Mitch Richmond not making the Hall of Fame...

[D.J.]

is absolutely disgraceful. Forget that he played on sh*tty teams. This was a player that not only put up 21/4/3+ over his career, but his first 10 seasons were basically his prime. IMO, he could have never played a game after 1998 and was still deserving of the HOF. His first 10 seasons:


22.0 PPG/5.9 RPG/4.2 APG/1.0 SPG on 46.8% and 36.7% from downtown

22.1 PPG/4.6 RPG/2.9 APG/1.3 SPG on 49.7% and 35.8% from downtown

23.9 PPG/5.9 RPG/3.1 APG/1.6 SPG on 49.4% and 34.8% from downtown

22.5 PPG/4.0 RPG/5.1 APG/1.2 SPG on 46.8% and 38.4% from downtown

21.9 PPG/3.4 RPG/4.9 APG/1.2 SPG on 47.4% and 36.9% from downtown

23.4 PPG/3.7 RPG/4.0 APG/1.3 SPG on 44.5% and 40.7% from downtown

22.8 PPG/4.4 RPG/3.8 APG/1.1 SPG on 44.6% and 36.8% from downtown

23.1 PPG/3.3 RPG/3.1 APG/1.5 SPG on 44.7% and 43.7% from downtown

25.9 PPG/3.9 RPG/4.2 APG/1.5 SPG on 45.4% and 42.8% from downtown

23.2 PPG/3.3 RPG/4.0 APG/1.3 SPG on 44.5% and 38.9% from downtown


You don't get much more consistent than that. In addition, he was a 6x All-Star, 3x All-NBA 2nd team, and 2x All-NBA 3rd team. Even though he didn't do it as the go to guy, he also has a ring. His first 10 seasons should have made him a lock. Not only was he not a lock, but he's been out of the league for eight years and still has not been voted in. He is certainly more deserving than some that are already in the HOF.

[ProfessorMurder]

He was on the cover of NBA Live 96, HE HAS TO BE GOOD! But seriously, he was really f*cking good.

[D.J.]

He was on the cover of NBA Live 96, HE HAS TO BE GOOD! But seriously, he was really f*cking good.



I used to have that game. Mitch was unconscious from beyond the arc. Mitch Richmond during the 90's was basically Vince Carter without the athleticism and a better shot selection.

[Bigsmoke]

Mitch Richmond > James Worthy

[ProfessorMurder]

Check this out it's f*cking sweet:

Edit I linked the wrong vid, let me find it...

[Kblaze8855]

While im a "If you have to discuss it...they shouldnt go" guy on the HOF I still gotta say...

The fact that Reggie is a near lock to make it and Mitch probably want is just funny as hell to me. Like 11 people would have said Reggie was better than Mitch and their primes overlapped almost the whole way.

Reggie got that combo of old man love for a few years and a grip of memorable moments in games and series that didnt matter to build his legacy. Guy has a ****ing 30 for 30 episode coming on about how he murdered the Knicks...when the Knicks beat him in the playoffs more often than he beat them.

Reggie Miller is retrospect greatness at its worst. Reggie wasnt considered as good as Sprewellbut hes a first 3 ballot HOf player I bet.

And Mitch has almost no chance....

[D.J.]

Mitch Richmond > James Worthy


Mitch Richmond > James Worthy, Joe Dumars, Calvin Murphy, and Tiny Archibald

[ProfessorMurder]

Here's the Mitch video, turns out I had the link right the first time haha. (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Jbtn4B5GH-M&feature=PlayList&p=83ECFDD9D81D7790&index=17)

[D.J.]

While im a "If you have to discuss it...they shouldnt go" guy on the HOF I still gotta say...


That's not necessarily the case. You can discuss a player's case and some have a case(ex: Tracy McGrady, Vince Carter, Paul Pierce).



The fact that Reggie is a near lock to make it and Mitch probably want is just funny as hell to me. Like 11 people would have said Reggie was better than Mitch and their primes overlapped almost the whole way.


It's absolutely horrible. Mitch was much more of a complete player and was unfortunate to play on some horrible teams.



Reggie got that combo of old man love for a few years and a grip of memorable moments in games and series that didnt matter to build his legacy. Guy has a ****ing 30 for 30 episode coming on about how he murdered the Knicks...when the Knicks beat him in the playoffs more often than he beat them.


Reggie was incredibly clutch, but the Knicks usually did have the upper hand on him. His great moments have really been blown out of proportion.



Reggie Miller is retrospect greatness at its worst. Reggie wasnt considered as good as Sprewellbut hes a first 3 ballot HOf player I bet.


Sprewell was another guy that was more complete. He even made the All-NBA 1st team in 1994. You can say he didn't deserve it, but he was worthy of at least the 2nd team.



And Mitch has almost no chance....


Sadly, that's probably true.

[chitownsfinest]

While im a "If you have to discuss it...they shouldnt go" guy on the HOF I still gotta say...

The fact that Reggie is a near lock to make it and Mitch probably want is just funny as hell to me. Like 11 people would have said Reggie was better than Mitch and their primes overlapped almost the whole way.

Reggie got that combo of old man love for a few years and a grip of memorable moments in games and series that didnt matter to build his legacy. Guy has a ****ing 30 for 30 episode coming on about how he murdered the Knicks...when the Knicks beat him in the playoffs more often than he beat them.

Reggie Miller is retrospect greatness at its worst. Reggie wasnt considered as good as Sprewellbut hes a first 3 ballot HOf player I bet.

And Mitch has almost no chance....
Agreed, it's a complete a joke. If anything, Pippen's 93 series performance against NY>> Any of Reggie's series performances against NY

[Alhazred]

Agreed, it's a complete a joke. If anything, Pippen's 93 series performance against NY>> Any of Reggie's series performances against NY

Pippen>>>Miller in general.

[Force]

Richmond absolutely deserves to be in the HOF. He was a monster, such a great post up game and the pull up jumper, or jumpers in general were just money.

[Ancient Legend]

The HOF should be reserved for legendary players.

His career stats of 21 ppg FG 45% 3PT 38% look pedestrian to me (in HOF terms). He didn't have any legendary performances a-la-Reggie.

Sure he had over 20K points, but you can credit that to longevity, like Mark Jackson getting over 10K assists but he's not getting in the HOF either.

I bet none will remember any of them 10 years from now.

[D.J.]

His career stats of 21 ppg FG 45% 3PT 38% look pedestrian to me (in HOF terms). He didn't have any legendary performances a-la-Reggie.


He had many good games, but it's not his fault his teams were horrible.



Sure he had over 20K points, but you can credit that to longevity, like Mark Jackson getting over 10K assists but he's not getting in the HOF either.


Longevity is one thing to consider for the HOF. Mark Jackson was a solid playmaker, but he was never dominant. He was never an elite point guard. Mitch was an elite swingman. He was consistently putting up 20+/4/4 or something along those lines. He did it every year for 10 years.



I bet none will remember any of them 10 years from now.


True fans and fans that were able to see him play will always remember him. I watched him play from 1988 right until the day he won his ring.

[Shep]

no, he does not deserve it. i could name 168 different nba players who had better careers than richmond

[dyna]

Richmond or Joe Johnson??

[D.J.]

Richmond or Joe Johnson??


I'd say Mitch. Mitch was a better outside shooter and was a better defender. Mitch's defense was better than most people gave him credit for.

[L.Kizzle]

A few other 90s cats, Tim Hardaway, Chris Mullin, Kevin Johnson.

Alonzo Mourning will probably also make it before him (should he.)

[Bandito]

Richmond>>>Jordan

[D.J.]

A few other 90s cats, Tim Hardaway, Chris Mullin, Kevin Johnson.

Alonzo Mourning will probably also make it before him (should he.)


Mourning is borderline, though I would learn towards yes. 1x All-NBA 1st team, 1x All-NBA 2nd team, 2x All-Defensive 1st teams, and 2 DPOY awards. He was also top 3 in MVP voting twice. His first eight seasons were very good.

Mullin's prime was only five seasons(six if you include his shortened 1992-93 season. He was done after that.)

Hardaway's prime was also around 5-6 seasons.

Kevin Johnson had six great seasons.


If you only have 5-6 great seasons like Mullin, Hardaway, or KJ, it's not going to be enough. Mourning had eight, which gives him a better shot. I'd vote Mourning in if I could.

[magic chiongson]

top shooting guards in the 90s

1. jordan
2. tie (richmond & reggie miller)
3. who cares

if reggie miller gets it, so should richmond

[robertshaw_1]

I used to have that game. Mitch was unconscious from beyond the arc. Mitch Richmond during the 90's was basically Vince Carter without the athleticism and a better shot selection.

best nba game ever.....The sonics was "the team" of that game (Payton-Hawkings-Schrempf-Kemp-Perkins)

no commentators....just "threeeeee".....at any three point shoot...

[D.J.]

top shooting guards in the 90s

1. jordan
2. tie (richmond & reggie miller)
3. who cares

if reggie miller gets it, so should richmond


Jordan, Mitch, Petro, Dumars, Starks, Hornacek, and maybe even Steve Smith were all better than Reggie.

[L.Kizzle]

Jordan, Mitch, Petro, Dumars, Starks, Hornacek, and maybe even Steve Smith were all better than Reggie.
Starks, Hornacek nope. Petro didn't play long enough. Steve Smith ... maybe

[steve]

Starks, Hornacek nope. Petro didn't play long enough. Steve Smith ... maybe
Petrovic is already in the Hall of Fame, but more based on his international resume.

[L.Kizzle]

Petrovic is already in the Hall of Fame, but more based on his international resume.
I know, I'm talking about NBA careers.

[D.J.]

I know, I'm talking about NBA careers.


Even during his time as a Net, Petro was better. More versatile scorer, better ball handler, and a better three point shooter.

[Bigsmoke]

top shooting guards in the 90s

1. jordan
2. tie (richmond & reggie miller)
3. who cares

if reggie miller gets it, so should richmond

I heard Clyde Drexler was kinda good. :confusedshrug:

[Samurai Swoosh]

Richmond was always one of my favorites. Oustanding. And he's got a GREAT first name.

:pimp:

[DCL]

he would had made it if he was croatian.

[Cosmonaut]

i guess the more important question is, how many players who have scored over 20,000 points are not in the HOF yet?

cause you don't score 20,000 points in the nba due to longevity, its cause you had game.

[JohnnySic]

Mitch Richmond > James Worthy
There have been literally hundreds of NBA players better than James Worthy...

[Lebron23]

Mitch Richmond is a future Hall of famer. He's the 3rd best shooting guard in the 1990's after Michael Jordan and Clyde Drexler.

[JohnnySic]

It's absolutely horrible. Mitch was much more of a complete player and was unfortunate to play on some horrible teams.
Richmond was better at his peak but Miller was good longer, and longevity does matter.

Kind of like how people say that Charles Barkley was better than Karl Malone at their respective peaks (arguable). That may be so, but Malone did it longer, and that matters.

[JohnnySic]

Mitch Richmond is a future Hall of famer. He's the 2nd best shooting guard in the 1990's after Michael Jordan.
1. MJ
2. Glyde
3. Mitch

[Lebron23]

1. MJ
2. Glyde
3. Mitch


Drexler was a beast during his prime. One of the most electrifying High Flyers in NBA History.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SvjJA93Xy9Y&feature=related

[ViNsAnItY1990]

Drexler > Richmond

[Poodle]

i swear i'll never understand how some people end up reinvented in hindsight as somebody legendary, when it was NOTHING like that when they were alive/playing.

its like the same with 2Pac. like half the generation that loves 2Pac so much weren't even alive or 5 yrs old when he was alive and getting radio play, but nowhere near the rap 'legend' he's become now that he's dead. its nuts.

mitch richmond? :lol you might as well be throwing Glen Rice in there too....Tim Bug deserves legendary status way before mitch richmond based on game alone. and mitch played on some bad teams where he was their primary chucker too.

[hawkfan]

is absolutely disgraceful.

Plus 1.

The Rock deserves to be in the Hall of Fame.

[malek4980]

Even though he didn't do it as the go to guy, he also has a ring.

WOW. That is one of the biggest understatements I've ever read. He didn't do it as the go-to-guy? Umm . . . he played four total minutes during the entire playoffs that year for the Lakers; in other words, he didn't do it PERIOD! Might as well give Adam Morrison credit for the Lakers championship. Sure, even though Adam Morrison didn't do it as the go-to-guy, he also has a ring! Do you see what BS that is?

And, no, Richmond is not a Hall of Fame player. He was a mediocre rebounder and passer who never finished in the top ten in MVP voting EVER. He did absolutely nothing in the playoffs (and he played in just 23 games!). His career PER is 17.6.

Basically, you think he should be in the hall because he was a very good scorer for ten years (I say very good and not great because he was in the top five in scoring only twice).

[willds09]

mitch was a beast, tha m in run tmc with tha warriors back in the day, 95 all star mvp, cover of nba live 97, and 1 ring with tha lakers in 02.

[malek4980]

mitch was a beast, tha m in run tmc with tha warriors back in the day
On a team that went nowhere.

95 all star mvp
MVP in the most meaningless game of the season? Congrats?

cover of nba live 97
Relevance?

and 1 ring with tha lakers in 02.
He played four total minutes in the playoffs that year. Give me a break.

[willds09]

On a team that went nowhere.

MVP in the most meaningless game of the season? Congrats?

Relevance?

He played four total minutes in the playoffs that year. Give me a break.
wow ur a hater :roll:

[Mateo]

They should start a "Hall of Good" and Mitch gets in.

[L.Kizzle]

They should start a "Hall of Good" and Mitch gets in.
There a re a lot of "good" ,players in the Hall of Fame.

Walt Bellamy
Adrian Dantley
Joe Dumars

just too name a few.

[Shep]

There a re a lot of "good" ,players in the Hall of Fame.

Walt Bellamy
Adrian Dantley
Joe Dumars

just too name a few.
uh walt ballamy was better than "good", and had a number of hall of fame worthy seasons:

1963 - played all 80 games, top 7 overall, 3rd best center behind wilt and russell, 27.9ppg, 16.4rpg, 2.9apg, 53%fg (2nd best in the nba)

1964 - played all 80 games, 27ppg, 17rpg, 1.6apg

1965 - played all 80 games, 3rd best center behind wilt and russell, top 8 overall, 24.8ppg, 14.6rpg, 2.4apg

1962 - missed only 1 game, top 9 overall, 31.6ppg, 19rpg, 2.7apg, 52%fg (led league)

1972 - played all 82 games, 18.6ppg, 12.8rpg, 3.2apg, 55%fg

1966 - played all 80 games, 22.8ppg, 15.7rpg, 2.9apg, 51%fg, 3rd best center

[magnax1]

http://www.basketball-reference.com/play-index/pcm_finder.cgi?request=1&sum=0&p1=richmmi01&y1=1997&p2=millere01&y2=1991
A comparison between Richmond and Miller's best seasons. Pretty much flat even. Especially per 36 minutes, but Miller had much much more longevity then Mitch. Really, I don't think Richmond deserves it that much.

[D.J.]

WOW. That is one of the biggest understatements I've ever read. He didn't do it as the go-to-guy? Umm . . . he played four total minutes during the entire playoffs that year for the Lakers; in other words, he didn't do it PERIOD! Might as well give Adam Morrison credit for the Lakers championship. Sure, even though Adam Morrison didn't do it as the go-to-guy, he also has a ring! Do you see what BS that is?


Reggie Miller, John Stockton, Karl Malone, Dominique Wilkins, and Gary Payton(until 2006 at age 38) didn't win a ring either. Are you holding that against them?



He was a mediocre rebounder


He was a guard and still put up 4-5 RPG. He also had two seasons at 5.9. Not exactly poor numbers from a 6'5" shooting guard.



and passer


He had multiple seasons averaging 4 APG and averaged over five a game one season. Not all that bad considering he wasn't a point guard.



who never finished in the top ten in MVP voting EVER.


Did you watch those Kings teams from the mid 90's? They were god awful. Mitch could have put up 30/7/7 like LeBron James on those teams and he still wouldn't have received any MVP recognition.



He did absolutely nothing in the playoffs (and he played in just 23 games!).


20.1 PPG/7.3 RPG/4.4 APG, 22.3 PPG/5.2 RPG/2.4 APG, and 21.0 PPG/4.3 RPG/3.0 APG were his statlines from his three playoff seasons prior to his Laker days. He also shot over 50% from the field in '91 with Golden State. When he was in the playoffs, he did fine.



His career PER is 17.6.


Joe Dumars had a lower career PER and he's in the HOF. Your point?


Basically, you think he should be in the hall because he was a very good scorer for ten years (I say very good and not great because he was in the top five in scoring only twice).


He was a consistent scorer, excellent outside shooter, respectable rebounder and passer, and a better defender than most people gave him credit for. Reggie Miller was only a scorer and people think he should be in the HOF. Not all players are fortunate to play on good teams. That shouldn't be held against them.


And if you want to get into longevity, Mitch averaged no fewer than 21.9 PPG in his first 10 seasons. In those 10 seasons, he averaged at least 21/4/3 in all but one season.

[veilside23]

miller is overrated. mitch is underrated.. the dude is a beast...

[L.Kizzle]

Bump

[Round Mound]

If Reggie Miller Made It. I Don`t See Why Not Mitch Richmond. Mitch was Better Than Reggie!

[Locked_Up_Tonight]

I know this board loves to spout off about peak. But longevity matters. And WINNING matters.

Mitch Richmond is a career loser. Reggie Miller may not have had great stats but he did make it to the Finals as the man. He also made it to a couple of ECFs as well.

Mitch Richmond would only make the playoffs most years if he bought a ticket.

There are degrees of winning as well.

[eliteballer]

Mitch Richmond > James Worthy, Joe Dumars, Calvin Murphy, and Tiny Archibald

All credibility lost:roll:

[jstern]

He was on the cover of NBA Live 96, HE HAS TO BE GOOD! But seriously, he was really f*cking good.

You meant NBA Live 97.

[stalkerforlife]

Mitch played in a total of 23 playoff games, 21 of which he started. In 14 seasons.

He could damn sure shoot, though.

[Roundball_Rock]

He should make it. He was the second best SG of the 90's (Drexler is better in terms of careers but if you limit it just to the 90's Richmond has the edge). If Miller made it then Richmond should since Richmond was the superior player.

[stalkerforlife]

He should make it. He was the second best SG of the 90's (Drexler is better in terms of careers but if you limit it just to the 90's Richmond has the edge). If Miller made it then Richmond should since Richmond was the superior player.

:biggums:

[Stringer Bell]

While im a "If you have to discuss it...they shouldnt go" guy on the HOF I still gotta say...

The fact that Reggie is a near lock to make it and Mitch probably want is just funny as hell to me. Like 11 people would have said Reggie was better than Mitch and their primes overlapped almost the whole way.

Reggie got that combo of old man love for a few years and a grip of memorable moments in games and series that didnt matter to build his legacy. Guy has a ****ing 30 for 30 episode coming on about how he murdered the Knicks...when the Knicks beat him in the playoffs more often than he beat them.

Reggie Miller is retrospect greatness at its worst. Reggie wasnt considered as good as Sprewellbut hes a first 3 ballot HOf player I bet.

And Mitch has almost no chance....

Reggie got overrated due to those playoffs series with the Knicks. He was a good player for a long time, but fairly one-dimensional. Richmond was indeed the superior player.

Not that I didn't enjoy watching Miller's performances in MSG. It wasn't only the 25 pt quarter in game 5 in 1994, and the 8 pts in 10 seconds or whataever in game 5 in 1995, but he also killed the Knicks in game 4 in 1998 with clutch shots, and that game pretty much ended the series, giving them a 3-1 lead with HCA

[Big#50]

I used to have that game. Mitch was unconscious from beyond the arc. Mitch Richmond during the 90's was basically Vince Carter without the athleticism and a better shot selection.
Nah dude. RICHMOND was athletic as ****. He used to get lobs like crazy. Of course Carter is probably top 3 athletic players ever, but Richmond's athleticism is always forgotten.

[GimmeThat]

the lack of playoff games is probably what hurts him over say someone like Reggie.

[JohnFreeman]

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/BuZYeV9IAAAoTyC.jpg:large

[SexSymbol]

I don't think anybody outside of top 30 should be in the hall of fame