Was LeBron James ever the best scorer in the league?

[StateOfMind12]

Some homo in another thread keeps trying to convince people that Lebron was a better scorer than Kobe and everybody is just laughing at him and calling him a moron. Anyways, do you guys ever think that Lebron was the best scorer in the league?

I honestly don't. Kobe was the best scorer in the league in my opinion from '05-'06 to '09-'10 and Dirk Nowitzki was the best scorer in the league in the '10-'11 season. I don't think Lebron was ever the best scorer in the league.

[Heavincent]

Kobe was the best scorer in the league in my opinion from '05-'06 to '09-'10

Agree with this.

[DRose1899]

You really have no shame Swagg3r :facepalm

[k0kakw0rld]

LeBron James 2007-08 Season with the Cleveland Cavaliers 30.0 PPG with 2,250 total points. SCORING CHAMP :applause:

[arifgokcen]

Lebron from 2005 to date 28.93697479ppg on %4914fg
Kobe from 2005 to date 29.03917526ppg on %4571fg
Dirk doesnt qualify here to compete with lebron and kobe

[arifgokcen]

So if you wanna pick a scorer over that span(to win a game) you would pick lebron.Because of his superior %fg because even though many claim scoring is beyond stats,when you look at the box score if you are up then you win.This is all about stats.This is why MJ was the best in the game.

[DaHeezy]

In terms of getting a bucket I would say yes. But not in terms of being the most prolific or dynamic.

[Bigsmoke]

Some homo in another thread keeps trying to convince people that Lebron was a better scorer than Kobe and everybody is just laughing at him and calling him a moron. Anyways, do you guys ever think that Lebron was the best scorer in the league?

I honestly don't. Kobe was the best scorer in the league in my opinion from '05-'06 to '09-'10 and Dirk Nowitzki was the best scorer in the league in the '10-'11 season. I don't think Lebron was ever the best scorer in the league.

Got a life yet?

[Deuce Bigalow]

So if you wanna pick a scorer over that span(to win a game) you would pick lebron.Because of his superior %fg because even though many claim scoring is beyond stats,when you look at the box score if you are up then you win.This is all about stats.This is why MJ was the best in the game.
Artis Gimore has the highest career FG% at 59.9% - He is the GOAT :bowdown:

[Eric Cartman]

Kobes shoot are always gonna be more high difficulty so hence the fg%.

Lebron gets alot of dunks layups & stuff like that.

[winwin]

if that was RRR3, ignore him .. he can't see anything
lEbrick's d in his moth and balls blocked his eyes

[Legends66NBA7]

LeBron James 2007-08 Season with the Cleveland Cavaliers 30.0 PPG with 2,250 total points. SCORING CHAMP :applause:

That's what I was going to post too.

[Deuce Bigalow]

LeBron James 2007-08 Season with the Cleveland Cavaliers 30.0 PPG with 2,250 total points. SCORING CHAMP :applause:
Kobe finally got a good team in 2007-08, if he would've had the same team as 06 and 07, it would've been another 31.6-35.4 PPG season

[jlip]

Define "best".

[JerrySteakhouse]

You really have no shame Swagg3r :facepalm
Is he really that obvious? :roll: :roll: :roll:

[StateOfMind12]

Kobe finally got a good team in 2007-08, if he would've had the same team as 06 and 07, it would've been another 31.6-35.4 PPG season
Pretty much, which is why I don't think Lebron was a better scorer than Kobe in '08, '09, or '10. You can't fault Kobe for finally having talent and offensive scoring weapons to work with. It would be like saying that Robinson was a better scorer than Hakeem in '94 or Ewing was a better scorer than Hakeem in '90 because he scored more ppg than him. Is there anyone out there that actually thought either Ewing or Robinson was a better scorer than Hakeem then?

[arifgokcen]

Kobes shoot are always gonna be more high difficulty so hence the fg%.

Lebron gets alot of dunks layups & stuff like that.

So if shots are harder to hit,that means you see a better score on the board at the end of the game???
No of course not.You still get 2.Bad shot selection doesn't make a better player this is why
Lets do an analogy
Assume there are two cars that goes 150mph,which one would you pick one with 10mpg or 15 mpg
This is as simple as that.There is no detailed calculations here.Basketball is a very simple game.Only purpose of the game is to score more than the other team at the end.This doesn't change whether its a regular season game or finals game.

[arifgokcen]

Artis Gimore has the highest career FG% at 59.9% - He is the GOAT :bowdown:

You know he averaged 17.1ppg during a much faster era which if you do the calculations,he would have averaged 15.5ppg and so there goes your logic.Please make a sane comment

[TylerOO]

Maybe not, but he has definitely been the best player since 07

[lilgodfather1]

LeBron lead the league in scoring. LeBron shoots a higher % than other players, and scores at a similar pace. But your argument is basically player A may score more, and more efficiently, but player B looks better when he does it.

[keepinitreal]

http://youtu.be/1EsgrlxjUvs?t=49s

[CardiacKemba]

LeBron lead the league in scoring. LeBron shoots a higher % than other players, and scores at a similar pace. But your argument is basically player A may score more, and more efficiently, but player B looks better when he does it.

This :applause:

[Lebron23]

Dumb Thread

[stephanieg]

Kobe is only better than LeBron in anything in the sense that Rasheed is better than Duncan because he can hit left handed threes.

[arifgokcen]

LeBron lead the league in scoring. LeBron shoots a higher % than other players, and scores at a similar pace. But your argument is basically player A may score more, and more efficiently, but player B looks better when he does it.

Wow what a remark.......
+1111111111111111111111

[knicksman]

LOL I would even prefer pierce/allen as scorers than him. The best scorer shouldnt be stopped by a SIMPLE ZONE DEFENSE.

tHATS why you can win with pierce/allen but not with lebron

[NumberSix]

Sooooooo...... If I understand the argument, Kobe is a better scorer because he misses cooler looking shots?

[keepinitreal]

LOL I would even prefer pierce/allen as scorers than him. The best scorer shouldnt be stopped by a SIMPLE ZONE DEFENSE.

tHATS why you can win with pierce/allen but not with lebron

Your post looks too retarded to be serious, but LeBron and Pierce just played the Indiana Pacers...

LeBron went for 33/8/13 on 12/21 shooting, while Pierce went 10/7/3 on 3/17 shooting...

:confusedshrug:

[knicksman]

Your post looks too retarded to be serious, but LeBron and Pierce just played the Indiana Pacers...

LeBron went for 33/8/13 on 12/21 shooting, while Pierce went 10/7/3 on 3/17 shooting...

:confusedshrug:

I think youre the one retarded here. Im not comparing 35 yr old pierce to prime lebron. LOL Im comparing pierce who won a ring and lebron who choked in the finals.

[Bigsmoke]

LeBron lead the league in scoring. LeBron shoots a higher % than other players, and scores at a similar pace. But your argument is basically player A may score more, and more efficiently, but player B looks better when he does it.

Lol. Post of the week

[StateOfMind12]

LeBron lead the league in scoring. LeBron shoots a higher % than other players, and scores at a similar pace. But your argument is basically player A may score more, and more efficiently, but player B looks better when he does it.
I'll quote a post someone else made on another site (RGM) about this subject/topic


Kobe's versality may help him more in situations where Lebron would struggle.

Let's talk scoring only. For example, let's say Player A (Lebron) has one offensive move he converts at 55% on average.

Player B (Kobe) is capable of the same offensive move, but has another move that Player A doesn't have to which he converts both at 45% on average.

Player A has a greater impact throughout the regular season because of his higher efficiency.

However, when you get to the playoffs, the defense tightens up. If you keep going in the playoffs, you'll inevitably end up facing against the best defenses in the league. If the defense is good enough to limit Player A's move to 35%, then he has nothing else to fall back on. Whereas, if they limit the same move of Player's B to 35%, he can fall back on his other move, to maybe which they can only limit to 40%. In this scenario, Player B has a greater impact than Player A.

It's the same reason why Hakeem was a better scorer than Robinson even though Robinson usually averaged more ppg and even or sometimes a higher fg% than Hakeem did in certain seasons.


Stfu swagger. Stop making accounts you ****ing twaht
Or what? What are you going to do about it? Please tell me. :oldlol:


Sooooooo...... If I understand the argument, Kobe is a better scorer because he misses cooler looking shots?
The argument is that Kobe has other moves to fall back on if his go-to move is taken away, whereas Lebron has nothing to fall back on once his go-to move (if he has one) is taken away..

[lilgodfather1]

The argument is that Kobe has other moves to fall back on if his go-to move is taken away, whereas Lebron has nothing to fall back on once his go-to move (if he has one) is taken away..
If you have 50 moves to score the ball, but you can't score as effiiently as the guy that only has one move then you are not a better scorer. We are not talking about versatility, we are talking about the fact that someone who scores more/the same/slightly less points than someone else, but does it on higher FG% he is helping his team more than the other player. Missing shots is not good for your team, and there is no argument to say that is, well other than the Kobe is a better scorer because it looks prettier than LeBron defense that Kobe fans like to use.

[StateOfMind12]

If you have 50 moves to score the ball, but you can't score as effiiently as the guy that only has one move then you are not a better scorer. We are not talking about versatility, we are talking about the fact that someone who scores more/the same/slightly less points than someone else, but does it on higher FG% he is helping his team more than the other player. Missing shots is not good for your team, and there is no argument to say that is, well other than the Kobe is a better scorer because it looks prettier than LeBron defense that Kobe fans like to use.
Did you miss my post earlier? Re-read that and then come back to me.


I'll quote a post someone else made on another site (RGM) about this subject/topic


Kobe's versality may help him more in situations where Lebron would struggle.

Let's talk scoring only. For example, let's say Player A (Lebron) has one offensive move he converts at 55% on average.

Player B (Kobe) is capable of the same offensive move, but has another move that Player A doesn't have to which he converts both at 45% on average.

Player A has a greater impact throughout the regular season because of his higher efficiency.

However, when you get to the playoffs, the defense tightens up. If you keep going in the playoffs, you'll inevitably end up facing against the best defenses in the league. If the defense is good enough to limit Player A's move to 35%, then he has nothing else to fall back on. Whereas, if they limit the same move of Player's B to 35%, he can fall back on his other move, to maybe which they can only limit to 40%. In this scenario, Player B has a greater impact than Player A.



It's the same reason why Hakeem was a better scorer than Robinson even though Robinson usually averaged more ppg and even or sometimes a higher fg% than Hakeem did in certain seasons.

[lilgodfather1]

That's cool and all, except against the same opponents LeBron's stats have historically been better in the playoffs. Seriously look it up. Kobe may have 2 moves to LeBron's 1, but LeBron's 1 is 3x better than both of Kobe's moves combined.

[RazorBaLade]

That's cool and all, except against the same opponents LeBron's stats have historically been better in the playoffs. Seriously look it up. Kobe may have 2 moves to LeBron's 1, but LeBron's 1 is 3x better than both of Kobe's moves combined.

wat? kobe scores more on about equal efficiency in their best years... i say equal overall, bron obv shoots better from 2 but kobe has like 2-3% pts on him in 3s which is huge.

[lilgodfather1]

wat? kobe scores more on about equal efficiency in their best years... i say equal overall, bron obv shoots better from 2 but kobe has like 2-3% pts on him in 3s which is huge.
3% is taken into account in FG%. I never said LeBron was a better 3 point shooter, but he is a better shooter from the feild, which is more important.

[Eric Cartman]

Best scorers:

Kobe (2006-2009) considering playoffs & all that crap

Durant (2010-Present)

[StateOfMind12]

That's cool and all, except against the same opponents LeBron's stats have historically been better in the playoffs. Seriously look it up. Kobe may have 2 moves to LeBron's 1, but LeBron's 1 is 3x better than both of Kobe's moves combined.
Playoff scoring for Kobe and Lebron from '05-'06 (Lebron's first playoff run) to '09-'10

Kobe in '06 playoffs - 27.9 ppg, 49.7% FG, 58.7% TS, 54.5% eFG - 7 gp
Kobe in '07 playoffs - 32.8 ppg, 46.2% FG, 56.1% TS, 50.0% eFG - 5 gp
Kobe in '08 playoffs - 30.1 ppg, 47.9% FG, 57.7% TS, 51.4% eFG - 21 gp
Kobe in '09 playoffs - 30.2 ppg, 45.7% FG, 56.4% TS, 49.2% eFG - 23 gp
Kobe in '10 playoffs - 29.2 ppg, 45.7% FG, 56.7% TS, 50.6% eFG - 23 gp

Lebron in '06 playoffs - 30.8 ppg, 47.6% FG, 55.7% TS, 51.0% eFG - 13 gp
Lebron in '07 playoffs - 25.1 ppg, 41.6% FG, 51.6% TS, 44.2% eFG - 20 gp
Lebron in '08 playoffs - 28.2 ppg, 41.1% FG, 52.5% TS, 44.4% eFG - 13 gp
Lebron in '09 playoffs - 35.3 ppg, 51.0% FG, 61.8% TS, 55.3% eFG - 14 gp
Lebron in '10 playoffs - 29.1 ppg, 46.6% FG, 56.3% TS, 50.7% eFG - 11 gp


'06 playoffs - Lebron produced more ppg but was less efficient.
'07 playoffs - Kobe produced more ppg and was more efficient
'08 playoffs - Kobe once again produced more ppg and was more efficient
'09 playoffs - Lebron produced more ppg and was more efficient
'10 playoffs - About even, but if I were to nitpick then Kobe produced more ppg and the scoring efficiency was about the same.


Kobe and Lebron both played the Celtics in '08, the Magic in '09, and the Celtics in '10.

vs. '08 Celtics

Kobe - 25.7 ppg, 40.5% FG, 32.1% 3P, 80% FT.
Lebron - 26.7 ppg, 35.5% FG, 23.1% 3P, 76% FT

Summary - Lebron scored one more ppg but was way less efficient in it. If we were to get the eFG and TS%, I am pretty sure Kobe would be superior in those categories.

vs. '09 Magic

Kobe - 32.4 ppg, 43% FG, 36% 3P, 84% FT.
Lebron - 38.5 ppg, 48.7% FG, 29.7% 3P, 74% FT

Summary - Lebron scored more ppg and shot a higher FG% but shot worse from 3 point range and from the FT line.

vs. '10 Celtics

Kobe - 28.6 ppg, 40.5% FG, 31.9% 3P, 88% FT,
Lebron - 26.8 ppg, 44.7% FG, 26.9% 3P, 74% FT.

Summary - Kobe scores more ppg but was less efficient as far as FG% is concerned.


I'll calculate the TS% and eFG% for each of those series that Kobe and Lebron played in.

The formula to calculate TS% according to ESPN is (Total points x 50) divided by [(FGA + (FTA x 0.44)]

Lebron's TS% vs. '08 Celtics

(186.9 x 50) / [(154.7 + (90.3 x .44)] - 48.063076

Kobe 's TS% vs. '08 Celtics

(154.2 x 50) / [(130.8 + (49.2 x .44)] - 50.5746222

Kobe had the higher TS% since he his TS% was 50.57% while Lebron's TS% was 48.06%.

I remember Kobe's TS% vs. the '09 Magic in the NBA finals was 54% so I'll just calculate Lebron's which I am sure will be astonishingly good.

(231 x 50) / [(154.2 + (94.2 x .44)] - 59%


Kobe vs. '08 Celtics - 50.57% TS
Lebron vs' 08 Celtics - 48.06% TS

Kobe vs. '09 Magic - 54% TS
Lebron vs. '09 Magic - 59% TS

Kobe vs. '10 Celtics - 52.80% TS
Lebron vs '10 Celtics - 55.49% TS

[madmax]

Sooooooo...... If I understand the argument, Kobe is a better scorer because he misses cooler looking shots?

:lol
According to Kobrick stans logic, FG % doesn't matter as long as the said player has "killer gene" and is not afraid to miss 90 % of highly retarded shots...

[Dave3]

Only LeBron could lead the league in scoring and have a higher FG% than anyone else in the top 5, and still have his scoring abilities questioned. For the last 4 years he's been at 28+ ppg on 50% FG% and ~60% TS%. But yeah, he's never been the best scorer, because he doesn't hit fancy looking fadeaways...

[RazorBaLade]

3% is taken into account in FG%. I never said LeBron was a better 3 point shooter, but he is a better shooter from the feild, which is more important.

It isn't taken into account so much as it is just there for no logical reason. a 3 pt shot is worth more points than a 2, yet missing a 3 takes you down from 48% to 45% from the field. (ie, 9-19, miss a shot, 9-20) just as much as a 2 will....

It makes absolutely no sense why FG% still exists after the inclusion of the 3 pt line. Idk if there's a metric that takes it into account properly though.

If someone is 3/10 from 3 it makes him a 33% FG shooter... But he scored 9 pts on 10 shots... If someone is 4/10 from 2, it makes him a 40%! FG shooter, yet he scored 8 pts on 10 shots. Since as you said Kobe is a better 3 pt shooter, it means he makes up for that disparity in FG%.. I haven't thought about it if it actually puts him ahead of bron, it really most likely doesn't, but it becomes close enough to where kobes extra points make him the better scorer without question IMO.

[Heavincent]

Continue to make you look even dumber than you already are.

You're pretty stupid yourself, so I don't think you're capable of making anyone look dumb.

[Dave3]

It isn't taken into account so much as it is just there for no logical reason. a 3 pt shot is worth more points than a 2, yet missing a 3 takes you down from 48% to 45% from the field. (ie, 9-19, miss a shot, 9-20) just as much as a 2 will....

It makes absolutely no sense why FG% still exists after the inclusion of the 3 pt line. Idk if there's a metric that takes it into account properly though.

If someone is 3/10 from 3 it makes him a 33% FG shooter... But he scored 9 pts on 10 shots... If someone is 4/10 from 2, it makes him a 40%! FG shooter, yet he scored 8 pts on 10 shots. Since as you said Kobe is a better 3 pt shooter, it means he makes up for that disparity in FG%.. I haven't thought about it if it actually puts him ahead of bron, it really most likely doesn't, but it becomes close enough to where kobes extra points make him the better scorer without question IMO.
For all of this arguing there is a simple stat called eFG% which counts all 3 pointers as 1.5 FGM in the FG% category, and LeBron's eFG% has also been higher than Kobe since after his rookie year.

Keep in mind, that even with LeBron's 48 FG%, that's while making about 1/3rd of his 3 pointers while taking about 4 a game. He still scores more per field goal attempt (even when 3s are included).

[DRose1899]

Only LeBron could lead the league in scoring and have a higher FG% than anyone else in the top 5, and still have his scoring abilities questioned. For the last 4 years he's been at 28+ ppg on 50% FG% and ~60% TS%. But yeah, he's never been the best scorer, because he doesn't hit fancy looking fadeaways...
Huh? he did a lot of those.

[Dave3]

Huh? he did a lot of those.
Not as many as other players argued over him for that title (Durant Melo and Kobe). People seem to think better shooter is better scorer for some reason.

[DRose1899]

Not as many as other players argued over him for that title (Durant Melo and Kobe). People seem to think better shooter is better scorer for some reason.
I swear he hit a lot more of that than those name this season, his game is mainly fast break n mid-range afterall. What they have a lot more than bron is jackass 3s brick :lol

[Dave3]

I swear he hit a lot more of that than those name this season, his game is mainly fast break n mid-range afterall. What they have a lot more than bron is jackass 3s brick :lol
He's hit more this year and last, but for overall the last 5 years, they've been better shooters, which is the argument they're basing their point of view on.

Oh, and his game hasn't been fast break until this year. Over the last 6 or 7 years, he's been on one of the slowest paced teams in the league. This is a different year in many aspects for him.

[DRose1899]

He's hit more this year and last, but for overall the last 5 years, they've been better shooters, which is the argument they're basing their point of view on.

Oh, and his game hasn't been fast break until this year. Over the last 6 or 7 years, he's been on one of the slowest paced teams in the league. This is a different year in many aspects for him.
He always in the top of fast break point leader though, even last season he's leading on it.

[Dave3]

He always in the top of fast break point leader though, even last season he's leading on it.
Where are these stats?

[DRose1899]

Where are these stats?
Mentioned in some game? :confusedshrug:
Its must be legit if its on TV isn't it?

Lebron is 1st, 2nd is Wade, 3rd Westbrook?

[Dave3]

Mentioned in some game? :confusedshrug:
Its must be legit if its on TV isn't it?

Lebron is 1st, 2nd is Wade, 3rd Westbrook?
I would want to see those if they were talking about 2006-2011. Cavs and Heat those years always had very low pace. LeBron did 95% of his damage in the halfcourt.

[DRose1899]

I would want to see those if they were talking about 2006-2011. Cavs and Heat those years always had very low pace. LeBron did 95% of his damage in the halfcourt.
Really?

Because the stats that I seen on tv he score about 400+ point from those, that's about 20% of his contribution last season.

Personally for me its not too unbelievable bron score a lot from fast break even if he only got few of those per game, he's like 100% money from it no matter what.

[Dave3]

Really?

Because the stats that I seen on tv he score about 400+ point from those, that's about 20% of his production of those

Personally for me its not too unbelievable bron score a lot from fast break even if he only got few of those per game, he's like 100% money from it no matter what.
Yeah, but say he gets a basket on a fastbreak every game or 2, I wouldn't call it a major part of his game, considering how little that is. Of course, that is assuming those stats exist, which I'm hesitant to believe unless I see them.

[madmax]

as for Lebron the scorer, he's currently comfortably dropping 30-33 PPG and is doing it with wild efficiency while leading the league in scoring. I say he takes the scoring title this year:cheers:

[StateOfMind12]

:lol
According to Kobrick stans logic, FG % doesn't matter as long as the said player has "killer gene" and is not afraid to miss 90 % of highly retarded shots...
FG% isn't as good of a stat to value efficiency like eFG% and TS% are. If you look at the playoffs, Kobe is typically more efficient and productive.

[Dave3]

FG% isn't as good of a stat to value efficiency like eFG% and TS% are. If you look at the playoffs, Kobe is typically more efficient and productive.
Typically more productive? LeBron has had a better eFG% and TS% than Kobe in the last 3 playoffs. How is it typically when LeBron has 3 and Kobe has 3? (and LeBron's 3 are the more current ones)

Not to mention 2 of those for Kobe came against the Suns, one series each, while LeBron played the Pistons twice and Spurs in those playoffs.

[StateOfMind12]

Typically more productive? LeBron has had a better eFG% and TS% than Kobe in the last 3 playoffs. How is it typically when LeBron has 3 and Kobe has 3? (and LeBron's 3 are the more current ones)
If you are bringing up 2011 I am not really arguing that, Lebron was obviously better that season and in pretty much everything.




Not to mention 2 of those for Kobe came against the Suns, one series each, while LeBron played the Pistons twice and Spurs in those playoffs.

Sure, and Lebron got to go up against the Wizards like what? 3 times? I'll take the Suns defense over the Wizards defense any day of the week. At least the Suns had good perimeter defenders in Raja Bell and Shawn Marion, what exactly did the Wizards have? Caron Butler, who isn't as good of a defender as either Bell or Marion? Wizards weren't exactly a good defensive team either. So don't you think you are a little biased by ignoring that?

Did you also forget that Kobe torched the hell out of the Spurs in the '08 WCF? I don't even think you want me to bring up those stats.

Once Lebron started to face the real competition of the East and the real defensive teams like the '08 Celtics then he started to face problems with scoring.

[All Net]

as for Lebron the scorer, he's currently comfortably dropping 30-33 PPG and is doing it with wild efficiency while leading the league in scoring. I say he takes the scoring title this year:cheers:

I think if Lebron chose to be purely a scorer he could lead the league in scoring most years. His overall game doesn't allow that...hense why Durant has won it the last two years.

[hitmanyr2k]

Sure, and Lebron got to go up against the Wizards like what? 3 times? I'll take the Suns defense over the Wizards defense any day of the week. At least the Suns had good perimeter defenders in Raja Bell and Shawn Marion, what exactly did the Wizards have? Caron Butler, who isn't as good of a defender as either Bell or Marion? Wizards weren't exactly a good defensive team either. So don't you think you are a little biased by ignoring that?

The Suns defense was garbage. Kobe could do anything he wanted against undersized Raja Bell and Shawn Marion was matched up with Odom.


Did you also forget that Kobe torched the hell out of the Spurs in the '08 WCF? I don't even think you want me to bring up those stats.

Kobe torched a tired, banged up Spurs team coming off a grueling 7 games series against the Hornets, with no interior presence besides a declining Tim Duncan and with Ginobili playing on one leg the entire series.


Once Lebron started to face the real competition of the East and the real defensive teams like the '08 Celtics then he started to face problems with scoring.

That goes for Kobe as well.

[StateOfMind12]

The Suns defense was garbage. Kobe could do anything he wanted against undersized Raja Bell and Shawn Marion was matched up with Odom.
That Suns defense was better than that Wizards defense.
Shawn Marion wasn't the primary defender on Kobe but he did occasionally defend him.


Suns '05-'06 DRating - 16th in the league
Suns '06-'07 DRating - 13th in the league

Wizards '05-'06 DRating - 22nd in the league
Wizards '06-'07 DRating - 28th in the league

Then factor in how the Suns had superior perimeter defenders and it isn't even close.



Kobe torched a tired, banged up Spurs team coming off a grueling 7 games series against the Hornets, with no interior presence besides a declining Tim Duncan and with Ginobili playing on one leg the entire series.
How many games did the Spurs play when they were going to the 2007 NBA Finals? Probably more games than they played heading into the 2008 WCF.

[Dave3]

If you are bringing up 2011 I am not really arguing that, Lebron was obviously better that season and in pretty much everything.

You said typically, so obviously I have to bring up all years. You can't say typically in something, then ignore one of the years. Typically means a majority of the time, meaning you have to look at all of the times.




Sure, and Lebron got to go up against the Wizards like what? 3 times? I'll take the Suns defense over the Wizards defense any day of the week. At least the Suns had good perimeter defenders in Raja Bell and Shawn Marion, what exactly did the Wizards have? Caron Butler, who isn't as good of a defender as either Bell or Marion? Wizards weren't exactly a good defensive team either. So don't you think you are a little biased by ignoring that?


Except that LeBron never went up against ONLY the Wizards. Kobe went up ONLY against the Suns. In the years LeBron went against the Wizards he also played the Pistons, the Pistons and Spurs, and the Celtics. He never played against them only like Kobe did with the Suns twice.



Did you also forget that Kobe torched the hell out of the Spurs in the '08 WCF? I don't even think you want me to bring up those stats.


How does that relate? You're going to nitpick series now? I thought we were looking at typical playoffs. I brought up the Suns because they comprised 2 entire playoffs for Kobe, not because I was going series by series. They were alone 2 playoffs.



Once Lebron started to face the real competition of the East and the real defensive teams like the '08 Celtics then he started to face problems with scoring.
Like all players who face stronger defenses. Did Kobe not also struggle against the 2004 Pistons and 2008 Celtics? And this was only up to 2008. Since then, he excelled against the Magic's #1 rated defense in 2009, and the Celtics in 2010, despite "quitting" he put up something like 27 on like 55 TS%, that's including his 3/14 and his 8/21 games. And those were his hardest defensive opponents in the last 3 years. Against other teams like the Bulls/Hawks/Pistons he killed them.

Since the 2008-2009 season, LeBron has been either the #1 or #2 at worst scorer in the league. Just because he's not the best shooter, doesn't make him not the best scorer.

[hitmanyr2k]

That Suns defense was better than that Wizards defense.
Shawn Marion wasn't the primary defender on Kobe but he did occasionally defend him.


Suns '05-'06 DRating - 16th in the league
Suns '06-'07 DRating - 13th in the league

Wizards '05-'06 DRating - 22nd in the league
Wizards '06-'07 DRating - 28th in the league

Then factor in how the Suns had superior perimeter defenders and it isn't even close.

Cmon, the 2006 Suns had no interior presence or shot blockers whatsoever, NONE. Their defense was terrible even if their defensive rating says they were in the middle of the pack. Raja Bell never stopped anybody. I'm not sure where he even got the reputation of a good defender. Since you're so high on defensive rating here's Bell's for 2006 (109) and 2007 (110). Now that's just plain ugly. At least Shawn Marion had great defensive ratings (100) for both 2006 and 2007 but he was primarily on Lamar Odom.



How many games did the Spurs play when they were going to the 2007 NBA Finals? Probably more games than they played heading into the 2008 WCF.

The 2007 Spurs were healthy in the playoffs. The 2008 Spurs were anything but. Like I said before, besides a declining Tim Duncan they had no interior presence in the middle. Ginobili carried them the second half of the season and then jacked his ankle a week before the playoffs started and that ankle got worse and worse as the playoffs went on. By the end of the semis with the Hornets he could barely walk but gutted up and played on anyway. The Lakers were well rested and healthy.

[StateOfMind12]

Cmon, the 2006 Suns had no interior presence or shot blockers whatsoever, NONE. Their defense was terrible even if their defensive rating says they were in the middle of the pack. Raja Bell never stopped anybody. I'm not sure where he even got the reputation of a good defender. Since you're so high on defensive rating here's Bell's for 2006 (109) and 2007 (110). Now that's just plain ugly. At least Shawn Marion had great defensive ratings (100) for both 2006 and 2007 but he was primarily on Lamar Odom.
It doesn't matter. The Suns defense in '06 and '07 were better than the Wizards defense in those years. Raja Bell was voted as an All-NBA Defensive member during those years and I remember Shawn Marion was a DPOY candidate in '07. It's safe to say those two defenders were far better defensive players than anybody on on the Wizards.




The 2007 Spurs were healthy in the playoffs. The 2008 Spurs were anything but. Like I said before, besides a declining Tim Duncan they had no interior presence in the middle. Ginobili carried them the second half of the season and then jacked his ankle a week before the playoffs started and that ankle got worse and worse as the playoffs went on. By the end of the semis with the Hornets he could barely walk but gutted up and played on anyway. The Lakers were well rested and healthy.
How does this explain why Kobe torched them with high efficiency while Lebron struggled to score and was inefficient against the Spurs? Did Manu play defense against either one? No, it was Bowen that was playing defense against those two and it was Duncan in the middle. Manu is irrelevant in this conversation.

[StateOfMind12]

Except that LeBron never went up against ONLY the Wizards. Kobe went up ONLY against the Suns. In the years LeBron went against the Wizards he also played the Pistons, the Pistons and Spurs, and the Celtics. He never played against them only like Kobe did with the Suns twice.

How does that relate? You're going to nitpick series now? I thought we were looking at typical playoffs. I brought up the Suns because they comprised 2 entire playoffs for Kobe, not because I was going series by series. They were alone 2 playoffs.
You could say something similar for '08, '09, and '10. Kobe played against more teams and in more games.



Like all players who face stronger defenses. Did Kobe not also struggle against the 2004 Pistons and 2008 Celtics? And this was only up to 2008. Since then, he excelled against the Magic's #1 rated defense in 2009, and the Celtics in 2010, despite "quitting" he put up something like 27 on like 55 TS%, that's including his 3/14 and his 8/21 games. And those were his hardest defensive opponents in the last 3 years. Against other teams like the Bulls/Hawks/Pistons he killed them.

Since the 2008-2009 season, LeBron has been either the #1 or #2 at worst scorer in the league. Just because he's not the best shooter, doesn't make him not the best scorer.
I say #2 at the best.

Kobe was the better scorer in '08-'09 and I would have to say he was probably better again in '09-'10. You also have to factor in that Kobe had a chance to play with some great offensive options. They are going to take away shots and points away from Kobe. It's not that Kobe wasn't good enough to produce the same way he did in '06 and '07, it's just that he didn't have to produce like that. That was obviously for the better since in '06 and '07 they were unable to get past the 1st round while in '08, '09, and '10 they at least made it to the Finals and they won in two of them.

[NumberSix]

How about this. When was LeBron the best scorer in the league?....... Now.

[Dave3]

You could say something similar for '08, '09, and '10. Kobe played against more teams and in more games.

:facepalm It's not about just the more teams in more games. It's about the fact that one was against only 1 team which was poor defensively, and the other was against 2 or 4 teams, half of which were excellent defensively. It's not the volume of teams, it's the huge difference in the competition, and the disparity in games. In the 2007 playoffs Kobe played in 5 games, while LeBron played in 20+. In the post seasons you're bringing up, the amount of teams/games played in during the post season is much closer than that.



I say #2 at the best.

Yeah, and you've already shown your usual anti LeBron agenda, and we all know you're RG, so I'm actually surprised you said #2 and not like 6th.

As for what you say, LeBron is the league leading scorer since 2008 (ie: all 4 years combined ppg) and has the highest FG% and eFG% of anyone else in the top 5. And only Durant challenges him in TS%. I would say that makes you easily #2 at worst, with a strong case for each year of 2009, 2010, and 2011. Almost inarguable for 2009 and 2010, with Durant having an equal argument for 2011. This year it's been a no contest so far, but it's only been 8 games for him.



Kobe was the better scorer in '08-'09 and I would have to say he was probably better again in '09-'10. You also have to factor in that Kobe had a chance to play with some great offensive options. They are going to take away shots and points away from Kobe.

And yet Kobe has taken more shots than LeBron in every single one of the last 8 years. How are Kobe's better offensive options hurting Kobe's offensive output if he's still taking more shots than LeBron?


It's not that Kobe wasn't good enough to produce the same way he did in '06 and '07, it's just that he didn't have to produce like that. That was obviously for the better since in '06 and '07 they were unable to get past the 1st round while in '08, '09, and '10 they at least made it to the Finals and they won in two of them.

Again, he was still taking more shots than LeBron. And there's also a difference between 2006 Kobe and 2009 Kobe, just like there is between 2006 and 2009 LeBron.

[StateOfMind12]

It's not about just the more teams in more games. It's about the fact that one was against only 1 team which was poor defensively, and the other was against 2 or 4 teams, half of which were excellent defensively. It's not the volume of teams, it's the huge difference in the competition, and the disparity in games. In the 2007 playoffs Kobe played in 5 games, while LeBron played in 20+. In the post seasons you're bringing up, the amount of teams/games played in during the post season is much closer than that.
What is funny about that is that the Nets were rated worse defensively in 2007 than the Suns. That leaves the Pistons and the Spurs, where Lebron played well in one series and got completely dominated in another. Lebron wasn't as good in the ECF as most people think. He had that one great game in Game 5 and that was truly about it. There is a reason why everybody says '07 was Lebron's most overrated season and they say his '06 season was actually better.


Yeah, and you've already shown your usual anti LeBron agenda, and we all know you're RG, so I'm actually surprised you said #2 and not like 6th
If you say Lebron is #2 at the worst, and I say #2 what is wrong with it? It sounds like you have a hard time accepting Lebron not being #1. RG? Tell the admins, mods around here to check my IP and lets see If I am this RG fellow. Ok?


As for what you say, LeBron is the league leading scorer since 2008 (ie: all 4 years combined ppg) and has the highest FG% and eFG% of anyone else in the top 5. And only Durant challenges him in TS%. I would say that makes you easily #2 at worst, with a strong case for each year of 2009, 2010, and 2011. Almost inarguable for 2009 and 2010, with Durant having an equal argument for 2011. This year it's been a no contest so far, but it's only been 8 games for him.
How exactly did Lebron do in the '08 playoffs specifically against the Celtics? I'll bring them up again.

Lebron vs. Celtics in the '08 playoffs- 26.7 ppg, 35.5% FG, 23.1% 3P, 76% FT, 48.06% TS.

That isn't better than what Kobe put up in the '08 NBA Finals against the Celtics.

Kobe vs. Celtics in the '08 playoffs - 25.7 ppg, 40.5% FG, 32.1% 3P, 80% FT, 50.57% TS.

Just because Lebron scores more due to having more opportunities to score and being forced to score more doesn't mean he is a better scorer.


And yet Kobe has taken more shots than LeBron in every single one of the last 8 years. How are Kobe's better offensive options hurting Kobe's offensive output if he's still taking more shots than LeBron?
He has taken more shots than Lebron, sure, but he is taking less shots than what Kobe himself took in '06 and '07 which was my point. But did you also factor in the FTA Lebron takes? They don't count a FGA if the players get to the FT line. Lebron has more shot and scoring opportunities to his team than Kobe does, that is a fact.

Kobe and Lebron FGA and FTA since '06

Kobe in '06 - 27.2 fga, 10.2 fta
Lebron in '06 - 23.1 fga, 10.3 fta

Kobe in '07 - 22.8 fga, 10.2 fta
Lebron in '07 - 20.8 fga, 9.0 fta

Kobe in '08 - 20.6 fga, 9.0 fta
Lebron in '08 - 21.9 fga, 10.3 fta

Kobe in '09 - 20.9 fga, 6.9 fta
Lebron in '09 - 19.9 fga, 9.4 fta

Kobe in '10 - 21.5 fga, 7.4 fta
Lebron in '10 - 20.1 fga, 10.2 fta

The player with more scoring opportunities was the one that scored more ppg. There is nothing odd about this.

[Dave3]

What is funny about that is that the Nets were rated worse defensively in 2007 than the Suns. That leaves the Pistons and the Spurs, where Lebron played well in one series and got completely dominated in another.

Ok...and that's irrelevant to what we're discussing, which is comparing 2 playoffs in which one player played 5 games against a poor defensive team, and one where the other played 20 against 4 different teams. Again, even if you give Kobe the win there, your "typically" statement is false, as LeBron and Kobe split the eFG%/TS% 3-3. I fail to see how it's typical of LeBron's won the more recent half of those.



If you say Lebron is #2 at the worst, and I say #2 what is wrong with it? It sounds like you have a hard time accepting Lebron not being #1.

Difference is you're saying #2 at best, and I'm saying at worst. He's actually #1 for 2009 and 2010, and arguably 2011, while #2 in 2008. You're saying he's not #1 in any of those. That's what I'm saying is clearly biased.


RG? Tell the admins, mods around here to check my IP and lets see If I am this RG fellow. Ok?
Yeah, because it's been shown that mods have this capability right?:rolleyes: Want to offer anything else you know can't happen? lol



How exactly did Lebron do in the '08 playoffs specifically against the Celtics? I'll bring them up again.

Lebron vs. Celtics in the '08 playoffs- 26.7 ppg, 35.5% FG, 23.1% 3P, 76% FT, 48.06% TS.

That isn't better than what Kobe put up in the '08 NBA Finals against the Celtics.

Kobe vs. Celtics in the '08 playoffs - 25.7 ppg, 40.5% FG, 32.1% 3P, 80% FT, 50.57% TS.

Um ok? Your defense for LeBron not being #1 in 2009, 2010, and 2011 is a series from 2008 before he added a consistent jumper to his game? Pretty weak evidence lol.



Just because Lebron scores more due to having more opportunities to score and being forced to score more doesn't mean he is a better scorer.
He has taken more shots than Lebron, sure, but he is taking less shots than what Kobe himself took in '06 and '07 which was my point. But did you also factor in the FTA Lebron takes? They don't count a FGA if the players get to the FT line. Lebron has more shot and scoring opportunities to his team than Kobe does, that is a fact.
Um, I did factor in FTA, and your "fact" is again wrong. LeBron last year for example LeBron took 1.2 less FGA than Kobe and 1.3 FTA more per game. Considering that about two free throw attempts equate to a FGA, you'd be wrong on 2011.

In 2010 LeBron 1.4 less FGA than Kobe, and 2.6 more FTA than Kobe...so yeah, that year they were very close..except for the fact that LeBron had 3 more ppg thanks to his much better eFG% and TS%.

In 2009 LeBron took a shot less/game but 2.5 more FTA. A small advantage for him there, but again he outscored Kobe by over 2 ppg because his eFG% and TS% was higher.

I ask you this: how is LeBron scoring more because he shoots more if he's got a higher FG%, eFG%, AND TS%? Makes no sense to me....:confusedshrug:

[DMAVS41]

What is funny about that is that the Nets were rated worse defensively in 2007 than the Suns. That leaves the Pistons and the Spurs, where Lebron played well in one series and got completely dominated in another. Lebron wasn't as good in the ECF as most people think. He had that one great game in Game 5 and that was truly about it. There is a reason why everybody says '07 was Lebron's most overrated season and they say his '06 season was actually better.


If you say Lebron is #2 at the worst, and I say #2 what is wrong with it? It sounds like you have a hard time accepting Lebron not being #1. RG? Tell the admins, mods around here to check my IP and lets see If I am this RG fellow. Ok?

How exactly did Lebron do in the '08 playoffs specifically against the Celtics? I'll bring them up again.

Lebron vs. Celtics in the '08 playoffs- 26.7 ppg, 35.5% FG, 23.1% 3P, 76% FT, 48.06% TS.

That isn't better than what Kobe put up in the '08 NBA Finals against the Celtics.

Kobe vs. Celtics in the '08 playoffs - 25.7 ppg, 40.5% FG, 32.1% 3P, 80% FT, 50.57% TS.

Just because Lebron scores more due to having more opportunities to score and being forced to score more doesn't mean he is a better scorer.


He has taken more shots than Lebron, sure, but he is taking less shots than what Kobe himself took in '06 and '07 which was my point. But did you also factor in the FTA Lebron takes? They don't count a FGA if the players get to the FT line. Lebron has more shot and scoring opportunities to his team than Kobe does, that is a fact.

Kobe and Lebron FGA and FTA since '06

Kobe in '06 - 27.2 fga, 10.2 fta
Lebron in '06 - 23.1 fga, 10.3 fta

Kobe in '07 - 22.8 fga, 10.2 fta
Lebron in '07 - 20.8 fga, 9.0 fta

Kobe in '08 - 20.6 fga, 9.0 fta
Lebron in '08 - 21.9 fga, 10.3 fta

Kobe in '09 - 20.9 fga, 6.9 fta
Lebron in '09 - 19.9 fga, 9.4 fta

Kobe in '10 - 21.5 fga, 7.4 fta
Lebron in '10 - 20.1 fga, 10.2 fta

The player with more scoring opportunities was the one that scored more ppg. There is nothing odd about this.


Kobe was marginally better if at all....and much of that was having a significantly better supporting cast.

I love how scoring more points on better overall efficiency somehow makes someone not a better scorer than another player.

[Dave3]

Kobe was marginally better if at all....and much of that was having a significantly better supporting cast.

I love how scoring more points on better overall efficiency somehow makes someone not a better scorer than another player.
That only applies if you're LeBron. If you lead the league in scoring with a 60% TS%? Naw, 2nd best scorer at best. :oldlol:

[pauk]

What is the best scorer? If that is average the most points per night and being very efficient at it? Then yes....... i dont see how stats lie...

If you go by who has the best scoring arsenal? Then i guess Kobe.......... but i think anybody can have that "scoring arsenal" shooting 45% fg

[madmax]

Kobe was marginally better if at all....and much of that was having a significantly better supporting cast.

I love how scoring more points on better overall efficiency somehow makes someone not a better scorer than another player.

:lol
I baffles me too...I mean you feel like these posters are coherent enough to post essays, yet they still try to argue that 2+2 does not equal 4...:roll: Reading these posts of butthurt Bryant brigade is probably the most amusing thing on internet there is:D

[StateOfMind12]

Difference is you're saying #2 at best, and I'm saying at worst. He's actually #1 for 2009 and 2010, and arguably 2011, while #2 in 2008. You're saying he's not #1 in any of those. That's what I'm saying is clearly biased.I think Kobe was the best in all three of those seasons. That is not knack on Lebron since Kobe is an all-time great scorer.


Yeah, because it's been shown that mods have this capability right? Want to offer anything else you know can't happen? lol
They have that capability, all message boards and forums do. So tell them to look it up and lets see if they match? If not, shut up and either discuss basketball or don't discuss at all.


Um ok? Your defense for LeBron not being #1 in 2009, 2010, and 2011 is a series from 2008 before he added a consistent jumper to his game? Pretty weak evidence lol.
I am not bringing up 2011 at least involving Kobe. 2011 the best scorer in the NBA was Dirk Nowitzki.


Kobe was marginally better if at all....and much of that was having a significantly better supporting cast.
What are you referring to?

Regular season stats

Kobe in '09 - 20.9 fga, 6.9 fta, 26.8 ppg
Lebron in '09 - 19.9 fga, 9.4 fta, 28.4 ppg

Lebron scored 1.6 more ppg because he had more attempts from the FT line, 2.5 fta more.

Kobe in '10 - 21.5 fga, 7.4 fta, 27 ppg
Lebron in '10 - 20.1 fga, 10.2 fta, 29.7 ppg

Lebron scored 2.7 more ppg despite having taking 1.4 fga less but taking 2.8 fta more. You also have to keep in mind that that was the season where Kobe was banged up from mid-season to the playoffs.

2010 post-season scoring stats between Kobe and Lebron

Kobe in '10 PO - 29.2 ppg, 22.2 fga, 8 fta
Lebron in '10 PO - 29.1 ppg, 19.1 fga, 10.9 fta

10.9 - 8 differential from FTA - 3.9
22.2 - 19.1 differential from fga - 3.1

Yet Kobe was the one that scored and averaged more ppg. Do you get my drift that the one that has more scoring opportunities is usually the one that scores more ppg?

[LA_Showtime]

Purely based off his mentality I would say no.

[pauk]

More efficiency than Kobe... more PPG...

Youngest to all scoring totals from 1000 to 17000... which means on pace to shatter Kareems scoring total...

3rd highest PPG average ever...

what the hell more do you want?


BUT.... Lebron is not just a scorer... i mean... a pure scorer... who just gets in there with a mindset of "score score score!" and dont mind chucking for 40-50 FGA and have 0 assists................. his unselfishness/"point-forward" instincts have something to do with that

[DMAVS41]

I think Kobe was the best in all three of those seasons. That is not knack on Lebron since Kobe is an all-time great scorer.


They have that capability, all message boards and forums do. So tell them to look it up and lets see if they match? If not, shut up and either discuss basketball or don't discuss at all.

I am not bringing up 2011 at least involving Kobe. 2011 the best scorer in the NBA was Dirk Nowitzki.


What are you referring to?

In the 08 playoffs against the celtics for both of them. You give Lebron the help/coaching that Kobe had and you would have seen him play far more efficient. That is how it normally works...its why you see Lebron shooting over 50% now because he has less to do offensively. Teams can't load up on him.

I know that is probably hard to understand as a Kobe fan. Kobe could go out there with the most loaded team ever and he'd still shoot 45%...just the player that he is. Kobe against air would find a way to shoot sub 50%.

If you are going to try and use such specific examples, better take the context into account.

And on another note, the Suns were horrendous defensively both times Kobe played them in the playoffs. Counting those as "playoff runs" is just silly....

[Dave3]

I think Kobe was the best in all three of those seasons. That is not knack on Lebron since Kobe is an all-time great scorer.
It's still a "knock" on LeBron because he was the better scorer. You don't have to be compared to a bad player to be insulted. Saying Kobe was better in 2009 and 2010 as a scorer is just wrong, and it's also clearly fitting with your agenda against LeBron.



They have that capability, all message boards and forums do. So tell them to look it up and lets see if they match? If not, shut up and either discuss basketball or don't discuss at all.
Yeah, and they've shown that willingness right? It happens right?:oldlol:



I am not bringing up 2011 at least involving Kobe. 2011 the best scorer in the NBA was Dirk Nowitzki.

:wtf: Nowitzki didn't even have an argument for top 2. The top 2 were easily LeBron Durant (no argument for anyone else at all) and Wade was arguably #3. Putting Dirk at #1 for 2011 is ridiculous.

[StateOfMind12]

It's still a "knock" on LeBron because he was the better scorer. You don't have to be compared to a bad player to be insulted. Saying Kobe was better in 2009 and 2010 as a scorer is just wrong, and it's also clearly fitting with your agenda against LeBron.
How is it wrong when there are plenty of people that said that including the media and analysts? It sounds like you just have a hard time accepting that Kobe was better in an area than Lebron at the time.


Yeah, and they've shown that willingness right? It happens right?:oldlol:
Well until then, you either discuss basketball or don't.



:wtf: Nowitzki didn't even have an argument for top 2. The top 2 were easily LeBron Durant (no argument for anyone else at all) and Wade was arguably #3. Putting Dirk at #1 for 2011 is ridiculous.
It is obvious you don't know the difference between most productive scorer and best scorer. Durant was not a better scorer than Dirk. He averaged and scored more ppg sure, but Dirk is the one with a variety of scoring moves and was also more efficient. It's the same with Dirk vs. Lebron as well. Dirk is considered the best scorer in the NBA last season by plenty, plenty here, and plenty on other sites such as RealGM.

[DMAVS41]

I think Kobe was the best in all three of those seasons. That is not knack on Lebron since Kobe is an all-time great scorer.


They have that capability, all message boards and forums do. So tell them to look it up and lets see if they match? If not, shut up and either discuss basketball or don't discuss at all.

I am not bringing up 2011 at least involving Kobe. 2011 the best scorer in the NBA was Dirk Nowitzki.


What are you referring to?

Regular season stats

Kobe in '09 - 20.9 fga, 6.9 fta, 26.8 ppg
Lebron in '09 - 19.9 fga, 9.4 fta, 28.4 ppg

Lebron scored 1.6 more ppg because he had more attempts from the FT line, 2.5 fta more.

Kobe in '10 - 21.5 fga, 7.4 fta, 27 ppg
Lebron in '10 - 20.1 fga, 10.2 fta, 29.7 ppg

Lebron scored 2.7 more ppg despite having taking 1.4 fga less but taking 2.8 fta more. You also have to keep in mind that that was the season where Kobe was banged up from mid-season to the playoffs.

2010 post-season scoring stats between Kobe and Lebron

Kobe in '10 PO - 29.2 ppg, 22.2 fga, 8 fta
Lebron in '10 PO - 29.1 ppg, 19.1 fga, 10.9 fta

10.9 - 8 differential from FTA - 3.9
22.2 - 19.1 differential from fga - 3.1

Yet Kobe was the one that scored and averaged more ppg. Do you get my drift that the one that has more scoring opportunities is usually the one that scores more ppg?


Is the bold serious? You act like getting to the line more often isn't a huge part of scoring.

Here is my drift. Over the last 4 years, Lebron has a higher ppg average and has done it more efficiently.

Let me make it clear:

More points and on better efficiency = better scorer

Its not hard at all.

[StateOfMind12]

[/B]

Is the bold serious? You act like getting to the line more often isn't a huge part of scoring.

Here is my drift. Over the last 4 years, Lebron has a higher ppg average and has done it more efficiently.

Let me make it clear:

More points and on better efficiency = better scorer

Its not hard at all.
I am pretty much saying Lebron scores and averages more ppg because he has more opportunities to do so.

[madmax]

I am pretty much saying Lebron scores and averages more ppg because he has more opportunities to do so.

he has more opportunities because he plays with those scrubs called Wade and Bosh I guess?:lol And despite having "less opportunities" to score, Mr. Bryant still takes more shots than Lebron:eek: Interesting indeed...

[Dave3]

How is it wrong when there are plenty of people that said that including the media and analysts? It sounds like you just have a hard time accepting that Kobe was better in an area than Lebron at the time.

The media and analysts? I thought the media was all over LeBron and they're not to be trusted when talking about him? The same media and analysts that have called him better than Jordan? And show me these "plently" of people that called LeBron a worse scorer than Kobe in 2010.



Well until then, you either discuss basketball or don't. Oh I'm sorry, I didn't know I was limited to what you allowed me to speak about. Hey, as long as trolls are allowed to make however stupid topics they want, I'll be allowed to call them out.



It is obvious you don't know the difference between most productive scorer and best scorer. Durant was not a better scorer than Dirk. He averaged and scored more ppg sure, but Dirk is the one with a variety of scoring moves and was also more efficient. It's the same with Dirk vs. Lebron as well. Dirk is considered the best scorer in the NBA last season by plenty, plenty here, and plenty on other sites such as RealGM.
And it's obvious you don't know the difference between most versatile and best. Production is what makes you the best, not versatility. If a player is going to score more and on better percentages everywhere, they're the better scorer. Just because the other one can hit tougher shots at times, doesn't make them the better scorer. In sports, production is what matters, not the way you produce, but what you produce. If you produce the better results, then you're better. It's that simple.

[Pointguard]

As much as I respect Kobe, and think he gets underrated by a lot of people here, if Lebron wanted to score more or put his down and said he was going to score like Kobe does, it wouldn't be close. If Lebron wanted to score more, as opposed to getting others involved, he's a better scorer than even Durant. Unfortunately, Lebron's offensive versatility is used against him.

[Dave3]

I am pretty much saying Lebron scores and averages more ppg because he has more opportunities to do so.
If it's only opportunity then why does he have higher FG%, eFG%, and TS%? Why continue to ignore those 3 stats over the last 4 years?

[DMAVS41]

I am pretty much saying Lebron scores and averages more ppg because he has more opportunities to do so.

But this is false though. That is your problem.

[StateOfMind12]

The media and analysts? I thought the media was all over LeBron and they're not to be trusted when talking about him? The same media and analysts that have called him better than Jordan? And show me these "plently" of people that called LeBron a worse scorer than Kobe in 2010.
Barkley would be one. He always said Lebron was the best player but Kobe was the best scorer. I am pretty sure that was the general consensus in 2010 until the Finals where Kobe started to be considered a better player than Lebron again.


And it's obvious you don't know the difference between most versatile and best. Production is what makes you the best, not versatility. If a player is going to score more and on better percentages everywhere, they're the better scorer. Just because the other one can hit tougher shots at times, doesn't make them the better scorer. In sports, production is what matters, not the way you produce, but what you produce. If you produce the better results, then you're better. It's that simple.
That's your definition of best......not mine and not many others either.

[lilgodfather1]

If it's versatility then Steve Nash aka Mr. 50/40/90 is the best scorer. He has the best offensive arsenal.

[Dave3]

Barkley would be one. He always said Lebron was the best player but Kobe was the best scorer. I am pretty sure that was the general consensus in 2010 until the Finals where Kobe started to be considered a better player than Lebron again.


It wasn't the general consensus, especially in 2010.


That's your definition of best......not mine and not many others either.Yeah, that's my definition, and the definition for many others. You say "other people believe what I believe" and I can make the exact same argument. That's why in all of the summer polls (including one you made as Swagg3r) LeBron was voted as the best player in the league, even coming off of his horrid NBA Finals series. Because at the end of the day, he still produced more than anyone else.

[Dave3]

If it's versatility then Steve Nash aka Mr. 50/40/90 is the best scorer. He has the best offensive arsenal.
No post game. If it's versatility it's Kobe/Melo just because they have the post game that Durant and LeBron have lacked in previous years, and have the 3 point game that LeBron isn't utilizing this year.

Versatility vs. effectiveness though. This thread seems to be about the former than the latter.

[DMAVS41]

Barkley would be one. He always said Lebron was the best player but Kobe was the best scorer. I am pretty sure that was the general consensus in 2010 until the Finals where Kobe started to be considered a better player than Lebron again.


That's your definition of best......not mine and not many others either.


That really would only come into play if there was a huge inherent weakness in Lebron's game that negated his impact at times. I don't see any evidence that there is such in Lebron's game and not Kobe's.

[StateOfMind12]

It wasn't the general consensus, especially in 2010.
Based on what? Most people said it and believed it so I would say that was the general consensus.


Yeah, that's my definition, and the definition for many others. You say "other people believe what I believe" and I can make the exact same argument. That's why in all of the summer polls (including one you made as Swagg3r) LeBron was voted as the best player in the league, even coming off of his horrid NBA Finals series. Because at the end of the day, he still produced more than anyone else.
Ok. :confusedshrug: I am not saying you are wrong for saying Lebron is the best scorer in the league, I just don't agree with you and majority of others probably don't either. You are allowed to have your own opinion. It's not ridilcious to say one is better than the other and I don't' know people always think this especially when comparing players that are in the same tier/class at the least.

Your definition of best may not be the same as others.


[/B]

That really would only come into play if there was a huge inherent weakness in Lebron's game that negated his impact at times. I don't see any evidence that there is such in Lebron's game and not Kobe's.
I would say we saw a pretty big weakness in Lebron's scoring in the 2011 NBA Finals.

[Dave3]

Based on what? Most people said it and believed so I would say that was the general consensus.

.
Ok. :confusedshrug: I am not saying you are wrong for saying Lebron is the best scorer in the league, I just don't agree with you and majority of others probably don't either. You are allowed to have your own opinion. It's not ridilcious to say one is better than the other and I don't' know people always think this especially when comparing players that are in the same tier/class at the least.

Your definition of best may not be the same as others.
Your problem is you keep saying "the majority agrees with me" when you offer no proof of that, it's all just you making up stuff. What majority agrees with you? ISH? Like when they voted for LeBron being better the entire summer? Where is this majority you're claiming backs you up?

And Ps. By saying he's number 2 at best while I say he's #1 for multiple seasons, that actually is saying I'm wrong lol. When two people disagree like that, each person thinks the other is wrong.

[lilgodfather1]

No post game. If it's versatility it's Kobe/Melo just because they have the post game that Durant and LeBron have lacked in previous years, and have the 3 point game that LeBron isn't utilizing this year.

Versatility vs. effectiveness though. This thread seems to be about the former than the latter.
This thread is simply about ooh's and ahh's. This twit thinks that Kobe is the GOAT scorer because he saw him hit a couple of shots with three defenders drapped all over him at the end of the game. Then he hears some idiot like Skip Bayless saying Kobe is super clutch, best scorer, blah, blah, blah, and now he is taking that opinion, and disregarding the facts, and trying to argue it on this board. That is all Kobe stans do. They simply say Kobe is better because he looks better. And if LeBron does something that looks better they simply make up something else. Kobe is clutch. Kobe is the best closer. Kobe is the man on his team. Kobe has killer instinct. Notice how Kobe is always the best at stuff that can't be seen? I have. LeBron on the other hand is the best at stuff that can be seen, and proved. He is the best scorer, non PG passer EVER, better rebounder than Kobe, better defender, he is more efficient. Basically the only areas in basketball that LeBron isn't better than Kobe in is the imaginary "warrior" categories that Kobe takes.

[rhythmic]

As much as I respect Kobe, and think he gets underrated by a lot of people here, if Lebron wanted to score more or put his down and said he was going to score like Kobe does, it wouldn't be close. If Lebron wanted to score more, as opposed to getting others involved, he's a better scorer than even Durant. Unfortunately, Lebron's offensive versatility is used against him.

Completely and utterly disagree. If he looked to score more, the defense would collapse on him a lot more and due to his lack of versatility his efficiency would plummet. The reason he is so efficient is because of his all-around game. He keeps defenses on their toes with his passing ability and that prevents them from collapsing on him. Kobe isn't as assertive as LeBron with the ball, which is his own kryptonite.

He is not creative enough nor does he have the perimeter game to face the same defensive pressure Kobe faced in 06' & 07'.

[DMAVS41]

Based on what? Most people said it and believed it so I would say that was the general consensus.

.
Ok. :confusedshrug: I am not saying you are wrong for saying Lebron is the best scorer in the league, I just don't agree with you and majority of others probably don't either. You are allowed to have your own opinion. It's not ridilcious to say one is better than the other and I don't' know people always think this especially when comparing players that are in the same tier/class at the least.

Your definition of best may not be the same as others.


I would say we saw a pretty big weakness in Lebron's scoring in the 2011 NBA Finals.

And I saw a pretty big weakness in Kobe's scoring in the 04 finals.....LOL

[rhythmic]

And I saw a pretty big weakness in Kobe's scoring in the 04 finals.....LOL

That wasn't his scoring, it was his poor decision making.
Kobe in 07' probably took more bad shots then LeBron in his entire career.

[The_Yearning]

What is the best scorer? If that is average the most points per night and being very efficient at it? Then yes....... i dont see how stats lie...

If you go by who has the best scoring arsenal? Then i guess Kobe.......... but i think anybody can have that "scoring arsenal" shooting 45% fg

That 3-5% difference between LeChoke and Kobe didn't seem to help LeChoke in the finals at all... especially in crunch time when you separate the men from the boys.

Stats are overrated. Watch the games and understand the impact.

5 rings > 0

[Pointguard]

[QUOTE=rhythmic

[rfoster24]

Pretty much, which is why I don't think Lebron was a better scorer than Kobe in '08, '09, or '10. You can't fault Kobe for finally having talent and offensive scoring weapons to work with. It would be like saying that Robinson was a better scorer than Hakeem in '94 or Ewing was a better scorer than Hakeem in '90 because he scored more ppg than him. Is there anyone out there that actually thought either Ewing or Robinson was a better scorer than Hakeem then?

So, then this must be under the assumption that Lebron didn't have any offensive talent to work with at the time Kobe did, yet Lebron scored more AND his team had a better record both of these years. How could that be if Lebron didn't have a good team around him like Kobe? Look, I'm a Kobe fan, but you sound ignorant as **** always looking at it from Kobe's POV and never Lebrons'.

[rhythmic]

Nearly Lebron's whole career he didn't have a consistent scorer on his team. Defenses collapsed on him like crazy every playoffs. You didn't see that? San Antonio threw the kitchen sink at Lebron in the finals. Nor did Lebron have a seasoned coach to help free him up either. Lebron's career before Miami, he was the offensive creative source of his team every year and he was very efficient the whole time. Maybe I'm not getting you?

LeBron's unselfishness/passing ability prevented defenses from collapsing on him. Kobe didn't care because his scoring ability is more versatile and polished.

James hardly ever had more then one defender covering him on the perimeter. The defense would only collapse on him when he would drive inside for the score.

[Pointguard]

[QUOTE=rhythmic

[rhythmic]

Who doubles perimeter players on the perimeter? They don't even do that to Durant or Dirk. The Knicks got Mello now and no body is as versatile and polished as he is. But he isn't even in the conversation. Lebron knows when to assert what aspect of his game and you have to be creative, versatile and polished to do what he does. Polished would mean efficient, which might be the biggest knock on Kobe.

Okay, we completely have a different understanding of the game.
No point in arguing.

[che guevara]

He was the best scorer in '09 at the very least. 2nd in scoring in the regular season on better efficiency than the scoring leader, and then he blew the rest of the league out of the water in the playoffs averaging a ridiculous 35.3 ppg on 62 TS%. He was also clearly the best crunch time scorer and player that season in both the regular season and playoffs.

[SlayerEnraged]

Kobe always has been better than Lebron at scoring...Any zone defense team always makes him quit dancing. Also teams that don't let him get fast break dunks also have success vs. him. Kobe played consistantly throughout his career. When he came into the league he got a better jumper and never relied on his athletism. That's why his production even as he's gotten older is about the same.

[RazorBaLade]

For all of this arguing there is a simple stat called eFG% which counts all 3 pointers as 1.5 FGM in the FG% category, and LeBron's eFG% has also been higher than Kobe since after his rookie year.

Keep in mind, that even with LeBron's 48 FG%, that's while making about 1/3rd of his 3 pointers while taking about 4 a game. He still scores more per field goal attempt (even when 3s are included).

Theres no arguing I was just telling him why FG% is useless. Thank you for telling me about eFG%.

So theres about a 2ish% difference, but prime to prime I think Kobe has about 3 or 4 points on lebron. Its pretty close. the question is do we count ft efficiency as well, as that is still kind of scoring? How much does explosiveness matter, do 3 games of 30 pts make someone a better scorer than someone who drops 20 20 then 50 in a game?

Its gonna be close tho, lebron is still a guy that has a damn 28 ppg career average... He'll never lose in a landslide unless you compare him to like wilt.

[Dave3]

Theres no arguing I was just telling him why FG% is useless. Thank you for telling me about eFG%.

So theres about a 2ish% difference, but prime to prime I think Kobe has about 3 or 4 points on lebron. Its pretty close. the question is do we count ft efficiency as well, as that is still kind of scoring? How much does explosiveness matter, do 3 games of 30 pts make someone a better scorer than someone who drops 20 20 then 50 in a game?

Its gonna be close tho, lebron is still a guy that has a damn 28 ppg career average... He'll never lose in a landslide unless you compare him to like wilt.
FT% is included in in TS%. TS% or True Shooting percentage counts every FGM as 2 points, every 3FGM as 3 points, and all 3FGA or FGA as one attempt. It also counts FTA as 0.43 FGA because according to Hollinger, 43% of Free throws end a possession (as opposed to 100% of FGA ending a possession) because of the fact that there are often 2 shot in a row (so the first one doesn't count as ending a possession) and all FTs in an and one don't end a possession because you've already gotten the 2 points for that possession and it's just a bonus.

To answer your question, LeBron also has the advantage in TS% throughout the majority of his career, but Kobe does win in some years I believe, just not recently.

[Pointguard]

Rythmic, I don't think its on the level of understanding as much as it is the way things are intepreted. Kobe is a more versatile scorer but Lebron a more versatile offensive player and they both should use what they have to achieve their ends. Both are great in that way.

I think Durant could be one of the greatest scorers ever (or after Wilt). He isn't as versatile as Kobe/Mello/Lebron but what does it matter if he can dominate from the outside like he has done his whole career. The thing I find amazing is that Lebron, if he prioritized for scoring, could even outscore Durant. With Lebron its just a matter of priority. Lebron is even ahead of Durant at this stage at equal stages of their career's. Shaq wasn't polished or versatile but he was definitely a better scorer than Ewing who was both. Its not gymnastic's where you get points for the way you land.

[bingo123]

I think Kobe was the best in all three of those seasons. That is not knack on Lebron since Kobe is an all-time great scorer.


They have that capability, all message boards and forums do. So tell them to look it up and lets see if they match? If not, shut up and either discuss basketball or don't discuss at all.

I am not bringing up 2011 at least involving Kobe. 2011 the best scorer in the NBA was Dirk Nowitzki.


What are you referring to?

Regular season stats

Kobe in '09 - 20.9 fga, 6.9 fta, 26.8 ppg
Lebron in '09 - 19.9 fga, 9.4 fta, 28.4 ppg

Lebron scored 1.6 more ppg because he had more attempts from the FT line, 2.5 fta more.

Kobe in '10 - 21.5 fga, 7.4 fta, 27 ppg
Lebron in '10 - 20.1 fga, 10.2 fta, 29.7 ppg

Lebron scored 2.7 more ppg despite having taking 1.4 fga less but taking 2.8 fta more. You also have to keep in mind that that was the season where Kobe was banged up from mid-season to the playoffs.

2010 post-season scoring stats between Kobe and Lebron

Kobe in '10 PO - 29.2 ppg, 22.2 fga, 8 fta
Lebron in '10 PO - 29.1 ppg, 19.1 fga, 10.9 fta

10.9 - 8 differential from FTA - 3.9
22.2 - 19.1 differential from fga - 3.1

Yet Kobe was the one that scored and averaged more ppg. Do you get my drift that the one that has more scoring opportunities is usually the one that scores more ppg?

LOL what a joke. Why dont you take away all bonus points that Kobe scored from 3 pts? And one more question, who is the best at getting AND1s in last decade (probably in history of basketball)? Freethrow attempts =/= more scoring opportunities.

[ShaqAttack3234]

Well, Kobe was clearly the best from '06-'08.

'09 is tough. Lebron was incredible. Improved his shot a lot compared to '07 and '08, and his game held up in the playoffs. Kobe was still lethal, though. The most skilled player in the game at the time, held back his individual scoring and coasted somewhat through the regular season due to the Lakers 65-17 record, but could score with the best whenever he wanted. Wade also has an argument, got his explosiveness back and shot the ball better than he ever has in his career, his jumper was better than Lebron's that year. Can't completely forget about Dirk either.

In 2010, he has an argument. Durant entered the picture, and had a virtually identical statistical season to Lebron, but was worse in the playoffs. I'd say that Lebron was more unstoppable, he may have shot the ball better than in '09. Him disappearing vs Boston was more mentality than skillset, imo. Kobe was right there when healthy such as the first 2 months when he was unstoppable, especially in the post and later after he got his knee drained in the OKC series, though that was more with a lot of tough jumpers. Wade fell off a bit from '09. Melo was great, but had some nagging injuries around January.

In 2011, well, I guess the top 4 were pretty close(Lebron, Wade, Durant, Dirk). Lebron didn't seem as explosive as past seasons, but his mid-range shot was better than ever. When Melo was focused he was right there.

So in '09, I'd go with Kobe or Wade before Lebron just as a scorer, but not by much. Lebron might be the best choice in 2010, though due to Kobe's injuries and Wade's decline as far as shooting, motivation and explosiveness to some degree. And Dirk seemed like the best overall scorer in '11 after seeing him look unguardable throughout the season.

It's all debatable and comes down to preference. I do think that Lebron was the best overall player those 3 seasons, but 2010 is the year I'm most comfortable calling him the best scorer.

[StateOfMind12]

Well, Kobe was clearly the best from '06-'08.

'09 is tough. Lebron was incredible. Improved his shot a lot compared to '07 and '08, and his game held up in the playoffs. Kobe was still lethal, though. The most skilled player in the game at the time, held back his individual scoring and coasted somewhat through the regular season due to the Lakers 65-17 record, but could score with the best whenever he wanted. Wade also has an argument, got his explosiveness back and shot the ball better than he ever has in his career, his jumper was better than Lebron's that year. Can't completely forget about Dirk either.

In 2010, he has an argument. Durant entered the picture, and had a virtually identical statistical season to Lebron, but was worse in the playoffs. I'd say that Lebron was more unstoppable, he may have shot the ball better than in '09. Him disappearing vs Boston was more mentality than skillset, imo. Kobe was right there when healthy such as the first 2 months when he was unstoppable, especially in the post and later after he got his knee drained in the OKC series, though that was more with a lot of tough jumpers. Wade fell off a bit from '09. Melo was great, but had some nagging injuries around January.

In 2011, well, I guess the top 4 were pretty close(Lebron, Wade, Durant, Dirk). Lebron didn't seem as explosive as past seasons, but his mid-range shot was better than ever. When Melo was focused he was right there.

So in '09, I'd go with Kobe or Wade before Lebron just as a scorer, but not by much. Lebron might be the best choice in 2010, though due to Kobe's injuries and Wade's decline as far as shooting, motivation and explosiveness to some degree. And Dirk seemed like the best overall scorer in '11 after seeing him look unguardable throughout the season.

It's all debatable and comes down to preference. I do think that Lebron was the best overall player those 3 seasons, but 2010 is the year I'm most comfortable calling him the best scorer.
:applause: Great post, but I have a few questions for you if you don't mind.

What do you think about the argument about how Lebron is the best or better scorer than Kobe because he averages more ppg and with higher efficiency (2009)? I already explained my part about that, I think Lebron just scored more ppg because he was given more opportunities to score because Kobe had other great offensive options on his team such as Gasol, Odom, and Bynum whereas Lebron's 2nd option was Mo Williams. I just want to know your thoughts on that.

[ShaqAttack3234]

:applause: Great post, but I have a few questions for you if you don't mind.

What do you think about the argument about how Lebron is the best or better scorer than Kobe because he averages more ppg and with higher efficiency (2009)? I already explained my part about that, I think Lebron just scored more ppg because he was given more opportunities to score because Kobe had other great offensive options on his team such as Gasol, Odom, and Bynum whereas Lebron's 2nd option was Mo Williams. I just want to know your thoughts on that.

It is a tough question to answer because Lebron was more ball dominant which can help you get your own shot whenever you want. But it is a fact that he put the ball in the basket more frequently and at a better rate than Kobe in both the regular season and playoffs so it can be tough to tell someone they're wrong in that belief when there is evidence to back it up.

These things are extremely subjective. The 2 facts that few will argue with are that Kobe was considerably more skilled with his footwork, in the post, shooting from all areas and a better off the ball player. While few will also argue that Lebron had a huge advantage as far as speed, strength and athleticism and when his jumper was falling and he was hitting those heat check 28 footers, that and his ability to attack the basket at will and finish made him look like a man among boys.

So I'm fine with both point of views, and yes the offense and other offensive options around them certainly played a huge role in their numbers. Again, it's obvious that '09 Kobe wasn't a 27 ppg scorer maxed out, for evidence, just look at the playoffs when he put up 30+ without his efficiency dropping while winning it all, or him dropping 61 at MSG.

[RaininTwos]

Isnt Lebron scoring like prime shaq right now? He's scoring 30.1 PPG @ 60% and someone is asking when has he ever been the best scorer in the league?:facepalm

Dude scores at a high rate, more efficiently than any of his peers on the perimeter.

[eliteballer]

Watch the way teams guard Kobe and then see how they guard LeBron, and you'll see who they fear more

[Bladers]

Watch the way teams guard Kobe and then see how they guard LeBron, and you'll see who they fear more

This... and its not even close!

[StateOfMind12]

It is a tough question to answer because Lebron was more ball dominant which can help you get your own shot whenever you want. But it is a fact that he put the ball in the basket more frequently and at a better rate than Kobe in both the regular season and playoffs so it can be tough to tell someone they're wrong in that belief when there is evidence to back it up.

These things are extremely subjective. The 2 facts that few will argue with are that Kobe was considerably more skilled with his footwork, in the post, shooting from all areas and a better off the ball player. While few will also argue that Lebron had a huge advantage as far as speed, strength and athleticism and when his jumper was falling and he was hitting those heat check 28 footers, that and his ability to attack the basket at will and finish made him look like a man among boys.

So I'm fine with both point of views, and yes the offense and other offensive options around them certainly played a huge role in their numbers. Again, it's obvious that '09 Kobe wasn't a 27 ppg scorer maxed out, for evidence, just look at the playoffs when he put up 30+ without his efficiency dropping while winning it all, or him dropping 61 at MSG.
Yea, I think this is evident by their usage percentages.

Lebron in the '09 RS had a USG% of 32.2, 2nd in the league behind Dwyane Wade who was the scoring champion

Lebron in the '10 RS had a USG% of 32.2 again, 2nd in the league and was once again behind Dwyane Wade.

Kobe Bryant in the '09 RS had a USG% of 30.2, 3rd in the league behind both Dwyane Wade and LeBron James.

Kobe Bryant in the '10 RS had a USG% of 30.5, tied for 4th in the league with Carmelo Anthony, and was behind Dwyane Wade, LeBron James, and surprisingly Gilbert Arenas.


Now lets compare their post-season USG%.

Lebron's '09 PO USG% - 33.4, 2nd in the league behind Tony Parker
Lebron's '10 PO USG% - 28.2, tied for 5th in the league with Carmelo Anthony

Lebron in '09 playoffs - 35.3 ppg, 51.0% FG, 61.8% TS, 55.3% eFG - 14 gp
Lebron in '10 playoffs - 29.1 ppg, 46.6% FG, 56.3% TS, 50.7% eFG - 11 gp

Kobe's '09 PO USG% - 29.7, 5th in the league
Kobe's '10 PO USG% - 30.8, 2nd in the league behind Dwyane Wade.

Kobe in '09 playoffs - 30.2 ppg, 45.7% FG, 56.4% TS, 49.2% eFG - 23 gp
Kobe in '10 playoffs - 29.2 ppg, 45.7% FG, 56.7% TS, 50.6% eFG - 23 gp

I don't think it is a coincidence that the player with the higher USG% was always the one that scored more ppg. This goes back to seasons such as '06 but I think everyone including Lebron fans agree that Kobe was the best scorer in the league by a good margin from '06-'08.

[Mr. Jabbar]

no