"But Kobe needs to pass the ball more for the Lakers to be successful"

[The Iron Fist]

So, why does the team lose when he has 7 or more assists lately?

[I.R.Beast]

So, why does the team lose when he has 7 or more assists lately?
because assists are overrated..... it's about moving the ball around and getting it done as a team.

[The Iron Fist]

because assists are overrated..... it's about moving the ball around and getting it done as a team.


But his detractors swear that, "If Kobe would pass the ball, the team would be more successful".

9 assists isn't enough?

[RazorBaLade]

I'd just like to see him stop going to artest and barnes and gasol so much, they are terrible, go to G lock and Bynum. Mostly bynum..

If kobe can get bynum 18 shots a game we'll be better than when gasol gets 18. Or hell. Get 18 for pau and 18 for bynum and dont let barnes shoot. IDK. But like tonight, I dont blame kobe at all.. But if bynum is 6/10 and pau is 6-18 then at some point in that game he has to realize that pau isnt getting it done and pass more to bynum. Feed the hot hand please

[KDthunderup]

Kobe often takes way too many shots and never gets the rest of his team involved as much as he should. He should try to take more high percentage shots, he often takes way too many of balance, tough bailout shots when he should be passing it to his teamates or playing off the ball.

[LiLharvard]

Kobe is still the boss, MVP and I'm adding goat hell shoot me I don't care, I just wish he was in green

[The Iron Fist]

Kobe often takes way too many shots and never gets the rest of his team involved as much as he should.
Yet, he somehow has more rings than anyone from his generation.


Can you please explain how this "Kobe pass the ball" system works?

Apparently, him facilitating the triangle and winning five rings along the way isn't successful.

[Whoah10115]

Listen people, stop posting shit all the time. You're trying too hard to defend Kobe. It's not relevant.



Just call the Lakers FO yourselves and let them know that Andrew Bynum is a black hole. Therefore, it is detrimental to individual players and the team as a whole, for the two of them to play side by side, on the same team as Kobe Bryant. Pau Gasol needs to go and they need a PG. Chris Paul, for example, is too ball dominant. You don't need him, but you need somebody. Now.



Mike Brown's offense doesn't help, but even the Triangle was going to have problems this year, with Bynum finally being healthy and ready to be a bigger piece.

[The Iron Fist]

Listen people, stop posting shit all the time. You're trying too hard to defend Kobe. It's not relevant.



Just call the Lakers FO yourselves and let them know that Andrew Bynum is a black hole. Therefore, it is detrimental to individual players and the team as a whole, for the two of them to play side by side, on the same team as Kobe Bryant. Pau Gasol needs to go and they need a PG. Chris Paul, for example, is too ball dominant. You don't need him, but you need somebody. Now.



Mike Brown's offense doesn't help, but even the Triangle was going to have problems this year, with Bynum finally being healthy and ready to be a bigger piece.


Defend Kobe?

He did exactly what his detractors say he should do, pass the ball and get assists.

He got 9, 8 the other night, and 7 a few nights before,

and the Lakers still lost.

So how is this "Kobe pass the ball" system successful?

[kuniva_dAMiGhTy]

Yet, he somehow has more rings than anyone from his generation.


Can you please explain how this "Kobe pass the ball" system works?

Apparently, him facilitating the triangle and winning five rings along the way isn't successful.

How he is playing now isn't working though. It looks similar to the 2005-06 and 2006-07 seasons where Kobe was just gunning for scoring titles. Did the Lakers win anything then? Hell, right now he has an even higher usage rate than he did in 2006.

Guy just needs to stop holding the ball so long and get it moving. He along with Brown are the major reasons LA hasn't cracked 100 points this year.

[KDthunderup]

Yet, he somehow has more rings than anyone from his generation.


Can you please explain how this "Kobe pass the ball" system works?

Apparently, him facilitating the triangle and winning five rings along the way isn't successful.
Kobe has taken 135 more shots then the next player bellow him, how is that sharing the basketball? Kobe should be playing off the ball alot more, that way he would get alot better shots, higher % from the field and get his teammates more involved, now that Phil Jackson has left their is no way to keep Kobe in check with the offense, Jackson has been quoted many times saying that Kobe would just take his own stupid shots and play out of the offensive plan often.

[KDthunderup]

How he is playing now isn't working though. It looks similar to the 2005-06 and 2006-07 seasons where Kobe was just gunning for scoring titles. Did the Lakers win anything then? Hell, right now he has an even higher usage rate than he did in 2006.

Guy just needs to stop holding the ball so long and get it moving. He along with Brown are the major reasons LA hasn't cracked 100 points this year.
This whole post, I agree

[Maga_1]

If he has the assists its because someone is scoring in that possessions, just saying.

He just needs to improve his shot selection and be a less ball stopper for the team.

[The Iron Fist]

How he is playing now isn't working though. It looks similar to the 2005-06 and 2006-07 seasons where Kobe was just gunning for scoring titles. Did the Lakers win anything then? Hell, right now he has an even higher usage rate than he did in 2006.

Guy just needs to stop holding the ball so long and get it moving. He along with Brown are the major reasons LA hasn't cracked 100 points this year.

So the fault lies with the guy who leads the team in scoring and assists?

:roll:


You've always been stupid, but this confirms it even more.

Since you clowns love to rely on FG% and try to make the Laker bigs into all time HOF big men,

chew on these numbers.

Pau 51%
Bynum 53%


Thats just terrible.

"But its Kobes fault"

Ok,

so is it Kobes "fault" when they win?

[KenneBell]

How he is playing now isn't working though. It looks similar to the 2005-06 and 2006-07 seasons where Kobe was just gunning for scoring titles. Did the Lakers win anything then? Hell, right now he has an even higher usage rate than he did in 2006.

Guy just needs to stop holding the ball so long and get it moving. He along with Brown are the major reasons LA hasn't cracked 100 points this year.
Actually it isn't and will probably be lower by tomorrow.

I think he's scaled back since the first Clippers game to get Pau and Bynum more involved. Whether than has worked or not is very debatable.

[rmt]

Can you please explain how this "Kobe pass the ball" system works?


Well, what's the alternative? Kobe can't win by himself. How many games can he play over 42 mins? Bynum needs more touches to develop. Don't know what's wrong with Gasol - probably fed up with Kobe. Team looks dysfunctional.

Surprised by the loss - no Bogut, no SJax.

[KenneBell]

Kobe has taken 135 more shots then the next player bellow him, how is that sharing the basketball? Kobe should be playing off the ball alot more, that way he would get alot better shots, higher % from the field and get his teammates more involved, now that Phil Jackson has left their is no way to keep Kobe in check with the offense, Jackson has been quoted many times saying that Kobe would just take his own stupid shots and play out of the offensive plan often.
:roll:

Kobe has been playing off ball more than ever before this season. You haven't been watching shit.

[The Iron Fist]

Kobe has taken 135 more shots then the next player bellow him, how is that sharing the basketball? Kobe should be playing off the ball alot more, that way he would get alot better shots, higher % from the field and get his teammates more involved, now that Phil Jackson has left their is no way to keep Kobe in check with the offense, Jackson has been quoted many times saying that Kobe would just take his own stupid shots and play out of the offensive plan often.

Kobe is a shooting guard who has played more games than anyone else.

Why wouldn't he lead the league in that stat?



Jackson also got 5 extra rings because of Kobe. So you can quote him all you want, but this "Kobe needs to pass the ball to be successful",

doesn't quite work as great as you fools think.

[KDthunderup]

So the fault lies with the guy who leads the team in scoring and assists?

:roll:


You've always been stupid, but this confirms it even more.

Since you clowns love to rely on FG% and try to make the Laker bigs into all time HOF big men,

chew on these numbers.

Pau 51%
Bynum 53%


Thats just terrible.

"But its Kobes fault"

Ok,

so is it Kobes "fault" when they win?bu..bu...but Kobe makes his teammates better

[The Iron Fist]

Well, what's the alternative? Kobe can't win by himself. How many games can he play over 42 mins? Bynum needs more touches to develop. Don't know what's wrong with Gasol - probably fed up with Kobe. Team looks dysfunctional.

Surprised by the loss - no Bogut, no SJax.


Score 40 per game.

When Kobe does, the team wins at a 70% rate.

[The Iron Fist]

bu..bu...but Kobe makes his teammates better
He turned them into champions.

:bowdown:

Thats Kobes fault too!

[KDthunderup]

:roll:

Kobe has been playing off ball more than ever before this season. You haven't been watching shit.
:oldlol:

Explains how he has taken 135 more shots then the next player, Kobe doesn't need to touch the ball every possession, just drawing attention away would make his team better, but Kobe wants to take his 30 shots a game.

[The Iron Fist]

:oldlol:

Explains how he has taken 135 more shots then the next player, Kobe doesn't need to touch the ball every possession, just drawing attention away would make his team better, but Kobe wants to take his 30 shots a game.


You do realize Kobe is basically the pg as well right?

But if Kobe is drawing attention,

why are the Lakers bigs almost shooting in the 40s?

[KenneBell]

Well, what's the alternative? Kobe can't win by himself. How many games can he play over 42 mins? Bynum needs more touches to develop. Don't know what's wrong with Gasol - probably fed up with Kobe. Team looks dysfunctional.

Surprised by the loss - no Bogut, no SJax.
How many touches can you possibly spread to two post players that operate in the same space?

With the Lakers horrible 3 point shooting and spacing, the other teams end up packing the paint leading to more outside jumpers by the Lakers.

Gasol is averaging just as many shots has he has in the previous 4 seasons.

[KDthunderup]

He turned them into champions.

:bowdown:

Thats Kobes fault too!
Phil Jackson turned them into champions, Kobe couldn't lead a team of scrubs to the playoffs 2005 like Lebron did every year, Kobe doesnt make his teammates better, you could probably make more of case that Kobe's teammates made him better.

[pauk]

"But Kobe needs to CREATE FOR HIS TEAMMATES MORE (difference between that and just "pass") when the game is on the line especially, trust his teammates fully down to the last second and not just pass the ball because he has to... and improve his god damn shot selection... for the Lakers to be successful"

fixed :cheers:

[KenneBell]

:oldlol:

Explains how he has taken 135 more shots then the next player, Kobe doesn't need to touch the ball every possession, just drawing attention away would make his team better, but Kobe wants to take his 30 shots a game.
Check out how many shots he's been assisted on this year compared to the years he was in the triangle. It's far greater.

Yeah, Kobe obviously wants 30 shots a game. :rolleyes:

Your trolling is extremely simple and unsophisticated.

[32Dayz]

Jackson also got 2 extra rings because of Kobe & Gasol.

Fixed. :facepalm

Prime Shaq was by far the main reason LA won 3 rings in the early 00's you dumbass.

Kobe was Pippen back then.

Gasol was MVP and FMVP for LA in 2010 and was only slightly less valuable then Kobe in 09.

[KDthunderup]

Kobe is a shooting guard who has played more games than anyone else.

Why wouldn't he lead the league in that stat?




Jackson also got 5 extra rings because of Kobe. So you can quote him all you want, but this "Kobe needs to pass the ball to be successful",

doesn't quite work as great as you fools think.
Kobe and Durant have both played 19 games, Kobe has taken 135 more shots then him.

Kobe is shooting 45%

KD is shooting 50%

Thunders record v Lakers speaks for itself.

[pauk]

Fixed. :facepalm

Prime Shaq was by far the main reason LA won 3 rings in the early 00's you dumbass.

Kobe was Pippen back then.

Gasol was MVP and FMVP for LA in 2010 and was only slightly less valuable then Kobe in 09.

this

[RazorBaLade]

Kobe and Durant have both played 19 games, Kobe has taken 135 more shots then him.

Kobe is shooting 45%

KD is shooting 50%

Thunders record v Lakers speaks for itself.

durant also has teammates worthy of receiving the ball

[KDthunderup]

You do realize Kobe is basically the pg as well right?

But if Kobe is drawing attention,

why are the Lakers bigs almost shooting in the 40s?if he is supposedly playing the point he should definitely be take less shots then what he is.

and please Gasol and Bynum are both shooting well over 50% dont give me any shit about them being close to the 40s.

[KDthunderup]

durant also has teammates worthy of receiving the ball
Bynum and Pau arent worthy? :facepalm

[LiLharvard]

Bynum and Pau arent worthy? :facepalm

Game, set and match

[Scoooter]

It looks like, and this stretches back several years, that the real problem is integrating Andrew Bynum into a full time role. The offense seemed to flow much better with Odom at the 4 and Pau manning the pivot. Andrew was injured so often that no could get a feel for how he'd gel in an extended playing stint.

[RazorBaLade]

Bynum and Pau arent worthy? :facepalm

2 years ago pau deserved 15+ a game. He went 6-18 today against drew gooden dude. Bynum deserves more than 10 but every 2 shots he takes he commits 1 turnover once the team starts doubling. So, the entire team overall doesn't deserve those extra 6 kobe shots because they would have to go to someone like matt barnes.

The rest of the laker team is atrocious.

[kuniva_dAMiGhTy]

So the fault lies with the guy who leads the team in scoring and assists?

:roll:

Your blind love for Kobe makes you irrational. Maybe If you tried reading some of the responses, you'd know it isn't just about the assists. His scoring is largely predicated off him holding the ball isoing until the shot clock winds down (a la LeBron in Cleveland). I blame Mike Brown for this; it's the guys offense.


Since you clowns love to rely on FG% and try to make the Laker bigs into all time HOF big men,


chew on these numbers.

Pau 51%
Bynum 53%

Thats just terrible.

In what world is shooting 51 and 53% "terrible"? And you have the gall to call others stupid?

Shit, I guess Hakeem was a world-class chucker. :oldlol:

[Bladers]

KDthunderup has got to be the most contradictory poster ever.
Everything he posts contradicts what he previously posted. :hammerhead:

[KDthunderup]

Another interesting stat is that Kobe is averaging nearly 5 more shots a game then last year, just shows that Kobe is sharing the ball :roll:

[RazorBaLade]

Another interesting stat is that Kobe is averaging nearly 5 more shots a game then last year, just shows that Kobe is sharing the ball :roll:

we traded our 3rd best player for a pack of gum.. those 12 shots go somewhere buddy. And then fisher and artest and barnes continue to decline even more so they themselves dont even want to shoot that much.. Shots gotta go somewhere.

[KDthunderup]

KDthunderup has got to be the most contradictory poster ever.
Everything he posts contradicts what he previously posted. :hammerhead:
how? everything i have posted has lead to saying that Kobe takes too many shots and should play of the ball and pass the ball more.

[DKLaker]

Gasol can't do crap under pressure or if someone is being physical with him......you just flat out can't rely on the guy anymore.......he got his @ss kicked by Drew freaking Gooden tonight :facepalm :facepalm :facepalm
That was the difference in the game.
Pau Gasol......6 for 18 = 12 points and shooting soft fadeaways he didn't get to the line.....not even once.

Drew Gooden...9 of 15 + 4 free throws = 23 points.
He out scored Gasol by 11.......Lakers lost by 11
Gasol is losing his head to head matchup almost every night....dude is making almost 19 million a year, 7th highest salary in the league and now even scrubs are kicking his @ss.......it's time for a trade.

[kuniva_dAMiGhTy]

Actually it isn't and will probably be lower by tomorrow.

It was a few games ago. It's about 39% equally. Point is, Kobe shouldn't have that much of a load to carry. He's not playing with Kwame and Smush anymore lol.

[Clippersfan86]

how? everything i have posted has lead to saying that Kobe takes too many shots and should play of the ball and pass the ball more.

Maybe Russell Westbrook should follow similar advice. He's putting up less than 6 assists per game as a PG on a loaded team that's arguably the best all around team in the NBA right now. Doesn't sound like he's playing up to the hype people had for him this year.

[KDthunderup]

Maybe Russell Westbrook should follow similar advice. He's putting up less than 6 assists per game as a PG on a loaded team that's arguably the best all around team in the NBA right now. Doesn't sound like he's playing up to the hype people had for him this year.Agreed but this thread isnt about Westbrook, also Westbrook is a pg so he doesnt have to play off the ball that much.

[Heavincent]

Guy just needs to stop holding the ball so long and get it moving. He along with Brown are the major reasons LA hasn't cracked 100 points this year.

That's retarded. The reason L.A hasn't cracked 100 points in 13 games is because Kobe is the only guy on the team that can make a shot.

[32Dayz]

That's retarded. The reason L.A hasn't cracked 100 points in 13 games is because Kobe is the only guy on the team that can make a shot.

lol you obviously werent watching early games where Bynum was getting alot of touches and dominating on offense.

or 1 or 2 games ago where Kobe made an effort to get Gasol the ball and he roasted the opposing team.

[Fawker]

outside of wide open guys, his assists come from unorthodox pass outs or dishes below

[RazorBaLade]

32dayz ur thinking of the clippers game where pau went 9-13 as kobe passing to pau and pau roasting the other team....... And using it to compare to how poorly kobe passed to him tonight when pau went 6-18

Are you trolling?

[I.R.Beast]

Maybe Russell Westbrook should follow similar advice. He's putting up less than 6 assists per game as a PG on a loaded team that's arguably the best all around team in the NBA right now. Doesn't sound like he's playing up to the hype people had for him this year.

Goes to show how overrated assists are.....Thunder are better than ever because they have much better ball movement this year. Westbrook i splaying great. No need to force the playmaking through one player. Wish people would understand that.

[KDthunderup]

Here's a video of how Kobe plays offense

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kmK1R17QpJU

[RazorBaLade]

Here's a video of how Kobe plays offense

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kmK1R17QpJU

I don't think you need to be a moron that cherry picks 10 plays of kobe taking contested shots when no one is open and jordan passing shots to open guys that make it to realize jordan was a better player...

[32Dayz]

32dayz ur thinking of the clippers game where pau went 9-13 as kobe passing to pau and pau roasting the other team....... And using it to compare to how poorly kobe passed to him tonight when pau went 6-18

Are you trolling?

Not trolling but the idea that Bynum or Gasol haven't had multiple really productive games this year is false.

They have.

The other guy is acting like they always suck and thats why Kobe has to shoot so much. This isn't 2006.

[Heavincent]

lol you obviously werent watching early games where Bynum was getting alot of touches and dominating on offense.

or 1 or 2 games ago where Kobe made an effort to get Gasol the ball and he roasted the opposing team.

Well how about the other games when Pau got plenty of touches but couldn't make anything?

It's pretty much a two man show at this point. Kobe and Bynum are the only guys on the team that show up on a consistent basis. Pau is wildly inconsistent, and everyone else on the Lakers is terrible offensively.

Offensively, what do the Lakers have outside of Kobe, Bynum, and Pau?

Fisher? :facepalm
World Peace? :roll:
Barnes? Good cutter and a decent finisher. Still not a very good offensive player.

****ing Andrew Goudlock (or whatever his name is) is like the fourth best player on the Lakers :facepalm

[KDthunderup]

I don't think you need to be a moron that cherry picks 10 plays of kobe taking contested shots when no one is open and jordan passing shots to open guys that make it to realize jordan was a better player...
Watch the video, Kobe had open teammates through out the whole video, it just displays how much better Jordan was getting his teammates involved.

[Heavincent]

this

A retarded troll agreeing with a retarded troll.

Typical.

[kuniva_dAMiGhTy]

That's retarded. The reason L.A hasn't cracked 100 points in 13 games is because Kobe is the only guy on the team that can make a shot.

That would be your post, considering Bynum and Pau both shoot the ball better.

[RazorBaLade]

Watch the video, Kobe had open teammates through out the whole video, it just displays how much better Jordan was getting his teammates involved.

no matter what its still cherry picked, if kobe never passed then he would never get assists.. u can find plenty of moments where he finds and hits the open guy. but either way, im not gonna watch the whole thing ill just skip to random moments

1:08 no one open

2:44 im not watching this vid anymore. kobe passes to pau twice, is open on 3 pt line and pau loses the ball trying to pass to him and thats a knock on kobe.

guy who made the vid is a ****ing moron and so are you

[Heavincent]

That would be your post, considering Bynum and Pau both shoot the ball better.

Kobe gets 30 points and 7 assists a game but he's the problem???

That doesn't make any ****ing sense. Watch the games. Kobe is constantly setting up his teammates with good looks but it's just brick after brick.

[KDthunderup]

no matter what its still cherry picked, if kobe never passed then he would never get assists.. u can find plenty of moments where he finds and hits the open guy. but either way, im not gonna watch the whole thing ill just skip to random moments

1:08 no one open

2:44 im not watching this vid anymore. kobe passes to pau twice, is open on 3 pt line and pau loses the ball trying to pass to him and thats a knock on kobe.

guy who made the vid is a ****ing moron and so are you
1:08, why doesn't he initiate an offense? why not play off the ball?

No point arguing with Kobe fans, they are some of the most blind people out there.

[RazorBaLade]

1:08, why doesn't he initiate an offense? why not play off the ball?

No point arguing with Kobe fans, they are some of the most blind people out there.

dude...... stop trolling man. ur better than this. dont disappoint your mother like this.

[kuniva_dAMiGhTy]

Kobe gets 30 points and 7 assists a game but he's the problem???

Yes, the guy has a usage rate of 39%. Higher than any season from Jordan, Magic, Magic and Lebron - all ball dominant players. You better be making more than half your shots (or at the very least averaging 7-8+ assists a game) with the amount of possessions he uses. Kobe just doesn't score the ball consistently enough to be handling the rock that frequently.


Watch the games.

You're not the only one who watches the games buddie. Deal with the fact Pau and Bynum convert their points more efficiently (albeit on less volume).

[RazorBaLade]

Yes, the guy has a usage rate of 39%. Higher than any year from Jordan, Magic, Magic and Lebron - all ball dominant players. You better be making more than half your shots and averaging 7-8+ assists a game with the amount of possessions he uses. Kobe just doesn't score the ball consistently enough to be handling the rock that frequently.



You're not the only one who watches the games buddie. Deal with the fact Pau and Bynum convert their points more efficiently (albeit on less volume).

my ***** g Lock converts his points more efficiently than bynum and pau on less volume

do u think we can trade him for someone like cp3? he just needs more touches right

[32Dayz]

my ***** g Lock converts his points more efficiently than bynum and pau on less volume

do u think we can trade him for someone like cp3? he just needs more touches right

Yea but Pau and Bynum have had multiple games where they have scored in the mid to high 20's when given more touches.

Acting like its impossible or unreasonable for one or both of them to surpass 20ppg seems a bit silly.

[kuniva_dAMiGhTy]

my ***** g Lock converts his points more efficiently than bynum and pau on less volume

Is he a low post threat? Does he average double-digit points? Heavincent claimed Kobe is the only one who can make shots, that's false.

[KDthunderup]

dude...... stop trolling man. ur better than this. dont disappoint your mother like this.
Stop sucking Kobe's nuts so hard, if you can't accept that Kobe takes to many shots and doesn't share enough then please see your shrink.

You never see anyone but Kobe fans suck someones nuts so hard.

[32Dayz]

Is he a low post threat? Does he average double-digit points? Heavincent claimed Kobe is the only one who can make shots, that's false.

Heavincent is a true Kobe troll, dont take him seriously.

[Heavincent]

Heavincent is a Kobe troll, dont take him seriously.

Coming from a kid that doesn't even understand how timezones work :facepalm

[KDthunderup]

Kobe has taken 135 more shots then anyone in the league and is only shooting 45% That is all that needs to be said.

/thread

[Heavincent]

Heavincent claimed Kobe is the only one who can make shots, that's false.

Well he's definitely the only perimeter player that can make a shot.

Pau is inconsistent, but good when he is aggressive. Bynum is usually pretty good, I'll give you that.

Still, Kobe is the least of the Lakers problems right now. He's the best player on the team by FAR so we can't pin this on him.

[SlayerEnraged]

The only time Gasol and Bynum play well is when Kobe isn't aggressive at all...then every1 bitches Kobe's not scoring or shooting good even though it's because he's off rhythm in those type of games.

[RazorBaLade]

Is he a low post threat? Does he average double-digit points? Heavincent claimed Kobe is the only one who can make shots, that's false.

So you draw the line at double digit points? Kobe averages 30 but as long as someone has double digits on higher efficiency thats where the line is? okay. Yes he does. The 2 games so far he's played big minutes in he averages over 10 points.

In all fairness, pau isn't really a low post threat either. Bynums pushed him outside the paint really. Kobe isn't the only one who can make shots, thats not a good way to word what he was really trying to say.. But if you point to pau and bynum as deserving more shots then I will point to G lock to show you how silly your logic is.


Stop sucking Kobe's nuts so hard, if you can't accept that Kobe takes to many shots and doesn't share enough then please see your shrink.

You never see anyone but Kobe fans suck someones nuts so hard.

What is the number of your care worker? I have a complaint to register with your internet usage allowment.

[kuniva_dAMiGhTy]

Kobe has taken 135 more shots then anyone in the league and is only shooting 45% That is all that needs to be said.

/thread

Exactly. How is that efficient? Not like he's taking (or making) 3PT shots either. He's shooting 27% from beyond the arc...

[comerb]

durant also has teammates worthy of receiving the ball

Bynum and Gasol are a front-court 90% of the teams in the league would kill for. Kobe isn't getting their best performances, mostly because he's a poor leader.

Having said that, Kobe's play isn't the problem. He's shooting a lot, but he always has done that. It is definitely a lack of other players doing their part. But it is not a talent issue, it's a lack of focus/effort issue.

These (Kobe's) Lakers have always had attitude problems, and it caused them to underperform in relation to their talent level for the last several years... even in championship years.

[KDthunderup]

The only time Gasol and Bynum play well is when Kobe isn't aggressive at all...then every1 bitches Kobe's not scoring or shooting good even though it's because he's off rhythm in those type of games.no one would bitch about kobe not scoring enough if he shot efficiently from the field and took less shots

[32Dayz]

The only time Gasol and Bynum play well is when Kobe isn't aggressive at all...then every1 bitches Kobe's not scoring or shooting good even though it's because he's off rhythm in those type of games.

There were some early games where Bynum went off big time and Kobe scored very little and LA still won.

Just go's to show you how much better LA's offense has been over the years when ran through the Bigs instead of Kobe.

How did LA win against Boston in 2010? By Running the offense primarily through Gasol and letting him score and create for others.

[Heavincent]

You guys know Kobe is the best player on this team by far, right? So why we putting all of the blame on him?

You guys are retarded :facepalm

[kuniva_dAMiGhTy]

So you draw the line at double digit points? Kobe averages 30 but as long as someone has double digits on higher efficiency thats where the line is? okay. Yes he does. The 2 games so far he's played big minutes in he averages over 10 points.

No, I draw the line when I've seen Pau and Bynum go off for 20+ points (each) on flawless efficiency. They're both averaging 16ppg on roughly 52% shooting. Keep feeding them the ball; have Kobe playmake and take over the 4th

I don't condone what he did tonight; guy was straight out chucking down the stretch. He's a huge part of the reason the Lakers are a terrible offensive team. Kobe is a major ballstopper like Melo.


In all fairness, pau isn't really a low post threat either.

Yeah, that's bullshit and you know it. Why can't you Kobe fans ever be objective? Wow :oldlol:

[KDthunderup]

Because Kobe is the most "must hold the ball every possession" player in the league completely stunting the Lakers ball movement, effectively making them worse.

And if Pau is so shit, how come Kobe could barely lead his team to the playoffs before he came? :lol

[32Dayz]

You guys know Gasol is the best player on this team right?

Fixed.

[RazorBaLade]

Bynum and Gasol are a front-court 90% of the teams in the league would kill for. Kobe isn't getting their best performances, mostly because he's a poor leader.

Having said that, Kobe's play isn't the problem. He's shooting a lot, but he always has done that. It is definitely a lack of other players doing their part. But it is not a talent issue, it's a lack of focus/effort issue.

These (Kobe's) Lakers have always had attitude problems, and it caused them to underperform in relation to their talent level for the last several years... even in championship years.

Well thats fine, but at some point you have to realize they are getting shit on by people like gooden and illy, hibbert etc.... I'm all for blaming the best player on the team in losses but at some point they as the 2nd and 3rd best players need to take SOME blame for getting shit on.

[Heavincent]

Fixed.

Please tell me you're joking. Gasol isn't even the second best player on the team. It goes:

1.) Kobe






























2.) Bynum
3.) Gasol

[32Dayz]

Please tell me you're joking. Gasol isn't even the second best player on the team. It goes:

1.) Kobe
2.) Bynum
3.) Gasol

Kobe was slightly MV then Gasol in 2009.
Gasol was slightly MV then Kobe in 2010.
They both sucked in 2011.

Kobe has looked MV so far this season but he is also dominating the offense so its hard to say for sure.
I guess I'll say Kobe is MV so far this season.

[RazorBaLade]

No, I draw the line when I've seen Pau and Bynum go off for 20+ points on flawless efficiency. They're both averaging 16ppg on sub 52% shooting (roughly). Keep feeding them the ball; have Kobe playmake and take over the 4th (though, I don't condone what he did tonight; guy was straight out chucking down the stretch tonight)

In all fairness, pau isn't really a low post threat either.

Yeah, that's bullshit and you know it. Why can't you Kobe fans ever be objective? Wow :oldlol:[/QUOTE]

Yeah they do that once in a while but what do you say about games like tonight? Pau has had like 3 good games out of 20 dude. Bynum 6 out of 20. Cmon. You can't be getting outplayed by the other teams PF and C more than 50% of the time if they are as good as they supposedly are.. They need to be blamed a little too man.

I'll change my opinion if theres a shotchart out there or something but atm I hold my stance that most of pau's shots come outside of the paint or barely inside.

[Heavincent]

Kobe was way more valuable than Gasol in 2009.
Kobe was way more valuable than Gasol in 2010
Kobe was way more valuable than Gasol in 2011



Fixed.

Wait, why am I arguing with a kid that doesn't even know how timezones work and thinks that Gasol was better than Kobe in 2010? God damn you're retarded and I don't know why I even reply to you.

[kuniva_dAMiGhTy]

They need to be blamed a little too man.

No, you're right. They were aggressive but just couldn't put the ball in the basket tonight..especially Pau. Kobe completely went away from the "game plan" and tried taking over the 4th. That didn't work either. Didn't give them a chance to break that dry spell.

I just think Kobe's gotta play more balanced while the bigs should demand the ball more late in games. Is it me or do they just watch Kobe do his thing in the 4th? They're like spectators out there. Where's the popcorn at?!?! :oldlol:

[32Dayz]

Wait, Gasol was better than Kobe in 2010?

Gasol severely outplayed Kobe in the OKC series.
They were equal in the Utah series.
Kobe significantly outplayed Gasol in the PHX series.
Gasol severely outplayed Kobe in the 4 Finalz wins.

Gasol was the MVP of the playoffs and the Finals that year.
The performances speak for themselves. :confusedshrug:

[RazorBaLade]

No, you're right. They were aggressive but just couldn't put the ball in the basket tonight..especially Pau. Kobe completely went away from the "game plan" and tried taking over the 4th. That didn't work either. Didn't give them a chance to break that dry spell.

I just think Kobe's gotta play more balanced while the bigs demand the ball more late in games. Is it me or do they just watch Kobe do his thing in the 4th? They're like spectators out there. Where's the popcorn at?!?! :oldlol:

i agree i would like to see kobe pass more but i also want them to make more.. ans yes its infuriating, at some point pau decides to be kobes personal 15 mil a year screen setter and holds ball until kobe gets it then just watches. everyone else on 3 pt line not moving just watching. ridic.

[Heavincent]

Gasol was the MVP of the playoffs and the Finals that year.


No he wasn't.

http://www.aolnews.com/2010/06/18/kobe-bryant-wins-2010-finals-mvp/

[LakersReign]

Same pathetic double standard hot garbage different day. When Kobe goes for 40, he sucks. When dishes for assists, and the team doesn't make their shots he still sucks.:rolleyes:


(yawn):rolleyes:

[MMM]

It is not as simple as Kobe needs to pass more or score more for the Lakers to be successful. What the Lakers need from him is just to make the right basketball play out there. I'm sick of this passing mode or scoring mode he alternates between because he is smarter than that or at least should be since he is a 16 year vet. With that being said I don't blame him for the loses since his teammates have a lot of glaring weaknesses but for an elite player and a player that some have in the all time top 10 he should get it by now. Finally Kobe should understand that in his role as the only play maker on the team that his passing is much more valuable then his scoring on this current team but with that being said he should refrain from being passive and dishing out low quality passes because some of the passes I've seen him make as of late are quite dreadful. Simply make the right play and play in the flow of the offense.

[longtime lurker]

Get a PG, problem solved

[macpierce]

It is not as simple as Kobe needs to pass more or score more for the Lakers to be successful. What the Lakers need from him is just to make the right basketball play out there. I'm sick of this passing mode or scoring mode he alternates between because he is smarter than that or at least should be since he is a 16 year vet. With that being said I don't blame him for the loses since his teammates have a lot of glaring weaknesses but for an elite player and a player that some have in the all time top 10 he should get it by now. Finally Kobe should understand that in his role as the only play maker on the team that his passing is much more valuable then his scoring on this current team but with that being said he should refrain from being passive and dishing out low quality passes because some of the passes I've seen him make as of late are quite dreadful. Simply make the right play and play in the flow of the offense.

Kobe's passing doesn't matter if he teammates can't make wide open jumpshots, same thing happened last post season and it's happening again

/thread.

[TheFrozenOne]

Hhmm...look at the Kobe hatred

Lol..yet no one does anything

Figures

[EGarrett]

It is not as simple as Kobe needs to pass more or score more for the Lakers to be successful. What the Lakers need from him is just to make the right basketball play out there. I'm sick of this passing mode or scoring mode he alternates between because he is smarter than that or at least should be since he is a 16 year vet. With that being said I don't blame him for the loses since his teammates have a lot of glaring weaknesses but for an elite player and a player that some have in the all time top 10 he should get it by now. Finally Kobe should understand that in his role as the only play maker on the team that his passing is much more valuable then his scoring on this current team but with that being said he should refrain from being passive and dishing out low quality passes because some of the passes I've seen him make as of late are quite dreadful. Simply make the right play and play in the flow of the offense.You're asking a leopard to change its spots. Kobe never has known how to do that and never will. He has two modes: Awezum roxor jumper shoot-all-the-time ballhog attack mode, and "get teammates involved, look how unselfish I am" stand there and do nothing mode. Not even try to get open or set picks. Just stand on the wing. Period.

[dunksby]

Having 27 points and 9 assists means you are directly responsible for at least 45 points of what your team scored. Kobe took 21 shots and contributed to the team, how is that a bad thing? Lakers losses are not because Kobe is not taking enough shots its because Lakers as a team are playing bad basketball.

[MMM]

Kobe's passing doesn't matter if he teammates can't make wide open jumpshots, same thing happened last post season and it's happening again

/thread.

That is why when Kobe is focusing on passing he should set his team up with high quality assists that lead to the basket instead of low quality assists away from the basket. Kobe is a great interior passer and it will really help the only 2 Lakers that can score. So, again for a 16 year vet he should be playing a much smarter brand of basketball but overall the blame should go to his teammates for not being able to step up.

[chips93]

because assists are overrated..... it's about moving the ball around and getting it done as a team.


this

the lakers need kobe to pass the ball more, but thy also need gasol to establish himself in the post

[ILLsmak]

Any Laker fan or Kobe fan that can watch him without thinking, at times, WTF ARE YOU DOING KOBE? Does not understand the game of basketball.

-Smak

[Micku]

He's doing fine. I think he is taking too many shots, but at times he just have to score. He's passing well enough, it just the team isn't converting. I dunno what's wrong. Maybe it's the whole Mike Brown bad offense deal. They should be better than this, even without Odom.

With that said, they need another guy who could create.

[The Iron Fist]

Any Laker fan or Kobe fan that can watch him without thinking, at times, WTF ARE YOU DOING KOBE? Does not understand the game of basketball.

-Smak

29 p 9 a - Lakers lose

35 p 2 a - Lakers win


So explain to me why "Kobe needs to pass the ball more" is better again?

[32Dayz]

29 p 9 a - Lakers lose

35 p 2 a - Lakers win


So explain to me why "Kobe needs to pass the ball more" is better again?

They won because Bynum and Gasol dominated with limited touches.

They also won by a small margin.

Kobe should not be taking the same amount of shots as Bynum + Gasol combined.

[The Iron Fist]

They won because Bynum and Gasol dominated with limited touches.

They also won by a small margin.

Kobe should not be taking the same amount of shots as Bynum + Gasol combined.


Lakers won.

So why are you crying again? If your style of play works so much better,


why aren't you coaching in the NBA?

[N0Skillz]

Kobe Is Great, Bwink = 32Dayz


-N0Skillz

[Heavincent]

Lakers when Kobe shoots 25+ times: 6-3
Lakers when Kobe shoots less than 25 times: 6-7

End thread.

[The Iron Fist]

Lakers when Kobe shoots 25+ times: 6-3
Lakers when Kobe shoots less than 25 times: 6-7

End thread.


"Bu, but, they need to pass it into the bigs"


Kobe dishes out 9 assists and the team loses.

"Bu, but, Kobe only passes with .3 seconds left".

[BlueandGold]

I'd just like to see him stop going to artest and barnes and gasol so much, they are terrible, go to G lock and Bynum. Mostly bynum..

If kobe can get bynum 18 shots a game we'll be better than when gasol gets 18. Or hell. Get 18 for pau and 18 for bynum and dont let barnes shoot. IDK. But like tonight, I dont blame kobe at all.. But if bynum is 6/10 and pau is 6-18 then at some point in that game he has to realize that pau isnt getting it done and pass more to bynum. Feed the hot hand please

That's the problem with the critics. Berate when Kobe scores too much yet states that its "his job" to get his teammates involved. It's Bynum's job to get Bynum more touches just like its Gasol's job to get Gasol more touches. They have to demand the ball in the paint.

[The Iron Fist]

That's the problem with the critics. Berate when Kobe scores too much yet states that its "his job" to get his teammates involved. It's Bynum's job to get Bynum more touches just like its Gasol's job to get Gasol more touches. They have to demand the ball in the paint.


Pau doesn't even want the ball. As soon as he gets it, hes kicking it back out.

[MMM]

Lakers when Kobe shoots 25+ times: 6-3
Lakers when Kobe shoots less than 25 times: 6-7

End thread.

And what is there record when he makes good basketball decisions??? It shouldn't be about him passing vs. shooting because that is a simplistic way of looking at the game of basketball.

[MMM]

"Bu, but, they need to pass it into the bigs"


Kobe dishes out 9 assists and the team loses.

"Bu, but, Kobe only passes with .3 seconds left".

Assists numbers aren't the most accurate indicator of good passing. Yea Kobe had 9 assists but if they were mainly low quality assists then I don't see how your point is valid.

[ThatsGame]

The reason Kobe loses when he has higher assists nights is probably because he's going up against a better defensive team that night. The Lakers offense is terrible, a good defense shuts them down.

[The Iron Fist]

Assists numbers aren't the most accurate indicator of good passing. Yea Kobe had 9 assists but if they were mainly low quality assists then I don't see how your point is valid.
Oh, so now we measure assists now?:roll: :roll:

[MMM]

Oh, so now we measure assists now?:roll: :roll:

Not all assists are created equal. Kobe is a great interior passer but if he is in passing mode and dishing passes for low% shots to poor jump shooters then he is not doing a good job of being a play maker. What I expect from Kobe is to pass the ball like he has shown from 08-10 and find a right balance in his game.