Rick Adelman will make Kevin Love a perennial all star.

[Clippersfan86]

People will see that Love's season last year was no fluke. People will see an improved Kevin love who puts up even better numbers this year and improves quite a bit. Wolves fans will start to appreciate him more and stop underrating him. Wolves will make the playoffs in 2012-2013 led by Kevin Love.

[airchibundo507]

it's not the magnitude of the stats that make him overrated, it's the lack of impact. bigger numbers won't change that in my mind unless the timberwolves are significantly better.

[Clippersfan86]

it's not the magnitude of the stats that make him overrated, it's the lack of impact. bigger numbers won't change that in my mind unless the timberwolves are significantly better.

I agree his impact hasn't been huge but I expect that to improve.

[RRR3]

PF is easily the deepest position in the NBA right now. So I doubt it.

[Clippersfan86]

PF is easily the deepest position in the NBA right now. So I doubt it.

Kevin Love>Aldridge>Pau Gasol>Zbo>Duncan going forward. His only legit competition in the west is Griffin who will likely be the all star starter for most of the next decade in the west.

[T-Time3]

NO, Kevin Love will make HIMSELF a perenial all star.
after what adelman did to T-Mac after his microfracture surgery back then,and after seeing houston struggle this past season, i don't know i just don't like him.

[chips93]

good to see clipperfan making a non-clipper thread . . .

love supposedly was a really good passer in college, so i'll be interested to see if adelman can find a way to utilise his passing, because so far in his nba career, there hasnt been much of it. in adelman's system there wont be as much black-hole post play that love can get into.

rubio should thrive under adelman too, running the break like white chocalate.

adelman was a great hire. kahn deserves credit for this.

[airchibundo507]

Kevin Love>Aldridge>Pau Gasol>Zbo>Duncan going forward. His only legit competition in the west is Griffin who will likely be the all star starter for most of the next decade in the west.

i strongly disagree. and all of those guys you ranked below love are on playoff teams.

[Clippersfan86]

i strongly disagree. and all of those guys you ranked below love are on playoff teams.

Yup. Because they have more experienced, playoff tested teams. Being on a playoff team or better team doesn't mean you're a better player. I truly think Love will be better than Gasol, Zbo, Duncan and Aldridge over the next decade going forward.

[Yung D-Will]

NO, Kevin Love will make HIMSELF a perenial all star.
after what adelman did to T-Mac after his microfracture surgery back then,and after seeing houston struggle this past season, i don't know i just don't like him.


Struggle? Considering the injuries and the lack of talent on that Roster Adelman made Houston overachive if anything.

[airchibundo507]

Yup. Because they have more experienced, playoff tested teams. Being on a playoff team or better team doesn't mean you're a better player. I truly think Love will be better than Gasol, Zbo, Duncan and Aldridge over the next decade going forward.

But big numbers are substantiated by team success.

I honestly think Love is a role player, albeit a very talented one. I mean it in the sense that he doesn't contribute on defense. He isn't a guy you can simply give the ball to on offense and expect him to score. I mean, he can spread the floor with his outside J, which definitely a valuable asset for a big man, but from what I've seen, his low post offense is weak. He's undersized/unathletic and his hook shots are heavily contested. His points mostly come from "garbage buckets", meaning that he's an opportunistic scorer.

Gasol, ZBo and Aldridge are on another level offensively. It would be absurd to build a franchise around Love over these guys. Absurd.

[DevilsAssassin]

Kevin Love>Aldridge>Pau Gasol>Zbo>Duncan going forward. His only legit competition in the west is Griffin who will likely be the all star starter for most of the next decade in the west.

:oldlol:

[Clippersfan86]

But big numbers are substantiated by team success.

I honestly think Love is a role player, albeit a very talented one. I mean it in the sense that he doesn't contribute on defense. He isn't a guy you can simply give the ball to on offense and expect him to score. I mean, he can spread the floor with his outside J, which definitely a valuable asset for a big man, but from what I've seen, his low post offense is weak. He's undersized/unathletic and his hook shots are heavily contested. His points mostly come from "garbage buckets", meaning that he's an opportunistic scorer.

Gasol, ZBo and Aldridge are on another level offensively. It would be absurd to build a franchise around Love over these guys. Absurd.

Actually I'd say it's only defensively and impact wise that Love gives anything up to these players. Offensively and on the boards he's superior and it's not even close. His efficiency is tops, his ppg is near the top only trailing Aldridge by a smidge and his versatility/range on offense is the best of this group.

We are talking about a guy who not only can post up and play in the paint but also shot 3's at a high volume and hit over 40 percent. This is a PF we are talking about. Only PF that comes close to his offensive ability/skill set is Dirk who is the best offensively out of all the PF's in the NBA. Dirk can hit a shot from anywhere on the court, in any situation and Love is the only other PF who can do the same.

BTW I don't mind if Love is an opportunistic scorer. Griffin is a clean up player too.

[T-Time3]

Struggle? Considering the injuries and the lack of talent on that Roster Adelman made Houston overachive if anything.

yes i forgot to mention the injuries.
also IMO the rockets were struggling this past season is because the fact that they let go of aaron brooks,carl landry, even shane battier not to mention Yao Ming's retirement. what did they got in return ?
kevin martin. i love the guy he's a great shooter and all that but he's injury prone, just like T-Mac.
jonny flynn. haven't show his A game in houston

overachieve ? i'd say they were overachieve if they make the 1st round playoffs last season..

[gasolina]

He'd better be...I picked him 6th on my fantasy team

[Jasi]

Most of this will depend on what Adelman will make of Ricky Rubio, imo.

[RRR3]

Better the Aldridge? Lay off the crack pipe fez. :facepalm

[Clippersfan86]

Better the Aldridge? Lay off the crack pipe fez. :facepalm

Got selected over Aldridge to all star game. It's clearly not in favor of Aldridge as much as you think :cheers: . Aldridge impacts games more defensively... Love's rebounding edge is HUGE. Give me 6 or 7 extra rebounds a game over a little better man D.

[chips93]

Love's rebounding edge is HUGE. Give me 6 or 7 extra rebounds a game over a little better man D.

its not as big as the raw stats indicate though.

portland played at the slowest pace in the league last year, while minnesota played at the fastest, so love's raw stats are inflated relative to the league, and aldridges are deflated relative to the league.

love is a better rebounder but not by that much

[Burgz]

Kevin Love>Aldridge>Pau Gasol>Zbo>Duncan going forward. His only legit competition in the west is Griffin who will likely be the all star starter for most of the next decade in the west.

in terms of potential maybe

but i honestly dont see him being more than a poor mans webber with less athleticism and perhaps more range on his jump shot

Adelman will have more impact on michael beasley and ricky rubio than any one else, his fluid style will suit them very well

this team has so much talent, but they are so young and frankly a little selfish

the only way to get them to share the ball would be to play a high volume style

[Clippersfan86]

its not as big as the raw stats indicate though.

portland played at the slowest pace in the league last year, while minnesota played at the fastest, so love's raw stats are inflated relative to the league, and aldridges are deflated relative to the league.

love is a better rebounder but not by that much

Aldridge is in the Amare tier of rebounder IMO. Average for his position. Love is tops at his position and it wasn't even close. So there is a massive gap in their rebounding prowess/skill even if the pace made it look worse than it is. Look at the pace of teams in the 90's. Rodman played for Bulls teams with better pace yet is considered among the best rebounders of all time. Love shouldn't be discredited when pace is relative.

[chips93]

Kevin Love>Aldridge>Pau Gasol>Zbo>Duncan going forward. His only legit competition in the west is Griffin who will likely be the all star starter for most of the next decade in the west.

plenty of guys who arent even in the league yet will be all-stars in the coming decade.

[Rose]

Aldridge is in the Amare tier of rebounder IMO. Average for his position. Love is tops at his position and it wasn't even close. So there is a massive gap in their rebounding prowess/skill even if the pace made it look worse than it is.
Keep in mind Aldridge actually played at the second? or third slowest pace last season, while Love played in the fastest.

It's easier to get 15 rebounds a game when the next best rebounder on the team is...Darko? Beasley? Where as LA had Camby and then Wallace to compete with the second half of the season in addition to the pace.

Love's numbers are RIDICULOUSLY inflated, and really don't help his team. It's like how people think Monta is the third best shooting guard. Sure he's probably top 5.

I generally don't even think pace matters, unless you're comparing a team like the Wolves to a team like the Blazers.

[Clippersfan86]

plenty of guys who arent even in the league yet will be all-stars in the coming decade.

Well there are two things to factor. 1 west is deeper so in the draft going forward they will likely not be getting as many top 3 picks. That cuts down on their chances for superstar rookies. Secondly.... Griffin like big men come around every decade or so. It's very unlikely that in the next 7 or 8 years a PF/C prospect at Griffin's level is going to come. We are talking about the best rookie since Duncan who came into the league in 97.

Dwight Howard is an exception as he wasn't a dominant rookie but is a top 3 player now. He was drafted 7 seasons ago and 5 seasons apart from Griffin. Chances of Griffin/Howard level big prospects are astronomically low. Especially because coaches are taking players away from the big man, back to the basket, crash the boards game.

[Clippersfan86]

Keep in mind Aldridge actually played at the second? or third slowest pace last season, while Love played in the fastest.

It's easier to get 15 rebounds a game when the next best rebounder on the team is...Darko? Beasley? Where as LA had Camby and then Wallace to compete with the second half of the season in addition to the pace.

Love's numbers are RIDICULOUSLY inflated, and really don't help his team. It's like how people think Monta is the third best shooting guard. Sure he's probably top 5.

I generally don't even think pace matters, unless you're comparing a team like the Wolves to a team like the Blazers.

Oh I agree it's inflated a bit. Even then on a team with capable rebounders and slower pace... Love is a 12-13 rpg guy no question which still puts him top 3 in the NBA and MUCH better than Aldridge. It's clear if you just watch the two players play that Love is an elite rebounder. Sure he stat pads them... and will take them from teammates.

Aldridge is more suitable as a first option.... but talent wise and production wise.. I have Love over Aldridge going forward.

[soadrules]

yes i forgot to mention the injuries.
also IMO the rockets were struggling this past season is because the fact that they let go of aaron brooks,carl landry, even shane battier not to mention Yao Ming's retirement. what did they got in return ?
kevin martin. i love the guy he's a great shooter and all that but he's injury prone, just like T-Mac.
jonny flynn. haven't show his A game in houston

overachieve ? i'd say they were overachieve if they make the 1st round playoffs last season..

You have no clue what you're talking about. The Rockets success was based on teamwork and Aaron Brooks was becoming a bad influence in the locker room. As was Tracy before the trade. Although trading Landry was hard for Rockets fans, he's a dime a dozen high-hustle player. Kyle Lowry was insanely good for the Rockets as well. Although he isn't the lights out shooter Aaron Brooks is, he brought in a better attitude and he worked well with the team at hand.

Rick Adelman is probably a top 3 coach in the league right now, if not THE best coach.

Letting go of players to bring in someone very good (Kevin Martin is probably a 10 top SG) and the fact that Martin works well with this team was a good move and the best we were going to get out of an expiring T-mac contract. The Rockets roster is nothing to write home about but they did exceptionally well and that's due to Rick Adelman alone.

[Rose]

Oh I agree it's inflated a bit. Even then on a team with capable rebounders and slower pace... Love is a 12-13 rpg guy no question which still puts him top 3 in the NBA and MUCH better than Aldridge. It's clear if you just watch the two players play that Love is an elite rebounder. Sure he stat pads them... and will take them from teammates.

Aldridge is more suitable as a first option.... but talent wise and production wise.. I have Love over Aldridge going forward.
I think he's probably a better rebounder, but I don't think his rebounds matter. It's like how Z-bo has been a 20-10 guy for 3-4 years, but it didn't really matter till 2 years ago.:lol

[The Macho Man]

But big numbers are substantiated by team success.

I honestly think Love is a role player, albeit a very talented one. I mean it in the sense that he doesn't contribute on defense. He isn't a guy you can simply give the ball to on offense and expect him to score. I mean, he can spread the floor with his outside J, which definitely a valuable asset for a big man, but from what I've seen, his low post offense is weak. He's undersized/unathletic and his hook shots are heavily contested. His points mostly come from "garbage buckets", meaning that he's an opportunistic scorer.

Gasol, ZBo and Aldridge are on another level offensively. It would be absurd to build a franchise around Love over these guys. Absurd.

I agree with this. He would be a very good piece on a contending team as like the 4th 5th best player.

I'm still upset he made the all star team over LA last year. Was dissapointed by LA in the playoffs last year but expect him to have a big year this year. Something like 24+ and 10.

[Clippersfan86]

I agree with this. He would be a very good piece on a contending team as like the 4th 5th best player.

I'm still upset he made the all star team over LA last year. Was dissapointed by LA in the playoffs last year but expect him to have a big year this year. Something like 24+ and 10.

I REALLY doubt Aldridge jumps to 24+ and 10. If Blazers are even remotely healthy compared to last year it's impossible. Not to mention there is still a small chance Roy doesn't get cut and is playing (he didn't play most of last season).

[Clippersfan86]

I think he's probably a better rebounder, but I don't think his rebounds matter. It's like how Z-bo has been a 20-10 guy for 3-4 years, but it didn't really matter till 2 years ago.:lol

I definitely think it's fair to question Love's impact. He never seems to impact games as much as his stats imply. That being said I truly feel Adelman will get the most out of Love. If he does become a poor man's Webber like poster above said.... that's a REALLY good thing. Poor man's Webber with improved rebounding? I'll take that from a PF.

[Crown&Coke]

I think KLove will explode like Brad Miller did in Sactown with Adelman. People knew he was good in Indy, but not THAT good.

Love's passing skill in the high post is going to surprise a lot of people. And Adelman's offense is perfect for that. Great hire

[Clippersfan86]

I think KLove will explode like Brad Miller did in Sactown with Adelman. People knew he was good in Indy, but not THAT good.

Love's passing skill in the high post is going to surprise a lot of people. And Adelman's offense is perfect for that. Great hire

Exactly. Love is exactly the kind of big who thrives under Adelman. I think a lot of the Aldridge hype will die down this year. Dude is pretty maxed out at 21 and 9 considering his age and potential. I think last years success by him had an awful lot to do with his circumstances.

[soadrules]

Exactly. Love is exactly the kind of big who thrives under Adelman. I think a lot of the Aldridge hype will die down this year. Dude is pretty maxed out at 21 and 9 considering his age and potential. I think last years success by him had an awful lot to do with his circumstances.

Eh, not really. Adelman does well with players that have really good back to the basket games and guys that are just money from hitting the wide open mid-range shot. I haven't really seen Love hit the mid-range shot as well as someone like Scola but that could just be selection bias. He's going to still get his hustle points like Adelman's guys always did but I don't see Love with the guy that has an established back to the basket game like Webber and Yao had. I could just be wrong there though.

Regardless, Adelman will always get the best out of his team, regardless of the players he has so that should be a bright spot for Timberwolves fans.

[Clippersfan86]

Eh, not really. Adelman does well with players that have really good back to the basket games and guys that are just money from hitting the wide open mid-range shot. I haven't really seen Love hit the mid-range shot as well as someone like Scola but that could just be selection bias. He's going to still get his hustle points like Adelman's guys always did but I don't see Love with the guy that has an established back to the basket game like Webber and Yao had. I could just be wrong there though.

Regardless, Adelman will always get the best out of his team, regardless of the players he has so that should be a bright spot for Timberwolves fans.

Love is a better shooter than both Webber and Miller were... AND he's a very good passer for his position, though not Webber level. Scola was also a versatile offensive player and passer like Love and he had a career year under Adelman.

[soadrules]

Love is a better shooter than both Webber and Miller were... AND he's a very good passer for his position, though not Webber level. Scola was also a versatile offensive player and passer like Love and he had a career year under Adelman.

Did you just say Love was better than Webber? Are you kidding me? Miller, yes, he's role player. But Chris Webber? Come on now.

Scola did have a 'career' year but he could have done so much more. And he thrived under the fact that he was a 2nd/3rd option that got awesome open shots and the fact that he has an A+ rated mid-range game. Does Love have that? That and Love will probably be the first option, at least for the first two years before Derrick Williams matures (if he does) meaning there will be a lot more defensive pressure.

As of now, Aldridge is better than Love. He has had a bigger impact on the game and is leading his game to wins.

[Clippersfan86]

Did you just say Love was better than Webber? Are you kidding me? Miller, yes, he's role player. But Chris Webber? Come on now.

Scola did have a 'career' year but he could have done so much more. And he thrived under the fact that he was a 2nd/3rd option that got awesome open shots and the fact that he has an A+ rated mid-range game. Does Love have that? That and Love will probably be the first option, at least for the first two years before Derrick Williams matures (if he does) meaning there will be a lot more defensive pressure.

As of now, Aldridge is better than Love. He has had a bigger impact on the game and is leading his game to wins.

Reading comprehension goes a long way. Love is a better, more efficient SHOOTER than Webber. NOT player.

[The Macho Man]

Exactly. Love is exactly the kind of big who thrives under Adelman. I think a lot of the Aldridge hype will die down this year. Dude is pretty maxed out at 21 and 9 considering his age and potential. I think last years success by him had an awful lot to do with his circumstances.

Before last year he was never the go to guy, last year partly due to injury he became that and stepped up huge. Definitely don't think he's maxed out at 21-9 there was a stretch last year when it seemed he was going for 28+ 12 a night. Dude was killin it.

[Clippersfan86]

Before last year he was never the go to guy, last year partly due to injury he became that and stepped up huge. Definitely don't think he's maxed out at 21-9 there was a stretch last year when it seemed he was going for 28+ 12 a night. Dude was killin it.

The fact that he played 4 seasons before blowing up proves exactly what I said. If a guy has gobs of potential like a Griffin, Rose, Durant recently... it's clear from day one. This guy was the 2nd pick in the draft and never showed signs of being a franchise player. Yet the perfect storm happens in Portland for his emergence and people act like he's a 2nd year player with tons of potential.

The guy is a very skilled big man but expecting 24+ ppg and 10+ rpg is a joke considering it took him 5 years to break out. If you give somebody the touches of a franchise player and they are skilled.. they will perform. That's what happened with Aldridge.

[04mzwach]

He'd better be...I picked him 6th on my fantasy team
6th? How? Playing with a bunch of retards?

[The Macho Man]

Exactly, he got the touches and he performed, he carried his team. I don't think it matters that it took a few seasons. I don't think he's gonna be a super elite player like Griffin can be, just much better than Love.

[Clippersfan86]

Exactly, he got the touches and he performed, he carried his team. I don't think it matters that it took a few seasons. I don't think he's gonna be a super elite player like Griffin can be, just much better than Love.

Only time will tell :cheers: .

[DevilsAssassin]

Exactly. Love is exactly the kind of big who thrives under Adelman. I think a lot of the Aldridge hype will die down this year. Dude is pretty maxed out at 21 and 9 considering his age and potential. I think last years success by him had an awful lot to do with his circumstances.
:wtf:

You are acting like he is in his 30's or something.

[The Macho Man]

Only time will tell :cheers: .

20 days:pimp:

[Clippersfan86]

:wtf:

You are acting like he is in his 30's or something.

He's 26. Has nothing to do with age. Has to do with fact that he was a number 2 pick.. taken to be the Blazers franchise player along with Roy. He doesn't show up till his 5th season when Roy goes down with bad injuries.

[DevilsAssassin]

He's 26. Has nothing to do with age. Has to do with fact that he was a number 2 pick.. taken to be the Blazers franchise player along with Roy. He doesn't show up till his 5th season when Roy goes down with bad injuries.

:facepalm

How doesn't he show up until his fifth season?

18PPG 8RPG 34MPG 2nd season
18PPG 8RPG 37MPG 3rd season
18PPG 8RPG 37MPG 4th season

these are solid numbers for a 2nd option.

[Clippersfan86]

:facepalm

How doesn't he show up until his fifth season?

18PPG 8RPG 34MPG 2nd season
18PPG 8RPG 37MPG 3rd season
18PPG 8RPG 37MPG 4th season

these are solid numbers for a 2nd option.

Solid yes. Borderline all star worthy yes. Expecting him to be a 24+ ppg, 10+ rpg player, be a perennial all star or be the best PF in the game is a huge stretch considering the circumstances. People act like he's extremely underrated. He's rated exactly where he should be. Second tier PF. He was a solid-good PF the last couple years and one season in which he was thrust into being the franchise player doesn't prove anything.

I just don't like people saying he will be the best, second best PF in the future. You know he's overrated when tons of people here start saying he's better than Griffin, which they have.

[alenleomessi]

i like the wolves team they just need to get rid of beasley for a defensive center

love-dwill-wesley-rubio is a nice core

i wonder how many points will love average this season with rubio running the point

[DevilsAssassin]

[QUOTE]

http://basketball.realgm.com/images/nba/4.2/wiretap/photos/2006/Aldridge_LaMarcus_por_091113.jpg

With Tim Duncan and Kevin Garnett

[ShaqAttack3234]

As far as power forwards? Love was behind these guys last season.

Dirk, Aldridge, Stoudemire, Gasol(ends up at center as much if not more than PF, but a much better player than Love regardless), Randolph(not a fan of his at all, but clearly better than Love), Griffin and Garnett off the top of my head.

I don't see the ability of a number 1 option in Love. He's a really good shooter for his position and will hit open shots and he'll score off offensive rebounds, but he's not a guy you're going to go through and have him carry you. Maybe he'll make an effective 2nd option one day, but as of now, I wouldn't want him as anything more than the 3rd best player on my team.

The difference in ability between Griffin and Love is huge, and Love has been in the league 2 extra years. Griffin is already better than I thought, and he has more skills, and more of a ceiling than I imagined. It will be interesting to see Griffin with Gordon healthy for a full year.

[Clippersfan86]

As far as power forwards? Love was behind these guys last season.

Dirk, Aldridge, Stoudemire, Gasol(ends up at center as much if not more than PF, but a much better player than Love regardless), Randolph(not a fan of his at all, but clearly better than Love), Griffin and Garnett off the top of my head.

I don't see the ability of a number 1 option in Love. He's a really good shooter for his position and will hit open shots and he'll score off offensive rebounds, but he's not a guy you're going to go through and have him carry you. Maybe he'll make an effective 2nd option one day, but as of now, I wouldn't want him as anything more than the 3rd best player on my team.

The difference in ability between Griffin and Love is huge, and Love has been in the league 2 extra years. Griffin is already better than I thought, and he has more skills, and more of a ceiling than I imagined. It will be interesting to see Griffin with Gordon healthy for a full year.

This thread isn't about last season. It's about the fact that Adelman should get the most out of Love going forward. I already admitted he's not really a number one option but neither is Aldridge.. unless you're using half a season out of 5 seasons as a sampling size, which is foolish.

[Clippersfan86]

Read more: http://basketball.realgm.com/article/214962#ixzz1fglIjZQ6

Nice Read:applause:

:oldlol: . Delusional read. Most complete bigman in the NBA? Dwight Howard. Don't be surprised if he becomes the best PF in the NBA? Yea right. It's pretty safe to assume that Griffin has the position on lock the next decade as guys like Dirk and Duncan exit the league. No chance in hell Aldridge>Griffin now or in the future.

[The Macho Man]

Man, I wish LA was playing on Christmas now:cry:

[Clippersfan86]

Man, I wish LA was playing on Christmas now:cry:

I wish Clippers got Blazers in opening game again. The games were VERY physical and dramatic last season. I want revenge because Blazers were only team to sweep us. There was a pretty crazy game with multiple techs/flagrants too where 2 of our guys got ejected.

[chips93]

Well there are two things to factor. 1 west is deeper so in the draft going forward they will likely not be getting as many top 3 picks. That cuts down on their chances for superstar rookies. Secondly.... Griffin like big men come around every decade or so. It's very unlikely that in the next 7 or 8 years a PF/C prospect at Griffin's level is going to come. We are talking about the best rookie since Duncan who came into the league in 97.

Dwight Howard is an exception as he wasn't a dominant rookie but is a top 3 player now. He was drafted 7 seasons ago and 5 seasons apart from Griffin. Chances of Griffin/Howard level big prospects are astronomically low. Especially because coaches are taking players away from the big man, back to the basket, crash the boards game.

im not saying that i expect a griffin/howard level guy to be drafted, im saying that an all-star level guy will be drafted, and he will take some of those all-star selections away from love

[ShaqAttack3234]

This thread isn't about last season. It's about the fact that Adelman should get the most out of Love going forward. I already admitted he's not really a number one option but neither is Aldridge.. unless you're using half a season out of 5 seasons as a sampling size, which is foolish.

Well, I don't really see Love passing any of those players except maybe Garnett if he completely falls off from last season due to age. I still expect Aldridge to be significantly better than Love, he's shown much more of a post game, he's a lot better defensively and he's a capable shooter himself.

Love strikes me as a guy who isn't going to get that much better going forward, he rebounds extremely well and shoots very well, that's pretty much what I see him doing. I think he could be effective as a 3rd option offensively with a good defensive center.

[Bigsmoke]

Rick Adelman will make the T-wolves play better more than just making Love look like an MVP candidate.


IMO. Rick Ademlan is the best coach in the NBA.

[Clippersfan86]

Well, I don't really see Love passing any of those players except maybe Garnett if he completely falls off from last season due to age. I still expect Aldridge to be significantly better than Love, he's shown much more of a post game, he's a lot better defensively and he's a capable shooter himself.

Love strikes me as a guy who isn't going to get that much better going forward, he rebounds extremely well and shoots very well, that's pretty much what I see him doing. I think he could be effective as a 3rd option offensively with a good defensive center.

Garnett's only big value at this point really is his defense. To act like he's still elite is a reach. Garnett put up 15, 9 and 2.5 apg. Hardly elite. Love is already better than Garnett as an all around PF. Maybe he can't defend like KG but KG also isn't on the level of Love's passing, rebounding and scoring anymore.

As for Aldridge being significantly better.... I disagree but as I said time will tell. Neither are first options so you can't have it both ways. Aldridge posted 2 or 3 great months out of 5 seasons as a first option so let's not act like he's some player capable of carrying an offense. Portland had a lot more to work with than Minnesota did last year.

Both are on the same tier now and both are NOT first option type of guys. Aldridge is less flawed but Love has higher upside IMO.

[RRR3]

Solid yes. Borderline all star worthy yes. Expecting him to be a 24+ ppg, 10+ rpg player, be a perennial all star or be the best PF in the game is a huge stretch considering the circumstances. People act like he's extremely underrated. He's rated exactly where he should be. Second tier PF. He was a solid-good PF the last couple years and one season in which he was thrust into being the franchise player doesn't prove anything.

I just don't like people saying he will be the best, second best PF in the future. You know he's overrated when tons of people here start saying he's better than Griffin, which they have.
He was better than Griffin last season. Griffin will be better, but he's not better yet. And how is Aldridge not a solid first option? How many PF's are better scorers than him right now?

[ShaqAttack3234]

Garnett's only big value at this point really is his defense. To act like he's still elite is a reach. Garnett put up 15, 9 and 2.5 apg. Hardly elite. Love is already better than Garnett as an all around PF. Maybe he can't defend like KG but KG also isn't on the level of Love's passing, rebounding and scoring anymore.

As for Aldridge being significantly better.... I disagree but as I said time will tell. Neither are first options so you can't have it both ways. Aldridge posted 2 or 3 great months out of 5 seasons as a first option so let's not act like he's some player capable of carrying an offense. Portland had a lot more to work with than Minnesota did last year.

Both are on the same tier now and both are NOT first option type of guys. Aldridge is less flawed but Love has higher upside IMO.

I think that Garnett was absolutely better than Love last season regardless of numbers. They both score on a lot of jump shots, while Love will get more offensive rebounds, I'd rather go to Garnett in the post. No way Love averages 20/15 or whatever on the Celtics either so it's useless to compare numbers. KG is also a better passer and defense can't be ignored considering the massive difference. KG is an elite defender while Love is a liability defensively.

KG had a really good season last year, he was considerably better than he was in 2010 when Boston went to the finals. It wouldn't surprise me if KG remains better than Love.

I definitely don't see Aldridge and Love in the same tier now. I'd bet a lot of money that Portland wouldn't have had a shot at the playoffs with love instead of Aldridge, and I don't know how good Minnesota would've been, but they sure as hell aren't winning 17 with Aldridge instead of Love.

I don't see Love making up what I consider to be a significant difference considering Aldridge isn't at an age where you'd expect him to decline. If anything, he could still get a bit better.

[DevilsAssassin]

He was better than Griffin last season. Griffin will be better, but he's not better yet. And how is Aldridge not a solid first option? How many PF's are better scorers than him right now?

Dirk and that is all.

[The Macho Man]

I wish Clippers got Blazers in opening game again. The games were VERY physical and dramatic last season. I want revenge because Blazers were only team to sweep us. There was a pretty crazy game with multiple techs/flagrants too where 2 of our guys got ejected.

Don't think I saw them play each other last year, looking forward to it. I didn't watch nearly enough of the Clippers last year, no idea why:facepalm

[Droid101]

Love's numbers are RIDICULOUSLY inflated, and really don't help his team. It's like how people think Monta is the third best shooting guard. Sure he's probably top 5.

Then don't look at rebounds per game. Look at rebound rate.

Kevin Love: Offensive 13.7, Defensive 34.2, Total 22.2
Dwight Howard: Offensive 12.6, Defensive 30.6, Total 21.8
LaMarcus Aldridge: Offensive 10.1, Defensive 17.2 (piss poor for a PF), total 13.5.

For lulz:
Andrea Bargnani: Offensive 3.6, Defensive 13.9, Total 8.6.

[stallionaire]

People will see that Love's season last year was no fluke. People will see an improved Kevin love who puts up even better numbers this year and improves quite a bit. Wolves fans will start to appreciate him more and stop underrating him. Wolves will make the playoffs in 2012-2013 led by Kevin Love.

No Wolves fans underrate Love, trust me.

[Clippersfan86]

He was better than Griffin last season. Griffin will be better, but he's not better yet. And how is Aldridge not a solid first option? How many PF's are better scorers than him right now?

In what way is Aldridge better? Slightly better defender? Worse scorer, worse passer, much worse rebounder. It's literally not even close and this is why coaches selected Griffin over Aldridge and probably didn't have to think twice about it. The fact that a ROOKIE on a subpar team was selected over a breakout player on a playoff team shows the gap between Griffin and Aldridge invididually in the eyes of the coaches around the league.

[Clippersfan86]

Then don't look at rebounds per game. Look at rebound rate.

Kevin Love: Offensive 13.7, Defensive 34.2, Total 22.2
Dwight Howard: Offensive 12.6, Defensive 30.6, Total 21.8
LaMarcus Aldridge: Offensive 10.1, Defensive 17.2 (piss poor for a PF), total 13.5.

For lulz:
Andrea Bargnani: Offensive 3.6, Defensive 13.9, Total 8.6.

His rebound rate is very bad. I consider him an average-sub par rebounder for a PF.

[Smoke117]

Let's see if he can get him to not be a worthless piece of trash defensively first. You know how much that hurts your team when your big men are complete trash defensively?

[tpols]

In what way is Aldridge better? Slightly better defender? Worse scorer, worse passer, much worse rebounder. It's literally not even close and this is why coaches selected Griffin over Aldridge and probably didn't have to think twice about it. The fact that a ROOKIE on a subpar team was selected over a breakout player on a playoff team shows the gap between Griffin and Aldridge invididually in the eyes of the coaches around the league.
Aldridge played on a stacked team with a lot of scoring options and they were a defensive minded team. Aldridge's post defense, help, defense, and pick and roll defense were all infinitely better than Griffin's. And his defense was a big reason the Blazers were good[as well as the whole offense being run through him) Griffin was a better rebounder, but I'd rather have a guy that actually stopped the other team from scoring than one who just hawks for rebounds.

As far as scoring goes, Aldridge was a better takeover player imo. I watched a lot of Blazers games last year and he would be the one carrying them in the fourth quarter every possession with his back to the basket and face up game. He was flat out unstoppable when he wanted to score because he has a great shot, he's quick, he's big, he's long, and he can finish/bang in the paint. He also knows how to make decisions with his back to the basket game as far as passing and scoring go. Griffin has a good shot, good face up ability, and great finishing, but I dont think he's as impactful and dominant a player. Aldridge can score or make a play on command better than Blake could.

[Clippersfan86]

Aldridge played on a stacked team with a lot of scoring options and they were a defensive minded team. Aldridge's post defense, help, defense, and pick and roll defense were all infinitely better than Griffin's. And his defense was a big reason the Blazers were good[as well as the whole offense being run through him) Griffin was a better rebounder, but I'd rather have a guy that actually stopped the other team from scoring than one who just hawks for rebounds.

As far as scoring goes, Aldridge was a better takeover player imo. I watched a lot of Blazers games last year and he would be the one carrying them in the fourth quarter every possession with his back to the basket and face up game. He was flat out unstoppable when he wanted to score because he has a great shot, he's quick, he's big, he's long, and he can finish/bang in the paint. He also knows how to make decisions with his back to the basket game as far as passing and scoring go. Griffin has a good shot, good face up ability, and great finishing, but I dont think he's as impactful and dominant a player. Aldridge can score or make a play on command better than Blake could.

So misinformed regarding Griffin. Many non Clippers would testify to Griffin's ability to carry the team as a first option offensively and hit clutch shots which he did many times. Dude saved so many games for us with clutch rebounds or buckets. Not only that but Aldridge averaged 1.5 points per game lower which is a pretty significant amount to give up to a rookie who's supposedly less skilled.

Griffin had WAY more big games too. We are talking about a rookie PF having two triple doubles, more 30 point games than Aldridge and being the first rookie since Iverson to have 2+ 40 point games. Iverson was a rookie in 96 to give you an idea.

[Rose]

Then don't look at rebounds per game. Look at rebound rate.

Kevin Love: Offensive 13.7, Defensive 34.2, Total 22.2
Dwight Howard: Offensive 12.6, Defensive 30.6, Total 21.8
LaMarcus Aldridge: Offensive 10.1, Defensive 17.2 (piss poor for a PF), total 13.5.

For lulz:
Andrea Bargnani: Offensive 3.6, Defensive 13.9, Total 8.6.
Unfortunately that still doesn't account for pace. Just the total available.

If you play at different rates it doesn't account for that. It's supposed to offset it for minutes played.

And like I said Kevin Love just snags rebounds that no one else gets. Not because he's fighting for them. But because there's no other rebounders.

Regardless Love is a BETTER rebounder, but it's not as large as it looks on paper.

[chips93]

Unfortunately that still doesn't account for pace. Just the total available.

If you play at different rates it doesn't account for that. It's supposed to offset it for minutes played.

And like I said Kevin Love just snags rebounds that no one else gets. Not because he's fighting for them. But because there's no other rebounders.

Regardless Love is a BETTER rebounder, but it's not as large as it looks on paper.

rebound rate does account for pace.

rebound rate is just the amount of boards you get divided by the amount available, so this takes pace out of the equation.

[G-train]

I didn't watch Love much last season.

I am interested in how Minny goes with all those forwards.

A trade might be on the cards.

There may be growing pains in Adelmans offence too.

[upside24]

Kevin Love will make Kevin Love a perennial all star.

[RRR3]

So misinformed regarding Griffin. Many non Clippers would testify to Griffin's ability to carry the team as a first option offensively and hit clutch shots which he did many times. Dude saved so many games for us with clutch rebounds or buckets. Not only that but Aldridge averaged 1.5 points per game lower which is a pretty significant amount to give up to a rookie who's supposedly less skilled.

Griffin had WAY more big games too. We are talking about a rookie PF having two triple doubles, more 30 point games than Aldridge and being the first rookie since Iverson to have 2+ 40 point games. Iverson was a rookie in 96 to give you an idea.
Aren't you the guy who loves Win Shares so much? Well, last year....
LA WS-11.1
BG WS-9.8

Not that I think that proves anything (WS are a very flawed stat).
And what exactly did Griffin "carry" the Clippers to? A 32-50 record? Don't give me that weak help or injuries BS either Rookie Melo carried the Nuggets to the playoffs and Rookie LeBron led the Cavs to more than double their previous year's victory total. BG improved the Clippers by 3 whole games. Don't give me excuses either, he's the "best rookie since Duncan" remember?

[Clippersfan86]

Aren't you the guy who loves Win Shares so much? Well, last year....
LA WS-11.1
BG WS-9.8

Not that I think that proves anything (WS are a very flawed stat).
And what exactly did Griffin "carry" the Clippers to? A 32-50 record? Don't give me that weak help or injuries BS either Rookie Melo carried the Nuggets to the playoffs and Rookie LeBron led the Cavs to more than double their previous year's victory total. BG improved the Clippers by 3 whole games. Don't give me excuses either, he's the "best rookie since Duncan" remember?

Once again simple logic eludes you. This is a team game. First off the Cavs were so bad before Lebron that them winning 37 games or w/e with him wasn't a surprise. As for Melo's rookie year playoff run... he had a very good squad around him.

Andre Miller: 15 ppg, 4.5 rpg, 6 apg, 1.7 spg.
Vashon Leonard 14.2 ppg, 2.7 rpg, 2 apg.
Nene: 12 ppg, 6.5 rpg, 2.2 apg, 1.5 spg.
Marcus Camby: 8.5 ppg, 10 rpg, 2 apg, 1 spg, 2.5 bpg.

Look at that contribution from the players around Melo who put up 21, 6 and 3. Melo was NOT a better rookie than Griffin, playoffs or not. It's not an excuse.. it's a fact that Griffin had WAY more problems to deal with than rookie Lebron or Melo. His team was on a rotating door with injuries, we had a new coaching staff and we even started the youngest lineup in NBA history for 15 games or so.

[RRR3]

Once again simple logic eludes you. This is a team game. First off the Cavs were so bad before Lebron that them winning 37 games or w/e with him wasn't a surprise. As for Melo's rookie year playoff run... he had a very good squad around him.

Andre Miller: 15 ppg, 4.5 rpg, 6 apg, 1.7 spg.
Vashon Leonard 14.2 ppg, 2.7 rpg, 2 apg.
Nene: 12 ppg, 6.5 rpg, 2.2 apg, 1.5 spg.
Marcus Camby: 8.5 ppg, 10 rpg, 2 apg, 1 spg, 2.5 bpg.

Look at that contribution from the players around Melo who put up 21, 6 and 3. Melo was NOT a better rookie than Griffin, playoffs or not. It's not an excuse.. it's a fact that Griffin had WAY more problems to deal with than rookie Lebron or Melo. His team was on a rotating door with injuries, we had a new coaching staff and we even started the youngest lineup in NBA history for 15 games or so.
The Cavs were not much different outside of having LBJ. Hmm...Plus, didn't BG have "franchise player" ERic Gordon for 56 games (68% of the season BTW), and Deandre "Better Defensive Anchor than KG" Jordan, along with Mo "The Leader" Williams (for half the year)? :confusedshrug:

[upside24]

In what way is Aldridge better? Slightly better defender? Worse scorer, worse passer, much worse rebounder. It's literally not even close and this is why coaches selected Griffin over Aldridge and probably didn't have to think twice about it. The fact that a ROOKIE on a subpar team was selected over a breakout player on a playoff team shows the gap between Griffin and Aldridge invididually in the eyes of the coaches around the league.
Aldridge played Griffin very well in one of their matchups. Griffin couldn't stop Aldridge from hitting turnarounds and 15 footers, while Aldridge prevented Griffin from getting deep in the post or getting any easy layups or dunks. It was one of the few times Griffin looked outmatched last year. Blake had good stats at the end but watching the game you could tell which player had the upper hand.

[BGriffin's Dad]

Lol @ anyone thinking Aldridge had a better individual 10-11 season than Griffin

[RRR3]

Lol @ anyone thinking Aldridge had a better individual 10-11 season than Griffin
Defense.

[Clippersfan86]

Aldridge played Griffin very well in one of their matchups. Griffin couldn't stop Aldridge from hitting turnarounds and 15 footers, while Aldridge prevented Griffin from getting deep in the post or getting any easy layups or dunks. It was one of the few times Griffin looked outmatched last year. Blake had good stats at the end but watching the game you could tell which player had the upper hand.

Aldridge did do relatively well on Griffin in the one game you are talking about... but overall Aldridge got murdered.


Game 1

Aldridge: 19 points, 10 rebounds, 1 assists and 2 steals
Griffin: 20 points, 14 rebounds, 4 assists and 1 steal (first game of career)


Game 2

Aldridge: 4 points, 5 rebounds, 1 assist (fouled out guarding Blake Griffin)
Griffin: 21 points, 15 rebounds, 2 assists and 2 steals


Game 3

Aldridge: 28 points, 8 rebounds, 3 assists and 1 block
Griffin: 20 points, 18 rebounds, 4 assists and 2 steals

[Clippersfan86]

Defense.

Yes because Aldridge is known as a great defender himself :oldlol: .

[RRR3]

Yes because Aldridge is known as a great defender himself :oldlol: .
Compared to Griffin he is.

[upside24]

Aldridge did do relatively well on Griffin in the one game you are talking about... but overall Aldridge got murdered.


Game 1

Aldridge: 19 points, 10 rebounds, 1 assists and 2 steals
Griffin: 20 points, 14 rebounds, 4 assists and 1 steal (first game of career)


Game 2

Aldridge: 4 points, 5 rebounds, 1 assist (fouled out guarding Blake Griffin)
Griffin: 21 points, 15 rebounds, 2 assists and 2 steals


Game 3

Aldridge: 28 points, 8 rebounds, 3 assists and 1 block
Griffin: 20 points, 18 rebounds, 4 assists and 2 stealsThe game I mentioned was the only matchup they had I got to see, but I agree Griffin had the better year.

[Clippersfan86]

Compared to Griffin he is.

Aldridge is a decent defender.. Griffin is a tad below average defensively. It doesn't make up for the huge gap in scoring, rebounding and passing Griffin has over Aldridge.

[RRR3]

Aldridge is a decent defender.. Griffin is a tad below average defensively. It doesn't make up for the huge gap in scoring, rebounding and passing Griffin has over Aldridge.
Huge gap in scoring? It's marginal you clown. :facepalm

[Clippersfan86]

Huge gap in scoring? It's marginal you clown. :facepalm

1.5 ppg is pretty big ppg difference for a big. Besides I was saying huge difference when you combine all 3, not individually. Efficiency wise they are comparable.

Plus 1.5 ppg
Plus 2 apg
Plus 3 rpg

MUCH more significant than a little extra D.

[soadrules]

Reading comprehension goes a long way. Love is a better, more efficient SHOOTER than Webber. NOT player.

Completely missed that. Regardless, Kevin Love's points come from garbage buckets on a bad team. When you're the clear first option and everybody is gunning for you (Chris Webber) your efficiency is going to go down. Please look at statistics in a meaningful matter. They're good up to a point, but other factors have to be taken into account.

[kumquat]

Kevin Love>Aldridge>Pau Gasol>Zbo>Duncan going forward. His only legit competition in the west is Griffin who will likely be the all star starter for most of the next decade in the west.

Aldridge smashed Love every time they played. ZBo is still in his prime. Pau is still in his prime. Griffin hasn't touched his prime. All their teams are way better than the T-Wolves.

[Clippersfan86]

Completely missed that. Regardless, Kevin Love's points come from garbage buckets on a bad team. When you're the clear first option and everybody is gunning for you (Chris Webber) your efficiency is going to go down. Please look at statistics in a meaningful matter. They're good up to a point, but other factors have to be taken into account.

Of course the way Love plays helps his efficiency. Doesn't change the fact that Webber was the Iverson of his position. Very inefficient. The dude had a couple seasons shooting in the low 40's as a PF. This wasn't as a young player either.. this was in his prime. He shot way too many jumpers for a guy that didn't have a great outside shot. I mean look at his overhyped 51 point, 26 rebound game. Nobody talks about how he shot 47 shots!

[Clippersfan86]

Aldridge smashed Love every time they played. ZBo is still in his prime. Pau is still in his prime. Griffin hasn't touched his prime. All their teams are way better than the T-Wolves.

Head to head isn't an indication of who's better. For example Chuck Hayes as* raped Griffin this year. Does it mean he's better? Only reason I posted h2h of Griffin vs Aldridge is because people seem to have this idea that Aldridge owned Griffin. The ONLY PF that got the best of Griffin this year is Hayes and Kris Humphries gave him a hell of a run too.

[soadrules]

Of course the way Love plays helps his efficiency. Doesn't change the fact that Webber was the Iverson of his position. Very inefficient. The dude had a couple seasons shooting in the low 40's as a PF. This wasn't as a young player either.. this was in his prime. He shot way too many jumpers for a guy that didn't have a great outside shot. I mean look at his overhyped 51 point, 26 rebound game. Nobody talks about how he shot 47 shots!

Fair enough. I just think Chris Webber is the type of player you can play and run an offense through and flourish as a 'number 1' option. I don't see Kevin Love having that type of dominant attitude and the skillset necessary. He doesn't have a solid consistent go to 'move' and unless he develops something consistently dangerous that you can set up and run through rather than garbage points, I'll stick by it.

[taucesays]

http://vimeo.com/850844

The music is gay as hell but it's sick to see Love, Westbrook, Mbah-a-moute and Collison playing together. He crapped on people in college. Now that he's in shape I'm very interested to see what he can do.

[chips93]

Lol @ anyone thinking Aldridge had a better individual 10-11 season than Griffin

Lol @ anybody taking your opinion of griffin seriously.

[DFish]

Lol @ anybody taking your opinion of griffin seriously.

Says the guy who doesn't even live in the U.S.

[ballsohard247]

Says the guy who doesn't even live in the U.S.
What does that have to do with anything?:confusedshrug:

[Clippersfan86]

Fair enough. I just think Chris Webber is the type of player you can play and run an offense through and flourish as a 'number 1' option. I don't see Kevin Love having that type of dominant attitude and the skillset necessary. He doesn't have a solid consistent go to 'move' and unless he develops something consistently dangerous that you can set up and run through rather than garbage points, I'll stick by it.

I agree though. Love= NOT a number 1 option. That being said.. contribution wise he can be a star for sure. His impact can improve. The reason Love isn't a first option is that he doesn't have the mentality.

[DFish]

What does that have to do with anything?:confusedshrug:

It's like me arguing with some brit about divegrass and how Manchester United sucks. Let's keep our sports leagues segregated to their respective countries, thanks.

[ballsohard247]

I agree though. Love= NOT a number 1 option. That being said.. contribution wise he can be a star for sure. His impact can improve. The reason Love isn't a first option is that he doesn't have the mentality.
This. I don't see how he can put up the stats he does and not impact a game more. I know it takes a team but he doesn't affect his team the way his stats would imply.

[ballsohard247]

It's like me arguing with some brit about divegrass and how Manchester United sucks. Let's keep our sports leagues segregated to their respective countries, thanks.
You sir, are a complete idiot.

[DFish]

You sir, are a complete idiot.

Missing comma. And you know for a fact that those tea-drinking queers would be incensed at some American telling them anything about United or any EPL team. Please.

Basketball always has and always will belong to its home country. The NBA, just like the NFL, is America's league and America's sport. Deal with it.

[ballsohard247]

Missing comma. And you know for a fact that those tea-drinking queers would be incensed at some American telling them anything about United or any EPL team. Please.

Basketball always has and always will belong to its home country. The NBA, just like the NFL, is America's league and America's sport. Deal with it.
So there should be no fans of the NBA in Ireland? Is our sport too good for them? I understand that the British know more about their soccer/futbol teams than we do, but I don't think that means Americans can't appreciate their leagues. Sports appreciation is not limited by imaginary lines and oceans.

[DFish]

So there should be no fans of the NBA in Ireland? Is our sport too good for them? I understand that the British know more about their soccer/futbol teams than we do, but I don't think that means Americans can't appreciate their leagues. Sports appreciation is not limited by imaginary lines and oceans.

They can watch whatever few games get broadcast in Ireland, but no, they can't be true fans of the NBA or any NBA team. Can I be a Celtic fan if I've lived in LA for my entire life? No. At least not without being some bandwagoner.

[ballsohard247]

They can watch whatever few games get broadcast in Ireland, but no, they can't be true fans of the NBA or any NBA team.
Agree to disagree.

[chips93]

They can watch whatever few games get broadcast in Ireland, but no, they can't be true fans of the NBA or any NBA team.

every single nba game is streamed online.

every single nba game is uploaded online, so i can download and watch later.

i could watch any nba game this season that i like.

[G-train]

They can watch whatever few games get broadcast in Ireland, but no, they can't be true fans of the NBA or any NBA team. Can I be a Celtic fan if I've lived in LA for my entire life? No. At least not without being some bandwagoner.

I watch more games than most of this board and I live in Australia.

[DFish]

every single nba game is streamed online.

every single nba game is uploaded online, so i can download and watch later.

i could watch any nba game this season that i like.

Being able to download game records doesn't make you a fan though. Which NBA team did your father follow? How many home games have you been to? Did you have good seats, bad seats? How often did you and your family watch the NBA when you were a child? Do you talk about the NBA with your friends and coworkers in Ireland? Do you all go to bars, or pubs as it were, to watch the NBA finals every year? Any betting take place? Fantasy basketball?

I can probably download every Manchester United game. But if I have no personal connection with the team or the sport itself, why would I?

[DFish]

I watch more games than most of this board and I live in Australia.

And if this were a rugby forum, that might matter.

[BGriffin's Dad]

I watch more games than most of this board and I live in Australia.

ohh no wonder you're so misinformed about the Clippers

[Clippersfan86]

ohh no wonder you're so misinformed about the Clippers

:roll:

[DevilsAssassin]

I agree though. Love= NOT a number 1 option. That being said.. contribution wise he can be a star for sure. His impact can improve. The reason Love isn't a first option is that he doesn't have the mentality.

no it's because he isn't that good of a scorer.

Nobody wants a 1 option that can't create scoring opportunities for himself or others.

[airchibundo507]

no it's because he isn't that good of a scorer.

Nobody wants a 1 option that can't create scoring opportunities for himself or others.

This is by far the most popular opinion, and those that disagree haven't seen enough of Love play. Case in point, he can't create his own shot and he is a defensive liability. Those facts alone make him a glorified role player in my mind.

Can he pass? Sure. But what's the point of that if you don't draw double teams? Is he the best rebounder in the league? probably. But that alone doesn't offset his glaring weaknesses.

[DevilsAssassin]

This is by far the most popular opinion, and those that disagree haven't seen enough of Love play. Case in point, he can't create his own shot and he is a defensive liability. Those facts alone make him a glorified role player in my mind.

Can he pass? Sure. But what's the point of that if you don't draw double teams? Is he the best rebounder in the league? probably. But that alone doesn't offset his glaring weaknesses.

Exactly :applause:

[chips93]

Being able to download game records doesn't make you a fan though. Which NBA team did your father follow? How many home games have you been to? Did you have good seats, bad seats? How often did you and your family watch the NBA when you were a child? Do you talk about the NBA with your friends and coworkers in Ireland? Do you all go to bars, or pubs as it were, to watch the NBA finals every year? Any betting take place? Fantasy basketball?

I can probably download every Manchester United game. But if I have no personal connection with the team or the sport itself, why would I?

wait a second. let me try follow you argument here;

first you say my opinion on basketball isnt valid because i dont live in america

then you qualify that statement by saying that i couldnt be a fan because nba games arent broadcasted in ireland.

then you change your tune all together, saying that i have to go to games and watch basketball with others for my opinion on basketball to be valid.

what does any of that have to do with understanding basketball?

i watch a ton of basketball. i discuss it with friends and here on this board, i read about basketball, i play basketball, i need nothing to undersatnd basketball that i dont have access to.

[DFish]

wait a second. let me try follow you argument here;

first you say my opinion on basketball isnt valid because i dont live in america

then you qualify that statement by saying that i couldnt be a fan because nba games arent broadcasted in ireland.

then you change your tune all together, saying that i have to go to games and watch basketball with others for my opinion on basketball to be valid.

what does any of that have to do with understanding basketball?

i watch a ton of basketball. i discuss it with friends and here on this board, i read about basketball, i play basketball, i need nothing to undersatnd basketball that i dont have access to.

No, I said that you can't be considered a genuine NBA fan because you have no real personal connection to the sport, the league, or any team within it. When you first decided to become a "fan," how did you choose your team? You probably chose whichever one you felt like choosing, right? That isn't fanhood. It's bandwagoning/fairweather at best, but in your case, you're not even at that level because you don't even live in the country that has the NBA. I highly doubt you can name 3 people that you personally know in Ireland who follow the NBA. Being a real NBA fan is following the team your father followed, watching and going to games as a child, etc.

Do you think I could suddenly become a genuine soccer and EPL league fan? Honest question. If I, an American with no connection to the EPL to speak of, suddenly declared my loyalty to Manchester United, how would you react? How would real United fans living in England react? That's my point. I can understand the game of soccer, I can download all the United games I find, I can post on Manchester United/EPL forums... but that doesn't make me a real EPL fan.

[Clippersfan86]

I don't fully agree that you literally can't be a fan from another country but I do agree with a good amount of it. Most diehards are born into our grow up around the team. I grew up in LA/OC around a family of Lakers fans and I got annoyed with them so I started listening to Ralph Lawler's broadcasts of the Clippers games as a kid all the time and got hooked on my team.

With only downloaded/streamed games and no personal connection to a team it would definitely be very hard to be a fan of a team as much as somebody that's been around it their entire lives.

[chips93]

No, I said that you can't be considered a genuine NBA fan because you have no real personal connection to the sport, the league, or any team within it. When you first decided to become a "fan," how did you choose your team? You probably chose whichever one you felt like choosing, right? That isn't fanhood. It's bandwagoning/fairweather at best, but in your case, you're not even at that level because you don't even live in the country that has the NBA. I highly doubt you can name 3 people that you personally know in Ireland who follow the NBA. Being a real NBA fan is following the team your father followed, watching and going to games as a child, etc.

i was born in ohio, so when i first started following the nba, i gravitated towards the cavs, and i have stuck with them ever since.

i play on a basketball team, so i know plenty of people interested in basketball.


Do you think I could suddenly become a genuine soccer and EPL league fan? Honest question. If I, an American with no connection to the EPL to speak of, suddenly declared my loyalty to Manchester United, how would you react? How real United fans living in England react? That's my point. I can understand the game of soccer, I can download all the United games I find, I can post on Manchester United/EPL forums... but that doesn't make me a real EPL fan.

i sorta understand where you are coming from, but i still disagree, i dont think living near a team, or inheriting fanhood from your parents, makes your fanhood any more legitimate.

irregardless, we are getting completely off topic.

i said that the poster BGriffin's Dad cant be taken seriously on what he says about griffin. then you said;


Says the guy who doesn't even live in the U.S.

you said my opinion on the nba wasnt valid because i wasnt from america.

you could question my fandom, because of where i live, but not my understanding and knowledge of the game. and thats what you did.

you didnt question my loyalty or legitimacy as a fan of my team, you questioned my knowledge of the game.

[chips93]

With only downloaded/streamed games and no personal connection to a team it would definitely be very hard to be a fan of a team as much as somebody that's been around it their entire lives.

define personal connection

[Clippersfan86]

define personal connection

Compare the difference between a local relationship between a girlfriend.. and a long distance one and you'll understand. Some people do fine with long distance relationships but it can never quite match being around each other all the time.

You downloading games and watching online isn't the same as being around the local news, buzz of the town and going to games at least a handful of times a year. Not to mention we run into our star players so that makes it a lot more personal. Guys like Kobe and Griffin can be see at local shopping malls, beaches etc. I have personally met Ralph Lawler for example.

[chips93]

You downloading games and watching online isn't the same as being around the local news, buzz of the town and going to games at least a handful of times a year. Not to mention we run into our star players so that makes it a lot more personal. Guys like Kobe and Griffin can be see at local shopping malls, beaches etc. I have personally met Ralph Lawler for example.

i really disagree.

for one, many avid fans dont have the money to go to games, and font live in affluent areas where they would bump inot millionaire athletes.

as for news, obviously that is accessible over the internet.

and 'buzz' well, thats pretty hard to define as well.

heres a question though, if you, for whatever arbitrary reason, had to move away from LA, and you couldnt attend games, bump into players, or feel the 'buzz' around the team, would that make you less of a clippers fan?

[FireMcFailPlease]

leave your crappy blazer and clipper players out of this

[Clippersfan86]

i really disagree.

for one, many avid fans dont have the money to go to games, and font live in affluent areas where they would bump inot millionaire athletes.

as for news, obviously that is accessible over the internet.

and 'buzz' well, thats pretty hard to define as well.

heres a question though, if you, for whatever arbitrary reason, had to move away from LA, and you couldnt attend games, bump into players, or feel the 'buzz' around the team, would that make you less of a clippers fan?

If I started as a fan and moved it's way different than becoming a fan from 3,000 miles away. Either way as I said... I don't fully agree you CAN'T become a true fan... just that the chances are much slimmer.