Top 10 Players All Time

[DonCorleone]

My list:

1. Shaquille Rashuan O'neal

2. Michael Jeffrey Jordan

3. Ferdinand Lewis Alcindor

4. Wilton Norman Chamberlain

5. William Felton Russell

6. Earvin Johnson jr.

7. Timothy Theodore Duncan

8. Kobe Bean Bryant

9. Larry Joe Bird

10. Akeem Abdul Olajuwon

[L.Kizzle]

My list:

1. Shaquille Rashuan O'neal

2. Michael Jeffrey Jordan

3. Ferdinand Lewis Alcindor

4. Wilton Norman Chamberlain

5. William Felton Russell

6. Earvin Johnson jr.

7. Timothy Theodore Duncan

8. Kobe Bean Bryant

9. Larry Joe Bird

10. Hakeem Abdul Olajuwon
Akeem Abdul Olajuwon, almost got it right tho.

[az00m]

Akeem Abdul Olajuwon, almost got it right tho.
http://2.bp.blogspot.com/_t_xlGGymR7U/S7o2mLmFTVI/AAAAAAAAAvc/AaPTu31SC6w/s1600/Fistpalm.jpg

[DonCorleone]

Shaquille Rashuan O'neal=GOAT.

[Stuckey]

Jordan
KAJ
Wilt
Russell
Shaq
Hakeem
Duncan
Magic
Bird
Kobe

[pauk]

1. jordan
2. wilt chamberlain
3. bill russell
4. kareem abdul jabbar
5. oscar robertson
6. shaquille oneal
7. magic johnson
8. larry bird
9. hakeem olajuwon
10. tim duncan

kobe does not belong in there u rtards
1 mvp... 2 fmvp... 2 championships.... (the others he got as a sidekick)
he was never even close to as dominant or productive or consistent as these top 10 players in season or especially not in playoffs....

[ShaqAttack3234]

1. jordan
2. wilt chamberlain
3. bill russell
4. kareem abdul jabbar
5. oscar robertson
6. shaquille oneal
7. magic johnson
8. larry bird
9. hakeem olajuwon
10. tim duncan

kobe does not belong in there u rtards
1 mvp... 2 fmvp... 2 championships.... (the others he got as a sidekick)
he was never even close to as dominant or productive or consistent as these top 10 players in season or especially not in playoffs....

Oscar has 1 MVP, 0 finals MVPs and by your logic, 0 championships.

[chazzy]

Kobe also has a better career PER than Oscar, a stat pauk loves :oldlol:

[Monkey D Dragon]

1. jordan
2. wilt chamberlain
3. bill russell
4. kareem abdul jabbar
5. oscar robertson
6. shaquille oneal
7. magic johnson
8. larry bird
9. hakeem olajuwon
10. tim duncan

kobe does not belong in there u rtards
1 mvp... 2 fmvp... 2 championships.... (the others he got as a sidekick)
he was never even close to as dominant or productive or consistent as these top 10 players in season or especially not in playoffs....


Someone give this guy a ckn in his mouth plz cause he is talking non sense.

[asdf1990]

http://www.threadbombing.com/data/media/2/perma_banned.gif

[magnax1]

Shaq is a great player but I don't see how you can put him at #1 ever.

[sacredcow]

Another thread about a topic that's purely subjective. How original.

[DonCorleone]

Shaq is a great player but I don't see how you can put him at #1 ever.

His PRIME bruh. His prime.

[magnax1]

Another thread about a topic that's purely subjective. How original.
Isn't pretty much all this stuff purely subjective?

[Kurosawa0]

I got:

1. Michael Jordan
2. Bill Russell
3. Kareem Abdul Jabbar
4. Magic Johnson
5. Wilt Chamberlain
6. Larry Bird
7. Kobe Bryant
8. Tim Duncan
9. Shaquille O'Neal
10. Hakeem Olujawon

[pauk]

Oscar has 1 MVP, 0 finals MVPs and by your logic, 0 championships.

now you are talking about OSCAR relating to KOBE............... sry but there is a difference to why oscar is up there and why kobe is up there..... the reason he is up there is not because of MVP or CHAMPIONSHIPS....... you and me both know that... but the reason kobe is up there near top 10 is because of CHAMPIONSHIPS and MVPS..........

its a difference........

oscar robertson........ was born to play for the NBA. When he was finally drafted, he proved why he was chosen. Two years into the league, he had put up numbers that not even the greatest could match before or after to even this day. He was a team player. A player whose drive pushed him to become one of the greatest. A player whose performance only kept rising and his longevity was nothing but astounding.

he was the first ever BIG point guard and the one who gave birth to the term POINT-FORWARD........ he was also the most versatile and most complete player in nba history........ without him there wouldnt have been any magic or lebron or jordan............ hence oscar had to come first....

without him there would be no such big household names u see today...

oscar had 180++ triple doubles in his career........ #1 all time

oscar is the only one to average a triple double in his career....

oscar averaged 30.1 ppg, 10.0 rpg, 10.0 apg in his first 5 seasons in the NBA.........

oscar is a hall of famer

oscar was the one who invented free agency

oscar was the one who shaped NBA

oscar is the only player in NBA history to be Top 10 in all time points and assists....

that all up there ALONE is more than enough to put him on top 10....

its a ONCE IN A LIFE TIME PLAYER.....

and on top of that this is not bad either :

26,710 Points

9,887 Assists

7,804 Rebounds

1 NBA Championship

1 NBA MVP

12 time All Star

3 All Star MVP

Olympic Gold Medalist (60's)

1 of the 50 Greatest NBA players in history



RINGS ARE LIKE ICING ON THE CAKE........ ITS THE CAKE THAT WILL SHAPE YOUR CAREER THE MOST...... AND OSCAR HAD THE BIGGEST CAKE OF EM ALL.............

[magnax1]

His PRIME bruh. His prime.
He had a great prime, but it's not like it's much better then the guy's hes near like Bird, Kareem, Russell or Wilt. And he definitely didn't have as good of a peak as Jordan, or as long as a lot of other guys. I just don't really see it.

[ThaRegul8r]

Shaq is a great player but I don't see how you can put him at #1 ever.

Elliot Kalb says hi.

[ShaqAttack3234]

now you are talking about OSCAR relating to KOBE............... sry but there is a difference to why oscar is up there and why kobe is up there..... the reason he is up there is not because of MVP or CHAMPIONSHIPS....... you and me both know that... but the reason kobe is up there near top 10 is because of CHAMPIONSHIPS and MVPS..........

its a difference........

oscar robertson........ was born to play for the NBA. When he was finally drafted, he proved why he was chosen. Two years into the league, he had put up numbers that not even the greatest could match before or after to even this day. He was a team player. A player whose drive pushed him to become one of the greatest. A player whose performance only kept rising and his longevity was nothing but astounding.

he was the first ever BIG point guard and the one who gave birth to the term POINT-FORWARD........ he was also the most versatile and most complete player in nba history........ without him there wouldnt have been any magic or lebron or jordan............ hence oscar had to come first....

without him there would be no such big household names u see today...

oscar had 180++ triple doubles in his career........ #1 all time

oscar is the only one to average a triple double in his career....

oscar averaged 30.1 ppg, 10.0 rpg, 10.0 apg in his first 5 seasons in the NBA.........

oscar is a hall of famer

oscar was the one who invented free agency

oscar was the one who shaped NBA

oscar is the only player in NBA history to be Top 10 in all time points and assists....

that all up there ALONE is more than enough to put him on top 10....

its a ONCE IN A LIFE TIME PLAYER.....

and on top of that this is not bad either :

26,710 Points

9,887 Assists

7,804 Rebounds

1 NBA Championship

1 NBA MVP

12 time All Star

3 All Star MVP

Olympic Gold Medalist (60's)

1 of the 50 Greatest NBA players in history



RINGS ARE LIKE ICING ON THE CAKE........ ITS THE CAKE THAT WILL SHAPE YOUR CAREER THE MOST...... AND OSCAR HAD THE BIGGEST CAKE OF EM ALL.............

I've covered this many times. Here are some posts I made about Oscar recently.


Oscar's triple double season is unbreakable because his team averaged around 125 possessions per 48 minutes instead of the 90-95 possesions per 48 that Shaq, Kobe and Duncan's teams got in the 2000's, that's the biggest problem I have with Oscar being ranked in the top 10. He had great stats, but not as historic when you consider the incredible pace. Plenty of players have put up great stats.

I just don't see an argument for Oscar over Shaq, Hakeem, Duncan or Kobe, all of whom won a lot more and dominated individually as well.



I'm not even talking about the quality of the players, just the stats in context, and I feel Oscar benefits a lot from people not putting the stats into perspective.

As far as team success, here are Oscar's Royals records.

1961- 33-46
1962- 43-37
1963- 42-38
1964- 55-25
1965- 48-32
1966- 45-35
1967- 39-42
1968- 39-43
1969- 41-41
1970- 36-46

He missed the playoffs 4 times in those seasons and won a total of 2 playoff series with Cincinnati. And the excuse that he played during the Celtics era doesn't work because they only lost to the Celtics 3 times in the playoffs, less than the amount of times Ewing's Knicks lost to Jordan's Bulls and the same amount of times that Barkley lost to Jordan's Bulls.

So, 2 playoff series wins, no finals appearances, one 50 win season.

And the supporting cast argument doesn't work unless you use it for Garnett, Robinson, Ewing ect.

Oscar entered the league with future hall of famer Jack Tyman who would make 2 all-star teams while playing with Robertson('62 and '63) and the all-nba second team in '62, Wayne Embry who made 5 consecutive all-star teams while playing with Robertson('61-'65) and then he got Jerry Lucas who made 6 consecutive all-star teams while playing with Oscar('64-'69) as well as 3 all-nba first teams and 2 all-nba second teams in those years. Adrian Smith also made the '66 all-star team while playing with Oscar and Tom Van Arsdale made the 1970 all-star team while playing with Oscar.

Can't see a valid argument for Oscar being top 10.

[DonCorleone]

He had a great prime, but it's not like it's much better then the guy's hes near like Bird, Kareem, Russell or Wilt. And he definitely didn't have as good of a peak as Jordan, or as long as a lot of other guys. I just don't really see it.

:lol

[magnax1]

Elliot Kalb says hi.
What?

[indiefan24]

now you are talking about OSCAR relating to KOBE............... sry but there is a difference to why oscar is up there and why kobe is up there..... the reason he is up there is not because of MVP or CHAMPIONSHIPS....... you and me both know that... but the reason kobe is up there near top 10 is because of CHAMPIONSHIPS and MVPS..........

its a difference........

oscar robertson........ was born to play for the NBA. When he was finally drafted, he proved why he was chosen. Two years into the league, he had put up numbers that not even the greatest could match before or after to even this day. He was a team player. A player whose drive pushed him to become one of the greatest. A player whose performance only kept rising and his longevity was nothing but astounding.

he was the first ever BIG point guard and the one who gave birth to the term POINT-FORWARD........ he was also the most versatile and most complete player in nba history........ without him there wouldnt have been any magic or lebron or jordan............ hence oscar had to come first....

without him there would be no such big household names u see today...

oscar had 180++ triple doubles in his career........ #1 all time

oscar is the only one to average a triple double in his career....

oscar averaged 30.1 ppg, 10.0 rpg, 10.0 apg in his first 5 seasons in the NBA.........

oscar is a hall of famer

oscar was the one who invented free agency

oscar was the one who shaped NBA

oscar is the only player in NBA history to be Top 10 in all time points and assists....

that all up there ALONE is more than enough to put him on top 10....

its a ONCE IN A LIFE TIME PLAYER.....

and on top of that this is not bad either :

26,710 Points

9,887 Assists

7,804 Rebounds

1 NBA Championship

1 NBA MVP

12 time All Star

3 All Star MVP

Olympic Gold Medalist (60's)

1 of the 50 Greatest NBA players in history



RINGS ARE LIKE ICING ON THE CAKE........ ITS THE CAKE THAT WILL SHAPE YOUR CAREER THE MOST...... AND OSCAR HAD THE BIGGEST CAKE OF EM ALL.............

The ........'s make your posts that more annoying.

[magnax1]

:lol
So you're just going to post a smiley to avoid posting a real answer?

[ThaRegul8r]

Elliot Kalb says hi.

What?

Mind you, I said absolutely nothing about agreeing with him, I just gave him as an example of someone who ranks Shaq as #1.

[magnax1]

Mind you, I said absolutely nothing about agreeing with him, I just gave him as an example of someone who ranks Shaq as #1.
I don't really care who ranks him at #1, I just don't see a logical case for it when you take everyone's complete career into account. Specifically I just can't see him over Jordan/Russell/Wilt/Kareem.
Also, I just don't know who Elliot Kalb is.

[DonCorleone]

So you're just going to post a smiley to avoid posting a real answer?

Shaquille O'neal is the most dominant player of all time.

[whoartthou]

I got:

1. Michael Jordan
2. Bill Russell
3. Kareem Abdul Jabbar
4. Magic Johnson
5. Wilt Chamberlain
6. Larry Bird
7. Kobe Bryant
8. Tim Duncan
9. Shaquille O'Neal
10. Hakeem Olujawon

i completely agree with this list except i would put kobe at 10, hakeem at 9, shaq at 7 and dunca at 8.

[ThaRegul8r]

I don't really care who ranks him at #1, I just don't see a logical case for it when you take everyone's complete career into account. Specifically I just can't see him over Jordan/Russell/Wilt/Kareem.

I wouldn't place him over them either, if I were to sit down a make a list. I've read Kalb's book, and I don't agree with his argument. As far as a logical case, most people aren't logical.

[magnax1]

I wouldn't place him over them either, if I were to sit down a make a list. I've read Kalb's book, and I don't agree with his argument. As far as a logical case, most people aren't logical.
True, everyone does have their bias.

[che guevara]

I don't really have a top 10 right now because I have so much trouble ranking Russell. He won 11 rings, often against the odds, was a tremendous leader that teammates and coaches rave about, and is the greatest defensive player of all time. However, I don't know how that would translate into today's game with three point shooting and bigger, more athletic guards/forwards driving into the lane and trying to dunk, looser traveling rules (which makes it easier to evade shot blockers) and those bigger guards/forwards fighting for rebounds. Would he even be 60% as effective today? I don't know. On the other hand, all of the other guys that people name for the top 10 would have almost the same effectiveness regardless of the era they played in. So my top 9 is:

1a./1b. Jordan/Kareem
3. Bird
4. Magic
5. Shaq
6. Hakeem
7. Duncan
8. Wilt
9. Kobe

Russell fits in there somewhere but I don't know exactly where.

[L.Kizzle]

I've covered this many times. Here are some posts I made about Oscar recently.






Can't see a valid argument for Oscar being top 10.
It's not Oscars fault they played in the pace they played in. You can't give him a negative for that.

And he had a few good teammates , Lucas being the best. Embry may have been an All-Star but he wasn't on the level as the other top centers in the league at the time (Russ, Wilt, Reed, Bellamy), no where close a matter of fact. He'd be Kevin Duckworth in the 90s with Hakeem, Pat, Ewing, Shaq, ect.

Twyman is a good swing player for a few of O's early seasons and Lucas later in the decade. Smith was an All-Star that season cause the game was being held in Cinnci. He never sniffed anything close to an All-Star appearance before or after again.

[ShaqAttack3234]

It's not Oscars fault they played in the pace they played in. You can't give him a negative for that.

But you can't just compare his numbers to players who played with 30-35 fewer possessions available without mentioning that.

[L.Kizzle]

But you can't just compare his numbers to players who played with 30-35 fewer possessions available without mentioning that.
There are not fewer possessions available because there isn't a set number of possessions per game. The only thing set is the shot clock at 24 seconds and 12 minute quarters. They had the same time in 1956, the same time in 1963, the same in 1977, the same in 1991, the same in 2009.

It's not like the pre-shot clock era. This current era takes a few more seconds to set up, that's all the difference is. I bet if someone does the calculations, the difference is about 2 seconds.

[ShaqAttack3234]

There are not fewer possessions available because there isn't a set number of possessions per game. The only thing set is the shot clock at 24 seconds and 12 minute quarters. They had the same time in 1956, the same time in 1963, the same in 1977, the same in 1991, the same in 2009.

It's not like the pre-shot clock era. This current era takes a few more seconds to set up, that's all the difference is. I bet if someone does the calculations, the difference is about 2 seconds.

Come on, do you think it's a coincidence that every 20+ rpg season came in the 70's? Do you think it's a coincidence that nobody has attempted over 30 shots per game since then? The league played at a MUCH faster pace and that makes it impossible to just compare numbers. Is 30/12/11 on a team that averages 125 possessions more impressive than 35/5/5 on a team that averages 90?

[Big#50]

KAJ
Duncan
SHAQ
MJ
Bird
Hakeem
Magic
Wilt
Russell
Kobe

[jlauber]

Come on, do you think it's a coincidence that every 20+ rpg season came in the 70's? Do you think it's a coincidence that nobody has attempted over 30 shots per game since then? The league played at a MUCH faster pace and that makes it impossible to just compare numbers. Is 30/12/11 on a team that averages 125 possessions more impressive than 35/5/5 on a team that averages 90?

In Oscar's 61-62 season, the NBA averaged 118.8 ppg. In Kobe's 05-06 season, the NBA averaged 97 ppg...or at about 82% of '62. Assists were at 88% of Oscar's '62 season in '06. And rebounds were at about 67% (after deducting TEAM rebounds.) BUT, Kobe too 27 FGAs per game in '06, while Oscar only took 23 in '62. So, does any intelligent poster believe that Oscar could not have taken more shots in '06 than he did in '62. In fact, Kobe in 06, and MJ in '87, took a higher percentage of their team's FGAs, per minute played, than Chamberlain did in his '62 season.

Not only that, but Oscar shot .478 in a league that shot .426. Kobe not only shot .450 in a league that shot .454, he had an eFG% of .491 in a league that shot .490. Using those numbers and Oscar's FG% would have sky-rocketed in '06.

So, we can safely assume that Oscar's assists would only have dropped from 11.4 apg down to about 10 apg in '06. His rebounds would have dropped to about 8.3. But, there is simply no way in hell that he would have only scored 24.4 ppg in '06. IMHO, he would have been even more ball dominant in '06, and could easily have taken MORE shots in '06...AND, at a MUCH higher FG%.

30-8-10 would have EASILY been within reason for Oscar in '06. And a GUNNING Oscar could EASILY have averaged 35-8-7 in '06.

[ShaqAttack3234]

In Oscar's 61-62 season, the NBA averaged 118.8 ppg. In Kobe's 05-06 season, the NBA averaged 97 ppg...or at about 82% of '62. Assists were at 88% of Oscar's '62 season in '06. And rebounds were at about 67% (after deducting TEAM rebounds.) BUT, Kobe too 27 FGAs per game in '06, while Oscar only took 23 in '62. So, does any intelligent poster believe that Oscar could not have taken more shots in '06 than he did in '62. In fact, Kobe in 06, and MJ in '87, took a higher percentage of their team's FGAs, per minute played, than Chamberlain did in his '62 season.

:facepalm


Not only that, but Oscar shot .478 in a league that shot .426. Kobe not only shot .450 in a league that shot .454, he had an eFG% of .491 in a league that shot .490. Using those numbers and Oscar's FG% would have sky-rocketed in '06.

:roll: :oldlol: :roll:


So, we can safely assume that Oscar's assists would only have dropped from 11.4 apg down to about 10 apg in '06. His rebounds would have dropped to about 8.3. But, there is simply no way in hell that he would have only scored 24.4 ppg in '06. IMHO, he would have been even more ball dominant in '06, and could easily have taken MORE shots in '06...AND, at a MUCH higher FG%.

Oh my god, you're killing me. :roll:


30-8-10 would have EASILY been within reason for Oscar in '06. And a GUNNING Oscar could EASILY have averaged 35-8-7 in '06.

Just when I think you couldn't top yourself with stupid shit. You're the same guy who supposedly watched Oscar and didn't think he'd even be an all-star today just a few years ago.

[jlauber]

:facepalm



:roll: :oldlol: :roll:



Oh my god, you're killing me. :roll:



Just when I think you couldn't top yourself with stupid shit. You're the same guy who supposedly watched Oscar and didn't think he'd even be an all-star today just a few years ago.

And YOU are the same IDIOT who ranked Wilt at #10, and WELL below Bird and Hakeem, whose careers PALE in comparison to Chamberlain's. There is simply NO argument that would either of those two anywhere NEAR Wilt's career or IMPACT on the game.

As for Oscar, you always use PACE, and NEVER take LEAGUE AVERAGE FG% in account. I suspect that you would also argue that pitching was much better in the "dead ball" era, than in any other year.

I have DESTROYED the RIDICULOUS "pace" argument here a dozen times.

[perrin_07]

i dont even see how shaq would be a top 10 player anyhow. i would rate olajuwon/d.robinson/kareem well b4 shaq. shaq didnt have that great skill,ewing was better if his knees were healthy =/

[ShaqAttack3234]

And YOU are the same IDIOT who ranked Wilt at #10, and WELL below Bird and Hakeem, whose careers PALE in comparison to Chamberlain's. There is simply NO argument that would either of those two anywhere NEAR Wilt's career or IMPACT on the game.

As for Oscar, you always use PACE, and NEVER take LEAGUE AVERAGE FG% in account. I suspect that you would also argue that pitching was much better in the "dead ball" era, than in any other year.

I have DESTROYED the RIDICULOUS "pace" argument here a dozen times.

The only thing you've destroyed is your breath with all of the shit that comes out of your mouth. And yes, Wilt is almost as overrated as Oscar, both of their legacies rely heavily on inflated stats, and luckily for them, not many actually take the time to really look into their careers.

Of course I don't use league average FG%, because defense is much better now regardless, something you also agreed with just a few years ago, funny how someone who claims to have watched the era will change their opinion so much. It's no mystery though, you started feeling insecure about Wilt's legacy.

[Mark Madsen]

1. Michael Jordan
2. Kareem Abdul-Jabbar
3. Wilt Chamberlain
4. Larry Bird
5. Hakeem Olajuwon
6. Shaquille O'Neal
7. Magic Johnson
8. Bill Russell
9. Tim Duncan
10. Jerry West

[whoartthou]

1. Michael Jordan
2. Kareem Abdul-Jabbar
3. Wilt Chamberlain
4. Larry Bird
5. Hakeem Olajuwon
6. Shaquille O'Neal
7. Magic Johnson
8. Bill Russell
9. Tim Duncan
10. Jerry West
:roll:

look man, i know kobe is overrated as all hell, but you gotta give him the numero 10 ranking !

[ballerz]

1. Michael Jordan
2. Bill Russell
3. Kareem Abdul Jabbar
4. Magic Johnson
5. Larry Bird
6. Wilt Chamberlain
7. Tim Duncan
8. Shaquille O'Neal
9. Kobe Bryant
10. Hakeem Olujawon

[magnax1]

The only thing you've destroyed is your breath with all of the shit that comes out of your mouth. And yes, Wilt is almost as overrated as Oscar, both of their legacies rely heavily on inflated stats, and luckily for them, not many actually take the time to really look into their careers.

Of course I don't use league average FG%, because defense is much better now regardless, something you also agreed with just a few years ago, funny how someone who claims to have watched the era will change their opinion so much. It's no mystery though, you started feeling insecure about Wilt's legacy.
You can't discount players from the 60's because of their inflated stats. I think you've gone a bit too far in compensating for the era they played in. I get where you're coming from, but I don't think it's exactly fair.

[Mark Madsen]

1. Michael Jordan
2. Bill Russell
3. Kareem Abdul Jabbar
4. Magic Johnson
5. Larry Bird
6. Wilt Chamberlain
7. Tim Duncan
8. Shaquille O'Neal
9. Kobe Bryant
10. Hakeem Olujawon

:roll: :lol :roll: :lol :roll:












































































































































































































































































































:lol

[ShaqAttack3234]

You can't discount players from the 60's because of their inflated stats. I think you've gone a bit too far in compensating for the era they played in. I get where you're coming from, but I don't think it's exactly fair.


I'm just trying to put the numbers into perspective. I look at Oscar's team success and it just doesn't warrant a top 10 ranking, I'm convinced that if stats were the 2000 equivalent or even the 80's equivalent that he wouldn't be in anyone's top 10, and that's the problem I have with anyone putting him top 10.

Russell and Wilt are both obviously top 10 and I'd probably rank West in the 11-13 range. So I respect the players from that era and aside from defense(which looks very weak compared to recent years), I didn't call it a weak era and disregard players from that era because of that. And I only brought up the worse defense because JLauber likes to now say that 60's defense was better.

[Christofire]

This list must be made relative to how these player dominated the Era they were in. Kobe IMO is the best ball player i've ever seen, but he did not dominate his ERA the way MJ dominated his with that Being said Michael Jordan is the greatest player and the most decorated player ever.

[magnax1]

I'm just trying to put the numbers into perspective. I look at Oscar's team success and it just doesn't warrant a top 10 ranking, I'm convinced that if stats were the 2000 equivalent or even the 80's equivalent that he wouldn't be in anyone's top 10, and that's the problem I have with anyone putting him top 10.

Russell and Wilt are both obviously top 10 and I'd probably rank West in the 11-13 range. So I respect the players from that era and aside from defense(which looks very weak compared to recent years), I didn't call it a weak era and disregard players from that era because of that. And I only brought up the worse defense because JLauber likes to now say that 60's defense was better.
Well comparing within the era, what Oscar did statistically was as impressive as anyone not named Elgin or Wilt, and everything I've read about him and the little I've watched of him indicates he was a top 10 player to me. Though at one point I probably would've ranked him outside of the top 10 basically for the same reasons as you.

[knightfall88]

1. Michael Jordan
2. Bill Russell
3. Kareem Abdul Jabbar
4. Larry Bird
5. Magic
6. Kobe
7. Duncan
8. Shaq
9. Hakeem
10. Wilt

[DixieNourmous]

KAJ Goat

[Monkey D Dragon]

now you are talking about OSCAR relating to KOBE............... sry but there is a difference to why oscar is up there and why kobe is up there..... the reason he is up there is not because of MVP or CHAMPIONSHIPS....... you and me both know that... but the reason kobe is up there near top 10 is because of CHAMPIONSHIPS and MVPS..........

its a difference........

oscar robertson........ was born to play for the NBA. When he was finally drafted, he proved why he was chosen. Two years into the league, he had put up numbers that not even the greatest could match before or after to even this day. He was a team player. A player whose drive pushed him to become one of the greatest. A player whose performance only kept rising and his longevity was nothing but astounding.

he was the first ever BIG point guard and the one who gave birth to the term POINT-FORWARD........ he was also the most versatile and most complete player in nba history........ without him there wouldnt have been any magic or lebron or jordan............ hence oscar had to come first....

without him there would be no such big household names u see today...

oscar had 180++ triple doubles in his career........ #1 all time

oscar is the only one to average a triple double in his career....

oscar averaged 30.1 ppg, 10.0 rpg, 10.0 apg in his first 5 seasons in the NBA.........

oscar is a hall of famer

oscar was the one who invented free agency

oscar was the one who shaped NBA

oscar is the only player in NBA history to be Top 10 in all time points and assists....

that all up there ALONE is more than enough to put him on top 10....

its a ONCE IN A LIFE TIME PLAYER.....

and on top of that this is not bad either :

26,710 Points

9,887 Assists

7,804 Rebounds

1 NBA Championship

1 NBA MVP

12 time All Star

3 All Star MVP

Olympic Gold Medalist (60's)

1 of the 50 Greatest NBA players in history



RINGS ARE LIKE ICING ON THE CAKE........ ITS THE CAKE THAT WILL SHAPE YOUR CAREER THE MOST...... AND OSCAR HAD THE BIGGEST CAKE OF EM ALL.............


If Big O is a Cake must be a cheep assss cake with One little dot of Icing

If Kobe was a Cake he must be a ChocolateCheese cake with 5 Icing on top.

Great story bra but Big O has 1 Mvp 1 Ring 0 Finals Mvp which are Most important stat out of all espcially for a "Top 10 " Player who played in One of the Weakest Era.

Funny thing is Kobe beats on Big O just about everything besides Averge stats Per game and we all know why but Kobe will own him end of his career in All Time Stats.

Owned.

You Fail try again

[Monkey D Dragon]

1. Michael Jordan
2. Kareem Abdul-Jabbar
3. Wilt Chamberlain
4. Larry Bird
5. Hakeem Olajuwon
6. Shaquille O'Neal
7. Magic Johnson
8. Bill Russell
9. Tim Duncan
10. Jerry West


How many idiots are on this Board? At least he has 1 and 2 right

The Real TOP 10 Players of ALL TIME Right now 3/20/2011

1. Michael Jordan
2. Kareem Abdul-Jabbar
3. Shaquille O'Neal
4. Wilt Chamberlain
5. Magic Johnson
6. Bill Russell
7. Larry Bird
8. Kobe Bryant
9. Tim Duncan
10. Hakeem Olajuwon

[griffmoney1784]

:roll: :lol :roll: :lol :roll:






:lol


i dont know if thats kobe crying in your avy. or its you crying

because your the only one laughing at kobe being top 10 in this thread.

things have changed buddy. its popular now. get used to it

sorry man but even without what he did with shaq you could argue top 10 all time

2005-2010

3 finals
2 championships
2 finals mvps
1 season mvp
5 1st team all nba's
5 1st team all defense's
2 scoring titles
81 point game

just in 5 years since shaq he has accomplished more than hakeem olajuwon did in his entire career ( and dreams on most peoples top 10 lists )

add his rings and all nbas, all defense's from playing with shaq and you dont have a single god damn argument buddy boyyyyyyyyyy

suck it

[Mark Madsen]

How many idiots are on this Board? At least he has 1 and 2 right

The Real TOP 10 Players of ALL TIME Right now 3/20/2011

1. Michael Jordan
2. Kareem Abdul-Jabbar
3. Shaquille O'Neal
4. Wilt Chamberlain
5. Magic Johnson
6. Bill Russell
7. Larry Bird
8. Kobe Bryant
9. Tim Duncan
10. Hakeem Olajuwon

Once again ... :roll: :lol :roll: !!

Pretty sure the ONLY person on that list to shoot under 40% for 17 finals games and sidekick his way to 5 titles. Shoots 6/24 in a game 7 of the finals yet his team bails him out to a W :lol .. Not to mention Gasol led the team in winshares last year :roll:

Only player on that list responsible for the WORST 40 point game performance (13

[griffmoney1784]

[QUOTE=Mark Madsen]Once again ... :roll: :lol :roll: !!

Pretty sure the ONLY person on that list to shoot under 40% for 17 finals games and sidekick his way to 5 titles. Shoots 6/24 in a game 7 of the finals yet his team bails him out to a W :lol .. Not to mention Gasol led the team in winshares last year :roll:

Only player on that list responsible for the WORST 40 point game performance (13

[Mark Madsen]

i dont know if thats kobe crying in your avy. or its you crying

because your the only one laughing at kobe being top 10 in this thread.

things have changed buddy. its popular now. get used to it

sorry man but even without what he did with shaq you could argue top 10 all time

2005-2010

3 finals
2 championships
2 finals mvps
1 season mvp
5 1st team all nba's
5 1st team all defense's
2 scoring titles
81 point game

just in 5 years since shaq he has accomplished more than hakeem olajuwon did in his entire career ( and dreams on most peoples top 10 lists )

add his rings and all nbas, all defense's from playing with shaq and you dont have a single god damn argument buddy boyyyyyyyyyy

suck it

LOL I forgot the travesty that is Kobe's 1st team all defense .. nothing more than a popularity contest ... Shane Battier never even cracks a single 1st team all defensive list but some how inconsistent Kobe does :lol :lol

[griffmoney1784]

LOL I forgot the travesty that is Kobe's 1st team all defense .. nothing more than a popularity contest ... Shane Battier never even cracks a single 1st team all defensive list but some how inconsistent Kobe does :lol :lol


you act like all 8 of his all defensive teams are bad

only in the last 2 years was he arguably not 1st team.

that still leaves 6 FIRST TEAM all nba defensive awards...

like i said



SUCK IT

cut all his sh*t in half and degrade it... even with that its still good enough for top 10 all time. thats why hes arguably top 5.

[Mark Madsen]

you act like all 8 of his all defensive teams are bad

only in the last 2 years was he arguably not 1st team.

that still leaves 6 FIRST TEAM all nba defensive awards...

like i said



SUCK IT

LMAO

Kobe Bryant - NBA record 30 missed shots :lol

Kobe Bryant - beaten by PJ Brown in 2005 MVP voting in his prime :lol

Kobe Bryant - Sidekicking his way to titles when shooting 8-27 for his first and 6-24 for his most recent :lol

Kobe Bryant - Shoots his team out of wins and gets shut down by the likes of Vince Carter and Paul Pierce :lol

Kobe Bryant = Sidekick for Life :lol

[griffmoney1784]

LMAO

Kobe Bryant - NBA record 30 missed shots :lol

Kobe Bryant - beaten by PJ Brown in 2005 MVP voting in his prime :lol

Kobe Bryant - Sidekicking his way to titles when shooting 8-27 for his first and 6-24 for his most recent :lol

Kobe Bryant - Shoots his team out of wins and gets shut down by the likes of Vince Carter and Paul Pierce :lol

Kobe Bryant = Sidekick for Life :lol

i'm a way better troll than you

[Mark Madsen]

Oh boyy here we go!

Kobe Bryant - 11-36 30.5% in 4th qtrs for 2010 finals

Kobe Bryant - 38.1 FG% in game 7's for career

Kobe Bryant - Outscored and outplayed by Von Wafer in 2009 WC semis

http://www.basketball-reference.com/boxscores/200905170LAL.html

Kobe made 4 shots and Von made 5 :lol

Even Kobe's dad is laughing at these :lol

[griffmoney1784]

Oh boyy here we go!

Kobe Bryant - 11-36 30.5% in 4th qtrs for 2010 finals

Kobe Bryant - 38.1 FG% in game 7's for career

Kobe Bryant - Outscored and outplayed by Von Wafer in 2009 WC semis

http://www.basketball-reference.com/boxscores/200905170LAL.html

Kobe made 4 shots and Von made 5 :lol

Even Kobe's dad is laughing at these :lol


so much better than you... good trolling means looking serious. youl never get people with worms. you need better bait

[alenleomessi]

1. Jordan



2. Kareem
3. Bird
4. Magic
5. Shaq
6. Wilt
7. Russell
8. Hakeem
9. Duncan
10. Kobe

[Mark Madsen]

so much better than you... good trolling means looking serious. youl never get people with worms. you need better bait


Kobe - 14/3/5 in his first finals game ... MJ - 15/3/5 in his first finals game .. in the FIRST QTR

Mike outperforms Kobe in a single qtr in their Finals debut! :roll:

[griffmoney1784]

Kobe - 14/3/5 in his first finals game ... MJ - 15/3/5 in his first finals game .. in the FIRST QTR

Mike outperforms Kobe in a single qtr in their Finals debut! :roll:


dude you wont get anyone saying stuff like that.

might as well try and make a kobe fan mad by talking about his rookie air balls

wont work.

listen bud. il help you since i'l probably retire after this year. heres the book on trolling

"creating a controvercial subject and more often than not choosing the side that is less popular but has enough merit to garner attention. meaning you cant fish without bait. you need a solid point to build on. then when you have one you have to stretch the truth. but not to the point where people dont believe you. the #1 rule to trolling is. make people believe what you're saying is truly what YOU believe. otherwise why would someone try and prove you wrong."

so use something that people actually care about. like "his 1st 3 rings" or "his mvp" or "his gold medal"

that always turns into a 3-4 page thread...


goodluck

[Nevaeh]

dude you wont get anyone saying stuff like that.

might as well try and make a kobe fan mad by talking about his rookie air balls

wont work.

listen bud. il help you since i'l probably retire after this year. heres the book on trolling

"creating a controvercial subject and more often than not choosing the side that is less popular but has enough merit to garner attention. meaning you cant fish without bait. you need a solid point to build on. then when you have one you have to stretch the truth. but not to the point where people dont believe you. the #1 rule to trolling is. make people believe what you're saying is truly what YOU believe. otherwise why would someone try and prove you wrong."

so use something that people actually care about. like "his 1st 3 rings" or "his mvp" or "his gold medal"

that always turns into a 3-4 page thread...


goodluck

Maybe Mark Madsen doesn't like trolling. Maybe he just likes, oh I don't know, telling the truth?:confusedshrug:

How was that? ;)

[OldSchoolBBall]

Kobe - 14/3/5 in his first finals game ... MJ - 15/3/5 in his first finals game .. in the FIRST QTR

:oldlol:

[PurpleChuck]

1. Michael Jordan
2. Bill Russell
3. Wilt Chamberlain
4. Larry Bird
5. Magic Johnson
6. Shaquille O'Neal
7. Hakeem Olujawon
8. Tim Duncan
9. Kobe Bryant
10. Dwyane Wade

11. Kareem Abdul Jabbar

[ballerz]

1. Michael Jordan
2. Bill Russell
3. Wilt Chamberlain
4. Larry Bird
5. Magic Johnson
6. Shaquille O'Neal
7. Hakeem Olujawon
8. Tim Duncan
9. Kobe Bryant
10. Dwyane Wade

11. Kareem Abdul Jabbar
http://i707.photobucket.com/albums/ww79/standingfor23/ha-ha-no.jpg

[griffmoney1784]

Maybe Mark Madsen doesn't like trolling. Maybe he just likes, oh I don't know, telling the truth?:confusedshrug:

How was that? ;)

good trolling is a half truth pushed as a whole truth. like

like for example...

kobe did play with shaq. and he did need him. but shaq also played with kobe. and also needed kobe.

so while your telling the truth. your only telling half the story.

thats trolling.

[rodman91]

Using all players second name making this thread more serious?

Ferdinand Lewis Alcindor
Akeem Abdul Olajuwon
WTF?

You mean Kareem and Hakeem,i guess.

[griffmoney1784]

#1A Kareem
#1B Jordan
#3 russell
#4 Wilt
#5 Magic
#6A Kobe
#6B Bird
#8 Shaq
#9 Duncan
#10 Hakeem

/thread

[NoName22]

now you are talking about OSCAR relating to KOBE............... sry but there is a difference to why oscar is up there and why kobe is up there..... the reason he is up there is not because of MVP or CHAMPIONSHIPS....... you and me both know that... but the reason kobe is up there near top 10 is because of CHAMPIONSHIPS and MVPS..........

its a difference........

oscar robertson........ was born to play for the NBA. When he was finally drafted, he proved why he was chosen. Two years into the league, he had put up numbers that not even the greatest could match before or after to even this day. He was a team player. A player whose drive pushed him to become one of the greatest. A player whose performance only kept rising and his longevity was nothing but astounding.

he was the first ever BIG point guard and the one who gave birth to the term POINT-FORWARD........ he was also the most versatile and most complete player in nba history........ without him there wouldnt have been any magic or lebron or jordan............ hence oscar had to come first....

without him there would be no such big household names u see today...

oscar had 180++ triple doubles in his career........ #1 all time

oscar is the only one to average a triple double in his career....

oscar averaged 30.1 ppg, 10.0 rpg, 10.0 apg in his first 5 seasons in the NBA.........

oscar is a hall of famer

oscar was the one who invented free agency

oscar was the one who shaped NBA

oscar is the only player in NBA history to be Top 10 in all time points and assists....

that all up there ALONE is more than enough to put him on top 10....

its a ONCE IN A LIFE TIME PLAYER.....

and on top of that this is not bad either :

26,710 Points

9,887 Assists

7,804 Rebounds

1 NBA Championship

1 NBA MVP

12 time All Star

3 All Star MVP

Olympic Gold Medalist (60's)

1 of the 50 Greatest NBA players in history



RINGS ARE LIKE ICING ON THE CAKE........ ITS THE CAKE THAT WILL SHAPE YOUR CAREER THE MOST...... AND OSCAR HAD THE BIGGEST CAKE OF EM ALL.............

Are you Evil Monkey or whatever that retard name was ?

[jlauber]

I'm just trying to put the numbers into perspective. I look at Oscar's team success and it just doesn't warrant a top 10 ranking, I'm convinced that if stats were the 2000 equivalent or even the 80's equivalent that he wouldn't be in anyone's top 10, and that's the problem I have with anyone putting him top 10.

Russell and Wilt are both obviously top 10 and I'd probably rank West in the 11-13 range. So I respect the players from that era and aside from defense(which looks very weak compared to recent years), I didn't call it a weak era and disregard players from that era because of that. And I only brought up the worse defense because JLauber likes to now say that 60's defense was better.

Defense was certainly not dramatically worse.A PRIME Kareem struggled to shoot 40-45% against ONE-ON-ONE defenders like Wilt and Thurmond. And he didn't face Russell, either. YET, a 38 year-old Kareem could EASILY pour in 40+ points against Ewing and Olajuwon (multiple times), and on as high as 70% shooting (21-30 in a 46 point explosion against Hakeem, who WAS guarding Kareem.) Even at ages 39-41 he outshot BOTH of those guys by a HUGE margin. My god, he outshot those guys, at age 39-41 by nearly a 100 points, and was WELL above his CAREER FG% of .559 against BOTH. BUT, once again, a PRIME Kareem, and playing against Nate and Wilt, who were both well past their primes (and Wilt on a surgically repaired knee), he seldom shot 50%, and had MANY games under 40%.

BUT, as I have post time-and-again, and which you have NEVER responded to, there were SEVERAL other factors which contributed to lower FG% in the 60's, and ESPECIALLY in the early 60's.

One,...FRIGID arenas. If you have played basketball outside in the cold, the ball does not feel, or shoot, the same, as in warm temperatures. Two,...BREEZY arenas. Even a complete idiot knows that shooting the ball in windy conditions is much more difficult than in calm conditions. Three,...DEAD SPOTS in the floors (and even NAILS popping out of the floor.) Here again, an inconsistent bounce of the ball affects SHOOTING. A player expects the ball to be consistent before he rises to shoot the ball.

And there were two more reasons that played a HUGE role in lower FG%. The BALL itself was not uniform until about 1970. I have mentioned it before, but I played in city leagues in which the ball was NEVER the SAME. Some were heavier, some were bald, and some were even LOPSIDED. And during the pre-game shoot-arounds, the rack of balls were never the same, so you just HOPED that the ball that was going to be used in the game, was the one that felt best for you.

And perhaps the biggest reason that players shot worse, was the scheduling. How many three-in-a-row games did MJ play in '87? Or Shaq in '00? ZERO! Now, just looking at Chamberlain's schedule in his historic 61-62 season, he played SIX three-in-a-rows, ANOTHER THREE FOUR-IN-A-ROW streaks, and still ANOTHER separate streak of FIVE-IN-A-ROW (and during that streak, he did not play at home in one B2B game.). On top of that, B2B games were much more common, as well. And just how great an athlete was Wilt? He missed a TOTAL of EIGHT minutes the ENTIRE season (and that was for being ejected by the official.)

Once again, the "pacelogists" rush to point out the difference in possessions, but NEVER account for the much lower FG% of the eras. And, here again, using baseball as an example, why were ERA's and HR's so low in up until about 1920? Were the pitchers of that era, that much better. Hell, why did ERA's and HR's drop dramatically from '43 thru '45? It was not that pitchers were better, but it was because the BALL was MUSHY. Does anyone honestly believe that Fred Anderson's 1.44 ERA in 1917, in a league that averaged 2.70, was better than Pedro Martinez's ERA of 1.74 in 2000, in a league that had a 4.91 ERA? Jeezus, Pedron's 1.74 was light years ahead of the next guy, Roger Clemens, who had a 3.70 ERA. Was Clemens that much worse than the pitchers in the "dead-ball" era, or even those in 1968?

And, the "paceologists" quickly point out the "inflated" stats of the 60's, and just hope that the readers will accept them as being way out of whack. Take these "possessions" as an example. ShaqAttack claims that the league had 125 possessions in '62, and 90 in '06...or about 72% of those in 1962. Ok, so the scoring should translate easily, then, right? Just reduce the 118.8 ppg of 1962 down to the 72% levels of 2006, and we should get about the 97 ppg that were scored in 2006, right? HOWEVER, we come up with 85.5 ppg. Last year the NBA averaged 100.4 ppg, which was at 85% of the scoring in '62. Yet, reducing the scoring by nearly one-third, as ShaqAttack projects, would result in a league that would score 79 ppg in 2010. The numbers simply don't add up.

Furthermore, I have seen these idiotic posters claim that Wilt would only be a 28-14 guy (or worse) in today's NBA. So, they are claiming that Chamberlain played at a pace that was about HALF of what the current NBA plays at. The reality was, had Wilt scored at 85% (which was the ACTUAL difference between 1962 and 2010) of his scoring level in 1962, he would have averaged 42.5 ppg in 2010.

And ShaqAttack points out that there were players who took over 30 FGAs in the 60's. Well, he is right. ONE player, and only ONE player did so (and I won't count Baylor's PART-TIME season in '62, either.) And that ONE player was Chamberlain, who did it FOUR times. And before a "paceologist" jumps in and claims that it was easier for centers to shoot the ball back in the 60's, think about this. Aside from Wilt, there was only ONE center, and in only ONE season, who even took 20 FGAs in a season, and that was Walt Bellamy with 24 FGAs in 1962. How come ONLY Wilt? Because he was a marvelous outside shooter when he came into the league. He could start his offense from 15+ feet, and while he was a gifted dribbler for a big man, he seldom needed to dribble. It was usually "catch-rise up-and shoot."

And before some disputes that Wilt was not a good outside shooter...

http://wiltfan.tripod.com/quotes.html


[Carl Braun said] "He [Wilt] disorganizes you under the basket the same way [as Bill Russell, on defense]. With Wilt, of course, there's that offense on top of it, which is better than Russell's. He hit on all those jumpers."
"Yes, Wilt hit on those jumpers...Wilt did come into the league with a good touch from the outside, which made his early scoring that much more significant. He wasn't just dunking the ball then."

--Red Holzman. A View from the Bench. P.70


In fact, before YouTube removed the footage, there was a video which showed Chamberlain hitting 15-18 ft. bank shots, sweeping hook shots, 15+ ft jump shots, as well as fadeways and finger-rolls. He was even leading the fast break and finishing it with a no-look, behind-the-back, pass. He was simply a remarkablly skilled seven-footer.

And were centers in the 90's incapable of getting 30 FGAs per game? My god, Hakeem averaged 30 FGAs against Shaq in the '95 Finals for cryingoutloud. And while Shaq easilty averaged 25 FGAs against the inept centers on the '00 Pacers, it must be noted that he also averaged over 15 FTAs against them, as well. So, he was clearly capable of hoisting 30+ shots (and in fact, had one game with 31.) And he was nowhere near as mobile, nor had the outside touch that Wilt had in '62.

These "paceologists" also seem to believe that, because players like Oscar scored 30 ppg in '62, that they would only be able to score 25 ppg in today's NBA. Of course they ignore reality. Even in the low scoring seasons of the early 00's, players like Iverson and Kobe were capable of getting 27-28 FGAs per game. In Oscar's '62 season, he took 22.9 FGAs per game. Are we to believe that Oscar could only get 15-16 shots per game in the 00's?

And if we are to believe that Wilt's '62 season would only translate into a 28 ppg season in today's NBA, as these clowns profess, then what of the other great players of the 60's? Would a peak Jerry West only score 16 ppg in today's NBA? Would Rick Barry, in '67, who scored 35.6 ppg on 28.7 FGAs in a league that averaged 115 ppg, only score18-19 ppg. The same Barry who scored 30.6 ppg on 27.7 FGAs per game in '75, in a league that averaged 102 ppg? Oh, and BTW, Bob McAdoo, a 6-10 F-C had a 34.5 ppg campaign in that same season 102 ppg season in '75.

Yep, because of Wilt, we now know that the great players of the 60's, and at their peaks, would only be scoring 15-18 ppg in today's NBA. Even though many of those same great players played against a Kareem who would just murder the best centers of the 80's, two of whom (Ewing and Hakeem) would be the best centers of the 90's.

[Big#50]

#1A Kareem
#1B Jordan
#3 russell
#4 Wilt
#5 Magic
#6A Kobe
#6B Bird
#8 Shaq
#9 Duncan
#10 Hakeem

/thread
Kobe ahead of Tim and Shaq is laughable. I used to have Kobe at 7 or 8 till I looked closer at his career. Now he barely makes my top ten. Kobe ahead of Tim, Shaq, and Hakeem is quite stupid. LoL

[griffmoney1784]

Kobe ahead of Tim and Shaq is laughable. I used to have Kobe at 7 or 8 till I looked closer at his career. Now he barely makes my top ten. Kobe ahead of Tim, Shaq, and Hakeem is quite stupid. LoL


tims career is built nearly 100% on accomplishments. you have to look at the career as a whole. i think kobe has his career high in 2 q's, and more 50 point games than duncan has 30 point games lol... then take a step back and look at the player as if he never won anything. and kobe has everything beat. all around tallent, averages, even poppavich said kobe was better.

and when it comes to those accomplishments...

kobe has twice as many finals/more championships/multiple repeats

duncan doesnt even have 1 repeat




kobe and shaq are more comparable... but then you look at how their careers have gone in the time without each other ( and wihout another all time great 2nd option )

shaq never did anything in his career without an elite near prime or prime kobe

as lead dogg he never won finals mvp or a league mvp from 1992 to 1999, and 2005-2010

thats 14 years without a championship or an award ( 10 of those years he was averaging 20+/10+ so dont act like he was over the hill or not good enough )

then factor in shaq wasnt a great defender.. no all nba 1st team defenses in his career


kobe on the other hand has done great with and without shaq.



factor all these then the fact that kobe kills both guys in the most important thing

and kobes better all time

[LEFT4DEAD]

#1A Kareem
#1B Jordan
#3 russell
#4 Wilt
#5 Magic
#6A Kobe
#6B Bird
#8 Shaq
#9 Duncan
#10 Hakeem

/thread
:roll: :lol my daily dose of humor, thanks griff

[MaxFly]

1. jordan
2. wilt chamberlain
3. bill russell
4. kareem abdul jabbar
5. oscar robertson
6. shaquille oneal
7. magic johnson
8. larry bird
9. hakeem olajuwon
10. tim duncan

kobe does not belong in there u rtards
1 mvp... 2 fmvp... 2 championships.... (the others he got as a sidekick)
he was never even close to as dominant or productive or consistent as these top 10 players in season or especially not in playoffs....

This is interesting. You've dismissed three of Bryant's championships because he wasn't the primary option, but rather the second option during those championship runs.

Let's look at his post season numbers for those years...

1999-2000: 21.1/4.5/4.4
2000-2001: 29.4/7.3/6.1
2001-2002: 26.6/5.8/4.6

The first championship post season... most would give you, even though it's somewhat foolish since he was a critical contributor to that playoff run (WCF, game 7 for instance), but no reasonable person would discredit the subsequent championships, especially '00-'01. 29.4/7.3/6.1 is excellent play regardless of what option you're considered to be, and it's also notable that he averaged 31.6/7/6.2 against the west that post season, demolishing Sacramento and San Antonio in particular.

Let's be reasonable.

[MaxFly]

1. Michael Jordan
2. Bill Russell
3. Wilt Chamberlain
4. Larry Bird
5. Magic Johnson
6. Shaquille O'Neal
7. Hakeem Olujawon
8. Tim Duncan
9. Kobe Bryant
10. Dwyane Wade

11. Kareem Abdul Jabbar

:facepalm

[NY-Knicks]

1. Michael Jordan
2. Bill Russell
3. Wilt Chamberlain
4. Larry Bird
5. Magic Johnson
6. Shaquille O'Neal
7. Hakeem Olujawon
8. Tim Duncan
9. Kobe Bryant
10. Dwyane Wade

11. Kareem Abdul Jabbar
:oldlol:

[Round Mound]

1-Wilt
2-MJ
3-Kareem
4-Shaq
5-Hakeem Olajuwon
6-Tim Duncan
7-Charles Barkley
8-Larry Bird
9-Magic Johnson
10-Oscar Robertson

[Hyperephania]

1: Michael Jordan
2: Bill Russell
3: Kareem Abdul Jabbar
4: Wilt Chamberlain
5: Magic Johnson
6: Shaq
7: Tim Duncan
8: Bird
9: Kobe
10: Hakeem Olajuwon

[Big#50]

tims career is built nearly 100% on accomplishments. you have to look at the career as a whole. i think kobe has his career high in 2 q's, and more 50 point games than duncan has 30 point games lol... then take a step back and look at the player as if he never won anything. and kobe has everything beat. all around tallent, averages, even poppavich said kobe was better.

and when it comes to those accomplishments...

kobe has twice as many finals/more championships/multiple repeats

duncan doesnt even have 1 repeat




kobe and shaq are more comparable... but then you look at how their careers have gone in the time without each other ( and wihout another all time great 2nd option )

shaq never did anything in his career without an elite near prime or prime kobe

as lead dogg he never won finals mvp or a league mvp from 1992 to 1999, and 2005-2010

thats 14 years without a championship or an award ( 10 of those years he was averaging 20+/10+ so dont act like he was over the hill or not good enough )

then factor in shaq wasnt a great defender.. no all nba 1st team defenses in his career


kobe on the other hand has done great with and without shaq.



factor all these then the fact that kobe kills both guys in the most important thing

and kobes better all time
Kobe is a sg. Only one sg belongs with the great bigs of the game. And he is Michael J. JORDAN.

[Monkey D Dragon]

So many idiots who get no pussssy are all here crying about Kobe when this is a Top 10 Player list of all time and it leads to " Is Kobe Top 10" because of all these insecure haters who dont even watch lick of basketball or even UNDERSTAND the game from a PLAYERS perspective.

I love how people like to pin point 10-15 stuff from Kobe Long career to bring him Down. :lol Its amazing how these kids dont even understand how Long and sick his accomplishments are.

What kinda sidekick avrg 25/5/5 LOL with 5 rings with 1MvP 2FMvP and Owns about all the All-Star game he played in and Dont give me crap about how those players dont give it all because they do Why? They are completors and they rather have the W then the L no matter what kinda game it is.

Bottom line if you think Kobe is not Top 10 Player in NBA History u should start following different sports cause simply you just dont understand the game of BASKETBALL.

[lakerspng]

Kareem/Jordan
Russell
Magic
Wilt
Kobe
Bird
Duncan
Shaq
Hakeem

If Kobe wins 2 more rings by the end of his career, which I believe he will, he will climb over Magic to a tie with Russell for 3rd.

[rodman91]

Kobe - 14/3/5 in his first finals game ... MJ - 15/3/5 in his first finals game .. in the FIRST QTR

Mike outperforms Kobe in a single qtr in their Finals debut! :roll:

Hah, that was gold. :roll:

[Monkey D Dragon]

Kobe - 14/3/5 in his first finals game ... MJ - 15/3/5 in his first finals game .. in the FIRST QTR

Mike outperforms Kobe in a single qtr in their Finals debut! :roll:

You fail to mention he only took 13 shots that game with key block at the 4th Q. Also When you have a Dominant Big Also known as Super Man Aka Steel Aka Big Daddy Aka Most Dominant Big of All Time and ur only 21 and he is 27 being in his Prime I wonder who is gonna get more touches?

Stop being a retard and the funny thing is You can only compare him to the Greatest Player of ALL TIMES.

So bottom line ur a retard and go do ur hw

[griffmoney1784]

You fail to mention he only took 13 shots that game with key block at the 4th Q. Also When you have a Dominant Big Also known as Super Man Aka Steel Aka Big Daddy Aka Most Dominant Big of All Time and ur only 21 and he is 27 being in his Prime I wonder who is gonna get more touches?

Stop being a retard and the funny thing is You can only compare him to the Greatest Player of ALL TIMES.

So bottom line ur a retard and go do ur hw

lmfao@ you being trolled with the lowest grade bait ive ever seen on ISH

[Monkey D Dragon]

lmfao@ you being trolled with the lowest grade bait ive ever seen on ISH

Do I know u retard?

[Jotaro Durant]

1. Jordan
2. KAJ
3. Russell
4. Magic
5. Wilt
6. Bird
7. Shaq
8. Duncan
9. Olajuwon
10. Kobe

[Disaprine]

:blah
its hilarious how butthurt this guy is every time he posts. :lol

[whoartthou]

Kareem/Jordan
Russell
Magic
Wilt
Kobe
Bird
Duncan
Shaq
Hakeem

If Kobe wins 2 more rings by the end of his career, which I believe he will, he will climb over Magic to a tie with Russell for 3rd.

ok, and what if kobe does it in horrendous fashion?

[whoartthou]

1. Jordan
2. KAJ
3. Russell
4. Magic
5. Wilt
6. Bird
7. Shaq
8. Duncan
9. Olajuwon
10. Kobe

good list

[whoartthou]

i dont know if thats kobe crying in your avy. or its you crying

because your the only one laughing at kobe being top 10 in this thread.

things have changed buddy. its popular now. get used to it

sorry man but even without what he did with shaq you could argue top 10 all time

2005-2010

3 finals
2 championships
2 finals mvps
1 season mvp
5 1st team all nba's
5 1st team all defense's
2 scoring titles
81 point game

just in 5 years since shaq he has accomplished more than hakeem olajuwon did in his entire career ( and dreams on most peoples top 10 lists )

add his rings and all nbas, all defense's from playing with shaq and you dont have a single god damn argument buddy boyyyyyyyyyy

suck it
:roll: :roll: :roll: :lol :lol

[whoartthou]

LMAO

Kobe Bryant - NBA record 30 missed shots :lol

Kobe Bryant - beaten by PJ Brown in 2005 MVP voting in his prime :lol

Kobe Bryant - Sidekicking his way to titles when shooting 8-27 for his first and 6-24 for his most recent :lol

Kobe Bryant - Shoots his team out of wins and gets shut down by the likes of Vince Carter and Paul Pierce :lol

Kobe Bryant = Sidekick for Life :lol
:roll:

[kizut1659]

Even Bill Simmons, who openly admits that he does not like Kobe and (correctly) states that Kobe is not as good as Jordan has him ranked as # 8 in his book - ahead of Shaq, but below Duncan.

[necya]

i don't know what's the most laughable, kobe in the top 10, shaq above hakeem in every list or no MJ at first place.

[chazzy]

i don't know what's the most laughable, kobe in the top 10, shaq above hakeem in every list
Nothing laughable about these two

[Colby Brian]

1. MJ
2. Wilt
3. Russell
4. Magic
5. Kareem
6. Shaq
7. Larry Bird
8. Kobe
9. Tim Duncan
10. Hakeem

[Batz]

1-Wilt
2-MJ
3-Kareem
4-Shaq
5-Hakeem Olajuwon
6-Tim Duncan
7-Charles Barkley
8-Larry Bird
9-Magic Johnson
10-Oscar Robertson
:roll: :roll: :roll: :roll: :roll:

Can always give me a hell of a laugh RM. :cheers:

[necya]

Nothing laughable about these two

yes, it's laughable, and it only happens on ISH.

never, shaq is a better basketball player than Hakeem.
do you even understand what does mean top 10 players of all time?

we are not talking about the 10 greatest list of accomplishment, that is completely different.

[chazzy]

yes, it's laughable, and it only happens on ISH.

never, shaq is a better basketball player than Hakeem.
do you even understand what does mean top 10 players of all time?

Do you? Most people rank players based on not only how they played in their peak/prime, but on their longevity and accomplishments as well.

[necya]

Do you? Most people rank players based on not only how they played in their peak/prime, but on their longevity and accomplishments as well.


...most people from ISH so...
i don't "rank" but judge from what i have seen.

nothing more stupid to read "if he wins another title kobe will pass x player..."

MJ could have pass his entire career with the clippers, it won't change his level of play. he would still be the GOAT.

[griffmoney1784]

to be a top 10 player all time you must have IMO

A) atleast 2+ finals mvps ( anyone but players before 1960 )

+

B) atleast 1+ season mvp

+

C) atleast 2+ championships

+

D) been on 1st team all nba's for most if not all of your prime ( with a prime thats near 10 years long )

+

E) atleast 10 allstar games ( starting most if not all )

+

F) been on a winning team for most of your career

+

G) atleast been argued as the best player in your era for 5+ years



the top 10 on my list is the best one by far

- Jordan
- Kareem
- Russell
- Wilt
- Magic
- Kobe
- Bird
- Shaq
- Duncan
- Hakeem



guys like barkley, robertson etc.... gtfo

[Round Mound]

:roll: :roll: :roll: :roll: :roll:

Can always give me a hell of a laugh RM. :cheers:

Charles Barkley =

- Top 10 All Time In EFF
- Top 10 All Time in PER Season and Play-Offs
- Top 5 All TIme in Statistical Plus/Minus
- Top 4 All Tine Made Shot Miss Shot Diferential

Big the Most Fundamentally Sound Player Ever and The Original Triple Double Master

[Mark Madsen]

Only a retard would put sidekick kobe ahead of


- Bird
- Shaq
- Duncan
- Hakeem

Hakeem still schools Kobe to this day, he owes Shaq 3 of his rings, and Duncan put a beat down on the 2003 Kobe led lakers

Come back when Kobe isn't outdone by Pau Gasol in the playoffs :lol

[ShaqAttack3234]

just in 5 years since shaq he has accomplished more than hakeem olajuwon did in his entire career ( and dreams on most peoples top 10 lists )

Yet Hakeem was simply a better player. And that's nothing against Kobe, I feel comfortable saying that Hakeem was better than Duncan and Magic as well.

[necya]

to be a top 10 player all time you must have IMO

A) atleast 2+ finals mvps ( anyone but players before 1960 )

+

B) atleast 1+ season mvp

+

C) atleast 2+ championships

+

D) been on 1st team all nba's for most if not all of your prime ( with a prime thats near 10 years long )

+

E) atleast 10 allstar games ( starting most if not all )

+

F) been on a winning team for most of your career

+

G) atleast been argued as the best player in your era for 5+ years



the top 10 on my list is the best one by far

- Jordan
- Kareem
- Russell
- Wilt
- Magic
- Kobe
- Bird
- Shaq
- Duncan
- Hakeem



guys like barkley, robertson etc.... gtfo

why do you still post? you are an idiot, you know strictly nothing about basketball. you just come here to troll. you are the worst poster here, and believe me it's something taking into account the competition here.
just post in the lakers forum.

[griffmoney1784]

Yet Hakeem was simply a better player. And that's nothing against Kobe, I feel comfortable saying that Hakeem was better than Duncan and Magic as well.

how do you judge this

because hakeem won a title in 94, then beat up on a 1995 orlando team

not only are they different positions, but different eras, and beat totally different teams.

the only way to truely judge their greatness is through career accomplishments, dominance, impact, longevity, prime, totals.


your acting as if hakeem in his prime beat kobe in the finals

how can you take yourself seriously?

the only guy hakeem can truely say hes better than is an early 20's shaq... ( if your not gonna look at careers subjectively )

im finished with you over the hill retro posters..

saying hakeem is just better than kobe and careers dont matter because he was the most dominant center in basketball for 2 years is like saying

russell/wilt > jordan.... just because.

[Doranku]

1. Jordan
2. Kareem
3. Wilt
4. Russell
5. Magic
6. Bird
7. Hakeem
8. Shaq
9. Duncan
10. Kobe

[Colby Brian]

Only a retard would put sidekick kobe ahead of


- Bird
- Shaq
- Duncan
- Hakeem

Hakeem still schools Kobe to this day, he owes Shaq 3 of his rings, and Duncan put a beat down on the 2003 Kobe led lakers

Come back when Kobe isn't outdone by Pau Gasol in the playoffs :lol

:facepalm

Kobe Bean Bryant

* 5-time NBA champion: 2000, 2001, 2002, 2009, 2010

* 7 NBA Finals appearances: 2000, 2001, 2002, 2004, 2008, 2009, 2010

* 2-time NBA Finals MVP: 2009, 2010
* NBA Most Valuable Player: 2008
* 2-time scoring champion: 2006, 2007
* 13-time NBA All-Star: 1998, 2000, 2001, 2002, 2003, 2004, 2005, 2006, 2007, 2008, 2009, 2010, 2011

* 11 consecutive appearances (No All-Star game in 1999 due to a league-wide lockout)
* Missed the 2010 game due to injury

* 4-time NBA All-Star Game MVP: 2002, 2007, 2009, 2011 (shared the 2009 award with Shaquille O'Neal)
* 12-time All-NBA Team selection:

* First team: 2002, 2003, 2004, 2006, 2007, 2008, 2009, 2010
* Second team: 2000, 2001
* Third team: 1999, 2005

* 10-time All-Defensive Team selection:

* First team: 2000, 2003, 2004, 2006, 2007, 2008, 2009, 2010
* Second team: 2001, 2002

* NBA All-Rookie Team selection:

* Second team: 1997

* NBA Slam Dunk Contest champion: 1997
* 14-time Player of the Month: December 2000, November 2001, January 2003, March 2004, January 2006, April 2006, December 2006, March 2007, April 2007, February 2008, April 2008, December 2008, January 2009, December 2009

* Player of the Month was awarded separately to Eastern and Western Conference starting from the 2001

[ShaqAttack3234]

how do you judge this

because hakeem won a title in 94, then beat up on a 1995 orlando team

not only are they different positions, but different eras, and beat totally different teams.

the only way to truely judge their greatness is through career accomplishments, dominance, impact, longevity, prime, totals.


your acting as if hakeem in his prime beat kobe in the finals

how can you take yourself seriously?

the only guy hakeem can truely say hes better than is an early 20's shaq... ( if your not gonna look at careers subjectively )

im finished with you over the hill retro posters..

saying hakeem is just better than kobe and careers dont matter because he was the most dominant center in basketball for 2 years is like saying

russell/wilt > jordan.... just because.

I know Hakeem was better from watching them play. What kind of stupid question is this? Hakeem is top 5 all time, IMO and I don't need to add up accomplishments to justify this ranking, he was THAT good. I can see Kobe at anywhere from 6-10. I have him around top 8.

[Colby Brian]

Only a retard would put sidekick kobe ahead of


- Bird
- Shaq
- Duncan
- Hakeem

Hakeem still schools Kobe to this day, he owes Shaq 3 of his rings, and Duncan put a beat down on the 2003 Kobe led lakers

Come back when Kobe isn't outdone by Pau Gasol in the playoffs :lol

kobe vs gasol in playoffs last 3 years

kobe
30.1 5.7 5.6
30.2 5.3 5.5
29.2 6.0 5.5

gasol
16.9 9.3 4.0
18.3 10.8 2.5
19.6 11.1 3.5

http://www.basketball-reference.com/players/b/bryanko01.html
http://www.basketball-reference.com/players/g/gasolpa01.html

finals kobe vs gasol

2008 finals
kobe 25.7 ppg, 4.7 rpg, 5.0 apg
gasol 14.7 ppg, 10.2 rpg, 3.3 apg


2009 finals
kobe 32.4 ppg, 5.6 rpg, 7.4 apg
gasol 18.6 ppg, 9.2 rpg, 2.2 apg


2010 finals
kobe 28.6 ppg, 8.0 rpg, 3.9 apg
gasol 18.6 ppg, 11.6 rpg, 3.7 apg

2008 finals http://www.basketball-reference.com/playoffs/NBA_2008_finals.html
2010 finals http://www.basketball-reference.com/blog/?p=6608
2009 finals http://www.nba.com/lakers/stats/2008...als_stats.html

Kobe - Only player in NBA history to score at least 600 points in the postseason for three consecutive years. 633 (2008), 695 (2009), 671 (2010)


^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
kobe vs duncan in playoffs

spurs vs lakers in playoffs (points from each game)

2001 wcf

kobe - 45, 28, 36, 24

duncan- 28, 40, 9, 15

LAL 4-0

2002 2nd round

kobe - 20, 26, 31, 28, 26

duncan - 26, 27, 28, 30, 34

LAL 4-1

2003 2nd round

kobe - 32.1 ppg

duncan- 24.7 ppg

SAS 4-2

2004 2nd round

kobe - 31, 15, 22, 42, 22, 26

duncan - 30, 24, 10, 19, 21, 20

LAL 4-2

2008 WCF

kobe - 27, 22, 30, 28, 39

duncan - 30, 12, 22, 29, 19

LAL 4-1

playoff series wins against each other

kobe - 4

duncan - 1

2001 http://www.nba.com/playoffs2001/finals/west/?nav=SiteFragment
2002 http://www.nba.com/playoffs2002/west_round2_02.html
2003 http://sports.espn.go.com/nba/playoffs2003/series?series=lalsas
2004 http://sports.espn.go.com/nba/playoffs2004/series?series=lalsas
2008 http://sports.espn.go.com/nba/playoffs2008/series?series=saslal

[Alhazred]

1. Michael Jordan
2. Bill Russell
3. Kareem Abdul-Jabbar
4. Wilt Chamberlain
5. Shaquille O'Neal
6. Larry Bird
7. Magic Johnson
8. Kobe Bryant
9. Hakeem Olajuwon
10. Tim Duncan

[Colby Brian]

1. Michael Jordan
2. Bill Russell
3. Kareem Abdul-Jabbar
4. Wilt Chamberlain
5. Shaquille O'Neal
6. Larry Bird
7. Magic Johnson
8. Kobe Bryant
9. Hakeem Olajuwon
10. Tim Duncan

thats a good list almost as same as mine

[t-rex]

Jordan
Jabbar
Chamberlin
Magic
O'neal
Russell
Bryant
Bird
Olajuwan
Duncan

[NBASTATMAN]

I got:

1. Michael Jordan
2. Bill Russell
3. Kareem Abdul Jabbar
4. Magic Johnson
5. Wilt Chamberlain
6. Larry Bird
7. Kobe Bryant
8. Tim Duncan
9. Shaquille O'Neal
10. Hakeem Olujawon


It all depends on how you rate them.. On career kobe and duncan are higher than Hakeem and maybe Larry.. But as a player I would put kobe and duncan around 10th



MJ or Kareem
Wilt
russell
mikan , :D
Bird
Magic
Hakeem
Shaq
kobe and duncan are about the same though Duncan was better in his prime and he has more awards as well..



Kobe will wind up with Bird and Magic when its all done..

[NBASTATMAN]

1. Jordan
2. Kareem
3. Wilt
4. Russell
5. Magic
6. Bird
7. Hakeem
8. Shaq
9. Duncan
10. Kobe


MAN DORANKU I never thought I would agree with you on anything.. :lol


:applause: :cheers: Very close to what I think.. Are you sure you arent' a kobe hater... ?

[griffmoney1784]

I know Hakeem was better from watching them play. What kind of stupid question is this? Hakeem is top 5 all time, IMO and I don't need to add up accomplishments to justify this ranking, he was THAT good. I can see Kobe at anywhere from 6-10. I have him around top 8.


prime kobe is arguably the most all around perfected tallent in nba history

if anything if you throw resume's out the window and just look at a players level of play... you could argue kobes reached a level that only maybe jordan has matched individually

:facepalm @ you


and btw... for non bigmen... you should look at what theyve done as even more impressive than the same accomplishments done by someone whos 7 feet tall


its much muuuuuuch muuuuuuuuuuuuuuuch harder to be the mvp of a championship team as a SHOOTING GUARD than it is as a CENTER

[DonCorleone]

prime kobe is arguably the most all around perfected tallent in nba history

if anything if you throw resume's out the window and just look at a players level of play... you could argue kobes reached a level that only maybe jordan has matched individually

:facepalm @ you


and btw... for non bigmen... you should look at what theyve done as even more impressive than the same accomplishments done by someone whos 7 feet tall


its much muuuuuuch muuuuuuuuuuuuuuuch harder to be the mvp of a championship team as a SHOOTING GUARD than it is as a CENTER

:confusedshrug:

[Eat Like A Bosh]

My list:

1. Shaquille Rashuan O'neal

2. Michael Jeffrey Jordan

3. Ferdinand Lewis Alcindor

4. Wilton Norman Chamberlain

5. William Felton Russell

6. Earvin Johnson jr.

7. Timothy Theodore Duncan

8. Kobe Bean Bryant

9. Larry Joe Bird

10. Akeem Abdul Olajuwon
:oldlol: Why not list them at full name, better off to list them at their usual names where everybody can recognize them.
People don't know who Ferdinand Lewis Alcindor is, they only know Kareem.

This list is pretty ****ed up tbh.
OP is a ****ing joke! :roll:

[NBASTATMAN]

prime kobe is arguably the most all around perfected tallent in nba history

if anything if you throw resume's out the window and just look at a players level of play... you could argue kobes reached a level that only maybe jordan has matched individually:facepalm @ you


and btw... for non bigmen... you should look at what theyve done as even more impressive than the same accomplishments done by someone whos 7 feet tall


its much muuuuuuch muuuuuuuuuuuuuuuch harder to be the mvp of a championship team as a SHOOTING GUARD than it is as a CENTER



:banana: :lol

[griffmoney1784]

:confusedshrug:


it means kobe has mastered the game. no weakness... even jordan had a range limmit

prime kobe was the most athletic guy. the most skilled guy. the most clutch guy, and was the most 2 - way offense/defense player aswell

no one was a more perfected player than kobe in nba history

[DonCorleone]

it means kobe has mastered the game. no weakness... even jordan had a range limmit

prime kobe was the most athletic guy. the most skilled guy. the most clutch guy, and was the most 2 - way offense/defense player aswell

no one was a more perfected player than kobe in nba history

Kobe Bryant is not very athletic. Not even in his prime was he very athletic compared to superior athletes.

[Mark Madsen]

kobe vs gasol in playoffs last 3 years

kobe
30.1 5.7 5.6
30.2 5.3 5.5
29.2 6.0 5.5

gasol
16.9 9.3 4.0
18.3 10.8 2.5
19.6 11.1 3.5

http://www.basketball-reference.com/players/b/bryanko01.html
http://www.basketball-reference.com/players/g/gasolpa01.html

finals kobe vs gasol

2008 finals
kobe 25.7 ppg, 4.7 rpg, 5.0 apg
gasol 14.7 ppg, 10.2 rpg, 3.3 apg


2009 finals
kobe 32.4 ppg, 5.6 rpg, 7.4 apg
gasol 18.6 ppg, 9.2 rpg, 2.2 apg


2010 finals
kobe 28.6 ppg, 8.0 rpg, 3.9 apg
gasol 18.6 ppg, 11.6 rpg, 3.7 apg

2008 finals http://www.basketball-reference.com/playoffs/NBA_2008_finals.html
2010 finals http://www.basketball-reference.com/blog/?p=6608
2009 finals http://www.nba.com/lakers/stats/2008...als_stats.html

Kobe - Only player in NBA history to score at least 600 points in the postseason for three consecutive years. 633 (2008), 695 (2009), 671 (2010)


^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
kobe vs duncan in playoffs

spurs vs lakers in playoffs (points from each game)

2001 wcf

kobe - 45, 28, 36, 24

duncan- 28, 40, 9, 15

LAL 4-0

2002 2nd round

kobe - 20, 26, 31, 28, 26

duncan - 26, 27, 28, 30, 34

LAL 4-1

2003 2nd round

kobe - 32.1 ppg

duncan- 24.7 ppg

SAS 4-2

2004 2nd round

kobe - 31, 15, 22, 42, 22, 26

duncan - 30, 24, 10, 19, 21, 20

LAL 4-2

2008 WCF

kobe - 27, 22, 30, 28, 39

duncan - 30, 12, 22, 29, 19

LAL 4-1

playoff series wins against each other

kobe - 4

duncan - 1

2001 http://www.nba.com/playoffs2001/finals/west/?nav=SiteFragment
2002 http://www.nba.com/playoffs2002/west_round2_02.html
2003 http://sports.espn.go.com/nba/playoffs2003/series?series=lalsas
2004 http://sports.espn.go.com/nba/playoffs2004/series?series=lalsas
2008 http://sports.espn.go.com/nba/playoffs2008/series?series=saslal

Gasol had more win shares than Kobe last playoffs with legit talks of him being FMVP .. amazing how you always leave out the shooting %'s :roll: :lol

Shaq led all those teams to victory against Duncan, Kobe failed in 2003 :lol :roll:

Scoring 600+ 3 times in a row is nothing impressive if you're playing 21, 23 and 23 games each run ... never shooting even 49% once and losing by 40 pts a game 7 of the finals :roll: :lol

[griffmoney1784]

Kobe Bryant is not very athletic. Not even in his prime was he very athletic compared to superior athletes.


:roll: @ these 5 year olds ..the only guy more athletic than kobe during the 1st half the 00's was vince carter

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YqiViGHl8jM&feature=related
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FJhzFrhGTP4&feature=related
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ntLzxb5BQUo&feature=related

[ShaqAttack3234]

prime kobe is arguably the most all around perfected tallent in nba history

if anything if you throw resume's out the window and just look at a players level of play... you could argue kobes reached a level that only maybe jordan has matched individually

:facepalm @ you


No.


and btw... for non bigmen... you should look at what theyve done as even more impressive than the same accomplishments done by someone whos 7 feet tall


its much muuuuuuch muuuuuuuuuuuuuuuch harder to be the mvp of a championship team as a SHOOTING GUARD than it is as a CENTER

I don't care, what matters is how big of an impact you can make on a basketball court, that's why I have Kareem right up there with Jordan for GOAT.




:roll: @ these 5 year olds ..the only guy more athletic than kobe during the 1st half the 00's was vince carter

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YqiViGHl8jM&feature=related
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FJhzFrhGTP4&feature=related
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ntLzxb5BQUo&feature=related

I never understood why people say Kobe was an average athlete. Nobody said that in the early 2000s. He was known as a high flyer.

At close to 30 years old in his 12th season after 2 knee surgeries.....

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_P-Sw9RPllA

One of my favorite dunks.


Gasol had more win shares than Kobe last playoffs with legit talks of him being FMVP .. amazing how you always leave out the shooting %'s :roll: :lol

Shaq led all those teams to victory against Duncan, Kobe failed in 2003 :lol :roll:

Scoring 600+ 3 times in a row is nothing impressive if you're playing 21, 23 and 23 games each run ... never shooting even 49% once and losing by 40 pts a game 7 of the finals :roll: :lol

No, Kobe was the MVP of the Lakers/Spurs series in 2001 and 2002, Shaq was the Lakers MVP in general, but not during those series.

[griffmoney1784]

No.



Yes.

[Monkey D Dragon]

Kobe Bryant is not very athletic. Not even in his prime was he very athletic compared to superior athletes.


Kobe Bryant not Athletic LOL and u had the balls to say Not even in his prime LOL :bowdown: :bowdown: :bowdown:


Idiot of the Day Award :facepalm

[magnax1]

Kobe wasn't anywhere near an average athlete, but he was no where near guys like AI TMac and VC either. He's always been a guy who's a top tier player because of his skill, not his athletic talent. Basically top 1/3rd of the league.

[Colby Brian]

Gasol had more win shares than Kobe last playoffs with legit talks of him being FMVP .. amazing how you always leave out the shooting %'s :roll: :lol

Shaq led all those teams to victory against Duncan, Kobe failed in 2003 :lol :roll:

Scoring 600+ 3 times in a row is nothing impressive if you're playing 21, 23 and 23 games each run ... never shooting even 49% once and losing by 40 pts a game 7 of the finals :roll: :lol

:facepalm

in 08 playoffs he shot 48%
09 46%
10 46%

2003 playoffs series, la vs san antonio

kobe - 32.1 ppg
duncan - 24.7 ppg


in 2003, it was duncans prime, but a 25 year old kobe outplayed him
duncan sure owned him :lol

plus kobe without shaq vs duncan is 1-0 in the playoffs

lol you think that gasol led the lakers to victory:facepalm
did you look at the stats, gasol by himself with the grizz never won a single playoff game

[Colby Brian]

Kobe Bryant not Athletic LOL and u had the balls to say Not even in his prime LOL :bowdown: :bowdown: :bowdown:


Idiot of the Day Award :facepalm

lol kobe haterz even that kobe was gasols sidekick :roll:

[DonCorleone]

Kobe Bryant not Athletic LOL and u had the balls to say Not even in his prime LOL :bowdown: :bowdown: :bowdown:


Idiot of the Day Award :facepalm

Kobe Bryant is a great player because of his skills. Not because of his athleticism.

Compared to NFL players Kobe Bryant is extremely unathletic.

[ShaqAttack3234]

:
in 2003, it was duncans prime, but a 25 year old kobe outplayed him
duncan sure owned him :lol

No he didn't. Kobe usually killed the Spurs, but he did not play up to his usual standard in the 2003 series. Duncan was clearly the best player during that series and Shaq also played better than Kobe in the '03 series.

[Colby Brian]

chris paul is the leader in win shares right now, so is he the best player?

[Big#50]

:facepalm

in 08 playoffs he shot 48%
09 46%
10 46%

2003 playoffs series, la vs san antonio

kobe - 32.1 ppg
duncan - 24.7 ppg


in 2003, it was duncans prime, but a 25 year old kobe outplayed him
duncan sure owned him :lol

plus kobe without shaq vs duncan is 1-0 in the playoffs

lol you think that gasol led the lakers to victory:facepalm
did you look at the stats, gasol by himself with the grizz never won a single playoff game
Kobe never made it out of the first round without Gasol. Missed the playoffs as well. Gasol comes in and The Lakers are in the finals since. Coincidence?
I wont even bother talking about 03.
Whose troll account is this. I still think this is a kobe hater.

[the_wise_one]

My list:

1. Shaquille Rashuan O'neal

2. Michael Jeffrey Jordan

3. Ferdinand Lewis Alcindor

4. Wilton Norman Chamberlain

5. William Felton Russell

6. Earvin Johnson jr.

7. Timothy Theodore Duncan

8. Kobe Bean Bryant

9. Larry Joe Bird

10. Akeem Abdul Olajuwon

List is invalid.

[Colby Brian]

No he didn't. Kobe usually killed the Spurs, but he did not play up to his usual standard in the 2003 series. Duncan was clearly the best player during that series and Shaq also played better than Kobe in the '03 series.

lol but it was 1 series, kobe outplayed duncan in the other 4 series, which LA won

[Colby Brian]

Kobe never made it out of the first round without Gasol. Missed the playoffs as well. Gasol comes in and The Lakers are in the finals since. Coincidence?
I wont even bother talking about 03.
Whose troll account is this. I still think this is a kobe hater.

in 06, kobe lost to phoenix 4-3, thats 3 wins
07, lost to phoenix 4-1, 1 win

gasol never won a single game in the playoffs he got swept twice, kobe never got swept
gasol only made the all star team once with the grizzles, 3 times with the lakers

[Colby Brian]

plus the lakers were 31-16 before they got gasol in 07/08...thats on pace for 54 wins
http://espn.go.com/nba/team/schedule/_/name/LAL/year/2008/los-angeles-lakers

[Monkey D Dragon]

Kobe Bryant is a great player because of his skills. Not because of his athleticism.

Compared to NFL players Kobe Bryant is extremely unathletic.


Trolls who never seen live NBA game will say something unreal and dumb like this.

No Doubt Kobe's Skill is SUPERB but saying he is "Extremely unathletic" u my man just made my day :roll:

Even on youtube you can tell Kobe was a Beast. Kobe had Combination of both only thing he was lacking was not his Athletic ability but his Physical figures like his hand size which are smaller compare to Mike, LeBron, and Tmac and Body Figure which Kobe dont have lanky arms like Tmac does or his Body size compare to LeBron.

Bottom line ya are retards if you think Kobe didnt have the Hops, Quickness, Speed, and Agility because without those he cant do the shiiit that he does solely on "Skills".

[Monkey D Dragon]

Kobe never made it out of the first round without Gasol. Missed the playoffs as well. Gasol comes in and The Lakers are in the finals since. Coincidence?
I wont even bother talking about 03.
Whose troll account is this. I still think this is a kobe hater.

You fail to mention earlier that season before they acquire Gasol, they were First Place and looking pretty solid where they would of made it to the Finals anyways. Gasol just made it a lot easier and end up not showing up in the Finals where they NEEDED him the MOST and he end up getting scared and playing like a inflated stat paddler he is and end up losing to better Boston team with 3 PROVEN HOF not like Gasol.

[Colby Brian]

You fail to mention earlier that season before they acquire Gasol, they were First Place and looking pretty solid where they would of made it to the Finals anyways. Gasol just made it a lot easier and end up not showing up in the Finals where they NEEDED him the MOST and he end up getting scared and playing like a inflated stat paddler he is and end up losing to better Boston team with 3 PROVEN HOF not like Gasol.

yeah i agree, lakers were 31-16 before getting gasol, thats on pace to win 54 games, that would probally get them a 2nd or 3rd seed, they woulda atleast got to the wcf

[Monkey D Dragon]

yeah i agree, lakers were 31-16 before getting gasol, thats on pace to win 54 games, that would probally get them a 2nd or 3rd seed, they woulda atleast got to the wcf


Kobe Shiiits on everyone on the West. Dont matter who it was gonna be they would of been at the Finals.

All Kobe needs is a big who can Catch unexpected passes who has great hands and finish strong around the rim.

Unfortunately he never had that after Shaq left but that season Bynum became a solid Big while working with Kareem.

[Optimus Prime]

1. Michael Jordan
2. Kobe Bryant

...

FIGHT! :lol

http://i42.photobucket.com/albums/e337/powerseller1269/Kobe/8vs23.jpg

PS - I don't take these subjective threads seriously. I view and participate in them merely for the entertainment value they posses with people vehemently arguing back and forth about opinions.

[T-bomb 25]

1.Jordan
2.Bird
3.KAJ
4.Wilt
5.Duncan
6.Hakeem
7.Shaq
8.Russell
9.Magic
10.Kobe

Russell had to many Legends on his team and he often wasnt even 2nd on the team in scoring,i used to have him at #11....and there is no way Magic and Kobe can be rated ahead of guys who were number 1 options on their team like Bird Larry lead other legends enough said on that,Hakeem,and Duncan have to be higher to and they are top 5 all time defensive players on top of that.Hakeem and Duncan get high marks for winning without all stars and Duncan gets even higher marks for making Parker and Ginobli into all stars,no other player has lifted players to that level i wish i can rank him higher and he beat and battled prime dominant Shaq.

[T-bomb 25]

And Duncan not winning any DOPY awards was ludacris he was clearly the best defensive player of his era...and a top 5 defensive player of all time...:facepalm

[whoartthou]

Kobe Shiiits on everyone on the West. Dont matter who it was gonna be they would of been at the Finals.

All Kobe needs is a big who can Catch unexpected passes who has great hands and finish strong around the rim.

Unfortunately he never had that after Shaq left but that season Bynum became a solid Big while working with Kareem.
:roll: :roll: