Kobe gets dissed by Clipper post game, predict DRAMA

[Force]

Clipper post game on Fox Sports after the game against the Lakers, possible issues in the locker room.

Interesting to see their take on Kobe's aggressive shooting since this was still LA media, some of the guys on the show also work with the Lakers at times. Just a sampling of what was said.

-They said Bynum just quit playing since Kobe wasn't looking to go to him

Chris Paul was asked about it and he said "He just wants to score, we are worried about winning"

Don Maclean brought up how during the ups and downs of his career, Kobe's downs were when he didn't trust teammates and tried to score 40 every night with a high number of field goal attempts.

Too many people standing around watching Kobe

They brought up how Kobe shooting so much left Gasol and Bynum out of the game and not even expecting the ball and that this formula would not work against good teams and that in the past week it was barely enough to beat mediocre teams.

They also said to "keep an eye on the Laker locker room for any player issues"

[Clippersfan86]

:eek:

[Fiasco]

Kobe was getting doubled teamed at half court, and NONE of his teammates were running to get open or help out.

What the **** else was he supposed to do?

[Bladers]

Clipper post game on Fox Sports after the game against the Lakers, possible issues in the locker room.

Interesting to see their take on Kobe's aggressive shooting since this was still LA media, some of the guys on the show also work with the Lakers at times. Just a sampling of what was said.

-They said Bynum just quit playing since Kobe wasn't looking to go to him

Chris Paul was asked about it and he said "He just wants to score, we are worried about winning"

Don Maclean brought up how during the ups and downs of his career, Kobe's downs were when he didn't trust teammates and tried to score 40 every night with a high number of field goal attempts.

Too many people standing around watching Kobe

They brought up how Kobe shooting so much left Gasol and Bynum out of the game and not even expecting the ball and that this formula would not work against good teams and that in the past week it was barely enough to beat mediocre teams.

They also said to "keep an eye on the Laker locker room for any player issues"

links or GTFO!!!!

[NumberSix]

Kobe was getting doubled teamed at half court, and NONE of his teammates were running to get open or help out.

What the **** else was he supposed to do?
If Kobe is getting doubled, wouldn't there HAVE TO BE somebody who is completely open?

[Bladers]

If Kobe is getting doubled, wouldn't there HAVE TO BE somebody who is completely open?
i think you need to rewatch that 4th qtr with your glasses off.

[Force]

links or GTFO!!!!

It's on TV. Fox Sports. It's a pretty popular channel. Here is California they televise home games for the Lakers, the Clippers and the LA Kings from the NHL.

Just 2 weeks ago I posted here about Rubio's interview about the NBA being easier and I didn't have a link because it was on TV and then people tried to say I was lying. Then Euroleague came on to post the links.

The links don't exist yet because it just came on TV.

[SAKOTXA]

Dear basketball gods: give us a Lakers-Clippers playoff series. :bowdown:

[ImmortalD24]

Ban this clown if he doesn't provide an actual source.

[kennethgriffin]

chris paul and kobe are good friends

lol@ op


and even if he did say it... hes on a rival team... he's not about to suck kobes meat publicly

[Bladers]

It's on TV. Fox Sports. It's a pretty popular channel. Here is California they televise home games for the Lakers, the Clippers and the LA Kings from the NHL.

Just 2 weeks ago I posted here about Rubio's interview about the NBA being easier and I didn't have a link because it was on TV and then people tried to say I was lying. Then Euroleague came on to post the links.

The links don't exist yet because it just came on TV.

If he said it on the post game interview then it would be on the post game video on LAclippers.com and the quote would exist in other articles aswell.

You don't say things like that without it hitting the fan. But since I can't find the quote i doubt this thread is legit.

[Force]

Ban this clown if he doesn't provide an actual source.

It's on TV. Fox Sports. Is that not a source? It was the Clipper post game show, titled "Clippers Live", is that not a source? Don Maclean and Kiki V. were both NBA players, Kiki. They were on the show along with the other guys who just talk but weren't pro players. That's my source. People know I don't post BS on this board.

[TMacsOneGoodEye]

I don't think that happened.

[Force]

If he said it on the post game interview then it would be on the post game video on LAclippers.com and the quote would exist in other articles aswell.

You don't say things like that without it hitting the fan. But since I can't find the quote i doubt this thread is legit.

I should have it on my DV-R still, I don't see myself going through all the trouble of recording it and putting it online, plus that's illegal. I can find out the guy who works on the show who was interviewing Paul though. He's the non super proper black guy who always talks to guys in the locker room with their shirts off.

[Fiasco]

If Kobe is getting doubled, wouldn't there HAVE TO BE somebody who is completely open?

Whenever Gomes/Foye/Paul left their man to double Kobe, the guy who was free never got in position for a pass. They just stood there watching with their hands on their shorts.

Again, I ask you: what was Bryant supposed to do?

[Bladers]

It's on TV. Fox Sports. Is that not a source? It was the Clipper post game show, titled "Clippers Live", is that not a source? Don Maclean and Kiki V. were both NBA players, Kiki. They were on the show along with the other guys who just talk but weren't pro players. That's my source. People know I don't post BS on this board.

saying it was on "xxxxxx" isn't a source.

You actually have to provide evidence that it was on "xxxxxxx" the proof is the source not the statement that it was on "xxxxxxx"

[Force]

LOL @ people asking to ban me. My source is in the damn subject line. HAHAHA. Everything I posted was really said on the show. They were hating on Kobe for not looking to pass or get teammates involved enough and yes, CP3 was asked about it. He complimented Kobe and also said he just wants to score but we are worried about winning.

[NumberSix]

i think you need to rewatch that 4th qtr with your glasses off.
Nobody's talking to you, troll.

Don't respond. You're already on ignore.:no:

[Force]

saying it was on "xxxxxx" isn't a source.

You actually have to provide evidence that it was on "xxxxxxx" the proof is the source not the statement that it was on "xxxxxxx"

No you are wrong. If someone says something and I repeat it, I leave them as the source. It came on TV and I told you who some of the announcers were. The show title, everything. It's like if I said Ric Bucher said on ESPN that so and so was on the trading block, would I have to come here and post a video clip of it even though it just came on TV? If I don't post the brand new video clip (illegal btw) and only said it was Ric Bucher on ESPN's show called NBA Today then it's not a legit source??? LOL @ that not being evidence enough. It's not my fault you didn't watch the same show. I told you what the show is, now go find it yourself. I told you the channel and the show already.

I saw it with my own eyes, listened with my own ears.

[Bladers]

Nobody's talking to you, troll.

Don't respond. You're already on ignore.:no:

Oh wow, you hurt my feelings.

[WBynumToTheHole]

why argue over the source. theres truth to what he says, it sounds legit to me. bynum and gasol looked stagnated by the takeover. discuss that and wait to see if any articles come out.

[NumberSix]

why argue over the source. theres truth to what he says, it sounds legit to me. bynum and gasol looked stagnated by the takeover. discuss that and wait to see if any articles come out.
The team did look unmotivated, but to be fair, the refs really trolled the shit out of Matt Barnes.

[WBynumToTheHole]

Lol yes they did, griffin straight up grabbed his junk and matt got a foul

what kind of move is that!?

[therammingman]

Doubt it matters but I live in LA...watched thr post game too....OP is right, excrept I don't know if the cp3 quote was word for word....

[RazorBaLade]

surprised theres nothing on twitter about this

[Xiao Yao You]

They just stood there watching with their hands on their shorts.

Because they know better than to waste their time thinking Kobe might actually pass the ball. Did anyone actually expect anything different with Phil gone? Phil was the only guy that ever kept Kobe's ego in check. Without him he's just a big time scoring all-star guard not a champion.

[Force]

why argue over the source. theres truth to what he says, it sounds legit to me. bynum and gasol looked stagnated by the takeover. discuss that and wait to see if any articles come out.

Good post. I had a thread about Gasol and Bynum needing more looks, I believe it was after the 2nd game with 40 plus. No doubt Bynum dropped his interest and level of play big time. Bynum isn't the easiest person to deal with either, he wants to be a bigger part of the offense. Remember this guy was bitching out to the media for not getting voted into the all star game TWO seasons ago. He isn't the kind of person to stick around mentally if he isn't getting his too.

[White Mamba]

i watched the post game and this is not true about cp3.

[brahmabull117]

LOL @ people complaining about Kobe's game



the guy scored 40+ points on 62% True Shooting. Maybe if he had to take 40 shots to get that many points, people would have a point - but he only took 28



awesome game

[Xiao Yao You]

griffin straight up grabbed his junk and matt got a foul

Evans earning his money already.

[WBynumToTheHole]

he very well could be a champion if this team gels.

another thought, what do lakers and nets fans think about bynum and somethin else for deron and lopez if lopez comes back healthy?

bynum wants to be a star. let him go do the howard thing in new jersey while the nets get capspace. deron isnt going to stick around anyway, looks like.

[Force]

i watched the post game and this is not true about cp3.

yes it is, it's when he was half naked in the lock room getting interviewed. Paul seemed very negative and bothered during the interview it was evident. It was probably him worried about his injury. He said he's never had a hammy injury in his life and he said beating Miami and the Lakers isn't a big deal because every game will be a hard challenge and they are supposed to win these kinds of games.

[Xiao Yao You]

LOL @ people complaining about Kobe's game

LOL at the great Kobe with a 7th seed and a first round playoff loss last time he gunned like this.

[brahmabull117]

LOL at the great Kobe with a 7th seed and a first round playoff loss last time he gunned like this.


It's a team game, there's only so much kobe can control




Look, I'm a bulls fan - if Kobe had a bad game where he needed 40 shots to score 40 points I would be all over him - but he scored on over 60% TS percentage - that's a phenomenal game by all standards

[Xiao Yao You]

he very well could be a champion if this team gels.

How are they going to ge when they are standing around watching Kobe?

[RazorBaLade]

LOL @ people complaining about Kobe's game



the guy scored 40+ points on 62% True Shooting. Maybe if he had to take 40 shots to get that many points, people would have a point - but he only took 28



awesome game

the truth is the lakers arent gonna beat anyone good like this in a series, and that means we need pau and bynum to be better.. or we need to trade them for better players. so you either need to lose games right now and get pau and bynum into shape, or win games any means necessary so you have the cushion to lose when youre building the chemistry with the revamped team.

maybe kobe is choosing option 2 because he knows something we dont. maybe he figures they wont win anyways and he might as well set some records. i dunno.. i agree the lakers are losing these games if kobe doesnt play like this, hes shooting 50% or something on 40 pts and pau is 7-17 and putting up stinkers. but can we win without the rest of the guys getting better?

[Xiao Yao You]

right now and get pau and bynum into shape

I thought Bynum was an all-star, better than Dwight, etc.?


maybe kobe is choosing option 2 because he knows something we dont. maybe he figures they wont win anyways and he might as well set some records. i dunno..

I do. We've seen it all before. He's a gunner. Phil isn't there to keep him in check. Same old story.

[RazorBaLade]

I thought Bynum was an all-star, better than Dwight, etc.?



I do. We've seen it all before. He's a gunner. Phil isn't there to keep him in check. Same old story.

If bynum and pau were as good as laker haters say they were, which is where u hear the all star better than dwight etc , we would see them be able to produce on their "limited touches" of 15+ shots a game. I know exactly how pathetic they are. This team right now is pretty much 06-07 season good. We had lamar and a bench then, we instead now have pau for both of those. Wouldnt make the playoffs higher than a 7th seed without kobe.

14 pts on 17 shots in the biggest game of the year pau.... Don't get me wrong tho, I'm grateful we were able to contend for as long as we did.. I just know damn well that pau is soft as hell, which goes against the team mantra we are trying to have now with barnes and artest added and lamar gone along with this coach who paces up and down and screams shit all game. Bynum cant play against physical people either.

Well I don't believe he'd be gunning if we had CP3 and Howard right now like we would have if Stern didn't get in the way. Gunning with this mediocre team? I'd hope so. Our 7'ft bigs get stopped by physical 6'7 guys =/. Maybe when they show they can score on defensive masterminds like 6'7 Reggie Evans and Deandre eyes way too close to each other Jordan he'll give em more touches. I mean I also want barnes to shoot more, 1 out of 6 shots is not good.. Lets make it 1-10, 1-15? Why would you give it to kobe who can win games and shoot 50%? So stupid!

[Fiasco]

Because they know better than to waste their time thinking Kobe might actually pass the ball. Did anyone actually expect anything different with Phil gone? Phil was the only guy that ever kept Kobe's ego in check. Without him he's just a big time scoring all-star guard not a champion.

That is a terrible excuse to make in a game that was as close as this. You don't stop playing because you're afraid the only player on the team worth his salary "might not" pass you the ball when you're completely open.

[monkeypox]

If Kobe is getting doubled, wouldn't there HAVE TO BE somebody who is completely open?

Umm... you know one defender can block the passing lane for more than one player right?

[Nash]

LOL @ people complaining about Kobe's game



the guy scored 40+ points on 62% True Shooting. Maybe if he had to take 40 shots to get that many points, people would have a point - but he only took 28



awesome game
Dude, that applies when its like 7 of 14 shots. Not 28 shots, thats 14 shots of misses that maybe could have gone to Gasol or Bynum.

[N0Skillz]

Dude, that applies when its like 7 of 14 shots. Not 28 shots, thats 14 shots of misses that maybe could have gone to Gasol or Bynum.


neither Gasol or Bynum were shooting higher then 50%. Bynum couldnt even get near the low post

[pauk]

http://i1214.photobucket.com/albums/cc500/pauk666/kobeselfish.jpg

:lol

[Artillery]

If bynum and pau were as good as laker haters say they were, which is where u hear the all star better than dwight etc , we would see them be able to produce on their "limited touches" of 15+ shots a game. I know exactly how pathetic they are. This team right now is pretty much 06-07 season good. We had lamar and a bench then, we instead now have pau for both of those. Wouldnt make the playoffs higher than a 7th seed without kobe.

Laker/Kobe fans after a win: "Bynum's the best damn center in the league! Forget Dwight, we already have an unstoppable frontcourt with him and Pau"

Laker/Kobe fans after a loss: "Bynum and Gasol are WAY overrated by the Kobe haters"

[NumberSix]

http://i1214.photobucket.com/albums/cc500/pauk666/kobeselfish.jpg

:lol
It looks like a joke, but he really does do this.:roll:

[Shaquille O'Neal]

LOL @ people complaining about Kobe's game



the guy scored 40+ points on 62% True Shooting. Maybe if he had to take 40 shots to get that many points, people would have a point - but he only took 28



awesome game


14/28 = 50%, not 62%.

[chains5000]

14/28 = 50%, not 62%.
TS%

[Glide2keva]

LOL @ people complaining about Kobe's game



the guy scored 40+ points on 62% True Shooting. Maybe if he had to take 40 shots to get that many points, people would have a point - but he only took 28



awesome gameCrutch stat is being a crutch.

[Glide2keva]

TS%
The BS stat.

[Blue&Orange]

Two things about this...

Kobe started shooting like mad, when Bynum started to be praised left and right, kobe is against spotlight changes. He had an atroucious shooting game but that didn't stop him, no way Bynum would get more press.

By the second game i wondered how long it would take before Kobe completely alienated Gasol and Bynum...

[Yao Ming's Foot]

Lakers didnt lose back in the day due to Kobe's "gunning". It was their bottom of the barrel defenses. If their defense gels they can shred anybody, if not they can lose to anybody. Its pretty simple.

[shaunliv]

i watched the post game and this is not true about cp3.

Maybe you were watching NBATV or KCAL 9 postgame because I can back up the OP. Fox Sports' Dain Blanton asked CP3 about Kobe's performance immediately after the game in the Clipper locker room and that's when he said matter of factually: He's (Kobe) worried about scoring while the Clippers only care about WINNING!

I'm sure a link to the interview will be posted soon!

[Yao Ming's Foot]

The best offense in the league right now averages 109.5 pts per 100 possessions

The Lakers offense last night averaged 109.4 pts per 100 possessions

BUT OMG KOBE SHOULD GIVEN ALL OF HIS SHOT ATTEMPTS TO BYNUM AND GASOL WHO WERE BOTH LESS EFFICIENT THAN HIM IN THIS GAME

:oldlol:

[AlphaWolf24]

Maybe you were watching NBATV or KCAL 9 postgame because I can back up the OP. Fox Sports' Dain Blanton asked CP3 about Kobe's performance immediately after the game in the Clipper locker room and that's when he said matter of factually: He's (Kobe) worried about scoring while the Clippers only care about WINNING!

I'm sure a link to the interview will be posted soon!


according to lebron fans the past 3 years...."winning is just Luck and having special teammates"...."stats are more important"


:confusedshrug:

[97 bulls]

Two things about this...

Kobe started shooting like mad, when Bynum started to be praised left and right, kobe is against spotlight changes. He had an atroucious shooting game but that didn't stop him, no way Bynum would get more press.

By the second game i wondered how long it would take before Kobe completely alienated Gasol and Bynum...
The same thing happened last year when gasol was in the early mvp discussions. And kobe opted to start jacking shots.

[Da_Realist]

Two things about this...

Kobe started shooting like mad, when Bynum started to be praised left and right, kobe is against spotlight changes. He had an atroucious shooting game but that didn't stop him, no way Bynum would get more press.

By the second game i wondered how long it would take before Kobe completely alienated Gasol and Bynum...


I was thinking the same thing. I told my boy (die hard Lakers fan) that around the all star break, Kobe's gonna wake up with a horse's head in his bed.

[DMAVS41]

It anyone here actually thinks Kobe played the right way last night and you aren't just trolling to your beloved GOD....you just hate the game of basketball.

Displays like that are pathetic.

[chains5000]

The BS stat.
I was just explaining what the other poster said.

[SwayDizzle]

Lakers didnt lose back in the day due to Kobe's "gunning". It was their bottom of the barrel defenses. If their defense gels they can shred anybody, if not they can lose to anybody. Its pretty simple.
This, This and then This.

[Yao Ming's Foot]

It anyone here actually thinks Kobe played the right way last night and you aren't just trolling to your beloved GOD....you just hate the game of basketball.

Displays like that are pathetic.

:oldlol:

How pathetic of a scoring guard to score efficiently in favor of two big men who were scoring less efficiently/

OH THE HUMANITY!

[SwayDizzle]

It anyone here actually thinks Kobe played the right way last night and you aren't just trolling to your beloved GOD....you just hate the game of basketball.

Displays like that are pathetic.
You must be nuts, if it wasn't for Godbe, the Lakers would lose by 20+

[DMAVS41]

You must be nuts, if it wasn't for Godbe, the Lakers would lose by 20+

LOL.....this is where actually watching the games comes into play. It was a pathetic display of team basketball.

As the Clippers announcer said, "why even have Pau and Bynum?"

There is no reason for the jacking taking place right now. At least make a pass or run some semblance of an offense before shooting.

Can't wait to watch Kobe try this in the playoffs and watch Lakers fans bitch and moan like they always do.

[Yao Ming's Foot]

LOL.....this is where actually watching the games comes into play. It was a pathetic display of team basketball.

As the Clippers announcer said, "why even have Pau and Bynum?"

There is no reason for the jacking taking place right now. At least make a pass or run some semblance of an offense before shooting.

Can't wait to watch Kobe try this in the playoffs and watch Lakers fans bitch and moan like they always do.

Last time Kobe out shot two more efficient big men the Lakers rang twice . :confusedshrug:

The last lime time the Lakers team defense went soft they were eliminated in the first or second round.

I agree why have Bynum and Pau if they are going to give up 17 offensive rebounds.

Logic is a rare trait around here.

[Allstar24]

Chris Paul was asked about it and he said "He just wants to score, we are worried about winning"
Did he actually say this...like is there any video or written quote of him saying this? I just want someone to show that to Kobe. Its disrespectful that after all these years, players think Kobe just "wants to score" when he is the ultimate winner. Then again, this is Chris Paul, who has never sniffed a championship and probably never will...what does he know about winning.

[kuniva_dAMiGhTy]

Google'd the quote, didn't find anything.

About Kobe's shooting though...It's obvious. I called this about a few days ago actually. Shooting 25+ shots a game when you have two legit 7ft scorers is a joke. The reason Pau and Bynum continue to shoot awful is because they hardly get the damn ball. Gasol did have 17 FGA but if you watched the game, he was getting it in terrible position and/or not consistently. Your bigs can't (and won't) get into a proper rhythm without getting the ball consistently.

[Yao Ming's Foot]

It's obvious. I called this about a few days ago actually. Shooting 25+ shots a game when you have two legit 7ft scorers is a joke. The reason why Pau and Bynum continue to shoot awful is because they hardly get the ball. Gasol did have 17 FGA but if you watched the game, he was getting it in terrible position and/or not consistently. Your bigs can't (and won't) get into a proper rhythm without touching the ball consistently.

:oldlol:

Bynum is averaging more shot attempts per minute than ever

Gasol is right around where he was from 08-10.

Any other theories?

[G-Funk]

Hahaha Haters are scared ass shyt cause Kobe is beasting, hahahaha

[DMAVS41]

Last time Kobe out shot two more efficient big men the Lakers rang twice . :confusedshrug:

The last lime time the Lakers team defense went soft they were eliminated in the first or second round.

I agree why have Bynum and Pau if they are going to give up 17 offensive rebounds.

Logic is a rare trait around here.

Logic? If you can't admit or realize that Kobe was gunning for 40 as his main goal last night.....then you just are delusional.

Its not hard. He wanted 40 and he got 40....and he did so at the detriment of his team.

[G-Funk]

:oldlol:
Logic? If you can't admit or realize that Kobe was gunning for 40 as his main goal last night.....then you just are delusional.

Its not hard. He wanted 40 and he got 40....and he did so at the detriment of his team.


ur hating sick wit it:oldlol:

[kuniva_dAMiGhTy]

:oldlol:

Bynum is averaging more shot attempts per minute than ever

Gasol is right around where he was from 08-10.

Any other theories?

It's not about the shot attempts (besides Kobe is taking 25+ which engulfs anyone on the team). Bynum + Pau aren't getting the ball in the right spots and when they do, they're completely out of rhythm due to going MINUTES without seeing the ball.

[Yao Ming's Foot]

Logic? If you can't admit or realize that Kobe was gunning for 40 as his main goal last night.....then you just are delusional.

Its not hard. He wanted 40 and he got 40....and he did so at the detriment of his team.

He was the most efficient starter in the game. He should have went for 80 and maybe the Lakers would have won playing piss poor defense. Its simple mathematics really.

At least come up with a reasonable theory. Kobe went for 40 and did not play any defense as a result. That at least is logical. Saying Kobe shot too much and should have passed more to less efficient players and then they would have won is moronic.

[Heavincent]

Logic? If you can't admit or realize that Kobe was gunning for 40 as his main goal last night.....then you just are delusional.

Its not hard. He wanted 40 and he got 40....and he did so at the detriment of his team.

This is a ****ing joke. Bynum and Pau were terrible last night. I watched the game, and the Lakers would have easily lost by 20+ if it wasn't for Kobe having 31 points on 67% shooting in the second half.

Blaming Kobe for the Lakers losing last night is so ****ing asinine.

[DMAVS41]

He was the most efficient starter in the game. He should have went for 80 and maybe the Lakers would have won playing piss poor defense. Its simple mathematics really.

At least come up with a reasonable theory. Kobe went for 40 and did not play any defense as a result. That at least is logical. Saying Kobe shot too much and should have passed more to less efficient players and then they would have won is moronic.

Again...LOGIC. You said it. The two are related. Do you really think players lock in as well when they are marginalized at one end of the court?

I just can't believe actual fans of basketball think that is the right way to play on a team with the best front court in the league. Its one thing when it was 2006 and it made sense. But now? Just doesn't make sense at all.

[Yao Ming's Foot]

It's not about the shot attempts (besides Kobe is taking 25+ which engulfs anyone on the team). Bynum + Pau aren't getting the ball in the right spots and when they do, they're completely out of rhythm due to going MINUTES without seeing the ball.

Going minutes without seeing the ball is consistent with their previous history with the Lakers. :confusedshrug:

[Doranku]

42/7/4/2/1 on 50% (62% TS) is clearly not playing the right way, guys.

He should have played more the ever so efficient Gasol and Bynum duo who both had more field goal attempts than points. :bowdown: :bowdown: :bowdown:



:oldlol: @ DMavs. The Lakers only made a comeback in the 3rd because Kobe was phenomenal that quarter. Was close for a while in the 4th, Clippers pulled away because Gasol and Bynum couldn't throw the ball in the ocean nor play ANY defense.

But yeah, Kobe played the wrong way last night. :oldlol:



Anyway, lol @ people who think Kobe will continue playing like this all season. He does this every year. He'll have a stretch where he'll try to keep a scoring streak alive (whether it be 30, 40, etc) and then when it's snapped he'll start facilitating more and getting everyone else involved.

[kuniva_dAMiGhTy]

Going minutes without seeing the ball is consistent with their previous history with the Lakers. :confusedshrug:

Clearly you weren't watching Phil Jackson's Lakers.

[Yao Ming's Foot]

Again...LOGIC. You said it. The two are related. Do you really think players lock in as well when they are marginalized at one end of the court?

I just can't believe actual fans of basketball think that is the right way to play on a team with the best front court in the league. Its one thing when it was 2006 and it made sense. But now? Just doesn't make sense at all.

Its how they played during three championship runs and two rings. Don't you remember chanting that "best front court in the league" mantra for a while now?

[DMAVS41]

This is a ****ing joke. Bynum and Pau were terrible last night. I watched the game, and the Lakers would have easily lost by 20+ if it wasn't for Kobe having 31 points on 67% shooting in the second half.

Blaming Kobe for the Lakers losing last night is so ****ing asinine.

I'm not blaming him for the loss. I'm saying I don't agree with the way he played.

Of course other guys struggled. How the **** could you ever excel with a teammate playing like that? How would you ever know when he's going to pass? Its mentally taxing.

Again. Very clear that nobody here has played ball at any level because you would all know how impossible it is to play with a guy that does what Kobe did last night.

Of course everyone else looked out of it. They were out of it. They didn't know what the **** to expect possession to possession......

[Yao Ming's Foot]

Clearly you weren't watching Phil Jackson's Lakers.

Ok. :facepalm . I wasn't aware the Jackson had a special rule that the bigs had to take a shot every 3 minutes.

I'm going to save that one though. Kobe shot poorly because he didnt have enough shot attempts. He just needed more touches to get in his rhythm.

[DMAVS41]

Its how they played during three championship runs and two rings. Don't you remember chanting that "best front court in the league" mantra for a while now?

Definitely not during the regular season...LOL

Kobe is taking 25 shots a game right now. That is considerably more than he ever did in 09 and 10.

And even in the playoffs, I believe Kobe only got to 23 a game. So no, this is not how they won.

Not to mention they didn't have a fully healthy Bynum either those runs. Which makes this even more absurd. 25 shots a game is absurd....

[Yao Ming's Foot]

I'm not blaming him for the loss. I'm saying I don't agree with the way he played.

Of course other guys struggled. How the **** could you ever excel with a teammate playing like that? How would you ever know when he's going to pass? Its mentally taxing.

Again. Very clear that nobody here has played ball at any level because you would all know how impossible it is to play with a guy that does what Kobe did last night.

Of course everyone else looked out of it. They were out of it. They didn't know what the **** to expect possession to possession......

How many shot attempts per game do the Lakers need to give Bynum and Gasol to motivate them to play defense and rebound the basketball?

[DMAVS41]

How many shot attempts per game do the Lakers need to give Bynum and Gasol to motivate them to play defense and rebound the basketball?

I don't think its shot attempts really. I think its getting them more involved. It also helps Kobe on defense as well to not take to many shots.

Kobe got lit up last night. His defense was awful. Rightfully so because its damn near impossible to play offense the way Kobe did last night and defend.

[kuniva_dAMiGhTy]

Ok. :facepalm . I wasn't aware the Jackson had a special rule that the bigs had to take a shot every 3 minutes.

I'm going to save that one though. Kobe shot poorly because he didnt have enough shot attempts. He just needed more touches to get in his rhythm.

It's not about shot attempts; it's the touches (how much they're involved in the offense).

Ever heard of the triangle? Doubt it. :oldlol:

[lakerspng]

Actually kobe didnt start going hard at it trying to score until the second half. He spent the majority of the first half trying to get other people going. When they proved unable to get into it, he started taking matters into his own hands.

Long term it's not a good recipe for team development, short term, he just wanted to win the game.

The biggest reason for last night's result was one thing. Exhaustion. The lakers have played 14 games in 20 days, more than any other team in the league,including a game the night before. Meanwhile the clippers, a younger, faster team, have played the fewest and were coming off a day of rest. The energy in the first half between the tewo teams was drastic. Clipers were quicker to spots, quicker down court, quicker to rebounds, had more hustle in general. Thats why the lakers lost.

[themurph]

This is a ****ing joke. Bynum and Pau were terrible last night. I watched the game, and the Lakers would have easily lost by 20+ if it wasn't for Kobe having 31 points on 67% shooting in the second half.

Blaming Kobe for the Lakers losing last night is so ****ing asinine.

I said it in another thread, and I'll say it again.....

It's not about about blaming Kobe...It's about one of the greatest to ever play the game not recognizing that his talented 7'1 center is being guarded by a 6'8 center....

You have to take advantage of this instead of attempting tough and nearly impossible shots, regardless if you are capable of making them or not....

[Yao Ming's Foot]

Definitely not during the regular season...LOL

Kobe is taking 25 shots a game right now. That is considerably more than he ever did in 09 and 10.

And even in the playoffs, I believe Kobe only got to 23 a game. So no, this is not how they won.

Not to mention they didn't have a fully healthy Bynum either those runs. Which makes this even more absurd. 25 shots a game is absurd....

2010 Playoffs FGA

Kobe 511
Gasol 306
Odom 194

2009 Playoffs FGA

Kobe 530
Gasol 276
Odom 206

2008 Playoffs FGA

Kobe 463
Gasol 266
Odom 218

:confusedshrug:

Bynum is averaging more shots than ever. Gasol is down maybe 0.5 of his Lakers average. Kobe's increased shots are not coming from them. They are coming from Shannon Brown and Ron Artest,

[Fudge]

To this DMavs clown. Stupidest reasons I've ever heard. What's with putting "LOL" after almost every sentence as well? To think you sound more superior over the other poster? **** outta here gayboy, you haven't proved absolutely nothing.

[bond10]

I bet Bynum's immature as ****. It's Kobe's team son, you'll get your chance in Orlando.

[kuniva_dAMiGhTy]

I said it in another thread, and I'll say it again.....

It's not about about blaming Kobe...It's about one of the greatest to ever play the game not recognizing that his talented 7'1 center is being guarded by a 6'8 center....

You have to take advantage of this instead of attempting tough and nearly impossible shots, regardless if you are capable of making them or not....

Exactly. This isn't rocket science people. Learn the game. :oldlol:

[Yao Ming's Foot]

I don't think its shot attempts really. I think its getting them more involved. It also helps Kobe on defense as well to not take to many shots.

Kobe got lit up last night. His defense was awful. Rightfully so because its damn near impossible to play offense the way Kobe did last night and defend.

There we go, stick with the defense theory and remain super vague on the offensive side of the ball.

:applause:

[Yao Ming's Foot]

I said it in another thread, and I'll say it again.....

It's not about about blaming Kobe...It's about one of the greatest to ever play the game not recognizing that his talented 7'1 center is being guarded by a 6'8 center....

You have to take advantage of this instead of attempting tough and nearly impossible shots, regardless if you are capable of making them or not....

How is it possible that Kobe's "impossible shots" were scoring more efficiently for the team than Bynum's shots against a midget center?

[Eric Cartman]

To this DMavs clown. Stupidest reasons I've ever heard. What's with putting "LOL" after almost every sentence as well? To think you sound more superior over the other poster? **** outta here gayboy, you haven't proved absolutely nothing.


So long gay boyyyyyyy

[Allstar24]

Google'd the quote, didn't find anything.
Figures...I highly doubt he would say something like that.

Anyways, we do need to share the ball better but I do NOT blame Kobe for that. Mike Brown said once again that he is not going to question anything Kobe does. Please coach the team Mike.

We need an offense where everyone is involved. This is where the lack of a PG hurts...it is too much to ask Kobe to set up others AND be the scorer that he is. Durant has Westbrook. Kobe is the only guy on this team who can create his own shot. That's a problem. He is so great, he can get good looks in the post and score any time he wants to, as proven by these 40 point games. Anyone with the scorer's mentality would do the same if they were as good as him...the difference is, he has to do more now...the bigs need to be set up.

This is not good for the playoffs...teams will just double or triple team Kobe like the Clippers did in the 4th quarter and then we have no one else who can create for themselves. We need a PG...we got away with Fisher all these years because of the triangle...but in any other offense, you NEED a PG. Mitch needs to go to work.

[Fudge]

Rocket science? I'm sorry if you thought we took it that way. Bynum and Gasol combined for 30 shots while making ONLY 13 of them. Not effective as you thought huh? And didnt Kobe have 11 points at halftime? On like 12 shots? I dont get these anti-Kobe boys' argument. Either way, even if they didn't get as many touches as they should have, the least they can do was make an effort on the defensive end. At least.

[themurph]

How is it possible that Kobe's "impossible shots" were scoring more efficiently for the team than Bynum's shots against a midget center?


Because Bynum didn't get the ball enough...And because Kobe is ALL WORLD...And he makes 15 foot fall-away shots look efficient...

But really, in the big scheme of things, when your center is is being guarded by a "midget," it's a no brainer. Give him the rock for the first 3 Q's....And then turn it on that Kobe in the 4th and go nuts....

[themurph]

Rocket science? I'm sorry if you thought we took it that way. Bynum and Gasol combined for 30 shots while making ONLY 13 of them. Not effective as you thought huh? And didnt Kobe have 11 points at halftime? On like 12 shots? I dont get these anti-Kobe boys' argument. Either way, even if they didn't get as many touches as they should have, the least they can do was make an effort on the defensive end. At least.

It's not about being anti-Kobe...It's just basketball 101...

It's all about going through long stretches without touching the ball...As stated, this works against the sh*tty teams...But against the quality teams, if your center is not getting the ball in quality spots after putting the other team's starting enter in foul trouble, that's a mistake...

And you have to chill with the hyperbole...Bynum was 6 for 13....Hardly ineffective...If anything, Bynum should have gotten 19 to 23 shots that night...

[Fudge]

Because Bynum didn't get the ball enough...And because Kobe is ALL WORLD...And he makes 15 foot fall-away shots look efficient...

But really, in the big scheme of things, when your center is is being guarded by a "midget," it's a no brainer. Give him the rock for the first 3 Q's....And then turn it on that Kobe in the 4th and go nuts....
A midget? Who exactly are you referring to? Reggie Evans? Dudes a GREAT defender for his size, he gets in your face and grabs rebounds. Acting like they're free shots in the post. :oldlol: Kinda argument is that gayboy?

[KenneBell]

.If anything, Bynum should have gotten 19 to 23 shots that night...
:roll:

Who do you think he is? Prime Shaq?! GTFO.

[Fudge]

It's not about being anti-Kobe...It's just basketball 101...

It's all about going through long stretches without touching the ball...As stated, this works against the sh*tty teams...But against the quality teams, if your center is not getting the ball in quality spots after putting the other team's starting enter in foul trouble, that's a mistake...

And you have to chill with the hyperbole...Bynum was 6 for 13....Hardly ineffective...If anything, Bynum should have gotten 19 to 23 shots that night...
It's not "basketball 101". They got the touches, not as much as they should, but they did. And they didn't take advantage of them. Simple as that.

[themurph]

A midget? Who exactly are you referring to? Reggie Evans? Dudes a GREAT defender for his size, he gets in your face and grabs rebounds. Acting like they're free shots in the post. :oldlol: Kinda argument is that gayboy?


Dude...chill with the name calling...I'm a grown ass man...If you want to talk basketball, I'm down...But if you can't make your point with such immature bullsh#t comments, just stop...

When you are ready to grow up and realize that Reggie Evans is 6 foot 8 and Bynum is 7'1, then you will understand where I'm coming from...Sure he can grab rebounds...But he has no business guarding the Lakers' very talented 7'1, 285 monster...If u can't understand that then maybe we shouldn't even be taken seriously as a Lakers fan...

[Phong]

When you are ready to grow up and realize that Reggie Evans is 6 foot 8 and Bynum is 7'1, then you will understand where I'm coming from...Sure he can grab rebounds...But he has no business guarding the Lakers' very talented 7'1, 285 monster...If u can't understand that then maybe we shouldn't even be taken seriously as a Lakers fan...Did you watch the Clippers post game? They had a short segment praising Evans on not allowing Bynum to back him down into the painted area and forcing Bynum to shoot farther away than he's used to.

[themurph]

It's not "basketball 101". They got the touches, not as much as they should, but they did. And they didn't take advantage of them. Simple as that.

13 touches for Bynum...

13....


And this was before he managed to sit down Jordan with foul trouble...Just saying...

[Fudge]

Dude...chill with the name calling...I'm a grown ass man...If you want to talk basketball, I'm down...But if you can't make your point with such immature bullsh#t comments, just stop...

When you are ready to grow up and realize that Reggie Evans is 6 foot 8 and Bynum is 7'1, then you will understand where I'm coming from...Sure he can grab rebounds...But he has no business guarding the Lakers' very talented 7'1, 285 monster...If u can't understand that then maybe we shouldn't even be taken seriously as a Lakers fan...
So what if he's 6'8"? What's your point? Chuck Hayes is 6'5" and could easily shut down top quality big men. Fact is, Bynum got the touches, he got as much touches as Dwight gets in most of his games. I don't know what your blabbering on about.

[themurph]

Did you watch the Clippers post game? They had a short segment praising Evans on not allowing Bynum to back him down into the painted area and forcing Bynum to shoot farther away than he's used to.


Dog...I don't care what Evans did....lol...U keep throwing the ball to your 285 pound center...He took 13 shots...Just 13...He should have taken more...And I blame the Lakers coach more than Kobe, really...

[Da_Realist]

It's not about being anti-Kobe...It's just basketball 101...

It's all about going through long stretches without touching the ball...As stated, this works against the sh*tty teams...But against the quality teams, if your center is not getting the ball in quality spots after putting the other team's starting enter in foul trouble, that's a mistake...

And you have to chill with the hyperbole...Bynum was 6 for 13....Hardly ineffective...If anything, Bynum should have gotten 19 to 23 shots that night...

And the Lakers would have won easily. Dude couldn't do anything with Bynum down low and would have been too exhausted to try by the fourth quarter.

Mike Brown could actually win the damn thing this year if he'd grow a pair and stand up to Kobe. He's making the same mistake he did in Cleveland with Lebron. He's not a coach, he's a puppet. If Bynum and Gasol were the focus of the offense (not matter how they shoot to start the game, they are consistently fed the ball) and Kobe with his 16 years of experience filling in the gaps, the Lakers could win it all. No other team can match that size. All Bynum has to do 80% of the time is catch, turn around and shoot. Gasol and Bynum playing patty cake above everyone's heads is a ridiculous advantage. But Mike Brown's gotta grow some balls.

Either that or Bynum's gonna break Kobe's legs before the season's over.

[ImmortalNemesis]

So what if he's 6'8"? What's your point? Chuck Hayes is 6'5" and could easily shut down top quality big men. Fact is, Bynum got the touches, he got as much touches as Dwight gets in most of his games. I don't know what your blabbering on about.

Chuck Hayes is an elite post defender though. I don't know anything about Evans but yeah, height shouldn't be a problem if you KNOW how to defend the post. Now rebouding, that's a different story. You can box out all you want you won't grow 5 inches.

[themurph]

So what if he's 6'8"? What's your point? Chuck Hayes is 6'5" and could easily shut down top quality big men. Fact is, Bynum got the touches, he got as much touches as Dwight gets in most of his games. I don't know what your blabbering on about.

Blabbering? Come on man, keep it....I'm saying the most simplistic thing you can say when it comes to basketball...When you have a mismatch, you exploit it...Your 7'1 center needs to get more than 13 shots....And he needs to be given the ball 7 times in a row if he has to against a guy that's 6'8...This is not saying something crazy...

And this is all due respect, of course...

[Phong]

Dog...I don't care what Evans did....lol...U keep throwing the ball to your 285 pound center...He took 13 shots...Just 13...He should have taken more...And I blame the Lakers coach more than Kobe, really...:facepalm

So you insist that Bynum had a huge size advantage, but when it's pointed out that he was unable to take advantage of it you response is: I don't ****ing care? :roll:

[Yao Ming's Foot]

Bynun had 9 shots in the first half of the game. His pace had it continued would have been higher than the average for every big man in the league not named Lamarcus Aldridge. The Lakers were down by 13 at the half.

:confusedshrug:

Next theory please...

[Da_Realist]

One of the advantages of size is that it wears the opponent down. You can't just look at fg% with a quality big man and justify not giving him shots. The Lakers have two 7 footers that can score, pass and rebound. If they're fed the ball early and often, it forces the defense to pack in (leaving shot happy perimeter scorers WIDE open). Plus, teams tend to foul guys as they tire so keeping Bynum and Gasol as a threat throughout the game is very likely to put most teams into foul trouble...and probably near exhaustion (YOU try to defend someone 3 inches taller and 20 pounds heavier for 40 mins). Looking at fg% after a few touches does not justify freezing them out of the offense.

On the other hand for Kobe-ball to work, he HAS to almost shoot lights out to have a chance. And even then, they could lose (as last night proved) because the other team isn't compromised at all. No foul trouble. No fatigue. Basically, Kobe is playing against the best team they can put on the floor for 4 quarters instead of going buck wild against a team fatigued and losing players due to foul trouble throughout the game.

[chazzy]

Bynum's taking as many shots per game as Dwight and hasn't shown a consistent ability to handle double teams yet. When he's single covered, he can score well.. but when a double comes he tries to score through it or turns the ball over. Pau has clearly regressed from his 08-10 form and is settling for jumpers now. The old Pau would've taken Griffin down to the block and gotten consistent buckets. I think once these guys start gelling, Kobe should be shooting around 21-22 FGA and Pau will start being more aggressive. Neither Pau nor Bynum have stepped up as a consistent #2 option yet, it was looking like Bynum earlier but he cannot handle increased defensive attention yet.

You guys have to realize that this is far from the back to back teams from two years ago. They have absolutely no bench and no perimeter play at all outside of Kobe, and no Lamar giving you 15 backing up Pau and Bynum. Miami's better outside of their big 3 than the Lakers are outside of their own at this point.. offense is going to be an issue all season.

And it's obvious Kobe's going for 40 now. Can't complain too much since he's doing it efficiently but it saps the offensive rhythm at times.

[Phong]

At the half: Kobe 13 shots, Pau 10 shots, Bynum 9 shots.

I would agree that the bigs weren't as involved in the second half when Kobe went berserk mode to decrease the Clippers lead, but in the first half they got plenty of touches and shots.

[KenneBell]

And the Lakers would have won easily. Dude couldn't do anything with Bynum down low and would have been too exhausted to try by the fourth quarter.
You can't be serious. Were we watching the same game? Evans was pushing Bynum out of the paint and was forcing him into some bad shots. The more shots Bynum gets, the more chances he'll be double teamed which means more TOs and Bynum fumbling the ball.

He didn't just get 13 touches. Giving Bynum 17-18 shots isn't the automatic answer to the Lakers' problems.

[NoGunzJustSkillz]

he very well could be a champion if this team gels.

another thought, what do lakers and nets fans think about bynum and somethin else for deron and lopez if lopez comes back healthy?

bynum wants to be a star. let him go do the howard thing in new jersey while the nets get capspace. deron isnt going to stick around anyway, looks like.
pretty sure we'd take back a unhealthy lopez if deron came with the package.

[Da_Realist]

At the half: Kobe 13 shots, Pau 10 shots, Bynum 9 shots.

I would agree that the bigs weren't as involved in the second half when Kobe went berserk mode to decrease the Clippers lead, but in the first half they got plenty of touches and shots.

Some of those shots could have been tip ins/put backs or the result of broken plays. And most of those probably came with Kobe on the bench to end the first quarter. Bynum was clearly not a real part of the offense when watching the game.

[NoGunzJustSkillz]

LOL at the great Kobe with a 7th seed and a first round playoff loss last time he gunned like this.
How many times you gonna make this same exact post? Also are you comparing this Lakers team to the 06-07 one?:oldlol:

[Phong]

Some of those shots could have been tip ins/put backs or the result of broken plays. And most of those probably came with Kobe on the bench to end the first quarter. Bynum was clearly not a real part of the offense when watching the game.In the first half, all of Bynum's minutes were alongside Kobe. Kobe played the entire first quarter and sat when Bynum sat. Leaving Pau in charge of the second unit in the 2nd QT. Only one of Andrew's shots came from an offensive rebound.

Why am I wasting time discussing this shit when people make assumptions without checking any facts. Makes you seem like you didn't even watch or can't remember the progression of the game.

[hitmanyr2k]

Bynum tends to check out of a game mentally when he's not involved. He becomes bored and doesn't put in his best effort. Last night I think he did it on purpose. A specific play is when he and Kobe posted on the same side. Kobe had the high post and Bynum had the low post. Both were calling for the ball. Fisher looked Kobe off and threw it to Bynum instead. Kobe's reaction was one of exasperation and disgust. If I'm Bynum and I see Kobe pulling that kind of shit it would piss me off...especially if Kobe was just 3-11 and had just jacked up the last 2-3 shots and missing.

People blame Bynum and Gasol when they're "inefficient" but don't understand that they don't get to make it up when they go into a cold spell. They have one chance to shoot good and then it's over. They won't touch the ball again. Hell, even if they're shooting good they might not touch the ball again :oldlol: Kobe on the other hand, if he shoots 3-11 or whatever he's still going to shoot and shoot and shoot until he gets in a rhythm. By then his teammates are disinterested and uninspired to play any real ball.

[chazzy]

I would understand the heavy criticism if Kobe was gunning and going 9/25 or something, but he's been efficient during this run. Allocating a couple extra FGA to Bynum or Gasol who have yet to show a consistent ability to score this season isn't the game changing factor between a win and loss. They didn't lose last night because Kobe took too many shots people; they had ancient Fisher and a 2nd round rookie who's only played 2 games this season defending arguably the best PG in the game. He dissected the Laker defense and everything collapsed once he easily beat the first line of defense. I do agree that Kobe has been riding the hot hand a bit too much lately and it can hurt the team's rhythm, but it wasn't some glaring issue last night that cost the game.

[themurph]

One of the advantages of size is that it wears the opponent down. You can't just look at fg% with a quality big man and justify not giving him shots. The Lakers have two 7 footers that can score, pass and rebound. If they're fed the ball early and often, it forces the defense to pack in (leaving shot happy perimeter scorers WIDE open). Plus, teams tend to foul guys as they tire so keeping Bynum and Gasol as a threat throughout the game is very likely to put most teams into foul trouble...and probably near exhaustion (YOU try to defend someone 3 inches taller and 20 pounds heavier for 40 mins). Looking at fg% after a few touches does not justify freezing them out of the offense.

On the other hand for Kobe-ball to work, he HAS to almost shoot lights out to have a chance. And even then, they could lose (as last night proved) because the other team isn't compromised at all. No foul trouble. No fatigue. Basically, Kobe is playing against the best team they can put on the floor for 4 quarters instead of going buck wild against a team fatigued and losing players due to foul trouble throughout the game.


Intelligent posting....Good sh*t....

[themurph]

:facepalm

So you insist that Bynum had a huge size advantage, but when it's pointed out that he was unable to take advantage of it you response is: I don't ****ing care? :roll:


When was it pointed out? That the fact that Bynum missed a few shots and FT's against a 6'8 back-up center? So now this means that you should go away from the tallest and most effective post player on your team and start pulling up for 3 pointers with a hand in your face?

Listen...just use some common sense and you will get my point...No one is blaming Kobe all the way.....His coach should take most of the blame...But you don't go away from your big man who just placed the starting center in foul trouble just because he missed a few shots...

13 shots? That's NOT being able to take advantage of a of a mismatch...That's not getting the ball enough...

[Bladers]

At the half: Kobe 13 shots, Pau 10 shots, Bynum 9 shots.

I would agree that the bigs weren't as involved in the second half when Kobe went berserk mode to decrease the Clippers lead, but in the first half they got plenty of touches and shots.

this and in the second half he scored 31 points on 11/16 shots (69%)

At one point he scored 13 straight bringing it close to 2 frm 14.

[Phong]

When was it pointed out?:facepalm

Obviously when you don't want to see something you won't, even though I already mentioned it. They had a short segment on Evans during the Clippers post game show, showing Bynum unable to post Evans and having to settle on contested shots and on the other end of the floor Evans outworking Bynum on the glass.

But but but.. if he had more than 13 shots he would have succesfully grown 50 lbs heavier and twice as strong and finally would have backed Evans down..:mad:

[chazzy]

But you don't go away from your big man who just placed the starting center in foul trouble
All of Deandre's fouls were committed against perimeter players

[Phong]

All of Deandre's fouls were committed against perimeter playersOuch!

[kuniva_dAMiGhTy]

All of Deandre's fouls were committed against perimeter players

Relevance though? Any more incentive to feed your bigs the ball?

[3peated]

the very strategic mike brown offensive working wonders.

[chazzy]

Relevance though? Any more incentive to feed your bigs the ball?
Just pointing out something I clearly remember was wrong

[FindingTim]

I saw the Chris Paul quote- the OP is not lying.
I'm not sure what to think about Kobe. The scoring is nice, but it's on tough shots and at the expense of his teammates. If I were LA, I'd probably get on that whole Howard thing. Hmm... is it possible to trade Bynum/Gasol for .

Lakers
Steve Nash
Kobe Bryant
Matt Barnes
Troy Murphy
Dwight Howard

hmm now that I see it on paper it isn't nearly as appealing. but still, that's a Hall-of-fame big 3.

[b0bab0i]

I don't think that happened.
It happened I saw CP3 say it on FSW last night.

[Force]

Chris Paul's exact quote. I went back to the DV-R since so many people here have their panties in a bunch.

Question is, "Let's talk about that 3rd quarter, Kobe Bryant went off, but in the 4th quarter you really slowed him down, what did you guys do at that point as a team"

"I don't know, We was just trying to win the game. He's a tough cover, you know he took a lot of shots, tough shots and stuff like that and got his. But in the end of the day, we're playing to win"

[BlackJoker23]

Chris Paul's exact quote. I went back to the DV-R since so many people here have their panties in a bunch.

Question is, "Let's talk about that 3rd quarter, Kobe Bryant went off, but in the 4th quarter you really slowed him down, what did you guys do at that point as a team"

"I don't know, We was just trying to win the game. He's a tough cover, you know he took a lot of shots, tough shots and stuff like that and got his. But in the end of the day, we're playing to win"
shut the fukk up

[themurph]

:facepalm

Obviously when you don't want to see something you won't, even though I already mentioned it. They had a short segment on Evans during the Clippers post game show, showing Bynum unable to post Evans and having to settle on contested shots and on the other end of the floor Evans outworking Bynum on the glass.

But but but.. if he had more than 13 shots he would have succesfully grown 50 lbs heavier and twice as strong and finally would have backed Evans down..:mad:

Oh...don't get it twisted...I know when it was said...And I know what you said...I just thought it was besides the point...

Bottom line: it's puzzling in terms of a pure basketball sense that you go away from your center just because he got outworked on a few plays...

It's kind of like a football coach deciding to go away from the running game because for about 5 or 6 plays the the defense stops them...If you know you still have a mismatch and you keep attacking, sooner or later that run game is going to clique...It's called patience...

I don't care about silly segments...I know who Evans is...he's a strong, capable undersized dude who gets rebounds, but still must be exploited by the Lakers....I have enough simple basketball knowledge to know if the game is a 5 to 6 point lead early on, and the other team's starting center is on the bench you take advantage even if Evans stops you three or four times in a row...

Because it's not just about scoring...It's about getting the other team's BIGS in foul trouble...It's about making life easier for Kobe so he doesn't have to play hero and shoot over two hands...

It's about slowing down the game so CP3 doesn't run reckless and turns it into a up and down lob city sprint, making the Clips go into a half court game, which is their weakness..

Ya dig?

[Force]

Thanks for bringing up the foul trouble.

Though Gasol and Bynum aren't Shaq, they can still benefit from the "Shaq effect"

All Shaq had to do was touch the ball and even if he didn't score, the bigs would get worn down (Bynum is huge and would eventually beat down the Clipper bigs), it would get the team in the penalty which leads the defense to play softer to avoid free throws and it puts bench guys on the court. BRIAN COOK actually gets important minutes on the Clips.

You HAVE to keep the big men involved. It keeps their defense sharper on the other end and makes it easier for all teammates to do everything they need to do. It's simple basketball.

[AMISTILLILL]

The team did look unmotivated, but to be fair, the refs really trolled the shit out of Matt Barnes.

Yeah, that phantom call they gave him at the end of the 4th quarter really trolled him. :rolleyes:

[themurph]

Ouch!


What does this mean? Are you guys basketball fans or just fans of certain players?

[amfirst]

So ur going to forget how many times Kobe passed out the double team, just to see Gasol shoot and jumper. C'mon dude watch the game.

[gilalizard]

chris paul and kobe are good friends

lol@ op


and even if he did say it... hes on a rival team... he's not about to suck kobes meat publicly



just privately?

[gilalizard]

Actually kobe didnt start going hard at it trying to score until the second half. He spent the majority of the first half trying to get other people going. When they proved unable to get into it, he started taking matters into his own hands.

Long term it's not a good recipe for team development, short term, he just wanted to win the game.
The biggest reason for last night's result was one thing. Exhaustion. The lakers have played 14 games in 20 days, more than any other team in the league,including a game the night before. Meanwhile the clippers, a younger, faster team, have played the fewest and were coming off a day of rest. The energy in the first half between the tewo teams was drastic. Clipers were quicker to spots, quicker down court, quicker to rebounds, had more hustle in general. Thats why the lakers lost.

Then his approach failed. They lost.. While causing damage to "team development".

They won't win a 7-game series like this. They might get lucky in a 5.

[Da_Realist]

Oh...don't get it twisted...I know when it was said...And I know what you said...I just thought it was besides the point...

Bottom line: it's puzzling in terms of a pure basketball sense that you go away from your center just because he got outworked on a few plays...

It's kind of like a football coach deciding to go away from the running game because for about 5 or 6 plays the the defense stops them...If you know you still have a mismatch and you keep attacking, sooner or later that run game is going to clique...It's called patience...

I don't care about silly segments...I know who Evans is...he's a strong, capable undersized dude who gets rebounds, but still must be exploited by the Lakers....I have enough simple basketball knowledge to know if the game is a 5 to 6 point lead early on, and the other team's starting center is on the bench you take advantage even if Evans stops you three or four times in a row...

Because it's not just about scoring...It's about getting the other team's BIGS in foul trouble...It's about making life easier for Kobe so he doesn't have to play hero and shoot over two hands...

It's about slowing down the game so CP3 doesn't run reckless and turns it into a up and down lob city sprint, making the Clips go into a half court game, which is their weakness..

Ya dig?

EXACTLY

[bwink23]

Bynun had 9 shots in the first half of the game. His pace had it continued would have been higher than the average for every big man in the league not named Lamarcus Aldridge. The Lakers were down by 13 at the half.

:confusedshrug:

Next theory please...


And Kobe shooting 3 for 12 in the first half had NOTHING to do with that right?? :facepalm

[Kobr]

And Kobe shooting 3 for 12 in the first half had NOTHING to do with that right?? :facepalm

http://i.imgur.com/LCAlb.jpg

[Yao Ming's Foot]

And Kobe shooting 3 for 12 in the first half had NOTHING to do with that right?? :facepalm

Yes. When Kobe was finally given the green light to be the natural #1 scoring option he went 11 for 14 and the Lakers outscored the Clippers by 5.

Less Bynum, more Kobe = Lakers +5

more Bynum, less Kobe = Lakers -13

:confusedshrug:

[themurph]

Yes. When Kobe was finally given the green light to be the natural #1 scoring option he went 11 for 14 and the Lakers outscored the Clippers by 5.

Less Bynum, more Kobe = Lakers +5

more Bynum, less Kobe = Lakers -13

:confusedshrug:


I'm glad u r not a coach...lol...u have no patience...And you wouldn't know how to exploit mismatches....

[JohnnyWall]

And Kobe shooting 3 for 12 in the first half had NOTHING to do with that right?? :facepalm

lol @ "in the first half"

Kobe shot 14 for 28 (50%) and ended the game with 42 points. Once again, you're delusional.

[Yao Ming's Foot]

I'm glad u r not a coach...lol...u have no patience...And you wouldn't know how to exploit mismatches....

Does Bynum in your fantasy world best 11 for 14 in the second half of the game?

[themurph]

Does Bynum in your fantasy world best 11 for 14 in the second half of the game?


I'm about simple basketball....Not fan worship...

When you are ready to be serious and talk about mature, meat and potatoes game planning, I'm down...

[Yao Ming's Foot]

I'm about simple basketball....Not fan worship...

When you are ready to be serious and talk about mature, meat and potatoes game planning, I'm down...

I'm talking about last night's game. Not some hypothetical dreamed up by the usual Kobe haters.

If you tell me that Bynum needs a certain amount of shots to play effective defense and rebound, I expect to see his defensive and rebounding impact seen in the first half of the game when he had as many shots as reasonably expected.

If you tell me the Lakers lost because Kobe went away from a Bynum offensive focused gameplan then I expect to see the Clippers lead increase when Kobe became aggressive in the second half not shrink.

[bwink23]

http://i.imgur.com/LCAlb.jpg


your turn.

[bwink23]

Yes. When Kobe was finally given the green light to be the natural #1 scoring option he went 11 for 14 and the Lakers outscored the Clippers by 5.

Less Bynum, more Kobe = Lakers +5

more Bynum, less Kobe = Lakers -13

:confusedshrug:


Let's not pretend Kobe does that on call..he has shot them out of games more times than can be counted.....:violin:

[Yao Ming's Foot]

Let's not pretend Kobe does that on call..he has shot them out of games more times than can be counted.....:violin:

Only when we have dolts such as yourself doing the counting

:lol

[themurph]

I'm talking about last night's game. Not some hypothetical dreamed up by the usual Kobe haters.

If you tell me that Bynum needs a certain amount of shots to play effective defense and rebound, I expect to see his defensive and rebounding impact seen in the first half of the game when he had as many shots as reasonably expected.

If you tell me the Lakers lost because Kobe went away from a Bynum offensive focused gameplan then I expect to see the Clippers lead increase when Kobe became aggressive in the second half not shrink.

This is nothing hypothetical....It's a pure basketball....You exploit a team's weakness...And Coach Brown/Kobe didn't do that...

I'm looking at the long view...U r looking at one game and r more worried about taking up for Kobe than having a real debate that is as simple as it comes...

No disrespect, btw....

[heyhey]

One of the advantages of size is that it wears the opponent down. You can't just look at fg% with a quality big man and justify not giving him shots. The Lakers have two 7 footers that can score, pass and rebound. If they're fed the ball early and often, it forces the defense to pack in (leaving shot happy perimeter scorers WIDE open). Plus, teams tend to foul guys as they tire so keeping Bynum and Gasol as a threat throughout the game is very likely to put most teams into foul trouble...and probably near exhaustion (YOU try to defend someone 3 inches taller and 20 pounds heavier for 40 mins). Looking at fg% after a few touches does not justify freezing them out of the offense.

On the other hand for Kobe-ball to work, he HAS to almost shoot lights out to have a chance. And even then, they could lose (as last night proved) because the other team isn't compromised at all. No foul trouble. No fatigue. Basically, Kobe is playing against the best team they can put on the floor for 4 quarters instead of going buck wild against a team fatigued and losing players due to foul trouble throughout the game.

Did u just say Bynum can pass?:oldlol:

And last nite proves nothing any team can lose a game playing however way during the season. Lakers lost 2 games since Kobe went off and we gonna act like last nite was a referendum on Kobe ball

[Yao Ming's Foot]

This is nothing hypothetical....It's a pure basketball....You exploit a team's weakness...And Coach Brown/Kobe didn't do that...

I'm looking at the long view...U r looking at one game and r more worried about taking up for Kobe than having a real debate that is as simple as it comes...

No disrespect, btw....

Not really. I'm trying to get people to get over their obsession with downplaying anything that Kobe accomplishes and actually recognize that their Lakers offense was more than good enough to win had they played even average defense. In fact it was on par with the best offense in the league so far 109.4 offensive rating vs Clippers vs 109.5 offensive rating for the season (Magic) )

[kuniva_dAMiGhTy]

Only when we have dolts such as yourself doing the counting

:lol

You love Kobe, just say that and move on. No need to drag out a pointless discussion paved around your infatuation with Kobe.

[Yao Ming's Foot]

http://i.imgur.com/GEHdw.png

http://www.basketball-reference.com/boxscores/201201140LAC.html

Clearly more Bynum and Gasol is what the Lakers needed to win the game

:facepalm

[heyhey]

http://i.imgur.com/GEHdw.png

http://www.basketball-reference.com/boxscores/201201140LAC.html

Clearly more Bynum and Gasol is what the Lakers needed to win the game

:facepalm
It's funny cuz together dre and paus usage rates higher than Kobe but their performance wasn't anywhere close.

[kurple]

EVERY team in the NBA would kill to have Pau and Bynum as their starting big men

[themurph]

Not really. I'm trying to get people to get over their obsession with downplaying anything that Kobe accomplishes and actually recognize that their Lakers offense was more than good enough to win had they played even average defense. In fact it was on par with the best offense in the league so far 109.4 offensive rating vs Clippers vs 109.5 offensive rating for the season (Magic) )

The first thing you may need to learn to do is stop thinking that everything is about Kobe..

Sometimes people make comments and debate on a pure basketball matter....

It's the big picture...

[Yao Ming's Foot]

The first thing you may need to learn to do is stop thinking that everything is about Kobe..

Sometimes people make comments and debate on a pure basketball matter....

It's the big picture...

I already know that people make comments and debate about basketball without having watched the game. That's been pretty obvious in this thread.
Lakers would have won had they simple used Bynum and Gasol more despite the fact they were the least efficient possession users on the entire team against the Clippers.

:facepalm

[themurph]

I already know that people make comments and debate about basketball without having watched the game. That's been pretty obvious in this thread.
Lakers would have won had they simple used Bynum and Gasol more despite the fact they were the least efficient possession users on the entire team against the Clippers.

:facepalm


Nah..I watched the game....I saw what I saw....And it was not entirely one person's fault...It was mainly the coach's fault...And some of it was Kobe's....

But I put the blame mostly on Coach Brown...

[Yao Ming's Foot]

Nah..I watched the game....I saw what I saw....And it was not entirely one person's fault...It was mainly the coach's fault...And some of it was Kobe's....

But I put the blame mostly on Coach Brown...

Defensive blame I hope or are we really going to act like a 109 offensive rating as a team isn't good enough.

[Jacks3]

Only Kobe can go for 42/7/5/2/1/64% TS, have the rest of his teammates play like garbage, and still get more blame than anyone. You'd think after 5 Championships people would be more willing to point out some of the clear flaws this team has, which have little to do with Bryant, but no. The discussion is all about Bryant and his FGA. :lol :facepalm

[themurph]

Defensive blame I hope or are we really going to act like a 109 offensive rating as a team isn't good enough.


Nah...the blame that you have to take advantage of a mismatch...

The blame that your 285 pound center didn't get the ball more than 13 times...

The blame that you went away from your center because he missed a few baskets and FT's...

The blame that your center was being guarded by a dude much smaller than him, no matter how much heart he showed for a few plays....

The blame that you allowed your HOF bound SG to go for tough shots while your center looked on in puzzlement...

That's all...

[themurph]

Only Kobe can go for 42/7/5/2/1/64% TS, have the rest of his teammates play like garbage, and still get more blame than anyone. You'd think after 5 Championships people would be more willing to point out some of the clear flaws this team has, which have little to do with Bryant, but no. The discussion is all about Bryant and his FGA. :lol :facepalm


Who cares about Kobe's field goals? Only a stat nerd would bring up something silly like that....

Most people are talking about the Lakers/Coach Brown/Kobe not taking more advantage of the mismatches they had...Not silly FG%...

[Jacks3]

Bynum gets FGA than any center in the league, despite his awful efficiency (53% TS).

lol. You haters are such ****king morons. Is it Kobe's fault that Bynum can't consistently get good position? Is it Kobe's fault he's a huge black-hole who is awful at handling double teams? Is it Kobe's fault he has a rudimentary post-up game, and struggles to back down defenders with similar size? Is it Kobe's fault he sucks at shooting FT's?

And he's still more FGA than any center in the league despite all that.

Dude gets plenty of touches and shots. In fact, Pau/Bynum get more FGA than any PF/C rotation in the league. STFU already.

[longtime lurker]

Nah...the blame that you have to take advantage of a mismatch...

The blame that your 285 pound center didn't get the ball more than 13 times...

The blame that you went away from your center because he missed a few baskets and FT's...

The blame that your center was being guarded by a dude much smaller than him, no matter how much heart he showed for a few plays....

The blame that you allowed your HOF bound SG to go for tough shots while your center looked on in puzzlement...

That's all...

I definitely think that people are ignoring the defensive side of the ball too much. I think on their win streak the Lakers held teams to under 90 points. The formula works and has worked before, if you have a great scorer and defensive minded team you can win games and a lot of games. Too much is made of the centers not getting enough touches when they couldn't rebound or stop anybody in the first place.

[themurph]

Too much is made of the centers not getting enough touches when they couldn't rebound or stop anybody in the first place.

16 rebounds....That was the Bynum's numbers...Again, let's chill with the hyperbole...

[Yao Ming's Foot]

Nah...the blame that you have to take advantage of a mismatch...

The blame that your 285 pound center didn't get the ball more than 13 times...

The blame that you went away from your center because he missed a few baskets and FT's...

The blame that your center was being guarded by a dude much smaller than him, no matter how much heart he showed for a few plays....

The blame that you allowed your HOF bound SG to go for tough shots while your center looked on in puzzlement...

That's all...

The "huge mismatch" was literally the least successful offensive player for the Lakers last night on a per possession basis.

You dont feel silly clamoring for more of that based on that simple truth?

[Whoah10115]

I was actually surprised by how often Kobe tried to make passes while he was feelin it. It's almost like he learned to not be petulant.


The offense has no flow. Kobe should always score. That's what he does. In the 2nd half this guy went 11-15, come on now. Those shots he was hitting were ridiculous. And he made a bunch of plays for the other players. Fisher was getting killed on defense and not contributing as anything more than a spot-up shooter on the offensive end.



Gasol is just not feeling it right now. His numbers are very good. He's shooting a high percentage and putting up 17 and 10 as one of 3 big-time players. But his impact is as a spot-up guy or skill guy. He's not owning the post. That's the offense and that's him. His shoulder is probably bothering him, but he's just not imposing himself. Just because people think he's soft or incapable of being a #1 option (he took that nothing Memphis team to 3 playoffs, won 50 games, won 49 as the out-and-out guy on an OK team that in a crowded West).


Figure out the offense. And once you do, don't let Metta clutter it. Then go from there.

[longtime lurker]

16 rebounds....That was the Bynum's numbers...Again, let's chill with the hyperbole...

17 offensive rebounds by the second worse rebounding team in the league. That's not hyperbole, it's fact that contributes directly to losing. Often times if you control the rebounding battle you have a great chance of winning.I'm not placing blame on Gasol or Bynum but the Lakers winning isn't as simple as just saying the bigs need more shots.

[themurph]

The "huge mismatch" was literally the least successful offensive player for the Lakers last night on a per possession basis.

You dont feel silly clamoring for more of that based on that simple truth?

Nah...Because I I don't care if Evans was getting good position at times and grabbing a few boards from Bynum...I don't care if Bynum was missing a few shots...I don't care if he was off and on at the FT line...

U don't go away from your 7'1, 285 pound center when he's been guarded by smaller man...

It's basketball 101....

And why do you keep giving it to your BIG when the other team's starter is on the bench? So your BIG keeps his defensive hunger in the second half of the game and not drift mentally because he feels like he's not being included in the plays...

[themurph]

17 offensive rebounds by the second worse rebounding team in the league. That's not hyperbole, it's fact that contributes directly to losing. Often times if you control the rebounding battle you have a great chance of winning.I'm not placing blame on Gasol or Bynum but the Lakers winning isn't as simple as just saying the bigs need more shots.

U want to blame soft Pau? Go ahead...But I'm not blaming the guy (Bynum) that ripped down 16 rebounds...

You go ahead and do that...lol

[Yao Ming's Foot]

Nah...Because I I don't care if Evans was getting good position at times and grabbing a few boards from Bynum...I don't care if Bynum was missing a few shots...I don't care if he was off and on at the FT line...

U don't go away from your 7'1, 285 pound center when he's been guarded by smaller man...

It's basketball 101....

And why do you keep giving it to your BIG when the other team's starter is on the bench? So your BIG keeps his defensive hunger in the second half of the game and not drift mentally because he feels like he's not being included in the plays...

Where was his defensive hunger in the first half when he was getting fed quite well?

You are basically criticizing the offensive strategy of the team in the second half for doing something that actually worked instead of doing something that failed miserably all game.

[longtime lurker]

U want to blame soft Pau? Go ahead...But I'm not blaming the guy (Bynum) that ripped down 16 rebounds...

You go ahead and do that...lol

Can you read?


I'm NOT placing blame on Gasol or Bynum but the Lakers winning isn't as simple as just saying the bigs need more shots.

Now you're not even trying to make sense. I keep saying the Lakers problem was on the defensive end and rebounding, yet you keep focusing on the offensive end.

[themurph]

Where was his defensive hunger in the first half when he was getting fed quite well?

You are basically criticizing the offensive strategy of the team in the second half for doing something that actually worked instead of doing something that failed miserably all game.


Listen homie...Bynum got 13 shots...And a few of those shots were put backs....That's not enough....Not in that game when Evans was on the floor...

It was a coaching mistake....It was boneheaded considering who was guarding him after Jordan was on the bench...

If Bynum went 7 for 23, I would see your point...But that's not the case....

The Lakers loss a game because they didn't take advantage of the mismatches that would have slowed down the game and not allowed CP3 to run up and down the court....

And Kobe, being a vet, should have noticed this...I'm sure he will recognize this when he watches the game film...

mismatches = wins....

[themurph]

Can you read?


Now you're not even trying to make sense. I keep saying the Lakers problem was on the defensive end and rebounding, yet you keep focusing on the offensive end.


Jokes homie...

And for the record, I'm placing blame on Coach Brown and Kobe...

[kuniva_dAMiGhTy]

Bynum gets FGA than any center in the league, despite his awful efficiency (53% TS).

lol. You haters are such ****king morons. Is it Kobe's fault that Bynum can't consistently get good position? Is it Kobe's fault he's a huge black-hole who is awful at handling double teams? Is it Kobe's fault he has a rudimentary post-up game, and struggles to back down defenders with similar size? Is it Kobe's fault he sucks at shooting FT's?

And he's still more FGA than any center in the league despite all that.

Dude gets plenty of touches and shots. In fact, Pau/Bynum get more FGA than any PF/C rotation in the league. STFU already.

I blame Mike Brown more than anyone. I said it before, and I'll say it again. The guy is gonna run Kobe into the ground. 43 minutes last night? 27 FGA the last 4 or so games? I mean forreal, can LA get some type of ball-movement going?

You'd think after all the failures in Cleveland, he'd grow a pair and tell Kobe to stop shooting while implementing a scheme that actually resembles a team offense.

[NumberSix]

Now you're not even trying to make sense. I keep saying the Lakers problem was on the defensive end and rebounding, yet you keep focusing on the offensive end.
Dude, don't even waste your time.

As dumb as it is, in some people's mind, basketball = shooting.

[NumberSix]

You'd think after all the failures in Cleveland, he'd grow a pair and tell Kobe to stop shooting while implementing a scheme that actually resembles a team offense.
You give Mike Brown too much credit. I wouldn't expect him to learn a god damn thing.

[themurph]

Dude, don't even waste your time.

As dumb as it is, in some people's mind, basketball = shooting.


What you guys fail to understand is keeping your big man involved in the offense makes him want to WORK even more defensively...

Indeed, CP3 was murdering whoever was guarding him....

But you know what stops a PG from running and gunning and throwing lobs and kicking out to his shooters on fast breaks?

You slow the game down on the other end....

It's the Clippers' Kryptonite...

[Doranku]

Only Kobe can go for 42/7/5/2/1/64% TS, have the rest of his teammates play like garbage, and still get more blame than anyone. You'd think after 5 Championships people would be more willing to point out some of the clear flaws this team has, which have little to do with Bryant, but no. The discussion is all about Bryant and his FGA. :lol :facepalm

This.

Is there anyone else in NBA history who would even be criticized at all for a 42/7/4/2/1/64% TS game? I really don't think so. Four straight 40 point games and these haters are desperately panicking trying to find a way to discredit Kobe... it's like Kobe murdered these guys' families. :roll:

[themurph]

This.

Is there anyone else in NBA history who would even be criticized at all for a 42/7/4/2/1/64% TS game? I really don't think so. Four straight 40 point games and these haters are desperately panicking trying to find a way to discredit Kobe... it's like Kobe murdered these guys' families. :roll:


Laker fans understand what some folks are saying...

Kobe fans may not....

[Doranku]

Laker fans understand what some folks are saying...

Kobe fans may not....

You don't even know what you're talking about. Weren't you the one who was acting like Drew was abusing the Clippers' big men early in the game getting them in foul trouble when in reality he didn't even draw one foul on them? :oldlol:

These mismatches you keep referring to are a cute smokescreen, but Bynum and Gasol getting more touches probably won't result in much more efficient/effective scoring than what Kobe produced, won't somehow make Derek Fisher have a chance at guarding CP3, and won't stop the Lakers from getting punked on the boards by a smaller team.

If a 6'8" guy going against Bynum is such a mismatch, then why was the dude able to grab 6 offensive rebounds in 16 minutes of play?

This loss was 95% the fault of Bynum, Gasol, Fisher, and Mike Brown. Kobe going off in the second half is not a valid excuse for Bynum and Gasol playing anemically and getting outrebounded by one of the worst rebounding teams in the league.

[MMM]

here comes the passive kobe game where he tries to get 15 assists so people forget he is a chucker.

[themurph]

You don't even know what you're talking about. Weren't you the one who was acting like Drew was abusing the Clippers' big men early in the game getting them in foul trouble when in reality he didn't even draw one foul on them? :oldlol:

These mismatches you keep referring to are a cute smokescreen, but Bynum and Gasol getting more touches probably won't result in much more efficient/effective scoring than what Kobe produced, won't somehow make Derek Fisher have a chance at guarding CP3, and won't stop the Lakers from getting punked on the boards by a smaller team.

If a 6'8" guy going against Bynum is such a mismatch, then why was the dude able to grab 6 offensive rebounds in 16 minutes of play?

This loss was 95% the fault of Bynum, Gasol, Fisher, and Mike Brown. Kobe going off in the second half is not a valid excuse for Bynum and Gasol playing anemically and getting outrebounded by one of the worst rebounding teams in the league.


No...I'm the one that thinks that you exploit your mismatches no matter if your center is missing a few shots or not getting a few rebounds...

If I'm a real Lakers fan, I would understand this...^^^^

If I'm just someone who cheers for Kobe and is only concerned with taking up for him even when folks are not even placing total blame on him (It's mostly dumb coaching), then I would agree with u...

[LA_Showtime]

You don't even know what you're talking about. Weren't you the one who was acting like Drew was abusing the Clippers' big men early in the game getting them in foul trouble when in reality he didn't even draw one foul on them? :oldlol:

These mismatches you keep referring to are a cute smokescreen, but Bynum and Gasol getting more touches probably won't result in much more efficient/effective scoring than what Kobe produced, won't somehow make Derek Fisher have a chance at guarding CP3, and won't stop the Lakers from getting punked on the boards by a smaller team.

If a 6'8" guy going against Bynum is such a mismatch, then why was the dude able to grab 6 offensive rebounds in 16 minutes of play?

This loss was 95% the fault of Bynum, Gasol, Fisher, and Mike Brown. Kobe going off in the second half is not a valid excuse for Bynum and Gasol playing anemically and getting outrebounded by one of the worst rebounding teams in the league.

Did Kobe force the issue early or try and get his guys going? Was he looking to score or win the game? Did he have an obvious agenda or was he trying to help the Lakers win?

I didn't watch the game last night but I have no problem with Kobe taking 30 some shots when he's playing within the offense and shooting close to 50% from the floor. What I don't support is when he decides to prove a point and just jack the ball every time he catches it (see three nights ago).

[Doranku]

Did Kobe force the issue early or try and get his guys going? Was he looking to score or win the game? Did he have an obvious agenda or was he trying to help the Lakers win?

I didn't watch the game last night but I have no problem with Kobe taking 30 some shots when he's playing within the offense and shooting close to 50% from the floor. What I don't support is when he decides to prove a point and just jack the ball every time he catches it (see three nights ago).

He didn't really start forcing the issue until the third, but that was when he exploded for 21 points and almost single handedly cut the lead from 12 to 2 I think it was. Game just got out of hand in the 4th despite Kobe making some difficult shots.

He could've done a better job of facilitating, but I don't have a problem with the way Kobe played last night at all. He did all he could to get his team back in the game, but Bynum and Gasol were missing easy shots all throughout the 2nd half. The Clippers were also getting hella offensive rebounds and the game just got away from the Lakers midway through the 4th.

[ZenMaster]

Did Kobe force the issue early or try and get his guys going? Was he looking to score or win the game? Did he have an obvious agenda or was he trying to help the Lakers win?

I didn't watch the game last night but I have no problem with Kobe taking 30 some shots when he's playing within the offense and shooting close to 50% from the floor. What I don't support is when he decides to prove a point and just jack the ball every time he catches it (see three nights ago).


It's weird watching this LA team without PJ as coach, there's a lot of "plays" now where the Lakers spend 14 seconds of the shot clock just to get Kobe in position to catch the ball in a spot he likes. It takes 14 seconds because the other team know what LA is doing and that now they apparently won't defer from it. The amount of pressure he gets before receiving the ball now is incredible, and it seems like the more pressure he gets from his defender the more he wants the ball.

Too me it looks forced, all these setup plays for ISO situations isn't good basketball.

[JohnnyWall]

It's pretty clear that themurph is just trolling and probably didn't even watch the game last night.

[Micku]

I think Kobe is entitle to take as many shots as he want depending on the flow of the game. But sometimes the way he takes his shots is more selfish because he isos too much. He dribble and dribbles and tries to score instead of passing to a teammate.

As long as they win, then they should be good.

[Jacks3]

This.

Is there anyone else in NBA history who would even be criticized at all for a 42/7/4/2/1/64% TS game? I really don't think so. Four straight 40 point games and these haters are desperately panicking trying to find a way to discredit Kobe... it's like Kobe murdered these guys' families. :roll:
Exactly. Why are you haters even worried about it? If Kobe's shooting is so detrimental, then shouldn't you guys be happy to see him play this way? lol @ you clowns trying to tell a dude with 5 NBA Championships how to play the game. :oldlol:

BTW, Kobe only took 18 FGA per game in the 2011 playoffs and was spending huge chunks of time feeding Bynum and trying to get Pau going. He was extremely passive. Why the hell the did Lakers offense fall of a cliff then? Why did they get swept? I thought that's what's best for the team? Guess not....

On the other they went to three straight Finals and won back-to-back rings with Kobe putting up 30 PPG and 23 FGA per game...There goes that theory.

The Lakers problems right now have nothing to do with Bryant and everything to do with the fact that their coach doesn't give a shit about offense, their bench is the worst in the league, and their 3pt shooting is dreadful. Plus Bynum has been playing like garbage every since teams started to send more doubles his way. That's not Kobe's fault.

STFU about his FGA already.

[demons2005]

It's funny for CP to say that when Kobe has 5 rings and he's been out of the 1st round once in his entire career despite playing with the likes of Chandler, West, and Peja. Oh so now winning is what matters? LOL

[32MJ32]

Anyone trying to pin the Lakers loss on Kobe dropping 40 on 50% from the field needs to immediately (and repeatedly) smack themselves over the head with their keyboard

[longtime lurker]

This.

Is there anyone else in NBA history who would even be criticized at all for a 42/7/4/2/1/64% TS game? I really don't think so. Four straight 40 point games and these haters are desperately panicking trying to find a way to discredit Kobe... it's like Kobe murdered these guys' families. :roll:

:oldlol: Now that I think about it the ridiculousness of the situation is comical. Only Kobe could garner this much criticism for playing well. If it was any other top player like Durant or Rose there wouldn't be near this type of reaction. They'd be praised. I've lurked on this board for a while and funny enough it's always the same characters trolling. Watch what happens next game Kobe will come out and try to facilitate the team and get them going, if they lose all these arm chair psychologists will claim Kobe is throwing games and being passive to prove a point, if they win they'll claim Kobe is overrated and needs to be carried by his bigs. Rinse and repeat it's always the same song on insidehoops.

[Force]

Basic basketball knowledge here. Please pay attention. Just because you shoot 50% it doesn't mean it's always good.

You people don't understand basketball deep enough. When Kobe takes an iffy shot, it gives the defense a free pass. Since the Lakers stand around that means the defense doesn't have to work very hard either.

When the ball goes inside, defenses have to react. The bigs get worn down by having to defend in the post. With a guy as big as Bynum, he should be beating guys up and tiring them out and getting them in foul trouble. When the front line has foul trouble that means the front line has to play more passive and stop trying for blocks and making plays since they are in foul trouble. It also means more minutes for the BACK UPS to play which makes every singe thing easier for your teammates because the starters are on the bench.

It's also a huge plus to get free throws from the penalty. Once a team is in penalty, their defense has to take it down a notch naturally.

If a player ran down the court and pulled up from 20 feet every single time and scored 50% of the attempts do you think the team would win? Never. Basketball is far more complex than just saying anybody who makes 50% in a game played a good game.

[Nevaeh]

:oldlol: Now that I think about it the ridiculousness of the situation is comical. Only Kobe could garner this much criticism for playing well. If it was any other top player like Durant or Rose there wouldn't be near this type of reaction. They'd be praised. I've lurked on this board for a while and funny enough it's always the same characters trolling. Watch what happens next game Kobe will come out and try to facilitate the team and get them going, if they lose all these arm chair psychologists will claim Kobe is throwing games and being passive to prove a point, if they win they'll claim Kobe is overrated and needs to be carried by his bigs. Rinse and repeat it's always the same song on insidehoops.

Bullsh!t. You just haven't been reading Lebron Threads lately :oldlol:

[9erEmpire]

Basic basketball knowledge here. Please pay attention. Just because you shoot 50% it doesn't mean it's always good.

You people don't understand basketball deep enough. When Kobe takes an iffy shot, it gives the defense a free pass. Since the Lakers stand around that means the defense doesn't have to work very hard either.

When the ball goes inside, defenses have to react. The bigs get worn down by having to defend in the post. With a guy as big as Bynum, he should be beating guys up and tiring them out and getting them in foul trouble. When the front line has foul trouble that means the front line has to play more passive and stop trying for blocks and making plays since they are in foul trouble. It also means more minutes for the BACK UPS to play which makes every singe thing easier for your teammates because the starters are on the bench.

It's also a huge plus to get free throws from the penalty. Once a team is in penalty, their defense has to take it down a notch naturally.

If a player ran down the court and pulled up from 20 feet every single time and scored 50% of the attempts do you think the team would win? Never. Basketball is far more complex than just saying anybody who makes 50% in a game played a good game.

this.

People are so concerned with FG% that it really hurts the team.

Lebron's high FG% is hurting his team because he stops trying to win and shoot...to keep it high.

[Jacks3]

:oldlol: Now that I think about it the ridiculousness of the situation is comical. Only Kobe could garner this much criticism for playing well. If it was any other top player like Durant or Rose there wouldn't be near this type of reaction. They'd be praised. I've lurked on this board for a while and funny enough it's always the same characters trolling. Watch what happens next game Kobe will come out and try to facilitate the team and get them going, if they lose all these arm chair psychologists will claim Kobe is throwing games and being passive to prove a point, if they win they'll claim Kobe is overrated and needs to be carried by his bigs. Rinse and repeat it's always the same song on insidehoops.
This.

[monkeypox]

Kobes me centric attitude drove out one of the most dominante bigs of alltime and drew a wedge with a guy who could tolerate jordans meglomaniacle attitude but could not tolerate kobes.

You mean the guy that burned bridges with almost every team he ever ended up on?

[RoseCity07]

It is kind of true though. If you ignore teammates too much you're taking them out of the game on the other end. Your big man isn't going to be into the game if he never scores. You ever notice when a scrub is on fire his defense picks up as well? Well it works that way with anyone.

Sometimes you have to let a lesser player shoot so he has your back on defense.

[Da_Realist]

Person of Interest: Kobe Bryant (http://www.grantland.com/story/_/id/7466271/person-interest)


Stuck with an aging roster and just 10,000 points shy of Kareem's record, what, exactly is Kobe playing for?

[Mr. I'm So Rad]

When Kobe is shooting poorly people say he needs to stop shooting and let his teammates take shots.

When Bynum and Gasol are shooting poorly people say they need to take more shots?

:wtf:

Only on ISH...

[NumberSix]

When Kobe is shooting poorly people say he needs to stop shooting and let his teammates take shots.

When Bynum and Gasol are shooting poorly people say they need to take more shots?

:wtf:

Only on ISH...
There's a difference between actually shooting poorly and some guy ballhogging for 20 seconds then passing it to a big for a 18 foot bail out shot.

Inefficient offense leads to poor shot selection which leads to poor shooting percentage and poor rebounding.

This is exactly what people mean when they say stats don't tell the whole story. Numbers don't lie, but people sure as shit misrepresent the context of the numbers.

[Mr. I'm So Rad]

There's a difference between actually shooting poorly and some guy ballhogging for 20 seconds then passing it to a big for a 18 foot bail out shot.

Inefficient offense leads to poor shot selection which leads to poor shooting percentage and poor rebounding.

This is exactly what people mean when they say stats don't tell the whole story. Numbers don't lie, but people sure as shit misrepresent the context of the numbers.

You mean like how people are doing with Kobe's FGA numbers?

So let me get this straight, Kobe should have just checked out and said "Ok guys, people on the internet say I should not shoot." and just give it to Gasol and Bynum (who were struggling) so they can start missing more? I don't understand. Why should bigs who aren't the #1 option who are shooting 7-17 and 6-13 get more shots when you have a guy who's hot shooting over 60%? If the roles were reversed you know damn well you guys would say that Kobe shouldn't have gotten more shots.

[NumberSix]

You mean like how people are doing with Kobe's FGA numbers?To a degree, yes.


So let me get this straight, Kobe should have just checked out and said "Ok guys, people on the internet say I should not shoot." and just give it to Gasol and Bynum (who were struggling) so they can start missing more? I don't understand. Why should bigs who aren't the #1 option who are shooting 7-17 and 6-13 get more shots when you have a guy who's hot shooting over 60%? If the roles were reversed you know damn well you guys would say that Kobe shouldn't have gotten more shots.
I kind of already explained this in the post you just quoted.

[ZenMaster]

You mean like how people are doing with Kobe's FGA numbers?

So let me get this straight, Kobe should have just checked out and said "Ok guys, people on the internet say I should not shoot." and just give it to Gasol and Bynum (who were struggling) so they can start missing more? I don't understand. Why should bigs who aren't the #1 option who are shooting 7-17 and 6-13 get more shots when you have a guy who's hot shooting over 60%? If the roles were reversed you know damn well you guys would say that Kobe shouldn't have gotten more shots.

Why does it HAVE to be one or the other?

No one is saying Kobe shouldn't get shots and "check out", just get a game flow as a team instead of just going screen-Kobe iso every play for the last 8 minutes if a game and one plenty of other possesions throughout the game.

[RazorBaLade]

Basic basketball knowledge here. Please pay attention. Just because you shoot 50% it doesn't mean it's always good.

You people don't understand basketball deep enough. When Kobe takes an iffy shot, it gives the defense a free pass. Since the Lakers stand around that means the defense doesn't have to work very hard either.

When the ball goes inside, defenses have to react. The bigs get worn down by having to defend in the post. With a guy as big as Bynum, he should be beating guys up and tiring them out and getting them in foul trouble. When the front line has foul trouble that means the front line has to play more passive and stop trying for blocks and making plays since they are in foul trouble. It also means more minutes for the BACK UPS to play which makes every singe thing easier for your teammates because the starters are on the bench.

It's also a huge plus to get free throws from the penalty. Once a team is in penalty, their defense has to take it down a notch naturally.

If a player ran down the court and pulled up from 20 feet every single time and scored 50% of the attempts do you think the team would win? Never. Basketball is far more complex than just saying anybody who makes 50% in a game played a good game.

this has no meaning. if the other team shoots 40% from 2 then they will lose to the player who shoots 50%. you need context. More often than not though, shooting 50% for a perimeter player is a measure of having an efficient game.