Melo is one of the most underrated players in basketball

[airchibundo507]

Lettuce discuss Melo the Point Forward.

28/7/4

Anyone with a brain who's watched at least one game has seen for themselves that Carnelo's game has blossomed this year. In prior years he has been labeled a ballstopper, but this year he transformed into a perimeter oriented facilitator. Melo has been running pick and rolls as the ballhandler, using it to slice up defenses with his penetration and distribute to Knicks shooters.

Melo is now a very willing passer. When faced with double teams he scans the floor and hits open guys. This is routine, folks.

- top 3 scorer
- average defender (like Rose, Paul, Dirk)
- good passer and facilitator
- great rebounder for his position
- clutchest mofo in league

[bagelred]

http://distilleryimage7.instagram.com/da8a1f2e380011e180c9123138016265_7.jpg

[GOBB]

Lettuce discuss Melo the Point Forward.

28/7/4

Anyone with a brain who's watched at least one game has seen for themselves that Carnelo's game has blossomed this year. In prior years he has been labeled a ballstopper, but this year he transformed into a perimeter oriented facilitator. Melo has been running pick and rolls as the ballhandler, using it to slice up defenses with his penetration and distribute to Knicks shooters.

Melo is now a very willing passer. When faced with double teams he scans the floor and hits open guys. This is routine, folks.

- top 3 scorer
- average defender (like Rose, Paul, Dirk)
- good passer and facilitator
- great rebounder for his position
- clutchest mofo in league

I was told Blake Griffin is DEFINATELY better. Now that poster hasnt presented an argument so maybe he had bad gas. Mexican beeze like dat some time holmes.

[Clutch]

He's been playing very well this season.

He's not a black hole anymore,he tries to set up his teammates.
Actually his assists numbers should be higher because his teammates were missing wide open,easy shots or got fouled instead of finishing.
I say 28/7/6 should be about right.

From the start of the game he has been setting up his teammates and he was scoring timely buckets (game against the Knicks) and taking over in the 4th quarter (22 4th quarter points against the Bobcats,17 against the Celtics and 13 against the Raptors).

I can only say you this. Our record is not very good right now (2-4) but without Melo it would easily be 0-6.

[nathanjizzle]

i like the part where you said average defender like derrick rose.

[The Ownage]

Paul is a better defender, but you got everything else right. I have no idea why people hate on 'Melo so much on this forum.

[kuniva_dAMiGhTy]

No, he's not.

[airchibundo507]

I feel Melo is underrated because a shitload of people are living under heavy rocks, stubbornly holding outdated perceptions of Melo from the corn row days. It's almost as if people are grouping him with Amare, calling him a black hole and defensive liability.

Tell me dumbasses, if Melo is a blackhole why is he averaging 4 assists per game? Better yet, what does that make Durant who averages more turnovers than assists?

The prior two games without Amare, the Knicks (with Melo playing major minutes) held their opponents to 91 ppg and 40% FG. the next damn gamn Amare comes back, Diaw plays like a GOAT and the cats score 120 on 60% FG.

[iDunk]

Melo's been playing average defense this year, no one can judge unless they've watched at least half the Knicks games so far this season. That's what pisses me off, everyone assumes and talk out of their ass that he doesn't play defense but they haven't watched a lick of game tape to honestly judge.

[KRAYZIE]

Everytime someone mentions corn rows on here I think of that damn corn roll thread someone made a while back. Good times.:oldlol:

[airchibundo507]

now I will proceed to respond to some of the greatest examples of fail from the Melo Overrated thread:



my point was that you can't look at Rose's career numbers yet because he's so young. Yet Carmelo's been in the league for how many years now without showing any real improvement as a passer or defender??

rookie Melo was a shit defender that averaged under 3 apg. the superstar Melo of today is an average defender who'll probably end up with 4.5-5 apg by season's end.

you, my friend, are an idiot

[dunksby]

I feel Melo is underrated because a shitload of people are living under heavy rocks, stubbornly holding outdated perceptions of Melo from the corn row days. It's almost as if people are grouping him with Amare, calling him a black hole and defensive liability.

Tell me dumbasses, if Melo is a blackhole why is he averaging 4 assists per game? Better yet, what does that make Durant who averages more turnovers than assists?

The prior two games without Amare, the Knicks (with Melo playing major minutes) held their opponents to 91 ppg and 40% FG. the next damn gamn Amare comes back, Diaw plays like a GOAT and the cats score 120 on 60% FG.
Durant is not a point forward, he mainly plays off the ball, considering the amount of time Melo has the ball in his hands he is bound to produce assists.

[airchibundo507]

Durant is not a point forward, he mainly plays off the ball, considering the amount of time Melo has the ball in his hands he is bound to produce assists.

durcant 3.6 turnovers per game
Melo 3.0 turnovers per game

Y A W N . . . .

[RRR3]

durcant 3.6 turnovers per game
Melo 3.0 turnovers per game

Y A W N . . . .
Durant>>>Melo.

/thread

[Nash]

Lettuce discuss Melo the Point Forward.

28/7/4

Anyone with a brain who's watched at least one game has seen for themselves that Carnelo's game has blossomed this year. In prior years he has been labeled a ballstopper, but this year he transformed into a perimeter oriented facilitator. Melo has been running pick and rolls as the ballhandler, using it to slice up defenses with his penetration and distribute to Knicks shooters.

Melo is now a very willing passer. When faced with double teams he scans the floor and hits open guys. This is routine, folks.

- top 3 scorer
- average defender (like Rose, Paul, Dirk)
- good passer and facilitator
- great rebounder for his position
- clutchest mofo in league:roll: Stopped reading there.

[airchibundo507]

Nash + Amare + D'Antoni = WCF
Melo + Amare + D'Antoni = First round sweep


but my dear idiot you forgot in Phoenix they had far better depth, far better role players, far better spacing and far better chemistry.

[airchibundo507]

:roll: Stopped reading there.
sorry I'll use smaller, simpler words next time.

[airchibundo507]

Durant>>>Melo.

/thread

durcant: 26.1 ppg, 6.0 rpg, 3.3 apg, 1 spg, 1.2 bpg, 3.6 to
Melo: 27.8 ppg, 7.0 rpg, 3.8 apg, 1.2 spg, 0.2 bpg, 3 to

sure stats don't mean that much seeing as how the season is still young, but still...

they are comparable scorers and rebounders. Durant is the better defender while Melo is the far better passer/facilitator.

they are comparable players whether you like it or not

[airchibundo507]

:roll: Stopped reading there.
Jokes aside, truthfully, how many Knicks games have you seen this season?

[The Ownage]

Jokes aside, truthfully, how many Knicks games have you seen this season?
He'll never ever talk positive about the Knicks nor it's players. Don't bother. :lol



durcant: 26.1 ppg, 6.0 rpg, 3.3 apg, 1 spg, 1.2 bpg, 3.6 to
Melo: 27.8 ppg, 7.0 rpg, 3.8 apg, 1.2 spg, 0.2 bpg, 3 to

sure stats don't mean that much seeing as how the season is still young, but still...

they are comparable scorers and rebounders. Durant is the better defender while Melo is the far better passer/facilitator.

they are comparable players whether you like it or not

Now you're overrating 'Melo/underrating Durant. Durant is quickly becoming a top 3 player in the league this season. :no:

[Clutch]

He'll never ever talk positive about the Knicks nor it's players. Don't bother. :lol
this

[RRR3]

durcant: 26.1 ppg, 6.0 rpg, 3.3 apg, 1 spg, 1.2 bpg, 3.6 to
Melo: 27.8 ppg, 7.0 rpg, 3.8 apg, 1.2 spg, 0.2 bpg, 3 to

sure stats don't mean that much seeing as how the season is still young, but still...

they are comparable scorers and rebounders. Durant is the better defender while Melo is the far better passer/facilitator.

they are comparable players whether you like it or not
Have you been watching durant lately?

[MeLO MvP 15]

People who say Melo is still a bad defender don't watch him consistently. He's usually average but when he wants to be (i.e against Kobe, Durant or LeBron) he's an amazing defender.

So underrated...

[airchibundo507]

Have you been watching durant lately?
I watched him clank away a home game to the Blazers. that gamewinner sure was a spectacle (although it was westbrook hitting all the big shots leading up to that point. then Durant pulled a disappearing act against Phoenix. his season hasn't been MVP quality IMO. 26/6/3 with 4 turnovers is quite pedestrian for a superstar.

[knicksman]

Durant>>>Melo.

/thread


rookie melo>>>>>>>prime tmac 44 wins to 42 wins LMAO

[hitmanyr2k]

People who say Melo is still a bad defender don't watch him consistently. He's usually average but when he wants to be (i.e against Kobe, Durant or LeBron) he's an amazing defender.

So underrated...

Sometimes I wonder how people judge defense because there are more aspects to that part of the game than just man to man defense. How is Carmelo's help defense? How are his rotations? Does he cover a teammates ass when they get beat off the dribble? Does he do anything to actually impact his team's defense to make it better? Or is he perceived as "better" because he doesn't completely suck like he used to?

[D-Wade316]

Yes, he is.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IX92j8wp7f8 :bowdown: :bowdown: :bowdown:

[airchibundo507]

Sometimes I wonder how people judge defense because there are more aspects to that part of the game than just man to man defense. How is Carmelo's help defense? How are his rotations? Does he cover a teammates ass when they get beat off the dribble? Does he do anything to actually impact his team's defense to make it better? Or is he perceived as "better" because he doesn't completely suck like he used to?
how about watching a damn game and forming your own opinions. I mean it's not like the Knicks don't have nationally televised games.

he's competent enough to rotate to the open guy with the ball. he's an average defender. he's not mobile or athletic enough to roam like a lebron would, but he's no liability. hes pretty good at man defense when matched up against other stars at his position

[knickswin]

he gets a lot of crap from people who don't watch him a lot. i am loving what i see out of him this season. he really wants to win and has a winner's mind set. he is not taking selfish shots and is instead looking to help his teammates. unfortunately, the team as a whole is a mess, and i am not convinced his right hand man really cares enough about basketball to change his game to become more of a winner. it's really a shame.

[hitmanyr2k]

how about watching a damn game and forming your own opinions. I mean it's not like the Knicks don't have nationally televised games.

he's competent enough to rotate to the open guy with the ball. he's an average defender. he's not mobile or athletic enough to roam like a lebron would, but he's no liability. hes pretty good at man defense when matched up against other stars at his position

I already have my opinion on Melo...he's a sub-par defender, always will be lol. I'm just questioning your criteria because people in this thread keep saying he's an "average" defender all of a sudden while not giving one damn reason why :oldlol: I just wanted specifics of what makes him average. Excuses aside he still sounds like the same sub-par defender who doesn't impact his team on that side of the floor.

And I'm a guy who loves defense so watching horrible defensive teams frustrates me. Watching a D'Antoni Knick team would be torture :oldlol: If they play a good defensive team (like the Heat, Bulls, or Celtics) I'll watch them, otherwise...

[knickswin]

carmelo problem has been his team defense (which was always weird to me because syracuse is known for their zone). he has been good enough at that this season. it's not like he's getting chase down blocks like lebron or clogging the paint like dwight, but he's good enough. he won't be a liability to your team. he is also a rather talented man defender. you don't have to work your defensive schemes to hide him when you play other good scoring wings.

[Lebron23]

He's an underachiever. Some of his peers already won an NBA scoring titles, Finals MVP, led their teams in the NBA Finals, and won an MVP Award.

He's not even as good as Alex English (Best Nuggets player of all time) and George Gervin (a highly skilled scoring forward).

[airchibundo507]

I already have my opinion on Melo...he's a sub-par defender, always will be lol. I'm just questioning your criteria because people in this thread keep saying he's an "average" defender all of a sudden while not giving one damn reason why :oldlol: I just wanted specifics of what makes him average. Excuses aside he still sounds like the same sub-par defender who doesn't impact his team on that side of the floor.

And I'm a guy who loves defense so watching horrible defensive teams frustrates me. Watching a D'Antoni Knick team would be torture :oldlol: If they play a good defensive team (like the Heat, Bulls, or Celtics) I'll watch them, otherwise...
and how good at defense to you consider Chris Paul, Derrick Rose and Dirk Nowitzki to be?

what do you mean by defensive "impact"? a good team defense in itself is a sum of the individual parts, an entire system in which players react to breakdowns. good rotation takes awareness and hustle. Melo can play in such a system without being a liability. His rotations are fine. His man defense is solid. He raises it up a notch against others stars, playing excellent ball denial on the peimeter.

An average defender is not a standout, nor do they better the defense of their teammates. That takes a star defensive player like Noah or Howard.

[lilgodfather1]

Sure if you call someone who doesn' deserve to be called a superstar, but is called a superstar underrated. Melo is all sorts of underrated then, and so is Durant, Paul, Deron, Bosh, Wade (this year), Kobe (entire career), and Amare. In fact there is only two superstars in the NBA today. LeBron and Dwight. A superstar in past generations was somebody that completely changed the way the game was played. Shaq, Jordan, Hakeem, Wilt, West, etc. Those guys were superstars, and honestly there is never more than 5 superstars in the NBA at a time, because a superstar is someone who is so superior to every other player in the league at their position/role that nobody is even close to them. LeBron is far superior to the second best SF in the league on both ends of the floor. No other SF is close to what LeBron does, just like no C is even remotely close to Dwight. Dwight's gap is like he is SS4, and every other C is chilling in the hyperbolic time chamber trying to go SS1, but they don't realise that they are just silly ass nameks.

[dbronx42]

Average defender...? I guess average means awful...

[airchibundo507]

Average defender...? I guess average means awful...
nugget fan. opinion disregarded.

[airchibundo507]

bump

[BankShot]

How exactly is Melo underrated??

He's universally considered an elite scorer, with a good midrange shot, awesome from the post, and really good rebounder from the SF spot.

While he's a mediocre-to-average defender, he has the tools to defend very well when motivated, which he has shown in the past.

I think his 3-point shooting last year in NY was an abberation, as it was well above his career averages.... but all in all he's decent from out there.

[airchibundo507]

How exactly is Melo underrated??

He's universally considered an elite scorer, with a good midrange shot, awesome from the post, and really good rebounder from the SF spot.

While he's a mediocre-to-average defender, he has the tools to defend very well when motivated, which he has shown in the past.

I think his 3-point shooting last year in NY was an abberation, as it was well above his career averages.... but all in all he's decent from out there.
have you seen his passing this season? his playmaking off of double teams and pick and rolls have been a thing of beauty.

I made the thread because a ton of people are calling Melo overrated, almost blaming him singlely for the Knicks struggles. They group Melo with Amare's weaknesses, referring to both as black holes and defensive liabilities, when it is clear Melo has become a good facilitator as the Knicks point forward as well as working hard to become an average defender.

the prior two games without Amare the Knicks held their opponents to 91 ppg 40% FG, but Amare comes back for one game, Diaw plays like a superstar, and the Bobcats score 120 on 55% FG

I appreciate your analysis of Melos game

[Clutch]

How exactly is Melo underrated??

He's universally considered an elite scorer, with a good midrange shot, awesome from the post, and really good rebounder from the SF spot.

While he's a mediocre-to-average defender, he has the tools to defend very well when motivated, which he has shown in the past.

I think his 3-point shooting last year in NY was an abberation, as it was well above his career averages.... but all in all he's decent from out there.
He's a good 3-pt shooter.
Not elite but good.

He takes a lot of his threes off the dribble,with defender close to him.
If he would just spot up for them I think he could easily shoot 40%.

Pretty good analysis.
Only thing that I would add is that he improved his passing and tries to involve his teammates more this season.

[kurple]

nugget fan. opinion disregarded.
who knows more about Melo than Nuggets fans?

[kurple]

and you have been saying Melo will average 4+ assists for 3-4 years now. He isn't even doing it as a point forward for the first time in his career.

He is a skilled passes, and can make some amazing ones.. But he's too much of a ball stopper to be considered a very good passer.

He's supposed to be the leader of the next great team (after MIA), and the TEAM (led by Melo) is underpreforming massively

[Sarcastic]

and you have been saying Melo will average 4+ assists for 3-4 years now. He isn't even doing it as a point forward for the first time in his career.

He is a skilled passes, and can make some amazing ones.. But he's too much of a ball stopper to be considered a very good passer.

He's supposed to be the leader of the next great team (after MIA), and the TEAM (led by Melo) is underpreforming massively

Wait till they get a new coach.

[fubu05]

Wait till they get a new coach.

And healthy. :cheers:

[airchibundo507]

and you have been saying Melo will average 4+ assists for 3-4 years now. He isn't even doing it as a point forward for the first time in his career.

He is a skilled passes, and can make some amazing ones.. But he's too much of a ball stopper to be considered a very good passer.

He's supposed to be the leader of the next great team (after MIA), and the TEAM (led by Melo) is underpreforming massively

he started the season off slowy assist wise, but last four games he is averaging 4.75 apg. That's with our shooters hitting at a terrible clip from behind the arc.

[Kyle_korver]

First .. You can't be underrated and haven't accomplished anything
Second.. Out of all his peers via lebron wade Durant .. He has nothing but points lebron has 2 mvps Durant has scoring titles n wade has a finals MVP .. N he never touched the finals once
Third.. He's not a good passer...he has the ability to pass but is not a good passer due to the fact that he wants to score most of the time instead of make the best play

To end it off ... HOW COME THE "BEST SCORER IN THE LEAGUE HAS 0 SCORING TITLES " .... He's gonna have a Vince carter career .. All these points n fans but no kind of success to make him a legend

[shootingcomets]

Lettuce discuss Melo the Point Forward.

28/7/4

Anyone with a brain who's watched at least one game has seen for themselves that Carnelo's game has blossomed this year. In prior years he has been labeled a ballstopper, but this year he transformed into a perimeter oriented facilitator. Melo has been running pick and rolls as the ballhandler, using it to slice up defenses with his penetration and distribute to Knicks shooters.

Melo is now a very willing passer. When faced with double teams he scans the floor and hits open guys. This is routine, folks.

- top 3 scorer
- average defender (like Rose, Paul, Dirk)
- good passer and facilitator
- great rebounder for his position
- clutchest mofo in league

You know why he's underrated? Because his team keeps on losing to crap teams.


Once they beat some more quality teams he'll get more recognition

[NugzFan]

hes underrated because he keeps losing to crap teams?

[Sarcastic]

First .. You can't be underrated and haven't accomplished anything
Second.. Out of all his peers via lebron wade Durant .. He has nothing but points lebron has 2 mvps Durant has scoring titles n wade has a finals MVP .. N he never touched the finals once
Third.. He's not a good passer...he has the ability to pass but is not a good passer due to the fact that he wants to score most of the time instead of make the best play

To end it off ... HOW COME THE "BEST SCORER IN THE LEAGUE HAS 0 SCORING TITLES " .... He's gonna have a Vince carter career .. All these points n fans but no kind of success to make him a legend

Karl Malone must been overrated all those years, up until he won MVP when he was 33 & 34. Because up until then, he never led the league in scoring, never led the league in rebounding, never won an MVP, never won a FMVP. Obviously those are the only things that make you a relevant basketball player.

[detroitkid816]

People who say Melo is still a bad defender don't watch him consistently. He's usually average but when he wants to be (i.e against Kobe, Durant or LeBron) he's an amazing defender.

So underrated...
he has always been a horrible team defender, and probably always will be. he also heavily overcommits a lot on man to man, and is easily beat off the dribble. with that said, I think if he continues to make strides as a facilitator, he will be in my top 6-8 and better than Durant who is becoming overrated.

[airchibundo507]

29.1 ppg, 6.9 rpg, 3.9 apg

- top 7 player
- clutchest player in league
- legit MVP candidate (especially when the team starts winning)

[Human Error]

29.1 ppg, 6.9 rpg, 3.9 apg

- top 7 player
- clutchest player in league
- legit MVP candidate (especially when the team starts winning)
Oh my god this idiot is just resilent.

[Shepseskaf]

Kinda funny how much things can change in half a season.

[k0kakw0rld]

Karl Malone must been overrated all those years, up until he won MVP when he was 33 & 34. Because up until then, he never led the league in scoring, never led the league in rebounding, never won an MVP, never won a FMVP. Obviously those are the only things that make you a relevant basketball player.
He also never scored 1 point in a game :oldlol:

[scotty00007]

Lol.

[tontoz]

Among small forwards Melo ranks 2nd in usage rate but 39th in True Shooting percentage. That is a bad combination. The team as a whole has a higher TS% than Melo, 52.3% to 49.9%.

Add in the fact that the team gives up almost 5 more ppg when Melo plays and it is clear why they have struggled with him in the lineup.

[Sakkreth]

29.1 ppg, 6.9 rpg, 3.9 apg

- top 7 player
- clutchest player in league
- legit MVP candidate (especially when the team starts winning)

:roll: :roll: :roll:

[dbugz]

29.1 ppg, 6.9 rpg, 3.9 apg

- top 7 player
- clutchest player in league
- legit MVP candidate (especially when the team starts winning)


:roll: :roll: :roll:

[dunksby]

"my thing is to get into the gym, and get out. No need to be in the gym, 3-4-5 hours, 45 minutes to an hour get it done"

Very underrated.

[strifed169]

black hole

[chips93]

Very underrated.

:oldlol:

[ThePointGuard11]

UNDERRATED!!!!!?

:oldlol: I can't think of a player more overrated than Carmelo Anthony. He's probably the most overrated player in the league. A one-dimensional scorer that is no longer good at scoring. An out of shape volume shooter with a questionable basketball IQ. He's frustrating to watch, BUT D'Antoni is part of the problem. I think he has the talent to be what people want him to be, but he needs the right coach and somebody to push him in the off-season. I know he has always been pudgy, but imagine if he wasn't and actually worked hard in the gym & weight room.

[Mr. Jabbar]

for a reason

[dunksby]

UNDERRATED!!!!!?

:oldlol: I can't think of a player more overrated than Carmelo Anthony. He's probably the most overrated player in the league. A one-dimensional scorer that is no longer good at scoring. An out of shape volume shooter with a questionable basketball IQ. He's frustrating to watch, BUT D'Antoni is part of the problem. I think he has the talent to be what people want him to be, but he needs the right coach and somebody to push him in the off-season. I know he has always been pudgy, but imagine if he wasn't and actually worked hard in the gym & weight room.
Come on dont bring up the coach excuse! Even George Karl could not make this guy into a leader at Melo's prime. D'antoni is horrible when it comes to defense but you can't blame him for Melo's offensive woes.

[ThePointGuard11]

Come on dont bring up the coach excuse! Even George Karl could not make this guy into a leader at Melo's prime. D'antoni is a horrible when it comes to defense but you can't blame him for Melo's offensive woes.

I'm just saying, Melo being Melo, the freedom involved with that offense makes him even more of a chucker than he already was. Personally, I don't think a Carmelo led team will ever win an NBA championship. The way he plays the game will never translate into that. I agree with you, his offensive woes are his fault, but I was just saying that D'Antoni doesn't help the situation. He probably makes it worse.

[Clutch]

I'm just saying, Melo being Melo, the freedom involved with that offense makes him even more of a chucker than he already was. Personally, I don't think a Carmelo led team will ever win an NBA championship. The way he plays the game will never translate into that. I agree with you, his offensive woes are his fault, but I was just saying that D'Antoni doesn't help the situation. He probably makes it worse.
http://www.insidehoops.com/forum/showthread.php?t=147107 :D

[ralph_i_el]

- top 3 scorer
- average defender (like Rose, Paul, Dirk)
- good passer and facilitator
- great rebounder for his position
- clutchest mofo in league

Durant, kobe, Lebron, and Dirk are all better scorers.

he is not an average defender. He is a decent amount worse than rose, paul, and dirk

he is probably the most overrated player in the league

This season the Knicks give up 104 points per 100 possesions with Melo on the floor. They give up 98 with him off the floor