I never thought I would see Okafor own Bosh

[Reverend Hoops]

Bosh looks horrible so far this season.

Bron-Wade and a wasted huge contract in Bosh so far.

[ginobli2311]

Bosh looks horrible so far this season.

Bron-Wade and a wasted huge contract in Bosh so far.

how could bosh ever own okafor though?

he's soft, can't play defense, and is only good with the ball in his hands. that bosh's problem. he's only good if he's touching the ball a ton. but he's not good enough to be a number 1 player on a title team. so i would never want bosh on my team.

he's like joe johnson and any other pretender out there because they can't be your center piece to win but they suck if they don't get the ball a ton.

[TDPrime2030]

Bosh looks horrible so far this season.

Bron-Wade and a wasted huge contract in Bosh so far.
Bosh doesn't fit....he's just......there. Nothing more.

[nba_55]

Come on guys!!!

You guys are reaching conclusions only after 6 games into the season. He still have 76 games to find his role in the team and fit with Lebron and Wade.
I am sure he ll do.

[Noob Saibot]

Come on guys!!!

You guys are reaching conclusions only after 6 games into the season. He still have 76 games to find his role in the team and fit with Lebron and Wade.
I am sure he ll do.

^this is only excuse Bosh has at this point, cuz he's playin' like bird doodoo.

[ginobli2311]

Come on guys!!!

You guys are reaching conclusions only after 6 games into the season. He still have 76 games to find his role in the team and fit with Lebron and Wade.
I am sure he ll do.

the problem is that i've had 7 years plus college to watch bosh and form my opinions. he's not a "dirty work" type player. and that is what the heat need.

even worse. bosh is a very poor defender and he's not great on the boards when he has to battle other guys with size actually.

bosh can't score in the low post either.

so what does he bring to the table? he brings some decent jump shooting...thats it.

[inclinerator]

u can say watever u want but this team is winning a chip this season

[ginobli2311]

u can say watever u want but this team is winning a chip this season

any amount of money you want...i'll take that action and give you +300

[game3524]

u can say watever u want but this team is winning a chip this season

Lmao, have you seen LA yet?

[yobore]

Okafor is turning a new leaf this season. He has been outstanding at pinning his defender off the CP/West pick and pop. That's what he's got to do.

[Harion]

ok. for 14 million, who could the Heat have gotten last summer that would better replace Bosh?

[ginobli2311]

ok. for 14 million, who could the Heat have gotten last summer that would better replace Bosh?

what do you mean replace bosh? he doesn't do anything special for this team. the heat would have been much better off just saving resources to getter better depth and size.

this team does not need a big 3. it needs wade/lebron and mike miller and house and halsem and big z and joel anthony.....which they have. and then they need better pg play and more size.

so that 14 million would have been much better spent on getting a better front line and guard play. those are the two weaknesses of this team....and bosh doesn't help either of those.....in fact he hurts their front line play.

i'll say it again. no post play on offense, average rebounding at best when going against size, and pathetic defense around the rim. bosh brings nothing to the table on this team.

[Harion]

you didn't answer the question.
whom would have the 14 mil been better spent on?
give a name. or names. whoever you think deserves the 14 mil more than Bosh.

[sayitaintso]

Bosh or Boozer or Amare or David Lee. David Lee over Bosh?

[kkling]

Bosh doesn't fit at all. He looks awkward as hell out there.

[StacksOnDeck]

You never thought because you hardly watched Bosh play. His D is horrendous.

[#1SportsFan86]

Lmao, have you seen LA yet?

:facepalm

How many contenders have the Lakers played yet?

[ginobli2311]

you didn't answer the question.
whom would have the 14 mil been better spent on?
give a name. or names. whoever you think deserves the 14 mil more than Bosh.

you didn't listen or understand i guess. i would have given it to perhaps 5 different players.

who those players are? i don't know....i'd have to do a lot of research. but i know via trades and free agency that the heat could have vastly improved their front line and guard play with that money.

and i know that the heat would be a ton better with that and without bosh. he does not fit. he does not play good defense. he is not tough. he does not get easy baskets. he holds the ball way too long for how effective he is.

like i said. bosh and joe johnson and arenas...etc are weird players because they aren't good unless they have the ball a lot....but they aren't good enough to have the ball a lot and win in the playoffs. so what do you do with them?

they are just guys i would never want on my team. give me gerald wallace over bosh any day of the week.

[game3524]

:facepalm

How many contenders have the Lakers played yet?

And?

Miami is struggling with the likes of Okafor, how the hell are they going to deal with Gasol, Odom, and Bynum when he comes back. Also add that LA has a bench, and their three point shooting seems to have improved.

It is clear to anyone who is objective that LA is the best team in the NBA at the moment.

It is like some of you guys forget they are the defending champions, and have only improved their roster.

[Allstar24]

how could bosh ever own okafor though?

he's soft, can't play defense, and is only good with the ball in his hands. that bosh's problem. he's only good if he's touching the ball a ton. but he's not good enough to be a number 1 player on a title team. so i would never want bosh on my team.

he's like joe johnson and any other pretender out there because they can't be your center piece to win but they suck if they don't get the ball a ton.
So I guess Bosh is going to be the scapegoat when Miami loses :oldlol:

[ginobli2311]

And?

Miami is struggling with the likes of Okafor, how the hell are they going to deal with Gasol, Odom, and Bynum when he comes back. Also add that LA has a bench, and their three point shooting seems to have improved.

It is clear to anyone who is objective that LA is the best team in the NBA at the moment.

It is like some of you guys forget they are the defending champions, and have only improved their roster.

i would put the current celtics slightly ahead of the lakers. but to your point. both the lakers and celtics are miles better than the heat right now. and i don't see that ever changing unless the heat get rid of bosh and bring in some size that can patrol the paint and score in the low post. and that player does not really exist because the lakers/magic/celtics have all of them.

heat will not win the title in their current form. no way.

[All Net]

That was the 2nd game this year Bosh had just 1 board

just poor

[game3524]

i would put the current celtics slightly ahead of the lakers. but to your point. both the lakers and celtics are miles better than the heat right now. and i don't see that ever changing unless the heat get rid of bosh and bring in some size that can patrol the paint and score in the low post. and that player does not really exist because the lakers/magic/celtics have all of them.

heat will not win the title in their current form. no way.

I have LA just better then Boston by a hair, but Miami is third and the Magic are fourth IMO.

[Lakers13]

They need a PF/C who can post up and bang.

[ginobli2311]

So I guess Bosh is going to be the scapegoat when Miami loses :oldlol:

there doesn't have to be a scapegoat so to speak. do you disagree with what i'm saying? i'm just speaking the truth.

how is bosh/z/anthony going to beat the big/best front lines in basketball?

its just the truth dude. bosh is not what the heat need to win. that falls on everyone....including wade and lebron. they chose to play together...and when you have two perimeter players as your best two players....you will likely have big weaknesses in the paint on both ends. and that is exactly the problem with the heat.

the problem is not wade and lebron. the problem is giving up too many easy baskets and not getting anything out of your bigs on offense in the paint. its almost impossible to win like that.

jordan won like that. thats it. every other title team had a great post presence on at least one end. and even jordan how grant/rodman....so really its never happened before.

bosh is simply not that guy. its not a scapegoat thing. its just the truth.

[ginobli2311]

I have LA just better then Boston by a hair, but Miami is third and the Magic are fourth IMO.

yea. boston and la is coin flip. i just think the celtics are a little better when healthy.

but that is a big "if"....i'd definitely (and i already have) bet on the lakers to win the title at this point over boston.

but if boston is healthy for a 7 game series....i think they win.

[TDPrime2030]

They need a PF/C who can post up and bang.
:oldlol: :roll:

[All Net]

there doesn't have to be a scapegoat so to speak. do you disagree with what i'm saying? i'm just speaking the truth.

how is bosh/z/anthony going to beat the big/best front lines in basketball?

its just the truth dude. bosh is not what the heat need to win. that falls on everyone....including wade and lebron. they chose to play together...and when you have two perimeter players as your best two players....you will likely have big weaknesses in the paint on both ends. and that is exactly the problem with the heat.

the problem is not wade and lebron. the problem is giving up too many easy baskets and not getting anything out of your bigs on offense in the paint. its almost impossible to win like that.

jordan won like that. thats it. every other title team had a great post presence on at least one end. and even jordan how grant/rodman....so really its never happened before.

bosh is simply not that guy. its not a scapegoat thing. its just the truth.

Agree completely

Said it all summer about Miami's frontcourt. For Miami to win they will need both Lebron and Wade to go nuts in a series. Their interior D I expect would get exposed in a possible finals.

If they win they big props to them but their frontcourt is not really strong enough right now.

[ginobli2311]

Agree completely

Said it all summer about Miami's frontcourt. For Miami to win they will need both Lebron and Wade to go nuts in a series. Their interior D I expect would get exposed in a possible finals.

If they win they big props to them but their frontcourt is not really strong enough right now.

agree. but here is the thing. its impossible for wade/lebron to go nuts in a series if you give up a ton of easy baskets inside all night.

you saw this tonight. its of supreme importance for every team to get stops because it leads to easy offense and gets you into a better rhythm. rhythm is so important in the nba.

but for the heat it is 10 times more important than most teams. lebron/wade are just so amazing in transition...but you don't get into transition if you don't get stops.....so the front line problem is actually a huge problem that is going to impact every aspect of this team.

i'm not saying the heat suck. they are going to win at least 62 games and be a really tough out in the playoffs. but in their current form they really have a very small chance to challenge boston or lakers.

[ILLsmak]

Hey, I think Bosh is overrated, but are you guys forgetting that Bosh hit a shot that put them only down by one (and 3 after 2 made free throws, thus still giving them a chance in the game.)

That was a huge shot... I never would have expected it. Can't say anything about Bosh after that shot. It was up to Wade or Bron to make the last shot and send it into OT, but they didn't step up they deferred to Eddie House who wasn't hitting anything up until that point.

-Smak

[#1SportsFan86]

And?

Miami is struggling with the likes of Okafor, how the hell are they going to deal with Gasol, Odom, and Bynum when he comes back. Also add that LA has a bench, and their three point shooting seems to have improved.

It is clear to anyone who is objective that LA is the best team in the NBA at the moment.

It is like some of you guys forget they are the defending champions, and have only improved their roster.

And what?

you still didn't tell me how many contenders have the Lakers played yet?

I know what the Lakers are all about but I want to see this Lakers team face a contender and not garbage teams every other night.....and as soon as the Lakers blow out a garbage team people are ready to praise the Lakers as if the Lakers where really gonna lose.

[Harison]

Personally I'm in Riley's place would trade Bosh for All-star level defensive PF/C who can rebound. If replacement isnt an all-star caliber, would do too - just would get more depth in the process.

I dont see Bosh helping Heat to win it all, yes he could adjust better to the team and be more productive, but he just isnt the right fit from the start.

[All Net]

And what?

you still didn't tell me how many contenders have the Lakers played yet?

I know what the Lakers are all about but I want to see this Lakers team face a contender and not garbage teams every other night.....and as soon as the Lakers blow out a garbage team people are ready to praise the Lakers as if the Lakers where really gonna lose.

People praise the Lakers for how they play not because of who they played.

Lakers are given credit due to the how the bench has performed which didn't happen last year even against these teams. As most know Lakers don't need to prove anything anymore to show how good they are.

[ginobli2311]

Hey, I think Bosh is overrated, but are you guys forgetting that Bosh hit a shot that put them only down by one (and 3 after 2 made free throws, thus still giving them a chance in the game.)

That was a huge shot... I never would have expected it. Can't say anything about Bosh after that shot. It was up to Wade or Bron to make the last shot and send it into OT, but they didn't step up they deferred to Eddie House who wasn't hitting anything up until that point.

-Smak

if we are focusing on one sequence and not talking about the broad issues....i totally agree. although i don't have any problem with last play or how lebron/wade played down the stretch. wade's turnover was obviously bad...but both lebron and wade started taking over late.

we are discussing the board problems with this team. and its pg play and front line play. they can hide the bad pg play....but the front line play is beyond pathetic. okafor had 26 and 13 tonight. he took only 13 shots. the hornets dominated the paint all night long. west/okafor is very good...don't get me wrong, but its not close to what the other eilite teams have. just look at the mavs.....dirk/chandler/haywood would destroy the current heat front line. the celtics and lakers would dismantle this.

we are talking about this team in terms of winning the title. and the fact remains that bosh is simply not going to provide what they need to win. i'm not saying bosh isn't good. he is very good. but he's not good at what the heat need....and his is over-rated...simply because you can't win with him as a main option...that much is painfully obvious.

so paying him near max money is a terrible return on investment.

[game3524]

And what?

you still didn't tell me how many contenders have the Lakers played yet?

I know what the Lakers are all about but I want to see this Lakers team face a contender and not garbage teams every other night.....and as soon as the Lakers blow out a garbage team people are ready to praise the Lakers as if the Lakers where really gonna lose.

Why does that even matter, the Lakers are the 2-time defending champions. We already know they can beat the contenders, they have nothing to prove already.

The scary thing is the team is even better this year then it was in 2009 and 2010.

[ginobli2311]

People praise the Lakers for how they play not because of who they played.

Lakers are given credit due to the how the bench has performed which didn't happen last year even against these teams. As most know Lakers don't need to prove anything anymore to show how good they are.

right. all you have to do is watch the lakers play and you realize they are amazing. they have a perfect team really. no weaknesses at all now. blake and barnes are huge for them. when/if bynum comes back they are nearly unbeatable.

this is the best team we have seen in over a decade in my opinion. people will realize this too late come playoff time.

oh and the lakers could win 70 this year if they wanted to. not sure if they do. but they might try for it if they start off super hot like 25-2 or something.

[justin43]

They need a PF/C who can post up and bang.

This and only this. The Heat doesn't need any more tall SG, which Bosh is.

[RoTM]

Bron is going to have to learn how to play inside, crash the boards, and let Wade handle the ball. Hes like 260 pounds so get off the top of the three point line. Bosh is scared of contact and big games so he isn't going to do it.

[game3524]

right. all you have to do is watch the lakers play and you realize they are amazing. they have a perfect team really. no weaknesses at all now. blake and barnes are huge for them. when/if bynum comes back they are nearly unbeatable.

this is the best team we have seen in over a decade in my opinion. people will realize this too late come playoff time.

oh and the lakers could win 70 this year if they wanted to. not sure if they do. but they might try for it if they start off super hot like 25-2 or something.


They have the talent, but it ain't happening IMO. They are just not wired for that kind of focus, they will pace themselves and take a few games off.

[AMISTILLILL]

Perkins would fit in perfectly for this Heat team.

[game3524]

Perkins would fit in perfectly for this Heat team.

Perkins would be great for any team, the guy is really underrated.

[All Net]

They have the talent, but it ain't happening IMO. They are just not wired for that kind of focus, they will pace themselves and take a few games off.

I think it's clear from Phil he wants HCA throughout so they will try hard to get it but 70? nah, nobody is touching that.

[DatDudeD]

yeah bosh is looking really bad right now, i dont wanna be to hasty because it is a long season but if he continues to play soft and sub par then they are gonna have trouble making it out of the east. I Also think that lebron might have to get in the post a little more also to compensate for the lack of scoring and defense down there.

[B-Easy]

im surprised how terrible Bosh has been .. he just looks slow, soft .. in bad position to rebound.

Joel has been terrible defensively this season.

i think theyll both turn it around.

[33teeth]

They have the talent, but it ain't happening IMO. They are just not wired for that kind of focus, they will pace themselves and take a few games off.
The Lakers don't look like that's their plan this year. It's different. I don't recall seeing them looking this hungry and effective this early in the season in many years. Barring injuries I just don't see them not being the best team all season long. Well, injuries or trades maybe.

[LA KB24]

Lmao I predicted CP3 would out rebound Bosh tonight in the game thread, hahhahah. :pimp:

Paul...0 OREB, 2 DREB
Bosh..0 OREB, 1 DREB


When he bulked up and needed to perform to get the big contract he worked hard in the post, but otherwise he'd settle for a lot of jumpshots...

And now signing with the Heat, hes being skinnier than ever, that's definitely not good for Miami.

Within in the next 3 years Bosh's contract will be seen as absolutely awful.

[NBASTATMAN]

Bosh looks horrible so far this season.

Bron-Wade and a wasted huge contract in Bosh so far.


Bosh has a nice jumper but even Mike James could avg 20 pts in toronto.. Dude was always overrated like Amare has always been.. Bosh's doubles on Paul were absolutely horrible. His rebounding atrocious and his defense down low is non existent.. I would have a problem arguing that this guy could clean Lamar Odoms' shoes nevermind compare him to Gasol... :D

[game3524]

The Lakers don't look like that's their plan this year. It's different. I don't recall seeing them looking this hungry and effective this early in the season in many years. Barring injuries I just don't see them not being the best team all season long. Well, injuries or trades maybe.

Oh, I think they will be the best team. But they will have nights like tonight, where they lack focus on defense, and sooner or later a team will steal one from them.

[G-Funk]

:oldlol: Bosh is the new scapegoat!!!! lmao. You got Lebron and Wade, who supposed to make players better, what the fuvl are the doing to Bosh? lol

[RoseCity07]

This is why pace and role has a lot to do with how we perceive a player. Aldridge is looking better than Bosh right now. When Bosh was the man, no one would even argue, Bosh is the better player.

I think Bosh is better than Aldridge. Look at the stats though. The Heat are still figuring things out. The overreaction threads are really immature.

It takes a couple months of basketball before we see what teams are really made of.

[B-Easy]

:oldlol: Bosh is the new scapegoat!!!! lmao. You got Lebron and Wade, who supposed to make players better, what the fuvl are the doing to Bosh? lol

Wade had like 13 points in the 4th . .he brought the team back. and Lebron had a near triple double.

Bosh .. its fine to be off on offense...but hes giving up too many offensive rebounds and playing with little energy for some reason.

[eliteballer]

If only Miami had a scrappy defender and rugged rebounder like Vareajo and a 3 point marksmen at the point like Mo Williams...WHOOPS!

[DatDudeD]

This is why pace and role has a lot to do with how we perceive a player. Aldridge is looking better than Bosh right now. When Bosh was the man, no one would even argue, Bosh is the better player.

I think Bosh is better than Aldridge. Look at the stats though. The Heat are still figuring things out. The overreaction threads are really immature.

It takes a couple months of basketball before we see what teams are really made of.

I am thinking that is what it is, the season is still young and it takes time. I also do believe that his weaknesses are more upfront because of what they need in miams (rebounding and tough defense).

[ginobli2311]

I am thinking that is what it is, the season is still young and it takes time. I also do believe that his weaknesses are more upfront because of what they need in miams (rebounding and tough defense).

of course he will get better. for his sake i hope so.

but the fact remains that a guy like reggie evans would simply bring more to the table than bosh. but most of ish misunderstands the game so badly that stuff like this is never talked about.

is bosh the better overall player? of course. but reggie evans is a far better fit than bosh in miami.

bosh is not going to reshape his entire game....he couldnt even if he wanted to.

[ILLsmak]

Yeah, it's funny because I'm sure Bosh went in thinking there would be no pressure on him, but in fact he's going to have the most pressure. He's the one that is going to have to do the most with the least touches. If a big man eats them, which is bound to happen a lot, it's going to go on Bosh even though that's unfair.

Rebounding, sure that's fair, but does it really matter that much? The could have used some offensive rebounds. One he got, that I saw, and got fouled on so it didn't count as a rebound.

I think it's just sad that you guys thought Bosh was going to come in here and dominate. He's got no help in the front court, so I don't know how you can blame him for their inside troubles.

I think the problem lies with everyone having huge expectations of Bosh like he was a superstar, but he's not! You should be glad to have an extra player like Bosh who MIGHT do something worthwhile after gathering the (arguably, but not much) two best players in the game.

Bosh is not a dominant rebounder (despite what stats might say) and Bosh was not a dominant defensive player (not that anyone thought he was), and yet you guys expect him to do that? Really? I think the game he played tonight (minus the 1 rebound thing lol) was pretty decent. If he's getting 15+ points on 50+% shooting, then you guys are gonna be tough to beat.

Why is nobody blaming Wade for turning the ball over when they need a good shot? Or for passing up a good shot to get the ball to House for a bad shot at the buzzer? Or Wade for jacking a bad 3. Or having 7 turnovers.

From what I saw (And I only saw the comeback part), it wasn't like Wade and LeBron were taking over, they were marching to the FT line.

Looking at the play by play, it seems that Wade made that one 3 (Which was a horrible shot IMO but he did make it...) with 4:13 to play. And that was the last shot he made. Sure, he did get fouled on that 3, but you guys act like Bosh was the one that held them back when, really, he was the only one that stepped up and made a shot.

Whatever happened before that point doesn't matter. In clutch time, there was plenty of chance for Wade or LeBron to step up and win the game, but they didn't do it.

The blame goes equally on all 3, period. Not buying that it's Bosh's fault at all.

-Smak

[BrentISballin]

Pat riley really needs to figure out a way to get Blake Griffen , maybe he can sacrifice Bosh to the devil , who knows.

Having Blake at the 4 , Miller at the 2 and Haslem at the 5 would be ridiculous . Then let wade run point and Lebron go to the 3 :)

[ginobli2311]

Yeah, it's funny because I'm sure Bosh went in thinking there would be no pressure on him, but in fact he's going to have the most pressure. He's the one that is going to have to do the most with the least touches. If a big man eats them, which is bound to happen a lot, it's going to go on Bosh even though that's unfair.

Rebounding, sure that's fair, but does it really matter that much? The could have used some offensive rebounds. One he got, that I saw, and got fouled on so it didn't count as a rebound.

I think it's just sad that you guys thought Bosh was going to come in here and dominate. He's got no help in the front court, so I don't know how you can blame him for their inside troubles.

I think the problem lies with everyone having huge expectations of Bosh like he was a superstar, but he's not! You should be glad to have an extra player like Bosh who MIGHT do something worthwhile after gathering the (arguably, but not much) two best players in the game.

Bosh is not a dominant rebounder (despite what stats might say) and Bosh was not a dominant defensive player (not that anyone thought he was), and yet you guys expect him to do that? Really? I think the game he played tonight (minus the 1 rebound thing lol) was pretty decent. If he's getting 15+ points on 50+% shooting, then you guys are gonna be tough to beat.

Why is nobody blaming Wade for turning the ball over when they need a good shot? Or for passing up a good shot to get the ball to House for a bad shot at the buzzer? Or Wade for jacking a bad 3. Or having 7 turnovers.

From what I saw (And I only saw the comeback part), it wasn't like Wade and LeBron were taking over, they were marching to the FT line.

Looking at the play by play, it seems that Wade made that one 3 (Which was a horrible shot IMO but he did make it...) with 4:13 to play. And that was the last shot he made. Sure, he did get fouled on that 3, but you guys act like Bosh was the one that held them back when, really, he was the only one that stepped up and made a shot.

Whatever happened before that point doesn't matter. In clutch time, there was plenty of chance for Wade or LeBron to step up and win the game, but they didn't do it.

The blame goes equally on all 3, period. Not buying that it's Bosh's fault at all.

-Smak


everything you say is spot on. but as a power forward/big....you can't play like bosh has so far. its on him or the heat will simply trade him if he doesn't step up his game.

pat riley is not going to watch 115 million dollars of shit out there with bosh getting destroyed by west and okafor.

its on everyone on the heat. but the fact remains that in order to win the heat need someone on the front line to board and protect the rim. they don't have that player. and the reality is that bosh is hurting this team...not helping it.

you don't blame bosh....but the problem is that bosh is not half as good as people think. you even said he was over-rated. so bascially you are saying...its not bosh's fault that he's not that great and can't board or defend. he's not good enough to be the main guy on a team....but he's not good if he's not getting a ton of touches all the time. so what is his value then? seems to me like he's only valuable if you have a really bad team. sucks for heat fans....but get used to games like this.

[BallsOut]

everything you say is spot on. but as a power forward/big....you can't play like bosh has so far. its on him or the heat will simply trade him if he doesn't step up his game.

pat riley is not going to watch 115 million dollars of shit out there with bosh getting destroyed by west and okafor.

its on everyone on the heat. but the fact remains that in order to win the heat need someone on the front line to board and protect the rim. they don't have that player. and the reality is that bosh is hurting this team...not helping it.

you don't blame bosh....but the problem is that bosh is not half as good as people think. you even said he was over-rated. so bascially you are saying...its not bosh's fault that he's not that great and can't board or defend. he's not good enough to be the main guy on a team....but he's not good if he's not getting a ton of touches all the time. so what is his value then? seems to me like he's only valuable if you have a really bad team. sucks for heat fans....but get used to games like this.

The Heat didn't bring Bosh in for defense. He was never known to be a good defender. They brought him in for offense presumably. He can give you 20 points still. It's just he doesn't get touches since Wade/Lebron dominate the ball so much.

If you want Bosh to be effective, start giving him the ball. Otherwise you're just wasting his talent.

Okafor is a C btw. Bosh is a PF. If you're going to put the blame solely on one guy, try one of Miami's centers.

[ILLsmak]

everything you say is spot on. but as a power forward/big....you can't play like bosh has so far. its on him or the heat will simply trade him if he doesn't step up his game.

pat riley is not going to watch 115 million dollars of shit out there with bosh getting destroyed by west and okafor.

its on everyone on the heat. but the fact remains that in order to win the heat need someone on the front line to board and protect the rim. they don't have that player. and the reality is that bosh is hurting this team...not helping it.

you don't blame bosh....but the problem is that bosh is not half as good as people think. you even said he was over-rated. so bascially you are saying...its not bosh's fault that he's not that great and can't board or defend. he's not good enough to be the main guy on a team....but he's not good if he's not getting a ton of touches all the time. so what is his value then? seems to me like he's only valuable if you have a really bad team. sucks for heat fans....but get used to games like this.

I think that it's true, but not for this game. I think all things considered he did a good job in that game (lol, even though I didn't watch the part where they were getting clobbered...) That's all I'm saying. He was absolutely trash vs Boston, though.

He's a good player. Maybe not a legit all-star, but he's better than a lot of players in the NBA at PF that you'd consider good. Definitely a player that would start on most teams. It's their job to involve him in the offense, too, Wade and LeBron get the ball in their hands and they create their own shots, but how much are they trying to set up Bosh in positions to succeed?

I know it sucks that Bosh only got 1 rebound, but it's not like they got killed on the boards. They got killed vs NJ but it didn't matter. They need a space eating player. I bet if they started Z (who isn't a great defensive rebounder, but is an amazing offensive rebounder), that the rebounding would improve and Bosh would rebound better, too. You can't start someone like Joel Anthony and expect to dominate inside. Sure, Joel goes hard for what he's got to work with, but he is the starting C, not Bosh, even though he's not playing huge minutes. They need to get someone decent to pair with Bosh in the front court.

I was laughing at Bosh because I really dislike him, but now I feel sorry for him because he has become a scapegoat, and that's not fair.

You know, it's funny they had a chance to sign Damp or Shaq and they didn't. So stupid...

-Smak

[west]

I'm think how good the Heat would be if they have KG instead.

[ginobli2311]

The Heat didn't bring Bosh in for defense. He was never known to be a good defender. They brought him in for offense presumably. He can give you 20 points still. It's just he doesn't get touches since Wade/Lebron dominate the ball so much.

If you want Bosh to be effective, start giving him the ball. Otherwise you're just wasting his talent.

Okafor is a C btw. Bosh is a PF. If you're going to put the blame solely on one guy, try one of Miami's centers.

i totally agree. the problem though is that they didn't bring him in to play horrid post defense and horrid pick and roll defense....which is what he is doing. they also didn't bring him in to grab 1 board.

a lot of blame should go on miami. but we all knew bosh would be to change his game. looks like he hasn't yet....and i question whether he can do the things this team needs him to.

again. you can't get into transition if you don't get stops. and you can't get stops if your team relies on bosh and joel anthony to protect the paint and board. those are the facts.

[NoGunzJustSkillz]

And what?

you still didn't tell me how many contenders have the Lakers played yet?

I know what the Lakers are all about but I want to see this Lakers team face a contender and not garbage teams every other night.....and as soon as the Lakers blow out a garbage team people are ready to praise the Lakers as if the Lakers where really gonna lose.
lakers have been to 3 finals in a row, what else do you fcking want? you think it's a coincidence they're undefeated?

[Harison]

I'm think how good the Heat would be if they have KG instead.
Any team would be better with KG, but since Heat have no chance getting him, what realistically they could sign? I dont see anyone worthy of attention at this moment, but with Bosh trade on the table, Heat could get someone very decent.

[ginobli2311]

I think that it's true, but not for this game. I think all things considered he did a good job in that game (lol, even though I didn't watch the part where they were getting clobbered...) That's all I'm saying. He was absolutely trash vs Boston, though.

He's a good player. Maybe not a legit all-star, but he's better than a lot of players in the NBA at PF that you'd consider good. Definitely a player that would start on most teams. It's their job to involve him in the offense, too, Wade and LeBron get the ball in their hands and they create their own shots, but how much are they trying to set up Bosh in positions to succeed?

I know it sucks that Bosh only got 1 rebound, but it's not like they got killed on the boards. They got killed vs NJ but it didn't matter. They need a space eating player. I bet if they started Z (who isn't a great defensive rebounder, but is an amazing offensive rebounder), that the rebounding would improve and Bosh would rebound better, too. You can't start someone like Joel Anthony and expect to dominate inside. Sure, Joel goes hard for what he's got to work with, but he is the starting C, not Bosh, even though he's not playing huge minutes. They need to get someone decent to pair with Bosh in the front court.

I was laughing at Bosh because I really dislike him, but now I feel sorry for him because he has become a scapegoat, and that's not fair.

You know, it's funny they had a chance to sign Damp or Shaq and they didn't. So stupid...

-Smak

right. once again i totally agree. my point is that while everything you say about bosh being a good player is true. he's not really adding anything to this team because of his style. you can't give bosh a lot of touches because he simply is not good enough to be a go to guy consistently on a championship team. he's just not.

the heat would be far better with reggie evans playing for bosh. bosh is a far better overall player. that is my whole point. i don't blame bosh.....in the right situation he can be very good. but unfortunatley bosh can really only be great on a bad team. that is why i fell bosh is the most over-rated player in the league and i've been saying this for years.

[BlueandGold]

any amount of money you want...i'll take that action and give you +300

lol @ this fanboy making conclusions after 6 games into the regular season. The 99 spurs started out 11-11 or something along those lines and then finished with the championship. Reason: it takes more than 5 or even 10 games for players of that magnitude who have basically been in 1 system their entire career to gel together.

[ginobli2311]

lol @ this fanboy making conclusions after 6 games into the regular season. The 99 spurs started out 11-11 or something along those lines and then finished with the championship. Reason: it takes more than 5 or even 10 games for players of that magnitude who have basically been in 1 system their entire career to gel together.

ok. say what you want. you can hammer me if i'm wrong. the heat will not win. you way they will. we'll see who is right at the end of the year.

[Harison]

in the right situation he can be very good.
Problem is, his right situation is Toronto :oldlol: I think in due course of time he'll do better in Heat, but he is definitely not the frontcourt cornerstone Heat desperately needs.

[branslowski]

Bosh should have joined Kobe in LA...Def would put up better numbers with a guy who would smack the softness out of him....

[ginobli2311]

Problem is, his right situation is Toronto :oldlol: I think in due course of time he'll do better in Heat, but he is definitely not the frontcourt cornerstone Heat desperately needs.

yep. that is my point. bosh will look great on a bad team. but if you put him on a very good team he is just not going to look nearly as good. plain and simple. he needs a bad team to be good. you can't win it all with him as your main guy. so his value just really isn't very high.

[ginobli2311]

Bosh should have joined Kobe in LA...Def would put up better numbers with a guy who would smack the softness out of him....

he might put up better numbers...but the lakers arent winning anything with bosh instead of gasol. even you know that brah.

[Harison]

yep. that is my point. bosh will look great on a bad team. but if you put him on a very good team he is just not going to look nearly as good. plain and simple. he needs a bad team to be good. you can't win it all with him as your main guy. so his value just really isn't very high.
Exactly. By the way, same applies to Amare, he wouldnt do any better on the Heat instead of Bosh. Maybe slightly better, but their major weaknesses are the same.

[Rowe]

Any team would be better with KG, but since Heat have no chance getting him, what realistically they could sign? I dont see anyone worthy of attention at this moment, but with Bosh trade on the table, Heat could get someone very decent.

Who could they get for Bosh?

It seems like once guys sign that big contract suddenly their value isnt the same.

[BlueandGold]

he might put up better numbers...but the lakers arent winning anything with bosh instead of gasol. even you know that brah.

lol hyping up Gasol to downplay Kobe, you need to come up with a new routine =/. Gasol and Bosh have nearly identical careers before they joined up in LA and Miami respectively. Both were on 1st-round exit caliber small-market teams and had nearly identical if not similar numbers. Bosh even had better scoring numbers. Like it's just somehow a coincidence that Gasol started to blossom right after he joined LA, right?

[ginobli2311]

lol hyping up Gasol to downplay Kobe, you need to come up with a new routine =/. Gasol and Bosh have nearly identical careers before they joined up in LA and Miami respectively. Both were on 1st-round exit caliber small-market teams and had nearly identical if not similar numbers. Bosh even had better scoring numbers. Like it's just somehow a coincidence that Gasol started to blossom right after he joined LA, right?

once again you people need to stop judging players on "resume'

only a ****ing retard that does not watch the games thinks that bosh = gasol.

its laughable. flat out laughable. this has nothing to do with kobe. gasol is one of my favorite players and he is head and shoulders better than bosh. hell....i'm not sure gasol is any worse than howard at this point...he's that good.

watch the games dude. ****ing "resume" bull shit is so old hat.

[KobeKlutch]

So everyone thinks Bosh is a scrub now?

Could it be that his teammates are not looking for him.

[branslowski]

lol hyping up Gasol to downplay Kobe, you need to come up with a new routine =/. Gasol and Bosh have nearly identical careers before they joined up in LA and Miami respectively. Both were on 1st-round exit caliber small-market teams and had nearly identical if not similar numbers. Bosh even had better scoring numbers. Like it's just somehow a coincidence that Gasol started to blossom right after he joined LA, right?

Umm...I agree that dude hypes up our players to "try" to diminish Kobe (which he thinks works, but only in his world)....But seriously....Gasol>>>>Bosh...Please don't compare that puss to Gasol ever again..

Maybe if Bosh got to play with Kobe, he would become mentally tough...But he's in Miami...So, he doesn't have a leader to be afraid of...Doubt LeBron or Wade smacks Bosh in the head when they feel he's playing soft....Just little things that are bigger than the stat book.

[Rowe]

Exactly. By the way, same applies to Amare, he wouldnt do any better on the Heat instead of Bosh. Maybe slightly better, but their major weaknesses are the same.
The same doesn't apply to Amare.

Amare has been a good player on good teams his entire career. Bosh had been the #1 option on Lottery bound Raptors teams for basically his entire career.

Bosh & Amare aren't similar as players.

Amare is tougher than Bosh.
Amare is stronger than Bosh.
Amare is a better defender than Bosh.
Amare is more clutch in crunch time than Bosh.

If you put Amare on a bad team, he will turn it into a better team. Hes a winner and he expects that much more from his teammates. The prime example is the role he has taken on in New York. Hes doing whatever it takes for the team to win, even if that means calling for isolations 10 feet out from the basket.

If you put Amare in Miami, they're a much better team. Amare can and has played a lot of Center when it matters. He would be the low post option they need. He likes to get his buckets around the basket and if LeBron or Wade can set him up, there isn't any problem. Bosh isn't that type of player. Bosh is in the mold of Dirk. You feed him the ball 10 feet out and let him take his shots and get to the Free Throw line. That style of play just doesn't fit at all with Wade/Bron.

[ginobli2311]

So everyone thinks Bosh is a scrub now?

Could it be that his teammates are not looking for him.

nobody thinks he is a scrub. he's just not nearly as good as anyone on here was saying over the last few years. i've been saying it for years.

what do you do with bosh. if you give him the ball a lot, he'll put up pretty good numbers, but you have no chance to win because he's simply not a cornerstone type player. but if you don't give him the ball a lot he's not very good because he doesn't defend or protect the rim or board real well against other bigs.

so what is his value? i keep asking this. what is this guy's value? he's not good enough to be a cornerstone on a title team....and he has little impact if he's not given a ton of touches. seems to me like he has little to no value for legit title teams.....and certainly has little value to this heat team.

[Rowe]

So everyone thinks Bosh is a scrub now?

Could it be that his teammates are not looking for him.

Bosh isn't a scrub. He just isn't effective without an offense built around him. Him transitioning into a role player rather than a #1 option hinders his effectiveness on the court.

Bosh is talented, but I've always viewed him in the same category as guys like Randolph & Jamison rather than Elite PF's like Duncan, Gasol, Dirk, Amare, KG.

[ginobli2311]

Umm...I agree that dude hypes up our players to "try" to diminish Kobe (which he thinks works, but only in his world)....But seriously....Gasol>>>>Bosh...Please don't compare that puss to Gasol ever again..

Maybe if Bosh got to play with Kobe, he would become mentally tough...But he's in Miami...So, he doesn't have a leader to be afraid of...Doubt LeBron or Wade smacks Bosh in the head when they feel he's playing soft....Just little things that are bigger than the stat book.

sorry dude. has nothing to do with kobe. just because gasol is ****ing awesome has nothing to with kobe. just because i think bosh is way over-rated has nothing to do with kobe.

do you people watch gasol and bosh play? i guess you do because you realize how much better gasol is....but i don't think many people on here every really watched bosh play.

and how could any of you anyway? he played in toronto on horrid teams that were never in the playoffs for 7 years. are you people really using league pass to watch raptors games every night? i seriously doubt that. i've followed bosh very closely his entire career because he's from Dallas...I grew up in Plano and i'm the same age and played high school ball when he played.

i just don't think anyone on here has seen him play half as much as i have. you people see box scores and thing he's amazing. watch him play this year and you will see why i've been so hard on him.

[BlueandGold]

Umm...I agree that dude hypes up our players to "try" to diminish Kobe (which he thinks works, but only in his world)....But seriously....Gasol>>>>Bosh...Please don't compare that puss to Gasol ever again..

Maybe if Bosh got to play with Kobe, he would become mentally tough...But he's in Miami...So, he doesn't have a leader to be afraid of...Doubt LeBron or Wade smacks Bosh in the head when they feel he's playing soft....Just little things that are bigger than the stat book.

rofl your saying that now but compare them with Gasol was in Memphis and Bosh was in toronto and it's a different story. lol @ you missing my point all together =/

[Rowe]

nobody thinks he is a scrub. he's just not nearly as good as anyone on here was saying over the last few years. i've been saying it for years.

what do you do with bosh. if you give him the ball a lot, he'll put up pretty good numbers, but you have no chance to win because he's simply not a cornerstone type player. but if you don't give him the ball a lot he's not very good because he doesn't defend or protect the rim or board real well against other bigs.

so what is his value? i keep asking this. what is this guy's value? he's not good enough to be a cornerstone on a title team....and he has little impact if he's not given a ton of touches. seems to me like he has little to no value for legit title teams.....and certainly has little value to this heat team.

Hes the ideal #2 option for a good but not great team. That way he gets his touches, but isn't as relied on as heavily to be the Franchise player.

Unfortunately for Bosh, he picked going to Miami knowing he'd be the 3rd wheel forced to be their only low post option instead of going to Chicago.

Lets be real, Bosh would've been a perfect for Chicago. Noah makes up for everything Bosh lacks in toughness, passion, & defense.

[ginobli2311]

Hes the ideal #2 option for a good but not great team. That way he gets his touches, but isn't as relied on as heavily to be the Franchise player.

Unfortunately for Bosh, he picked going to Miami knowing he'd be the 3rd wheel forced to be their only low post option instead of going to Chicago.

Lets be real, Bosh would've been a perfect for Chicago. Noah makes up for everything Bosh lacks in toughness, passion, & defense.

yep. funny i was just going to say that. the bulls are the only team in the league in which bosh could be the 2nd best player and win a title. because of noah and gibson.

[branslowski]

sorry dude. has nothing to do with kobe. just because gasol is ****ing awesome has nothing to with kobe. just because i think bosh is way over-rated has nothing to do with kobe.

do you people watch gasol and bosh play? i guess you do because you realize how much better gasol is....but i don't think many people on here every really watched bosh play.

and how could any of you anyway? he played in toronto on horrid teams that were never in the playoffs for 7 years. are you people really using league pass to watch raptors games every night? i seriously doubt that. i've followed bosh very closely his entire career because he's from Dallas...I grew up in Plano and i'm the same age and played high school ball when he played.

i just don't think anyone on here has seen him play half as much as i have. you people see box scores and thing he's amazing. watch him play this year and you will see why i've been so hard on him.

Ginobli...Every NBA fan watches a mutliple All-Star player....Bosh is a sick player...20/8 type player...But is just too soft for my taste...Needs a leader to show him the way....

Everyone also knows how good Gasol is...Just that some ppl with obvious agendas takes it a little too extreme...Dude has never made it to an All-NBA team untill playing with Kobe...No MVP votes, exc....Yet you put him in your Top 10 players of the decade...:facepalm ....And I f*cking love Pau...MVP of the league imo so far..

With the agenda thing...It isn't just you or Kobe haters....I also see Kobe stans turning Pippen into King Tut...They all deny they are pushing agendas...But common sense knows better...Kobe fan in every Jordan thread pumping up Pippen...Obvious whats going on...Same for non Kobe/Laker in every Laker/Kobe related thread talking about Kobe more than he/she does with her own team....Ben on these type of boards long enough to know whats going on.

[alenleomessi]

You all forgot that Okafor was actually above average player for Bobcats and won ROY against Howard
CP3 makes everything better

[ginobli2311]

Ginobli...Every NBA fan watches a mutliple All-Star player....Bosh is a sick player...20/8 type player...But is just too soft for my taste...Needs a leader to show him the way....

Everyone also knows how good Gasol is...Just that some ppl with obvious agendas takes it a little too extreme...Dude has never made it to an All-NBA team untill playing with Kobe...No MVP votes, exc....Yet you put him in your Top 10 players of the decade...:facepalm ....And I f*cking love Pau...MVP of the league imo so far..

With the agenda thing...It isn't just you or Kobe haters....I also see Kobe stans turning Pippen into King Tut...They all deny they are pushing agendas...But common sense knows better...Kobe fan in every Jordan thread pumping up Pippen...Obvious whats going on...Same for non Kobe/Laker in every Laker/Kobe related thread talking about Kobe more than he/she does with her own team....Ben on these type of boards long enough to know whats going on.


we just disagree on everything dude. of course gasol was being overlooked. he played in memphis and he is a tim duncan type boring player that offers no highlights. why would people pay a ton of attention to him? of course he's improved over time. the the 2003 to 2005 kobe is half the player the current player kobe is today.

players get better dude. you act like me putting gasol in the top 10 players of the last ten years is absurd or something. he's either top ten or right on the fringe. you can't discount what he did in memphis and what he has helped turn the lakers into. the fact remains that if pau gasol offered more highlights he would be talked about as a far greater player.....thats a fact

there is no agenda. you have the agenda. i just state the honest truth. kobe is one of the best players ever...but he's over-rated a bit on here. just like bosh. putting bosh and gasol in the same category as players is laughable. if that is the case then kobe and paul pierce are in the same category.

if you really have watched both of them play. you know damn well that gasol is a far superior player on both ends. he's just a winner....he knows how play the game well. do you realize how important gasol's passing is for the lakers to win? bosh simply couldn't make 10 percent of those passes. or how about gasol's ability to get easy baskets on quick post ups before the defense can hunker down. bosh can't do that either.

back to kobe and gasol together. they need eachother. obviously kobe is the better player. but you can't discount what gasol is and how vital he has been to winning. you say gasol didn't matter in memphis.....how was kobe doing in LA without gasol mate? he was begging for a trade and getting trounced in the playoffs. i could sit here and say the only reason kobe gets the GOAT comparisons is because of gasol....because kobe wasn't winning shit without gasol the last 3 years.

nobody is saying gasol is top ten all time. i just find it very funny that even lakers fun laugh at the idea the gasol is starting to turn into an elite big of all time. its not an agenda. i think the lakers on paper are much much better than the heat on paper. thats not an agenda...its just how i feel. just like if kobe plays an amazing game....i give him his credit. that goes for every player. my favorite player is dirk....but that doesn't mean i have to be blinded by the truth that he's not quite on the kg/malone/barkley level all time...even though i want him to be. that doesn't mean i can't just watch and evaluate players that i love or hate.

i don't hate kobe at all. i just don't like that the media/ish/public have started to really over-rate him. he won player of the decade on tnt fan voting in a land slide over shaq and duncan. that is laughable. duncan and shaq were simply much better players.

but i think its funny that you think in a thread about bosh i have an agenda about kobe. my feelings on bosh have nothing to do with kobe. if chris bosh was on the lakers i would be saying the exact same thing. although bosh with bynum would actually be good....not gasol/bynum...but if bynum was healthy then bosh could flourish a bit. but you can't try to make every single thing that some people write about kobe. it gets annoying.

my comments were strictly about why bosh is over-rated and why he brings little to the table for the heat. the fact remains that reggie evans would be a better option for the heat. that is exactly what they need out of the 4 position. obviously they need a better center as well.....but i just don't see what bosh gives them or really any title team.

again...its not about kobe. i think derek fisher is one of the most under appreciated playoff players of the decade. its not about kobe. its just how i feel. there are only a handful of players in the league i'd want on the floor over fisher with 6 minutes left in a close playoff game. that has nothing to do with kobe mate. you have to give some of these other guys credit from time to time.....they did just carry the lakers in game 7 in the nba finals while kobe had one of his worst games ever.

we know you love kobe. and that is fine. he's an all time great and top ten in my book. but don't think that everyone has to feel the same way you do. and certainly don't pretend that kobe is some dominant force that is clearly better than the likes of wade or lebron currently. its just not the case.

i know ish is kobeville. but it really needs to stop. keep kobe in the kobe threads. don't hate on me for calling out bosh for a long time now. i told everyone here it would be like this. looks like i'm right so far. and don't hate on me because i told you how good gasol was. when i listed my top ten of the decade i said some of it had to do with where i thought the players would finish by the end of their careers. and i feel more comfortable with my ranking of gasol now more than ever. he's elevated his game to new heights and in my opinion should have won finals mvp. regardless....he outplayed the celtics front line in that series and it was really the key to the series. big props to gasol....he's just a much better player than bosh currently...end of story mate.

[SAKOTXA]

http://chzgifs.files.wordpress.com/2010/11/loveneverworksp1.gif

[kentatm]

So I guess Bosh is going to be the scapegoat when Miami loses :oldlol:


he was always going to be the scapegoat.

Of the big three, who are the two with the national marketing campaigns? Bosh will always be the one to get crapped on if things go poorly in Miami simply b/c Wade and LeBron were already superstars while Bosh is practically unknown outside of NBA fans. Its all about the money.



as for Bosh vs Gasol.

Gasol is CLEARLY better. Gasol was leading a mediocre Memphis squad to 50 win seasons and into the playoffs in the stacked West while Bosh was having trouble just getting Toronto into the playoffs in a 3-4 team East.

Bosh is barely (if even) a top 5 PF in this last decade let alone a top ten player.

[DeronMillsap]

we just disagree on everything dude. of course gasol was being overlooked. he played in memphis and he is a tim duncan type boring player that offers no highlights. why would people pay a ton of attention to him? of course he's improved over time. the the 2003 to 2005 kobe is half the player the current player kobe is today.

players get better dude. you act like me putting gasol in the top 10 players of the last ten years is absurd or something. he's either top ten or right on the fringe. you can't discount what he did in memphis and what he has helped turn the lakers into. the fact remains that if pau gasol offered more highlights he would be talked about as a far greater player.....thats a fact

there is no agenda. you have the agenda. i just state the honest truth. kobe is one of the best players ever...but he's over-rated a bit on here. just like bosh. putting bosh and gasol in the same category as players is laughable. if that is the case then kobe and paul pierce are in the same category.

if you really have watched both of them play. you know damn well that gasol is a far superior player on both ends. he's just a winner....he knows how play the game well. do you realize how important gasol's passing is for the lakers to win? bosh simply couldn't make 10 percent of those passes. or how about gasol's ability to get easy baskets on quick post ups before the defense can hunker down. bosh can't do that either.

back to kobe and gasol together. they need eachother. obviously kobe is the better player. but you can't discount what gasol is and how vital he has been to winning. you say gasol didn't matter in memphis.....how was kobe doing in LA without gasol mate? he was begging for a trade and getting trounced in the playoffs. i could sit here and say the only reason kobe gets the GOAT comparisons is because of gasol....because kobe wasn't winning shit without gasol the last 3 years.

nobody is saying gasol is top ten all time. i just find it very funny that even lakers fun laugh at the idea the gasol is starting to turn into an elite big of all time. its not an agenda. i think the lakers on paper are much much better than the heat on paper. thats not an agenda...its just how i feel. just like if kobe plays an amazing game....i give him his credit. that goes for every player. my favorite player is dirk....but that doesn't mean i have to be blinded by the truth that he's not quite on the kg/malone/barkley level all time...even though i want him to be. that doesn't mean i can't just watch and evaluate players that i love or hate.

i don't hate kobe at all. i just don't like that the media/ish/public have started to really over-rate him. he won player of the decade on tnt fan voting in a land slide over shaq and duncan. that is laughable. duncan and shaq were simply much better players.

but i think its funny that you think in a thread about bosh i have an agenda about kobe. my feelings on bosh have nothing to do with kobe. if chris bosh was on the lakers i would be saying the exact same thing. although bosh with bynum would actually be good....not gasol/bynum...but if bynum was healthy then bosh could flourish a bit. but you can't try to make every single thing that some people write about kobe. it gets annoying.

my comments were strictly about why bosh is over-rated and why he brings little to the table for the heat. the fact remains that reggie evans would be a better option for the heat. that is exactly what they need out of the 4 position. obviously they need a better center as well.....but i just don't see what bosh gives them or really any title team.

again...its not about kobe. i think derek fisher is one of the most under appreciated playoff players of the decade. its not about kobe. its just how i feel. there are only a handful of players in the league i'd want on the floor over fisher with 6 minutes left in a close playoff game. that has nothing to do with kobe mate. you have to give some of these other guys credit from time to time.....they did just carry the lakers in game 7 in the nba finals while kobe had one of his worst games ever.

we know you love kobe. and that is fine. he's an all time great and top ten in my book. but don't think that everyone has to feel the same way you do. and certainly don't pretend that kobe is some dominant force that is clearly better than the likes of wade or lebron currently. its just not the case.

i know ish is kobeville. but it really needs to stop. keep kobe in the kobe threads. don't hate on me for calling out bosh for a long time now. i told everyone here it would be like this. looks like i'm right so far. and don't hate on me because i told you how good gasol was. when i listed my top ten of the decade i said some of it had to do with where i thought the players would finish by the end of their careers. and i feel more comfortable with my ranking of gasol now more than ever. he's elevated his game to new heights and in my opinion should have won finals mvp. regardless....he outplayed the celtics front line in that series and it was really the key to the series. big props to gasol....he's just a much better player than bosh currently...end of story mate.

Holy sh*t! :oldlol: Somebody should hire you to blog about basketball.

[ginobli2311]

oh...and you want to talk about agenda? LOL

how about you saying that bosh is not mentally tough but if he played in LA he would be because of kobe. LOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOL.

The second gasol came to LA they were title contenders....did kobe reach inside his brain and make him mentally tough in one night?

for christ sake dude you need to come back to reality. the lakers loss in 08 to the celtics had way more to do with kobe. if kobe can't be the best player vs. paul pierce.....the lakers can't win....and they didnt. at least gasol was going up against the likes of perkins and kg. kobe couldn't do shit against ray allen or pierce. LOLOLOLOLOL.

This right here is why i hate lakers/kobe fans. you make comments like kobe is responsible for making gasol good. he was already ****ing awesome when he came. its just a natural progression to get better after being battle tested. its why poppovich said "people have no idea just how good gasol is....its going to be unfair for the league" LOLOLOLOLOL...he said that right after the trade

but her's a fact Branslowski Brah.....the lakers needed kobe to be the best player on the floor in 08 in the finals. AND HE WASN'T DUDE. HE WASN'T AS GOOD AS PIERCE OR KG IN THE SERIES. ****ing deal with it. stop insinuating that gasol's toughness was the main reason for the loss. that is a joke. the main reason for the loss was that kobe couldn't do shit against the celtics...plain and simple. damn i hate kobe stans. such a ****ing joke.

[SAKOTXA]

Holy sh*t! :oldlol: Somebody should hire you to blog about basketball.
Quality > quantity. He can't form a grammatically correct sentence to save his life.

[ginobli2311]

Quality > quantity. He can't form a grammatically correct sentence to save his life.

i can but this its easier this way.

[SAKOTXA]

oh...and you want to talk about agenda? LOL

how about you saying that bosh is not mentally tough but if he played in LA he would be because of kobe. LOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOL.

The second gasol came to LA they were title contenders....did kobe reach inside his brain and make him mentally tough in one night?

for christ sake dude you need to come back to reality. the lakers loss in 08 to the celtics had way more to do with kobe. if kobe can't be the best player vs. paul pierce.....the lakers can't win....and they didnt. at least gasol was going up against the likes of perkins and kg. kobe couldn't do shit against ray allen or pierce. LOLOLOLOLOL.

This right here is why i hate lakers/kobe fans. you make comments like kobe is responsible for making gasol good. he was already ****ing awesome when he came. its just a natural progression to get better after being battle tested. its why poppovich said "people have no idea just how good gasol is....its going to be unfair for the league" LOLOLOLOLOL...he said that right after the trade

but her's a fact Branslowski Brah.....the lakers needed kobe to be the best player on the floor in 08 in the finals. AND HE WASN'T DUDE. HE WASN'T AS GOOD AS PIERCE OR KG IN THE SERIES. ****ing deal with it. stop insinuating that gasol's toughness was the main reason for the loss. that is a joke. the main reason for the loss was that kobe couldn't do shit against the celtics...plain and simple. damn i hate kobe stans. such a ****ing joke.
The Lakers were doing just fine, before Pau the trade. If my memory serves me correctly, we were 25-12 and were coming off a huge win against Phoenix.

[ginobli2311]

The Lakers were doing just fine, before Pau the trade. If my memory serves me correctly, we were 25-12 and were coming off a huge win against Phoenix.

oh they were, but they were not title contenders. proven by the simple fact that they got gasol and still didn't win.

[SAKOTXA]

oh they were, but they were not title contenders. proven by the simple fact that they got gasol and still didn't win.
It wasn't because Lakers weren't good enough to win it; our bench, that would give us great energy throughout the year, didn't show up in the finals. Bynum missing was also very heartbreaking. We still would have had a shot at a game 7, if we didn't choke in game 4.

[Scal]

In all honesty, Haslem is a better fit for this team than Bosh. Dude rebounds better and is a better defender, and doesn't need the ball (can catch a Wade/LeBron pass and knock down a mid range jumper, all that is needed).

As far as getting another of the big men from FA, I don't think it would have mattered too much who they got - none of them are great defenders (Bosh, Boozer, Amar'e, David Lee). Amar'e would be a better offensive option if the Heat ran pick and rolls, but Bosh should be good enough to go that anyway.

They would have been better if they could get a legit big man, and have Haslem at the 4, but honestly it probably ain't gonna matter too much anyway - the Heat are still gonna be tough to beat.

[ginobli2311]

It wasn't because Lakers weren't good enough to win it; our bench, that would give us great energy throughout the year, didn't show up in the finals. Bynum missing was also very heartbreaking. We still would have had a shot at a game 7, if we didn't choke in game 4.

true. but the fact remains that the lakers needed kobe to step up and play better. he did not. and thats the thing. if kobe is so much better than pierce and kg and ray allen and gasol....and all these guys. he should have been the clear cut best player and he should have taken over that series. but he didn't. and all the rest is just excuses because the team he had around him was definitely good enough to win it and he had the best coach ever on his side.

just flat out excuses. he couldn't take over in the finals. plain and simple. it what separates kobe from the likes of duncan and shaq. he can't dominate other great teams in the finals. he can't win when he doesn't have the clear cut best team. does that mean he sucks? of course not....but he simply can't do what the likes of shaq/duncan/hakeem/jordan...etc could do...and that is elevate his team and his play to get by really tough competition.

i mean a 40 point loss in an elimination game in the finals.....LOL...coming into the series as the favorite? LOL....you can blame gasol and the bench as much as you want....but it was actually kobe that came up the smallest....especially if you think kobe is an all time elite.

jordan didn't get outplayed by drexler in the 92 finals. if he had....the bulls would have lost. same thing should have been true for kobe in 08. but he did get outplayed....and the lakers lost. plain and simple.

[DeronMillsap]

It wasn't because Lakers weren't good enough to win it; our bench, that would give us great energy throughout the year, didn't show up in the finals. Bynum missing was also very heartbreaking. We still would have had a shot at a game 7, if we didn't choke in game 4.
Healthy Bynum wouldn't have done much against that 2008 Boston frontcourt.
I mean, even Powe had his way in one of those games.

And that Ginobili guy is right about Kobe's struggles against Boston. He actually tends to be not Kobe-like in most of his Finals games. Even the 2010 series, I think he only had 1 great performance, which was Game 5 and LA lost.

He's great in the playoffs but for some reason, he comes down to Earth in the Finals majority of the time.

[SAKOTXA]

true. but the fact remains that the lakers needed kobe to step up and play better. he did not. and thats the thing. if kobe is so much better than pierce and kg and ray allen and gasol....and all these guys. he should have been the clear cut best player and he should have taken over that series. but he didn't. and all the rest is just excuses because the team he had around him was definitely good enough to win it and he had the best coach ever on his side.

just flat out excuses. he couldn't take over in the finals. plain and simple. it what separates kobe from the likes of duncan and shaq. he can't dominate other great teams in the finals. he can't win when he doesn't have the clear cut best team. does that mean he sucks? of course not....but he simply can't do what the likes of shaq/duncan/hakeem/jordan...etc could do...and that is elevate his team and his play to get by really tough competition.

i mean a 40 point loss in an elimination game in the finals.....LOL...coming into the series as the favorite? LOL....you can blame gasol and the bench as much as you want....but it was actually kobe that came up the smallest....especially if you think kobe is an all time elite.

jordan didn't get outplayed by drexler in the 92 finals. if he had....the bulls would have lost. same thing should have been true for kobe in 08. but he did get outplayed....and the lakers lost. plain and simple.
All great defensive teams, such as the 2008 Celtics, force perimeter players to pass the ball out of double/triple teams. Kobe was the guy they concentrated on the most throughout the series. Gasol never showed up when he had to; Kobe tried giving him the ball in the low block, high post, spot up mid range shots, etc... I am not saying Kobe played great in the finals by any stretch, he clearly didn't perform when it mattered the most. In my candid opinion, Phil got embarrassingly out-coached in the finals that year. Doc Rivers had every antidote to whatever Phil threw at him. There were bad officiated games also, but blaming the refs would just be reaching for excuses. Although, KG's illegal screens got very irritating as the series developed. The bottom line is, Lakers weren't ready and they learned a thing or two from that physically punishing finals.

[SAKOTXA]

Healthy Bynum wouldn't have done much against that 2008 Boston frontcourt.
I mean, even Powe had his way in one of those games.

And that Ginobili guy is right about Kobe's struggles against Boston. He actually tends to be not Kobe-like in most of his Finals games. Even the 2010 series, I think he only had 1 great performance, which was Game 5 and LA lost.

He's great in the playoffs but for some reason, he comes down to Earth in the Finals majority of the time.
And that is why, he will never be better than Michael Jordan. :cheers:

[ginobli2311]

In all honesty, Haslem is a better fit for this team than Bosh. Dude rebounds better and is a better defender, and doesn't need the ball (can catch a Wade/LeBron pass and knock down a mid range jumper, all that is needed).

As far as getting another of the big men from FA, I don't think it would have mattered too much who they got - none of them are great defenders (Bosh, Boozer, Amar'e, David Lee). Amar'e would be a better offensive option if the Heat ran pick and rolls, but Bosh should be good enough to go that anyway.

They would have been better if they could get a legit big man, and have Haslem at the 4, but honestly it probably ain't gonna matter too much anyway - the Heat are still gonna be tough to beat.

there just aren't many good bigs on both ends in the league right now. bogut/howard/gasol/bynum/kg/perk/lopez/okafor/haywood/noah

some of those guys are a stretch. its just really hard to find solid bigs that can defend. i'm not saying the heat were dumb to get bosh. but they just have two glaring weaknesses now because they got him and had to pay so much for him. he does not address the pg problem or the big problem.

put it this way....if the heat had signed felton and signed haywood with the money they gave to bosh. nobody would be saying......"the heat are good, but they really need a jumpshooting power forward"

you see what i'm saying? think how good this team is:

felton/wade/lebron/haslem/haywood/miller/house/joel/arroyo/jones/z

now that is a legit team with no glaring weaknesses. still not a great front line....but much better. and felton would be a perfect fit at the guard spot. i would have done something like that if i was riley. but i don't think he knew lebron was coming so he had to sign bosh first i think.

[Harison]

The same doesn't apply to Amare.

Amare has been a good player on good teams his entire career. Bosh had been the #1 option on Lottery bound Raptors teams for basically his entire career.

Bosh & Amare aren't similar as players.

Every player is unique, but Bosh and Amare are as close as it can be. Both are average rebounders (Bosh is better), soft (dont even dare to speak of Amare as a tough guy, although he at least visits the post), good offensively and doesnt play defense (Bosh better though).

Dont you think Bosh would prosper if Nash would feed him the ball? Of course he would, he would do better than in Toronto. Amare without Nash dropped significantly. Bosh stats are obviously worse too, but he isnt 1st option, as 3rd option Amare would do just as bad.

I could even bet Bosh on Knicks would do better than Amare does now. Bottom line is, both Amare and Bosh sucks for the Heat.

[SAKOTXA]

Every player is unique, but Bosh and Amare are as close as it can be. Both are average rebounders (Bosh is better), soft (dont even dare to speak of Amare as a tough guy, although he at least visits the post), good offensively and doesnt play defense (Bosh better though).

Dont you think Bosh would prosper if Nash would feed him the ball? Of course he would, he would do better than in Toronto. Amare without Nash dropped significantly. Bosh stats are obviously worse too, but he isnt 1st option, as 3rd option Amare would do just as bad.

I could even bet Bosh on Knicks would do better than Amare does now. Bottom line is, both Amare and Bosh sucks for the Heat.
Let's bet.

[ginobli2311]

Every player is unique, but Bosh and Amare are as close as it can be. Both are average rebounders (Bosh is better), soft (dont even dare to speak of Amare as a tough guy, although he at least visits the post), good offensively and doesnt play defense (Bosh better though).

Dont you think Bosh would prosper if Nash would feed him the ball? Of course he would, he would do better than in Toronto. Amare without Nash dropped significantly. Bosh stats are obviously worse too, but he isnt 1st option, as 3rd option Amare would do just as bad.

I could even bet Bosh on Knicks would do better than Amare does now. Bottom line is, both Amare and Bosh sucks for the Heat.


i think you are under-rating amare a bit. i definitely think amare would be better in miami...not sure about the knicks. but next to nash? amare without question.

[knightfall88]

lebron and wade can't open up the paint up for the bigs which is something that Kobe excels out. Kobe is so aggressive and so dangerous from the mid-range that whether he makes or misses or even when he fighting for position - it opens up so many opportunities for Gasol, Odom and Bynum. How many times have you heard that a missed shot for kobe is basically a free layup for the front court?

[ginobli2311]

lebron and wade can't open up the paint up for the bigs which is something that Kobe excels out. Kobe is so aggressive and so dangerous from the mid-range that whether he makes or misses or even when he fighting for position - it opens up so many opportunities for Gasol, Odom and Bynum. How many times have you heard that a missed shot for kobe is basically a free layup for the front court?

i completely disagree. wade and lebron have to be doubled or shaded nearly every time they touch the ball. the problem is that bosh/anthony/z/haslem aren't good in the paint. they all prefer open 15 footers....well...other than anthony, but he's not a good finisher inside.

have you watched the heat play? they get so many open jumpers its insane. but sometimes you miss jumpers even if they are open...thats why they need an inside presence to at least get some offensive boards or score a few buckets from the low post.

kobe opens things up as well. but really its gasol/bynum/odom that just live in the paint. they are all great rebounders and gasol/odom have great chemistry with passing in the paint. bosh/anthony/z/haslem really struggle with passing the ball and its really hurting the offense of the heat.

[Harison]

Let's bet.
How? Magically transplant players? :oldlol:

Lets compare Knicks ('11) and Toronto ('10).

Knicks: PTS/G: 105.2 (7th of 30) ▪ Opp PTS/G: 100.2 (13th of 30)
SRS: 4.58 (8th of 30) ▪ Pace: 97.6 (6th of 30)
Off Rtg: 107.8 (11th of 30) ▪ Def Rtg: 102.7 (7th of 30)
Expected W-L: 3-2 (10th of 30)

Toronto: PTS/G: 104.1 (5th of 30) ▪ Opp PTS/G: 105.9 (27th of 30)
SRS: -1.83 (19th of 30) ▪ Pace: 93.1 (13th of 30)
Off Rtg: 111.3 (5th of 30) ▪ Def Rtg: 113.2 (30th of 30)
Expected W-L: 36-46 (19th of 30)

Of course its early for a decent comparison, but so far, Knicks look better as a team.

Bosh: 24.0/10.8/2.4 at TS% .592
Amare: 19.2/7.0/2.8 at TS% .493

And Amare still has a better PG than Bosh had in Toronto. If we swap Bosh to Knicks, we also should assume Bosh wont be playing center, roster adjustment for this. End result - its highly likely Bosh would maintain stats similar to Toronto, i.e. better than Amare.

[Harison]

i think you are under-rating amare a bit. i definitely think amare would be better in miami...not sure about the knicks. but next to nash? amare without question.

Bosh: 24.0/10.8/2.4 at TS% .592 ('10)
Amare: 23.1/8.9/1.0 at TS% .615 ('10)

As you can see, Bosh had slightly better stats, its reasonable to assume with Nash Bosh would do even better.

[ginobli2311]

Bosh: 24.0/10.8/2.4 at TS% .592 ('10)
Amare: 23.1/8.9/1.0 at TS% .615 ('10)

As you can see, Bosh had slightly better stats, its reasonable to assume with Nash Bosh would do even better.

thats not how it works. bosh is not a great pick and roll player. amare is. bosh would simply not benefit as much from nash because all bosh wants to do is get the ball 17 feet away...face up...take 10 seconds and either shoot or drive. he doesn't move well without the ball and he doesn't crash the boards. i don't care if magic johnson is throwing him the ball.....he's not going to benefit the same way a guy with great movement like amare would.

he's best off playing on a bad team that gives him the ball a ton. the problem is that he's not good enough to be one of the 2 best players on a title team. so his value plummets on a good team.

[Clocian-IGN]

bosh - 13 pts, 45% fg, 5.5 rebounds for 15 million

taj gibson - 15 pts, 64% fg, 6.2 rebounds for 1 million

sad bosh

[ILLsmak]

Bosh: 24.0/10.8/2.4 at TS% .592 ('10)
Amare: 23.1/8.9/1.0 at TS% .615 ('10)

As you can see, Bosh had slightly better stats, its reasonable to assume with Nash Bosh would do even better.

Amare would fit in much better because he could catch the ball moving towards the basket. Amare has some amazing hands and it would make a huge difference on that Miami team. He would have a bunch of 30 point games and probably average 20. Would he rebound and play D? No... but he's definitely a better offensive player in a system like Miami.

You saw how good LeBron looked dishing the ball to JJ Hickson, Amare is better. And they'd look for Amare because Amare doesn't need an iso and doesn't need a play. Plus almost all of Amare's scores would be an assist which would make their stats look better.

Bosh is probably the worst 'good big man' fit for Miami. It's hilarious that they ended up with "and Bosh." And everyone had such high hopes for him. I'm not saying he's not going to come around. He will, they will get him working and he will do alright. Miami is too good for him to not play well. They're not gonna trade Bosh, either. They can't, not after all of that hype. It would be like, in the 08 season, the Cs trading Ray Allen because he was in a shooting slump.

Although the idea that Reggie Evans would be a better fit is not true, either. That would really kill their front line. Dude is very similar to Joel Anthony. Too small. You can't start 2 6'9 guys that can't do anything but make hustle plays.

There wasn't a lot available in terms of big men, and they got the biggest name, but they needed a big man who could either score well without having plays called for him, be a legit back to the basket option, or guard opposing elite Cs and dominate the paint. They got a big man that couldn't do any of that.

They will get a C eventually, though, that's just how things work. I don't see it happening before the trade deadline unless they pull someone out of retirement because I can't imagine any team would give Miami a piece to make them stronger when they don't have anything to offer if you consider their draft picks will be horrible and their roster outside of "big 3" and Haslem/Miller is trashy journey men or unproven rookies. They could have got more out of Beasley, too, probably got a C that could start that's better than Joel.

-Smak

[NoGunzJustSkillz]

oh...and you want to talk about agenda? LOL

how about you saying that bosh is not mentally tough but if he played in LA he would be because of kobe. LOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOL.

The second gasol came to LA they were title contenders....did kobe reach inside his brain and make him mentally tough in one night?

for christ sake dude you need to come back to reality. the lakers loss in 08 to the celtics had way more to do with kobe. if kobe can't be the best player vs. paul pierce.....the lakers can't win....and they didnt. at least gasol was going up against the likes of perkins and kg. kobe couldn't do shit against ray allen or pierce. LOLOLOLOLOL.

This right here is why i hate lakers/kobe fans. you make comments like kobe is responsible for making gasol good. he was already ****ing awesome when he came. its just a natural progression to get better after being battle tested. its why poppovich said "people have no idea just how good gasol is....its going to be unfair for the league" LOLOLOLOLOL...he said that right after the trade

but her's a fact Branslowski Brah.....the lakers needed kobe to be the best player on the floor in 08 in the finals. AND HE WASN'T DUDE. HE WASN'T AS GOOD AS PIERCE OR KG IN THE SERIES. ****ing deal with it. stop insinuating that gasol's toughness was the main reason for the loss. that is a joke. the main reason for the loss was that kobe couldn't do shit against the celtics...plain and simple. damn i hate kobe stans. such a ****ing joke.
what was the lakers record that season before gasol came on board?

[miamiandorlando]

i was hell bent on the magic drafting him over dwight :facepalm:

[Funnyfuka]

bosh + lebron + wade = too much talent on a single team, one of em has to be useless/leave. You cannot build a team with all of em in it at once.

Honnestly i think the team would have been more stable with only wade + bosh or only wade +lebron.

Bosh obviously looks like the weakest link.

[Harison]

thats not how it works. bosh is not a great pick and roll player. amare is. bosh would simply not benefit as much from nash because all bosh wants to do is get the ball 17 feet away...face up...take 10 seconds and either shoot or drive. he doesn't move well without the ball and he doesn't crash the boards. i don't care if magic johnson is throwing him the ball.....he's not going to benefit the same way a guy with great movement like amare would.

he's best off playing on a bad team that gives him the ball a ton. the problem is that he's not good enough to be one of the 2 best players on a title team. so his value plummets on a good team.
Amare fits Nash slightly better, but you overstate a bit the issue. Bosh along his disadvantages has his advantages too, like better range. Plus this outside/inside game is overstated in their cases:

Bosh inside shots: 46%, jumpers 54%
Amare inside shots: 49%, jumpers 51%

Not exactly screaming of major difference now, does it? Courtesy by www.82games.com.

Lets look at more detailed '10 stats from:
http://www.hoopdata.com/player.aspx?name=Chris%20Bosh

Bosh:
At Rim: FG 3.7, FGA 5.9
<10 Feet: FG 1.6, FGA 3.3
10-15 Feet: FG 1.1, FGA 2.6
16-23 Feet: FG 1.9, FGA 4.5

Amare:
At Rim: FG 4.5, FGA 6.7
<10 Feet: FG 1.8, FGA 3.3
10-15 Feet: FG 0.6, FGA 1.4
16-23 Feet: FG 1.6, FGA 3.9

Considering Amare sometimes plays as a center, their data is remarkably similar, less than one shot per game at the rim and exactly the same from <10 Feet shows this calling of Amare as "inside player" and Bosh "outside jumpshooter" is way overstated.

Bosh also draws more fouls (FTA 8.4 vs 7.7), how can soft jumpshooter be better at this than "post-player"? Over many seasons their data is similar. Since Amare is more frequently in the post, it shows he is avoiding contact more, and isnt exactly banging in the post either.

And to sum it up: while Amare may fit Nash slightly better, its also true Bosh would benefit from him way better than from Calderon. Bosh stats were already better, with an elite PG his PPG and efficiency would only go up, thus making him better for the team (along with better rebounding and defense), even though he isnt the best fit possible. Like Wade and Lebron doesnt fit perfectly, yet they are better together than a perfect fit like Ray and Lebron.

[Harison]

Amare has some amazing hands and it would make a huge difference on that Miami team. He would have a bunch of 30 point games and probably average 20. Would he rebound and play D? No... but he's definitely a better offensive player in a system like Miami.
In my first post I said Amare would fit Heat slightly better because of the reasons you mentioned, plus the inside-presence, but after more thinking and data crunching I take that back - Bosh fits Heat better :oldlol: Bare with me.

Both Amare and Bosh arent that different what concerns "post-presence", check my post above for data. Amare obviously wouldnt flourish as good in the Heat as he did with Nash (neither Lebron or Wade are as good at passing, nor Amare would get as many touches), so no - he wouldnt have a bunch of 30 points games. In stat-padding D-Antoni team as a main option he is averaging 19PPG, on a bad efficiency, just because he doesnt have Nash anymore. In Heat his eFG% would be better, but points as 3rd option even lower. Thus even though Amare fits in Heat offense slightly better, there would be little difference compared to Bosh.

But offense isnt what Heat needs from 3rd option PF anyway, they need defense and rebounding, and Bosh as soft as he is, is still better at it than Amare. Last 1 rebound game sticks out, but considering Amare is even worse than Bosh at it, his RPG avg would be lower than Bosh anyway.

All of this doesnt matter in the end, both Bosh and Amare would suck at the Heat. This back and forth "who would suck less" is meaningless really, Heat would be better off without either of them :oldlol: Someone like Perkins, Bynum, or even Noah would be far, far better fit. And they dont even cost that much.

[Bodhi]

what was the lakers record that season before gasol came on board?

The Lakers had the best record in the west before they got Gasol and before Bynum went down.

[raptorfan_dr07]

Lmao, have you seen LA yet?

You mean the same Lakers who have played the Warriors, Grizzlies, Raptors, and Kings? Even Phoenix is a former shell of themselves. The Rockets were the only real tough team they played and it came right down to the final possession. The Heat would kill to have the Lakers opening schedule. The Magic, Celtics, and Hornets are better than anyone the Lakers have faced so far. The Heat beat the Magic.

[G-Funk]

there just aren't many good bigs on both ends in the league right now. bogut/howard/gasol/bynum/kg/perk/lopez/okafor/haywood/noah

some of those guys are a stretch. its just really hard to find solid bigs that can defend. i'm not saying the heat were dumb to get bosh. but they just have two glaring weaknesses now because they got him and had to pay so much for him. he does not address the pg problem or the big problem.

put it this way....if the heat had signed felton and signed haywood with the money they gave to bosh. nobody would be saying......"the heat are good, but they really need a jumpshooting power forward"

you see what i'm saying? think how good this team is:

felton/wade/lebron/haslem/haywood/miller/house/joel/arroyo/jones/z

now that is a legit team with no glaring weaknesses. still not a great front line....but much better. and felton would be a perfect fit at the guard spot. i would have done something like that if i was riley. but i don't think he knew lebron was coming so he had to sign bosh first i think.



you're an idiot

[game3524]

You mean the same Lakers who have played the Warriors, Grizzlies, Raptors, and Kings? Even Phoenix is a former shell of themselves. The Rockets were the only real tough team they played and it came right down to the final possession. The Heat would kill to have the Lakers opening schedule. The Magic, Celtics, and Hornets are better than anyone the Lakers have faced so far. The Heat beat the Magic.

And your point?

It is not who they are playing, it is how they are playing. The biggest weakness LA had last year, was their bench. And so far that has improved dramatically. I find it funny how LA still has to prove themselves to people, they are the two-time defending champions...........

[Samurai Swoosh]

This and only this. The Heat doesn't need any more tall SG, which Bosh is.
Stop with the stupid exaggerations ... Bosh isn't a "tall SG" or even a SF. He's just a player that needs the ball in his hands to be effective or to get comfortable and into the flow of the game. There is only one basketball. Bosh played well in preseason when it was just him and LeBron. But you want the ball in Wade's hands first, LeBron second, and Bosh will have to learn to adapt his game to those two very quickly.

[ginobli2311]

you're an idiot

so you would rather have lebron/wade/bosh over lebron/wade/felton/haywood

and you are calling me an idiot? LOL....damn posters on ISH have no ****ing clue what wins in the nba.

[NBASTATMAN]

If only Miami had a scrappy defender and rugged rebounder like Vareajo and a 3 point marksmen at the point like Mo Williams...WHOOPS!

All teams cannot be built like the darn lakers.. They have it all. The scoring threat, the tough veteran clutch pg, the long and super skilled odom who is very effective even when he isn't scoring, the best all around big in the game to go with the best perimeter defender in the game in artest.. Then you have to deal with bynum who could avg 20 and 10 on any other team not so deep. And the great acquisition of blake.. The Lakers just have the best GM in basketball... They have the perfect team and in my opinion can challenge the 72-10 mark this year...

[ginobli2311]

All teams cannot be built like the darn lakers.. They have it all. The scoring threat, the tough veteran clutch pg, the long and super skilled odom who is very effective even when he isn't scoring, the best all around big in the game to go with the best perimeter defender in the game in artest.. Then you have to deal with bynum who could avg 20 and 10 on any other team not so deep. And the great acquisition of blake.. The Lakers just have the best GM in basketball... They have the perfect team and in my opinion can challenge the 72-10 mark this year...

don't say that. you will get neg repped for saying that kobe has great talent and coaching around him. i had a kobe stan tell me that the biggest reason for the laker loss to the celtics in 08 was phil jackson's coaching. the greatest coach ever is not safe from the stans like branslowskikobedicksucker.

i love it. there are no laker fans here....only kobe stans....must be killing them that gasol is playing so well.