So wait, LeBron has been in the league 7 years less than Bryant?

[TennesseeFan]

And hes only 10K points behind him? Thats pretty amazing.

[weebok]

He's also 5 championships behind him.

[TennesseeFan]

He's also 5 championships behind him.

He's also 1 sidekick period behind him.

[Mark Madsen]

He's also 5 championships behind him.

3 as sidekick

[Colby Brian]

lebron came on a cavs team that had nobody, so lebron was number 1 option from the get go

while kobe came into a playoff contending team, with shaq as the first option
it wasnt kobes team until 2004, kobe wasnt a starter until his 3rd year, while lebron got 40 mpg as a rookie compared to 15.5 for kobe

but kobe has way more 60,50,40 point games than lebron and would never top offensivly what bryant did in 05-06 and 06-07 seasons

[Colby Brian]

3 as sidekick

ok 2 as the man, thats 2 more than lebron

http://www.ver5e.com/wp-content/uploads/2010/11/ringless-450x250.jpg

[TennesseeFan]

ok 2 as the man, thats 2 more than lebron

http://www.ver5e.com/wp-content/uploads/2010/11/ringless-450x250.jpg

Put prime Shaq or Gasol on the Cavs, it would have been a different story.

[Colby Brian]

Put prime Shaq or Gasol on the Cavs, it would have been a different story.
:facepalm

lebron has a prime wade and bosh, lets see whats gonna happen
wade>>gasol, wade+bosh>>>>>>>>>gasol
lebron has 2 players in the top 10, kobes older now and has 1 top 10 player, gasol

[Bandito]

Put prime Shaq or Gasol on the Cavs, it would have been a different story.
Yeah they still lose because Lebron cannot play with a post presence. Remember Bosh a 6'11'' spot up shooter since coming to Miami? That would be Gasol dawg...

[Zach Morris]

:facepalm

lebron has a prime wade and bosh, lets see whats gonna happen
wade>>gasol, wade+bosh>>>>>>>>>gasol

It's ALWAYS something. It will NEVER be enough. Bosh & Wade are inadequate! Duh! LeBron needs the Team USA roster to win any gold. Nothing less. :oldlol:

[TennesseeFan]

Yeah they still lose because Lebron cannot play with a post presence. Remember Bosh a 6'11'' spot up shooter since coming to Miami? That would be Gasol dawg...

Thats Bosh's problem, not LeBron's. And Shaq is definitely not going to turn into a Bosh thats for sure.

[Colby Brian]

plus why diss kobes first 3 rings, when he was on that team, he helped them win and was a legit 2nd option, just like wade is to lebron, but some nights wade played better just like kobe played better
so if in the future the heat win, wades ring isnt gonna count because he was a sidekick? what about kareems? pippens? jerry wests? why is it only for kobe that his 3 rings "dont count" he was their closer and legit player

[Colby Brian]

Thats Bosh's problem, not LeBron's. And Shaq is definitely not going to turn into a Bosh thats for sure.

what about wade, hes freakin good player, top 3 in the league a prime wade is a better teammate than gasol, and wade+bosh is better teammates than shaq

[All Net]

Hardly a surprise, Lebron is a great regular season stats guy. Will be one of the top 5 ever in terms of points.

[TennesseeFan]

I think you Kobe homers are ridiculous. LeBron is on a better scoring pace than Bryant, get over it.

[Colby Brian]

kobes led his team to championships, lebron hasnt, and this year lebron has a damn good team, he just needs to lead his team to a title, if he doesnt than its a failed season, not more excuses

[Colby Brian]

I think you Kobe homers are ridiculous. LeBron is on a better scoring pace than Bryant, get over it.

no shit, but it doesnt mean hes gonna pass kobe tho, kobes longevity and jump shooting skills keep him at a good pace, once lebron gets around kobes age, he wont be at kobes level and his pace will drop

[MayCeltics]

I think you Kobe homers are ridiculous. LeBron is on a better scoring pace than Bryant, get over it.

The Stans are unbearable. They haven't come to terms Lebron will go down better than Kobe.

[NoGunzJustSkillz]

kobe ain't sh!t without his homeboys.:rant

[All Net]

The Stans are unbearable. They haven't come to terms Lebron will go down better than Kobe.

Lebron is going to need to do alot from now to have a better career than Kobe. Think it's unlikely.

[TennesseeFan]

Lebron is going to need to do alot from now to have a better career than Kobe. Think it's unlikely.

The pace does not suggest that.

[Colby Brian]

The Stans are unbearable. They haven't come to terms Lebron will go down better than Kobe.

:facepalm :facepalm

Kobe Bean Bryant

* 5-time NBA champion: 2000, 2001, 2002, 2009, 2010

* 7 NBA Finals appearances: 2000, 2001, 2002, 2004, 2008, 2009, 2010

* 2-time NBA Finals MVP: 2009, 2010
* NBA Most Valuable Player: 2008
* 2-time scoring champion: 2006, 2007
* 13-time NBA All-Star: 1998, 2000, 2001, 2002, 2003, 2004, 2005, 2006, 2007, 2008, 2009, 2010, 2011

* 11 consecutive appearances (No All-Star game in 1999 due to a league-wide lockout)
* Missed the 2010 game due to injury

* 4-time NBA All-Star Game MVP: 2002, 2007, 2009, 2011 (shared the 2009 award with Shaquille O'Neal)
* 12-time All-NBA Team selection:

* First team: 2002, 2003, 2004, 2006, 2007, 2008, 2009, 2010
* Second team: 2000, 2001
* Third team: 1999, 2005

* 10-time All-Defensive Team selection:

* First team: 2000, 2003, 2004, 2006, 2007, 2008, 2009, 2010
* Second team: 2001, 2002

* NBA All-Rookie Team selection:

* Second team: 1997

* NBA Slam Dunk Contest champion: 1997
* 14-time Player of the Month: December 2000, November 2001, January 2003, March 2004, January 2006, April 2006, December 2006, March 2007, April 2007, February 2008, April 2008, December 2008, January 2009, December 2009

* Player of the Month was awarded separately to Eastern and Western Conference starting from the 2001

[nbacardDOTnet]

ok 2 as the man, thats 2 more than lebron

http://www.ver5e.com/wp-content/uploads/2010/11/ringless-450x250.jpg

:oldlol:

[griffmoney1784]

i still laugh at the people who say BUT KOBE HAD SHAQ


ya

but kobe also proved those rings werent a fluke by leading a team without even a top 250 all time sidekick to 3 straight finals and 2 straight championships

theres atleast 250 players better than gasol all time... atleast

[Colby Brian]

Only player in NBA history to score at least 600 points in the postseason for three consecutive years.

i didnt know that

[pauk]

lebron came on a cavs team that had nobody, so lebron was number 1 option from the get go

while kobe came into a playoff contending team, with shaq as the first option
it wasnt kobes team until 2004, kobe wasnt a starter until his 3rd year, while lebron got 40 mpg as a rookie compared to 15.5 for kobe

but kobe has way more 60,50,40 point games than lebron and would never top offensivly what bryant did in 05-06 and 06-07 seasons

please dont let me ever hear anybody make that excuse ever again ok?

kobe came into the league not even close to as NBA ready as lebron...... kobe played 15 minutes a game his rookie year for a reason...
kobe played 25 minutes a game his sophomore year for a reason...

HE WAS NOT EVEN CLOSE TO AS NBA READY OR AS GOOD AS LEBRON............

LEBRON WAS THE MOST NBA READY 18 YEAR OLD IN NBA HISTORY..... WHILE KOBE HAD TO DEVELOPE HIS SKILLS IN THE NBA...... IT TOOK KOBE 4 YEARS TO BECOME AS GOOD AS EVEN A ROOKIE LEBRON.........

by the time kobe was 21 (his 4th season) he was only then as good as the ROOKIE LEBRON.........

please get over it...

by the time kobe was 21-22 he put up the same amount of FG Attempts per game as Lebron ever did in his CAREER and still came up very short....... dont bring that excuse plz...

AND GUESS WHAT? DURING THAT PROCESS LEBRON WAS TOP 10 IN ASSISTS ASWELL..... AVERAGED MORE REBOUNDS, SHOT MORE EFFICIENTLY FG, MORE BLOCKS, STEALS... TRIPLE DOUBLES, DOUBLE DOUBLES.... YOUNGEST TO RECORDS....


kobe cant be compared to lebron.......... you better bring in the RINGS.... because thats the only thing holding him up...

[NoGunzJustSkillz]

please dont let me ever hear anybody make that excuse ever again ok?

kobe came into the league not even close to as NBA ready as lebron...... kobe played 15 minutes a game his rookie year for a reason...
kobe played 25 minutes a game his sophomore year for a reason...

HE WAS NOT EVEN CLOSE TO AS NBA READY OR AS GOOD AS LEBRON............

LEBRON WAS THE MOST NBA READY 18 YEAR OLD IN NBA HISTORY..... WHILE KOBE HAD TO DEVELOPE HIS SKILLS IN THE NBA...... IT TOOK KOBE 4 YEARS TO BECOME AS GOOD AS EVEN A ROOKIE LEBRON.........

by the time kobe was 21 (his 4th season) he was only then as good as the ROOKIE LEBRON.........

please get over it...

by the time kobe was 21-22 he put up the same amount of FG Attempts as Lebron ever did and still came up very short....... dont bring that excuse plz...
i still don't think kobe is nba ready. maybe a couple more years.

[pauk]

i still don't think kobe is nba ready. maybe a couple more years.

:oldlol: :applause:

think we upset some kobe fans

butthurt kobe fan comment in 3.. 2... 1....

[All Net]

The pace does not suggest that.

I'm not talking just points. Alot can be great scorers. Lebron in terms of a career Lebron isn't close to Kobe.

Lebron is a GREAT player and puts up great stats but in terms of a career hasn't done anything YET. He is only 26 so he is going to need to win titles, have more deep runs in the playoffs, more all NBA teams, all defensive teams, finals MVP's.

How Lebron ages is going to be key, can he still be as great once he starts to decline and go past 30? Kobe has the skills to last a long time from 30-36 for example..does Lebron? that remains to be seen.

[Mr. I'm So Rad]

It's ALWAYS something. It will NEVER be enough. Bosh & Wade are inadequate! Duh! LeBron needs the Team USA roster to win any gold. Nothing less. :oldlol:

this

[pauk]

I'm not talking just points. Alot can be great scorers. Lebron in terms of a career Lebron isn't close to Kobe.

Lebron is a GREAT player and puts up great stats but in terms of a career hasn't done anything YET. He is only 26 so he is going to need to win titles, have more deep runs in the playoffs, more all NBA teams, all defensive teams, finals MVP's.

How Lebron ages is going to be key, can he still be as great once he starts to decline and go past 30? Kobe has the skills to last a long time from 30-36 for example..does Lebron? that remains to be seen.

dude.... lebron by that age will be better than kobe at 35 (i didnt bring up age 30 because thats freakin young man, thats the best year for most players... most players reach their PRIME PRIME right there)... 32-33 is where u start to decline athletically and so on.... jordan was at best from 28-32.. won his first championship 28

i dont know of ANY such good player with such skills & talent and work ethic of the level of lebron who were not able to adjust skills to suit his declining athleticism and so on after the age of 30.... not including those who were injured....

its not like lebron will go: "ah **** it... i cant jump over people anymore and i cant zip by everybody... i give up... without my athleticism i cant shoot, rebound, pass, defend or develope a hakeemesque post game... nothing.... all those skills depended on my athleticism so **** it."

LOL

[All Net]

dude.... lebron by that age will be better than kobe at 35 (i didnt bring up age 30 because thats freakin young man, thats the best year for most players... most players reach their PRIME PRIME right there)... 32-33 is where u start to decline athletically and so on....

i dont know of ANY such good player with such skills & talent and work ethic of the level of lebron who were not able to adjust skills to suit his declining athleticism and so on after the age of 30.... not including those who were injured....

You would hope Lebron would adjust his game and work on other areas but there is no lock that happens. Same with Wade. Both depend alot on their speed and quickness to be as great as they are..once that goes then what? that will be interesting to see. Lebron needs to work on his post game, that will make him last longer.

[pauk]

You would hope Lebron would adjust his game and work on other areas but there is no lock that happens. Same with Wade. Both depend alot on their speed and quickness to be as great as they are..once that goes then what? that will be interesting to see. Lebron needs to work on his post game, that will make him last longer.

his post game being bad is a ****ing myth....
he has a good post game... its not HAKEEM LEVEL or even KOBE LEVEL.... but its good.... he just doesnt use it for obvious reasons!!

I do agree he definitely can improve his post game tho!!! right now...? not needed the slightest bit..... post game is for those slow unathletic dudes who cant do what lebron can do.... lebron gets the ball in the post... faces up... one quick jab step and BAM he explodes to the rim... with one step he is already by you and going for a AND1.... so i can see why he doesnt use his post game very often

[pauk]

here is one analogy on lebron not wanting to post up so much....
lets say you have a .50 cal Sniper and a Bow with a Arrow... an elephant is running towards u to kill u.... would you use the Sniper or the Bow/Arrow?
u use the SNIPER right?? why play around with the Bow & Arrow and give the Elephant a chanse to kill you when you can finish it of quickly with the Sniper???
now all of the sudden u are criticised for not being skilled with Bow & Arrow..... but u are... u just have another weapon which nobody else has which gets the job done much more easier and more efficient than anybody could with a Bow & Arrow no matter how skilled they was with the Bow & Arrow!!
get it? :D

[NoGunzJustSkillz]

here is one analogy on lebron not wanting to post up so much....
lets say you have a .50 cal Sniper and a Bow with a Arrow... an elephant is running towards u to kill u.... would you use the Sniper or the Bow/Arrow?
u use the SNIPER right?? why play around with the Bow & Arrow and give the Elephant a chanse to kill you when you can finish it of quickly with the Sniper???
now all of the sudden u are criticised for not being skilled with Bow & Arrow..... but u are... u just have another weapon which nobody else has which gets the job done much more easier and more efficient than anybody could with a Bow & Arrow no matter how skilled they was with the Bow & Arrow!!
get it? :D
how much is jeff paying u to keep the circus up and running 24/7?

[pauk]

how much is jeff paying u to keep the circus up and running 24/7?

nothing
but maybe he should? gona talk to jeff right now! :mad:
1.000.000$ should be aight i think per month? this job is tough!!

[Micku]

Kevin Durant may catch up to Kobe too if he is going to keep going on his current pace too.

[griffmoney1784]

heres the difference between kobe and lebron fans in a nutshell

- Kobe fans will make excuses as to why kobe hasnt done enough to be GOAT

- Lebron fans will make excuses as to why lebron hasnt done anything


/thread

[NoGunzJustSkillz]

heres the difference between kobe and lebron fans in a nutshell

- Kobe fans will make excuses as to why kobe hasnt done enough to be GOAT

- Lebron fans will make excuses as to why lebron hasnt done anything


/thread
:oldlol:

[Colby Brian]

please dont let me ever hear anybody make that excuse ever again ok?

kobe came into the league not even close to as NBA ready as lebron...... kobe played 15 minutes a game his rookie year for a reason...
kobe played 25 minutes a game his sophomore year for a reason...

HE WAS NOT EVEN CLOSE TO AS NBA READY OR AS GOOD AS LEBRON............

LEBRON WAS THE MOST NBA READY 18 YEAR OLD IN NBA HISTORY..... WHILE KOBE HAD TO DEVELOPE HIS SKILLS IN THE NBA...... IT TOOK KOBE 4 YEARS TO BECOME AS GOOD AS EVEN A ROOKIE LEBRON.........

by the time kobe was 21 (his 4th season) he was only then as good as the ROOKIE LEBRON.........

please get over it...

by the time kobe was 21-22 he put up the same amount of FG Attempts per game as Lebron ever did in his CAREER and still came up very short....... dont bring that excuse plz...

AND GUESS WHAT? DURING THAT PROCESS LEBRON WAS TOP 10 IN ASSISTS ASWELL..... AVERAGED MORE REBOUNDS, SHOT MORE EFFICIENTLY FG, MORE BLOCKS, STEALS... TRIPLE DOUBLES, DOUBLE DOUBLES.... YOUNGEST TO RECORDS....


kobe cant be compared to lebron.......... you better bring in the RINGS.... because thats the only thing holding him up...

Kobe Bean Bryant

* 5-time NBA champion: 2000, 2001, 2002, 2009, 2010

* 7 NBA Finals appearances: 2000, 2001, 2002, 2004, 2008, 2009, 2010

* 2-time NBA Finals MVP: 2009, 2010
* NBA Most Valuable Player: 2008
* 2-time scoring champion: 2006, 2007
* 13-time NBA All-Star: 1998, 2000, 2001, 2002, 2003, 2004, 2005, 2006, 2007, 2008, 2009, 2010, 2011

* 11 consecutive appearances (No All-Star game in 1999 due to a league-wide lockout)
* Missed the 2010 game due to injury

* 4-time NBA All-Star Game MVP: 2002, 2007, 2009, 2011 (shared the 2009 award with Shaquille O'Neal)
* 12-time All-NBA Team selection:

* First team: 2002, 2003, 2004, 2006, 2007, 2008, 2009, 2010
* Second team: 2000, 2001
* Third team: 1999, 2005

* 10-time All-Defensive Team selection:

* First team: 2000, 2003, 2004, 2006, 2007, 2008, 2009, 2010
* Second team: 2001, 2002

* NBA All-Rookie Team selection:

* Second team: 1997

* NBA Slam Dunk Contest champion: 1997
* 14-time Player of the Month: December 2000, November 2001, January 2003, March 2004, January 2006, April 2006, December 2006, March 2007, April 2007, February 2008, April 2008, December 2008, January 2009, December 2009

* Player of the Month was awarded separately to Eastern and Western Conference starting from the 2001

[Colby Brian]

http://www.ver5e.com/wp-content/uploads/2010/11/ringless-450x250.jpg

[KG5MVP]

He's also 5 championships behind him.

kobe has 2 champions behind horry

horry > kobe

[Colby Brian]

heres the difference between kobe and lebron fans in a nutshell

- Kobe fans will make excuses as to why kobe hasnt done enough to be GOAT

- Lebron fans will make excuses as to why lebron hasnt done anything


/thread

:roll:

[Batz]

kobe has 2 champions behind horry

horry > kobe
awww that's e-cuuuute. :oldlol:

[boxclever]

heres the difference between kobe and lebron fans in a nutshell

- Kobe fans will make excuses as to why kobe hasnt done enough to be GOAT

- Lebron fans will make excuses as to why lebron hasnt done anything


/thread
:lol

[PurpleChuck]

here is one analogy on lebron not wanting to post up so much....
lets say you have a .50 cal Sniper and a Bow with a Arrow... an elephant is running towards u to kill u.... would you use the Sniper or the Bow/Arrow?
u use the SNIPER right?? why play around with the Bow & Arrow and give the Elephant a chanse to kill you when you can finish it of quickly with the Sniper???
now all of the sudden u are criticised for not being skilled with Bow & Arrow..... but u are... u just have another weapon which nobody else has which gets the job done much more easier and more efficient than anybody could with a Bow & Arrow no matter how skilled they was with the Bow & Arrow!!
get it? :D
Wade has a bazooka, why Spo no use?:confusedshrug:

[NY-Knicks]

I think you Kobe homers are ridiculous. LeBron is on a better scoring pace than Bryant, get over it.

Remember Kobe's first two years ?

[Harion]

i'm not mad at all. because once Lebron starts winning rings, it'll be all Kobe nut tards can do to keep from going into apoplectic shocks. and then, they'll be able to run nowhere with that "ringless" shit. and what will they have to say once he does win? that Lebron needs to win 6 rings, 1 more than Kobe?

i for one am just biding my time. because my time to troll these retards will come. and then i'll be there, serving this thread (http://www.insidehoops.com/forum/showthread.php?t=211924)

[Artillery]

Kobe led his team to the lottery and two first round exits until he was gifted an All-NBA big man. Give Lebron someone like prime-Shaq and a coach like PJ and he'd have just as much rings as Kobe.

[Mirjalovic]

Put prime Shaq or Gasol on the Cavs, it would have been a different story.

See what happen to Bosh/Jamison/Old Shaq. I wouldnt guarantee if Gasol play alongside LeBron, Gasol will be good as now.

[Mr. I'm So Rad]

Kobe led his team to the lottery and two first round exits until he was gifted an All-NBA big man. Give Lebron someone like prime-Shaq and a coach like PJ and he'd have just as much rings as Kobe.

Give Kobe someone like prime Pippen, Rodman and a coach like PJ and he'll have just as many rings as Jordan...

See how faulty the logic is?

[Artillery]

Give Kobe someone like prime Pippen, Rodman and a coach like PJ and he'll have just as many rings as Jordan...

See how faulty the logic is?

Butthurt Kobe fan trying to veer the argument into another MJ vs Kobe debate.

No one's talking about Jordan/Kobe because Bryant's numbers are nowhere near being comparable to MJ in the first place. Lebron, though, will continue breaking Kobe's records yet KB fanboys will claim he's a regular season player(despite the fact that he's been carrying bad teams his whole career).

[All Net]

Butthurt Kobe fan trying to veer the argument into another MJ vs Kobe debate.

No one's talking about Jordan/Kobe because Bryant's numbers are nowhere near being comparable to MJ in the first place. Lebron, though, will continue breaking Kobe's records yet KB fanboys will claim he's a regular season player(despite the fact that he's been carrying bad teams his whole career).

And those fans will continue to call him that till he wins something.

Lebron should win some titles but 5 or 6? think It's unlikely. As I said depends how he ages and who he has around him. Same goes for Kobe, if Mitch and Dr Buss keeps improving Kobe may end up with 7 or 8 rings just not as the main man...

Lebron should be winning titles so I don't see how Kobe or Laker fans will be mad. People in L.A have seen freaking 5 titles in 11 years which could be 6 after this year. Hardly anything to be jealous about.

[AJ2k8]

Wade has a bazooka, why Spo no use?:confusedshrug:
Slow reload time, somewhat inaccurate..

[Lebron23]

See what happen to Bosh/Jamison/Old Shaq. I wouldnt guarantee if Gasol play alongside LeBron, Gasol will be good as now.


Lakers have Phil Jackson aka one of the best coaches in the NBA. LeBron is going to win an NBA title in the next few years. Celtics, Lakers, and Spurs are going to decline.

[AJ2k8]

Lakers have Phil Jackson aka one of the best coaches in the NBA. LeBron is going to win an NBA title in the next few years. Celtics, Lakers, and Spurs are going to decline.

No no no, Bulls and Thunder are gonna win titles.. Just ask their fans:D

[Lebron23]

No no no, Bulls and Thunder are gonna win titles.. Just ask their fans:D


They still need to win some playoffs series. I am just kidding. :lol :lol :lol

Heat, Thunder, Bulls, Knicks, Lakers ( with Howard and Bynum), and Clippers are going to be the future of the NBA.

[All Net]

Lakers have Phil Jackson aka one of the best coaches in the NBA. LeBron is going to win an NBA title in the next few years. Celtics, Lakers, and Spurs are going to decline.

Don't expect Lakers to decline anytime soon, they will still be strong for quite a few more years yet. Plus a franchise this big will always bring in fresh talent.

[Nash]

Look, this is how it is. In terms of talent, dominans and being a better player, Lebron is cleary the better basketball player. But when it comes to winning, Kobe is better, for now.

Also, you can't compare championships and winning into all of this. Lebron never had the players Kobe had. But while Lebron lead his scrub players to 2 straight 60+ seasons, Kobe lead his scrub team(04-07) nowhere.

[brwnman]

Look, this is how it is. In terms of talent, dominans and being a better player, Lebron is cleary the better basketball player. But when it comes to winning, Kobe is better, for now.

Also, you can't compare championships and winning into all of this. Lebron never had the players Kobe had. But while Lebron lead his scrub players to 2 straight 60+ seasons, Kobe lead his scrub team(04-07) nowhere.

Lebron had the perfect supporting cast around him last year, he should have won. Perfect combination of offense/defense. He didn't play up to his capabilities, the team didn't play to the best of their abilities. When that happens, the best player on the team shoulders the blame...

[gts]

I think you Kobe homers are ridiculous. LeBron is on a better scoring pace than Bryant, get over it.he was... his pace is lower this year... he's sharing the load with others now like kobe did early in his career...

[crosso√er]

I think you Kobe homers are ridiculous. LeBron is on a better scoring pace than Bryant, get over it.

You just said, you IDIOT.
Kobe played with Shaquille for eight god damn years, obviously his production (especially scoring) is hindered because Shaq demands the ball as well.
It's a two-way street; plus Kobe wasn't even a starter his first two years.

We all saw what a prime Kobe could do on his own without Shaquille, scoring wise. Pretty much have arguably the greatest scoring season in league history. :facepalm

[crosso√er]

They still need to win some playoffs series. I am just kidding. :lol :lol :lol

Heat, Thunder, Bulls, Knicks, Lakers ( with Howard and Bynum), and Clippers are going to be the future of the NBA.

Heat haven't won a playoff series either? :confusedshrug:
You just said LA are going to decline, then a post later you claim they are the future? Come on bro, make up your mind.

[crisoner]

3 as sidekick

And your point?

Does Pippen have 5 as a sidekick as well? Sam thing with Kareem..he has what 5 of them? Ignorant. :facepalm

[crisoner]

he was... his pace is lower this year... he's sharing the load with others now like kobe did early in his career...

THIS

Kobe did not start as a starter and got few minutes early on. Plus he had to play as the second option for a long time. LeBron reaching these marks is expected...kudos to him.

[Nash]

Lebron had the perfect supporting cast around him last year, he should have won. Perfect combination of offense/defense. He didn't play up to his capabilities, the team didn't play to the best of their abilities. When that happens, the best player on the team shoulders the blame...
Thats BS, how good could his cast be if as soon as Lebron leaves they become the worst team in the history of NBA? They are in now shape or form a good cast, the worst scrubs the nba has seen.

[Dresta]

plus why diss kobes first 3 rings, when he was on that team, he helped them win and was a legit 2nd option, just like wade is to lebron, but some nights wade played better just like kobe played better
so if in the future the heat win, wades ring isnt gonna count because he was a sidekick? what about kareems? pippens? jerry wests? why is it only for kobe that his 3 rings "dont count" he was their closer and legit player
Its because Shaq was much better then Kobe during those finals that it doesn't count the same

[crisoner]

Thats BS, how good could his cast be if as soon as Lebron leaves they become the worst team in the history of NBA? They are in now shape or form a good cast, the worst scrubs the nba has seen.

That's because that team was built around LeBron James...they had good pieces around him and as a unit they won. You can't call them scrubs what so ever that team around LeBron had a better record then his current team now. So I guess by your logic LeBron is playing with worse scrubs now you can say.

[pauk]

and in those 7 years lebron scored 17000 points.....

that means he has 7000 points headstart.....

that means in 7 more years (when he will be at kobes age now 32-33) he will have 34.000 points..... when he is 35 he will already be #1 scorer of all time... then he will decline i guess but still padd it to over 40000+ points when its all said and done.....

[crisoner]

Its because Shaq was much better then Kobe during those finals that it doesn't count the same

:facepalm

That makes no sense....

Wade was much better then Shaq in the what 06 Finals less discredit Shaq's ring that year now.

[Nash]

That's because that team was built around LeBron James...they had good pieces around him and as a unit they won. You can't call them scrubs what so ever that team around LeBron had a better record then his current team now. So I guess by your logic LeBron is playing with worse scrubs now you can say.
No, they are scrubs and Lebron lead them to those 60+ season.

Also, no, Lebron is not playing with worse scrubs in Miami. Lebron right now is not the leader of the team, the team has no specific leader cuz the difference now is that Wade and Bosh lead themselves. Back in Cleveland Lebron lead Mo Williams and Anderson Varejao to the wins. And as soon as he left, there was no more W's for the Cavs. What if he had Pau Gasol instead of Antawn Jamison? What if he had a brilliant Bynum instead of a 100 year old Shaq?
The Heat can't completely play a basketball that suits Lebron and not utilize both Wade and Bosh's talents. You can't have two other superstars and force them to play a basketball that suits Lebron. The Heat need to find a game that suits both Lebron, Wade and Bosh and when they end up doing that the Heat will be scary good.

[Eat Like A Bosh]

Not surprised at all.
LeBron's a dominant regular season player and will finish ahead of Kobe and MJ on the all time scoring list when all is said and done.
Barring injury.

[Mr. I'm So Rad]

Butthurt Kobe fan trying to veer the argument into another MJ vs Kobe debate.

No one's talking about Jordan/Kobe because Bryant's numbers are nowhere near being comparable to MJ in the first place. Lebron, though, will continue breaking Kobe's records yet KB fanboys will claim he's a regular season player(despite the fact that he's been carrying bad teams his whole career).

Not trying to turn the argument into Kobe/Jordan just trying to show you how stupid the "give x player this player and this coach" non sense. Anyone would be used in that example.

Who cares if he breaks records? Records are just a testament to hard work and longevity. What every NBA player plays for is to win the ultimate prize in a championship.

And if LeBron's teams were so bad that he literally won every game by himself and was the team, if you replace a Mo Williams with D Wade and a Jamison with Bosh shouldn't that mean the Heat should be damn near undefeated by now? Or maybe LeBron didn't carry that team as much as we thought.

[Ne 1]

3 as sidekick

He put up 21/5/4, 29/7/6 and 27/6/5 in the playoffs during the 3-peat.

What a dispensable side-kick....:rolleyes:

[Indian guy]

Lebron had the perfect supporting cast around him last year

:oldlol:

Who knew LeBron's "perfect supporting cast" featured 'Mo Williams as his 2nd best player, a starting front line of Shaq/Hickson and Mike Brown as his head coach. So perfect that they can't even win 20 games without him.

[Mr. Jabbar]

Don't compare pears with apples. Lebron is a stat whore wannabe winner with low iq. In the other hand, Kobe is a 5 time nba champion proven winner, last of a competitive dying breed, GOAT of his decade.

Who the F cares about his "scoring pace".

[Mr. I'm So Rad]

He put up 21/5/4, 29/7/6 and 27/6/5 in the playoffs during the 3-peat.

What a dispensable side-kick....:rolleyes:

I know right? I'd rather have Chris Quinn on those teams :oldlol:

They would have 5 straight titles with Quinn instead of Bryant :rolleyes:

Kobe never did ANYTHING to contribute to ANY championship right? Shaq did EVERYTHING and Kobe just rode the bench right? :rolleyes:

[kaiiu]

Out of the 17,000 how many were layupa,dunks and free throws for Lebrick. How many should have been travels or charges :hammerhead:

[ukplayer4]

heres the difference between kobe and lebron fans in a nutshell

- Kobe fans will make excuses as to why kobe hasnt done enough to be GOAT

- Lebron fans will make excuses as to why lebron hasnt done anything


/thread



this is your best post ever

[amfirst]

It's funny haters say Kobe couldn't do it with Shaq. So what will they use if Wade, LeBron or Bosh gets a ring. LeBron couldn't do it without Wade and Bosh?

[Mr. I'm So Rad]

It's funny haters say Kobe couldn't do it with Shaq. So what will they use if Wade, LeBron or Bosh gets a ring. LeBron couldn't do it without Wade and Bosh?

Nope they'll say he carried them too :hammerhead:

[ginobli2311]

this is your best post ever

nothing? really?

turning a 17 win team into a finals team in 4 years without having a decent 2nd player is nothing?

i think you guys live in fantasy land. come back to reality please. given his circumstances, and honestly don't know how much more Lebron could have done for his first 7 years.

the next 7 are yet to be written.

but if anyone is actually going to use anything from his first 7 against him then we can't have a legit conversation anyway.

[PurpleChuck]

Nope they'll say he carried them too :hammerhead:
:no:

Uh-uh, Wade is doing the carrying.:pimp:

[AlphaWolf24]

heres the difference between kobe and lebron fans in a nutshell

- Kobe fans will make excuses as to why kobe hasnt done enough to be GOAT

- Lebron fans will make excuses as to why lebron hasnt done anything


/thread

http://images4.fanpop.com/image/user_images/2173000/AlphaWolf-2173987_203_254.jpg

[gts]

Thats BS, how good could his cast be if as soon as Lebron leaves they become the worst team in the history of NBA? They are in now shape or form a good cast, the worst scrubs the nba has seen.you're another poster stuck in the twilight zone between reality and perception to further your agenda

you purposely dismiss the massive changes the cavs underwent this offseason besides lebron leaving and the effect it had on the team... but as long as you beat that "Lebron leaves they become the worst team in the history of NBA" drum you think you're making valuable contribution to the thread

[LMFAO]

And hes only 10K points behind him? Thats pretty amazing.
if the object of the game was to score points only then tada he is a great player. But no, the object it to win the game hello. Where is Herm when you need him?

[Colby Brian]

Its because Shaq was much better then Kobe during those finals that it doesn't count the same

:facepalm

reread that and see how ridiculous that sounds

kobe haters:facepalm

[Colby Brian]

kobe put up 21/5/4, 29/7/6 and 27/6/5 in the playoffs during the 3-peat.

no but those rings dont count....

[Optimus Prime]

The only stat that matters...

http://images.mirror.co.uk/upl/m4/jun2010/5/5/kobe-bryant-pic-getty-458428273.jpg

[dillondavis]

Let's see how far kobe has come along17 years old
Gets drafted into the nba onto a playoff contending team,
Rides bench for a few years, throws up a few air balls in utah,
Over comes that a few later becomes "secod fiddle" at the age of 20
To one of the most dominating forces in nba history wins 3 rings by the time he is 22, then 04 comes around flakes in detroit tests free agent waters "runs shaq out of la" gets injured misses the playoffs,gets phil to come back
Takes kwame brown, smush parker and chris mihm to a game 7 first round exit (in which they was a rebound away from winning) threatens to leave unless a team gets built that happens he wins brings 2 titles back to la
Climbs the scoring ranks to 6th and atill gets no respect

What im saying is hes over come so much adversity and is still on top
Haters gonna hate

[Christofire]

I think you Kobe homers are ridiculous. LeBron is on a better scoring pace than Bryant, get over it.

And durant is on a better scoring pace than Lebron What the hell is your point

[Christofire]

And durant is on a better scoring pace than Lebron What the hell is your point

Come playoff time You idiots will really see who the sidekick is on Miami when the Ball is in wade's hand to close games. The Nba is a closers league

[Lebron23]

I smell a rocketsgreateness sock account.

[bbms]

Kobe had Phil Jackson, Shaq and Gasol.
LeBron had no one until now.

And Gasol + Phil > Wade + Bosh + Spo. IMO. Not talking about role players around.

I think LeBron is only behind of Jordan, Kareem and Shaq talent-wise. But I think Kobe will have a better carreer because of his superior work ethic and ability to fit a team. LeBron turns everyone around him into shooters, so I think it'll take him some time until he learns how to play with Wade.

[Monkey D Dragon]

:facepalm

lebron has a prime wade and bosh, lets see whats gonna happen
wade>>gasol, wade+bosh>>>>>>>>>gasol
lebron has 2 players in the top 10, kobes older now and has 1 top 10 player, gasol

Bosh Top 10?
Gasol Top 10? When?

[Bandito]

Come playoff time You idiots will really see who the sidekick is on Miami when the Ball is in wade's hand to close games. The Nba is a closers league
Why did you quote yourself?:facepalm

[Bandito]

Thats Bosh's problem, not LeBron's. And Shaq is definitely not going to turn into a Bosh thats for sure.
The Lebron would cruise to a championship with Shaq? Hell no. He's too much of a Me-Stats whore player to let Shaq have all the glory.

Lol @ you if you think Bosh let himself be a spot up shooter. It is Lebron's job to pass him to Bosh. It is not Bosh's job to ask for the ball for a post move for christ's sakes. Last year he was averaging 25 points, he has sacrificed a LOT to be in this team. Get over it or die do whatever you want :lol

[Monkey D Dragon]

I love how LeBron coccck riders think LeBron had no team. LOL

Think Idiots if you do follow the league LeBron had all the support from Cavs franchise from ins and outs. Cavs spent their pride money and even their balls for LeBron. They did whatever it took to build around LeBron by spending madd money and trading so they could keep his Gorilla asss happy.

You fools need to understand LeBron might be a fucccking Beast but he is not a easy TYPE of player to BUILD AROUND. So Dont be crying he had no help because he got all the fucccking support. One thing I can back up LeBron for not winning or even getting back to the finals is due to terrible coaching job. Not the Fans Not Cleveland Maybe little bit of LeBron but ultimately it was all FUCCCKED UP Job by the coaching crew.

LeBron will Break all the scoring records for the youngest player from Kobe but that record will be broken by Mr.Durant so it dont even matter.

[Bandito]

here is one analogy on lebron not wanting to post up so much....
lets say you have a .50 cal Sniper and a Bow with a Arrow... an elephant is running towards u to kill u.... would you use the Sniper or the Bow/Arrow?
u use the SNIPER right?? why play around with the Bow & Arrow and give the Elephant a chanse to kill you when you can finish it of quickly with the Sniper???
now all of the sudden u are criticised for not being skilled with Bow & Arrow..... but u are... u just have another weapon which nobody else has which gets the job done much more easier and more efficient than anybody could with a Bow & Arrow no matter how skilled they was with the Bow & Arrow!!
get it? :D
Good analogy, I am pretty surprised you're not an idiot.:lol

You troll so much that I wasn't sure anymore.

[Blue&Orange]

while kobe came into a playoff contending team, with shaq as the first option
it wasnt kobes team until 2004, kobe wasnt a starter until his 3rd year, while lebron got 40 mpg as a rookie compared to 15.5 for kobe
poor Kobe. That's what you get when u go ring chasing at 18 years old by refusing to play for any other NBA team. Somebody should have told him, he could have a lot more points now.

[Nash]

I love how LeBron coccck riders think LeBron had no team. LOL

Think Idiots if you do follow the league LeBron had all the support from Cavs franchise from ins and outs. Cavs spent their pride money and even their balls for LeBron. They did whatever it took to build around LeBron by spending madd money and trading so they could keep his Gorilla asss happy.

You fools need to understand LeBron might be a fucccking Beast but he is not a easy TYPE of player to BUILD AROUND. So Dont be crying he had no help because he got all the fucccking support. One thing I can back up LeBron for not winning or even getting back to the finals is due to terrible coaching job. Not the Fans Not Cleveland Maybe little bit of LeBron but ultimately it was all FUCCCKED UP Job by the coaching crew.

LeBron will Break all the scoring records for the youngest player from Kobe but that record will be broken by Mr.Durant so it dont even matter.Yeah right, they worked so hard for Lebron that they managed to get him Mo Williams and Antawn Jamison as the second choice. His supporting cast was crap, so bad that they showed their true colors without Lebron by becoming the worst team in the leagues H I S T O R Y, now any players whos involved in a team that is considered the worst team in history is absolute piece of sh*t. If Kobe left Lakers, you think Lakers would have been the worst team in the league?

Why are you so mad?

[whoartthou]

He put up 21/5/4, 29/7/6 and 27/6/5 in the playoffs during the 3-peat.

What a dispensable side-kick....:rolleyes:

Prime t-mac, VC, probably even allen iverson would have won chips in that role.

Hell prime pierce and ray allen with shaq = winning atleast 2 chips.

[whoartthou]

Don't compare pears with apples. Lebron is a stat whore wannabe winner with low iq. In the other hand, Kobe is a 5 time nba champion proven winner, last of a competitive dying breed, GOAT of his decade.

Who the F cares about his "scoring pace".

I don't think those are wise words to use when having kobe in your comparison.. :lol :lol :lol :lol

[G-Funk]

Ne ring Lebron wins from here on out will be as the 2nd best player

[RazorBaLade]

Prime t-mac, VC, probably even allen iverson would have won chips in that role.

Hell prime pierce and ray allen with shaq = winning atleast 2 chips.

tmac and vc couldnt do those things in the clutch tho. and duncan could have replaced shaq 4 some rings...

[G-Funk]

Prime t-mac, VC, probably even allen iverson would have won chips in that role.

Hell prime pierce and ray allen with shaq = winning atleast 2 chips.
:oldlol: yup cause they were great defenders!

[lebob23]

UUUUUUHHHHHHHHH :facepalm

[EnoughSaid]

:oldlol: yup cause they were great defenders!

Ray Allen is a great defender. What are you talking about?

[Eat Like A Bosh]

Kobe had Phil Jackson, Shaq and Gasol.
LeBron had no one until now.

And Gasol + Phil > Wade + Bosh + Spo. IMO. Not talking about role players around.

I think LeBron is only behind of Jordan, Kareem and Shaq talent-wise. But I think Kobe will have a better carreer because of his superior work ethic and ability to fit a team. LeBron turns everyone around him into shooters, so I think it'll take him some time until he learns how to play with Wade.
:oldlol:

Btw, Wade+Bosh > Gasol , but Phil > Spo

[Eat Like A Bosh]

Pointless thread.
So what? LeBron will break the youngest records by Kobe. Durant then breaks LeBron's youngest record.
http://img535.imageshack.us/img535/4205/trolldetected.png

[Monkey D Dragon]

Yeah right, they worked so hard for Lebron that they managed to get him Mo Williams and Antawn Jamison as the second choice. His supporting cast was crap, so bad that they showed their true colors without Lebron by becoming the worst team in the leagues H I S T O R Y, now any players whos involved in a team that is considered the worst team in history is absolute piece of sh*t. If Kobe left Lakers, you think Lakers would have been the worst team in the league?

Why are you so mad?


Another proven loser right here folks.

Funny how kids like to step up with no ammo's these days. Look here kid, not sure how long u been following NBA but you cant always have 3-4 superstars in a team especially in a small market Franchise. The Funny thing is when they did bring in Mo he was playing great and when they brought Antwan he was playing great and other etc players they brought over the past all played great till they got to Cleveland to play with LBJ hmmmm is there a trend here? On top of that they brought in so many players to put around LeBron they never thought about the future and LeBron had no other potential players to grow with that is why Cavs failed and LeBron dipped out on them because he knows they are all old and no one wants to come to Cleveland and play with him. So where the fuccck are you getting this from Cavs didnt try to bring anyone in?

Bottom Line Cavs did there best to bring ppl in and LeBron failed to carry that team and as the Best fuccking player of the team LeBron will be blamed for the bad times and be praised for the good times and it will be like this till he retires.

Also Cavs are not just doing bad because LeBron left u idiot. Of course thats given but they are doing worst then expected because of a lot of injuries and spending big bucks on player like Verjao who only plays well around LeBron which becomes useless. There is so many intangibles that you dont even see since you have a virgin eye for the league.

[lebob23]

I will break them :wtf:

[Monkey D Dragon]

Kobe had Phil Jackson, Shaq and Gasol.
LeBron had no one until now.

And Gasol + Phil > Wade + Bosh + Spo. IMO. Not talking about role players around.

I think LeBron is only behind of Jordan, Kareem and Shaq talent-wise. But I think Kobe will have a better carreer because of his superior work ethic and ability to fit a team. LeBron turns everyone around him into shooters, so I think it'll take him some time until he learns how to play with Wade.


LOL

Why are LeBron fans so retarded? YOU HAVE D- Wade It should not matter who else you have in ur fucccking team. LeBron Wade Kobe Best players in the league and you have TWO of them. WTF ELSE DO YOU NEED TO WIN A FUCCCKING RING? Ya want LeBron to be Spoon fed to a Ring? Fucccking Bunch of retards

Even Bosh owns Gasol 1vs1 time to time and the gap is not even that wide and ya have the Balls to say Gasol is better then Wade :facepalm

[G-Funk]

Ray Allen is a great defender. What are you talking about?
id like to see him score 3pts and be the same defender Kobe was...Ray became a nice defender when he had to do much less with the Celtics... I would like to also see him create his own shot in the crunch time...

[Dresta]

kobe put up 21/5/4, 29/7/6 and 27/6/5 in the playoffs during the 3-peat.

no but those rings dont count....
They count as rings, but not as leading your team to a championship, just because the guy that was, was on a different level. Sorry but its true.

[LilBTheBasedGod]

I'm 12 years old, and what is the NBA?

[whoartthou]

:oldlol: yup cause they were great defenders!

? Are you inferring that kobe is a great defender? Let me guess, his all-team defense nba selections? :roll: :roll:

VC/TMAC/ALLEN can easily replace kobes role. Hell, kobe barely plays defense in the new laker teams (gasol onwards), and they win chips.

[whoartthou]

Ne ring Lebron wins from here on out will be as the 2nd best player

and you know this how? Can you predict the future?

[DixieNourmous]

I think you Kobe homers are ridiculous. LeBron is on a better scoring pace than Bryant, get over it.

Lebron nut huggers are so jealous of Kobe it is laughable.

James is like a Vince carter,, great young, but accomplished really nothing. You will fade from you favorite nut sack just as Carters did.

Real talk

[pauk]

this is funny.... because if lebron really was as scoring minded as DURANT or KOBE taking as many shots as KOBE used to take and average that low assists he would have averaged around 40 ppg every season........ considering he was and still is wasting possessions on being a pointforward facilitating... he averaged up to 9 assists a game with 30 ppg..... and for the career is 28 ppg with 7 APG..... think about that.... thats alot of possessions where he could instead used to take shots himself instead of passing..........................

despite that he still is in the best scoring pace in NBA history.... :oldlol:
this dude is good

[LMFAO]

Lebron nut huggers are so jealous of Kobe it is laughable.

James is like a Vince carter,, great young, but accomplished really nothing. You will fade from you favorite nut sack just as Carters did.

Real talk
agreed and Kobe manmeatgagers want to suck Kobe's dick so bad its pathetic.

[White Mamba]

And hes only 10K points behind him? Thats pretty amazing.

thats make sense since kobe wasn't even a starter on the lakers first two seasons.

[Bandito]

this is funny.... because if lebron really was as scoring minded as DURANT or KOBE taking as many shots as KOBE used to take and average that low assists he would have averaged around 40 ppg every season........ considering he was and still is wasting possessions on being a pointforward facilitating... he averaged up to 9 assists a game with 30 ppg..... and for the career is 28 ppg with 7 APG..... think about that.... thats alot of possessions where he could instead used to take shots himself instead of passing..........................

despite that he still is in the best scoring pace in NBA history.... :oldlol:
this dude is good
Dude he is as scoring minded as Kobe both are averaging about the same FG attempts in each of their seasons. You better take Lebron's nuts off your face and see the games.
Also he only passes when the other guy is wide open, he kills ball movement with his ballhogging and all I see whenever I see him play is he running down the shot clock.

[ginobli2311]

people in the future will look back at lebron's first 7 years as a positive not a negative.

it will be funny. they'll use his 07 trip to the finals properly. they'll use back to back mvps and his level of play those 2 years as positives. they'll use his series against the magic in a positive way.

if you compared the first 8 years of kobe's career to the first 8 of lebron's its not even close. lebron has been significantly better as a player.

does anyone here really think Lebron and prime Shaq for the last 8 years wouldn't have won more than 3 titles? LOL

[Papaya Petee]

Lol how did a person making a statement turn into 25 Kobe homers coming in here and arguing?

[knickscity]

Lol how did a person making a statement turn into 25 Kobe homers coming in here and arguing?
Look at the thread title.

[Nick Young]

he's also 5 rings behind him:lol

[CanadaBBallFan]

he's also 5 rings behind him:lol

5 rings = team accomplishment...so yeah Kobe was on some good teams.

LeBron = WAY better player than Kobe...not even close really.

[dynasty1978]

I expect so much more from Lebron to be frank. For being the "chosen one" he should've been able to at least replicate the success of the other greats.

Jordan won it all in year 7.
Duncan led his team to a ring in his 2nd year.
Shaq did it in his 8th.
Kobe won as option 2 in his 4th year, as option 1 within 5 years. Once he was given a legit #2, he managed to get his team to the finals w/about a half season of chemistry.


Lebron in Cleveland had the complementary pieces for his talent and ability (which is basically the iso offense at the top of the key, which he continues to runs in Miami). Last year, his apologists and homers claimed that w/Shaq and Jamison, that there were no more excuses (74-8 was it?) and here we are...still w/the same tired excuses.


Now in Miami, he's given a 20-10 player and a top 3 player. No more excuses, at least get this team to the finals in year 8. Of course when that doesn't happen, we'll have to hear that "it takes time"....of course it does :violin:



Lebron is better than Kobe now (would hope given the stages of their career). At their best, Kobe > Lebron, not even close.

[Mr. I'm So Rad]

5 rings = team accomplishment...so yeah Kobe was on some good teams.

LeBron = WAY better player than Kobe...not even close really.

http://i218.photobucket.com/albums/cc185/Strikeninja95/images-2.jpg

[Mr. I'm So Rad]

people in the future will look back at lebron's first 7 years as a positive not a negative.

it will be funny. they'll use his 07 trip to the finals properly. they'll use back to back mvps and his level of play those 2 years as positives. they'll use his series against the magic in a positive way.

if you compared the first 8 years of kobe's career to the first 8 of lebron's its not even close. lebron has been significantly better as a player.

does anyone here really think Lebron and prime Shaq for the last 8 years wouldn't have won more than 3 titles? LOL

LeBron in triangle = fail

Besides, three titles is a lot lol. You all act like Kobe and Shaq never won anything

[ginobli2311]

LeBron in triangle = fail

Besides, three titles is a lot lol. You all act like Kobe and Shaq never won anything

maybe they wouldn't run the triangle with lebron. just a thought. LOL

i didn't say it wasn't a lot, i said that lebron and shaq would have won more because Lebron quickly became an elite player. kobe took a while to develop.

i think lebron and shaq would have won 5 titles minimum in 8 years playing together.

and before i hear the "clutch" argument. Lebron has actually been really clutch in the playoffs and has already made 5 playoff game winners. kobe only has 6 for his entire career.

the simple fact remains that Lebron as a player has been better than kobe if you compared the first 8 years of their careers.

[All Net]

maybe they wouldn't run the triangle with lebron. just a thought. LOL

i didn't say it wasn't a lot, i said that lebron and shaq would have won more because Lebron quickly became an elite player. kobe took a while to develop.

i think lebron and shaq would have won 5 titles minimum in 8 years playing together.

and before i hear the "clutch" argument. Lebron has actually been really clutch in the playoffs and has already made 5 playoff game winners. kobe only has 6 for his entire career.

the simple fact remains that Lebron as a player has been better than kobe if you compared the first 8 years of their careers.

Stats wise he has, he is a more rounded player who has the ball in his hands pretty much all the time throughout his career. I could see him and Shaq bumping heads just as much. Touches is something Shaq has always moaned about and anybody taking away his limelight is something that didn't impress him.

[magnax1]

maybe they wouldn't run the triangle with lebron. just a thought. LOL

i didn't say it wasn't a lot, i said that lebron and shaq would have won more because Lebron quickly became an elite player. kobe took a while to develop.

i think lebron and shaq would have won 5 titles minimum in 8 years playing together.

and before i hear the "clutch" argument. Lebron has actually been really clutch in the playoffs and has already made 5 playoff game winners. kobe only has 6 for his entire career.

the simple fact remains that Lebron as a player has been better than kobe if you compared the first 8 years of their careers.
I sort of doubt they win 5. Say he comes in 97, they obviously don't win then against the 69 win Bulls when Lebron wasn't even really an all star yet. 98 He becomes a top 5 player in the league, and if he takes a massive drop in his scoring role, maybe he could win it, however Lebron just doesn't fit as a second option. There is a reason Dwyane is the one that's coming off the screens all the time, Lebron is just useless without the ball in his hands. Not exactly what you want in your second option.

[All Net]

people in the future will look back at lebron's first 7 years as a positive not a negative.

it will be funny. they'll use his 07 trip to the finals properly. they'll use back to back mvps and his level of play those 2 years as positives. they'll use his series against the magic in a positive way.

if you compared the first 8 years of kobe's career to the first 8 of lebron's its not even close. lebron has been significantly better as a player.

does anyone here really think Lebron and prime Shaq for the last 8 years wouldn't have won more than 3 titles? LOL

Only if he wins

If he doesn't people will consider him a stats king and a career loser and not a true winner. Just the way sports fans are.

[ginobli2311]

Only if he wins

If he doesn't people will consider him a stats king and a career loser and not a true winner. Just the way sports fans are.

totally agree.

but to what extent? malone and barkley are often listed in the top 17 all time. Lebron will end up higher than them all time for sure unless something drastically changes.

thats my point. and that is why titles often are over-rated. how does winning a title in the future change the past? i totally agree with what you say, but i think that is my point.

i dealt with this exact same stuff with jordan for his first 6 years. all anyone said was "stat whore" "ball hog" "can't win playing his style"

literally all the same stuff said about lebron. what was holding jordan back? it was his team strength. we don't know the future, but so many people are going to look stupid yet again if he wins some titles. just like all the morons did that hated endlessly on jordan (the greatest athlete of all time according to many)

i'm saying that lebron's level of play has not been the problem so far. maybe it will be in the future. but nobody can ever convince me that lebron was not easily the best player in 09....put him on a great team and they destroy everyone.

[SSSTRESSS]

He's also 1 sidekick period behind him.

Lebron is a SIDEKICK.

[MayCeltics]

totally agree.

but to what extent? malone and barkley are often listed in the top 17 all time. Lebron will end up higher than them all time for sure unless something drastically changes.

thats my point. and that is why titles often are over-rated. how does winning a title in the future change the past? i totally agree with what you say, but i think that is my point.

i dealt with this exact same stuff with jordan for his first 6 years. all anyone said was "stat whore" "ball hog" "can't win playing his style"

literally all the same stuff said about lebron. what was holding jordan back? it was his team strength. we don't know the future, but so many people are going to look stupid yet again if he wins some titles. just like all the morons did that hated endlessly on jordan (the greatest athlete of all time according to many)

i'm saying that lebron's level of play has not been the problem so far. maybe it will be in the future. but nobody can ever convince me that lebron was not easily the best player in 09....put him on a great team and they destroy everyone.

Is there a doubt Lebron will win few more MVP's, Crush every stat, and grab couple larry o'brien trophy before its set and done?

[PrimeJohnnyDepp]

Lebron is a grunt, no finesse and a non-threat to anybody. He has to meditate a bit and catch small fishes with hands in pool, or eat chinese with sticks.

[Nero Tulip]

This thread was always going to be great ^^

How about a Kobe and Lebron sub forum?

[The Iron Fist]

this is funny.... because if lebron really was as scoring minded as DURANT or KOBE taking as many shots as KOBE used to take and average that low assists he would have averaged around 40 ppg every season........ considering he was and still is wasting possessions on being a pointforward facilitating... he averaged up to 9 assists a game with 30 ppg..... and for the career is 28 ppg with 7 APG..... think about that.... thats alot of possessions where he could instead used to take shots himself instead of passing..........................

despite that he still is in the best scoring pace in NBA history.... :oldlol:
this dude is good


Field goals attempted per game

Kobe Bryant 19.3
Lebron James 20.6

[Mr. I'm So Rad]

maybe they wouldn't run the triangle with lebron. just a thought. LOL

i didn't say it wasn't a lot, i said that lebron and shaq would have won more because Lebron quickly became an elite player. kobe took a while to develop.

i think lebron and shaq would have won 5 titles minimum in 8 years playing together.

and before i hear the "clutch" argument. Lebron has actually been really clutch in the playoffs and has already made 5 playoff game winners. kobe only has 6 for his entire career.

the simple fact remains that Lebron as a player has been better than kobe if you compared the first 8 years of their careers.

Yeah they wouldn't, but LeBron iso ball wouldn't be more successful I don't think. I get what you are saying, that LeBron is a great player and putting him with another great player in Shaq would result in a lot of titles. But I don't think it is as simple as that. LeBron is much more ball dominant than Kobe and that would take away from Shaq's game. When LeBron would throw the ball down to Shaq, he would just stop and do nothing else. He can't catch and shoot and is not a reliable jump shooter anyway. Shaq clogging the lane for him would be more of a disadvantage in my opinion.

Of course it's all just speculation as we would never know for sure.

[ProfessorMurder]

lebron came on a cavs team that had nobody, so lebron was number 1 option from the get go

while kobe came into a playoff contending team, with shaq as the first option
it wasnt kobes team until 2004, kobe wasnt a starter until his 3rd year, while lebron got 40 mpg as a rookie compared to 15.5 for kobe

but kobe has way more 60,50,40 point games than lebron and would never top offensivly what bryant did in 05-06 and 06-07 seasons

Took until the 4th post to get a Kobe was a bench player excuse...

[DixieNourmous]

I remember threads like this about Vince Carter someday being better than MJ.

That didnt work out either :oldlol:

[The Iron Fist]

Is there a doubt Lebron will win few more MVP's, Crush every stat, and grab couple larry o'brien trophy before its set and done?
yes!

[AlphaWolf24]

totally agree.

but to what extent? malone and barkley are often listed in the top 17 all time. Lebron will end up higher than them all time for sure unless something drastically changes.

thats my point. and that is why titles often are over-rated. how does winning a title in the future change the past? i totally agree with what you say, but i think that is my point.

i dealt with this exact same stuff with jordan for his first 6 years. all anyone said was "stat whore" "ball hog" "can't win playing his style"

literally all the same stuff said about lebron. what was holding jordan back? it was his team strength. we don't know the future, but so many people are going to look stupid yet again if he wins some titles. just like all the morons did that hated endlessly on jordan (the greatest athlete of all time according to many)

i'm saying that lebron's level of play has not been the problem so far. maybe it will be in the future. but nobody can ever convince me that lebron was not easily the best player in 09....put him on a great team and they destroy everyone.




must of been your brother?:confusedshrug:





next

[talkingconch]

Put prime Shaq or Gasol on the Cavs, it would have been a different story.

Um, this is like saying put player X around player Y and it would have been a different story

How stupid can you get?

I can say that about any player with no ring

[AlphaWolf24]

people in the future will look back at lebron's first 7 years as a positive not a negative.

it will be funny. they'll use his 07 trip to the finals properly. they'll use back to back mvps and his level of play those 2 years as positives. they'll use his series against the magic in a positive way.

if you compared the first 8 years of kobe's career to the first 8 of lebron's its not even close. lebron has been significantly better as a player.

does anyone here really think Lebron and prime Shaq for the last 8 years wouldn't have won more than 3 titles? LOL


:roll: ...yeah...Shaq needed a player with Brass ****z to step up and be the Man in the 4th...


LBJ + Shaq = 10' Cavs X8..lawl



you and your Brothers keep it up....this fun YAY!

[knightfall88]

perhaps Stern will let Lebron trade in his triple doubles for some rings.

[with malice]

Put prime Shaq or Gasol on the Cavs, it would have been a different story.
Can someone translate for me? All I can see is "Waaaaaaaaaaaaaaah!"...