ISH All-time Top 25 Guards Project: #3 Jerry West Vs Kobe Bryant.

[Kblaze8855]

Still filling in for GOAT till he returns. Last vote was 13-8 for West.


Make your arguments here for the next 48 hours on rather Mr.Clutch or Kobe should advance and continue to move higher on the list. Put the players name you are voting for in BOLD so I don't miss it when I tally. The loser of this poll will be ranked #4 in our project.

Only members listed on the project roster will have their votes counted. Anyone may add their opinion and or argument as long as it's constructive. Our roster is now finalized. If you like the project and think you can make it better please add your opinion. If you'd like to join in the forwards, centers or all-time top 67 project, please let GOAT know via PM. The Final Roster is listed below....

The Roster

L.Kizzle
ThaSwagg3r
Rose
WillC
G.O.A.T
1987 Lakers
neyca
Toizumi
Shaqattack3234
Magnax1
RobertdeMeijer
nycelt84
KGMN
SteveNashMVPcro

Crossover (added after initial vote)
bizil (added after initial vote)
Boston C's (added at #20)
Gotterdammerung (added at #17)
SuperPippen (added at #14)
Big164 (added at #13)
Droid101 (added at #11)
D.J. (added at #11)
Miller for 3 (added at #10)
Odinn (added at #9)
OmniStrife (added at #9)
HylianNightmare (added at #9)
Pushxx (added at #9)
MasterDurant24 (added at #9)
Clippersfan86 (added at #9)

ThaRegul8r (contributor)
NugzHeat3 (contributor)
Psileas (contributor)
alexandreben (contributor)
EricForman (contributor)




http://thehoopdoctors.com/online2/wp-content/uploads/2009/thelogo.jpg
14 seasons
12x all-NBA
5x All-defensive(all D teams started in his 9th season)
14x all-star
1x ASG MVP
1x NBA Champion
1969 Finals MVP
Top 6 in Field goal percentage 3 times and top 6 in TS% 8 seasons in a row
1x Assists leader(top 3 in 2 seasons)
1x scoring leader(top three in 5 seasons)
28.5-7-6 averages over 11 year prime
29/6/6 career average in the playoffs

or



http://blacksportsonline.com/home/wp-content/uploads/2011/06/kobe-Bryant.jpg

15 seasons
2008 NBA MVP
13x all-NBA(1 3rd...did not exist in Jerry Wests day)
11x All-defensive
13x all-star(no ASG in 1999)
4x ASG MVP
5x NBA Champion
2X Finals MVP
2x scoring leader(top three in 6 seasons)
28.5-6-5 averages over 11 year prime
25/5/5 career average in the playoffs







Kobe wins 11-2

[RRR3]

Uh-oh...brace yourself for the Kobe Troll Brigade!

And :facepalm at West getting past Oscar.

[Heavincent]

Kobe.

[Heavincent]

Uh-oh...brace yourself for the Kobe Troll Brigade!


I, for one, welcome our Kobe Troll overlords.

[ThaSwagg3r]

Kobe Bryant has my vote. Kobe has surpassed West ever since he won his first championship as the lead dog in 2009.

btw, kblaze, I made a Reggie Miller thread that I think you should contribute in. :pimp:

[RRR3]

I, for one, welcome our Kobe Troll overlords.
Of course you do, being one yourself.

[L.Kizzle]

Somebody made a West/Kobe thread a few days ago. Don't know why though.

[Heavincent]

Of course you do, being one yourself.

Okay Captain Butthurt.

[RRR3]

Okay Captain Butthurt.
:rolleyes:

[c3z4r]

I'll honestly say that i haven't seen west play but i simply can't see any argument that can be made in his favor against kobe.

Therefore ill go wit kobe

[Heavincent]

:rolleyes:

Thanks for proving my point Captain.

[necya]

i vote for West, knowing he has no chance on this forum.

[Rnbizzle]

Kobe is easily the better player.

[Clippersfan86]

Super tough pick. I'll go Kobe . Jerry West called Kobe the greatest Laker player of all time not long ago too. Kobe also called Jerry the GOAT Laker... but since then Kobe passed him up as the best scorer in Lakers history and we have to remember Kobe's got at least another 2-3 seasons at an all star level. He's moving up that scoring list quickly.

[Legends66NBA7]

Somebody made a West/Kobe thread a few days ago. Don't know why though.

That would be me.

http://www.insidehoops.com/forum/showthread.php?t=235354

I was specifically talking about who is the #2 shooting guard of all-time though. I was going for statstics, mostly .

[Jacks3]

listing kobe's career playoffs numbers instead of prime. :facepalm

kobe from 2001-2010.

28.8/5.7/5.4/1.5/0.6/55% TS

[Kblaze8855]

listing kobe's career playoffs numbers instead of prime. :facepalm

kobe from 2001-2010.

28.8/5.7/5.4/1.5/0.6/55% TS

I try to do the same for both sides. Jerry put up 32/7/4, 28/8/5, 31/7/3, 41/6/5, 34/6/6, 31/6/5, 31/8/4, and 31/8/4 again in his prime in the playoffs. His career playoff numbers are pulled down by his later years and rookie season.

[iamgine]

This is already predictable. #2 would be Magic and #1 would be Jordan. Kobe vs Oscar would've been more fun.

1. Jordan
2. Magic
3. Kobe

[Gotterdammerung]

Bryant: 15 years, 13 quality, 13 all stars, top 5 (02-04, 06-11), top 10 (00, 01). 2 year peak: 33-6-5.
West: 14 years, 12 quality, 14 all stars, top 5 (62 - 67, 70 - 73), top 10 (68, 69). 4 year peak: 30-6-6.

Shooting: Even. Caveat: Jerry West's numbers would be even higher had he played with a 3 point line. :facepalm
Scoring: Even, tho West got to the line more often, and was a more physical guard. Kobe takes tougher shots just to prove he can make them.
Clutch: Even, but West was the superior playoff performer. He stepped it up much higher than Kobe ever did.
Defense: Even, but only when Kobe was inspired. :rolleyes:
Work Ethic: Even

Difference? Kobe is/was the better dunker, and West the superior passer. He was the Lakers' primary ball carrier in the second half of his career. First half, he was a combo guard, but they didn't truly define positions in the 60s. Kobe has more hardware (titles, thanks to Shaq) but West was the better teammate, better locker-room presence and team leader. Kobe didn't learn the secret till very late, till he drank from the cup of bitter defeat in 2008.

Mr. Clutch by the skin of his nose.

BTW: Kobe is only 33. In other words, he has the potential to pass West, Jordan, and even Abdul Jabbar with the totality of his career, though - as long he stays healthy. :no:

[Boston C's]

Uh-oh...brace yourself for the Kobe Troll Brigade!

And :facepalm at West getting past Oscar.

its all good cuz their votes dont count :roll: :roll: :roll: :roll:

its whoever is on the roster which i am :D

that being said i still vote for kobe on this one lol

[Jacks3]

lol @ anybody voting for west. :facepalm

[Gotterdammerung]

lol @ anybody voting for west. :facepalm
lol @ you not being a voter. :oldlol:

[Jacks3]

lol @ u saying kobe won titles "thanks to shaq" and ignoring the fact that west couldn't win the legend elgin baylor, and that he only won when wilt came along, and he shot like 36% during that championship run.:oldlol: meanwhile, kobe posted 29/7/6/2 in the 2001 playoffs and 27/6/6/2/1 in 02 playoffs. yup. it was all thanks to shaq.

lol @ u saying kobe didn't learn the "secret" until 2008 when he'd already been on 3 championship teams and another finals appearance before that.

lol @ west stepping up "much higher" in the playoffs when kobe has about 4 playoff runs (2001, 2008, 2009, 2010) better than anything west did.

****king hating *******.

[1987_Lakers]

Before 2009 I might of picked Jerry West, but in my eyes Kobe has definitely passed him now. Tell me one thing West has an advantage over Kobe? Kobe has more individual accomplishments, greater team success, & he surpassed Jerry West to become the Lakers All-Time leading scorer not to long ago.

The only true edge West has over Kobe is passing, Kobe is a better scorer (this is not debatable), a better athlete, he is a much better ball-handler, & a better defender when he focuses on the defensive end.

Kobe Bryant

[catch24]

lol @ u saying kobe won titles "thanks to shaq" and ignoring the fact that west couldn't win the legend elgin baylor, and that he only won when wilt came along, and he shot like 36% during that championship run.:oldlol: meanwhile, kobe posted 29/7/6/2 in the 2001 playoffs and 27/6/6/2/1 in 02 playoffs. yup. it was all thanks to shaq.

lol @ u saying kobe didn't learn the "secret" until 2008 when he'd already been on 3 championship teams and another finals appearance before that.

lol @ west stepping up "much higher" in the playoffs when kobe has about 4 playoff runs (2001, 2008, 2009, 2010) better than anything west did.

****king hating *******.

Damn, Jacks3 laying down the law. Good post...not sure you needed all the expletives though :oldlol:

[Sarcastic]

If Jerry West posted on ISH, I bet he would vote for Kobe.

[Legends66NBA7]

Let the resumes speak for themselves:

Jerry West Regular Season
27.0ppg 5.8reb 6.7ast 47.4%fg 81.4%ft

Scoring Title: 1

Assist Title: 1

All-NBA: 12 (10 First Team)

NBA Regular Season Records held by West:

Most free throws made: 840 (840-977 = 86.0%ft)

Jerry West Playoffs
29.1ppg 5.6reb 6.3ast 46.9%fg 80.5%ft

NBA Playoff runs over 30ppg: 7

NBA Playoff runs over 32ppg: 2

NBA Playoff runs over 34ppg: 2

NBA Playoff runs over 40ppg: 1

NBA Playoffs 30 point or higher games: 74

NBA Playoffs 40 point or higher games: 20

NBA Playoffs 50 point or higher games: 2

NBA Playoff Records held by West:

Highest points per game average in a Playoff series: 46.3ppg vs. Baltimore Bullets, 1965
Most consecutive 40 point games: 6 vs. Baltimore Bullets, April 3-April 13, 1965


Jerry West Finals Performances
1962: ??
1963: 29.5ppg 6.8reb 4.8ast 49.0%fg 75.8%ft
1965: 33.8ppg ??reb 10.2ast 42.4%fg 86.4%ft
1966: 33.9ppg ??reb ?? ast?? %fg (88 field goals made) 87.1%ft
1968: 31.3ppg ??reb ?? ast ?? %fg (68 field goals made) 81.3%ft
1969: 37.9ppg ??reb ?? ast ?? %fg (96 field goals made) 83.9%ft
1970: 31.4ppg 3.4reb 7.7ast 45.0%fg 83.3%ft
1972: 19.0ppg 4.0reb 8.8ast 32.5%fg 79.3%ft
1973: 21.4ppg 3.2reb 4.6ast 44.2%fg 67.6%ft

I couldn

[Jacks3]

lol @ that biased bullshit.^

[1987_Lakers]

It is pointless to compare stats from the 60's to today's era, why don't people understand this?

[Jacks3]

possessions per game during west's era: 110-120

possessions per game during kobe's: 90-95

west played against a bunch of nonathletic white guys, kobe played in the GOAT era for wings.

imagine what he'd do with 15-25 extra possessions a game. probably something like 40 PPG/7-8 RPG/6-7 APG/57-58% TS.

[Sarcastic]

It is pointless to compare stats from the 60's to today's era, why don't people understand this?

Exactly. It's best to compare them to their peers.

[Borat]

Before 2009 I might of picked Jerry West, but in my eyes Kobe has definitely passed him now. Tell me one thing West has an advantage over Kobe? Kobe has more individual accomplishments, greater team success, & he surpassed Jerry West to become the Lakers All-Time leading scorer not to long ago.

The only true edge West has over Kobe is passing, Kobe is a better scorer (this is not debatable), a better athlete, he is a much better ball-handler, & a better defender when he focuses on the defensive end.

Kobe Bryant

West for his time was a superior defender than Bryant. To suggest otherwise is tomfoolery.

LOL at people dissing West for not getting titles. know your history a$$wipes.

Also West isn't a total c0ckhead with no friends.

[Legends66NBA7]

Yes, because stats are biased. Kobe and West just put those numbers up from pixie dust.

So being a better playoff performer is pointless. Good to know.

Being a better finals performer is pointless. Good to know.

The fact West holds notable playoff records and finals records is pointless. Good to know.

Kobe still took 27.2 shots per game to get 35.4ppg in 90.9 possessions "slower pace". Kobe took more shots in one season than West ever did in a "faster pace" game. West only averages one more shot than Kobe in their careers. What a difference of "pace" !

We can only compare them at best vs their peers (non-athletic talk can go to the trash can). So West clearly has the advantage in notable playoff series, finals, etc...

The fact that people are unfairly pinning West for not winning titles (which is what teams do) is nonsense. Some are actually saying it like West was playing like total garbage for the majority of his finals. And it's not like he was facing some easy defense either.

60's 8 peat Boston Celtics had defensive players like:

Bill Russell (would have been racking up the DPOY's and All-Defense First Teams if they existed back then), John Havlicek, Sam Jones, Bailey Howell, K.C. Jones, Tom Sanders, etc...

How about the 70's New York Knicks who had great defensive players like:
Walt Fraizer, Dave DeBusschere, Willis Reed, etc..


Yup, amazing logic being used.

[Gotterdammerung]

:oldlol: at Jacks3 for joining my ignore list in record breaking time. Enjoy the stay & make yourself at home! Plenty of trolls to keep you company! :oldlol:

[Legends66NBA7]

:oldlol: at Jacks3 for joining my ignore list in record breaking time. Enjoy the stay & make yourself at home! Plenty of trolls to keep you company! :oldlol:

If I may...:

http://i35.tinypic.com/vo0vna.jpg

[Hondo]

Kobe takes this with ease.

[Jacks3]

Kobe takes this with ease.
+1

[ThaSwagg3r]

possessions per game during west's era: 110-120

possessions per game during kobe's: 90-95

west played against a bunch of nonathletic white guys, kobe played in the GOAT era for wings.

imagine what he'd do with 15-25 extra possessions a game. probably something like 40 PPG/7-8 RPG/6-7 APG/57-58% TS.
Yet you have Jerry West as your avy. :facepalm

[Kblaze8855]

Something like 3-2 for Kobe at the moment but I got sick of seeing a vote and going to the top to see if they are voters. I'll leave it open for the full 2 days then count it up...then Magic can damn near sweep the winner so MJ can beat him like 15-2.

[Jacks3]

[QUOTE]So being a better playoff performer is pointless. Good to know.
Kobe is the better playoff performer.

Being a better finals performer is pointless. Good to know.
Doesn't mean much since West was playing in a weaker era with 20-30 more possessions. Not to mention Kobe plays much better defenses and much better comp.



Kobe still took 27.2 shots per game to get 35.4ppg in 90.9 possessions "slower pace". Kobe took more shots in one season than West ever did in a "faster pace" game. West only averages one more shot than Kobe in their careers. What a difference of "pace" !
Yeaah, Kobe would do nothing 20-30 extra possessions a game. :oldlol:

Pace doesn't matter at all. West would have no trouble putting up 40+ PPG in the playoffs with 20-30 less possessions right? Wilt doing 50 PPG? Bayler getting 15 RPG? Oscar with a triple-double? Yup. Pace doesn't matter at all.

:roll:


We can only compare them at best vs their peers (non-athletic talk can go to the trash can). So West clearly has the advantage in notable playoff series, finals, etc...
No, he really doesn't. Kobe has the better playoff runs, the better peak, the better prime, he's more durable, has better longevity, more team success, more accolades/accomplishments.





Yup, amazing logic being used.
Yeah, acting like 20-35 extra possessions per game don't matter is such great logic. :roll:

[1987_Lakers]

West for his time was a superior defender than Bryant. To suggest otherwise is tomfoolery.

LOL at people dissing West for not getting titles. know your history a$$wipes.

Also West isn't a total c0ckhead with no friends.

For his time, I agree. But as much as I respect 60's basketball who exactly did West have to guard? We all know Kobe had to guard superior talent, put West in Kobe's era, make them both focus on solely defense and Kobe would do more damage defensively, that's not to say West would be a horrible defender in today's league, I think he would be solid.

[Lebron23]

Jerry West by a slight margin. Just look at his Finals stats.

[Jacks3]

:facepalm

[Doctor Rivers]

Jerry West by a slight margin. Just look at his Finals stats.

ok lebron fan

[Legends66NBA7]

Jerry West by a slight margin. Just look at his Finals stats.

Gets it.

[Jacks3]

kobe by a clear margin. just look at his clearly superior peak, superior prime, superior longevity, superior era/comp, superior defense, superior durability, superior team success.

[Odinn]

West went against 1960s Celtics the most dominant dynasty in the NBA history, along side Jordan's Bulls in 1990s.

If Kobe played in '60s, he wouldn't win anything like Jerry West.
If West played in '00s, he would win mvp/fmvps/scoring champs like Kobe.

It's too close but coz of accomplishment difference, I vote for Kobe Bryant.

[Doctor Rivers]

Doesn't Get it.

fixed

[SteveNashMVPcro]

kobe

[Droid101]

Not much to say here. Inflate Kobe's per game numbers by 30% to compensate for pace (or deflate Jerry's by 30%) and it doesn't look so close.

Kobe Bryant

[OldSchoolBBall]

Kobe is the better playoff performer.

This is a JOKE. :oldlol: West is a top 5 playoff performer in history at a MINIMUM. Kobe, not so much.

[Ronaldinho]

West went against 1960s Celtics the most dominant dynasty in the NBA history, along side Jordan's Bulls in 1990s.

If Kobe played in '60s, he wouldn't win anything like Jerry West.
If West played in '00s, he would win mvp/fmvps/scoring champs like Kobe.

It's too close but coz of accomplishment difference, I vote for Kobe Bryant.
Its the opposite.Kobe would win more if he played in the 60s.He is taller, stronger, more athletic.And is a better player in almost every aspect.

[D-Wade316]

Jerry West by a slight margin. Just look at his Finals stats.
This.

Jerry West

[Rose]

So Kobe.

And we're now, done right?:lol

[Odinn]

Its the opposite.Kobe would win more if he played in the 60s.He is taller, stronger, more athletic.And is a better player in almost every aspect.
:oldlol: :oldlol:

You Kobe-stans.:roll:

[jlip]

Not much to say here. Inflate Kobe's per game numbers by 30% to compensate for pace (or deflate Jerry's by 30%) and it doesn't look so close.

Kobe Bryant

Individual scoring has very little to do with league "pace". It has more to do with the willingness to take shots. Just look at the career fga by players across eras who've avg. roughly the same amount of points over their careers.
Both Wilt and MJ avg. roughly 30ppg for their careers. Despite playing 7 fewer minutes per game and in a much slower era MJ still managed to attempt slightly more fgs per game than Wilt- 22.9 to 22.5.

Both Jerry West and Allen Iverson avg. roughly 27ppg for their careers. Despite playing in a much slower era, Iverson still managed to attempt more shots per game than West- 21.8 to 20.4

Both Kobe and Oscar Robertson avg. roughly 25ppg for their careers. Despite playing in nearly 6 minutes less and a much slower era, Kobe still managed to attempt slightly more shots per game than Big O- 19.4-18.9.

It's quite obvious that these players from the modern, slower era had more than enough possessions to pad their scoring stats. They took more shots than their scoring counterparts from previous eras. You can't just magically throw "pace" into some equation and say, player X would score more if the league had more possessions. Too many other factors figure into the equation along with pace, namely the individual player's willingness to shoot.

The primary individual stat that is affected by pace (and fg%) across eras is rebounds.

[Ronaldinho]

:oldlol: :oldlol:

You Kobe-stans.:roll:
How the hell do you think a player athletic as Kobe and with all the skills, fundamentals e etc would play worse in the 60s.Please explain...


West, on the other hand, could play worse in the 00 since he is not that athletic.

[D-Wade316]

Individual scoring has very little to do with league "pace". It has more to do with the willingness to take shots. Just look at the career fga by players across eras who've avg. roughly the same amount of points over their careers.
Both Wilt and MJ avg. roughly 30ppg for their careers. Despite playing 7 fewer minutes per game and in a much slower era MJ still managed to attempt slightly more fgs per game than Wilt- 22.9 to 22.5.

Both Jerry West and Allen Iverson avg. roughly 27ppg for their careers. Despite playing in a much slower era, Iverson still managed to attempt more shots per game than West- 21.8 to 20.4

Both Kobe and Oscar Robertson avg. roughly 25ppg for their careers. Despite playing in nearly 6 minutes less and a much slower era, Kobe still managed to attempt slightly more shots per game than Big O- 19.4-18.9.

It's quite obvious that these players from the modern, slower era had more than enough possessions to pad their scoring stats. They took more shots than their scoring counterparts from previous eras. You can't just magically throw "pace" into some equation and say, player X would score more if the league had more possessions. Too many other factors figure into the equation along with pace, namely the individual player's willingness to shoot.
JERRY WEST

/thread

[RRR3]

How the hell do you think a player athletic as Kobe and with all the skills, fundamentals e etc would play worse in the 60s.Please explain...


West, on the other hand, could play worse in the 00 since he is not that athletic.
If Kobe had grown up when West did, he wouldn't have access to the same training methods he did growing up when he did.

[Ronaldinho]

If Kobe had grown up when West did, he wouldn't have access to the same training methods he did growing up when he did.
He would still be 6.6 and more athletic than west.

[Jacks3]

This is a JOKE. :oldlol: West is a top 5 playoff performer in history at a MINIMUM. Kobe, not so much.
And yet he shot like 36% in his only championship run. Kobe has 4-5 runs better, and does it with 20-30 less possessions and against better defenses.

You're a joke. :oldlol:

[Jacks3]

Not much to say here. Inflate Kobe's per game numbers by 30% to compensate for pace (or deflate Jerry's by 30%) and it doesn't look so close.

Kobe Bryant
This. Put Kobe in the 60's and he'd average 40-45 PPG/7-9 RPG/6-7 APG very easily.

[Legends66NBA7]

Individual scoring has very little to do with league "pace". It has more to do with the willingness to take shots. Just look at the career fga by players across eras who've avg. roughly the same amount of points over their careers.
Both Wilt and MJ avg. roughly 30ppg for their careers. Despite playing 7 fewer minutes per game and in a much slower era MJ still managed to attempt slightly more fgs per game than Wilt- 22.9 to 22.5.

Both Jerry West and Allen Iverson avg. roughly 27ppg for their careers. Despite playing in a much slower era, Iverson still managed to attempt more shots per game than West- 21.8 to 20.4

Both Kobe and Oscar Robertson avg. roughly 25ppg for their careers. Despite playing in nearly 6 minutes less and a much slower era, Kobe still managed to attempt slightly more shots per game than Big O- 19.4-18.9.

It's quite obvious that these players from the modern, slower era had more than enough possessions to pad their scoring stats. They took more shots than their scoring counterparts from previous eras. You can't just magically throw "pace" into some equation and say, player X would score more if the league had more possessions. Too many other factors figure into the equation along with pace, namely the individual player's willingness to shoot.

The primary individual stat that is affected by pace (and fg%) across eras is rebounds.

This.

[AlphaWolf24]

:roll: at people trying to use math.....

99.9% of the people in this thread never watched Jerry West play.....

it's Kobe...now move along...nothing to see here

[pegasus]

KOBE(insert period here)

[HylianNightmare]

Kobe

i think when it's all said and done he will surpass west

[DMAVS41]

[QUOTE=Legends66NBA7]

Kobe is the better playoff performer.

Doesn't mean much since West was playing in a weaker era with 20-30 more possessions. Not to mention Kobe plays much better defenses and much better comp.



Yeaah, Kobe would do nothing 20-30 extra possessions a game. :oldlol:

Pace doesn't matter at all. West would have no trouble putting up 40+ PPG in the playoffs with 20-30 less possessions right? Wilt doing 50 PPG? Bayler getting 15 RPG? Oscar with a triple-double? Yup. Pace doesn't matter at all.

:roll:


No, he really doesn't. Kobe has the better playoff runs, the better peak, the better prime, he's more durable, has better longevity, more team success, more accolades/accomplishments.





Yeah, acting like 20-35 extra possessions per game don't matter is such great logic. :roll:


This is simply not true. West is the better playoff performer.

[Droid101]

It's quite obvious that these players from the modern, slower era had more than enough possessions to pad their scoring stats. They took more shots than their scoring counterparts from previous eras. You can't just magically throw "pace" into some equation and say, player X would score more if the league had more possessions. Too many other factors figure into the equation along with pace, namely the individual player's willingness to shoot.

The primary individual stat that is affected by pace (and fg%) across eras is rebounds.
Rebounds... and the shot attempts that create them.

Sorry, but if there are 130 possessions in a game, compared to 80, there's going to be a lot more chances to pad EVERY stat.

And since things like Rebound Rate, Assist Rate, Points Per Possession, etc, aren't available from the 60's, we just have to guestimate.

And in all guestimations, Kobe is superior to Jerry West.

[Legends66NBA7]

[QUOTE=Jacks3]


This is simply not true. West is the better playoff performer.

Glad someone else sees the light.

West is also the better finals performer.

And West holds notable playoff and finals records.

[ThaRegul8r]

Kobe would win more if he played in the 60s.

What would Kobe do in that era, minus today's technological advantages, that West, Baylor, Wilt, Oscar, etc., didn't do? What problems would he give, what could he do that the Celtics didn't already see?

Baylor averaged 40.6 points and 17.9 rebounds, scored 61 in a game, had 41 and 22 in Game 7, and won nothing.

West averaged 37.9, had 53 points and 10 assists in Game 1, and dropped 42/13/12 in Game 7, and won nothing for all of that.

Offensive players would go off against the Celtics on occasion and win nothing. What exactly would Kobe do that would be any different from what the Celtics already saw? Three-point line doesn't exist, dunking is frowned upon, any attempts at showboating will get punished, what exactly would Kobe do that all the great offensive players of the era didn't, and got absolutely nothing from for all that?

:confusedshrug:

[ThaSwagg3r]

And yet he shot like 36% in his only championship run. Kobe has 4-5 runs better, and does it with 20-30 less possessions and against better defenses.

You're a joke. :oldlol:
You are the one constantly getting banned on RealGM. :oldlol: You got banned again today, John28

[Kellogs4toniee]

Kobe for me, quite easily too. Relative to his peers, especially at his position, Jerry West might have been better, but factoring in the amount of athleticism at the position these days and how Kobe has still managed to surpass, rise above, and shit* on all peers at the same position puts him above West in my book.

[Jacks3]

This is simply not true. West is the better playoff performer.
Not really. Kobe's best runs are better and against much better comp in a much slower paced league. Prime Kobe in the playoffs in the 60's would be nuts...something like 40-45 PPG/8-9 RPG/7-8 APG every night.

[Jacks3]

Rebounds... and the shot attempts that create them.

Sorry, but if there are 130 possessions in a game, compared to 80, there's going to be a lot more chances to pad EVERY stat.

And since things like Rebound Rate, Assist Rate, Points Per Possession, etc, aren't available from the 60's, we just have to guestimate.

And in all guestimations, Kobe is superior to Jerry West.
+1

[ThaSwagg3r]

+1
How is posting on realGM going? Oh yeah I forgot you got waived today :roll:

[Miller for 3]

Kobe but it's a lot closer than the Kobe trolls think

[DMAVS41]

Not really. Kobe's best runs are better and against much better comp in a much slower paced league. Prime Kobe in the playoffs in the 60's would be nuts...something like 40-45 PPG/8-9 RPG/7-8 APG every night.

You can't do it like that. Its about how they did respective to the era and players that they played against.

My god, put Jason Terry back in the 60's and he's probably a first ballot hall of famer. Doesn't work like that. The game and the players have changed so much in 40 plus years.

And if you want to just drop players in and out of eras with no adaptation or common sense. Then Kobe would get called for traveling and carrying the ball literally every time he would make a move.

[Legends66NBA7]

You can't do it like that. Its about how they did respective to the era and players that they played against.

My god, put Jason Terry back in the 60's and he's probably a first ballot hall of famer. Doesn't work like that. The game and the players have changed so much in 40 plus years.

And if you want to just drop players in and out of eras with no adaptation or common sense. Then Kobe would get called for traveling and carrying the ball literally every time he would make a move.

Who cares about using logic for rankings and comparisons ? Let's use excuses and bias for one player and tear down the other.

[Jacks3]

You can't do it like that. Its about how they did respective to the era and players that they played against.
.
Not really, or else Mikan might me GOAT, or Cousy might be a top 3 PG. It doesn't change the fact that Kobe is flat-out the better player.

Kobe's best runs are just flat-out better in a much slower paced league...and against much better defenses....against much better comp on the wing.

It's a fact.

[Boston C's]

looks like kobe is prolly takin this one... cant wait to see how the kobe vs magic one will turn out... seeing no stans of any sort will vote for that one itll be an interesting debate

[catch24]

looks like kobe is prolly takin this one... cant wait to see how the kobe vs magic one will turn out... seeing no stans of any sort will vote for that one itll be an interesting debate

Rest assure, Magic will be winning that one in a land-slide.

[Boston C's]

Rest assure, Magic will be winning that one in a land-slide.

Yea he def has my vote... itll be hilarious to see the kobe stans bitch and moan though :lol

for the record im a huge fan of kobe just dont like his legion of idiotic fans

[DMAVS41]

Not really, or else Mikan might me GOAT, or Cousy might be a top 3 PG. It doesn't change the fact that Kobe is flat-out the better player.

Kobe's best runs are just flat-out better in a much slower paced league...and against much better defenses....against much better comp on the wing.

It's a fact.

There is absolutely nothing factual about you claiming Kobe is better than West.

Although I do have Kobe ranked over West, your reasons just aren't logical at all.

And actually Mikan does get a huge boost in his all time ranking based on his era. It makes sense....along with Cousy.

Do you really think that if you put Jerry West in the game today that he'd be better than Kevin Durant or Carmelo Anthony? Of course not. So how far do you take this? Is Jerry West not a top 50 player now because he played 50 years ago.

Again, your logic makes no sense at all. Its not about what West would do now or what Kobe would do then. Its about what they did in the time they played and how good they were compared to everyone else in the world playing basketball during their career.

So if you take off the blinders for a second, you realize its actually a legit debate....and you'd also realize that West performed fantastically well in the playoffs throughout his career.

[Jacks3]

There is absolutely nothing factual about you claiming Kobe is better than West.

Although I do have Kobe ranked over West, your reasons just aren't logical at all.


They're perfectly logical. Kobe has better runs in a much better league with much slower pace against much better comp on the wing. It's not hard to see that he's the better player.

[Jacks3]

So if you take off the blinders for a second, you realize its actually a legit debate....and you'd also realize that West performed fantastically well in the playoffs throughout his career.
And if you take off your Kobe-hate blinders for a sec, you'd see that Kobe is clearly superior. Deal with it.

[ThaSwagg3r]

And if you take off your Kobe-hate blinders for a sec, you'd see that Kobe is clearly superior. Deal with it.
How did it feel to get waived again on RealGM today? :oldlol:

[Jacks3]

And actually Mikan does get a huge boost in his all time ranking based on his era. It makes sense....along with Cousy.



.
Actually, neither of those guys are even considered top 25 at this point, despite the fact that they totally owned their era. So yeah, it's not just about "how they did respective to the era and players that they played against".

Era consideration is a big part of ranking players, and Kobe has the clear edge there, whether you like it or not.

[nycelt84]

You can't do it like that. Its about how they did respective to the era and players that they played against.

My god, put Jason Terry back in the 60's and he's probably a first ballot hall of famer. Doesn't work like that. The game and the players have changed so much in 40 plus years.

And if you want to just drop players in and out of eras with no adaptation or common sense. Then Kobe would get called for traveling and carrying the ball literally every time he would make a move.

If you really think that about Jason Terry then you know nothing about 60's basketball.

[DMAVS41]

Actually, neither of those guys are even considered top 25 at this point, despite the fact that they totally owned their era. So yeah, it's not just about "how they did respective to the era and players that they played against".

Era consideration is a big part of ranking players, and Kobe has the clear edge there, whether you like it or not.

Cousy is almost always in the top 25 all time. LOL

[Jacks3]

Cousy is almost always in the top 25 all time. LOL
Not really...nor should he.

[DMAVS41]

If you really think that about Jason Terry then you know nothing about 60's basketball.

If you really think that the game hasn't progressed at the guard level a near infinite amount in 50 years then you know nothing about basketball.

Its not crazy at all to think just inserting Jason Terry in his present form into the 1960's would yield a hall of fame career. And forget Terry....lets say Paul Pierce instead....or Joe Johnson...I don't want to shift the focus. The simple point is that Joe Johnson would be known as a better player historically if he played 50 years ago and was the exact same player.

Which is exactly why you can't use that logic. It simply does not make sense.

[L.Kizzle]

If you really think that the game hasn't progressed at the guard level a near infinite amount in 50 years then you know nothing about basketball.

Its not crazy at all to think just inserting Jason Terry in his present form into the 1960's would yield a hall of fame career. And forget Terry....lets say Paul Pierce instead....or Joe Johnson...I don't want to shift the focus. The simple point is that Joe Johnson would be known as a better player historically if he played 50 years ago and was the exact same player.

Which is exactly why you can't use that logic. It simply does not make sense.
Joe Johnson, I doubt it. He'd be no better than Jo Jo White.

[Gotterdammerung]

Funny how Kobe stans think the only true reason to rank West over Kobe is hatred. :facepalm

Bill Simmons, a notorious Kobe hater, ranks Kobe over West in his Pantheon. :no:

Next!

[Jacks3]

Kobe haters mad that Kobe is indisputably better at this point.

Next.

[RRR3]

Kobe haters mad that Kobe is indisputably better at this point.

Next.

You don't deserve to have Jerry West as your avatar. Don't get me wrong, I would put Kobe over West too, but stop acting like Kobe's miles better.

[Legends66NBA7]

Kobe haters mad that Kobe is indisputably better at this point.

Next.

So that's a "fact" now since you changed your avatar ? hahaha...

[ThaSwagg3r]

Kobe haters mad that Kobe is indisputably better at this point.

Next.
lol at this loser, he gets banned on RealGM AGAIN and now he trolls on here AGAIN. :oldlol:

[Jacks3]

So that's a "fact" now since you changed your avatar ? hahaha...
No, it's a fact because Kobe has the better prime, peak, longevity, durability, team success, accolades/accomplishments, skill-level, and plays in a better era and against better comp.


Next.

[D-Wade316]

lol at this loser, he gets banned on RealGM AGAIN and now he trolls on here AGAIN. :oldlol:
Yeah. IIRC, his current account in RealGM is thong28.

[ThaSwagg3r]

Yeah. IIRC, his current account in RealGM is thong28.
It was John25 today, posted on a Wade thread, everybody knew it was him, and got waived. :oldlol:

[Legends66NBA7]

No, it's a fact because Kobe has the better prime, peak, longevity, durability, team success, accolades/accomplishments, skill-level, and plays in a better era and against better comp.


Next.

Most of that is opinion but whatever. Not like your going to listen to objectivity.

Did AlphaWolf24 take over your computer or something ? What's with the next....

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=liwDVF69Cis

[8BeastlyXOIAD]

It was John25 today, posted on a Wade thread, everybody knew it was him, and got waived. :oldlol:

:oldlol: :oldlol: didn't that happen to you too?

[D-Wade316]

It was John25 today, posted on a Wade thread, everybody knew it was him, and got waived. :oldlol:
Thanks for the correction. I saw that too.

[ThaSwagg3r]

:oldlol: :oldlol: didn't that happen to you too?
It will happen to you too, if you post the same way you post on here. :pimp:

[D-Wade316]

Most of that is opinion but whatever. Not like your going to listen to objectivity.

Did AlphaWolf24 take over your computer or something ? What's with the next....

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=liwDVF69Cis
:lol

[D-Wade316]

It was John25 today, posted on a Wade thread, everybody knew it was him, and got waived. :oldlol:
He probably changes his IP address from time to time.

[Jacks3]

Most of that is opinion but whatever. Not like your going to listen to objectivity.


No, it's all fact. U mad that Kobe is indisputably better and higher All-Time on 99% of lists?

Next.

[8BeastlyXOIAD]

It will happen to you too, if you post the same way you post on here. :pimp:

ISH = Troll Site

REALGM = Serious B-Ball Talk

[ThaSwagg3r]

He probably changes his IP address from time to time.
Even if he does he gets caught everytime. It is funny too because he jacks about 90% of the posts on there. You know you are an idiot when you are considered trolling when you aren't even trying to.

[ThaSwagg3r]

ISH = Troll Site

REALGM = Serious B-Ball Talk
Pretty much, I noticed your ways. :cheers: ISH is good when the season is on but it sucks in the off-season. ISH have the much better off-court topics though.

[8BeastlyXOIAD]

Pretty much, I noticed your ways. :cheers: ISH is good when the season is on but it sucks in the off-season. ISH have the much better off-court topics though.

:cheers:

btw why u hate Lebron so much?

[D-Wade316]

Even if he does he gets caught everytime. It is funny too because he jacks about 90% of the posts on there. You know you are an idiot when you are considered trolling when you aren't even trying to.
As one poster said, "obvious troll is extremely obvious".

[8BeastlyXOIAD]

He probably changes his IP address from time to time.

proxy sites :cheers:

i got waived one time for posting rude comments ............. they actually IP banned me :mad: now i use proxy servers to connect to REALGM forum :cheers:

[ThaSwagg3r]

:cheers:

btw why u hate Lebron so much?
I was a LeBron fan when he was in Cleveland. I always respected Wade and I also liked him too but I use to like LeBron more. The 2010 off-season made me lose all the respect for him. It wasn't the fact that he left Cleveland either, it was the fact that he joined Miami. If he joined Chicago, New Jersey, LA Clippers, New York Knicks (where I wanted him to go) I wouldn't have cared at all. He chose Miami and it was a b1tch move in my opinion. He joins any other team besides Miami and I would probably be rooting for him instead of against him. He has literally abandoned his talents and ruined all of his chances of being a REALLY all-time great.

[Legends66NBA7]

No, it's all fact. U mad that Kobe is indisputably better and higher All-Time on 99% of lists?

Next.

What would I be mad about ? Is this a defensive mechanism or something of insecurity ? I couldn't care less about someone elses opinionated "list", it doesn't make it guaranteed fact. Every list is different anyways. All that matters is how I want to rank them with the proper context, prespective, production, etc...


For this list, Kobe will arguably pass West with the votes I have seen go through. So on this list Kobe would be 3rd all-time and West would be 4th all-time. Oh wow, sure showed me. People are still saying this is close, rather than miles ahead....

What is there to be mad about that at all ? Your just insecure about some who has an objective stance on the subject.

[Jacks3]

What would I be mad about ? Is this a defensive mechanism or something of insecurity ? I couldn't care less about someone elses opinionated "list", it doesn't make it guaranteed fact. Every list is different anyways. All that matters is how I want to rank them with the proper context, prespective, production, etc...


For this list, Kobe will arguably pass West with the votes I have seen go through. So on this list Kobe would be 3rd all-time and West would be 4th all-time. Oh wow, sure showed me. People are still saying this is close, rather than miles ahead....


You're not being objective. Stop lying. Anyway, Kobe will win, so this is all moot.

Next.

[D-Wade316]

proxy sites :cheers:

i got waived one time for posting rude comments ............. they actually IP banned me :mad: now i use proxy servers to connect to REALGM forum :cheers:
I was banned there once too. Can you help me with this one? PM me if you like.

[8BeastlyXOIAD]

I was a LeBron fan when he was in Cleveland. I always respected Wade and I also liked him too but I use to like LeBron more. The 2010 off-season made me lose all the respect for him. It wasn't the fact that he left Cleveland either, it was the fact that he joined Miami. If he joined Chicago, New Jersey, LA Clippers, New York Knicks (where I wanted him to go) I wouldn't have cared at all. He chose Miami and it was a b1tch move in my opinion. He joins any other team besides Miami and I would probably be rooting for him instead of against him. He has literally abandoned his talents and ruined all of his chances of being a REALLY all-time great.


o.i.c.............yEAh i actually wanted Lebron to go to New York. That would have been epic if the Knicks got him along with Amare.

BTW, would the Knicks still have enuff money to sign 4 Felton?

[D-Wade316]

You're not being objective.
:rolleyes:

[ThaSwagg3r]

o.i.c.............yEAh i actually wanted Lebron to go to New York. That would have been epic if the Knicks got him along with Amare.

BTW, would the Knicks still have enuff money to sign 4 Felton?
Maybe, I know that they made a S & T with the Warriors to trade David Lee.

Who would you take to win a playoff series, Wade or LeBron? :D

[8BeastlyXOIAD]

I was banned there once too. Can you help me with this one? PM me if you like.

you need a proxy site?

[Legends66NBA7]

You're not being objective. Stop lying. Anyway, Kobe will win, so this is all moot.

Next.

Whatever you say, AlphaWolf24.

[8BeastlyXOIAD]

Maybe, I know that they made a S & T with the Warriors to trade David Lee.

Who would you take to win a playoff series, Wade or LeBron? :D

depends on the team that is built around them

[Jacks3]

Whatever you say, AlphaWolf24.
I'm not alphawolf.

Next.

[ThaSwagg3r]

Whatever you say, AlphaWolf24.
He is not AlphaWolf24 he is just a moron who is bored.

[8BeastlyXOIAD]

D-Wade316 this should work :cheers:

http://broadsurf.info/browse.php?u=39f2c823ec925a3Oi8vZm9ydW1zLnJlYWxnbS 5jb20vYm9hcmRzL3ZpZXdmb3J1bS5waHA%2FZj02&b=5

[Legends66NBA7]

He is not AlphaWolf24 he is just a moron who is bored.

I know that. But he's stealing Alpha's line. So it's either what you said or they share the same computer or something....

[D-Wade316]

you need a proxy site?
If that's the only way, then proceed.

[8BeastlyXOIAD]

If that's the only way, then proceed.
http://broadsurf.info/browse.php?u=3...aHA%2FZj02&b=5

[Jacks3]

So it's either what you said or they share the same computer or something....
Kobe is better than West and higher All-Time on 99% of lists. Deal with it, you moronic, piece-of-shit mother****ing *******.

Next.

[D-Wade316]

D-Wade316 this should work :cheers:

http://broadsurf.info/browse.php?u=39f2c823ec925a3Oi8vZm9ydW1zLnJlYWxnbS 5jb20vYm9hcmRzL3ZpZXdmb3J1bS5waHA%2FZj02&b=5
I forgot. I changed my PC. I only need to create a new email. TBW.

[The-Legend-24]

Are people really debating this? Kobe is light years ahead of that skinny white dude.

Kobe > West. And it ain't even close.

[Jacks3]

Are people really debating this? Kobe is light years ahead of that skinny white dude.

Kobe > West. And it ain't even close.
+1

[Legends66NBA7]

Kobe is better than West and higher All-Time on 99% of lists.

To your opinion....:

http://mlkshk.com/r/28CZ

[8BeastlyXOIAD]

I forgot. I changed my PC. I only need to create a new email. TBW.

you might still have the same IP address, having a new computer doesn't fix that!

[Jacks3]

To your opinion....:

No, it's a fact, and it's also a fact that 99% of all-time lists have Bryant ahead.

Deal with it, you *******.

Next.

[D-Wade316]

you might still have the same IP address, having a new computer doesn't fix that!
I also have a different internet connection. I was able to go to the main forum without being blocked, the General Discussion, which I wasn't able to do at my previous PC.

[Doranku]

It's not a huge difference, but if you have to choose one, I'd say it's pretty clear that Kobe is the correct choice.

I feel like the top 3 guards are more or less unanimous at this point:

1. Jordan
2. Magic
3. Kobe

[D-Wade316]

No, it's a fact, and it's also a fact that 99% of all-time lists have Bryant ahead.

Deal with it, you *******.

Next.
You never have given any credible facts. The "facts" you present are deeply biased, and flawed.

[Jacks3]

It's not a huge difference, but if you have to choose one, I'd say it's pretty clear that Kobe is the correct choice.

I feel like the top 3 guards are more or less unanimous at this point:

1. Jordan
2. Magic
3. Kobe
This.

[8BeastlyXOIAD]

I also have a different internet connection. I was able to go to the main forum without being blocked, the General Discussion, which I wasn't able to do at my previous PC.

lucky bastard

[Legends66NBA7]

No, it's a fact, and it's also a fact that 99% of all-time lists have Bryant ahead.

Deal with it, you *******.

Next.

Opinion *yawns*.....

[Doctor Rivers]

everyone needs to stop fighting


wade should have been here instead of Copy Cryant

[Jacks3]

Opinion *yawns*.....
Facts. Yawn.

Next.

[Legends66NBA7]

everyone needs to stop fighting


wade should have been here instead of Copy Cryant

None is fighting. I'm laughing really.

Wade ? We will see in a couple of years.

[D-Wade316]

everyone needs to stop fighting


wade should have been here instead of Copy Cryant
:applause:

[Jacks3]

None is fighting.

Kobe> West. U mad?


Next.

[8BeastlyXOIAD]

Jerry West in this era would be a JJ Reddick REAL TALKS BRO!!

6-2
170
6-1 t-rex like arms :lol

[Legends66NBA7]

Kobe> West. U mad ?

Not at all. Why would I be ?

[Jacks3]

Yup. U mad.

Next.

[Legends66NBA7]

Jerry West in this era would be a JJ Reddick REAL TALKS BRO!!

6-2
170
6-1 t-rex like arms :lol

http://img.bestmemes.com/pix/62761800.jpg

[Legends66NBA7]

Yup. U mad.

Next.

http://images.cheezburger.com/completestore/2009/11/9/129022884517120540.jpg

[Kblaze8855]

Trex arms? jerry West had Wade/Rondo like arm length.

[Jacks3]

...
Kobe> Wade. Deal with it.

Next.

[Legends66NBA7]

Trex arms? jerry West had Wade/Rondo like arm length.

He's either clueless about Jerry West or obviously trolling, Kblaze.

Ignorance will be ignorance.

[Legends66NBA7]

Kobe> Wade. Deal with it.

Next.

http://4.bp.blogspot.com/-WAcyG-yJQWo/TcisuHtbcCI/AAAAAAAACJk/bGj0htg6KQc/s1600/captain_obvious.jpg

[Jacks3]

Kobe> Wade now and forever, you goddamn mother****ing *******.

Next.

[Legends66NBA7]

Kobe> Wade now and forever, you goddamn mother****ing *******.

Next.

http://www.planetcalypsoforum.com/gallery/files/1/7/7/9/captain_obvious_rock_gift.jpg

[ThaSwagg3r]

Kobe> Wade now and forever, you goddamn mother****ing *******.

Next.
http://i54.tinypic.com/2akl6p3.gif

[Jacks3]

:banana: :banana: :banana:

[Jacks3]

http://www.planetcalypsoforum.com/gallery/files/1/7/7/9/captain_obvious_rock_gift.jpg
http://i54.tinypic.com/2akl6p3.gif

[SuperPippen]

Kobe> Wade now and forever, you goddamn mother****ing *******.

Next.


:oldlol: at this fool Jacks3 calling people mad when he himself routinely gets madder than hell and says shit like this.





Anyway, I vote Kobe.

[ThaSwagg3r]

http://i54.tinypic.com/2akl6p3.gif
:facepalm swagger jacker

[Jacks3]

:oldlol: at this fool Jacks3 calling people mad when he himself routinely gets madder than hell and says shit like this.





Anyway, I vote Kobe.
http://kneeslappers.info/ks/wp-content/uploads/2011/08/he-aint-even-mad.jpg

*******.

Next.

[Legends66NBA7]

:oldlol: at this fool Jacks3 calling people mad when he himself routinely gets madder than hell and says shit like this.





Anyway, I vote Kobe.

Fixed. Forgot to Bold :P.

[RobertdeMeijer]

Kobe Bryant has been considered the best player in the league, something that can't be said for West.

[tpols]

Kobe seen by and voted as the best player of his generation against:

Shaq and Duncan..

West.. great player, but never in the chamberlain/russel/kareem range, all guys he played with.. but wasn't nearly as commended as.

Kobe clearly garnered more respect amongst his peers despite playing with just as much historically great competition as West. All I need to know..

[Jacks3]

West was the best in 1970.

[Yao Ming's Foot]

Imagine this thread if Kobe was 1-8 in the Finals and shot .37% in his only title year. :oldlol:

The Celtics Dynasty was a dynasty due to the repeated failings of Jerry West and company. Their greatness takes away from Jerry's the same way Jordan's keeps Malone and Stockton for being ranked higher than they are on all time lists.

Even for the efficiency diehards who always somehow ignore the defensive efficiency of the teams these guys faced have no leg to stand on

Regular season

Career TS%

.556>.550

Playoffs TS%

.542>.541

What exactly is the case for West?

[IGOTGAME]

I always wonder why we hold up quotes from players and coaches from different time periods in such high regard but treat every note and comment about Kobe as garbage?

[catch24]

I always wonder why we hold up quotes from players and coaches from different time periods in such high regard but treat every note and comment about Kobe as garbage?

Because Kobe isn't allowed a fair shake. It's part of the unwritten rules...how do you not know this?

[RRR3]

KBlaze what's the score?

[WillC]

I hate voting against Jerry West, but I believe that Kobe Bryant achieved more success in his career and was, arguably, the better player.

So he gets my vote.

[Odinn]

Kobe Bryant has been considered the best player in the league, something that can't be said for West.
When Shaq&Duncan late or past prime and LeBron wasn't in his prime.

Prime Russell... Prime Chamberlain...

[Doctor Rivers]

I hate voting against Jerry West, but I believe that Kobe Bryant achieved more success in his career and was, arguably, the better player.

So he gets my vote.

it pretty much boils down to this statement. anything else is troll speak.

[Kblaze8855]

Kobe won im just trying to count up the votes. Its not easy with all the...rest. Plus im kinda busy tonight.

[Jacks3]

When Shaq&Duncan late or past prime and LeBron wasn't in his prime.

You're pathetic.


Next.

[Jacks3]

I hate voting against Jerry West, but I believe that Kobe Bryant achieved more success in his career and was, indisputably, the better player.
.
Fixed.

[RRR3]

Fixed.
Jesus get a ****ing grip. Your precious Kobe won, you happy? Now watch him get raped by Magic. :oldlol:

[Legends66NBA7]

Jesus get a ****ing grip. Your precious Kobe won, you happy? Now watch him get raped by Magic. :oldlol:

Either Kobe or West would have lost against Magic. It was inevitable.

[RRR3]

Either Kobe or West would have lost against Magic. It was inevitable.
West shouldn't have got past Oscar IMO.

[Legends66NBA7]

West shouldn't have got past Oscar IMO.

Agree to disagree there, but it was razor thin close. To each his own.

[Jacks3]

Jesus get a ****ing grip. Your precious Kobe won, you happy? Now watch him get raped by Magic. :oldlol:
He should be above Magic, but haters gonna hate.

Next.

[RRR3]

He should be above Magic, but haters gonna hate.

Next.
http://i36.tinypic.com/1ptcn5.jpg

[catch24]

http://i36.tinypic.com/1ptcn5.jpg

:roll:

Hilarious gif :cheers:

[Legends66NBA7]

He should be above Magic, but haters gonna hate.

Next.

http://lakers.topbuzz.com/gallery/d/283650-2/Magic+Johnson+has+a+laugh+as+he+watches+a+Lakers+N ets+game.JPG

[Heavincent]

Jesus get a ****ing grip. Your precious Kobe won, you happy? Now watch him get raped by Magic. :oldlol:

Mad.

[Legends66NBA7]

lmao, he's too mad, as usual.

Surprised you didn't end your post with "next" like the mad, unoriginal, AlphaWolf-copying fool you are.

That's what I was saying. Like damn, do him and Alpha share the same computer ? Live in the same house (logical as well) ? Or most logical:

Vanessa Bryant ???

[ThaSwagg3r]

I was going to vote for Kobe for #2 but with the way Jacks is trolling I'm not sure If I still will. I was going to vote for Kobe just to make a case for being over Magic, not because I actually believe it.

[AlphaWolf24]

That's what I was saying. Like damn, do him and Alpha share the same computer ? Live in the same house (logical as well) ? Or most logical:

Vanessa Bryant ???


Nope....that would be DMAVS