What's wrong with LeBron?

[Dave3]

Watching the Cavs this year, I've mirrored many of the thoughts people have been voicing regarding LeBron's explosiveness, and particularly how it seems that it has disappeared. The guy doesn't seem to get nearly as high as he used to and most people have noticed it. I've also noticed that he doesn't seem to try as hard to jump very high, but I'm not sure if I'm right. So for those that watch the Cavs frequently, has he just not been trying to jump as high or explode as much, or has he actually lost a step before even turning 25?

[LA_Showtime]

yea, he definitely looks a step slower this season. but honestly, i think he's still got most of his explosion off of one foot. he gets himself into trouble though when he tries to gather himself with two feet. not like it matters though, lebron's still a freak athlete lol

[Dave3]

yea, he definitely looks a step slower this season. but honestly, i think he's still got most of his explosion off of one foot. he gets himself into trouble though when he tries to gather himself with two feet. not like it matters though, lebron's still a freak athlete lol
But if he's lost a step at freaking 24, he'll be out of the league by like 32...

[LA_Showtime]

But if he's lost a step at freaking 24, he'll be out of the league by like 32...

well, yeah, it's definitely strange to see him declining athletically when he should be at his peak... however, i think he would be fine if he just lost 10-20 pounds. at this point it looks like he's too heavy... naturally his body is going to break down faster if he's carrying the extra weight. and it's not like he's using his bulk to punish his defender in the post lol

[che guevara]

I thought the same thing in the first 8 games or so of the season, but in the last 2 games he's looked just as athletic/explosive/whatever term you would like to use as he did last season. Maybe he was just a bit rusty or something. Did you watch the last 2 games? He got a ton of explosive dunks/layups. I remember hearing people say the same thing at the beginning of last season, too, and I specifically remember listening to a podcast where they thought Lebron had lost some of his athleticism. I'd say that it's just rust, especially after seeing these last 2 games.

And Showtime, in the 3 games before tonight, Lebron was doing a ton of work in the post - whether it was scoring or creating for others. I'm guessing you haven't been watching the games. His weight is a big reason why he's so impossible to guard.

[StroShow4]

Highlights from tonight's game (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5tv0-uvQKIw)


He looks pretty f@cking explosive to me. :confusedshrug:

[cotdt]

Lebron's more of a jumpshooter now. He want to be like Kobe. Be like Kobe.

[LA_Showtime]

Highlights from tonight's game (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5tv0-uvQKIw)


He looks pretty f@cking explosive to me. :confusedshrug:

still don't think he's getting off the ground as quickly as he did last year. and you can really tell when he gathers himself with two feet...

[OneMoreSucka]

My first thought would be he's just saving his energy more, not losing a step.

[Dave3]

Highlights from tonight's game (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5tv0-uvQKIw)


He looks pretty f@cking explosive to me. :confusedshrug:
Dude, he looks like he's barely getting off the ground compared to his former self. Before his head would be rim level on most of his dunks, right now it looks like he's barely getting up there. He's quick I guess, but doesn't get up high.

[L.Kizzle]

But if he's lost a step at freaking 24, he'll be out of the league by like 32...
Dude is already close to 14 thousand points already, he's had a career and a half already.

[LA_Showtime]

Dude, he looks like he's barely getting off the ground compared to his former self. Before his head would be rim level on most of his dunks, right now it looks like he's barely getting up there. He's quick I guess, but doesn't get up high.

yeah, he's not finishing as many of those crazy shots he used to make on a regular basis.

maybe his ego is weighing him down? relax, i kid i kid

[ArizaAttack24]

Nothing...It's just time for him to expand his game and mix it up more often. He probably realizes at this point, if he is crazy aggressive to the rack ever game he probably won't be able to play that long due to possible injuries. It's a safety issue as well as a strategy change.

[HylianNightmare]

...will be fine

[LA_Showtime]

i don't understand why people think he's willingly lost some of his explosiveness. there is a difference between picking your spots and losing a step and i think people are getting them mixed up ....

[sergiorodriguez]

I think his athleticism is the same and his explosiveness is the same, he just isnt trying as hard as he was last year, he knows he's going to NY or Jersey, he knows hes gonna start selling his new number 6 jerseys on his new team and make a ton of cash of jersey sales and shoes, his heart just doesnt seem to be in Cleveland very much and you can see it in his game

He's still beasting because he has so much talent but he doesnt seem as hungry as last year

[inclinerator]

he's saving it for the dunk contest

[Indian guy]

Have been saying this since Game 1 of the preseason. For whatever reason he just doesn't have his old explosivness. Haven't seen him make one impressive leap in the half-court all season(can he?). And the YT highlights posted from tonight's game only reaffirm that. He barely got up on the 2 dunks he had at 0:23 & 1:57.

And :oldlol: @ the pacing himself bit. He's freaking 24 years old and historically has always looked as explosive in April/May/June as he has in December. So it's not like there's been a burn-out issue in the past. Would make NO sense for him to not jump like he can ALL THE TIME. But that's what we're seeing right now. LeBron hasn't displayed his old leaping ability in every game, every drive of this season so far.

Fortunately the other aspects of his offensive game have come a long way. He's shooting 53% despite being more perimeter oriented than ever. 05-08 LeBron would've struggled to produce at a superstar level with his current body.

[che guevara]

Have been saying this since Game 1 of the preseason. For whatever reason he just doesn't have his old explosivness. Haven't seen him make one impressive leap in the half-court all season(can he?). And the YT highlights posted from tonight's game only reaffirm that. He barely got up on the 2 dunks he had at 0:23 & 1:57.

And :oldlol: @ the pacing himself bit. He's freaking 24 years old. Why would he suddenly decide to not jump like he can ALL THE TIME? It's not like we're only talking about a few possessions here. LeBron hasn't displayed his old leaping ability in every game, every drive of this season so far.

Good thing the other aspects of his offensive game have come along as far as they have. He's shooting 53% despite being more perimeter oriented than ever. 05-08 LeBron would've struggled to produce at a superstar level with his current body.
Why am I the only one who doesn't see a decline? Can somebody link me to a clip where Lebron is clearly more explosive/athletic than he was vs. Indiana or Philly? In the last few games, it seems to me as if his athleticism is the same as it was last year.

[Dave3]

Why am I the only one who doesn't see a decline? Can somebody link me to a clip where Lebron is clearly more explosive/athletic than he was vs. Indiana or Philly? In the last few games, it seems to me as if his athleticism is the same as it was last year.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ve5lSjtmE4Q
His head is almost rim level...

[Indian guy]

Why am I the only one who doesn't see a decline?

His speed/quickness for the most part seems fine. His leaping/explosiveness in the paint sure as hell isn't. And that's obvious on every drive/layup/dunk he has made this season. Just watch the 2 dunks at :23 & 1:57 from tonight's game itself: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5tv0-uvQKIw. Surely you can see that he barely got up?

And watch ANY highlight clip of his prior to this season to see a NOTICEABLY more explosive LeBron.

[che guevara]

His speed/quickness for the most part seems fine. His leaping/explosiveness in the paint sure as hell isn't. And that's obvious on every drive/layup/dunk he has made this season. Just watch the 2 dunks at :23 & 1:57 from tonight's game itself: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5tv0-uvQKIw. Surely you can see that he barely got up?

And watch ANY highlight clip of his prior to this season to see a NOTICEABLY more explosive LeBron.
I'm not sure what to make of that. I have no idea if he didn't get his head to rim level because he couldn't, or just because he didn't have to. He didn't need to jump that high on either attempt. Or maybe it's just rust - as I said, I remember this same thing being discussed at the beginning of last season, too. If he never gets his head to rim level or shows his old explosiveness after the season is over, then we'll know something is up - but right now, it's only 14 games into the season, and the sample size we're looking at is just too small.

[Dave3]

I'm not sure what to make of that. I have no idea if he didn't get his head to rim level because he couldn't, or just because he didn't have to. He didn't need to jump that high on either attempt. Or maybe it's just rust - as I said, I remember this same thing being discussed at the beginning of last season, too. If he never gets his head to rim level or shows his old explosiveness after the season is over, then we'll know something is up - but right now, it's only 14 games into the season, and the sample size we're looking at is just too small.
It's not about sample size in this case. This is something that used to happen 3 or 4 times a game, and now hasn't happened for 14 games...just seems a bit weird.

[chazzy]

Yeah if he has declined leaping wise, it would definitely have to deal with a muscle mass gain.. not necessarily a decline in his overall athleticism. I stopped working out for a month and a half because of a shoulder injury, and lost a lot of my muscle mass.. but when I came back, I was jumping almost higher than before because I was lighter. Weight is a big factor.

[Diesel J]

Early on I also thought something wasn't right about him explosion wise but I think my perception was off because he wasn't getting out on the break/dunking as much but Lebron is OK. Dude still has his hops and explosion as you can see here...

http://img688.imageshack.us/img688/3218/lebronele.jpg (http://img688.imageshack.us/i/lebronele.jpg/)

@ 14 & 19 secs getting head level vs the Bulls from like a week or two ago:lol

lebron james dunks on bulls

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Hft4i9F65IU


or his cheetah like acceleration/speed as he chases down Monta the other night for rejection

LeBron Skies and Rejects Ellis

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7qwkIjJktOQ

[Indian guy]

He didn't need to jump that high on either attempt.

Of course he didn't need to jump high in order to DUNK the ball. There's never a reason to jump as high as great leapers do! But they still do because they CAN. Why would LeBron suddenly stop at 24? Only if he CAN'T, and through 14 games he's clearly shown that he CAN'T.


Or maybe it's just rust - as I said, I remember this same thing being discussed at the beginning of last season, too.

That was just a 3-5 game issue and he was back better than ever after that. The current slump has almost lasted 2 months!


but right now, it's only 14 games into the season, and the sample size we're looking at is just too small.

But what does the amount of games have to do with anything? A great leaper, at the freaking age of 24, should be expected to be a great leaper barring injury or being out of shape/poor conditioning. LeBron doesn't have those issues. I've never seen or heard of a great athlete suddenly losing his vertical at LeBron's age. But he has and it's not like we're looking at a small sample(even though the # of games is irrelevant anyway). Including preseason, this is nearly 2 months of the game's best athlete suddenly displaying a lack of explosiveness/elite leaping.


Yeah if he has declined leaping wise, it would definitely have to deal with a muscle mass gain

That's what I believe is the case too, except LeBron's gained muscle mass EVERY year he's been in the league and it hasn't had the slightest impact(negative) on his explosiveness/leaping. He's gotten better athetically every year, if anything. So what went wrong now?

[Indian guy]

Early on I also thought something wasn't right about him explosion wise but I think my perception was off because he wasn't getting out on the break/dunking as much but Lebron is OK. Dude still has his hops and explosion as you can see here...

http://img688.imageshack.us/img688/3218/lebronele.jpg (http://img688.imageshack.us/i/lebronele.jpg/)

@ 14 & 19 secs getting head level vs the Bulls from like a week or two ago:lol

lebron james dunks on bulls

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Hft4i9F65IU

These 2 plays were a result of near-full court runs though. His real issue is his leaping/explosiveness off of short distances(3pt line to basket and shorter).

[che guevara]

That's what I believe is the case too, except LeBron's gained muscle mass EVERY year he's been in the league and it hasn't had the slightest impact(negative) on his explosiveness/leaping. He's gotten better athetically every year, if anything. So what went wrong now?
If what you're saying really is true, that he has lost some of his vertical, it's almost certainly because of the wear and tear on his body. Prior to this season, he played 472 games, not counting two deep runs in the postseason - including this season and all playoff games, he's played 545 games.

I think this is evidence that wear and tear is more of a factor in an athlete's decline than age. I'm sure you've heard of the 1000 game theory, that players decline significantly around that mark - Lebron, at the age of 24, is already more than halfway there. KG, despite being only 33, has declined very significantly, and it's probably because of the wear and tear he's accumulated from coming straight out of High School. It's not like 33 is an advanced age for a basketball player - players like Kareem, Steve Nash, Chauncey Billups, and Karl Malone didn't show much decline at all 33.

I don't think he got better athletically every year, though - Lebron in 2007 seemed less athletic (and worse in every way) than he was before or after.

[Diesel J]

Lebron in 2007 seemed less athletic (and worse in every way) than he was before or after.

There were threads on here in 2007 just like this one in saying that Lwbron was washed up because his athleticism was gone:lol

[Alan]

Been saying Bron should lose 15 pounds ASAp for the last 3 years.

Glad to see someone else notices it'll put more miles on him quickly.
Yeah.. because he's really been strugling with those extra 15 pounds the last few years...

You don't fix something that isn't broken.

[madmax]

:roll: at this thread...dude is playing at an all time great level, and some d-bags are wondering what is wrong with him LOL. Do you know how many back to back games Cavs had so far? Maybe he is just saving energy and playing smart basketball? Or is that so hard to grasp...

[Mamba]

:roll: at this thread...dude is playing at an all time great level, and some d-bags are wondering what is wrong with him LOL. Do you know how many back to back games Cavs had so far? Maybe he is just saving energy and playing smart basketball? Or is that so hard to grasp...
they've had two sequences already in the season wh they've played 4 games in 5 nights and have played the second most games this season only having less than portland. just give em time

[plowking]

Can people STFU about Lebron's explosiveness and stop pretending like they're experts about it. He looks the same in the regard and better everywhere else.

If this is what a "troubled with explosiveness" Lebron looks like, then he's still someone I would take over all but about 5 players ever in NBA history. So yeah, he sucks ass.

[Real Men Wear Green]

How many fast break dunks and lay-ups has he blocked this year? I really don't see whatever it is you guys are seeing.

[ukballer]

I'm sorry, but complete and utter rubbish.

[ImmortalD24]

http://www.nba.com/video/games/cavaliers/2009/11/19/091119_lebron_james_dunk.nba/index.html

^ Just a couple of days ago..


Can't go all out on dunks anymore and risk injury, he's playing for something this year.. His FG% has been ridiculous this season and is just playing smarter basketball.

[Blue&Orange]

These 2 plays were a result of near-full court runs though. His real issue is his leaping/explosiveness off of short distances(3pt line to basket and shorter).
lol i wonder if someone post a clip from short distances what crap will you spew next.

[Blue&Orange]

These 2 plays were a result of near-full court runs though. His real issue is his leaping/explosiveness off of short distances(3pt line to basket and shorter).
lol i wonder if someone post a clip from short distances what crap will you spew next.

[mlh1981]

I disagree with the premise of this topic. Is LeBron James still the exact same, explosive athlete he was at 19? Maybe he's lost 5-10 percent of that (maybe--if that)), but he's gotten smarter as a basketball player, added to his repetoire, and is still an athletic freak when compared to most everyone else in the league

[Pharcyde]

His head got above the rim on a dunk vs. The bulls.

[thegodfather]

dnt worry guys,Bron's just coasting and playin really smart basketball...id rather hav him look a lil less explosive and a lil less exciting as long as cavs continue to win and eventually get that CHIP...

[Dave3]

I disagree with the premise of this topic. Is LeBron James still the exact same, explosive athlete he was at 19? Maybe he's lost 5-10 percent of that (maybe--if that)), but he's gotten smarter as a basketball player, added to his repetoire, and is still an athletic freak when compared to most everyone else in the league
I don't doubt that at all, but it just seems weird that he'd start to look like he's declining before turning 25...

[Dave3]

:roll: at this thread...dude is playing at an all time great level, and some d-bags are wondering what is wrong with him LOL. Do you know how many back to back games Cavs had so far? Maybe he is just saving energy and playing smart basketball? Or is that so hard to grasp...
Did anyone mention anything about him playing bad? Not once was there a mention of him not playing like the best in the league, so your first statement means nothing. About your second point, if you took the time to actually read the first post you would've come across this


I've also noticed that he doesn't seem to try as hard to jump very high, but I'm not sure if I'm right

so clearly that idea was already brought up, and I was asking others for their opinions, you know, how a basketball forum is supposed to operate...

[v-unit]

All you have to do is look up LeBron James on youtube and find his dunks from this season to know he didn't lose any vertical. I say he is saving his energy for the dunk contest.

[LA_Showtime]

no one has said lebron james is playing bad this season. nobody has said lebron james is on the decline.... all we're saying is he's not as explosive as he was in seasons past. lol @ pacing himself... there's a huge difference between picking your spots and not having the ability to elevate. i figured most people on ish wouldn't notice, but for the people who have watched him since coming into the league it's quite obvious...

[DukeDelonte13]

this thread is just ridiculous. There is no decline in his athleticism, you see it less because he is involving his teammates more and controlling the ball less. If this was true, Lebron would probably be the first player to start declining at 25 without a major injury.

[sixer6ad]

no one has said lebron james is playing bad this season. nobody has said lebron james is on the decline.... all we're saying is he's not as explosive as he was in seasons past. lol @ pacing himself... there's a huge difference between picking your spots and not having the ability to elevate. i figured most people on ish wouldn't notice, but for the people who have watched him since coming into the league it's quite obvious...

He started in the NBA when he was 18 and has not missed any major time. He has had three full summers of additional Team USA play and his off-season workouts are becoming legendary - (nobody needs to hate on that fact...he's just a hard worker).
He has had additional season time in the playoffs.
In addition, he is 6-8 and listed at 250. He's not a Kobe, CP3, TParker body type. The fact that he flies the way he does is freakish...it will not last forever.

LBJ learns at least one major lesson per year and adds it to his knowledge: Last year's lesson was that nobody gets a prize for working your --- off in the regular season and being the best team. So...this year he is going to jump start the team every game...work on his jump shut a little more in the middle quarters...and save some for a needed 4th quarter surge. By doing that, they all hope to have some in the tank in April/May/June...because this team will need it. In addition, they need to have some 4th quarter leads in order to get some rest.

He will never not play hard, but he will not dine and dash for 48 minutes every game anymore....saving some for the playoffs.

[nbastatus]

Dude, he looks like he's barely getting off the ground compared to his former self. Before his head would be rim level on most of his dunks, right now it looks like he's barely getting up there. He's quick I guess, but doesn't get up high.
I agree, but I'm pretty sure he is saving it for the Slam Dunk Contest. :lol

[Dave3]

I agree, but I'm pretty sure he is saving it for the Slam Dunk Contest. :lol
I never said that's not a possibility, but I'm just asking around.

[che guevara]

I never said that's not a possibility, but I'm just asking around.
Remember when Lebron's athleticism seemed to be worse in 2007? Was that really the case (I'm 99% sure it was, I thought the same thing myself without going on message boards), and what was the reason for it? Maybe he's experiencing the same thing again right now.

[Fatal9]

Lebron was most explosive in his second and third years. Then obviously he gained a lot of weight. I think he has been as quick as ever this season though.


Highlights from tonight's game (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5tv0-uvQKIw)


He looks pretty f@cking explosive to me. :confusedshrug:
:oldlol: at the post up at :39-:41. Looks so robotic and coarse.

[lbj23clutch]

I think it has to do with him bieng too passive earlier this season, and him bieng too damn heavy for a wingman. 270 pounds is too heavy for a wingman, especially for LeBron's playing style who gets banged up inside the paint and relies on his explosiveness. He should consider going back down to around 250, if he wants to play a long healthy career.

[lbj23clutch]

05-06 was his most explosive year, he was dunking on everyone that year. Since then I think his leaping ability hasn't been the same, though his speed and quickness has remained the same. You also have to remember he's gotten alot stronger since then. And ALOT heavier, playng around 265-275. If he would lose weight and go back to 250, then I think he would be more explosive.

[Fatal9]

Could you imagine his vertical and explosiveness if he was around 200 lbs like MJ :eek:. No way in hell MJ can retain that level of quickness and leaping ability if he put on as much weight as Lebron (relative to his height of course, so probably like 235-240). Another reason why Lebron is a better athlete imo.

[BallersTalk]

Could you imagine his vertical and explosiveness if he was around 200 lbs like MJ :eek:. No way in hell MJ can retain that level of quickness and leaping ability if he put on as much weight as Lebron (relative to his height of course, so probably like 235-240). Another reason why Lebron is a better athlete imo.
LeBron's the GOAT athlete. Duh. But athleticism only gets you so far. Look at Kobe. Physically, he's no different from Michael Finley and Ray Allen. Yet, he's been a superior player.

[sergiorodriguez]

Yeh, long term, Lebron weighing 270 is really really bad for his knees. It doesnt matter how hard this guy works, you cant strengthen your knees and they always go out eventually. Lebron works really hard all over the court and gets up really high, coming down with 270 of eight on those knees over and over every game is not good for him if he wants to keep his explosiveness for longer.

I think even 250 is going to hurt this guy, if he went down to 240 he would still be stronger than most guys his size, have a quickness advantage over all of them, and put less stress on his knees, which means his athleticism will last longer.

[LA_Showtime]

LeBron's the GOAT athlete. Duh. But athleticism only gets you so far. Look at Kobe. Physically, he's no different from Michael Finley and Ray Allen. Yet, he's been a superior player.

thou sho wilt chamberlain fool lol

kobe's body control was superior to finley and allen... btw it's always funny when people mention kobe's athleticism and take offense when you're essentially complementing him.

[LA_Showtime]

He started in the NBA when he was 18 and has not missed any major time. He has had three full summers of additional Team USA play and his off-season workouts are becoming legendary - (nobody needs to hate on that fact...he's just a hard worker).
He has had additional season time in the playoffs.
In addition, he is 6-8 and listed at 250. He's not a Kobe, CP3, TParker body type. The fact that he flies the way he does is freakish...it will not last forever.

LBJ learns at least one major lesson per year and adds it to his knowledge: Last year's lesson was that nobody gets a prize for working your --- off in the regular season and being the best team. So...this year he is going to jump start the team every game...work on his jump shut a little more in the middle quarters...and save some for a needed 4th quarter surge. By doing that, they all hope to have some in the tank in April/May/June...because this team will need it. In addition, they need to have some 4th quarter leads in order to get some rest.

He will never not play hard, but he will not dine and dash for 48 minutes every game anymore....saving some for the playoffs.

what? he might be pacing himself, but i don't see why we would jump more slowly when driving to the hoop. :oldlol: again, he's still a freak athlete so this argument is next to pointless. people have just noticed he's not finishing as many freak layups as he was in seasons past

[2LeTTeRS]

LeBron's the GOAT athlete. Duh. But athleticism only gets you so far. Look at Kobe. Physically, he's no different from Michael Finley and Ray Allen. Yet, he's been a superior player.

This is a lie. Kobe at this stage is as quick and explosive as those players were in their primes. If your talking peak Kobe, he was a level above those guys. He was only under the guys like Vince, T Mac, Wade, Bron and possibly J Rich when at his best in terms of complete athleticism.

[Indian guy]

Remember when Lebron's athleticism seemed to be worse in 2007

Umm...not really. His play had fallen off compared to 05-06 because of lack of effort and teams guarding him better. These are his Top 10 dunks from 06-07: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9dCrWZmHArU. Clearly, he was as explosive as ever.

And :lol @ those still living in denial about his athletic regression this season, even though the visual evidence is so overwhelming in every game he's played. Try to find me one EXPLOSIVE dunk/layup LeBron's made in a halfcourt setting this season where he jumps really HIGH and gets off the ground quick(you know, like he used to the previous 6 seasons of his career). Go ahead.

[DuMa]

i think most of you are just used to lebron's mannerisms now. nothing he can do to surprise you in terms of explosion.

[Dave3]

i think most of you are just used to lebron's mannerisms now. nothing he can do to surprise you in terms of explosion.
Not really. It's an objective comparison to previous abilities. Mind you, for all we know LeBron has all his explosion and is opting to be more careful and not jump as high as possible on every dunk, but it's evident he hasn't been getting as high as he used to last year.

[KAJ=GOAT]

steriods are starting to take a toll on his bones making them more brittle.












I kid, I kid.


Its the extra weight hes carrying.

[ProfessorMurder]

Its the extra weight hes carrying.

What I was about to say.

The dude needs to drop some weight. He's pushing 265/270, that's what Kendrick Perkins weighs.

Get it down to like 240/245.

[davo ownz]

LeBron's more of a jumpshooter now. He want to be like Kobe. Be like Kobe.

You are a complete idiot. If he wanted a lethal jumper (if that's what your illiterate post was meant to say) why wouldn't he want to be like Ray Allen, Gilbert arenas??



32 PTS
7 RBS
9 AST

IF he has temporarily lost some of his explosiveness then I eagerly await when it returns

[davo ownz]

Umm...not really. His play had fallen off compared to 05-06 because of lack of effort and teams guarding him better. These are his Top 10 dunks from 06-07: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9dCrWZmHArU. Clearly, he was as explosive as ever.

And :lol @ those still living in denial about his athletic regression this season, even though the visual evidence is so overwhelming in every game he's played. Try to find me one EXPLOSIVE dunk/layup LeBron's made in a halfcourt setting this season where he jumps really HIGH and gets off the ground quick(you know, like he used to the previous 6 seasons of his career). Go ahead.

He is rusty obviously, has a few more pounds then would be ideal.

Look at the rounds those dunks were made, not so early in the season - players were fitter, used to the demanding schedule of NBA life. Give LeBron time and he will get back into his ideal weight range and be as explosive as ever.

[Johnni Gade]

Highlights from tonight's game (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5tv0-uvQKIw)


He looks pretty f@cking explosive to me. :confusedshrug:
BEAST

[triangleoffense]

Does anyone know how many minutes/games he's played so far in the NBA? He came into the league when he was 18 and has played starter minutes (35+ pg) ever since his first tip. For those of us who are old enough to remember (lol) Lebron's first possession was a successful tip ball and then a dunk on the other end. He's played 7 seasons of NBA basketball already and will soon qualify to be paid the vets minimum.

[che guevara]

Does anyone know how many minutes/games he's played so far in the NBA? He came into the league when he was 18 and has played starter minutes (35+ pg) ever since his first tip. For those of us who are old enough to remember (lol) Lebron's first possession was a successful tip ball and then a dunk on the other end. He's played 7 seasons of NBA basketball already and will soon qualify to be paid the vets minimum.
Including postseason, he's already played 545 games. In the regular season, he's played 19673 minutes, 22302 including postseason. Wear and tear could be an explanation for the athletic decline.

[inclinerator]

its kinda hard to get up with jash on ur balls

[Bodin]

Of course he didn't need to jump high in order to DUNK the ball. There's never a reason to jump as high as great leapers do! But they still do because they CAN. Why would LeBron suddenly stop at 24? Only if he CAN'T, and through 14 games he's clearly shown that he CAN'T.

He can't or he won't? Just because he hasn't shown it doesn't mean he cannot do it. Don't be so narrow minded.

Like a lot of others have mentioned, his weight might play a big factor in his leaping ability. Maybe conserving himself for the playoffs... maybe wear and tear... I think it's a combination of the above. In the end it doesn't really matter, he is still able to produce efficiently for his team.

[ProfessorMurder]

its kinda hard to get up with jash on ur balls

That's another 45 pounds to pull up with you.

[Dave3]

That's another 45 pounds to pull up with you.
Which to LeBron shouldn't be that much right?

[Bigsmoke]

he still looks pretty dangerous to me

[ProfessorMurder]

Which to LeBron shouldn't be that much right?

Well he's got to be used to it by now. Maybe PB gained some weight recently and that's what's causing LeBron's issues.

[chazzy]

its kinda hard to get up with jash on ur balls

:roll:

[kkling]

I have noticed zero difference. He still gets way up there if he wants to.

[plowking]

I heard he can't even touch the ring anymore, and he's just grazing the backboard when he tries to do board taps.

[LA_Showtime]

again, idiots saying he's choosing not to jump as high... WOW

[Lebron23]

Lebron was more explosive last year. This season he got most of his points from his jumpers.

And last week he injured his left wrist againts the Washington Wizards.

[Diesel J]

Again, I think those who think he's lost some his hops has more to do with the fact that he hasn't had the chances to get out on the break like last season so you have not seen as many dunks as last season around the same time.

[DukeDelonte13]

again, idiots saying he's choosing not to jump as high... WOW


Idiots thinking that Lebron has already lost a step before age 25....

WOW
:roll: :oldlol: :oldlol:

best part is he is having the best individual season of his career so far :oldlol:

haters got to hate.

[Diesel J]

haters got to hate.

:oldlol:

[Simple Jack]

There been a bunch of plays where he runs a fast-break but doesn't finish. The full-court speed is still there. He still blows by everyone with ease.

[KenneBell]

There's nothing wrong with him. He's just getting smarter about how to exert himself in the game.

[DECK]

Why am I the only one who doesn't see a decline? Can somebody link me to a clip where Lebron is clearly more explosive/athletic than he was vs. Indiana or Philly? In the last few games, it seems to me as if his athleticism is the same as it was last year.
LOL I agree he seems the same athletically wise as last year but i think he became a better jump shooter.

[LA_Showtime]

Idiots thinking that Lebron has already lost a step before age 25....

WOW
:roll: :oldlol: :oldlol:

best part is he is having the best individual season of his career so far :oldlol:

haters got to hate.

I love the idiots who use the hater excuse when they can't think of anything better to say.

Again, saying that LeBron James isn't as explosive as he was in seasons past is something I along with many others have observed.

Why am I even talking to you? You've proved in seasons past you're just an idiot who knows nothing about basketball.

[Poodle Bark]

Haters spend his first seven years in the league hating on every weakness LeBron could ever hope to have. So LeBron sets to conquer all his haters by basically become the perfect player with no weaknesses.

So what happens next?

Haters invert their strategy, now focusing their hate on LeBron's strengths.

LeBron, I think all this does is tell you that you can never rest. A Hater is always in position, ready to nab you. :oldlol:

[BigTicket]

I have noticed that he seems not to get up quite as far on his dunks, but I don't think it matters much. Probably just means he has some minor injury that he hasn't made public, most NBA players have those from time to time.

What actually matters is that he's once again playing better than anyone else in the league, and seems to have made some progress on his jump shot.

[sixer6ad]

I love the idiots who use the hater excuse when they can't think of anything better to say.

Again, saying that LeBron James isn't as explosive as he was in seasons past is something I along with many others have observed.

Why am I even talking to you? You've proved in seasons past you're just an idiot who knows nothing about basketball.

The smugness in your posts clearly reflect you don't want others to have opinions that don't match yours. You have solid basketball knowledge; you should just rely on that.

[DukeDelonte13]

I love the idiots who use the hater excuse when they can't think of anything better to say.

Again, saying that LeBron James isn't as explosive as he was in seasons past is something I along with many others have observed.

Why am I even talking to you? You've proved in seasons past you're just an idiot who knows nothing about basketball.


You think that Lebron has "lost explosiveness" and you wanna tell me I know nothing about basketball? I mean it doesn't take a basketball genius to understand that typically players don't even hit there prime to around 25, but you seem to think Lebron is already on decline. Great observation. :applause:
24 years old and losing it. Its just laughable; and somehow i'm the one who knows nothing about bball.
You are just a Lebron hater plain and simple.

[bagelred]

You know what? Reading this, when Lebron asks to come to New York, we'll say "Thanks, but no thanks." Who needs him....

[LA_Showtime]

The smugness in your posts clearly reflect you don't want others to have opinions that don't match yours. You have solid basketball knowledge; you should just rely on that.

Lol it's the weekday and I'm just bored.

[LA_Showtime]

You think that Lebron has "lost explosiveness" and you wanna tell me I know nothing about basketball? I mean it doesn't take a basketball genius to understand that typically players don't even hit there prime to around 25, but you seem to think Lebron is already on decline. Great observation. :applause:
24 years old and losing it. Its just laughable; and somehow i'm the one who knows nothing about bball.
You are just a Lebron hater plain and simple.

LMAO @ LeBron hater. Give me a break. I prefer LeBron's game to Kobe's game. Oh wait, now I'm a Kobe hater.

[Dave3]

LMAO @ LeBron hater. Give me a break. I prefer LeBron's game to Kobe's game. Oh wait, now I'm a Kobe hater.
Really? Most people here find LeBron's game ugly compared to others...

[lbj23clutch]

LMAO @ LeBron hater. Give me a break. I prefer LeBron's game to Kobe's game. Oh wait, now I'm a Kobe hater.
Man, have you been watching any Cavs games at all this season? He's still a run away fright train and still as quick as any guard in the NBA. I mean he looks like a tight end going full speed on the fastbreak. He may have lost some leaping ability from his 03-06 years, but you gotta keep in mind that LeBron has gained ALOT of muscle weight, since then. Still it's amazing how he can gain all that sheer strength and yet still maintain his quickness and speed. Also you have to remember, LeBron only really started to seriously lift weights in 2008. And not suprisingly since that time, he has gone up to 270 pounds, compared to bieng only at 240 in his rookie year.


Overall, I think LeBron is as explosive as ever, he's alot stronger compared to his Rookie year, and has maintained speed, quickness, and agility.

[Solid Snake]

If he's not going to post up, there's NO NEED for him to be that heavy. He needs to either lose weight, or start posting up.

[LA_Showtime]

Really? Most people here find LeBron's game ugly compared to others...

Not his fluidity or whatever... just the way he approaches the game.

[Ancient Legend]

Watching the Cavs this year, I've mirrored many of the thoughts people have been voicing regarding LeBron's explosiveness, and particularly how it seems that it has disappeared. The guy doesn't seem to get nearly as high as he used to and most people have noticed it. I've also noticed that he doesn't seem to try as hard to jump very high, but I'm not sure if I'm right. So for those that watch the Cavs frequently, has he just not been trying to jump as high or explode as much, or has he actually lost a step before even turning 25?


Bump.

He was just pacing himself.

[kmartshopper]

Baseball prime: 27 to 32
Football prime: 23 to 28
Basketball prime: 24 to 29

Based on his size and style of play it seems plausible that Lebron could drop off earlier than average, say around 27/28. Lebron is a borderline middle aged player imo.

[DukeDelonte13]

Baseball prime: 27 to 32
Football prime: 23 to 28
Basketball prime: 24 to 29

Based on his size and style of play it seems plausible that Lebron could drop off earlier than average, say around 27/28. Lebron is a borderline middle aged player imo.

:wtf:


Not this sh*t again.

[RedBlackAttack]

Bump.

He was just pacing himself.
Absolutely. During last night's game, he had two of the most explosive plays I have ever seen out of him. On two separate occasions, he went coast-to-coast at full speed and got to the cup... One for a dunk and the other for a reverse layup. I think he now understands exactly how to pace himself so that he is at full capacity come playoff time.

[Sticks]

Yeah, borderline middle-aged: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZrCAskM65N4

I hope I can do that when I'm borderline middle-aged...

[smoovegittar]

The Cavs are in great shape right now. I'd say Lebron is being smart and gearing up for the playoffs. You'll get your share of explosiveness then.

I believe it's called playing sensibly.

[ILLsmak]

Come on you guys, it's not nice to bump people's threads to prove they are wrong :no:

-Smak

[Diesel J]

Lebron is a borderline middle aged player imo.

Yeah, middle aged players can do this (from yesterday)

Lebron James warmup 01

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lHoBXCIpDVA

LeBron Leads Cavs To Fifth Straight Win

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zXxZfrWbHlA

from :32 sec-->:37 secs

:lol

[kmartshopper]

Even a sub prime Lebron will still be able to do things most can't do, especially if he gains any saavy at all. He is on the outskirts of human physical ability. I'm not bashing him, just setting myself up to be not disappointed. He's just too big to sustain his athleticism. Maybe I'm wrong, maybe he's something new, something the human race has never seen before. I hope he is. It's just that it seems like really extreme abilities burn out fast. Super geniuses fill chalkboards with equations that explain all sorts of crazy ish and then end up in mental institutions, athletes jump out of the building and outrun everybody and then suddenly their knees are gone

[ds123]

Come on you guys, it's not nice to bump people's threads to prove they are wrong :no:

-Smak


Well, if you read carefully what the OP said, he could still be totally 100% right in his observations even if Lebron was jumping 5 feet in the air last week.


OP wasn't saying LBJ has lost it, just that he hasn't been showing it this year as of November(for whatever reason).

[crisoner]

Stop the LeBron threads please.

[LA_Showtime]

Wow. I regret posting that stuff. Haha. :oldlol: Although I do think LeBron's two foot leap has regressed.

[gts]

lebron's crab dribble is slower now.. more like a stone crab than a king crab

[macpierce]

lebron is still the most athletic player in the league, itll be interesting how his career turns out at the age of 30