By the end of their careers, LBJ will be best SF ever, Wade 2nd best SG ever

[KG5MVP]

Suppose they win 4 championships, LBJ will have 4 rings and possibily 2-3 finals MVP, along with his godly stats, he will be remembered as best SF in history, passing Larry Bird and becoming top 5 player of all time.

Wade will have 5 rings and 2-3 finals MVP, thus having more accomplishments than Kobe, and because Wade had been putting godlike stats too, he will pass Kobe and become second best SG in history.

I support this because they both deserve the recognition of the best.

[Rick James]

Wade will be 2nds best. behind kobe.

[Hulk Hogan]

Suppose they win 4 championships, LBJ will have 4 rings and possibily 2-3 finals MVP, along with his godly stats, he will be remembered as best SF in history, passing Larry Bird and becoming top 5 player of all time.

Wade will have 5 rings and 2-3 finals MVP, thus having more accomplishments than Kobe, and because Wade had been putting godlike stats too, he will pass Kobe and become second best SG in history.

I support this because they both deserve the recognition of the best.

godly stats? What godly things has wade done? :wtf:
Even lebron haven't done anything close to being godly :wtf:

FG% is NOT godly. :facepalm

[KG5MVP]

godly stats? What godly things has wade done? :wtf:
Even lebron haven't done anything close to being godly :wtf:

FG% is NOT godly. :facepalm

Lebron's 2009 and 2010 season stats are pretty close to Michael Jordan-esque, which makes them godly.

Wade's 2008-2009 season was pretty crazy too.

[8BeastlyXOIAD]

godly stats? What godly things has wade done? :wtf:
Even lebron haven't done anything close to being godly :wtf:

FG% is NOT godly. :facepalm

when comparing Kobe to MJ alot of people talk about FG% difference

[StillKill24]

not on my watch.

[8BeastlyXOIAD]

not on my watch.
negged:oldlol:

[Kurosawa0]

LeBron will be the best SF ever, but Wade will still be behind MJ & Kobe.

[magnax1]

It's definitely possible. I think Lebron 2nd best SF and Wade 3rd best SG is more likely.

[KG5MVP]

LeBron will be the best SF ever, but Wade will still be behind MJ & Kobe.

Kobe has never dominated a finals series remotely close to Wade's 2006 finals

and if Wade wins more rings and finals MVP than Kobe, he will be better

[Al Thornton]

ya....

[TonyJones]

godly stats? What godly things has wade done? :wtf:



He was Godly in the 2006 finals. That 4th quarter performance in game 6 was EPIC.

[Kurosawa0]

It's definitely possible. I think Lebron 2nd best SF and Wade 3rd best SG is more likely.

If LeBron wins a couple of rings, he surpasses Bird.

[SpecialQue]

Neat. Now give me some winning Lotto numbers, Nostradamus.

[StillKill24]

Kobe has never dominated a finals series like Wade's 2006 finals because he didn't get 16 fta per game
fixed

[comerb]

Wade needs to work on his mid-game to pass up Kobe. He's not going to have that blinding speed for too many more years, and he's pretty heavily reliant on it.

Kobe & Jordan both developed their game to compensate for aging, I haven't seen that progression so much with Wade.

[8BeastlyXOIAD]

Neat. Now give me some winning Lotto numbers, Nostradamus.
2012?

[magnax1]

If LeBron wins a couple of rings, he surpasses Bird.
No, Lebron really isn't better at anything except being possibly the most athletic wing player ever. Bird's 100 times more skilled scorer, just a plain better scorer, much better rebounder, a better passer, and at least an equal defender up until this year. He was actually a similar defender in that he struggled 1 on 1 but was pretty great as a team defender.

[Miserio]

Larry Bird > LBJ.

[JrueHoliday11]

negged:oldlol:
:lol

[8BeastlyXOIAD]

:lol

hey are you new here? Never seen you posting here before:cheers: :cheers: :cheers:

[Hulk Hogan]

Lebron's 2009 and 2010 season stats are pretty close to Michael Jordan-esque, which makes them godly.

Wade's 2008-2009 season was pretty crazy too.

I see so someone becomes a great SG based on a one year performance. Save me your pennies.:oldlol:

Wade has only scored 30 points once in his career! ONCE! and that's worth being the second best SG? :roll:

He's not even close. Prime T-mac > D-Wade

50+ Point Games:

Micheal Jordan: 30
Kobe Bryant: 24
Lebron James: 8
Dwyane Wade: 3

:facepalm

[JrueHoliday11]

hey are you new here? Never seen you posting here before:cheers: :cheers: :cheers:

yea im new, :cheers:

[theoneneo]

Kobe has never dominated a finals series remotely close to Wade's 2006 finals

and if Wade wins more rings and finals MVP than Kobe, he will be better

Wades 2006 Finals? U mean the one against the Dallas Mavericks? That Team that Kobe outscored in 3 quarters, Scored 62? Dropped 43 in Dallas on em, Averaged 43ppg against in 2006? Oh My!

Stop overrating the 2006 finals...DWade Averaged 16 FTA Per game:roll: He had back to back 20FTA games in games 5 & 6...When Wade got those 25 FTA he scored 43 points...When Kobe got 25FTA he scored 62 in 3 quarters:bowdown: And that is all.

[Nash-tastic]

He was Godly in the 2006 finals. That 4th quarter performance in game 7 was EPIC.
There was no Game 7

[JrueHoliday11]

There was no Game 7
yeah ahah i was thinking the same

[tpols]

If the heat win four rings but lebron is the more dominant player in all of them or more than half there's no way wade gets ranked higher than kobe. He doesn't even have an MVP award. He has no 1st team defensive selections. His resume just isnt even close. The chances of this happening are slim to none.

More interestingly, if kobe leads the lakers to the finals again this year and plays extremely well like he did last year throughout the playoffs (29/5+/5+ on 45+%) and they win...he'll move up in everyone's GOAT list even more:applause:

[8BeastlyXOIAD]

yea im new, :cheers:

welcome

Jrue Holiday cool:cheers: :cheers:

BTW I am OnceInADECADE aka 8BeastlyXOIAD aka the biggest Beasley homer in the world:cheers: :cheers:

Nice to meet you

[JrueHoliday11]

welcome

Jrue Holiday cool:cheers: :cheers:

BTW I am OnceInADECADE aka 8BeastlyXOIAD aka the biggest Beasley homer in the world:cheers: :cheers:

Nice to meet you

Haha, awesome. I'm a huge Holiday/UCLA fan :pimp:

nice to meet you too and nice avatar :cheers:

[PurpleChuck]

Haha, awesome. I'm a huge Holiday/UCLA fan :pimp:

nice to meet you too and nice avatar :cheers:

He and DirkNowitzki41 has the hottest avy here. Hot girls in their rep jersey?!?!:bowdown:

[Clutch]

I see so someone becomes a great SG based on a one year performance. Save me your pennies.:oldlol:

Wade has only scored 30 points once in his career! ONCE! and that's worth being the second best SG? :roll:

He's not even close. Prime T-mac > D-Wade

50+ Point Games:

Micheal Jordan: 30
Kobe Bryant: 24
Lebron James: 8
Dwyane Wade: 3

:facepalm

@bold(Wade has only scored 30 points once in his career!) :wtf:

btw,Kobe still has a chance to reach 31 game scoring 50+ and be better than Jordan at 50+ point games but I don't see it happening.
He will probably stay on 24,or maybe he will add 1 or 2 more

James probably will not reach Kobe's 24 because he is now playing with Wade and Wade would reach it anyway,now he has no chance

[JrueHoliday11]

He and DirkNowitzki41 has the hottest avy here. Hot girls in their rep jersey?!?!:bowdown:

haha yeah thats awesome!! :bowdown:

[PurpleChuck]

ever?:wtf:

[Kurosawa0]

No, Lebron really isn't better at anything except being possibly the most athletic wing player ever. Bird's 100 times more skilled scorer, just a plain better scorer, much better rebounder, a better passer, and at least an equal defender up until this year. He was actually a similar defender in that he struggled 1 on 1 but was pretty great as a team defender.

The athleticism is the biggest difference though. If LeBron actually wins a championship or two, there will have been no other small forward that you'd rather have. Bird may have been the better scorer, but he never put the kind of pressure on the defense that LeBron does.

You're really underrating LeBron's physicality. You could still beat Boston with Bird hitting jumpers. If LeBron does, his team will win 9 times out 10. At their best, LeBron is better. You can argue that at his best, LeBron's about as good as there has ever been. He's just not always at his best.

[ashbelly]

ever?:wtf:
http://www.caniuseapurchasedemaillist.com/im-watching-you-focker.jpg

[PurpleChuck]

http://www.caniuseapurchasedemaillist.com/im-watching-you-focker.jpg

you are?:rolleyes:

[Hulk Hogan]

@bold(Wade has only scored 30 points once in his career!) :wtf:

btw,Kobe still has a chance to reach 31 game scoring 50+ and be better than Jordan at 50+ point games but I don't see it happening.
He will probably stay on 24,or maybe he will add 1 or 2 more

James probably will not reach Kobe's 24 because he is now playing with Wade and Wade would reach it anyway,now he has no chance

I meant he has only averaged 30 for only one season throughout his career.
That does not deserve being the best at anything or even being close.

[jstern]

The only true way that Wade can pass Kobe is if he has the consistent memorable top ten player type playoff moments that Kobe is lacking. It's the one true knock against Kobe when comparing him to past legends.

[magnax1]

The athleticism is the biggest difference though. If LeBron actually wins a championship or two, there will have been no other small forward that you'd rather have. Bird may have been the better scorer, but he never put the kind of pressure on the defense that LeBron does.

You're really underrating LeBron's physicality. You could still beat Boston with Bird hitting jumpers. If LeBron does, his team will win 9 times out 10. At their best, LeBron is better. You can argue that at his best, LeBron's about as good as there has ever been. He's just not always at his best.
Eh, I really disagree. I think for 3-4 years in his prime Bird was as good as any perimeter player ever, very close to Michael Jordan from 88-93, probably not exactly equal. Lebron's effectiveness can be dulled if you pack it in the paint, there really is no way to dull Bird's effectiveness because he's to skilled of a scorer. He could score on the perimeter, was extremely good in the post, and was actually a pretty good slasher despite his lack of athleticism. He was also able to take over a series with his rebounding if somehow the defense stopped his scoring. Maybe at his very best Lebron is better, but I don't think he has reached his very best in the playoffs that often. Hopefully it's because he didn't have the team mates in cleveland and it will change now that he's in Miami, but we'll just have to wait until the playoffs to see.
Really you could make an argument either way, it just depends on what you prefer. Everyone looks for different things in a basketball player.

[aj242]

Wade will be 2nds best. behind kobe.

MJ>Kobe>Wade.

[Kurosawa0]

Eh, I really disagree. I think for 3-4 years in his prime Bird was as good as any perimeter player ever, very close to Michael Jordan from 88-93, probably not exactly equal. Lebron's effectiveness can be dulled if you pack it in the paint, there really is no way to dull Bird's effectiveness because he's to skilled of a scorer. He could score on the perimeter, was extremely good in the post, and was actually a pretty good slasher despite his lack of athleticism. He was also able to take over a series with his rebounding if somehow the defense stopped his scoring. Maybe at his very best Lebron is better, but I don't think he has reached his very best in the playoffs that often. Hopefully it's because he didn't have the team mates in cleveland and it will change now that he's in Miami, but we'll just have to wait until the playoffs to see.
Really you could make an argument either way, it just depends on what you prefer. Everyone looks for different things in a basketball player.

That's why I said he has to win a couple of rings first. I think in the end I'd take having the athletic edge though. Skill is great, but it's the physicality that usually is the determining factor. It's the hardest aspect of the game to match up with. A team of Steve Nash, Reggie Miller, Larry Bird, Kevin McHale and Bill Walton probably doesn't do so well against Magic Johnson, Michael Jordan, LeBron James, Karl Malone and Shaq.

That and I just see it being the narrative if LeBron wins a couple rings. I think you'll see the common five be Magic, Michael, LeBron, Duncan and then Russell/Kareem/Wilt.

[Sarcastic]

Wade is not, and will not be better than Kobe. Winning rings won't change that fact.

Wade has a lot of work to do just to get past Jerry West, if he even can.

[8BeastlyXOIAD]

He and DirkNowitzki41 has the hottest avy here. Hot girls in their rep jersey?!?!:bowdown:

thanks bra:cheers: :cheers:

[PurpleChuck]

thanks bra:cheers: :cheers:

Girl don't lie bro!:cheers:

Btw gratz on your homey Beasley beasting, damn wish he was still a Heat!

[Knoe Itawl]

If he stays healthy, I think Wade will have the accomplishments to make him the 2nd best sg by career. I already believe as far as play on the court he is, just needs a few more seasons of relative good health to solidify.

[magnax1]

That's why I said he has to win a couple of rings first. I think in the end I'd take having the athletic edge though. Skill is great, but it's the physicality that usually is the determining factor. It's the hardest aspect of the game to match up with. A team of Steve Nash, Reggie Miller, Larry Bird, Kevin McHale and Bill Walton probably doesn't do so well against Magic Johnson, Michael Jordan, LeBron James, Karl Malone and Shaq.

That and I just see it being the narrative if LeBron wins a couple rings. I think you'll see the common five be Magic, Michael, LeBron, Duncan and then Russell/Kareem/Wilt.
Well, Skills will almost always win offense (though reggie miller isn't really of the same caliber, lol) and Magic Jordan and Shaq were just as much skill based as they were athleticism, probably more so. Especially magic.
Like I said you can pack it in when you play Lebron, he doesn't play very well, not the same with the other guys you listed. Lebron just hasn't played as high of caliber of playoff ball as the Magic, Jordan Russell, Kareem and Wilt, and quite a couple others you didn't list.

[ginobli2311]

If he stays healthy, I think Wade will have the accomplishments to make him the 2nd best sg by career. I already believe as far as play on the court he is, just needs a few more seasons of relative good health to solidify.


if wade maintains his career numbers and wins 3 more titles and 1 more finals mvp......i see no reason why he wouldn't go down as the 2nd best sg ever.

his numbers will be more impressive than kobe's overall and he'll most likely outperform kobe big time over their careers in the finals.

[8BeastlyXOIAD]

Girl don't lie bro!:cheers:

Btw gratz on your homey Beasley beasting, damn wish he was still a Heat!
:cheers: :cheers:

[alenleomessi]

No respect for Larry Legend :facepalm

[Nash-tastic]

There was no Game 7
No answer?

[momo]

He was Godly in the 2006 finals. That 4th quarter performance in game 7 was EPIC.

http://forum.grasscity.com/photopost/data/500/NotSureIfSerious.jpg

[Pushxx]

A lot of people in this thread need to look at Larry Bird's playoff stats.

Dude is unpassable as the best SF ever. Clutch, best J, great post-up, ridiculous hustle.....best passing forward ever.

LeBron gets half his assists from open 3-PT shooters LOL Look at some of these passes by Larry Bird...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EhnRtgBGMl4

[scm5]

Wade has nearly no chance at being a better player than Kobe.

Wade at 28 isn't better than a 32 year old Kobe.

http://www.basketball-reference.com/play-index/h2h_finder.cgi?request=1&p1=wadedw01&p2=bryanko01

Through their careers, Kobe has always guarded Wade while defensive duties on Kobe were mostly passed onto other players. I think the xmas day game was one of the few games where i've seen Wade guard Kobe pretty much the whole game.

Kobe has pretty much maintained his career averages while going up against Wade while Wade's averages are down significantly (43% from his usual 48%).

In fact, this is one of the best examples of Kobe's defensive prowess. While Kobe might not respect a lot of players in the league, when he encounters a player he respects, he will lock him down. Say what you will about Kobe, his defensive 1st team nominations have some merit. Few players can lock down Wade as well as Kobe has through his career.

[Soundwave]

I love how the Kobe nut-huggers/Heat haters think they can have their cake and eat it too ...

"B ... bu ... but, LeBron is Robin! Wade is Batman!"

So if Wade wins 3-4 more titles shouldn't that put him on par, or perhaps even better than Bryant?

"B ... bu ... but, Wade isn't even the best player on his team!".

Kobe's defensive prowess my ass ... Wade gets more penetration on the Lakers D than a Jenna Jameson gang bang. Just missed some easy gimmes (the dunk attempt) most likely because of that sore knee.

[dee-rose]

I'm surprised no one has mentioned the fact that in a few years wades body will break down and his skillset isn't polished enough to be effective after that. Same goes for Lebron

[Soundwave]

I'm surprised no one has mentioned the fact that in a few years wades body will break down and his skillset isn't polished enough to be effective after that. Same goes for Lebron

Playing with each other will help both of them extend their careers. Less minutes, more blow outs, easier regular season runs.

[blacknapalm]

they better start filling up the larry o'brien trophy case then. i don't see wade getting an MVP when he's in the latter stages of his prime and lebron is on the team. i hardly see lebron getting any more than one more MVP because of that reason (stacked + media not wanting to vote for him again). finals MVP wise, wade obviously needs one more. lebron needs a couple. something will have to give. i'd definitely vote one or the other in this scenario but not both. scoring titles aren't gonna happen here.

west/bird were no slouches. if they make a historic run, the impact of who did what will surely greatly debated.

you also have to consider you are essentially putting five (+shaq/duncan) players from this era in the top 12 all-time. that's pretty saturated and you may want to take a closer look at where the chips fall.

[scm5]

Kobe's defensive prowess my ass ... Wade gets more penetration on the Lakers D than a Jenna Jameson gang bang. Just missed some easy gimmes (the dunk attempt) most likely because of that sore knee.

Lol. The Xmas day game was ONE game and if Wade made those shots, his career FG% against Kobe might go up .3%. Kobe's 32 now and clearly can't keep up with Wade as well as he used to. Through their careers, Kobe has limited Wade to well below his career averages while maintaining his own averages... that's where I base Kobe's defensive prowess off of. Way to take things out of context and IGNORE how throughout his career, Kobe has limited Wade to lower FG%.

[dee-rose]

Playing with each other will help both of them extend their careers. Less minutes, more blow outs, easier regular season runs.
Youre right but wades style of play is reckless and he's not about to hange his game. it's becoming evident that he's already breaking down slowly while Lebron weighs about 260 pounds and plays above the rim. That takes alot out of your knees.

[blacknapalm]

Lol. The Xmas day game was ONE game and if Wade made those shots, his career FG% against Kobe might go up .3%. Kobe's 32 now and clearly can't keep up with Wade as well as he used to. Through their careers, Kobe has limited Wade to well below his career averages while maintaining his own averages... that's where I base Kobe's defensive prowess off of. Way to take things out of context and IGNORE how throughout his career, Kobe has limited Wade to lower FG%.

mostly true. in their H2H matchups, kobe has averaged more points on a better %. rebounds were identical. wade got more assists, steals, blocks and turnovers. 14 games, 7-7.

[YAWN]

i swear if lebron ever wins 1 title these kids are gonna flood the board with lebron>>larry bird topics. :facepalm

and as for the other comment...

dwade (turns 29 in a couple weeks)
1x nba champion
1x finals mvp
6x all star
5x all nba
3x all defense

kobe (turned 32 in august)
5x nba champion
2x finals mvp
1x mvp
12x all star
12x all nba
10x all defense

really...

[PurpleChuck]

i swear if lebron ever wins 1 title these kids are gonna flood the board with lebron>>larry bird topics. :facepalm

and as for the other comment...

dwade (turns 29 in a couple weeks)
1x nba champion
1x finals mvp
6x all star
5x all nba
3x all defense

kobe (turned 32 in august)
5x nba champion
2x finals mvp
1x mvp
12x all star
12x all nba
10x all defense

really...

Agreed. As much as I like Wade, Kobe got that no.2 SG spot pretty much sealed.

[L.A. Jazz]

please save this topic until they won their first ring with the Heat.
next year there's a lock-out which will cost them one chance.
(alltough it will hurt Kobe, TD, Dirk, KG, PP, Ray Allen even more)

[ginobli2311]

i swear if lebron ever wins 1 title these kids are gonna flood the board with lebron>>larry bird topics. :facepalm

and as for the other comment...

dwade (turns 29 in a couple weeks)
1x nba champion
1x finals mvp
6x all star
5x all nba
3x all defense

kobe (turned 32 in august)
5x nba champion
2x finals mvp
1x mvp
12x all star
12x all nba
10x all defense

really...

just because wade went to college does not mean he can't surpass kobe. what you reference is how you would rank a career...not a player. there is a difference.

wade's numbers and efficiency levels will be better than kobe's if both maintain their current career averages. the premise is that wade wins 3 more titles and at least 1 more finals mvp. if that happens it would be very likely that wade's level of play in the nba finals would blow kobe's out of the water considering wade already owns one of the best finals performances of all time.

wade has consistently played better against the elite defenses in the league as well.

in 6 years (if he remains healthy) wade will be a 12 time all star and add 6 more all-nba and all defense honors.

either way it would be very very close between the two players.

the career averages would both essentially be 25/5/5...with wade being more efficient and less selfish.

its really not far fetched at all.

and that is just the numbers aspect. anyone with a set of eyes knows that when wade is healthy he's one of the best players ever. most already have him in the top 35 all time because of how good he's been. if he adds 6 more great years with some honors and titles he'll be right there with the 15 best of all time.

its not a knock on kobe...kobe is amazing, but wade has been just as good or better since the 05 season (wade's 2nd year)

wade was better in 05 and 06
kobe was better in 07 and 08
09 and 10 are a toss up to me but i prefer wade.

now wade has an elite team that should win multiple titles over the next 6 years. if he doesn't. then he won't get much all time greatest sg talk after jordan. if he does? he'll sky rocket up the all time rankings because there simply aren't many guys all time that could dominate from the perimeter like him at his efficiency that won multiple titles.

[Stuckey]

have no idea how Wade will pass Kobe

5 more rings wont even do it

[asdf1990]

have no idea how Wade will pass Kobe

5 more rings wont even do it

Lol, Kobe is overrated.

[Hagbard]

No respect for Larry Legend :facepalm
Everybody in the thread is calling him the #1 of all time, Copernicus.

[tpols]

just because wade went to college does not mean he can't surpass kobe. what you reference is how you would rank a career...not a player. there is a difference.

wade's numbers and efficiency levels will be better than kobe's if both maintain their current career averages. the premise is that wade wins 3 more titles and at least 1 more finals mvp. if that happens it would be very likely that wade's level of play in the nba finals would blow kobe's out of the water considering wade already owns one of the best finals performances of all time.

wade has consistently played better against the elite defenses in the league as well.

in 6 years (if he remains healthy) wade will be a 12 time all star and add 6 more all-nba and all defense honors.

either way it would be very very close between the two players.

the career averages would both essentially be 25/5/5...with wade being more efficient and less selfish.

its really not far fetched at all.

and that is just the numbers aspect. anyone with a set of eyes knows that when wade is healthy he's one of the best players ever. most already have him in the top 35 all time because of how good he's been. if he adds 6 more great years with some honors and titles he'll be right there with the 15 best of all time.

its not a knock on kobe...kobe is amazing, but wade has been just as good or better since the 05 season (wade's 2nd year)

wade was better in 05 and 06
kobe was better in 07 and 08
09 and 10 are a toss up to me but i prefer wade.

now wade has an elite team that should win multiple titles over the next 6 years. if he doesn't. then he won't get much all time greatest sg talk after jordan. if he does? he'll sky rocket up the all time rankings because there simply aren't many guys all time that could dominate from the perimeter like him at his efficiency that won multiple titles.
Not at all because any future titles wont be won as the main option. And all of your 'wade was better in x season' are opinions that could be easily flipped around. And for all the seasons where you think wade was better kobe has been better for nearly 3x the amount of time. Kobe has had elite MVP type numbers since 2001 where as wade has had them since 06/07. It's not even close in terms of span of dominance. He doesn't even have an MVP and you think he could finish top ten all time:facepalm

Wade virtually has no chance at passing kobe on GOAT lists and you know it. In order to pass kobe wade would have to end up at top 6-7 all time. This is just absurd.

[blondie]

Lebron will never top Larry Bird because Lebron is one of the mentally softest superstars ever and Larry Bird is one of the toughest and clutchest ever.

[madmax]

Lebron will never top Larry Bird because Lebron is one of the mentally softest superstars ever and Larry Bird is one of the toughest and clutchest ever.
any facts to back up this outlandish claim or you're just slurping that Lebron haterade like you usually do?

[Tha Catalyst]

just because wade went to college does not mean he can't surpass kobe. what you reference is how you would rank a career...not a player. there is a difference.

wade's numbers and efficiency levels will be better than kobe's if both maintain their current career averages. the premise is that wade wins 3 more titles and at least 1 more finals mvp. if that happens it would be very likely that wade's level of play in the nba finals would blow kobe's out of the water considering wade already owns one of the best finals performances of all time.

wade has consistently played better against the elite defenses in the league as well.

in 6 years (if he remains healthy) wade will be a 12 time all star and add 6 more all-nba and all defense honors.

either way it would be very very close between the two players.

the career averages would both essentially be 25/5/5...with wade being more efficient and less selfish.

its really not far fetched at all.

and that is just the numbers aspect. anyone with a set of eyes knows that when wade is healthy he's one of the best players ever. most already have him in the top 35 all time because of how good he's been. if he adds 6 more great years with some honors and titles he'll be right there with the 15 best of all time.

its not a knock on kobe...kobe is amazing, but wade has been just as good or better since the 05 season (wade's 2nd year)

wade was better in 05 and 06
kobe was better in 07 and 08
09 and 10 are a toss up to me but i prefer wade.

now wade has an elite team that should win multiple titles over the next 6 years. if he doesn't. then he won't get much all time greatest sg talk after jordan. if he does? he'll sky rocket up the all time rankings because there simply aren't many guys all time that could dominate from the perimeter like him at his efficiency that won multiple titles.
It sounds kinda far fetched that Wade will make every all nba team and all defensive team from now til he is 35. Its not impossible but for a player with Wade's history is so very unlikely. I'm getting the impression you don't like Kobe, Wade being in the top 15 will still have him ranked undoubtedly below Kobe.



Try again if you want though...

[indiefan24]

Try again if you want though...

Don't worry. He will.

[PurpleChuck]

Try again if you want though...

Don't!:eek: :rant :banghead:

[blondie]

any facts to back up this outlandish claim or you're just slurping that Lebron haterade like you usually do?
His only finals performance ever-choke and swept putting up horrible numbers below his averages in the process


in 2008 he choked in ab out 3 games vs the Celtics putting up loads of 3-19 type performances WHICH NOBODY, NOT EVEN ESPN ever talk about

2009 vs Orlando, the #1 seed chokes out against the Hedo lead Orlando Magic:lol

2010 vs Boston-Game 5 vs Boston is probably the biggest playoff choke job of all time


Do you really need more evidence?

[madmax]

His only finals performance ever-choke and swept putting up horrible numbers below his averages in the process


in 2008 he choked in ab out 3 games vs the Celtics putting up loads of 3-19 type performances WHICH NOBODY, NOT EVEN ESPN ever talk about

2009 vs Orlando, the #1 seed chokes out against the Hedo lead Orlando Magic:lol

2010 vs Boston-Game 5 vs Boston is probably the biggest playoff choke job of all time


Do you really need more evidence?
2008 - so apparently he "choked" in the first games of those series because his shot wasn't falling? So did he choke too when he came closest to beating eventual champions in a deciding Game 7 as well?:lol
2009 - one of the best individual playoff series of all time. I don't see any choke here, just a one man team trying to overcome huge mismatch problem in Orlando.
2010 - the only "susceptible" series of his. And even then his team was just outplayed by much better squad. Not to mention all the offcourt issues and his elbow problems.

[PurpleChuck]

Why is it that every troll thread by KG5MVP gets fed with so many pages.:banghead:

Dude's shamelessly luring ppl to argue over nonsense statements.:rant

[MasterDurant24]

Suppose they win 4 championships, LBJ will have 4 rings and possibily 2-3 finals MVP, along with his godly stats, he will be remembered as best SF in history, passing Larry Bird and becoming top 5 player of all time.

Wade will have 5 rings and 2-3 finals MVP, thus having more accomplishments than Kobe, and because Wade had been putting godlike stats too, he will pass Kobe and become second best SG in history.

I support this because they both deserve the recognition of the best.

Nuff said.

[NauruDude]

Wade will be 2nds best. behind kobe.

Michael Jordan is better than Kobe and Wade. B

[Monkey D Dragon]

Kobe has never dominated a finals series remotely close to Wade's 2006 finals

and if Wade wins more rings and finals MVP than Kobe, he will be better

2009 Finals Kobe lit it up wtf were u watching? :facepalm

Go watch some hockey kid

[niko]

If the Knicks get Melo and CP3 and win 4 straight titles Amare will be as good as Duncan.

:hammerhead:

[PurpleChuck]

If the Knicks get Melo and CP3 and win 4 straight titles Amare will be as good as Duncan.

:hammerhead:

Scary thought.:eek:

[LastChanceToWin]

I think Lebron can retire not only the greatest SF but also the greatest PG of all time.

[PurpleChuck]

I think Lebron can retire not only the greatest SF but also the greatest PG of all time.

Ah you found a way to make it worse huh...:banghead: :rant :facepalm

[ginobli2311]

Not at all because any future titles wont be won as the main option. And all of your 'wade was better in x season' are opinions that could be easily flipped around. And for all the seasons where you think wade was better kobe has been better for nearly 3x the amount of time. Kobe has had elite MVP type numbers since 2001 where as wade has had them since 06/07. It's not even close in terms of span of dominance. He doesn't even have an MVP and you think he could finish top ten all time:facepalm

Wade virtually has no chance at passing kobe on GOAT lists and you know it. In order to pass kobe wade would have to end up at top 6-7 all time. This is just absurd.

listen carefully.

wade does not have to win 5 titles to surpass kobe. he has to win 3 more and continue to play at a high level.

so now titles only count if you are the main man? a big LOL

wade's career is only 7 seasons in. kobe's is double that....of course he has a longer span of dominance.

but again. does wade going to college somehow make kobe better? nope. that is the dumbest logic ever.

wade's numbers are better than kobe's: FACT

25 points 5 boards 5 assists on 45% shooting for kobe for his career


25 points 5 boards 7 assists on 48& shooting for wade for his career

LOL. Wade is slightly better than kobe by the numbers. thats just a fact. not opinion. again.....a FACT.

this is a hypothetical....and IF wade were to win a few more titles and at least one more finals mvp he would be right there with kobe all time.

what would be the difference? honestly...what? that kobe played longer because he came out of high school? LOL....wade was ready to lead a team to a title in his 2nd and 3rd years. Kobe was airballing shots in the playoffs and not getting anywhere in his first 3 years even though he had the most stacked team in the league. again...LOL

performance vs similar competition?

wade dominated the same pistons that owned kobe. wade trumped kobes' performances against the celtics. wade dominated a mavericks team that beat the same suns team that held kobe to 8 points less per game than his regular season average in 06.

in one finals appearance wade did what kobe has never been able to do.

so lets get this straight. rings only count if you are the clear cut main option now? ok...so kobe only has 2 rings. wade already has 1. so wade can't be better than kobe because he has 1 less ring that counts now? retarded logic.

all rings count. there are just varying degrees of credit that are assigned to each player. and lets be real. the gap between wade and lebron (as if there really is one) is not even close to the size of the gap between shaq and kobe. again...LOL

so wade has better numbers....FACT
wade has performed better against similar competition....FACT
in 1 finals appearance wade trumped anything kobe has done in the finals in 7 tries....FACT

so again. what makes kobe a better player again? don't give me career resume. what makes him a better player? thats right....nothing.

they are virtually identical and if wade ends up winning 4 titles and keeps up his level of play and impact i see no reason why he wouldn't be slightly ahead of kobe or slightly behind him all time.

wade's resume for his circumstances would be better than kobe's in my opinion.

you people are just like the same hater morons that were on here saying "kobe will never win without shaq" "he's not that great and is too selfish to win" "LOL at the idea that kobe could be top 15 all time"

you remember those morons that i'm sure you all went crazy at. well....you are doing the same exact same thing to wade if you think its absurd for him to finish as a legit top 15 player of all time with a chance to crack the top 12 and surpass kobe.

i'll ask it again. what makes kobe better than wade?

its not the numbers. its not the level of play or impact. its not finals performances. its not ability to take over in the playoffs. its not level of play against the best teams/defenses.

you have nothing.

i hope someone tries to respond with spouting off how many all-star appearances or going down the list of kobe's resume. each player plays in different circumstances and those circumstances must be taken into account when judging each player. there is no set in stone criteria of what each player must have to be ranked in front of another.

again. how is kobe a better PLAYER than wade?

[ginobli2311]

this thread is a perfect example of why we hate kobe stans.

wade's regular season career numbers are better. wade's playoff career numbers are better.

wade has proven he can elevate his game in the finals and dominate. wade has proven he can beat the best teams and the best defenses. wade has proven he can lead a team to a title.

and he's done all this in his first 7 years and now he's in a situation that he could POTENTIALLY win a lot more titles. thus the reason for the thread. nobody is saying it is likely. but its possible. and to say otherwise is just agenda driven BS.

it will be next to impossible for wade to have a better career than kobe. but not that unlikely or improbable that wade could go down as the better player. that is what you guys are missing.

perfect example:

kobe is a better player than hondo. hondo (up to this point) had the better career. you see how that works?

[All Net]

I think the next 3 years are key for Wade, what Miami do here will show if he can be 2nd best SG of all time. Championships change alot of people's minds...I think it's possible he does finish there but as I said if he can win 2 titles in the next 3 years for example while averaging 24, 6 and 5 say...they I think it's possible.

It's not all about matching Kobe's rings.

[scm5]

listen carefully.

wade does not have to win 5 titles to surpass kobe. he has to win 3 more and continue to play at a high level.

so now titles only count if you are the main man? a big LOL

wade's career is only 7 seasons in. kobe's is double that....of course he has a longer span of dominance.

but again. does wade going to college somehow make kobe better? nope. that is the dumbest logic ever.

wade's numbers are better than kobe's: FACT

25 points 5 boards 5 assists on 45% shooting for kobe for his career


25 points 5 boards 7 assists on 48& shooting for wade for his career

LOL. Wade is slightly better than kobe by the numbers. thats just a fact. not opinion. again.....a FACT.

this is a hypothetical....and IF wade were to win a few more titles and at least one more finals mvp he would be right there with kobe all time.

what would be the difference? honestly...what? that kobe played longer because he came out of high school? LOL....wade was ready to lead a team to a title in his 2nd and 3rd years. Kobe was airballing shots in the playoffs and not getting anywhere in his first 3 years even though he had the most stacked team in the league. again...LOL

performance vs similar competition?

wade dominated the same pistons that owned kobe. wade trumped kobes' performances against the celtics. wade dominated a mavericks team that beat the same suns team that held kobe to 8 points less per game than his regular season average in 06.

in one finals appearance wade did what kobe has never been able to do.

so lets get this straight. rings only count if you are the clear cut main option now? ok...so kobe only has 2 rings. wade already has 1. so wade can't be better than kobe because he has 1 less ring that counts now? retarded logic.

all rings count. there are just varying degrees of credit that are assigned to each player. and lets be real. the gap between wade and lebron (as if there really is one) is not even close to the size of the gap between shaq and kobe. again...LOL

so wade has better numbers....FACT
wade has performed better against similar competition....FACT
in 1 finals appearance wade trumped anything kobe has done in the finals in 7 tries....FACT

so again. what makes kobe a better player again? don't give me career resume. what makes him a better player? thats right....nothing.

they are virtually identical and if wade ends up winning 4 titles and keeps up his level of play and impact i see no reason why he wouldn't be slightly ahead of kobe or slightly behind him all time.

wade's resume for his circumstances would be better than kobe's in my opinion.

you people are just like the same hater morons that were on here saying "kobe will never win without shaq" "he's not that great and is too selfish to win" "LOL at the idea that kobe could be top 15 all time"

you remember those morons that i'm sure you all went crazy at. well....you are doing the same exact same thing to wade if you think its absurd for him to finish as a legit top 15 player of all time with a chance to crack the top 12 and surpass kobe.

i'll ask it again. what makes kobe better than wade?

its not the numbers. its not the level of play or impact. its not finals performances. its not ability to take over in the playoffs. its not level of play against the best teams/defenses.

you have nothing.

i hope someone tries to respond with spouting off how many all-star appearances or going down the list of kobe's resume. each player plays in different circumstances and those circumstances must be taken into account when judging each player. there is no set in stone criteria of what each player must have to be ranked in front of another.

again. how is kobe a better PLAYER than wade?

http://www.basketball-reference.com/play-index/h2h_finder.cgi?request=1&p1=wadedw01&p2=bryanko01

Kobe locks Wade down in head to head match up and puts up better numbers. FACT.

5 NBA titles and 7 Finals appearances in 14 years (this is his 15th year) trumps anything any other player in Kobe's era has done. FACT.



I don't understand how Wade can be considered Better than Kobe when Kobe actually MATCHES UP and DEFENDS Wade and has held him to far below his career averages and the same can't be said about Wade defending Kobe. They play the same position.

Wade might put up better stats through their careers than Wade, but Kobe came off the bench in the early parts of his career. As a starter, Kobe has put up 27.5ppg 5.7rpg 5.1apg on 45.7% FG.

Wade's Finals appearance was against a team that Kobe outscored through 3 quarters and averaged 43ppg against in the regular season. Suffice to say that they were weak defending SG's considering what Kobe did to them in the regular season and what Wade did to them in the post season.

[scm5]

this thread is a perfect example of why we hate kobe stans.

wade's regular season career numbers are better. wade's playoff career numbers are better.

wade has proven he can elevate his game in the finals and dominate. wade has proven he can beat the best teams and the best defenses. wade has proven he can lead a team to a title.

and he's done all this in his first 7 years and now he's in a situation that he could POTENTIALLY win a lot more titles. thus the reason for the thread. nobody is saying it is likely. but its possible. and to say otherwise is just agenda driven BS.

it will be next to impossible for wade to have a better career than kobe. but not that unlikely or improbable that wade could go down as the better player. that is what you guys are missing.

perfect example:

kobe is a better player than hondo. hondo (up to this point) had the better career. you see how that works?

Sure. But your argument accounts for nothing when you look at their head to head stats in which KOBE always defends Wade and locks him down 5% below his career FG%.

http://www.basketball-reference.com/play-index/h2h_finder.cgi?request=1&p1=wadedw01&p2=bryanko01

We can use this argument because they play the same position and Kobe has always matched up against Wade.

[guy]

The main reason Lebron will probably surpass Bird is cause of his durability and longevity. Not saying he can't due to other reasons, but that will probably end up being the difference maker. And thats the same reason why I think Wade will probably fall short of Kobe.

[Clutch]

Wade 2nd best SG ever - NO WAY,END OF STORY

[dankok8]

http://www.basketball-reference.com/play-index/h2h_finder.cgi?request=1&p1=wadedw01&p2=bryanko01

Kobe locks Wade down in head to head match up and puts up better numbers. FACT.

5 NBA titles and 7 Finals appearances in 14 years (this is his 15th year) trumps anything any other player in Kobe's era has done. FACT.



I don't understand how Wade can be considered Better than Kobe when Kobe actually MATCHES UP and DEFENDS Wade and has held him to far below his career averages and the same can't be said about Wade defending Kobe. They play the same position.

Wade might put up better stats through their careers than Wade, but Kobe came off the bench in the early parts of his career. As a starter, Kobe has put up 27.5ppg 5.7rpg 5.1apg on 45.7% FG.

Wade's Finals appearance was against a team that Kobe outscored through 3 quarters and averaged 43ppg against in the regular season. Suffice to say that they were weak defending SG's considering what Kobe did to them in the regular season and what Wade did to them in the post season.

Yea I noticed this a while ago and it doesnt discredit Wade's Finals by any means but it does bring it down to earth. Lebron also averaged 41ppg on 60% shooting against the Mavs that season.

[ronniec]

Suppose they win 4 championships, LBJ will have 4 rings and possibily 2-3 finals MVP, along with his godly stats, he will be remembered as best SF in history, passing Larry Bird and becoming top 5 player of all time.

Wade will have 5 rings and 2-3 finals MVP, thus having more accomplishments than Kobe, and because Wade had been putting godlike stats too, he will pass Kobe and become second best SG in history.

I support this because they both deserve the recognition of the best.

Supposed they win 4 rings?? Come on.
Wait till they win one before you start this thread.
Even if Lebron wins a couple, make sure he is the leader of the team but not a sidekick of Wade.

[Niquesports]

Supposed they win 4 rings?? Come on.
Wait till they win one before you start this thread.
Even if Lebron wins a couple, make sure he is the leader of the team but not a sidekick of Wade.
Suppose Bill Russell comes back signs with the heat to fill the need of a defensive Center and helps Lebron and Wade win 5 titles. That would give Russ 20. Without question GOAT.:roll:

[icewill36]

fixed

fixed ? kobe cant get those FTA because hes not as quick or explosive as wade.
kobe is the best in the game at making difficult shots, the thing is wade and bron dont have to take difficult shots because they just get to the basket and force ppl to foul them.

[dyna]

LeBron will be the best SF ever, but Wade will still be behind MJ & Kobe.

And West

[ronniec]

Suppose Bill Russell comes back signs with the heat to fill the need of a defensive Center and helps Lebron and Wade win 5 titles. That would give Russ 20. Without question GOAT.:roll:

:lol :lol :lol :lol :lol :lol :lol

[macpierce]

not until wade surpasses kobe for 2nd most 40 point games which is 106 lol
or 50 point games or 60 point games or 80 point games...............
NAH BRAH

[madmax]

fixed ? kobe cant get those FTA because hes not as quick or explosive as wade.
kobe is the best in the game at making difficult shots, the thing is wade and bron dont have to take difficult shots because they just get to the basket and force ppl to foul them.

:applause: :applause:
The best post in all of this trollish thread

[GiveItToBurrito]

Lebron could be the best small forward, although I think Bird might be better. Lebron put up ungodly stats on the Cavs, but now that he's playing with two or three other stars, his numbers are pretty similar to Larry Legend's. They could be 1a and 1b, though.

Wade's great, but I don't think he'll ever surpass Kobe, at least as far as public perception of him goes, and he'll definitely never surpass Jordan. I'm sure there's some guy from the 70s or 60s who I don't really know much about who people can say is better, maybe Jerry West or Robertson or someone.

[GiveItToBurrito]

Yea I noticed this a while ago and it doesnt discredit Wade's Finals by any means but it does bring it down to earth. Lebron also averaged 41ppg on 60% shooting against the Mavs that season.

Dallas could never stop quick wings, I don't think that cheapens Wade basically beating them single-handedly in the Finals. Although Kobe personally outscoring a 50+ win team is pretty impressive...

[amfirst]

Enjoy now, wait to LeBron and Wade turn 32, they will become washed up players and the young players will be rank above them.

[niko]

listen carefully.

wade does not have to win 5 titles to surpass kobe. he has to win 3 more and continue to play at a high level.

so now titles only count if you are the main man? a big LOL

wade's career is only 7 seasons in. kobe's is double that....of course he has a longer span of dominance.

but again. does wade going to college somehow make kobe better? nope. that is the dumbest logic ever.

wade's numbers are better than kobe's: FACT

25 points 5 boards 5 assists on 45% shooting for kobe for his career


25 points 5 boards 7 assists on 48& shooting for wade for his career

LOL. Wade is slightly better than kobe by the numbers. thats just a fact. not opinion. again.....a FACT.

this is a hypothetical....and IF wade were to win a few more titles and at least one more finals mvp he would be right there with kobe all time.

what would be the difference? honestly...what? that kobe played longer because he came out of high school? LOL....wade was ready to lead a team to a title in his 2nd and 3rd years. Kobe was airballing shots in the playoffs and not getting anywhere in his first 3 years even though he had the most stacked team in the league. again...LOL

performance vs similar competition?

wade dominated the same pistons that owned kobe. wade trumped kobes' performances against the celtics. wade dominated a mavericks team that beat the same suns team that held kobe to 8 points less per game than his regular season average in 06.

in one finals appearance wade did what kobe has never been able to do.

so lets get this straight. rings only count if you are the clear cut main option now? ok...so kobe only has 2 rings. wade already has 1. so wade can't be better than kobe because he has 1 less ring that counts now? retarded logic.

all rings count. there are just varying degrees of credit that are assigned to each player. and lets be real. the gap between wade and lebron (as if there really is one) is not even close to the size of the gap between shaq and kobe. again...LOL

so wade has better numbers....FACT
wade has performed better against similar competition....FACT
in 1 finals appearance wade trumped anything kobe has done in the finals in 7 tries....FACT

so again. what makes kobe a better player again? don't give me career resume. what makes him a better player? thats right....nothing.

they are virtually identical and if wade ends up winning 4 titles and keeps up his level of play and impact i see no reason why he wouldn't be slightly ahead of kobe or slightly behind him all time.

wade's resume for his circumstances would be better than kobe's in my opinion.

you people are just like the same hater morons that were on here saying "kobe will never win without shaq" "he's not that great and is too selfish to win" "LOL at the idea that kobe could be top 15 all time"

you remember those morons that i'm sure you all went crazy at. well....you are doing the same exact same thing to wade if you think its absurd for him to finish as a legit top 15 player of all time with a chance to crack the top 12 and surpass kobe.

i'll ask it again. what makes kobe better than wade?

its not the numbers. its not the level of play or impact. its not finals performances. its not ability to take over in the playoffs. its not level of play against the best teams/defenses.

you have nothing.

i hope someone tries to respond with spouting off how many all-star appearances or going down the list of kobe's resume. each player plays in different circumstances and those circumstances must be taken into account when judging each player. there is no set in stone criteria of what each player must have to be ranked in front of another.

again. how is kobe a better PLAYER than wade?

How are we supposed to get your point? You write 47,000 words every post. Being brief is ok.

[Harison]

To OP, no.

[Samurai Swoosh]

If LeBron wins a couple of rings, he surpasses Bird.
If LeBron wins 3 rings, he surpasses Bird. Even though he's still probably the best all around player to ever play that position. He's just got to WIN to cement his legacy. And then he truly will be KING.

The best Wade can achieve is probably 3rd best SG of all-time. He's not going to move above Jordan and Bryant by any stretch of the imagination. Best he can do is be tied to Mr. Clutch.

[knightfall88]

If LeBron wins 3 rings, he surpasses Bird. Even though he's still probably the best all around player to ever play that position. He's just got to WIN to cement his legacy. And then he truly will be KING.

The best Wade can achieve is probably 3rd best SG of all-time. He's not going to move above Jordan and Bryant by any stretch of the imagination. Best he can do is be tied to Mr. Clutch.

If he wins 3 FMVP to go with that then it might be debatable. But I don't see Lebron getting 3 FMVP.

[madmax]

If he wins 3 FMVP to go with that then it might be debatable. But I don't see Lebron getting 3 FMVP.
and why is that care to elaborate? He's the best player in the game, or are you suggesting voters would get bored voting for him all the time?:lol

[Samurai Swoosh]

If he wins 3 FMVP to go with that then it might be debatable. But I don't see Lebron getting 3 FMVP.
Why can't you see LeBron getting 3 Finals MVPs?

Hell, the way he's been playing ... he could win ANOTHER reg. season MVP this year.

You do realize that, right?

[crosso√er]

Wade is becoming what Kobe is in comparison to Jordan.
Continue with this non-sense...

So many things have to go right for Wade to ever be considered better then Kobe; but if you believe he'll have a Jordan-like stretch for the next 7-8 years then more power to you. :oldlol:

[YAWN]

gino, you say wade is going to add to his accomplishments for 6 more years... but fail to acknowledge that kobe still has 3-4 more years of all nba level play left in him too...

nothing is impossible, but its highly unlikely given Wades current circumstances that he will pass Kobe or even West.


Lebron has a chance to pass Bird... but lots of his fanboys keep proclaiming that after winning one or two he will climb over Bird on an all time list. :oldlol: Their moronic stance is hilarious, yet frustrating.

[Poochymama]

Lebron - probably

Wade - probably not

I definitely think Lebron has a legitimate shot at passing Bird. Having watched both players play, Lebron is the better player it's just a matter of accomplishments. Lebron is a better scorer/playmaker and MUCH better defender(not even close here), while Larry clearly has an edge in rebounding, passing is equal.

Wade on the other hand, has to pass Kobe. While this is certainly possible, it's a little less likely. For Wade to pass Kobe he is going to need to match Kobe in rings, which I don't see happening.

[macpierce]

not just rings, kobe's scoring output thru 15 years will never be matched by wade period.........40 pt 50 pt 60 pt 80 pt games wade has no chance in that realm...........wade has never had these barrages of scoring nights the league has seen once every 10 years or so..........wade isnt that type of player, special he is but he'll never be considered better than kobe

[lilgodfather1]

not just rings, kobe's scoring output thru 15 years will never be matched by wade period.........40 pt 50 pt 60 pt 80 pt games wade has no chance in that realm...........wade has never had these barrages of scoring nights the league has seen once every 10 years or so..........wade isnt that type of player, special he is but he'll never be considered better than kobe
Scoring is a very small part of the game. How many triple doubes does Kobe have in comparison to Wade? How many 6+ assists seasons does Kobe have, etc. Scoring is a very small part of the game.

[Hulk Hogan]

Scoring is a very small part of the game. How many triple doubes does Kobe have in comparison to Wade? How many 6+ assists seasons does Kobe have, etc. Scoring is a very small part of the game.
First of all, the duty of a shooting guard is to SCORE to ball.
That is the reason they are called "shooting" guard. If you are going to say Wade has a chance to surpass Kobe as 2nd best SG then he has to be able to score prolifically than him.

Kobe has 17 triple doubles, wade has 3.

Again Kobe has played in the triangle throughout his career, in addition Wade earlier in his career actually played the PG position!

Anyway, Welcome back to ISH bruceblitz.. Uhmm I mean... * a guy that loves watching bruceblitz videos*

Jordan has 30, 50point games.
Kobe has 24, 50 point games (and would have arguably had more if he didn't play with Shaq)

While Wade has only 3, 50 pt game (2 of them coming in OT and one in Double OT!)

The fact is, Wade pales in comparision to Kobe!

[NoGunzJustSkillz]

Wade is like a year a half younger than Kobe. I don't see Wade surpassing him...

[ginobli2311]

Sure. But your argument accounts for nothing when you look at their head to head stats in which KOBE always defends Wade and locks him down 5% below his career FG%.

http://www.basketball-reference.com/play-index/h2h_finder.cgi?request=1&p1=wadedw01&p2=bryanko01

We can use this argument because they play the same position and Kobe has always matched up against Wade.


using a 14 game sample size of head to head matchups is retarded as a main piece of evidence. is it worth something? sure. it it worth much? nah. mainly because kobe does not always defend wade.....and again...there is a lot of time left.

wade just outplayed kobe this year on christmas and locked down kobe. what if wade wins the 8 of the next 10 battles? head to head is silly...especially when its not over the course of a playoff series.


Look...to everyone:

I'm not saying its likely. I'm saying its possible. and i'm talking about ranking players....not careers.

Wade has already been slightly better or as good or slightly worse than kobe since 05. that is just a fact if you are not a biased kobe stan. wade is also already really a top 30 player ever. I think simmons had him number 29 all time already coming into this year. so don't act like i'm crazy for saying that if a ton of things come together that wade can't surpass kobe. he could.

career numbers and efficiency levels are career numbers and efficiency levels. every player has different circumstances. wade didn't get a ton of shots and didn't get to be the focal point of his team his rookie year...that lowered his numbers. the first 3 years of kobe's career are part of his career. you can't throw them out because he wasn't good enough to play big minutes and win. so what if he came out of high school? Lebron came out of high school and was light years beyond kobe in his first 3 seasons. light years.

so now you can't be great if you aren't an explosive scorer like kobe? come on now. 60 point games do not make a player great. i could sit here and say that wade is better because he's a far more willing and better passer. you can't boil it down to specific things. its about the entire body of work and a players' entire game.

i have no problem with people saying kobe is better. none. but to try and pretend that over the last 6 years (since the 05 season) that these two guys have not been neck and neck and had virtually the same impact and level of play is just false.

my point stands. IF....again....IF....wade were to win a few more titles and keep up his current career impact/numbers/level of play....and add another fmvp or 2.....he will be right there with kobe as the 2nd best sg ever.

but again. this is why we hate stans so much. its all right there. you can't really deny it. but people want to diminish wade. like his 06 finals performance. if its so easy...why didn't kobe do that to a worse team overall in the suns? why didn't kobe just say "**** this....we aren't losing"....because he couldn't. why didn't kobe dominate the pistons like wade did? because he couldn't. why didn't kobe dominate the celtics like wade did? because he couldn't. why didn't kobe get along with shaq the way wade did? because he couldn't.

there is so much more than just surface level issues. dwade's career is not over. in fact, he probably (if healthy) has 5 more great years left after this one. so lets see what he does.

[Punx]

using a 14 game sample size of head to head matchups is retarded as a main piece of evidence. is it worth something? sure. it it worth much? nah. mainly because kobe does not always defend wade.....and again...there is a lot of time left.

wade just outplayed kobe this year on christmas and locked down kobe. what if wade wins the 8 of the next 10 battles? head to head is silly...especially when its not over the course of a playoff series.


Look...to everyone:

I'm not saying its likely. I'm saying its possible. and i'm talking about ranking players....not careers.

Wade has already been slightly better or as good or slightly worse than kobe since 05. that is just a fact if you are not a biased kobe stan. wade is also already really a top 30 player ever. I think simmons had him number 29 all time already coming into this year. so don't act like i'm crazy for saying that if a ton of things come together that wade can't surpass kobe. he could.

career numbers and efficiency levels are career numbers and efficiency levels. every player has different circumstances. wade didn't get a ton of shots and didn't get to be the focal point of his team his rookie year...that lowered his numbers. the first 3 years of kobe's career are part of his career. you can't throw them out because he wasn't good enough to play big minutes and win. so what if he came out of high school? Lebron came out of high school and was light years beyond kobe in his first 3 seasons. light years.

so now you can't be great if you aren't an explosive scorer like kobe? come on now. 60 point games do not make a player great. i could sit here and say that wade is better because he's a far more willing and better passer. you can't boil it down to specific things. its about the entire body of work and a players' entire game.

i have no problem with people saying kobe is better. none. but to try and pretend that over the last 6 years (since the 05 season) that these two guys have not been neck and neck and had virtually the same impact and level of play is just false.

my point stands. IF....again....IF....wade were to win a few more titles and keep up his current career impact/numbers/level of play....and add another fmvp or 2.....he will be right there with kobe as the 2nd best sg ever.

but again. this is why we hate stans so much. its all right there. you can't really deny it. but people want to diminish wade. like his 06 finals performance. if its so easy...why didn't kobe do that to a worse team overall in the suns? why didn't kobe just say "**** this....we aren't losing"....because he couldn't. why didn't kobe dominate the pistons like wade did? because he couldn't. why didn't kobe dominate the celtics like wade did? because he couldn't. why didn't kobe get along with shaq the way wade did? because he couldn't.

there is so much more than just surface level issues. dwade's career is not over. in fact, he probably (if healthy) has 5 more great years left after this one. so lets see what he does.

Damn son the amount of words typed by this dude in this thread are longer than essays I wrote in highschool:hammerhead: I lurk arond alot on this forum and I notice you write storys in every kobe related thread. If you mad at kobe stans just ignore them.

[Hulk Hogan]

Damn son the amount of words typed by this dude in this thread are longer than essays I wrote in highschool:hammerhead: I lurk arond alot on this forum and I notice you write storys in every kobe related thread. If you mad at kobe stans just ignore them.
:oldlol:

[mashbelly]

Damn son the amount of words typed by this dude in this thread are longer than essays I wrote in highschool:hammerhead: I lurk arond alot on this forum and I notice you write storys in every kobe related thread. If you mad at kobe stans just ignore them.

it's his therapy

[mashbelly]

:oldlol:

kobe stan

[ShaqAttack3234]

Bird is a top 3-4 player all time, IMO so I'll have to see how the rest of Lebron's career goes before entertaining the thought of Lebron passing him.

I don't see Wade passing Kobe on my list. A few more elite seasons and another title and the West vs Wade debates will be very interesting, though.

[StillKill24]

kobe stan
ashbelly stan

[ginobli2311]

the funny thing about this whole debate:

7 years ago when shaq left people were spewing all of this bs about how kobe would never lead a team to a title and never even crack the top 20 all time. it was so annoying. i never have really loved kobe, but i used to argue for hours after the 04 finals when people were using that one series to try and sum up kobe's entire career. same thing about 06 when they collapsed in the playoffs. same thing with 08. you people need to learn from history.

who here thought kobe would win back to back titles and olympic gold and play this well after getting destroyed in the 08 finals? things happen. great players find a way to do great things.

i see no reason why kobe should be vaulted up to some higher tier than wade simply because wade is about as good as kobe. they impact the game in such similar fashions and it shows.

the same things were said about jordan. "he'll never win" "he's too selfish" "once his legs go he'll suck"

do you know how many hours i spent arguing with my dad and brothers about jordan? growing up they laughed at me when i said he would win titles and go down as one of the best ever. they said bird and magic were much better and that basketball is a team game and mj could never learn that. LOL...jordan is now recognized as arguably the greatest athlete of all time.

now the same thing is being said about lebron. he can't win. he'll never do this and he'll never do that. and its so dumb. lebron is a great player. wade is a great player. kobe is a great player. when i watch all three of them i see so many similarities. do you really want to bet against wade/lebron the way all the moronic haters beat against kobe? more power to you if you do.

but i'm betting you'll be wrong. and i'm betting that in 8 years we'll be talking about wade/lebron/kobe in very similar terms with 4 to 6 titles for all of them and 3 of the top 15 players ever. where the rank specifically is pretty much irrelevant. you could make an argument for kobe to be top 7 (although i don't agree with it) right now....or you could make an argument for kobe to be only top 14 (although i don't agree with it) right now.

you people act like these rankings are set in stone and nobody can surpass other players. wade is entering the defining part of his career. what if he sucks ass? what if he's legendary? what if he's just average? we don't know yet.

so stop trying to say its not possible for him to challenge the all time greats. it is.

[ginobli2311]

also.

do you guys realize that kobe didn't become an elite player in the league until his 5th season? kobe was very good in his 4th year, but not elite.

wade was an elite player in the league starting his 2nd year.

if you compared them as players solely off their first 7 years, wade destroys kobe.

so lets tap the breaks a little here and see how this plays out.

[G-Funk]

MJ>Kobe>West>Wade

Bird>Lebron

Bird didn't need the 2nd best player in the NBA. Specially in a era when it was more difficult to win...

[G-Funk]

BTW Did Kobe retire? Kobe still hasa shot at winning 2 more rings...

Can you imagine Wade surpassing that? But it's ironic how the only ppl who think so are the 3 of the 5 biggest Kobe haters on here. Not even Heats biggest fan thinks so.

[G-Funk]

WADE




03-04 Mia 61 56 34.9 0.465 0.302 0.747 1.4 2.7 4.0 4.5 1.4 0.6 3.21 2.30 16.2
04-05 Mia 77 77 38.6 0.478 0.289 0.762 1.4 3.7 5.2 6.8 1.6 1.1 4.17 2.99 24.1
05-06 Mia 75 75 38.6 0.495 0.171 0.783 1.4 4.3 5.7 6.7 2.0 0.8 3.57 2.89 27.2
06-07 Mia 51 50 37.9 0.491 0.266 0.807 1.0 3.7 4.7 7.5 2.1 1.2 4.24 2.29 27.4
07-08 Mia 51 49 38.3 0.469 0.286 0.758 0.9 3.3 4.2 6.9 1.7 0.7 4.39 2.69 24.6
08-09 Mia 79 79 38.6 0.491 0.317 0.765 1.1 3.9 5.0 7.5 2.2 1.3 3.44 2.25 30.2
09-10 Mia 77 77 36.3 0.476 0.300 0.761 1.4 3.5 4.8 6.5 1.8 1.1 3.27 2.35 26.6
10-11 Mia 30 30 36.0 0.485 0.333 0.719 1.6 4.8 6.4 4.3 1.5 1.0 3.13 2.50 23.3


KOBE


00-01 LAL 68 68 41.0 0.464 0.305 0.853 1.5 4.3 5.9 5.0 1.7 0.6 3.24 3.26 28.5
01-02 LAL 80 80 38.3 0.469 0.250 0.829 1.4 4.1 5.5 5.5 1.5 0.4 2.79 2.85 25.2
02-03 LAL 82 82 41.5 0.451 0.383 0.843 1.3 5.6 6.9 5.9 2.2 0.8 3.51 2.66 30.0
03-04 LAL 65 64 37.7 0.438 0.327 0.852 1.6 3.9 5.5 5.1 1.7 0.4 2.63 2.71 24.0
04-05 LAL 66 66 40.7 0.433 0.339 0.816 1.4 4.5 5.9 6.0 1.3 0.8 4.09 2.64 27.6
05-06 LAL 80 80 41.0 0.450 0.347 0.850 0.9 4.4 5.3 4.5 1.8 0.4 3.13 2.91 35.4
06-07 LAL 77 77 40.8 0.463 0.344 0.868 1.0 4.7 5.7 5.4 1.4 0.5 3.31 2.66 31.6
07-08 LAL 82 82 38.9 0.459 0.361 0.840 1.1 5.2 6.3 5.4 1.8 0.5 3.13 2.77 28.3
08-09 LAL 82 82 36.1 0.467 0.351 0.856 1.1 4.1 5.2 4.9 1.5 0.4 2.56 2.30 26.8
09-10 LAL 73 73 38.8 0.456 0.329 0.811 1.1 4.3 5.4 5.0 1.6 0.3 3.19 2.56 27.0
10-11 LAL 30 30 33.2 0.447 0.326 0.843 1.0 4.0 5.1 4.6 1.3 0.1 2.87 2.17 25.4

[guy]

also.

do you guys realize that kobe didn't become an elite player in the league until his 5th season? kobe was very good in his 4th year, but not elite.

wade was an elite player in the league starting his 2nd year.

if you compared them as players solely off their first 7 years, wade destroys kobe.

so lets tap the breaks a little here and see how this plays out.

Kobe's been elite ever since. This is his 11th season playing at an elite level and I don't think that will stop for another 2-3 seasons. Wade's been elite since his 2nd season like you said, but he also had a season and a half where he definitely wasn't elite due to injuries. You can say this is his 6th season playing at an elite level. If he were to play the next 5 seasons at an elite level (making it 11), he will be 34 when it happens. Does anyone honestly think Wade will be elite for that long? Thats the best case scenario for him too. The fact is he's not durable and he isn't known for a great work ethic. I know people will say it was only those few years where he was injured, and he's been healthy ever since. But the guy is ALWAYS dealing with nagging injuries. Thats not a good sign. And you can say the same about Kobe, but it really doesn't seem to bother him that much (meaning either he hides it better, or they just aren't as serious.) In fact, you can argue that his team was affected in 05, 09, and 2010 by his injuries in the playoffs even though he played the whole season. I see Wade's level of play going the same path as AI, T-Mac, and/or Vince, not Kobe, Dirk, Pierce, or Allen.

[ginobli2311]

Kobe's been elite ever since. This is his 11th season playing at an elite level and I don't think that will stop for another 2-3 seasons. Wade's been elite since his 2nd season like you said, but he also had a season and a half where he definitely wasn't elite due to injuries. You can say this is his 6th season playing at an elite level. If he were to play the next 5 seasons at an elite level (making it 11), he will be 34 when it happens. Does anyone honestly think Wade will be elite for that long? Thats the best case scenario for him too. The fact is he's not durable and he isn't known for a great work ethic. I know people will say it was only those few years where he was injured, and he's been healthy ever since. But the guy is ALWAYS dealing with nagging injuries. Thats not a good sign. And you can say the same about Kobe, but it really doesn't seem to bother him that much (meaning either he hides it better, or they just aren't as serious.) In fact, you can argue that his team was affected in 05, 09, and 2010 by his injuries in the playoffs even though he played the whole season. I see Wade's level of play going the same path as AI, T-Mac, and/or Vince, not Kobe, Dirk, Pierce, or Allen.

injuries could derail wade. i've said this time and time again. but if you are going to talk about wade having a bad year and a half then you have to bring up kobe in the 04/05 season. he was often injured and not elite. his team with butler and odom was ten games under .500 when kobe played. that is not elite.

that is why i didn't bring it up for wade or kobe. this will be kobe's 11th season as an elite player and wade's 7th. thats all i was pointing out.

you simply can't bring up wade's 08 season without bringing up kobe's 05.

[ginobli2311]

WADE




KOBE


the point? wade is starting his 7th elite season while kobe is starting his 11th. if you compared the first 7 years of their respective careers wade would be ahead huge....huge.

and again. ring count is not all that matters. i don't know why everyone can't get over this with kobe. hondo won 8 rings in 16 seasons. will kobe surpass that? nope. so again...is hondo better than kobe? similar playoff numbers and overall game and impact and hondo has 3 more titles.

wade does not have to win 6 rings to surpass kobe. he has to continue his high level of play and win a few more titles. but the main thing has/will be his level of play and impact.

and if you just go off that....wade has been kobe's equal or slightly better or slightly worse over the last 6 years.

this is a hypothetical about what would happen IF wade were to win 4 titles and at least 1 more finals mvp and keep up his current level of play.

yes...its a big IF, but certainly within the realm of possibilities. and if wade did the above....at worst he'd be considered the 12th best player ever.

so stop ****ing acting like this a joke thread or that wade vs kobe isn't a legit comparison.

again. first 7 years of careers? wade absolutely destroys kobe in terms of level of play and impact. its not even close. same for lebron vs kobe.

so who knows what will happen in the next half of their careers. i never expected wade/lebron to be this good....so i'm not going to set limits on what they could accomplish on the same team in the primes of their careers.

[G-Funk]

the point? wade is starting his 7th elite season while kobe is starting his 11th. if you compared the first 7 years of their respective careers wade would be ahead huge....huge.





so stop ****ing acting like this a joke thread or that wade vs kobe isn't a legit comparison.

again. first 7 years of careers? wade absolutely destroys kobe in terms of level of play and impact. its not even close. same for lebron vs kobe.




NICE, AT TRYING TO COMPARE A SKINNY UNDEVELOPED 18-21 YEAR OLD TO A FULLY DEVELOPED 22-26YR OLD. JUST TO FIT UR AGENDA. COMPARE THEM BY AGE OR YOU SCARED? YOU SCARED HUH?


KOBE WAS SO GOOD AT AGE 18 HE WAS THE FIRST GUARD TO GET DRAFTED. AT AGE 18 WADE COULDN'T EVEN DREAM OF PLAYING IN THE NBA. WADE WAS NOT EVEN GOOD ENOUGH TO PLAY IN THE LEAGUE AT AGE 21.

18-22 KOBE>>>>WADE

22-29 KOBE>>>>WADE

AND BY THE LOOK AT WADE'S STATS

29-35+ KOBE>>>>WADE

[Jacks3]

Wade has zero chance of surpassing Bryant.

These Wade homers are delusional.

Even if you assume he wins 3-5 rings, it still won't mater because he's the second guy next to the best player in the world.

He's never going to have multiple rings as the clear #1 like Kobe.

Take Wade off the Heat and they'd still win 60+ wins and have a very good chance at a championship.

And dude is already 29.:oldlol:

[ginobli2311]

NICE, AT TRYING TO COMPARE A SKINNY UNDEVELOPED 18-21 YEAR OLD TO A FULLY DEVELOPED 22-26YR OLD. JUST TO FIT UR AGENDA. COMPARE THEM BY AGE OR YOU SCARED? YOU SCARED HUH?


KOBE WAS SO GOOD AT AGE 18 HE WAS THE FIRST GUARD TO GET DRAFTED. AT AGE 18 WADE COULDN'T EVEN DREAM OF PLAYING IN THE NBA. WADE WAS NOT EVEN GOOD ENOUGH TO PLAY IN THE LEAGUE AT AGE 21.

18-22 KOBE>>>>WADE

22-29 KOBE>>>>WADE

AND BY THE LOOK AT WADE'S STATS

29-35+ KOBE>>>>WADE


comparing by age really makes no sense because wade wasn't even in the league.

so is KG better than kobe because he turned into a better player quicker. or how about lebron? lebron destroys kobe on an age basis. i think that is a silly comparison.

you should compare the number of quality years each player has regardless of age. is nash better than other players because he's better at age this age? how about kg over duncan or dirk over kg and duncan. is dirk now better because he's clealry still elite while duncan has seriously fallen off.

[ginobli2311]

Wade has zero chance of surpassing Bryant.

These Wade homers are delusional.

Even if you assume he wins 3-5 rings, it still won't mater because he's the second guy next to the best player in the world.

He's never going to have multiple rings as the clear #1 like Kobe.

Take Wade off the Heat and they'd still win 60+ wins and have a very good chance at a championship.

And dude is already 29.:oldlol:

wade can't surpass kobe's career. he can surpass him as a player though.

two completely different things. you fail to grasp this.

wade is starting his 7th year as an elite player. kobe is starting his 11th. that is only a 4 year difference. when you compare players and rank them its not always about rings/accolades/point totals. you have to take each player into account.

if kobe plays til he's 40 but only has 12 elite seasons...does that make him better than jordan? or shaq? or bird or magic? or wilt?

that makes no sense.

the two players have nearly identical numbers...although wade's are slightly better and wade's next 3 years will likely be his best of his career in terms of stats plus winning.

if wade puts together 12 or so elite seasons and wins more titles he'll be right there all time.

christ....bird only played at an elite level for 12 seasons and he's a top 7 player all time. why is that ok for bird and not wade? makes no sense at all.

[Jacks3]

Don't see how Wade can surpass Kobe at all considering the consensus is that Kobe had the better prime/peak AND totally destroys him in terms of longevity and accolades/achievements.

Now, it's certainly fine to think Wade has the better peak/prime (though I would disagree) but the difference is so small either way that Kobe's HUGE advantage in longevity/accolades/achievements would trump it anyway.

Personally, I don't see it happening at all.

Especially considering Wade won't be the best player on his team for the rest of his prime.

Plus, Kobe is still going strong (though he's obviously slowing down).

[LA KB24]

Wade needs to work on his mid-game to pass up Kobe. He's not going to have that blinding speed for too many more years, and he's pretty heavily reliant on it.

Kobe & Jordan both developed their game to compensate for aging, I haven't seen that progression so much with Wade.
Funny thing is, Wade has a better post game than LeBron. :oldlol:

[LA KB24]

Hulk Hogan = Bladers ... ???

[G-Funk]

comparing by age really makes no sense because wade wasn't even in the league.

so is KG better than kobe because he turned into a better player quicker. or how about lebron? lebron destroys kobe on an age basis. i think that is a silly comparison.

you should compare the number of quality years each player has regardless of age. is nash better than other players because he's better at age this age? how about kg over duncan or dirk over kg and duncan. is dirk now better because he's clealry still elite while duncan has seriously fallen off.




Both KG & Lebron had a better body at that age... ur giving me the casual fan argument. As if I don't know the different type of circumstances these players were in. But i'm not biting on it maybe a casual fan will.


Comparing players by age makes alot more sense...

Just like yo can't compare a 30yr prime player to a 40yr old player, yo

[LA KB24]

just because wade went to college does not mean he can't surpass kobe. what you reference is how you would rank a career...not a player. there is a difference.

wade's numbers and efficiency levels will be better than kobe's if both maintain their current career averages. the premise is that wade wins 3 more titles and at least 1 more finals mvp. if that happens it would be very likely that wade's level of play in the nba finals would blow kobe's out of the water considering wade already owns one of the best finals performances of all time.

wade has consistently played better against the elite defenses in the league as well.

in 6 years (if he remains healthy) wade will be a 12 time all star and add 6 more all-nba and all defense honors.

either way it would be very very close between the two players.

the career averages would both essentially be 25/5/5...with wade being more efficient and less selfish.

its really not far fetched at all.

and that is just the numbers aspect. anyone with a set of eyes knows that when wade is healthy he's one of the best players ever. most already have him in the top 35 all time because of how good he's been. if he adds 6 more great years with some honors and titles he'll be right there with the 15 best of all time.

its not a knock on kobe...kobe is amazing, but wade has been just as good or better since the 05 season (wade's 2nd year)

wade was better in 05 and 06
kobe was better in 07 and 08
09 and 10 are a toss up to me but i prefer wade.

now wade has an elite team that should win multiple titles over the next 6 years. if he doesn't. then he won't get much all time greatest sg talk after jordan. if he does? he'll sky rocket up the all time rankings because there simply aren't many guys all time that could dominate from the perimeter like him at his efficiency that won multiple titles.
Look, you know I love Wade and I think he has a case for best player in the game when 100% healthy...

But.. what makes you think Wade is going to continue his elite play when he's in his 30's? I think his body will deteriorate faster than Kobe's due to his style of play. He doesn't have a polished offensive game like Kobe, so I don't see him being able to adjust once he starts declining athletically.

When it's all said and done...
1. MJ
|
|
|
|
|
2. Kobe
3. Wade

No shame in being the 3rd greatest SG OF ALL TIME.

[ronniec]

A lot of people in this thread need to look at Larry Bird's playoff stats.

Dude is unpassable as the best SF ever. Clutch, best J, great post-up, ridiculous hustle.....best passing forward ever.

LeBron gets half his assists from open 3-PT shooters LOL Look at some of these passes by Larry Bird...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EhnRtgBGMl4

In just a few minutes of video, it shows why Bird is the greatest SF of all time... Lebron??? come on!!! Except driving to the basket and dunk by his pure strength, what else he is beter than Bird?

[ginobli2311]

Look, you know I love Wade and I think he has a case for best player in the game when 100% healthy...

But.. what makes you think Wade is going to continue his elite play when he's in his 30's? I think his body will deteriorate faster than Kobe's due to his style of play. He doesn't have a polished offensive game like Kobe, so I don't see him being able to adjust once he starts declining athletically.

When it's all said and done...
1. MJ
|
|
|
|
|
2. Kobe
3. Wade

No shame in being the 3rd greatest SG OF ALL TIME.


i can't see the future. and i don't think wade will surpass kobe in terms of career ranking

however. in the hypothetical put out in this thread it assumed wade won 3 more titles and 1 more finals mvp in the next 6 years. which i think is reasonable.

and if the above were to happen....i honestly don't know who i would rank 2nd all time...wade or kobe.

put it this way. lets say kobe winds up with 14 elite years and wade winds up with 11 elite years. so what? is that enough to be the difference? if so....then KG should have a legit case against duncan if kg wins one more title because KG has seriously outlasted duncan in terms of quality years in the league.

i just don't look at it that way. i personally like to look at the 10 to 12 best years of a players' career and see what their level of play and impact was and then look at things like playoff performances/titles/accolades/stats/...then i just simply evaluate them in terms of the "eye test"

and wade would pass all of those measures for me. if he plays 11 plus elite years and has slightly better numbers than kobe and has at least 4 titles...what is keeping him behind kobe? nothing for me simply because i think wade is the superior player when i watch the game. the numbers back me up as well.

this is not a hate thread on kobe. its a legit discussion about what wade needs to do to surpass him as a PLAYER...not in terms of who had the better career.

[guy]

injuries could derail wade. i've said this time and time again. but if you are going to talk about wade having a bad year and a half then you have to bring up kobe in the 04/05 season. he was often injured and not elite. his team with butler and odom was ten games under .500 when kobe played. that is not elite.

that is why i didn't bring it up for wade or kobe. this will be kobe's 11th season as an elite player and wade's 7th. thats all i was pointing out.

you simply can't bring up wade's 08 season without bringing up kobe's 05.

And the Heat were 30 games under .500 when Wade played in 08. Wade's 08 season is much worse then Kobe's 05. Whatever the case, either way, its highly doubtful Wade will have the longevity that Kobe has. With similar level of play at their best, similar achievements, but Kobe's most likely greater longevity, its highly doubtful Wade surpasses Kobe.