Jeff Teague is more athletic than John Wall

[Ikill]

that is all.

[Rnbizzle]

Got any more retarded statements to make? Might as well post them right now, in here so you're not gonna make any new threads..

[DevilsAssassin]

and Derrick Rose is more athletic than both Wall & Teague

[RRR3]

and Derrick Rose is more athletic than both Wall & Teague
And LeBron James is more athletic than all three of them.

[outbreak]

And big baby davis is more athletic then all 3 combined

[xoneatom]

eddy curry just ate jeff teague for breakfast

[wally_world]

and Yao Ming is a better jump ball tipper than Jeff Teague

[Dizzle-2k7]

hes def not faster..but hes def stronger, bigger, and probably just as quick...

[Ikill]

hes def not faster..but hes def stronger, bigger, and probably just as quick...
John Wall is longer taller and heavier so he is bigger than Teague and yeah Teaugue is def not faster. But Jeff is better in every other area IMO seriously unless John Wall is in transition he really is not that athletic.

[Ikill]

and Derrick Rose is more athletic than both Wall & Teague
i agree Westbrooks more athletic than them too

[nathanjizzle]

actually, i am one of those that doubt john wall, but after watching him in a few games this off season, i doubt teague is more athletic than him, he might be quicker but not athletic

[DevilsAssassin]

i agree Westbrooks more athletic than them too

naw i don't agree Jeff is more athletic than Wall.

[Ikill]

And LeBron James is more athletic than all three of them.
current Lebron? :roll: I think Rose is more athletic than even Cavs Lebron

[nathanjizzle]

And LeBron James is more athletic than all three of them.

and all 3 are more skillfull then lebron james.

[Ikill]

naw i don't agree Jeff is more athletic than Wall.
No Rose is more athletic than Westbrook other than speed what does Wall have have over Teague

[Ikill]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TDP1gbGd1FI

[Clippersfan86]

Excellent athlete but nowhere near the all around athlete Wall is. He's slower, weaker, has less hops and doesn't have the change of direction and explosiveness of Wall.

[Ikill]

Excellent athlete but nowhere near the all around athlete Wall is. He's slower, weaker, has less hops and doesn't have the change of direction and explosiveness of Wall.
Too bad Wall is not an all around athlete he has very good max vertical and speed but thats it. Watch the video i posted go to 1:40 Wall can not do that his first step and body control is just not good enough.

[Clippersfan86]

Too bad Wall is not an all around athlete he has very good max vertical and speed but thats it. Watch the video i posted go to 1:40 Wall can not do that his first step and body control is just not good enough.

I watched it. Check it out dude. Wall had the better agility drill times AND better sprint times at the combine. Not to mention Wall is carrying a much bigger frame. Being a great athlete isn't even about these alone though. It's about the whole package coming together. If you have a group of 500 people watch John Wall play... then a group watch Jeff Teague play, even non basketball fans... I can guarantee at least 400 are going to say Wall is the more athletic player.

[Clippersfan86]

BTW about a month or two ago Chauncey Billups said nobody matches Wall's speed and quickness besides Derrick Rose MAYBE. Yes he threw in maybe too. BTW lol at saying Teague has better body control. Wall is arguably better than Rose when it comes to impossible finishes in the lane over defenders. The guy is amazing to watch when he slashes to the hoop.

[DevilsAssassin]

BTW about a month or two ago Chauncey Billups said nobody matches Wall's speed and quickness besides Derrick Rose MAYBE. Yes he threw in maybe too. BTW lol at saying Teague has better body control. Wall is arguably better than Rose when it comes to impossible finishes in the lane over defenders. The guy is amazing to watch when he slashes to the hoop.

STFU :lol

nobody in the league comes closes to what Derrick Rose does to avoid contact..........his body control is un-comparable

[Rnbizzle]

BTW about a month or two ago Chauncey Billups said nobody matches Wall's speed and quickness besides Derrick Rose MAYBE. Yes he threw in maybe too. BTW lol at saying Teague has better body control. Wall is arguably better than Rose when it comes to impossible finishes in the lane over defenders. The guy is amazing to watch when he slashes to the hoop.
I'm not gonna rate him over Rose yet in that category, if he does it consistently on a night to night basis for another year I'd be willing to make that kinda statements, not right now though.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=U29Ujl8hQtk

Just adding that for reference..

[DevilsAssassin]

I'm not gonna rate him over Rose yet in that category, if he does it consistently on a night to night basis for another year I'd be willing to make that kinda statements, not right now though.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=U29Ujl8hQtk

Just adding that for reference..

:bowdown: :bowdown:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Vo9ogunBwuE

I doubt Wall will ever be able to pull that. Rose athleticism is unreal, and his body control is the best in the NBA. Probably the best thing the league has ever seen since Michael Jordan.

[Clippersfan86]

STFU :lol

nobody in the league comes closes to what Derrick Rose does to avoid contact..........his body control is un-comparable

I used the word arguably. You guys have 3 seasons of material to gauge Rose and 1 season of a banged up John Wall who had multiple injuries and played through them Kobe style for the most part.

John Wall is an incredible circus shot finisher at the rim just like Rose is.... and people will see soon enough when they get a bigger sample size.

[DMVLeGenD]

:facepalm Dude WTF are you watching. John Wall is more athleteic than Teague. End of story. Teague is super quick and athletic, but Wall is even faster and more exploxive. Wall might be the fastest player in the NBA (well, maybe behind Ty Lawson and Devin Harris), but you get my point. And call me when Teage ever pulls off these dunks:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5F_zRBsC5BY

Wall's head is at the rim!

And Wall is more athletic than Westbrook. He can do everything Westbrook can. but he's even faster. Wall has greyhound-type speed.

The only PG that MIGHT be more athletic than him is Derrick Rose, but I even think Wall has more straight-line speed than Rose.

[G-train]

Rose athleticism is unreal, and his body control is the best in the NBA. Probably the best thing the league has ever seen since Michael Jordan.

Vince says hi, how are you this evening.

[Clippersfan86]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jH2lXNu2zdY

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=D8EzJgOD7WQ

How are those for Wall's body control?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0jXN4nsT3BY

How's this for Wall's speed and body control combined?

Wall is on Rose's level and it's not even a question to me.

[G-train]

:facepalm Dude WTF are you watching. John Wall is more athleteic than Teague. End of story. Teague is super quick and athletic, but Wall is even faster and more exploxive. Wall might be the fastest player in the NBA (well, maybe behind Ty Lawson and Devin Harris), but you get my point. And call me when Teage ever pulls off these dunks:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5F_zRBsC5BY

Wall's head is at the rim!

And Wall is more athletic than Westbrook. He can do everything Westbrook can. but he's even faster. Wall has greyhound-type speed.

The only PG that MIGHT be more athletic than him is Derrick Rose, but I even think Wall has more straight-line speed than Rose.

Been waiting for this video. Teague definitely cant jump as high.

[Rnbizzle]

I used the word arguably. You guys have 3 seasons of material to gauge Rose and 1 season of a banged up John Wall who had multiple injuries and played through them Kobe style for the most part.

John Wall is an incredible circus shot finisher at the rim just like Rose is.... and people will see soon enough when they get a bigger sample size.
Exactly. I agree. :cheers:

[Clippersfan86]

Vince says hi, how are you this evening.

Yea apparently Air Canada never existed.

[DevilsAssassin]

I used the word arguably. You guys have 3 seasons of material to gauge Rose and 1 season of a banged up John Wall who had multiple injuries and played through them Kobe style for the most part.

John Wall is an incredible circus shot finisher at the rim just like Rose is.... and people will see soon enough when they get a bigger sample size.

Even after Derrick Rose 1st season, he was already crowed the most athletic PG the league has ever seen.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MqUets688Vo

Derrick Rose No Step Vert 34.5.....Max Vert 40
http://www.draftexpress.com/profile/Derrick-Rose-1068/

John Wall No Step Vert 30......Max Vert 39
http://www.draftexpress.com/profile/John-Wall-1339/

Keep in mind Derrick Rose is just 6'2, while John Wall is 6'5. He grew an inch according to a number of sources.

[DMVLeGenD]

Even after Derrick Rose 1st season, he was already crowed the most athletic PG the league has ever seen.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MqUets688Vo

Derrick Rose No Step Vert 34.5.....Max Vert 40
http://www.draftexpress.com/profile/Derrick-Rose-1068/

John Wall No Step Vert 30......Max Vert 38
http://www.draftexpress.com/profile/John-Wall-1339/

Keep in mind Derrick Rose is just 6'2, while John Wall is 6'5. He grew an inch according to a number of sources.

Wall's max vert is 39', not 38', but I agree that Rose has better body control, but Wall is no slouch in that area.

Like I said, Rose might be the only PG in the league that's more athletic than Wall. I think Wall has more pure speed than Rose, but Rose is better at every other athletic dimension.

And LOL @ people calling Wall's athleticism "overrated" after the combine.:facepalm

[Clippersfan86]

Honestly I'd probably take Wall over ANY player in the league as my franchise player probably. His natural gifts at playing PG amaze me. I mean on Sports Science the guy was throwing no look passes through tires from like 30 feet away and other crazy things.

Never again in our life will we see another 6'5 PG with this athleticism, these incredible PG instincts and this basketball IQ all combined. He's as rare as any player I've seen.

BTW yes this means I'd take Wall over Griffin. I honestly would trade Griffin for Wall straight up.

[DevilsAssassin]

Vince says hi, how are you this evening.

I wrote body control......not athleticism



http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jH2lXNu2zdY

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=D8EzJgOD7WQ

How are those for Wall's body control?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0jXN4nsT3BY

How's this for Wall's speed and body control combined?

Wall is on Rose's level and it's not even a question to me.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0BnSaJhh-Fs

:no: please

[Ikill]

BTW about a month or two ago Chauncey Billups said nobody matches Wall's speed and quickness besides Derrick Rose MAYBE. Yes he threw in maybe too. BTW lol at saying Teague has better body control. Wall is arguably better than Rose when it comes to impossible finishes in the lane over defenders. The guy is amazing to watch when he slashes to the hoop.
Walls quickness is not good its okay i guess. The whole bolded part is just wrong unless Wall is in transtion he doesn't do much in terms of slashing to the hoop. Teague creates more separation on his drives and dunks on more people.

[Rnbizzle]

Walls quickness is not good its okay i guess. The whole bolded part is just wrong unless Wall is in transtion he doesn't do much in terms of slashing to the hoop. Teague creates more separation on his drives and dunks on more people.
You're delusional bro.

[DMVLeGenD]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0BnSaJhh-Fs

:no: please

I can do that too.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fFT2Yktz2vo

[Clippersfan86]

Even after Derrick Rose 1st season, he was already crowed the most athletic PG the league has ever seen.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MqUets688Vo

Derrick Rose No Step Vert 34.5.....Max Vert 40
http://www.draftexpress.com/profile/Derrick-Rose-1068/

John Wall No Step Vert 30......Max Vert 38
http://www.draftexpress.com/profile/John-Wall-1339/

Keep in mind Derrick Rose is just 6'2, while John Wall is 6'5. He grew an inch according to a number of sources.

Players improve their verts, strength etc at the NBA level dude. Combine numbers are a good starting point, nothing more. Regardless of who's got the better vert Wall is an equal ALL AROUND athlete. Combine is the wrong thing to use to show Rose's superiority over Wall because they were extremely similar in a lot of ways. The scouts at the combine compared them.

[DevilsAssassin]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0BnSaJhh-Fs

:no: please

I can do that too.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fFT2Yktz2vo[/QUOTE]

so are you telling me Wall got up higher than Rose?

:lol :lol please watch that Derrick Rose video clip again

[Clippersfan86]

I wrote body control......not athleticism




http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0BnSaJhh-Fs

:no: please

I don't get it. Am I supposed to believe they aren't on the same level because of this vid? They are as close as you can get athletically and I'm showing you that with videos of my own. This 360 doesn't make me say OMG Rose>Wall because Wall has plenty of similar shots.

[Ikill]

By the way quickness is the most important and useful part of a gaurds athleticism FACT.

[Clippersfan86]

I can do that too.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fFT2Yktz2vo

so are you telling me Wall got up higher than Rose?

:lol :lol please watch that Derrick Rose video clip again[/QUOTE]

So now vertical is everything? They are within a couple inches of each other vert wise, maybe even equal right now. When it comes to the overall athlete... both are elite, world class and on the same level. Neither is clearly better than the other like you're making it seem.

[DMVLeGenD]

Walls quickness is not good its okay i guess. The whole bolded part is just wrong unless Wall is in transtion he doesn't do much in terms of slashing to the hoop. Teague creates more separation on his drives and dunks on more people.

You kind of have of point. He's a blur in transition, but he can't always get by people in the half-court, but that's mostly because he doesn't have the tightest handle and plays with a high center of gravity. If he worked on his handle and bent at the waist just a little, he would be truly UNSTOPPABLE in the half court.

And Teague might dunk more on people, but that doesn't mean he's more explosive. Wall just isn't as fierce going to the rim, and usually tries to twist his body around for a layup in traffic instead of trying to throw down on someone, but I'm sure he could do the same dunks Teague can.

[DevilsAssassin]

I don't get it. Am I supposed to believe they aren't on the same level because of this vid? They are as close as you can get athletically and I'm showing you that with videos of my own. This 360 doesn't make me say OMG Rose>Wall because Wall has plenty of similar shots.

you said John Wall athleticism was superior or arguably the best in the league.....and i'm correcting you. Derrick Rose is superior in that department.

[Clippersfan86]

you said John Wall athleticism was superior or arguably the best in the league.....and i'm correcting you. Derrick Rose is superior in that department.

Haha quote me on it then because that's a lie. I said Wall is ARGUABLY better when it comes to finishing circus shots inside. Never said he had superior athleticism. I know I wouldn't say that because I think they are as close as it gets athletically as I said a sec ago.

[Ikill]

You're delusional bro.
No im not Walls an overrated athlete watch him when the game slows down he was even having trouble seprating from his defenders in these summer games.

[DevilsAssassin]

So now vertical is everything? They are within a couple inches of each other vert wise, maybe even equal right now. When it comes to the overall athlete... both are elite, world class and on the same level. Neither is clearly better than the other like you're making it seem.

nope.

But what does John Wall have over Derrick Rose that would make you think he is more athletic?

[DMVLeGenD]

so are you telling me Wall got up higher than Rose?

:lol :lol please watch that Derrick Rose video clip again

So now vertical is everything? They are within a couple inches of each other vert wise, maybe even equal right now. When it comes to the overall athlete... both are elite, world class and on the same level. Neither is clearly better than the other like you're making it seem.[/QUOTE]

And plus, a person's max vert REACH is more IMO, and Wall's vert reach is 11'8.5", while Rose's is 11'6.5".

http://www.draftexpress.com/nba-pre-draft-measurements/?year=2010&sort2=DESC&draft=0&pos=0&source=All&sort=12
http://www.draftexpress.com/nba-pre-draft-measurements/?year=2008&sort2=DESC&draft=0&pos=0&source=All&sort=12

Rose might jump a little higher, but it's not substantial, and it all evens out once you take into account Wall's height & length.

[DMVLeGenD]

nope.

But what does John Wall have over Derrick Rose that would make you think he is more athletic?

Wall has the edge in straight-line speed, but that's probably it.

[Clippersfan86]

You kind of have of point. He's a blur in transition, but he can't always get by people in the half-court, but that's mostly because he doesn't have the tightest handle and plays with a high center of gravity. If he worked on his handle and bent at the waist just a little, he would be truly UNSTOPPABLE in the half court.

And Teague might dunk more on people, but that doesn't mean he's more explosive. Wall just isn't as fierce going to the rim, and usually tries to twist his body around for a layup in traffic instead of trying to throw down on someone, but I'm sure he could do the same dunks Teague can.

This has a lot more to do with the fact that like Rose... Teague is a score first player, not a proper playmaking PG like Wall. Both Rose and Teague are constantly looking to be aggressive on offense and score buckets. Wall is primarily a pass first player who likes to set up with the drive and dish and run the fastbreak to go with a little pick and roll.

You can't compare them if they don't have the same mentality. Wall's trying to get teammates involved most of the game and make plays, not drop 40 points. So of course he's not going to dunk on people as often etc. You don't gauge athleticism on how often a player dunks on people etc. Athleticism isn't always about finishing either. It can be getting past your man, on the defensive end and how you play off the ball as well.

[DevilsAssassin]

Sport Science .............i know this doesn't show you everything ............ but it does show you somethings ;)

Derrick Rose
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ffQeTIM1ceg

John Wall
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8jBE46ba01Q&feature=related

[Clippersfan86]

Wall has the edge in straight-line speed, but that's probably it.

The way I see it is....

Explosiveness= Rose
Speed= Wall
Agility=Wall
Leaping ability=Rose
Body control= Equal
Strength=Wall
Endurance=Rose

These are some of the main categories that define athleticism and my opinions of who has the edge. As you can see they split 3 each and tie in one in my opinion. They are very close.

[Ikill]

The way I see it is....

Explosiveness= Rose
Speed= Wall
Agility=Wall
Leaping ability=Rose
Body control= Equal
Strength=WallEndurance=Rose

These are some of the main categories that define athleticism and my opinions of who has the edge. As you can see they split 3 each and tie in one in my opinion. They are very close.
:roll: and how about quickness

[DevilsAssassin]

The way I see it is....

Explosiveness= Rose
Speed= Equal
Agility=Rose
Leaping ability=Rose
Body control= Rose
Strength=Rose
Endurance=Rose

btw not trolling.

[DMVLeGenD]

Sport Science .............i know this doesn't show you everything ............ but it does show you somethings ;)

Derrick Rose
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ffQeTIM1ceg

John Wall
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8jBE46ba01Q&feature=related

LOL @ them saying Rose only has a 35" vertical. :lol :facepalm

[Clippersfan86]

Sport Science .............i know this doesn't show you everything ............ but it does show you somethings ;)

Derrick Rose
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ffQeTIM1ceg

John Wall
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8jBE46ba01Q&feature=related

Basically these videos just show Wall has superior PG skills while Rose relies more on athleticism? What was I supposed to be learning? BTW you showed earlier the combine said Wall's vert was 38 and Sports Science got a 39 out of him. Shows exactly why you can't get caught up on things like combine vert when comparing.

When they are assessing Derrick Rose they are making so many assumptions and estimations that it's laughable. It's on par with saying... this player scored 15 points in the first half... so by the end of the game he will have 30 points. We all know sports don't work that way.

BTW Wall beat Rose by literally 4 inches on the Sports Science vertical leap... so not sure you're helping your case any here.

[DevilsAssassin]

LOL @ them saying Rose only has a 35" vertical. :lol :facepalm

i think they were talking about his no step vertical leap..........but ESPN does fails a lot of times :oldlol:

[Clippersfan86]

:roll: and how about quickness

I categorized quickness as explosiveness. When we are talking about explosiveness we are talking about the force at which a player moves or changes direction in basketball. The speed in which you go from relaxed to 100 percent. To me that's basically quickness. So I gave the edge to Rose in quickness/explosiveness.

[G-train]

I wrote body control......not athleticism



Yeah and I'm talking about body control.

if you think Rose has better body control than Vince I don't know what to say.

[DevilsAssassin]

Basically these videos just show Wall has superior PG skills while Rose relies more on athleticism? What was I supposed to be learning? BTW you showed earlier the combine said Wall's vert was 38 and Sports Science got a 39 out of him. Shows exactly why you can't get caught up on things like combine vert when comparing.

When they are assessing Derrick Rose they are making so many assumptions and estimations that it's laughable. It's on par with saying... this player scored 15 points in the first half... so by the end of the game he will have 30 points. We all know sports don't work that way.

BTW Wall beat Rose by literally 4 inches on the Sports Science vertical leap... so not sure you're helping your case any here.
like i wrote before i posted the video..............


i know this doesn't show you everything ............ but it does show you somethings ;)

[Ikill]

You kind of have of point. He's a blur in transition, but he can't always get by people in the half-court, but that's mostly because he doesn't have the tightest handle and plays with a high center of gravity. If he worked on his handle and bent at the waist just a little, he would be truly UNSTOPPABLE in the half court.

And Teague might dunk more on people, but that doesn't mean he's more explosive. Wall just isn't as fierce going to the rim, and usually tries to twist his body around for a layup in traffic instead of trying to throw down on someone, but I'm sure he could do the same dunks Teague can.
Wall is more athletic in transtion Teague is more athletic in the half court. But i would take Teagues quickness over Walls speed yeah Walls athleticism is great to watch when he is on the fast break but Teagues athletcicsim is more useful.

[Clippersfan86]

like i wrote before i posted the video..............

I understand but I'm telling you I don't see the point to those videos :confusedshrug: . They ESTIMATE that based on game footage they can tell the speed, quickness, vert of Rose which is impossible to be 100 percent accurate on. The only things I gathered are...

1. Rose is an elite athlete
2. Wall had a higher vert
3. Wall is the more gifted passer/playmaker
4. Rose is one of the most explosive athletes in NBA history


I know all of these things already.... :confusedshrug:

[Ikill]

I categorized quickness as explosiveness. When we are talking about explosiveness we are talking about the force at which a player moves or changes direction in basketball. The speed in which you go from relaxed to 100 percent. To me that's basically quickness. So I gave the edge to Rose in quickness/explosiveness.
Yeah my bad. but Rose is way stronger than Wall

[DevilsAssassin]

I understand but I'm telling you I don't see the point to those videos :confusedshrug: . They ESTIMATE that based on game footage they can tell the speed, quickness, vert of Rose which is impossible to be 100 percent accurate on. The only things I gathered are...

1. Rose is an elite athlete
2. Wall had a higher vert
3. Wall is the more gifted passer/playmaker
4. Rose is one of the most explosive athletes in NBA history


I know all of these things already.... :confusedshrug:

bolded is false.

They were talking about Derrick Rose no step vertical leap!!

which is 34.5" which = 35"

[DMVLeGenD]

Remember this gem?

http://www.insidehoops.com/forum/showthread.php?t=175209

LOL @ the OP calling Wall "overrated" just because of his vertical. BTW, he got Wall's max vert wrong. He said it was 36.5", but it was really 39".

"heavy legged" "Not explosive" "Not a quick leaper" WTF! :roll:

[Clippersfan86]

bolded is false.

They were talking about Derrick Rose no step vertical leap!!

which is 34.5" which = 35"

It doesn't specify what kind of vert for either player. Just says 39 inch vert for Wall, 35 for Rose so how did you come to that conclusion?

[Ikill]

I'm pretty sure Rose was injured during the combine too and can we stop comparing Rose and Walls athleticism its really not even close. Rose has all time great athleticism.

[Ikill]

Remember this gem?

http://www.insidehoops.com/forum/showthread.php?t=175209

LOL @ the OP calling Wall "overrated" just because of his vertical. BTW, he got Wall's max vert wrong. He said it was 36.5", but it was really 39".

"heavy legged" "Not explosive" "Not a quick leaper" WTF! :roll:
Walls a very quick leaper but yeah he is not explosive i think his lack of first step and 30 inch no step vert kind of show that.

[DevilsAssassin]

Derrick Rose Athleticism :bowdown: :bowdown:

Derrick Rose baptizes Dragic
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=H3cUl4iO5d0

Derrick Rose 3 Nasty Dunks
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=e04uyfgVgjY&feature=related

Derrick Rose Reverse Slam
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iJktVDUiDIk

Derrick Rose incredible Lay-Up
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZHux-OqW950

Derrick Rose reverse lay-up
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TNdk8kkozZs

Derrick Rose shows Westbrook how to do it
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JrRs5K08S68&feature=related

Derrick Rose reverse lay-up
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MyIEhnv3Cqc&feature=related

Love watching this guy play

[Clippersfan86]

I'm pretty sure Rose was injured during the combine too and can we stop comparing Rose and Walls athleticism its really not even close. Rose has all time great athleticism.

If I had to pick between Wall or Rose as my PG I take Wall without even blinking. He's not only the smarter player and better point guard but he has equal upside and athleticism. Rose fans need to relax in thinking that he's untouchable because he's not.

[RRR3]

current Lebron? :roll: I think Rose is more athletic than even Cavs Lebron
http://media.tumblr.com/tumblr_lkol4pk0MJ1qf54x4.gif

And people say LeBron isn't becoming underrated. :facepalm

[DMVLeGenD]

Derrick Rose Athleticism :bowdown: :bowdown:

Derrick Rose baptizes Dragic
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=H3cUl4iO5d0

Derrick Rose 3 Nasty Dunks
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=e04uyfgVgjY&feature=related

Derrick Rose Reverse Slam
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iJktVDUiDIk

Derrick Rose incredible Lay-Up
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZHux-OqW950

Derrick Rose reverse lay-up
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TNdk8kkozZs

Derrick Rose shows Westbrook how to do it
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JrRs5K08S68&feature=related

Derrick Rose reverse lay-up
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MyIEhnv3Cqc&feature=related

Love watching this guy play

I can sit here posting athletic plays Wall has made all day long.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=i4SmKL5UHhs&feature=related

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=czybugWoKJ0&feature=related

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R-Ayf4p8f80&feature=related

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_j3S9-sCWGw&feature=related

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lF90lEkRfIc&feature=related

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ABEH2KzQeXM&feature=related

Got some more?

[RRR3]

and all 3 are more skillfull then lebron james.
What amazing skills does the great Rose have? Shooting 6 percent when LeBron guards him? Missing free throws in key situations? Chucking up 20 threes a game and making 1 or 2 of them? Shooting his team out of the playoffs? Getting shat on by Jeff Teague and Darren Collison? :roll: :roll:

[Ikill]

If I had to pick between Wall or Rose as my PG I take Wall without even blinking. He's not only the smarter player and better point guard but he has equal upside and athleticism. Rose fans need to relax in thinking that he's untouchable because he's not.
Thats great if you would take Wall but we are talking about their athleticism and Rose is way more athletic than Wall. How is Wall the smarter player cause he put up nice assist numbers. Rose is smarter from what i've seen Wall has better court vision is Lebron a smarter player than Jordan?

[Rnbizzle]

If I had to pick between Wall or Rose as my PG I take Wall without even blinking. He's not only the smarter player and better point guard but he has equal upside and athleticism. Rose fans need to relax in thinking that he's untouchable because he's not.
I disagree, Rose has proven to be clutch and a great leader. I'll admit, it's not easy for Wall to show the same qualities on that bad Wizards team. The facts remain that Rose has proven to be a good/great playoff performer, while Wall is yet to make the playoffs. The leadership abilities, work ethic and will to win should be worth something.

[DMVLeGenD]

Rose can't can't change direction in mid-stride like this. Wall is probably the only player I've seen do this:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RdqYHPtMB8U&feature=related

[Clippersfan86]

Thats great if you would take Wall but we are talking about their athleticism and Rose is way more athletic than Wall. How is Wall the smarter player cause he put up nice assist numbers. Rose is smarter from what i've seen Wall has better court vision is Lebron a smarter player than Jordan?

It's not all about assists. Wall plays PG the right way. The job of a PG is to set up teammates first, not score. Sure Rose has made a nice niche for himself as a scoring PG but it's been proven countless times that a pass first PG is superior to a score first one. Look at the top PG's in NBA history. Magic and Stockton. The 2 best passers/playmakers in NBA history. This is why when CP3 is healthy people quickly say he's better than Rose again. Because they see how PG is SUPPOSED to be played.

Chris Paul can still drop 30 on you.. but it's within the flow of the game and AFTER he gets teammates involved, not before.

[Ikill]

I can sit here posting athletic plays Wall has made all day long.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=i4SmKL5UHhs&feature=related

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=czybugWoKJ0&feature=related

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R-Ayf4p8f80&feature=related

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_j3S9-sCWGw&feature=related

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lF90lEkRfIc&feature=related

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ABEH2KzQeXM&feature=related

Got some more?
All of Walls highlights are sprints down the floor and in the last you see how Wall has to start all the way from halfcourt to beat Evan Turner.

[Ikill]

Rose can't can't change direction in mid-stride like this. Wall is probably the only player I've seen do this:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RdqYHPtMB8U&feature=related
I can agree with you on the change of direction

[Clippersfan86]

I disagree, Rose has proven to be clutch and a great leader. I'll admit, it's not easy for Wall to show the same qualities on that bad Wizards team. The facts remain that Rose has proven to be a good/great playoff performer, while Wall is yet to make the playoffs. The leadership abilities, work ethic and will to win should be worth something.

Both have intangibles in spades. The difference is Wall has much greater potential to be the more dominant ALL AROUND PG.

Would you rather have a PG who puts up

22 ppg, 11+ apg, 5 rpg and 3 spg

Or a PG who puts up

27 ppg, 8 apg, 5 rpg and 1.5-2 spg

I mean Rose's only area statistically I see noticeably improving from this point is his scoring. Wall is bigger and longer so will likely be the better defender, rebounder... not to mention he already passes better and gets more steals.

[DMVLeGenD]

I disagree, Rose has proven to be clutch and a great leader. I'll admit, it's not easy for Wall to show the same qualities on that bad Wizards team. The facts remain that Rose has proven to be a good/great playoff performer, while Wall is yet to make the playoffs. The leadership abilities, work ethic and will to win should be worth something.

Wall hasn't been able to prove himself yet. Walll might have all of those intangibles for all we know.

[Rnbizzle]

Wall hasn't been able to prove himself yet. Walll might have all of those intangibles for all we know.
Agreed, but for Rose they are already facts, so choosing Wall over Rose right now, is a gamble in those aspects. I would go with Rose, until Wall has proven he can live up to the hype.

[Ikill]

It's not all about assists. Wall plays PG the right way. The job of a PG is to set up teammates first, not score. Sure Rose has made a nice niche for himself as a scoring PG but it's been proven countless times that a pass first PG is superior to a score first one. Look at the top PG's in NBA history. Magic and Stockton. The 2 best passers/playmakers in NBA history. This is why when CP3 is healthy people quickly say he's better than Rose again. Because they see how PG is SUPPOSED to be played.

Chris Paul can still drop 30 on you.. but it's within the flow of the game and AFTER he gets teammates involved, not before.
No the job of the PG is to put the team in the best postion to score the basketball since Rose is the best scorer he scores. Passing PG and scoring pg its just a style of play one is not better than the other. People say CP3 is better not because he is a pass first but because he is just flat out better his numbers were amazing in 08 and 09.

[Ikill]

http://media.tumblr.com/tumblr_lkol4pk0MJ1qf54x4.gif

And people say LeBron isn't becoming underrated. :facepalm
Do you count size as athlesism if not than Cavs Lebron and Rose are very close and Rose is easily more athletic than current Lebron.

[Clippersfan86]

No the job of the PG is to put the team in the best postion to score the basketball since Rose is the best scorer he scores. Passing PG and scoring pg its just a style of play one is not better than the other. People say CP3 is better not because he is a pass first but because he is just flat out better his numbers were amazing in 08 and 09.

If you want to see how the direction of the Bulls is going... watch the 01 Sixers. Surrounding an elite scoring combo guard with a defensive minded coach and defensive minded players (besides Boozer). Like AI... Rose just got his MVP and plays a great 1 on 1 game. Problem is as currently constructed they will fiz out within a couple years.

You can't have a team succeed that's so dependent on 1 player. Don't get me wrong the Bulls will probably be ECF regulars for the next decade or so which is amazing.... but to really get over the top and win some rings they will need a consistent second scoring option (Boozer was supposed to be that) and Rose will need to evolve into a player that passes more often and shoots less often.

[DMVLeGenD]

Agreed, but for Rose they are already facts, so choosing Wall over Rose right now, is a gamble in those aspects. I would go with Rose, until Wall has proven he can live up to the hype.

iight, just wanted to make sure I understood your post.

[DMVLeGenD]

Do you count size as athlesism if not than Cavs Lebron and Rose are very close and Rose is easily more athletic than current Lebron.

I'm not sos ure about Rose being more athletic than Cavs LeBron. I think Cavs LeBron was the greatest athleter in NBA history. Rose is easily more athletic than current LeBron though.

[hammer2010]

I heard John Wall has saggy balls.

[eliteballer]

Keep in mind a guy like Rose is more physically mature than Wall. Wall has more room to improve physically.

[Ikill]

If you want to see how the direction of the Bulls is going... watch the 01 Sixers. Surrounding an elite scoring combo guard with a defensive minded coach and defensive minded players (besides Boozer). Like AI... Rose just got his MVP and plays a great 1 on 1 game. Problem is as currently constructed they will fiz out within a couple years.

You can't have a team succeed that's so dependent on 1 player. Don't get me wrong the Bulls will probably be ECF regulars for the next decade or so which is amazing.... but to really get over the top and win some rings they will need a consistent second scoring option (Boozer was supposed to be that) and Rose will need to evolve into a player that passes more often and shoots less often.
How does this have to do with Rose playing pg your not going win with only one creator on your team thats kind of obvious. It didn't work for Iverson a SG that just focused on scoring it didn't work for Lebron an all around SF and didn't work for Chris Paul a pass first pg. so yeah i agree the Bulls are not going to win with only Derrick Rose. Rose is not a combo gaurd.

[Ikill]

I'm not sos ure about Rose being more athletic than Cavs LeBron. I think Cavs LeBron was the greatest athleter in NBA history. Rose is easily more athletic than current LeBron though.
You think Rose is close to Cavs Lebron?

[chips93]

You think Rose is close to Cavs Lebron?

if you disregard height, then rose is above lebron. but its pretty difficult to separate the two. i usually just look at it from a 'physical profile' point of view. which guy has the best physical attributes. height and athleticism are too intertwined to say for sure.

[DevilsAssassin]

If I had to pick between Wall or Rose as my PG I take Wall without even blinking. He's not only the smarter player and better point guard but he has equal upside and athleticism. Rose fans need to relax in thinking that he's untouchable because he's not.

well good for you.

i'd take Derrick Rose over John Wall.

What he has been able to do in just 3 season is astonishing.
[B]
NBA Most Valuable Player (2011)
NBA Rookie of the Year (2009)
2

[DevilsAssassin]

Both have intangibles in spades. The difference is Wall has much greater potential to be the more dominant ALL AROUND PG.

Would you rather have a PG who puts up

22 ppg, 11+ apg, 5 rpg and 3 spg

Or a PG who puts up

27 ppg, 8 apg, 5 rpg and 1.5-2 spg

I mean Rose's only area statistically I see noticeably improving from this point is his scoring. Wall is bigger and longer so will likely be the better defender, rebounder... not to mention he already passes better and gets more steals.

wtf are you basing these stats from?

[hawkfan]

and Derrick Rose is more athletic than both Wall & Teague

Teague is faster than Rose, but Rose is stronger.

[Rnbizzle]

Teague is faster than Rose, but Rose is stronger.
There is no way Jeff Teague is faster, quicker or more agile then Derrick Rose, sorry he just isn't.

[ILLsmak]

dey shuda never gave yall kids da internetz.

-Smak

[D-Wade316]

By the way quickness is the most important and useful part of a gaurds athleticism FACT.
The reason why Wade is the best guard in the NBA, and no one is even close.

[chips93]

dey shuda never gave yall kids da internetz.

-Smak

signing your posts is pretentious

-chip

[Rnbizzle]

signing your posts is pretentious

-chip
Agreed.

~Rnbizzle

[Clippersfan86]

The reason why Wade is the best guard in the NBA, and no one is even close.

Talk about a load of crap. Wade may be the best guard but he's not the clear cut most athletic guard in the game. I'd say Rose, Westbrook, Gordon, Harden and a couple others are all around better athletes. Maybe Wade is better at using his athleticism and controls it better... but not the best athlete.

[D-Wade316]

Talk about a load of crap. Wade may be the best guard but he's not the clear cut most athletic guard in the game. I'd say Rose, Westbrook, Gordon, Harden and a couple others are all around better athletes. Maybe Wade is better at using his athleticism and controls it better... but not the best athlete.
Where did I state that Wade is the most athletic guard? :facepalm I only agreed that Wade is the quickest guard and that quickness is the most important aspect of athleticism. Since Wade utilizes this to perfection like no other, he is the best.

[Clippersfan86]

Where did I state that Wade is the most athletic guard? :facepalm I only agreed that Wade is the quickest guard and that quickness is the most important aspect of athleticism. Since Wade utilizes this to perfection like no other, he is the best.

It was implied. Wade isn't anywhere near the quickest either though dude. Wade's the best because of the COMBINATION he has of skill and athleticism. Just don't think he should be getting called the quickest or most athletic at least not now after he's 29 years old and has had a ton of injuries.

[D-Wade316]

It was implied. Wade isn't anywhere near the quickest either though dude. Wade's the best because of the COMBINATION he has of skill and athleticism. Just don't think he should be getting called the quickest or most athletic at least not now after he's 29 years old and has had a ton of injuries.
Quickness is the combination of physical capablities with bball IQ. A guy can't be called "quick" if he can't decide in a split second which direction he should change. Quickness isn't just about v=d/t. Who in the league has the deadliest basket attacks? No need to answer.

Anyway. I might derail this thread, because of inserting Wade. I'm out.

[DevilsAssassin]

dey shuda never gave yall kids da internetz.

-Smak

stfu u punk azz wigga

[Ikill]

It was implied. Wade isn't anywhere near the quickest either though dude. Wade's the best because of the COMBINATION he has of skill and athleticism. Just don't think he should be getting called the quickest or most athletic at least not now after he's 29 years old and has had a ton of injuries.
The only player quicker than Wade right now is Rose but Wade has a better better change of direction. Age is just a number Wade hasn't lost any athleticism

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8p52I1Oy-7M Wade from 04-07
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pPVzvf3nPxQ Wade from 09-11

[DevilsAssassin]

The only player quicker than Wade right now is Rose but Wade has a better better change of direction. Age is just a number Wade hasn't lost any athleticism

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8p52I1Oy-7M Wade from 04-07
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pPVzvf3nPxQ Wade from 09-11

:bowdown: :bowdown: :bowdown:

[Ikill]

Talk about a load of crap. Wade may be the best guard but he's not the clear cut most athletic guard in the game. I'd say Rose, Westbrook, Gordon, Harden and a couple others are all around better athletes. Maybe Wade is better at using his athleticism and controls it better... but not the best athlete.
Wades is the 3rd most athletic gaurd behind Rose and Westbrook in terms of in game athleticism

[DMVLeGenD]

The only player quicker than Wade right now is Rose but Wade has a better better change of direction. Age is just a number Wade hasn't lost any athleticism

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8p52I1Oy-7M Wade from 04-07
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pPVzvf3nPxQ Wade from 09-11

:applause: THIS. I laugh when people say Wade is declining. He's as athletic as he was in his prime. LeBron is younger than him, and he's lost WAYY more athleticism than Wade has.

[Ikill]

:bowdown: :bowdown: :bowdown:
you like that line

[Clippersfan86]

:applause: THIS. I laugh when people say Wade is declining. He's as athletic as he was in his prime. LeBron is younger than him, and he's lost WAYY more athleticism than Wade has.

I agree Lebron has declined way more noticeably athletically. Doesn't mean Wade hasn't lost anything at all. Regardless I consider Wall, Rose and Westbrook better athletes, not better players.

[DevilsAssassin]

:applause: THIS. I laugh when people say Wade is declining. He's as athletic as he was in his prime. LeBron is younger than him, and he's lost WAYY more athleticism than Wade has.

Lebron hasn't lost shit.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5F_zRBsC5BY

still that scary mofo

[Ikill]

I agree Lebron has declined way more noticeably athletically. Doesn't mean Wade hasn't lost anything at all. Regardless I consider Wall, Rose and Westbrook better athletes, not better players.
Wade hasn't lost anything did you see those videos there is no diffrence

[D-Wade316]

I agree Lebron has declined way more noticeably athletically. Doesn't mean Wade hasn't lost anything at all. Regardless I consider Wall, Rose and Westbrook better athletes, not better players.
Fair enough

[Clippersfan86]

Wade hasn't lost anything did you see those videos there is no diffrence

I'd rather base it on watching him since he was a rookie in 03 rather than on a couple highlight plays dude. That would be like me showing you highlights of Vince Carter in NJ and saying see! He hasn't lost anything since Toronto. Or posting videos of Kobe in the last 3-4 seasons.

I know just from watching Wade that he's a step slower and a tad bit less athletic. It's not that noticeable but no question there are quicker and more athletic players than him right now, even if not by a big margin. Wade is still an ELITE, world class athlete.

[Clippersfan86]

Fair enough

BTW.... Not sure if it's you doing it but a few people including me are getting random negs from you (or at least it has your signature). So if you're getting negged a lot that's why. Lately a lot of pus*ies on ISH are negging me and tagging the neg with another users name so just a heads up.

[Ikill]

Wade hasn't lost anything did you see those videos there is no diffrence
well his fist step is not as good and he's not as agile but he's replaced it by getting stronger and heavier.

[Ikill]

BTW.... Not sure if it's you doing it but a few people including me are getting random negs from you (or at least it has your signature). So if you're getting negged a lot that's why. Lately a lot of pus*ies on ISH are negging me and tagging the neg with another users name so just a heads up.
i got negged 4 times for making this but got repped twice so nothing changed

[DevilsAssassin]

who the **** cares about getting negged

[Ikill]

who the **** cares about getting negged
true

[D-Wade316]

BTW.... Not sure if it's you doing it but a few people including me are getting random negs from you (or at least it has your signature). So if you're getting negged a lot that's why. Lately a lot of pus*ies on ISH are negging me and tagging the neg with another users name so just a heads up.
:wtf: I have never negged you. I don't neg posters randomly. I don't write my name in the comments. Must be some idiot who tries to blackmail me. Your a decent poster, you aren't agenda driven, so why should I neg you? I've been also getting a lot of negs.

[Clippersfan86]

:wtf: I have never negged you. I don't neg posters randomly. I don't write my name in the comments. Must be some idiot who tries to blackmail me. Your a decent poster, you aren't agenda driven, so why should I neg you? I've been also getting a lot of negs.

I'll rep you to offset a little of it. One of my reps isn't big but it's worth 5 negs from the retard no name posters who are randomly negging. Yea someone called me an idiot with a neg.. and signed your name. :cheers:

[DMVLeGenD]

Lebron hasn't lost shit.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5F_zRBsC5BY

still that scary mofo

Leaping ability IMO is the least important athletic trait, and LeBron has lost some bounce too. The only time he can get that high in games any is if he has a long ass running start. If not, you see dunks like this:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9HutLHan6to

LeBron has lost a lot of quickness, agility, fluidity, and overall athleticism. It was evident in the Finals, and he can't even beat people off the dribble in these charity games.

[Clippersfan86]

Leaping ability IMO is the least important athletic trait, and LeBron has lost some bounce too. The only time he can get that high in games any is if he has a long ass running start. If not, you see dunks like this:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9HutLHan6to

LeBron has lost a lot of quickness, agility, fluidity, and overall athleticism. It was evident in the Finals, and he can't even beat people off the dribble in these charity games.

Exactly. People seem to think vertical leap means athletic or not athletic. It's the combination of multiple things such as vertical, endurance, explosiveness, speed, change of direction etc. Many things are related to athleticism and Lebron HAS clearly declined some. I mean the guy struggled to get by big men in the playoffs last year. The play where he tried to get by 7' Omar Asik and had to flop because he couldn't is a classic and hilarious play.

[DevilsAssassin]

Leaping ability IMO is the least important athletic trait, and LeBron has lost some bounce too. The only time he can get that high in games any is if he has a long ass running start. If not, you see dunks like this:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9HutLHan6to

LeBron has lost a lot of quickness, agility, fluidity, and overall athleticism. It was evident in the Finals, and he can't even beat people off the dribble in these charity games.

true dat