Kobe fans, are you rooting for LeBron to dominate and win Finals MVP? [Archive] - Message Board Basketball Forum

Benji23

06-11-2011, 03:13 AM

I'm really torn on this. I want Dirk, Kidd and Terry to get their rings but this piling on LeBron reminds me so much of the irrational Kobe-bashing. It's really irritating..

I would rather see the Mavs win than Wade ride LeBron's coattails all season and then steal Finals MVP though lol

I honestly think a lot of kobe fans are hoping lebron doesn't dominate and win at all ever. If he does, what are they going to fall back on, more rings = better player?

:roll: :roll:

Indian guy

06-11-2011, 03:14 AM

I'm really torn on this.

Not buying this :oldlol:

I have never seen you do anything but hate on LeBron here.

but this piling on LeBron reminds me so much of the irrational Kobe-bashing.

Kobe hate back in the day were love-fests compared to this.

And no, Kobe fans are NOT rooting for LeBron. They have lived in mortal fear of the guy for half a decade now. Nothing's changed.

thejumpa

06-11-2011, 03:16 AM

Not buying this :oldlol:

I have never seen you do anything but hate on LeBron here.

Kobe hate back in the day were love-fests compared to this.

And no, Kobe fans are NOT rooting for LeBron. They have lived in mortal fear of the guy for half a decade now. Nothing's changed.

Kids do that. I'm a Kobe fan and I'm rooting for LeBron to come through:confusedshrug: Then again, I'm also a LeBron fan:oldlol:

DMAVS41

06-11-2011, 03:16 AM

Kobe fans absolutely want Dirk and the Mavs to win.

They are terrified of Wade and Lebron.

Bill Simmons wrote today that if Wade and the Heat win, it officially opens up the Kobe vs Wade debate.

LOL

We all know who the Kobe fans want to win. Not buying this torn shit for a second.

cotdt

06-11-2011, 03:17 AM

Kobe fan here. I hope Lebron wins the championship one day. In fact, I hope he wins 4 rings. But right now I am cheering for Dallas because Dirk has really paid his dues and deserves a ring. Make no mistake that Lebron is a legendary player though, as he is a hybrid of Jordan and Magic.

konex

06-11-2011, 03:17 AM

I have never seen you do anything but hate on LeBron here.

I've always argued that Kobe is a basketball better player than LeBron but I'm in no way a LeBron hater. Find me a post of me "hating" on Bron (calling out refs for phantom fouls that benefit him doesn't count)

konex

06-11-2011, 03:18 AM

Bill Simmons wrote today that if Wade and the Heat win, it officially opens up the Kobe vs Wade debate.

Not if Bron dominates the last 2 games and wins mvp. Wade is a complete fraud and does not deserve it IMO

DMAVS41

06-11-2011, 03:20 AM

Not if Bron dominates the last 2 games and wins mvp. Wade is a complete fraud and does not deserve it IMO

What?

Wade is a fraud in the finals? I think you have your names mixed up mate. Its Lebron and Kobe that have been frauds in the finals. Wade is on his way to becoming one of the best finals performers of all time if this continues.

konex

06-11-2011, 03:23 AM

What?

Wade is a fraud in the finals? I think you have your names mixed up mate. Its Lebron and Kobe that have been frauds in the finals. Wade is on his way to becoming one of the best finals performers of all time if this continues.

The refs gave it to him in 2006 and he didn't do shit against good D the Bulls series. Then after Bron carries him to the Finals, he starts talking about how he's a leader and been there before cos he's getting off while Mavs are focusing on Bron. He's a FRAUD! :no:

It's especially galling considering his terrible play in the Bulls series and the fact that the media sharks are looking for anything to denigrate LeBron. But Wade did that shit anyways to pump himself up the first chance he had. Despicable...

DMAVS41

06-11-2011, 03:27 AM

The refs gave it to him in 2006 and he didn't do shit against good D the last series. Then after Bron carries him to the Finals, he starts talking about how he's a leader and been there before cos he's getting off while Mavs are focusing on Bron. He's a FRAUD! :no:

So just to be clear. Do you also not count the Lakers title and finals trip in 2002? Can't have it both ways.

Wade had a bad series against Chicago. He got carried by his team. Totally agree.

Very similar to many other all time greats that have won a playoff series not playing great.

I just don't know how you can call Wade a fraud. The guy has been tearing up the league's best teams for 8 years now and has played great so far in 2 trips to the finals.

Hardly a fraud.

konex

06-11-2011, 03:33 AM

I just don't know how you can call Wade a fraud. The guy has been tearing up the league's best teams for 8 years now and has played great so far in 2 trips to the finals.

Hardly a fraud.

Obviously I'm exaggerating a bit but I cannot stand that dude most times. First of all, he's not that good and he is a ****ing flopper.

He's been legit these Finals but 2006 was an abomination and he gets no credit from me for shooting 25fts a game :hammerhead:

Mr. I'm So Rad

06-11-2011, 03:33 AM

Idk, it's not really rooting against LeBron, as I have nothing against him. It's just fun seeing the Heat lose because of all the overreaction and when people make fun of them, LeBron, Wade and Bosh in particular.

I'm not really rooting against LeBron or Wade because I don't fear them "overtaking" Kobe or something. He's already accomplished much more than both of them combined and he's getting older. His time is going to be up anyway. And from a skillset standpoint he is superior than them imo.

It's kinda like I don't care who wins but it would be much more entertaining to see the Heat lose after all of the hype that came before it and the fallout that will wreak havoc on ISH's servers if they do in fact lose.

Rysio

06-11-2011, 03:38 AM

DirkLegend41

06-11-2011, 03:39 AM

Jordan fans don't even want LeBron to win a Championship and Finals MVP.

Ne 1

06-11-2011, 04:05 AM

Kobe fans absolutely want Dirk and the Mavs to win.

Most fans are all rooting for the Mavs to take down the Heat and the 3 Stooges, not just Laker/Kobe fans.

They are terrified of Wade and Lebron.

:roll:

Bill Simmons wrote today that if Wade and the Heat win, it officially opens up the Kobe vs Wade debate.

Wade has no chance at catching Bryant. Not only does Kobe have the better peak/prime, but he also has the edge on Wade in terms of longevity, winning and accolades/accomplishments/records etc. Don't forget Wade is going to be 30 already next season. Kobe is perhaps the most durable guard, in his 15th year and he isn't even done yet.

Kobe still has about 2 more 25/5/5/55% TS/All-NBA 1st or 2nd Team type of seasons left in him.

DMAVS41

06-11-2011, 04:19 AM

Most fans are all rooting for the Mavs to take down the Heat and the 3 Stooges, not just Laker/Kobe fans.

:roll:

Wade has no chance at catching Bryant. Not only does Kobe have the better peak/prime play, but he also has the edge on Wade in terms of longevity, winning and accolades/accomplishments/records etc. Don't forget Wade is going to be 30 already next season.

That would be your opinion mate. Some people rank players differently than you do.

Every person is different and every criteria is different.

Bird is almost always ranked over Kobe all time here. Why? Kobe kills him in longevity and has 2 more rings.

Its not as black and white as you make it.

knightfall88

06-11-2011, 04:29 AM

That would be your opinion mate. Some people rank players differently than you do.

Every person is different and every criteria is different.

Bird is almost always ranked over Kobe all time here. Why? Kobe kills him in longevity and has 2 more rings.

Its not as black and white as you make it.

Our opinions on who is better doesn't really mean much. Fact is, Kobe has taken the 1st team SG/1st team defensive SG over Wade for Wades ENTIRE career (Wade has 2 1st teams and NO 1st defensive teams only and not at Kobes expense as well). Now i'm not discussing who deserves it or who doesn't, the fact remains, Kobe has taken the 1st team SG/defensive SG over Wade for his entire career EVEN during Wades prime while Kobe is on his way out (Wade didn't even get it this year). Now you might not agree but obviously some people do which is why this happened.

And we are not even talking about playoff success here or other individual achievements yet and Wade already doesn't look too good next to Bryant. Wade has a long way to go we can all agree with that, and we all doubt he even get that far playing with lebron.

Ne 1

06-11-2011, 04:35 AM

Every person is different and every criteria is different.

Except there is no logical criteria for ranking Wade over Kobe. Anyone who does has no clue on how to evaluate a players legacy.

DMAVS41

06-11-2011, 04:38 AM

Our opinions on who is better doesn't really mean much. Fact is, Kobe has taken the 1st team SG/1st team defensive SG over Wade for Wades ENTIRE career (Wade has 2 only and not at Kobes expense). Now i'm not discussing who deserves it or who doesn't, the fact remains, Kobe has taken the 1st team SG/defensive SG over Wade for his entire career EVEN during Wades prime while Kobe is on his way out (Wade didn't even get it this year). Now you might not agree but obviously some people do which is why this happened.

And we are not even talking about playoff success here or other individual achievements yet and Wade already doesn't look too good next to Bryant. Wade has a long way to go we can all agree with that, and we all doubt he even get that far playing with lebron.

And I would counter with the fact that Wade's regular season and playoff numbers are superior. FACT.

I'd talk about Wade's superior defensive numbers as well. FACT.

I'd talk about Wade's superior play against the elite defenses in the league in the playoffs. FACT.

I'd talk about Wade outplaying Kobe when put in similar situations in both the playoffs and the Olympics. FACT.

But what does it all mean? It simply means that Wade and Kobe are extremely similar players in terms of overall impact on the game. I don't know how anyone can really dispute the fact that these two guys are close as you can get. They played in the same era against the same teams with similar teams and have had very similar results to date both individually and team wise.

It comes down to personal preference and the criteria people use to rank players.

If a person uses honors/accolades/titles heavily....they will favor Kobe right now.

If a person uses numbers/advanced stats/play against best competition....they will favor Wade right now.

I'm totally cool with either. As long as anyone taking one over the other admits its extremely close.

If a person can't admit that, I think they have too great of a bias to be taken seriously.

ImmortalD24

06-11-2011, 04:39 AM

OP is a gimmick. Lock this up.

Ne 1

06-11-2011, 04:53 AM

And I would counter with the fact that Wade's regular season and playoff numbers are superior.

I'd talk about Wade's superior defensive numbers as well.

I'd talk about Wade's superior play against the elite defenses in the league in the playoffs.

I'd talk about Wade outplaying Kobe when put in similar situations in both the playoffs and the Olympics.

All of this has been refuted before.

It comes down to personal preference and the criteria people use to rank players.

Again there is absolutely no logical criteria for ranking Wade ahead of Kobe on an all-time list. Anyone who does has no clue when it comes to evaluating a players legacy. Unless you use some criteria.

If a person uses honors/accolades/titles heavily....they will favor Kobe right now.

If a person uses numbers/advanced stats/play against best competition....they will favor Wade right now.

I'm totally cool with either. As long as anyone taking one over the other admits its extremely close

Currently Wade is better, but all-time and peak/prime years and number of years as an elite player Kobe is better etc.

DMAVS41

06-11-2011, 05:05 AM

All of this has been refuted before.

Again there is absolutely no logical criteria for ranking Wade ahead of Kobe on an all-time list. Anyone who does has no clue when it comes to evaluating a players legacy. Unless you use some criteria.

Currently Wade is better, but all-time and peak/prime years and number of years as an elite player Kobe is better etc.

It hasn't been refuted. Right now, Wade has better career numbers in both the regular season and playoffs. This is just a fact.

You can't have it both ways. You can't use Kobe coming in out of high school to explain his inferior numbers and then turn around in the same breath and use Wade's longevity against him.

Kobe has played 7 more years than Wade. Of course he has had a better career so far. I have never seen anyone rank Wade over Kobe all time yet.

Nobody will do that even if the Heat win this year and Wade wins finals mvps.

The only thing people have said is that over the last 8 years (since wade has been in the league) they have played at a very similar impact overall.

If Wade fails to win a few titles with Lebron in the coming years....he'll have no business being ranked with Kobe all time. Everyone knows this.

We can only go off what we've seen. This is Wade's 3rd chance at a title....really only his 2nd if we are fair because of his injury in 05. So lets not act like its been remotely a level playing field in chances to win titles so far.

We don't know what will happen. Kobe could come back next year and play great and win a title. Wade could get injured. Wade could play at a high level until he's 35 because of the team he'll have around him.

We don't know.

All I do know is that anyone looking back at the last 8 years for both of these guys with an open mind and without an agenda would readily admit its debatable between the two.

knightfall88

06-11-2011, 05:06 AM

If a person uses honors/accolades/titles heavily....they will favor Kobe right now.

these are what careers are made of. End of story. Examining the period that Wade and Bryant has played, individually and team, Bryant has taken more awards.

If a person uses numbers/advanced stats/play against best competition....they will favor Wade right now.

Don't be blinded by stats, they are meaningless without context, and when we start examining the context, Wade really doesn't have much on Kobe because like I said he doesn't have the honors or titles to backup these so called great 'stats' that you bring up.

If a person can't admit that, I think they have too great of a bias to be taken seriously.

You are talking about all time rankings and for that Wade has a long way to go to catch bryant. It is impossible? no. But he is 30 and he plays with Lebron James now and most likely to the end of his career. So it isn't likely he will catch Bryant.

DMAVS41

06-11-2011, 05:13 AM

these are what careers are made of. End of story. Examining the period that Wade and Bryant has played, individually and team, Bryant has taken more awards.

Don't be blinded by stats, they are meaningless without context, and when we start examining the context, Wade really doesn't have much on Kobe because like I said he doesn't have the honors or titles to backup these so called great 'stats' that you bring up.

You are talking about all time rankings and for that Wade has a long way to go to catch bryant. It is impossible? no. But he is 30 and he plays with Lebron James now and most likely to the end of his career. So it isn't likely he will catch Bryant.

I'm sorry, but I could not disagree more. Its the awards and honors that need context. Not the stats.

You want to use those because they favor Kobe. That is fine. I prefer data instead of opinion. Especially when that opinion has no basis in reality at times. What are the legit reasons for ranking Kobe over Wade defensively right now?

I keep hearing every single person admit that Wade is better right now. Yet if you went by your standards, Kobe is the superior overall player and defender right now. I feel that is a terrible conclusion.

So what if Wade is 30? He's had 8 great years with some of the best numbers of all time and a title and finals mvp with one of the best finals performances of all time. And oh yea, he's playing great again on the biggest basketball stage in the world.

You have to adjust for circumstances at least a little. You can't compare Wade and Kobe based on the same standards. Kobe had the great fortune to play with prime shaq for 8 years and then loaded rosters the last few years.

This will be Wade's 3rd team in his career that was capable of winning a title. And one of those teams, in 05, was derailed by an injury to Wade leading the ECF.

Which is exactly why you have to be open to others views. If you want to go by your standard....I'm totally cool with it. Doesn't mean I have to go by it though. I prefer more tangible things.

knightfall88

06-11-2011, 05:24 AM

I'm sorry, but I could not disagree more. Its the awards and honors that need context. Not the stats.

OK lets examine Kobe and Wades awards and you try to justify them. You love to bring up Kobes stack teams and I'll try to not find anything that makes you bring this up.

Kobe has 9 x All NBA First teams.
Wade has 2 x All NBA First teams.
Individual award can't get anymore black and white than this.

Kobe has 9 x All defensive 1st teams.
Wade has none.
Individual award can't get anymore black and white than this.

Kobe has 2 Scoring titles
Wade has 1.

Me bringing anything else up will make you fall on the "Kobe has stack teams" excuse.

And I bet you will want to bring out Wades final stats - sure great achievement but hey he played in the finals twice and both times against the Dallas Mavericks

And you probably want to bring out Wades stats against the celtics - great achievement but hey he didn't even come close to competing with celtics and they really couldnt care less how much he was going off in that series.

Wades 2006 run - I give him lot of credit for that, but that pales compared to what Kobe has done for 6 or so post seasons.

DMAVS41

06-11-2011, 05:30 AM

DMAVS41

06-11-2011, 05:35 AM

OK lets examine Kobe and Wades awards and you try to justify them. You love to bring up Kobes stack teams and I'll try to not find anything that makes you bring this up.

Kobe has 9 x All NBA First teams.
Wade has 2 x All NBA First teams.
Individual award can't get anymore black and white than this.

Kobe has 9 x All defensive 1st teams.
Wade has none.
Individual award can't get anymore black and white than this.

Kobe has 2 Scoring titles
Wade has 1.

Me bringing anything else up will make you fall on the "Kobe has stack teams" excuse.

And I bet you will want to bring out Wades final stats - sure great achievement but hey he played in the finals twice and both times against the Dallas Mavericks

And you probably want to bring out Wades stats against the celtics - great achievement but hey he didn't even come close to competing with celtics and they really couldnt care less how much he was going off in that series.

Wades 2006 run - I give him lot of credit for that, but that pales compared to what Kobe has done for 6 or so post seasons.

So it means nothing for Wade, but you want to give Kobe credit for playing much worse against the exact same team with more help and having more success solely because of his supporting cast?

What a pathetic double standard.

This is basically what you are saying:

"I don't care if Wade played the Celtics much better. I don't care if Doc and PP said they tried everything to stop Wade and simply couldn't do it. I don't care because Wade didn't win. "

"I do care that Kobe beat the same team....even though Kobe played much worse. I only care about the end result and not the process"

Sorry, I hate that line of thinking.

YAWN

06-11-2011, 05:35 AM

damn dmavs, let the irrational kobe hate go son.. :facepalm

knightfall88

06-11-2011, 05:38 AM

I'll ask you this.

Who do you think was a better overall player this year? Wade or Kobe?

Who do you think was a better defender this year? Wade or Kobe?

What does this have anything to do with all time rankings?

Better career stats and playoff stats? Some more assists? Kobe plays in the triangle. More steals and blocks? doesn't mean anything since he never even gotten a defensive 1st team! Higher FG%? Can't shoot 3s can he? Everything Kobe is better and he has played longer and with more wins!!

DMAVS41

06-11-2011, 05:38 AM

damn dmavs, lets the irrational kobe hate go son.. :facepalm

Irrational Kobe hate?

What?

Its hating on Kobe to say Wade has been his equal the last 8 years?

The only irrational hating going on is people acting like Wade doesn't belong in that conversation. You people have it so backwards its laughable.

I honestly don't know how much more evidence you need.

DMAVS41

06-11-2011, 05:41 AM

What does this have anything to do with all time rankings?

Better career stats and playoff stats? Some more assists? Kobe plays in the triangle. More steals and blocks? doesn't mean anything since he never even gotten a defensive 1st team! Higher FG%? Can't shoot 3s can he? Everything Kobe is better and he has played longer and with more wins!!

It matters because it blows a huge hole in your argument concerning honors.

Kobe got first team all nba and first team all defense this year.

I asked if you think Kobe is better than Wade this year. You won't answer because it diminishes the impact of your argument.

We just view the game differently. I think its a huge positive that Wade doesn't shoot threes. Much like Jordan.

Why on earth would you want a rational person to ignore hard data that you keep just tossing to the side in favor of your honors/accolades standard that is based on opinions and team strength?

It doesn't make sense.

DMAVS41

06-11-2011, 05:51 AM

Lets just take a look at their playoff careers so far for fun:

PPG? Wade
APG? Wade
RPG? Wade
FG%? Wade
eFG%? Wade
TS%? Wade

ORB%? Wade
DRB%? Wade
TRB%? Wade

AST%? Wade
STL%? Wade
BLK%? Wade
TOV%? Kobe

Offensive rating? Tied
Defensive rating? Wade

Defensive win shares average? Wade
Offensive win shares average? Wade
Total win shares average? Wade
Win shares per 48? Wade

PER? Wade

And you honestly want people to just ignore the above?
Ignore the fact that Wade has been better on the biggest stage?
Ignore the fact that Wade has been better against the best defenses?

Come on now. Come back to reality.

Ne 1

06-11-2011, 05:52 AM

Wade has better career numbers in both the regular season and playoffs.

Their career numbers are a wash. Despite almost half of Kobe's prime being during the greatest defensive era of the last 25 years.

You can't use Kobe coming in out of high school to explain his inferior numbers and then turn around in the same breath and use Wade's longevity against him.

Longevity is a huge factor. Will Wade even be in the NBA for 15 years, let alone still be playing at a high level like Kobe is still? The crazy part about that is Kobe isn't even done yet. He probably has 2 more years of being an elite player! Also you don't need to bring up Kobe's numbers because he came out of high school, just compare their numbers Per 48 minutes.

Kobe has played 7 more years than Wade. Of course he has had a better career so far. I have never seen anyone rank Wade over Kobe all time yet.

Alright so let's see what Wade does for the next 7 years before we compare him to Kobe then? :confusedshrug:

Nobody will do that even if the Heat win this year and Wade wins finals mvps.

Nobody should, but you have people who are right now who are caught up in the moment and have this "what have you done for me lately" attitude. Honestly if Wade weren't playing in the Finals this wouldn't even be a discussion.

The only thing people have said is that over the last 8 years (since wade has been in the league) they have played at a very similar impact overall.

Since Wade has entered the league they have been comparable during the years near the end of Kobe's prime.

If Wade fails to win a few titles with Lebron in the coming years....he'll have no business being ranked with Kobe all time. Everyone knows this.

We'll just have to see how it plays out. Wade is already 30 and IMO will be able to play at a high level for maybe 2-3 more years. Even if he does win a few titles with LeBron/Bosh it still isn't a guarantee that means that he has an argument over Kobe.

We can only go off what we've seen.

I agree.

This is Wade's 3rd chance at a title....really only his 2nd if we are fair because of his injury in 05. So lets not act like its been remotely a level playing field in chances to win titles so far.

Actually based on having contending teams around them during their prime seasons, it's not that huge of a diffrence.

Wade could play at a high level until he's 35

I doubt it, he hasn't exactly shown that he has great durability.

Quizno

06-11-2011, 05:52 AM

dude, nobody wants lebron to win. the guy's a ****ing douche bag.

DMAVS41

06-11-2011, 05:58 AM

Their career numbers are a wash. Despite almost half of Kobe's prime being during the greatest defensive era of the last 25 years.

Longevity is a huge factor. Will Wade even be in the NBA for 15 years, let alone still be playing at a high level like Kobe is still? The crazy part about that is Kobe isn't even done yet. He probably has 2 more years of being an elite player! Also you don't need to bring up Kobe's numbers because he came out of high school, just compare their numbers Per 48 minutes.

Alright so let's see what Wade does for the next 7 years before we compare him to Kobe then? :confusedshrug:

Nobody should, but you have people who are right now who are caught up in the moment and have this "what have you done for me lately" attitude. Honestly if Wade weren't playing in the Finals this wouldn't even be a discussion.

Since Wade has entered the league they have been comparable during the years near the end of Kobe's prime.

We'll just have to see how it plays out. Wade is already 30 and IMO will be able to play at a high level for maybe 2-3 more years. Even if he does win a few titles with LeBron/Bosh it still isn't a guarantee that means that he has an argument over Kobe.

I agree.

Actually based on having contending teams around them during their prime seasons, it's not that huge of a diffrence.

I doubt it, he hasn't exactly shown that he has great durability.

So do you rank Kobe over Bird? If longevity plays a huge role, wouldn't you have to rank Kobe higher?

Ne 1

06-11-2011, 06:02 AM

Ne 1

06-11-2011, 06:08 AM

So do you rank Kobe over Bird? If longevity plays a huge role, wouldn't you have to rank Kobe higher?

Relevance? Anyway I never said longevity was the be all end all determining factor, but it is important though when judging players.

DMAVS41

06-11-2011, 06:08 AM

About the only thing that Wade currently does better than Kobe is get to the rim and that's mostly because he's younger and has less miles on his legs. In his prime, Kobe could get to the basket even better than Wade, Kobe was a beast at that when he had the young legs to do it. What will Wade have to fall back on in 3-4 years when his legs are almost gone? He's not nearly as good a shooter as Kobe.

I don't know what Wade will be like in 4 years. I have no idea what relevance that has because you don't know either.

All we can go off of is what we've seen these last 8 years from Wade.

And I'm confused as to why I'm supposed to just concede that Kobe at his peak was better offensively.

Kobe has shot over 48% once in his career for a playoff run.
Wade has shot over 48% 4 times in his career for a playoff run.

They have just been so similar these last 8 years. I just don't see what you see at all.

DMAVS41

06-11-2011, 06:09 AM

Relevance? Anyway I never said longevity was the be all end all determining factor, but it is important though when judging players.

How important?

Is it enough for you to rank Kobe over Bird?

I'm not saying its a non factor at all. I'm trying to understand the value you place on it.

So do you rank Kobe over Bird?

Ne 1

06-11-2011, 06:28 AM

And I'm confused as to why I'm supposed to just concede that Kobe at his peak was better offensively.

Because he clearly was.

Kobe has shot over 48% once in his career for a playoff run.
Wade has shot over 48% 4 times in his career for a playoff run.

Wade has a slightly better % because he's a slasher and mainly gets his points in the paint from dunks and layups.

Ne 1

06-11-2011, 06:39 AM

How important?

I'm not saying its a non factor at all. I'm trying to understand the value you place on it.

It's one of the main factors for judging players, but defiantly isn't the be all end all criteria or anything. It defiantly matters when the magnitude is as significantly great as it is between Kobe and Wade.

Ne 1

06-11-2011, 06:40 AM

Have to leave now. Will sub this thread for later.

Hittin_Shots

06-11-2011, 07:59 AM

Because he clearly was.

Wade has a slightly better % because he's a slasher and mainly gets his points in the paint from dunks and layups.

Didn't you say Kobe got to the the paint easier than wade when he was young? Therefore whats up wid dat?

branslowski

06-11-2011, 09:49 AM

They are terrified of Wade and Lebron.

:roll: :roll: :roll: :roll: :roll:

:oldlol: I love it when NON Kobe fans and known Kobe haters assume this is what ACTUAL Kobe fans are feeling..

From an ACTUAL Kobe fan, most Kobe fans root against LeBron because over the years, most Kobe haters transformed into LeBron fans and bashed Kobe, so it's only normal to want to see a fan of LeBron cry. I mean from personal experience, Bruce Blitz ruined LeBron for me....Now I want LeBron to lose just so fans like him can go on with their summer all butthurt....

But if LeBron wins, good for him...Just f*ck his fans.

5 Rings, 2 finals MVP's, Top 3 All-Time Playoff points, multiple playoff runs that are on par with Wade's best....Wade 2 rings 2 finals MVPs....LeBron 1 ring??? Terrified?....:roll:

Kobe is top 10 All-Time...Legacy already in stone...F*ck is to fear? That more players from this era is moving up All-Time proving that this era has the greater players than weak ass 80's?....lol, right, scared...

Miss me with that BS Kobe haters...

Reporter-"What are 49ers fans thoughts on the past season? I'll ask one"

Rick-"Well, I'm a life long 49ers fan, and my thought is....

Bob-"Whoa, whoa whoa, I'm a Denver Broncos fan, but I hate 49ers, so I think I'm the best fit for this answer..."

Reporter-"Umm, I wanted a 49ers fan thought..."

Bob-"But I know what they are thinking because I hate them."

Rick-"uhh, I'm a 49ers fan, about to give my though, you know, what the reporter asked..."

Bob-"Whatever, what do you think"?

Rick-"I think that we just needed a better QB, and a better secondary...We have the young talent and personal to be a better team, we just need a leader in place."

Bob-"Yeah right, that is not a 49er fan thought, this is what they think, derp derp derp blah, blah"

Reporter-":facepalm "

Rick-":facepalm "

(Bob still thinks he's right, and even though he got multiple thoughts from ACTUAL niners fan, he still believes he knows what ACTUAL niners fans are thinking better than, you know, actual niners fans.)

:facepalm

Yao Ming's Foot

06-11-2011, 10:16 AM

Bill Simmons also claimed that Dirk getting a ring would put him in the conversation with Duncan as the greatest forward of all time after Bird. Duncan > Bird anyway, but that is beside the point which is Bill Simmons is an idiot.

Heat win- LeBron gets a ring as a sidekick and his apologists will prop up its status forcing people to elevate Kobe's sidekick rings with Shaq.

Heat lose- High comedy is guaranteed as his apologists struggle to come up with more and more excuses for the most hyped player in the history of the NBA

Yao Ming's Foot

06-11-2011, 10:21 AM

bleedinpurpleTwo

06-11-2011, 12:05 PM

cheering for Kidd and Dirk to get a ring. They have had great careers and are getting old. May be their last shot.

jrong

06-11-2011, 12:12 PM

The refs gave it to him in 2006 and he didn't do shit against good D the Bulls series. Then after Bron carries him to the Finals, he starts talking about how he's a leader and been there before cos he's getting off while Mavs are focusing on Bron. He's a FRAUD! :no:

It's especially galling considering his terrible play in the Bulls series and the fact that the media sharks are looking for anything to denigrate LeBron. But Wade did that shit anyways to pump himself up the first chance he had. Despicable...

But, Wade stepped up in the clutch to help James in the Bulls series. Where has James been for Wade in the Finals?

Plus, this is the Finals! THIS is where you make your name.

As far as FMVP, that ship has sailed. Right now, he needs to do whatever he has to so to help them win, so that he's not blamed for losing this Finals by posterity. Because he's the #1 culprit if they do.

NoGunzJustSkillz

06-11-2011, 01:01 PM

Jacks3

06-11-2011, 01:31 PM

:roll: :roll: :roll: :roll: :roll:

:oldlol: I love it when NON Kobe fans and known Kobe haters assume this is what ACTUAL Kobe fans are feeling..

From an ACTUAL Kobe fan, most Kobe fans root against LeBron because over the years, most Kobe haters transformed into LeBron fans and bashed Kobe, so it's only normal to want to see a fan of LeBron cry. I mean from personal experience, Bruce Blitz ruined LeBron for me....Now I want LeBron to lose just so fans like him can go on with their summer all butthurt....

But if LeBron wins, good for him...Just f*ck his fans.

5 Rings, 2 finals MVP's, Top 3 All-Time Playoff points, multiple playoff runs that are on par with Wade's best....Wade 2 rings 2 finals MVPs....LeBron 1 ring??? Terrified?....:roll:

Kobe is top 10 All-Time...Legacy already in stone...F*ck is to fear? That more players from this era is moving up All-Time proving that this era has the greater players than weak ass 80's?....lol, right, scared...

Miss me with that BS Kobe haters...

Reporter-"What are 49ers fans thoughts on the past season? I'll ask one"

Rick-"Well, I'm a life long 49ers fan, and my thought is....

Bob-"Whoa, whoa whoa, I'm a Denver Broncos fan, but I hate 49ers, so I think I'm the best fit for this answer..."

Reporter-"Umm, I wanted a 49ers fan thought..."

Bob-"But I know what they are thinking because I hate them."

Rick-"uhh, I'm a 49ers fan, about to give my though, you know, what the reporter asked..."

Bob-"Whatever, what do you think"?

Rick-"I think that we just needed a better QB, and a better secondary...We have the young talent and personal to be a better team, we just need a leader in place."

Bob-"Yeah right, that is not a 49er fan thought, this is what they think, derp derp derp blah, blah"

Reporter-":facepalm "

Rick-":facepalm "

(Bob still thinks he's right, and even though he got multiple thoughts from ACTUAL niners fan, he still believes he knows what ACTUAL niners fans are thinking better than, you know, actual niners fans.)

:facepalm
This. Kobe is one of the top 10 ever. lol @ Wade ever even coming close.

Jacks3

06-11-2011, 01:32 PM

Lucifer

06-11-2011, 01:54 PM

"kobe fans, are you rooting for lebron.."

Stopped right there..

Jimmy2k8

06-11-2011, 02:16 PM

I am not rooting for either team, but I don't want to see Lebron holding the trophy if the Heat win.

rs98762001

06-11-2011, 02:36 PM

And no, Kobe fans are NOT rooting for LeBron. They have lived in mortal fear of the guy for half a decade now. Nothing's changed.
Including the fact that Lebron still doesn't have a single ring to his name.

DMAVS41

06-11-2011, 03:44 PM

Because he clearly was.

Wade has a slightly better % because he's a slasher and mainly gets his points in the paint from dunks and layups.

You just said Kobe was better at getting to the rim and a much better shooter.

So what gives?

And answer the damn question. Do you rank Kobe higher than Bird?

If longevity plays a big role, how big of a role does it play?

Or do you have a "moving" criteria?

seanlakers

06-11-2011, 03:52 PM

I just happen to hate the players on the Mavs less than I hate the players on the Heat.

I mean, come on. Eddie House?

Mavs all day.

kaiiu

06-11-2011, 03:57 PM

Kobe >> both these fraudulent fakes

G-Funk

06-11-2011, 04:03 PM

Assuming the Heat win...

Kobe Bryant last 4 seasons

- 3 Finals appearances
- 2 rings
- 3 MVPs ( 2 Finals)
- 4 1st team all nba
- 4 1st team all nba defensive team

Wade's entire career

- 2 Finals appearances
- 2 rings
- 2 MVPs ( 2 Finals)
- 2 1st team all nba
- 0 1st team all nba defensive team

Oh Shyt!!!

How many games have Wade scored over 50 compared to Kobe?

How many games have Wade scored over 40 compared to Kobe?

How many games have Wade scored over 30 compared to Kobe?

Kobe only comes 3rd or 2nd to Wilt & Jordan when scoring.

How many MVP's does Wade have over Kobe?

Kobe was the better player from ages 17-23?

Kobe was the better player from ages 23-30?

&

Kobe will be the better player from ages 30-37 or when he decides to stop.

Heavincent

06-11-2011, 04:17 PM

Kobe fans absolutely want Dirk and the Mavs to win.

They are terrified of Wade and Lebron.

Why the hell would Kobe fans be terrified of Wade and Lebron? If the Heat win this year, Lebron won't won't anywhere near Kobe in terms of career accomplishments. Kobe's 2010 playoff run >>> Lebron's career in the playoffs.

konex

06-11-2011, 05:11 PM

zay_24

06-11-2011, 05:21 PM

Im the biggest Kobe stan on this planet and im rooting for the heat.

Lebron getting carried to a ring by wade and chalmers= not a threat to kobes legacy:lol

bleedinpurpleTwo

06-11-2011, 05:26 PM

Dizzle-2k7

06-11-2011, 05:27 PM

LOL at Simmons fraud ass..

Dirk will never see Duncan just like Wade will never see Kobe. Its not hating. Just the truth. Im a fan of all LEGENDS anyways I couldnt give a damn but Simmons = FRAUD.

Killer_Instinct

06-11-2011, 05:29 PM

:oldlol: at any hate being thrown towards Lebron at this point being irrational.

DMAVS41

06-11-2011, 05:33 PM

WOW!!
Yao Mings Foot completely pwns DMAVS41

What?

Its hilarious how people continue to want to pretend like a single player is responsible for winning.

You can't have it both ways. It that is the way it is, then you have to give full blame to that player when they lose.

All I know is that yet again Wade is destroying the same team that destroyed Kobe.

A running theme in their respective careers.

Dizzle-2k7

06-11-2011, 05:33 PM

What?

Its hilarious how people continue to want to pretend like a single player is responsible for winning.

You can't have it both ways. It that is the way it is, then you have to give full blame to that player when they lose.

All I know is that yet again Wade is destroying the same team that destroyed Kobe.

A running theme in their respective careers.

When Kobe was Wade's age he dropped 62 on 3 quarters on the Mavs. Theres no doubt Wade is on a level right now that Kobe isnt, however, CAREER TO CAREER, Wade is never touchin Kobe. Thats a fact.

What now, Stan?

DropStep

06-11-2011, 05:35 PM

IMO Bron winning a ring as Wade's ballboy (trust me, this is how it'll be spun if Bron doesn't explode) is more damaging to his legacy than losing to a good Mavs team. At least there is also criticism for Wade, Bosh and Spo if they lose. If they win, the bitter Mavs-backers in the media will spend the summer tearing into LeBron as opposed to celebrating Dirk
They are gonna tear in to Lebron win or lose.
Lebron was a hated player before he went to Miami(Every top player gets hated) he should of realized his only redeeming quality was that he played on the shitty Cavs for 7 years.

Mr. I'm So Rad

06-11-2011, 05:36 PM

What?

Its hilarious how people continue to want to pretend like a single player is responsible for winning.

You can't have it both ways. It that is the way it is, then you have to give full blame to that player when they lose.

All I know is that yet again Wade is destroying the same team that destroyed Kobe.

A running theme in their respective careers.

Well to be fair Kobe has single handedly destoyed the Mavs on multiple occasions. You are right. One player isn't responsible for winning or losing, just pointing out that Kobe has played well against teams Wade has struggled against and vice versa. And Kobe has lit the Mavs up before it's not like they've been owning him his entire career like they did this year.

DMAVS41

06-11-2011, 05:37 PM

When Kobe was Wade's age he dropped 62 on 3 quarters on the Mavs. Theres no doubt Wade is on a level right now that Kobe isnt, however, CAREER TO CAREER, Wade is never touchin Kobe. Thats a fact.

What now, Stan?

That same year Kobe couldn't even average over 30 against a Suns team that played far worse defense than this Mavs team...and also had the softest defensive rules in NBA history.

So how could 06 Kobe kill this current mavs team if he couldn't even kill a much worse suns team with easier rules?

What now, Stan?

Ouch.

bleedinpurpleTwo

06-11-2011, 05:37 PM

What?

Its hilarious how people continue to want to pretend like a single player is responsible for winning.

You can't have it both ways. It that is the way it is, then you have to give full blame to that player when they lose.

All I know is that yet again Wade is destroying the same team that destroyed Kobe.

A running theme in their respective careers.

EVERYONE, let me point out this post above...
first he points out that a single player is not responsible for winning (very true, obviously).
THEN, he goes on to make the very statement he is b!tching about: Wade (a single player) destroying a team.

see the irony? :rolleyes:

DMAVS41

06-11-2011, 05:39 PM

EVERYONE, let me point out this post above...
first he points out that a single player is not responsible for winning (very true, obviously).
THEN, he goes on to make the very statement he is b!tching about: Wade (a single player) destroying a team.

see the irony? :rolleyes:

what?

i'm merely saying Wade is playing better than Kobe. I said nothing of winning/losing.

I said Wade is playing great against this Mavs team while Kobe struggled.

Do you dispute that? Of course not.

Owned again.

Bad time for Kobe stans. Wade once again playing better against the same competition and another clutch stat comes out that makes Kobe look like an idiot.

LOL

Full on panic mode. Love it.

IGOTGAME

06-11-2011, 05:41 PM

what?

i'm merely saying Wade is playing better than Kobe. I said nothing of winning/losing.

I said Wade is playing great against this Mavs team while Kobe struggled.

Do you dispute that? Of course not.

Owned again.

Bad time for Kobe stans. Wade once again playing better against the same competition and another clutch stat comes out that makes Kobe look like an idiot.

LOL

Full on panic mode. Love it.

im so confused. Kobe 15 yeat vet, Wade in prime. Kobe playing after 3 str8 finals appearances and injured ankle, Wade playing after resting at home. Yep...still confused.

Dizzle-2k7

06-11-2011, 05:41 PM

That same year Kobe couldn't even average over 30 against a Suns team that played far worse defense than this Mavs team...and also had the softest defensive rules in NBA history.

So how could 06 Kobe kill this current mavs team if he couldn't even kill a much worse suns team with easier rules?

Wade is seeing 1on1 against the MAVS Team that is focused on shutting down the MVP LEBRON.. You obviously didnt watch the Suns-Lakers because if you did youd know the Suns double-triple teamed Kobe every damn time.

:oldlol:

Fukk outta here, son. I love Wade, but he aint on Kobe's level all time.

YAWN

06-11-2011, 05:43 PM

Do you rank Kobe higher than Bird?

I noticed you keep asking this question but no one answers.

These are the players that most rank above Kobe:
Jordan, Kareem, Russell, Wilt, Magic, Bird; and some still have Shaq & Duncan.

I can sit here and say with certainty. if Kobe retired today and accomplished absolutely nothing else in this league, 5 years from now when an all time list discussion is brought up... Kobe will be ranked above Shaq, Duncan, Magic, and Bird on the overwhelming majority of those lists.

I personally have him at 7 today, but would be willing to bet the house on that previous statement.

The guy has been a star since 1996. Think about where you were in your life in 96 and let that sink in...

5x champion (7 NBA Finals appearances)
2x finals mvp
1x mvp
13x all star
13x all nba
11x all nba defense
#6 on all time scoring list
#3 on all time playoff scoring list

DMAVS41

06-11-2011, 05:43 PM

im so confused. Kobe 15 yeat vet, Wade in prime. Kobe playing after 3 str8 finals appearances and injured ankle, Wade playing after resting at home. Yep...still confused.

So Wade is much better than Kobe now? Funny how people here want to say first team all nba is a good representation of who is better.

Did kobe not make first team all nba?

I'm confused again.

Which one is it?

DMAVS41

06-11-2011, 05:46 PM

I noticed you keep asking this question but no one answers.

These are the players that most rank above Kobe:
Jordan, Kareem, Russell, Wilt, Magic, Bird; and some still have Shaq & Duncan.

I can sit here and say with certainty. if Kobe retired today and accomplished absolutely nothing else in this league, 5 years from now when an all time list discussion is brought up... Kobe will be ranked above Shaq, Duncan, Magic, and Bird on the overwhelming majority of those lists.

I personally have him at 7 today, but would be willing to bet the house on that previous statement.

The guy has been a star since 1996. Think about where you were in your life in 96 and let that sink in...

5x champion (7 NBA Finals appearances)
2x finals mvp
1x mvp
13x all star
13x all nba
11x all nba defense
#6 on all time scoring list
#3 on all time playoff scoring list

That is fine. I find that laughable.

The idea of universally taking Kobe over Duncan/Shaq/Magic/Bird is just hilarious.

Which is exactly why the shit you list above is over-rated when ranking players.

Thats my freaking point.

IGOTGAME

06-11-2011, 05:46 PM

That same year Kobe couldn't even average over 30 against a Suns team that played far worse defense than this Mavs team...and also had the softest defensive rules in NBA history.

So how could 06 Kobe kill this current mavs team if he couldn't even kill a much worse suns team with easier rules?

What now, Stan?

Ouch.

Kobe didnt try to average 30 ppg against that Suns team because it wasnt in the best interest of the team for him to light it up scoring every game because you can't beat a scoring juggernaut like that by yourself. Kobe did play masterfully and orchestrated a great team effort.

Watch the series again, and tell me Kobe had any trouble scoring. Dude was trying to get his troops behind him because he needed them to play defense and rebound. If he wanted to he could have easily average 5-10 points a game that series.

IGOTGAME

06-11-2011, 05:47 PM

So Wade is much better than Kobe now? Funny how people here want to say first team all nba is a good representation of who is better.

Did kobe not make first team all nba?

I'm confused again.

Which one is it?

what does that have to do with my post?

DMAVS41

06-11-2011, 05:48 PM

Kobe didnt try to average 30 ppg against that Suns team because it wasnt in the best interest of the team for him to light it up scoring every game because you can't beat a scoring juggernaut like that by yourself. Kobe did play masterfully and orchestrated a great team effort.

Watch the series again, and tell me Kobe had any trouble scoring. Dude was trying to get his troops behind him because he needed them to play defense and rebound. If he wanted to he could have easily average 5-10 points a game that series.

Always an excuse.

So the guy scores 35 a game the entire year. Gets his team used to him taking 27 plus shots a game all year.

And then in the playoffs decides to change his game to get others involved.

Actually that makes perfect sense. This is Kobe. LOL

DMAVS41

06-11-2011, 05:50 PM

what does that have to do with my post?

It has everything to do with your post.

You can't have it both ways. What if the Lakers had won this year? Would you say:

"Well, Kobe doesn't deserve as much credit because he's hurt and old"

Of course not.

Wade is better than Kobe right now because he's better at playing the game of basketball.

LOL.

Whats the excuse in the olympics in 08? Or against the Pistons and Celtics?

Why did young/inexperienced Wade have more success playing with similar teams and against similar teams?

Always an excuse.

Mr. I'm So Rad

06-11-2011, 05:52 PM

Bladers

06-11-2011, 05:53 PM

A prime wade with the best player in the world and an additional top 10-15 players, about to lose in the finals against an inferior team with the worst defense in the finals.

And he's being compared to kobe? Is this a joke? :roll:

1. 1998-99 San Antonio Spurs - 95.0
2. 2003-04 Detroit Pistons Roster - 95.4
3. 1998-99 New York Knickerbockers - 97.5
5. 2002-03 New Jersey Nets - 98.1
6. 1999-00 Los Angeles Lakers - 98.2
7. 2004-05 San Antonio Spurs - 98.8
8. 2000-01 Philadelphia 76ers - 98.9
9. 2007-08 Boston Celtics - 98.9
10. 2001-02 New Jersey - 99.5
11. 2002-03 San Antonio Spurs - 99.7
12. 1997-98 Chicago Bulls - 99.8
13. 2006-07 San Antonio Spurs - 99.9
14. 2004-05 Detroit Pistons - 101.2
15. 2003-04 Los Angeles Lakers - 101.3
16. 2006-07 Cleveland Cavaliers -101.3
17. 2001-02 Los Angeles Lakers - 101.7
18. 1995-96 Chicago Bulls - 101.8
19. 2008-09 Orlando Magic - 101.9
20. 1995-96 Seattle SuperSonics - 102.1
21. 1996-97 Chicago Bulls - 102.4
22. 2010-11 Miami Heat - 103.5
23. 1999-00 Indiana Pacers - 103.6
24. 2009-10 Los Angeles Lakers - 103.7
25. 2009-10 Boston Celtics - 103.8
26. 1996-97 Utah Jazz - 104.0
27. 2005-06 Miami Heat - 104.5
28. 2008-09 Los Angeles Lakers - 104.7
29. 2000-01 Los Angeles Lakers - 104.8
30. 2005-06 Dallas Mavericks - 105.0
31. 2010-11 Dallas Mavericks - 105.0
32. 1997-98 Utah Jazz - 105.4
33. 2007-08 Los Angeles Lakers - 105.5

Dizzle-2k7

06-11-2011, 05:53 PM

DMAVS is a good poster on anything non-kobe related. Dude is incoherent with Kobes nuts in his mouth. :facepalm:

Mr. I'm So Rad

06-11-2011, 05:53 PM

Whats the excuse in the olympics in 08?

What about the Olympics?

DMAVS41

06-11-2011, 05:54 PM

What about the Olympics?

When Wade once again outplayed Kobe in a similar situation. Standard.

IGOTGAME

06-11-2011, 05:55 PM

Always an excuse.

So the guy scores 35 a game the entire year. Gets his team used to him taking 27 plus shots a game all year.

And then in the playoffs decides to change his game to get others involved.

Actually that makes perfect sense. This is Kobe. LOL

actually it did, it was the only reason the series was close.

What was LA's record again Phx in the regular when Kobe averaged 43 points against them? Oh, yeah it was 1-3. The one win coming in a game to end the year where Steve Nash didn't play.

So yeah, it would make perfect sense if you would watch the games and get off your agenda!

I'm out of this conversation. You are way too biased on the subject.

Dizzle-2k7

06-11-2011, 05:56 PM

When Wade once again outplayed Kobe in a similar situation. Standard.

All I remember is Kobe carrying team USA to a Gold Medal. The *** kinda drugs you on dogg?..Pass that this way :oldlol:

DMAVS41

06-11-2011, 05:56 PM

He averaged 28/6/5 against them and even dropped 50 on them in Game 6...and then the next year he averaged 33/5/4 against them. That looks similar to what Wade is doing and has done against the Mavs back in 06

That is similar to 35/8/4 against a better team?

I'm confused again.

Dizzle-2k7

06-11-2011, 05:57 PM

http://worldbestsports.com/wp-content/uploads/2011/02/Kobe-Bryant-Wins-NBA-All-Star-MVP.jpg

DMAVS41

06-11-2011, 05:58 PM

actually it did, it was the only reason the series was close.

What was LA's record again Phx in the regular when Kobe averaged 43 points against them? Oh, yeah it was 1-3. The one win coming in a game to end the year where Steve Nash didn't play.

So yeah, it would make perfect sense if you would watch the games and get off your agenda!

I'm out of this conversation. You are way too biased on the subject.

Yes, its makes perfect sense that a player couldn't get it done against the suns would somehow be destroying a much better team.

Great logic.

Its makes perfect sense that Kobe is much better than Wade despite the last 8 years of evidence we have.

Do you people hear yourselves? You are the ones hating. You are all hating on Wade. A player that is virtually a lock to go down as one of the 15 best players of all time.

Its hilarious. You people have it so backwards.

bleedinpurpleTwo

06-11-2011, 05:59 PM

When Wade once again outplayed Kobe in a similar situation. Standard.

I think you know very well that the roles at that team were fairly well defined.
Kobe was the designated defensive stopper. He was solid. He also came up big in the 4th qtr of the gold medal game. Wade, imo, was the MVP of that team...but Kobe was solid, esp when it mattered most.

You should bow out of this thread, it is getting ugly for you.

Bladers

06-11-2011, 05:59 PM

DMAVS41

06-11-2011, 05:59 PM

All I remember is Kobe carrying team USA to a Gold Medal. The *** kinda drugs you on dogg?..Pass that this way :oldlol:

http://www.fiba.com/pages/eng/fe/08/olym/men/teamPlay/team/p/eventid/4004/langid/1/langlc/en/openNodeIDs/6591/roundid/4004/selNodeID/6591/teamnumber/379/fe_teamPlay_teamAccuStat.html

:wtf:

Mr. I'm So Rad

06-11-2011, 06:00 PM

That is similar to 35/8/4 against a better team?

I'm confused again.

You said Kobe couldn't even average 30ppg against the Suns and he did. And the numbers Wade is putting up now is similar to the ones Kobe was putting up against a better team in the 06 Suns.

Do you think this year's Mavs are better than the '06 Suns?

IGOTGAME

06-11-2011, 06:00 PM

Yes, its makes perfect sense that a player couldn't get it done against the suns would somehow be destroying a much better team.

Great logic.

Its makes perfect sense that Kobe is much better than Wade despite the last 8 years of evidence we have.

Do you people hear yourselves? You are the ones hating. You are all hating on Wade. A player that is virtually a lock to go down as one of the 15 best players of all time.

Its hilarious. You people have it so backwards.

when you address me, address me not some fictional group of people you ascribe characteristics too.

thanks for not addressing my post. you can't because you were wrong and it obviously made sense that Kobe would scale back.

DMAVS41

06-11-2011, 06:01 PM

I think you know very well that the roles at that team were fairly well defined.
Kobe was the designated defensive stopper. He was solid. He also came up big in the 4th qtr of the gold medal game. Wade, imo, was the MVP of that team...but Kobe was solid, esp when it mattered most.

You should bow out of this thread, it is getting ugly for you.

What?

So you admit that Wade was MVP and then you have an issue with me saying Wade was better?

What?

Kobe jacked up 34 more shots than Wade and scored 8 less points. LOL

Killer_Instinct

06-11-2011, 06:01 PM

Always an excuse.

So the guy scores 35 a game the entire year. Gets his team used to him taking 27 plus shots a game all year.

And then in the playoffs decides to change his game to get others involved.

Actually that makes perfect sense. This is Kobe. LOL

Surely you aren't this much of an idiot as you're coming off as. Kobe alternating his style of play, which coincidentally was a part of the scheme Jackson convinced him to buy into, is what helped put them up 3-1 against a team they couldn't notch a regular season victory against with Kobe averaging over 37 PPG. (He put up 37, 39, and 51 to be exact) The Lakers choked, but let's not pretend Kobe didn't hang up 50 in a pivotal Game 6 that they were a Tim Thomas 3 away from sealing.

Bladers

06-11-2011, 06:01 PM

Yes, its makes perfect sense that a player couldn't get it done against the suns would somehow be destroying a much better team.

Great logic.

Its makes perfect sense that Kobe is much better than Wade despite the last 8 years of evidence we have.

Do you people hear yourselves? You are the ones hating. You are all hating on Wade. A player that is virtually a lock to go down as one of the 15 best players of all time.

Its hilarious. You people have it so backwards.

It still stands that Kobe averaged 44 points against the mavs that year. Kobe would murder the mavs if he had Wade's teammates in the finals! :roll: :roll:

If Kobe had Wade's teammates in the east, he would have won the title that year and repeated the next!

DMAVS41

06-11-2011, 06:02 PM

Surely you aren't this much of an idiot as you're coming off as. Kobe alternating his style of play, which coincidentally was a part of the scheme Jackson convinced him to buy into, is what helped put them up 3-1 against a team they couldn't notch a regular season victory against with Kobe averaging over 37(37, 39, and 51 to be exact) ppg on. The Lakers choked, but let's not pretend Kobe didn't hang up 50 in a pivotal Game 6 that they were a Tim Thomas 3 away from sealing.

Nobody is blaming Kobe for that series or saying he didn't play well.

I am saying the logic to assume that Kobe would be destroying this Mavs team in his prime is silly.

We have no evidence for that at all. Especially if it was in the finals.

Shooting 41% aint going to get it done mate. LOL

DMAVS41

06-11-2011, 06:03 PM

IGOTGAME

06-11-2011, 06:04 PM

Kobe never murdered anyone in the finals. 7 years and no murdering. I would take my chances.

so what do you think would happen if 2006 kobe met this team in the semi-finals?

Bladers

06-11-2011, 06:04 PM

bleedinpurpleTwo

06-11-2011, 06:04 PM

What?

So you admit that Wade was MVP and then you have an issue with me saying Wade was better?

What?

Kobe jacked up 34 more shots than Wade and scored 8 less points. LOL

yes, Wade was MVP, imo.
yes, Wade is probably the better player than Kobe right now. Kobe doesn't have the young legs. In about 6 games, Kobe will surpass Jordan in minutes played.
no, Wade is still wayyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyy behind Kobe on the all-time list.

Killer_Instinct

06-11-2011, 06:05 PM

Edit:

...Nevermind...

Mr. I'm So Rad

06-11-2011, 06:05 PM

http://www.fiba.com/pages/eng/fe/08/olym/men/teamPlay/team/p/eventid/4004/langid/1/langlc/en/openNodeIDs/6591/roundid/4004/selNodeID/6591/teamnumber/379/fe_teamPlay_teamAccuStat.html

:wtf:

He shot a higher FG% and got more offensive rebounds and less fouls? :confusedshrug:

Rose

06-11-2011, 06:05 PM

I missed Bladers.

Bladers

06-11-2011, 06:07 PM

Kobe never murdered anyone in the finals. 7 years and no murdering. I would take my chances.

Because he has never played a mavs type defense in the finals. The worst defensive team to make the finals in decades! :roll: :roll:

1. 1998-99 San Antonio Spurs - 95.0
2. 2003-04 Detroit Pistons Roster - 95.4
3. 1998-99 New York Knickerbockers - 97.5
5. 2002-03 New Jersey Nets - 98.1
6. 1999-00 Los Angeles Lakers - 98.2
7. 2004-05 San Antonio Spurs - 98.8
8. 2000-01 Philadelphia 76ers - 98.9
9. 2007-08 Boston Celtics - 98.9
10. 2001-02 New Jersey - 99.5
11. 2002-03 San Antonio Spurs - 99.7
12. 1997-98 Chicago Bulls - 99.8
13. 2006-07 San Antonio Spurs - 99.9
14. 2004-05 Detroit Pistons - 101.2
15. 2003-04 Los Angeles Lakers - 101.3
16. 2006-07 Cleveland Cavaliers -101.3
17. 2001-02 Los Angeles Lakers - 101.7
18. 1995-96 Chicago Bulls - 101.8
19. 2008-09 Orlando Magic - 101.9
20. 1995-96 Seattle SuperSonics - 102.1
21. 1996-97 Chicago Bulls - 102.4
22. 2010-11 Miami Heat - 103.5
23. 1999-00 Indiana Pacers - 103.6
24. 2009-10 Los Angeles Lakers - 103.7
25. 2009-10 Boston Celtics - 103.8
26. 1996-97 Utah Jazz - 104.0
27. 2005-06 Miami Heat - 104.5
28. 2008-09 Los Angeles Lakers - 104.7
29. 2000-01 Los Angeles Lakers - 104.8
30. 2005-06 Dallas Mavericks - 105.0
31. 2010-11 Dallas Mavericks - 105.0
32. 1997-98 Utah Jazz - 105.4
33. 2007-08 Los Angeles Lakers - 105.5

DMAVS41

06-11-2011, 06:08 PM

He shot a higher FG% and got more offensive rebounds and less fouls? :confusedshrug:

What?

Wade scored more points. Shot 21% better from the field. Got more rebounds.

He just outplayed Kobe.

Do you dispute that Wade was better than Kobe in the 08 olympics?

Mr. I'm So Rad

06-11-2011, 06:08 PM

Kobe never murdered anyone in the finals. 7 years and no murdering. I would take my chances.

http://www.kobebryantshoes.com/game_logs/2009_playoffs_game_log.htm

DMAVS41

06-11-2011, 06:09 PM

http://www.kobebryantshoes.com/game_logs/2009_playoffs_game_log.htm

You can't murder anyone shooting less than 44% and failing in crunch time. Sorry.

Mr. I'm So Rad

06-11-2011, 06:12 PM

What?

Wade scored more points. Shot 21% better from the field. Got more rebounds.

He just outplayed Kobe.

Do you dispute that Wade was better than Kobe in the 08 olympics?

He scored more points because he shot significantly more free throws. Kobe made more shots than him and played 188 more minutes, 2nd only to LeBron James with 198. More minutes means more chances to take shots and more opportunities for misses.

He did get more boards I'll give him that. But if higher FG% and more rebounds mean 1 player > another then Shaq > everyone in history besides Wilt and Russell

Mr. I'm So Rad

06-11-2011, 06:13 PM

You can't murder anyone shooting less than 44% and failing in crunch time. Sorry.

Two games went to OT and they won both of them...

But whatever, have it your way dude. FG% > All

KingBeasley08

06-11-2011, 06:15 PM

You can't murder anyone shooting less than 44% and failing in crunch time. Sorry.
kobe murdered that year. stop hating

DMAVS41

06-11-2011, 06:15 PM

He scored more points because he shot significantly more free throws. Kobe made more shots than him and played 188 more minutes, 2nd only to LeBron James with 198. More minutes means more chances to take shots and more opportunities for misses.

He did get more boards I'll give him that. But if higher FG% and more rebounds mean 1 player > another then Shaq > everyone in history besides Wilt and Russell

Answer the question please.

Who was better in the 08 Olympics? Wade or Kobe.

Bladers

06-11-2011, 06:15 PM

You can't murder anyone shooting less than 44% and failing in crunch time. Sorry.

Like wade & lebron in the finals? :roll: :roll:

Oh boy, such a bad day for your fanboys! :oldlol:

kuniva_dAMiGhTy

06-11-2011, 06:15 PM

It still stands that Kobe averaged 44 points against the mavs that year. Kobe would murder the mavs if he had Wade's teammates in the finals! :roll: :roll:

If Kobe had Wade's teammates in the east, he would have won the title that year and repeated the next!

Different team, dumpster diver. And No, Kobe is not "dominating" anyone. He shot 40% in the finals, and went 6-24 in a game 7. The worst game 7 shooting EVER for a player taking 24+ shots. He shot 24% in the fourth quarter in the series. LMAO. Kobe was bailed out by his team. He's actually stinks it up in the Finals.

bleedinpurpleTwo

06-11-2011, 06:17 PM

He's actually stinks it up in the Finals.

so they gave him TWO Finals MVPs because he is so lovable?

DMAVS41

06-11-2011, 06:18 PM

Like wade & lebron in the finals? :roll: :roll:

Oh boy, such a bad day for your fanboys! :oldlol:

I want the Mavs to win and Lebron/Wade deserve a ton of blame for coming up small in crunch time.

You'd get no argument from me.

I'm not a fanboy like you are. Thats the difference.

LOL

Bladers

06-11-2011, 06:18 PM

Different team, dumpster diver. And No, Kobe is not "dominating" anyone. He shot 40% in the finals, and went 6-24 in a game 7. The worst game 7 shooting EVER for a player taking 24+ shots. He shot 24% in the fourth quarter in the series. LMAO. Kobe was bailed out by his team. He's actually stinks it up in the Finals.

Different team? So the 06 mavs were different from the 06 mavs?
You have reached a new low in IQ, Bron and wade lovers are dumber than I thought! :roll: :roll:

IGOTGAME

06-11-2011, 06:19 PM

so what do you think would happen if 2006 kobe met this team in the semi-finals?

answer this question DMAVS.

Mr. I'm So Rad

06-11-2011, 06:19 PM

Answer the question please.

Who was better in the 08 Olympics? Wade or Kobe.

Whatever I say you're just gonna say "Omg you're an idiot." so idk why you even do this. You ask people a question then just ignore what they say entirely.

Overall who was a better player? Kobe

Who rebounded more and got to the line more? Wade

kuniva_dAMiGhTy

06-11-2011, 06:20 PM

so they gave him TWO Finals MVPs because he is so lovable?

That's right they "gave him" the Finals MVP.

Bladers

06-11-2011, 06:20 PM

I want the Mavs to win and Lebron/Wade deserve a ton of blame for coming up small in crunch time.

You'd get no argument from me.

I'm not a fanboy like you are. Thats the difference.

LOL

You are the one saying Wade > Kobe when Wade is failing to beat the worst defensive team in the finals for the past decades even with the best player in the game. :oldlol:

DMAVS41

06-11-2011, 06:21 PM

Whatever I say you're just gonna say "Omg you're an idiot." so idk why you even do this. You ask people a question then just ignore what they say entirely.

Overall who was a better player? Kobe

Who rebounded more and got to the line more? Wade

Ok. Agree to disagree.

I think your bias is shown if you say Kobe played better in the 08 Olympics.

That basically just means that no matter what Wade does he can never outplay Kobe in your mind.

That is your opinion and I respect that, but there is no point in debating if we are that far apart.

I thought Wade was significantly better in the Olympics as evidenced by Wade basically doing everything better than Kobe in less minutes.

DMAVS41

06-11-2011, 06:22 PM

You are the one saying Wade > Kobe when Wade is failing to beat the worst defensive team in the finals for the past decades even with the best player in the game. :oldlol:

What?

Wade has played great so far in the finals. Are your really disputing that?

And you guys have the audacity to call me a hater. Hilarious.

Mr. I'm So Rad

06-11-2011, 06:22 PM

That's right they "gave him" the Finals MVP.

You're right Kobe is just the most worthless player in history. Keith Bogans would be just as effective on that Lakers team if not more. He would shoot a higher FG% than Kobe.

Kobe has never actually really played a game in the NBA ever. They just give him awards and make up stats for him. He's never actually shown that he's a great player. He just sleeps in the locker room all day and then comes out when the game is decided.

bleedinpurpleTwo

06-11-2011, 06:22 PM

That's right they "gave him" the Finals MVP.

okay
:rolleyes:

kuniva_dAMiGhTy

06-11-2011, 06:23 PM

Different team? So the 06 mavs were different from the 06 mavs?
You have reached a new low in IQ, Bron and wade lovers are dumber than I thought! :roll: :roll:

Yes, different in the playoffs. They were better defensively.

Kobe has 1 playoff series averaging 35 ppg. You are owned. Sit down and shut up p*ssy.

DMAVS41

06-11-2011, 06:23 PM

answer this question DMAVS.

I think he would put up 30/5/5 on 43% shooting and he would have lost in 5 or 6 games. Kobe would brick a game winner at some point and then lay down in the elimination game as usual.

tpols

06-11-2011, 06:25 PM

I think your bias is shown if you say Kobe played better in the 08 Olympics.
.
Clyde the Glide

1992 Olympics: 11ppg on 58% shooting.

Michael Jordan

1992 Olypics: 15ppg on 45% shooting.

I guess Clyde is better than MJ. Boy.. these olympic stats are really insightful in determining whose a better player.:applause:

Bladers

06-11-2011, 06:26 PM

I think he would put up 30/5/5 on 43% shooting and he would have lost in 5 or 6 games. Kobe would brick a game winner at some point and then lay down in the elimination game as usual.

You sound butthurt.
But anyway, Against who are you speaking of, the mavs? :oldlol:

Mr. I'm So Rad

06-11-2011, 06:26 PM

Ok. Agree to disagree.

I think your bias is shown if you say Kobe played better in the 08 Olympics.

That basically just means that no matter what Wade does he can never outplay Kobe in your mind.

That is your opinion and I respect that, but there is no point in debating if we are that far apart.

I thought Wade was significantly better in the Olympics as evidenced by Wade basically doing everything better than Kobe in less minutes.

It's not bias, I like Wade as a player. I just think Kobe is the more skilled player.

Wade didn't destroy him in every single category. He got 10 more rebounds, which I gave him credit for, and he got to the free throw line more and took less shots.

You say it as though Wade just outmatches Kobe in every category by a wide margin. The only 3 he did that in were rebounds, FTA and steals.

Kobe made more FG's than Wade, got more assists, made more 3's and more blocks.

Bladers

06-11-2011, 06:27 PM

What?

Wade has played great so far in the finals. Are your really disputing that?

And you guys have the audacity to call me a hater. Hilarious.

He is playing against the worst defensive team in the finals in his prime. The team Kobe averaged 44 points against.

Are you disputing that?

DMAVS41

06-11-2011, 06:27 PM

Clyde the Glide

1992 Olympics: 11ppg on 58% shooting.

Michael Jordan

1992 Olypics: 15ppg on 45% shooting.

I guess Clyde is better than MJ. Boy.. these olympic stats are really insightful in determining whose a better player.:applause:

Its a totally different circumstance. But I'm not saying Wade is better than Kobe just because of the Olympics.

I am saying that Wade played better in the Olympics.

Again. Do you refute that?

KingBeasley08

06-11-2011, 06:28 PM

Its a totally different circumstance. But I'm not saying Wade is better than Kobe just because of the Olympics.

I am saying that Wade played better in the Olympics.

Again. Do you refute that?
what? lol

DMAVS41

06-11-2011, 06:29 PM

It's not bias, I like Wade as a player. I just think Kobe is the more skilled player.

Wade didn't destroy him in every single category. He got 10 more rebounds, which I gave him credit for, and he got to the free throw line more and took less shots.

You say it as though Wade just outmatches Kobe in every category by a wide margin. The only 3 he did that in were rebounds, FTA and steals.

Kobe made more FG's than Wade, got more assists, made more 3's and more blocks.

What?

How about points, fg%, 3p%, 2p%, ft%????????????????????????

Again, no point in debating. We are too far apart. If you won't concede that Wade played better in the Olympics then its just pointless.

kuniva_dAMiGhTy

06-11-2011, 06:30 PM

They gave him awards

Don't exaggerate and don't act like Gasol wasnt just as deserving for last years Finals MVP.

tpols

06-11-2011, 06:30 PM

Its a totally different circumstance. But I'm not saying Wade is better than Kobe just because of the Olympics.

I'm just pointing out that you dont know how to apply context or reasoning to any of your posts.

You bring up the olympics.. yet they hardly tell anything of how good a player is or who is better since these guys are on the same team and aren't trying to compete with each other.

You bring up detroit.. and ignore the fact that their defensive rating dropped IMMENSELY from when kobe played them.. both because of personell changes and because of the rule changes.

You just dont have the brainpower to properly analyze these situations.:oldlol:

bleedinpurpleTwo

06-11-2011, 06:30 PM

That's exactly what they did. They gave it to him; Gasol out played him.

Kobe led the team in scoring, assists, steals in what was a very very defensive series. Props to Kobe for leading his team to victory, doing anything and everything it took to get there.

DMAVS41

06-11-2011, 06:32 PM

what? lol

Did you read his post?

He tried to use that as the reason to say Clyde is better than MJ.

Is anyone here saying Wade is better than Kobe solely because the olympics? Nope.

I am merely saying that Wade played better in the olympics. That is all.

Which is really just a ****ing fact, yet kobe stans still want to come up with bs reasons why Wade was better.

Mr. I'm So Rad

06-11-2011, 06:32 PM

That's exactly what they did. They gave it to him; Gasol out played him.

So right. Gasol is the real MVP. Gasol would dominate the Celtics 1 on 5 he doesn't even need Kobe or the Lakers. The only reason the Lakers lost this year was because he never even touched the ball in the series. Not once did he ever get it

DMAVS41

06-11-2011, 06:33 PM

I'm just pointing out that you dont know how to apply context or reasoning to any of your posts.

You bring up the olympics.. yet they hardly tell anything of how good a player is or who is better since these guys are on the same team and aren't trying to compete with each other.

You bring up detroit.. and ignore the fact that their defensive rating dropped IMMENSELY from when kobe played them.. both because of personell changes and because of the rule changes.

You just dont have the brainpower to properly analyze these situations.:oldlol:

Yes I do.

Its not hard. Wade played better in the Olympics.

Wade has been better against similar teams.

Is it the end all be all? Of course not.

The brainpower that you have is lacking because you basically want everyone to throw out all the things that favor wade.

Which by the way, is all the hard data.

Its hilarious.

We've been over this before.

Perception vs reality. Look it up please.

Bladers

06-11-2011, 06:36 PM

KingBeasley08

06-11-2011, 06:36 PM

Did you read his post?

He tried to use that as the reason to say Clyde is better than MJ.

Is anyone here saying Wade is better than Kobe solely because the olympics? Nope.

I am merely saying that Wade played better in the olympics. That is all.

Which is really just a ****ing fact, yet kobe stans still want to come up with bs reasons why Wade was better.
i admit wade played better in the olympics but what does that mean :oldlol:

the only reason you'd bring that up was if you mean to say he's a better player. dont give me that bulls*** that its all u mean. everyone knows exactly what u were implying

and no ones taking u seriously right now :lol considering im not a kobe stan and have made fun of him multiple times

its funny, the kobe stans made me hate kobe but now the haters are making me like him again

tpols

06-11-2011, 06:37 PM

Wade has been better against similar teams.

There not similar.

2004 Pistons DRtg: 95.4
2005 Pistons DRtg: 101.2
2006 Pistons DRtg: 103.1

Hard evidence. Massive difference.:oldlol:

tpols

06-11-2011, 06:38 PM

the only reason you'd bring that up was if you mean to say he's a better player.
Yup..

I'm laughing at this clown acting like he was just 'stating' that Wade was better in the 08 olympics acting like he had no agenda behind it.:roll:

DMAVS41

06-11-2011, 06:39 PM

i admit wade played better in the olympics but what does that mean :oldlol:

the only reason you'd bring that up was if you mean to say he's a better player. dont give me that bulls*** that its all u mean. everyone knows exactly what u were implying

and no ones taking u seriously right now :lol considering im not a kobe stan and have made fun of him multiple times

its funny, the kobe stans made me hate kobe but now the haters are making me like him again

It means Wade was better. Thats all. Just a small piece of evidence in the Wade vs Kobe debate.

Here is what is funny.

My stance:

"I personally think Wade is a slightly better basketball player than Kobe. Having said that, I would not rank Wade over Kobe at this point. I am cool with anyone saying Kobe is better than Wade as long as they admit its close."

The stance of Kobe stans:

"Its not close at all. 5 rings. First team all nba, first team all defense. Did we mention 5 rings yet? Only a moron would say Wade is even close to Kobe."

You tell me which stance is more reasonable and accurate given the past 8 years of evidence.

Mr. I'm So Rad

06-11-2011, 06:39 PM

What?

How about points, fg%, 3p%, 2p%, ft%????????????????????????

Again, no point in debating. We are too far apart. If you won't concede that Wade played better in the Olympics then its just pointless.

Dude, he scored EIGHT more points and shot TWENTY-NINE more free throws. That in and of itself accounts for points.

Kobe shot significantly more 3's than him and made more. Again, volume comes into account.

Wade did make more 2 pointers than him, so Ill give him that. Though considering how many FT's he shot that could be slightly misleading.

And I already mentioned FT%. Wade took way more than him. Kobe only took 12 and made 7. That is misleading as we all know Kobe is a better FT shooter than Wade.

I said Kobe was the more skilled player back then that's all.

Bladers

06-11-2011, 06:39 PM

There not similar.

2004 Pistons DRtg: 95.4
2005 Pistons DRtg: 101.2
2006 Pistons DRtg: 103.1

Hard evidence. Massive difference.:oldlol:

Guess what. Kobe averaged 40 pts against the Pistons 2006 defense. :roll: :roll:

Mr. I'm So Rad

06-11-2011, 06:41 PM

Don't exaggerate and don't act like Gasol wasnt just as deserving for last years Finals MVP.

You're the one exaggerating the fact like Kobe has never deserved any Finals MVP he's earned.

I just felt one idiotic post deserved another.

DMAVS41

06-11-2011, 06:41 PM

Dude, he scored EIGHT more points and shot TWENTY-NINE more free throws. That in and of itself accounts for points.

Kobe shot significantly more 3's than him and made more. Again, volume comes into account.

Wade did make more 2 pointers than him, so Ill give him that. Though considering how many FT's he shot that could be slightly misleading.

And I already mentioned FT%. Wade took way more than him. Kobe only took 12 and made 7. That is misleading as we all know Kobe is a better FT shooter than Wade.

I said Kobe was the more skilled player back then that's all.

Free throws don't count? I'm confused again.

I simply said that Wade played better than Kobe in the olympics. I did not say Wade is a better overall player because of it.

Its just merely a small piece of evidence with Wade outperforming Kobe in a similar situation.

Something Wade has done at times throughout his career.

Mr. I'm So Rad

06-11-2011, 06:43 PM

It means Wade was better. Thats all. Just a small piece of evidence in the Wade vs Kobe debate.

Here is what is funny.

My stance:

"I personally think Wade is a slightly better basketball player than Kobe. Having said that, I would not rank Wade over Kobe at this point. I am cool with anyone saying Kobe is better than Wade as long as they admit its close."

The stance of Kobe stans:

"Its not close at all. 5 rings. First team all nba, first team all defense. Did we mention 5 rings yet? Only a moron would say Wade is even close to Kobe."

You tell me which stance is more reasonable and accurate given the past 8 years of evidence.

I don't feel that way at all. As far as career accomplishments go, no Wade is not close to Kobe as he hasn't played nearly as long.

But as far as players, I don't think they are light years apart I just think Kobe is a more skilled player is all.

DMAVS41

06-11-2011, 06:45 PM

I don't feel that way at all. As far as career accomplishments go, no Wade is not close to Kobe as he hasn't played nearly as long.

But as far as players, I don't think they are light years apart I just think Kobe is a more skilled player is all.

And I have no problem with that.

As I have said literally over a thousand times:

Over the last 8 years they have had an extremely similar impact on the game. I personally think Wade is slightly better because of his efficiency, finals play, and play against the best teams.

I have no problem with someone taking Kobe as long as they admit that gap is very small either way.

I have no problem with anyone taking a reasonable stance. Its the unreasonable Kobe stans that turn this into a hate fest. Not me.

I give Kobe plenty of credit all the time.

Mr. I'm So Rad

06-11-2011, 06:46 PM

Free throws don't count? I'm confused again.

I simply said that Wade played better than Kobe in the olympics. I did not say Wade is a better overall player because of it.

Its just merely a small piece of evidence with Wade outperforming Kobe in a similar situation.

Something Wade has done at times throughout his career.

So if you don't think Wade is better than Kobe then for what purpose did you even bring this point up?

If you keep saying that player x outplays player y all of the time then it's obvious you are saying player x is better than player y.

And if you feel Wade is better than Kobe then that's cool. Everyone is entitled to their own opinion I'm not gonna knock you for that. I just don't like when people knock others for their opinions. Your views on basketball are just as subjective as ours. We value different things in different lights. That's all.

DMAVS41

06-11-2011, 06:50 PM

So if you don't think Wade is better than Kobe then for what purpose did you even bring this point up?

If you keep saying that player x outplays player y all of the time then it's obvious you are saying player x is better than player y.

And if you feel Wade is better than Kobe then that's cool. Everyone is entitled to their own opinion I'm not gonna knock you for that. I just don't like when people knock others for their opinions. Your views on basketball are just as subjective as ours. We value different things in different lights. That's all.

I brought it up because its evidence that favors Wade. Doesn't mean its the end all be all.

Again. I'm not knocking anyone that thinks Kobe is better. I'm knocking people that think Kobe is better and its not close.

Huge difference.

Mr. I'm So Rad

06-11-2011, 06:50 PM

I brought it up because its evidence that favors Wade. Doesn't mean its the end all be all.

Again. I'm not knocking anyone that thinks Kobe is better. I'm knocking people that think Kobe is better and its not close.

Huge difference.

Ok fair enough :cheers:

kaiiu

06-11-2011, 06:51 PM

Gino/Dmavs getting ass raped YET AGAIN :roll: :roll:

tpols

06-11-2011, 06:52 PM

I brought it up because its evidence that favors Wade. Doesn't mean its the end all be all.

What evidence? Your evidence? Of course yours favors Wade.. you're extremely biased in this conversation.:oldlol:

You still haven't responded to my post about the piston's difference in DRtg's from 04 to 05 and 06.

tpols

06-11-2011, 06:54 PM

Are these two situations comparable?

There not similar.

2004 Pistons DRtg: 95.4
2005 Pistons DRtg: 101.2
2006 Pistons DRtg: 103.1

Hard evidence. Massive difference.:oldlol:
Were the pistons the same because it still says 'Detroit' across the front of their jerseys?:oldlol:

Bladers

06-11-2011, 06:56 PM

Are these two situations comparable?

Were the pistons the same because it still says 'Detroit' across the front of their jerseys?:oldlol:

If they were the same how come Kobe averaged 40 pts against them in 06... :oldlol:

bl2k8

06-11-2011, 06:56 PM

is gino even a real mavs fan?

kaiiu

06-11-2011, 06:58 PM

is gino even a real mavs fan?
No, He just hops on a teams or players bandwagon in a thread for the sole purpose of a "debate to the death" :lol

Ne 1

06-11-2011, 06:59 PM

I simply said that Wade played better than Kobe in the olympics.

Wade and Bron without Kobe = two bronze medals.

Wade and Bron with Kobe = 1 gold medal.

hmmmmm

Xabit

06-11-2011, 06:59 PM

konex smh grow up kid :facepalm

creepingdeath

06-11-2011, 07:00 PM

ESPN is so ridiculous. One of their headlines:

LeBron and Dirk may not have Mike's killer instinct, but they're actually almost as effective in the clutch.

Lebron? :roll:

Xabit

06-11-2011, 07:01 PM

ESPN is so ridiculous. One of their headlines:

LeBron and Dirk may not have Mike's killer instinct, but they're actually almost as effective in the clutch.

Lebron? :roll:

smh why do u always have to bring up jordan. :facepalm

Bladers

06-11-2011, 07:01 PM

ESPN is so ridiculous. One of their headlines:

LeBron and Dirk may not have Mike's killer instinct, but they're actually almost as effective in the clutch.

Lebron? :roll:

Its henry abbort, what do you think? He's a huge lebron homer! :oldlol:

kaiiu

06-11-2011, 07:02 PM

ESPN is so ridiculous. One of their headlines:

LeBron and Dirk may not have Mike's killer instinct, but they're actually almost as effective in the clutch.

Lebron? :roll:
BSPN has no shame smh

Ne 1

06-11-2011, 07:02 PM

Bryant has set the tone defensively but down the stretch in the gold medal game Bryant took over offensively. First, he made a strong move to the hoop and hit a tough shot in the lane to make the score 93-89. After that play, Collins commented, "One of the things LeBron has said is that we know that there is one guy on this team who will take big shots and that's Kobe Bryant. That's a big shot coming out of the timeout to sort of stem Spain's run."

After Fernandez missed a three pointer, Bryant drove to the hoop, collapsed the defense and passed to a wide open Williams for a big three pointer. "That's a gigantic shot," Collins said. "Great play by Kobe Bryant. I thought that he was going to take the shot but instead the dribble kick (pass). That's what I always talk about--that's how you get those threes in rhythm."

After another Fernandez miss, Bryant again drove into the paint, collapsed the defense and made a great feed, this time to Howard for a dunk. That pushed Team USA's lead to 98-89 and Collins noted, "Who's been on every play? All three plays--Kobe Bryant. He hit the big shot and he's had two assists in this stretch." Fernandez answered with a three pointer but Bryant retaliated with a three pointer to reestablish a nine point bulge

:applause:

DMAVS41

06-11-2011, 07:04 PM

BSPN has no shame smh

He is solely talking about game winnings shots in the playoffs.

Dirk and Lebron are both 5 of 12 in their careers.

Jordan made 9 of 18 for his career.

Obviously neither Dirk or Lebron have any business being mentioned with MJ as "clutch" players overall.

kaiiu

06-11-2011, 07:06 PM

He is solely talking about game winnings shots in the playoffs.

Dirk and Lebron are both 5 of 12 in their careers.

Jordan made 9 of 18 for his career.

Obviously neither Dirk or Lebron have any business being mentioned with MJ as "clutch" players overall.
Dont ever use Lebron and clutch in the same sentence EVER again. Dirk has proven his self this playoffs and time again in the regular season through his career. A couple open layups vs the Wizards dont make u clutch, sorry.

DMAVS41

06-11-2011, 07:09 PM

Dont ever use Lebron and clutch in the same sentence EVER again. Dirk has proven his self this playoffs and time again in the regular season through his career. A couple open layups vs the Wizards dont make u clutch, sorry.

I have no dog in that fight other than Dirk. And Dirk is definitely as clutch as you get.

Lebron has been very clutch in the playoffs his entire career up to the Finals. Just the truth.

But I could care less about that at this point.

If Dirk misses a game winner tomorrow and Lebron makes one....you'll be on here calling Dirk not clutch and a choker.

Just the way this forum and the public goes. Kind of pathetic if you ask me.

kaiiu

06-11-2011, 07:11 PM

I have no dog in that fight other than Dirk. And Dirk is definitely as clutch as you get.

Lebron has been very clutch in the playoffs his entire career up to the Finals. Just the truth.

But I could care less about that at this point.

If Dirk misses a game winner tomorrow and Lebron makes one....you'll be on here calling Dirk not clutch and a choker.

Just the way this forum and the public goes. Kind of pathetic if you ask me.
Dirk is my second fav. player in the NBA and I never trashed him. Get that shit str8.

creepingdeath

06-11-2011, 07:13 PM

Its henry abbort, what do you think? He's a huge lebron homer! :oldlol:
What's funny, though, is that he's getting ripped in the video. :lol

bleedinpurpleTwo

06-11-2011, 07:18 PM

thanks to DMAVS getting pwned in this thread, and the responses he has generated herein, I now see how utterly dominant Kobe has been in his career.
I have been questioning whether he is really top-10 all time, but this thread shows that he is clearly top-10 and perhaps up there with Magic and Bird.

kaiiu

06-11-2011, 07:19 PM

DMAVS41

06-11-2011, 07:25 PM

They laughed at me when I said Dirk is one of the 25 or 20 best players of all time. Now its being talked about endlessly here and around the sports world.

Owned.

They are laughing at me again for saying Wade and Kobe are close and that Wade will go down as a top 15 player of all time. Sooner or later it will be talked about here and the in the sports world.

Future Owned.

:rockon:

Svendiggity

06-11-2011, 07:28 PM

DMAVS41

06-11-2011, 07:29 PM

That's not why people laugh at you..

They attack me because they can't attack my posts.

Its not hard.

I'll just sit back and watch it all unfold.

Very entertaining.

NoGunzJustSkillz

06-11-2011, 07:43 PM

amfirst

06-11-2011, 09:56 PM

Wade and Bron would never over take Kobe if they win. What kind of superstar actually flops as much as these two.

IGOTGAME

06-11-2011, 10:01 PM

They attack me because they can't attack my posts.

Its not hard.

I'll just sit back and watch it all unfold.

Very entertaining.

I don't think people have the time to take out of there daily lives to constantly debate you.

your dedication is unmatched.

Doctor Rivers

06-11-2011, 10:02 PM

They attack me because they can't attack my posts.

Its not hard.

I'll just sit back and watch it all unfold.

Very entertaining.

ISH is your life apparently.

LOL

OWNED

DMAVS41

06-11-2011, 10:04 PM

ISH is your life apparently.

LOL

OWNED

My point exactly. Attack the poster when you can't take getting your shit thrown back at you.

I don't blame you and others. I'd get sick of it as well.

Owned.

Bladers

06-11-2011, 10:07 PM

My point exactly. Attack the poster when you can't take getting your shit thrown back at you.

I don't blame you and others. I'd get sick of it as well.

Owned.

Dude you got pwned throughout this thread. Its almost comical.
The smell of pwnage in the cool of the evening! :pimp:

DMAVS41

06-11-2011, 10:10 PM

Dude you got pwned throughout this thread. Its almost comical.
The smell of pwnage in the cool of the evening! :pimp:

Kobe vs Dallas 22\4\3 46%
Wade vs Dallas 28\7\5 58%

Kobe vs Boston 28\8\4 40%
Wade vs Boston 33\7\6 56%
Wade vs Boston 30\7\5 53%

Kobe vs Pistons 22\4\4 38% 4 TO
Wade vs Pistons 28\6\6 60%

I think I'm just going to start posting this whenever Wade vs Kobe comes up.

Owned.

I'll add in the Olympics as well later.

d.bball.guy

06-11-2011, 10:16 PM

Nope. Not now. He has many chances to win and this is J-Kidd's last(probably). Plus, I'm a new Mavs fan. LOL.

Doctor Rivers

06-11-2011, 10:32 PM

My point exactly. Attack the poster when you can't take getting your shit thrown back at you.

I don't blame you and others. I'd get sick of it as well.

Owned.

LOL i could care less. i think it's funny that you say the same thing all the time

OWNED

Bladers

06-11-2011, 10:38 PM

Kobe vs Dallas 22\4\3 46%
Wade vs Dallas 28\7\5 58%

Kobe vs Boston 28\8\4 40%
Wade vs Boston 33\7\6 56%
Wade vs Boston 30\7\5 53%

Kobe vs Pistons 22\4\4 38% 4 TO
Wade vs Pistons 28\6\6 60%

I think I'm just going to start posting this whenever Wade vs Kobe comes up.

Owned.

I'll add in the Olympics as well later.

You are an idiot.

2004 pistons (95.4) >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> 2006 pistons (103.1).

Kobe averaged 40 pts against the 2006 pistons! :oldlol:

2010 Finals Celtics >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> 2010 First Round/2011 Celtics

18pts, 40%, 4tovs against a (100.3) bulls
How much more a (95.4) Pistons?
Not even debatable!