Messi or Ronaldo?

[bdreason]

Messi has won the last 3 FIFA Player of the Year awards, and Ronaldo won it in 2008 (over Messi), while placing 2nd (to Messi) in both 2009 (MU) and 2011 (RM). I also think it's worth noting that every year Messi has won the award, there has been another Barcelona player in the top 3 (Iniesta, Xavi).



So, right now, who do you think the best of the two is? I don't follow the sport closely enough to make an educated evaluation, but with Real Madrid leading La Liga with a supposedly inferior cast, I'm leaning towards Ronaldo.

[Nanners]

Ronald is way better.... at flopping and crying

[chains5000]

Both are equally good IMO. Barcelona winning everything lately is the only reason behind the difference in personal awards.

[alenleomessi]

Messi has won the last 3 FIFA Player of the Year awards, and Ronaldo won it in 2008 (over Messi), while placing 2nd (to Messi) in both 2009 (MU) and 2011 (RM). I also think it's worth noting that every year Messi has won the award, there has been another Barcelona player in the top 3 (Iniesta, Xavi).



So, right now, who do you think the best of the two is? I don't follow the sport closely enough to make an educated evaluation, but with Real Madrid leading La Liga with a supposedly inferior cast, I'm leaning towards Ronaldo.
:oldlol: thats not how things work in football mate, this aint nba

this might have been a good question in 2008 or 2009, but its not right now and it wont be ever
messi is already one of the best ever, the same cant be said for cristiano

[baseketball4life]

I like Ronaldo's game more can't decide who is actually better

[blablabla]

Both are equally good IMO. Barcelona winning everything lately is the only reason behind the difference in personal awards.
this

[rhythmic]

Is this a joke? Messi by a country mile.
He actually steps up in big games.

Messi will be compared to Pele and Diego. :rolleyes:

[LJJ]

In before "Messi doesn't play well for Argentina NT, he can only perform with Xavi", even though he totally does.

[donald_trump]

i like ronaldo more, but i initially thought messi was better at the start of the year. now im not so sure. i think they are equally great.

[rhythmic]

This entire forum has the "what have you done for me lately" mentality. Since Ronaldo has been really good this season, people totally forgot how often Messi outplays this cry-baby.

Skill-wise perhaps they're somewhat close, in terms of their resume: it's Messi by a century mile, actually. In a way, you're asking me who's better Michael Jordan or LeBron James? I'll take the winner.

[rhythmic]

In before "Messi doesn't play well for Argentina NT, he can only perform with Xavi", even though he totally does.

:oldlol: Which idiot says that? Do people watch Barca play? Messi half the time dashes 30 yards on his own for the score.

[LJJ]

[quote=rhythmic

[EMERE]

Messi is way better today, he is just a different kind of breed... this question is totally pointless now, you could of ask years before but not now.......

[Dolphin]

How can anyone say Ronaldo isn't one of the best ever? He may not be in your top 15-20 all-time (he disappears still a lot because his game is pretty linear), but I'm sorry, when a guy is breaking scoring records seemingly every year now, ya, you can put him into that category of one of the greatest ever regardless of how many people you put on that list.

Seriously alenleomessi, you are gonna say that possibly the greatest finisher ever when his career is done, is not gonna be considered one of the greatest ever? lol

Messi is better. Much better all-around game on offense, but it's sad when certain messi fans laugh at Ronaldo as if he's some chump. The dude is the second best player of this generation and he's laughed at......lol

On another note, Ronaldo will probably tighten the footballer of the year award overall race to 3-2 in Messi's favor after this year. Probably end up with more goals, Madrid will win La Liga, Portugal may not do better in the Euros than Argentina did in Copa, but they prob won't do worse (and while that doesn't mean he's better than Messi LJJ, it does matter to voters of this award). Now, it would be interesting to see what happens if that all comes to fruition and Barca still wins the CL. But if there ever was a year for Ronaldo to get his second player of the year award, it would be this year.

[soadrules]

Anybody who thinks it's "Messi by a country mile" is a fool. Ronaldo has been godly this season. They are two different kind of wingers in terms of playing style.

As far as resumes go, yes, Messi is ahead. Let's not forget Ronaldo HAS won on some of the biggest stages as well. It's a shame Barca has had their number in head to head games, but I think a lot of that is on Mourinho/Pepe/a few other Real players letting the heat get to their head. Ronaldo did blow a few chances this past game and it's a shame, but that shouldn't discredit his whole resume and it's not like he literally went 'head to head' versus Messi. You can't say Messi got the better in a 'head' to 'head,' as they aren't really playing against each other; their teams are.

Anybody who discredits Messi because of his national team play (which isn't even 'bad' by any means, just not as great as his club team play) is a fool as well. He plays a different role there.

I think Messi is a greater player and will rightfully go down as so. But it's closer than most people make it out to be, and it's got to be disheartening for him to never get his props around now.

[soadrules]

How can anyone say Ronaldo isn't one of the best ever? He may not be in your top 15-20 all-time (he disappears still a lot because his game is pretty linear), but I'm sorry, when a guy is breaking scoring records seemingly every year now, ya, you can put him into that category of one of the greatest ever regardless of how many people you put on that list.

Seriously alenleomessi, you are gonna say that possibly the greatest finisher ever when his career is done, is not gonna be considered one of the greatest ever? lol

Messi is better. Much better all-around game on offense, but it's sad when certain messi fans laugh at Ronaldo as if he's some chump. The dude is the second best player of this generation and he's laughed at......lol

On another note, Ronaldo will probably tighten the footballer of the year award overall race to 3-2 in Messi's favor after this year. Probably end up with more goals, Madrid will win La Liga, Portugal may not do better in the Euros than Argentina did in Copa, but they prob won't do worse (and while that doesn't mean he's better than Messi LJJ, it does matter to voters of this award). Now, it would be interesting to see what happens if that all comes to fruition and Barca still wins the CL. But if there ever was a year for Ronaldo to get his second player of the year award, it would be this year.

AleonMessi is one of the worst posters on the board. Ignore him when it comes to any soccer advice. He's a barca fanboi through and through.

[Flamboyant]

Both are great players, but honestly they are both overrated stat-padders, and partly products of having superb teams. It comes down to what you prefer I guess. Messi is the better creator. He can find ways to be effective anywhere on the pitch. Ronaldo is the better scorer overall. He is considerably better on headers, and FreeKicks.

I'd take Messi over Cristiano by a bit. I'd take Zlatan Ibrahimovic over both without thinking twice.


In before "Messi doesn't play well for Argentina NT, he can only perform with Xavi", even though he totally does.

Did someone just say Messi performs for the NT :roll: Where were you when he got his ass handed to himself in the WC? How about the time Argentina hosted Copa America, and they barely even passed the group stage (which was the easiest group btw)?
If getting knocked out in the quarters and scoring an astonishing 0 goals in two most important tournaments is performing, then I'd really like to see Messi play bad. :hammerhead:

PS: Ronaldo is quite crap for NT, as well.

[blablabla]

Well he does perform for the NT if you look at the stats, he plays a different role on the NT than he does in Barca, but you can't let your team lose 4-0 to Germany or lose in the first knockout round in Copa America. He doesn't make a real difference while playing for Argentina, he's no leader. Not saying that Ronaldo is better.
Also let's be real Messis Barcelona is the most stacked team in the history of football and far superior in every way compared to Ronaldos squads of course he's going to win, but let's see how they'll do this year in CL if Ronaldo wins both CL and the Spanish League he and Messi are equal again, right now Messi has a little edge

[Dolphin]

Both are great players, but honestly they are both overrated stat-padders, and partly products of having superb teams. It comes down to what you prefer I guess. Messi is the better creator. He can find ways to be effective anywhere on the pitch. Ronaldo is the better scorer overall. He is considerably better on headers, and FreeKicks.

I'd take Messi over Cristiano by a bit. I'd take Zlatan Ibrahimovic over both without thinking twice.



Did someone just say Messi performs for the NT :roll: Where were you when he got his ass handed to himself in the WC? How about the time Argentina hosted Copa America, and they barely even passed the group stage (which was the easiest group btw)?
If getting knocked out in the quarters and scoring an astonishing 0 goals in two most important tournaments is performing, then I'd really like to see Messi play bad. :hammerhead:

PS: Ronaldo is quite crap for NT, as well.

You take credit away from Messi because he plays on the best club team ever, yet you seem to be putting a lot of blame on him for Argentina's struggles. He's just the best. Simple as that. Ibra is nowhere near him.

Argentina has been pretty garbage imo since Messi has starred on the team. Defense sucks. Midfield not that good. They have a bunch of good scorers up front.

Plus, while I do think results and stats matter somewhat when we're talking about the GOAT list, if you use the eye test from the last WC, Messi played quite well regardless of the fact he failed to score.

[AllenIverson3]

Iniesta better than both of them.. He performs for his country n club where as Messi is ghost for his country. He should've gotten one of those Ballon D'or that Messi got. Without Xavi n Iniesta, Messi is nothing.

[AllenIverson3]

Did someone just say Ibrahimovic is better than both of them? Haha

[alenleomessi]

How can anyone say Ronaldo isn't one of the best ever? He may not be in your top 15-20 all-time (he disappears still a lot because his game is pretty linear), but I'm sorry, when a guy is breaking scoring records seemingly every year now, ya, you can put him into that category of one of the greatest ever regardless of how many people you put on that list.

Seriously alenleomessi, you are gonna say that possibly the greatest finisher ever when his career is done, is not gonna be considered one of the greatest ever? lol

Messi is better. Much better all-around game on offense, but it's sad when certain messi fans laugh at Ronaldo as if he's some chump. The dude is the second best player of this generation and he's laughed at......lol

On another note, Ronaldo will probably tighten the footballer of the year award overall race to 3-2 in Messi's favor after this year. Probably end up with more goals, Madrid will win La Liga, Portugal may not do better in the Euros than Argentina did in Copa, but they prob won't do worse (and while that doesn't mean he's better than Messi LJJ, it does matter to voters of this award). Now, it would be interesting to see what happens if that all comes to fruition and Barca still wins the CL. But if there ever was a year for Ronaldo to get his second player of the year award, it would be this year.
I said right now he isnt up there with the greatest while Messi is. When career is done he probably will

Edit : for FIFA player of the year, a lot will depend on Euros, so i wont be surprised if Xavi, Iniesta, Van Persie or Schweini win it if their countries do good. Portugal is out of the question for winning it, and the award will be Ronaldo's only if Madrid wins both La Liga and CL

[Nick Young]

In before "Messi doesn't play well for Argentina NT, he can only perform with Xavi", even though he totally does.
LAWL Biased Euro who doesnt watch south american football, last time messi performed for Argentina was 2006 when he had Riquelme carrying the team on his back and Messi was just a bench sub who Riquelme spoon fed.

[alenleomessi]

Did someone just say Ibrahimovic is better than both of them? Haha
Almost as worst as you saying Iniesta is better than both of them

[Nick Young]

Almost as worst as you saying Iniesta is better than both of them
Iniesta>Messi.

People saying Messi's teammates suck for Argentina, gtfo.

Veron, Mascherano, Tevez, Aguero, Banega Lavezzi, Cambiasso, Zannetti.

The only problem position they have is keeper, who sucks but doesn't justify the fact that Messi can't do shit without the two most creative players of his generation giving him 1v1s with the keeper 2-3 times a game.

You're trying to claim Banega isn't a good midfielder now? That Aguero is not a good player? Messi plays on a top 5 most talented team in the world, with teammates like Aguero and Lavezzi who make it impossible for them to focus on Messi, meaning Messi should have all the more reason to flourish. But nope, all he does is fail in the white and blue.

[AllenIverson3]

^^ Your knowledge is limited...please yell me how Messi is better? 90% of his goals come from Xavi n Iniestas passes.. Hence why he sucks for Argentina. If he can score without Xavi n Iniesta, why don't he put up numbers like at Barcelona ? I believe he has more assists than goals for his country. Please tell me who scored winning goal at world cup? N don't tell me Argentina has a bad team.. With the talent that they have, they should've easily won copa America but instead were embarrassing.. Sergio Aguero in that tournament coming off the bench was better than Messi starting.

And don't come at me w some bullshit bcuz I know more about football than probably anyone on this board. You're a Messi groupie.... N I like Messi alot

[Dolphin]

Iniesta>Messi.

People saying Messi's teammates suck for Argentina, gtfo.

Veron, Mascherano, Tevez, Aguero, Banega Lavezzi, Cambiasso, Zannetti.

The only problem position they have is keeper, who sucks but doesn't justify the fact that Messi can't do shit without the two most creative players of his generation giving him 1v1s with the keeper 2-3 times a game.

You're trying to claim Banega isn't a good midfielder now? That Aguero is not a good player? Messi plays on a top 5 most talented team in the world, with teammates like Aguero and Lavezzi who make it impossible for them to focus on Messi, meaning Messi should have all the more reason to flourish. But nope, all he does is fail in the white and blue.

Argentina has good goal scorers as I said. But you can't tell me their defense isn't horrible. I also said their midfield is meh, not as horrid as their defense, but meh, and in its case it's more to due with under performing. They never seem on in the midfield. Coaching? Weak mental players? Overrated players? Who knows.

This has nothing to do with Messi anymore. Just pointing out that I personally don't think Argentina SHOULD be as good as some of you do.

[alenleomessi]

Its a mystery why Argentina underperforms, it might be the coaching or the players just arent motivated
The WC is still far but i dont see any defenders/mids with potential. Hopefully someone jumps out

They are playing Switzerland tomorrow, this is their expected lineup

Romero
Zabaleta, Campagnaro, Fernandez, Rojo
Gago, Mascherano, Sosa
Messi, Higuain, Aguero


Yes, the attack is insane, annnnnnd thats it. Messi will once again has to go back and make actions by himself

[Flamboyant]

You take credit away from Messi because he plays on the best club team ever, yet you seem to be putting a lot of blame on him for Argentina's struggles. He's just the best. Simple as that. Ibra is nowhere near him.

Argentina has been pretty garbage imo since Messi has starred on the team. Defense sucks. Midfield not that good. They have a bunch of good scorers up front.

Plus, while I do think results and stats matter somewhat when we're talking about the GOAT list, if you use the eye test from the last WC, Messi played quite well regardless of the fact he failed to score.

I didn't take credit away from Messi's impact on Barcelona's success. I took credit away from Messi himself for not being able to come up with similar performances on different circumstances. There is a difference, and it's an obvious one.

Let me give credit first, Messi to me is top 15 all-time (maybe even top 10). He makes some of the smartest runs in the box when he doesn't have the ball. It was early 2009 when I said he was better than Ronaldinho at his best, and my Barca supporters fans were calling me a fanboy.
However people love to exagerrate a lot of what he does. You claim that Messi is surrounded with the best team ever. You also claim that Argentina NT is garbage. Both statements are hyperboles. I'll say it as I think it is: Messi is surrounded with one of the best offensive line-ups in history that helps him a lot in his scoring explosion. He can't play like that and be successful while having a worse cast.

His play with NT supports that. He plays bad, plain and simple. His teammates winning Euro+WC, makes it even worse. Yes he played OK for an eye test. However Tevez and Aguerro played even better. Meanwhile David Villa played like God. For the guy that Ibra is "nowhere near him," putting an all tournament 7th team performance isn't enough. I want to see what seperates him form the others!

Edit: Also, Argentinian team that you guys love to trash was the best team in the WC 2006. A lot of changes on that team were made to suit Messi's game. I love how people ignore that.

[LJJ]

Argentina has good goal scorers as I said. But you can't tell me their defense isn't horrible. I also said their midfield is meh, not as horrid as their defense, but meh, and in its case it's more to due with under performing. They never seem on in the midfield. Coaching? Weak mental players? Overrated players? Who knows.

This has nothing to do with Messi anymore. Just pointing out that I personally don't think Argentina SHOULD be as good as some of you do.

I feel the same way.

First of all, Argentina has been a horribly managed side these past years. At the World Cup, two of Argentina's three best players weren't even on the roster! That is some seriously horrible managing.

And look at the lineup posted just now. You have Gago and Mascherano on the field, neither of whom really understand how to play football. They are fine bonecrushers if you surround them with a whole lot of players who know how to play, but as the centerpieces of your team? Gtfo.

And throughout it all, Messi has always played fantastic. He just hasn't been scoring as prophetically as he does with Barca, but if you hinge his entire performance strictly on that only the only thing it tells me is that you either don't watch football or you do watch it but don't quite understand what is going on.

[ClutchOver9000]

Not that I particularly favor one over the other but the Ronaldo hate on here is ridiculous. Messi may be better but its not by a "country mile".

And to be fair, Ronaldo has had great success in both the EPL and La Liga, two leagues with contrasting styles of play if you ask me.

Barca and Messi are tied at the hip but I honestly wonder how Messi would do in the EPL.

[Nick Young]

Argentina has good goal scorers as I said. But you can't tell me their defense isn't horrible. I also said their midfield is meh, not as horrid as their defense, but meh, and in its case it's more to due with under performing. They never seem on in the midfield. Coaching? Weak mental players? Overrated players? Who knows.

This has nothing to do with Messi anymore. Just pointing out that I personally don't think Argentina SHOULD be as good as some of you do.
Mascherano, Veron, Banega isn't "Meh":banghead: Argentina has one of the best midfields in the world, top 20. That's not "Meh"

[Nash]

The whole NT thing is not an issue since both Messi AND Ronaldo suck with their NT's.

[Nick Young]

The whole NT thing is not an issue since both Messi AND Ronaldo suck with their NT's.
Ronaldo for Portugal>Messi for Argentina, Ronaldo scores more with worse teammates against stronger defenses.

[falc39]

Not that I particularly favor one over the other but the Ronaldo hate on here is ridiculous. Messi may be better but its not by a "country mile".

Not just here -that's how it's like everywhere. Message boards, youtube, facebook, you name it, Ronaldo is treated like a scrub (especially when compared to Messi). I've always admired his technique so I usually end up defending him even though I appreciate watching Messi too.

[Dolphin]

I didn't take credit away from Messi's impact on Barcelona's success. I took credit away from Messi himself for not being able to come up with similar performances on different circumstances. There is a difference, and it's an obvious one.

Let me give credit first, Messi to me is top 15 all-time (maybe even top 10). He makes some of the smartest runs in the box when he doesn't have the ball. It was early 2009 when I said he was better than Ronaldinho at his best, and my Barca supporters fans were calling me a fanboy.
However people love to exagerrate a lot of what he does. You claim that Messi is surrounded with the best team ever. You also claim that Argentina NT is garbage. Both statements are hyperboles. I'll say it as I think it is: Messi is surrounded with one of the best offensive line-ups in history that helps him a lot in his scoring explosion. He can't play like that and be successful while having a worse cast.

His play with NT supports that. He plays bad, plain and simple. His teammates winning Euro+WC, makes it even worse. Yes he played OK for an eye test. However Tevez and Aguerro played even better. Meanwhile David Villa played like God. For the guy that Ibra is "nowhere near him," putting an all tournament 7th team performance isn't enough. I want to see what seperates him form the others!

Edit: Also, Argentinian team that you guys love to trash was the best team in the WC 2006. A lot of changes on that team were made to suit Messi's game. I love how people ignore that.

I don't think Argentina is garbage. Just highly overrated by some here.

Messi wouldn't put up the stats he does playing at Man U or any other team. Yes, Barca is perfect for him. He plays with the two smartest midfielders in the game. However, just because I believe he gets a boost by playing at Barca that other players don't get, when I look at him play, I still see a player who would be the best by a clear margin on any team in the world. Sometimes it's hard to imagine how a player would perform without certain players or within another system, but I in my heart of hearts can't see him being anything but the smartest, craftiest, most productive etc. player on the field while being one of the best teammates and playmakers on any team.

We have Argentina to go by on the international level. He was a top 3 player in the '10 WC. His team didn't help him at all. You put him on any team in that tournament, including Spain, and he's the clear best player on that team. He was playing that good.

And as I said before, I'm not giving him a free pass. As for the GOAT lists, I won't even hear of him being at the same level of Pele and Maradona, let alone above them, until he wins something on the international level. Those lists are about the eye test, individual stats and team accomplishments. The WC is too huge for me to put Messi at the top if he doesn't even make a semi in his career.

[Nick Young]

I don't think Argentina is garbage. Just highly overrated by some here.

Messi wouldn't put up the stats he does playing at Man U or any other team. Yes, Barca is perfect for him. He plays with the two smartest midfielders in the game. However, just because I believe he gets a boost by playing at Barca that other players don't get, when I look at him play, I still see a player who would be the best by a clear margin on any team in the world. Sometimes it's hard to imagine how a player would perform without certain players or within another system, but I in my heart of hearts can't see him being anything but the smartest, craftiest, most productive etc. player on the field while being one of the best teammates and playmakers on any team.

We have Argentina to go by on the international level. He was a top 3 player in the '10 WC. His team didn't help him at all. You put him on any team in that tournament, including Spain, and he's the clear best player on that team. He was playing that good.

And as I said before, I'm not giving him a free pass. As for the GOAT lists, I won't even hear of him being at the same level of Pele and Maradona, let alone above them, until he wins something on the international level. Those lists are about the eye test, individual stats and team accomplishments. The WC is too huge for me to put Messi at the top if he doesn't even make a semi in his career.
wtf

Sneijder, Muller, Ozil, Stekelenburg, Schweinsteiger, Nuer, Iniesta, Xavi, Villa, Forlan, Enyeama, Higuain, Kevin Prince, I can go on and on and on, with players who had a better world cup than Messi, top 3, how can you justify that in your mind, honestly.

[knickballer]

wtf

Sneijder, Muller, Ozil, Stekelenburg, Schweinsteiger, Nuer, Iniesta, Xavi, Villa, Forlan, Enyeama, Higuain, Kevin Prince, I can go on and on and on, with players who had a better world cup than Messi, top 3, how can you justify that in your mind, honestly.

Lulz, Landon Donovan

[ClutchOver9000]

Lulz, Landon Donovan

:lol

[Nick Young]

Lulz, Landon Donovan
sad but true

[alenleomessi]

wtf

Sneijder, Muller, Ozil, Stekelenburg, Schweinsteiger, Nuer, Iniesta, Xavi, Villa, Forlan, Enyeama, Higuain, Kevin Prince, I can go on and on and on, with players who had a better world cup than Messi, top 3, how can you justify that in your mind, honestly.
Iniesta and Ozil, maybe Forlan too.. thats it. Robben was good too until the final

[Nick Young]

Iniesta and Ozil, maybe Forlan too.. thats it. Robben was good too until the final
Not Sneijder, who won player of the tournament? Not Muller who scored 5 goals and was joint top scorer as a 20 year old? Not Xavi or Bastian Schweinsteiger? Messi was better than those players? How? Explain your line of thought.:facepalm

[Jasi]

I guess I am biased because of Ronaldo's arrogant, frivolous manners.
But I cannot deny he is an all time great forward.

I would still pick Messi over him in an All Time Starting XI, though.

[alenleomessi]

Not Sneijder, who won player of the tournament? Not Muller who scored 5 goals and was joint top scorer as a 20 year old? Not Xavi or Bastian Schweinsteiger? Messi was better than those players? How? Explain your line of thought.:facepalm
ugh it was actually forlan, do your research. and i dont need to explain shit to you this is the last time im quoting u

[alenleomessi]

I guess I am biased because of Ronaldo's arrogant, frivolous manners.
But I cannot deny he is an all time great forward.

I would still pick Messi over him in an All Time Starting XI, though.
I dont think even Messi deserves to be in an all time starting XI over Maradona, Ronaldo, Cruyff or Zizu, so far in his career.

[CeltsGarlic]

Ronaldo all teh way. Dude's way more versatile and can adjust to any kind of team he plays.

[Nick Young]

ugh it was actually forlan, do your research. and i dont need to explain shit to you this is the last time im quoting u
Muller was tied for 5 goals with Forlan, Sneijder and Villa, but played less games then all of them. Muller only played 473 minutes and the other top scorers all played atleast 635 minutes. Also Muller had 3 assists, compared to all the other top scorers who had 1 each, which is why he officially won the golden shoe over them.

Do your research retard. And explain how messi was a top 3 player at the 2010 world cup.

[Jasi]

I dont think even Messi deserves to be in an all time starting XI over Maradona, Ronaldo, Cruyff or Zizu, so far in his career.

I meant: if I had to pick between him and CR7.

I'd pick him over Zidane too, though

[Jasi]

[CENTER]Buffon
Cafu --- Beckenbauer --- Moore --- Maldini
Did

[qrich]

Can't go wrong with either of the two, but I'd personally take Ronaldo on my squad though Messi is slightly better at the moment.

[blablabla]

Do your research retard. And explain how messi was a top 3 player at the 2010 world cup.
i'd like to hear that too

[blablabla]

I meant: if I had to pick between him and CR7.

I'd pick him over Zidane too, though
over zidane?
not sure if srs

[Jasi]

over zidane?
not sure if srs

Messi is 24 and on his way to having a case for GOAT, Zidane never was in the conversation and never will be.

[LJJ]

Messi is 24 and on his way to having a case for GOAT, Zidane never was in the conversation and never will be.

I'd take CR over Zidane without thinking about it as well.

[blablabla]

Messi is 24 and on his way to having a case for GOAT, Zidane never was in the conversation and never will be.
imo zidane is the third best footballer all time

[pauk]

Dunno... soccer sux, who cares, most overrated sport in the world.....

http://www.twowheelforum.com/images/smilies/runaway.gif

[LJJ]

imo zidane is the third best footballer all time

:facepalm

[blablabla]

:facepalm
who would you take over him

[Jasi]

Pel

[LJJ]

who would you take over him

Almost every player Jasi lists in his all time team for starters.

First explain to me how the hell you take Zidane over any of the players who are normally recognized as the top three: Pele, Maradona or Cruyff? The idea is completely preposterous.

[The_Yearning]

Are you guys serious? Ronaldo is a choker... you can compare him to LBJ of the NBA. He just isn't ugly as LBJ.

Ronaldo will probably win La Liga... but guess what, that shit is a regular season award. It all comes down to CL. Whoever wins CL will be Player of the Year, no question.

The only reason Real is at the top of La Liga is due to Barca's injuries and new players getting acclimated on the team... and they still cream Real at every opportunity... it's not even funny anymore.

Messi > Ronaldo, always will be.

Copa Del Ray... you're an idiot if you think that means anything for Real.

CL or bust.

[blablabla]

Almost every player Jasi lists in his all time team for starters.

First explain to me how the hell you take Zidane over any of the players who are normally recognized as the top three: Pele, Maradona or Cruyff? The idea is completely preposterous.
i never said i would take him over pele or maradona those two are better than him
Cryuff ok you could rank him above zidane
but the others puskas di stefano, who played on the same team that's like CR and messi on the same team , messi and ronaldo have no argument to be above zidane

imo top 5 footballers are
pele
diego
zidane
cruyff
beckenbauer

[LJJ]

i never said i would take him over pele or maradona those two are better than him
Cryuff ok you could rank him above zidane
but the others puskas di stefano, who played on the same team that's like CR and messi on the same team , messi and ronaldo have no argument to be above zidane

imo top 5 footballers are
pele
diego
zidane
cruyff
beckenbauer

I'm just going to assume you are totally laughing your ass off right now. Nothing Zidane has done remotely justifies him being in that type of company.

He won a World Cup while not even performing well himself.

He won the Champions League on a team filled with players who had already won the CL before he even got there...... twice.

Those are his two defining accolades. Are you kidding me.

[AllenIverson3]

I'm just going to assume you are totally laughing your ass off right now. Nothing Zidane has done remotely justifies him being in that type of company.

He won a World Cup while not even performing well himself.

He won the Champions League on a team filled with players who had already won the CL before he even got there...... twice.

Those are his two defining accolades. Are you kidding me.
Please stop talkin u dumb piece of shit... Yeah I guess world cup, champions league, one of 3 players ever to win 3 world player of the year doesn't count as top 5. You make me sick... I really hope your ass is American

[Dolphin]

How did Robben player better than Messi at the WC?

Robben is severely overrated by some here. He is crafty and has pace, but jesus if the dude had some actually skill he'd be a lot better. His idea of breaking down a defender is kicking the ball 10 feet ahead of him and running past someone. lol

He's a black hole as well. He scored one of the luckiest goals ever in the quarters.

Messi was doing everything for Argentina in the WC. Setting up players, hitting posts (he had bad luck). He was the best player on the field in each and every game for Argentina.

Robben sat out wide and did nothing without the ball or for his teammates a lot of the time. He is crafty as I said so yes, there were times he found himself in a position to help out, but there are so many times in a game where he just doesn't look like a top player due to lack of smarts, selfishness, whatever. When he got the ball he didn't do much for his teammates either. Looked impressive individually taking on someone once in a while. His guile I think masks his overall lack of skill. That lack of skill I think even more than his selfishness is what prevents him from helping his teammates to be honest. He has little fluidity when marked. Can't get into positions with the ball that are prime to help his teammates like Messi does.

Sure, he has a tactical role....but you get the sense with certain players that what they do helps their team A LOT....I don't get that sense with Robben. In the WC, now, etc.

[LJJ]

Please stop talkin u dumb piece of shit... Yeah I guess world cup, champions league, one of 3 players ever to win 3 world player of the year doesn't count as top 5. You make me sick... I really hope your ass is American

One world cup (not as the best player) and one CL (played on stacked teams his entire career, mostly underperforming) is not nearly enough for top 5.

[AllenIverson3]

One world cup (not as the best player) and one CL (played on stacked teams his entire career, mostly underperforming) is not nearly enough for top 5.
My gawd... Zidane scored twice in the final u stupid ****... He single handedly beat brazil... Who was a better player that him on France ? Ur a dumb shit I won't even reply to the rest of ****ery.. He won more than maradona which who also won one wc... Like I said I really hope your American for saying this nonsense...

[Dolphin]

My gawd... Zidane scored twice in the final u stupid ****... He single handedly beat brazil... Who was a better player that him on France ? Ur a dumb shit I won't even reply to the rest of ****ery.. He won more than maradona which who also won one wc... Like I said I really hope your American for saying this nonsense...

Zidane is top 5 because he scored twice in a WC final?

[blablabla]

One world cup (not as the best player) and one CL (played on stacked teams his entire career, mostly underperforming) is not nearly enough for top 5.
but 60's real wasn't stacked or barca right now or ronaldos brazil squads

[LJJ]

My gawd... Zidane scored twice in the final u stupid ****... He single handedly beat brazil... Who was a better player that him on France ? Ur a dumb shit I won't even reply to the rest of ****ery.. He won more than maradona which who also won one wc... Like I said I really hope your American for saying this nonsense...

Zidane's performance at the 98 world cup was a joke. He hasn't played much worse during his career, he had barely any impact during the entire tournament. You using arguably his worst stretch of games during his prime to prep up Zidane only shows your all-encompassing lack of knowledge.

[LJJ]

but 60's real wasn't stacked or barca right now or ronaldos brazil squads

Sure 60s Real was stacked or current Barcelona is stacked. The difference here is that they capitalized on their dominance. This is very important.


Zidane played for stacked teams too. Those Juventus and Real Madrid squads were filled with players who had already proven they could win without him. Considering his teammates and the status you entitle him with he should have a lot more to show than one CL title and a decade of embarrassing under performance.

At least if he is the super-legend GOAT you claim him to be. If he was simply one of the greatest players of his generation, with no serious All Time consideration, maybe it's excusable.

Don't compare him to Pele, or to Maradona or Cruijff both of whom did much more than Zidane with much less. It's embarrassing. It's the football equivalent of comparing Kevin Garnett to Kareem Abdul Jabbar.

[Nick Young]

How did Robben player better than Messi at the WC?

Robben is severely overrated by some here. He is crafty and has pace, but jesus if the dude had some actually skill he'd be a lot better. His idea of breaking down a defender is kicking the ball 10 feet ahead of him and running past someone. lol

He's a black hole as well. He scored one of the luckiest goals ever in the quarters.

Messi was doing everything for Argentina in the WC. Setting up players, hitting posts (he had bad luck). He was the best player on the field in each and every game for Argentina.

Robben sat out wide and did nothing without the ball or for his teammates a lot of the time. He is crafty as I said so yes, there were times he found himself in a position to help out, but there are so many times in a game where he just doesn't look like a top player due to lack of smarts, selfishness, whatever. When he got the ball he didn't do much for his teammates either. Looked impressive individually taking on someone once in a while. His guile I think masks his overall lack of skill. That lack of skill I think even more than his selfishness is what prevents him from helping his teammates to be honest. He has little fluidity when marked. Can't get into positions with the ball that are prime to help his teammates like Messi does.

Sure, he has a tactical role....but you get the sense with certain players that what they do helps their team A LOT....I don't get that sense with Robben. In the WC, now, etc.
wow you're a huge moron who evidently doesnt understand football or has never played it:facepalm
more skill and technique then your boy nani...by a mile

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FyZTYTxKvvk
lack of skill? Robben? WTF? WTF? Really, sport? Really? Do you realize how retarded that statement is?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fDKbsrzbYVA
No skill. No technique. All luck right?

Messi doing everything for Argentina? LAWL more like trying hard and failing to do anything.

Veron was clearly the man running the show for Argentina in 2010, and oh yeah Higuain's 4 goals are the only reason the team got so far as they did. All Messi did was hit the post a few times. That in no way shape or form involves carrying the team. Veron carried that team. And then he got hurt and they began to suck. Plus he was like 35 anyways. Pretty sad when some old washed up has-been is the main playmaker on the team when apparently the "best player in the world is there next to him."

[Dolphin]

wow you're a huge moron who evidently doesnt understand football or has never played it:facepalm
more skill and technique then your boy nani...by a mile

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FyZTYTxKvvk
lack of skill? Robben? WTF? WTF? Really, sport? Really? Do you realize how retarded that statement is?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fDKbsrzbYVA
No skill. No technique. All luck right?

Messi doing everything for Argentina? LAWL more like trying hard and failing to do anything.

Veron was clearly the man running the show for Argentina in 2010, and oh yeah Higuain's 4 goals are the only reason the team got so far as they did. All Messi did was hit the post a few times. That in no way shape or form involves carrying the team. Veron carried that team. And then he got hurt and they began to suck. Plus he was like 35 anyways. Pretty sad when some old washed up has-been is the main playmaker on the team when apparently the "best player in the world is there next to him."

I'd take you seriously if you hadn't already admitted you're a troll.

So since we both agree you're a troll.......you would agree with me that I shouldn't take your post seriously.

Glad that's done with.

[AllenIverson3]

Zidane is top 5 because he scored twice in a WC final?
reading is fundamental....go re read my conversation with him n come back :facepalm

[AllenIverson3]

Sure 60s Real was stacked or current Barcelona is stacked. The difference here is that they capitalized on their dominance. This is very important.


Zidane played for stacked teams too. Those Juventus and Real Madrid squads were filled with players who had already proven they could win without him. Considering his teammates and the status you entitle him with he should have a lot more to show than one CL title and a decade of embarrassing under performance.

At least if he is the super-legend GOAT you claim him to be. If he was simply one of the greatest players of his generation, with no serious All Time consideration, maybe it's excusable.

Don't compare him to Pele, or to Maradona or Cruijff both of whom did much more than Zidane with much less. It's embarrassing. It's the football equivalent of comparing Kevin Garnett to Kareem Abdul Jabbar.

this guy is the worst poster that i've come across.....Zidane won more than Maradona..so how the **** is Maradona in top 5 then and Zidane isn't...?

Just stop already.

[AllenIverson3]

Zidane's performance at the 98 world cup was a joke. He hasn't played much worse during his career, he had barely any impact during the entire tournament. You using arguably his worst stretch of games during his prime to prep up Zidane only shows your all-encompassing lack of knowledge.
and he ended up having one of the greatest impacts in world cup final history...:oldlol:

He single handedly beat Brazil in the finals....

And if those teams were stacked like u claim, how come they barely beat Bayer in the CL finals? better yet, who ended up scoring the winning goal? i'll wait. Not to mention it is the greatest goal in CL history.

[LJJ]

and he ended up having one of the greatest impacts in world cup final history...:oldlol:

He single handedly beat Brazil in the finals....

And if those teams were stacked like u claim, how come they barely beat Bayer in the CL finals? better yet, who ended up scoring the winning goal? i'll wait. Not to mention it is the greatest goal in CL history.

So that is the extent of your argument.

"Yeah Zidane played pretty horrible in 98, but he got two headers in the final and that's why he's top 5 all time."


You idiot.

[Dolphin]

reading is fundamental....go re read my conversation with him n come back :facepalm

I read what you posted perfectly fine. LJJ said Zidane had a bad tournament and you responded by saying Zidane scored twice in one game.

Yep, reading IS fundamental and I'm quite good at it.:cheers:

But please....please.....don't come back. lol

[Flamboyant]

Wow, I would have expected a little more reasonable conversations in a football thread, but weirdness of this board never fails to amaze me.

So now Messi was top 3 of WC '10, while Zidane played horrible in '98. :facepalm Meanwhile Robben doesn't have any actual skill. :eek:








I'm speechless. . . :violin:

[LJJ]

while Zidane played horrible in '98. :eek:

I'm speechless. . . :violin:

Instead of being speechless, what about speaking up and showing us your "knowledge"? (this goes for you too, idiot)

This is someone's match for match breakdown of Zidane's tournament:

[QUOTE]And now to Zidane

[AllenIverson3]

So that is the extent of your argument.

"Yeah Zidane played pretty horrible in 98, but he got two headers in the final and that's why he's top 5 all time."


You idiot.
You ****ing retard listen up cuz I'm only gonna this once... First of all zidane is the greatest midfielder I ever seen... His resume consists of winning world cup, champions league, n 3 time world player of the year. Which is only two other players have done that. Those are the top highlights of his career. He performs on the biggest stage when it matters. Having scored winning goals in wc final n CL final. Not to mention he was the best player during the 06 world cup but made a dumb mistake in the final.. And he was 34. Never in my argument did I say Zidane was top 5 bcuz he scored two goals in wc final alone. And never was he on a team as stacked as Barcelona or Santos. So stop with this ****ery of trying to justify him not being top 5 bcuz he was on a stacked team. Meanwhile Maradona won one wc by cheating n he's better than Zidane. And better yet Cruyff who never won a ****ing wc is also better. Please explain to me how they're better.. Don't worry I'll wait. And don't bring up stacked teams in your argument because it's evident your knowledge is limited.

[Dolphin]

Wow, I would have expected a little more reasonable conversations in a football thread, but weirdness of this board never fails to amaze me.

So now Messi was top 3 of WC '10, while Zidane played horrible in '98. :facepalm Meanwhile Robben doesn't have any actual skill. :eek:








I'm speechless. . . :violin:

I didn't say Robben has no skill. I said his guile and physical ability are superior to his skill. I also said he's overrated by many people.

Messi was performing at a level that I would consider top 3. You put him on any team and he would have been the best player on that team except in Spain's case perhaps. Do you think he wouldn't have looked as good as Iniesta and Xavi if he was playing with them? You think he wouldn't have looked as good as anyone on Germany if he was playing with them? Netherlands? Uruguay? He played fine. His pace was great. He put pressure on the defense. He set teammates up.

If you asked any of those team's managers, they would have loved to have Messi on their team playing the way he did in that tournament.

[Nick Young]

I didn't say Robben has no skill. I said his guile and physical ability are far superior to his skill. I also said he's overrated by many people.

Messi was performing at a level that I would consider top 3. You put him on any team and he would have been the best player on that team except in Spain's case perhaps. Do you think he wouldn't have looked as good as Iniesta and Xavi if he was playing with them? You think he wouldn't have looked as good as anyone on Germany if he was playing with them? Netherlands? Uruguay? He played fine. His pace was great. He put pressure on the defense. He set teammates up.

If you asked any of those team's managers, they would have loved to have Messi on their team playing the way he did in that tournament.
You said Robben has no skill retard, you said all he can do is kick the ball 10 feet past players and run past them:roll:

Probably a top 5 skilled technical player in the world at the moment, idiot.

Stick with ice hockey, retard.:roll:

How can Messi have been top 3 of any team at the world cup when he wasnt even top 3 of his own team XD

[Mr Clutch Melo]

"If Robben actually had some skill"

You can call Robben selfish, ineffective and not a team(system) player but to say he does not have skill ? Wow :facepalm

[Dolphin]

You said Robben has no skill retard, you said all he can do is kick the ball 10 feet past players and run past them:roll:

Probably a top 5 skilled technical player in the world at the moment, idiot.

Stick with ice hockey, retard.:roll:

How can Messi have been top 3 of any team at the world cup when he wasnt even top 3 of his own team XD

Fine, hold that against me. I said he has no skill. Clearly he has skill or else he wouldn't be playing on Bayern Munich and starting for one of the top international squads. It was an exaggeration. He is not top 5 in the world technically. Not even close. And ya, watch him play. Watch him when he's breaking down a defender in open space. Pushed ball to his left, uses the outside of foot to push ball back to the right side and runs past people. His one on one game is very linear. His one on one game benefits more from his pace and knowing how to best use his abilities (guile) than a top 5 skill set.

But you are a troll....you are gonna keep referring to me saying that.


"If Robben actually had some skill"

You can call Robben selfish, ineffective and not a team(system) player but to say he does not have skill ? Wow :facepalm

Read above.

[LJJ]

You ****ing retard listen up cuz I'm only gonna this once... First of all zidane is the greatest midfielder I ever seen... His resume consists of winning world cup, champions league, n 3 time world player of the year. Which is only two other players have done that. Those are the top highlights of his career. He performs on the biggest stage when it matters. Having scored winning goals in wc final n CL final. Not to mention he was the best player during the 06 world cup but made a dumb mistake in the final.. And he was 34. Never in my argument did I say Zidane was top 5 bcuz he scored two goals in wc final alone. And never was he on a team as stacked as Barcelona or Santos. So stop with this ****ery of trying to justify him not being top 5 bcuz he was on a stacked team. Meanwhile Maradona won one wc by cheating n he's better than Zidane. And better yet Cruyff who never won a ****ing wc is also better. Please explain to me how they're better.. Don't worry I'll wait. And don't bring up stacked teams in your argument because it's evident your knowledge is limited.


Cruijff let a team who had never won anything before he got there and had been a middling provincial club up to that point to three consecutive Champions League titles as the sole star player.

Zidane doesn't come close to any success on that type of scale. And that is only the tiniest fragment of why Cruijff in the top three conversation. Consider your ass schooled.

[Nick Young]

I'd take you seriously if you hadn't already admitted you're a troll.

So since we both agree you're a troll.......you would agree with me that I shouldn't take your post seriously.

Glad that's done with.
LOL what a retard, gets destroyed in an argument when he makes an outrageous statement, then backs out like a little bitch, because he knows he got destroyed with his dumbass comment. Robben has no skill. Walcott has no pace. Van Persie can't finish. Nani is a top 5 player in the world. Casillas is a shit goal keeper. what's next from this kid's mouth, I wouldn't be surprised by anything:roll: :roll: :roll:

No balls at all from this kid. :roll: :roll: :roll:

[Nick Young]

Fine, hold that against me. I said he has no skill. Clearly he has skill or else he wouldn't be playing on Bayern Munich and starting for one of the top international squads. It was an exaggeration. He is not top 5 in the world technically. Not even close. And ya, watch him play. Watch him when he's breaking down a defender in open space. Pushed ball to his left, uses the outside of foot to push ball back to the right side and runs past people. His one on one game is very linear. His one on one game benefits more from his pace and knowing how to best use his abilities (guile) than a top 5 skill set.



Read above.

But you are a troll....you are gonna keep referring to me saying that.
List 5 better technically. This will be highly amusing in my current drunken and jubilant state at England's latest choke job:roll: :roll: :roll:

Go on kid, really, list guys you think have Robben beaten in technique, your honest opinion.

[Dolphin]

Walcott has no pace. Van Persie can't finish. Nani is a top 5 player in the world. Casillas is a shit goal keeper

No balls at all from this kid. :roll: :roll: :roll:

Quoted for future reference. Can't believe you believe these things.

And how do I have no balls for admitting I was exaggerating? You think anyone reading this is gonna believe I think Robben has 0 skill? lol

[Nick Young]

Quoted for future reference. Can't believe you believe these things.

And how do I have no balls for admitting I was exaggerating? You think anyone reading this is gonna believe I think Robben has 0 skill? lol
lol. Name your list of players better technically then Robben, why can't you do it, sport?

I have admitted to trolling on the fair occassion yes. The difference between you and me is I do it because I get hilarious responses from people when I'm bored. When you do it you actually believe the retarded shit you say and don't realize how stupid you sound.

[Dolphin]

lol. Name your list of players better technically then Robben, why can't you do it, sport?

I have admitted to trolling on the fair occassion yes. The difference between you and me is I do it because I get hilarious responses from people when I'm bored. When you do it you actually believe the retarded shit you say and don't realize how stupid you sound.

My voice is in your head, eh? Does it sound hot? lol

Do you want me to name just attacking players? I will give you one chance to take back your statement. Ronaldo, Messi, Xavi, Iniesta. There's 4. All I need is one more....'DUH, DUH DUH!!!!!!".........can he do it?.....only one way to find out. Bruinlove must give the green light.

[Mr Clutch Melo]

Fine, hold that against me. I said he has no skill. Clearly he has skill or else he wouldn't be playing on Bayern Munich and starting for one of the top international squads. It was an exaggeration. He is not top 5 in the world technically. Not even close. And ya, watch him play. Watch him when he's breaking down a defender in open space. Pushed ball to his left, uses the outside of foot to push ball back to the right side and runs past people. His one on one game is very linear. His one on one game benefits more from his pace and knowing how to best use his abilities (guile) than a top 5 skill set.

But you are a troll....you are gonna keep referring to me saying that.



Read above.

:applause: Better formulated this time. I fully agree.

[Mr Clutch Melo]

Not sure if Robben is the most skillful at Bayern . Is he even in he top 3 ? :confusedshrug:

[Dolphin]

Not sure if Robben is the most skillful at Bayern . Is he even in he top 3 ? :confusedshrug:

Bruinlove is thinking to himself "Well......it's not like I was sober when I said that....."

[Nick Young]

My voice is in your head, eh? Does it sound hot? lol

Do you want me to name just attacking players? I will give you one chance to take back your statement. Ronaldo, Messi, Xavi, Iniesta. There's 4. All I need is one more....'DUH, DUH DUH!!!!!!".........can he do it?.....only one way to find out. Bruinlove must give the green light.
lawl lawl lawl, no reason Ronaldo, Xavi and Iniesta have better technique.

They are better creatively, less selfish and make better decisions and have higher work rate. But no reason they are more skilled than Robben, sport.
Technique wise-how are they above Robben?

Stop trying to redeem yourself retard, and accept your idiocy:roll: :roll: :roll:

[LJJ]

I depends on how you see skill.

The broader a definition of skill you assume, the faster Robben drops down the list. At the same time you could say there is no one in football who does what Robben does better. He's a specialist through and through.

[Nick Young]

I depends on how you see skill.

The broader a definition of skill you assume, the faster Robben drops down the list. At the same time you could say there is no one in football who does what Robben does better. He's a specialist through and through.
Robben's only weakness besides his attitude and getting hurt all the time is he is incredibly one footed. But he just has such a high level of technique and skill it doesn't matter, everyone knows he will cut in from the left, everyone knows he can only shoot from his left and still he gets it off all the time, vs everyone.

So on one hand, you can rank him lower because he only has one foot compared to guys like Ronaldo, Messi, Sneijder, Iniesta, true two-footed players, but on the other hand he is so skilled that on his day, when he is trying he is just as good as those players, even playing basically with just one foot.

[AllenIverson3]

Cruijff let a team who had never won anything before he got there and had been a middling provincial club up to that point to three consecutive Champions League titles as the sole star player.

Zidane doesn't come close to any success on that type of scale. And that is only the tiniest fragment of why Cruijff in the top three conversation. Consider your ass schooled.
:oldlol: :oldlol: thats your argument? no wonder why i have to repeat the same shit for the 5th time...Zidane won CL himself..I could give a **** how many times he won CL because thats not what makes the player the best. The main silverware is the WC which he never won. Not to mention Zidane also won Euro in 2000. I'll take a player who won WC over someone who won CL..Messi won CL 3 time already but if he never wins WC, he won't ever be considered top 5....

Ronaldo, Zidane, Pele, Maradona >>> Cruiyff...now gtfo

[AllenIverson3]

Ribery >>>> Robben

Robben is too inconsistent n most of the time spends on the injury list

[Nick Young]

Ribery >>>> Robben

Robben is too inconsistent n most of the time spends on the injury list
hmm do you watch Bayern ever, you can say the exact same thing about Ribery, inconsistent and spends too much time injured

[LJJ]

:oldlol: :oldlol: thats your argument? no wonder why i have to repeat the same shit for the 5th time...Zidane won CL himself..I could give a **** how many times he won CL because thats not what makes the player the best. The main silverware is the WC which he never won. Not to mention Zidane also won Euro in 2000. I'll take a player who won WC over someone who won CL..Messi won CL 3 time already but if he never wins WC, he won't ever be considered top 5....

Ronaldo, Zidane, Pele, Maradona >>> Cruiyff...now gtfo

WC is the main silverware? :facepalm You are an idiot.

I already posted a match for match breakdown of Zidane's WC. Showing what actually happened. You might read it sometime. Since you clearly haven't watched it, it's better than nothing.

[AllenIverson3]

hmm do you watch Bayern ever, you can say the exact same thing about Ribery, inconsistent and spends too much time injured
Bayern is probably my 2nd fave team to watch...so yes i watch them on consistent basis..matter of fact i just watched the replay of their match against Schalke 04 last night.

[Nick Young]

Bayern is probably my 2nd fave team to watch...so yes i watch them on consistent basis..matter of fact i just watched the replay of their match against Schalke 04 last night.
for me they are my third favorite team to watch behind chelsea and tottenham, see them every week, how do you say ribery is more consistent then robben then, did you forget about last year, and did you forget how when Robben wasn't injured he lead Bayern to the european final and Holland to the final as the second best player?

[AllenIverson3]

WC is the main silverware? :facepalm You are an idiot.

I already posted a match for match breakdown of Zidane's WC. Showing what actually happened. You might read it sometime. Since you clearly haven't watched it, it's better than nothing.
:oldlol: i'm an idiot....what is more important than WC? why is Pele considered by many to be the greatest player of all time? because he won 3 world cups. World Cup is the most competitive and biggest tournament in all of football...:facepalm

[Grinder]

When Robben's playing well and healthy, there might be 2-3 players better than him.

Guy's truly incredible with the ball.

[AllenIverson3]

for me they are my third favorite team to watch behind chelsea and tottenham, see them every week, how do you say ribery is more consistent then robben then, did you forget about last year, and did you forget how when Robben wasn't injured he lead Bayern to the european final and Holland to the final as the second best player?
Because he's known more for being injured than performing well... :lol he's only played more than 30 games in a league once in his career n that was with PSV. Most of the time he barely plays half the season and is always injured. yeah he had a good run in the WC but choked. Ever since WC, he hasn't been the same..

Right now Ribery >> Robben

and Robben will be gone in the summer i'm pretty sure.

[Dolphin]

Silva and Modric make it 6 right there.

Bruinlove.......







































http://i41.tinypic.com/34xrrck.jpg

"60 mile road is thataway!!!!"


:roll:

[LJJ]

why is Pele considered by many to be the greatest player of all time? because he won 3 world cups.

That's not the reason idiot.

World Cup is the most competitive tournament in all of football...:facepalm


That's not true idiot.

[AllenIverson3]

That's not the reason idiot.



That's not true idiot.
So tell me what is true then....why is Pele considered to be the greatest ever and what is more competitive than WC...i'll wait

[AllenIverson3]

When Robben's playing well and healthy, there might be 2-3 players better than him.

Guy's truly incredible with the ball.
When he's fit and healthy i stand by what you said, but that doesn't happen very often nowadays.

[Nick Young]

Silva and Modric make it 6 right there.

Bruinlove.......







































http://i41.tinypic.com/34xrrck.jpg

"60 mile road is thataway!!!!"


:roll:
lawl stop trying to redeem yourself, modric and silva are not better technically then robben, silva is maybe on his level.
Stop trying to redeem yourself:roll:

[LJJ]

So tell me what is true then....why is Pele considered to be the greatest ever and what is more competitive than WC...i'll wait

Pele is considered the goat because of his level of play.

The Champions League is much more competitive than the WC. The level of play is much, much higher. The level of play in the upper ranks of the better domestic competitions is also higher.



That was easy. Is there anyone here who does not think you are an idiot? It takes some kind of fool to piss off both me and bruinlove with your level of idiocy. That is some high level idiocy type shit.

[AllenIverson3]

Pele is considered the goat because of his level of play.

The Champions League is much more competitive than the WC. The level of play is much, much higher. The level of play in the upper ranks of the better domestic competitions is also higher.



That was easy. Is there anyone here who does not think you are an idiot? It takes some kind of fool to piss off both me and bruinlove with your level of idiocy. That is some high level idiocy type shit.
:oldlol: i'm done with this shit.....you're def an american who doesn't know 2 shit about the greatest sport in the world.

[LJJ]

schooled

[AllenIverson3]

Yeah u def did. I'm offended

[Not No Talker]

Champions League is more competitive than the World Cup imo.

[Dolphin]

lawl stop trying to redeem yourself, modric and silva are not better technically then robben, silva is maybe on his level.
Stop trying to redeem yourself:roll:

Saying Robben is equal technically to Silva is similar to saying Tony Parker is equal technically to Steve Nash.


Hey buddy....buddy......wait for it......wait for it.......a little bit longer.....k, he we go....



















































http://i41.tinypic.com/34xrrck.jpg

"60 Mile road is thataway!!!!!"

:roll:

[Nick Young]

Saying Robben is equal technically to Silva is similar to saying Tony Parker is equal technically to Steve Nash.


Hey buddy....buddy......wait for it......wait for it.......a little bit longer.....k, he we go....



















































http://i41.tinypic.com/34xrrck.jpg

"60 Mile road is thataway!!!!!"

:roll:
lawl this kid actually is retarded:applause:

[Dolphin]

lawl this kid actually is retarded:applause:

C'mon, say it with me homeboy. Which way is 60 mile?

Say it........saaaaay it......you know you want to.

[Flamboyant]

Instead of being speechless, what about speaking up and showing us your "knowledge"? (this goes for you too, idiot)

This is someone's match for match breakdown of Zidane's tournament:

Pretty harsh, but care to discredit anything he said? What I have watched of Zidane that tournament left me thoroughly unimpressed. He was not good at all, he did not come close to his usual level of play.

Anyone who says otherwise is probably going off Wikipedia entirely to be honest, that's how sure I am of what I saw.

Sure. First off, I didn't claim '98 WC was Zizou at his best. He didn't play out of this world. However nothing that you wrote/quoted suggests that he was horrible. Yep, he got sent off in the group stage, and you can break some points for it, but at the end it didn't matter much. The game against Paraguay was a closed one, and Zizou didn't do much, though he didn't make any mistakes neither. Overall a meh performance. Against Croatia he was decent. Anyone who thinks he played bad needs a smack. Yes it was Thurams heroics that saved the french, but Zizou overall had a good game. And then came the finals, and he decided the game. As usual the more important the games were, the better he was playing.
However that WC isn't the reason Zizou is a GOAT candidate. If you haven't watched him at all, I won't waste my time here. He was an exceptional player from the epic come back against Milan in UEFA Cup '96 (w Bordeaux), until his very last game as a pro.


I didn't say Robben has no skill. I said his guile and physical ability are superior to his skill. I also said he's overrated by many people.

Messi was performing at a level that I would consider top 3. You put him on any team and he would have been the best player on that team except in Spain's case perhaps. Do you think he wouldn't have looked as good as Iniesta and Xavi if he was playing with them? You think he wouldn't have looked as good as anyone on Germany if he was playing with them? Netherlands? Uruguay? He played fine. His pace was great. He put pressure on the defense. He set teammates up.

If you asked any of those team's managers, they would have loved to have Messi on their team playing the way he did in that tournament.

Initially I thought you said Messi was top 3 for Argentina NT. That would have made some sense. Messi has no business being compared to Villa, Sneijder, or Forlan. He was worse than Robben, worse than Ozil, and worse than Kaka. Forget them, Messi wasn't even better than his teammate Tevez. Make it worse, he wasn't even better than the likes of Quagliarela, or Drogba who didn't get past the group stage. You're doing some serious reaching here. Idoubt if you have watched other teams much at all. One post against S. Korea doesn't make you top 3. He faced some of the weakest competition and failed to do anything noteworthy, while getting humiliated when they met their first serious opponent. I see no excuse for him. At least C.Ronaldo was playing against serious opponents. All tournament 7th team was where he belonged.

Also what goal were you referring to when you said he scored one of the luckiest goals ever in the quarters of WC. He didn't score against Brasil (Sneijder scored the goals).

[LJJ]

Sure. First off, I didn't claim '98 WC was Zizou at his best. He didn't play out of this world. However nothing that you wrote/quoted suggests that he was horrible. Yep, he got sent off in the group stage, and you can break some points for it, but at the end it didn't matter much. The game against Paraguay was a closed one, and Zizou didn't do much, though he didn't make any mistakes neither. Overall a meh performance. Against Croatia he was decent. Anyone who thinks he played bad needs a smack. Yes it was Thurams heroics that saved the french, but Zizou overall had a good game. And then came the finals, and he decided the game. As usual the more important the games were, the better he was playing.
However that WC isn't the reason Zizou is a GOAT candidate. If you haven't watched him at all, I won't waste my time here. He was an exceptional player from the epic come back against Milan in UEFA Cup '96 (w Bordeaux), until his very last game as a pro.


That's what the idiot I was arguing with was saying though.

So in the end you agree with me. Zidane played far below his usual standards at the World Cup. If he plays far below his usual standards, saying it was a "horrible" performance for him wouldn't be that far out of line no?

Bottom line is this: You want to argue for Zidane as a great player: DO NOT use his WC 98' performance. Period. It only proves you haven't watched Zidane play much.


That's not to say Zidane is in the GOAT discussion at all though. He's not. He has the resume nor the ability.

[soadrules]

AllenIverson3 is a bumbling idiot.

[AllenIverson3]

That's what the idiot I was arguing with was saying though.

So in the end you agree with me. Zidane played far below his usual standards at the World Cup. If he plays far below his usual standards, saying it was a "horrible" performance for him wouldn't be that far out of line no?

Bottom line is this: You want to argue for Zidane as a great player: DO NOT use his WC 98' performance. Period. It only proves you haven't watched Zidane play much.


That's not to say Zidane is in the GOAT discussion at all though. He's not. He has the resume nor the ability.
Your a dumb ****... I never said it was the only reason u ****ing retard... Stick to American shitty version of rugby

[LJJ]

Your a dumb ****... I never said it was the only reason u ****ing retard... Stick to American shitty version of rugby

It was the first thing you bring up:

http://www.insidehoops.com/forum/showpost.php?p=6956445&postcount=64


:roll: :roll: :roll:

Only someone who has not even watched a single game of WC 98 would say something like that. You are racking up all kind of idiot points here. :roll:

[Grinder]

Your a dumb ****... I never said it was the only reason u ****ing retard... Stick to American shitty version of rugby

Pretty sure LJJ is Dutch, not American.

My top 5, when healthy and in good form:
Messi
Ronaldo
Robben
Iniesta
Xavi

Silva, Ribery, Ibrahimovic, Fabregas, and Van Persie after that.

[Dolphin]

I can't understand how Robben is better or plays a more important role than players such as Silva, Modric, etc. Even deeper lying playmakers such as Busquets.

I'd take Busquets on Man U long before I'd take Fabregas as an attacking midfielder as well, but that's a different argument.

If I had a choice between Robben and Ribery to play on the flanks, I'd take Ribery.

I'd definitely put Ibra ahead of Robben.

Eto'o well ahead of Robben.

These are only midfielders and forwards as well. A few defenders I'd take over Robben as well (Vidic, Pique, Thiago Silva, etc.)

[Nick Young]

I can't understand how Robben is better or plays a more important role than players such as Silva, Modric, etc. Even deeper lying playmakers such as Busquets.

I'd take Busquets on Man U long before I'd take Fabregas as an attacking midfielder as well, but that's a different argument.

If I had a choice between Robben and Ribery to play on the flanks, I'd take Ribery.

I'd definitely put Ibra ahead of Robben.

Eto'o well ahead of Robben.

These are only midfielders and forwards as well. A few defenders I'd take over Robben as well (Vidic, Pique, Thiago Silva, etc.)
LAWL, Busquets? You are still bitter and in denial of reality, sport. :lol

[Dolphin]

LAWL, Busquets? You are still bitter and in denial of reality, sport. :lol


Walcott has no pace. Van Persie can't finish. Nani is a top 5 player in the world. Casillas is a shit goal keeper

No balls at all from this kid. :roll: :roll: :roll:

Sorry, did you say something? :confusedshrug:

[blablabla]

I can't understand how Robben is better or plays a more important role than players such as Silva, Modric, etc. Even deeper lying playmakers such as Busquets.

I'd take Busquets on Man U long before I'd take Fabregas as an attacking midfielder as well, but that's a different argument.

If I had a choice between Robben and Ribery to play on the flanks, I'd take Ribery.

I'd definitely put Ibra ahead of Robben.

Eto'o well ahead of Robben.

These are only midfielders and forwards as well. A few defenders I'd take over Robben as well (Vidic, Pique, Thiago Silva, etc.)
why what argument do eto,silva,modric etc. over robben
robben is more productive 33goals 18 assists in 52 games for bayern
his team overachieves bayerns squads have been horrible in comparison to madrid,barca,inter,milan in 2010 and 2011
Silvas team is playing EL despite having the one of most talented squads Robben shows up all the time unlike all the players you have listed i have seen almost every bayern in the last 3 years and everytime he plays he's one of the best players on the pitch
When healthy he's top 5 in the world and i don't even like the guy.

[Nick Young]

Sorry, did you say something? :confusedshrug:
Lawl are you really dense enough to not realize I was mocking you sport? You really that stupid?:roll: :roll: :roll:

[Dolphin]

Lawl are you really dense enough to not realize I was mocking you sport? You really that stupid?:roll: :roll: :roll:

Again....


Walcott has no pace. Van Persie can't finish. Nani is a top 5 player in the world. Casillas is a shit goal keeper

No balls at all from this kid. :roll: :roll: :roll:

Can't read your posts...this quote keeps blocking my vision.

[alenleomessi]

Pretty sure LJJ is Dutch, not American.

My top 5, when healthy and in good form:
Messi
Ronaldo
Robben
Iniesta
Xavi

Silva, Ribery, Ibrahimovic, Fabregas, and Van Persie after that.
good list, i would have aguero and rooney over cesc and persie though
from the defenders/GKs silva and hart have been tremendous this season

[Flamboyant]

That's what the idiot I was arguing with was saying though.

So in the end you agree with me. Zidane played far below his usual standards at the World Cup. If he plays far below his usual standards, saying it was a "horrible" performance for him wouldn't be that far out of line no?

Bottom line is this: You want to argue for Zidane as a great player: DO NOT use his WC 98' performance. Period. It only proves you haven't watched Zidane play much.


That's not to say Zidane is in the GOAT discussion at all though. He's not. He has the resume nor the ability.

Oh, you don't know jack shit what you're talking about. Zidane's '98 WC is still much better than, say Beckenbauer's '74 that you claimed he didn't deserve to be put in the same elite company. Zidane's '06 is also better than a lot of other greats performances as well. His overall international career is better than a lot of players, in fact only Pele is clearly superior to him. Maradona that most people jizz when his name gets mentioned has joined the reigning WC champs, and he lost 3 of his 5 games in '82. After his one legendary performance, he was also "horrible" in '90. Argentina qualified even though they finished the group stage in 3rd place, and defeated the Brasil squad that had food poisoning. Even though Maradona-less Argentina won Copa America twice in '91 & '93, he again left his team alone in '94.
You see it's easy to trash any player with flowed logic. I could have written an essay trashing his '86 performance as well, by overmentioning the fact "Hand of God" was just a stupid ref mistake, and in actuality Diego should have been eleminated in the quarters. :blah

Zidane was not the type to catch the eye with mind blowing numbers. He was just one of the smartest to ever play the game, and there is a reason he was always on the winning sides. His habit of performing great on important games really seperates him from many greats. He won a WC (+ another finals lost in penalties), a Euro, a CL (+ 2 finals), and 3 domestic titles. All of these are equal or better than Diego. While he joined already succsessful teams, Juve were not the reigning Serie A champs, nor were Real any sort of super team. Them winning CL '00 was a complete fluke, and mainly the merit of Nicholas Anelka single handly defeating Bayern in the semis. They finished 5th that year in La Liga.

Zizou is obviously in the GOAT discussion and I rank him higher than Maradona as well. Also I doubt there is any player with a better resume than him. No one has the perfect club success, national success and POTY awards combination that he has.


I can't understand how Robben is better or plays a more important role than players such as Silva, Modric, etc. Even deeper lying playmakers such as Busquets.

I'd take Busquets on Man U long before I'd take Fabregas as an attacking midfielder as well, but that's a different argument.

If I had a choice between Robben and Ribery to play on the flanks, I'd take Ribery.

I'd definitely put Ibra ahead of Robben.

Eto'o well ahead of Robben.

These are only midfielders and forwards as well. A few defenders I'd take over Robben as well (Vidic, Pique, Thiago Silva, etc.)

Oh, I hope you're trolling. I'd take John Obi Mikel, Gennaro Gattusso, Jeremy Toulalan, Roman Shirokov, and even Eric Djemba Djemba over that backpass making, no charge taking, injury faking, flop machine that's a shame for modern football. I've seen more positive play from Robben in many single games, than I've seen from Busquets in his entire career. It's beyond me how someone mentions him in the same sentence with Robben, or Cesc. WOW. :facepalm x1000000000

[Dolphin]

Mikel? Fighting "trolling" with trolling, eh?:roll:

There are maybe 3-4 defensive midfielders in the world that are smart enough to play the role he is asked to properly, thus allowing players such as Alves to do what they do.

[Flamboyant]

Mikel? Fighting "trolling" with trolling, eh?:roll:

Obviously :pimp:

[AllenIverson3]

It was the first thing you bring up:

http://www.insidehoops.com/forum/showpost.php?p=6956445&postcount=64


:roll: :roll: :roll:

Only someone who has not even watched a single game of WC 98 would say something like that. You are racking up all kind of idiot points here. :roll:
You dumb **** I watched every game with my father... You can't even read correctly because I posted 3 times why Zidane is top 5.

[AllenIverson3]

Oh, you don't know jack shit what you're talking about. Zidane's '98 WC is still much better than, say Beckenbauer's '74 that you claimed he didn't deserve to be put in the same elite company. Zidane's '06 is also better than a lot of other greats performances as well. His overall international career is better than a lot of players, in fact only Pele is clearly superior to him. Maradona that most people jizz when his name gets mentioned has joined the reigning WC champs, and he lost 3 of his 5 games in '82. After his one legendary performance, he was also "horrible" in '90. Argentina qualified even though they finished the group stage in 3rd place, and defeated the Brasil squad that had food poisoning. Even though Maradona-less Argentina won Copa America twice in '91 & '93, he again left his team alone in '94.
You see it's easy to trash any player with flowed logic. I could have written an essay trashing his '86 performance as well, by overmentioning the fact "Hand of God" was just a stupid ref mistake, and in actuality Diego should have been eleminated in the quarters. :blah

Zidane was not the type to catch the eye with mind blowing numbers. He was just one of the smartest to ever play the game, and there is a reason he was always on the winning sides. His habit of performing great on important games really seperates him from many greats. He won a WC (+ another finals lost in penalties), a Euro, a CL (+ 2 finals), and 3 domestic titles. All of these are equal or better than Diego. While he joined already succsessful teams, Juve were not the reigning Serie A champs, nor were Real any sort of super team. Them winning CL '00 was a complete fluke, and mainly the merit of Nicholas Anelka single handly defeating Bayern in the semis. They finished 5th that year in La Liga.

Zizou is obviously in the GOAT discussion and I rank him higher than Maradona as well. Also I doubt there is any player with a better resume than him. No one has the perfect club success, national success and POTY awards combination that he has.


:bowdown: :bowdown: thank you for proving my point even more....