LeBron will go down as a better player than Kobe.

[stallionaire]

It's the truth. It's why Lakers fans are so adament in bashing him.

[pauk]

Yep!

[Dictator]

:lol

[Heavincent]

If that makes you sleep better at night.

[b1imtf]

Better player, ok. But not a better carreer

[SpecialQue]

I agree about Lebron going down, but I don't know about the rest of that sentence.

[LakersReign]

Typical butthurt Lebronyte b***h move. They get owned in one thread. So, they run away cryin' like little girls to make another thread, desperately looking for support:lol

Hilarious:roll:

[stallionaire]

No other athlete is more talked about in basketball than LeBron. He has been our generations Magic, a team player in an era of ball hogs and chuckers. Guys like me who grew up watching team basketball know that what LeBron has is special. His toolset on offense and defense is thr best we've seen, ever. Kids today forget that its a team sport, so expect fg% comparisons and other bullshit.

Magic was my fav player growing up. Really wish we had more ballers like LeBron around, as in guys who do everything and act as the brain for the team. It's basketball at its soul. I love LeBron James and I'm going to savor seeing him in his prime.

20 years from now these threads will be pulled up and they will laugh just like we do when we read archived material bashing Jordan.

[christian1923]

:no: :no: :no: :no: :no: :no: :no: :no: :no: :no:

maybe if he wins 4-5 finals

[Vienceslav]

Entirely possible , but not easy.

[SpecialQue]

No other athlete is more talked about in basketball than LeBron. He has been our generations Magic, a team player in an era of ball hogs and chuckers. Guys like me who grew up watching team basketball know that what LeBron has is special. His toolset on offense and defense is thr best we've seen, ever. Kids today forget that its a team sport, so expect fg% comparisons and other bullshit.

Magic was my fav player growing up. Really wish we had more ballers like LeBron around, as in guys who do everything and act as the brain for the team. It's basketball at its soul. I love LeBron James and I'm going to savor seeing him in his prime.

20 years from now these threads will be pulled up and they will laugh just like we do when we read archived material bashing Jordan.

http://lh6.ggpht.com/_YODg65nll_o/SkIrfVUqMtI/AAAAAAABzkY/Xf7f_skW1R8/news_lebron-james-check-my-stats-1.jpg

[SpecialQue]

Also, shouldn't there be a forum rule against randomly creating bullshit threads to get hits? OP is like one of those YouTube girls who makes an ass-shaking video just to get people to look at them.

[Vienceslav]

http://lh6.ggpht.com/_YODg65nll_o/SkIrfVUqMtI/AAAAAAABzkY/Xf7f_skW1R8/news_lebron-james-check-my-stats-1.jpg
http://www.totalprosports.com/wp-content/uploads/2010/12/Kevin-Durant-Knows-Where-Amazing-Happens.jpg
KD>Lebron in Funny T-Shirt department.:roll:

[Dictator]

Also, shouldn't there be a forum rule against randomly creating bullshit threads to get hits? OP is like one of those YouTube girls who makes an ass-shaking video just to get people to look at them.

:roll:

[stallionaire]

Post all the gag pics where LeBron is having fun. But every great basketball mind is afraid to say it:LeBron is head and shoulders above what Kobe was capable of in his prime.

[Ronaldinho]

Better player, ok. But not a better carreer
:roll: :roll: :roll:

[christian1923]

Post all the gag pics where LeBron is having fun. But every great basketball mind is afraid to say it:LeBron is head and shoulders above what Kobe was capable of in his prime.

81 POINTS

[pauk]

No other athlete is more talked about in basketball than LeBron. He has been our generations Magic, a team player in an era of ball hogs and chuckers. Guys like me who grew up watching team basketball know that what LeBron has is special. His toolset on offense and defense is thr best we've seen, ever. Kids today forget that its a team sport, so expect fg% comparisons and other bullshit.

Magic was my fav player growing up. Really wish we had more ballers like LeBron around, as in guys who do everything and act as the brain for the team. It's basketball at its soul. I love LeBron James and I'm going to savor seeing him in his prime.

20 years from now these threads will be pulled up and they will laugh just like we do when we read archived material bashing Jordan.

Well said my man...

[Phong]

No other athlete is more talked about in basketball than LeBron. He has been our generations Magic, a team player in an era of ball hogs and chuckers. Guys like me who grew up watching team basketball know that what LeBron has is special. His toolset on offense and defense is thr best we've seen, ever. Kids today forget that its a team sport, so expect fg% comparisons and other bullshit.

Magic was my fav player growing up. Really wish we had more ballers like LeBron around, as in guys who do everything and act as the brain for the team. It's basketball at its soul. I love LeBron James and I'm going to savor seeing him in his prime.

20 years from now these threads will be pulled up and they will laugh just like we do when we read archived material bashing Jordan.Damn... again with this Magic shit?

Nobody, not you, not even LeBron, was talking about Magic or Oscar until LeBron failed to compare to Jordan... :facepalm

[LakersReign]

No other athlete is more talked about in basketball than LeBron. He has been our generations Magic, a team player in an era of ball hogs and chuckers. Guys like me who grew up watching team basketball know that what LeBron has is special. His toolset on offense and defense is thr best we've seen, ever. Kids today forget that its a team sport, so expect fg% comparisons and other bullshit.

Magic was my fav player growing up. Really wish we had more ballers like LeBron around, as in guys who do everything and act as the brain for the team. It's basketball at its soul. I love LeBron James and I'm going to savor seeing him in his prime.

20 years from now these threads will be pulled up and they will laugh just like we do when we read archived material bashing Jordan.

This generations Magic my a**. Just gotta love it how Lebronytes make comparisons that have nothing to do with anything, just to have something to say. Magic and Lebron have nothing in common, so just stop. At least Magic accepted the role of the passer on the team until Kareem got hurt, and it was his time to take over. Lebron and his fans refuse for him to accept that role, simply cuz they won't be able to compare him to Jordan if he does, so stop embarrassing yourself.:rolleyes:

[White Mamba]

If he will it will be sad day.

[stallionaire]

81 POINTS
I can name a few epic triple doubles that trump 81 pts.

[SpecialQue]

Post all the gag pics where LeBron is having fun. But every great basketball mind is afraid to say it:LeBron is head and shoulders above what Kobe was capable of in his prime.

It's incredibly disingenuous of you to imply that Lebron isn't also making a concerted effort to boost his stats in every game he plays.

[nathanjizzle]

how many cocks you ride

[stallionaire]

Damn... again with this Magic shit?

Nobody, not you, not even LeBron, was talking about Magic or Oscar until LeBron failed to compare to Jordan... :facepalm
LeBron will rival Jordan as the GOAT when its all said and done.

[b1imtf]

:roll: :roll: :roll:
What? He has the potential to...

[nathanjizzle]

I can name a few epic triple doubles that trump 81 pts.

i can name a few championship games that trump triple doubles

[stallionaire]

It's incredibly disingenuous of you to imply that Lebron isn't also making a concerted effort to boost his stats in every game he plays.
So? It's called winning any way you want. Just get the W...

[LakersReign]

LeBron will rival Jordan as the GOAT when its all said and done.
Lebron CAN'T be a GOAT .....on SOMEONE ELSE'S TEAM!!!!:roll: :roll: :roll: :roll: :roll: :roll: :roll: :roll: :roll: :roll:

[stallionaire]

i can name a few championship games that trump triple doubles
Age difference. Jordan got his first ring at....27.

[nathanjizzle]

LeBron will rival Jordan as the GOAT when its all said and done.

how so, jordan had the cohonas to do the slam dunk contest...lebron cant even beat jordan in that department....all said and done.

[nathanjizzle]

Age difference. Jordan got his first ring at....27.

im talkin about the black mamba. jordan vs lebron isnt even a discussion.

[stallionaire]

how so, jordan had the cohonas to do the slam dunk contest...lebron cant even beat jordan in that department....all said and done.
The dunk contest when LeBron entered was a rigged joke. It only recently became fan vote. I admire LeBron for avoiding the dumb contest.

[Indian guy]

LeBron's so much more statistically dominant that if he even wins 1, there will be a lot of people who'll consider him better than Kobe ever was.

This is what petrifies Kobe fans. They KNOW it's not a matter of whether LeBron can match Kobe in rings. The statistical divide is simply too great. Not to mention other individual accomplishments. He gets compared to MJ statistically every year, something nobody's ever bothered to do with MJ/Kobe.

Kobe fans better pray LeBron never wins a ring. And they do pray.

[stallionaire]

im talkin about the black mamba. jordan vs lebron isnt even a discussion.
The great Pippen thinks otherwise.

[stallionaire]

LeBron's so much more statistically dominant that if he even wins 1, there will be a lot of people who'll consider him better than Kobe ever was.

This is what petrifies Kobe fans. They KNOW it's not a matter of whether LeBron can match Kobe in rings. The statistical divide is simply too great. Not to mention other individual accomplishments. He gets compared to MJ statistically every year, something nobody's ever bothered to do with MJ/Kobe.

Kobe fans better pray LeBron never wins a ring.
Well said. LeBron, imo, will win 6.

[Nash]

As player, talent and an unstoppable force, Lebron is one of the best in the history of the game. When watching Lebron play, you can see how extremely dominant he is.

But if Lebron don't win anything, people will still point that out. I won't count in the years with Cleveland because to be honest, after what he did with those scrubs, when its all said and done, he will get praise for what he did with Cleveland. But if he don't get a few rings with Miami, it will haunt him forever. And I'm a huge Lebron fan.

[pauk]

LeBron's so much more statistically dominant that if he even wins 1, there will be a lot of people who'll consider him better than Kobe ever was.

This is what petrifies Kobe fans. They KNOW it's not a matter of whether LeBron can match Kobe in rings. The statistical divide is simply too great. Not to mention other individual accomplishments. He gets compared to MJ statistically every year, something nobody's ever bothered to do with MJ/Kobe.

Kobe fans better pray LeBron never wins a ring. And they do pray.

Damn... i thought you hated Lebron :eek:

[pauk]

im talkin about the black mamba. jordan vs lebron isnt even a discussion.

as a sidekick yes.... Kobe wasnt the best player in his team / didnt lead a team as the best player in his team to a Championship until he was 30 years old...........

[SpecialQue]

as a sidekick yes.... Kobe wasnt the best player in his team / didnt lead a team as the best player in his team to a Championship until he was 30 years old...........

Lebron fans using the "sidekick" argument are hilarious.

[pauk]

Lebron fans using the "sidekick" argument are hilarious.

When people say Kobe was a sidekick they dont mean 1A & 1B like Kareem & Magic in 1980 or even like Lebron & Wade...... but they mean like in Jordan & Pippen or Duncan & Ginobili, you could even argue Pippen was better compared to the 2000 Kobe........ Shaq was with a ridicilously big gap better.... Kobe was nowhere even close to as good as he is today during those 3 championship runs....

The 2 last championship runs of Kobe are far more valuable compared to his 3 first championships, much greater context......

[G-Funk]

Nobody is scared of a choke artist. Lebron will be remembered as starting and being part of the worst era in the NBA...where top players team up to win championships.

[ballinhun8]

OP is becoming, if she's not already there, a very annoying and stupid poster.

[pauk]

OP is becoming, if she's not already there, a very annoying and stupid poster.

He makes valid points, doesnt hate Lebron (a rare thing here in ISH), is mature and doesnt insult people (unlike you)... he is a better poster than you will ever be...

Why do you think he is a stupid poster anyways? Care to explain? Just because he shares opinions which dont reflect to yours?

[stallionaire]

This is why no one wants to hang out with him at T-Wolves games.

HAha the rest of the Wolves fans here barely go to games lol.

Did I mention... GO WOLVES.

[Celtics4ever]

LMAO. This thread cracks me up. LeBron will be in the Top 60, and that's if he wins a championship, which is very unlikely. Kobe is easily top 15.

[stallionaire]

I'm a Minnesota Timberwolves fanboy who understands that LeBron is the most dominate player we're witnessing since Jordan.

I don't care for the Heat. I want the Wolves to win a ring.

I just am not dumb enough to say things like "LeBron is very unclutch." (stats say otherwise.) "LeBron has no heart." (meaningless rhetoric.) "LeBron james is a d.ick." (Jordan will go down as the biggest assh.ole in sports history.)

[stallionaire]

LMAO. This thread cracks me up. LeBron will be in the Top 60, and that's if he wins a championship, which is very unlikely. Kobe is easily top 15.

TOP 60?

:roll: :roll: :roll: :roll: :roll:

a LeBon hater has appeared?

[Celtics4ever]

I'm a Minnesota Timberwolves fanboy who understands that LeBron is the most dominate player we're witnessing since Jordan.

I don't care for the Heat. I want the Wolves to win a ring.

I just am not dumb enough to say things like "LeBron is very unclutch." (stats say otherwise.) "LeBron has no heart." (meaningless rhetoric.) "LeBron james is a d.ick." (Jordan will go down as the biggest assh.ole in sports history.)

LOL dude LeBron plays 3 quarters and is a choke artist. He isn't going to be top 50. Now Shutup. All he can do is pad his stats.

[SpecialQue]

He makes valid points, doesnt hate Lebron (a rare thing here in ISH), is mature and doesnt insult people (unlike you)... he is a better poster than you will ever be...

Why do you think he is a stupid poster anyways? Care to explain? Just because he shares opinions which dont reflect to yours?

Give up that martyr shit. The number of Lebron/Kobe stans on this site is roughly equal, probably eclipsed by Jordan stans.

And most people agree that Lebron is a fantastic player, but object to retarded threads like this one, where the sole purpose is to argue the same points that have been made for the past few years. NOTHING new has been added in this thread. It's like Christians debating Atheists...pointless, with neither side changing their opinion.

[ballinhun8]

He makes valid points, doesnt hate Lebron (a rare thing here in ISH), is mature and doesnt insult people (unlike you)... he is a better poster than you will ever be...

Why do you think he is a stupid poster anyways? Care to explain? Just because he shares opinions which dont reflect to yours?



Please, you just started posting here and the only thing you post is about one player, you're not knowledgeable, you're bias and you create threads to get people riled up. I been posting here since before we moved to these boards. I actually know what I'm talking about. I don't have an agenda like you have ever since you came along your LeBron cruise. This is is why no one takes you seriously and its because you only defend AMD go against everything LeBron related. You bring absolutely nothing else to this board besides your foul stenched curry odor.


And she's a dumb poster because she only makes stupid threads to ignite arguments rather then debates. And who ever said they don't reflect my opinions? I just find it annoying he comes up with the same thread everyday.

[stallionaire]

LOL dude LeBron plays 3 quarters and is a choke artist. He isn't going to be top 50. Now Shutup. All he can do is pad his stats.

I'd be upset if LeBron James single-handedly mutilated the Boston Celtics last season.

Remember game 5 when LeBron absolutely closed and was clutch as hell?

Here's a refresher.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uTHOz7CXrk4

CLUTCH.

[Bladers]

TOP 60?

:roll: :roll: :roll: :roll: :roll:

a LeBon homer has appeared?

Exactly... he's top 100.

[SpecialQue]

HAha the rest of the Wolves fans here barely go to games lol.

Did I mention... GO WOLVES.

I'm really pulling for the Wolves this season. I deleted that post because when I looked at it again, it seemed unnecessarily dickish.

[Celtics4ever]

TOP 60?

:roll: :roll: :roll: :roll: :roll:

a LeBon hater has appeared?

We dont like to put losers and weak minded choke artists in the top players ever discussion.

[SpecialQue]

LMAO. This thread cracks me up. LeBron will be in the Top 60, and that's if he wins a championship, which is very unlikely. Kobe is easily top 15.

But where do you think Chris Paul will rank?

[Celtics4ever]

I'd be upset if LeBron James single-handedly mutilated the Boston Celtics last season.

Remember game 5 when LeBron absolutely closed and was clutch as hell?

Here's a refresher.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uTHOz7CXrk4

CLUTCH.

All I remember was Wade taking over. Lebron had one decent game.

[stallionaire]

Please, you just started posting here and the only thing you post is about one player, you're not knowledgeable, you're bias and you create threads to get people riled up. I been posting here since before we moved to these boards. I actually know what I'm talking about. I don't have an agenda like you have ever since you came along your LeBron cruise. This is is why no one takes you seriously and its because you only defend AMD go against everything LeBron related. You bring absolutely nothing else to this board besides your foul stenched curry odor.


And she's a dumb poster because she only makes stupid threads to ignite arguments rather then debates. And who ever said they don't reflect my opinions? I just find it annoying he comes up with the same thread everyday.

I'm a guy first of all.

Also, respect for not being a Cubs fan.

[SpecialQue]

I'm a Minnesota Timberwolves fanboy who understands that LeBron is the most dominate player we're witnessing since Jordan.

I don't care for the Heat. I want the Wolves to win a ring.

I just am not dumb enough to say things like "LeBron is very unclutch." (stats say otherwise.) "LeBron has no heart." (meaningless rhetoric.) "LeBron james is a d.ick." (Jordan will go down as the biggest assh.ole in sports history.)

Hey, we agree on something!

[stallionaire]

All I remember was Wade taking over. Lebron has one decent game.

LOL look at this toddler. He's closing his eyes and saying "tHAT NEVER HAPPENED, nope!!!!!"

Watch the video.

Witness Greatness.

[Celtics4ever]

LOL look at this toddler. He's closing his eyes and saying "tHAT NEVER HAPPENED, nope!!!!!"

Watch the video.

Witness Greatness.

I witnessed choking greatness when I saw him chocking under pressure numerous times(at least 30-40 times in the past 3 years).

[andgar923]

It's the truth. It's why Lakers fans are so adament in bashing him.

Without a question.

[stallionaire]

I witnessed choking greatness when I saw him chocking under pressure numerous times(at least 30-40 times in the past 3 years).

Enjoy your haterade.

I wish people enjoyed the game of basketball rather than hating on players. You're really going to regret in 20 years when people talk about how great LeBron was.. you spent his entire prime online talking shit without watching this man ball his heart out.

[Celtics4ever]

Enjoy your haterade.

I wish people enjoyed the game of basketball rather than hating on players. You're really going to regret in 20 years when people talk about how great LeBron was.. you spent his entire prime online talking shit without watching this man ball his heart out.

You're an idiot. You are one dumb girl. I mean I would have respect for girls on ISH for being involved in BBall. But girl, you're stupid as fuclk. Only thing LeBron will be remembered for is being a choker and a loser.

[Pursuer]

Enjoy your haterade.

I wish people enjoyed the game of basketball rather than hating on players. You're really going to regret in 20 years when people talk about how great LeBron was.. you spent his entire prime online talking shit without watching this man ball his heart out.

And you're dedicating to celebrate LeBron for the next 20 years and telling everybody how they ****ed up, because they went to ISH to write their opinion?

[stallionaire]

Nobody has come up with a decent response to this thread.

Everyone has seen the stats... we all know LeBron ON PAPER is a more supreme athlete than Kobe.

The difference is rings which will come.

[Extempo]

I think he'll be remembered as a player with great stats, like Oscar, that's about it. It would be different if he won in Cleveland. But he teamed up with 2 other franchise players to chase a ring. MJ never did that, neither did Kobe...so expecting Lebron to be remembered as better is wishful thinking that even these trolls know deep down in their hearts. He has earned the label of being a choker...there is too much talk about his lack of a killer instinct, him being scared of the last shot, etc...the internet will never let anyone forget that. He was also the biggest reason Miami came up short in the finals last year. It would be different if he played well but his teammates failed him...however, he was the one who hurt his team by completely disappearing in the finals and getting owned by Jason Terry. All this while he was healthy and the so-called best player in the league. Miami failed to beat an aging Dallas team with a 38 year old starting PG...it was 3 superstars vs 1 and they still came up short. Story of Lebron's career...always coming up short. He's in his 9th season, he is who he is. Nothing is changing. The fact that he disappeared on the biggest stage, even when his team was stacked, tells me that even if he was in Kobe's place with the Lakers, we would never win as many championships in the past decade. You need to do whatever it takes to win, you need to will your team to win, not worry about stats and then disappear when it really matters. Maybe his fans can relate to him because they come up short in everything they do in their daily lives, who knows, maybe they just have a loser mentality. I love a guy who is obsessed with winning and who actually wins. Winning = success. No team has won more rings or had as many finals appearances as the Lakers in the past decade. If both Kobe and Lebron were coming into the league at 17 now, knowing what we know now, I would pick Kobe 10 out of 10 times.

[SpecialQue]

Nobody has come up with a decent response to this thread.

Everyone has seen the stats... we all know LeBron ON PAPER is a more supreme athlete than Kobe.

The difference is rings which will come.

Basketball isn't played on paper.

[trabash]

He is the best and most complete basketball player to date, no doubt, but careerwise he has to prove something to be called greatest of all time, cause that is not all about skill and being the best player.

[stallionaire]

I think he'll be remembered as a player with great stats, like Oscar, that's about it. It would be different if he won in Cleveland. But he teamed up with 2 other franchise players to chase a ring. MJ never did that, neither did Kobe..

:roll: :roll: :roll: :roll:

LeBron's supporting cast in Cleavland compared to:

Pippen
Rodman
Shaq
Gasol
Bynum

He was forced to leave. The Cavs organization in that stretch is known as the worst GMing in the history of the NBA.

[andgar923]

Enjoy your haterade.

I wish people enjoyed the game of basketball rather than hating on players. You're really going to regret in 20 years when people talk about how great LeBron was.. you spent his entire prime online talking shit without watching this man ball his heart out.

Perhaps the only thing Kobe will be remembered being better than Bron would be his scoring. Aside from Kobe's superior scoring arsenal, Kobe's scoring mentality is easily superior than Bron's.

BUT

Bron will go down as the better PLAYER than Kobe, and imo he's already been that for a while now.

People seem to confuse 'scoring' with being a great 'player'. Not that Kobe isn't a great player, he's just not better than Bron and other players.

The scary part is, if Bron had Kobe's scoring mentality, he could easily average 35 pts per game while shooting a relatively high fg% with about half the offensive arsenal that Kobe possesses.

[Celtics4ever]

Nobody has come up with a decent response to this thread.

Everyone has seen the stats... we all know LeBron ON PAPER is a more supreme athlete than Kobe.

The difference is rings which will come.

You're one stupid girl. Stat padding

[SpecialQue]

:roll: :roll: :roll: :roll:

LeBron's supporting cast in Cleavland compared to:

Pippen
Rodman
Shaq
Gasol
Bynum

He was forced to leave. The Cavs organization in that stretch is known as the worst GMing in the history of the NBA.

Elgin says hello.

[Nash]

I think he'll be remembered as a player with great stats, like Oscar, that's about it. It would be different if he won in Cleveland. But he teamed up with 2 other franchise players to chase a ring. MJ never did that, neither did Kobe...so expecting Lebron to be remembered as better is wishful thinking that even these trolls know deep down in their hearts. He has earned the label of being a choker...there is too much talk about his lack of a killer instinct, him being scared of the last shot, etc...the internet will never let anyone forget that. He was also the biggest reason Miami came up short in the finals last year. It would be different if he played well but his teammates failed him...however, he was the one who hurt his team by completely disappearing in the finals and getting owned by Jason Terry. All this while he was healthy and the so-called best player in the league. Miami failed to beat an aging Dallas team with a 38 year old starting PG...it was 3 superstars vs 1 and they still came up short. Story of Lebron's career...always coming up short. He's in his 9th season, he is who he is. Nothing is changing. The fact that he disappeared on the biggest stage, even when his team was stacked, tells me that even if he was in Kobe's place with the Lakers, we would never win as many championships in the past decade. You need to do whatever it takes to win, you need to will your team to win, not worry about stats and then disappear when it really matters. Maybe his fans can relate to him because they come up short in everything they do in their daily lives, who knows, maybe they just have a loser mentality. I love a guy who is obsessed with winning and who actually wins. Winning = success. No team has won more rings or had as many finals appearances as the Lakers in the past decade. If both Kobe and Lebron were coming into the league at 17 now, knowing what we know now, I would pick Kobe 10 out of 10 times.If he would have won with Cleveland it'd be one of the biggest accomplishments in nba. You can't fault him for not winning with those guys.

[stallionaire]

You're one stupid girl. Stat padding

All the greats loved to be on the floor.

[TonyJones]

Kobe Bryant = Tom Brady
Lebron James = Peyton Manning

They are both equally talented players but one will go down as having the better career.

[Celtics4ever]

:roll: :roll: :roll: :roll:

LeBron's supporting cast in Cleavland compared to:

Pippen
Rodman
Shaq
Gasol
Bynum

He was forced to leave. The Cavs organization in that stretch is known as the worst GMing in the history of the NBA.

LeBron left because he couldnt motivate his team. They guy is a immature fool, have you seen him dance around and fool around with his teammates on the Cavs? Did you ever see Jordan or Kobe do that? There is a reason why teammates were scared of Kobe and Jordan, they were scared to fuclk up because kobe and jodan were great leaders and they will call them out.
LeBron's teammates on the cavs thought he was a clown, they didnt listen to him for shlt. Thats why one of his teammates ****jed his mom.

You see how focused the Heat are this year? That's because of Wade and Riley, they made this team focus and not fool around like clowns. They have kept LeBron in check. If wade or Riley werent with the Heat, the heat would be another clown team doing stupid shlt.

[stallionaire]

LeBron couldn't lead the Cavs because it was a team of nobodies.

Where are all the former Cavs right now that played with LeBron? Other than Mo (6th man now...) who is relevant? Has a team ever reached the finals with as many scrubs as the Cavs? The answer is NO.

[Celtics4ever]

If he would have won with Cleveland it'd be one of the biggest accomplishments in nba. You can't fault him for not winning with those guys.

Yes, you can. Lebron lacks leadership skills. His teammates thought of him as a fool. Put Kobe or Jordan on that team and they would win championships because they would force everyone on that team to bust their a$$ everynight. Lets not forget the Cavs were the best defensive team all those years. They werent a bunch of scrubs.

[blablabla]

Lebron will probably end up with Big 0,Moses,Dr.J,West,Barkley in that top 10-15 range. I don't see him winning 3+ rings, the Heat couldn't even win against the Mavs even if they win this year next year the thunder/bulls are even better and the team Howard goes to will also be dangurous

[blablabla]

LeBron couldn't lead the Cavs because it was a team of nobodies.

Where are all the former Cavs right now that played with LeBron? Other than Mo (6th man now...) who is relevant? Has a team ever reached the finals with as many scrubs as the Cavs? The answer is NO.
The 10'Cavs won more games than the 11'Heat

[lilgodfather1]

LeBron will easily make the top 10 and push Kobe out of it. Kobe will be #11, LeBron will be number 5.

[Celtics4ever]

LeBron will easily make the top 100 . Kobe will be #11, LeBron will be number 50 at best.

Fixed for you to make you sound less stupid

[Extempo]

:roll: :roll: :roll: :roll:

LeBron's supporting cast in Cleavland compared to:

Pippen
Rodman
Shaq
Gasol
Bynum

He was forced to leave. The Cavs organization in that stretch is known as the worst GMing in the history of the NBA.Not that I'm taking you seriously because you sound like a delusional fanboy with no sense of objectivity...but...what about his supporting cast in Miami last year? That team was the definition of stacked. Gasol's a great sidekick but he has never been a top 3 player in the league like Wade. It didn't change anything though, Lebron still came up short when it really mattered. I honestly wouldn't trust him to lead my Lakers to a championship. It doesn't matter whether his team is mediocre or stacked...he consistently comes up short. No thanks, I enjoy watching winners.

[SpecialQue]

Lebron will probably end up with Big 0,Moses,Dr.J,West,Barkley in that top 10-15 range. I don't see him winning 3+ rings, the Heat couldn't even win against the Mavs even if they win this year next year the thunder/bulls are even better and the team Howard goes to will also be dangurous

:facepalm

Last year's Mavs were a great team.

[Nash]

Yes, you can. Lebron lacks leadership skills. His teammates thought of him as a fool. Put Kobe or Jordan on that team and they would win championships because they would force everyone on that team to bust their a$$ everynight. Lets not forget the Cavs were the best defensive team all those years. They werent a bunch of scrubs.
They were not good, stop overrating them. Tell me who has won something with Mo feckin' Williams as their 2nd option.

You think Kobe would have won with:

Mo Williams
Kobe
Parker
Jamison
Old Shaq

You have to be joking..

[Simple Jack]

Yes, you can. Lebron lacks leadership skills. His teammates thought of him as a fool. Put Kobe or Jordan on that team and they would win championships because they would force everyone on that team to bust their a$$ everynight. Lets not forget the Cavs were the best defensive team all those years. They werent a bunch of scrubs.

Then why did Kobe get swept with a better supporting cast?

It's people like you, who act like he isn't even top 60 unless he wins a ring who bring about the LeBron trolls. The dude is already a top 25 player and can only move up. I'd love to hear an actual explanation of him being top 60 with a list of 59 players better than him, resumes and individual dominance included.

Hard to say where he'll end up but he's already ~top 25.

[blablabla]

:facepalm

Last year's Mavs were a great team.
they are one of the weaker finals teams all time

[Doctor Rivers]

Kobe Bryant = Tom Brady
Lebron James = Peyton Manning

They are both equally talented players but one will go down as having the better career.

LeBron = Brady + Manning

[Dave3]

Damn... again with this Magic shit?

Nobody, not you, not even LeBron, was talking about Magic or Oscar until LeBron failed to compare to Jordan... :facepalm
I hope you're kidding. LeBron was compared to Magic long before he even entered the NBA. Hell, most people were talking about how his game contrasts Jordan's due to LeBron's more all around play versus scoring. If anything, he's developed into more of a score first type player throughout his career.

This is a scouting report from 2003: http://www.nbadraft.net/players/lebron-james

The NBA comparison is Magic, and this wasn't the only source making that comparison. This was just the first one I found. No one actually compared his play style to Jordan coming into the NBA. All of it was either Magic or Oscar, which is why he spent the majority of his rookie year at point guard.

[Extempo]

Lebron fans love making excuses for why he doesn't win so I'll make an excuse for Kobe. Last year is a terrible example. Kobe was not healthy, period. No other player would play with his injuries....he was playing at 10% in the playoffs...we only found out later in the year just how bad his ankle and knee was. Gasol was definitely out of it, I've never seen Phil more frustrated with a player. Lamar had a great year until checking out in the playoffs, more concerned with his reality show. But more importantly, Kobe wasn't himself because he was not healthy. Lebron was healthy...and he had two healthy Top 15 teammates...he still lost to the same Dallas team though. Haha.

[RRR3]

Fixed for you to make you sound less stupid
Name 49 better. Now.

[StateOfMind12]

I agree about Lebron going down, but I don't know about the rest of that sentence.
:applause:


Damn... again with this Magic shit?

Nobody, not you, not even LeBron, was talking about Magic or Oscar until LeBron failed to compare to Jordan... :facepalm
A lot of people were comparing LeBron to Magic but those people are also dumb and know nothing about basketball, so it doesn't really matter.

If LeBron resembles any all-time great it is Oscar, not Magic and certainly as hell not Jordan.

[RRR3]

One of the more hilarious things on ISH is when people think by comparing LeBron to Wilt Chamberlain and/or Oscar Robertson they are insulting him, when they are inadvertantly duing the exact opposite :lol

[Dave3]

Name 49 better. Now.
Useless request. He'll name 49 players, out of which maybe 30 will have almost no argument, and 5 or so will be debatable. You're not going to change his opinion because he clearly isn't here to learn anything. Pick your battles. This one is the equivalent of arguing with Jacks3 about Duncan vs. Kobe or RG on Tmac. Not worth it.

[Nash]

Lebron fans love making excuses for why he doesn't win so I'll make an excuse for Kobe. Last year is a terrible example. Kobe was not healthy, period. No other player would play with his injuries....he was playing at 10% in the playoffs...we only found out later in the year just how bad his ankle and knee was. Gasol was definitely out of it, I've never seen Phil more frustrated with a player. Lamar had a great year until checking out in the playoffs, more concerned with his reality show. But more importantly, Kobe wasn't himself because he was not healthy. Lebron was healthy...and he had two healthy Top 15 teammates...he still lost to the same Dallas team though. Haha.
What are these excuses? Nobody is excuse Lebron for playing below his level in the finals. There is no excuse for that. The Cleveland years are another story though.

[stallionaire]

One of the more hilarious things on ISH is when people think by comparing LeBron to Wilt Chamberlain and/or Oscar Robertson they are insulting him, when they are inadvertantly duing the exact opposite :lol
:applause: truth.

[d21221hk]

they are one of the weaker finals teams all time
Who did they sweep again last year? At least try to make a conscious effort to act intelligent when posting please.

[stallionaire]

Who did they sweep again last year? At least try to make a conscious effort to act intelligent when posting please.
:roll: :roll: :roll: :roll:

[RRR3]

Yo Celtics4ever,
Still waiting for 49 players better than LBj all time. Hell, can you even give me 30? :lol

[d21221hk]

To stop on topic...not unless he gets at least 2-3 rings.

[Rojogaqu11]

Is the Big O better than MJ?

[hawke812]

Nobody has come up with a decent response to this thread.

Everyone has seen the stats... we all know LeBron ON PAPER is a more supreme athlete than Kobe.

The difference is rings which will come.

You expect people to argue numbers on a piece of paper? Basketball is played on the court. You are just full of shit troll:facepalm

[Figlo]

I agree, LeBron right now is better than Kobe has ever been.

[stallionaire]

You expect people to argue numbers on a piece of paper? Basketball is played on the court. You are just full of shit troll:facepalm

Don't misinterpret what I'm saying. I'm aware that the game isn't played on paper but with that logic we might as well stop recording stats and fire all the guys who do box score writing. :facepalm

there is A LOT that doesn't translate to paper, but most of it does.

If stats were not involved and people did not crunch every number, VISUALLy, you could say LeBron James is the best baller to ever play in the league.

[Doctor Rivers]

VISUALLy, you could say LeBron James is the best baller to ever play in the league.

lol visually

[Heavincent]

Kobe Bryant = Tom Brady
Lebron James = Peyton Manning

They are both equally talented players but one will go down as having the better career.

No :oldlol:

Peyton Manning is a GOAT candidate at the QB position, and at least he has won something.

[blablabla]

Who did they sweep again last year? At least try to make a conscious effort to act intelligent when posting please.
lakers they sweeped the lakers

[Dave3]

lakers they sweeped the lakers
His point is that a team that sweeps the defending champs can't be all that bad. They were playing well, regardless of who they had on paper.

[Simple Jack]

No :oldlol:

Peyton Manning is a GOAT candidate at the QB position, and hat least he has won something.

It's a great comparison. Tom Brady is held in high praise because of his rings. Anytime there is a Brady v Peyton argument, the rings come into the discussion by the Brady fans to put him ahead of Peyton. Peyton on the other hand, has the consistent production, the records (career ones at least), but has fallen short in the playoffs and is often criticized for his play in crucial games. I don't think there is a better cross-sport comparison.

[blablabla]

His point is that a team that sweeps the defending champs can't be all that bad. They were playing well, regardless of who they had on paper.
i know what his point is but the lakers weren't that good last year they already had problems against the hornets
the 11'mavs aren't even a top 5 championship team in the last 10 years

[Heavincent]

It's a great comparison. Tom Brady is held in high praise because of his rings. Anytime there is a Brady v Peyton argument, the rings come into the discussion by the Brady fans to put him ahead of Peyton. Peyton on the other hand, has the consistent production, the records (career ones at least), but has fallen short in the playoffs and is often criticized for his play in crucial games. I don't think there is a better cross-sport comparison.

Peyton Manning has a ring. 1 ring makes a big difference. He won't be looked at as a career loser because of that 1 ring.

Not to mention the validity of Tom Brady's rings have been questioned by some people (because of spygate).

And yes, Kobe = Eli and Lebron = Romo is probably a more appropriate comparison, like the guy above me said.

[StateOfMind12]

LeBron James was never the best player in the league and someone is trying to say that he is better than Kobe? :oldlol: Please.

It's the same thing every season.

LeBron James looks dominant in the regular season, everybody starts calling him the best player in the league, sometimes even unanimous or undisputed best, but once the post-season rolls around people start to change their opinion on who the best player is and the best player is no longer LeBron.

[d21221hk]

i know what his point is but the lakers weren't that good last year they already had problems against the hornets
the 11'mavs aren't even a top 5 championship team in the last 10 years
Yes sure anything you say but, but sweep?

[Lakers_Kobe_Fan]

It's the truth. It's why Lakers fans are so adament in bashing him.

Like Kobe said...its not even a comparison and a rivalry....come back when lebrons takes the last shot...forget about winning a championship

[lilgodfather1]

Fixed for you to make you sound less stupid
I bet you can't name 20 players ranked above LeBron all time. Simply because he is easily already top 20. Two rings and he is #8 easily.

[Lakers_Kobe_Fan]

LeBron James was never the best player in the league and someone is trying to say that he is better than Kobe? :oldlol: Please.

It's the same thing every season.

LeBron James looks dominant in the regular season, everybody starts calling him the best player in the league, sometimes even unanimous or undisputed best, but once the post-season rolls around people start to change their opinion on who the best player is and the best player is no longer LeBron.

its fcuking ESPN brain washing people.....freaking they had a comparison the other day with MJ23 and Wilt...lol

[Dave3]

i know what his point is but the lakers weren't that good last year they already had problems against the hornets
the 11'mavs aren't even a top 5 championship team in the last 10 years
That's because in the last 10 years we've had the 2002 & 2009 Lakers, the 2008 Celtics, and 2003 + 2005 Spurs. There have been stronger teams no doubt, but they're hardly "the weakest in history" like you said. They're about mid pack for this decade based on how they were playing.

Mind you at the end of the day, in my opinion LeBron should've destroyed them and he no doubtedly choked, I was just elaborating on his point on the Mavs.

[Doctor Rivers]

It's a great comparison. Tom Brady is held in high praise because of his rings. Anytime there is a Brady v Peyton argument, the rings come into the discussion by the Brady fans to put him ahead of Peyton. Peyton on the other hand, has the consistent production, the records (career ones at least), but has fallen short in the playoffs and is often criticized for his play in crucial games. I don't think there is a better cross-sport comparison.

Brady has fallen short in his past two SBs

[KingBeasley08]

I agree. 3 rings will do the trick. 4 and its a lock

[Yanch856]

Doubt it.

You heard Kobe say it himself - he's got no contemporaries, he's chasing the past greats at this point. This is after he scolds Lebron for choking on the last shot of the ASG :lol

[Simple Jack]

Peyton Manning has a ring. 1 ring makes a big difference. He won't be looked at as a career loser because of that 1 ring.

Not to mention the validity of Tom Brady's rings have been questioned by some people (because of spygate).

And yes, Kobe = Eli and Lebron = Romo is probably a more appropriate comparison, like the guy above me said.

1 ring doesn't discount the rest of what I said in my post. The discussions started before Peyton won his 1st ring; and will continue to last if or when LeBron wins his first ring. Peyton still gets called out for his play in big games; he got shit for it in the superbowl the other year vs the Saints as well.

The majority of people don't act like Brady's rings are suspect. The general issue is a guy who is considered clutch and a winner vs a guy who people think could be the GOAT, because of his overall ability, but is missing the hardware to solidify him as such.

Romo and Eli aren't considered the best players in the league nor were they ever. Suggesting that is a more appropriate comparison ignores the more critical issue.

[Heavincent]

Brady has fallen short in his past two SBs

And that loss to the Jets in 2010 was about as bad a loss as you could imagine. Losing to your biggest rival as a #1 seed, despite beating them 45-3 just a few weeks before-hand? It doesn't get much worse than that. The Patriots were like 10 point favorites but got punched in the mouth. One of my favorite memories as a Jets fan :D

[NoGunzJustSkillz]

You know you're in bad shape when you gotta look 20 years into the future to make an argument.

[Heavincent]

1 ring doesn't discount the rest of what I said in my post. The discussions started before Peyton won his 1st ring; and will continue to last if or when LeBron wins his first ring. Peyton still gets called out for his play in big games; he got shit for it in the superbowl the other year vs the Saints as well.

The majority of people don't act like Brady's rings are suspect. The general issue is a guy who is considered clutch and a winner vs a guy who people think could be the GOAT, because of his overall ability, but is missing the hardware to solidify him as such.

Romo and Eli aren't considered the best players in the league nor were they ever. Suggesting that is a more appropriate comparison ignores the more critical issue.

Peyton Manning is a GOAT candidate at the QB position. I put him at #2 behind Montana. You're acting like he has no case for the GOAT QB, when he absolutely does. I've seen him play extremely well in plenty of big games, and I've never seen him choke like Lebron did in the Finals.

[blablabla]

Yes sure anything you say but, but sweep?
don't you think they'll probably face a better team this year in the finals

[lilgodfather1]

I agree. 3 rings will do the trick. 4 and its a lock
4 in a row and he's nippin on MJ's heels. The historical significance of winning 4 straight rings can't be overstated. It would be the second time in history, and the first time since there was more than 8 teams or whatever.

[Simple Jack]

Peyton Manning is a GOAT candidate at the QB position. I put him at #2 behind Montana. You're acting like he has no case for the GOAT QB, when he absolutely does. I've seen him play extremely well in plenty of big games, and I've never seen him choke like Lebron did in the Finals.

Are you retarded? It's a comparison, from a different sport. It need not have everything exactly related. The general consensus among people, and the way each QB is argued by their respective fan-base, is equivalent to Peyton and Brady.

I have Manning as #1.

[DMAVS41]

Meh....doubtful at this point.

I do think Lebron is the better player, but in order to go down historically as the better player Lebron needs to start piling up rings asap.

Last year might have ended his chances.....especially because Kobe is still playing at such a high level and is clearly going to stick around as long as he can to go for all the all time records. Last year was just such a putrid performance that its going to be hard to get over when you look at Lebron's career.

Right in the heart of his prime with homecourt and by far the best team and not only did he lose, but he was the main reason his team lost. He played horrible on offense and equally horrible on defense....and then when crunch time happened Lebron went missing more than any star player I've ever seen. Just hard to get over.

If Lebron ends up with 4 mvps and 3 rings he'll be right there with Kobe for most people i'd bet. In order for him to go down as for sure "better"....Lebron would need 4 or 5 mvps, 4 rings, and would need to play around 16 quality NBA seasons.

Definitely possible, but not likely.

[Heavincent]

Are you retarded? It's a comparison, from a different sport. It need not have everything exactly related. The general consensus among people, and the way each QB is argued by their respective fan-base, is equivalent to Peyton and Brady.

I have Manning as #1.

When did I say it does?

Kobe = Eli and Lebron = Romo is a better comparison IMO. Of course there are flaws in that comparison too, but Romo is the guy that puts up pretty numbers, but has pulled choke-jobs that are so bad it's comical, just like Lebron, and Eli is looked at as a career winner that looks pretty good while doing it, just like Kobe. Yes, Kobe is a better basketball player than Eli is a QB, and the same goes for Lebron and Romo, but if there's a cross-sport comparison, I think that would be it.

[lilgodfather1]

When did I say it does?

Kobe = Eli and Lebron = Romo is a better comparison IMO. Of course there are flaws in that comparison too, but Romo is the guy that puts up pretty numbers, but has pulled choke-jobs that are so bad it's comical, just like Lebron, and Eli is looked at as a career winner that looks pretty good while doing it, just like Kobe. Yes, Kobe is a better basketball player than Eli is a QB, and the same goes for Lebron and Romo, but if there's a cross-sport comparison, I think that would be it.
Has Romo ever won a playoff series? LeBron's never lost in the first round, really bad comparison imo.

[DMAVS41]

When did I say it does?

Kobe = Eli and Lebron = Romo is a better comparison IMO. Of course there are flaws in that comparison too, but Romo is the guy that puts up pretty numbers, but has pulled choke-jobs that are so bad it's comical, just like Lebron, and Eli is looked at as a career winner that looks pretty good while doing it, just like Kobe. Yes, Kobe is a better basketball player than Eli is a QB, and the same goes for Lebron and Romo, but if there's a cross-sport comparison, I think that would be it.

No...just no.

Brady vs. Manning is much better. You could even go Brady vs Marino or Montana vs Marino as well.

But currently? Brady vs Manning is so much better than Eli vs Romo....do you even know anything about football?

Kobe and Lebron are two of the best players ever. Just like Brady and Manning. The only thing holding Manning back from being the best qb ever quite easily has been a lack of dominating playoff games and superbowl rings. Just like Lebron. While Brady is great, his career ranking has been greatly enhanced by his superbowl rings. Just like Kobe.

Eli vs Romo? WTF:facepalm

[Extempo]

People give Kobe so much crap because he won his first 3 rings with another best player in the league. Lebron plays with Wade now...even if he wins 3, it won't matter unless he wins a couple more without Wade. Then we can talk about Kobe comparisons. Fools. I bet Miami gets knocked out by the Bulls this year, last year was their best opportunity. Stop dreaming about multiple championships :oldlol: They haven't even won one and I bet it stays that way.

[Heavincent]

Has Romo ever won a playoff series? LeBron's never lost in the first round, really bad comparison imo.

First of all, there are no playoff series in the NFL, it's just one game. And yes, Romo has won a playoff game. But he's still looked at as a career loser.

Of course there are major flaws in the comparison, but there will be flaws in any cross-sport comparison.

[stallionaire]

lol stop with the quarterback comparisons. Football is sooo much different than basketball. are yall dumb.


Let's get back to agreeing that Kobe won't touch LeBron's career.

[Kiarip]

Lebron is already the GOAT ...




























































at passing to haslem

[talkingconch]

I don't really care too much for the stats, since you're comparing two different physique's, positions, start time of careers


Just like someone already said. If you're a dumbass lebron fan (note: dumbass one, ie pauk and a few others), you've already said Kobe has won 3 rings as a ''sidekick'', Lebron is playing with Wade and Bosh and has already failed to win it once. what makes you think him winning 3 with those players will matter compared to winning as the man? Nice double standard.

[Heavincent]

No...just no.

Brady vs. Manning is much better. You could even go Brady vs Marino or Montana vs Marino as well.

But currently? Brady vs Manning is so much better than Eli vs Romo....do you even know anything about football?

Kobe and Lebron are two of the best players ever. Just like Brady and Manning. The only thing holding Manning back from being the best qb ever quite easily has been a lack of dominating playoff games and superbowl rings. Just like Lebron. While Brady is great, his career ranking has been greatly enhanced by his superbowl rings. Just like Kobe.

Eli vs Romo? WTF:facepalm

I know plenty about football. It's my favorite sport.

There's nothing holding Peyton back from being the GOAT QB. Many people think he is the GOAT, and rightfully so. Perhaps another super bowl ring would make him the undisputed GOAT QB, but I'd say he's made out pretty well for himself in terms of winning.

And yes, Montana vs Marino is much better comparison than Brady vs Manning in relation to Kobe vs Lebron.

[DMAVS41]

People give Kobe so much crap because he won his first 3 rings with another best player in the league. Lebron plays with Wade now...even if he wins 3, it won't matter unless he wins a couple more without Wade. Then we can talk about Kobe comparisons. Fools. I bet Miami gets knocked out by the Bulls this year, last year was their best opportunity. Stop dreaming about multiple championships :oldlol: They haven't even won one and I bet it stays that way.

Yep. The truth is that any ring won with Bosh and Wade is simply not going to be worth the same that Dirk's should be last year. Or most of Duncan's....or Hakeem's...etc.

They will be worth similar to Kobe in 01 and 02 (maybe slightly more because Lebron is the best player on his team and Kobe wasn't)....most likely worth more than Kobe's in 00 as Lebron is just so much better than Kobe was then.

That is why its going to take 3 plus rings and 4 or more MVP's to get on that same tier. And in order to be thought of as "better"...well...might just not be realistic at this point.

[Extempo]

Meh....doubtful at this point.

I do think Lebron is the better player, but in order to go down historically as the better player Lebron needs to start piling up rings asap.

Last year might have ended his chances.....especially because Kobe is still playing at such a high level and is clearly going to stick around as long as he can to go for all the all time records. Last year was just such a putrid performance that its going to be hard to get over when you look at Lebron's career.

Right in the heart of his prime with homecourt and by far the best team and not only did he lose, but he was the main reason his team lost. He played horrible on offense and equally horrible on defense....and then when crunch time happened Lebron went missing more than any star player I've ever seen. Just hard to get over.

If Lebron ends up with 4 mvps and 3 rings he'll be right there with Kobe for most people i'd bet. In order for him to go down as for sure "better"....Lebron would need 4 or 5 mvps, 4 rings, and would need to play around 16 quality NBA seasons.

Definitely possible, but not likely.
Shocking post from a Kobe hater...I applaud you for putting your blind hate aside and at least trying to be objective. More quality posts like these from you, please.

[lilgodfather1]

People give Kobe so much crap because he won his first 3 rings with another best player in the league. Lebron plays with Wade now...even if he wins 3 now, it won't matter unless he wins a couple more without Wade. Then we can talk about Kobe comparisons. Fools. I bet Miami gets knocked out by the Bulls this year, last year was their best opportunity. Stop dreaming about multiple championships :oldlol: They haven't even won one and I bet it stays that way.
The difference very well could be that Kobe never won a FMVP where as LeBron has a chance to win multiple FMVP's all while playing with Wade. Also he might win a regular season MVP for the third time. 3x MVP + 3 x FMVP makes him at minimum a top 7 or 8 player. 30k/10k/10k makes him a top 10 player, if you combine that with 3 MVP's and 3 FMVP's were talking top 5 territory.

[Kobr]

The OP's trolling is so transparent, and yet people always bite. :lol

[DMAVS41]

I know plenty about football. It's my favorite sport.

There's nothing holding Peyton back from being the GOAT QB. Many people think he is the GOAT, and rightfully so. Perhaps another super bowl ring would make him the undisputed GOAT QB, but I'd say he's made out pretty well for himself in terms of winning.

And yes, Montana vs Marino is much better comparison than Brady vs Manning in relation to Kobe vs Lebron.

Nope. There was talking about Peyton being the GOAT QB going into the superbowl against the Saints....after his performance and another costly INT in crunch time and people started questioning him again.

He's not the GOAT QB. He simply hasn't done enough in the post season to warrant that when a guy like Montana did so much more.

And that is the only thing holding him back. Just like Lebron.

Its a very good comparison on many different levels....far better than two good but not great players in Eli and Romo.

Eli vs Romo is the basketball equivalent of Pierce vs Melo or something.

[Rojogaqu11]

I saw Prime Kobe play and it's close even though they do different things on the court and have had different roles. I would say Lebron this year has become a complete player in all aspects of the game.

I also would say that Lebron puts himself in a better position to be effective than prime Kobe, but you would also have to factor prime Kobe's different system and lesser teammates.

Lebron has become a better inside and out player and has matured from being a predictable offensive player into a more well-rounded offensive player. And it's only from last year that I believe he could still be an effective offensive player, let's say for example, in a non-defensive minded team.

Still, Kobe at his best was better at attacking many more types of defenses, was a better player at staging comebacks with his scoring streaks, and has always been a more skillful offensive player and handles pressure way better, and was a better individual defender at his peak and position.

Lebron needs to win championships to really become "better" in the eyes of the public and media. I know it sounds old, but there's a lot of weight on Kobe being a 5 time champion over more than a decade, 16 year veteran still at elite level of play, battling 3 generation of players in an evolving league, along with scoring titles and legendary scoring outbursts, and career defining moments in both the season and playoffs,etc.

I think the slight edge that Lebron might have statistically is not really a strong enough argument to counterbalance the weight of such a productive and victorious career.

Still, even if Lebron wins only one championship, it would be enough to put him in a better contrast for that argument. And even if he wins as a sidekick, which he isn't, or he had the dream team to hep him win it, if he keeps the same level of production for his team, he would earn a right to be considered among the others who have risen above the rest of his peers.

But as of now, he definitely would need multiple championships to be unanimously better than Kobe. At least 3 to counter that slight statistical advantage and the apparent qualifications as an individual player that those statistics give. The context of those championships would also play a role.
Like, Dirk, Kidd, KG, Wade, Payton, West, etc. and others that have finally won a championship, a single championship only validates them as winners but it doesn't put them above the likes of Duncan, Kobe, Shaq, Hakeem, Magic, Bird, Wilt, Moses, MJ, Kareem, etc.

[talkingconch]

Also,


I think it's awesome that we're having this debate when Lebron is in his "prime" and Kobe is aging and leaning towards retirement. If the argument is really this close and can be debated either way, then that should really speak volumes for the career of Kobe.

[DMAVS41]

Also,


Its not debatable at this point though. If we can't admit that Lebron is clearly better than Kobe right now then there will never be any enjoyable discussions about this stuff.

Lebron is so far beyond Kobe as a player so far this season its laughable to compare them.

[stallionaire]

The OP's trolling is so transparent, and yet people always bite. :lol

A lot of what I say is to get a rise out of people. This thread was one of those things, but I honestly believe 100% (on my grandfathers grave) that LeBron James will go down as a better player than Kobe.

[Kingwillball]

Yep. The truth is that any ring won with Bosh and Wade is simply not going to be worth the same that Dirk's should be last year. Or most of Duncan's....or Hakeem's...etc.

They will be worth similar to Kobe in 01 and 02 (maybe slightly more because Lebron is the best player on his team and Kobe wasn't)....most likely worth more than Kobe's in 00 as Lebron is just so much better than Kobe was then.

That is why its going to take 3 plus rings and 4 or more MVP's to get on that same tier. And in order to be thought of as "better"...well...might just not be realistic at this point.


Good for Dirk, He won a Title cause Miami and Lebron Couldn't Close series..

[Nash]

Yep. The truth is that any ring won with Bosh and Wade is simply not going to be worth the same that Dirk's should be last year. Or most of Duncan's....or Hakeem's...etc.

They will be worth similar to Kobe in 01 and 02 (maybe slightly more because Lebron is the best player on his team and Kobe wasn't)....most likely worth more than Kobe's in 00 as Lebron is just so much better than Kobe was then.

That is why its going to take 3 plus rings and 4 or more MVP's to get on that same tier. And in order to be thought of as "better"...well...might just not be realistic at this point.
So Bird's rings with McHale and Parrish not worth that much? Or Magic's rings with Kareem and Worthy? Good to know.

[hops and stops]

Individually, I think prime LeBron will probably be a more complete basketball player than Kobe. An all-around talent that plays solid defense and can score consistently. Whereas Kobe is more of an explosive scorer and clutch shooter.

However, when we compare the careers of both players, I can't imagine that LeBron's will surpass Kobe's unless he seriously goes nuts and starts repeating championships soon. I think Kobe will have the better basketball career. When we compare them 20 years from now, I think we'll look at Kobe as a once-in-a-generation longevity player who had an insatiable desire to win and was able to compete almost every year of his career. And I think we'll look at LeBron as a once-in-a-generation individual talent who played a thrilling style of basketball and was an incredible physical specimen.

[All Net]

Yep. The truth is that any ring won with Bosh and Wade is simply not going to be worth the same that Dirk's should be last year. Or most of Duncan's....or Hakeem's...etc.

They will be worth similar to Kobe in 01 and 02 (maybe slightly more because Lebron is the best player on his team and Kobe wasn't)....most likely worth more than Kobe's in 00 as Lebron is just so much better than Kobe was then.

That is why its going to take 3 plus rings and 4 or more MVP's to get on that same tier. And in order to be thought of as "better"...well...might just not be realistic at this point.

Depends if he is the clear cut best player or not....

[Dave3]

Depends if he is the clear cut best player or not....
Precisely. All of this "it will take X rings to surpass Kobe" talk is completely useless. LeBron might only need 2 and surpass him, or he may win 4 and not surpass him. It's about how he plays, how the other team plays, and how his own team plays. Saying getting 3 will automatically catapult him for example. is as narrow minded as the "5 rings!" non sequiter you get from every troll.

[DMAVS41]

So Bird's rings with McHale and Parrish not worth that much? Or Magic's rings with Kareem and Worthy? Good to know.

Compared to some of the rings won by the likes of Hakeem and Duncan or Dirk last year? No...they aren't in my opinion.

If we can't understand that Kobe's ring in 00 isn't worth nearly as much as Dirk's this year....well...then....all logic is being thrown out and any legit discussion would be impossible.

All rings should not be valued equally...we must use context.

[MMM]

I love LeBron's skillet over Kobe's but the big difference is Kobe's mental make up.

[DMAVS41]

Precisely. All of this "it will take X rings to surpass Kobe" talk is completely useless. LeBron might only need 2 and surpass him, or he may win 4 and not surpass him. It's about how he plays, how the other team plays, and how his own team plays. Saying getting 3 will automatically catapult him for example. is as narrow minded as the "5 rings!" non sequiter you get from every troll.

For you that might be the case. But in terms of "going down as the better player"

No way would two rings be enough for the masses or even historians to rank Lebron higher.

I actually probably would, but that is just me.

[All Net]

Precisely. All of this "it will take X rings to surpass Kobe" talk is completely useless. LeBron might only need 2 and surpass him, or he may win 4 and not surpass him. It's about how he plays, how the other team plays, and how his own team plays. Saying getting 3 will automatically catapult him for example. is as narrow minded as the "5 rings!" non sequiter you get from every troll.

Even as a big Kobe fan I realise how lebron wins will decide how high he gets as stats wise they aren't many in the top 5-10 who are better.

[Dave3]

For you that might be the case. But in terms of "going down as the better player"

No way would two rings be enough for the masses or even historians to rank Lebron higher.

I actually probably would, but that is just me.
Masses are freaking retarded. Ask "the masses" where KAJ ranks and you might not even get him in the top 5. This is a guy that's arguably the GOAT, and you won't see him on most people's top 5. Right now it looks for most people like

1. Jordan
2. Kobe
3. Magic
4. Bird
5. Wilt
6. Shaq
7. Russell
8. KAJ
9. Oscar
10. Jerry West

Not to mention in 20 years, LeBron and Kobe will be the GOAT's and Jordan wouldn't be able to keep up in "today's" (2030's) game.

[All Net]

Compared to some of the rings won by the likes of Hakeem and Duncan or Dirk last year? No...they aren't in my opinion.

If we can't understand that Kobe's ring in 00 isn't worth nearly as much as Dirk's this year....well...then....all logic is being thrown out and any legit discussion would be impossible.

All rings should not be valued equally...we must use context.

Not many of the greats titles are worth as much as dirk's was last year. Yes dirk had perfect role players around him but he still won without a 2nd star which only hakeem and Duncan can say they have won titles with... Was very impressive.

[LakersReign]

LeBron's so much more statistically dominant that if he even wins 1, there will be a lot of people who'll consider him better than Kobe ever was.

This is what petrifies Kobe fans. They KNOW it's not a matter of whether LeBron can match Kobe in rings. The statistical divide is simply too great. Not to mention other individual accomplishments. He gets compared to MJ statistically every year, something nobody's ever bothered to do with MJ/Kobe.

Kobe fans better pray LeBron never wins a ring. And they do pray.

Just gotta love it how haters keep trying to play reverse psychology with the "oh Kobe fans are scared of Lebron passing up Kobe." Newsflash, ESPN's been trying to use Lebron to eclipse Kobe for the last 9 years and it hasn't worked. Furthermore, Kobe fans aren't always the ones bringing up Lebron to cover up Kobe's faults, it's the other way around. So tell me what exactly Kobe fans are supposed to be scared of again?!:sleeping

[DMAVS41]

Masses are freaking retarded. Ask "the masses" where KAJ ranks and you might not even get him in the top 5. This is a guy that's arguably the GOAT, and you won't see him on most people's top 5. Right now it looks for most people like

1. Jordan
2. Kobe
3. Magic
4. Bird
5. Wilt
6. Shaq
7. Russell
8. KAJ
9. Oscar
10. Jerry West

Not to mention in 20 years, LeBron and Kobe will be the GOAT's and Jordan wouldn't be able to keep up in "today's" (2030's) game.

Look....we just disagree. I think you underestimate the career Kobe has had and the kind of historical significance his career numbers will have.

Of course it matters how Lebron wins and who he plays...etc. I just don't think he will be higher than Kobe in any lists until he wins 3 or more. 2 just won't get it done.

Hell, Hakeem won 2 and did so in about the most impressive fashion possible against Shaq and Ewing in the finals and he's not above Kobe on a lot of lists.

And its pretty obvious Hakeem was a better and higher impact player than Kobe imo.

[LakersReign]

The OP's trolling is so transparent, and yet people always bite. :lol

They troll themselves with their hilarious nonsense. They post these topics, desperately looking for support cuz they can't form a coherent defense of the hot garbage they post in them. Then, after embarrassing themselves enough in their own pointless thread, they eventually abandon it and haul a**:roll:

[NumberSix]

I don't really care too much for the stats, since you're comparing two different physique's, positions, start time of careersWhy is it always Kobe stans spewing the "stats don't matter? line. Everybody else in the sports world doesn't have this mentality. Only Kobetards who are adamant that Kobe is better than players that he really isn't.

Do you EVER hear Gretzky, Jordan, Payton fans say "stats don't matter"? Of corse not.

Anytime somebody brings up his poor FG%, playmaking or defense, the response is always "it doesn't matter. He's clutch". Then when confronted with stats that he's pretty average in the clutch it's the same "stats don't matter" line.

Like, what is it do you guys think stats are? Some kind of jumbled numbers that barely make sense? They're pretty freaking simple. If you shoot 10 times and 4 go in, 6 miss, that's pretty straight forward. If you grab 7 rebounds, that's pretty straight forward.

Is it you guys assertion that when the stats say this, that it's somehow not really true that he made 4 of his 10 shots? Just random jumbled numbers that don't really mean anything?

I think obsessive Kobe fans would find that virtually nobody would have a negative thing to say about Kobe if they weren't constantly trying to rewrite history and elevate him beyond what he is. It's perfectly OK that he's not the best basketball player ever. One of the best is still fcuking impressive.


Just like someone already said. If you're a dumbass lebron fan (note: dumbass one, ie pauk and a few others), you've already said Kobe has won 3 rings as a ''sidekick'', Lebron is playing with Wade and Bosh and has already failed to win it once. what makes you think him winning 3 with those players will matter compared to winning as the man? Nice double standard.
What kind of logic is this? You could just as easily say Kobe lost 5 times with Shaq. It makes as much sense and it's equally as stupid.

[NumberSix]

Not many of the greats titles are worth as much as dirk's was last year. Yes dirk had perfect role players around him but he still won without a 2nd star which only hakeem and Duncan can say they have won titles with... Was very impressive.
Wow, some of you are acting as if Dirk was Jordan-esque or something in the finals it. Far from. He had his stretches where he was ice cold. He also had PLENTY of help from his team mates. Just because they aren't marquee names doesn't mean they contributed nothing. There were at least 2 games where the team shot lights out.

[DMAVS41]

Wow, some of you are acting as if Dirk was Jordan-esque or something in the finals it. Far from. He had his stretches where he was ice cold. He also had PLENTY of help from his team mates. Just because they aren't marquee names doesn't mean they contributed nothing. There were at least 2 games where the team shot lights out.

He was talking about his entire playoff run...not just the finals. And Dirk's run last year defines the term "Jordan-esque"

Easily one of the most clutch playoff runs ever.

[Tenchi Ryu]

Do you EVER hear Gretzky, Jordan, Payton fans say "stats don't matter"? Of corse not.
that's pretty straight forward.

Actually, Jordan didn't care about stats. He just wanted to win...him having great stats was just a product of being that damn good....He wasn't checking his stats at the end of games though...or trying to keep a certain average.

[NumberSix]

He was talking about his entire playoff run...not just the finals. And Dirk's run last year defines the term "Jordan-esque"

Easily one of the most clutch playoff runs ever.
Wow. I know Dirk's your guy, but you're going full blown Kobetard on this. You can't serious think Dirk's championship run was on par with Jordan's championship runs. Let's not get ridiculous here.

[All Net]

Wow, some of you are acting as if Dirk was Jordan-esque or something in the finals it. Far from. He had his stretches where he was ice cold. He also had PLENTY of help from his team mates. Just because they aren't marquee names doesn't mean they contributed nothing. There were at least 2 games where the team shot lights out.

Yeah I meant overall not just finals...

[DMAVS41]

Wow. I know Dirk's your guy, but you're going full blown Kobetard on this. You can't serious think Dirk's championship run was on par with Jordan's championship runs. Let's not get ridiculous here.

Did I say that? I said it defines the term "jordan-esque"

Do you even know what that term means? You used it and I don't think you understand what it actually means. The term does not mean equal to or better than Jordan or something.

Dirk's playoff run last year was historically significant in a lot of ways. He was as clutch as anyone since MJ and Bird...and he won a title without an all nba teammate or all star (two things that rarely happen)....and he did all of that going through one of the toughest roads to the title a team has had in some time.

That defines the term "jordan-esque"....well, if you actually knew what that meant...LOL

[NumberSix]

Did I say that? I said it defines the term "jordan-esque"

Do you even know what that term means? You used it and I don't think you understand what it actually means. The term does not mean equal to or better than Jordan or something.

Dirk's playoff run last year was historically significant in a lot of ways. He was as clutch as anyone since MJ and Bird...and he won a title without an all nba teammate or all star (two things that rarely happen)....and he did all of that going through one of the toughest roads to the title a team has had in some time.

That defines the term "jordan-esque"....well, if you actually knew what that meant...LOL
Dude, you're being a homer. You just straight up said Dirk's title run > Bird's and Magic's. I KNOW that you know that's not really true.

[SwooshReturns]

Age difference. Jordan got his first ring at....27.
Here we go with this stupid argument. It's years in the league, kid

Pro experience is pro experience. Both were rookies handed the reigns to terrible franchises and were impact players from their first season.

9 years deep MJ was working on 3 straight, then "retiring" at his apex.

9 years deep LeBron just played with the most talented team this side of the late 80s Celtics / Lakers, gagged in the Finals like a rookie porn star.

The comparison isn't even legit.

[DMAVS41]

Dude, you're being a homer. You just straight up said Dirk's title run > Bird's and Magic's. I KNOW that you know that's not really true.

I said in terms of valuing rings? Yes, I consider what Dirk did last year along with Duncan in 03 and Hakeem in 94 to be some of the most valuable rings in the modern era.

Its really not absurd to say that at all.

Dirk put up 28/8/3 on 61% TS...had the most efficient game of all time...and had a clutch run that really only Bird and MJ can match.

And he did that without elite help....having to go through one of the toughest roads to the title in years. 2 series as huge underdogs without homecourt and two very good teams as well.

I didn't say Dirk was better than those guys....I said his ring should be one of extreme value.

[NumberSix]

Dirk put up 28/8/3 on 61% TS
Rounding up and using TS%... Come on. You're better than that. You're doing exactly what Kobetards do.

[DMAVS41]

Rounding up and using TS%... Come on. You're better than that. You're doing exactly what Kobetards do.

Rounding up? That is what you do. Would you like the raw numbers? I actually think they are more impressive.

49%fg 46%3 94% ft....ROFL

[Tenchi Ryu]

9 years deep LeBron just played with the most talented team this side of the late 80s Celtics / Lakers, gagged in the Finals like a rookie porn star.


:roll: :roll: :roll: :roll:

[SwooshReturns]

Dirk's 2006 was more impressive (pre-Finals) ...

And let's not forget how CRITICAL Jason Terry and Tyson Chandler were to Dirk finally getting his ring.

If LeBron plays remotely average the series would've been sweep caliber.

[NumberSix]

Rounding up? That is what you do. Would you like the raw numbers? I actually think they are more impressive.

49%fg 46%3 94% ft....ROFL
There you go. Good numbers. No need to add in an extra half an assist to make you're point. I mean, you're STILL rounding his FG% up half a percent, but whatever. Close enough.

That's all beside the point though. This title run still isn't on the level on Magic's rookie season.

Lol. What a stupid conversation to even discuss this. :roll:

[DMAVS41]

Dirk's 2006 was more impressive (pre-Finals) ...

And let's not forget how CRITICAL Jason Terry and Tyson Chandler were to Dirk finally getting his ring.

If LeBron plays remotely average the series would've been sweep caliber.

And if Dirk would have finished off the Heat and won in 06...that would have gone down as a great run as well.

His numbers were better: 27/12/3...but he wasn't as clutch...at least not in the finals.

You guys act like players are putting up numbers like that while leading huge underdog teams to the title on a yearly basis. It rarely happens....rarely.

And you bring up Terry and Chandler...of course they were important. I don't understand that argument at all.

[DMAVS41]

There you go. Good numbers. No need to add in an extra half an assist to make you're point. I mean, you're STILL rounding his FG% up half a percent, but whatever. Close enough.

That's all beside the point though. This title run still isn't on the level on Magic's rookie season.

Lol. What a stupid conversation to even discuss this. :roll:

Disagree.

[SwooshReturns]

Dirk's run in 2011 was nice, don't get me wrong. But I still don't think it was as legendary as people make it out to be ... on ISH.

[NumberSix]

Disagree.
Are you really telling me Magic's rookie season playoffs < Dirk's 2011 playoffs?

[DMAVS41]

Are you really telling me Magic's rookie season playoffs < Dirk's 2011 playoffs?

I think they are on the same level...very hard to rank stuff like that. You said they weren't on the same level.

And I said I disagreed. What is confusing about that?

[NumberSix]

I think they are on the same level...very hard to rank stuff like that. You said they weren't on the same level.

And I said I disagreed. What is confusing about that?
Nothing, just making sure it's beyond the point of backtracking. Although, now apparently they're on the same level instead of Dirk's being outright better.

[DMAVS41]

Nothing, just making sure it's beyond the point of backtracking. Although, now apparently they're on the same level instead of Dirk's being outright better.

I never said that. You said Magic's was outright better. I never said Dirk's was better.

You seem to be confusing yourself a lot.

[Alamo]

If he can win 4-5 rings yeah

[LeFraud James]

:roll:

What is this garbage of a thread?

I agree he has the skills and athleticism to be better than Kobe, but let him win a damn ring before we start ranking them.

[JohnnyWall]

Dirk never would have won last year if his team hadn't stepped up in such a major way like they did. That's a fact.

The Mavs' run last year was nowhere near Magic's or Bird's, get the **** out of here.

[lebeast666]

Lol already is better you fvck boy

[Mr. Jabbar]

After the decision, and quitting during playoffs numerous times, not to mention 1 Finals Sweep + 1 Finals 2pt 4th qtr avrg. He will hardly ever be ranked above kobe. Even if winning 3 chips with that cheap team.

[DKLaker]

Typical butthurt Lebronyte b***h move. They get owned in one thread. So, they run away cryin' like little girls to make another thread, desperately looking for support:lol

Hilarious:roll:

:roll: :roll: :roll: :roll: :roll:

[Simple Jack]

After the decision, and quitting during playoffs numerous times, not to mention 1 Finals Sweep + 1 Finals 2pt 4th qtr avrg. He will hardly ever be ranked above kobe. Even if winning 3 chips with that cheap team.

:facepalm

[pegasus]

After the decision, and quitting during playoffs numerous times, not to mention 1 Finals Sweep + 1 Finals 2pt 4th qtr avrg. He will hardly ever be ranked above kobe. Even if winning 3 chips with that cheap team.
True.:applause:

[okayabc123]

Lebron needs to win at least 3 rings in his career to be better than Kobe from a career perspective. Comparing player to player, it's extremely tough just because Kobe is just a different player than Lebron. Lebron is not a SG, and has never been a scorers mentality type of player.

If you look at Lebron's career, he actually needs to win soon and quickly. Very quickly. OKC will contend for years if they keep their core of KD/Westbrook/Harden/Ibaka. Chicago, as long as Rose/Deng/Noah is there, and they can find shooters, they will contend year after year.

Also you have to take into account that this is the best Lebron will ever get to be, it is within this next 3-5 years. This current Miami team isn't built to contend for a long time I don't think. Wade is slowly aging. Bosh has never been and will never be a dominant force. And you will have to replace players like Battier/Miller year in and year out. Lebron needs to win now, and win at least 3 rings in the next 5 years.

[lakerspng]

Only thing Lebron will outshine Kobe in career wise is PER, which only means anything to fantasy sports junkies. He has not shown the heart, toughnes, skill, determination and championship material it takes to be an all time legend. He has the tools with his size, athleticism and natural talent but that doesnt mean anything until he uses it to triumph on the ultimate stage. Lebron is great but there is another level he needs to get to. Maybe he will, maybe he wont.

This is one of many reasons why i thik fantasy sports ruin sports. Stats take precedence over victories.

[Simple Jack]

Only thing Lebron will outshine Kobe in career wise is PER, which only means anything to fantasy sports junkies. He has not shown the heart, toughnes, skill, determination and championship material it takes to be an all time legend. He has the tools with his size, athleticism and natural talent but that doesnt mean anything until he uses it to triumph on the ultimate stage. Lebron is great but there is another level he needs to get to. Maybe he will, maybe he wont.

This is one of many reasons why i thik fantasy sports ruin sports. Stats take precedence over victories.

He already has him in MVP's. He could easily accumulate more FMVP's, career milestones, and nearly every statistical average possible.

It's going to be interesting to see how his career plays out.

[Kobe 4 The Win]

Lebron could go down as a better player than Kobe if he eventually wins something.

He could also go down as a talented douche who was insecure, mentally weak and had a history of coming up short in the finals. That is the road he's headed down right now. Lebron's fans art finally starting to realize that. Even if he wins a few rings his legacy could be hurt by fleeing Cleveland to form a super team with Wade and Bosh. We shall see.

[Simple Jack]

Lebron could go down as a better player than Kobe if he eventually wins something.

He could also go down as a talented douche who was insecure, mentally weak and had a history of coming up short in the finals. That is the road he's headed down right now. Lebron's fans art finally starting to realize that. Even if he wins a few rings his legacy could be hurt by fleeing Cleveland to form a super team with Wade and Bosh. We shall see.

It won't be remembered in hindsight; or not made a big deal, just like Moses' situation doesn't affect his legacy; either that or people choose to ignore it. He was a 2 time MVP who lost in the finals and signed with a team who had the GOAT forward at the time, and 3 other stars, with the team winning 59/62/58 games without him

[Kobe 4 The Win]

It won't be remembered in hindsight; or not made a big deal, just like Moses' situation doesn't affect his legacy; either that or people choose to ignore it. He was a 2 time MVP who lost in the finals and signed with a team who had the GOAT forward at the time, and 3 other stars, with the team winning 59/62/58 games without him


So, You aren't disputing that he did it, you just think people will choose to ignore it. Hmmmm. There's a lot of variables in this situation. Assuming he does win one, which there is no guanrantee he will, what if D-Wade lights it up and Lebron cowers from the moment......again? Are you going to tell me that people won't be calling him Wade's sidekick? He joined Wade's team. Wade didn't join Lebron's team. A lot could happen in the next 5 or 6 years. Lebron better hope you're right.

[Simple Jack]

So, You aren't disputing that he did it, you just think people will choose to ignore it. Hmmmm. There's a lot of variables in this situation. Assuming he does win one, which there is no guanrantee he will, what if D-Wade lights it up and Lebron cowers from the moment......again? Are you going to tell me that people won't be calling him Wade's sidekick? He joined Wade's team. Wade didn't join Lebron's team. A lot could happen in the next 5 or 6 years. Lebron better hope you're right.

Huh? I think the notion of the Heat being a "super-team" as if this amount of talent top to bottom has never been seen on a team before is stupid. It's not the most stacked team ever, nor is it even approaching that status.

The issue of who decided to change to what team is irrelevant. Again, throughout history, there have been plenty of players who went to "someone elses team". The result? It became the team of whoever played better over the course of their tenure.

If LeBron plays terribly in the finals, and they still win, of course that won't be highly regarded, especially if Wade plays amazing. However, the opposite can happen as well. Even that situation is overblown. When Kobe's rings are brought up; no one, beside a few trolls on the internet, stops to explain that Kobe won his first playing awful in the finals while Shaq was dominant. Things like what you've mentioned seem to get forgotten overtime, as history has shown.

[LakersReign]

Just like I said before, Lebronytes love to come on here and post these hilariously stupid pointless threads. But the minute it backfires, they haul abandon them and haul a**:roll:

[Simple Jack]

Just like I said before, Lebronytes love to come on here and post these hilariously stupid pointless threads. But the minute it backfires, they haul abandon them and haul a**:roll:

Laker fans do a great job of not posting pointless threads. And you, my friend, do a great job of not posting pointless posts. Each one is so enriched with information I'm hardly able to comprehend it.

On a serious note, are you capable of having a normal, logical, basketball discussion instead of throwing around insults and "i told you so's" and "you gotta love the LeBronytes"? Can you actually contribute something?

[Faptastrophe]

Kobe isn’t and hasn't been on Lebrons' level.

I don’t hate Kobe Bryant. I love watching him play. He played a beautiful game Sunday. Kobe is the Jerry West of this era. But let’s stop the blasphemy of elevating Bryant to the same level as James. Don’t let your hatred of LeBron convince you that Kobe is something he’s clearly not.

[chazzy]

[QUOTE=Faptastrophe]Kobe isn

[PickernRoller]

That guy hopefully gets the boot soon. I bet he had a deadline for an article and drew that shit up after that article criticizing Lebron got "much" attention. Journalist compete for hits to keep their job and that lady got some hits. Probably got more hits than all of Jason's articles combined. What's not better than appealing to the LBJ crowd with an article comparing Kobe and LBJ, hailing LBJ with meaningless facts, full of one sided opinions and "what if's"?

Not the first time he has shown his colors....a maggot he is. Members on ISH have done a better job to make the case for Lebron vs. Kobe and it's still crap. Attention whoring at its best - that's why he makes articles for Fox sports provided he has been riding LBJ dick since he came to the league. Quickly out of the first page by the responses...........

As for the copy and pasting of Fatastrophe well, what do you expect? Kobe haters sticking together. If Jason Whitlock were to be a member of ISH he wouldn't last 2 days before getting the boot. Guy has no credibility nor authoritative demeanor when he writes, spouting crap is all he does. That's why they call it "Opinion articles", so you can get away with fanboyism.

Fatastrophe is another maggot going to the ignore list. Dude is retarded.

[kuniva_dAMiGhTy]

LMAO. Did you seriously just copy the closing paragraph of Jason fckin Whitlock's awful article last night as your post? Wow

:roll: :oldlol:

[Faptastrophe]

LMAO. Did you seriously just copy the closing paragraph of Jason fckin Whitlock's awful article last night as your post? Wow
Yes (http://msn.foxsports.com/nba/story/LeBron-James-haters-make-Kobe-Bryant-Los-Angeles-Lakers-a-false-living-legend-030412).
The 'awful' part says everything I need to know about you.. It's sad that you don't see the truth in things author writes about.

[chazzy]

Yes (http://msn.foxsports.com/nba/story/LeBron-James-haters-make-Kobe-Bryant-Los-Angeles-Lakers-a-false-living-legend-030412).
The 'awful' part says everything I need to know about you.. It's sad that you don't see the truth in things author writes about.
The fact that you think a Jason fckin Whitlock article is noteworthy says everything about you lol. Are you reading some of the stuff he's saying? Kobe with 8 rings isn't on the level of Bird, Magic, and Lebron. Brings up how Kobe benefited from playing in LA as if Magic and the other great LA players didn't. Bring up Bynum and Gasol as his blessed supporting cast when Bynum was injured for both titles and those 80s greats had far better supporting casts. You give Lebron Bynum/Pau and that's a title... even though he just lost with Wade and Bosh. Says Kobe did nothing but score in last nights game and then follows it up with "Wade had an off night," giving no credit to Kobe's defense. Dude is an awful writer and consistently churns out BS just to get views.

[truhooper]

:cheers:

[Phong]

LMAO. Did you seriously just copy the closing paragraph of Jason fckin Whitlock's awful article last night as your post? WowWOW... So the guy can't articulate his own thoughts so he jacks someone else's writing and pass it off as his? :facepalm

Not surprising coming from a LeBron fan. :rolleyes:

[Deuce Bigalow]

Wow. I know Dirk's your guy, but you're going full blown Kobetard on this. You can't serious think Dirk's championship run was on par with Jordan's championship runs. Let's not get ridiculous here.
The dude thinks Dirk's '11 run is better than any of Kobe's :oldlol:

[Doctor Rivers]

Yes (http://msn.foxsports.com/nba/story/LeBron-James-haters-make-Kobe-Bryant-Los-Angeles-Lakers-a-false-living-legend-030412).
The 'awful' part says everything I need to know about you.. It's sad that you don't see the truth in things author writes about.

All of Whitlock's articles are AWFUL

[Indian guy]

The perception by most fans and media is that LeBron's been better than Kobe since the start of the 08-09 season. Conduct a peak vs. peak poll and pretty much every non-LAKER fan will pick LeBron too. Then you have the stats, LeBron's only peer there is MJ. MVPs are in LeBron's favor too. There's already much fanfare over LeBron's current record breaking season. Now imagine if he ends up with the highest PER ever, wins MVP and Finals MVP this season. All good possibilities. Can you imagine the "Best Season Ever?" discussion that will generate?

I'm telling you, if LeBron wins a ring this season playing reasonably well in the playoffs, Kobe fans are in deep sh!t. Rings are the ONLY reason why people pick Kobe over LeBron.

[Deuce Bigalow]

The perception by most fans and media is that LeBron's been better than Kobe since the start of the 08-09 season. Conduct a peak vs. peak poll and pretty much every non-LAKER fan will pick LeBron. Then you have the stats and accolades. Big difference between the 2. There's already much fanfare over LeBron's current record breaking season. Now imagine if he ends up with the highest PER ever, wins MVP and Finals MVP this season. All good possibilities. Can you imagine the "Best Season Ever?" discussion that will generate?

I'm telling you, if LeBron wins a ring this season playing reasonably well in the playoffs, Kobe fans are in deep sh!t. Rings are the ONLY reason why people pick Kobe over LeBron.
Uh...lol

Players, former players, GMs, coaches the majority have been saying Kobe's better in the '08-'09 and '09-'10 seasons.

[rodman91]

Lebron is mentally weak.He has been shrink couple of times before but last years finals was statement of it.He is exposed as mentally weak.Even his rival Kobe yelled at his face "Shoot the ****ing ball" and he scared to challange. Even in an allstar game.

Because he is exposed now, everybody is gonna keep looking at his game at clutch more than overall game.

He might go down as better player than Kobe if he can get couple of FMVP's but probably being coward or unclutch will always a part of his legacy.

[Indian guy]

Uh...lol

Players, former players, GMs, coaches the majority have been saying Kobe's better in the '08-'09 and '09-'10 seasons.

This is absolutely not true. LeBron was media and fans' consensus pick for best player during the '09 and '10 seasons.

[rule1223]

when lebron retires he'll be on the same tier as kg, couldve been the best player in the league, one of the greatest talents ever, but when talking about the GOATs just an afterthought

[chazzy]

The perception by most fans and media is that LeBron's been better than Kobe since the start of the 08-09 season. Conduct a peak vs. peak poll and pretty much every non-LAKER fan will pick LeBron too. Then you have the stats, LeBron's only peer there is MJ. MVPs are in LeBron's favor too. There's already much fanfare over LeBron's current record breaking season. Now imagine if he ends up with the highest PER ever, wins MVP and Finals MVP this season. All good possibilities. Can you imagine the "Best Season Ever?" discussion that will generate?

I'm telling you, if LeBron wins a ring this season playing reasonably well in the playoffs, Kobe fans are in deep sh!t. Rings are the ONLY reason why people pick Kobe over LeBron.
How much would a ring as a not even top 5 player alongside a superior teammate (according to you) mean to you as far as his all time ranking?

[Deuce Bigalow]

This is absolutely not true. LeBron was media and fans' consensus pick for best player during the '09 and '10 seasons.
:oldlol:

June 2009 Dwyane Wade:

“I believe that Kobe Bryant is still the best player in the game, his experience and his overall talent. It’s not taking away from LeBron, it’s not taking away from Carmelo, it’s not taking away from myself,” Wade told ESPN Radio Chicago. “Kobe has been in the game longer than the rest of us, he’s older than us, he’s smart with the game. He’s the better player.”

May 2010 Alvin Gentry:

"Kobe is the best player in the league and its not even close"

[Deuce Bigalow]

The quote from Gentry means nothing, because saying "it's not even close" destroys any credibility he may have had. Strangely, I'm sure you won't bring up quotes by Jerry West (who said LeBron>Kobe) or Jeff Van Gundy who has said numerous times LeBron has been the best since 2008-09. OF course, those wouldn't fit your agenda. :rolleyes:
Jerry West: Kobe is the best Laker of alltime"

[Indian guy]

[QUOTE=Deuce Bigalow]:oldlol:

June 2009 Dwyane Wade:

[Deuce Bigalow]

and Jerry West said those things in April/may..we all know what happened later on

[Doranku]

The perception by most fans and media is that LeBron's been better than Kobe since the start of the 08-09 season. Conduct a peak vs. peak poll and pretty much every non-LAKER fan will pick LeBron too. Then you have the stats, LeBron's only peer there is MJ. MVPs are in LeBron's favor too. There's already much fanfare over LeBron's current record breaking season. Now imagine if he ends up with the highest PER ever, wins MVP and Finals MVP this season. All good possibilities. Can you imagine the "Best Season Ever?" discussion that will generate?

I'm telling you, if LeBron wins a ring this season playing reasonably well in the playoffs, Kobe fans are in deep sh!t. Rings are the ONLY reason why people pick Kobe over LeBron.

And if LeBron does his usual choke job in the Finals, he'll NEVER be considered as good as Kobe no matter what he does from this point forward.

There's only so many times you can fall short with home court advantage before being written off and accordingly dismissed by fans.

[Indian guy]

How much would a ring as a not even top 5 player alongside a superior teammate (according to you) mean to you as far as his all time ranking?

I'm not talking about myself. I'm talking about others. These are people who consider LeBron the best since '09, especially today, think he's having a GOAT-like season and will change their tunes in a second if he wins a championship while playing reasonably well. Perception is everything.

[Deuce Bigalow]

Yes, when things don't fit your agenda, just make excuses! That'll solve everything! :applause: :applause: :applause:
excuses? :oldlol: okay

[PickernRoller]

The quote from Gentry means nothing, because saying "it's not even close" destroys any credibility he may have had. Strangely, I'm sure you won't bring up quotes by Jerry West (who said LeBron>Kobe) or Jeff Van Gundy who has said numerous times LeBron has been the best since 2008-09. OF course, those wouldn't fit your agenda. :rolleyes:

Opinions are opinions hehehe........let them fight over it. I see you're getting serious somewhat - which is good. I don't care about any coach in the league or any player in the league with two exceptions.

The only opinion I take for granted is Phill's and Jordan's above anyone else. Talk about true champions. Phill for being such a brilliant coach, dealing with superstars and taking teams to beat superstars - he knows talent. Jordan for being the Goat and doing it all - he knows what it takes.

Both agree Kobe> LBJ. But that is my one sided comment.

Lebron can become better than Kobe? I just don't see that happening - this era Lebron is growing in is not gonna take him to that level - my opinion. I guess anyone with great talent has a shot at being better than anyone. It's just a matter of it happening or not. There has been a lot "next Micheals" in history and when Mike was becoming the Goat there were a bunch of people who differed he was it.

[Deuce Bigalow]

So, LeBron>Kobe>Kareem>Magic>Wilt>West>Baylor etc.? After all West said so.

He said KOBE is the best Laker. not Lebron, he is not a Laker. Are you stupid?

[Deuce Bigalow]

Kobe won back to back championships and finals MVPs in '09 and '10. Only been done by Jordan, Shaq and Hakeem. I'll take that, I could care less opinions anyways especially from you.

[pegasus]

The perception by most fans and media is that LeBron's been better than Kobe since the start of the 08-09 season. Conduct a peak vs. peak poll and pretty much every non-LAKER fan will pick LeBron too. Then you have the stats, LeBron's only peer there is MJ. MVPs are in LeBron's favor too. There's already much fanfare over LeBron's current record breaking season. Now imagine if he ends up with the highest PER ever, wins MVP and Finals MVP this season. All good possibilities. Can you imagine the "Best Season Ever?" discussion that will generate?

I'm telling you, if LeBron wins a ring this season playing reasonably well in the playoffs, Kobe fans are in deep sh!t. Rings are the ONLY reason why people pick Kobe over LeBron.

So Lebron has been better than Kobe since the 08-09 season, despite the fact that Kobe has won two chips and two FMVP's while Lebron has choked away the HCA three years in a row by disappearing in pivotal games (see 2010 ECF game 6, and 2011 ECSF game 5&6) or in pivotal series (see 2011 finals)?:lol

And one ring with one of the most stacked teams off all time is gonna put him over Kobe?

What a basket case you are! You just can't decide to ride or bash Lebron:roll:

[Deuce Bigalow]

Phil Jackson (in 2003-04, mind you) "Kobe doesn't deserve all-defensive teams. Shaq is the man on the Lakers."
MJ: "Kobe is a top 10 all-time...shooting guard"
MJ: "Kobe is the only one to have put the work to deserve comparisons"
Phil: "Kobe is more skilled than Jordan"
:lol

[PickernRoller]

Phil Jackson (in 2003-04, mind you) "Kobe doesn't deserve all-defensive teams. Shaq is the man on the Lakers."
MJ: "Kobe is a top 10 all-time...shooting guard"

Ask Phill if he though MJ was GOAT before he won his 1st championship. Ask MJ where he stands on Kobe now?

You make comments as you see the player grow. You can't call a guy GOAT just by seeing him play in 1 game.

[Deuce Bigalow]

He said LeBron>Kobe. You can't just take the things he said that fit your agenda and ignore the things he said that don't.
we all know what happened a month later and the next year. Do I need to repeat it?

[PickernRoller]

Argument is getting stupid now. Back where we started....:rolleyes:

:blah :blah :blah :blah

Later people.......

[Deuce Bigalow]

Kobe stans are the scum of the earth. :facepalm
PER!
PER!
PER!
PER!
FG%
WS

[Deuce Bigalow]

Lebron already has rings. He's a 4 time PER Champion, going for his 5th.

[pegasus]

LeBron choked in 09? Funny, I remember him averaging nearly 40 points a game against the Magic and hitting a game winner, and consistently taking over in the 4th quarters. Lebron choked in the 2011 ECSF? Um...how? He closed out the Celtics, scored the last 10 points of the game. "Choking" my ass. :roll:

I got the years mixed up. He disappeared in game 6 in 2009 (had a monster serious, but still didn't show up for the elimination game while his supporting cast played quite well). He quit after game 4 in 2010, and you know what happened last year.

[JohnnyWall]

I love how insecure LeBron fans get when Kobe's greatness is mentioned :lol

http://i.imgur.com/GnaI5.jpg

http://i.imgur.com/WxiQG.jpg

http://i.imgur.com/A7XSl.jpg

http://i.imgur.com/aGDeq.jpg

[Disaprine]

I agree about Lebron going down, but I don't know about the rest of that sentence.


Also, shouldn't there be a forum rule against randomly creating bullshit threads to get hits? OP is like one of those YouTube girls who makes an ass-shaking video just to get people to look at them.

:roll: :roll: :roll:

[rhythmic]

Just like in Business, analysis involves not only quantifiable data but also qualitative.

[ILLsmak]

I agree about Lebron going down, but I don't know about the rest of that sentence.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qtuTUsDd6gk

-Smak

[schyza]

I stopped reading when this kid tried to compare LeBron to Magic. Just stop

[LakersReign]

[QUOTE=schyza]I stopped reading when this kid tried to compare LeBron to Magic. Just stop

[Heavincent]

Lebron isn't passing Kobe. The stans should just learn to deal with it.

[ItsTwisted]

All the Laker fans in this thread stating that what the OP said is false are completely wrong. I am a Laker fan and completely agree with the OP.

Lebron already is a better player then Kobe, and whoever tries to dispute it has a blind fold on. Yes Kobe has the killer instrinct, and the scoring aresenal, but Lebron has the size, the athleticism, and can very well take over games at any point just like Kobe as we have seen before.

People are so quick to forget, but with Cleveland, the guy was practically unstoppable. Yes people argue he had strong teammates, but being REALISTIC, no he did not. The fact that they won as many games, and made it as far into the playoffs as they did every year is truly amazing, and that was due to Lebron. As we have seen Laker fans, even with Kobe, one man cant do everything himself. Lebron had the talent around him, but the talent wasnt producing. I did not want to comment on the Lebron hate going on as of late due to his so called " lack of killer instinct" because it just makes my skin crawl that people would even question something like that. Obviously going to Miami, things are different so ofcourse he is going to be more hesitant. Now instead of having Gibson to pass to, and the likes of Varejao, he has Dwayne Wade and Chris Bosh. Very very different scenario, and I bet if Lebron didnt pass at the end of games looking for Wade and so on, people would say he is a ball hog and that he is trying to outshine Wade. I have actually heard people bring this up last year when Lebron was taking all the late game shots, which is just ridiculous. Anyways I am not going to go on about this subject because I could go on for days, but yes the OP is right.
Lebron has been the better player between the two for the last 3 years or so, and will go down as the better player.

However, Kobe Bryant will go down as having a better legacy and will be cherished more as a player. I have noticed that as Kobe Bryant ages, he seems to get more and more fans, and people that use to criticize him once are now big fans of his. This is due to the fact that they are now starting to cherish the type of player Bryant is. The fact that he is 33 years old, and still putting up numbers better then his career averages is truly remarkable. It shows how much drive the guy has, and the fact that at every second he is looking to get better.After being in the league for so many years and having accomplished what he has, you would think a player would slow down and accept the fact that there is younger guys coming up. It seems like he only get more motivated as every year goes on to prove people wrong.

Lebron can win 7 championships, and will still not be compared to Jordan, and his legacy still wont be greater then Bryants due to the fact that he went to Miami and teamed up with Wade and Bosh. Now I dont fault Lebron for this, because I can see that what he had in Cleveland was not going to lead him anywhere, but at the same time many people dont understand this, and never will. You have the all-time greats coming out of the woods more and more and praising Bryant, not because he is now all of a sudden a greater player, but more as a diss to Lebron for leaving, and unfortunately that will always be a knock on his legacy.

If there is one player that I believe will challenge Kobe Bryant as being the superior player and being ranked higher then him on the all time list when everything is said and then, I believe thats Kevin Durant. If Kevin Durant stays with the Thunder and manages to win a couple of rings, FMVPS, MVPS, he is more of a threat to Kobes throne at this point then Lebron is. For Lebron, the problem is he has DRose and Durant to compete with when it comes to legacy not Kobe Bryant. Kobe Bryant is chasing Michael Jordan and the all time greats, where Lebron, and the new guys coming in will be chasing Kobe, whether Lebron fanboys want to admit it or not.

I unlike many of you here, am a fan of both Kobe Bryant and Lebron James. I believe they are both extraordinary players, and I feel as though Lebron is the superior player, however Lebron is playing in tougher times, when there is way more competition than what Kobe has faced his entire career, and this whole new idea of players teaming up is only hurting his legacy further. It shouldnt be something that is used against him, but unless DRose or Durant leave their respected teams to go and play with someone else, at the end of the day if they win as many rings as Lebron, they will be cherished more as players.

[SwayDizzle]

All the Laker fans in this thread stating that what the OP said is false are completely wrong. I am a Laker fan and completely agree with the OP.

Lebron already is a better player then Kobe, and whoever tries to dispute it has a blind fold on. Yes Kobe has the killer instrinct, and the scoring aresenal, but Lebron has the size, the athleticism, and can very well take over games at any point just like Kobe as we have seen before.

People are so quick to forget, but with Cleveland, the guy was practically unstoppable. Yes people argue he had strong teammates, but being REALISTIC, no he did not. The fact that they won as many games, and made it as far into the playoffs as they did every year is truly amazing, and that was due to Lebron. As we have seen Laker fans, even with Kobe, one man cant do everything himself. Lebron had the talent around him, but the talent wasnt producing. I did not want to comment on the Lebron hate going on as of late due to his so called " lack of killer instinct" because it just makes my skin crawl that people would even question something like that. Obviously going to Miami, things are different so ofcourse he is going to be more hesitant. Now instead of having Gibson to pass to, and the likes of Varejao, he has Dwayne Wade and Chris Bosh. Very very different scenario, and I bet if Lebron didnt pass at the end of games looking for Wade and so on, people would say he is a ball hog and that he is trying to outshine Wade. I have actually heard people bring this up last year when Lebron was taking all the late game shots, which is just ridiculous. Anyways I am not going to go on about this subject because I could go on for days, but yes the OP is right.
Lebron has been the better player between the two for the last 3 years or so, and will go down as the better player.

However, Kobe Bryant will go down as having a better legacy and will be cherished more as a player. I have noticed that as Kobe Bryant ages, he seems to get more and more fans, and people that use to criticize him once are now big fans of his. This is due to the fact that they are now starting to cherish the type of player Bryant is. The fact that he is 33 years old, and still putting up numbers better then his career averages is truly remarkable. It shows how much drive the guy has, and the fact that at every second he is looking to get better.After being in the league for so many years and having accomplished what he has, you would think a player would slow down and accept the fact that there is younger guys coming up. It seems like he only get more motivated as every year goes on to prove people wrong.

Lebron can win 7 championships, and will still not be compared to Jordan, and his legacy still wont be greater then Bryants due to the fact that he went to Miami and teamed up with Wade and Bosh. Now I dont fault Lebron for this, because I can see that what he had in Cleveland was not going to lead him anywhere, but at the same time many people dont understand this, and never will. You have the all-time greats coming out of the woods more and more and praising Bryant, not because he is now all of a sudden a greater player, but more as a diss to Lebron for leaving, and unfortunately that will always be a knock on his legacy.

If there is one player that I believe will challenge Kobe Bryant as being the superior player and being ranked higher then him on the all time list when everything is said and then, I believe thats Kevin Durant. If Kevin Durant stays with the Thunder and manages to win a couple of rings, FMVPS, MVPS, he is more of a threat to Kobes throne at this point then Lebron is. For Lebron, the problem is he has DRose and Durant to compete with when it comes to legacy not Kobe Bryant. Kobe Bryant is chasing Michael Jordan and the all time greats, where Lebron, and the new guys coming in will be chasing Kobe, whether Lebron fanboys want to admit it or not.

I unlike many of you here, am a fan of both Kobe Bryant and Lebron James. I believe they are both extraordinary players, and I feel as though Lebron is the superior player, however Lebron is playing in tougher times, when there is way more competition than what Kobe has faced his entire career, and this whole new idea of players teaming up is only hurting his legacy further. It shouldnt be something that is used against him, but unless DRose or Durant leave their respected teams to go and play with someone else, at the end of the day if they win as many rings as Lebron, they will be cherished more as players.
:rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: Did not read.

[NLZ]

No other athlete is more talked about in basketball than LeBron.
Tim Tebow is the best QB, it's true.