Past Grammy Winners For Rap Album Of The Year... [Archive] - Message Board Basketball Forum

bdreason

03-17-2010, 01:56 PM

2010 - Eminem for Relapse
2009 – Lil Wayne for Tha Carter III
2008 – Kanye West for Graduation
2007 – Ludacris for Release Therapy
2006 – Kanye West for Late Registration
2005 – Kanye West for The College Dropout
2004 – Outkast for Speakerboxxx/The Love Below
2003 – Eminem for The Eminem Show
2002 – OutKast for Stankonia
2001 – Eminem for The Marshall Mathers LP
2000 – Eminem for The Slim Shady LP
1999 – Jay-Z for Vol. 2: Hard Knock Life
1998 – Puff Daddy & the Family for No Way Out
1997 – The Fugees for The Score
1996 – Naughty By Nature for Poverty's Paradise

I'm okay with the bolded ones.

v-unit

03-17-2010, 02:02 PM

Jay-Z's worst album won album of the year...What?? He should have won in 1996, I'm fine with not winning one for Blueprint/Black album because they would have won any other year, but Eminem's MMLP/Eminem Show were just as good.

Lupe Fiasco got robbed BOTH years. Sad this man doesn't get more attention, severely underrated

v-unit

03-17-2010, 02:04 PM

50 got robbed in 2003

Ludacris robbed T.i

Relapse was just terrible but i guess nothing significantly better came out this year

Jay-z only deserved it in 96

Rest seems legit other then diddys album
Just looking over that, there is only like 3 choices I agree with... Anyone feel the same way?

GRODT over Eminem Show? :roll: 19 songs about being a thug can never be better than the Eminem Show. TES was too complete from every aspect and is arguably his greatest album

Bigsmoke

03-17-2010, 02:05 PM

OneMoreSucka

03-17-2010, 02:09 PM

Seriously what '98 album was better than No Way out? That one wasn't even close.

Black Joker

03-17-2010, 02:13 PM

those are the only ones i agree with

American Gangster and The Cool were WAAAAY better than Graduation
what rap album in 2002 was better than Stankonia?

v-unit

03-17-2010, 02:14 PM

It's kind of confusing because it came out in 1997 but it's kind of hard for me to recall something better...I like "Can-I-Bus" but that was in no position to win. Why are half of them from the year before and the other half THAT year?

StroShow4

03-17-2010, 02:17 PM

I wouldn't expect whoever makes these Grammy decisions to know anything about rap music, so this does not surprise me.

Bigsmoke

03-17-2010, 02:19 PM

what rap album in 2002 was better than Stankonia?

u mean 2001?

Blueprint

Bigsmoke

03-17-2010, 02:20 PM

Seriously what '98 album was better than No Way out? That one wasn't even close.

1997?

Wu-Tang Forever and Life After Death

hell... Uptown Saturday Night was better than No Way Out but i guess No Way Out isnt a wrong answer

v-unit

03-17-2010, 02:21 PM

1997?

Wu-Tang Forever and Life After Death

See this is confusing...Life After Death came out in 1997, but so did No Way Out and NWO won it for 1998. How do they determine what year albums fall under? Is it based on which half of the year they come out?

Dasher

03-17-2010, 02:22 PM

u mean 2001?

BlueprintLOL.

Bigsmoke

03-17-2010, 02:25 PM

See this is confusing...Life After Death came out in 1997, but so did No Way Out and NWO won it for 1998. How do they determine what year albums fall under? Is it based on which half of the year they come out?

all award shows do that besides what... the BET awards?

Bigsmoke

03-17-2010, 02:31 PM

LOL.

there is really nothing to laugh about.

Blueprint was the rap best album of that decade. Stankonia wasnt even half as good as Aquemini. I bought both and there is really no debate.

Dasher

03-17-2010, 02:40 PM

there is really nothing to laugh about.

Blueprint was the rap best album of that decade. Stankonia wasnt even half as good as Aquemini. I bought both and there is really no debate.Blueprint was dated and cheesy on the day it was released. It is a 2 and a half mic album that was elevated to classic status because of hype. Stankonia was another otherworldly effort by OutKast.

blasian

03-17-2010, 02:50 PM

Seriously what '98 album was better than No Way out? That one wasn't even close.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BS181X4F3bw

Black Joker

03-17-2010, 04:03 PM

there is really nothing to laugh about.

Blueprint was the rap best album of that decade. Stankonia wasnt even half as good as Aquemini. I bought both and there is really no debate.
i'm a fan of Jay-z... but no way the Blueprint was better than Stankonia.

Gundress

03-17-2010, 04:46 PM

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BS181X4F3bw

Kayne West.. I am happy for you but I am gonna let you finish but Ol'Dirty Bastard had the best interruption speech of all time. :oldlol:

Knicks101

03-17-2010, 05:05 PM

Seriously what '98 album was better than No Way out? That one wasn't even close.

Not a huge fan of that album. Although Victory is one of the greatest songs of all time.

Yo the sun don't shine forever, but as long as we here then we might as well shine together.

OneMoreSucka

03-17-2010, 05:18 PM

Not a huge fan of that album. Although Victory is one of the greatest songs of all time.

Yo the sun don't shine forever, but as long as we here then we might as well shine together.
Go listen to that shit right now!!!!!!!!! It was a great album!

CeoTypeDoe619

03-17-2010, 05:18 PM

GRODT over Eminem Show? :roll: 19 songs about being a thug can never be better than the Eminem Show. TES was too complete from every aspect and is arguably his greatest album

Wow eminem show was not even his 2nd best album. And eminem talking about od'ing and popping pills is more relevant? Come on brah em probably lacks the least substance when he raps. But obviously your a white boy who worships eminem so no reason in arguing

Knicks101

03-17-2010, 05:23 PM

Go listen to that shit right now!!!!!!!!! It was a great album!

I've listened to it plenty of times. The first time was when I was 7 years old. It was just okay back then and it's just okay now!

OneMoreSucka

03-17-2010, 05:28 PM

I've listened to it plenty of times. The first time was when I was 7 years old. It was just okay back then and it's just okay now!
But over any '98 album? Don't give me that life after death bullshit, it doesn't count!!!!!!

Knicks101

03-17-2010, 06:06 PM

But over any '98 album? Don't give me that life after death bullshit, it doesn't count!!!!!!

Why doesn't Life After Death count?

Anyway, I'd take this over No Way Out.

http://i734.photobucket.com/albums/ww345/efad1/album-presents-the-carnival-featuri.jpg

97 was a pretty shitty year for rap now that I'm looking back at it.

phoenix18

03-17-2010, 08:02 PM

Its pretty sad that Nas didnt win one grammy.

Bigsmoke, I was bumping H to the Izzo today, but the blueprint is not that great of an album. That and Renegade are pretty much the only songs I like from it. I think it got that classic status because it dropped on 9/11.

50's GRODT should have won. No doubt about it.

GOBB

03-17-2010, 08:10 PM

Eminem winning is like a veteran being selected to the Pro Bowl based on rep and not his actual performance.

lilBjennings

03-17-2010, 08:12 PM

LOL @ 2003 not being 50, i mean i dont like the guy but seriously? that album was bumpin for like 3 years

back then it was ll bout 50, like him or not you know it.

v-unit

03-17-2010, 08:20 PM

Wow eminem show was not even his 2nd best album. And eminem talking about od'ing and popping pills is more relevant? Come on brah em probably lacks the least substance when he raps. But obviously your a white boy who worships eminem so no reason in arguing

Yeah I'm white but Eminem is my third favourite mainstream artist so :confusedshrug: to your post because you assumed everything I said was because I worship him because of similar skin color.

Name me a song that was on TES that was below average. I'll say "Drips" and even that would have probably made the album for some artists. Besides that, he has 14 amazing songs. Seriously, name me a weak song off that album besides Drips :confusedshrug:

And then take that information, and compare it to SSLP :confusedshrug: . Yeah some of my favourite Eminem songs were on SSLP like "If I had" and "Rock Bottom" and "Bad Meets Evil" but he also had songs like "My Fault" and "*** On Everybody" :oldlol: What you heard Cleaning out my closet was his single and didn't like it so you assumed his album was trash? Anybody who listened to Eminem's big 3 albums would never rate TES as the worst one.

Now go listen to TES and tell me how it's worse than GRODT?

v-unit

03-17-2010, 08:21 PM

Eminem winning is like a veteran being selected to the Pro Bowl based on rep and not his actual performance.

You're talking about Relapse, right? What would you have win in its place? I'd say Blueprint 3 but nothing else really comes to mind :confusedshrug: If the world was perfect J.Cole would win it for his mixtape "Warm Up"

RaininThrees

03-17-2010, 08:25 PM

Where's the Love for the Fresh Prince & DJ Jazzy Jeff?

You can't remember 1988??

phoenix18

03-17-2010, 08:30 PM

You're talking about Relapse, right? What would you have win in its place? I'd say Blueprint 3 but nothing else really comes to mind :confusedshrug: If the world was perfect J.Cole would win it for his mixtape "Warm Up"
Anything but BP3.

v-unit

03-17-2010, 08:31 PM

Anything but BP3.

Why? You think it was the worst album released? You think RELAPSE was better?!?!? Deeper Than Rap?!?

GOBB

03-17-2010, 08:57 PM

BP3 easy for me. Relaspe was a let down.

playtetris

03-17-2010, 09:09 PM

bp3 > relapse, but both albums were pretty mediocre.

'stankonia' is one of the weakest outkast albums; personally i'd put it behind 'blueprint', but i'm not massively big on that album either apart from like half the beats.

playtetris

03-17-2010, 09:11 PM

Bigsmoke, I was bumping H to the Izzo today, but the blueprint is not that great of an album. That and Renegade are pretty much the only songs I like from it. I think it got that classic status because it dropped on 9/11.

wow, i hate those tracks. 'jigga that *****' and 'song cry' were also horrible.

v-unit

03-17-2010, 09:23 PM

You hate Song Cry?????

/ban

I could NEVER get into Outkast. Not even songs like "Hey Ya" and sorry ms. jackson.

Black Joker

03-17-2010, 09:30 PM

You hate Song Cry?????

/ban

I could NEVER get into Outkast. Not even songs like "Hey Ya" and sorry ms. jackson.
:eek:

too each their own. i'd advice going back and listening to Spottieottiedopaliscious and the rest of Aquemini, but ya can't force someone to like something

phoenix18

03-17-2010, 09:31 PM

wow, i hate those tracks. 'jigga that *****' and 'song cry' were also horrible.
You hate renegade? Wow....

playtetris

03-17-2010, 09:33 PM

You hate Song Cry?????

/ban

I could NEVER get into Outkast. Not even songs like "Hey Ya" and sorry ms. jackson.

yeah. i love 'heart of the city', 'u don't know', 'hola hovito', etc. etc. but 'song cry' is way too sappy.

you should try outkast's 'aquemini' (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VbSGAk6d6bU). less radio friendly than the tracks you mentioned, but way more worth it. 'atliens' (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fAeFEmp0WFU) and 'southernplayalistic' are (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2T0SorIk3n0) also very dope.

Black Joker

03-17-2010, 09:35 PM

you should try outkast's 'aquemini' (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VbSGAk6d6bU). less radio friendly than the tracks you mentioned, but way more worth it. 'atliens' (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fAeFEmp0WFU) and 'southernplayalistic' are (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2T0SorIk3n0) also very dope.
+1

Knicks101

03-17-2010, 09:36 PM

Yeah, Aquemini is definitely Outkast's best album. I probably have Dre in my Top 10. :rockon:

L.Kizzle

03-17-2010, 09:37 PM

LOL at Am winning four times.

phoenix18

03-17-2010, 09:37 PM

Why? You think it was the worst album released? You think RELAPSE was better?!?!? Deeper Than Rap?!?
Can someone give me the list of all the albums that could have been nominated because there has to be a better choice than BP3. It was average. Relapse was garbage.

v-unit

03-17-2010, 09:39 PM

I don't know I just hate their delivery and voice. That alone makes me not even want to get into their music. I mean I'll listen to it but I won't sit down and try to analyze it like I do with Jay, Nas, Em, Lupe, Canibus, anyone else with lyrics worth reading. To me I think they would be great ghost writers because they just can't make a good sounding song that fits ME.

Like second verse comes in and I'm like "what?" Just sounds ugly to me (Aquemini track you posted)

playtetris

03-17-2010, 09:42 PM

Like second verse comes in and I'm like "what?" Just sounds ugly to me (Aquemini track you posted)

you talking about big boi rhyming over the piano breakdown? really? i think he sounds awesome there. great flow too. :confusedshrug:

Black Joker

03-17-2010, 09:43 PM

v-unit

03-17-2010, 09:43 PM

I know, this site has a lot of devoted fans of any topic but know that I'm not hating, I recognize lyrics I just don't like the way it sounds to me.

50 Cent BISD
Rick Ross Deeper Than Rap
Jay-Z Blueprint 3
Raekwon OB4CL2 (Probably should have won but I didn't like every track)
Eminem Relapse
Clipse Till the Casket Drops (One of my favs of that year actually)

Rae/Jay/Clipse were the only ones I play continuously. Em had a few tracks but besides that everything is 1 star in my library. Rick Ross; pretty much the same as Relapse but good production. 50 Cent...stick to investing.

Gundress

03-17-2010, 09:45 PM

You hate Song Cry?????

/ban

I could NEVER get into Outkast. Not even songs like "Hey Ya" and sorry ms. jackson.

Seriously? You never get into the first 3 albums (Southernplayalisticadillacmuzik, ATLiens, Aquemini)?

I am telling you that Andree 3000>>>>Jay-Z

Wait a min, I know you're a huge Jay-Z fan but it has gotta do with Andre 3000 said that he's not into Jay-Z music? even Jay-Z gave Andre 3000 props for being a genius musician, he said Andree 3000 is version of Lauryn Hill.

Outkast always used the different formula on their albums, which why they are f*cking genius. Jay-Z always used the same shit formula on his albums, always rap about himself but he's still dope MC's to me. I only like Reasonable Doubt, BP, Black Album...In My Life Time Vol:1 isn't that bad....rest of his albums are garbage.

OH MY GOSH...YOU DON"T LIKE MS.JACKSON song....WTF? shitty on Jay-Z hits songs.

playtetris

03-17-2010, 09:45 PM

Black Joker

03-17-2010, 09:48 PM

i can't even be mad at v-unit for not digging outkast, i'm not gonna lie, it's hard for me to listen to Nas and Canibus sometimes, their voices, it just doesn't sit right with me. i dunno, i just can't listen to them for an extended period of time

Gundress

03-17-2010, 09:49 PM

Can someone give me the list of all the albums that could have been nominated because there has to be a better choice than BP3. It was average. Relapse was garbage.

My opinion......Mos Def - The Ecstatic

Bigsmoke

03-17-2010, 11:33 PM

i'm a fan of Jay-z... but no way the Blueprint was better than Stankonia.

...wow i'm just defferent then. Stankonia was good but overrated. The shit didnt blow me away at all, it was a good solid album that i could only listen to at occasional moods.

Blueprint is something i can pump 24/7 without pressing the skip button while in the process.

GOBB

03-17-2010, 11:36 PM

BP3 wasnt great but compared to Em Relaspe? It was better.

raekwon's album is CLEARLY the best out of that list. not even close. i actually really enjoyed p.o. ricky's album too, probably more than jay's and em's - some hot beats on there

I like Clipse and Rae...just cant see them being given a grammy for thier album.

playtetris

03-17-2010, 11:37 PM

Stankonia was good but overrated. The shit didnt blow me away at all, it was a good solid album that i could only listen to at occasional moods.

i agree. i was kinda disappointed when i first heard it. love bob though

playtetris

03-17-2010, 11:39 PM

I like Clipse and Rae...just cant see them being given a grammy for thier album.

i can't really see it either, but rae's album was easily better than all the others. probably too much coke talk and slang for him to win it, though

Bigsmoke

03-17-2010, 11:43 PM

f*ck it... i'm going to do my own list

2010 - Only Built 4 Cuban Linx II - Raekwon
2009 – The Renaissance - Q-tip
2008 – American Gangster - Jay-Z/ The Cool - Lupe Fiasco "goes both ways"
2007 – Food and Liquor - Lupe Fiasco
2006 – Be - Common
2005 – Kanye West - The College Dropout
2004 – The Black Album - Jay-Z
2003 – The Fix - Scarface
2002 – Blueprint - Jay-Z
2001 – Eminem - The Marshall Mathers LP
2000 – Eminem - The Slim Shady LP
1999 – Aquemini - Outkast
1998 – Life After Death - The Notorious BIG
1997 – Reasonable Doubt - Jay-Z
1996 – Me Against the World - 2pac

... yes, i am a Jay-Z fan but my favorite MC ever is Nas.

GOBB

03-17-2010, 11:44 PM

i can't really see it either, but rae's album was easily better than all the others. probably too much coke talk and slang for him to win it, though

Yup.

lefthook00

03-17-2010, 11:55 PM

Not a huge fan, but I'm surprise Nelly didn't win any of those years...he is a pop chart beast. What year did T.I. - KING drop? That sht was hard as fuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuukk.

Bigsmoke

03-18-2010, 12:33 AM

Not a huge fan, but I'm surprise Nelly didn't win any of those years...he is a pop chart beast. What year did T.I. - KING drop? That sht was hard as fuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuukk.

i'm glad too. i couldnt stand Nelly.

T.I. King dropped in 2006 when some how Release Therapy won.... I not even a Luda hater ether. Theater of the Mind was my shit

plowking

03-18-2010, 12:54 AM

2010 - Eminem for Relapse /// Only Built 4 Cuban Linx 2 - Raekwon
2009 – Lil Wayne for Tha Carter III /// Untitled - Nas
2008 – Kanye West for Graduation /// Hip Hop is Dead - Nas (another joke, anyone but Kanye that year should have won)
2007 – Ludacris for Release Therapy /// Game Theory - The Roots
2006 – Kanye West for Late Registration /// Common - Be
2005 – Kanye West for The College Dropout /// The Black Album - Jay-Z
2004 – Outkast for Speakerboxxx/The Love Below /// 50 Cent - Get Rich Or Die Tryin'
2003 – Eminem for The Eminem Show /// just a sh!tty year for hip hop...
2002 – OutKast for Stankonia /// Stillmatic - Nas
2001 – Eminem for The Marshall Mathers LP /// Dr Dre - 2001
2000 – Eminem for The Slim Shady LP /// Slim Shady LP - Eminem
1999 – Jay-Z for Vol. 2: Hard Knock Life /// Capital Punishment - Big Punisher (an absolute joke than Pun lost this)
1998 – Puff Daddy & the Family for No Way Out /// Life After Death - Notorious B.I.G.
1997 – The Fugees for The Score /// All Eyez On Me - 2pac
1996 – Naughty By Nature for Poverty's Paradise /// Reasonable Doubt - Jay-Z

Just looking over that, there is only like 3 choices I agree with... Anyone feel the same way? I mean even Puff won one... really?

Just my opinion after reviewing everything. And for the record, I think the nomination is a year after the album is released, so 50's album wouldn't have been going up against Eminem's, Eminem Show.

plowking

03-18-2010, 12:58 AM

Can someone give me the list of all the albums that could have been nominated because there has to be a better choice than BP3. It was average. Relapse was garbage.

Common - Universal Mind Control
Flo Rida - R.O.O.T.S.
Mos Def - The Ecstatic
Q-Tip - The Renaissance

Those were the other albums nominated that year, though Raekwon's album was the clear cut winner IMO.

v-unit

03-18-2010, 01:17 AM

Just my opinion after reviewing everything. And for the record, I think the nomination is a year after the album is released, so 50's album wouldn't have been going up against Eminem's, Eminem Show.

You have your years mixed up, 2001 came out in 1999. Black Album came out in 2003. Second of all...

2002:
Nas-God's Son
Eminem-Eminem Show (Why is this so hated? Someone please tell me why)
Scarface-The Fix
Talib Kweli-Quality

plowking

03-18-2010, 01:33 AM

You have your years mixed up, 2001 came out in 1999. Black Album came out in 2003. Second of all...

2002:
Nas-God's Son
Eminem-Eminem Show (Why is this so hated? Someone please tell me why)
Scarface-The Fix
Talib Kweli-Quality

They were actually nominated in the years I put them in...

Also I'd take The Fix and God's Son over Eminem Show.

v-unit

03-18-2010, 01:44 AM

They were actually nominated in the years I put them in...

Also I'd take The Fix and God's Son over Eminem Show.

Really? Because you didn't say that in this thread :oldlol:

Anyways, lets get to the real issue. Explain to me how Eminem Show is in any way weak? I call that album an easy classic.

White America
Business
Cleaning Out My Closet
Square Dance
Soldier
Say Goodbye Hollywood
Drips
Without Me
Sing For The Moment
Hailies Song
Superman
When The Music Stops
Say What You Say
Till I Collapse
My Dad's Gone Crazy

Tell me what is considered WEAK? Shit even Without Me had crazy lines in it, let alone flow

plowking

03-18-2010, 01:56 AM

Really? Because you didn't say that in this thread :oldlol:

Anyways, lets get to the real issue. Explain to me how Eminem Show is in any way weak? I call that album an easy classic.

White America
Business
Cleaning Out My Closet
Square Dance
Soldier
Say Goodbye Hollywood
Drips
Without Me
Sing For The Moment
Hailies Song
Superman
When The Music Stops
Say What You Say
Till I Collapse
My Dad's Gone Crazy

Tell me what is considered WEAK? Shit even Without Me had crazy lines in it, let alone flow

I must have skipped the fact that those two albums were nominated. Both are better. Eminem Show was an okay album, nothing more for me. I don't know, might be a difference in tastes, but yeah...

CeoTypeDoe619

03-18-2010, 02:53 AM

LOL @ 2003 not being 50, i mean i dont like the guy but seriously? that album was bumpin for like 3 years

back then it was ll bout 50, like him or not you know it.
Exactly form the hood to suburbs sh*t was knocking for 3 years.
50 got robbed tho

Timmy D for MVP

03-18-2010, 03:01 AM

I think we know that the Rap Album award is a joke. They only consider big mainstream albums and MAYBE an outside artist.

I do think that Outkast deserved both albums, I know ya'll talkin about some other albums in those years but I think those were good picks.

Late Registration and College Dropout were awesome, but Graduation was only okay I feel. I'm surprised Jay-Z has only won one but I think next year he'll prob have two.

phoenix18

03-18-2010, 11:25 AM

i'm glad too. i couldnt stand Nelly.

T.I. King dropped in 2006 when some how Release Therapy won.... I not even a Luda hater ether. Theater of the Mind was my shit

Yeah, King was pretty awesome and better than Release Therapy.

I am still in shock that Nas has not won ONE but Em has won four.

Nas>>>>>Eminem.

Untitled>>>>Tha Carter III
God's Son>>>>>Everything else that year
Stillmatic>>>>>Same as above.

Why the f*ck does he not get an award?

I didnt even mention Hip Hop Is Dead....

Just disgraceful.

I bet they are going to try and make it up with a Lifetime Achievement Award or something. I mean this is an artist that arguably has classics. Who else can boat that? (Illmatic,Stillmatic,God's Son,It Was Written and Untitled)

His worst effort was an average album at worst.

dough

03-18-2010, 11:31 AM

politics.

v-unit

03-18-2010, 12:04 PM

Yeah, King was pretty awesome and better than Release Therapy.

I am still in shock that Nas has not won ONE but Em has won four.

Nas>>>>>Eminem.

Untitled>>>>Tha Carter III
God's Son>>>>>Everything else that year
Stillmatic>>>>>Same as above.

Why the f*ck does he not get an award?

I didnt even mention Hip Hop Is Dead....

Just disgraceful.

I bet they are going to try and make it up with a Lifetime Achievement Award or something. I mean this is an artist that arguably has classics. Who else can boat that? (Illmatic,Stillmatic,God's Son,It Was Written and Untitled)

His worst effort was an average album at worst.

How about NO.

Lets get some facts straight.

I'm fine with Tha Carter III winning, why aren't you? Look what it did for hip hop. I'm not a Wayne/Young Money fan AT ALL I actually hate them but it was big for hip hop.

Stillmatic isn't even better than Blueprint, but I know a lot of people that would take Stankonia over Stillmatic, let alone Blueprint. And wtf? Seriously doubting your hip hop knowledge when you say "this is an artist that arguably has classics" LOL, yeah he has for sure classics...Illmatic and potentially It Was Written.

And his worst effort was WAY below average. Did you ever hear Nastrodomus? Did you ever hear the worst double album of all time? It's called Street's Disciple. That's three Cd's far below average, another reason why Nas isn't a clear cut GOAT, way too inconsistent.

Also, Eminem did something Nas couldn't do, produce three great albums in a row (SSLP,MMLP,TES). He can't show emotion that Eminem has and his world play and flow isn't anywhere near either.

plowking

03-18-2010, 12:28 PM

How about NO.

Lets get some facts straight.

I'm fine with Tha Carter III winning, why aren't you? Look what it did for hip hop. I'm not a Wayne/Young Money fan AT ALL I actually hate them but it was big for hip hop.

Stillmatic isn't even better than Blueprint, but I know a lot of people that would take Stankonia over Stillmatic, let alone Blueprint. And wtf? Seriously doubting your hip hop knowledge when you say "this is an artist that arguably has classics" LOL, yeah he has for sure classics...Illmatic and potentially It Was Written.

And his worst effort was WAY below average. Did you ever hear Nastrodomus? Did you ever hear the worst double album of all time? It's called Street's Disciple. That's three Cd's far below average, another reason why Nas isn't a clear cut GOAT, way too inconsistent.

Also, Eminem did something Nas couldn't do, produce three great albums in a row (SSLP,MMLP,TES). He can't show emotion that Eminem has and his world play and flow isn't anywhere near either.

Eminem Show is average.

Let's take a look at their first three albums.

Illmatic > Slim Shady LP
It Was Written > Marshall Mathers LP
I Am... = Eminem Show

So if Nas can't be considered GOAT, what in your right mind makes you think Jay can. Reasonable Doubt and Blueprint, what then? Few songs on Black Album. Nothing decent anywhere in between those.

plowking

03-18-2010, 12:32 PM

BTW, Nas has two albums originally being listed as 5 mics in The Source. So much for not having classics.

v-unit

03-18-2010, 12:36 PM

Eminem Show is average.

Let's take a look at their first three albums.

Illmatic > Slim Shady LP
It Was Written > Marshall Mathers LP
I Am... = Eminem Show

So if Nas can't be considered GOAT, what in your right mind makes you think Jay can. Reasonable Doubt and Blueprint, what then? Few songs on Black Album. Nothing decent anywhere in between those.

1. Eminem Show is average? I asked you and another poster last night WHY and both of you dodged. None of you could tell me why after I posted the track list so until you try to explain that, Eminem Show is a great album just like the majority of the world thinks it is.

2. IWW is arguably > than MMLP, I have read plenty of people's opinion who think otherwise

3. I Am...<<<Eminem Show. Again prove to me how Eminem Show is AVERAGE. I Am... Was a pretty shitty album, it's fun to listen to some of those tracks but it's hot trash.

4. I never said he doesn't have a chance to be goat, I said he isn't CLEAR CUT GOAT. He can't put out three good albums in a row. Jay has RD, Blueprint and the Black Album as a whole, many people think Black Album is greater than Blueprint (I do). Those are all classics. Not to mention American Gangster which some people rank in his top 3.

Nothing decent between those?? lol please. Jay doesn't have one album thats on the level of Nastradomus or Street's Disciple. His worst album is Volume 2 and I'd put that on level with I Am...Volume 1, Volume 3, Roc La Familia, Blueprint 2, Kingdome Come, Blueprint 3 are all better than Nastradomus and Street's Disciple. Then you factor in his consistency with the fact that he started 2 years later and took a 3 year break from rapping and you see why he is considered GOAT by many. I also consider Nas a GOAT but it's clear his consistency is a problem

v-unit

03-18-2010, 12:38 PM

BTW, Nas has two albums originally being listed as 5 mics in The Source. So much for not having classics.

Get a grip :roll: I never said he doesn't have classics, I said Illmatic and IWW were classics :roll:

plowking

03-18-2010, 12:45 PM

1. Eminem Show is average? I asked you and another poster last night WHY and both of you dodged. None of you could tell me why after I posted the track list so until you try to explain that, Eminem Show is a great album just like the majority of the world thinks it is.

2. IWW is arguably > than MMLP, I have read plenty of people's opinion who think otherwise

3. I Am...<<<Eminem Show. Again prove to me how Eminem Show is AVERAGE. I Am... Was a pretty shitty album, it's fun to listen to some of those tracks but it's hot trash.

4. I never said he doesn't have a chance to be goat, I said he isn't CLEAR CUT GOAT. He can't put out three good albums in a row. Jay has RD, Blueprint and the Black Album as a whole, many people think Black Album is greater than Blueprint (I do). Those are all classics. Not to mention American Gangster which some people rank in his top 3.

Nothing decent between those?? lol please. Jay doesn't have one album thats on the level of Nastradomus or Street's Disciple. His worst album is Volume 2 and I'd put that on level with I Am...Volume 1, Volume 3, Roc La Familia, Blueprint 2, Kingdome Come, Blueprint 3 are all better than Nastradomus and Street's Disciple. Then you factor in his consistency with the fact that he started 2 years later and took a 3 year break from rapping and you see why he is considered GOAT by many. I also consider Nas a GOAT but it's clear his consistency is a problem

LOL at Jay being consistent and not having garbage albums. Vol 3 was garbage. I guess you forgot about Kingdome Come?

Stillmatic received 5 stars from the Source... It Was Written, Illmatic, Stillmatic are all classics.

Illmatic, It Was Written, I Am..., Stillmatic, God's Son, Hip Hop Is Dead and Untitled > Jay's catalogue minus his two worst CD's.

v-unit

03-18-2010, 12:48 PM

LOL at Jay being consistent and not having garbage albums. Vol 3 was garbage. I guess you forgot about Kingdome Come?

Stillmatic received 5 stars from the Source... It Was Written, Illmatic, Stillmatic are all classics.

Illmatic, It Was Written, I Am..., Stillmatic, God's Son, Hip Hop Is Dead and Untitled > Jay's catalogue minus his two worst CD's.

Wow. I don't think I've ever read heard someone post that. I don't know if you're trying to make a joke out of this but there is no way Nas' catalogue is greater than Jay's. I'm not even going to continue this because theres nothing I can say besides listen to his albums and the lyrics he is spitting but obviously you haven't heard a full Jay album if you think the Black Album has only a few songs on it that are classic.

But I'll note that you still can't tell me why Eminem Show is weak and average

plowking

03-18-2010, 12:53 PM

Wow. I don't think I've ever read heard someone post that. I don't know if you're trying to make a joke out of this but there is no way Nas' catalogue is greater than Jay's. I'm not even going to continue this because theres nothing I can say besides listen to his albums and the lyrics he is spitting but obviously you haven't heard a full Jay album if you think the Black Album has only a few songs on it that are classic.

But I'll note that you still can't tell me why Eminem Show is weak and average

Because the songs were simply catchy and had no great depth.

As for Nas' catalogue, there isn't an album I listed that received less than 4 mics from the Source there. Same can't be said about Jay minus his two worst.

phoenix18

03-18-2010, 12:57 PM

How about NO.

Lets get some facts straight.

I'm fine with Tha Carter III winning, why aren't you? Look what it did for hip hop. I'm not a Wayne/Young Money fan AT ALL I actually hate them but it was big for hip hop.

What did it do? Explain.

Stillmatic isn't even better than Blueprint, but I know a lot of people that would take Stankonia over Stillmatic, let alone Blueprint. And wtf? Seriously doubting your hip hop knowledge when you say "this is an artist that arguably has classics" LOL, yeah he has for sure classics...Illmatic and potentially It Was Written.
:roll:

"One mic">>>>>>>>>Blueprint. Whoa, wait a minute. What makes Blueprint so great? I personally find it to be a good album but in no way shape or form better than Stillmatic.

And his worst effort was WAY below average. Did you ever hear Nastrodomus? Did you ever hear the worst double album of all time? It's called Street's Disciple. That's three Cd's far below average, another reason why Nas isn't a clear cut GOAT, way too inconsistent.

Also, Eminem did something Nas couldn't do, produce three great albums in a row (SSLP,MMLP,TES). He can't show emotion that Eminem has and his world play and flow isn't anywhere near either.

*sigh*

Please.:rolleyes:

I dont care about streaks, this isnt a video game. Look, I know, Nas made your favorite rapper cry. Its understandable to hate on him every once in a while, but to say that he has only TWO classics is reckless and dumb. Then to say that Street's Disciple was the worst double album of all time? I know you''re exaggerating but still, come on. Its got a 80/100 on metacritic and I personally enjoyed it. It wasnt as commercial but it was more than solid and nowhere close to terrible.

Nastradamus is a throwaway, thanks to Napster, all of the songs intended for the album were leaked and he had to redo it all.

v-unit

03-18-2010, 12:59 PM

Because the songs were simply catchy and had no great depth.

As for Nas' catalogue, there isn't an album I listed that received less than 4 mics from the Source there. Same can't be said about Jay minus his two worst.

List of albums plowking hasn't ever listened to : Reasonable Doubt, Black Album, Kingdome Come, American Gangster, Volume 3, and now The Eminem Show. Saying it had no depth is simply telling me you never listened to it, one of his deeper albums that he released. Probably his deepest.

The **** do I care what the Source says :oldlol: They're people just like me and you. If it was me I wouldn't give Stillmatic 5 stars, I wouldn't give Untitled 4 stars, or I Am... If it was you, you would probably give them all 5 stars. It's just opinion, only their opinion is heard by the general public. So please spare me what the Source says and stop using that as a means of judging musical talent.

phoenix18

03-18-2010, 01:01 PM

Wow. I don't think I've ever read heard someone post that. I don't know if you're trying to make a joke out of this but there is no way Nas' catalogue is greater than Jay's. I'm not even going to continue this because theres nothing I can say besides listen to his albums and the lyrics he is spitting but obviously you haven't heard a full Jay album if you think the Black Album has only a few songs on it that are classic.

But I'll note that you still can't tell me why Eminem Show is weak and average

Illmatic>>Reasonable Doubt

It was Written and I am even including Nastradamus>>>>All of jay's shitty shawn carter volumes(I still want my money back)

Stillmatic>>>>Blueprint

God's Son>>>>>Blueprint 2

Street's Disciple<<The Black Album

Hip Hop is Dead>>>>>>Kingdom Come

Untitled>>>>>Blueprint 3

v-unit

03-18-2010, 01:05 PM

"One mic">>>>>>>>>Blueprint. Whoa, wait a minute. What makes Blueprint so great? I personally find it to be a good album but in no way shape or form better than Stillmatic.

Beats and lyrics. :confusedshrug:

*sigh*

Please.:rolleyes:

I dont care about streaks, this isnt a video game. Look, I know, Nas made your favorite rapper cry. Its understandable to hate on him every once in a while, but to say that he has only TWO classics is reckless and dumb. Then to say that Street's Disciple was the worst double album of all time? I know you''re exaggerating but still, come on. Its got a 80/100 on metacritic and I personally enjoyed it. It wasnt as commercial but it was more than solid and nowhere close to terrible.

Video game? I don't get the analogy.

Anyways, consistency is very important for a rapper if they wish to be named the greatest, as it is for anything. No one will be the best in anything just because of one product or service, check NBA, music, etc. Nas is my second/third favourite rapper out, what I said in this thread wasn't hating at all. I bump all of his albums and have his full catalogue downloaded. Stillmatic is great, I love HHID, blah blah blah. Why do you all look at what critics said about the album? Who are they to tell you what an album's value is?
They're people just like me and you, they just have a job that lets them voice their opinion. Read what I said to plowking about it.

v-unit

03-18-2010, 01:09 PM

stupid album rankings

Alright whatever. You think T.I. is some power house rapper anyways, what do I care what your rankings are? I feel like you wouldn't even understand the lyrics Nas or Jay spits. You just ranked Nas' shittiest albums greater than Jay's middleweight albums. What am I supposed to say to that? LeBron's rookie year>>>Jordan's three peat years. But then again, I guess this is why I'm arguing with you two here on this site as appose to a hip hop forum. Post that anywhere else where people actually know the subject and watch the backlash you'll get

Stan? I'm being realistic, Nas, Jay and Em. are all in my top 3 favourites and I can be realistic about it. I never said Jay's albums are 1 for 1 greater than any other artists, I'm looking at this neutrally and it's clear you aren't :confusedshrug:

phoenix18

03-18-2010, 01:10 PM

Beats and lyrics. :confusedshrug:

What?:oldlol:

"Eminem killed you on your own shit"

phoenix18

03-18-2010, 01:12 PM

Alright whatever. You think T.I. is some power house rapper anyways, what do I care what your rankings are? I feel like you wouldn't even understand the lyrics Nas or Jay spits. You just ranked Nas' shittiest albums greater than Jay's middleweight albums. What am I supposed to say to that? LeBron's rookie year>>>Jordan's three peat years. But then again, I guess this is why I'm arguing with you two here on this site as appose to a hip hop forum. Post that anywhere else where people actually know the subject and watch the backlash you'll get

Stan? I'm being realistic, Nas, Jay and Em. are all in my top 3 favourites and I can be realistic about it. I never said Jay's albums are 1 for 1 greater than any other artists, I'm looking at this neutrally and it's clear you aren't :confusedshrug:
:wtf:

I want you, album by album to say which one is better since that my album rankings are stupid. Go ahead.

I'm waiting...

EDIT:When did I say T.I was a powerhouse rapper? What? I like him, he moves units, but I dont think I have given him that much praise at all. Maniak is the guy on his nuts all the time not me.

v-unit

03-18-2010, 01:26 PM

What?:oldlol:

"Eminem killed you on your own shit"

Jay's verses on Renegade are better than anything Nas said in Ether. I liked Ether when I was like 12 because it was simple words, calling another man gay and ugly, and yet Jay is with the hottest girl in the hip hop industry. Go listen to what Jay said on Renegade and find me a verse to match it on Stillmatic

lefthook00

03-18-2010, 04:10 PM

Jay > Nas. Nas won that battle though. Is it me or is Nas just BORING sometimes?

plowking

03-18-2010, 09:33 PM

Jay's verses on Renegade are better than anything Nas said in Ether. I liked Ether when I was like 12 because it was simple words, calling another man gay and ugly, and yet Jay is with the hottest girl in the hip hop industry. Go listen to what Jay said on Renegade and find me a verse to match it on Stillmatic

You must be thinking about Eminem, since Jay got outdone on his own album.

LOL at Jay having Beyonce being justification to him not being an ugly mofo. Further LOL that you care. :oldlol:

Look at Phoenix's comparisons of each album in order, I don't think any of those rankings are wrong, would you agree?

v-unit

03-18-2010, 09:43 PM

You must be thinking about Eminem, since Jay got outdone on his own album.

LOL at Jay having Beyonce being justification to him not being an ugly mofo. Further LOL that you care. :oldlol:

Look at Phoenix's comparisons of each album in order, I don't think any of those rankings are wrong, would you agree?

No I meant Nas, Jay's Renegade verses outshine anything Nas said on Stillmatic.

What does looks matter anymore? I never even argued hes good looking or not because thats not something I do. All I said was Nas used weak lines like calling him ugly and gay, and yet Jay is with Beyonce and Nas was with Kelis :confusedshrug: If you are married to a gorgeous and successful woman and you don't look retarded, what do looks matter then? Like I said, arguing about looks is something I don't do, but the fact that he has Beyonce makes his looks whatever you think they are irrelevant.

And no, I wouldn't agree with Pheonix's list at all, terrible list :roll:

playtetris

03-18-2010, 09:49 PM

Go listen to what Jay said on Renegade and find me a verse to match it on Stillmatic

rewind, poison, shit even second childhood are better than jay's verses on renegade.

i don't even LIKE stillmatic, i prefer blueprint all day, but neither are close to classics.

StroShow4

03-18-2010, 09:52 PM

second childhood

:pimp: :pimp: :pimp: :pimp: :pimp:

v-unit

03-18-2010, 10:05 PM

rewind, poison, shit even second childhood are better than jay's verses on renegade.

i don't even LIKE stillmatic, i prefer blueprint all day, but neither are close to classics.

First of all...Whats poison??? Or are you saying the track is poison? lol

Second of all:

That's debateable. I def. wouldn't say Rewind is though, Second Childhood is closer and even still, I wouldn't take it.

say that I'm foolish I only talk about jewels (bling bling)
Do you fools listen to music or do you just skim through it?
See I'm influenced by the ghetto you ruined
That same dude you gave nothin, I made somethin doin
what I do through and through and
I give you the news - with a twist it's just his ghetto point-of-view
The renegade; you been afraid
I penetrate pop culture, bring 'em a lot closer to the block where they
pop toasters and they live with their moms got drop roasters from botched robberies ****** crouched over
mommies knocked up cause she wasn't wached over knocked down by some clown when child support knocked
no he's not around tnow how that sound to ya, jot it down
I bring you through the ghetto without ridin 'round
hidin down duckin strays from frustrated youths stuck in they ways
Just read a magazine that ****ed up my day
How you rate music that thugs with nothin relate to it i help them see their way through it - not you cant step in my pants cant walk in my shoes bet everything you worth you lose your tie and your shirt

LETS GET REAL. And this is just his first verse.

StroShow4

03-18-2010, 10:08 PM

First of all...Whats poison???

A song on Stillmatic. (I think it's technically called "What Goes Around")

phoenix18

03-18-2010, 10:13 PM

:sleeping

playtetris

03-18-2010, 10:17 PM

First of all...Whats poison??? Or are you saying the track is poison? lol

Second of all:

That's debateable. I def. wouldn't say Rewind is though, Second Childhood is closer and even still, I wouldn't take it.

LETS GET REAL. And this is just his first verse.

i see nothing remarkable in that verse. what he's doing is bascially describing nas' approach to rhyming.

conceptually rewind is >>>>
what has jay done in his career that touches that? it's far more creative than your standard battle rap track.

poison (what goes around) is an amazing song. perfect marriage of beat and societal frustration.

Religion misoverstood is poison
Sisters up in my hood try to do good given choices
When pregnant, drop out of school or have abortions
Stop workin hopin that they find a man that will support them
Up late night, on they mother's cordless
Thinkin a perm or bleach and cream will make them better when they gorgeous
White girls tannin, lyposuction
Fake titties are implanted, fake lips that's life destruction
Light-skinned women, bi-racial hateful toward themselves
Denyin even they blood
I don't judge Tiger Woods but I, overstand the mental poison
That's even worse than drugs - yo it's poison

second childhood contains better narrative than virtually everything in jay's career barring some verses on reasonable doubt. first verse he is reminiscing, and the nostalgia provides his second childhood. second and third verses he is painting pictures of protagonists who are in a state of permanent identity moratorium and hence have stagnated.

i'm sorry, but the topics/concepts are far more interesting than jay talking about being misunderstood. :confusedshrug:

v-unit

03-18-2010, 10:33 PM

i see nothing remarkable in that verse. what he's doing is bascially describing nas' approach to rhyming.

conceptually rewind is >>>>
what has jay done in his career that touches that? it's far more creative than your standard battle rap track.

poison (what goes around) is an amazing song. perfect marriage of beat and societal frustration.

I know Poison...I was talking about Stillmatic though I know Poisoin wasn't on it so it didn't even cross my mind that you were talking about the song. Great song. NOT on Stillmatic though. Yeah conceptually Rewind is better but thats because he's telling a story and he's doing it backwards. Jay isn't telling a story necessarily.

second childhood contains better narrative than virtually everything in jay's career barring some verses on reasonable doubt. first verse he is reminiscing, and the nostalgia provides his second childhood. second and third verses he is painting pictures of protagonists who are in a state of permanent identity moratorium and hence have stagnated.

i'm sorry, but the topics/concepts are far more interesting than jay talking about being misunderstood. :confusedshrug:

I'd put Meet The Parents higher than Second Childhood. It's one long story and it's actually entertaining to think about. Nas tells a good story but it gets boring towards the end :confusedshrug: I'm HUGE on Nas but damn sometimes he just can't get me into his songs. Lyrics are WOW! almost always but as a whole song? Meet The Parents>>>>

playtetris

03-18-2010, 10:49 PM

I know Poison...I was talking about Stillmatic though I know Poisoin wasn't on it so it didn't even cross my mind that you were talking about the song. Great song. NOT on Stillmatic though. Yeah conceptually Rewind is better but thats because he's telling a story and he's doing it backwards. Jay isn't telling a story necessarily.

I'd put Meet The Parents higher than Second Childhood. It's one long story and it's actually entertaining to think about. Nas tells a good story but it gets boring towards the end :confusedshrug: I'm HUGE on Nas but damn sometimes he just can't get me into his songs. Lyrics are WOW! almost always but as a whole song? Meet The Parents>>>>

firstly, 'poison' is on stillmatic. what choo talkin bout?

secondly, do you get bored during 'one love' too? how about 'shootouts'. i find nas' storytelling very engaging and he is certainly one of the best in the game in that regard. rae/ghost, slick rick, dre3k, jay... these are the only dudes that can mess with him.

thirdly, successfully executing a concept like 'rewind' is extremely difficult and requires a certain level of lyrical acumen, probably why jay has never attempted something like that. pharoahe monch and nas are the most proficient at doing that sort of thing fo sho.

plowking

03-18-2010, 11:49 PM

As for Nastradamus, aren't most of the original tracks on Lost Tapes? Originally it would have been a decent album.

Nas' catalogue easily trumps Jay's.

And keep thinking that Street Disciple sucked.

v-unit

03-19-2010, 12:02 AM

firstly, 'poison' is on stillmatic. what choo talkin bout?

secondly, do you get bored during 'one love' too? how about 'shootouts'. i find nas' storytelling very engaging and he is certainly one of the best in the game in that regard. rae/ghost, slick rick, dre3k, jay... these are the only dudes that can mess with him.

thirdly, successfully executing a concept like 'rewind' is extremely difficult and requires a certain level of lyrical acumen, probably why jay has never attempted something like that. pharoahe monch and nas are the most proficient at doing that sort of thing fo sho.

I had it downloaded but for some reason it isn't under Stillmatic in my library. I guess I gotta edit it. I read Stro's post above and I'm like "Stillmatic? What?" but two opinions probably means its true.

One Love does get a bit boring, and Nas fans usually state this as the reason why it's the worst song on Illmatic. Although, I'm still a fan of his stories. What I'm trying to say is I love Nas' story telling and didn't mean to imply that he was BAD at it in any way, but I don't think he's the best at it. You can compare Rewind and other stories like Meet The Parents, Coming of Age 1 and 2, and others and I would take Jay's tracks over Nas' stories usually because of mic presence alone. BUT. Rewind is a great concept but I just don't get engaged into it. Lyrically, Nas' lyrics aren't to be messed with and thats a reason why he is my number 2. Meet The Parents >>> almost all of Nas' stories to me and Rewind is debateable, but Rewind >>> most of Nas' stories anyways.

Story telling in rap is a bit weak to me anyways. I think there are great stories but no one consistently goes out of their way to make it known they are the best story teller. It's like one story track an album or 2 and it just seems like it's not on their priority list. So I don't really take into account story telling as something crazy for me if anyone is the best story teller, to me there will be someone right behind him right there.

StroShow4

03-19-2010, 12:05 AM

One Love does get a bit boring

One Love is anything but boring to me. The story he tells is so vivid, that sh!t paints a picture in my head. I never get tired of that song.

v-unit

03-19-2010, 12:07 AM

And keep thinking that Street Disciple sucked.

You don't have to tell me twice

http://www.clipartguide.com/_named_clipart_images/0511-0809-2414-5606_Businessman_Giving_the_Thumbs_Up_Sign_clipart _image.jpg

v-unit

03-19-2010, 12:10 AM

One Love is anything but boring to me. The story he tells is so vivid, that sh!t paints a picture in my head. I never get tired of that song.

The song itself isn't boring. But it GETS boring. I can listen to it a few times, appreciate it and then move on.

p.s. I downloaded Can-I-Bus like last week and I love it...Should I download his catalogue or does he just go downhill? I know Poet Laureate II is on one of his later albums but is he just hit or miss on each album or is it worth a full download

plowking

03-19-2010, 12:13 AM

You don't have to tell me twice

Yet you think Vol. 1-3 were awesome... :ohwell:

Blueprint 3 sucked ass as well...

v-unit

03-19-2010, 12:21 AM

Yet you think Vol. 1-3 were awesome... :ohwell:

Blueprint 3 sucked ass as well...

Million and One Questions
Imaginary Player
Streets Is Watching
Friend or Foe '98
Lucky Me
Real ******
Rap Game/Crack Game
Where I'm From
You Must Love Me

So yeah, I do think Volume 1 is awesome. I already said Volume 2 was his worst and yet it's better than Nastrodomus/I Am... Don't act like you listened to all of his albums :oldlol: I listen to music when I wake up, when I work, and when I sleep. I literally download an album every day, I've listened to every song by the main artist so I at least have some background on my opinion. YOU? I'm not so sure if you heard them all.

plowking

03-19-2010, 12:26 AM

Million and One Questions
Imaginary Player
Streets Is Watching
Friend or Foe '98
Lucky Me
Real ******
Rap Game/Crack Game
Where I'm From
You Must Love Me

So yeah, I do think Volume 1 is awesome. I already said Volume 2 was his worst and yet it's better than Nastrodomus/I Am... Don't act like you listened to all of his albums :oldlol: I listen to music when I wake up, when I work, and when I sleep. I literally download an album every day, I've listened to every song by the main artist so I at least have some background on my opinion. YOU? I'm not so sure if you heard them all.

I'm a Uni student, I do nothing but work, school, watch movies and listen to music...
I've heard all of Jay's, Nas's, Pac's, Big's albums, as well as a whole lot of others. But keep going on your hypothetical route, it's going well for you...

plowking

03-19-2010, 12:29 AM

Go on and bold each album that was better...

Illmatic vs Reasonable Doubt
It Was Written vs In My Lifetime, Vol. 1
I Am... vs Vol. 2... Hard Knock Life
Nastradamus vs Vol. 3 Life and Times of S. Carter
Stillmatic vs The Blueprint
God's Son vs The Blueprint

plowking

03-19-2010, 12:36 AM

[QUOTE=plowking]Go on and bold each album that was better...

Illmatic vs Reasonable Doubt (widely regarded as the best rap album ever - I agree)
It Was Written vs In My Lifetime, Vol. 1 (If I ruled the world, shootouts, I gave you power, affirmative action, street dreams... Jay doesn't have that many incredible songs on their)
I Am... vs Vol. 2... Hard Knock Life (Tie)
Nastradamus vs Vol. 3 Life and Times of S. Carter
Stillmatic vs The Blueprint (Tie)
God's Son vs The Blueprint

Timmy D for MVP

03-19-2010, 12:38 AM

I'm a HUGE fan of Jay. Love his stuff, and I think as far as moving units, and the image, and the empire and everything he is the king.

But for me Nas is better as an MC. I'm not saying Jay is bad but Nas is just better.

I don't listen to much mainstream rap anymore, just cause it's gotten ridiculous. I'm more a Talib Kweli, Mos Def, Common, Blue Scholars, Cunninlyguists, etc... type guy. So this award for me is just like a popularity contest.

v-unit

03-19-2010, 12:39 AM

[QUOTE=plowking]Go on and bold each album that was better...

Illmatic vs Reasonable Doubt
It Was Written vs In My Lifetime, Vol. 1 (Great album, IWW is just amazing)
I Am... vs Vol. 2... Hard Knock Life both are trash to me.
Nastradamus vs Vol. 3 Life and Times of S. Carter
Stillmatic vs The Blueprint
God's Son vs The Blueprint

playtetris

03-19-2010, 12:54 AM

One Love does get a bit boring, and Nas fans usually state this as the reason why it's the worst song on Illmatic. Although, I'm still a fan of his stories.

wtf? i've never heard that opinion before! that story is just so great all the way through - IMO the third verse is crazy and maybe the best on that joint - that when he gets to "shorty's laugh was cold-blooded as he spoke so foul..." i still have this crazy vivid image in my head. that beat/story combo is PERFECT. i have no idea how anyone could say that's the weakest joint on the album

Story telling in rap is a bit weak to me anyways. I think there are great stories but no one consistently goes out of their way to make it known they are the best story teller. It's like one story track an album or 2 and it just seems like it's not on their priority list. So I don't really take into account story telling as something crazy for me if anyone is the best story teller, to me there will be someone right behind him right there.

ghost, rae, slick rick, dre3k all tell stories constantly. i'd say they almost tell more stories than they do make battle/concept tracks. i'd say you're using specious reasoning here to support your argument.

playtetris

03-19-2010, 12:55 AM

[QUOTE=plowking]Go on and bold each album that was better...

Illmatic vs Reasonable Doubt
It Was Written vs In My Lifetime, Vol. 1
I Am... vs Vol. 2... Hard Knock Life (both crap)
Nastradamus vs Vol. 3 Life and Times of S. Carter (still both average, but i give vol 3 benefit of the doubt)
Stillmatic vs The Blueprint
God's Son vs The Blueprint

plowking

03-19-2010, 12:55 AM

First of all, I'm a non-biased Jay/Nas/Eminem fan. Those three are my favourites and I'm rating it as I feel fit. YOU on the other hand are a Jay hater and coincidently a large Nas fan. You have every Nas album higher than Jay's, I mean seriously? Saying Volume 1 doesn't have a lot of great songs? Check the songs I posted, those are better than the majority of his tracks after RD and before Blueprint.

You can't compare it like that. Jay started his career 2 years LATER than Nas. Then he took a 3 year break. That's 5 years lost. Then add in that he has MORE albums than Nas. You can't compare them one for one, Jay put in more work and released a few albums while Nas released only one.

For instance, why do you compare Dynasty to Lost Tapes? 1, it's different years; 2, you can't just compare a mixtape of Nas' best unreleased material with a Roc A Fella album. Anytime you Memphis Bleek has his own track on an album you know it'll get pulled down critically.

So I'm biased yet you're not?

Considering Illmatic is generally considered to be the best rap album ever, I have it over RD. Going by your list, if you changed that, it would be 4-4. I was even kind enough to rate Stillmatic and Blueprint on the same level, since both got 5 mics from Source. You have IWW over Vol. 1, so stop arguing about that.

I compared Dynasty and Lost due to both being compilation albums more than anything.

plowking

03-19-2010, 12:56 AM

...

And I got called a Nas fan despite others agreeing with me.

v-unit

03-19-2010, 12:56 AM

, rae, slick rick, dre3k all tell stories constantly. i'd say they almost tell more stories than they do make battle/concept tracks. i'd say you're using specious reasoning here to support your argument.

?

"specious rasoning here to support your argument"

What's my arguement? That I'm not that interested in story telling in rap songs? lol. I don't get this post, all I said was I'm not big on story telling and I feel that no one goes out of their way to prove they are the best at it. As it stands though, I only listen to Slick Rick out of those mentioned, everyone else is here and there, so i don't know where I rank them story telling wise. I meant Nas, Jay, Eminem, etc. Mainstream artists.

playtetris

03-19-2010, 12:59 AM

?

"specious rasoning here to support your argument"

What's my arguement? That I'm not that interested in story telling in rap songs? lol. I don't get this post, all I said was I'm not big on story telling and I feel that no one goes out of their way to prove they are the best at it. As it stands though, I only listen to Slick Rick out of those mentioned, everyone else is here and there, so i don't know where I rank them story telling wise. I meant Nas, Jay, Eminem, etc. Mainstream artists.

storytelling is an integral part of lyricism in hip hop. it has been ever since 'the message'. to argue otherwise is completely irrational.

kool g rap, big daddy kane, rakim... all these dudes told stories too.

Timmy D for MVP

03-19-2010, 01:01 AM

Talib Kweli>Jay-Z for me. Thoughts?

v-unit

03-19-2010, 01:01 AM

So I'm biased yet you're not?

Considering Illmatic is generally considered to be the best rap album ever, I have it over RD. Going by your list, if you changed that, it would be 4-4. I was even kind enough to rate Stillmatic and Blueprint on the same level, since both got 5 mics from Source. You have IWW over Vol. 1, so stop arguing about that.

I compared Dynasty and Lost due to both being compilation albums more than anything.

You're biased because you don't listen to Jay as much as you do Nas. I do, both of them are my top 2 rappers. And again you go talking about the Source, why? Seriously, make your own opinions, forget magazines. Just because something is published doesn't make it real or fact. I have IWW over Volume 1, and so do you. The difference? I know volume 1 has great songs on it, you don't. You think just because Volume 1 is worse that makes it shitty? Or the fact that it didn't sell? or what? Like I said, some of his best songs are on that album.

And Dynasty isn't a compilation album. It didn't take the best songs that Roc A Fella made over years, it was a regular recording session in one year with Jay, Memphis Bleek, Beanie Sigel, and others. Lost Tapes was his greatest unreleased hits. Jay wasn't even on every track on the Dynasty album :roll:

And I got called a Nas fan despite others agreeing with me.

Sorry, I thought you were a fan :oldlol: Am I wrong?

playtetris

03-19-2010, 01:03 AM

Talib Kweli>Jay-Z for me. Thoughts?

nah. i've got heaps of love for kwe, but i don't see that.

Gundress

03-19-2010, 01:03 AM

[QUOTE=plowking]Go on and bold each album that was better...

Illmatic vs Reasonable Doubt
It Was Written vs In My Lifetime, Vol. 1
I Am... vs Vol. 2... Hard Knock Life
Nastradamus vs Vol. 3 Life and Times of S. Carter
Stillmatic vs The Blueprint
God's Son vs The Blueprint

Timmy D for MVP

03-19-2010, 01:04 AM

nah. i've got heaps of love for kwe, but i don't see that.

I feel like he has flashes of just ridiculous shit, and then kinda mellows out on other tracks. Idk what it is.

v-unit

03-19-2010, 01:05 AM

storytelling is an integral part of lyricism in hip hop. it has been ever since 'the message'. to argue otherwise is completely irrational.

kool g rap, big daddy kane, rakim... all these dudes told stories too.

You're trying to push me on a certain opinion or "side" of an arguement. There is no argument here. I never said anything negative about story telling, all I said was I don't get into it as much as I do on other subjects. I love story telling, my favorite rap song is "Stan"; all I'm literally saying is I don't look into it as much as I do other types of tracks.

v-unit

03-19-2010, 01:06 AM

Talib is great. Reflection Eternal...BEAST

plowking

03-19-2010, 01:12 AM

You're biased because you don't listen to Jay as much as you do Nas. I do, both of them are my top 2 rappers. And again you go talking about the Source, why? Seriously, make your own opinions, forget magazines. Just because something is published doesn't make it real or fact. I have IWW over Volume 1, and so do you. The difference? I know volume 1 has great songs on it, you don't. You think just because Volume 1 is worse that makes it shitty? Or the fact that it didn't sell? or what? Like I said, some of his best songs are on that album.

And Dynasty isn't a compilation album. It didn't take the best songs that Roc A Fella made over years, it was a regular recording session in one year with Jay, Memphis Bleek, Beanie Sigel, and others. Lost Tapes was his greatest unreleased hits. Jay wasn't even on every track on the Dynasty album :roll:

Sorry, I thought you were a fan :oldlol: Am I wrong?

Of course I listen to Nas more, he's better... :hammerhead:

I'm a fan of Jay, whether you want to believe it or not. In fact I'd say Reasonable Doubt is my most played album after Sin-A-Matic by Louis Logic (check him out, especially the song "ugly truth").

And you know what I meant by the fan line. I'm not overly biased in any sense.