I'm not mad Nash won 2 MVPs

[GOBB]

21ppg 11.5apg 2.9rpg FG 53% 3pt 52% FT 89%

:bowdown:

How else do you explain his incredible production the last 3yrs? I mean his %'s are insane across the board. He's avg about 15 shots a game and 5 of them are 3pters. I guess if he shot more his FG % would go down...but he's avg 21ppg. I mean if he shot more he'd probably have retarded stats.

His defense isnt nothing to type about but quite frankly. Offensively, as a guy who can get the ball to people in the right spots, who has decieving speed/change of direction when he is handling the ball...who cares. :confusedshrug:

People knocked his MVP trophies, probably will continue it but I'm sold. I'm convinced. He deserved them, he produces, he does it all. Whats to say he wont win it again? Only 15gms, season is way young...but he is having as good a year so far as he did the previous two MVP seasons. 3gms behind Utah for having the best record in the NBA. I f*cks with the homie Nash. And you all should do.

Agree?

[Kobe24]

He didn't deserve his second one no matter how hard you try to deny it.

[DreamRockets]

i agree, his mvp were deserved, too bad the dirk groupies will swarm and inffest this thread in no time.

[DreamRockets]

He didn't deserve his second one no matter how hard you try to deny it.

let me guess, the guy on your avatar did ? :rollingeyes:

[GOBB]

He didn't deserve his second one no matter how hard you try to deny it.

Who did deserve it? Last season the race was close. I compare it to a Kentuck Derby finish where you gotta go to the tapes to see who won.

[WildStyle]

There have been plenty of players that put up numbers like that in the past and didn't win MVP. Phoenix didn't even have a top 2 record last season. Shaq should have won MVP in 2005, Dirk should have won in 2006.

[i seen hippos]

1st one no one was close to nash.
2nd one only lebron had a realistic arguement and played too immature too many times to deserve it.

if nash keeps these numbers up and has a few more games like last night that boggle the mind, then he'll have to be at least top 3 again.

[DreamRockets]

nash won more games than shaq in 05, turned a worst team than pre shaq miami into a better team than miami with shaq, there isnt a REALLY great argument you can make for each because that was the closest voting ever.

[raiderfan19]

Who did deserve it? Last season the race was close. I compare it to a Kentuck Derby finish where you gotta go to the tapes to see who won.
last season was a photo finish between two guys to use that analogy. Nash wasnt one of them.

[GOBB]

There have been plenty of players that put up numbers like that in the past and didn't win MVP.

So? Then you name me who should have won it plus thier stats so i can counter the same damn argument. :no:

[i seen hippos]

the worst arguement is always "hey let's look back ten years to find out why nash shouldn't have won it."

or

"how many MVP's did stockton win?"

who gives a **** about the past?

[GOBB]

last season was a photo finish between two guys to use that analogy. Nash wasnt one of them.

Who was?

[GOBB]

the worst arguement is always "hey let's look back ten years to find out why nash shouldn't have won it."

or

"how many MVP's did stockton win?"

who gives a **** about the past?

Exactly...holds no relevance whatsoever.

[raiderfan19]

Who was?
lebron and dirk. One of them should have won it.

[Younggrease]

im not mad at NAsh either... It just changed my opinion about the MVP as an award. I will now give it a lot less weight when comparing players. It is obvious that you can win it but not even be a top 7 player.

[WildStyle]

Not saying they should have won it, because I'm not saying Nash should have won it. But guys who have put up similar or better numbers then Nash's 2 MVP years are Kevin Johnson, Tim Hardaway, John Stockton, Rod Strickland, Isiah Thomas, Stephon Marbury, Gary Payton. That's off the top of my head.

[DreamRockets]

lebron and dirk. One of them should have won it.

:hammerhead: :wtf: :hammerhead: :oldlol:

lebron mvp my ass, 50 wins in the east make you the mvp ?

[LakersDynasty]

Nash is a top 5 player, he has more impact on the game than Wade, Garnett, Iverson. Where he goes the Suns go.

[i seen hippos]

Kevin Johnson, Tim Hardaway, John Stockton, Rod Strickland, Isiah Thomas, Stephon Marbury, Gary Payton.

what's your point though. are they playing now?

[WildStyle]

It is obvious that you can win it but not even be a top 7 player.

lol... only since Nash started winning it.

[raiderfan19]

:hammerhead: :wtf: :hammerhead: :oldlol:

lebron mvp my ass, 50 wins in the east make you the mvp ?
50 wins is closer to the suns win total than the suns win total was to the mavs so why do those 4 wins preclude lebron from winning but the mavs 6 more wins AND dirks better individual season dont give it to him.

[adamcz]

That's ridiculous. There's no way that Nash was not a top 5 player over the past two years. His stats support this, his team record supports this, and actually watching him play supports this. He gets it done, all year long - It's just hard for people to comprehend that he peaked so late in his career.

I think his detractors are still looking at his stats and results from five years ago instead of confronting reality.

[raiderfan19]

its hilarious the hypocrisy you have to use to argue nash for mvp. Lebron cant win it because nashs team won 4 more games. 4 whole games.

But dirks team won 6 more games than nashs? Ummmm Move along, nothing to see here.

[WildStyle]

what's your point though. are they playing now?

No, but Shaq was playing in 2005. Dirk was playing in 2006. So was LeBron.

[i seen hippos]

i thought shaq was very undeserving of being the 2nd vote getter two years ago.

dirk was 3rd or 4th on my list last year.

[GOBB]

Not saying they should have won it, because I'm not saying Nash should have won it. But guys who have put up similar or better numbers then Nash's 2 MVP years are Kevin Johnson, Tim Hardaway, John Stockton, Rod Strickland, Isiah Thomas, Stephon Marbury, Gary Payton. That's off the top of my head.

I'd ask you to post the stats and years only to show you who won the MVP over them and how the MVP race back then didnt compare to NOW. I bet my life if a prime GP was playing today and he won MVP? No one would complain or make a big piss fest.

[DreamRockets]

Not saying they should have won it, because I'm not saying Nash should have won it. But guys who have put up similar or better numbers then Nash's 2 MVP years are Kevin Johnson, Tim Hardaway, John Stockton, Rod Strickland, Isiah Thomas, Stephon Marbury, Gary Payton. That's off the top of my head.

those player were facing true mvp candidates.

payton, KJ, strickland and stockton were facing prime jordan, prime hakeem, drob, young shaq for the award, those players were getting 60 wins every year and putting almost unmatchable numbers.

thomas was facing magic, bird and jordan as well.

tim hardaway was facing prime shaq and prime duncan during the era in when they were ruling the league.

steve nash didnt win mvp because he was better than those beforementioned players, but because his competition is weaker, shaq is way past his days of mvp contention, duncan is probably in his last couple years of contention for the award, nash won it because he was going against a couple of overhyped guards who haven't done jack in their lives and who barely crack 40 something and 50 wins in kobe and lebron.

nash isnt better than stockton, payton, strickland, whoever, he didnt win because he was better than those players were, but because his competition sucked.

[A Roc 23]

That's ridiculous. There's no way that Nash was not a top 5 player over the past two years. His stats support this, his team record supports this, and actually watching him play supports this. He gets it done, all year long - It's just hard for people to comprehend that he peaked so late in his career.

I think his detractors are still looking at his stats and results from five years ago instead of confronting reality.

:bowdown: :applause:

[raiderfan19]

and we continue to ignore the point that the differential between the mavs and suns was greater than the differential between the suns and cavs

[A Roc 23]

Not saying they should have won it, because I'm not saying Nash should have won it. But guys who have put up similar or better numbers then Nash's 2 MVP years are Kevin Johnson, Tim Hardaway, John Stockton, Rod Strickland, Isiah Thomas, Stephon Marbury, Gary Payton. That's off the top of my head.

Only Isiah Thomas and maybe Stockton had as much IMPACT on the game as Nash. Also, other then Stockton (who's career overall is still a litte > Nash's) which one of those players had seasons with about 12 assists on the best regular season team in the league?

[LakersDynasty]

nash isnt better than stockton, payton, strickland, whoever, he didnt win because he was better than those players were, but because his competition sucked.
Nash is easily better than Strickland.

[i seen hippos]

and we continue to ignore the point that the differential between the mavs and suns was greater than the differential between the suns and cavs

who cares? obviously no one if they're ignoring you.

[Shepseskaf]

Excellent point guard. Gets his teammates involved. Generates entertaining up-tempo style.

Not the MVP. Either year. End of story.

[DreamRockets]

the cavs won 50 IN THE EAST, whether YOU like it or no the voters understand that the cavs would barely crack 40 in the west, which is the conference where nash lead the suns to 54 wins without 30 ppg amare stoudemire who was out all year.

the suns werent better in 06 than in 05, but having lost amare, and still winning 54 games made nash a huge favor in the voter's eyes.

[DreamRockets]

Nash is easily better than Strickland.

i meant to say is debateable, sorry if you misunderstood that but what i meant is that nash didnt win mvp because he was better than those players (maybe he was, maybe he wasnt, is debateable) but because his teams were btter and because his competition for the award was worst, nash wouldnt have won the award over jordan, magic, bird, hakeem, prime shaq, prime duncan either, buts thats kind of irrelevant, he didnt compete against them, but against 2 overrated guards who werent part of elite teams.

[raiderfan19]

the cavs won 50 IN THE EAST, whether YOU like it or no the voters understand that the cavs would barely crack 40 in the west, which is the conference where nash lead the suns to 54 wins without 30 ppg amare stoudemire who was out all year.

the suns werent better in 06 than in 05, but having lost amare, and still winning 54 games made nash a huge favor in the voter's eyes.
which is retarded. You dont focus on what a team doesnt have. The suns still had Marion, Diaw(who was good regardless of nash) bell, barbosa and kurt thomas. The mavs won 60 games with adrian griffin and desagana diop starting the majority of games and having the most injuries in the nba that negated their already overrated depth.

Griffin cant get minutes on the bulls now and diop is a 15 minute a game guy who can only block shots. The suns had more talent and won less games last year than the mavs.

[GOBB]

I want to know what makes Lebron or Dirk MVP canidates and not Steve Nash. Seems like fans have made him into a player that cant win it. Like its reserved for a specific elite group and no one else...and Nash isnt among the elites. His production is a product of the system D'Antoni has instilled along with talented players who excel in the same system to give Nash his assist numbers. I wanna know what it is about Nash that he cant win a MVP.

[DreamRockets]

which is retarded. You dont focus on what a team doesnt have. The suns still had Marion, Diaw(who was good regardless of nash) bell, barbosa and kurt thomas. The mavs won 60 games with adrian griffin and desagana diop starting the majority of games and having the most injuries in the nba that negated their already overrated depth.

Griffin cant get minutes on the bulls now and diop is a 15 minute a game guy who can only block shots. The suns had more talent and won less games last year than the mavs.


thats bullcrap, why no mention of howard and terry ?

the suns were hit by injuries all year, one injury sidelined their best scorer all season long, kurt thomas missed a lot of games too, marion depends on amare to do pretty much everything, diaw was a garbage 4 ppg player who nash MADE good, end of story.

[konex]

Maybe he deserved the first one but he STOLE that second one from Kobe, Bron or Dirk.

I mean, who DOESN'T have good stats in that system? And he plays with too many good players to get MVP twice in a row IMO.

Voters are in a jam this year cos there's NO WAY they can give it to him even if he does deserve it :roll:

[Glove_20]

Nash in 2005

Ok, he deserved MVP

But in 2006?

NO WAY



Dirk should've been MVP...
Why?
Simple

1. His team had a better record
2. He had less talent around him
3. He put numbers as good as or BETTER than Nash last year


Why didn't Dirk win MVP?

[tontoz]

the suns werent better in 06 than in 05, but having lost amare, and still winning 54 games made nash a huge favor in the voter's eyes.

Have to agree there. When Amare went down i saw so many gloom and doom predictions for the Suns. I also saw some Nash haters who said he would be exposed without Amare. OOPS

I have no problem at all with him winning his two MVPs.

[LakersDynasty]

For the first time ever, I agree with Glove. Nash should have been a top MVP candidate last year but Dirk deserved it more than him IMO.

[DreamRockets]

Maybe he deserved the first one but he STOLE that second one from Kobe, Bron or Dirk.


dirk is the only one arguable, kobe was part of a garbage team who won 45 games, lebron won 50 games, seriously dislodge your head from those 2 overrated guards and tell me who was won mvp in the last 25 years with 50-wins ? nobody has, lebron and kobe mvp would have been a pharce and a travesty to say the least.


I mean, who DOESN'T have good stats in that system? And he plays with too many good players to get MVP twice in a row IMO.


thats all it is, your opinion, biased as always, diaw was garbage without nash, amare jumped from 19 ppg scorer to 26 pg 56% scorer within a year thanks to the mvp, bell, jones, house, marion do nothing offensivelly except for wait the mvp to give them the ball on an open spot to take an open jumper, nash isnt a part or product of the system, the guy IS the system.

[GOBB]

Maybe he deserved the first one but he STOLE that second one from Kobe, Bron or Dirk.

:roll: stole it from Kobe? Get real. Last yrs was arguable. But for fans to act like he shouldnt have even been in the race, been considered is silly.


I mean, who DOESN'T have good stats in that system? And he plays with too many good players to get MVP twice in a row IMO..

Classic, i just spoke on fans using this excuse.


Voters are in a jam this year cos there's NO WAY they can give it to him even if he does deserve it :roll:

They arent in a jam. He continues this if not betters his stats...and the Suns win games. I wouldnt be mad if he won #3.




The thing that gets me is this board can be stat whores. We post the stats Lebron puts up. KG put up back then...a list of players who put up eye opening stats. Nash does that and he doesnt deserve an award for it. What does Bron do that makes him any more deserving? Didnt know the prerequisitie was to play on a bad team, play in a avg system and put up stats...therefore you qualify. If thats the case Allen Iverson should have won it last yr. Oops you'll edit your criteria and say they must make playoffs/have a top NBA record. But Nash was apart of that as well. Whatever.

You guys make a criteria that is funny and not consistent at all. Has holes.

[DoubleTech]

Maybe he deserved the first one but he STOLE that second one from Kobe, Bron or Dirk.

I mean, who DOESN'T have good stats in that system? And he plays with too many good players to get MVP twice in a row IMO.

Voters are in a jam this year cos there's NO WAY they can give it to him even if he does deserve it :roll:


raja bell, boris diaw... who were these players before they played with nash?

but no... its ENTIRELY the system... i mean, its easy to get great numbers in the system, it has nothing to do with the person who makes that system tick.

when george karl was asked at the beginning of the season whether the nugs could run a system as effective as PHX's... his response "nah, thats a Steve Nash thing"

and no one better mention kobe... this year he may have a chance cause the lakers are actually performing... last couple seasons with the lakers playing like a$$... NO CHANCE.

[raiderfan19]

thats bullcrap, why no mention of howard and terry ?

the suns were hit by injuries all year, one injury sidelined their best scorer all season long, kurt thomas missed a lot of games too, marion depends on amare to do pretty much everything, diaw was a garbage 4 ppg player who nash MADE good, end of story.
well how does marion depend on amare for everything considering he had a career year last year and if you want to talk about thomas missing alot of games? Ok lets go there. The mavs had Jerry stackhouse, Josh Howard, KVH, Quis, Devin Harris, and adrian griffin who all missed at least 20 games.

The mavs started rawle freakin marshall 9 games last year.

[raiderfan19]

raja bell, boris diaw... who were these players before they played with nash?

but no... its ENTIRELY the system... i mean, its easy to get great numbers in the system, it has nothing to do with the person who makes that system tick.

when george karl was asked at the beginning of the season whether the nugs could run a system as effective as PHX's... his response "nah, thats a Steve Nash thing"

and no one better mention kobe... this year he may have a chance cause the lakers are actually performing... last couple seasons with the lakers playing like a$$... NO CHANCE.
raja bells numbers barely moved except for a slight uptick in ppg which is simply accounted for by the pace.

[Younggrease]

[QUOTE=DreamRockets]dirk is the only one arguable, kobe was part of a garbage team who won 45 games, lebron won 50 games, seriously dislodge your head from those 2 overrated guards and tell me who was won mvp in the last 25 years with 50-wins ? nobody has, lebron and kobe mvp would have been a pharce and a travesty to say the least.



\QUOTE]

so you wanna bring up historical trends???The same trends that would make NAsh has more MVP's than Shaq. Shaq has been more valuable than NAsh ever since Orlando. Every single year, where are his 4 MVP's?????

[DreamRockets]

the historical trend is made by the voters, not me, THEY have decided for the past 3 decades (if i research further than that im sure the trend continues) that the mvp should be part of an elite team, not a 45wins team, they decide it, and thanks god they got it right, nash mvp, avery coach of the year, and ben wallace DPOY, im glad the voters saw through the kobe bryant/lebron james hype and voted for a true candidate on a true contendor, same with wallace over bowen.

[Glove_20]

I mean I am ok with Nash getting it in 2005

But he didn't deserve it in 2006...

Dirk should've been MVP...
Why?
Simple

1. His team had a better record
2. He had less talent around him
3. He put numbers as good as or BETTER than Nash last year


Why didn't Dirk win MVP?

[DreamRockets]

because his team didnt lose a 30 ppg scorer, pre-injury amare is as valuable as terry and howard put together, lets see what can dirk do if he loses them.

[konex]

seriously dislodge your head from those 2 overrated guards and tell me who was won mvp in the last 25 years with 50-wins ?

And who has won MVP in the last 25 with stats like Nash's?

[DreamRockets]

nash isnt a stat maker, he is a team leader, great passer and playmaker, who cant score the **** out of you if his team needs to.

there is a difference between being the mvp and a meaningless scoring champion, some people have trouble understanding that.

the kobe bryant bandwagoners made their case for kobe winning mvp on 3 things, his 81 pts game, his 62 pts game and his scoring title, because based on records the lakers were crap.

[Glove_20]

because his team didnt lose a 30 ppg scorer, pre-injury amare is as valuable as terry and howard put together, lets see what can dirk do if he loses them.

Dirk STILL had less talent around him even after he lost Amare

Nash had

Marion (All-Star)
Diaw
Raja Bell
Kurt Thomas

Dirk had

Josh Howard
Terry
Dampier



Nash STILL had more talent around him...yet Dirk put out a better record, with less talent, just as good or better numbers,

yet Nash gets the MVP
:confusedshrug:

[XxNeXuSxX]

I mean I am ok with Nash getting it in 2005

But he didn't deserve it in 2006...

Dirk should've been MVP...
Why?
Simple

1. His team had a better record
2. He had less talent around him
3. He put numbers as good as or BETTER than Nash last year


Why didn't Dirk win MVP?

I simply disagree with the bolded statement Glove. Dirk is surrounded with talented players around him Like Terry, Stackhouse(Good scorer), and Howard. As we know Nash didn't have Amare, so other than Nash the only really good player was Marion. The other players around him simply put up better numbers can be attributed to Nash, not so much can be said for Dirk's mates. Oh and I do think Dirk should have been MVP.

[raiderfan19]

because his team didnt lose a 30 ppg scorer, pre-injury amare is as valuable as terry and howard put together, lets see what can dirk do if he loses them.
This is the logic im talking about dip****. Yes losing amare was a huge loss and moreso than the other people the mavs lost BUT that would only matter if they started off with the same amount of talent around them which they didnt. Just saying well he didnt have amare doesnt mean that that team didnt have talent. No one else had amare either. :hammerhead: The suns were still an extremely talented team. Moreso than the mavs excluding the respective mvp candidates.

[konex]

If Kidd, GP and Stockon couldn't sniff MVPs doing the same thing, Nash ain't no MVP. And those guys played defense!

Best PG on a loaded team? Yes. MVP? Nope...

[DreamRockets]

Dirk STILL had less talent around him even after he lost Amare

Nash had

Marion (All-Star)
Diaw
Raja Bell
Kurt Thomas



all 4 players arent even 60% of what they looked with nash when nash doesnt play, so :confusedshrug:

[Glove_20]

I simply disagree with the bolded statement Glove. Dirk is surrounded with talented players around him Like Terry, Stackhouse(Good scorer), and Howard. As we know Nash didn't have Amare, so other than Nash the only really good player was Marion. The other players around him simply put up better numbers can be attributed to Nash, not so much can be said for Dirk's mates. Oh and I do think Dirk should have been MVP.

Marion is an all-star, and he is easily, and much better than Josh Howard or Jason Terry...

Diaw has talent, he isn't a product of a system, he just has great all-around ability...

Bell u can say is the product of Nash, but not Diaw...

Stachouse is a role player, kinda like Barbosa...

Kurt Thomas = Dampier basically




But anyways, what were ur reasons...

[raiderfan19]

it still amazes me that a team that started a guy who couldnt get minutes in cleveland and a guy who cant get minutes in chicago was considered to be so loaded by many of you. Wake the hell up. Jerry stackhouse was someone the mavs HAD to take to get devin. Besides that he was hurt and he sucked anyway.

[Glove_20]

all 4 players arent even 60% of what they looked with nash when nash doesnt play, so :confusedshrug:
Marion was doing good before Nash
Diaw has talent and excelled in the games Nash didn't play for the Suns
Bell, u could say was cuz of Nash
And Kurt Thomas put BETTER numbers without Nash...so :confusedshrug:

[Shepseskaf]

I want to know what makes Lebron or Dirk MVP canidates and not Steve Nash. Seems like fans have made him into a player that cant win it. Like its reserved for a specific elite group and no one else...and Nash isnt among the elites. His production is a product of the system D'Antoni has instilled along with talented players who excel in the same system to give Nash his assist numbers. I wanna know what it is about Nash that he cant win a MVP.
The factor is individual dominance. Just look at the list of past MVPs. For the most part they were acknowledged top-5 players, and feared around the league. To this legacy you put in a guy who averaged 15.5ppg (in 04-05)?????

The Suns had a great turnaround season, and he was a big part of it -- but was by no means the ONLY reason that the team ended with a gaudy record. He wasn't even the best player on his own team. Name me the last time a player like that was selected the MVP?

Various people have different reasons for why Nash shouldn't have been in the running for the MVP in either year. Mine is that he just isn't dominant enough, not in the mold of the previous winners.

All his defenders can talk about is the team record, but it seems to me like individual accomplishments in a given season -- which is usually heavily weighted in the MVP vote -- seems to have been completely discounted.

[DreamRockets]

If Kidd, GP and Stockon couldn't sniff MVPs doing the same thing, Nash ain't no MVP. And those guys played defense!

Best PG on a loaded team? Yes. MVP? Nope...

what part dont you get ?

kidd was going against prime shaq and duncan, kidd is an insignificant bum compared to those 2 legends.

GP was going against mike, hakeem, robinson, young shaq, barkley, malone, and he was simply no match for them

nash was going against 2 overhyped guards who didn't win enough games to be mvp, one of them won 45 so he was 100% not mvp and the other won 50 in the east, which translates into 40-43 in the west at most.

nash didn't face the legendary competition kidd and payton faced.

[EuJazz]

the cavs won 50 IN THE EAST, whether YOU like it or no the voters understand that the cavs would barely crack 40 in the west, which is the conference where nash lead the suns to 54 wins without 30 ppg amare stoudemire who was out all year.

the suns werent better in 06 than in 05, but having lost amare, and still winning 54 games made nash a huge favor in the voter's eyes.

LeBron averaged 31/7/7. Dirk averaged 27/9/3/1blk on a better team. And Amare hasn't ever averaged over 26 a game. Not that it's a huge difference, but stop putting '30 ppg' in there like it's his name, annoying.

Steve Nash winning the MVP is right up there with Hurricane Katrina in terms of the disasters that occured last year. It's just as sad, too.

[DreamRockets]

He wasn't even the best player on his own team.



of course he was, amare increased scoring and % was a product of nash's mvp game, same for JJ, q-rich, marion, bell, house, barbosa, jones increased scoring averages and having career years was a product of steve nash.

the only way to realize he is the best player is to ask yourself this= would amare or marion lead the suns to 54 wins with nash sitting out all season ? they would be cellar dwellars without nash, he is the system not just a part of it.

[EuJazz]

To this legacy you put in a guy who averaged 15.5ppg

Utter domination of the league! :rolleyes:

[raiderfan19]

btw on the nash makes marion idea, marions scoring isnt what improved with nash. He still scores roughly what he did pre nash if you exclude his rookie season. His rebounds and blocks went up. How the hell is that a result of nash? The rebounds are a result of the pace which some of you will confuse with nash but marion is roughly the same player he was pre nash. Bell is EXACTLY the same player he was he just gets to shoot a little more because of the pace.

[DreamRockets]

LeBron averaged 31/7/7. Dirk averaged 27/9/3/1blk on a better team. And Amare hasn't ever averaged over 26 a game. Not that it's a huge difference, but stop putting '30 ppg' in there like it's his name, annoying.

Steve Nash winning the MVP is right up there with Hurricane Katrina in terms of the disasters that occured last year. It's just as sad, too.

lebron averaged meaningless numbers on a pathetic and hyped pretender who barely cracked 50 wins after choking their way out of the playoffs for 2 consecutive years.

i don't give a sheit if it annoys you mister "stockton is a better shooter than hornacek and reggie miller" :roll: :roll: :roll: thats the true, their lost their best scorer and still were a great team, courtesy of nash mvp game, not of the overrated coattail riders who look better because of nash.

[EuJazz]

of course he was, amare increased scoring and % was a product of nash's mvp game, same for JJ, q-rich, marion, bell, house, barbosa, jones increased scoring averages and having career years was a product of steve nash.


Thanks for explaining for us how loaded that team was. Those guys would have goten theirs, you think all of them played well because of Nash? Bell did this same stuff in Utah, just upped his ppg in Phoenix because of the faster-paced game. And we all know Q-Rich (finally playing well again), JJ, and Marion can ball.

[raiderfan19]

of course he was, amare increased scoring and % was a product of nash's mvp game, same for JJ, q-rich, marion, bell, house, barbosa, jones increased scoring averages and having career years was a product of steve nash.

the only way to realize he is the best player is to ask yourself this= would amare or marion lead the suns to 54 wins with nash sitting out all season ? they would be cellar dwellars without nash, he is the system not just a part of it.
except that jj didnt have a career year, marions career year was a result of rebounding not scoring, qrich didnt have a career year and bell is just scoring 2 a game more than he used to because of the pace but on similar percentages. Barbosa has played almost his whole career with nash so that would be like attributing josh howards scoring solely to dirk.

You know for someone that complains about hype you dont seem to know a hell of alot more than what ric dickhead bucher says.

[EuJazz]

lebron averaged meaningless numbers on a pathetic and hyped pretender who barely cracked 50 wins after choking their way out of the playoffs for 2 consecutive years.

i don't give a sheit if it annoys you mister "stockton is a better shooter than hornacek and reggie miller" :roll: :roll: :roll: thats the true, their lost their best scorer and still were a great team, courtesy of nash mvp game, not of the overrated coattail riders who look better because of nash.

Never said he was better than Miller, fyi, you ****ing asshat.

How many people in history have averaged something like that? Meaningless my ass. And it's the regular season MVP, 50 wins isn't successful now-a-days?

And I could have sworn NASH was the best scorer on the team with the way people praise him around here...he wasn't even the best player on his team the first year. This is bush league.

[DreamRockets]

Thanks for explaining for us how loaded that team was. Those guys would have goten theirs, you think all of them played well because of Nash? Bell did this same stuff in Utah, just upped his ppg in Phoenix because of the faster-paced game. And we all know Q-Rich (finally playing well again), JJ, and Marion can ball.

no, we dont, marion balls because of nash, qrich the same, johnsonis the only one legit.

and no one invited you to the discussion MR "stockton is a better shooter than miller and hornacek" :roll: :roll: :roll: better go a delete those bs posts you made on the stockton threads :roll:

[Shepseskaf]

of course he was, amare increased scoring and % was a product of nash's mvp game, same for JJ, q-rich, marion, bell, house, barbosa, jones increased scoring averages and having career years was a product of steve nash.

the only way to realize he is the best player is to ask yourself this= would amare or marion lead the suns to 54 wins with nash sitting out all season ? they would be cellar dwellars without nash, he is the system not just a part of it.
So, this is your convoluted reasoning for saying that because he helped to facilitate getting his teammates involved (which is a point guard's job), which led to a very good record, he somehow is the best player on the team?

What are you smoking? This Nash groupie thing is so far out of control, it isn't funny anymore.

[Glove_20]

Come talk to me about this Dream Rockets

You still haven't dis proven my points

[EuJazz]

You know for someone that complains about hype you dont seem to know a hell of alot more than what ric dickhead bucher says.

*B!tchslaps DreamRockets with a fish*

[DreamRockets]

Never said he was better than Miller, fyi, you ****ing asshat.

How many people in history have averaged something like that? Meaningless my ass. And it's the regular season MVP, 50 wins isn't successful now-a-days?

of course is not when there are better players on better teams, lebron's 50 wins was like the 5th or 6th best record in the league, mvp my ass, 50 wins in the east is crap, and thats exactly why kidd didn't win it, because he had no arguments over tim duncan.

[EuJazz]

no, we dont, marion balls because of nash, qrich the same, johnsonis the only one legit.

and no one invited you to the discussion MR "stockton is a better shooter than miller and hornacek" :roll: :roll: :roll: better go a delete those bs posts you made on the stockton threads :roll:

Why dont you go read them, dumbass.

[raiderfan19]

the hypocrisy continues.

Nash supporter: its all about winning Nashs team won more than kobes or lebrons.
Dirk supporter: Umm Dirks team won more than nashs while dirk put up better individual numbers.
Nash Supporter: Nash didnt have amare.
Dirk supporter:He did have marion and diaw and bell and barbosa and thomas and...
Nash supporter: Ummm Nash is the greatest player ever....
dirk Supporter: so you have no clue what the hell you are talking about?
Nash supporter: Nash makes everyone better...
Dirk supporter: thats what i thought...

[DreamRockets]

So, this is your convoluted reasoning for saying that because he helped to facilitate getting his teammates involved (which is a point guard's job), which led to a very good record, he somehow is the best player on the team?

What are you smoking? This Nash groupie thing is so far out of control, it isn't funny anymore.

again wh0re boy , what would the suns be if nash sits out and amare and marion lead the team without him all season long ? :hammerhead: garbage is what they would be without their mvp :pimp:

[Glove_20]

the hypocrisy continues.

Nash supporter: its all about winning Nashs team won more than kobes or lebrons.
Dirk supporter: Umm Dirks team won more than nashs while dirk put up better individual numbers.
Nash Supporter: Nash didnt have amare.
Dirk supporter:He did have marion and diaw and bell and barbosa and thomas and...
Nash supporter: Ummm Nash is the greatest player ever....
dirk Supporter: so you have no clue what the hell you are talking about?
Nash supporter: Nash makes everyone better...
Dirk supporter: thats what i thought...

Thats basically how it went

[EuJazz]

of course is not when there are better players on better teams, lebron's 50 wins was like the 5th or 6th best record in the league, mvp my ass, 50 wins in the east is crap, and thats exactly why kidd didn't win it, because he had no arguments over tim duncan.

LeBron averaged 31/7/7 on the team with the 7th best record in the league, actually. Dirk averaged 27/9/3/1blk on the team with the 2nd best record, both deserved the MVP over Nash. The end.

[DreamRockets]

no, lebron didn't , you still don't make an argument for him which has any weight except for his horseshi** numbers which didnt translate into wins :hammerhead: so far dirk is the only argument here, but thats ok, after all stockton is a better shooter than hornacek so we can pretty much know what kind of replies to wait from you :pimp:

[raiderfan19]

on the marion thing im guessing the only way you would even begin to argue he makes him better is scoring because if you want to argue its nash that makes him a better rebounder well ill just laugh you off the board. These are marions scoring averages from each of the 3 pre nash seasons.

19.1
21.1
19.0

3 nash seasons(im including this one
19.4
21.4
19.9

Umm not that big of a difference guys...

[EuJazz]

again wh0re boy , what would the suns be if nash sits out and amare and marion lead the team without him all season long ? :hammerhead: garbage is what they would be without their mvp :pimp:

Mmm, Barbosa starting and Banks backing him up? That's better than you'd think. Bell, Marion, Thomas, '30 ppg Amare', Diaw, James Jones, Jalen Rose, Jumaine Jones...I bet they win 50+

[raiderfan19]

no, lebron didn't , you still don't make an argument for him which has any weight except for his horseshi** numbers which didnt translate into wins :hammerhead: so far dirk is the only argument here, but thats ok, after all stockton is a better shooter than hornacek so we can pretty much know what kind of replies to wait from you :pimp:
im a Dirk fan. Ill straight up admit that. However your arguments just seem abit retarded. So basically now its "well he only screwed one guy so whats the big deal?" Great...

[EuJazz]

no, lebron didn't , you still don't make an argument for him which has any weight except for his horseshi** numbers which didnt translate into wins :hammerhead: so far dirk is the only argument here, but thats ok, after all stockton is a better shooter than hornacek so we can pretty much know what kind of replies to wait from you :pimp:

Stockton's just as good of a shooter, exactly what I said in the other thread, horsec0ck.

Yes, LeBron did. And HOW IN THE WORLD does 31 points, 7 rebounds and 7 assists every night NOT translate into wins for Cleveland? Are you serious? You're kidding, right?

[DreamRockets]

if you chose marion you cant choose amare and vis versa, nash did it with only one of them in 06.

where would amare lead the suns without nash and marion ?

where would marion lead the suns without nash and amare ?

straight to lottery baby :hammerhead:

[EuJazz]

on the marion thing im guessing the only way you would even begin to argue he makes him better is scoring because if you want to argue its nash that makes him a better rebounder well ill just laugh you off the board. These are marions scoring averages from each of the 3 pre nash seasons.

19.1
21.1
19.0

3 nash seasons(im including this one
19.4
21.4
19.9

Umm not that big of a difference guys...

Nash, what a monster. Marion's rebounds went up, maybe it's because Nash is hucking up shots with his hair in his eyes. GOAT!

[DreamRockets]

Stockton's just as good of a shooter, exactly what I said in the other thread, horsec0ck.

Yes, LeBron did. And HOW IN THE WORLD does 31 points, 7 rebounds and 7 assists every night NOT translate into wins for Cleveland? Are you serious? You're kidding, right?

how in the world does he only get 50 wins in the pathetic east if those all-mighty legendary numbers translate into wins ? they should have won 70 games then if his numbers translate into wins :pimp:

[Shepseskaf]

again wh0re boy , what would the suns be if nash sits out and amare and marion lead the team without him all season long ? :hammerhead: garbage is what they would be without their mvp :pimp:
Ok, I see that you're an idiot so I'll try to use simple words:

I never said that Nash wasn't a key part of his team's success. He obviously was and is.

However, nothing that you just said explains why he should be the MVP of the entire league.

Do you get it? He is an excellent distributor, who gets his teammates involved but a player averaging 15.5ppg, even with lots of assists, does not rise to the traditional level of someone who wins the MVP.

Was that simple enough for you?

[LakersDynasty]

if you chose marion you cant choose amare and vis versa, nash did it with only one of them in 06.

where would amare lead the suns without nash and marion ?

where would marion lead the suns without nash and amare ?

straight to lottery baby :hammerhead:
You could use that logic with any of the MVP candidates.

Where would the Mavs be without Dirk? How about Kobe's and Lebron's teams? That's right, Nash still had a better supporting cast than any of these players.

[raiderfan19]

Im still also waiting for the explanation of how everything marion does right is attributable to nash but everything he does wrong is his own fault?

[XxNeXuSxX]

Im still also waiting for the explanation of how everything marion does right is attributable to nash but everything he does wrong is his own fault?
Who said this?

[DreamRockets]

so what ? if they dont win enough games they dont win mvp, PERIOD, what part of "winning 45 and 50 games isnt gonna get you mvp" the kobe and lebron groupies don't get ? :confusedshrug:

[EuJazz]

if you chose marion you cant choose amare and vis versa, nash did it with only one of them in 06.

where would amare lead the suns without nash and marion ?

where would marion lead the suns without nash and amare ?

straight to lottery baby :hammerhead:

He had them both the first year, jackass. Nash has always had one or the other. You'd have to say 'Where would Amare and Marion lead the Suns without Nash.'

Which, with Barbosa at point guard, there's not too big of a dropoff (what, 18 points and 7 assists instead of 18 and 10?) So in that case they average what, 102-104 points instead of around 110? Damn! They'll never win! :rolleyes:

[raiderfan19]

if you chose marion you cant choose amare and vis versa, nash did it with only one of them in 06.

where would amare lead the suns without nash and marion ?

where would marion lead the suns without nash and amare ?

straight to lottery baby :hammerhead:
Umm why the hell would you only have to pick one dip****? Has nash ever had to lead the suns without BOTH of those guys? I swear i think if someone asked you whats 2 + 2 you would answer nash is the mvp and the suns would suck without nash.

[EuJazz]

so what ? if they dont win enough games they dont win mvp, PERIOD, what part of "winning 45 and 50 games isnt gonna get you mvp" the kobe and lebron groupies don't get ? :confusedshrug:

Dirk Nowitzki.

Just admit that at least he deserved it over Nash and we can go ahead and call it good.

[DreamRockets]

Ok, I see that you're an idiot so I'll try to use simple words:

I never said that Nash wasn't a key part of his team's success. He obviously was and is.

However, nothing that you just said explains why he should be the MVP of the entire league.

Do you get it? He is an excellent distributor, who gets his teammates involved but a player averaging 15.5ppg, even with lots of assists, does not rise to the traditional level of someone who wins the MVP.

Was that simple enough for you?

11 assists translate into 22 points at least and up to 33 points if you consider 3pointers, in 00 shaq won mvp with 29 ppg and 3.8 apg.

nash averaged from 37 to 48 ppg considering his assists and shaq did from 37 to 41 ppg in 00 when he won mvp by a landslide, care to explain that ? :confusedshrug:

[LakersDynasty]

so what ? if they dont win enough games they dont win mvp, PERIOD, what part of "winning 45 and 50 games isnt gonna get you mvp" the kobe and lebron groupies don't get ? :confusedshrug:
Dirk had 60 wins last season with better numbers, why Nash before Dirk?

[DreamRockets]

Dirk Nowitzki.

Just admit that at least he deserved it over Nash and we can go ahead and call it good.

and i already conceded the dirk part of the debate deaf idiot :hammerhead: ist the kobe and lebron groupies who are driving me crazy :hammerhead:

[raiderfan19]

Who said this?
everyone in other threads. When they say that during the regular season everything marion does comes from nash but then he choked on his own in the playoffs(against the spurs). If everything he gets comes from nash then maybe nash choked at setting him up? (yes i know it sounds stupid thats the point i want some of you to realize how stupid some of the logic you use sounds)

[LakersDynasty]

11 assists translate into 22 points at least and up to 33 points if you consider 3pointers, in 00 shaq won mvp with 29 ppg and 3.8 apg.

nash averaged from 37 to 48 ppg considering his assists and shaq did from 37 to 41 ppg in 00 when he won mvp by a landslide, care to explain that ? :confusedshrug:
You did not just go there, Shaq averaged around 13 rebounds and 3 blocks that season shooting around 58% from the field while being a force on both ends of the floor, he was the most dominant player of all-time during that period, and you're comparing him to Nash based on assist numbers?

[Glove_20]

OK its over, the arguement is over

Nash shouldn't have won MVP

Dirk should've, Dream Rocket admit it




end of thread

[raiderfan19]

11 assists translate into 22 points at least and up to 33 points if you consider 3pointers, in 00 shaq won mvp with 29 ppg and 3.8 apg.

nash averaged from 37 to 48 ppg considering his assists and shaq did from 37 to 41 ppg in 00 when he won mvp by a landslide, care to explain that ? :confusedshrug:
So we should just go ahead and change mvp to pg of the year award then by your retarded ass logic. Other positions create shots for teammates in ways that dont lead to assists(screens, players doubling, just attention in general and drawing the best defenders) you are also totally ignoring defense, rebounding and just general impact on the game. Congratulations. I dub thee moron.

[EuJazz]

and i already conceded the dirk part of the debate deaf idiot :hammerhead: ist the kobe and lebron groupies who are driving me crazy :hammerhead:

Um, Nash didn't deserve it. Doesn't matter to whom. Good. We're done.

[DreamRockets]

You did not just go there, Shaq averaged around 13 rebounds and 3 blocks that season shooting around 58% from the field while being a force on both ends of the floor, he was the most dominant player of all-time during that period, and you're comparing him to Nash based on assist numbers?

im trying to understand the argument of the deluded nash haters who think he shoulndt win mvp because of his scoring average while they think kobe should win it based on scoring average :hammerhead:

[Shepseskaf]

11 assists translate into 22 points at least and up to 33 points if you consider 3pointers, in 00 shaq won mvp with 29 ppg and 3.8 apg.

nash averaged from 37 to 48 ppg considering his assists and shaq did from 37 to 41 ppg in 00 when he won mvp by a landslide, care to explain that ? :confusedshrug:
Oh... so now we should add assist numbers to re-calculate scoring totals???
:roll: :roll: :roll: :roll: :roll:

What a genius! I nominate you as the smartest poster of the year!

[bumpyknucks]

I don

[raiderfan19]

just so im getting this straight dream you have just spent 7 pages arguing that nash deserved the mvp when you really feel that dirk deserved it?

[DreamRockets]

Oh... so now we should add assist numbers to re-calculate scoring totals???
:roll: :roll: :roll: :roll: :roll:

What a genius! I nominate you as the smartest poster of the year!

so that's your rebuttal ? :confusedshrug: i was expecting something more from the idiot who thinks scoring average = mvp :roll: :roll:

[raiderfan19]

[QUOTE=bumpyknucks]I don

[DreamRockets]

just so im getting this straight dream you have just spent 7 pages arguing that nash deserved the mvp when you really feel that dirk deserved it?

i have argued a billion times the only argument you can make is about dirk, i dont know how that overhyped pretender lebron james got into the mvp list and that coat-tail rider kobe bryant got into the list with 45 wins,

45 wins for the mvp ? :rollingeyes: nicccee :hammerhead:

[EuJazz]

so that's your rebuttal ? :confusedshrug: i was expecting something more from the idiot who thinks scoring average = mvp :roll: :roll:

You're right.

Scoring average + hair length.

Wait, Dirk STILL deserves it.

[DreamRockets]

maybe dirk getting wh0red by 1 ppg/1 rpg ryan bowen was still in the mind of the voters ? :confusedshrug: :pimp: :roll:

i guess we'll never know, thats the only explanation i can find from a voter's pov.

[raiderfan19]

i have argued a billion times the only argument you can make is about dirk, i dont know how that overhyped pretender lebron james got into the mvp list and that coat-tail rider kobe bryant got into the list with 45 wins,

45 wins for the mvp ? :rollingeyes: nicccee :hammerhead:
Just say dirk nowitzki deserved the mvp and well be good. Ill wonder why it took you so long to say this but thats not a big deal. Here the thing there is no argument for taking nash over dirk. So its not a well you can make an argument for dirk situation. Its a nash had no business winning situation which has been my point the entire thread.


BTW dont take my arguments in this thread the wrong way. I like nash. Always have(its from his time in dallas) but hes not as valuable as dirk. (or lebron ;)

[Glove_20]

Yeah

I like Nash too...He is the best PG in the game today...and the best shooter in the league too

But, Dirk deserved MVP

[raiderfan19]

except for getting his ass kicked by the true best player in the league :roll:

maybe that softie dirk nowitzki getting wh0red by 1 ppg/1 rpg ryan bowen was still in the mind of the voters ? :confusedshrug: :pimp: :roll:

i guess we'll never know.
Yeah dirk getting "whored" had nothing to do with him having bronchitis and getting routinely doubled and tripled which led to jason terry having a ton of open looks. But wait that would mean he made players better even though he didnt pile up assist numbers and nash groupies cant recognize that someone could "make someone else better" without piling up assist numbers.

[i seen hippos]

dirk did not deserve the award last year.

marion with an average pg would have no offense outside of offensive putbacks.

[Shepseskaf]

You're right.

Scoring average + hair length.

Wait, Dirk STILL deserves it.
Classic. :roll:

[DreamRockets]

he made players better ? :roll:

the rockets lost juwan howard and started that scrub bowen which meant playing 4-on-5 against dallas, oyu can make all the arguments you want but a player shooting 30% is in fact getting owned, specially a superstar, specially a freakin PF ! :hammerhead:

[Shepseskaf]

so that's your rebuttal ? :confusedshrug: i was expecting something more from the idiot who thinks scoring average = mvp :roll: :roll:
You don't waste logic on morons. You just laugh at them. Now go take a look in the mirror.

[EuJazz]

dirk did not deserve the award last year.

marion with an average pg would have no offense outside of offensive putbacks.

These are marions scoring averages from each of the 3 pre nash seasons.

19.1
21.1
19.0

3 nash seasons(im including this one)
19.4
21.4
19.9

Someone posted these numbers a couple pages back... You're dumb.

[DreamRockets]

i will see nash winning the mvp over that shaq-made champion kobe bryant and hype machine lebron james, why would i do that ? :confusedshrug:

[i seen hippos]

did you even read my post?

[raiderfan19]

dirk did not deserve the award last year.

marion with an average pg would have no offense outside of offensive putbacks.
so explain why he scores a combined average of 1ppg more in his three years with nash than he did in the 3 years previous to nash. If hes so horrible without nash you would think that he would have had some major change once nash got there.

[EuJazz]

i will see nash winning the mvp over that shaq-made champion kobe bryant and hype machine lebron james, why would i do that ? :confusedshrug:

You don't expect people to hype a guy who scores 81 in a game (35.4 ppg) and another who averages 31/7/7? One in L.A. and the other dubbed as the next coming before he got drafted? Of course there will be hype, you moron.

Get over it, Nash is OVER-RATED! CLAP, CLAP, CLAP CLAP CLAP! OVER-RATED! CLAP, CLAP, CLAP CLAP CLAP!

Chant with me boys...! :D

[raiderfan19]

did you even read my post?
do you have a point. in the 3 years previous to nash he scored a similar amount to his numbers with nash before nash went there. His numbers change has been in REBOUNDING which unless you are gonna say nash boxes out for him you cant attribute to nash.

[EuJazz]

did you even read my post?

These are marions scoring averages from each of the 3 pre nash seasons.

19.1
21.1
19.0

3 nash seasons(im including this one
19.4
21.4
19.9

Someone posted these numbers a while back... Thought I'd put them back up, set some b!tches straight.

[raiderfan19]

whats funny is that shawn marion used to be underrated then everyone said he was underrated so he wasnt anymore and now everyone acts like hes a bum that only gets numbers because of nash so hes underrated again.

[LakersDynasty]

His numbers change has been in REBOUNDING which unless you are gonna say nash boxes out for him you cant attribute to nash.
:oldlol: :oldlol: :oldlol:

[EuJazz]

do you have a point. in the 3 years previous to nash he scored a similar amount to his numbers with nash before nash went there. His numbers change has been in REBOUNDING which unless you are gonna say nash boxes out for him you cant attribute to nash.

Nash did average 4 rebounds last year. :bowdown: :bowdown: :rockon: :banana: GOAT!

[bumpyknucks]

Explain marions and bells numbers being remarkably similar to pre nash and JJ going on to be better without nash...

Ok. Looking at numbers alone (although I normally wouldnt want to do that).....Raja Bell- Raja has a 8 year scoring average of 9.1 points a game....and this is including last season with Nash where he averaged 14.7 points....and this year where is averaging 17.1. These are not similar numbers.

As for Marion, the Suns have gotten deeper, with the emergence of Diaw, the addition of Thomas, and the increased dominance of Amare, his numbers arent going to improve dramatically. I am impressed that he has been able to maintain his numbers playing on a much better team.

Until Atlanta makes the playoffs, I wouldnt say that Joe Johnson is better without Nash. I would rather have a guy putting up solid number on a WCF team than a guy scoring his ass off on a really marginal team...although I will give you that they are playing better this year. I would still make the argument that playing in Phoenix with Nash helped JJ

[raiderfan19]

about raja yes for his career his numbers are much worse than with nash. However for his career he was a backup for a large part of that. His numbers last year werent that dissimilar than his numbers each of his years in utah. He just got to shoot more.

Bells scoring couldnt have anything to do with his minutes DRASTICALLY increasing(his career high pre suns was 28 and hes averaged 38 with phoenix) and the pace that they play. No. It could only possibly be steve nashs golden touch and now nash can even be in phoenix and you can be in atlanta and the golden touch will still apply.

[EuJazz]

Ok. Looking at numbers alone (although I normally wouldnt want to do that).....Raja Bell- Raja has a 8 year scoring average of 9.1 points a game....and this is including last season with Nash where he averaged 14.7 points....and this year where is averaging 17.1. These are not similar numbers.

He rode the bench and averaged 3 points tops in Philly/Dallas his first 3 years. Don't bring up career averages, those years DRASTICALLY skew them.

In his last year with Utah he scored 12.3 points in a much slower paced, half-court game (93 ppg), on 45.4% shooting.

In his first year with Phoenix (last year), he averaged 14.7 points in a much faster-paced offense (108 ppg), on 45.7% shooting.

Game, set, Dirk.

[bumpyknucks]

Someone posted these numbers a while back... Thought I'd put them back up, set some b!tches straight.

Marion putting up 20 ppg on a 20, 30, or even 40 win teams is alot less impressive to me than doing it on a 50 and 60 win teams.

[raiderfan19]

He rode the bench and averaged 3 points tops in Philly/Dallas his first 3 years. Don't bring up career averages, those years DRASTICALLY skew them.

In his last year with Utah he scored 12.3 points in a much slower paced, half-court game (93 ppg), on 45.4% shooting.

In his first year with Phoenix (last year), he averaged 14.7 points in a much faster-paced offense (108 ppg), on 45.7% shooting.

Game, set, Dirk.
dont forget the 10 extra minutes a game he played.

[DreamRockets]

He rode the bench and averaged 3 points tops in Philly/Dallas his first 3 years. Don't bring up career averages, those years DRASTICALLY skew them.

In his last year with Utah he scored 12.3 points in a much slower paced, half-court game (93 ppg), on 45.4% shooting.

In his first year with Phoenix (last year), he averaged 14.7 points in a much faster-paced offense (108 ppg), on 45.7% shooting.

Game, set, nash.

well said biatch :pimp:

[raiderfan19]

well said biatch :pimp:
you really are a douche-bag. Ive made my points. You can either listen to them or continue to be an idiot. Up to you but im pretty much done with this thread.

[EuJazz]

Marion putting up 20 ppg on a 20, 30, or even 40 win teams is alot less impressive to me than doing it on a 50 and 60 win teams.

So you concede that Nash didn't make Marion better? Deal.

:banana: Pla-Plow!

[DreamRockets]

no one invited you, and it wasnt you who i quoted, if i struck a never and undid months of therapy after nash won mvp over your boy dirk im really sorry about it :confusedshrug: :pimp:

[bumpyknucks]

He rode the bench and averaged 3 points tops in Philly/Dallas his first 3 years. Don't bring up career averages, those years DRASTICALLY skew them.

He rode the bench for a reason. He

[BlackVVaves]

those player were facing true mvp candidates.

payton, KJ, strickland and stockton were facing prime jordan, prime hakeem, drob, young shaq for the award, those players were getting 60 wins every year and putting almost unmatchable numbers.

thomas was facing magic, bird and jordan as well.

tim hardaway was facing prime shaq and prime duncan during the era in when they were ruling the league.

steve nash didnt win mvp because he was better than those beforementioned players, but because his competition is weaker, shaq is way past his days of mvp contention, duncan is probably in his last couple years of contention for the award, nash won it because he was going against a couple of overhyped guards who haven't done jack in their lives and who barely crack 40 something and 50 wins in kobe and lebron.

nash isnt better than stockton, payton, strickland, whoever, he didnt win because he was better than those players were, but because his competition sucked.

Thank You and goodnight.

And I wasn't even aware of Nash's stats over the last three eyars. Thanks for that GOBB.

[singmingming]

Well, i don't know about two but he for sure deserves one. He's just one of a kind guy. Best point in NBA alongside Jason Kidd and Chris Paul.

[GOBB]

Nash dropped 16pts and 14 assists tonight. That assist avg will rise to 11.68.

:bowdown:

[EuJazz]

He rode the bench for a reason. He

[BlackVVaves]

He had them both the first year, jackass. Nash has always had one or the other. You'd have to say 'Where would Amare and Marion lead the Suns without Nash.'

Which, with Barbosa at point guard, there's not too big of a dropoff (what, 18 points and 7 assists instead of 18 and 10?) So in that case they average what, 102-104 points instead of around 110? Damn! They'll never win! :rolleyes:

You are a certified idiot. You are telling me that equal numbers translate into equal impact? So, Barbosa could do what Nash does just with less assists?

People like you make it hard to read a thread without bumping into ignorance on this site.

[EuJazz]

Nash dropped 16pts and 14 assists tonight. That assist avg will rise to 11.68.

:bowdown:

Oh my God 11.7??? GOAT! GOAT!

He's the best point guard ever because he plays how a point guard is supposed to, pass-first, in an era where passing is a lost art.

A whole 11.7? That doesn't warrant an MVP. Not even today.

[EuJazz]

You are a certified idiot. You are telling me that equal numbers translate into equal impact? So, Barbosa could do what Nash does just with less assists?

People like you make it hard to read a thread without bumping into ignorance on this site.

Then....don't....read it....and....leave.

[raiderfan19]

Thank You and goodnight.

And I wasn't even aware of Nash's stats over the last three eyars. Thanks for that GOBB.
gobbs numbers werent even close to what nash has averaged over the last three years, they are what he is averaging THIS year in a very short sample size which is largely skewed because he just had a career night.

[BlackVVaves]

He's the best point guard ever because he plays how a point guard is supposed to


Yea. I mean...its SOOO damn easy to play how a point is supposed to play. I mean....EVERYBODY is averaging 11 assists per game. And giving passes reminiscent of Magic's days. And scoring over 50% from 3pt and FG. Yea. He's supposed to do that.

Kid. Guy. Whatever the eff you are. You seriously need to start appraoching things with intelligence. Because I'm starting to doubt you even have a brain. Do you bother to read what you post before ou post it?


Anyway. Its never going to change. Some people are going to support Nash and his MVP's. Others will not. That will never change. We can sit and argue about arguing over who's career was not made better with Nash and all that hoop-la all we want. You still have the doubters. Like someone said before, Nash won't be appreciated until he is gone from the game and the NBA represents the days when ball movement and crisp passes and "fun" basketball was a thing of the 80s.

[BlackVVaves]

gobbs numbers werent even close to what nash has averaged over the last three years, they are what he is averaging THIS year in a very short sample size which is largely skewed because he just had a career night.

Thought they were.

And how are they skewed? You act as if Nash has been under-performing this season. He is playing the best basketball of his career right now. Last night was a representation of what he has been doing this season: carrying the Suns to 11 out of 12 wins

[EuJazz]

Yea. I mean...its SOOO damn easy to play how a point is supposed to play. I mean....EVERYBODY is averaging 11 assists per game. And giving passes reminiscent of Magic's days. And scoring over 50% from 3pt and FG. Yea. He's supposed to do that.

We can sit and argue about arguing over who's career was not made better with Nash and all that hoop-la all we want.

1. 11 assists a game doesn't impress me when I grew up watching one of the two best PG's of all time average 10 each year for 10 years, 8 of which he averaged over 12 apg, 5 over 13 apg, and 2 over 14 apg. One year at 14.5 (NBA Record). In the 14.5 apg season, he also averaged 17 ppg (completely overshadowing Nash's not-even-close-15.5 ppg/11.5apg.) and never was in an MVP race. Obviously, he had the Jordans, etc., in the game, and never would have won one even if considered, but I'm saying the league has forgotten that what Nash is doing is A POINT GUARDS JOB. You're SUPPOSED to average 10 apg, that makes you a damn good PG. Not an MVP, though.

2. http://www.blackvvaves.justgotowned.com/

[raiderfan19]

Thought they were.

And how are they skewed? You act as if Nash has been under-performing this season. He is playing the best basketball of his career right now. Last night was a representation of what he has been doing this season: carrying the Suns to 11 out of 12 wins
well they are skewed because he just scored 42 which raised his scoring average from below (slightly) 20 to over 21. As for his numbers the last 2 years before this his numbers are basically 16.5 and 11 which isnt even remotely close to what he posted. Nash has NEVER averaged 20 for a season and most likely wont this year.

[DieHardBullsFan]

He didn't deserve his second one no matter how hard you try to deny it.

dude are you serious??? Nash deserved MVP last year why?

because he lost all of his scorers on that team...Stodamire was injured for the whole year...they traded Joe Johnson, Traded Q richardson....Kurt Thomas was out the majority of the year...he was like there last hope for any size down low....they were not even picked to make the playoffs and they managed to make it to the WCF....

Now I dont think that he should of won the first MVP at all!

[raiderfan19]

dude are you serious??? Nash deserved MVP last year why?

because he lost all of his scorers on that team...Stodamire was injured for the whole year...they traded Joe Johnson, Traded Q richardson....Kurt Thomas was out the majority of the year...he was like there last hope for any size down low....they were not even picked to make the playoffs and they managed to make it to the WCF....

Now I dont think that he should of won the first MVP at all!
so you dont count kurt thomas as part of their roster last year since he missed a signifigant amount of time?

In that case this is the mavs team from last year Dirk, Jet, Diop, Damp. Thats it. EVERYONE else missed at least a similar amount of time to Thomas.

[EuJazz]

dude are you serious??? Nash deserved MVP last year why?

because he lost all of his scorers on that team...Stodamire was injured for the whole year...they traded Joe Johnson, Traded Q richardson....Kurt Thomas was out the majority of the year...he was like there last hope for any size down low....they were not even picked to make the playoffs and they managed to make it to the WCF....

Now I dont think that he should of won the first MVP at all!

Who cares if they were picked for the playoffs.

People picked the Dolphins to win the AFC East this year, and the Panthers were the 'sexy' Super Bowl pick. And the Tigers and Cardinals were in the World Series, I'm sure nobody picked the Tigers to be there prior to the season.

Knock Knock...
"Who's there"
Dirk.
"Dirk who?"
Nash didn't deserve sh!t.

[EuJazz]

so you dont count kurt thomas as part of their roster last year since he missed a signifigant amount of time?

In that case this is the mavs team from last year Dirk, Jet, Diop, Damp. Thats it. EVERYONE else missed at least a similar amount of time to Thomas.

That must mean it was ALL Dirk. AND they had more wins that Phoenix.

Is Dirk the MVP now?

[DieHardBullsFan]

so you dont count kurt thomas as part of their roster last year since he missed a signifigant amount of time?

In that case this is the mavs team from last year Dirk, Jet, Diop, Damp. Thats it. EVERYONE else missed at least a similar amount of time to Thomas.

what are you talking about? if you know how to read it I clearly talk about that and two....last year, (if your talking about last year) Dirk had more talent around him than Nash did last year....so I dont know what your point is??

[DieHardBullsFan]

Who cares if they were picked for the playoffs.

People picked the Dolphins to win the AFC East this year, and the Panthers were the 'sexy' Super Bowl pick. And the Tigers and Cardinals were in the World Series, I'm sure nobody picked the Tigers to be there prior to the season.

Knock Knock...
"Who's there"
Dirk.
"Dirk who?"
Nash didn't deserve sh!t.

Dirk had a storng year but they also had terry, stackhouse, howard, and daniels they were the deepest team in the NBA, nash took a team that was going to suck without those guys....

Hello????? Nash lost 50ppg from Q, Amare, and Joe Johnson last year and they still got to the WCF.....MVP deserving...If you ask me!

[BlackVVaves]

1. 11 assists a game doesn't impress me when I grew up watching one of the two best PG's of all time average 10 each year for 10 years, 8 of which he averaged over 12 apg, 5 over 13 apg, and 2 over 14 apg. One year at 14.5 (NBA Record). In the 14.5 apg season, he also averaged 17 ppg (completely overshadowing Nash's not-even-close-15.5 ppg/11.5apg.) and never was in an MVP race. Obviously, he had the Jordans, etc., in the game, and never would have won one even if considered, but I'm saying the league has forgotten that what Nash is doing is A POINT GUARDS JOB. You're SUPPOSED to average 10 apg, that makes you a damn good PG. Not an MVP, though.

2. http://www.blackvvaves.justgotowned.com/

You're good at repeating yourself. Horrible at answering questions though. :applause:

[MTing]

Well He was better last season then 04-05 season so he should have got it. I said Bron Bron but Nash was second
I'm happy:pimp:

[EuJazz]

Yea. I mean...its SOOO damn easy to play how a point is supposed to play. I mean....EVERYBODY is averaging 11 assists per game. And giving passes reminiscent of Magic's days. And scoring over 50% from 3pt and FG. Yea. He's supposed to do that.

Kid. Guy. Whatever the eff you are. You seriously need to start appraoching things with intelligence. Because I'm starting to doubt you even have a brain. Do you bother to read what you post before ou post it?


Anyway. Its never going to change. Some people are going to support Nash and his MVP's. Others will not. That will never change. We can sit and argue about arguing over who's career was not made better with Nash and all that hoop-la all we want. You still have the doubters. Like someone said before, Nash won't be appreciated until he is gone from the game and the NBA represents the days when ball movement and crisp passes and "fun" basketball was a thing of the 80s.

Oh, I'll answer that.

Answer: Not really.

Sorry about that.

[raiderfan19]

Dirk had a storng year but they also had terry, stackhouse, howard, and daniels they were the deepest team in the NBA, nash took a team that was going to suck without those guys....

Hello????? Nash lost 50ppg from Q, Amare, and Joe Johnson last year and they still got to the WCF.....MVP deserving...If you ask me!
First off, learn how to write. If you are older than 14 I feel sorry for you. Second, like i said, all of those guys you mentioned other than jet missed the roughly the same amount of time kurt thomas did. Guys you lose to Fa/trade dont count anyway. If so then dirk should have won the mvp the year before because he lost nash. That doesnt matter though because its not about who you dont have its about who you do have and the suns STILL had marion, Bell, Barbosa, Kurt thomas, and diaw.

[JtotheIzzo]

Not saying they should have won it, because I'm not saying Nash should have won it. But guys who have put up similar or better numbers then Nash's 2 MVP years are Kevin Johnson, Tim Hardaway, John Stockton, Rod Strickland, Isiah Thomas, Stephon Marbury, Gary Payton. That's off the top of my head.

this is why anyone who argues against Nash numbers wise is a bonehead. The point guard on any team can put up numbers if he wants (Mike James???) the question is can that point guard make good players great and average team contenders.

You talk about Marbury in your list, a guy who won 29 less game with the same team Nash had.

STFU

learn a little about the game, and the impact Nash has on everyone on the floor, how he turns five guys into a threat instead of one.

[reppy]

A few points to take into consideration:

- Nash's team had changed a lot (if i recall correctly) and they were missing their key post player for an entire season
- Tim Duncan and Shaq had less than stellar years
- LeBron's team wasn't good enough and I don't think people are ready to give it to him yet. Let him earn his stripes so to speak I guess.
- Kobe's team did not start to flourish until the latter part of the year. Hard to give an MVP for 1/5th of the season.
- Dirk is the only legit candidate that got snubbed, in my opinion. But even then his team had more depth than the Suns. Maybe not enough to where you can say Nash is far and above the better MVP...

It's not like the league had MJ, Bird and Magic all playing and they gave it to Nash instead. Nash is benefitting from 1) timing and lack of serious competition for MVP considerations 2) a couple awesome seasons.

[DieHardBullsFan]

First off, learn how to write. If you are older than 14 I feel sorry for you. Second, like i said, all of those guys you mentioned other than jet missed the roughly the same amount of time kurt thomas

Learn how to write...obviously you dont know how to write with that sentence.....

And another thing, come stronger than that....your argument is weak

Let me ask you a question: Who had the better team last year, Mavs or Dallas?

[raiderfan19]

Learn how to write...obviously you dont know how to write with that sentence.....

And another thing, come stronger than that....your argument is weak

Let me ask you a question: Who had the better team last year, Mavs or Dallas?
ummm... yeah.

[Horde of Temujin]

Do you guys not watch the suns and see what nash does for that team.

[and1]

21ppg 11.5apg 2.9rpg FG 53% 3pt 52% FT 89%


Whats to say he wont win it again?
Agree?

whats to say? unless no one else has an awesome season, he just might

[Horde of Temujin]

Yea. I mean...its SOOO damn easy to play how a point is supposed to play. I mean....EVERYBODY is averaging 11 assists per game. And giving passes reminiscent of Magic's days. And scoring over 50% from 3pt and FG. Yea. He's supposed to do that.

Kid. Guy. Whatever the eff you are. You seriously need to start appraoching things with intelligence. Because I'm starting to doubt you even have a brain. Do you bother to read what you post before ou post it?


Anyway. Its never going to change. Some people are going to support Nash and his MVP's. Others will not. That will never change. We can sit and argue about arguing over who's career was not made better with Nash and all that hoop-la all we want. You still have the doubters. Like someone said before, Nash won't be appreciated until he is gone from the game and the NBA represents the days when ball movement and crisp passes and "fun" basketball was a thing of the 80s.

Well said, i guess it comes down to whether you like the guy or not, you come up with arguments for each side all day. Haters vs non haters

[Horde of Temujin]

Yea. I mean...its SOOO damn easy to play how a point is supposed to play. I mean....EVERYBODY is averaging 11 assists per game. And giving passes reminiscent of Magic's days. And scoring over 50% from 3pt and FG. Yea. He's supposed to do that.

Kid. Guy. Whatever the eff you are. You seriously need to start appraoching things with intelligence. Because I'm starting to doubt you even have a brain. Do you bother to read what you post before ou post it?


Anyway. Its never going to change. Some people are going to support Nash and his MVP's. Others will not. That will never change. We can sit and argue about arguing over who's career was not made better with Nash and all that hoop-la all we want. You still have the doubters. Like someone said before, Nash won't be appreciated until he is gone from the game and the NBA represents the days when ball movement and crisp passes and "fun" basketball was a thing of the 80s.

Well said, i guess it comes down to whether you like the guy or not, you come up with arguments for each side all day. Haters vs non haters
STop the hate! Get a girlfriend.

[Da KO King]

This has nothing to do with the actual topic but I just wanted to say it cause most people seem to ignore it...

Nash's "skill level" nor athleticism has improved since leaving Dallas.

The only difference in him as a player is he now takes fewer bad shots. I think everyone remembers those weird twirling fadeaways he loved taking. He's shooting far less of those.

He's improved his decision making and its improved his effectiveness.

[GOBB]

bump

[Glove_20]

bump
WHy bump this?

Everybody already agreed that Dirk should've been MVP

[konex]

He's improved his decision making and its improved his effectiveness.

His supporting cast has also improved bigtime...

[GOBB]

WHy bump this?

Everybody already agreed that Dirk should've been MVP

No everybody didnt.

[Glove_20]

No everybody didnt.
1. Dream Rocket was the one heavily arguing for Nash, and he even admit it
2. Nobody has had anything to say against the Dirk arguements

[GOBB]

1. Dream Rocket was the one heavily arguing for Nash, and he even admit it
2. Nobody has had anything to say against the Dirk arguements

Wrong but I'll let you tell it.

Nash was the mvp and rightrfully so the last 2yrs. Last yr was arguable with Dirk and Bron. There was no "...should have won". Period.

[Glove_20]

Wrong but I'll let you tell it.

Nash was the mvp and rightrfully so the last 2yrs. Last yr was arguable with Dirk and Bron. There was no "...should have won". Period.
Once again, heres my quote that started the Dirk arguements (and finished it off)



Nash in 2005

Ok, he deserved MVP

But in 2006?

NO WAY



Dirk should've been MVP...
Why?
Simple

1. His team had a better record
2. He had less talent around him
3. He put numbers as good as or BETTER than Nash last year


Why didn't Dirk win MVP?

[GOBB]

Dirk should've been MVP...
Why?
Simple

1. His team had a better record
2. He had less talent around him
3. He put numbers as good as or BETTER than Nash last year


Why didn't Dirk win MVP?

1. by 6 wins without amare Stoudamire
2. Less talent? If you think so but considering Suns lost a starter and changed 2 starters and a 6th man says something.
3. His numbers were not better...you can milk "as good" but not "or BETTER".

Its arguable...nothing definite for Dirk. People still cant get over Steve Nash is an MVP. Only reason they cant accept Dirk not winning last yr and thinkin he all but deserved it which he didnt.

So much for everyone thinks Dirk should've won.

[Glove_20]

1. by 6 wins without amare Stoudamire
2. Less talent? If you think so but considering Suns lost a starter and changed 2 starters and a 6th man says something.
3. His numbers were not better...you can milk "as good" but not "or BETTER".

Its arguable...nothing definite for Dirk. People still cant get over Steve Nash is an MVP. Only reason they cant accept Dirk not winning last yr and thinkin he all but deserved it which he didnt.

So much for everyone thinks Dirk should've won.

Even WITHOUT Amare...The Suns had more talent, yet the Mavs won more...

Marion/Bell/Diaw/Kurt Thomas/Barbosa

are better than

Terry/Howard/Dampier...

Are you seriously going to deny the Nash had a better supporting cast?

[GOBB]

Even WITHOUT Amare...The Suns had more talent, yet the Mavs won more...

Marion/Bell/Diaw/Kurt Thomas/Barbosa

are better than

Terry/Howard/Dampier...

Are you seriously going to deny the Nash had a better supporting cast?

It was even.

[Glove_20]

It was even.
:roll:
Even if it was even, Dallas still got more wins...Why Nash again?

Marion/Diaw >>>>>> Terry/Howard

Marion was getting MVP votes, was an All-Star, and Terry or Howard don't come close to that

Then Bell/Kurt Thomas/Barbosa >>>>> ANYONE ELSE...Name some players

[The Roxy]

It was even.
:hammerhead:

[GOBB]

:roll:
Even if it was even, Dallas still got more wins...Why Nash again?

Marion/Diaw >>>>>> Terry/Howard

Marion was getting MVP votes, was an All-Star, and Terry or Howard don't come close to that

Then Bell/Kurt Thomas/Barbosa >>>>> ANYONE ELSE...Name some players


:wtf: is all this ">>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>" crap you do? Retarded, cut it out.

Dallas got 6 more wins. :confusedshrug:

Its arguable...Nash has just as much a case as Dirk did. Sorry you cant see it that way. You presented no argument that is so sound you cant counter and it all but screams "Dirk should have won". It was close.

[Glove_20]

:wtf: is all this ">>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>" crap you do? Retarded, cut it out.

Dallas got 6 more wins. :confusedshrug:

Its arguable...Nash has just as much a case as Dirk did. Sorry you cant see it that way. You presented no argument that is so sound you cant counter and it all but screams "Dirk should have won". It was close.
Dirk got more wins with a weaker supporting cast

That

[dgbigballer9329]

Originally Posted by Glove_20

Even if it was even, Dallas still got more wins...Why Nash again?

Marion/Diaw >>>>>> Terry/Howard

Marion was getting MVP votes, was an All-Star, and Terry or Howard don't come close to that

Then Bell/Kurt Thomas/Barbosa >>>>> ANYONE ELSE...Name some players

Stackouse/Barbosa is basically a wash, especially last year. Daniels was decent off the bench. Kurt Thomas......missed 30 games. Devin Harris was a big reason Dallas beat SA last year, not a great player as of yet but very solid role player. Fact is both supporting casts had several good ROLE players, but neither just sh*tted on eachother. And Marion/Diaw weren't >>>>>>> Terry/Howard. It's close, probably Suns have the slight advantage. Terry and Howard were excellent last year, not to mention both generate their own offense better than either Sun.

Both guys had great stat seasons. How was Nash's (led the league in assists) and scored a bunch too much worse than Dirk (also shot better)???

People just wanna hate on Steve Nash for some reason. Probably cause he looks like he'd suck. I'd have picked him over Dirk, you could argue the other way.......but it was no landslide unless you're delusional.

[23jordan23]

Wel hope people dont get too upset because looks like he on his way to a 3rd lol...Yao is havin a career season ..but mo T-Mac

[Glove_20]

Stackouse/Barbosa is basically a wash, especially last year. Daniels was decent off the bench. Kurt Thomas......missed 30 games. Devin Harris was a big reason Dallas beat SA last year, not a great player as of yet but very solid role player. Fact is both supporting casts had several good ROLE players, but neither just sh*tted on eachother. And Marion/Diaw weren't >>>>>>> Terry/Howard. It's close, probably Suns have the slight advantage. Terry and Howard were excellent last year, not to mention both generate their own offense better than either Sun.

Both guys had great stat seasons. How was Nash's (led the league in assists) and scored a bunch too much worse than Dirk (also shot better)???

People just wanna hate on Steve Nash for some reason. Probably cause he looks like he'd suck. I'd have picked him over Dirk, you could argue the other way.......but it was no landslide unless you're delusional.


Of course there was no landslide

[dgbigballer9329]

So if there was no landslide then why are you so adamant that it was robbery???

And Marion's a very good player, but I'd say Terry and Howard are both better than Diaw. Diaw may be more versatile but Howard's more versatile than Marion too. Versatile doesn't equal better.

[KingofKings718]

Dirk or LeBron should've won it last season. Nonetheless, this season I would not be surprised if Nash gets it. My dude is averaging Kevin Johnson-esque numbers.

[dgbigballer9329]

And Dirk was averaging Chris Webber numbers.

Neither should've won MVP based solely on stats.

[nashforprez]

analysts were calling this the deepest team in the league wat are you talking about

[GOBB]

So if there was no landslide then why are you so adamant that it was robbery???.

:confusedshrug: good question

[Serge]

21ppg 11.5apg 2.9rpg FG 53% 3pt 52% FT 89%

When is this? This Year?

Anyway he did not deserve his first 2 MVP's

Last year Lebron 307/7 is to good not to win a MVP, and Kobe carrying a team on no bodys leading the league in scoring.

And the first year AI should have won it not Nash. AI 31/7 that year or w/e it was something like that was amazing. That year Nash got 3 more assists per game then AI, but scored only half the points yes HALF the points AI scored and only getting 3 assists more a game then AI. And AI's team even made the playoffs yet he finishes 4th behind Nash, and Shaq who just came to turn a team around. And Dirk who was nice, but still AI was having a better year.

[Smokee]

I used to doubt Nash but at this point hes the real deal and one of the best players right now. His offense is underated, and yeah people know hes good offensively but hes REALLY good most of the time. When i watch the Suns i keep thinking hes going to miss or theres something ****ed up going on where they should be able to trap his lil ass, but hes constantly proving himself every time i watch. I think Nash is one of the biggest difference makers in the NBA :pimp:

[Eric Cartman]

bump

[Prime_Shaq]

Shaq in both 05 and 06. Its a travesty that Shaq only has 1 MVP while having the most dominant peak of all-time. Should have at least 4-5.
Nash can only dream of this
https://thatmanal.files.wordpress.com/2010/05/oneal-riley-and-dwyane-wade.jpg
http://i.usatoday.net/sports/_photos/2011/06/01/shaquilleonealx-large.jpg

[JimmyMcAdocious]

I'm not mad nine years later either.

[Marchesk]

Historic bump, damn ISH. You guys sure do like to dig.

[HOoopCityJones]

One belongs to Kobe.

[MP.Trey]

Damn, ISH back when you could have 13-14 page discussions that didn't even have anything to do with LeBron or Kobe. :bowdown:

[clipps]

Damn, ISH back when you could have 13-14 page discussions that didn't even have anything to do with LeBron or Kobe. :bowdown:

Weak era

[Dragic4Life]

One belongs to Kobe.
:facepalm

[ArbitraryWater]

Shaq in both 05 and 06. Its a travesty that Shaq only has 1 MVP while having the most dominant peak of all-time. Should have at least 4-5.
Nash can only dream of this
https://thatmanal.files.wordpress.com/2010/05/oneal-riley-and-dwyane-wade.jpg
http://i.usatoday.net/sports/_photos/2011/06/01/shaquilleonealx-large.jpg

This guy said Shaq should have won in '06 :facepalm

FOH

[Dresta]

Shaq played 30mpg and less than 60 games in 06 :roll:

[Wade's Rings]

Shaq in both 05 and 06. Its a travesty that Shaq only has 1 MVP while having the most dominant peak of all-time. Should have at least 4-5.
Nash can only dream of this
https://thatmanal.files.wordpress.com/2010/05/oneal-riley-and-dwyane-wade.jpg
http://i.usatoday.net/sports/_photos/2011/06/01/shaquilleonealx-large.jpg

Shaq was suppose to win in 06?:facepalm

[Eric Cartman]

Revisiting this thread it got me reminiscing of the good 'ol days of spirited discussion in ISH, not the infested troll-hell that we experience now.

[T_L_P]

Shaq in both 05 and 06. Its a travesty that Shaq only has 1 MVP while having the most dominant peak of all-time. Should have at least 4-5.


Shaq has no case for MVP in 06. :oldlol:

That fat-ass didn't even have a case for top five MVP candidate. :oldlol:

[Prime_Shaq]

Shaq has a legit case every year he has played except the Suns/Cavs/Celtics days. The most devastating force the league has ever seen.

[T_L_P]

Shaq has a legit case every year he has played except the Suns/Cavs/Celtics days. The most devastating force the league has ever seen.

Again, he has no case for 06.

This is a guy whose teammate nearly scored 3 times as many points as him in a Finals series.

[Demon Lizard]

Shaq in 05 sure, but 06? :biggums: