Best player in 2002-2003: Kobe Bryant

[ImmortalD24]

Best player in 2002-2003: Kobe Bryant

30 ppg 7 rpg 6 apg 2.2 spg against both handchecking and zone
1st team all defensive
1st team All-NBA
40+ points 19 times in 82 games
40+ in 9 striaght
35+ in 13 straight
NBA record 12 threes in a game
50+ points 3 times
42 ppg in February 2003 (Jordan never averaged 40 ppg for a month in regular season, Kobe did it 3 times)

http://www.vintageadsandstuff.com/viewsi030303.jpeg

http://www.nba.com/features/kobe_40plus_030221.html


"He was just phenomenal. He's been doing it all along. He's playing so good, it's sickening."
--Rockets coach Rudy Tomjanovich, Houston Chronicle


Everyone had their hands in Kobe's face. My momma had a hand in his face and he still hit it. Kobe is playing at an unbelievable level and hitting shots. I feel like I am an all-right defender and Ruben (Patterson) is an all-right defender, and he still made us feel like we were no defenders."
--Blazers guard Bonzi Wells


"That was perhaps the greatest streak shooting I've ever seen in my life," Phil Jackson told the paper.


"The shots he took were shots you would want guys to take -- 3 or 4 feet behind the 3-point line with a hand in his face," Sonics coach Nate McMillan said. "He made five or six in a row ... nine in a row? Well, there you go.


"There's no stopping Kobe. We felt like we played pretty good defense but he still got 40 down the stretch. The way he's shooting the ball, he's just incredible."
--Knicks forward Latrell Sprewell


"If I had to pick somebody, I would have to say Kobe is my MVP, the way he is playing right now. Bruce (Bowen) did a great job on him, made him take a lot of tough shots and just stayed with him and took the challenge."
--Spurs swingman Stephen Jackson


On Kobe's offseason weight training: "The added muscle and bulk from pushing that steel and the natural maturation process now enables this grandmaster to regularly accomplish the unimaginable without dragging around excessive bulk and baggage. Most top players get to the point where they truly believe that anything is possible. Most are also governed by gravity, the laws of physics and self-regulating mental control mechanisms. Kobe has left all these behind. The extra strength and stamina have made him a superior 3-point shooter, a most dominant defender and arguably the game's top rebounder." - Bill Walton

5 straight double doubles with 2 triple doubles in the 1st 5 games of the 2002-2003 season

27/10
25/10
33/15
34/14
15/13

Calling kobe the games best rebounder is silly, but with 5 straight double doubles, its easy to see where Bill was coming from

I'm tired of the agendas and disinformation campagins on here. Sure Kobe did have setbacks in 2003-2004, and 2004-2005. But in 2002-2003, make no mistake, the best player in the NBA BY FAR was not Tim Duncan or Shaq. It was Kobe Bryant.

http://i56.tinypic.com/sczw5g.jpg

http://www.loudsportsshorts.com/basketball/dunks/bryant_dunks_over_ming.jpg

http://i54.tinypic.com/112eb0j.jpg

[EarlTheGoat]

In my opinion, Tracy Mcgrady was slightly more impressive that year. He was probably the fourth best player after Tim Duncan and Shaq.

[TheLogo]

Kobe that year was just a beast. I don't think the league has witnessed his performance that year, in their history.

I am glad I witnessed that year. I have watched basketball for many years and there wasn't a performance like that, I have witnessed.

Swine fluness!

[ShaqAttack3234]

Wrong.

First of all, Duncan was the best player in the league. This is obvious.

Kobe had a phenomenal year, but come on. The Lakers were 5-10 without Shaq and Kobe had a disappointing WCSF series when he forced too many shots. He took 26.5 shots per game, but only shot 43% and averaged 4.5 turnovers compared to 3.8 assists that series.

Shaq was still better than Kobe as well and aside from them?

McGrady- 32.1 ppg, 6.5 rpg, 5.5 apg, 1.7 spg, 46 FG%, 39 3P% 2.3 3P, 2.6 TO
Garnett- 23 ppg, 13.4 rpg, 6 apg, 1.4 spg, 1.6 bpg, 2.8 TO, 50.2 FG%

McGrady's team was horrible and they took Detroit to 7. Garnett led a team that had no business winning 51 games.

Kobe was the 5th best player that season, he certainly wasn't better than Duncan who had a legendary year and was clearly the best player in the game.

[Shep]

duncan, garnett, o'neal, kidd - all better than bryant.

kobe was fantastic in the regular season (even better than shaq) but o'neal thoroughly outplayed him in the playoffs, and as a result was officially named the lakers best player for that particular year.

[TheLogo]

Wrong.

First of all, Duncan was the best player in the league. This is obvious.

Kobe had a phenomenal year, but come on. The Lakers were 5-10 without Shaq and Kobe had a disappointing WCSF series when he forced too many shots. He took 26.5 shots per game, but only shot 43% and averaged 4.5 turnovers compared to 3.8 assists that series.

Shaq was still better than Kobe as well and aside from them?

McGrady- 32.1 ppg, 6.5 rpg, 5.5 apg, 1.7 spg, 46 FG%, 39 3P% 2.3 3P, 2.6 TO
Garnett- 23 ppg, 13.4 rpg, 6 apg, 1.4 spg, 1.6 bpg, 2.8 TO, 50.2 FG%

McGrady's team was horrible and they took Detroit to 7. Garnett led a team that had no business winning 51 games.

Kobe was the 5th best player that season, he certainly wasn't better than Duncan who had a legendary year and was clearly the best player in the game.

I know you are a huge Shaq fan but please keep your bias views to yourself. You don't have to come in a Kobe thread and start praising Duncan.

Like Jordan, what Kobe did was pretty amazing, in a game dominated by bigs.

[EarlTheGoat]

Wrong.

First of all, Duncan was the best player in the league. This is obvious.

Kobe had a phenomenal year, but come on. The Lakers were 5-10 without Shaq and Kobe had a disappointing WCSF series when he forced too many shots. He took 26.5 shots per game, but only shot 43% and averaged 4.5 turnovers compared to 3.8 assists that series.

Shaq was still better than Kobe as well and aside from them?

McGrady- 32.1 ppg, 6.5 rpg, 5.5 apg, 1.7 spg, 46 FG%, 39 3P% 2.3 3P, 2.6 TO
Garnett- 23 ppg, 13.4 rpg, 6 apg, 1.4 spg, 1.6 bpg, 2.8 TO, 50.2 FG%

McGrady's team was horrible and they took Detroit to 7. Garnett led a team that had no business winning 51 games.

Kobe was the 5th best player that season, he certainly wasn't better than Duncan who had a legendary year and was clearly the best player in the game.

Good post, like I said before, T-Mac, Shaq and Duncan were better than Kobe that year, specially Duncan, who was the undisputed number one and probably one of the most clear MVPs of this decade. Garnett is debatable, I still have Kobe above him but well, he makes the top-5, but no way in hell he was the best player that year.

[TheLogo]

This is the same argument I remember when people said Shaq and David Robinson was the best player over Jordan.

or

How Barkley is the best player over Jordan.

:facepalm

[Willkill24]

Kobe was a beast that year that 9 staright 40+ppg was sick.

[BDiesel324]

OP, Does Tim Duncan not exist in your mind? Or are you just trolling in a boring and pathetic way?

[TheLogo]

Kobe was a beast that year that 9 staright 40+ppg was sick.

Yep.

I guarantee if another player did this, they would be praising the heck out of them. It's Kobe, so people will say bleh.

[TheLogo]

OP, Does Tim Duncan not exist in your mind? Or are you just trolling in a boring and pathetic way?

Like I said, in a league dominated by bigs....Kobe did show why he was the best player. Like MJ did with Shaq and Drob.

[DatDudeD]

uh oh....and it begins.... lol. I am gonna throw my bone out there and let the dogs fight it out the rest of this thread. Anyway it was a great season for a lot of players kobe, kg, dunca, shaq and t mac were easily the 3 best players in the league. I cant go so far to say kobe was the best but imo he was top 3 or 4. People look at t mac season that year and say wow, but kobes numbers are damn near identical down t mac 32/6/5 46% kobe 30/7/6 45%. I do think Duncan deserved the MVP that year he was just too consistently dominant up through the playoffs. Kg was a beast had one of his best all around seasons. Also shaq missed a few games that year but came on late in the season and did his thing.

[rmt]

I know you are a huge Shaq fan but please keep your bias views to yourself. You don't have to come in a Kobe thread and start praising Duncan.

Like Jordan, what Kobe did was pretty amazing, in a game dominated by bigs.
We do still have freedom of speech in this country and that includes coming in a thread and disagreeing with the thread title. I also agree that Duncan was the best player in 2002-03, not Kobe.

Talk about pot calling the kettle black - why compare Kobe to Jordan? This is a thread about the best player in 2002-03 so why wouldn't the player who won MVP and Finals MVP that year be mentioned.

BTW, Kobe is nowhere near Jordan.

[nek1477]

takes me back, getting off work with a cold brew, wings and a pizza, watching kobe go for 40 almost every night :pimp: god i miss the old days.

[TheLogo]

The OP brought up:

-stats
-reasons
-quotes
-pretty pictures

....in this entire thread to note that Kobe was the best player in the game. Those that said otherwise just said Duncan was better with no clear indication of why?

[chazzy]

The OP brought up:

-stats
-reasons
-quotes
-pretty pictures

....in this entire thread to note that Kobe was the best player in the game. Those that said otherwise just said Duncan was better with no clear indication of why?

In a nutshell..

23.5/13/4/3
MVP + FMVP
Ended the Shaq/Kobe dynasty
Posted great Finals numbers including a near quad double to close out the series

Kobe's never had a season as good as this, and 03 was Kobe's 3rd best season IMO

[TheLogo]

In a nutshell..

23.5/13/4/3
MVP + FMVP
Ended the Shaq/Kobe dynasty
Posted great Finals numbers including a near quad double to close out the series

Kobe's never had a season as good as this, and 03 was his 3rd best season IMO

sorry dude that isn't enough.

I don't want to here Duncan led a bunch of scrubs argument either.

[Manute for Ever!]

In a nutshell..

23.5/13/4/3
MVP + FMVP
Ended the Shaq/Kobe dynasty
Posted great Finals numbers including a near quad double to close out the series

Kobe's never had a season as good as this, and 03 was Kobe's 3rd best season IMO

And a guy with a Lakers avy wrote it, too.

http://4.bp.blogspot.com/_WRYzUWY23r8/SGedqxubkAI/AAAAAAAAAEg/O32O8qoypoQ/s400/Game+Set+Match.jpg

[Micku]

In a nutshell..

23.5/13/4/3
MVP + FMVP
Ended the Shaq/Kobe dynasty
Posted great Finals numbers including a near quad double to close out the series

Kobe's never had a season as good as this, and 03 was Kobe's 3rd best season IMO

I hated the Spurs. Do you realize the Lakers were one shot away from changing that entire series around?

LOOK AT THAT:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=m6V1-UraQAs#t=10m14s

It went in and out! It still stings.

But yeah, I don't think Kobe was the best player that year. More people were ready to consider him the man with the Lakers since he exploded and Shaq was out a lot. But I think Duncan, Shaq, and Garnett were consider better.

[chazzy]

sorry dude that isn't enough.

I don't want to here Duncan led a bunch of scrubs argument either.

Eh, don't know what to tell you..

But to stay on topic, Kobe was incredible to watch that year. This is one of my favorite games

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WytqShjjYRA
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TN4YMwo44Qc&feature=related

Baseline windmill game in NY. 46/6/3, 36 came in the 2nd and 3rd Qs alone. You can see just how much more athletic/strong he was that year, even the elevation on his jumpers is noticeably better.

[ImmortalD24]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NhgC2o6IEeo&t=23s

[Yung D-Will]

Duncan was obviously the best player that year :facepalm

[Jacks3]

lol @ Shaq, KG, and T-Mac being better then Kobe that year. :oldlol: Duncan is the only one with a case.

[Jacks3]

Kobe had a phenomenal year, but come on. The Lakers were 5-10 without Shaq and Kobe had a disappointing WCSF series when he forced too many shots. He took 26.5 shots per game, but only shot 43% and averaged 4.5 turnovers compared to 3.8 assists that series.



:roll: dude was playing with a shoulder that needed to be surgically repaired. his series wasn't that bad. and did you forget his tremendous series in the first round vs the t-wolves where he outplayed garnett? and didn't t-mac blow a 3-1 series lead while shooting like 41% in the last 4 games?:oldlol: :oldlol: :oldlol:

[Jacks3]

Best player in 2002-2003: Kobe Bryant

30 ppg 7 rpg 6 apg 2.2 spg against both handchecking and zone
1st team all defensive
1st team All-NBA
40+ points 19 times in 82 games:roll:
40+ in 9 striaght
35+ in 13 straight
NBA record 12 threes in a game
50+ points 3 times
42 ppg in February 2003 (Jordan never averaged 40 ppg for a month in regular season, Kobe did it 3 times)

http://www.vintageadsandstuff.com/viewsi030303.jpeg

http://www.nba.com/features/kobe_40plus_030221.html














5 straight double doubles with 2 triple doubles in the 1st 5 games of the 2002-2003 season

27/10
25/10
33/15
34/14
15/13




:applause: :applause: :applause:

[All Net]

Duncan was amazing that year and was the best player in the league. Kobe was great and was right up there but Timmy was just teriffic all year. It wasn't just about stats with him his overall presents on the floor was outstanding. You had to watch the games to realise how damn good he was.

His impact on games went way above stats, his defense clogging the paint was great and changes alot of shots each game nevermind to go along with 23 and 14 numbers.

[SinJackal]

I know you are a huge Shaq fan but please keep your bias views to yourself. You don't have to come in a Kobe thread and start praising Duncan.

Like Jordan, what Kobe did was pretty amazing, in a game dominated by bigs.

It isn't bias, it's true. I agree with him 100%. He's right roughly 95% of the time he posts, even with his opinions.

Are you dumb enough to not realize Shaq and Duncan were easily the #1 and #2 players for like a 5 year span back then? Nobody else impacted the game as much as them. It's embarrassing that you think Duncan wouldn't have been the #1 player in the league during his best season, when he'd just been the #2 player in the league for the last 3 years behind Shaq.



Duncan was amazing that year and was the best player in the league. Kobe was great and was right up there but Timmy was just teriffic all year. It wasn't just about stats with him his overall presents on the floor was outstanding. You had to watch the games to realise how damn good he was.

His impact on games went way above stats, his defense clogging the paint was great and changes alot of shots each game nevermind to go along with 23 and 14 numbers.

Yeah, exactly. That was a dream season. He was one of those players who at the time (if you cheered for his team), was the type of player where you didn't feel like you were going to lose no matter how shitty the rest of the team was. As long as he was there, you knew something magical could happen, and it did.

[All Net]

It isn't bias, it's true. I agree with him 100%. He's right roughly 95% of the time he posts, even with his opinions.

Are you dumb enough to not realize Shaq and Duncan were easily the #1 and #2 players for like a 5 year span back then? Nobody else impacted the game as much as them. It's embarrassing that you think Duncan wouldn't have been the #1 player in the league during his best season, when he'd just been the #2 player in the league for the last 3 years behind Shaq.

I know Timmy wasn't flash and all but it is sickening when people don't realise how great he was.

[Jacks3]

lol @ duncan being better than kobe. dude most be the most overrated player in history.

[Indian guy]

The Top 5 players ALL had sick statistical seasons that year. You can't really go wrong with any of them, but what TD accomplished besides his numbers should put him over the top.

[Harison]

Homer is strong one in OP :sleeping Kobe was in the Top3 that season, and even that is arguable.

[branslowski]

Duncan was the best. Clearly....But lol@ Shaqattack having 4 players over Kobe....C'mom man...:lol

[ShaqAttack3234]

As a follow up to my previous post with explanations.

1.Tim Duncan- Tim's offensive skills were at their peak. Whether it be the 12-15 foot bank shot, the 15-18 foot straight away jumper, both of which complemented his face up game and allowed him to use his ball handling skills and mobility to attack the basket, or his excellent back to the basket game consisting of a great jump hook, a necessary amount of polished fakes and a variety of turnarounds over either shoulder. His passing skills were also elite for a big man. He made numerous great passes every game, not always flashy, but often the perfect pass depending on how the defense reacted. He also had his best rebounding and shot blocking year which enhanced his always stellar defense. Tim had the length and athleticism to block tougher shots, but the impeccable timing to block shots almost flatfooted because he didn't bite on many fakes. Tim also ran the floor well for a big man always keeping him involved in the game and he adjusted perfectly to each lineup whether it be the twin towers lineup with Robinson or the more traditional lineup with Rose. He was also remarkably consistent, led by example and stepped up in the clutch. But I won't be able to convince those who didn't watch the NBA back then without stats. Here are his regular season stats with his rankings among league leaders in parenthesis; 23.3 ppg(7th), 12.9 rpg(3rd), 3.9 apg, 2.9 bpg(3rd), 51.3 FG%(7th). And he stepped up his game big time in the playoffs with averages of 24.7 ppg, 15.4 rpg, 5.3 apg and 3.3 bpg on 52.9% shooting. He had just too many monster games to name in those playoffs. Among them were 37/16/4 to close out the Lakers in LA, 40/15/7 to open up the WCF, 34/24/6/6 in game 3 of the WCF, 32/20/6/7 to open up the finals and 21/20/10/8 to clinch the title. For the playoffs, he had six 30 point games, six 20 rebound games and two triple doubles. Nuff said.

2.Kevin Garnett- Dragged a core of Wally Szcerbiak(who missed 30 games), Troy Hudson and Rasho Nesterovic to 51 wins in the West. His versatility was at it's peak. He was the worst offensive player out of the top 5, but his ability to help his team overachieve, his defense and his incredible versatility put him at 2nd. He was the best big man at defending the perimeter, he played hard on every defensive play and he was still a good shot blocker. His main offense weapons were his jump shot which he could make consistently out to 20 feet and his turnaround jumper, but he was also a phenomenal athlete. Like Duncan, he was also an excellent passer and he often found himself handling the ball out on the perimeter, sometimes running the pick and roll with another big man! And again, I'll end the post with stats to back up my post and spot among the league leaders in parenthesis. 23 ppg(9th), 13.4 rpg(2nd), 6 apg(13th), 1.4 spg and 1.6 bpg(17th) on 50.2% shooting(11th). In the playoffs, he stepped up vs a much more talented Laker team and averaged 27 ppg, 15.7 rpg, 5.2 apg, 1.7 spg and 1.7 bpg on 51.4% shooting.

3.Shaq- Still easily the most unstoppable low post scorer, one of the best passing big men, one of the better rebounders in the league and the toughest matchup physically. He wasn't as active defensively as previous seasons, but he still blocked a lot of shots, took up space in the paint and provided intimidation that was second to none. He also had a career year at the line so that wasn't as much of an issue. His value can be demonstrated by the fact that the Lakers were 5-10 without him and 45-22 with him. He averaged 27.5 ppg(4th), 11.1 rpg(4th if he had qualified), 3.1 apg and 2.4 bpg(6th) on 57.4% shooting(2nd). His TS% was second to only Eddy Curry who didn't attempt anywhere near half as many shots and not only did no other 20+ ppg scorer have a TS% of 60% or better like Shaq, but he was one of only two top 20 scorers to finish top 20 in TS% along with Dirk who finished 6th in scoring and 13th in TS%, respectively. More importantly, he averaged 27 ppg, 14.8 rpg, 3.7 apg and 2.8 bpg in the playoffs.

4.Tracy McGrady- The best scorer in the year and as good of a passer/playmaker at the swingman position as anyone you'll find in that era. Tracy was an incredible athlete and his length was rare the shooting guard position. He was also a prolific shooter with unlimited range, even off the dribble and he also had a mid-range game. He also had sick ball handling skills and routinely finished with strong dunks or acrobatic reverse lay ups like Kobe. He dragged a terrible team to 42 wins and the playoffs, not to mention a 7th game vs a Detroit team that won it all the next year with the additions of Rasheed Wallace and Larry Brown. All he had was Mike Miller for 49 games, Grant Hill at probably not even 50% for 29 games, Gordan Giricek for 27 games and Drew Gooden for 18 games. As far as constant rotation players throughout the season? Pat Garrity, a 34 year old Darrell Armstrong, a 300+ pound Shawn Kemp who was too fat to do anything other than shoot jumpers(and he shot a low percentage) and Jacque Vaughn. He averaged 32.1 ppg(1st), 6.5 rpg, 5.5 apg and 1.7 spg on 45.7% from the field and 38.6% on 3s while making 2.3 3s per game(3rd). The 2.6 TO he averaged is also very low considering the offensive load he carried and the defensive attention he received. Considering how overmatched his team was in talent, you couldn't ask much more of him in the playoffs. He averaged 31.7 ppg, 6.7 rpg, 4.7 apg and 2 spg on a respectable 44.8% shooting while still making 2.3 threes. To show what a one man team he was, he had 43/7/3 on 15/28 shooting, 3/6 3P and 10/12 FT while winning the game with only one other double digit scorer on his team. In game 2, he went out and dropped 46 points on 16/26 shooting, 4/9 on 3s and 10/11 from the line, but the rest of his team combined only scored 33 points.

This isn't an anti-Kobe post. I have nothing against Kobe, I actually have him at 8th all-time right now and for the record, I don't think this was one of his top 3 seasons

[Yung D-Will]

As a follow up to my previous post with explanations.

1.Tim Duncan- Tim's offensive skills were at their peak. Whether it be the 12-15 foot bank shot, the 15-18 foot straight away jumper, both of which complemented his face up game and allowed him to use his ball handling skills and mobility to attack the basket, or his excellent back to the basket game consisting of a great jump hook, a necessary amount of polished fakes and a variety of turnarounds over either shoulder. His passing skills were also elite for a big man. He made numerous great passes every game, not always flashy, but often the perfect pass depending on how the defense reacted. He also had his best rebounding and shot blocking year which enhanced his always stellar defense. Tim had the length and athleticism to block tougher shots, but the impeccable timing to block shots almost flatfooted because he didn't bite on many fakes. Tim also ran the floor well for a big man always keeping him involved in the game and he adjusted perfectly to each lineup whether it be the twin towers lineup with Robinson or the more traditional lineup with Rose. He was also remarkably consistent, led by example and stepped up in the clutch. But I won't be able to convince those who didn't watch the NBA back then without stats. Here are his regular season stats with his rankings among league leaders in parenthesis; 23.3 ppg(7th), 12.9 rpg(3rd), 3.9 apg, 2.9 bpg(3rd), 51.3 FG%(7th). And he stepped up his game big time in the playoffs with averages of 24.7 ppg, 15.4 rpg, 5.3 apg and 3.3 bpg on 52.9% shooting. He had just too many monster games to name in those playoffs. Among them were 37/16/4 to close out the Lakers in LA, 40/15/7 to open up the WCF, 34/24/6/6 in game 3 of the WCF, 32/20/6/7 to open up the finals and 21/20/10/8 to clinch the title. For the playoffs, he had six 30 point games, six 20 rebound games and two triple doubles. Nuff said.

2.Kevin Garnett- Dragged a core of Wally Szcerbiak(who missed 30 games), Troy Hudson and Rasho Nesterovic to 51 wins in the West. His versatility was at it's peak. He was the worst offensive player out of the top 5, but his ability to help his team overachieve, his defense and his incredible versatility put him at 2nd. He was the best big man at defending the perimeter, he played hard on every defensive play and he was still a good shot blocker. His main offense weapons were his jump shot which he could make consistently out to 20 feet and his turnaround jumper, but he was also a phenomenal athlete. Like Duncan, he was also an excellent passer and he often found himself handling the ball out on the perimeter, sometimes running the pick and roll with another big man! And again, I'll end the post with stats to back up my post and spot among the league leaders in parenthesis. 23 ppg(9th), 13.4 rpg(2nd), 6 apg(13th), 1.4 spg and 1.6 bpg(17th) on 50.2% shooting(11th). In the playoffs, he stepped up vs a much more talented Laker team and averaged 27 ppg, 15.7 rpg, 5.2 apg, 1.7 spg and 1.7 bpg on 51.4% shooting.

3.Shaq- Still easily the most unstoppable low post scorer, one of the best passing big men, one of the better rebounders in the league and the toughest matchup physically. He wasn't as active defensively as previous seasons, but he still blocked a lot of shots, took up space in the paint and provided intimidation that was second to none. He also had a career year at the line so that wasn't as much of an issue. His value can be demonstrated by the fact that the Lakers were 5-10 without him and 45-22 with him. He averaged 27.5 ppg(4th), 11.1 rpg(4th if he had qualified), 3.1 apg and 2.4 bpg(6th) on 57.4% shooting(2nd). His TS% was second to only Eddy Curry who didn't attempt anywhere near half as many shots and not only did no other 20+ ppg scorer have a TS% of 60% or better like Shaq, but he was one of only two top 20 scorers to finish top 20 in TS% along with Dirk who finished 6th in scoring and 13th in TS%, respectively. More importantly, he averaged 27 ppg, 14.8 rpg, 3.7 apg and 2.8 bpg in the playoffs.

4.Tracy McGrady- The best scorer in the year and as good of a passer/playmaker at the swingman position as anyone you'll find in that era. Tracy was an incredible athlete and his length was rare the shooting guard position. He was also a prolific shooter with unlimited range, even off the dribble and he also had a mid-range game. He also had sick ball handling skills and routinely finished with strong dunks or acrobatic reverse lay ups like Kobe. He dragged a terrible team to 42 wins and the playoffs, not to mention a 7th game vs a Detroit team that won it all the next year with the additions of Rasheed Wallace and Larry Brown. All he had was Mike Miller for 49 games, Grant Hill at probably not even 50% for 29 games, Gordan Giricek for 27 games and Drew Gooden for 18 games. As far as constant rotation players throughout the season? Pat Garrity, a 34 year old Darrell Armstrong, a 300+ pound Shawn Kemp who was too fat to do anything other than shoot jumpers(and he shot a low percentage) and Jacque Vaughn. He averaged 32.1 ppg(1st), 6.5 rpg, 5.5 apg and 1.7 spg on 45.7% from the field and 38.6% on 3s while making 2.3 3s per game(3rd). The 2.6 TO he averaged is also very low considering the offensive load he carried and the defensive attention he received. Considering how overmatched his team was in talent, you couldn't ask much more of him in the playoffs. He averaged 31.7 ppg, 6.7 rpg, 4.7 apg and 2 spg on a respectable 44.8% shooting while still making 2.3 threes. To show what a one man team he was, he had 43/7/3 on 15/28 shooting, 3/6 3P and 10/12 FT while winning the game with only one other double digit scorer on his team. In game 2, he went out and dropped 46 points on 16/26 shooting, 4/9 on 3s and 10/11 from the line, but the rest of his team combined only scored 33 points.

This isn't an anti-Kobe post. I have nothing against Kobe, I actually have him at 8th all-time right now and for the record, I don't think this was one of his top 3 seasons

Over who =X

[G-Funk]

4.Tracy McGrady- The best scorer in the year and as good of a passer/playmaker at the swingman position as anyone you'll find in that era. Tracy was an incredible athlete and his length was rare the shooting guard position. He was also a prolific shooter with unlimited range, even off the dribble and he also had a mid-range game. He also had sick ball handling skills and routinely finished with strong dunks or acrobatic reverse lay ups like Kobe. He dragged a terrible team to 42 wins and the playoffs, not to mention a 7th game vs a Detroit team that won it all the next year with the additions of Rasheed Wallace and Larry Brown. All he had was Mike Miller for 49 games, Grant Hill at probably not even 50% for 29 games, Gordan Giricek for 27 games and Drew Gooden for 18 games. As far as constant rotation players throughout the season? Pat Garrity, a 34 year old Darrell Armstrong, a 300+ pound Shawn Kemp who was too fat to do anything other than shoot jumpers(and he shot a low percentage) and Jacque Vaughn. He averaged 32.1 ppg(1st), 6.5 rpg, 5.5 apg and 1.7 spg on 45.7% from the field and 38.6% on 3s while making 2.3 3s per game(3rd). The 2.6 TO he averaged is also very low considering the offensive load he carried and the defensive attention he received. Considering how overmatched his team was in talent, you couldn't ask much more of him in the playoffs. He averaged 31.7 ppg, 6.7 rpg, 4.7 apg and 2 spg on a respectable 44.8% shooting while still making 2.3 threes. To show what a one man team he was, he had 43/7/3 on 15/28 shooting, 3/6 3P and 10/12 FT while winning the game with only one other double digit scorer on his team. In game 2, he went out and dropped 46 points on 16/26 shooting, 4/9 on 3s and 10/11 from the line, but the rest of his team combined only scored 33 points.





Like how you did not mention he's defense.lol @ ppl who chose no defense T-mac over Kobe that year.

That must have been 1 of the greatest 1st teams of all-time

[ShaqAttack3234]

Like how you did not mention he's defense.lol @ ppl who chose no defense T-mac over Kobe that year.

That must have been 1 of the greatest 1st teams of all-time

McGrady wasn't a bad defender in his Orlando days, he was a pretty good defender, above average, though his defense slipped a bit in 2003 with the bigger offensive load he carried compared to previous seasons. Kobe's defense also wasn't quite at the level it was during the 3peat either, this was usually the case in his higher scoring seasons. I'll give him the edge over T-Mac and it closes the gap to make it a tough choice, but McGrady having to carry a team without a 2nd scorer all season while having a superior scoring season to Kobe and being atleast equal in the other aspects(aside from defense) give him the edge.

Again, the Lakers record without Shaq hurts Kobe's season to me, T-Mac had to carry a roster no better than that for an entire season and he did so without a consistent starting 5 due to trades and injuries.

But also forcing it vs the Spurs, again, as evidenced by 26.5 FGA, but just 43% shooting and 4.5 TO compared to 3.8 apg that series. If he didn't have it going vs a great defender like Bowen, don't force it, especially with a proven championship team playing with him.

[necya]

Best player in 2002-2003: Kobe Bryant

30 ppg 7 rpg 6 apg 2.2 spg against both handchecking and zone
1st team all defensive
1st team All-NBA
40+ points 19 times in 82 games
40+ in 9 striaght
35+ in 13 straight
NBA record 12 threes in a game
50+ points 3 times
42 ppg in February 2003 (Jordan never averaged 40 ppg for a month in regular season, Kobe did it 3 times)

http://www.vintageadsandstuff.com/viewsi030303.jpeg

http://www.nba.com/features/kobe_40plus_030221.html














5 straight double doubles with 2 triple doubles in the 1st 5 games of the 2002-2003 season

27/10
25/10
33/15
34/14
15/13

Calling kobe the games best rebounder is silly, but with 5 straight double doubles, its easy to see where Bill was coming from

I'm tired of the agendas and disinformation campagins on here. Sure Kobe did have setbacks in 2003-2004, and 2004-2005. But in 2002-2003, make no mistake, the best player in the NBA BY FAR was not Tim Duncan or Shaq. It was Kobe Bryant.

http://i56.tinypic.com/sczw5g.jpg

http://www.loudsportsshorts.com/basketball/dunks/bryant_dunks_over_ming.jpg

http://i54.tinypic.com/112eb0j.jpg

ball hog season by excellence
the guy was very dangerous on a skill point but his selffish mind killed the lakers, why he would be named MVP?
because he had a month at 40ppg? with 5/14 games over 50% FG shooting? you overrate your god like a child who idolizes superman.

as it has been said, TD and shaq had a lot more impact on the game. kobe just sold more jersey for kids.

[Willkill24]

McGrady wasn't a bad defender in his Orlando days, he was a pretty good defender, above average, though his defense slipped a bit in 2003 with the bigger offensive load he carried compared to previous seasons. Kobe's defense also wasn't quite at the level it was during the 3peat either, this was usually the case in his higher scoring seasons. I'll give him the edge over T-Mac and it closes the gap to make it a tough choice, but McGrady having to carry a team without a 2nd scorer all season while having a superior scoring season to Kobe and being atleast equal in the other aspects(aside from defense) give him the edge.

Again, the Lakers record without Shaq hurts Kobe's season to me, T-Mac had to carry a roster no better than that for an entire season and he did so without a consistent starting 5 due to trades and injuries.

But also forcing it vs the Spurs, again, as evidenced by 26.5 FGA, but just 43% shooting and 4.5 TO compared to 3.8 apg that series. If he didn't have it going vs a great defender like Bowen, don't force it, especially with a proven championship team playing with him.
I don't think he played bad at all in that series, they won games 3,4 because of Kobes freethrows and game 5 he went off for 15-31 5-11 3pt and lakers still lost.

[SinJackal]

As a follow up to my previous post with explanations.

1.Tim Duncan- Tim's offensive skills were at their peak. Whether it be the 12-15 foot bank shot, the 15-18 foot straight away jumper, both of which complemented his face up game and allowed him to use his ball handling skills and mobility to attack the basket, or his excellent back to the basket game consisting of a great jump hook, a necessary amount of polished fakes and a variety of turnarounds over either shoulder. His passing skills were also elite for a big man. He made numerous great passes every game, not always flashy, but often the perfect pass depending on how the defense reacted. He also had his best rebounding and shot blocking year which enhanced his always stellar defense. Tim had the length and athleticism to block tougher shots, but the impeccable timing to block shots almost flatfooted because he didn't bite on many fakes. Tim also ran the floor well for a big man always keeping him involved in the game and he adjusted perfectly to each lineup whether it be the twin towers lineup with Robinson or the more traditional lineup with Rose. He was also remarkably consistent, led by example and stepped up in the clutch. But I won't be able to convince those who didn't watch the NBA back then without stats. Here are his regular season stats with his rankings among league leaders in parenthesis; 23.3 ppg(7th), 12.9 rpg(3rd), 3.9 apg, 2.9 bpg(3rd), 51.3 FG%(7th). And he stepped up his game big time in the playoffs with averages of 24.7 ppg, 15.4 rpg, 5.3 apg and 3.3 bpg on 52.9% shooting. He had just too many monster games to name in those playoffs. Among them were 37/16/4 to close out the Lakers in LA, 40/15/7 to open up the WCF, 34/24/6/6 in game 3 of the WCF, 32/20/6/7 to open up the finals and 21/20/10/8 to clinch the title. For the playoffs, he had six 30 point games, six 20 rebound games and two triple doubles. Nuff said.

2.Kevin Garnett- Dragged a core of Wally Szcerbiak(who missed 30 games), Troy Hudson and Rasho Nesterovic to 51 wins in the West. His versatility was at it's peak. He was the worst offensive player out of the top 5, but his ability to help his team overachieve, his defense and his incredible versatility put him at 2nd. He was the best big man at defending the perimeter, he played hard on every defensive play and he was still a good shot blocker. His main offense weapons were his jump shot which he could make consistently out to 20 feet and his turnaround jumper, but he was also a phenomenal athlete. Like Duncan, he was also an excellent passer and he often found himself handling the ball out on the perimeter, sometimes running the pick and roll with another big man! And again, I'll end the post with stats to back up my post and spot among the league leaders in parenthesis. 23 ppg(9th), 13.4 rpg(2nd), 6 apg(13th), 1.4 spg and 1.6 bpg(17th) on 50.2% shooting(11th). In the playoffs, he stepped up vs a much more talented Laker team and averaged 27 ppg, 15.7 rpg, 5.2 apg, 1.7 spg and 1.7 bpg on 51.4% shooting.

3.Shaq- Still easily the most unstoppable low post scorer, one of the best passing big men, one of the better rebounders in the league and the toughest matchup physically. He wasn't as active defensively as previous seasons, but he still blocked a lot of shots, took up space in the paint and provided intimidation that was second to none. He also had a career year at the line so that wasn't as much of an issue. His value can be demonstrated by the fact that the Lakers were 5-10 without him and 45-22 with him. He averaged 27.5 ppg(4th), 11.1 rpg(4th if he had qualified), 3.1 apg and 2.4 bpg(6th) on 57.4% shooting(2nd). His TS% was second to only Eddy Curry who didn't attempt anywhere near half as many shots and not only did no other 20+ ppg scorer have a TS% of 60% or better like Shaq, but he was one of only two top 20 scorers to finish top 20 in TS% along with Dirk who finished 6th in scoring and 13th in TS%, respectively. More importantly, he averaged 27 ppg, 14.8 rpg, 3.7 apg and 2.8 bpg in the playoffs.

4.Tracy McGrady- The best scorer in the year and as good of a passer/playmaker at the swingman position as anyone you'll find in that era. Tracy was an incredible athlete and his length was rare the shooting guard position. He was also a prolific shooter with unlimited range, even off the dribble and he also had a mid-range game. He also had sick ball handling skills and routinely finished with strong dunks or acrobatic reverse lay ups like Kobe. He dragged a terrible team to 42 wins and the playoffs, not to mention a 7th game vs a Detroit team that won it all the next year with the additions of Rasheed Wallace and Larry Brown. All he had was Mike Miller for 49 games, Grant Hill at probably not even 50% for 29 games, Gordan Giricek for 27 games and Drew Gooden for 18 games. As far as constant rotation players throughout the season? Pat Garrity, a 34 year old Darrell Armstrong, a 300+ pound Shawn Kemp who was too fat to do anything other than shoot jumpers(and he shot a low percentage) and Jacque Vaughn. He averaged 32.1 ppg(1st), 6.5 rpg, 5.5 apg and 1.7 spg on 45.7% from the field and 38.6% on 3s while making 2.3 3s per game(3rd). The 2.6 TO he averaged is also very low considering the offensive load he carried and the defensive attention he received. Considering how overmatched his team was in talent, you couldn't ask much more of him in the playoffs. He averaged 31.7 ppg, 6.7 rpg, 4.7 apg and 2 spg on a respectable 44.8% shooting while still making 2.3 threes. To show what a one man team he was, he had 43/7/3 on 15/28 shooting, 3/6 3P and 10/12 FT while winning the game with only one other double digit scorer on his team. In game 2, he went out and dropped 46 points on 16/26 shooting, 4/9 on 3s and 10/11 from the line, but the rest of his team combined only scored 33 points.

This isn't an anti-Kobe post. I have nothing against Kobe, I actually have him at 8th all-time right now and for the record, I don't think this was one of his top 3 seasons

Stop destroying threads! :P

Agreed though, I don't see why these people are acting like Duncan, Shaq and KG had anything less than incredible seasons. Duncan's was straight up magical. Clearly the best player in the NBA that year. Truly his first year as almost the sole low post presence offensively, and delivered beautifully.

People forget that players like Shaq during the three peat, Duncan this particular season we're talking about (and the next couple years), and MJ back in the early/mid 90s were the guys where you hoped someone else would knock off in the playoffs before they got to you, because the odds of winning were absolutely horrible against them. This isn't highsight either, it was truly the feeling among the league and fans at the times.

Shaq and Duncan were the most feared players in the league for years. It's really irritating how fans who didn't even watch back then won't accept that.

[G-Funk]

McGrady wasn't a bad defender in his Orlando days, he was a pretty good defender, above average, though his defense slipped a bit in 2003 with the bigger offensive load he carried compared to previous seasons. Kobe's defense also wasn't quite at the level it was during the 3peat either, this was usually the case in his higher scoring seasons. I'll give him the edge over T-Mac and it closes the gap to make it a tough choice, but McGrady having to carry a team without a 2nd scorer all season while having a superior scoring season to Kobe and being atleast equal in the other aspects(aside from defense) give him the edge.

Again, the Lakers record without Shaq hurts Kobe's season to me, T-Mac had to carry a roster no better than that for an entire season and he did so without a consistent starting 5 due to trades and injuries.

But also forcing it vs the Spurs, again, as evidenced by 26.5 FGA, but just 43% shooting and 4.5 TO compared to 3.8 apg that series. If he didn't have it going vs a great defender like Bowen, don't force it, especially with a proven championship team playing with him.



Not only was T-mac a bad defender, he was a horrible defender, he was lazy and had completly no interests in defending. If you think that a player could make his team better by scoring, than that's fine but IMO a leader can also make his team a better defensive team. Look at Wade for example or Kobe, Altough not the best defensive players with or without the best teams, Particually Wade, he showed to lead not only on offense but on defense . If he wanted to just focus on offense he would have obiously scored better stats. T-mac could have focosed atleast 4-5 possesions on defense and try to shut someone down intead of wasting so much energy on scoring.


BTW although I disagree with your opinion 100% on this matter, I gotta give you props and respect your opinion, cause ur not as bias or have an agenda like others (SinJackel cough, cough).

[ShaqAttack3234]

I don't think he played bad at all in that series, they won games 3,4 because of Kobes freethrows and game 5 he went off for 15-31 5-11 3pt and lakers still lost.

I don't want to turn this into a bash Kobe thread, but in the game 1 and 2 losses, he averaged 31 shot attempts and just 6 free throw attempts and he averaged just 1.5 apg, but 5 TO while shooting 40% on those 31 FGA.

And in the game 6 loss, Kobe had a solid first half and the game was tied at one point in the 3rd and LA trailed by just 2 with under 5 remaining in the 3rd, but Kobe disappeared in the second half in a winnable game.

I have no problem with anyone praising this great season, the only thing I took issue with was the OP claiming he was not only the best in the NBA, but by far the best.

I do have Kobe as the best player in the league for 3 consecutive years from 2006-2008, so I'd have no problem declaring him the best player in the league if I agreed for the season in question.


Clearly the best player in the NBA that year. Truly his first year as almost the sole low post presence offensively, and delivered beautifully.

Nah, Duncan was even more of the focal point in 2002. He had less help than 2003 and another incredible season and one of his 2 well deserved MVPs. Duncan didn't have the consistent go to second guy in 2003, but he had more guys who could step up than in '02 and Parker atleast gave him more scoring as a 2nd option than what he got from his 2nd option in '02.

But Duncan was truly incredible in 2003, the word unstoppable is overused, but it applies to Duncan for 2003, particularly in the playoffs.


Not only was T-mac a bad defender, he was a horrible defender, he was lazy and had completly no interests in defending. If you think that a player could make his team better by scoring, than that's fine but IMO a leader can also make his team a better defensive team. Look at Wade for example or Kobe, Altough not the best defensive players with or without the best teams, Particually Wade, he showed to lead not only on offense but on defense . If he wanted to just focus on offense he would have obiously scored better stats. T-mac could have focosed atleast 4-5 possesions on defense and try to shut someone down intead of wasting so much energy on scoring.

Nah, I'm not seeing how T-Mac was a horrible defender back then. He was a poor defender for most of his Rockets career, but in his Toronto days and Magic days(pre-2004) he played well on that end. He didn't consistently play all-defensive team level D in 2003, but it was one of those cases like Kobe in 2006 and 2007 where his team wasn't good enough and needed him to score too much for him to spend the necessary energy on that end.

You're entitled to your opinion, and I won't try to change your opinion on T-Mac's defense back then. I'm just stating how I viewed it.

[SinJackal]

I don't think he played bad at all in that series, they won games 3,4 because of Kobes freethrows and game 5 he went off for 15-31 5-11 3pt and lakers still lost.

Shaq had better games in the two losses though.

Essentially, it was 2 good games for Kobe as opposed to 1-2 average ones and 2-3 shitty ones. Compared to Shaq's 4-5 good games and 1-2 average ones. The Spurs/Lakers series is not a good topic to use to talk about Kobe having a better year than Shaq. Shaq was clearly much, much better in the series.



Not only was T-mac a bad defender, he was a horrible defender, he was lazy and had completly no interests in defending. If you think that a player could make his team better by scoring, than that's fine but IMO a leader can also make his team a better defensive team. Look at Wade for example or Kobe, Altough not the best defensive players with or without the best teams, Particually Wade, he showed to lead not only on offense but on defense . If he wanted to just focus on offense he would have obiously scored better stats. T-mac could have focosed atleast 4-5 possesions on defense and try to shut someone down intead of wasting so much energy on scoring.


BTW although I disagree with your opinion 100% on this matter, I gotta give you props and respect your opinion, cause ur not as bias or have an agenda like others (SinJackel cough, cough).

Whew! I almost thought you were talking about me for a second. Thankfully, I'm not "SinJackel", and know I don't have some magical "agenda", as if I'm getting paid for, or gain something in talking to other fans about a sports league and it's players. :facepalm

As for bias, everyone's bias in some way. . .especially you, and thus, calling me that doesn't mean anything.

[beermonsteroo]

Eh, don't know what to tell you..

But to stay on topic, Kobe was incredible to watch that year. This is one of my favorite games

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WytqShjjYRA
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TN4YMwo44Qc&feature=related

Baseline windmill game in NY. 46/6/3, 36 came in the 2nd and 3rd Qs alone. You can see just how much more athletic/strong he was that year, even the elevation on his jumpers is noticeably better.

At age 24 Kobe had already to settle on jumpers. He had already lost a step compared to 00-02

[Heilige]

In terms of the regular season from best to least:

1. Shaquille O'Neal

2. Tracy McGrady

3. Kobe Bryant

4. Kevin Garnett

5. Tim Duncan


In terms of the playoffs from best to least:

1. Tim Duncan

2. Shaquille O'Neal

3. Kobe Bryant

4. Kevin Garnett

5. Tracy McGrady

[indiefan24]

true or false: kobe bryant is one of the greatest streak shooters in NBA history.

[Willkill24]

I don't want to turn this into a bash Kobe thread, but in the game 1 and 2 losses, he averaged 31 shot attempts and just 6 free throw attempts and he averaged just 1.5 apg, but 5 TO while shooting 40% on those 31 FGA.

And in the game 6 loss, Kobe had a solid first half and the game was tied at one point in the 3rd and LA trailed by just 2 with under 5 remaining in the 3rd, but Kobe disappeared in the second half in a winnable game.

I have no problem with anyone praising this great season, the only thing I took issue with was the OP claiming he was not only the best in the NBA, but by far the best.

I do have Kobe as the best player in the league for 3 consecutive years from 2006-2008, so I'd have no problem declaring him the best player in the league if I agreed for the season in question.
Game 1 Kobe shot 16-38 3-4 3pt again only 2 freethrows but that was a winnable game an game 2 that was a blowout Kobe shot bad and about game 6 that was a blowout during that 3rd Qt and I agree Duncan was the best player in 03 for sure.

[chazzy]

because he had a month at 40ppg? with 5/14 games over 50% FG shooting

What's with this "<50% FG% = inefficient" mentality?

[branslowski]

T-Mac and Kobe were just about equal offensive players...Matched Skillset...So you can't really go wrong with either....But the seperation happens when you reale how much better a defender Kobe was than T-Mac...Don't know why defense gets underrated on this board...Basically, Kobe can match Mac offensively and still keep up his defensive skill.

Plus, I also find it dumb to prop McGrady up because he played with less talent...If we are going to factor that into players vs players, then couldn't we say his numbers would be worst with talent on his roster? He only gets those numbers because there's no one else to play along side him and take them away?...

Oh well, doesn't matter...

But in 02' Ranking imo is..

1. Duncan
2. Kobe
3. T-Mac
4. KG
5. Shaq.

[necya]

What's with this "<50% FG% = inefficient" mentality?

he scored many points just because he took many shots, and didn't matter if he was hot or not...(a part of a ball hogger definition)

when you have someone who can scores 30ppg at 60%, you don't need a 45% shooter taking 27 shots a game especially when this guy had 10/27, 11/26, 13/34, 12/31, 19/41 and you have a great team.
kobe had this month at 40ppg just because he wanted to be THE man...thing that nevr happened with shaq on the team...

thse threads on kobe are so boring, he is the most overrated player here

[Yung D-Will]

I'm tired of people using fg% to justify that people weren't great scorer.


Everytime I hear that argument about A.I or Kobe I just lol :oldlol:

[necya]

I'm tired of people using fg% to justify that people weren't great scorer.


Everytime I hear that argument about A.I or Kobe I just lol :oldlol:

just watch games,
when you listen to the commentator saying : "oh he is amazing" after he put a difficult jumshot...but he missed 3 previous stupid choices.

of course he is a great scorer, but give the same amount of shot to other guards and you will see that it's not so difficult to score 30ppg with 23 shots per game at 45%

[Willkill24]

he scored many points just because he took many shots, and didn't matter if he was hot or not...(a part of a ball hogger definition)

when you have someone who can scores 30ppg at 60%, you don't need a 45% shooter taking 27 shots a game especially when this guy had 10/27, 11/26, 13/34, 12/31, 19/41 and you have a great team.
kobe had this month at 40ppg just because he wanted to be THE man...thing that nevr happened with shaq on the team...

thse threads on kobe are so boring, he is the most overrated player here
14 games 40ppg on 47 fg%, I guess anybody can do that if they wanted to :facepalm

[chazzy]

14 games 40ppg on 47 fg%, I guess anybody can do that if they wanted to :facepalm

Give anyone those kinds of shots and they can do that. Anyone. 47<50, and it's 50 or bust. No scoring feat is impressive unless it's 50%. :mad:

[necya]

14 games 40ppg on 47 fg%, I guess anybody can do that if they wanted to :facepalm

in the 2nd round he average 27shots 33pts and 43%. yeah you are right, only kobe can do that...
he is the reason that the lakers didn't have won their 4th title in a row. what an impact...

now look at the the list of his 50pts game as kobe trolls like to post it.
just take a look at the teams he faced. toronto, new orleans, new york, golden state...kobe just never had a 50pts game against a reel good defense.

[Willkill24]

Give anyone those kinds of shots and they can do that. Anyone. 47<50, and it's 50 or bust. No scoring feat is impressive unless it's 50%. :mad:
That's just so stupid but I guess centers shooting 50% is better then 40% + 3pt shooters too :wtf:

[indiefan24]

of course he is a great scorer, but give the same amount of shot to other guards and you will see that it's not so difficult to score 30ppg with 23 shots per game at 45%

to say you're a joke of a poster would be underrated.

[Willkill24]

in the 2nd round he average 27shots 33pts and 43%. yeah you are right, only kobe can do that...
he is the reason that the lakers didn't have won their 4th title in a row. what an impact...

now look at the the list of his 50pts game as kobe trolls like to post it.
just take a look at the teams he faced. toronto, new orleans, new york, golden state...kobe just never had a 50pts game against a reel good defense.
I'm not gonna say he had a great series but it was against real good D. And 50 point game is still a 50 point game.

[necya]

to say you're a joke of a poster would be underrated.

what do you want troll?
we can't criticize your idol?
you don't have seen 1% of the games i have. go talk with your stupid friends, i don't have time for you

[Birmingham1955]

Jordan never average 40 ppg for a single month?

I find that hard to believe. In his 86' season where he averaged 37.1 ppg for the entire year. He was averaging 40.1 ppg when the Bulls won their game.

[necya]

I'm not gonna say he had a great series but it was against real good D. And 50 point game is still a 50 point game.


like a 40pts game is a 40pts game? what about his 17/47 shooting night against boston? you are right, again, we should remember the 41pts...

[indiefan24]

what do you want troll?
we can't criticize your idol?
you don't have seen 1% of the games i have. go talk with your stupid friends, i don't have time for you

you don't have speak 1% of the english i can

[catch24]

in the 2nd round he average 27shots 33pts and 43%. yeah you are right, only kobe can do that...
he is the reason that the lakers didn't have won their 4th title in a row. what an impact...

now look at the the list of his 50pts game as kobe trolls like to post it.
just take a look at the teams he faced. toronto, new orleans, new york, golden state...kobe just never had a 50pts game against a reel good defense.

You do realize there's other ways a player can cost their teams a possession besides 'missed shots', right? FT shooting and turnovers are nearly just as important. While 2004-05 Wade averaged a better FG% at 48%, scoring 24ppg, would you take him over Kobe in 2009 who averaged 26ppg on 46%, 2 less turnovers and a better FT% -- 85% vs 76%? FG% isn't the end all be all in terms of efficiency (although I do believe it's the best measure).

[thomaspynchon]

The Spurs kicked the Lakers' ass that postseason.

[Willkill24]

like a 40pts game is a 40pts game? what about his 17/47 shooting night against boston? you are right, again, we should remember the 41pts...
when you shoot 35% for a game and score 40 that's bad but you are picking Kobes bad games, and when did he shot 17/47

[ShaqAttack3234]

Game 1 Kobe shot 16-38 3-4 3pt again only 2 freethrows but that was a winnable game an game 2 that was a blowout Kobe shot bad and about game 6 that was a blowout during that 3rd Qt and I agree Duncan was the best player in 03 for sure.

38 shots is WAY too much, especially with just 2 assists and 5 turnovers with 2 free throw attempts.

Game 6 wasn't a blowout until late in the 3rd or early in the 4th, iirc. Kobe just disappeared in the second half. It also didn't help that Robert Horry couldn't hit anything, but Kobe didn't have a good series.

[necya]

You do realize there's other ways a player can cost their teams a possession besides 'missed shots', right? FT shooting and turnovers are nearly just as important. While 2004-05 Wade averaged a better FG% at 45%, scoring 24ppg, would you take him over Kobe in 2009 who averaged 26ppg on 46%, 2 less turnovers and a better FT% -- 85% vs 76%? FG% isn't the end all be all in terms of efficiency (although I do believe it's the best measure).

of course i understand what you want to underline, but wade has nothing to do here. kobe is dangerous, he will go to the FT line very often, it's one of the best part of his offensive game.
this stupid thread is talking about kobe being the best player of the 02-03 season.
the answer is easy, but for those who have seen lakers game that year, he was nothing but a ball hog who only think to steal the show at scoring many points. and after 6 seasons of experience, i found it pathetic and immature. it cost the title for his team.
i liked him in 99 and 00, he had a better positive impact on his team. plus, he was more than ever concerned by the defense.
but after, he clearly wanted to be the best, and think about scoring the most he could : the result was the deception in 03, the shame in 04, shaq left and 05, 06, 07 poor season

[Willkill24]

38 shots is WAY too much, especially with just 2 assists and 5 turnovers with 2 free throw attempts.

Game 6 wasn't a blowout until late in the 3rd or early in the 4th, iirc. Kobe just disappeared in the second half. It also didn't help that Robert Horry couldn't hit anything, but Kobe didn't have a good series.
Maybe but If horry hit that shot in game 5 I think the series would've been over. And most likley another championship.

[indiefan24]

Maybe but If horry hit that shot in game 5 I think the series would've been over. And most likley another championship.

4 in a row would have been insane

[Simple Jack]

Like I said, in a league dominated by bigs....Kobe did show why he was the best player. Like MJ did with Shaq and Drob.

Why do you act like people constantly underrated Kobe? He was voted number 2 or 3 ALL-TIME on an ESPN poll. He's constantly being compared to Jordan (some even say he's better which is absurd). You live in a fantasy world, my man.

[catch24]

of course i understand what you want to underline, but wade has nothing to do here. kobe is dangerous, he will go to the FT line very often, it's one of the best part of his offensive game.
this stupid thread is talking about kobe being the best player of the 02-03 season.
the answer is easy, but for those who have seen lakers game that year, he was nothing but a ball hog who only think to steal the show at scoring many points. and after 6 seasons of experience, i found it pathetic and immature. it cost the title for his team.
i liked him in 99 and 00, he had a better positive impact on his team. plus, he was more than ever concerned by the defense.
but after, he clearly wanted to be the best, and think about scoring the most he could : the result was the deception in 03, the shame in 04, shaq left and 05, 06, 07 poor season

Shaq and Duncan were better in 2003. Kobe was better than Mcgrady though, because of his all around D. He shot a lot in 2003 but to say he was an 'inefficient ball hog' is just not true. He was efficient from the FT line, 3PT, as well as averaging 7 rebounds, 6 assists, and 2 steals. This is arguably his best all around season...

Me personally? I rank his 2005-06, 2006-07 and 2007-08 seasons higher.

[KenneBell]

Jordan never average 40 ppg for a single month?

I find that hard to believe. In his 86' season where he averaged 37.1 ppg for the entire year. He was averaging 40.1 ppg when the Bulls won their game.
The highest monthly average he had that year was 38.4ppg.

[necya]

Shaq and Duncan were better in 2003. Kobe was better than Mcgrady though, because of his all around D. He shot a lot in 2003 but to say he was an 'inefficient ball hog' is just not true. He was efficient from the FT line, 3PT, as well as averaging 7 rebounds, 6 assists, and 2 steals. This is arguably his best all around season...

Me personally? I rank his 2005-06, 2006-07 and 2007-08 seasons higher.

i have no problem with what you said about kobe-mcgrady.
but admit that to say it's his best all around season is a bit stupid.it's only stats.
obviously, no matter who is the guard, but we don't care if kobe or wade averages 4-5-6-7 rbd per game. it doesn't show anything. it's not his role to fight for rebound. he will grab 1 or 2 on the offensive hand, but when you look at the defensive hand, guards and small forwards took random rebound like long rebound. really no matter.

kidd is apart of my statement, cause it's his way to play, he uses to leave his opponent to take the rebound and run the court quickly to create transition opportunities, that is very smart. that's why he averages a lot of rebound, but that does not mean he is a better rebounder than kobe for exemple.

[KenneBell]

it cost the title for his team.

:roll:

GTFO.

[necya]

The highest monthly average he had that year was 38.4ppg.

yeah, i don't think he had a 40ppg from 1 to 31 of the month, but he got it if you count a straight of 15 games.
but we don't care, it's not important.

[necya]

:roll:

GTFO.

what does that mean?
if kobe stayed at his place, i mean the second scorer and let shaq destroy the boards, the lakers would have beaten the spurs.

[indiefan24]

...but he got it if you count a straight of 15 games.


thanks capt obvious

[catch24]

i have no problem with what you said about kobe-mcgrady.
but admit that to say it's his best all around season is a bit stupid.it's only stats.
obviously, no matter who is the guard, but we don't care if kobe or wade averages 4-5-6-7 rbd per game. it doesn't show anything. it's not his role to fight for rebound. he will grab 1 or 2 on the offensive hand, but when you look at the defensive hand, guards and small forwards took random rebound like long rebound. really no matter.

kidd is apart of my statement, cause it's his way to play, he uses to leave his opponent to take the rebound and run the court quickly to create transition opportunities, that is very smart. that's why he averages a lot of rebound, but that does not mean he is a better rebounder than kobe for exemple.

Whether or not rebounding should be part of a guards role is irrelevant. Crashing the boards is vital and those 1-2 extra from your guard CAN and WILL impact the game, thus they do matter.

It's not "just stats". Kobe was near his peak defensively and impacted the game in other ways besides scoring. Even so, I said arguably, I feel there were 2-3 seasons he was better.

[JustinJDW]

I don't understand how you can be the MVP of the league when you're not even the MVP of your team. :facepalm:

[raptorfan_dr07]

I'm tired of the agendas and disinformation campagins on here.


The only "agendas" and "disinformation campaigns" on here are from people like you and TheLogo who are trying to make Kobe out to be something he wasn't back then, and in TheLogo's case, something he never was and never will be.

Kobe had a great season that year individually, but when Shaq was injured to start the season, he had his chance to step up and lead that team. He led them all right, to a 5-10 record. I don't want to hear any BS about weak teammates either, since that was a battle hardened, veteran team of champions that Shaq was routinely winning games with when Kobe was injured. As has already been pointed out, there were other players who had just as impressive, if not better seasons. Kobe also lacked the maturity necessary to really lead a team.

[thejumpa]

The only "agendas" and "disinformation campaigns" on here are from people like you and TheLogo who are trying to make Kobe out to be something he wasn't back then, and in TheLogo's case, something he never was and never will be.

Kobe had a great season that year individually, but when Shaq was injured to start the season, he had his chance to step up and lead that team. He led them all right, to a 5-10 record. I don't want to hear any BS about weak teammates either, since that was a battle hardened, veteran team of champions that Shaq was routinely winning games with when Kobe was injured. As has already been pointed out, there were other players who had just as impressive, if not better seasons. Kobe also lacked the maturity necessary to really lead a team.

:applause:

I swear...OP probably was 9 in 2002-2003. Didn't even watch Kobe play. He just looks at stats and YouTube vids and calls it a day. News flash: No one said Kobe was the best player in 2002-2003. At least I never heard it(and I watched every game and followed basketball closer than I do now). IIRC, he finished 3rd in MVP voting with TMac on his tail. He was good, but best player in the league? Let's be real here.

[Calabis]

Sorry there was no handchecking, they already were trying to help todays players increase scoring...try again homer

1999-00
• In the backcourt, there is no contact with hands and forearms by defenders. In the frontcourt, there is no contact with hands and forearms by defenders except below the free throw line extended in which case the defender may only use his forearm. In the post, neither the offensive player nor the defender is allowed to dislodge or displace a player who has legally obtained a position. Defender may not use his forearm, shoulder, hip or hand to reroute or hold-up an offensive player going from point A to point B or one who is attempting to come around a legal screen set by another offensive player. Slowing or impeding the progress of the screener by grabbing, clutching, holding “chucking” or “wrapping up” is prohibited.
• The official(s) will visually commence a five-second count if an offensive player with the ball and not facing-up starts dribbling below the free throw line extended while being closely guarded; or if he starts dribbling outside and then penetrates below the free throw line extended while being closely guarded. The five-second count commences when the offensive player penetrates the free throw line extended. The penalty is the offensive team’s loss of possession of the ball.
• If the shot clock is below 14 seconds, it is recycled to 14 seconds when a kicked ball, a punched ball, a common foul requiring no free throw attempts or an illegal defense requiring no free throw attempts occurs.
• Any defense is legal on the strong side. Defenders must remain on the weak side outside the paint unless they are double-teaming the ball, picking up a free cutter or closely guarding an offensive player.

[Jacks3]

lol @ idiots blaming kobe for the 03 playoffs when, in fact, had shaq not been such a lazy piece of shit, had not come into training camp out of shape, and then missed 16 games because of a bull-shit injury... the lakers would have had home -court and wouldn't have spent most of the year trying to establish chemistry and rhythm that was never there. dude's laziness, greed, and apathy cost the lakers badly. what a clown. and lol @ shaqattack blaming the spurs series on kobe.:roll:

[Jacks3]

and there where plenty of people calling kobe the best in the game in 03 including the great sportswriter ralph wiley. kobe in 2003= #1

[thejumpa]

and there where plenty of people calling kobe the best in the game in 03 including the great sportswriter ralph wiley. kobe in 2003= #1

I don't believe it. Maybe that guy, but I didn't hear many else. Anyone else who watched this season feel free to chime in and correct me. Best SG? OK. Best player in the game? No.

[Jacks3]

even national commentators were calling him the best in basketball during games. :pimp:

[EarlTheGoat]

Not even the most deluded Kobe Bryant homer would say he was better than Tim Duncan that year. And those who say it are just trolling, they dont actually believe what they say.

[Killer_Instinct]

Agreed. When looking in detail at the list of individual feats Kobe accomplished that season, it's amazing.

Edit: The Laker apologist are disgusting.

[SsKSpurs21]

http://i.a.cnn.net/si/2007/writers/steve_aschburner/10/30/duncan.kareem/p1.td.jpg

http://i.cdn.turner.com/sivault/si_online/covers/images/2003/0609_mid.jpg

[Jacks3]

Averaged 30/7/6/2/1 on 46%/38%/84%/55%
9 straight 40+ games
13 straight 35+ games
19 40+ games total (#1 total)
4 50+ games (#1 total)
6 triple doubles
Played all 82 games
#1 rebounding guard in the league
1st Team All-NBA
1st Team All-Defense



:bowdown: :bowdown: :bowdown: :bowdown:

[Calabis]

Tim Duncan 23.3 points, 12.9 rebounds, 3.9 assists and 2.9 blocks per game, led team to 60-22 record, beat Kobe, put up 37/16 in closeout game vs lakers, won the NBA chip...again the over hyping of Kobe Bryant continues by his band of misfits

[G-Funk]

Tim Duncan 23.3 points, 12.9 rebounds, 3.9 assists and 2.9 blocks per game, led team to 60-22 record, beat Kobe, put up 37/16 in closeout game vs lakers, won the NBA chip...again the over hyping of Kobe Bryant continues by his band of misfits


Averaged 30/7/6/2/1 on 46%/38%/84%/55%
9 straight 40+ games
13 straight 35+ games
19 40+ games total (#1 total)
4 50+ games (#1 total)
6 triple doubles
Played all 82 games
#1 rebounding guard in the league
1st Team All-NBA
1st Team All-Defense


Are these stats over hyping?

[Calabis]

Averaged 30/7/6/2/1 on 46%/38%/84%/55%
9 straight 40+ games
13 straight 35+ games
19 40+ games total (#1 total)
4 50+ games (#1 total)
6 triple doubles
Played all 82 games
#1 rebounding guard in the league
1st Team All-NBA
1st Team All-Defense


Are these stats over hyping?

Is Kobe a better player for his career, possibly, but that season Tim Duncan was far more important to his team and had more of an impact on his team then Kobe did, enough said.....doesn't mean Kobe season sucked, just laugh at guys calling him the best, when he clearly wasn't

[tpols]

Is Kobe a better player for his career, possibly, but that season Tim Duncan was far more important to his team and had more of an impact on his team then Kobe did, enough said.....doesn't mean Kobe season sucked, just laugh at guys calling him the best, when he clearly wasn't
Lol, of course duncan had more of an impact on his team. Kobe was playing with a top 5 impact player ever in the peak/prime of his game. There's no way kobe could have made up the difference playing with someone who demands so many possesions and is the focal point of the team (especially on offense). Kobe's numbers, however, are simply extraordinary and he was on duncan's level that year(shit kobe's season that year was better than over half of mj's total seasons).

[Mor'Fiyah]

Why are you people arguing over something that cannot be proven? I mean, seriously, the best player in the NBA in any given season is mostly subjective. If someone says that Kobe was the best player in the NBA in a particular season AND Kobe has the stats and accomplishments to back it up then its certainly a valid argument and holds as much weight as saying Tim Duncan was the best.

Might as well argue what God's favourite colour is. I happen to think its blue.

[PowerGlove]

notsureifsrs

KG and Duncan must have gotten lost and missed all 82 games that year or something.

Nice season though.

[Bigsmoke]

lol @ people have Kobe over KG in 2003 when KG even led his horrible Wolves team to more wins that year.

[LEFT4DEAD]

http://img158.imageshack.us/img158/8991/tripgj9.swf
-at this thread

[laronprofit9]

1. Tim Duncan
2. Shaq
3. Kevin Garnett
4. Kobe/TMac
5. TMac/Kobe

[DuMa]

Dunksan

[BlueandGold]

That was a ridiculous year by Kobe, but like Shaqattack said, Duncan had a better year, especially after the WCF. Shaq definitely didn't have a greater year and McGrady and Garnett were just short of Kobe's season. McGrady had fewer assists, rebounds and steals and had only two more points per game, even though he didn't have to share the ball with Shaq and other members of a championship level squad.




Kobe was the 5th best player that season, he certainly wasn't better than Duncan who had a legendary year and was clearly the best player in the game.

I always knew that Shaqattack was bias but I didn't think the extent of the homerism was that bad until now? 5th best player that year? lol no wonder everyone thinks shaqattack is a shaq troll now. It's like the more desperate Shaq(actual) gets he more desperate shaqattack gets to try to defend his hero lol

[B-Easy]

This has to be Tim Duncan pretty clearly.

He won MVP , Finals MVP..and he couldve easily won Defensive Player of the Year (or Garnett) .. instead of Ben Wallace.

His team was 10 games better than the Lakers in the regular season ..and his team eliminated the Lakers in the 2nd round.

[Papaya Petee]

You know, I love the effort you put in this thread, but sorry to burst your bubble, but he was not.

[ShaqAttack3234]

I always knew that Shaqattack was bias but I didn't think the extent of the homerism was that bad until now? 5th best player that year? lol no wonder everyone thinks shaqattack is a shaq troll now. It's like the more desperate Shaq(actual) gets he more desperate shaqattack gets to try to defend his hero lol

:roll: Unlike you, I actually explained my thoughts.

And no, Shaq is not my hero. My favorite player, yes(edging out Patrick Ewing), but I am FAR from a troll. When was the last time you saw me create a thread about Shaq or bring him up in a topic where he's not relevant? Exactly. Don't group me in with the idiotic trolls who can't go without mentioning their favorite players.

Look at the 4 players who I put above Kobe, they all had phenomenal seasons. Unlike you, I actually have the capability to back up my opinions.

The fact is, if it weren't for my username, idiots wouldn't even call me a Shaq homer or Shaq troll.

[G-Funk]

You know, I love the effort you put in this thread, but sorry to burst your bubble, but he was not.

Wade wouldn't even be top 5 that season. lol just ****ing with you!

[Jacks3]

I always knew that Shaqattack was bias but I didn't think the extent of the homerism was that bad until now? 5th best player that year? lol no wonder everyone thinks shaqattack is a shaq troll now. It's like the more desperate Shaq(actual) gets he more desperate shaqattack gets to try to defend his hero lol
this. 5th best? LOL

[Jacks3]

Averaged 30/7/6/2/1 on 46%/38%/84%/55%
9 straight 40+ games
13 straight 35+ games
19 40+ games total (#1 total)
4 50+ games (#1 total)
6 triple doubles
Played all 82 games
#1 rebounding guard in the league
1st Team All-NBA
1st Team All-Defense

5th best. :facepalm

[Papaya Petee]

Wade wouldn't even be top 5 that season. lol just ****ing with you!

Lol I doubt it myself too many players in their prime.

It's not Kobe's fault that Tim Duncan, T-Mac and KG decided to be at their best that year, and that Shaq decided to have a "average" season for his standards.

[Papaya Petee]

Averaged 30/7/6/2/1 on 46%/38%/84%/55%
9 straight 40+ games
13 straight 35+ games
19 40+ games total (#1 total)
4 50+ games (#1 total)
6 triple doubles
Played all 82 games
#1 rebounding guard in the league
1st Team All-NBA
1st Team All-Defense

5th best. :facepalm

Ok, now you want us to post Tim Duncans, Shaqs, T-Macs, and KG's numbers that year?

[ShaqAttack3234]

T-Mac and Kobe were just about equal offensive players...Matched Skillset...So you can't really go wrong with either....But the seperation happens when you reale how much better a defender Kobe was than T-Mac...Don't know why defense gets underrated on this board...Basically, Kobe can match Mac offensively and still keep up his defensive skill.

Plus, I also find it dumb to prop McGrady up because he played with less talent...If we are going to factor that into players vs players, then couldn't we say his numbers would be worst with talent on his roster? He only gets those numbers because there's no one else to play along side him and take them away?...

With less talent, McGrady faced more defensive pressure. And in 15 games without Shaq, Kobe got 3 more shots per game than McGrady did for his season average, yet with those 3 extra shots, he averaged the same 32 ppg McGrady did for the season.

And for the season, with more talent around him, he was still less efficient while McGrady averaged 2 more ppg and McGrady averaged almost 1 less turnover per game.

I'm not going to call someone wrong for taking Kobe over T-Mac that year, but atleast statistically, McGrady didn't have better stats because he got more of an opportunity.

[B-Easy]

Averaged 30/7/6/2/1 on 46%/38%/84%/55%
9 straight 40+ games
13 straight 35+ games
19 40+ games total (#1 total)
4 50+ games (#1 total)
6 triple doubles
Played all 82 games
#1 rebounding guard in the league
1st Team All-NBA
1st Team All-Defense

5th best. :facepalm

you need to realize, Shaq, Duncan, KG, Tmac were basically still in their primes .. and had great seasons as well...so its not that crazy to put him 5th if you actually bother to compare him with somebody.

In my opinion , Duncan was the best and KG was 2nd best that year .. and kobe 3rd.

[Willkill24]

Averaged 30/7/6/2/1 on 46%/38%/84%/55%
9 straight 40+ games
13 straight 35+ games
19 40+ games total (#1 total)
4 50+ games (#1 total)
6 triple doubles
Played all 82 games
#1 rebounding guard in the league
1st Team All-NBA
1st Team All-Defense
Kobe was beast that year top 3 player IMO

[White Chocolate]

I still think T-Mac slightly edges out Kobe overall, but the two of them were the best in 2002-2003. IMO:


-McGrady
-Kobe
-Garnett
-Duncan
-Kidd


Top 5 ^

[tpols]

:roll: Unlike you, I actually explained my thoughts.

And no, Shaq is not my hero. My favorite player, yes(edging out Patrick Ewing), but I am FAR from a troll. When was the last time you saw me create a thread about Shaq or bring him up in a topic where he's not relevant? Exactly. Don't group me in with the idiotic trolls who can't go without mentioning their favorite players.

Look at the 4 players who I put above Kobe, they all had phenomenal seasons. Unlike you, I actually have the capability to back up my opinions.

The fact is, if it weren't for my username, idiots wouldn't even call me a Shaq homer or Shaq troll.
You're a good smart poster, but you'll ALWAYS jump to shaq's defense. You're like jlauber and wilt.

[ShaqAttack3234]

You're a good smart poster, but you'll ALWAYS jump to shaq's defense. You're like jlauber and wilt.

If there's a reason to defend him, yes, however I I don't defend crap like "hurt on company time, heal on company time". Not to mention that I've said numerous times that Kobe does not deserve all of the blame for the team splitting up after 2004. Shaq, as well as Jackson and Buss, all deserve blame.

And I've said he deserves blame for losing in '97 and '99 because his play was below his standards. Actually, '94 as well, though I cut him some slack because it was his first playoff series. Hell, I criticize him for his '99 season in general.

I clear up misconceptions such as Shaq being on the bench in crunch time in his prime, or not contributing in 4th quarters or those disputing that he was the Lakers best player during the 3peat.

[Kellogs4toniee]

Before the last two championships, this wasn't even a debate in these forums on whether Kobe was the best player that season... much less the best player on his team.

Now with the confidence from the past two championships, Kobe homers have the balls now to come up and create threads like this that would have held no warrant a couple years ago. This is why posters like TheLogo will always be a troll. It is clear from his posts and threads, all his knowledge is purely based on stats and over-glorifying past events he's never seen for the current player he loves.

ShaqAttack has already shiat on you posters in this thread like at least five times already by my count. Kobe's season was incredible, but in retrospect and for those who actually watched the Lakers that season, it's clear that Shaq was the better of the two on that team. Is it up for debate who was better? Surely, especially since Kobe played more games (entire 82).

But, from a purely objective standpoint there is no way that Duncan was not the best player in the league that season for those who actually watched it. Robinson's playing time was limited, yet Duncan still anchored (in every sense of the word) that Spurs team to a 60 win season and second MVP. Kobe was an offensive monster and elite defensive asset, but his overall impact just can't match a healthy and clutch big man in his prime.

So please you Kobe trolls, we all know Kobe is one of the greatest to play the game. We know he's amazing, we know he's been the best player in this league for a LONG time now, but stop making ridiculous claims just because your all high up on the recent success.

[ImmortalD24]

Now with the confidence from the past two championships, Kobe homers have the balls now to come up and create threads like this that would have held no warrant a couple years ago. :roll: Such utter bullshit.

You've got to be out of your damn mind, or just suffering from short term memory loss if you think Kobe fans wouldn't dare to make a thread like this prior to the two championships. Hell, I personally made a thread similar to this 4 years ago on another board.

[Force]

Didn't the Shaq/Kobe Lakers have a better record when Kobe was injured than when he was playing? They couldn't win w/o Shaq, they weren't even a playoff team when he was injured with a sorry record. Shaq was the best player on the Lakers still, despite Kobe putting up big scoring.

[ImmortalD24]

Didn't the Shaq/Kobe Lakers have a better record when Kobe was injured than when he was playing? Kobe played all 82 games and playoffs that year. Nice try.

[necya]

Kobe played all 82 games and playoffs that year. Nice try.

you should not go back on your own thread, you have already been enough ridiculous

[MasterDurant24]

sorry dude that isn't enough.

I don't want to here Duncan led a bunch of scrubs argument either.
How is that not enough? He won a Finals MVP and a championship as the best player with no other stars(not discrediting Kobe). That's only been done by Hakeem Olajuwon. 24 and 14(if you round up) says alot too.

[ImmortalD24]

you should not go back on your own thread, you have already been enough ridiculous
http://i41.tinypic.com/e17rrc.jpg




don't kill me.. http://i55.tinypic.com/2m4615g.gif

[Kellogs4toniee]

Kobe played all 82 games and playoffs that year. Nice try.


He chose the wrong stat, lez go with this one :

Kobe without Shaq that season : 5 wins. 10 Losses.

Kobe with Shaq that season : 47 Wins. 20 losses .

[Mor'Fiyah]

So please you Kobe trolls, we all know Kobe is one of the greatest to play the game. We know he's amazing, we know he's been the best player in this league for a LONG time now, but stop making ridiculous claims just because your all high up on the recent success.


Can you please name the exact season(s) Kobe was the best in the league please.

[ImmortalD24]

He chose the wrong stat, lez go with this one :

Kobe without Shaq that season : 5 wins. 10 Losses.

Kobe with Shaq that season : 47 Wins. 20 losses . What does this have to do with anything?

The with/without fluf has more to do with the backups than the actual superstars ability. You look at the Lakers team makeup and you notice how thin their frontline was with Samaki Walker and Slava Mededenko getting heavy minutes.

Of course the Lakers would struggle without their only starting caliber big man.

EDIT:

Do you know the teams they played during that 15 game stretch? were the majority of the games home or away? How did Kobe play during those games? You just giving numbers with no substance and detail behind it isn't helping your agenda.

[Kellogs4toniee]

What does this have to do with anything?

The with/without fluf has more to do with the backups than the actual superstars ability. You look at the Lakers team makeup and you notice how thin their frontline was with Samaki Walker and Slava Mededenko getting heavy minutes.

Of course the Lakers would struggle without their only starting caliber big man.

My point is Shaq's importance was just as great if not greater then Kobe's to that Lakers team in 2002-2003. On the other hand, Duncan had a team during the regular season with Stephen Jackson and Tony Parker as your second highest scorer at 11.8 and 15.5 respectively.

Kobe fans will state how underwhelming Duncan's stats were in the regular season compared to Kobe's that season, but forgot to realize the slow pace and emphasis on defense the Spurs had that season. Add the MVP, 60 win record, and finals MVP and that's why Duncan was the best player that season. Which is the entire reason why I'm writing in this thread right? So contradict the OP.

[Willkill24]

He chose the wrong stat, lez go with this one :

Kobe without Shaq that season : 5 wins. 10 Losses.

Kobe with Shaq that season : 47 Wins. 20 losses .
Yea and after shaq came back they went 7-9 next 16 games so I don't get your point Kobe without shaq 5-10 and he comes back and they go 7-9, lakers started real bad that year it wasn't just Kobe.

[ImmortalD24]

Lakers opponents to start the season without Shaq


G Date Opponent Tm Opp W L Streak Notes
1 Tue, Oct 29, 2002 San Antonio Spurs L 82 87 0 1 L 1
2 Wed, Oct 30, 2002 @ Portland Trail Blazers L 90 102 0 2 L 2
3 Fri, Nov 1, 2002 @ Los Angeles Clippers W 108 93 1 2 W 1
4 Sun, Nov 3, 2002 Portland Trail Blazers W OT 98 95 2 2 W 2
5 Tue, Nov 5, 2002 @ Cleveland Cavaliers L 70 89 2 3 L 1
6 Thu, Nov 7, 2002 @ Boston Celtics L OT 95 98 2 4 L 2
7 Fri, Nov 8, 2002 @ Washington Wizards L 99 100 2 5 L 3
8 Tue, Nov 12, 2002 Atlanta Hawks L 83 95 2 6 L 4
9 Fri, Nov 15, 2002 Golden State Warriors W OT 96 89 3 6 W 1
10 Sun, Nov 17, 2002 Houston Rockets L 89 93 3 7 L 1
11 Tue, Nov 19, 2002 @ Dallas Mavericks L 72 98 3 8 L 2
12 Wed, Nov 20, 2002 @ San Antonio Spurs L 88 95 3 9 L 3
13 Fri, Nov 22, 2002 Chicago Bulls W 86 73 4 9 W 1


Lakers with Kobe AND Shaq till the end of the year:



14 Sun, Nov 24, 2002 Milwaukee Bucks W 111 99 5 9 W 2
15 Tue, Nov 26, 2002 @ Miami Heat L 85 97 5 10 L 1
16 Wed, Nov 27, 2002 @ Orlando Magic L 102 112 5 11 L 2
17 Fri, Nov 29, 2002 @ Memphis Grizzlies W OT 112 106 6 11 W 1
18 Sun, Dec 1, 2002 Minnesota Timberwolves L 107 110 6 12 L 1
19 Tue, Dec 3, 2002 Memphis Grizzlies W 101 91 7 12 W 1
20 Wed, Dec 4, 2002 @ Utah Jazz L 85 93 7 13 L 1
G Date Opponent Tm Opp W L Streak Notes
21 Fri, Dec 6, 2002 Dallas Mavericks W 105 103 8 13 W 1
22 Sun, Dec 8, 2002 Utah Jazz W 110 101 9 13 W 2
23 Tue, Dec 10, 2002 @ Golden State Warriors L 102 106 9 14 L 1
24 Fri, Dec 13, 2002 New Orleans Hornets L 82 98 9 15 L 2
25 Sun, Dec 15, 2002 Orlando Magic W 107 84 10 15 W 1
26 Tue, Dec 17, 2002 @ Minnesota Timberwolves L 80 96 10 16 L 1
27 Thu, Dec 19, 2002 @ New Jersey Nets L 71 98 10 17 L 2
28 Fri, Dec 20, 2002 @ Philadelphia 76ers L OT 104 107 10 18 L 3
29 Sun, Dec 22, 2002 @ Toronto Raptors W OT 109 107 11 18 W 1
30 Wed, Dec 25, 2002 Sacramento Kings L 99 105 11 19 L 1
31 Sat, Dec 28, 2002 @ Denver Nuggets W 112 93 12 19 W 1
32 Sun, Dec 29, 2002 Toronto Raptors W 104 88 13 19 W 2

The earlier schedule is much much tougher.. probably the toughest stretch of the year WITH or WITHOUT Shaq.


Kobe without Shaq that season : 5 wins. 10 Losses.

Kobe with Shaq that season : 47 Wins. 20 losses .

Where did you get your numbers?

[ShaqAttack3234]

Here are their wins and losses without Shaq.

Losses
vs San Antonio
@ Portland
@ Cleveland
@ Boston
@ Washington
vs Atlanta
vs Houston
@ Dallas
@ San Antonio
vs New York


Wins
@ Clippers (without Odom)
vs Portland
vs Golden State
vs Houston
@ Utah

Really, a mix of championship contenders, average and bad teams.

[Killer_Instinct]

Before the last two championships, this wasn't even a debate in these forums on whether Kobe was the best player that season... much less the best player on his team.

Now with the confidence from the past two championships, Kobe homers have the balls now to come up and create threads like this that would have held no warrant a couple years ago


http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v471/fujisan/11a8r2p.gif

Joking?

[Calabis]

Lol, of course duncan had more of an impact on his team. Kobe was playing with a top 5 impact player ever in the peak/prime of his game. There's no way kobe could have made up the difference playing with someone who demands so many possesions and is the focal point of the team (especially on offense). Kobe's numbers, however, are simply extraordinary and he was on duncan's level that year(shit kobe's season that year was better than over half of mj's total seasons).


LMAO!! He shot 23 times a game what the hell are you smoking, ...Shaq 18 times...I love how you homers act as if Shaq ruined him or prevented him from jacking shots...:facepalm

What prime Kobe actually put a better season than 32-35 year old Jordan.....hooray give him a reward.....because at age 24, Jordan had the superior season

[Jacks3]

lol @ shaq fans ignoring the fact that the lakers were still playing under .500 ball even when he was playing, and that it was kobe's epic run from december on that lead the lakers from a 13-19 record to 52-30. :oldlol:

[EarlTheGoat]

lol @ shaq fans ignoring the fact that the lakers were still playing under .500 ball even when he was playing, and that it was kobe's epic run from december on that lead the lakers from a 13-19 record to 52-30. :oldlol:



Jordan > Kobe


get mad.

[Jacks3]

Jordan > Kobe


get mad.
kobe> 99.99% of players in nba history

[Rose]

kobe> 99.99% of players in nba history
Jordan>100% of players in NBA history

[EarlTheGoat]

Jordan>100% of players in NBA history

:applause:

[Papaya Petee]

Jordan>100% of players in NBA history
Wade > 101% of players in NBA history

[Willkill24]

Wade > 101% of players in NBA history
Adam Morrison > Wade

[EarlTheGoat]

Adam Morrison > Wade


PleezeBelieve < Adam Morrison

[mananmater]

By far he was the best in the nba at this time, a beautiful scorer!!

[Papaya Petee]

By far he was the best in the nba at this time, a beautiful scorer!!

Was Tim Duncan invisible to you in 2003?

[Samurai Swoosh]

You may not agree with it ... but Kobe Bryant definitely has a CASE for being the best player in the league that year.

[Yung D-Will]

kobe> 99.99% of players in nba history


That must be a big 1 percent to include Jordan,Wilt,Kareem,Russell,Bird,Magic,Hakeem,Dunca n and Saq

[mananmater]

Was Tim Duncan invisible to you in 2003?


Yes I know your right but lets give kobe what he deserves, hes been hated on a lot this year, and duncan was the leagues best in 99, second or fourth best in 01, 02 ,03.

[Yung D-Will]

Anyone who actually watched Duncan in the 03 season is loling so hard at this thread

[Yung D-Will]

Yes I know your right but lets give kobe what he deserves, hes been hated on a lot this year, and duncan was the leagues best in 99, second or fourth best in 01, 02 ,03.

Duncan was the best in 03.

Probally not in 02

[Papaya Petee]

Yes I know your right but lets give kobe what he deserves, hes been hated on a lot this year, and duncan was the leagues best in 99, second or fourth best in 01, 02 ,03.
Actually in 1999-2000, 2000-2001 Nobody really has anything on Shaq. 2001-2002 is a tie between Duncan and Shaq, and Duncan was the best in 2002-2003, winning Finals MVP, MVP, on insane stats and nearly DPOY speaks for itself.

Kobe IMO was the best in 2007-2008, and tied for best in 2005-2006.

[Gambler23]

Duncan, O'Neal, and Garnett were all better in 2003. McGrady arguably.

[Willkill24]

Actually in 1999-2000, 2000-2001 Nobody really has anything on Shaq. 2001-2002 is a tie between Duncan and Shaq, and Duncan was the best in 2002-2003, winning Finals MVP, MVP, on insane stats and nearly DPOY speaks for itself.

Kobe IMO was the best in 2007-2008, and tied for best in 2005-2006.
lol tied with who

[Yung D-Will]

lol tied with who




































































































































































































:no:

[Papaya Petee]

lol tied with who
Kobe 35\5\4 45% 45-37

LeBron 31\7\7 48% 50-32

don't laugh, because LeBron was arguably better

also

Wade 27\7\6 50% 52-30 Finals MVP on 7 less shots then Kobe

[rmt]

kobe> 99.99% of players in nba history
That would mean that there have been about 90,000 NBA players. That .01% that he's not better than includes Wilt, Bird, Magic, MJ, Hakeem, Duncan, Russell, Shaq, KAJ.

[Willkill24]

Kobe 35\5\4 45% 45-37

LeBron 31\7\7 48% 50-32

don't laugh, because LeBron was arguably better

also

Wade 27\7\6 50% 52-30 Finals MVP on 7 less shots then Kobe
Wade no and Kobe was better then lebron if watched them play that year.

[RazorBaLade]

Kobe 35\5\4 45% 45-37

LeBron 31\7\7 48% 50-32

don't laugh, because LeBron was arguably better

also

Wade 27\7\6 50% 52-30 Finals MVP on 7 less shots then Kobe

bro anyone is arguably better if one of the people arguing is insane

[Papaya Petee]

Wade no and Kobe was better then lebron if watched them play that year.

You're basing that of off what? I'm not saying he wasn't, but you're not giving me facts to change my mind.

[RazorBaLade]

You're basing that of off what? I'm not saying he wasn't, but you're not giving me facts to change my mind.

if you take into account the teams they all had, kobes season is easily better

[Papaya Petee]

if you take into account the teams they all had, kobes season is easily better
Are you trying to tell me LeBron's team was any better then Kobe's? Maybe slightly. And I'm in no way saying LeBron was better, I said their arguably equal. I don't see how 31\7\7 48% 50-32 and 35\5\4 45% 45-37 can't be argued as close.

[Willkill24]

You're basing that of off what? I'm not saying he wasn't, but you're not giving me facts to change my mind.
27 40+ point games 6 50+ point games 81 point game:bowdown:
2800+ points in season most scince mjs season idk whitch.

[RazorBaLade]

Are you trying to tell me LeBron's team was any better then Kobe's? Maybe slightly. And I'm in no way saying LeBron was better, I said their arguably equal. I don't see how 31\7\7 48% 50-32 and 35\5\4 45% 45-37 can't be argued as close.

Their stats are close by the numbers, so that means lebrons team was 5 wins better in the east. Kobe was in a TOUGH west. So clearly that shows lebrons team was quite a bit better, factoring in that means Kobe has worse shooters and worse players it accounts for the small % dip (since other teams can focus on him and if he passes out doesn't matter because smush parker isn't gonna kill anybody) as well as the assist dip (although kobe never gets a lot of assists, but we'll ignore that because hes never really surrounded with great shooters anyways since shaq left)

I don't think wades is close at all to either of them, but kobes is definitely just a bit above lebrons season which is kinda crazy because it doesn't get much better than the kind of season lebron had.

[White Chocolate]

27 40+ point games 6 50+ point games 81 point game:bowdown:
2800+ points in season most scince mjs season idk whitch.


'87

[Papaya Petee]

Their stats are close by the numbers, so that means lebrons team was 5 wins better in the east. Kobe was in a TOUGH west. So clearly that shows lebrons team was quite a bit better, factoring in that means Kobe has worse shooters and worse players it accounts for the small % dip (since other teams can focus on him and if he passes out doesn't matter because smush parker isn't gonna kill anybody)

I don't think wades is close at all to either of them, but kobes is definitely just a bit above lebrons season which is kinda crazy because it doesn't get much better than the kind of season lebron had.


Wade not close? How so? He played with Shaquille O'Neal yet managed to average 27\7\6\2\1 on 50% while taking 7 less shots then Kobe and 4 less shots then LeBron. He averaged 34\8\4 in the Finals and 28\7\6 in the playoffs. If that's not close then I don't know what is.

Kobe scored more, but he took 3 more shots then LeBron and was less efficient. Was a worse playmaker and worse rebounder. His team had a worse record and seed no matter how you look at it. Cavaliers made it past the first round.

I don't really see how it isn't close between them 3. I think Kobe is the best player that year, but LeBron and Wade could be argued for it too.

[G.O.A.T]

I'm tired of the agendas and disinformation campagins on here. Sure Kobe did have setbacks in 2003-2004, and 2004-2005. But in 2002-2003, make no mistake, the best player in the NBA BY FAR was not Tim Duncan or Shaq. It was Kobe Bryant.

If those were the three guys in the conversation and Tim Duncan wasn't the best, why did his team beat the team with the other two?

[Papaya Petee]

If those were the three guys in the conversation and Tim Duncan wasn't the best, why did his team beat the team with the other two?

G.O.A.T always comes in and takes care of business.

[RazorBaLade]

Wade not close? How so? He played with Shaquille O'Neal yet managed to average 27\7\6\2\1 on 50% while taking 7 less shots then Kobe and 4 less shots then LeBron. He averaged 34\8\4 in the Finals and 28\7\6 in the playoffs. If that's not close then I don't know what is.

Kobe scored more, but he took 3 more shots then LeBron and was less efficient. Was a worse playmaker and worse rebounder. His team had a worse record and seed no matter how you look at it. Cavaliers made it past the first round.

I don't really see how it isn't close between them 3. I think Kobe is the best player that year, but LeBron and Wade could be argued for it too.

Well think about it, if he played with Shaq he not only had someone to get assists from pretty easily but also someone to draw the defense away from him, unlike lebron and kobe. Taking 7 less shots than someone and boasting about 50% is kind of retarded. You can't be a worse playmaker if you have no one to pass too, that's ridiculous. He made Kwame and Smush almost look like an NBA player. Almost. This years Hawks were better than the Lakers in that year, Joe Johnson is clearly a better playmaker and does more than Kobe right? That year the lakers without kobe are the nets of this year.take that into account.

But at the end of the day its definitely a lot closer than what my memory leads me to believe, Kobe just had a much more memorable and historic season so as a fan you kind of have to factor that in. It's like if you compare them side by side its a lot closer than what people usually admit, but if you rate each one individually and THEN compare your ratings, kobe feels like so much higher to me because of the crazy shit he did and WHO he did it with. I mean cmon, through 3 quarters the guy beat the team thats in the finals... by himself

[Willkill24]

Well think about it, if he played with Shaq he not only had someone to get assists from pretty easily but also someone to draw the defense away from him, unlike lebron and kobe. Taking 7 less shots than someone and boasting about 50% is kind of retarded. You can't be a worse playmaker if you have no one to pass too, that's ridiculous. He made Kwame and Smush almost look like an NBA player. Almost. This years Hawks were better than the Lakers in that year, Joe Johnson is clearly a better playmaker and does more than Kobe right? That year the lakers without kobe are the nets of this year.take that into account.

But at the end of the day its definitely a lot closer than what my memory leads me to believe, Kobe just had a much more memorable and historic season so as a fan you kind of have to factor that in. It's like if you compare them side by side its a lot closer than what people usually admit, but if you rate each one individually and THEN compare your ratings, kobe feels like so much higher to me because of the crazy shit he did and WHO he did it with. I mean cmon, through 3 quarters the guy beat the team thats in the finals... by himself
This:cheers:

[Duncan21formvp]

Best player in 2002-2003: Kobe Bryant

30 ppg 7 rpg 6 apg 2.2 spg against both handchecking and zone
1st team all defensive
1st team All-NBA
40+ points 19 times in 82 games
40+ in 9 striaght
35+ in 13 straight
NBA record 12 threes in a game
50+ points 3 times
42 ppg in February 2003 (Jordan never averaged 40 ppg for a month in regular season, Kobe did it 3 times)

http://www.vintageadsandstuff.com/viewsi030303.jpeg

http://www.nba.com/features/kobe_40plus_030221.html




5 straight double doubles with 2 triple doubles in the 1st 5 games of the 2002-2003 season

27/10
25/10
33/15
34/14
15/13

Calling kobe the games best rebounder is silly, but with 5 straight double doubles, its easy to see where Bill was coming from

I'm tired of the agendas and disinformation campagins on here. Sure Kobe did have setbacks in 2003-2004, and 2004-2005. But in 2002-2003, make no mistake, the best player in the NBA BY FAR was not Tim Duncan or Shaq. It was Kobe Bryant.

http://i56.tinypic.com/sczw5g.jpg

http://www.loudsportsshorts.com/basketball/dunks/bryant_dunks_over_ming.jpg

http://i54.tinypic.com/112eb0j.jpg



No he wasn't it was clearly Duncan. Whenever you get League and Finals MVP the same year you are the best player period.

[DatDudeD]

No he wasn't it was clearly Duncan. Whenever you get League and Finals MVP the same year you are the best player period.

ill roll with that, i thought duncan was the better player that year also but it wasnt by a huge margin as some people think.

[bl2k8]

god forbid anybody claim kobe was better than duncan, jesus. it's just an opinion. outside of the net duncan is severley underrated which is why I think he becomes so protected on tha net

[Jacks3]

That would mean that there have been about 90,000 NBA players. That .01% that he's not better than includes Wilt, Bird, Magic, MJ, Hakeem, Duncan, Russell, Shaq, KAJ.
so you're saying that since 1947 there have been only 9 players in history better than kobe? what a beast! amazing. :applause: :applause: :applause:

[laronprofit9]

What baffles me the most is how Kobe didn't win player of the month while averaging 40.6 ppg in February 2003.

If you round his averages for that month he was averaging 41ppg/5rpg/4apg on 47%FG/43%3P/85%FT.

Kobe did win the player of the month for January 2003 though.

Kobe had very sick all-around numbers that year.

2002-2003 Best Months

November: 29ppg/9rpg/7apg 44%FG/24%3P/79%FT
December: 24ppg/6rpg/8apg 45%FG/38%3P/86%FT
January: 31ppg/7rpg/6apg 47%FG/40%3P/85%FT
February: 41ppg/5rpg/4apg 47%FG/43%3P/85%FT
March: 28ppg/7rpg/5apg 44%FG/43%3P/85%FT
April: 28ppg/7rpg/6apg 44%FG/32%3P/90%FT

At the beginning of this season, Kobe was an excellent playmaker, and a triple double threat every night. Kobe was basically Lebron in the first half of the season. With lower fg% but higher 3P% and FT%.

http://img121.imageshack.us/img121/2296/speakj.jpg

I think Kobe should've gotten 3 player of the month awards that season. He got 1 for January, He should've received one for November and February imo.

I don't know how the :banghead: Kobe didn't win player of the month in February. What he did that month was legendary, truly an all-time great month by a single player.

[wheyhigh]

i thought scoring didn't make you great? oh wait, it's kobe. double standard. so when jimmy scores 30 a night he is called one dimensional and overrated and everyone says high scoring is meaningless. even though kobe scored a lot and still didn't win a chip he is great. sure thing bob.

[RazorBaLade]

i thought scoring didn't make you great? oh wait, it's kobe. double standard. so when jimmy scores 30 a night he is called one dimensional and overrated and everyone says high scoring is meaningless. even though kobe scored a lot and still didn't win a chip he is great. sure thing bob.

joyner? is jimmy durant?

[laronprofit9]

What baffles me the most is how Kobe didn't win player of the month while averaging 40.6 ppg in February 2003.

If you round his averages for that month he was averaging 41ppg/5rpg/4apg on 47%FG/43%3P/85%FT.

Kobe did win the player of the month for January 2003 though.

Kobe had very sick all-around numbers that year.

2002-2003 Best Months

November: 29ppg/9rpg/7apg 44%FG/24%3P/79%FT
December: 24ppg/6rpg/8apg 45%FG/38%3P/86%FT
January: 31ppg/7rpg/6apg 47%FG/40%3P/85%FT
February: 41ppg/5rpg/4apg 47%FG/43%3P/85%FT
March: 28ppg/7rpg/5apg 44%FG/43%3P/85%FT
April: 28ppg/7rpg/6apg 44%FG/32%3P/90%FT

At the beginning of this season, Kobe was an excellent playmaker, and a triple double threat every night. Kobe was basically Lebron in the first half of the season. With lower fg% but higher 3P% and FT%.

http://img121.imageshack.us/img121/2296/speakj.jpg

I think Kobe should've gotten 3 player of the month awards that season. He got 1 for January, He should've received one for November and February imo.

I don't know how the :banghead: Kobe didn't win player of the month in February. What he did that month was legendary, truly an all-time great month by a single player.

I consider this Kobe's best season as a playmaker, and his Physical Prime, but Not Overall Prime. He wasn't as skilled as 2006, and not as mature as 2008. Kobe however was stronger, faster, higher vertical, and more mobile this season than any other season of his career. Best athletic season for him physically. Also his best defensive season imo.

[j3lademaster]

This was my favorite version of Kobe. Boxing out for rebounds, tipping loose balls to teammates, and a more physical defense than I was used to seeing from him.

[thejumpa]

I consider this Kobe's best season as a playmaker, and his Physical Prime, but Not Overall Prime. He wasn't as skilled as 2006, and not as mature as 2008. Kobe however was stronger, faster, higher vertical, and more mobile this season than any other season of his career. Best athletic season for him physically. Also his best defensive season imo.

What skills did Kobe possess in 2006 that he didn't in 2003? From what I saw and remember, he had the same skills but chose to be more Kevin Durant and Melo with his game ie score whenever he got the ball. Also, in 2004-2005 he was still pretty damn athletic. Hell, didn't he dunk on Dwight in the 2004 season?

[j3lademaster]

What skills did Kobe possess in 2006 that he didn't in 2003? From what I saw and remember, he had the same skills but chose to be more Kevin Durant and Melo with his game ie score whenever he got the ball. Also, in 2004-2005 he was still pretty damn athletic. Hell, didn't he dunk on Dwight in the 2004 season?

I felt Kobe's footwork was the biggest improvement '03 vs '06. Kobe right now would still dunk on 04-05 Dwight.

[thejumpa]

I felt Kobe's footwork was the biggest improvement '03 vs '06. Kobe right now would still dunk on 04-05 Dwight.

You talking about a post game? Possibly. You're buggin on that other comment, though. Dwight was hesistant in 04-05 but he was still 6'10 250+. No way a 33 year old Kobe is dunking on him like he did in 04. All of his dunks now come from the fact that's he's 6'6....not from his vertical. That is long gone:oldlol:

[laronprofit9]

What skills did Kobe possess in 2006 that he didn't in 2003? From what I saw and remember, he had the same skills but chose to be more Kevin Durant and Melo with his game ie score whenever he got the ball. Also, in 2004-2005 he was still pretty damn athletic. Hell, didn't he dunk on Dwight in the 2004 season?

I consider 2006 Kobe the pinnacle of his fundamentals and athleticism combined. I think he is more fundamentally sound now than in 2006, and I think he was more athletic in 2003 than 2006. But combining both, 2006 makes this the most skilled version of Kobe. Kobe's shooting touch this season was at its peak. His mid-range jumper this season was arguably the best ever by a player. His footwork, pull-up jumper, ball-handling, all came together perfectly this season. Although he wasn't dunking on people as much as he used too, he still was able to do windmills, 360s, dunk on people(Nash:lol ), and baseline reverse dunk.

He was hella athletic in 2004-2005. He had several famous dunks that season. With the Dunk on D12, Baseline 2-Hand Reverse Dunk @ Sacramento, Double-Clutch 180 Baseline Reverse Dunk @ Utah, Dunk on BirdMan, and Reverse Dunk against TMac.

However 2002-2003 was more impressive as far as athleticism. He had more famous dunks this season: Baseline Reverse Windmill against Sprewell @ New York, Baseline Reverse Windmill against KG @ Minnesota, Dunk on Yao, Behind-the-Back 360 Dunk vs Nuggets. Kobe also was a better defender this season than 05. Kobe had career highs in steals, minutes played, and 3 point shot. Which a lot of it attributes to his peak athleticism. If you remember in the summer of 2002 during training camp. Everyone mentioned how Kobe bulked up about 15 lbs of pure muscle from last season going from 210 lbs to 225 lbs. His frame looked a lot bigger in 2003 than 2002. He was also just as fast as the season before, and somehow his vertical even seemed better. Not to mention his defense this season was at an all time great level.

[Jacks3]

If you round his averages for that month he was averaging 41ppg/5rpg/4apg on 47%FG/43%3P/85%FT.

Kobe did win the player of the month for January 2003 though.

Kobe had very sick all-around numbers that year.

2002-2003 Best Months

November: 29ppg/9rpg/7apg 44%FG/24%3P/79%FT
December: 24ppg/6rpg/8apg 45%FG/38%3P/86%FT
January: 31ppg/7rpg/6apg 47%FG/40%3P/85%FT
February: 41ppg/5rpg/4apg 47%FG/43%3P/85%FT
March: 28ppg/7rpg/5apg 44%FG/43%3P/85%FT
April: 28ppg/7rpg/6apg 44%FG/32%3P/90%FT



.
:bowdown: :bowdown: :bowdown:

[laronprofit9]

Here are all of Kobe's 40+ppg months.

February 2003

41ppg/5rpg/4apg 47%FG/43%3P/85%FT

January 2006

43ppg/6rpg/4apg 47%FG/40%3P/90%FT

April 2006

42ppg/6rpg/4apg 51%FG/41%3P/82%FT

March 2007

40ppg/6rpg/5apg 46%FG/37%3P/87%FT

[Samurai Swoosh]

Here are all of Kobe's 40+ppg months.

February 2003

41ppg/5rpg/4apg 47%FG/43%3P/85%FT

January 2006

43ppg/6rpg/4apg 47%FG/40%3P/90%FT

April 2006

42ppg/6rpg/4apg 51%FG/41%3P/82%FT

March 2007

40ppg/6rpg/5apg 46%FG/37%3P/87%FT
:facepalm

[laronprofit9]

:facepalm
:(

[laronprofit9]

I believe Kobe was the best player in the league at one point during that season it was February.

However for the entire season it goes.

1. Tim Duncan
2. Shaq
3. Kevin Garnett
4. Kobe/TMac
5. TMac/Kobe

[Willkill24]

Here are all of Kobe's 40+ppg months.

February 2003

41ppg/5rpg/4apg 47%FG/43%3P/85%FT

January 2006

43ppg/6rpg/4apg 47%FG/40%3P/90%FT

April 2006

42ppg/6rpg/4apg 51%FG/41%3P/82%FT

March 2007

40ppg/6rpg/5apg 46%FG/37%3P/87%FT
:bowdown:

[Samurai Swoosh]

:(
Facepalm ...

Because of the SICKNESS

:pimp:

[j3lademaster]

You talking about a post game? Possibly. You're buggin on that other comment, though. Dwight was hesistant in 04-05 but he was still 6'10 250+. No way a 33 year old Kobe is dunking on him like he did in 04. All of his dunks now come from the fact that's he's 6'6....not from his vertical. That is long gone:oldlol:

Did you see his block on Durant on the break in the playoffs? He's nowhere near his '03 self obviously but he can still get up, still has ridiculous body control, and can still finish with contact at the rim. Much less defensively aware 04-05 Dwight Howard who was relying more on athleticism than anticipation would get dunked on by current Kobe. Kobe's still a very good athlete even for NBA standards.

When I said footwork I was mostly thinking about his spin move, which is mostly seen in the post after a pump fake so yeah post game for the most part. His footwork weaving through the lane is on GOAT level as well though.

[DatDudeD]

Here are all of Kobe's 40+ppg months.

February 2003

41ppg/5rpg/4apg 47%FG/43%3P/85%FT

January 2006

43ppg/6rpg/4apg 47%FG/40%3P/90%FT

April 2006

42ppg/6rpg/4apg 51%FG/41%3P/82%FT

March 2007

40ppg/6rpg/5apg 46%FG/37%3P/87%FT

http://www.threadbombing.com/data/media/2/1tr8ya.gif (http://www.threadbombing.com/details.php?image_id=4163)

[thejumpa]

I consider 2006 Kobe the pinnacle of his fundamentals and athleticism combined. I think he is more fundamentally sound now than in 2006, and I think he was more athletic in 2003 than 2006. But combining both, 2006 makes this the most skilled version of Kobe. Kobe's shooting touch this season was at its peak. His mid-range jumper this season was arguably the best ever by a player. His footwork, pull-up jumper, ball-handling, all came together perfectly this season. Although he wasn't dunking on people as much as he used too, he still was able to do windmills, 360s, dunk on people(Nash:lol ), and baseline reverse dunk.

He was hella athletic in 2004-2005. He had several famous dunks that season. With the Dunk on D12, Baseline 2-Hand Reverse Dunk @ Sacramento, Double-Clutch 180 Baseline Reverse Dunk @ Utah, Dunk on BirdMan, and Reverse Dunk against TMac.

However 2002-2003 was more impressive as far as athleticism. He had more famous dunks this season: Baseline Reverse Windmill against Sprewell @ New York, Baseline Reverse Windmill against KG @ Minnesota, Dunk on Yao, Behind-the-Back 360 Dunk vs Nuggets. Kobe also was a better defender this season than 05. Kobe had career highs in steals, minutes played, and 3 point shot. Which a lot of it attributes to his peak athleticism. If you remember in the summer of 2002 during training camp. Everyone mentioned how Kobe bulked up about 15 lbs of pure muscle from last season going from 210 lbs to 225 lbs. His frame looked a lot bigger in 2003 than 2002. He was also just as fast as the season before, and somehow his vertical even seemed better. Not to mention his defense this season was at an all time great level.

Damn you must be a diehard fan. You pulled alll that shit off the top of your head?

And yeah, I remember when he put on that weight. IIRC, he actually felt slower and got tired faster(personally I couldn't tell) so he dropped it for 2004. I must have forgot how developed his post skills were in 2006, though. I've always thought 04-07 to be his prime so I guess I got lost in those years.

And yeah, that baseline windwill dunk against Minnesota is one of the greatest dunks of all time IMO. Not because he got so high(he didn't), but because he used full extension and seemed to use every bit of athleticism he had. I had one chance to do it in a pickup game and ended up doing a layup on the dunk attempt. Super ****ing hard to do.

[Jacks3]

Here are all of Kobe's 40+ppg months.

February 2003

41ppg/5rpg/4apg 47%FG/43%3P/85%FT

January 2006

43ppg/6rpg/4apg 47%FG/40%3P/90%FT

April 2006

42ppg/6rpg/4apg 51%FG/41%3P/82%FT

March 2007



40ppg/6rpg/5apg 46%FG/37%3P/87%FT
:bowdown:

[jaydacris]

kobe was also the best looking player that year, no homo

well maybe 2nd best looking, wally was pretty stunning

[j3lademaster]

kobe was also the best looking player that year, no homo

well maybe 2nd best looking, wally was pretty stunning

Rudy Fernandez takes that title now, no homo.

[Samurai Swoosh]

http://www.threadbombing.com/data/media/2/1tr8ya.gif (http://www.threadbombing.com/details.php?image_id=4163)
I raise you your Mase and Diddy ...

http://img268.imageshack.us/img268/7884/shoulders.gif

[Samurai Swoosh]

Rudy Fernandez takes that title now, no homo.
Yeah with that lop sided, Terrance and Phillip looking jaw of his ... a real stunner.

:oldlol:

http://static.technorati.com/10/02/02/4107/rudy-fernandez.jpg

http://a6.vox.com/6a00c22521073e8e1d00fad695b6260005-500pi

[DatDudeD]

I raise you your Mase and Diddy ...

http://img268.imageshack.us/img268/7884/shoulders.gif

lol........ better step it up

http://www.threadbombing.com/data/media/2/ac-slater-dance.gif (http://www.threadbombing.com/details.php?image_id=4838)

[thejumpa]

Did you see his block on Durant on the break in the playoffs? He's nowhere near his '03 self obviously but he can still get up, still has ridiculous body control, and can still finish with contact at the rim. Much less defensively aware 04-05 Dwight Howard who was relying more on athleticism than anticipation would get dunked on by current Kobe. Kobe's still a very good athlete even for NBA standards.

When I said footwork I was mostly thinking about his spin move, which is mostly seen in the post after a pump fake so yeah post game for the most part. His footwork weaving through the lane is on GOAT level as well though.

We are gonna have to agree to disagree on this one. While I think he has more athleticism left than most people think, it's not in his legs. To dunk on someone, you have to be explosive and has hops. I don't know his vert now.....but it ain't the 38" that was reported years ago. 6'10 is a lot of body to leap into and forcefully come down on.

[Samurai Swoosh]

lol........ better step it up

One word ... BIEBER

http://www.gifsoup.com/view/84906/justin-bieber-o.gif

[DatDudeD]

One word ... BIEBER

http://www.gifsoup.com/view/84906/justin-bieber-o.gif

damn justin beiber....lol
http://www.threadbombing.com/data/media/2/2lawm89.gif (http://www.threadbombing.com/details.php?image_id=2821)

[JustinJDW]

When people posts Kobe's stats, don't they realize that he had those stats as a 2nd option, and wasn't at all the main focus of defenses back then? Timmy, Shaq, KG and T-Mac were all the main focus of defenses when they played, and they still put up better stats. And I'm not even saying its all about stats.

I just blows my mind how people don't understand HOW MUCH EASIER it is for a player as talented as Kobe Bryant, to have an absolute field day, play amazing and have great stats when you have a Top 2-4 Big Man ever on your team, in his prime, dominating everything, demanding triple teams and sucking in defenses like a black hole. Do people not see this?

Do people just ignore that obvious and glaring piece of information? Have people honestly forgotten just how amazing Shaq was in his prime. :facepalm

[YAWN]

I hated the Spurs. Do you realize the Lakers were one shot away from changing that entire series around?

LOOK AT THAT:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=m6V1-UraQAs#t=10m14s

It went in and out! It still stings.

But yeah, I don't think Kobe was the best player that year. More people were ready to consider him the man with the Lakers since he exploded and Shaq was out a lot. But I think Duncan, Shaq, and Garnett were consider better.

kobe should of jumped into bowen and taken 3 free throws :banghead:

[YAWN]

When people posts Kobe's stats, don't they realize that he had those stats as a 2nd option, and wasn't at all the main focus of defenses back then? Timmy, Shaq, KG and T-Mac were all the main focus of defenses when they played, and they still put up better stats. And I'm not even saying its all about stats.

I just blows my mind how people don't understand HOW MUCH EASIER it is for a player as talented as Kobe Bryant, to have an absolute field day, play amazing and have great stats when you have a Top 2-4 Big Man ever on your team, in his prime, dominating everything, demanding triple teams and sucking in defenses like a black hole. Do people not see this?

Do people just ignore that obvious and glaring piece of information? Have people honestly forgotten just how amazing Shaq was in his prime. :facepalm

spoken like someone that didn't watch basketball back then.

[JustinJDW]

spoken like someone that didn't watch basketball back then.Look, I'm not saying Kobe had a cake walk, cause he didn't. He torched teams and their best defenders. Him and Shaq were great.

But you have to, YOU HAVE TO, understand the difference for when Kobe puts up 30ppg with prime dominant and triple-teamed Shaq on the team, to when someone like Timmy and KG puts up 30ppg, being the only stars with weak supporting casts and no other all-stars on the team.

You just have to understand the huge difference! Do you not understand what I am saying right now?

[YAWN]

Look, I'm not saying Kobe had a cake walk, cause he didn't. He torched teams and their best defenders. Him and Shaq were great.

But you have to, YOU HAVE TO, understand the difference for when Kobe puts up 30ppg with prime dominant and triple-teamed Shaq on the team, to when someone like Timmy and KG puts up 30ppg, being the only stars with weak supporting casts and no other all-stars on the team.

You just have to understand the huge difference! Do you not understand what I am saying right now?

You're making up a "huge difference" that isn't there. During that season Kobe was the man and everyone knew it, especially in crunch time when he torched teams with the big man on the bench; this was proven countless times that season.

So unless you're going to go back and get stats for when Shaq was on the bench and compare them to when he was on the court... then you're just attempting to justify your bias. All anyone had to do is watch him play and you could tell how ****ing good he was, regardless of who else was on his team. Your argument is also opening up the flood gates for kobe biased posters to counter with, "well if shaq wasn't on the team that year, kobe would of averaged 40!!1".

But both arguments don't hold a candle to actually watching how good he was that season.

[JustinJDW]

You're making up a "huge difference" that isn't there. During that season Kobe was the man and everyone knew it, especially in crunch time when he torched teams with the big man on the bench; this was proven countless times that season.

So unless you're going to go back and get stats for when Shaq was on the bench and compare them to when he was on the court... then you're just attempting to justify your bias. All anyone had to do is watch him play and you could tell how ****ing good he was, regardless of who else was on his team. Your argument is also opening up the flood gates for kobe biased posters to counter with, "well if shaq wasn't on the team that year, kobe would of averaged 40!!1".

But both arguments don't hold a candle to actually watching how good he was that season.Ok, I kinda get what you're saying. Now do you think he was the MVP of the 2002-2003 Season? Better than Shaq, Timmy and KG?

[laronprofit9]

When people posts Kobe's stats, don't they realize that he had those stats as a 2nd option, and wasn't at all the main focus of defenses back then? Timmy, Shaq, KG and T-Mac were all the main focus of defenses when they played, and they still put up better stats. And I'm not even saying its all about stats.

I just blows my mind how people don't understand HOW MUCH EASIER it is for a player as talented as Kobe Bryant, to have an absolute field day, play amazing and have great stats when you have a Top 2-4 Big Man ever on your team, in his prime, dominating everything, demanding triple teams and sucking in defenses like a black hole. Do people not see this?

Do people just ignore that obvious and glaring piece of information? Have people honestly forgotten just how amazing Shaq was in his prime. :facepalm

You have to realize a few notes here:

1. Kobe had his best seasons being the Main Option of his team, after Shaq.
2. The early Lakers were built specifically for Shaq, not Kobe.
3. Kobe's individual numbers are a result of mainly his own play.
4. Doesn't being a second option hurt your volume stats?

A Main Option faces more defensive attention from the other team. However, the main option of the team gets the best opportunities to score. Your teammates are looking specifically for you first over anybody else. Your coach and team spent the most time creating plays and situations to give the Main Option (Not 2nd Option) the best opportunities on the team to score. The team is designed to cater to strengths of the #1 option not the #2 option. This means the #1 option is utilized more efficiently by the team.

To off-set these disadvantages, a #2 mainly thrives off the attention #1 draws. The team is built and designed to specifically bring out the best of the #1 option of the team by catering to the #1 option's particular strengths. The 2nd option has to somehow find his own way of fitting into the offense and working around #1. The 2nd option probably doesn't get as many good opportunities within the team offense as option 1, but benefits from the attention #1 draws.

I'm just saying this, because the triangle of Shaq/Kobe put Kobe in a less comfortable role than the triangle offense now. Shaq was the main scorer and option at the time, and the offense was set up to benefit him the most, and the players surrounding him would thrive off his success. Right now, Kobe is the main option. Starting from the 2005-2006 season Kobe was placed in a different position of the triangle at the high-post elbow wing, since this time he was the main option of the team.

Despite Kobe receiving more attention from the opposition, he was better than ever this season. Kobe had the benefit of Phil Jackson utilizing his strengths better, because this time he was the main option of the team. His shot selection improved compared to when he was younger, a lot of that has do with his new/more comfortable position in the offense.

If Shaq wasn't on the Lakers in 2003, Kobe would've probably still posted up the same or even better numbers. The Lakers obviously wouldn't have been as good. Kobe would receive more defensive attention, but Kobe's scoring opportunities would come easier for him, because the offense is built specifically for him instead of someone else. The Lakers would adjust the offense from catering to Shaq to catering to Kobe to help him counter the extra defensive pressure.

[YAWN]

Ok, I kinda get what you're saying. Now do you think he was the MVP of the 2002-2003 Season? Better than Shaq, Timmy and KG?

i would of been ok with TD, KG, or Kobe getting it. Thought KB should of got a little more love (finished a distant 3rd in MVP voting). But the media fell in love with the big men.

[Big#50]

Duncan had one of the greatest seasons of all time in 03.

[Samurai Swoosh]

damn justin beiber....lol
http://www.threadbombing.com/data/media/2/2lawm89.gif (http://www.threadbombing.com/details.php?image_id=2821)
LOL ...

[rmt]

so you're saying that since 1947 there have been only 9 players in history better than kobe? what a beast! amazing. :applause: :applause: :applause:
IMO, there have been only 9 players in history better than Kobe.

The post that states that Kobe is > 99.99% of players in nba history is not correct since there haven't been around 90,000 players in the NBA.


If those were the three guys in the conversation and Tim Duncan wasn't the best, why did his team beat the team with the other two?
Logic doesn't work with some of these Kobe fans.

They can't explain why Duncan + a bunch of scrubs (no all-stars, no all-nba 1st, 2nd, 3rd team, 1 all-defensive 2nd team ) [B]did beat Kobe + Shaq (2 all-stars, 2 all-nba 1st teams, 2 all-defensive 2nd teams) + scrubs.

They'd rather post a bunch of Kobe's regular season stats and revise history/disregard Duncan carrying a rebuilding team to 60 wins, defeating the 3-time defending champion and posting dominant regular season, playoff and Finals runs.

[evilmonkey]

damn justin beiber....lol
http://www.threadbombing.com/data/media/2/2lawm89.gif (http://www.threadbombing.com/details.php?image_id=2821)

haha nice

[ImmortalD24]

When people posts Kobe's stats, don't they realize that he had those stats as a 2nd option, and wasn't at all the main focus of defenses back then? Timmy, Shaq, KG and T-Mac were all the main focus of defenses when they played, and they still put up better stats. And I'm not even saying its all about stats.You have to realize a few notes here:

1. Kobe had his best seasons being the Main Option of his team, after Shaq.
2. The early Lakers were built specifically for Shaq, not Kobe.
3. Kobe's individual numbers are a result of mainly his own play.
4. Doesn't being a second option hurt your volume stats?

A Main Option faces more defensive attention from the other team. However, the main option of the team gets the best opportunities to score. Your teammates are looking specifically for you first over anybody else. Your coach and team spent the most time creating plays and situations to give the Main Option (Not 2nd Option) the best opportunities on the team to score. The team is designed to cater to strengths of the #1 option not the #2 option. This means the #1 option is utilized more efficiently by the team.

To off-set these disadvantages, a #2 mainly thrives off the attention #1 draws. The team is built and designed to specifically bring out the best of the #1 option of the team by catering to the #1 option's particular strengths. The 2nd option has to somehow find his own way of fitting into the offense and working around #1. The 2nd option probably doesn't get as many good opportunities within the team offense as option 1, but benefits from the attention #1 draws.

I'm just saying this, because the triangle of Shaq/Kobe put Kobe in a less comfortable role than the triangle offense now. Shaq was the main scorer and option at the time, and the offense was set up to benefit him the most, and the players surrounding him would thrive off his success. Right now, Kobe is the main option. Starting from the 2005-2006 season Kobe was placed in a different position of the triangle at the high-post elbow wing, since this time he was the main option of the team.

Despite Kobe receiving more attention from the opposition, he was better than ever this season. Kobe had the benefit of Phil Jackson utilizing his strengths better, because this time he was the main option of the team. His shot selection improved compared to when he was younger, a lot of that has do with his new/more comfortable position in the offense.

If Shaq wasn't on the Lakers in 2003, Kobe would've probably still posted up the same or even better numbers. The Lakers obviously wouldn't been as good. Kobe would receive more defensive attention, but Kobe's scoring opportunities would come easier for him, because the offense is built specifically for him instead of someone else. The Lakers would adjust the from catering to Shaq to catering to Kobe to help him counter the extra defensive pressure.
Good post.

[evilmonkey]

Have no idea, but T-Mac and Kobe were statistically pretty much even....

While T-Mac averaged more points, Kobe averaged just a bit more rebs, assists.

[BlueandGold]

Before the last two championships, this wasn't even a debate in these forums on whether Kobe was the best player that season... much less the best player on his team.

Now with the confidence from the past two championships, Kobe homers have the balls now to come up and create threads like this that would have held no warrant a couple years ago

It's always been a debate. To say that a player who averaged 30/7/6/2 on a championship level team and who also had to share the ball with one of the most ball dominant big men ever doesn't even deserve a hint of best player or MVP in 2002/2003 just screams anti-kobe troll. Jordan on the 96 bulls averaged 30/7/4 and won MVP and then averaged 30/6/4 the next won and lost the MVP to Malone (who has never won MVP up to that point, in a long career) by 1 or 2 first place votes and everyone was talking about how Jordan got robbed. 30/6/4/1.5 is a little lower than 30/7/6/2 the last time I checked.

Simmons (A Celtic homer) also has Malone over Jordan for 97 MVP as the most fishiest MVP voting years in NBA history and Nash over Kobe in 06 around 5th or so in most fishiest.

[BlueandGold]

Wade not close? How so? He played with Shaquille O'Neal yet managed to average 27\7\6\2\1 on 50% while taking 7 less shots then Kobe and 4 less shots then LeBron. He averaged 34\8\4 in the Finals and 28\7\6 in the playoffs. If that's not close then I don't know what is.

Kobe scored more, but he took 3 more shots then LeBron and was less efficient. Was a worse playmaker and worse rebounder. His team had a worse record and seed no matter how you look at it. Cavaliers made it past the first round.

I don't really see how it isn't close between them 3. I think Kobe is the best player that year, but LeBron and Wade could be argued for it too.

It's these type of foreign brain-dead comments that blatantly show that your some 12 y/o kid who never even had a chance to watch shaq/kobe duo play. Your arguing about 2006 yet you weren't even an NBA fan back then. Who did the Cavs play in the first round compared to the Lakers? The cavs got to face a 5th or 6th seed in Washington while the Lakers faced the 1 or 2 seeded Suns lead by an MVP. And Kobe still single-handedly took the first seed to 7 games.

lol @ kid who doesn't understand the concept of context.

[BlueandGold]

What baffles me the most is how Kobe didn't win player of the month while averaging 40.6 ppg in February 2003.

If you round his averages for that month he was averaging 41ppg/5rpg/4apg on 47%FG/43%3P/85%FT.

Kobe did win the player of the month for January 2003 though.

Kobe had very sick all-around numbers that year.

2002-2003 Best Months

November: 29ppg/9rpg/7apg 44%FG/24%3P/79%FT
December: 24ppg/6rpg/8apg 45%FG/38%3P/86%FT
January: 31ppg/7rpg/6apg 47%FG/40%3P/85%FT
February: 41ppg/5rpg/4apg 47%FG/43%3P/85%FT
March: 28ppg/7rpg/5apg 44%FG/43%3P/85%FT
April: 28ppg/7rpg/6apg 44%FG/32%3P/90%FT

At the beginning of this season, Kobe was an excellent playmaker, and a triple double threat every night. Kobe was basically Lebron in the first half of the season. With lower fg% but higher 3P% and FT%.

http://img121.imageshack.us/img121/2296/speakj.jpg

I think Kobe should've gotten 3 player of the month awards that season. He got 1 for January, He should've received one for November and February imo.

I don't know how the :banghead: Kobe didn't win player of the month in February. What he did that month was legendary, truly an all-time great month by a single player.

It's because the whole colorado thing was still fresh(searing) into people's minds. There's no way Stern would let a player like that win player of the year that year with the type of charges he was facing. Imagine Gilbert winning player of the year during his whole gun-show fiasco. Or if Hamiliton won player of the month during the malace at the palace. Sometimes public perception may be too hard to overcome for a player. (Rodman not in the hall, Pete Rose not in the hall*baseball).

[RazorBaLade]

Look, I'm not saying Kobe had a cake walk, cause he didn't. He torched teams and their best defenders. Him and Shaq were great.

But you have to, YOU HAVE TO, understand the difference for when Kobe puts up 30ppg with prime dominant and triple-teamed Shaq on the team, to when someone like Timmy and KG puts up 30ppg, being the only stars with weak supporting casts and no other all-stars on the team.

You just have to understand the huge difference! Do you not understand what I am saying right now?

so how do you rate gasols last 4 years? with your logic u better not think he was the finals mvp or even a great, i mean he had kobe to make things so easy for him. that would mean kobe just had 4 legendary seasons right since gasols stats should be taken with a grain of salt?

[RazorBaLade]

It's because the whole colorado thing was still fresh(searing) into people's minds. There's no way Stern would let a player like that win player of the year that year with the type of charges he was facing. Imagine Gilbert winning player of the year during his whole gun-show fiasco. Or if Hamiliton won player of the month during the malace at the palace. Sometimes public perception may be too hard to overcome for a player. (Rodman not in the hall, Pete Rose not in the hall*baseball).

Wasnt the denver thing in 05?

[Heilige]

I always knew that Shaqattack was bias but I didn't think the extent of the homerism was that bad until now? 5th best player that year? lol no wonder everyone thinks shaqattack is a shaq troll now. It's like the more desperate Shaq(actual) gets he more desperate shaqattack gets to try to defend his hero lol


ShaqAttack3234 has Kobe in his top 10 all time list so how can you call him a Shaq homer. Jacks3 has Kobe in his top 15 all time.

[nycelt84]

The Colorado Thing happened in the 03-04 season.

[Calabis]

Lol...wow the Kobehomers are pure hypocrites...its amazing the shit they say...things I have learned in only a few months on the ish board

1. Shaq hindered Kobe, yet Kobe avg more shots as a starter while playing with Shaq, and during this particular season he avg 23 shots, his second highest career total, but hey Shaq held him back....ooh wait, they sure love using those Shaq led titles....oops my bad, refer to number 2 and 3...sorry Shaq)

2. Shaq being doubled, tripled teamed and being the opposing teams main focus, did not help Kobe, again Shaq hurt Kobe, yet Kobe makes the game easier for Gasol.....hmmm.....only Kobe makes the game easier for his teammates

3. All of Kobe's teammates are not that good, but other greats have the best players ever and those teammates should have been MVP's over these other greats during particular seasons. When Shaq is mentioned, Kobe falls into this teammate category.

4. Only when praising Kobe, does a GM, Coach, Current/Former Players word mean anything and is totally fact, if they diss him....they are just haters, if they say someone else is better currently, they are haters, if they say any other particular player is better all time, they are liars and full of shit.

5. Stats don't tell the whole story, or they don't mean shit, unless it favors Kobe, then stats are like the ten commandments

6. You cannot say anything bad about Kobe, because even if you enjoy watching him play and call him an all time great, if he's not top 5 on your GOAT list....you're just a hater or "u mad"

7. MJ is not better than Kobe. MJ is the most overhyped athlete of all time, his stats are a product of weak basketball and playing against nobodies, he could not handle the zone of today, or the perimeter players of today, he would not be a great defender and would just be another decent athlete in todays game(although many have stated different...please refer to #4). A new one I heard today, if Jordan played in today's style of uniforms, he would not have been as great as he was...lmao

8. If 10 Kobe topics are not posted daily, his fanatics will make sure it happens

9. People only hate Kobe because he keeps winning and is passing their idols..(lol, no people hate on Kobehomers because the shit they pull out of their ass and how they continue to overrate Mr. Bryant, unfortunately it prevents some people from commenting on the great things Kobe does).