusting the numbers, Hakeem was the better shot blocker and better at getting steals while Duncan in his overall prime as a player was a better rebounder than Hakeem was in his overall prime as a player. But in Hakeem's rebounding prime('89-'91) he averaged 13.5, 14 and 13.8 rebounds respectively leading the league 2 times and Duncan's rebounding numbers adjusted for pace likely wouldn't be higher than that. So in their rebounding primes, Olajuwon was atleast as good of a rebounder as Duncan.

And as far as scoring even Duncan's adjusted 26.7 scoring average would fall short of 3 of Olajuwon's seasons including his '96 season when he played at a slower pace than any of the previous seasons(which also backs up my point about pace having very little to do with individual scoring).
:applause:

[guy]

2003 Duncan might be able to with homecourt advantage. He was a monster that year, he averaged 25, 15, 5 and 3 in the playoffs on 53% shooting while knocking out the Shaq/Kobe Lakers. That'd be a great series IMO.

It might be a great series, but no he wouldn't. Hakeem was an absolute monster in those playoffs, and Duncan has never really approached the dominance Hakeem had in that run.

[magnax1]

In his prime, Robinson was better than Hakeem, but Hakeem had more longevity, and was more clutch, so career wise hes better. Though I can completely understand why you'd chose David.

[White Chocolate]

In his prime, Robinson was better than Hakeem, but Hakeem had more longevity, and was more clutch, so career wise hes better. Though I can completely understand why you'd chose David.


Robinson was the better scorer and shooter. Hakeem was far superior on D, was more clutch, and had more moves in the post.

[Shep]

what else is new? :confusedshrug:

[magnax1]

Robinson was the better scorer and shooter. Hakeem was far superior on D, was more clutch, and had more moves in the post.
He had more moves in the post, but it doesn't really matter how you score, if you score more at similar efficiency. I said Hakeem was better, but hes not better by a large margin, and Robinson was better in his prime.

[iamgine]

Robinson was the better scorer and shooter. Hakeem was far superior on D, was more clutch, and had more moves in the post.
:no:

Throughout their career:

Shaq shot 54.4% against Hakeem. Ewing shot 45.6% against Hakeem.
Hakeem won 6 out of 20 meetings with Shaq and 13 out of 27 meetings with Ewing.

Shaq shot 53.6% against Robinson. Ewing shot 43.4% against Robinson.
Robinson won 12 out of 23 meetings with Shaq and 12 out of 19 meetings with Ewing.

Hakeem shot 44% against Robinson. Robinson shot 48% against Hakeem. Robinson won 30 out of 42 meetings with Hakeem.

Robinson > Hakeem

[magnax1]

:no:

Throughout their career:

Shaq shot 54.4% against Hakeem. Ewing shot 45.6% against Hakeem.
Hakeem won 6 out of 20 meetings with Shaq and 13 out of 27 meetings with Ewing.

Shaq shot 53.6% against Robinson. Ewing shot 43.4% against Robinson.
Robinson won 12 out of 23 meetings with Shaq and 12 out of 19 meetings with Ewing.

Hakeem shot 44% against Robinson. Robinson shot 48% against Hakeem. Robinson won 30 out of 42 meetings with Hakeem.

Robinson > Hakeem
Thats not really a fair comparison, cus Shaq rapped everyone, from mutumbo to Divac to Hakeem, they all got killed by Shaq. A comparison to a guy that someone actually had a chance of slowing down like Ewing would be more fair.

[Big#50]

Ok I'll use the pace as a reference an use Hakeem's mid 90's peak and Duncan's 3 year peak(2002-2004)

Hakeem's numbers

1992-1993 26.1 ppg, 13 rpg, 3.5 apg, 4.2 bpg, 1.8 spg, 52.9 FG%, 77.9 FT%, 3.2 TO
1993-1994 27.3 ppg, 11.9 rpg, 3.6 apg, 3.7 bpg, 1.6 spg, 52.8 FG%, 71.6 FT%, 3.4 TO
1994-1995 27.8 ppg, 10.8 rpg, 3.5 apg, 3.4 bpg, 1.8 spg, 51.7 FG%, 75.6 FT%, 3.3 TO

1.049

Duncan's 2002 season adjusted to the 1993 Rockets pace- 26.7 ppg, 13.3 rpg, 3.9 apg, 2.6 bpg, 0.7 spg, 50.8 FG%, 79.9 FT%, 3.4 TO
Duncan's 2003 season adjusted to 1994 Rockets pace24.6 ppg, 13.6 rpg, 4.1 apg, 3.1 bpg, 0.7 spg, 51.3 FG%, 71 FT%, 3.3 TO
Duncan's 2004 season adjusted to 1995 Rockets pace 23.5 ppg, 13.1 rpg, 3.3 apg, 2.9 bpg, 1 spg, 50.1 FG%, 59.9 FT%, 2.9 TO

Duncan's 2002 season adjusted to 1993 narrowly edges out Dream in points and rebounds and assists, but that's evened out by the fact that Duncan was less efficient(without even adjusting his FG% which in all probability would go down given more shots) and Duncan's higher turnover average. So we can say that outside of blocks and steals, Tim and Hakeem are virtually even when comparing those seasons. However Dream slaughters Duncan in the blocks and stealsdepartment.

Plus it's not really fair to assume a player will score more at a slightly faster pace, particularly a low post player. Superstars scoring generally doesn't see that much of an increase in scoring at a faster pace because their system is already designed to have the ball go through them as much as possible. I don't have a problem with Duncan's rebounding being slightly higher at the faster pace, but really, how much of a difference does 0.6 extra rebounds make when comparing the seasons? It's safe to say that both are virtually even as rebounders anyway.

When comparing Duncan's 2003 to Hakeem's 1994, Duncan still falls short by almost 3 ppg(even though I explained the flaws when adjusting scoring to pace), he edges him by 0.5 apg and almost 2 rpg, still falls well short in blocks and steals, 0.1 less turnover and less efficient as far a FG% and FT%.

More of the same when comparing Hakeem's 1995 to Duncan's 2004. Hakeem slaughters him in scoring and steals while he was quite a bit more efficient due to his higher FG% and Duncan's sub 60% foul shooting, Duncan easily wins in rebounding, but loses in assists(although he also had fewer turnovers so that evens out) and Hakeem still blocked 0.5 more shots.

So I think we can agree that Hakeem was defintley the better scorer, Duncan was the better passer(something I said even before adjusting the numbers, Hakeem was the better shot blocker and better at getting steals while Duncan in his overall prime as a player was a better rebounder than Hakeem was in his overall prime as a player. But in Hakeem's rebounding prime('89-'91) he averaged 13.5, 14 and 13.8 rebounds respectively leading the league 2 times and Duncan's rebounding numbers adjusted for pace likely wouldn't be higher than that. So in their rebounding primes, Olajuwon was atleast as good of a rebounder as Duncan.

And as far as scoring even Duncan's adjusted 26.7 scoring average would fall short of 3 of Olajuwon's seasons including his '96 season when he played at a slower pace than any of the previous seasons(which also backs up my point about pace having very little to do with individual scoring).
Just admit I was right.

[ShaqAttack3234]

Just admit I was right.

Why would I say that? You're wrong so I'd be wrong to say you're right.

And I can't stop laughing at the poster who said Robinson was better than Hakeem in his prime. 1993-1995 Hakeem played at a level easil higher than Robinson in his prime(which happened to be about the same time). But then again I think it's the same poster who said that John Stockton was better than Magic Johnson.

[Big#50]

Why would I say that? You're wrong so I'd be wrong to say you're right.

And I can't stop laughing at the poster who said Robinson was better than Hakeem in his prime. 1993-1995 Hakeem played at a level easil higher than Robinson in his prime(which happened to be about the same time). But then again I think it's the same poster who said that John Stockton was better than Magic Johnson.
Hakeem will always be better than DROB because of that 95 WCF. They were pretty even before that. Hakeem had already scored 40 on Robinson before that series so it wasn't a surprise to me that Hakeem did it. Robinson would still attack Hakeem and come through. He'd make his presence felt even if Hakeem had a better game. In the WCF Robinson just vanished. Hakeem out played him in 4 games of that series really bad. And all Robinson did was fumble balls and lose his knees under him all series long. That tells me it wasn't really Hakeem abusing him. The spotlight and pressure did him in. He just crumbled. In most of those plays that DROB turned the ball over Hakeem was nowhere near him.

[JustinJDW]

Duncan > Hakeem = Shaq > Robinson.

People underrate Hakeem when they say Shaq and Robinson were better than him, but they overrate him when people say he was better than Duncan, or that he is #5-7 on the All-Time List.

Their is a reason why he had to wait for Magic, Bird and Jordan to all leave the NBA before he could starting winning Championships.

[ShaqAttack3234]

Duncan > Hakeem = Shaq > Robinson.

People underrate Hakeem when they say Shaq and Robinson were better than him, but they overrate him when people say he was better than Duncan, or that he is #5-7 on the All-Time List.

Their is a reason why he had to wait for Magic, Bird and Jordan to all leave the NBA before he could starting winning Championships.

Oh god, now Duncan is better than Shaq? This really is a "what have you done for me lately" message board. Shaq was obviously better than Duncan. No doubt about it. Hakeem was also defintley better than Tim.

Duncan gets overrated by Spurs fans. It's ridiculous that some actually think he's better than Shaq? :wtf:. Individual stats easily go to Shaq, peak easily goes to Shaq, Team success is about even, longevity goes to Shaq so far and impact on the league goes to Shaq. So, how was Duncan better again? :rolleyes:

[Big#50]

Oh god, now Duncan is better than Shaq? This really is a "what have you done for me lately" message board. Shaq was obviously better than Duncan. No doubt about it. Hakeem was also defintley better than Tim.

Duncan gets overrated by Spurs fans. It's ridiculous that some actually think he's better than Shaq? :wtf:. Individual stats easily go to Shaq, peak easily goes to Shaq, Team success is about even, longevity goes to Shaq so far and impact on the league goes to Shaq. So, how was Duncan better again? :rolleyes:
Shaq played for the Lakers. Put Duncan on the Lakers from 98 to 04. Tell me he wouldn't be more known.
It's funny how Shaq has called it the Duncan/Shaq era. But a fanboy like yourself still says Shaq>Duncan.

[ShaqAttack3234]

Shaq played for the Lakers. Put Duncan on the Lakers from 98 to 04. Tell me he wouldn't be more known.
It's funny how Shaq has called it the Duncan/Shaq era. But a fanboy like yourself still says Shaq>Duncan.

Yes it is the Shaq/Duncan era because Shaq was much older when the era started. We saw his peak(2000 and 2001) which blew Duncan's peak away as well as some great elite years until 2005, but Shaq was 33 by that time and declining. So this era is equally Shaq and Duncan's as a result with Shaq owning the earlier part of the decade and Duncan dominating the later years. But if you factor in Shaq's accomplishments before Duncan came into the league then these 2 aren't even close.

We all know that Duncan has never been at 2000 or 2001 Shaq's level, but compare Shaq in his 13th season when he nearly won an MVP to Duncan this year in his 12th season last year, it's not even close. Shaq has a much better peak and as of now, Duncan isn't matching Shaq's longevity.

[JustinJDW]

Tim Duncan as of RIGHT NOW, is placed higher on the All-Time List, in my opinion of course. You disagree with this?

If somebody wins a 5th Ring, things will be different.

[CB4GOATPF]

1989 Drob was an NBA Rookie while Hakeem was at his prime.

Even then, head to head from 1989-1996, Drob won 20 games shooting 48% while Hakeem only won 12 games while shooting only 44%.

Robinson > Olajuwon.

:no:

He was a rookie but he had plenty of Olympic Experience against some Props (including getting owned by 8 month older NON INJURED SABONIS) and was

Already Age 24 as a Rookie in 1989

That`s pretty late for a late 80s and early 90 drated player

Then again Hakeem was 33 years old plus the 1995-96 ....that is Past Prime

So The Ideal Head to Head Matchups are The Following

Hakeem ages: 27-32/33 (1989-90 to 1994-95) or if you want just to give D-Rob some advantage do it even for Hakeem Past Prime age 33 (1 year past prime in 1995-96)

Robinson ages: 24-30 (19809-90 to 1995-96): till the 1995-96 seaon because in the 1996-97 season Robinson suffered a big injury and neveer played the same offensive game past that.

Evaluate the Head to Head Matchups From the 1989-90 to 1995-96 Season and then tell me Who Was The Better Player...

Next...

[All Net]

No Robinson was not better than Hakeem at all...easy to forget the asskicking Hakeem gave David in the playoffs when Robinson won MVP.

[Big#50]

The only big man I can say Duncan can't be ranked of is KAJ.
KAJ>Duncan>Shaq>Hakeem>DROB>Ewing>Wilt>the rest

[G.O.A.T]

The only big man I can say Duncan can't be ranked of is KAJ.
KAJ>Duncan>Shaq>Hakeem>DROB>Ewing>Wilt>the rest

Why Wilt so low?

[Big#50]

Why Wilt so low?
He played against High School Math Teachers.

[ShaqAttack3234]

:roll: Wilt is defintley a top 3 big man of all time. The top 3 big men IMO are Kareem(defintley number 1 IMO) and then Shaq and Wilt alternating between 2 and 3. How Duncan could be placed above Shaq is beyond me. Team success is about equal and Shaq's individual dominance is far beyond Duncan's so Shaq>Duncan.

[iamgine]

Evaluate the Head to Head Matchups From the 1989-90 to 1995-96 Season and then tell me Who Was The Better Player...


Robinson is.

Robinson won 20 - 12 while limiting Hakeem to 44% shooting from 1989-1996. After 1996, Robinson won 10 more straight while limiting Hakeem to 43% shooting.

[Duncan21formvp]

Met head to head 42 times, Robinson held Olajuwon to a measly 44 FG% and won 30 games while being better or comparable at every other stats. Plus, he's a much better Christian.

http://i37.tinypic.com/ape93t.jpg

http://i.cdn.turner.com/sivault/multimedia/photo_gallery/0902/this.day.sports.history.feb17/images/david-robinson.jpg

:cheers: :cheers: :cheers:

Put the crack pipe down.

Hakeem beat Robinson when Robinson had the #1 seed and the HCA.

[branslowski]

He played against High School Math Teachers.

:roll: :roll: :roll: :roll:

[Big#50]

:roll: :roll: :roll: :roll:
Fact.

[ShaqAttack3234]

Fact.

Yeah, because Nate Thurmond sure looked like a math teacher. :rolleyes:

[CB4GOATPF]

Robinson is.

Robinson won 20 - 12 while limiting Hakeem to 44% shooting from 1989-1996. After 1996, Robinson won 10 more straight while limiting Hakeem to 43% shooting.

Don`t Put Team Concept Crap of 20-12 Here :rolleyes: :banghead:

Put The Whole Stat Sheet For BOTH PLAYERS From 1989 to 1995 and if u want also 1995-96 even though Hakeem was past his prime age 33 but ill give it to u since it was D-Robs last Healthy Offensive Season

Include Play-Offs aswell

What about RPG?, BPG?, APG?, SPG?, TOVs PG?, PFs PG?

Forgot those too?

[iamgine]

Don`t Put Team Concept Crap of 20-12 Here :rolleyes: :banghead:

Put The Whole Stat Sheet For BOTH PLAYERS From 1989 to 1995 and if u want also 1995-96 even though Hakeem was past his prime age 33 but ill give it to u since it was D-Robs last Healthy Offensive Season

Include Play-Offs aswell

What about RPG?, BPG?, APG?, SPG?, TOVs PG?, PFs PG?

Forgot those too?
Fact doesn't change. 20 - 12, limit Hakeem to 44% shooting. Don't forget Hakeem lost another 10 straight times after 1996 shooting only 43%. And 1989 was Robinson's NBA rookie year while Hakeem was in his prime. Also, don't forget Hakeem had Drexler, Barkley, Pippen and still only won 12 out of 42 matches.

The stats you request is in the 1st page. Robinson > Olajuwon.

[CB4GOATPF]

Fact doesn't change. 20 - 12, limit Hakeem to 44% shooting. Don't forget Hakeem lost another 10 straight times after 1996 shooting only 43%. And 1989 was Robinson's NBA rookie year while Hakeem was in his prime. Also, don't forget Hakeem had Drexler, Barkley, Pippen and still only won 12 out of 42 matches.

The stats you request is in the 1st page. Robinson > Olajuwon.

20-12 is a Team Concept...don`t bring that up again....

Talk To Me Abou the Match Ups....:banghead: :rolleyes:

You Posted The Total Head to Head Matchups From 1989 till the Year 2001 :roll:

Rk

84

:no:

Post Me ONLY THE MATCHUPS FROM 1989 TO 1996 (i could even exclude 95-96 season cause 33 is past prime 1 year for most players)

When Both Where Prime

Rk

64

:pimp:


Robinson as 24 when he entered the NBA and played in 2 Olympics Experiences(destroyed by a Both Aquilles Tendon Free Injured Sabons - who was only 8 months older) had enough experiene to inmedietly cause havoc in the NBA his 1st season:

Hakeem came to the NBA at age 22 was raw from never playing Competitive Highschool Ball.

Robinson had to 2 Olympic Experienes prior to the NBA and was actally drafted in 1987 but refued so he could finish his Admiral Navy thing.

He had plenty of experiene nd game...

Now Do It....

Robinson 1989-1996: ages 24-30 (Health and Prime)
Hakeem 1989-1996: ages 27-33 (1 Year Past Prime)

Include the Play-Offs....When It Matters for Both and Both Where in their Primes Too

Do Those Stats When Both Where Prime and When Robinson Did Not Play With The 2nd Best FC of All Time Tim Duncan and Then Come Back and Talk To Me about Who Outplayed Who...

Don`t forget to Include

RPGs
BPG
APG
SPG
TOVs PG
PFs PG
FT%

:violin:

[iamgine]

Do Those Stats When Both Where Prime and When Robinson Did Not Play With The 2nd Best FC of All Time Tim Duncan and Then Come Back and Talk To Me about Who Outplayed Who...:violin:

[/B]
Their stats were pretty similar except Robinson shot 48% + getting lots more FT while winning 20 games while Hakeem shot 44% and only won 12 games despite having Drexler. Hakeem would lost 10 more straight after that despite having Barkley & Pippen vs a rookie Duncan + old ass Robinson.

Hakeem record vs Robinson = 12 - 30, shooting 44%.

Hakeem record vs rookie Duncan = 0 - 10, shooting 43%.

Robinson & Duncan each one > Hakeem.

[CB4GOATPF]

Their stats were pretty similar except Robinson shot 48% + getting lots more FT while winning 20 games while Hakeem shot 44% and only won 12 games despite having Drexler. Hakeem would lost 10 more straight after that despite having Barkley & Pippen vs a rookie Duncan + old ass Robinson.

Hakeem record vs Robinson = 12 - 30, shooting 44%.

Hakeem record vs rookie Duncan = 0 - 10, shooting 43%.

Robinson & Duncan each one > Hakeem.

Read My Post Again....

1-Stats for: 1989-90 to 1995-96 Head to Heads

2-Do Not Mention crippled Barkley, Pippen or that of old Drexler (beyond 95-96)

3-Neither Inlude Stats from Tim Duncan Era or the 1996-97 season when D-Rob was injured

(im even giving you the benefit for Hakeem age 33, past his prime in 1995-96)

4-Include Play-Off Stats when both where in their Primes

And Finally when u do so:

Include

RPG
BPG
APG
SPG
FT%

Next.

[Psileas]

The only big man I can say Duncan can't be ranked of is KAJ.
KAJ>Duncan>Shaq>Hakeem>DROB>Ewing>Wilt>the rest

:oldlol:
I also liked the comment about his "math teachers" opponents...like the guy who's listed at #1...

[iamgine]

Read My Post Again....

1-Stats for: 1989-90 to 1995-96 Head to Heads

2-Do Not Mention crippled Barkley, Pippen or that of old Drexler (beyond 95-96)

3-Neither Inlude Stats from Tim Duncan Era or the 1996-97 season when D-Rob was injured

(im even giving you the benefit for Hakeem age 33, past his prime in 1995-96)

4-Include Play-Off Stats when both where in their Primes

And Finally when u do so:

Include

RPG
BPG
APG
SPG
FT%

Next.
Go ahead and list them. They don't matter.

Fact remains Hakeem win a lot less against Robinson, as shown by the only 12 wins in 42 games shooting a measly 44% while having similar team. In fact, Hakeem had Drexler for some years before 1996.

[CB4GOATPF]

Go ahead and list them. They don't matter.

Fact remains Hakeem win a lot less against Robinson, as shown by the only 12 wins in 42 games shooting a measly 44% while having similar team. In fact, Hakeem had Drexler for some years before 1996.

Fact Shows that Hakeem outplayed Robinson When Both Where in Their Health and Game Primes 89-95/96 too before Timmy Duncan arrived to save Robinson`s ass in 97.

Fact Shows that in the Clutch in 1995 when it was time for Robinson to Step it Up Offensively after his ball hogging display of 71 points against the worst NBA Franchise of All Tme: Clippers "Come on Proof How Great Offensively You Are" (knowing Rodman would help him on the rebounding end, Hakeem did not have Otis anymore) HE FAILED.

Hakee could not be contained by Robinson, Doubled or Tripled and Totally Destroyed Duncan to settle it for once who was Better.

One of the Greatest Schoolings in the Clutch of All Time Head to Head by 2 Legends

I was the only at School that Predicted thi Would Happen. My MJ Ball Hoggin and Flashy Playground Wanabee Friends...Laughed At Me.

In My Mind i Just Kept Saying:

Fundamentals My Friend
Post Game My Friend
Multi Positional Offensive Skills My Friend
Hakeem Makes Others Better My Friend

1989-1994-95/95-96

ages 24-30
ages 27-33

:violin:

[Dizzle-2k7]

Duncan > All

:bowdown:

4 rings without playing next to a hall of famer in their prime *cough Shaq cough* , while playing Championship defense and offense *Shaq never played defense or finished games*

[iamgine]

Fact Shows that Hakeem outplayed Robinson When Both Where in Their Health and Game Primes 89-95/96 too before Timmy Duncan arrived to save Robinson`s ass in 97.

Fact Shows that in the Clutch in 1995 when it was time for Robinson to Step it Up Offensively after his ball hogging display of 71 points against the worst NBA Franchise of All Tme: Clippers "Come on Proof How Great Offensively You Are" (knowing Rodman would help him on the rebounding end, Hakeem did not have Otis anymore) HE FAILED.

Hakee could not be contained by Robinson, Doubled or Tripled and Totally Destroyed Duncan to settle it for once who was Better.

One of the Greatest Schoolings in the Clutch of All Time Head to Head by 2 Legends

I was the only at School that Predicted thi Would Happen. My MJ Ball Hoggin and Flashy Playground Wanabee Friends...Laughed At Me.

In My Mind i Just Kept Saying:

Fundamentals My Friend
Post Game My Friend
Multi Positional Offensive Skills My Friend
Hakeem Makes Others Better My Friend

1989-1994-95/95-96

ages 24-30
ages 27-33

:violin:
Clearly the record shows Robinson won 20 - 12 with similar team and without a star like Drexler. And when he finally has a rookie star in Duncan, he beat Hakeem 10 straight times. Robinson owned Hakeem to a measly 44% shooting before Duncan and 43% afterwards. Sure Hakeem had a good game once or twice.

Robinson > Olajuwon.

[Big#50]

Duncan should have been top 3 for MVP in 09. The Spurs won 54 games despite Manu missing about 38 games and Parker 12. Duncan's D is far, far, far, far, far, far, far, far superior to Shaq's. Duncan>Shaq anybody who doesn't think is a media blinded fool.

[Bigsmoke]

Duncan should have been top 3 for MVP in 09. The Spurs won 54 games despite Manu missing about 38 games and Parker 12. Duncan's D is far, far, far, far, far, far, far, far superior to Shaq's. Duncan>Shaq anybody who doesn't think is a media blinded fool.

Manu is overrated and The Spurs was lead by Tony Parker.

[Big#50]

Manu is overrated and The Spurs was lead by Tony Parker.
Duncan was averaging 22 and 11 before he was banged up because his frontline sucked.

[triangleoffense]

I honestly don't see what all these "compare 2 of the greatest players of all time and pick who's better" threads are trying to accomplish. Both were beast.. I am lucky to have watched NBA during the 90s

[Bigsmoke]

Duncan was averaging 22 and 11 before he was banged up because his frontline sucked.

u said top 3? dude Brandon Roy had a better year than Duncan last season.

[Big#50]

u said top 3? dude Brandon Roy had a better year than Duncan last season.
LOL GTFOH. ROY is not even in the radar.

[Bigsmoke]

LOL GTFOH. ROY is not even in the radar.

are u talking about overall or last year?

Brandon Roy won as many games asDuncan did with his first round draft pick center recovering from microfracture surgery. He shouldnt been mention in the MVP talks at all last year?

[Big#50]

are u talking about overall or last year?

Brandon Roy won as many games asDuncan did with his first round draft pick center recovering from microfracture surgery. He shouldnt been mention in the MVP talks at all last year?
No. He didn't carry the team.

[triangleoffense]

Brandon roy is doing just as much as pierce did. Not like Pierce got out of the second round without Allen or KG. Anyone who doesn't see the possible comparison seriously needs to get out of beantown

[Bigsmoke]

No. He didn't carry the team.

ok... i think Roy was a bigger impact on his Portland Trailblazers on last year than Duncan was on his Spurs squad... LAST SEASON... i'm not talking about career wise.... just the 08-09 season where Duncan was struggle with injuries

[CB4GOATPF]

Clearly the record shows Robinson won 20 - 12 with similar team and without a star like Drexler. And when he finally has a rookie star in Duncan, he beat Hakeem 10 straight times. Robinson owned Hakeem to a measly 44% shooting before Duncan and 43% afterwards. Sure Hakeem had a good game once or twice.

Robinson > Olajuwon.

Call Me Back When You Do the Head to Head Stats from 89-95 or 96...That is: Both Their Primes and Even Age Wise.

Include the Play-Offs ofcourse...

Don`t forget to include:

RPG
BPG
APG
SPG
TOVs PG
PFs PG
FT%

For Both


Still Waiting

:violin:

[AirJordan23]

The OP is an idiot. Using head to head numbers from meaningless season games as the main criteria in this comparison is the worst way to make a convincing argument.

If you want to match them up head to head, why not take the 1995 WCF which was basically the epitome of each player’s prime. That famous "Dream Shake" basically sums up the entire match up. Robinson just couldn't figure Olajuwon out. It was like Olajuwon got into his head and Robinson was hit with something he NEVER knew of. Right from game 1, Robinson struggled. He turned the ball over, made several mistakes, couldn't make up his mind on what to do, played soft and didn't show his leadership qualities. While the Dream played like a true MVP. Games 3 and 4 were the ONLY games where Robinson played remotely like the Robinson we knew of. Played some solid post defense on the Dream and came up when it mattered. In game 4, he struggled offensively though. Another BS myth is that Olajuwon never got doubled while Robinson was getting hacked, trapped, doubled and tripled. Robinson was mostly doubled when Olajuwon was resting or in foul trouble. Dream played him pretty well straight up. Dream was doubled in certain situations as well especially in games 1, 3 and 4. Less than Robinson because the Rockets' role players were deadly from 3 so Olajuwon would just kick out to the spot up shooter.

And this isn’t to say Robinson didn’t have great games against Hakeem..Anyone remember that block Robinson had in the closing seconds of the game off the Thorpe inbound pass to Hakeem..Robinson flatout blocked Dream on that play…Spurs won that game as well….Also, Robinson would often get the better of Dream in the early 90s..Doesn’t matter though since the playoffs were what mattered. That series was career defining. Bringing up team records is also misleading since Hakeem’s teams weren’t exactly great throughout his career. Not to say Robinson’s were amazing because Robinson was stuck with some mid-tier talent as well. But, you have to take match ups into account and to be able to do that, you need to watch that games which you clearly haven’t.

And this is not even revisionist history. Hakeem, Ewing and Robinson all had arguments for the best center in the league from 1990-1993. All had great years. Ewing was hyped up thanks to playing in NY that hogged NBC and got all the coverage. Not to say Ewing wasn’t great but overhyped. Robinson was extremely talented while Hakeem was well…Hakeem. It wasn’t until 1993-94 till Hakeem established himself as the best center in the league. And it wasn’t consensus. Just that Hakeem was entering into his true peak. Flourished in Rudy T’s system. Had the perfect players around him. Barkley called him the best player in the league in 1994 during the WCSF between Suns/Rockets. Hakeem was the MVP, DPOY and finals MVP. Truly stepped up in the playoffs, had like 37/15 in that game 7 against Phoenix, outplaying the Jazz frontcourt, being an immense presence all over the court, getting 27/9 in the finals against that loaded Knicks’ frontcourt etc. You won’t see Robinson doing that. Hakeem in the 1995 season wasn’t considered the best center in the league either due to the poor start Rockets had. Well, they started off something like 15-0 but had chemistry issues thanks to Mad Max. Shaq’s dominant self was coming up while Robinson had an amazing season. His team overachieved given the talent and he was crowned MVP. Then, Hakeem demoralized him. Stole his lunch and won the series 4-2 with comparable supporting casts. Hakeem was then considered the best player in the league heading into the 1995 finals. 1996, DESPITE MJ, many considered the Dream the best player in the league. That quickly changed in the 1996 playoffs, however.

As for Robinson, he was soft. He’d fold under pressure when playoff time came. Season wise, I might actually take Robinson over the Dream but the playoffs, hell no. And playoffs are where legends are made. Robinson was talented as hell. Not a single thing he couldn’t on the court. Ran the floor really well, had great face up moves, phenomenal athlete, GREAT defensive player, very solid passer etc but his game didn’t go beyond stats. He wasn’t a leader on the court. Robinson didn’t have the desire or need to win. He even mentioned basketball wasn’t even his first priority…..

[ShaqAttack3234]

Duncan>Shaq anybody who doesn't think is a media blinded fool.

No, anyone who thinks Duncan>Shaq is an idiotic Spurs fanboy who didn't watch Shaq in his prime. Shaq's offense>>>>Duncan's offense. Shaq's rebounding>Duncan's rebounding.

[White Chocolate]

:roll: @ Duncan > Shaq. I love Timmy, but no one came close to the level at which Shaq dominated from 1992-2002.

[phxsuns4life]

David was a BEAST and quite rightly deserves to be a legend, but Hakeem was better. He was more clutch, more agile in the post. Maybe the Admiral could deliver dependable figures, but the Dream wins this battle holistically. Numbers aren't everything.

[Big#50]

:roll: @ Duncan > Shaq. I love Timmy, but no one came close to the level at which Shaq dominated from 1992-2002.
How many rings did he win? How many seasons did he average 30ppg? Shaq is becoming a tad overrated.

[ShaqAttack3234]

How many rings did he win? How many seasons did he average 30ppg? Shaq is becoming a tad overrated.

Who cares how many seasons he averaged 30 ppg? When was the last time a center did that? Something like 30 years ago. How many seasons did Duncan average 25? How many seasons did Duncan average 13 rpg or 3 bpg? How many seasons has Duncan shot 55%?

:roll: :oldlol: :roll:

[che guevara]

Who cares how many seasons he averaged 30 ppg? When was the last time a center did that? Something like 30 years ago. How many seasons did Duncan average 25? How many seasons did Duncan average 13 rpg or 3 bpg? How many seasons has Duncan shot 55%?

:roll: :oldlol: :roll:
I believe Moses Malone was the last center to average 30, and that was in the early 80s. You also have to keep in mind that Shaq didn't try nearly as hard during the regular season. His numbers were certainly better in the playoffs, especially in the Finals.

Shaq > Duncan. Duncan was never as good and never had nearly the impact on the game that Shaq had.

[Big#50]

Who cares how many seasons he averaged 30 ppg? When was the last time a center did that? Something like 30 years ago. How many seasons did Duncan average 25? How many seasons did Duncan average 13 rpg or 3 bpg? How many seasons has Duncan shot 55%?

:roll: :oldlol: :roll:
Fanboys like you have no remedy. Shaq averaged 3 blocks but we all know his D sucked. Shaq was at least 70 pounds heavier than every player and still couldn't average 30. He had sick numbers against Vlade and Dikembe who was virtually terrified of Shaq big deal. Shaq got a free gift from the NBA vs the Kings. He never won **** until K0BE came into his own. No Kobe no rings.

[ShaqAttack3234]

Fanboys like you have no remedy.

I have a few minutes to destroy you. Everyone grab some popcorn and enjoy.


Shaq averaged 3 blocks but we all know his D sucked.

You've admitted in the past that Shaq was an average defender with an impact that was well above average defensively. That was after I pointed out that Shaq's presence in the paint scared away 95% of players, his dominant rebounding helped eliminate second chances and his ridiculous strength, length and athleticism made him a good post defender. Not many people posted up prime Shaq with any success. At the very least he forced opposing big men to be jumpshooters which any coach would prefer.

Shaq has also had seasons when he was an above average defender.

In 2000 he anchored the number 1 ranked defense in the league, finished 2nd in rebounding and 3rd in blocks while finishing 2nd in DPOY voting behind only a prime Alonzo Mourning and ahead of the following players in their primes....Dikembe Mutombo, Eddie Jones, Gary Payton, Jason Kidd and Tim Duncan. Of course he was all-defensive second team as well behind only the DPOY.

In 2001 he was all-defensive second team once again behind the DPOY(Dikembe Mutombo). He was 8th in DPOY voting while finishing 3rd in rebounding and 4th(virtually tied for 2nd in blocks).

In 2003, Shaq once again was on the all-defensive second team behind only the DPOY, Ben Wallace. He was 6th in blocks per game and had he qualified he would have been 4th in rebounding.

In 2004 he would have been 4th once again in rebounding and he was 8th with 2.5 blocks plsu he anchored the 8th best defense despite Slava Medvedenko playing the most minutes at PF that season. He was top 10 in DPOY voting.

In 2005, O'Neal lost a ton of weight and he anchored the 6th best defense in the league despite having a 6'7" PF alongside him. He was 8th in DPOY voting.

There's no way to justify calling him a crappy defender.


Shaq was at least 70 pounds heavier than every player and still couldn't average 30.

Who cares what advantage he had? You don't take off points for someone having a physical advantage. That's like saying Magic was 6 inches taller than just about every other PG, but he couldn't average 25.

O'Neal was top 3 in scoring 8 times and top 2 twice, plus he won 2 scoring titles. He's won of only 4 players to win a title and scoring title in the same season(Jordan, Kareem and Mikan). If he wanted to score a lot on a bad team he easily could have scored 30. Instead he averaged 29.7(30.7 in the playoffs and 38 in the finals) on a 67 win championship team.


He had sick numbers against Vlade and Dikembe who was virtually terrified of Shaq big deal. Shaq got a free gift from the NBA vs the Kings. He never won **** until K0BE came into his own. No Kobe no rings.

If one of the best defenders ever Dikembe Mutombo is scared of you then what does that tell you? :hammerhead: There's no way you can diminish 33, 16, 5 and 3 in the finals vs the 4 time DPOY and a great defensive team.

Who cares if he didn't win until Kobe came into his own? Everyone needs help to win a title. Shaq was the number 1 guy on those teams.

Gift from the NBA? Shaq earned that series victory with 41 and 17 while facing elimination in game 6 and 35/13/4 in game 7. The Kings choked by bricking free throws and wide open 3's(Peja and Christie). In fact in the series, Shaq shot a much better % than C-Webb. If someone had said that'd happen before the series then everyone would have thought Sacramento would have been in trouble.

By your logic, Duncan got a gift in 2007. With the series tied 2-2 going back to Phoenix he got to face the Suns without Amare and Diaw, and they still only won by 3. But I'm not going to take away Duncan's 4th ring because he won it, even though I could argue that they probably wouldn't have if Phoenix had Amare.

[iamgine]

Call Me Back When You Do the Head to Head Stats from 89-95 or 96...That is: Both Their Primes and Even Age Wise.

Include the Play-Offs ofcourse...

Don`t forget to include:

RPG
BPG
APG
SPG
TOVs PG
PFs PG
FT%

For Both


Still Waiting

:violin:
You don't need that. count that yourself.

Robinson won 20 - 12 with similar team and without a star like Drexler. And when he finally has a rookie star in Duncan, he beat Hakeem 10 straight times. Robinson owned Hakeem to a measly 44% shooting before Duncan and 43% afterwards. Sure Hakeem had a good game once or twice.

Robinson > Olajuwon.

[White Chocolate]

How many rings did he win? How many seasons did he average 30ppg? Shaq is becoming a tad overrated.


No one dominated like Shaq. Better yet, when did Duncan ever average 30 PPG? Over 3 BPG? Pushing 60% from the field?

[juju151111]

I have a few minutes to destroy you. Everyone grab some popcorn and enjoy.



You've admitted in the past that Shaq was an average defender with an impact that was well above average defensively. That was after I pointed out that Shaq's presence in the paint scared away 95% of players, his dominant rebounding helped eliminate second chances and his ridiculous strength, length and athleticism made him a good post defender. Not many people posted up prime Shaq with any success. At the very least he forced opposing big men to be jumpshooters which any coach would prefer.

Shaq has also had seasons when he was an above average defender.

In 2000 he anchored the number 1 ranked defense in the league, finished 2nd in rebounding and 3rd in blocks while finishing 2nd in DPOY voting behind only a prime Alonzo Mourning and ahead of the following players in their primes....Dikembe Mutombo, Eddie Jones, Gary Payton, Jason Kidd and Tim Duncan. Of course he was all-defensive second team as well behind only the DPOY.

In 2001 he was all-defensive second team once again behind the DPOY(Dikembe Mutombo). He was 8th in DPOY voting while finishing 3rd in rebounding and 4th(virtually tied for 2nd in blocks).

In 2003, Shaq once again was on the all-defensive second team behind only the DPOY, Ben Wallace. He was 6th in blocks per game and had he qualified he would have been 4th in rebounding.

In 2004 he would have been 4th once again in rebounding and he was 8th with 2.5 blocks plsu he anchored the 8th best defense despite Slava Medvedenko playing the most minutes at PF that season. He was top 10 in DPOY voting.

In 2005, O'Neal lost a ton of weight and he anchored the 6th best defense in the league despite having a 6'7" PF alongside him. He was 8th in DPOY voting.

There's no way to justify calling him a crappy defender.



Who cares what advantage he had? You don't take off points for someone having a physical advantage. That's like saying Magic was 6 inches taller than just about every other PG, but he couldn't average 25.

O'Neal was top 3 in scoring 8 times and top 2 twice, plus he won 2 scoring titles. He's won of only 4 players to win a title and scoring title in the same season(Jordan, Kareem and Mikan). If he wanted to score a lot on a bad team he easily could have scored 30. Instead he averaged 29.7(30.7 in the playoffs and 38 in the finals) on a 67 win championship team.



If one of the best defenders ever Dikembe Mutombo is scared of you then what does that tell you? :hammerhead: There's no way you can diminish 33, 16, 5 and 3 in the finals vs the 4 time DPOY and a great defensive team.

Who cares if he didn't win until Kobe came into his own? Everyone needs help to win a title. Shaq was the number 1 guy on those teams.

Gift from the NBA? Shaq earned that series victory with 41 and 17 while facing elimination in game 6 and 35/13/4 in game 7. The Kings choked by bricking free throws and wide open 3's(Peja and Christie). In fact in the series, Shaq shot a much better % than C-Webb. If someone had said that'd happen before the series then everyone would have thought Sacramento would have been in trouble.

By your logic, Duncan got a gift in 2007. With the series tied 2-2 going back to Phoenix he got to face the Suns without Amare and Diaw, and they still only won by 3. But I'm not going to take away Duncan's 4th ring because he won it, even though I could argue that they probably wouldn't have if Phoenix had Amare.
OWNED:applause: :lol

[catch24]

...

Excellent post yet again...Rep'd

[Big#50]

I have a few minutes to destroy you. Everyone grab some popcorn and enjoy.



You've admitted in the past that Shaq was an average defender with an impact that was well above average defensively. That was after I pointed out that Shaq's presence in the paint scared away 95% of players, his dominant rebounding helped eliminate second chances and his ridiculous strength, length and athleticism made him a good post defender. Not many people posted up prime Shaq with any success. At the very least he forced opposing big men to be jumpshooters which any coach would prefer.

Shaq has also had seasons when he was an above average defender.

In 2000 he anchored the number 1 ranked defense in the league, finished 2nd in rebounding and 3rd in blocks while finishing 2nd in DPOY voting behind only a prime Alonzo Mourning and ahead of the following players in their primes....Dikembe Mutombo, Eddie Jones, Gary Payton, Jason Kidd and Tim Duncan. Of course he was all-defensive second team as well behind only the DPOY.

In 2001 he was all-defensive second team once again behind the DPOY(Dikembe Mutombo). He was 8th in DPOY voting while finishing 3rd in rebounding and 4th(virtually tied for 2nd in blocks).

In 2003, Shaq once again was on the all-defensive second team behind only the DPOY, Ben Wallace. He was 6th in blocks per game and had he qualified he would have been 4th in rebounding.

In 2004 he would have been 4th once again in rebounding and he was 8th with 2.5 blocks plsu he anchored the 8th best defense despite Slava Medvedenko playing the most minutes at PF that season. He was top 10 in DPOY voting.

In 2005, O'Neal lost a ton of weight and he anchored the 6th best defense in the league despite having a 6'7" PF alongside him. He was 8th in DPOY voting.

There's no way to justify calling him a crappy defender.



Who cares what advantage he had? You don't take off points for someone having a physical advantage. That's like saying Magic was 6 inches taller than just about every other PG, but he couldn't average 25.

O'Neal was top 3 in scoring 8 times and top 2 twice, plus he won 2 scoring titles. He's won of only 4 players to win a title and scoring title in the same season(Jordan, Kareem and Mikan). If he wanted to score a lot on a bad team he easily could have scored 30. Instead he averaged 29.7(30.7 in the playoffs and 38 in the finals) on a 67 win championship team.



If one of the best defenders ever Dikembe Mutombo is scared of you then what does that tell you? :hammerhead: There's no way you can diminish 33, 16, 5 and 3 in the finals vs the 4 time DPOY and a great defensive team.

Who cares if he didn't win until Kobe came into his own? Everyone needs help to win a title. Shaq was the number 1 guy on those teams.

Gift from the NBA? Shaq earned that series victory with 41 and 17 while facing elimination in game 6 and 35/13/4 in game 7. The Kings choked by bricking free throws and wide open 3's(Peja and Christie). In fact in the series, Shaq shot a much better % than C-Webb. If someone had said that'd happen before the series then everyone would have thought Sacramento would have been in trouble.

By your logic, Duncan got a gift in 2007. With the series tied 2-2 going back to Phoenix he got to face the Suns without Amare and Diaw, and they still only won by 3. But I'm not going to take away Duncan's 4th ring because he won it, even though I could argue that they probably wouldn't have if Phoenix had Amare.
Great novel.
Damn. I don't say this much but you're obsessed.

[ShaqAttack3234]

Great novel.
Damn. I don't say this much but you're obsessed.

Spoken like a defeated man.

[Big#50]

Spoken like a defeated man.
LOL. I'm defeated because you think Shaq is better than Duncan? All right.

[ShaqAttack3234]

LOL. I'm defeated because you think Shaq is better than Duncan? All right.

You're defeated because you stated something ridiculous and I proved it was ridiculous.

[CB4GOATPF]

Prime 27-33 year old Hakeem Owned Prime 24-30 year old Robinson

In the Play-Offs when it was time to see who was the man in their primes...even more :bowdown:

Olajuwon dominates Robinson

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hW4uXlRGAF0

[Big#50]

You're defeated because you stated something ridiculous and I proved it was ridiculous.
Sure you did. You're just a fanboy that repeats every freaking thing in every post. I said Shaq had monster games against Vlade and Dikembe. Five seconds later you're bringing it up when I just said he did. You keep saying he was the most dominant force blah, blah, changed the game and all other ****. But Shaq never won a thing until Kobe came into his own. Why is that?
Duncan>Shaq

[ShaqAttack3234]

Sure you did. You're just a fanboy that repeats every freaking thing in every post. I said Shaq had monster games against Vlade and Dikembe. Five seconds later you're bringing it up when I just said he did. You keep saying he was the most dominant force blah, blah, changed the game and all other ****. But Shaq never won a thing until Kobe came into his own. Why is that?
Duncan>Shaq

Shaq never had the luxuary of shooting 46% in the playoffs and still winning a title. Only Spurs fanboys like yourself think Duncan>Shaq. Shaq has him in individual success and they're tied in team success. You do the math. Maybe if Timmy could've shot better than 45% in the 2008 playoffs he would have finally won 2 titles in a row.

[Big#50]

Shaq never had the luxuary of shooting 46% in the playoffs and still winning a title. Only Spurs fanboys like yourself think Duncan>Shaq. Shaq has him in individual success and they're tied in team success. You do the math. Maybe if Timmy could've shot better than 45% in the 2008 playoffs he would have finally won 2 titles in a row.
LOL Duncan doesn't have the luxury of being 7'1 350. His FG% is lower because he actually does more than just dunk. Duncan got a title shooting that low % because he made up for it with championship D.

[ShaqAttack3234]

LOL Duncan doesn't have the luxury of being 7'1 350. His FG% is lower because he actually does more than just dunk. Duncan got a title shooting that low % because he made up for it with championship D.

:roll: Who cares if Shaq's 7'1", 350? That's part of what makes him such a great player. By that logic, Paul Pierce>Michael Jordan because Pierce didn't have the luxuary of a 40+ inch vertical. Shaq was a greater player, partially due to his size, but a greater player regardless.

Every player has certain things physically that they can use to make them a great player. Shaq's size is just part of why he was so talented. And :roll: at Shaq only dunking. Don't forget the jumphook and that baseline 8-10 foot turnaround jumper he liked to shoot so much.

Duncan won a title shooting that low because he had Manu(21, 6 and 4, 51 FG%, 44 3P%, 80 FT% in the playoffs), Parker(17 ppg in the playoffs) clutch players like Robert Horry and the best perimeter defender in the league, Bruce Bowen. Not to mention the best coach in the league.

[Big#50]

:roll: Who cares if Shaq's 7'1", 350? That's part of what makes him such a great player. By that logic, Paul Pierce>Michael Jordan because Pierce didn't have the luxuary of a 40+ inch vertical. Shaq was a greater player, partially due to his size, but a greater player regardless.

Every player has certain things physically that they can use to make them a great player. Shaq's size is just part of why he was so talented. And :roll: at Shaq only dunking. Don't forget the jumphook and that baseline 8-10 foot turnaround jumper he liked to shoot so much.

Duncan won a title shooting that low because he had Manu(21, 6 and 4, 51 FG%, 44 3P%, 80 FT% in the playoffs), Parker(17 ppg in the playoffs) clutch players like Robert Horry and the best perimeter defender in the league, Bruce Bowen. Not to mention the best coach in the league.
Duncan can do more than Shaq.

[iamgine]

Head to head record:

Robinson: 30 wins 48% FG, Hakeem: 12 Wins 44% FG

Duncan: 10 wins 48% FG, Hakeem: 0 wins 40% FG


Robinson & Duncan > Hakeem.

[ShaqAttack3234]

Duncan can do more than Shaq.

Yeah, but what Shaq could do(score, rebound and block shots) he could do better than Duncan. And passing was about equal.

Hakeem could do more than Wilt or Kareem, it doesn't mean he was better.

[Big#50]

Yeah, but what Shaq could do(score, rebound and block shots) he could do better than Duncan. And passing was about equal.

Hakeem could do more than Wilt or Kareem, it doesn't mean he was better.
Broken record.

[ShaqAttack3234]

Broken record.

A broken record that keeps saying the right things.

[HighFlyer23]

Shaq> Duncan in almost all facets of the game and was better in both the regular season and postseason

Hakeem > Duncan in almost all facets of the game and was better in both the regular season and postseason

[CB4GOATPF]

Head to head record:

Robinson: 30 wins 48% FG, Hakeem: 12 Wins 44% FG

Duncan: 10 wins 48% FG, Hakeem: 0 wins 40% FG


Robinson & Duncan > Hakeem.

Why are you including The Head to Heads when Hakeem was Past his Prime and Robison had Tim Duncan? :confusedshrug:

Put The Head to Head Stats only For a Prime Hakeem ages 27-32 or 33 vs Robinson ages 24-30

You Posted The Total Head to Head Matchups From 1989 till the Year 2001 :roll:

Rk

84

:no:

Post Me ONLY THE MATCHUPS FROM 1989 TO 1996 (i could even exclude 95-96 season cause 33 is past prime 1 year for most players)

When Both Where Prime

Rk

64

:pimp:

Lets See What Happens...:cheers:

[symbol33]

Shut up. Put a young Timmy in 80's basketball and he'd get 30/15/4 like it ain't ****. Hakeem was good but not that good. 4 titles>2 titles and it does matter. Hakeem outplays DROB in 3 games and all of a sudden he is the GOAT. GTFO with that silly **** you nostalgic fool.

can the first title in 1999 vs knicks be a valuable title? not at all, Drob +Duncan vs rookie camby, that's a easy title, not worth enough.
put a young duncan in 80's, can he got that numbers, i don't know. how do you know that? Hakeem was a much better postseason player, he had that ability, duncan did not have that ability. in his last title, without paker, duncan was nothing, in his first title, without robinson, duncan was alos nothing.

[iamgine]

Why are you including The Head to Heads when Hakeem was Past his Prime and Robison had Tim Duncan? :confusedshrug:

Put The Head to Head Stats only For a Prime Hakeem ages 27-32 or 33 vs Robinson ages 24-30

You Posted The Total Head to Head Matchups From 1989 till the Year 2001 :roll:

Rk

84

:no:

Post Me ONLY THE MATCHUPS FROM 1989 TO 1996 (i could even exclude 95-96 season cause 33 is past prime 1 year for most players)

When Both Where Prime

Rk

64

:pimp:

Lets See What Happens...:cheers:
Head to head record:

Robinson: 30 wins 48% FG, Hakeem: 12 Wins 44% FG

Duncan: 10 wins 48% FG, Hakeem: 0 wins 40% FG


Go ahead and post them. I already showed Robinson won 30 of their 42 meetings, owning Hakeem to a terrible 44% FG. If you have better data, go ahead.

Robinson > Hakeem.

[SayTownRy]

can the first title in 1999 vs knicks be a valuable title? not at all, Drob +Duncan vs rookie camby, that's a easy title, not worth enough.
put a young duncan in 80's, can he got that numbers, i don't know. how do you know that? Hakeem was a much better postseason player, he had that ability, duncan did not have that ability. in his last title, without paker, duncan was nothing, in his first title, without robinson, duncan was alos nothing.

1. yes, the 99 title was a valuable title. the spurs faced more than camby those playoffs.

2. duncan was nothing in his last title without parker? let me guess because parker got the finals mvp trophy?

3. duncan was a monster in 99. needa check up on your history.

[CB4GOATPF]

Why are you including The Head to Heads when Hakeem was Past his Prime and Robison had Tim Duncan? :confusedshrug:

Put The Head to Head Stats only For a Prime Hakeem ages 27-32 or 33 vs Robinson ages 24-30

You Posted The Total Head to Head Matchups From 1989 till the Year 2001 :roll:

Rk

84

:no:

Post Me ONLY THE MATCHUPS FROM 1989 TO 1996 (i could even exclude 95-96 season cause 33 is past prime 1 year for most players)

When Both Where Prime

Rk

64

:pimp:

Lets See What Happens...:cheers:

:sleeping

[Big#50]

A broken record that keeps saying the right things.
Really? Duncan is ten times more clutch. Better leader. Ten times the defender, better shooter, better passer, smarter, doesn't cry like Shaq and is as good a rebounder. Tell me how Shaq is better? Oh yeah, he had 42 and 18 against Vlade Divac but still needed the refs to send the Lakers to the line 99 times in a crucial game just to win.Shaq dominates like no other but needed Kobe to be super sidekick to win a ring. Tell me how Duncan waited for Parker and Manu to come into their own to win a ring. You can't. Duncan dominated The Lakers to get a ring. He had 36 and 17 on the road to eliminate the 3peat champs. Making Fish, Kobe and Shaq cry like kids. Shaq tried his best to stop Duncan but got schooled. He did this with no all star playing besides him.
Duncan>Shaq

[Big#50]

can the first title in 1999 vs knicks be a valuable title? not at all, Drob +Duncan vs rookie camby, that's a easy title, not worth enough.
put a young duncan in 80's, can he got that numbers, i don't know. how do you know that? Hakeem was a much better postseason player, he had that ability, duncan did not have that ability. in his last title, without paker, duncan was nothing, in his first title, without robinson, duncan was alos nothing.
Duncan>Hakeem in the post season.
4 rings>2 rings
99 counts because every team still played their hearts out in the playoffs. The season was 50 games long. Those playoffs were great BTW. Many good moments.
Duncan's last title he averaged his usual numbers while playing the best D he has played. Even better than 03. The Cavs made their whole game plan around Tim. He was the focal point in all their schemes. Parker was open because of this. Nobody was worried about Parker. Do you watch basketball? Be honest.

[juju151111]

Broken record.
OMG STF^ You not responding to him at all. He showed the evidence and backed it up. ALl you say is Duncan>Shaq "Broken record" Either counter his arguement or STF^:ohwell:

[Big#50]

OMG STF^ You not responding to him at all. He showed the evidence and backed it up. ALl you say is Duncan>Shaq "Broken record" Either counter his arguement or STF^:ohwell:
What's his argument? Shaq's more dominant. I've said why I think Duncan is better many times. I don't want to be posting the same **** over and over again.
BTW **** you. ****ing Capt'n-Save-A-Hoe.

[ShaqAttack3234]

Really? Duncan is ten times more clutch.

Says who? 40/20 games in the finals aren't clutch. Dropping 40 on Sacramento while facing elimination isn't clutch?


better shooter

Who cares? Shaq is still a far better low post scorer and scorer overall. I'd rather have my big man dominating the paint.


better passer

Nope, both players are on par with eachother in this category. Both were elite for their position.


smarter

:roll: Could your crap get any more subjective? I don't care who YOU think is smarter. Shaq produced more on the court and usually made the right decision.


doesn't cry like Shaq

Which has nothing to do with their playing ability.


and is as good a rebounder.

Nope, Shaq was a better rebounder.


Tell me how Shaq is better?

I already did. Far better scorer, better rebounder, much more efficient and a far bigger mismatch which cases more double teams and more looks for his teammates. It's pretty obvious.


Oh yeah, he had 42 and 18 against Vlade Divac but still needed the refs to send the Lakers to the line 99 times in a crucial game just to win.Shaq dominates like no other but needed Kobe to be super sidekick to win a ring. Tell me how Duncan waited for Parker and Manu to come into their own to win a ring. You can't. Duncan dominated The Lakers to get a ring. He had 36 and 17 on the road to eliminate the 3peat champs. Making Fish, Kobe and Shaq cry like kids. Shaq tried his best to stop Duncan but got schooled. He did this with no all star playing besides him.
Duncan>Shaq

You want to talk head to head? Remember the 2001 WCF when Shaq's Lakers swept Duncan's Spurs who had homecourt? O'Neal faced constant double teams from Duncan and Robinson, two of the league's best defenders.

Shaq- 27 ppg, 13 rpg, 2.5 apg, 1.5 bpg, 3.5 TO, 54 FG%, 39 mpg
Duncan- 23 ppg, 12.3 rpg, 4.3 apg, 4.3 bpg, 4.5 TO, 47.8 FG%, 42.3 mpg

Don't act like Shaq had so much more help than Kobe. He had ONE all-star teammate, but his team depended on him just as much as the Spurs depended on Duncan.

Spurs without Duncan in 2000: 5-3
Spurs without Duncan in 2004: 7-9
Spurs without Duncan in 2005: 9-7

Don't give me that super sidekick crap. Duncan had very well rounded supporting casts. D-Rob during Duncan's first 3 years was a legit all-star level player.

Yes Duncan won in 2003 without an all-star teammate, but look at his road to the finals. They faced a pretty weak Suns team in the first round, a dysfunctional Lakers team with no role players(who they would have lost to had Horry's 3 not rimmed out), a Mavs team who were without their best player for 3 teams and a 49 win Nets team.

Duncan had less help in 2003 compared to Shaq's 3peat years, but he also faced a much easier path to the finals so it evens out. Just like Magic and Bird can't be penalized for their casts compared to Duncan and 2000 players because the teams they played were also more stacked.

Then you consider that Shaq's individual performances easily exceed Duncan's. And Duncan had comparable supporting casts in 1999, 2005 and 2007. In fact if anything Duncan's 2005 and 2007 were more stacked from top to bottom with a legit second and third option(something Shaq never really had during his title years) as well as the best perimeter defender in the league.

I wish you'd stop comparing Duncan to players who were clearly better like Shaq and Hakeem. It makes Duncan look worse which is a shame because I love Duncan's game. One of my 5 favorite players from this era.

[godofgods]

Really? Duncan is ten times more clutch. Better leader. Ten times the defender, better shooter, better passer, smarter, doesn't cry like Shaq and is as good a rebounder. Tell me how Shaq is better? Oh yeah, he had 42 and 18 against Vlade Divac but still needed the refs to send the Lakers to the line 99 times in a crucial game just to win.Shaq dominates like no other but needed Kobe to be super sidekick to win a ring. Tell me how Duncan waited for Parker and Manu to come into their own to win a ring. You can't. Duncan dominated The Lakers to get a ring. He had 36 and 17 on the road to eliminate the 3peat champs. Making Fish, Kobe and Shaq cry like kids. Shaq tried his best to stop Duncan but got schooled. He did this with no all star playing besides him.
Duncan>Shaq

Word brother.

[symbol33]

1. yes, the 99 title was a valuable title. the spurs faced more than camby those playoffs.

2. duncan was nothing in his last title without parker? let me guess because parker got the finals mvp trophy?

3. duncan was a monster in 99. needa check up on your history.

1. valuable to the team, not for duncan or robinson neither. too big C vs one rookie and a white small C, what i saw was duncan and robinson caught the reboundes again and again, put the ball to the basket in the color area and a 4:1 easy title. Ewing was injured not even play one minute in the series. the only challenge to the spurs was Allen Houston only, by to the spurs, they faced no challenge.

2. Cav only had one steady offenser, and Gibson performed good in a short while, that's all for Cav in that series, the season later, they got Ben Wallace. Spurs had at least two steady offenser, what i saw was Paker outplayed cav's PG a lot, without paker, that could not be another easy 4:1 title.

3. :lol monster? how can it be a monster without a weighty rival? of course a monster when the rival was a rookie

[Lakas Fan Yo]

I find it really funny that anyone would take Robinson over Hakeem. Robinson was a great player but Hakeem was on another level. Hakeem was an absolute freaking beast.

[symbol33]

Duncan>Hakeem in the post season.
4 rings>2 rings
99 counts because every team still played their hearts out in the playoffs. The season was 50 games long. Those playoffs were great BTW. Many good moments.
Duncan's last title he averaged his usual numbers while playing the best D he has played. Even better than 03. The Cavs made their whole game plan around Tim. He was the focal point in all their schemes. Parker was open because of this. Nobody was worried about Parker. Do you watch basketball? Be honest.

4 rings>2 rings, if this is the truth, so Russell was definitely > Jabar > Wilt without any double. why we discussed a lot of things beneath the data, made a conclusion with the data only was actually not enough.
Do i watched the series? ok, we just let parker open and still with his bad middle shooting skill like the season before, spurs would faced much more difficulty, parker made great progress in his shooting that year. second, Lewis got lost in the series, Cavs put all their weight in james only.
that's you no worried about parker, not me, not the Cavs.

[Lakas Fan Yo]

Shut up. Put a young Timmy in 80's basketball and he'd get 30/15/4 like it ain't ****. Hakeem was good but not that good. 4 titles>2 titles and it does matter. Hakeem outplays DROB in 3 games and all of a sudden he is the GOAT. GTFO with that silly **** you nostalgic fool.

You cannot be serious? You obviously did not see prime Hakeem. Duncan is a really great player, but he's no Hakeem.

[Lakas Fan Yo]

Thats not really a fair comparison, cus Shaq rapped everyone, from mutumbo to Divac to Hakeem, they all got killed by Shaq. A comparison to a guy that someone actually had a chance of slowing down like Ewing would be more fair.

You must be young. Because the ONLY center of the modern era that can be compared to Hakeem is Shaq. And quite frankly, Hakeem was better than Shaq.

[Lakas Fan Yo]

Duncan > All

:bowdown:

4 rings without playing next to a hall of famer in their prime *cough Shaq cough* , while playing Championship defense and offense *Shaq never played defense or finished games*

What the hell? Shaq, Kareem, Hakeem, Wilt were all better than Duncan.

[Big#50]

You cannot be serious? You obviously did not see prime Hakeem. Duncan is a really great player, but he's no Hakeem.
Watched the Midwest since 89.

[SinJackal]

To those that claimed Hakeem had a crap team during their finals wins. ..no he didn't. He had Clyde Drexler, Sam Cassel, Robert Horry, and several other quality players. They were stacked.

Also, you cannot keep clinging to one playoff series as some defining moment in both of their careers, when Robinson had been playing him well all throughout their careers before and after that. His one playoff series against him does not erase the fact that he struggled against Robinson for the rest of his career.

They have the same number of MVP awards, same number of rings, and same DPY awards. Not to mention their stats are all similar otherwise.

Robinson was more versitile to me. He was a better shooter, more agile, better on team defense, better game IQ, and had better dribbles. Hakeem had a superior post game, which makes him more of a prototypical center. People are too soon to write off centers who score very well in non traditional ways. Hakeem struggled against double teams, and had no answer for it. Robinson can knock down jumpers, continuing to be effective even if he's double teamed in the post.

I'd prefer Robinson over him if I could make a timeless team. Hakeem would be my second choice.

[juju151111]

To those that claimed Hakeem had a crap team during their finals wins. ..no he didn't. He had Clyde Drexler, Sam Cassel, Robert Horry, and several other quality players. They were stacked.

Also, you cannot keep clinging to one playoff series as some defining moment in both of their careers, when Robinson had been playing him well all throughout their careers before and after that. His one playoff series against him does not erase the fact that he struggled against Robinson for the rest of his career.

They have the same number of MVP awards, same number of rings, and same DPY awards. Not to mention their stats are all similar otherwise.

Robinson was more versitile to me. He was a better shooter, more agile, better on team defense, better game IQ, and had better dribbles. Hakeem had a superior post game, which makes him more of a prototypical center. People are too soon to write off centers who score very well in non traditional ways. Hakeem struggled against double teams, and had no answer for it. Robinson can knock down jumpers, continuing to be effective even if he's double teamed in the post.

I'd prefer Robinson over him if I could make a timeless team. Hakeem would be my second choice.
Who are these new people who keep making accounts and saying Crap?? Robinson isn't in his league.

[ShaqAttack3234]

To those that claimed Hakeem had a crap team during their finals wins. ..no he didn't. He had Clyde Drexler, Sam Cassel, Robert Horry, and several other quality players. They were stacked.

That was the 1995 team, the 1994 team didn't have Drexler. They were far from stacked in '94, in fact Olajuwon's supporting cast was among the worst on a championship team.

The team's second leading scorer averaged 14 ppg and their 3rd leading scorer shot 39%.

They had good role players, but they didn't really have a championship caliber number 2 guy who you could rely on to consistently get his own shot. Maxwell was too inconsistent. I liked Maxwell because of how hard he played and his defense, but offensively he was a streaky 3 point shooter. Some nights he could get ridiculously hot and other nights he couldn't buy a basket.


They have the same number of MVP awards, same number of rings, and same DPY awards. Not to mention their stats are all similar otherwise.

Olajuwon won both of his titles as the undisputed number 1 guy and he had some legendary performances. Robinson won one as a number 2 guy and the other as maybe the 4th best player averaging something like 8/6. You can't compare their rings.

Olajuwon also has one more DPOY award.

[kuniva_dAMiGhTy]

no way man. hakeem averaged 21 points 11 reb 1 steal and 2 blocks. overall he had a better stat line and was better in the playoffs. he also led a team to back to back finals with 2 final mvps as a result.

[pierce2008mvp]

Robinson was on Karl Malone's level not Hakeem Olajuwon's.

[SmackOrH.A.K]

To those that claimed Hakeem had a crap team during their finals wins. ..no he didn't. He had Clyde Drexler, Sam Cassel, Robert Horry, and several other quality players. They were stacked.

The red was not even there during the 1994 championship.
The yellow were rookies during the 1994 championship.

[CB4GOATPF]

Why are you including The Head to Heads when Hakeem was Past his Prime and Robison had Tim Duncan? :confusedshrug:

Put The Head to Head Stats only For a Prime Hakeem ages 27-32 or 33 vs Robinson ages 24-30

You Posted The Total Head to Head Matchups From 1989 till the Year 2001 :roll:

Rk

84

:no:

Post Me ONLY THE MATCHUPS FROM 1989 TO 1996 (i could even exclude 95-96 season cause 33 is past prime 1 year for most players)

When Both Where Prime

Rk

64

:pimp:

Lets See What Happens...:cheers:

:applause:

[dave520]

I dont think any sportsfan worth is weight can reasonably say that Robinson was a superior player to Olajuwon if he takes the totality of the circumstances into play (and that should be the case in all matchups that pit player against player)

Its never a sound argument to argue JUST stats, or JUST championships... they need to take the entire equation and make a judgement call.

Career stats are similar, although Olajuwon has higher all time numbers, he also played a good many more years. I think for players who play a minimum 6 or 7 years, it is much more accurateto gauge them on averages, and in this individual matchup they both come up about equal.

I think David was better team defender and Olajuwon was a slightly better individual one.

David had better peak numbers offensively, Olajuwon was more consistent.

Both were good rebounders, about the same I would say.

They were probably the best two centers ever in regards to steals.. Olajuwon being more consitent, and David having slightly better peak numbers (92 Robinson was a complete beast). Both also were pretty even as far as assists, although I think Olajuwon was a slightly better passer.

Olajuwon entered the league much younger than David, and I feel overstayed his welcome a bit as well (playing as a shell of his former self in Toronto).. so he has better all time numbers.

David started late (24)... if Dave had entered when he was 20 or so, he would be much higher on the all time lists and would be number 2 on the all time blocked shots list behind Olajuwon for sure.

They both have two championships, the difference obviously being that Olajowon wasnt only the prime player on those Rocket teams, but he steamrolled through not only Robinson, but through the other two prime centers of that era.. Ewing and O'Neal to get those rings, and THAT is where Olajuwon separates himself from the pack and from Robinson in regards to his all-time status. Not to mention he carried a grossly undermanned unit in 1994-1995 and put up one of the single greatests playoff performances in the playoffs that year, especially against the MVP Robinson.

(On a side note, WAY too much is made of that one playoff series in regards to Robinsons career, and many young people who never saw them play in their primes give the impression that they werent even close in terms of talent... not realizing from around 1991-1996 they were considered without question as the two best centers in the league.. and not only that as two of the leagues top 5 players all those years as well)

Olajuwon also had a tendency to play better in the clutch and in the playoffs, which is where Robinson gets hurt in his all time status.

There individual numbers against eachother in the regular season would be more relevant if Olajuwon had'nt had that wild performance againt Robinson in 95.

That being said, I feel overall Robinson is underrated by most casual sports fans and even knowlegable ones. He played quite well his first few years in the playoffs, and struggled 94-96 mainly because the Spurs themselves were inflitrated with role players and with the exception of Rodman and the occasional Elliot (Elliot really didnt help because he wasnt a consistant scorer on the block or in the paint, where Rob needed relief), and Robinsons game wasnt back the traditional back to the basket game... and teams could always double team him because they lacked a second go to man (Elliot WAS NOT going to go off for 30 if Robinson had a bad night, and Rodman never scored unless he was either bored or collected an inordinate amount of offensive boards).

Both were very athletic and probably are the most athletic big men in the history of the league (Dwight Howard is a great leaper, and quick for his size but lacks the footwork, quick feet around the basket that Robinson and Olajuwon had, not to mention a jump shot and some decent post moves). Again David being the more natural athlete (could do almost anything) and Olajuwon had the better footwork and quicker feet around the basket (thank you Soccer).

Overall though, Olajuwon had the more succesful career and will be remembered as the better player, (for some reasonable reasons and some not so reasonable)... and rightfully so.

[dave520]

no way man. hakeem averaged 21 points 11 reb 1 steal and 2 blocks. overall he had a better stat line and was better in the playoffs. he also led a team to back to back finals with 2 final mvps as a result.

Robinson has almost exactly the same stat line all time.. Robinson avg 3 blocks per game and Olajuwon around 2.6 or so....

[dave520]

:applause:

I like the depth of your analysis, but I feel it isnt well rounded enough.. too much dependancy on stats.. needs more intangibles.

[CB4GOATPF]

Robinson has almost exactly the same stat line all time.. Robinson avg 3 blocks per game and Olajuwon around 2.6 or so....

[B]Hakeem played longer reason to why his stats diminished. If you account their primes ages 22-32 (for D-Rob 23) there is no discusson on who was better. If u wan

[Da_Realist]

I dont think any sportsfan worth is weight can reasonably say that Robinson was a superior player to Olajuwon if he takes the totality of the circumstances into play (and that should be the case in all matchups that pit player against player)

Its never a sound argument to argue JUST stats, or JUST championships... they need to take the entire equation and make a judgement call.

Career stats are similar, although Olajuwon has higher all time numbers, he also played a good many more years. I think for players who play a minimum 6 or 7 years, it is much more accurateto gauge them on averages, and in this individual matchup they both come up about equal.

I think David was better team defender and Olajuwon was a slightly better individual one.

David had better peak numbers offensively, Olajuwon was more consistent.

Both were good rebounders, about the same I would say.

They were probably the best two centers ever in regards to steals.. Olajuwon being more consitent, and David having slightly better peak numbers (92 Robinson was a complete beast). Both also were pretty even as far as assists, although I think Olajuwon was a slightly better passer.

Olajuwon entered the league much younger than David, and I feel overstayed his welcome a bit as well (playing as a shell of his former self in Toronto).. so he has better all time numbers.

David started late (24)... if Dave had entered when he was 20 or so, he would be much higher on the all time lists and would be number 2 on the all time blocked shots list behind Olajuwon for sure.

They both have two championships, the difference obviously being that Olajowon wasnt only the prime player on those Rocket teams, but he steamrolled through not only Robinson, but through the other two prime centers of that era.. Ewing and O'Neal to get those rings, and THAT is where Olajuwon separates himself from the pack and from Robinson in regards to his all-time status. Not to mention he carried a grossly undermanned unit in 1994-1995 and put up one of the single greatests playoff performances in the playoffs that year, especially against the MVP Robinson.

(On a side note, WAY too much is made of that one playoff series in regards to Robinsons career, and many young people who never saw them play in their primes give the impression that they werent even close in terms of talent... not realizing from around 1991-1996 they were considered without question as the two best centers in the league.. and not only that as two of the leagues top 5 players all those years as well)

Olajuwon also had a tendency to play better in the clutch and in the playoffs, which is where Robinson gets hurt in his all time status.

There individual numbers against eachother in the regular season would be more relevant if Olajuwon had'nt had that wild performance againt Robinson in 95.

That being said, I feel overall Robinson is underrated by most casual sports fans and even knowlegable ones. He played quite well his first few years in the playoffs, and struggled 94-96 mainly because the Spurs themselves were inflitrated with role players and with the exception of Rodman and the occasional Elliot (Elliot really didnt help because he wasnt a consistant scorer on the block or in the paint, where Rob needed relief), and Robinsons game wasnt back the traditional back to the basket game... and teams could always double team him because they lacked a second go to man (Elliot WAS NOT going to go off for 30 if Robinson had a bad night, and Rodman never scored unless he was either bored or collected an inordinate amount of offensive boards).

Both were very athletic and probably are the most athletic big men in the history of the league (Dwight Howard is a great leaper, and quick for his size but lacks the footwork, quick feet around the basket that Robinson and Olajuwon had, not to mention a jump shot and some decent post moves). Again David being the more natural athlete (could do almost anything) and Olajuwon had the better footwork and quicker feet around the basket (thank you Soccer).

Overall though, Olajuwon had the more succesful career and will be remembered as the better player, (for some reasonable reasons and some not so reasonable)... and rightfully so.

Really good analysis :applause:

[purple32gold]

geez guy gets put in the hall of fame and apparently everyone and their mama has somethin ****ty to say. life's tough i guess lol