What makes Kevin Durant better than Derrick Rose?

[2010splash]

I see on all these people's list Kevin Durant listed as a top 5 player. What's with this BS?

Do you think it would be that hard for Rose to average 28 ppg if all he did was jack up shots?

What's harder to do, score 28 ppg and average 3 apg or score 24 ppg and average 8 apg? You really think if Rose focused as little on getting others involved as Durant does that he couldn't average a pitiful assist total and score a whole lot more?

And please don't tell me Durant is a good defender. Last I checked he was starting for the 16th ranked defense in the league. Rose starts for the #1 ranked defense.

And please don't bring up shooting. How is Durant a better shooter? is shooting 32% from three somehow better than shooting 38% from three? :confusedshrug:

Enough with the jockriding of Kevin Durant. Overrated as they come.....

[KingBeasley08]

He's KD baby.

[az00m]

he has a youtube chan.

[NorthernTouch]

DRose has mad dickriders lately....

[hkfosho]

inb4 Joyner with is durantclopedia textbook tucked under his arms ready to pounce on doubters faster than a b!tching roadrunner :oldlol:

[YouCallILose]

Durant averages 28 ppg on 20 FGA

Rose averages 24 ppg on 20 FGA

/thread

[CHi1PriDe]

oh gawd... in b4 youcallilose

but drose is actually starting to get calls now :applause:

[XxSMSxX]

I see on all these people's list Kevin Durant listed as a top 5 player. What's with this BS?

Do you think it would be that hard for Rose to average 28 ppg if all he did was jack up shots?

What's harder to do, score 28 ppg and average 3 apg or score 24 ppg and average 8 apg? You really think if Rose focused as little on getting others involved as Durant does that he couldn't average a pitiful assist total and score a whole lot more?

And please don't tell me Durant is a good defender. Last I checked he was starting for the 16th ranked defense in the league. Rose starts for the #1 ranked defense.

And please don't bring up shooting. How is Durant a better shooter? is shooting 32% from three somehow better than shooting 38% from three? :confusedshrug:

Enough with the jockriding of Kevin Durant. Overrated as they come.....

They take the same amount of shots per game

[VishaltotheG]

If Rose sustains his play for the rest of the season, he is in the top 5 for me. Durant is playing like bullsh*t

[2010splash]

Durant averages 28 ppg on 20 FGA

Rose averages 24 ppg on 20 FGA

/thread
Yeah, with an amazing 3 apg :roll:

[YouCallILose]

If Rose sustains his play for the rest of the season, he is in the top 5 for me. Durant is playing like bullsh*t

Durant has averaged 30 ppg 6 rpg and 3.5 apg since December on 52 FG% 40 3P%

GTFO idiot

[Mr. I'm So Rad]

Depends on how you judge players

Some people use stats
Some people use what they see
Some people just dickride

[YouCallILose]

Yeah, with an amazing 3 apg :roll:

he plays SF you imbecile. Durant=3rd in the NBA in assists among SF's. Rose=8th in the NBA in assists among PG's

any other bright ideas?

[B-Easy]

theyre both mostly scorers .. and Durant is just way better at it.

Watch FIBA last year .. when you see guys as teammates in competitive games it gives you better perspective .. and Durant was clearly head and shoulders the leader and best player on that team.

[Nets fan 93]

Yeah, with an amazing 3 apg :roll:
Kinda hard to get assists when you have a PG like Russell Westbrook on your team.

[Mr. I'm So Rad]

Yeah, with an amazing 3 apg :roll:

:facepalm its not his job to get assists. His job as a SF is to score and rebound. Rose is a PG. He is supposed to get more assists than Durant. If Durant averaged nearly as many assists as Rose, then that would make Rose a shitty PG, not make Durant a good passer. Westbrook handles the ball and gets the assists. That's like saying Chauncey Billups > Carmelo Anthony because he gets more assists...

[VishaltotheG]

Durant has averaged 30 ppg 6 rpg and 3.5 apg since December on 52 FG% 40 3P%

GTFO idiot

:lol

[hkfosho]

:lol
:lol

[2010splash]

Durant really can't do anything but score. Really he's not even that good of a shooter. (low 3-pt %).

Rose is the better all around player.

[YouCallILose]

:lol

what are you retarded? December 1->today is like 25 games which is more than half of the season thus far

Durant struggling is putting up 28.2 ppg on 20 FGA

Rose apparently playing god mode is averaging 24.2 ppg on 20 FGA

GTFO

[NoEasy9]

The only aspect where Durant is better than Rose is scoring. Derrick Rose is the better player. One is a proven playoff performer, the other is a choker. One can do more offensively than score the ball, the other cant. Durant has been overrated for a while now and shit like this is why.

[XxSMSxX]

what are you retarded? December 1->today is like 25 games which is more than half of the season thus far

Durant struggling is putting up 28.2 ppg on 20 FGA

Rose apparently playing god mode is averaging 24.2 ppg on 20 FGA

GTFO

I love joyner's angry ass attitude in 90% of his posts :roll:

[Walduś]

6'11 jump shooter vs a chucking pg

[hkfosho]

I love joyner's angry ass attitude in 90% of his posts :roll:

Even at times of adversity, Joyner manages to make us smile with his childish and blasphemous remarks :lol

[Bigsmoke]

Meh... KD is still a lil better.

[hkfosho]

6'11 jump shooter vs a chucking pg

6'11 jump shooter & "chucking pg" > crybaby top 10 of all time wannabe Kobe Cryant :lol

[VishaltotheG]

what are you retarded? December 1->today is like 25 games which is more than half of the season thus far

Durant struggling is putting up 28.2 ppg on 20 FGA

Rose apparently playing god mode is averaging 24.2 ppg on 20 FGA

GTFO

8 assist and 5 rebounds to Durant's 0.0000001 assist and like 4 rebounds?

[Walduś]

6'11 jump shooter & "chucking pg" > crybaby top 10 of all time wannabe Kobe Cryant :lol
:rolleyes:

[XxSMSxX]

6'11 jump shooter & "chucking pg" > crybaby top 10 of all time wannabe Kobe Cryant :lol


Shots fired!

The Bryant Brigade shall be hear soon enough

[hkfosho]

Shots fired!

The Bryant Brigade shall be hear soon enough

It has begun

[Batz]

Kinda hard to get assists when you have a PG like Russell Westbrook on your team.
Kinda easy to get assists with 32% USG

[KingBeasley08]

:lol
to his defense, you did say lately :confusedshrug:

[KingBeasley08]

Personally. I think Durant is a better player. not by much tho. drose has been a beast this season :bowdown:

[VishaltotheG]

to his defense, you did say lately :confusedshrug:

when did I say lately?

[M.V.P]

Kinda easy to get assists with 32% USG
Usage is FGA + TO, has nothing to do with assists. If a guy shoots and drives everytime and gets stripped once or twice, he'll have a high usage rate.

For this topic, so far Rose has played about as well as Durant. Durant by the end of the season though will probably end up being viewed as the better player, but so far, Rose has a slight advantage.

[Rose]

Welllllllllll
TS%
/joyner.

[The_Yearning]

Durant averages 28 ppg on 20 FGA

Rose averages 24 ppg on 20 FGA

/thread

You also forgot to add Rose gets maybe 5 free throws a game compared to Durants 12 a game.

[YouCallILose]

I particularly enjoy how Rose is apparently a more complete player than Durant

Durant is a better defender who averages 1.2 SPG & 1 BPG

Rose is a worse defender who averaged 1.1 SPG & .5 BPG

Durant scores 4 more ppg on MUCH better efficiency

Durant averages 2 more RPG

Durant ranks 3rd in the league in assists per game @ his position
Rose ranks 8th in the league in assists per game @ his position

Durant is one of the best players in the league @ playing off the ball
Rose doesn't even know what off the ball means

Bulls fans are such a fcking joke

[Kblaze8855]

I find it kinda odd that guys who get fouled(or force a foul call somehow) taking a shot have people pretend they never took a shot at all. If you take 20 shots and 10-12 free throws you probably made 23-25 efforts to score by shooting at the basket. That you got brushed one some doesnt mean the play didnt happen.

I wish we had ISH around back in the day with stat freaks pointing out that Dantley was scoring 31 a game on 18 shots acting like he was the best player in the league. Or Karl Malone scoring 31 a game on 19. Pointing out that Jordan never even took as few as 19 shots a game till he was 39 even though he scored under the 31 they managed on 19 or less 5 times(not counting 86 and 95 even).

Id love to see a topic from 92 with "Jordan is scoring 30...but hes taking 23 shots a game! Karl Malone is at 28...on FOUR less shots! And he has a higher TS%! And a higher efg% even though Jordan is a guard and gets 3s! But Jordan is the best scorer in the league? Lol. Let me explain the compumetrics that make that a joke".

[YouCallILose]

I find it kinda odd that guys who get fouled(or force a foul call somehow) taking a shot have people pretend they never took a shot at all. If you take 20 shots and 10-12 free throws you probably made 23-25 efforts to score by shooting at the basket. That you got brushed one some doesnt mean the play didnt happen.

I wish we had ISH around back in the day with stat freaks pointing out that Dantley was scoring 31 a game on 18 shots acting like he was the best player in the league. Or Karl Malone scoring 31 a game on 19. Pointing out that Jordan never even took as few as 19 shots a game till he was 39 even though he scored under the 31 they managed on 19 or less 5 times(not counting 86 and 95 even).

Id love to see a topic from 92 with "Jordan is scoring 30...but hes taking 23 shots a game! Karl Malone is at 28...on FOUR less shots! And he has a higher TS%! And a higher efg% even though Jordan is a guard and gets 3s! But Jordan is the best scorer in the league? Lol. Let me explain the compumetrics that make that a joke".

durant has a higher FG%, eFG%, TS%, PPS, and whatever the hell else you want.

[Kblaze8855]

And Karl Malone in 92 had higher numbers in all of those than Jordan. I didnt know it...but I wish I did. I could have stopped caring about them 20 years earlier.

Oh and he does not have higher version of "whatever the hell else you want". Because I want to win. Id like to be able to rely on my guy when it matters. I dont care if Karl has higher...everything shooting. I dont care about his PPS. If I need my best player to go back to back to back on 3 posessions to keep my season going because everyone else is having an off night...Jordan can do that for me on a pretty regular basis. Karl can...sometimes. Far less.

What do all those numbers matter when you are still somehow less reliable?

Has nothing to do with Rose or Durant. I dont care if anyone wants Durant. I wouldnt trade rose for him. But I dont care if his fans owuldnt trade him for Rose. Irrelevant shit to me.

But if the reasons one way or another are a string of numbers nobody in the real world gives a **** about....and nobody needed to know who the best was for the last 60 years...I just find it odd.

Just...odd.

There are basketball reasons to take either one of them. No doubt a case could be made by someone actually talking about basketball skills. But the love of numbers push such issues to the back and leave the primary cases being made on TI-83s instead of by pointing out who plays basketball best on the floor. All our numbers combined might account for 45 seconds of 40 minutes of gameplay and people will still lean on them as if they have nothing better. I bet in 20 years we weont even have highlights of games. Just a box score with 38 stats scroll by as Sportscenter douchebags scream about some guys absurd PPHOLA(Points per heartbeat over league average) rating. These are the end times for people who...just like basketball.

And I bet I was way off on the Ti-83 wasnt I? What is the standard now? I believe I saw a few Ti-86s in classrooms before I was done with school. I could see you knowing such a thing. Im...quite old it seems.

[Rose]

And Karl Malone in 92 had higher numbers in all of those than Jordan. I didnt know it...but I wish I did. I could have stopped caring about them 20 years earlier.

Oh and he does not have higher version of "whatever the hell else you want". Because I want to win. Id like to be able to rely on my guy when it matters. I dont care if Karl has higher...everything shooting. I dont care about his PPS. If I need my best player to go back to back to back on 3 posessions to keep my season going because everyone else is having an off night...Jordan can do that for me on a pretty regular basis. Karl can...sometimes. Far less.

What do all those numbers matter when you are still somehow less reliable?

Has nothing to do with Rose or Durant. I dont care if anyone wants Durant. I wouldnt trade rose for him. But I dont care if his fans owuldnt trade him for Rose. Irrelevant shit to me.

But if the reasons one way or another are a string of numbers nobody in the real world gives a **** about....and nobody needed to know who the best was for the last 60 years...I just find it odd.

Just...odd.

There are basketball reasons to take either one of them. No doubt a case could be made by someone actually talking about basketball skills. But the love of numbers push such issues to the back and leave the primary cases being made on TI-83s instead of by pointing out who plays basketball best on the floor. All our numbers combined might account for 45 seconds of 40 minutes of gameplay and people will still lean on them as if they have nothing better. I bet in 20 years we weont even have highlights of games. Just a box score with 38 stats scroll by as Sportscenter douchebags scream about some guys absurd PPHOLA(Points per heartbeat over league average) rating. These are the end times for people who...just like basketball.

And I bet I was way off on the Ti-83 wasnt I? What is the standard now? I believe I saw a few Ti-86s in classrooms before I was done with school. I could see you knowing such a thing. Im...quite old it seems.
great post.:bowdown:

and I think ti-84 is the standard now.

[magnax1]

I don't know. They're pretty equal, but based on a somewhat small sample size KD seems like a chocker and D-Rose seems like the opposite. I'm going to reserve my judgement of both of them until they play some meaningful playoff games though.

[Doranku]

Per 40?

[2010splash]

If Rose got the calls Kevin "playoff choker" Durant gets, he'd probably be averaging 27 ppg and 8 apg right now.

Notice how all Durant homers can point to is scoring. Please, his defense stinks. His team ranks a whopping 16th defensively. Rose's team ranks 1st. It sure as hell can't be all Carlos Boozer and Kurt Thomas.

What does Kevin Durant do in the playoffs? Ask the Lakers last year when he single handedly lost them the series with his pitiful 35% FG shooting on 20+ FGA/game.:oldlol:

[az00m]

I particularly enjoy how Rose is apparently a more complete player than Durant

Durant is a better defender who averages 1.2 SPG & 1 BPG

Rose is a worse defender who averaged 1.1 SPG & .5 BPG

Durant scores 4 more ppg on MUCH better efficiency

Durant averages 2 more RPG

Durant ranks 3rd in the league in assists per game @ his position
Rose ranks 8th in the league in assists per game @ his position

Durant is one of the best players in the league @ playing off the ball
Rose doesn't even know what off the ball means

Bulls fans are such a fcking joke

Dennis rodman, a player which won 2 defense player of the year awards averaged under 1 block and 1 steal. Also arguably one of the best all around defenders of all time So please dont say that bull shit about who has more steals/blocks

[yeaaaman]

And Karl Malone in 92 had higher numbers in all of those than Jordan. I didnt know it...but I wish I did. I could have stopped caring about them 20 years earlier.

Oh and he does not have higher version of "whatever the hell else you want". Because I want to win. Id like to be able to rely on my guy when it matters. I dont care if Karl has higher...everything shooting. I dont care about his PPS. If I need my best player to go back to back to back on 3 posessions to keep my season going because everyone else is having an off night...Jordan can do that for me on a pretty regular basis. Karl can...sometimes. Far less.

What do all those numbers matter when you are still somehow less reliable?

Has nothing to do with Rose or Durant. I dont care if anyone wants Durant. I wouldnt trade rose for him. But I dont care if his fans owuldnt trade him for Rose. Irrelevant shit to me.

But if the reasons one way or another are a string of numbers nobody in the real world gives a **** about....and nobody needed to know who the best was for the last 60 years...I just find it odd.

Just...odd.

There are basketball reasons to take either one of them. No doubt a case could be made by someone actually talking about basketball skills. But the love of numbers push such issues to the back and leave the primary cases being made on TI-83s instead of by pointing out who plays basketball best on the floor. All our numbers combined might account for 45 seconds of 40 minutes of gameplay and people will still lean on them as if they have nothing better. I bet in 20 years we weont even have highlights of games. Just a box score with 38 stats scroll by as Sportscenter douchebags scream about some guys absurd PPHOLA(Points per heartbeat over league average) rating. These are the end times for people who...just like basketball.

And I bet I was way off on the Ti-83 wasnt I? What is the standard now? I believe I saw a few Ti-86s in classrooms before I was done with school. I could see you knowing such a thing. Im...quite old it seems.

Great post. I am by no means a Durant hater, and haven't engaged in any of the Rose vs. debates, but strictly on Durant, I don't care what the numbers say, I have never been impressed with his style of play. He often seems like he has already decided he is going to shoot no matter what before he gets the ball, regardless of the defense or where his teammates are etc. Apparently Thunder fans have told me that's just how confident he is with his game, and then the stats I guess support their ideas that these are good shots for him and the Thunder. In any case, when I watch him play I'm never really impressed, at least not to the point where I would consider him as a leading candidate for MVP. I certainly wasn't impressed after the playoffs last year and haven't been overwhelmingly impressed with him this year, at least in regards to MVP. He's a nice player, a great scorer, but that's where I'd stop as of now.

[kabalcage]

They played together on the same team and Kevin Durant, not Rose, won FIBA MVP. Kevin was 2nd in MVP voting last year; Derrick didn't make the cut. Kevin Durant was on the All-NBA 1st team; Derrick didn't even make the 3rd team.

By most subjective measures; the media considers Kevin the superior player. He's also the more decorated player.

If Chicago called and offered Rose for Durant, I'm sure the Thunder would hang up. If the Thunder offered Durant for Rose, I'm positive the Bulls would at least think about it.

Durant > Rose (the gap is closing, but c'mon... Rose deferred to Durant when they were on the same team)

[az00m]

They played together on the same team and Kevin Durant, not Rose, won FIBA MVP. Kevin was 2nd in MVP voting last year; Derrick didn't make the cut. Kevin Durant was on the All-NBA 1st team; Derrick didn't even make the 3rd team.

By most subjective measures; the media considers Kevin the superior player. He's also the more decorated player.

If Chicago called and offered Rose for Durant, I'm sure the Thunder would hang up. If the Thunder offered Durant for Rose, I'm positive the Bulls would at least think about it.

Durant > Rose (the gap is closing, but c'mon... Rose deferred to Durant when they were on the same team)

You can't read the minds of others. Highly doubt the bulls would ever consider trading rose for anyone in this league besides Lebron james:)

[Kblaze8855]

Really not seeing the relevance of olympic teams. Kg took a step back for VC during the 2000 olympics. Duncan took a backseat to Marbury and Iverson in the 04 Oympics. Most would tell you barkley was the best player in the 92 Olympics.

Doesnt factor into Jordan vs Barkley or Duncan vs Marbury.

[MMM]

he plays SF you imbecile. Durant=3rd in the NBA in assists among SF's. Rose=8th in the NBA in assists among PG's

any other bright ideas?

Damn I didn't know that but it seems pretty small compared to where traditionally SF's are at.

BTW when did Durant choke in the playoffs??? Don't remember it like that at all. In fact using the playoffs when both haven't done much yet within them is faulty at best.

[LilEddyCurry]

http://www.obogoalkeeping.com/resources/wp-content/uploads/2010/02/whistle.jpg

[yeaaaman]

he plays SF you imbecile. Durant=3rd in the NBA in assists among SF's. Rose=8th in the NBA in assists among PG's

any other bright ideas?

http://www.nba.com/statistics/player/Assists.jsp?league=00&season=22010&conf=OVERALL&position=2&splitType=9&splitScope=GAME&qualified=N&yearsExp=-1&splitDD=

Durant is 11th among forwards in assists some of them are power forwards and some I'm sure you will say are SG's but these are the stats, I don't think I'd say he's 3rd.

[Yung D-Will]

Yeah, with an amazing 3 apg :roll:


You're comparing a point guard with a small forward and asking why he has less assist?

[thomaspynchon]

I like Rose as the better player. Durant has got to be the least impressive superstar I have seen over the past few years.

[adbgonzalez]

he plays SF you imbecile. Durant=3rd in the NBA in assists among SF's. Rose=8th in the NBA in assists among PG's

any other bright ideas?
That's not true. He's 11th among forwards and 6th if you only take SF into account. James, Igouadala, Turkoglu, Pierce, Melo, have more APG and you can even consider SF people like Odom or Stephen Jackson.

But third... IMPOSSIBLE

[Rose]

You're comparing a point guard with a small forward and asking why he has less assist?
Well actually Joyner brought it up first, AND he even lied saying he was third best.

[BlueandGold]

If you compare their playoffs numbers:

2010: Durant: 25/7.7/2.3/.5 stl/1 blck, 35% FG
2010: Rose: 26.8/3.4/7.2/.8 stl , 45% FG

Rose might be considered better.

[YouCallILose]

I didn't lie you idiots, he was third a week ago apparently Hedo jumped him with the 17 assists the other night. He's 4th now, big deal
http://espn.go.com/nba/statistics/player/_/stat/assists/sort/avgAssists/position/small-forwards

Rose is still 8th, so no matter what 4>8

http://espn.go.com/nba/statistics/player/_/stat/assists/sort/avgAssists/position/point-guards


But I guess we're going to keep on pushing this agenda, right? and LOL @ comparing playoff numbers. Durant was guarded by one of the best perimiter defenders in the past decade and a team that included 2 7 footers protecting the rim in his first playoff appearance. Rose was guarded by Mo fvcking Williams.

And FWIW Durant had a higher TS% in the playoffs last year than Rose did

[PurpleChuck]

joyner just stop.

we don't really need to compare a PG with SF in terms of stats, worthless debates.

[YouCallILose]

joyner just stop.

we don't really need to compare a PG with SF in terms of stats, worthless debates.

I didn't make this thread, some delusional Bulls fan did

[asdf1990]

Rose is more impressive, Durant gets 10 free points a game by the refs. U can't breathe on him. Durant is so overhyped now adays.

[PurpleChuck]

Rose is more impressive, Durant gets 10 free points a game by the refs. U can't breathe on him. Durant is so overhyped now adays.
Oh not this...shhhh, joyner is still online!

[YouCallILose]

Rose is more impressive, Durant gets 10 free points a game by the refs. U can't breathe on him. Durant is so overhyped now adays.

LeBron @ 22: 27.3 ppg 20.8 FGA 9.0 FTA
Durant @ 22: 28.2 ppg 20.1 FGA 8.9 FTA

???

[PurpleChuck]

Lol, so now you wanna compare Durant with Lebron?:facepalm

Lebron23 gonna clown you sir.

[BlackWhiteGreen]

Joyner is a slave to stats but he is so, SO right about this.

[artificial]

I thought this is could be an interesting debate, as both are great players and neither is "clearly" superior to the other.

But then I read the thread and realized it's just a clash of homers, each side on a mission to degrade the other player, and felt disappointed.



:cletus:

[asdf1990]

LeBron @ 22: 27.3 ppg 20.8 FGA 9.0 FTA
Durant @ 22: 28.2 ppg 20.1 FGA 8.9 FTA

???

Lebron actually drives to the hoop, all Durant does is throw his arms into defenders and refs give him calls.

[YouCallILose]

Lebron actually drives to the hoop, all Durant does is throw his arms into defenders and refs give him calls.

LeBron makes 1 more basket per game at the rim than Durant 1 more. 2 more ppg, that's it.

Yes clearly he drives much, much more. You really never do watch OKC games do you?

And Durant's last season was actually scoring more points at the rim than LeBron is this year

[JerrySteakhouse]

http://www.obogoalkeeping.com/resources/wp-content/uploads/2010/02/whistle.jpg

:roll:

[YouCallILose]

Also what the hell am I even arguing about free throws for?

Last season: Durant 7.1 ppg @ the rim
This season: Rose 6.9 ppg @ the rim

stop crying

[asdf1990]

Also what the hell am I even arguing about free throws for?

Last season: Durant 7.1 ppg @ the rim
This season: Rose 6.9 ppg @ the rim

stop crying

Thanks to Westbrook getting him wide open dunks. KDwhistle.

[catch24]

LeBron makes 1 more basket per game at the rim than Durant 1 more. 2 more ppg, that's it.

Yes clearly he drives much, much more. You really never do watch OKC games do you?

And Durant's last season was actually scoring more points at the rim than LeBron is this year

According to 82games (cited by NewYorkKnicks), 85% of his attempts are jumpshots.

[2010splash]

Man these stupid Durant homers...:facepalm :roll:

Saying shiet like this guy is third at his position in assists, lmao so what? 3 apg is nothing.

TS%?? Hahahaha, not only do you not know what this stat means but the only reason Durant is higher is because he cries to the refs and gets more calls.

Unfortunately free throws are a large component of "TS%" and doesn't make a player better.

Hey look guys, Manu Ginobili has a much higher "TS%" than Kobe Bryant, and heck even Dwyane Wade too. Must mean Ginobili is the best scoring SG in the league!!!

[PurpleChuck]

Man these stupid Durant homers...:facepalm :roll:

Saying shiet like this guy is third at his position in assists, lmao so what? 3 apg is nothing.

TS%?? Hahahaha, not only do you not know what this stat means but the only reason Durant is higher is because he cries to the refs and gets more calls.

Unfortunately free throws are a large component of "TS%" and doesn't make a player better.

Hey look guys, Manu Ginobili has a much higher "TS%" than Kobe Bryant, and heck even Dwyane Wade too. Must mean Ginobili is the best scoring SG in the league!!!

Wonder what joyner will bring to the table after this.

[YouCallILose]

Man these stupid Durant homers...:facepalm :roll:

Saying shiet like this guy is third at his position in assists, lmao so what? 3 apg is nothing.

TS%?? Hahahaha, not only do you not know what this stat means but the only reason Durant is higher is because he cries to the refs and gets more calls.

Unfortunately free throws are a large component of "TS%" and doesn't make a player better.

Hey look guys, Manu Ginobili has a much higher "TS%" than Kobe Bryant, and heck even Dwyane Wade too. Must mean Ginobili is the best scoring SG in the league!!!

Does Ginobili average more ppg than Kobe or Wade?

Durant has a higher FG% and eFG% as well, your excuse?

You idiots don't even have an argument. You're just arguing with no basis.

And LOL @ talking about Durant's assists. Seriously how many assists should he average when he plays off the ball almost the entire game.

[Chicago Brawls]

Wouldn't mind both joining forces in Chicago.

:cheers:

[BlackWhiteGreen]

Man these stupid Durant homers...:facepalm :roll:

Saying shiet like this guy is third at his position in assists, lmao so what? 3 apg is nothing.

TS%?? Hahahaha, not only do you not know what this stat means but the only reason Durant is higher is because he cries to the refs and gets more calls.

Unfortunately free throws are a large component of "TS%" and doesn't make a player better.

Hey look guys, Manu Ginobili has a much higher "TS%" than Kobe Bryant, and heck even Dwyane Wade too. Must mean Ginobili is the best scoring SG in the league!!!

You're the one with Rose's nuts in your mouth. Rose averages 4ppg less on the same number of shots, how is this even an argument? Rose has the ball in his hands more, yet is less efficient. Did you watch the World Championships? Durant was the clear leader there, and if Team USA was assembled again he'd still be the leader now.

I can't wait until Rose gets outplayed by someone so I can make 5 reaction threads.

[All Net]

Comparing a point guard's assists to a small forward's assists is idiotic to say the least.

[All Net]

I see on all these people's list Kevin Durant listed as a top 5 player. What's with this BS?

Do you think it would be that hard for Rose to average 28 ppg if all he did was jack up shots?

What's harder to do, score 28 ppg and average 3 apg or score 24 ppg and average 8 apg? You really think if Rose focused as little on getting others involved as Durant does that he couldn't average a pitiful assist total and score a whole lot more?

And please don't tell me Durant is a good defender. Last I checked he was starting for the 16th ranked defense in the league. Rose starts for the #1 ranked defense.

And please don't bring up shooting. How is Durant a better shooter? is shooting 32% from three somehow better than shooting 38% from three? :confusedshrug:

Enough with the jockriding of Kevin Durant. Overrated as they come.....

He does that anyway

Rose averages less points per game and the same amount of shots. So really you have no point.

[2010splash]

Does Ginobili average more ppg than Kobe or Wade?

Durant has a higher FG% and eFG% as well, your excuse?

You idiots don't even have an argument. You're just arguing with no basis.

And LOL @ talking about Durant's assists. Seriously how many assists should he average when he plays off the ball almost the entire game.
Get off Durant's sack gee. He ain't that good. Wow his 1% higher FG% really makes him better offensively than Rose. Guaranteed at the end of the year Rose will shoot a higher % than Kevin "The Chucka" Durant.

"eFG%"???:roll: What is that?

Sorry son but scoring is only one aspect of the game, and happens to be the only one Durant is good at.

Still lmao at "eFG%". :lol

[MMM]

I would build around a scoring SF more so than a PG imo especially when you are considering he is a 6'10+ SF.

[alenleomessi]

Few months ago he was compared to James and was top 3 on the majority of lists and now he isnt better than Rose?
I dont think he has changed that much, he started bad but from December 1 he is putting big numbers with 50% fg

[kabalcage]

How about Kevin Durant being the more unique and rare talent?

There are so many good PGs in the league; even OKC has a guy that's nearly as good as Rose. By that same token; there aren't that many comparable SFs. You're looking at Carmelo, LeBron and Durant; after that, it's a significant drop off.

In a basketball sense, Durant offers off-ball scoring and incredible length for team defensive purposes. Conversely, Rose offers a ball-dominant drive and kick game and overwhelming athleticism at the PG position. Both are very good offensive players that have considerable defensive potential.

What Durant has on Rose is that he has already carried his team to a 50 win season and has more accolades.

[asdf1990]

Few months ago he was compared to James and was top 3 on the majority of lists and now he isnt better than Rose?
I dont think he has changed that much, he started bad but from December 1 he is putting big numbers with 50% fg

That talk was fueled by the hate lebron was getting . The first tier of players are still Kobe wade lebron and maybe Dwight . Durant is a second tier player. I was lol'ing so hard when I read that 59% of the gm said they would start a franchise with Durant vs 15% choosing lebron. Lol MVP lock too coming into the season. Durant doesn't impress me. I hate Kobe but when I watch him play i am impressed.

[YouCallILose]

That talk was fueled by the hate lebron was getting . The first tier of players are still Kobe wade lebron and maybe Dwight . Durant is a second tier player. I was lol'ing so hard when I read that 59% of the gm said they would start a franchise with Durant vs 15% choosing lebron. Lol MVP lock too coming into the season. Durant doesn't impress me. I hate Kobe but when I watch him play i am impressed.

You do realize that Durant is shooting 52% on 2 point fg's, right? That is actually higher than LeBron who is shooting 51%

Kobe has always been around 48 FG% on 2 pointers and Rose is currently at 47%

This isn't even a discussion and the only people arguing otherwise are Rose homers/Durant haters.

If OKC offered Durant+Westbrook for Rose+Deng+Gibson tomorrow the Bulls would make that trade and not even think twice. Conversely there is literally no package the Bulls could make that would lead to OKC trading Durant, well aside from prime Jordan coming back.

There is literally nothing Rose does better than Durant given position standards.

But you're a LeBron stan so you naturally hate Durant

[Rose]

Comparing a point guard's assists to a small forward's assists is idiotic to say the least.

He does that anyway

Rose averages less points per game and the same amount of shots. So really you have no point.
I agree with both of these.

[PurpleChuck]

I agree with both of these.
Rose I wanna see that Durant thread of yours, go clown joyner plox!:oldlol:

[Rose]

This isn't even a discussion and the only people arguing otherwise are Rose homers/Durant haters.

If OKC offered Durant+Westbrook for Rose+Deng+Gibson tomorrow the Bulls would make that trade and not even think twice. Conversely there is literally no package the Bulls could make that would lead to OKC trading Durant, well aside from prime Jordan coming back.

There is literally nothing Rose does better than Durant given position standards.

But you're a LeBron stan so you naturally hate Durant
That's not even CLOSE to a fair trade, since deng has absolutely no trade value.

[Rose]

Rose I wanna see that Durant thread of yours, go clown joyner plox!:oldlol:
Actually I already gave everyone a sneak peek inside the Rudy Gay thread, and I'm not ready yet, although 2010splash, did point out a HUUUUUGE thing about Durant already.

[PurpleChuck]

Actually I already gave everyone a sneak peek inside the Rudy Gay thread, and I'm not ready yet, although 2010splash, did point out a HUUUUUGE thing about Durant already.
Can't wait for the thread. It's gonna be pure comedy seeing what nonsense joyner sprouts out then.:lol

[Rose]

Can't wait for the thread. It's gonna be pure comedy seeing what nonsense joyner sprouts out then.:lol
Lol he's gonna shit twice and die when he sees who I compare him too and lay out the case as well.

[PurpleChuck]

Lol he's gonna shit twice and die when he sees who I compare him too and lay out the case as well.
Hope so! :cheers: I think even when he dies, he gonna have Durant's balls still hanging in his throat.:oldlol:

Dude has a serious problem with his man-crush, should go see a doctor or something.:facepalm

[Rose]

Hope so! :cheers: I think even when he dies, he gonna have Durant's balls still hanging in his throat.:oldlol:

Dude has a serious problem with his man-crush, should go see a doctor or something.:facepalm
Don't get me wrong I like Durant and all that. Hell I thought before this season, he'd be MVP lead the thunder to the fourth seed(which has more or less happened) andddddddd yeah.

But if you look at big games and his overall stats there's a pretty funny/kinda true comparison.:roll:

Also we need the joyner durant twitter pic

[YouCallILose]

Lol he's gonna shit twice and die when he sees who I compare him too and lay out the case as well.

T-Mac is a cute comparison and all, well aside from the fact that Durant is insanely efficient who has the 2nd highest advanced metrics behind LeBron these past 2 years.

[PurpleChuck]

Kevin Martin is a cute comparison and all, well aside from the fact that Durant is a very good defender/rebounder who has the 2nd highest advanced metrics behind LeBron these past 2 years.
Ah early attack I see...Not gonna work here, Rose is rdy to pwn you. So enjoy getting styled on, while I watch your comical stat orgasming.:oldlol:

[PurpleChuck]

T-Mac is a cute comparison and all, well aside from the fact that Durant is insanely efficient who has the 2nd highest advanced metrics behind LeBron these past 2 years.
Lol why you edit your post son? Lose for argument?:lol

[Rose]

Kevin Martin is a cute comparison and all, well aside from the fact that Durant is a very good defender/rebounder who has the 2nd highest advanced metrics behind LeBron these past 2 years.
not Kevin Martin, really the only similarity there is the same amount of turnovers. and the high three pointers. and durant is NOT a good defender. he's below average at best. He still trades 2s for 3s. I'll give you a hint though, the guy who he's a hell of a lot like is the most overrated "superstar" of the modern era probably

[Rose]

Lol why you edit your post son? Lose for argument?:lol
Lol prime Mac>Durant easilyyy

[2010splash]

Bulls would trade Rose for Durant? Are you joking?

The Bulls have had way more injuries and Rose still has a better record than Durant. If the Bulls had the the injuries the Thunder have had (pretty much nothing) they'd be like 4-5 games ahead of them right now.

Heck if Durant's second and third best teammates missed 25+ games combined he'd probably be leading the Thunder to the lottery again. Remember early during the year when Durant was piggybacking Westbrook? :oldlol:

[VishaltotheG]

You do realize that Durant is shooting 52% on 2 point fg's, right? That is actually higher than LeBron who is shooting 51%

Kobe has always been around 48 FG% on 2 pointers and Rose is currently at 47%

This isn't even a discussion and the only people arguing otherwise are Rose homers/Durant haters.

If OKC offered Durant+Westbrook for Rose+Deng+Gibson tomorrow the Bulls would make that trade and not even think twice. Conversely there is literally no package the Bulls could make that would lead to OKC trading Durant, well aside from prime Jordan coming back.

There is literally nothing Rose does better than Durant given position standards.

But you're a LeBron stan so you naturally hate Durant


Well, yeah. Getting rid of Mr. LOL's contract alone is enough for us to do the deal. Durant + Westbrook > Rose and Gibson so yeah.

[PurpleChuck]

Lol prime Mac>Durant easilyyy
And his only thing to say is it's "cute".:lol

joyner, I can forsee your ass getting pwned hard and ISH styling on you again.

DURANT DA BESS?:oldlol:

[YouCallILose]

Yes Durant clearly struggles against top competition..lets look at those numbers vs teams above .500

Atlanta 33 ppg 4 rpg 3 apg 50 FG%
Boston 34 ppg 6 rpg 3 apg 50 FG%
Chicago 29.5 ppg 6 rpg 2 apg 38 FG%
Dallas 29.3 ppg 6 rpg 4 apg 52.4 FG%
Denver 44 ppg 7 rpg 4 apg 57 FG%
New York 26 ppg 7 rpg 3 apg 50 FG%
Portland 31 ppg 7.5 rpg 2.5 apg 53.3 FG%
San Antonio 19.5 ppg 5.5 rpg 2.5 apg 44.7 FG%
Utah 29 ppg 5 rpg 2.5 apg 39 FG%


Yep, just sucking it up

3rd season McGrady was averaging 15/6/3 on 45 FG%
3rd season Durant averaged 30/8/3 on 48 FG%

yawn

[PurpleChuck]

Yes Durant clearly struggles against top competition..lets look at those numbers vs teams above .500

Atlanta 33 ppg 4 rpg 3 apg 50 FG%
Boston 34 ppg 6 rpg 3 apg 50 FG%
Chicago 29.5 ppg 6 rpg 2 apg 38 FG%
Dallas 29.3 ppg 6 rpg 4 apg 52.4 FG%
Denver 44 ppg 7 rpg 4 apg 57 FG%
New York 26 ppg 7 rpg 3 apg 50 FG%
Portland 31 ppg 7.5 rpg 2.5 apg 53.3 FG%
San Antonio 19.5 ppg 5.5 rpg 2.5 apg 44.7 FG%
Utah 29 ppg 5 rpg 2.5 apg 39 FG%


Yep, just sucking it up

Erm please dun under-perform, where's TS% and eFG%?:rolleyes:

And while you're at it, per 40 please?

[Rose]

Yes Durant clearly struggles against top competition..lets look at those numbers vs teams above .500

Atlanta 33 ppg 4 rpg 3 apg 50 FG%
Boston 34 ppg 6 rpg 3 apg 50 FG%
Chicago 29.5 ppg 6 rpg 2 apg 38 FG%
Dallas 29.3 ppg 6 rpg 4 apg 52.4 FG%
Denver 44 ppg 7 rpg 4 apg 57 FG%
New York 26 ppg 7 rpg 3 apg 50 FG%
Portland 31 ppg 7.5 rpg 2.5 apg 53.3 FG%
San Antonio 19.5 ppg 5.5 rpg 2.5 apg 44.7 FG%
Utah 29 ppg 5 rpg 2.5 apg 39 FG%


Yep, just sucking it up

3rd season McGrady was averaging 15/6/3 on 45 FG%
3rd season Durant averaged 30/8/3 on 48 FG%

yawn
playoffs?

[YouCallILose]

Erm please dun under-perform, where's TS% and eFG%?:rolleyes:

And while you're at it, per 40 please?

too lazy to calculate TS% but given those FG%'s its well above 63% which is godly

[PurpleChuck]

too lazy to calculate TS% but given those FG%'s its well above 63% which is godly
:facepalm

[YouCallILose]

playoffs?

McGrady's first playoff series was a 3 game sweep where he averaged 17/7/3 against the garbage Knicks. Durant's 1st playoff series was against arguably the best perimeter defender since Pippen and 2 7 footers protecting the rim. Would you like to compare LeBron & Durant's playoff numbers vs teams that won the championship?

[PurpleChuck]

McGrady's first playoff series was a 3 game sweep where he averaged 17/7/3 against the garbage Knicks. Durant's 1st playoff series was against arguably the best perimeter defender since Pippen and 2 7 footers protecting the rim. Would you like to compare LeBron & Durant's playoff numbers vs teams that won the championship?
Sure, hit us. Comparing Lebron and Durant, let's see what you can come up with...:rolleyes:

[MMM]

I really haven't seen anyone make a great argument either way yet.

[8BeastlyXOIAD]

Kevin is better IMO

but its close:cheers:

[YouCallILose]

Sure, hit us. Comparing Lebron and Durant, let's see what you can come up with...:rolleyes:

Durant vs the champs in 2010 25 ppg 20.5 FGA 8 rpg 2.3 apg 3.7 to/g 35 FG% 87 FT% 49.9 TS%

LeBron vs the champs in 2007 22 ppg 22.5 FGA 7 rpg 6.7 apg 5.8 to/g 34 FG% 69 FT% 42.8 TS%

LeBron vs the champs in 2008 26.7 ppg 22.5 FGA 6 rpg 7.5 apg 5.3 to/g 35 FG% 77 FG% 48.0 TS%
:bowdown:

[8BeastlyXOIAD]

Durant vs the champs in 2010 25 ppg 20.5 FGA 8 rpg 2.3 apg 3.7 to/g 35 FG% 87 FT% 49.9 TS%

LeBron vs the champs in 2007 22 ppg 22.5 FGA 7 rpg 6.7 apg 5.8 to/g 34 FG% 69 FT% 42.8 TS%

LeBron vs the champs in 2008 26.7 ppg 22.5 FGA 6 rpg 7.5 apg 5.3 to/g 35 FG% 77 FG% 48.0 TS%
:bowdown:
:lol :lol

[PurpleChuck]

Durant vs the champs in 2010 25 ppg 20.5 FGA 8 rpg 2.3 apg 3.7 to/g 35 FG% 87 FT% 49.9 TS%

LeBron vs the champs in 2007 22 ppg 22.5 FGA 7 rpg 6.7 apg 5.8 to/g 34 FG% 69 FT% 42.8 TS%

LeBron vs the champs in 2008 26.7 ppg 22.5 FGA 6 rpg 7.5 apg 5.3 to/g 35 FG% 77 FG% 48.0 TS%
:bowdown:

So this post of yours, and the utilization of the this ":bowdown: " I can safely assume you think Durant > Lebron yeah?

[MMM]

Is Derrick Rose considerd an entrenched top 10 player or borderline???? I think many still have Durant within their top 5

[IN-PAX-WE-TRUST]

Durant is 6'9... Rose is 6'3. I will always take the bigger player in the NBA if the talent level is the same.

[8BeastlyXOIAD]

Is Derrick Rose considerd an entrenched top 10 player or borderline???? I think many still have Durant within their top 5

IMO he is like 7th while KD is like 5th:cheers:

[YouCallILose]

So this post of yours, and the utilization of the this ":bowdown: " I can safely assume you think Durant > Lebron yeah?

nope, just stating the case that this "durant chokes in the playoffs" is a joke.

Durant and LeBron are very close in terms of impact at 21/22, LeBron is obviously the superior player today @ 26.

LeBron was a better playmaker, Durant is a much more efficient scorer & can play off of the ball.

[8BeastlyXOIAD]

Durant is 6'9... Rose is 6'3. I will always take the bigger player in the NBA if the talent level is the same.

KD is like 6'11 legit bra

[tpols]

If you look at the stats straight up, durant blows rose out of the water. He scores more on a higher efficiency, rebounds well for his position, and gets a good number of assists for his position. On top of that, durant has the quickness of your average small forward, except he's 6'11 with a teradactyl wingspan which helps a lot on defense where he also is a valuable asset.

Rose is great at penetrating, scoring, and setting his teammates up, but he doesn't bring much to the table defensively(he's average here).

I think a more fair comparison would be rose versus westbrook since they play very similarly:

Rose

24 ppg on 20 shots
8 assists
4.5 rebounds
1.1 steals

Westbrook

22 ppg on 17.4 shots
8 assists
5 rebounds
1.9 steals

Westbrook scores 2 less points than rose, but he also takes almost 3 less shots. He also has the same amount of assists as rose. The real difference between the two is that russell outrebounds rose, plays better man to man defense than rose, and plays the passing lanes better than rose.

Rose's assignment as the main option makes him the more valuable player than westbrook though, but the difference between these two guys is definitely smaller than the difference between rose and durant.

[LeFraud Shames]

http://www.phillyref.com/basketball/nbarefs/ism_bennett_salvatore.jpg

^Makes Kevin Durant better than Derrick Rose.

[PurpleChuck]

nope, just stating the case that this "durant chokes in the playoffs" is a joke.

Durant and LeBron are very close in terms of impact at 21/22, LeBron is obviously the superior player today @ 26.

LeBron was a better playmaker, Durant is a much more efficient scorer & can play off of the ball.
Alright I'm glad that you can at least think straight.:cheers:

[YouCallILose]

http://www.phillyref.com/basketball/nbarefs/ism_bennett_salvatore.jpg

^Makes Kevin Durant better than Derrick Rose.

I guess that's why Durant shoots 52% on 2 point FG's while Rose shoots 47%. Makes sense

[Penny_Hardaway]

I think Derrick Rose as a whole is the slightly better/more valuable player to his team.

Rose has proved this year that he`s an amazing scorer for the point-guard position: he has an incredible athleticism which makes him drive at will and dunk on people bigger than him, he has a solid mid-range game and he`s improving his 3pt range at a high rate, I think its all he needs (and its a lot) for being an effective and explosive scoring PG (which he already is).

But at the same time, he can assist to his teammates and make them part of the game, unlike other scoring PGs like Steve Francis or Marbury, I think Rose is an unselfish player and a pretty good passer, and he can still improve on this department, which is godly scary.

And also due to his incredible athleticism combined with speed he grabs a lot of rebounds for the PG position and gets some steals/blocks too, specially steals. Not that he is a lock defender like Rondo or something, but I think if he can work on it he can be a pretty good defender, right now he is decent to average.

Kevin Durant on the other hand is probably a slightly more complete and effective scorer (mainly due to his size, his post-up moves and his hability to get to the line) but I think he doesnt have the same impact on games Rose has. I mean, Durant is still not an elite passer for a considered franchise-player, Tracy Mcgrady, Lebron James or Grant Hill (all players similar in size) could pass pretty well while at the same time scoring 25 to 30 points per game. His defense is not elite also, not like he aint a good defender but when comparing 2 superstars like these its things like having elite defense or not who make you say: "who`s better and so on...".

If I had to pick one player right now, I will go with D-Rose, mainly because as I said before, he impacts and dominates the game in more ways than Durant does.

[Rose]

Sure Artest is GREAT. But how many of those teams are defensive teams that you listed?
Portland? No
Knicks?:roll:
Lakers anymore? not really
Curiously versus real defenses his stats are a lot lower...

[Rose]

I guess that's why Durant shoots 52% on 2 point FG's while Rose shoots 47%. Makes sense
The whistles up Durant's TS% which makes him basically the best scorer in the game considering he averages what 11 fta? Oh I just looked it up it's 9 this year.

[YouCallILose]

Seriously how is Rose any better than Westbrook?

[Rose]

The whistles up Durant's TS% which makes him basically the best scorer in the game considering he averages what 11 fta? Oh I just looked it up it's 9 this year.
He hits 90% of them thus adding about 8 extra points to his stats, compare that to say other "superstars" like LeBron or Wade he gets an extra 2 or so, even though they drive a hell of a lot, really the only guy that gets more than him is Dwight, and that's because he shoots under 60%

[Rose]

Seriously how is Rose any better than Westbrook?
Alpha Dog>Beta Dog.
Unless you concede that ....Russell carried them for the first month.

[PurpleChuck]

Seriously how is Rose any better than Westbrook?
Lol @ this clown bringing Westbrook in to protect his mancrush Durant from debates.:facepalm

[YouCallILose]

Alpha Dog>Beta Dog.
Unless you concede that ....Russell carried them for the first month.

Westbrook was absolutely the best player on the Thunder in November, Durant struggled as usual. Conversely Boozer was the best player on the Bulls in December

[Rose]

Westbrook was absolutely the best player on the Thunder in November, Durant struggled as usual. Conversely Boozer was the best player on the Bulls in December
BUT BUT when we were saying Westbrook was the MVP, you said NO DURANT IS.

You can't change your argument now.

[Glide2keva]

http://www.phillyref.com/basketball/nbarefs/ism_bennett_salvatore.jpg

^Makes Kevin Durant better than Derrick Rose.
Other than this, nothing. Durant is nothing more than the golden child and a prissy little jumpshooter

[8BeastlyXOIAD]

Scoring >>>>>>>>>>>>> EVERYTHING ELSE

[Rose]

Scoring >>>>>>>>>>>>> EVERYTHING ELSE
Assists>>>>>>>>>>Anything else.

[YouCallILose]

BUT BUT when we were saying Westbrook was the MVP, you said NO DURANT IS.

You can't change your argument now.

I said all along Westbrook had the better month of November. I also said Durant would start to dominate again in December like he always does, and it happened. Supposedly Durant gets out of shape during the summer and he loses his shot..not really sure how considering he plays in pickup games

[YouCallILose]

Assists>>>>>>>>>>Anything else.

No they dont..and team assists is what is important, not individual assists

[pegasus]

http://www.phillyref.com/basketball/nbarefs/ism_bennett_salvatore.jpg

He looks like a cute little baby with that whistle in his mouth, and the KD fans cry like one when he doesn't put it to work.

[Rose]

No they dont..and team assists is what is important, not individual assists
That's what I meant.

[Rose]

I said all along Westbrook had the better month of November. I also said Durant would start to dominate again in December like he always does, and it happened. Supposedly Durant gets out of shape during the summer and he loses his shot..not really sure how considering he plays in pickup gameshttp://www.insidehoops.com/forum/showpost.php?p=5261784&postcount=21

And While Durant might start off slow, if you pay attention to who he plays...he doesn't quite get the same stats...

[YouCallILose]

http://www.insidehoops.com/forum/showpost.php?p=5261784&postcount=21

And While Durant might start off slow, if you pay attention to who he plays...he doesn't quite get the same stats...

12-27-2010


nice try

[tpols]

Assists>>>>>>>>>>Anything else.
lol after the rondo thread you made yesterday?:oldlol:

[Rose]

12-27-2010


nice try
Sure the date's december, but you said the play better without Russy, and you even said why!

[YouCallILose]

lol after the rondo thread you made yesterday?:oldlol:

great point, i love it.

Rose is better than Durant because he averages 5 more apg yet he plays a different position. Yet Rose is also better than Rondo who averages 6 more apg while playing the same position :lol

[Rose]

lol after the rondo thread you made yesterday?:oldlol:
There's a difference between stats padding, and regular assists, Sure everyone stat pads, but he's a pretty clear interest. And did I not give him credit for what he does?

[YouCallILose]

Sure the date's december, but you said the play better without Russy, and you even said why!

And I have always said he was the best player on the team in November, your point? Westbrook has been in full on chucker/turnover mode the past month. He's shooting 38% this month and shot 42.6% last month

[Rose]

great point, i love it.

Rose is better than Durant because he averages 5 more apg yet he plays a different position. Yet Rose is also better than Rondo who averages 6 more apg while playing the same position :lol
Find where I said Rose is better than Durant.

DO IT.

[Johnni Gade]

DRose is amazing. Just saw him vs Boston

[Jon_Koncak]

Really not seeing the relevance of olympic teams. Kg took a step back for VC during the 2000 olympics. Duncan took a backseat to Marbury and Iverson in the 04 Oympics. Most would tell you barkley was the best player in the 92 Olympics.

Doesnt factor into Jordan vs Barkley or Duncan vs Marbury.

It wasn't olympics,it was World Championships.And Rose didn't take a backseat in the sense that he voluntarily let Durant lead the team.He tried but just wasn't effective at all,Durant single handedly led usa to the gold while Rose wasn't that much of a factor.

[Rose]

http://www.insidehoops.com/forum/showpost.php?p=5180499&postcount=52
http://www.insidehoops.com/forum/showpost.php?p=5180499&postcount=55
http://www.insidehoops.com/forum/showpost.php?p=5181010&postcount=163

Oh and in case you want to say well THATS DECEMBER SIXTH
http://www.nba.com/games/20101201/OKCNJN/gameinfo.html#nbaGIboxscore http://www.nba.com/games/20101203/OKCTOR/gameinfo.html#nbaGIboxscore
http://www.nba.com/games/20101205/GSWOKC/gameinfo.html#nbaGIboxscore

So I guess in one game, he came back and re-asserted his dominance?

[YouCallILose]

http://www.insidehoops.com/forum/showpost.php?p=5180499&postcount=52
http://www.insidehoops.com/forum/showpost.php?p=5180499&postcount=55
http://www.insidehoops.com/forum/showpost.php?p=5181010&postcount=163

Oh and in case you want to say well THATS DECEMBER SIXTH
http://www.nba.com/games/20101201/OKCNJN/gameinfo.html#nbaGIboxscore http://www.nba.com/games/20101203/OKCTOR/gameinfo.html#nbaGIboxscore
http://www.nba.com/games/20101205/GSWOKC/gameinfo.html#nbaGIboxscore

So I guess in one game, he came back and re-asserted his dominance?


And where did I say Westbrook wasn't the MVP of the team in November?

Triple OT vs New Jersey, beating Boston without Rondo by scoring 4 points in the 4th quarter, and losing to Toronto is your evidence?

[Rose]

And where did I say Westbrook wasn't the MVP of the team in November?

Triple OT vs New Jersey, beating Boston without Rondo by scoring 4 points in the 4th quarter, and losing to Toronto is your evidence?
But they fluked into those! you said it yourself.

[Harrison_Barnes]

Right now I see them almost as equals. They both have advantages against their matchups and both are good at different things. Can we not just ignore the numbers and just sit back and watch two up and coming superstars in the making?:confusedshrug:

[M.V.P]

I didn't lie you idiots, he was third a week ago apparently Hedo jumped him with the 17 assists the other night. He's 4th now, big deal
http://espn.go.com/nba/statistics/player/_/stat/assists/sort/avgAssists/position/small-forwards

Rose is still 8th, so no matter what 4>8

http://espn.go.com/nba/statistics/player/_/stat/assists/sort/avgAssists/position/point-guards


But I guess we're going to keep on pushing this agenda, right? and LOL @ comparing playoff numbers. Durant was guarded by one of the best perimiter defenders in the past decade and a team that included 2 7 footers protecting the rim in his first playoff appearance. Rose was guarded by Mo fvcking Williams.

And FWIW Durant had a higher TS% in the playoffs last year than Rose did
The website you're using has false information though. They don't include Iguodala, Melo, or Odom, which all play small forward...Durant ends up ranking 7th. In addition to that, 4 other power forwards (including the rookie Griffin), who handle the ball less are averaging more assists than him.

One other thing though. If you're going to compare stats by position, you should compare rebounds by position. Durant is 6th among small forwards in rebounding while Rose is 4th among point guards in rebounding. Relative to their positions then, Durant is one place ahead of Rose in assists, while Rose is 2 spots ahead of Durant in rebounding. Both are at the top of their position in scoring.

I'm not using this argument to say Rose is better, I'm just pointing out that you're using relative rankings for one player, giving him the benefit of being compared to his position, while not granting the other player the same luxury.

Like I said already though, Durant I think will be the better player by season's end, but Rose has been the better one so far.

[tpols]

The website you're using has false information though. They don't include Iguodala, Melo, or Odom, which all play small forward...Durant ends up ranking 7th. In addition to that, 4 other power forwards (including the rookie Griffin), who handle the ball less are averaging more assists than him.

One other thing though. If you're going to compare stats by position, you should compare rebounds by position. Durant is 6th among small forwards in rebounding while Rose is 4th among point guards in rebounding. Relative to their positions then, Durant is one place ahead of Rose in assists, while Rose is 2 spots ahead of Durant in rebounding. Both are at the top of their position in scoring.

I'm not using this argument to say Rose is better, I'm just pointing out that you're using relative rankings for one player, giving him the benefit of being compared to his position, while not granting the other player the same luxury.

Like I said already though, Durant I think will be the better player by season's end, but Rose has been the better one so far.
Odom's a powerforward, not a small forward. Ron artest and matt barnes play the SF position for the lakers.

[M.V.P]

Odom's a powerforward, not a small forward. Ron artest and matt barnes play the SF position for the lakers.
I had a feeling, but I thought he still played a lot of small forward now that Bynum is back. He handles the ball a lot no?

[Rose]

I had a feeling, but I thought he still played a lot of small forward now that Bynum is back. He handles the ball a lot no?
Correct. If anything he's a combo forward.

[tpols]

I had a feeling, but I thought he still played a lot of small forward now that Bynum is back. He handles the ball a lot no?
He handles the ball but he's done that his whole career. He defends opposing PFs when he's in the game and he rebounds like a PF.

[97 bulls]

I particularly enjoy how Rose is apparently a more complete player than Durant

Durant is a better defender who averages 1.2 SPG & 1 BPG

Rose is a worse defender who averaged 1.1 SPG & .5 BPG

Durant scores 4 more ppg on MUCH better efficiency

Durant averages 2 more RPG

Durant ranks 3rd in the league in assists per game @ his position
Rose ranks 8th in the league in assists per game @ his position

Durant is one of the best players in the league @ playing off the ball
Rose doesn't even know what off the ball means

Bulls fans are such a fcking joke
I don't believe your trying to compare blocks and rebounds between guys that are 6'11 and 6'3. Actually, based on size, rose is a better rebounder. Not to mention he's getting 5 boards a game playing with noah and boozer. The steals are the same. 1.2 to 1.1? Come on.

[ThickassGlasses]

I don't believe your trying to compare blocks and rebounds between guys that are 6'11 and 6'3. Actually, based on size, rose is a better rebounder. Not to mention he's getting 5 boards a game playing with noah and boozer. The steals are the same. 1.2 to 1.1? Come on.

Isn't that as dumb as comparing a PG's assists to a SF's assists???

Or no because that makes Drose seem better??

[Rose]

Isn't that as dumb as comparing a PG's assists to a SF's assists???

Or no because that makes Drose seem better??
I reiterate, Joyner brought it up first.

[Rose]

I particularly enjoy how Rose is apparently a more complete player than Durant

Durant is a better defender who averages 1.2 SPG & 1 BPG

Rose is a worse defender who averaged 1.1 SPG & .5 BPG

Durant scores 4 more ppg on MUCH better efficiency

Durant averages 2 more RPG

Durant ranks 3rd in the league in assists per game @ his position
Rose ranks 8th in the league in assists per game @ his position

Durant is one of the best players in the league @ playing off the ball
Rose doesn't even know what off the ball means

Bulls fans are such a fcking joke
...

[ThickassGlasses]

I reiterate, Joyner brought it up first.

Fair enough.

It's dumb to compare the two. Both are in the top 5 at their position, and roughly
in the same spot. Hard to tell who is actually better.

[97 bulls]

If were being unbiased, rose flat out brings more to the table than durant. Just looking at raw stats, they're even but when other things are factored in as roles etc rose takes it. For ll intents and purposes, the things durant beats rose in are barely. Other than points and that's due to the fact that rose doesn't get the calls durant does. They basically shoot the same %. I think its 46 to 45 durant. Durant does has a better ft%. Although roses is solid. Obviously rose kills durant in apg 8 to 3. The nod goes on the things durant for his size should be dominating rose in durant is at best an avg rebounder for a sf. Rose is a great reboinder for a pg. At 6'11, durant should be blocking more shots. At 6'3, rose is close. Thus another advantage for rose (relatively). I just don't see an argument for durant being better than rose. At worse, they're equal.

[97 bulls]

Right now I see them almost as equals. They both have advantages against their matchups and both are good at different things. Can we not just ignore the numbers and just sit back and watch two up and coming superstars in the making?:confusedshrug:
That's no fun

[tpols]

If were being unbiased, rose flat out brings more to the table than durant. Just looking at raw stats, they're even but when other things are factored in as roles etc rose takes it. For ll intents and purposes, the things durant beats rose in are barely. Other than points and that's due to the fact that rose doesn't get the calls durant does. They basically shoot the same %. I think its 46 to 45 durant. Durant does has a better ft%. Although roses is solid. Obviously rose kills durant in apg 8 to 3. The nod goes on the things durant for his size should be dominating rose in durant is at best an avg rebounder for a sf. Rose is a great reboinder for a pg. At 6'11, durant should be blocking more shots. At 6'3, rose is close. Thus another advantage for rose (relatively). I just don't see an argument for durant being better than rose. At worse, they're equal.
You can't say rose kills durant in assists and then say well durant only rebounds and blocks more because he's 6'11. You're making excuses for your player while ignoring the fact that durant is a small forward and obviously isn't going to have as many assists as a point guard. The fact that durant is 6'11 and quick is not to be used as an excuse to why he performs better. It's just another advantage he has over rose. It's part of why he is a much better defender than rose(both team and help). And with defense being half the game, and durant having a much higher ppg average on offense while being considerably more efficient it's not fair to say rose is better(I mean are you really going to bring the ref argument into this? really?)...

[8BeastlyXOIAD]

Rose do you still think Gay is better than Durant:oldlol: :oldlol: :facepalm

[Droid101]

12 pages and I haven't read one good argument to sway me either way (but I am leaning towards Rose being "More Valuable" to his team than Durant is to his).

But at least we got to see joyner nerd rage out. Always comedy gold.

[Rose]

Rose do you still think Gay is better than Durant:oldlol: :oldlol: :facepalm
Yep, easily, aside from pure scoring.

[Rose]

Fair enough.

It's dumb to compare the two. Both are in the top 5 at their position, and roughly
in the same spot. Hard to tell who is actually better.
Exactly. If Rose was a wing...that'd be one thing. but it's tricky comparing a point guard to a wing scorer.

[tpols]

I don't understand the ref argument against durant here. He's averaging just as many FTs as all of the other high volume scorers in the game but everyone wants to act like he's cheating or something. I mean.. what do you consider wade or lebron then? They barrel into people all the time looking for calls, and abuse the jump into the defender for fouls technique all the time. And because durant uses rip through moves and draws contact on his arms all the time he is somehow worse?

This is the nba nowadays. It's how it works for everybody. Durant right now is averaging 28.2 ppg on ~47% FG and 59% TS.

Rose is averaging 24.3 on 46% FG and 55% TS. And rose is averaging 3 less FTs a game, but even if you gave rose those extra FTs every game he still would be behind durant in scoring and still would not be as efficient.

Despite his scoring, Rose is a better playmaker than durant as he's a point guard and he creates more opportunities for his teammates. But durant's advantages in rebounding and on the defensive side of the ball in both man and team defense easily make up for the disparity in their playmaking abilities. Now.. part of this is because durant is much bigger and longer than rose so he can more easily grab boards, tip/alter shots and passes, and overall just have more of an impact on his team defensively, but that is just another advantage. Bigger players have always impacted the game more than smaller ones.

[Doranku]

Yep, easily, aside from pure scoring.

Gay on the Thunder = .500 team (generously)
Durant on the Thunder = .658 team

???

[8BeastlyXOIAD]

Yep, easily, aside from pure scoring.
:oldlol: :oldlol: :oldlol: :oldlol: :oldlol: O GOD

So i guess your saying Iggy>Gay>KD:oldlol: :oldlol:

[8BeastlyXOIAD]

Gay on the Thunder = .500 team (generously)
Durant on the Thunder = .658 team

???

Yeah like seriously Rose Rudy Gay > Durant:facepalm

Gay team isnt even 500%

[Rose]

Gay on the Thunder = .500 team (generously)
Durant on the Thunder = .658 team

???
The Grizzlies are two games under .500, with wins over the Heat, Lakers(twice) a loss to the Spurs (because Gay was out, if he played they win in regulation), the Jazz, Durant's Thunder, and I believe the Mavericks.

[YouCallILose]

I can't believe this thread is still going on

Stephon fvcking Marbury averaged 24 ppg 8 apg 3 rpg on 54 TS% in 2001

Derick Rose is averaging 24 ppg 8 apg 5 rpg on 54.5 TS% this season

/thread, GFO

Durant shoots 52% from 2
Rose shoots 47% from 2
Durant makes 1.7 3's a game
Rose makes 1.5 3's a game
Durant shoots 88% from the line
Rose shoots 80% from the line

Durant ranks higher in assists for his respective position
Durant averages way more rpg, bpg, and equal spg
Durant averages fewer to/g

Durant averages 4 more ppg on the same FGA

Durant's defense is unquestionably better than Rose's

WHat the hell is the argument here? What exactly does Rose do better than Durant?

Rose's team is on pace for 55 wins with this front court

20.6 ppg 10.1 rpg .5 BLK 56 FG%
14 ppg 11.7 rpg 1.6 BLK 51.4 FG%
17.8 ppg 6.1 rpg .5 BLK 45.3 FG%



Durant's team is on pace for 55 wins with this SG, PF, C lineup
15.5 ppg 5.7 rpg .3 BLK 42.1 FG%
7.5 ppg 4.7 rpg .4 BLK 46.5 FG%
5.5 ppg 5.1 rpg .4 BLK 44.8 FG%



What a damn joke of a thread

[8BeastlyXOIAD]

The Grizzlies are two games under .500, with wins over the Heat, Lakers(twice) a loss to the Spurs (because Gay was out, if he played they win in regulation), the Jazz, Durant's Thunder, and I believe the Mavericks.
:sleeping :sleeping :sleeping and they are still under 500% cool

call me when Gay makes it to the playoffs


lol @ this Gay > KD crap

[8BeastlyXOIAD]

I can't believe this thread is still going on

Stephon fvcking Marbury averaged 24 ppg 8 apg 3 rpg on 54 TS% in 2001

Derick Rose is averaging 24 ppg 8 apg 5 rpg on 54.5 TS% this season

/thread, GFO

Durant shoots 52% from 2
Rose shoots 47% from 2
Durant makes 1.7 3's a game
Rose makes 1.5 3's a game
Durant shoots 88% from the line
Rose shoots 80% from the line

Durant ranks higher in assists for his respective position
Durant averages way more rpg, bpg, and equal spg
Durant averages fewer to/g

Durant averages 4 more ppg on the same FGA

Durant's defense is unquestionably better than Rose's

WHat the hell is the argument here? What exactly does Rose do better than Durant?

yo Joyner, Rose said Gay>Kevin:roll: :roll: :roll:

[Doranku]

Yeah like seriously Rose Rudy Gay > Durant:facepalm

Gay team isnt even 500%

And the supporting cast surrounding Gay is probably better than Durant's. Durant has Westbrook, but let's compare bigs.

Zach Randolph/Marc Gasol vs. Krstic/Ibaka/Collison :oldlol: :oldlol: :oldlol: The talent levels aren't even CLOSE, yet Durant's team has a significantly better record than Gay's.

Hell, even from a statistical standpoint, Durant shits on Gay in EVERY category while playing less minutes. What is the argument here?

[Rose]

Furthermore, here's an ESPN article, ironically from today
Despite Monday night's miserable effort in Charlotte, the Grizzlies look to be the big winners from an unexpected shakeout in the West that has Phoenix falling off the radar and Denver appearing ready to join it. Memphis has a 38.8 percent probability of making the playoffs, according to today's Playoff Odds, and that probably understates its chances, given the odds of the Nuggets' trading Anthony and the fact that the Grizzlies play Denver twice more in mid-February.

Before the Charlotte disaster, Memphis beat three winning teams consecutively for the first time since 2004, including an impressive beatdown of the Lakers in L.A. Although Memphis' overall record is just 17-21, the Griz play 24 of their final 43 games at home. They've been unlucky, too -- scoring as many points as their opponents but standing four games under .500 -- with Tyreke Evans' half-court shot in Sacramento being the most notable manifestation of their misfortune.

Nonetheless, the Griz stand a solid 13th in the Power Rankings this morning, and if I were a betting man, I'd wager that this is the year they make the playoffs

[Doranku]

The Grizzlies are two games under .500, with wins over the Heat, Lakers(twice) a loss to the Spurs (because Gay was out, if he played they win in regulation), the Jazz, Durant's Thunder, and I believe the Mavericks.

Didn't Durant just drop 40 on Gay's ass a few days ago? I think Gay fouled out that game, too. :facepalm

[8BeastlyXOIAD]

And the supporting cast surrounding Gay is probably better than Durant's. Durant has Westbrook, but let's compare bigs.

Zach Randolph/Marc Gasol vs. Krstic/Ibaka/Collison :oldlol: :oldlol: :oldlol: The talent levels aren't even CLOSE, yet Durant's team has a significantly better record than Gay's.

Hell, even from a statistical standpoint, Durant shits on Gay in EVERY category while playing less minutes. What is the argument here?
I dont know you tell me


Rose is from Tennessee so maybe he is a Gay Homer?:confusedshrug:

[Rose]

And the supporting cast surrounding Gay is probably better than Durant's. Durant has Westbrook, but let's compare bigs.

Zach Randolph/Marc Gasol vs. Krstic/Ibaka/Collison :oldlol: :oldlol: :oldlol: The talent levels aren't even CLOSE, yet Durant's team has a significantly better record than Gay's.

Hell, even from a statistical standpoint, Durant shits on Gay in EVERY category while playing less minutes. What is the argument here?Bolded is a HUGE myth. Gay actually gets slightly more assists, with FAR LESS turnovers, same rebounds basically, more steals and blocks.

And anyone who's EVER watched Zach Randolph will tell you that his stats are almost always empty ones. BUT I will admit the talent level is better.

[8BeastlyXOIAD]

[QUOTE=Rose]Furthermore, here's an ESPN article, ironically from today
Despite Monday night's miserable effort in Charlotte, the Grizzlies look to be the big winners from an unexpected shakeout in the West that has Phoenix falling off the radar and Denver appearing ready to join it. Memphis has a 38.8 percent probability of making the playoffs, according to today's Playoff Odds, and that probably understates its chances, given the odds of the Nuggets' trading Anthony and the fact that the Grizzlies play Denver twice more in mid-February.

Before the Charlotte disaster, Memphis beat three winning teams consecutively for the first time since 2004, including an impressive beatdown of the Lakers in L.A. Although Memphis' overall record is just 17-21, the Griz play 24 of their final 43 games at home. They've been unlucky, too -- scoring as many points as their opponents but standing four games under .500 -- with Tyreke Evans' half-court shot in Sacramento being the most notable manifestation of their misfortune.

Nonetheless, the Griz stand a solid 13th in the Power Rankings this morning, and if I were a betting man, I'd wager that this is the year they make the playoffs

[Rose]

Didn't Durant just drop 40 on Gay's ass a few days ago? I think Gay fouled out that game, too. :facepalm
Didn't Gay assault his ass two days before?

Yes. and I posted that, which was conviently ignored because people still prop up Durant. I like the guy don't get me wrong but he's not better, if anything they're equal.

[8BeastlyXOIAD]

Bolded is a HUGE myth. Gay actually gets slightly more assists, with FAR LESS turnovers, same rebounds basically, more steals and blocks.

And anyone who's EVER watched Zach Randolph will tell you that his stats are almost always empty ones. BUT I will admit the talent level is better.

Gay doesnt make life easier for his teams like how Durant does.

[8BeastlyXOIAD]

Didn't Gay assault his ass two days before?

Yes. and I posted that, which was conviently ignored because people still prop up Durant. I like the guy don't get me wrong but he's not better, if anything they're equal.
:roll: :roll: :roll: :roll: :roll: :roll: :roll:

where is Beasley in this than?

[scm5]

I have recently become a fan of Rose. I love the way Rose plays and find him to be probably the most exciting non-Laker player to watch right now.

If I were starting a franchise today though, and had my choice of the two to build around, I would definitely choose Durant. It's really hard to compare two players of different positions, so this is my explanation:

Durant would make it easier for almost any point guard coming into the league to rack up assists. He plays off the ball really well and he can create for himself. He is a very efficient scorer as well. His length and mobility for his size makes him an asset on defense. He could theoretically play any position 2-4. Drawing an obscene amount of fouls also puts a lot of pressure on the opposition.

Also, when watching Thunder games and seeing Durant go off, I can't help but feel for the other team. There are always ways to stop dribble penetration as long as the players respond. However, how do you stop a 6'11 dude w/ 7'4 wingspan from hitting shots all over the court? Put another 6'11 player on him and he's gonna blow by him. Put someone smaller and he will shoot over him. Very tough match up.

[Rose]

Gay doesnt make life easier for his teams like how Durant does.
I don't get how Durant does that with his .9 A:T ratio. And it's not like its a 7:7 or anything.

[YouCallILose]

OK Thunder 25-13

PG-23 ppg 8 apg 5 rpg 43 FG%
SG-6 ppg 5 rpg 2 apg 44 FG%
backup SF-1.0 ppg 1 rpg .3 apg 40 FG%
PF-16 ppg 6 rpg .3 BLK 42 FG%
C-8 ppg 5 rpg .5 BLK 47 FG%


Memphis Grizzlies 17-21

PG-13 ppg 7 apg 3 rpg 44 FG%
SG-13 ppg 3 rpg 2 apg 41 FG%
backup SF-6 ppg 2 rpg 1 apg 46 FG%
PF-20 ppg 13 rpg 2 apg 1.2 BLK 49 FG%
C-12 ppg 7 rpg 3 apg 1.6 BLK 52 FG%


ya seems like a fair game...ROFL


Durant averages 7 more ppg, more rpg, more apg, and on much better efficiency but ya..Gay is the better player

Durant just got done averaging 30/6/4 on 52/40 last month, Gay couldn't dream of averaging that

[8BeastlyXOIAD]

I don't get how Durant does that with his .9 A:T ratio. And it's not like its a 7:7 or anything.
:facepalm :facepalm so your gonna use stats to point out who is better:facepalm

[Doranku]

Bolded is a HUGE myth. Gay actually gets slightly more assists, with FAR LESS turnovers, same rebounds basically, more steals and blocks.

And anyone who's EVER watched Zach Randolph will tell you that his stats are almost always empty ones. BUT I will admit the talent level is better.

Rudy Gay: 21.0/6.1/2.7/1.9/1.2
Kevin Durant: 28.2/6.3/3.0/1.1/1.0

If you're going to say same rebounds, then you've gotta be consistent and say same blocks too. The only categories Gay wins, then, are steals and turnovers.

FAR LESS turnovers? Kevin Durant averages 3.3 TOs, Gay averages 2.6. I suppose that's a considerable gap, but when you consider usage rates, it's only natural that Durant is going to have more turnovers.

[Rose]

:facepalm :facepalm so your gonna use stats to point out who is better:facepalm
Well if he doesn't pass the ball, and he's really only shooting averagely...I don't see how he can make it easier. He gets 8 of his 28 points at the line and then shoots 45% from the field. That's not exactly spacing. And if you want to use that argument then Rudy Gay does it too by having more assists/less turnovers. While being a comparable shooter besides from three.

And defensively they're catching onto Durant. YOU HAVE TO BODY HIM. if you do that, he doesn't shoot as well. Artest pointed that out, and that's why smart defensive teams play him like that.

[tpols]

I have recently become a fan of Rose. I love the way Rose plays and find him to be probably the most exciting non-Laker player to watch right now.

If I were starting a franchise today though, and had my choice of the two to build around, I would definitely choose Durant. It's really hard to compare two players of different positions, so this is my explanation:

Durant would make it easier for almost any point guard coming into the league to rack up assists. He plays off the ball really well and he can create for himself. He is a very efficient scorer as well. His length and mobility for his size makes him an asset on defense. He could theoretically play any position 2-4. Drawing an obscene amount of fouls also puts a lot of pressure on the opposition.

Also, when watching Thunder games and seeing Durant go off, I can't help but feel for the other team. There are always ways to stop dribble penetration as long as the players respond. However, how do you stop a 6'11 dude w/ 7'4 wingspan from hitting shots all over the court? Put another 6'11 player on him and he's gonna blow by him. Put someone smaller and he will shoot over him. Very tough match up.
Yup anyone who isn't a rose stan/bulls fan would take durant over rose if given the choice...

[Doranku]

I don't get how Durant does that with his .9 A:T ratio. And it's not like its a 7:7 or anything.

Gay's is 2.7:2.6. That's hardly any better.

[YouCallILose]

Well if he doesn't pass the ball, and he's really only shooting averagely...I don't see how he can make it easier. He gets 8 of his 28 points at the line and then shoots 45% from the field. That's not exactly spacing. And if you want to use that argument then Rudy Gay does it too by having more assists/less turnovers. While being a comparable shooter besides from three.

And defensively they're catching onto Durant. YOU HAVE TO BODY HIM. if you do that, he doesn't shoot as well. Artest pointed that out, and that's why smart defensive teams play him like that.


First off, Durant is shooting 47% from the field. Secondly he is shooting 52% from inside the arc, only 32% from 3 but 3's count for more than 2's. If you break it down he's really shooting are 51 effective field goal percentage which is very good for his position and much better than your boy Rose.

All of this coming while he had the worst month of his career since his rookie year. By the end of the season Durant will be at 30~ ppg on 52-53 eFG% and this thread will be a joke.

You put Durant on the Grizzlies and they're a 3 or 4 seed right now.

[Rose]

Rudy Gay: 21.0/6.1/2.7/1.9/1.2
Kevin Durant: 28.2/6.3/3.0/1.1/1.0

If you're going to say same rebounds, then you've gotta be consistent and say same blocks too. The only categories Gay wins, then, are steals and turnovers.

FAR LESS turnovers? Kevin Durant averages 3.3 TOs, Gay averages 2.6. I suppose that's a considerable gap, but when you consider usage rates, it's only natural that Durant is going to have more turnovers.
Alright I thought Rudy was higher in blocks. I was wrong on that one.:cheers:

And even if that's true. And I'll go advanced stats with you and say sure usage rate accounts for most of the difference. But if it does then Gay's comparable in all stats. I personally believe he IS better, but there's at least a case that it's arguable.

[8BeastlyXOIAD]

I'm done with this thread:banana: :banana:

[YouCallILose]

Alright I thought Rudy was higher in blocks. I was wrong on that one.:cheers:

And even if that's true. And I'll go advanced stats with you and say sure usage rate accounts for most of the difference. But if it does then Gay's comparable in all stats. I personally believe he IS better, but there's at least a case that it's arguable.

No there is really not..and the only reason Durant is shooting 47% from the field is because of his horrible November where he shot 42%. The last 2 months he's shooting 52% from the field which is incredible considering he's taking 5 3's a game..so you can just stop with that garbage.

[Rose]

:cheers:
I'm done with this thread:banana: :banana:

[Doranku]

Alright I thought Rudy was higher in blocks. I was wrong on that one.:cheers:

And even if that's true. And I'll go advanced stats with you and say sure usage rate accounts for most of the difference. But if it does then Gay's comparable in all stats. I personally believe he IS better, but there's at least a case that it's arguable.

Agree to disagree. Gay has played phenomenally this year, no doubt, but I just don't see him on Durant's level.

To address the OP, however, with the way Rose is playing, I think that is a comparison that is arguable at the very least.

[chips93]

Oh and he does not have higher version of "whatever the hell else you want". Because I want to win. Id like to be able to rely on my guy when it matters. I dont care if Karl has higher...everything shooting. I dont care about his PPS. If I need my best player to go back to back to back on 3 posessions to keep my season going because everyone else is having an off night...Jordan can do that for me on a pretty regular basis. Karl can...sometimes. Far less.

What do all those numbers matter when you are still somehow less reliable?




clutch scoring stats can explain that :D

[Rose]

No there is really not..and the only reason Durant is shooting 47% from the field is because of his horrible November where he shot 42%. The last 2 months he's shooting 52% from the field which is incredible considering he's taking 5 3's a game..so you can just stop with that garbage.
Or you could say the inverse and say he just got hot:oldlol: And he still gets exposed against good defenses, you can't deny that. Whereas Rudy Gay has pretty much remained consistent against anyone and everyone.

[YouCallILose]

clutch scoring stats can explain that :D

per 48 clutch stats

Durant 42.8 ppg 55 TS% in the clutch

Rose 40.8 ppg 50.4 TS% in the clutch

OKC +51 in 73 clutch minutes with Durant

Chicago +33 in 76 clutch minutes with Rose

[Rose]

Agree to disagree. Gay has played phenomenally this year, no doubt, but I just don't see him on Durant's level.

To address the OP, however, with the way Rose is playing, I think that is a comparison that is arguable at the very least.
:cheers: Once he gets more exposure more people will see it. Tune into ESPN (16th?)when Derrick Rose takes his talents to Memphis. and you shall see! Statistically I think he's there, and I think he's finally using those intangibles but unless you don't watch the games you won't know.

[scm5]

http://www.basketball-reference.com/play-index/h2h_finder.cgi?request=1&p1=duranke01&p2=gayru01

Just adding fuel to the fire.

[YouCallILose]

Or you could say the inverse and say he just got hot:oldlol: And he still gets exposed against good defenses, you can't deny that. Whereas Rudy Gay has pretty much remained consistent against anyone and everyone.

Stasticially the top 8 teams in the league in opponents TS% are

Miami
Los Angeles L
Chicago
San Antonio
Dallas
Atlanta
Orlando
Boston

Durant's stats against these teams

Miami DNP
Los Angeles L DNP
Chicago 30 ppg 6 rpg 2 apg 38 FG% 93 FT%
San Antonio 20 ppg 6 rpg 3 apg 45 FG% 67 FT%
Dallas 29 ppg 6 rpg 4 apg 53 FG% 89 FT%
Atlanta 33 ppg 4 rpg 3 apg 50 FG% 100 FT%
Orlando DNP
Boston 34 ppg 6 rpg 3 apg 50 FG% 91 FT%



Yes clearly, exposed

[Rose]

http://www.basketball-reference.com/play-index/h2h_finder.cgi?request=1&p1=duranke01&p2=gayru01

Just adding fuel to the fire.
Playing each other to a draw, also let's highlight how many of those are free throws.

[Rose]

Stasticially the top 8 teams in the league in opponents TS% are

Miami
Los Angeles L
Chicago
San Antonio
Dallas
Atlanta
Orlando
Boston

Durant's stats against these teams

Miami DNP
Los Angeles L DNP
Chicago 30 ppg 6 rpg 2 apg 38 FG% 93 FT%
San Antonio 20 ppg 6 rpg 3 apg 45 FG% 67 FT%
Dallas 29 ppg 6 rpg 4 apg 53 FG% 89 FT%
Atlanta 33 ppg 4 rpg 3 apg 50 FG% 100 FT%
Orlando DNP
Boston 34 ppg 6 rpg 3 apg 50 FG% 91 FT%



Yes clearly, exposed
Clearly exposed yes.

[YouCallILose]

http://www.basketball-reference.com/play-index/h2h_finder.cgi?request=1&p1=duranke01&p2=gayru01

Just adding fuel to the fire.

And that includes Durants rookie year :lol

lets make it even more fun, Durant vs Gay these last 3 years

Durant: 31.75 ppg 8 rpg 3.25 apg 1.9 bpg 51.8 FG%
Gay: 22 ppg 5.9 rpg 1.8 apg 1.1 BPG 44.8 FG%

Yep, Gay>Durant

[Rose]

And that includes Durants rookie year :lol

lets make it even more fun, Durant vs Gay these last 3 years

Durant: 31.75 ppg 8 rpg 3.25 apg 1.9 bpg 51.8 FG%
Gay: 22 ppg 5.9 rpg 1.8 apg 1.1 BPG 44.8 FG%

Yep, Gay>Durant
Glad we agree.:cheers:

[YouCallILose]

Clearly exposed yes.

That adds up to 28.4 ppg on 47.1 FG%

Yep, exposed. You're an idiot just GTFO those are better than his regular season numbers which are 28.2 ppg on 46.6 FG%

[8BeastlyXOIAD]

:facepalm :facepalm :facepalm :facepalm @ this Gay vs Durant argument

[Rose]

That adds up to 28.4 ppg on 47.1 FG%

Yep, exposed. You're an idiot just GTFO those are better than his regular season numbers which are 28.2 ppg on 46.6 FG%
:facepalm

Who was better Chris Paul or Deron Williams because in their head to head matchups usually Deron put up better numbers than Paul and always won, but who was actually better the past two years?

[YouCallILose]

Want some more Rose? Here is last seasons

Statistically the 5 best defenses in the league are Charlotte, Boston, Orlando, Milwaukee, and Miami.

LeBron James
29.2 PPG 47.8 FG% 80.5 FT% 58.8 TS%

Kevin Durant
30.1 ppg 51.5 FG% 91.0 FT% 62.4 TS%

Carmelo Anthony
27.6 ppg 43.5 FG% 85.1 FT% 52.3 TS%

Kobe Bryant
24.2 ppg 40.7 FG% 81.0 FT% 49.16 TS%

Dwayne Wade(LAL is #6 substituted in place of Miami)
23.6 ppg 42.9 FG% 76.9 FT% 47.4 TS%

[8BeastlyXOIAD]

:facepalm

Who was better Chris Paul or Deron Williams because in their head to head matchups usually Deron put up better numbers than Paul and always won, but who was actually better the past two years?

Deron Williams next question

[Rose]

He wasn't really exposed until Artest....

[8BeastlyXOIAD]

Want some more Rose? Here is last seasons

Statistically the 5 best defenses in the league are Charlotte, Boston, Orlando, Milwaukee, and Miami.

LeBron James
29.2 PPG 47.8 FG% 80.5 FT% 58.8 TS%

Kevin Durant
30.1 ppg 51.5 FG% 91.0 FT% 62.4 TS%

Carmelo Anthony
27.6 ppg 43.5 FG% 85.1 FT% 52.3 TS%

Kobe Bryant
24.2 ppg 40.7 FG% 81.0 FT% 49.16 TS%

Dwayne Wade(LAL is #6 substituted in place of Miami)
23.6 ppg 42.9 FG% 76.9 FT% 47.4 TS%

i lol'd when i seen Kobe fg%:oldlol: :oldlol:

[YouCallILose]

He wasn't really exposed until Artest....

Oh..you mean he was exposed in his first ever playoff series which happened to be vs the 2X defending world champs? LeBron has posted worse numbers vs the NBA champs when he faced them in the playoffs, was he exposed? Factoring in 3 pointers and FT's Durant was more efficient vs Artest, Bynum, and Gasol than Rose was vs Mo Williams and Snaq attack

[Rose]

Deron Williams next question
Paul had the two best seasons by a point guard EVER. there's no doubt about it.

[8BeastlyXOIAD]

Paul had the two best seasons by a point guard EVER. there's no doubt about it.

but who was better:pimp:


Deron Williams next question

STATS dont mean shit

[Rose]

Oh..you mean he was exposed in his first ever playoff series which happened to be vs the 2X defending world champs? LeBron has posted worse numbers vs the NBA champs when he faced them in the playoffs, was he exposed? Factoring in 3 pointers and FT's Durant was more efficient vs Artest, Bynum, and Gasol than Rose was vs Mo Williams and Snaq attack
Not comparing Rose, here...I haven't in this entire thread actually...

And no, by Ron Artest arguably the greatest wing defender since Jordan, since then any smart defensive team has locked him up.

[YouCallILose]

Paul had the two best seasons by a point guard EVER. there's no doubt about it.
:roll:

wait no...
:roll:

really?
:roll:

Magic averaged 24/12/6 & 23/13/8 on insane percentages
:roll:

[Rose]

but who was better:pimp:


Deron Williams next question

STATS dont mean shit
I'm gonna go Joyner and argue this
HE WAS SECOND IN MVP VOTING.
Did more with less.

[YouCallILose]

Not comparing Rose, here...I haven't in this entire thread actually...

And no, by Ron Artest arguably the greatest wing defender since Jordan, since then any smart defensive team has locked him up.

Really? is that why he destroyed the best defensive team in the league, boston?

[Rose]

:roll:

wait no...
:roll:

really?
:roll:

Magic averaged 24/12/6 & 23/13/8 on insane percentages
:roll:
Yes really. look it up, pretty much anyone agrees stats wise he had the best season ever.

[8BeastlyXOIAD]

I'm gonna go Joyner and argue this
HE WAS SECOND IN MVP VOTING.
Did more with less.
:confusedshrug: :confusedshrug:

There you go than

I'm gonna go with Rose and argue this
Kevin Durant was second in MVP VOTING
Did more with less

see what i just did there

/thread:banana: :banana:

[alenleomessi]

I'm gonna go Joyner and argue this
HE WAS SECOND IN MVP VOTING.
Did more with less.
Should have been first

[Rose]

:confusedshrug: :confusedshrug:

There you go than

I'm gonna go with Rose and argue this
Kevin Durant was second in MVP VOTING
Did more with less

see what i just did there

/thread:banana: :banana:
:banana: :banana:

/chris paul was still better ;D

[Rose]

Should have been first
I agree wholeheartedly

[8BeastlyXOIAD]

Really? is that why he destroyed the best defensive team in the league, boston?

"i thought we were playing Michael F#$#%in Jordan out there mAN":lol :lol :lol

QUOTE OF THE YEAR^^^


http://www.playerpress.com/uploads/Image/mp_main_wide_Kevin_Garnett-300x185.jpg

[YouCallILose]

So according to Rose

23 ppg 11 apg 6 rpg 50 FG%>23 ppg 13 apg 8 rpg 51 FG%

pass that shit bro

[Rose]

So according to Rose

23 ppg 11 apg 6 rpg 50 FG%>23 ppg 13 apg 8 rpg 51 FG%

pass that shit bro
Old Kareem, Worthy, Scott>>>>>>>Peja,West, Tyson.

[Sarcastic]

Pretty ironic that today someone asked Durant on Twitter who his favorite athletes are, and he listed Derrick Rose and Mike Vick.


@KDthunderup
Kevin Durant
Derrick rose and mike vick RT @BlackMaJic1212: @KDthunderup favorite player to watch? any sport?

http://twitter.com/#!/KDthunderup/status/25007193967300608

[PurpleChuck]

Pretty ironic that today someone asked Durant on Twitter who his favorite athletes are, and he listed Derrick Rose and Mike Vick.


@KDthunderup
Kevin Durant
Derrick rose and mike vick RT @BlackMaJic1212: @KDthunderup favorite player to watch? any sport?

http://twitter.com/#!/KDthunderup/status/25007193967300608

joyner wad you got now? your mancrush gave Rose his props, you mad brah?:lol

[RoseCity07]

If I had Derrick Rose, I would trade him for Durant.

Durant is very long, so he can get some blocks and contest any shot.

He's an unstoppable scorer. This guy makes 3 pointers look like lay ups.

I just think at the end of their careers, Durant will be a lot more useful.

[ILLsmak]

"the refs"

-Smak

[M.V.P]

So according to Rose

23 ppg 11 apg 6 rpg 50 FG%>23 ppg 13 apg 8 rpg 51 FG%

pass that shit bro
Pace might be a huge factor.
Putting them at Magic's pace, Paul's stats are: 24.2, 11.7, 5.8 and 3.2 steals. That's compared to Magic's 22.5, 12.8, and 7.9 with 1.8 steals. Compared to league average, Paul would also give you a much better FG% than Magic did compared to the rest of his peers. Paul gives you the scoring and stealing advantage, while Magic gives you a slight advantage in passing (he had MUCH better players to pass to than Paul did) and rebounding.

I'm not saying these would be Paul's exact stats, but taking pace and teammates into account, it's not terribly wrong to say they're comparable.

[MELOgamaniac]

he plays SF you imbecile. Durant=3rd in the NBA in assists among SF's. Rose=8th in the NBA in assists among PG's

any other bright ideas?


HAHA...who listens to you...you lie in every post..durant=3rd best among sf in assist per game

Durant=3.0 ast per game

lebron=7.2
iggy= 5.5
pierce= 3.6
turkalo= 3.5

Where do you get your numbers from ...your imagination lulz

[Nash-tastic]

HAHA...who listens to you...you lie in every post..durant=3rd best among sf in assist per game

Durant=3.0 ast per game

lebron=7.2
iggy= 5.5
pierce= 3.6
turkalo= 3.5

Where do you get your numbers from ...your imagination lulz
Don't forget Stephen Jackson (4.2 APG) and John Salmons (3.2 APG) if you consider them SFs, they are more like swingmen though.

[Sarcastic]

According ESPN, Durant is 4th among SFs in assists.

http://espn.go.com/nba/statistics/player/_/stat/assists/sort/avgAssists/position/small-forwards

[M.V.P]

According ESPN, Durant is 4th among SFs in assists.

http://espn.go.com/nba/statistics/player/_/stat/assists/sort/avgAssists/position/small-forwards
They probably have a minimum games played thing, because they don't include Iggy or Melo who have missed some games.

[YouCallILose]

They probably have a minimum games played thing, because they don't include Iggy or Melo who have missed some games.

Melo is averaging exactly 3 apg, same as Durant. Iguodala is a freaking SG, gtfo

[2010splash]

Face it man, Durant stunk it up when it truly mattered (in the playoffs).

Rose's first ever playoff game he dropped 36/11, best playoff debut ever. And he's only gonna get better.

Durant in his first playoff series shot 35%.

I'll repeat that: THIRTY FIVE PERCENT! :oldlol:

[madmax]

Face it man, Durant stunk it up when it truly mattered (in the playoffs).

Rose's first ever playoff game he dropped 36/11, best playoff debut ever. And he's only gonna get better.

Durant in his first playoff series shot 35%.

I'll repeat that: THIRTY FIVE PERCENT! :oldlol:

:lol :D He was owned badly in those series...Westbrook had to carry that team on his back for them to have any chance

[M.V.P]

Melo is averaging exactly 3 apg, same as Durant. Iguodala is a freaking SG, gtfo
Iguodala a shooting guard? Dude, you'll find absolutely no one that will agree with you on that. Melo was averaging more assists per game when the posts were made. Additionally, Melo is still averaging more assists per game technically if you go into more decimal places, so technically Durant is still behind him.

[lilojmayo]

First off, Durant is shooting 47% from the field. Secondly he is shooting 52% from inside the arc, only 32% from 3 but 3's count for more than 2's. If you break it down he's really shooting are 51 effective field goal percentage which is very good for his position and much better than your boy Rose.

All of this coming while he had the worst month of his career since his rookie year. By the end of the season Durant will be at 30~ ppg on 52-53 eFG% and this thread will be a joke.

You put Durant on the Grizzlies and they're a 3 or 4 seed right now.


That's a very bold statement, and that's where I believe the Gay vs Durant argument ends. I feel the same way, Durant on the Grizzlies they would be one of the top teams in the West right now record wise. Gay is very talented player though.


That being said give me Derrick Rose because he can pass the ball and score

[8BeastlyXOIAD]

According ESPN, Durant is 4th among SFs in assists.

http://espn.go.com/nba/statistics/player/_/stat/assists/sort/avgAssists/position/small-forwards

according to ESPN Beasley is a power forward:facepalm