Sources: Knicks tuning out coach

[RedBlackAttack]

Big trouble in the Big Apple...


Sources: Knicks tuning out coach
By Chris Broussard | ESPN The Magazine

After a remarkable Jeremy Lin-led run that made them the toast of the NBA, the Knicks have lost 8 of their last 10 games. There's plenty of blame to go around, but while some within the organization are questioning superstar Carmelo Anthony, most of the fingers are being pointed at head coach Mike D'Antoni, according to several sources close to the situation.

D'Antoni, hailed as an offensive genius during his successful tenure in Phoenix, has lost the Knicks' locker room, the sources say.

"The players like Mike as a person," one source said. "They think he's a good guy. But he doesn't have the respect of the team anymore."

D'Antoni is in the last year of a four-year deal and all indications are that he will not be brought back after this season; that is, if he survives the rest of this season. The Knicks are expected to make a run at Phil Jackson, who retired from the Lakers last year with 11 NBA titles.

But the Knicks, losers of six straight games, still have 24 games left to get through this year, and according to numerous sources close to the team, the reeling club is as dysfunctional in the locker room as it is on the court.

In addition to questioning D'Antoni, players are complaining about playing time, and confused about the offensive and defensive schemes.

It is lost on no one that the Knicks' free-fall coincides precisely with the return of Anthony. While Anthony was out with a groin injury, the Knicks won 6 of 7 games, including victories over the Los Angeles Lakers and defending champion Dallas Mavericks. With Lin leading D'Antoni's offense, the Knicks played fast and free, spacing the floor, hitting the open man, and even improving defensively.

But the day Anthony returned, the Knicks lost to the struggling New Jersey Nets, starting a sorry stretch that has washed away all the feel-good emotions of Lin's emergence and left them on the verge of missing the playoffs.

Management, the coaching staff and the players know Anthony is hurting the offense and in turn, the defensive morale, according to the sources. While D'Antoni's offense calls for Anthony to plant himself on the wing at the 3-point line, he often creeps in to his favorite spot in the floor -- the area between the elbow, the arc and the post. That kills the Knicks' ability to run the high pick-and-roll and ruins the spacing that is so critical to D'Antoni's offense.

"That's at the very core of our problem," one person close to the situation said. "That messes up the fluidity of the offense. Melo could do it, but he's got to trust the offense."

When Anthony first returned -- and it still appears to be the case -- Lin would bring the ball up court and try to run D'Antoni's system. When Anthony would abandon the offense, Lin would not pass him the ball, which irritated Anthony, sources said. So when Lin tried to talk to Anthony on the court, Anthony would turn his back to the point guard and tune him out. The two never had heated exchanges, though, and the players tried to come to a compromise, agreeing to run D'Antoni's system while also mixing in post-ups for Anthony.

"But it's just a mess because D'Antoni's system is not designed for that," one source said.

Despite his often poor body language, many of the players believe Anthony is trying to adjust and sincerely wants to win. He has told people close to him that he is being asked to do things he's never done, saying that throughout his career he has always had plenty of post-up opportunities and that he is uncomfortable standing on the wing spacing the floor.

"Half the team is trying to do what coach says and the other half is doing something different," one source said. "Then it spills over to the defensive end because players are (ticked) off about somebody taking a bad shot."

With Anthony sapping the energy from the offense, the players often lose their incentive to play defense. But even when he's trying to play defense, Amare Stoudemire struggles. Having spent almost his entire career in D'Antoni's non-defensive system, Stoudemire has trouble making defensive reads and rotations. Anthony knows what to do defensively, but simply refuses to do it consistently, the sources said.

Some players believe D'Antoni had the leverage to force Anthony to adjust to his system when he first returned from injury. The Knicks were rolling, showing they could win without Anthony, and their fan base was believing in D'Antoni's system. If D'Antoni had checked Anthony, perhaps even benching him, when he strayed from the offense, the players and fans would have been behind the coach and Anthony would have had no choice but to conform. But D'Antoni, ever the one to avoid confrontation with his players, would not do it, and now it's too late. That's when he lost the locker room for good.

Now, the players believe they need a coach who will hold players, especially the stars like Anthony and Stoudemire, accountable, the sources said. They do not believe D'Antoni is willing or able to do it.

On top of that, Baron Davis, who just returned from a back injury, is unhappy with his limited role as Lin's backup. Davis, averaging just 17 minutes a game, has already spoken to D'Antoni about giving him more playing time, according to the sources. While Lin wants to run D'Antoni's system, Davis is more in line with running the offense through Anthony and Stoudemire, the sources said.

"The only way this is going to work is if we have a coach that will hold Melo accountable and teach Melo, Amare and Jeremy how to play winning basketball," a source said.

Chris Broussard is a senior writer for ESPN The Magazine.

Link (http://espn.go.com/new-york/nba/story/_/id/7684157/mike-dantoni-lost-new-york-knicks-locker-room-according-sources)

[DMV2]

Broussard briefly mentioned this during the Celtics-Lakers halftime show after they showed the Knicks-Bulls highlights.

[RedBlackAttack]

Broussard briefly mentioned this during the Celtics-Lakers halftime show after they showed the Knicks-Bulls highlights.
I've said all along that blindly blaming the coach for what is happening in New York is misguided and short-sighted. However, if he has lost the team, there really is no going back from that as a coach.

It may be time to move on... Problem is, it doesn't matter who the coach is, there are fundamental problems with the core makeup of this team and, unlike Miami who is able to overcome chemistry issues with pure talent, the Knicks as individuals are not good enough to do that.

Major issues... Possible unresolvable issues on this roster.

[Sarcastic]

If Carmelo gets the coach fired, it will be the best thing to happen to the Knicks since 1999 when they made the finals as the 8 seed.

[keep-itreal]

sounds like either jeremy lin, melo, or amare is gonna get traded

[Kingwillball]

There it is in Black and White.. Melo is the Cancer, most already knew it but now there is no denying it.. PLus Coach Pringles has got to go at this point..

[ballashotcalla]

I think you have to look at Melo first.

He came to NY to be a star and get attention. He didn't come to win a championship. To win a championship, you have to do the nitty gritty hustle and defensive plays every night. He hustles when he plays against Lebron, Pierce, etc. but fails miserably against the likes of Taj Gibson, ilyasova, etc.

[PHaYze]

So it comes down to Melo vs. Pringles?

[ballashotcalla]

There it is in Black and White.. Melo is the Cancer, most already knew it but now there is no denying it.. PLus Coach Pringles has got to go at this point..

Either Melo or dantoni goes. Both don't need to be gone.

[PHaYze]

Either Melo or dantoni goes. Both don't need to be gone.
It only makes sense to get rid of D'antoni. He's had his chance with the Knicks, his record is sub .500.

[BlitzForce]

http://www.nydailynews.com/sports/basketball/knicks/carmelo-anthony-trade-sense-ny-knicks-wallet-garden-honcho-lead-on-court-success-article-1.1038532#ixzz1p3qczPmk



According to a team source, at least one member of James Dolan's inner circle wants to trade Anthony for the same reason the Knicks acquired him 13 months ago: money.
Part of that thinking is Jeremy Lin's meteoric rise from anonymous bench warmer to international phenomenon. "Linsanity" has created a financial windfall for the Knicks unlike anything they've seen before.

The second-year point guard is a one-man money making machine for the Garden, which is experiencing a significant spike in ticket sales, ratings and merchandise since Lin became a household name in early February.
There is a feeling inside the organization that it makes business, and to a lesser degree basketball sense, to severe ties with Anthony, the perennial All Star who has struggled since returning from a groin injury. The Knicks are 2-8 with Anthony back in the lineup including a six game losing streak.

The source would not reveal the name of the executive pushing to trade Anthony but the Daily News has learned that Anthony still has two formidable allies in his corner; Dolan, the Chairman of Madison Square Garden and MSG President Scott O'Neil, who both played significant roles in bringing Anthony to New York.

[Sarcastic]

There it is in Black and White.. Melo is the Cancer, most already knew it but now there is no denying it.. PLus Coach Pringles has got to go at this point..

It doesn't mean he is a cancer. It just means that D'Antoni's streetball style of ball will never work unless the best player on the team is a point guard.

MDA should go coach the Wizards. Let John Wall put up 40/10/10, by possessing the ball 90% of the time.

[Kingwillball]

I think you have to look at Melo first.

He came to NY to be a star and get attention. He didn't come to win a championship. To win a championship, you have to do the nitty gritty hustle and defensive plays every night. He hustles when he plays against Lebron, Pierce, etc. but fails miserably against the likes of Taj Gibson, ilyasova, etc.


Yup I noticed U see a Different Melo against Certain teams and Players but this guy is the Issue and it isnt coincidence the team was Playing much better and more cohesive while he was out.. It has also affected Lin as Linsanity has not been the same since his Return along with Bdavis who obviously thinks He should be getting more PT..

[blacknapalm]

lol @ melo tuning out lin because he was trying to run his coach's system. that's just childish and immature

[Scoooter]

Sounds like a real clusterf*ck, as my father would say.

[Draz]

How's this big trouble? This might be bigger news then signing Melo/Amare

[LockoutOver11]

knicks investment on melo is too much... coach will be gone. I feel bad for Lin, hes prolly like wahhht do i do... fields help me out. fields cant say shit either. tyson needs to be captain. i thought melo could be a leader but nah. it was amares team last year, but people respect defense. amare cant play a lick of it....

next year, this team with no smith, davis, and maybe even fields.. lose alot of depth and pieces that if used right could have made this team so dangerous...
that really sucks.

[BlitzForce]

Well Melo likes Lin :)


Anthony is not jealous of Jeremy Lin’s global fame, according to the source. Lin, the source said, is Anthony’s favorite teammate, and Anthony feels they could be like the Thunder duo of Kevin Durant and Russell Westbrook.

[RedBlackAttack]

How's this big trouble? This might be bigger news then signing Melo/Amare
It's big news because when New York made its splash in 2010 with Amare and then an even bigger splash last year with Melo, the idea was that this 'Super Team' would be the ones that rivaled the Heat in the East.

Now, the team is in turmoil, the coach may be gone and the biggest superstar catch that the team has had since Patrick Ewing may be soon to follow... And, they are under .500 and clinging desperately to the 8th playoff spot in the East... With teams in total rebuild mode like the Cavs nipping at their heels.

How could you not consider this big news?

[ballashotcalla]

Well Melo likes Lin :)

Source?

Who wrote this fake crap?

[bdreason]

Does anyone honestly think Rick Adelman wouldn't have this Knicks team in the playoffs out East?






The truth is, Dantoni is a one-trick pony, and Jeremy Lin isn't Steven Nash.

[BlitzForce]

Well Melo likes Lin :)

[QUOTE]Anthony is not jealous of Jeremy Lin

[Smoke117]

It's big news because when New York made its splash in 2010 with Amare and then an even bigger splash last year with Melo, the idea was that this 'Super Team' would be the ones that rivaled the Heat in the East.

Now, the team is in turmoil, the coach may be gone and the biggest superstar catch that the team has had since Patrick Ewing may be soon to follow... And, they are under .500 and clinging desperately to the 8th playoff spot in the East... With teams in total rebuild mode like the Cavs nipping at their heels.

How could you not consider this big news?

The only people who had that idea were delusional Knick fans.

[Sarcastic]

When the whole Lin thing started, everyone said that it was Melo who told MDA to play Lin, EXCEPT Mike D'Antoni. He refused to give Melo credit for Lin, even though Lin himself came out and said it was Melo.

FCK Mike D'Antoni. I hope he never works in the NBA ever again.

[RedBlackAttack]

The only people who had that idea were delusional Knick fans.
Well, you have to remember... There was still the idea that they may also acquire Chris Paul or some other big piece.

Hopefully, what is happening in New York puts an end to this AAU-ification of the NBA. You can't just take a bunch of really individually delicious pieces, blindly toss them into a blunder and expect a tasty result.

To build a truly great team, it is imperative that the pieces fit together and they bring out the best of one another. As much as I would like to see the Knicks knock off the likes of the Heat in the postseason, it feels like these kinds of experiments are best off failing for the good of the league.

[ballashotcalla]

Well Melo likes Lin :)





http://www.nypost.com/p/sports/knicks/source_anthony_at_odds_with_antoni_YjNqpRkBHjhTuav BXv5IhJ#ixzz1p4FvgIqk

Publicly, he would say this. Even with those close to him, he would say this.

You would have to be mentally retarded to say you do not like Lin if you are on the Knicks roster.

[markymark]

They can go the short term route and win a ring now.

Trade Amare, Lin, and a draft pick for D-Ho. You now have a core of Melo-Baron-Dwight. Fire Pringles, then get a defensive-minded coach and let Melo's skills flourish in a half-court oriented O.

Championship.

[ballashotcalla]

When the whole Lin thing started, everyone said that it was Melo who told MDA to play Lin, EXCEPT Mike D'Antoni. He refused to give Melo credit for Lin, even though Lin himself came out and said it was Melo.

FCK Mike D'Antoni. I hope he never works in the NBA ever again.

Actually, we don't know the whole situation.

When Lin came out on the radio to talk about that situation, it was more a PR talk to get people to see that Lin and Melo were cool.

Lin never said he saw melo say it. Lin said, he heard from another source that Melo said to play Lin.

[strifed169]

I'd rather have Dantoni than Melo, and the rest of the Divas in Baron and JR, the GM of this team needs to be jumped and stomped publicly

[RedBlackAttack]

Publicly, he would say this. Even with those close to him, he would say this.

You would have to be mentally retarded to say you do not like Lin if you are on the Knicks roster.
I don't know... I don't think Lin is above critique at this point. He had a great run to start his time in New York, but so far in March, he is averaging almost 4 turnovers per game, shooting 39% from the field, yet still taking almost 15 shots a game.

Why is it that the entire Knicks organization can be taken to task for recent failures, but Lin is above reproach? Hell, if I were a teammate, that would probably bother me.

[Sarcastic]

Actually, we don't know the whole situation.

When Lin came out on the radio to talk about that situation, it was more a PR talk to get people to see that Lin and Melo were cool.

Lin never said he saw melo say it. Lin said, he heard from another source that Melo said to play Lin.

Obviously you are completely talking out of your ass and never listened to the interview.

http://newyork.cbslocal.com/2012/02/16/linsanity-comes-to-wfan-knicks-phenom-jeremy-lin-with-boomer-carton/


“I’m just confused, because he’s the one who vouched for me in the first place,”

[Micku]

And apparently Davis feels like he shouldn't really be the backup. He wants to play through Melo and Amare while Lin wants to play the coach system. I feel like they should really split up. Have Lin come off the bench, where he could play the coaches ball and have Davis in the starting lineup.

Either way, it's not going to work out if the players are not listening to the coach. They are going to trade or get another coach.

[ballashotcalla]

I don't know... I don't think Lin is above critique at this point. He had a great run to start his time in New York, but so far in March, he is averaging almost 4 turnovers per game, shooting 39% from the field, yet still taking almost 15 shots a game.

Why is it that the entire Knicks organization can be taken to task for recent failures, but Lin is above reproach? Hell, if I were a teammate, that would probably bother me.

Whether or not Lin is to blame doesn't change the fact that Lin will not be traded.

100% guaranteed he is going to be back with the Knicks.

So that means we turn to the other players on the team that can or will probably be traded.

[Lover]

Obviously you are completely talking out of your ass and never listened to the interview.

http://newyork.cbslocal.com/2012/02/16/linsanity-comes-to-wfan-knicks-phenom-jeremy-lin-with-boomer-carton/
In an interview before that he was asked and said,


On whether Lin appreciated Anthony's gesture, the second-year player said, "Of course! ... I didn't hear about that until after the game."

http://espn.go.com/new-york/nba/story/_/id/7583284/jeremy-lin-got-my-shot-new-york-knicks-thanks-carmelo-anthony

You can tell when he was being interviewed that he didn't have firsthand information of it happening. Stephen A. Smith had already told the public that Melo's the one that asked for him to be in the lineup before Lin ever said anything at all.

[bdreason]

Lin cannot be traded or benched?


So Knicks are going to build around Jeremy Lin now?




:roll: :roll: :roll:

[RedBlackAttack]

Whether or not Lin is to blame doesn't change the fact that Lin will not be traded.

100% guaranteed he is going to be back with the Knicks.

So that means we turn to the other players on the team that can or will probably be traded.
I didn't say they were trading him, although, it is pretty funny that a guy who was cut from a team a month ago is now untouchable. I was responding to the notion that you would 'have to be mentally retarded to say that you don't like Lin if you are on the Knicks roster.'

There are legitimate complaints that players could have with his play recently.

[Lover]

Lin was never asked whether or not he knows FIRSTHAND that Carmelo Anthony vouched for him. A story was released that said Carmelo Anthony vouched for him and then the reporter asked Lin how he felt about it. Lin has never confirmed it ever even happening. And neither has any other player, coach, or staff member.

[Sarcastic]

In an interview before that he was asked and said,



http://espn.go.com/new-york/nba/story/_/id/7583284/jeremy-lin-got-my-shot-new-york-knicks-thanks-carmelo-anthony

You can tell when he was being interviewed that he didn't have firsthand information of it happening. Stephen A. Smith had already told the public that Melo's the one that asked for him to be in the lineup before Lin ever said anything at all.

When did I say it was firsthand? Jeremy Lin went on the radio and said it was Melo. D'Antoni went on the radio and said he really couldn't remember how it happened. Are you telling me that Lin, as a good Christian would go out there and lie to the world about what happened?

[Lover]

Lin cannot be traded or benched?


So Knicks are going to build around Jeremy Lin now?




:roll: :roll: :roll:
I'd rather build around a chair than build around Carmelo Anthony.

[Sarcastic]

Lin was never asked whether or not he knows FIRSTHAND that Carmelo Anthony vouched for him. A story was released that said Carmelo Anthony vouched for him and then the reporter asked Lin how he felt about it. Lin has never confirmed it ever even happening. And neither has any other player, coach, or staff member.

His exact words were "he vouched for me". Whether he knew about it at the moment it came from Melo's mouth is irrelevant.

[RedBlackAttack]

I'd rather build around a chair than build around Carmelo Anthony.
Wow. How quickly things change.

Melo hasn't played in the kind of offense to suit his style of play since leaving Denver. Knicks fans are already totally done with him? :oldlol:

[markymark]

I don't know... I don't think Lin is above critique at this point. He had a great run to start his time in New York, but so far in March, he is averaging almost 4 turnovers per game, shooting 39% from the field, yet still taking almost 15 shots a game.

Why is it that the entire Knicks organization can be taken to task for recent failures, but Lin is above reproach? Hell, if I were a teammate, that would probably bother me.

Have to agree. His Taiwanese roots + Harvard background + the fact that he is touted as the ultimate teammate somehow makes him immune to criticism.

Imagine the backlash JR Smith would receive if he gets 10 turnovers.

[Sarcastic]

Wow. How quickly things change.

Melo hasn't played in the kind of offense to suit his style of play since leaving Denver. Knicks fans are already totally done with him? :oldlol:

No. Real Knick fans want him here.

[Scoooter]

No. Real Knick fans want him here.
Questionable.

[bdreason]

I'd rather build around a chair than build around Carmelo Anthony.


Melo never missed a single season of the Playoffs in the WESTERN CONFERENCE. You think the Knicks struggling to make the playoffs out East is really his fault?

You think if Rick Adelman was coaching this Knicks squad, they wouldn't be in the playoffs out East?

[Lover]

When did I say it was firsthand? Jeremy Lin went on the radio and said it was Melo. D'Antoni went on the radio and said he really couldn't remember how it happened. Are you telling me that Lin, as a good Christian would go out there and lie to the world about what happened?
He did no such thing. He was asked about how he felt about it he wasn't asked whether or not it was true. How else would he get the information whether or not it happened if it wasn't firsthand?
Melo fed Stephen A. Smith the story.
Stephen A. Smith posted it.
EVERYBODY read it.
Lin was asked about it and said in a "cool, I appreciate it" way not "yeah, that's how it happened" way.

[Kingwillball]

Wow. How quickly things change.

Melo hasn't played in the kind of offense to suit his style of play since leaving Denver. Knicks fans are already totally done with him? :oldlol:


Honestly though U think if U replaced Melo with Lebron Knicks would lose 6 in a Row.. I dont think so and Lebron would be out of sorts in a Dantoni Offense as well.

[Sarcastic]

He did no such thing. He was asked about how he felt about it he wasn't asked whether or not it was true. How else would he get the information whether or not it happened if it wasn't firsthand?
Melo fed Stephen A. Smith the story.
Stephen A. Smith posted it.
EVERYBODY read it.
Lin was asked about it and said in a "cool, I appreciate it" way not "yeah, that's how it happened" way.

I posted the interview. Go listen to it.

[Lover]

His exact words were "he vouched for me". Whether he knew about it at the moment it came from Melo's mouth is irrelevant.
The question already contained Melo "vouching" for him as if it were fact. His answer was something like, "the fact that he vouched for me says a lot" which sounds more like it's news to him (great news, but still news) like it is to everyone else.

[ballashotcalla]

Obviously you are completely talking out of your ass and never listened to the interview.

http://newyork.cbslocal.com/2012/02/16/linsanity-comes-to-wfan-knicks-phenom-jeremy-lin-with-boomer-carton/


:facepalm



Lin never said he saw melo say it. Lin said, he heard from another source that Melo said to play Lin.



On whether Lin appreciated Anthony's gesture, the second-year player said, "Of course! ... I didn't hear about that until after the game."

[bdreason]

Honestly though U think if U replaced Melo with Lebron Knicks would lose 6 in a Row.. I dont think so and Lebron would be out of sorts in a Dantoni Offense as well.


If the offense consisted of LeBron standing in the corner and taking jumpers to "spread the floor" for Jeremy Lin, then yes, the Knicks would lose just like they're losing now.

[Sarcastic]

The question already contained Melo "vouching" for him as if it were fact. His answer was something like, "the fact that he vouched for me says a lot" which sounds more like it's news to him (great news, but still news) like it is to everyone else.

Go listen to the interview, and stop posting until you do. Ok?

[Lover]

I posted the interview. Go listen to it.
And go look up what he said before that interview where he was asked "did you know Melo vouched for you?" and he said, "No, I didn't know that until after the game". So as far as we know, the only person claiming Melo vouched for him is Melo.

[Lover]

If the offense consisted of LeBron standing in the corner and taking jumpers to "spread the floor" for Jeremy Lin, then yes, the Knicks would lose just like they're losing now.
They already tried a "Melo offense" and they started the season 8-15.

[Scoooter]

If the offense consisted of LeBron standing in the corner and taking jumpers to "spread the floor" for Jeremy Lin, then yes, the Knicks would lose just like they're losing now.
LeBron would probably be the point guard.

[Sarcastic]

And go look up what he said before that interview where he was asked "did you know Melo vouched for you?" and he said, "No, I didn't know that until after the game". So as far as we know, the only person claiming Melo vouched for him is Melo.

The shit you posted came out on Feb 17. He did the Boomer and Carton show on Feb 16.

[Lover]

The shit you posted came out on Feb 17. He did the Boomer and Carton show on Feb 16.
That's when the quote was posted not when the interview took place genius.

[Sarcastic]

That's when the quote was posted not when the interview took place genius.

It doesn't matter if he heard it directly from Melo's mouth. The point is that Melo said it, and Lin has never denied that.

Why would Melo tell D'Antoni to play Lin right in front of Lin's face? That's the kind of conversation between coach and star that happens behind closed doors.

[Lover]

It doesn't matter if he heard it directly from Melo's mouth. The point is that Melo said it, and Lin has never denied that.

Why would Melo tell D'Antoni to play Lin right in front of Lin's face? That's the kind of conversation between coach and star that happens behind closed doors.
How can Lin deny it when he doesn't know if it's one way or the other? The only person that CAN know it other than Melo is the coach. And the coach said NOPE.

[Lover]

Lin heard about the "vouching" the same way we heard it....via Melo's own personal cheerleader Stephen A. Smith.

[Sarcastic]

How can Lin deny it when he doesn't know if it's one way or the other? The only person that CAN know it other than Melo is the coach. And the coach said NOPE.

The coach never said NOPE. He said he does not remember. Everyone else said it was Melo.

[Shih508]

It doesn't matter if he heard it directly from Melo's mouth. The point is that Melo said it, and Lin has never denied that.

Why would Melo tell D'Antoni to play Lin right in front of Lin's face? That's the kind of conversation between coach and star that happens behind closed doors.

ya, we all know melo's not an attention whore by any mean and we should believe w/e craps that came out of his mouth like gold

[Shih508]

The coach never said NOPE. He said he does not remember. Everyone else said it was Melo.

Truth is Jeremy and Pringles are trying to be nice here to not calling out Melo' bluff

[Lover]

The coach never said NOPE. He said he does not remember. Everyone else said it was Melo.
He pretty much said No. "He might've, I don't remember" = "No, but I'm not gonna say that outright because the media's killing Melo right now and Dolan's breathing down my throat."

No other player confirmed it happening. Everyone always refers to the report. Nobody actually has firsthand knowledge of it ever occurring other than Melo of course.

Lin plays out of his mind and leads the bottomfeeding Knicks out of the doldrums.

Melo comes out and says it was his idea.

RIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIGHT.

[Sarcastic]

ya, we all know melo's not an attention whore by any mean and we should believe w/e craps that came out of his mouth like gold

I am not asking you to believe him. Believe Jeremy Lin.

[QUOTE=Jeremy Lin]

[Sarcastic]

He pretty much said No. "He might've, I don't remember" = "No, but I'm not gonna say that outright because the media's killing Melo right now and Dolan's breathing down my throat."

No other player confirmed it happening. Everyone always refers to the report. Nobody actually has firsthand knowledge of it ever occurring other than Melo of course.

Lin plays out of his mind and leads the bottomfeeding Knicks out of the doldrums.

Melo comes out and says it was his idea.

RIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIGHT.


Show me some proof it was someone else. Otherwise you are just speculating. Every bit of evidence points to Melo saying it.

Oh, that's right. You don't have any evidence. Genius.

[Lover]

Truth is Jeremy and Pringles are trying to be nice here to not calling out Melo as a liar
Yeah, I mean the media and the fans have been killing Melo all season long. If anyone came out and denied this, Melo would look really really bad and the team chemistry would implode even more.

I remember a reporter going on ESPN, forget if it was a Knicks beat writer or an ESPN writer but he was asked if he really believed it. And he said he really doubted it and finds it hard to believe that a player would do that. Glen Grunwald was asked about it and said he'd never heard of it either until the report came out.

[ballashotcalla]

I am not asking you to believe him. Believe Jeremy Lin.

Listen to 3:46.

http://espn.go.com/new-york/nba/story/_/id/7583284/jeremy-lin-got-my-shot-new-york-knicks-thanks-carmelo-anthony

Straight from the horse's mouth.



No, I didn't know about that until after the game.

There's reason to believe he read the report by steve a smith. If he heard from another player, he would've probably mentioned it.

[Lover]

I am not asking you to believe him. Believe Jeremy Lin.
Right, after he told us he didn't hear about it until after. Believe what you want to believe.

[Sarcastic]

Yeah, I mean the media and the fans have been killing Melo all season long. If anyone came out and denied this, Melo would look really really bad and the team chemistry would implode even more.

I remember a reporter going on ESPN, forget if it was a Knicks beat writer or an ESPN writer but he was asked if he really believed it. And he said he really doubted it and finds it hard to believe that a player would do that. Glen Grunwald was asked about it and said he'd never heard of it either until the report came out.

:lol @ basing your shit on what an ESPN writer said. That's the worst place to get your news.

You're pathetic.

[ballashotcalla]

Nobody but steve a smith said melo said it.

/end

[Lover]

Listen to 3:46.

http://espn.go.com/new-york/nba/story/_/id/7583284/jeremy-lin-got-my-shot-new-york-knicks-thanks-carmelo-anthony

Straight from the horse's mouth.



There's reason to believe he read the report by steve a smith. If he heard from another player, he would've probably mentioned it.
Exactly. It's so absurdly obvious. Only Melo fans think otherwise.

[Lover]

:lol @ basing your shit on what an ESPN writer said. That's the worst place to get your news.

You're pathetic.
As opposed to picking and choosing which quotes you want to use and ignore the question the person was asked? Cool.

[Lover]

Nobody but steve a smith said melo said it.

/end
Yup. Not a single writer, a single player, a single other source. Not one. You would think one of the assistants would know about it? Kenny Atkinson? Mike Woodson? Phil Weber? Nope. Nobody.

[RedBlackAttack]

Honestly though U think if U replaced Melo with Lebron Knicks would lose 6 in a Row.. I dont think so and Lebron would be out of sorts in a Dantoni Offense as well.
When did I say that Melo was as good as LeBron? He isn't. That doesn't mean he isn't worth building around. If James is the standard that every player in the league has to live up to, there aren't many players worthy of building a team around.

[Sarcastic]

Listen to 3:46.

http://espn.go.com/new-york/nba/story/_/id/7583284/jeremy-lin-got-my-shot-new-york-knicks-thanks-carmelo-anthony

Straight from the horse's mouth.



There's reason to believe he read the report by steve a smith. If he heard from another player, he would've probably mentioned it.

OMG. I am not going in circles with you all night long.

I never said Lin heard it at the moment it came from Melo's mouth.

D'Antoni has a lot to gain by making sure that Melo does not get the credit. He was the one that was about to cut Lin's ass after the Nets game. He looks like a total idiot for that. He's the one that had him the entire damn year, and refused to play him. He's the one that played Toney Douglas all year, when it was clear as day he could not play point guard.

D'Antoni looks like the biggest idiot in the world if he says Melo is the one who said it. Of course he is gonna cover his ass.

[Lover]

When did I say that Melo was as good as LeBron? He isn't. That doesn't mean he isn't worth building around. If James is the standard that every player in the league has to live up to, there aren't many players worthy of building a team around.
There aren't. If you can't nab one of the true franchise players, you don't build around one player.

[Lover]

OMG. I am not going in circles with you all night long.

I never said Lin heard it at the moment it came from Melo's mouth.

D'Antoni has a lot to gain by making sure that Melo does not get the credit. He was the one that was about to cut Lin's ass after the Nets game. He looks like a total idiot for that. He's the one that had him the entire damn year, and refused to play him. He's the one that played Toney Douglas all year, when it was clear as day he could not play point guard.

D'Antoni looks like the biggest idiot in the world if he says Melo is the one who said it. Of course he is gonna cover his ass.
I like how you think D'Antoni has to cover his ass, but Melo doesn't have to try and make himself look better after everybody in the media killed him. Cool story bro.

[bdreason]

Why are you guys so focused on Melo and Lin's 'relationship'? This isn't reality TV. Kobe and Shaq hated each other for 3 titles. Nobody liked MJ for 6 championships. Honestly, who gives a fukc if these guys like each other or not? Talk about something relevant, like how Dantoni can't make the playoffs out East with 3 All-stars and the Asian sensation.

I bet Dantoni is a running joke amongst NBA coaches (pun intended).

[ballashotcalla]

OMG. I am not going in circles with you all night long.

I never said Lin heard it at the moment it came from Melo's mouth.

D'Antoni has a lot to gain by making sure that Melo does not get the credit. He was the one that was about to cut Lin's ass after the Nets game. He looks like a total idiot for that. He's the one that had him the entire damn year, and refused to play him. He's the one that played Toney Douglas all year, when it was clear as day he could not play point guard.

D'Antoni looks like the biggest idiot in the world if he says Melo is the one who said it. Of course he is gonna cover his ass.

Go read your post 31 and carefully read what you quoted from me.

Your apology is accepted.

[selrahc]

knicks should tune out carmelo, thats who they should tune out.

[Sarcastic]

So if it wasn't Melo, then who was it that decided to play Lin?

If you have ever watched a Knick game, you would know that Mike D'Antoni is not known to play people at the end of his bench. Players get thrown into his doghouse, and never get out. He is notorious for overplaying people and wearing them out. Why all of the sudden would he play a 3rd string point guard that he was about to cut?

[RedBlackAttack]

There aren't. If you can't nab one of the true franchise players, you don't build around one player.
I don't like the idea of building around "one player," LeBron James or no. Hell, he already proved that even he wasn't capable of winning in that manner.

What I was referring to was being able to win with Melo as the best player on your team. I'm not sure how it turned into, "LeBron could do better with the Knicks, so Melo must not be the guy."

Again, crazy way of looking at things. And, yeah... I think, if done the right way with the right system and the right coach, a team with Melo as a vital piece contends for a title. He is a great enough player to live up to that standard. The way it was done in New York, however, was all wrong. He isn't great enough to overcome a team and system that works contrary to his strengths as a player.

[Sarcastic]

I like how you think D'Antoni has to cover his ass, but Melo doesn't have to try and make himself look better after everybody in the media killed him. Cool story bro.

Why does Melo want to make himself look better? He is Dolan's best friend. He ain't going anywhere.

[Lover]

So if it wasn't Melo, then who was it that decided to play Lin?

If you have ever watched a Knick game, you would know that Mike D'Antoni is not known to play people at the end of his bench. Players get thrown into his doghouse, and never get out. He is notorious for overplaying people and wearing them out. Why all of the sudden would he play a 3rd string point guard that he was about to cut?
The Nets game wasn't the first game where he was the first PG off the bench. He got more minutes in NJ because Shump got in foul trouble.

[Lover]

Why does Melo want to make himself look better? He is Dolan's best friend. He ain't going anywhere.
According to a recent report by Berman, apparently they're not as close as people think. But, of course you can discredit any report that doesn't support your agenda.

[Sarcastic]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZoqXlGvsTUA

Here's Jeremy Lin with Melo and Tyson chilling after a game, before Linsanity started. These guys were friends for the whole year.

[Sarcastic]

According to a recent report by Berman, apparently they're not as close as people think. But, of course you can discredit any report that doesn't support your agenda.

:oldlol: Marc Berman hates Carmelo, and he writes for the NY Post. He has the biggest anti Carmelo agenda of all the writers.

You are arguing with someone who lives in NY, and knows these stories very well.

[Lover]

I don't like the idea of building around "one player," LeBron James or no. Hell, he already proved that even he wasn't capable of winning in that manner.

What I was referring to was being able to win with Melo as the best player on your team. I'm not sure how it turned into, "LeBron could do better with the Knicks, so Melo must not be the guy."

Again, crazy way of looking at things. And, yeah... I think, if done the right way with the right system and the right coach, a team with Melo as a vital piece contends for a title. He is a great enough player to live up to that standard. The way it was done in New York, however, was all wrong. He isn't great enough to overcome a team and system that works contrary to his strengths as a player.
Melo doesn't make players better. Great scorer. But he can't be the best player on the team. LeBron for all his faults makes every player better and that's undeniable. Look at Fields. Look at Amare. If Melo can play within a team concept, sure keep him. But he needs to know his place.

[Sarcastic]

D'Antoni didn't even let Lin practice with Melo and Amar'e for the entire year, up until Linsanity started. He hated Lin. He used to put him in garbage minutes, then pull him within a minute or so.

[Faberg]

Get Melo off my team. Now.

[Lover]

:oldlol: Marc Berman hates Carmelo, and he writes for the NY Post. He has the biggest anti Carmelo agenda of all the writers.

You are arguing with someone who lives in NY, and knows these stories very well.
You don't have to be from New York to read the news. Welcome to 2012. There's this thing called the INTERNET.

BTW, I live in NY. But go ahead and keep nitpicking the news stories you want to believe and taking quotes out of context to support your agenda. Good luck to ya.

[ballashotcalla]

D'Antoni didn't even let Lin practice with Melo and Amar'e for the entire year, up until Linsanity started. He hated Lin. He used to put him in garbage minutes, then pull him within a minute or so.

Where are you getting your crazy ideas?

Tell me Knicks insider, how many practices have they had from Dec 28 to February 4? I'm not talking about together. I'm asking how many practices have the Knicks had during that time frame?

[Lover]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZoqXlGvsTUA

Here's Jeremy Lin with Melo and Tyson chilling after a game, before Linsanity started. These guys were friends for the whole year.
Can't believe you tricked me into watching that whole thing and Lin and Melo didn't have a single interaction.

[Lover]

For the people that don't trust the post or daily news, how about the times?

http://www.nytimes.com/2012/03/14/sports/basketball/anthonys-return-has-hurt-the-knicks.html?_r=1

[Bigsmoke]

I'd rather have Dantoni than Melo, and the rest of the Divas in Baron and JR, the GM of this team needs to be jumped and stomped publicly

u rather keep the worst coach in the NBA over a top 3 SF?

thats some crazy shit.

[Micku]

The Knicks were better without Melo. It just seem that Melo kills the ball movement.

The game with the Bulls, Lin and Fields should've gave Melo or Amare the ball. Amare was open a few times and Melo had mismatch opportunities that Lin/Fields missed.

And Melo wasn't in form. He has been missing a lot of shots and easy shots lately.

There are two different teams on the Knicks basically. I feel the coach needs to put Lin to the bench. Not because he sucks, but because Lin would probably play much better with the bench than with Melo/Amare. Davis could possibly play better with Melo/Amare, but they will do a mixup of what Melo likes to do without the coaches system. Davis is a vet and he knows how to run the offense better. Lin will learn later.

[Haymaker]

However good the Knicks were in the short-lived Linsanity run, D'Antoni's disdain for defense would've killed any chance of winning in the playoffs. Hire Van Gundy or ****, Lenny Wilkens if he still breathes, trade Anthony for Crash/Wesley Matthews and that's it.

[I<3NBA]

D'Antoni is a bad coach. a good coach would've been able to manage the egos on this team.

[xtn5021]

Trade Melo to the Warriors, we'll give you Sjax..

:D

[swi7ch]

So it all started when Melo returned, eh? Pretty shocking there! :rolleyes:

[swi7ch]

Nice classy move of Baron adding to the disorder. Well done, veteran! :applause:

[Kiddlovesnets]

Oh wait a sec, I heard that the Knicks would be amazing with Baron Davis being their Steve Nash. Why hasnt it happened?
:eek:

[DMV2]

Have to agree. His Taiwanese roots + Harvard background + the fact that he is touted as the ultimate teammate somehow makes him immune to criticism.

Imagine the backlash JR Smith would receive if he gets 10 turnovers.
He's only immune(at least for this season) for any blame this season due to the fact that 3 weeks ago he put the Knicks back into the playoff picture.

The kid was the 14th/15th man on the roster, he had nothing to due with the Knicks' 8-15 start. The 5-9 turnovers he had did result in wins.

You can still criticize the bad areas of his game though but for the Knicks failure to make the playoffs that's 0% on him.

[MiseryCityTexas]

Get Melo off my team. Now.

budinger, t-will, thabeet, and a bunch of other rockets scrubs for mello.

[Shepseskaf]

Look, forgetting about who gets the credit for the decision to play Lin (who gives a f anyway?), the real elephant in the room is that Carmelo just might be on the downside of his career.

He has all the talent in the world, but has never committed to keeping in top condition. You can just look at him to see this. He's been coasting on his talent, and now its starting to tell.

Mark my words, nagging groin injuries, leg injuries, and such things will now become more common because he's not really in shape.

The real reason there's so much indecision in NY on what to do is that Lin is not a proven commodity, and what if you get rid of Carmelo and the team still can't get the job done?

I say get rid of Carmelo for some solid pieces. Time will prove that he's past his peak prematurely. Let some other team pay for him to cruise through the rest of his career.

[bagelred]

This sounds made up. Broussard is simply taking educated guesses as to what's going on, and made up a story. I could have made up the same exact story based on what's going on with the Knicks.....

"Sources say players upset with D'Antoni........tuning him out.......confusion over roles........."

Do you need a source to come up with that?

[Blue&Orange]

That's the most bullshit ridiculous article i've seen in awhile

It's a let's blame Melo for everything, disguised of it's D'Antoni fault.

Melo ruins the spacing, never happened, Melo angry at Lin, never happened, D'Antoni Offense mixed up with Melo post-ups being the problem, never happened, Melo posted-up one time in the last 3 games and he didn't get the ball, Players without incentive to play defense because of Melo, :roll: priceless, that's a new one.

And their fan base was believing in D'Antoni's system? What system? D'antoni have no system, only idiots believe D'Antoni have a system, you got former players saying D'Antoni have no system. Watching the LA-Grizzlies games and the Grizzlies have more things going on in one play than the Knicks in a whole game, that tells you how bad D'Antoni is.

"Accourding to sources" - Broussard sources is Santa claus and his reindeer's.

Melo is a bum because he doesn't post up, Melo is a bum because he doesn't stand behind the 3 point line.... it's hilarious.

It's a lie, obvious the only spacing that is hurt, it's Broussards spacing between his brain cells, but i clearly remember everyone angry at D'Antoni because of the way he used Gallinari, everyone wanted Gallo doing more than just stand behind the 3 point line, but now frack Melo for not standing in the 3 point line, again hilarious.

Why isn't Stat hurting the spacing? Why is Melo that is always more further from paint hurting the spacing and Amare is not? :hammerhead:

I can't stop laughing, if it was true, if the offense of any coach is to put a player like Melo behing the 3 point line, how can anyone defend that coach and say it's the player fault?

Melo barely touches the ball, 2 fga 4th quarter last game, where is the win? His usage is half of what his career average is. Where are the Knicks runs when Melo in on the bench? Why don't the Knicks play better when Melo is on the bench? The only thing Melo haters have it's a puny run when the sixers players weren't trying anymore cause the game was already over, in every other 5 games, when Melo was not playing it was the other team that made runs... so again, why without the hurt spacing techniques of Melo on the floor, why don't the Knicks play better?

http://www.82games.com/1112/1112NYK.HTM

Chandler +6.9
Melo +6.7
Novak +5.3
Lin +3.2

Lin's Knicks without Melo lost to New Orleans AFAIK.

Love how Brossard forgot to mention the level of competition for Knicks winning streak other than LA and Dallas at home, and forgot to mention that Knicks wins against Atlanta and Cavs was with Melo playing, no agenda at all, let's just mention the last six games... :pimp:

This reeks of Zach Randolph all over again, the guy that is playing in Memphis exactly like he was playing in New York, exactly the same numbers, same production, but went from joke to All-Star, somehow...

The fact that Knicks haters are bashing Melo left and right, and trying to blame him for everything should give dumb Knicks fans a clue, and i mean Knicks fans, no Linidiots or Gallo gay lovers, or Amare fans, or D'Antoni mustache zealots.

so yeah let's trade Melo, because the Knicks without Amare and Melo and Chandler hurt, and with Lin being properly scouted, the Knicks would have won at least one of the last six games :facepalm

[niko]

Broussard just figured this out? Like this is news?

[JMT]

You needed "sources" to figure this out ?

[It's A VC3!!!]

If you don't know how to effectively mesh in Carmelo, Amare, and Lin you deserve to be fired. There are tons of other coaches who would love the chance to turn the Knicks big 3 in to a cohesive unit. Just fire Mike or trade Melo, one or the either.

[Kiddlovesnets]

You hire a coach but give inappropriate players to him, cant see any difference between this and forcing a NASCAR champion to drive a helicopter.

[Punpun]

The Knicks are expected to make a run at Phil Jackson, who retired from the Lakers last year with 11 NBA titles.

What am I reading ? :oldlol:

[Clutch]

You hire a coach but give inappropriate players to him, cant see any difference between this and forcing a NASCAR champion to drive a helicopter.
That's stupid comparison.
NASCAR driver is paid to drive a car,not a helicopter just like a basketball coach is paid to coach a basketball team,not a football team.
He isn't paid to coach whatever player he wants.
He's paid to coach the team GM gives to him.

If he can't adjust he simply isn't a good coach.
Knicks have so much talent and D'Antoni doesn't know how to use it.
I seriously don't know is it possible to do any worse with this team.

[Kiddlovesnets]

That's stupid comparison.
NASCAR driver is paid to drive a car,not a helicopter just like a basketball coach is paid to coach a basketball team,not a football team.
He isn't paid to coach whatever player he wants.
He's paid to coach the team GM gives to him.

If he can't adjust he simply isn't a good coach.
Knicks have so much talent and D'Antoni doesn't know how to use it.
I seriously don't know is it possible to do any worse with this team.

Oh alright then, name me a coach that can coach this Knicks team, other than those who have retired or hired by an elite team?

[bmulls]

That's stupid comparison.
NASCAR driver is paid to drive a car,not a helicopter just like a basketball coach is paid to coach a basketball team,not a football team.
He isn't paid to coach whatever player he wants.
He's paid to coach the team GM gives to him.

If he can't adjust he simply isn't a good coach.
Knicks have so much talent and D'Antoni doesn't know how to use it.
I seriously don't know is it possible to do any worse with this team.

And what's he supposed to do when his primadonna "superstar" won't buy into his system because "he doesn't like it"?

If I was D'Antoni I sit his ass on the bench and go back to the Linsanity lineup. He's gone at the end of the season anyway, nothing to lose and everything to gain.

[305Baller]

And what's he supposed to do when his primadonna "superstar" won't buy into his system because "he doesn't like it"?

If I was D'Antoni I sit his ass on the bench and go back to the Linsanity lineup. He's gone at the end of the season anyway, nothing to lose and everything to gain.

exactly. The coach should make an adjustment now , it is obviously not working.

[niko]

Oh alright then, name me a coach that can coach this Knicks team, other than those who have retired or hired by an elite team?
Either Van Gundy. Adelman. Mark Jackson in retrospect would have worked. The way we play now, Woodson would probably be better.

We don't have a team to run and gun except situationally. So a half court coach would not be a disaster.

[Clutch]

Oh alright then, name me a coach that can coach this Knicks team, other than those who have retired or hired by an elite team?
Who could do any worse ? Team with Carmelo Anthony,Amare Stoudemire and Tyson Chandler should be much better than 9th place in the weak East.

[Bigsmoke]

Oh alright then, name me a coach that can coach this Knicks team, other than those who have retired or hired by an elite team?

thats why they should have did what the Timberwolves were able to do during the off season.

Fire their current coach and get the best coach in basketball today in rick adelman.

they came from just be historically bad to actually looking to make the playoffs in the West with just the addition of Rubio and Derrick who are both rookies.

[Blue&Orange]

And what's he supposed to do when his primadonna "superstar" won't buy into his system because "he doesn't like it"?

Can you give examples in the past games, of things Melo did that show he isn't doing what the coach ask of him?

Could u just stop sucking your boyfriends c0cks for a minute and shed some light on the subject.

[blablabla]

Can you give examples in the past games, of things Melo did that show he isn't doing what the coach ask of him?

Could u just stop sucking your boyfriends c0cks for a minute and shed some light on the subject.
not streching the floor posting tkaing space away from chandler and amare
he plays his own game

[Killbot]

That was a painful read. He said sources way too many times. Blah blah blah, sources said. Oh yeah, that's helpful.

Article sounds fake, but at the same time with the Knicks losing, that might be true.

[Punpun]

Am I the only one who laughed at the Knicks going after Phil Jackson ?

:oldlol:

[SwooshReturns]

I would tune him out, too ... defense wins championships.

[plUto or bUst]

Melo barely touches the ball, 2 fga 4th quarter last game, where is the win? His usage is half of what his career average is. Where are the Knicks runs when Melo in on the bench? Why don't the Knicks play better when Melo is on the bench? The only thing Melo haters have it's a puny run when the sixers players weren't trying anymore cause the game was already over, in every other 5 games, when Melo was not playing it was the other team that made runs... so again, why without the hurt spacing techniques of Melo on the floor, why don't the Knicks play better?

http://www.82games.com/1112/1112NYK.HTM

Chandler +6.9
Melo +6.7
Novak +5.3
Lin +3.2


You're looking at the wrong stats if you're trying to answer the question of whether the Knicks play better when Melo is on the court. You should be looking at On Court / Off Court. Melo's net is -1.6. The Knick's are slightly less productive with Melo on the floor. Of course, being paired with Amare might be the bigger problem, as Amare's is -10.7, which is simply atrocious for someone getting major minutes.

[Blue&Orange]

You're looking at the wrong stats if you're trying to answer the question of whether the Knicks play better when Melo is on the court. You should be looking at On Court / Off Court. Melo's net is -1.6. The Knick's are slightly less productive with Melo on the floor. Of course, being paired with Amare might be the bigger problem, as Amare's is -10.7, which is simply atrocious for someone getting major minutes.
lol yes if i was RETARDED i would be looking at the on court\ off court stat, Know what, Chandler is the 3 worst Knicks player this season.

http://www.insidehoops.com/forum/showpost.php?p=7020592&postcount=4

[D-Wade316]

lol yes if i was RETARDED i would be looking at the on court\ off court stat, Know what, Chandler is the 3 worst Knicks player this season.

http://www.insidehoops.com/forum/showpost.php?p=7020592&postcount=4
+/- is "noisy" in small samples.

[Blue&Orange]

not streching the floor posting tkaing space away from chandler and amare
he plays his own game
:facepalm :

i clearly remember everyone angry at D'Antoni because of the way he used Gallinari, everyone wanted Gallo doing more than just stand behind the 3 point line, but now frack Melo for not standing in the 3 point line, again hilarious.

Why isn't Stat hurting the spacing? Why is Melo that is always more further from paint hurting the spacing and Amare is not? :hammerhead:

[Blue&Orange]

+/- is "noisy" in small samples.
That's funny because Chandler is the Knicks player with more minutes. And any other stat will show that he has been arguably the most valuable player throughout the season.

[plUto or bUst]

lol yes if i was RETARDED i would be looking at the on court\ off court stat, Know what, Chandler is the 3 worst Knicks player this season.

http://www.insidehoops.com/forum/showpost.php?p=7020592&postcount=4

The on court \ off court stat is flawed, especially with small sample sizes. Besides, I never said you could use just that one stat to prove a players value to the team.

I'm just pointing out that you used the wrong stat if you're trying to prove your point that Knicks are better with Melo on the floor. The production stat measures a players production against his positional counterpart and has almost no bearing on whether his team plays better with him on the floor.

[Pointguard]

I've said all along that blindly blaming the coach for what is happening in New York is misguided and short-sighted. However, if he has lost the team, there really is no going back from that as a coach.

It may be time to move on... Problem is, it doesn't matter who the coach is, there are fundamental problems with the core makeup of this team and, unlike Miami who is able to overcome chemistry issues with pure talent, the Knicks as individuals are not good enough to do that.

Major issues... Possible unresolvable issues on this roster.

In Miami the individuals are superior passers and great defenders and play a defensive game. The Knicks did have offensive chemistry at one point as recent as a month ago. The coach, has trouble incorporating Mello, has trouble with defense his entire career and especially now, and got rid of a versatile defensive player at a needed position in favor of a one dimensional offensive player in a loaded position. Coach also alienated, doghoused, about seven players to extreme proportions most of the time for garbage reasons - so he has definite communication problems, since his arrival in NY.

If there are core personelle problems the coach can try different lineups - which he hasn't done, with the core. If Amare and Mello miss key defensive coverages, like they do three times every game, bench them. The coach is a major part of the problem.

[plUto or bUst]

That's funny because Chandler is the Knicks player with more minutes. And any other stat will show that he has been arguably the most valuable player throughout the season.

He's also probably the Knick that was paired with Amare the most over the course of the season.

[GOBB]

"Half the team is trying to do what coach says and the other half is doing something different," one source said. "Then it spills over to the defensive end because players are (ticked) off about Jeremy Lin taking a bad shot."

Fixed!

:roll:

[Pointguard]

I don't know... I don't think Lin is above critique at this point. He had a great run to start his time in New York, but so far in March, he is averaging almost 4 turnovers per game, shooting 39% from the field, yet still taking almost 15 shots a game.

Why is it that the entire Knicks organization can be taken to task for recent failures, but Lin is above reproach? Hell, if I were a teammate, that would probably bother me.
When Lin was on the last day of the contract - he was playing to stay in the league. Seemingly, his style was the best thing needed for the Knicks to win. No other touch worked, not the coach, not Mello, not Amare. Why go after the only proven commodity on the team. If you were a teammate and wanted to win, you would want to go back to playing to your winning and united ways. The only time they were happy, winning and celebrating was when Lin was integral to the team. Why reproach the guy that reflects hope, change and winning?

[RedBlackAttack]

In Miami the individuals are superior passers and great defenders and play a defensive game. The Knicks did have offensive chemistry at one point as recent as a month ago. The coach, has trouble incorporating Mello, has trouble with defense his entire career and especially now, and got rid of a versatile defensive player at a needed position in favor of a one dimensional offensive player in a loaded position. Coach also alienated, doghoused, about seven players to extreme proportions most of the time for garbage reasons - so he has definite communication problems, since his arrival in NY.

If there are core personelle problems the coach can try different lineups - which he hasn't done, with the core. If Amare and Mello miss key defensive coverages, like they do three times every game, bench them. The coach is a major part of the problem.

You are right in that the biggest thing that separates Miami from these other 'Super Teams' (most notably NY) is that they are so good defensively and so good when they get out and run, it makes up for fundamental problems in their chemistry as a half-court offensive team.

New York is made up of mostly offensive-oriented talent (aside from Chandler and Shumpert), so if they aren't clicking on that end, they aren't going to be able to contend strictly based on shutting down opponents.

I still say that there are serious issues even with Miami's Super Team and that it will rear its ugly head once again when the playoffs begin and the game starts slowing down. Their offensive sets really haven't improved much since last year when all three of Bosh, James and Wade are playing. Wade and James just do nothing for one another in their half-court sets.

However, they will still be damn difficult to beat because of their defensive prowess.

As far as the Knicks are concerned, I see clashing styles. I see square pegs attempting to be stuffed into round holes with MDA's offense. I see a young point guard who has become all the rage, but his scoring mentality really doesn't fit into a starting lineup who already didn't have enough shots to go around.

I still think that a step in the right direction would be to start Davis and allow Lin to be that offensive spark off of the bench.


I'm not blaming any of these guys, though... Not Lin, Melo or even D'Antoni. I blame the people who have put this thing together. There wasn't much thought given to how these guys would play with one another... Just about acquiring as many big names as possible.

When you have natural fits like Ray Allen, Kevin Garnett and Paul Pierce, it is a great idea. When your offense is focused around Lin, Stat and Melo, there are going to be problems.

And, I don't personally think the answer is to get rid of your best player.

[Pointguard]

That's funny because Chandler is the Knicks player with more minutes. And any other stat will show that he has been arguably the most valuable player throughout the season.
Chandler does more right things than any other Knick. Obviously his defense is great. He plays hard, smart, aggressive and tenacious every game. Is the leader and support guy. Without him the team would just be a disjointed crazy bunch. I respect him at a whole different level.

[SwooshReturns]

New York is made up of mostly offensive-oriented talent
So are the Bulls, but they are the 2nd best defensive team in the league ... each player at every position is at best average defender for their place on the floor. Most down right bad ...

Rose - Average
Hamilton - Average
Deng - Average
Boozer - Atrocious
Noah - Average

It's a team mind set, philosophy, and effort thing.

The Knicks two defenders in Shumpert and Chandler are better man and help defenders than ANYONE on the Bulls. Which begs the question why are they so terrible defensively?

It's an effort and philosophy thing.

[Blue&Orange]

The on court \ off court stat is flawed, especially with small sample sizes. Besides, I never said you could use just that one stat to prove a players value to the team.

I'm just pointing out that you used the wrong stat if you're trying to prove your point that Knicks are better with Melo on the floor. The production stat measures a players production against his positional counterpart and has almost no bearing on whether his team plays better with him on the floor.
The goal of a game of basketball is to win games not be aesthetic pleasing, if the 5 players of your team have better production than their counterpart they will win the game. How do you or anybody takes +\- over player production is beyond me.

http://www.nba.com/games/20120309/NYKMIL/gameinfo.html, see the play by play.
Knicks are killing the Bucks, 28-18 D'Antoni decides do substitutions and play Melo, Harrelson back from injury, Davis, Novak, Shumpert. Look well at that lineup, first time ever playing together, no center, 2 small forwards, quarter ends at 36-34 for the Knicks. How do you think that affected Melo +\-?


How does that translate to Knicks being worse with Melo on the floor? They were doing fine with Melo on the floor with a decent rotation.

[Blue&Orange]

New York is made up of mostly offensive-oriented talent (aside from Chandler and Shumpert), so if they aren't clicking on that end, they aren't going to be able to contend strictly based on shutting down opponents.

And yet when Chandler was out, Jeffries out, D'Antoni decided to play Shumpert for just 5 minutes :facepalm

[Pointguard]

You are right in that the biggest thing that separates Miami from these other 'Super Teams' (most notably NY) is that they are so good defensively and so good when they get out and run, it makes up for fundamental problems in their chemistry as a half-court offensive team.

New York is made up of mostly offensive-oriented talent (aside from Chandler and Shumpert), so if they aren't clicking on that end, they aren't going to be able to contend strictly based on shutting down opponents.

I still say that there are serious issues even with Miami's Super Team and that it will rear its ugly head once again when the playoffs begin and the game starts slowing down. Their offensive sets really haven't improved much since last year when all three of Bosh, James and Wade are playing. Wade and James just do nothing for one another in their half-court sets.

However, they will still be damn difficult to beat because of their defensive prowess.

As far as the Knicks are concerned, I see clashing styles. I see square pegs attempting to be stuffed into round holes with MDA's offense. I see a young point guard who has become all the rage, but his scoring mentality really doesn't fit into a starting lineup who already didn't have enough shots to go around.

I still think that a step in the right direction would be to start Davis and allow Lin to be that offensive spark off of the bench.

I'm not blaming any of these guys, though... Not Lin, Melo or even D'Antoni. I blame the people who have put this thing together. There wasn't much thought given to how these guys would play with one another... Just about acquiring as many big names as possible.

When you have natural fits like Ray Allen, Kevin Garnett and Paul Pierce, it is a great idea. When your offense is focused around Lin, Stat and Melo, there are going to be problems.

And, I don't personally think the answer is to get rid of your best player.
:cheers: Good Post!

Stat and Mello are challenged defensively and are less willing to change like Pierce and Ray were. The problem is our two best players and Lin are defensively challenged when compared to (Allen/PP/KG, Kobe/Bynum, Gas, Lebron/Wade/Bosh, OKC, Memphis)... . The only way to have a tri-pod is to have the three core guys with their foot on the gas... if they are playing defense the energy will be there offensively. Those other guys named above never play like Amare and Mello.

[Kappy]

Am I the only one who laughed at the Knicks going after Phil Jackson ?

:oldlol:

NOPE!! :roll:

There is NO WAY Phil Jackson would come back to coach the Knicks!! Not going to happen!

[Pointguard]

So are the Bulls, but they are the 2nd best defensive team in the league ... each player at every position is at best average defender for their place on the floor. Most down right bad ...

Rose - Average
Hamilton - Average
Deng - Average
Boozer - Atrocious
Noah - Average

It's a team mind set, philosophy, and effort thing.

The Knicks two defenders in Shumpert and Chandler are better man and help defenders than ANYONE on the Bulls. Which begs the question why are they so terrible defensively?

It's an effort and philosophy thing.
Deng and Noah are among the best at their position. But Chandler is a little better than Noah on pure defense. And Shumpert is arguably among the best perimeter defenders in the league. So our best two is right there with their best two, but after that its not close with anybody. Unfortunately Shumpert and Chandler aren't always paired. Mello and Amare just don't put in the effort. And you are right, it is philosophy coupled after that.

[Blue&Orange]

http://starting5.com.au/nba-news/1093-mike-dantoni--carmelo-could-flirt-with-a-triple-double-nightly


After a polished display against the New Jersey Nets in which Melo found open teammates all night after being double-teamed he finished with a rounded stat line of 39 points, 10 rebounds and 5 assists. D'Antoni says the offense should run through the newly aquired Knick and that he should be making the right play from there, be it with scoring or finding shots for teammates.

"Yeah, I thought he got after it and rebounded well," D'Antoni said Wednesday. "He should nightly be getting close to a triple double. The ball should be going through him a lot, and he should be knocking on that door."

Melo is primarily thought of as a scorer and only has one triple-double for his career, ironically against a Mike D'Antoni coached Phoenix team in 2007.
So yes it's Melo that isn't buying D'Antoni system, it's wasn't D'Antoni that tried to make him something that he was not, and in the process destroyed his confidence on doing what he do best, scoring. Clearly this start of the season, he was holding the ball because he wanted, not because he was told to.

Yes how can someone believe that Melo begged D'Antoni to play Lin. :facepalm

One thing is passing when being double teamed, other is running the offense, D'Antoni didn't get that.

[La Frescobaldi]

It doesn't mean he is a cancer. It just means that D'Antoni's streetball style of ball will never work unless the best player on the team is a point guard.

MDA should go coach the Wizards. Let John Wall put up 40/10/10, by possessing the ball 90% of the time.

It worked fine until Mushmelon showed up.

The Knicks were exploding with popularity and beating everybody. Same coach, same team, same everything except no Chronic Heroism Complex Bozo from Denver.

As I said at the beginning of the season, if the coach can't get the Offense Wrecker under control, the Knicks will just go back to 35 years of smelling up the place.

{sniff sniff... yep.... still smells like the Garden, coach can't control Anthony}

[Sarcastic]

It worked fine until Mushmelon showed up.

The Knicks were exploding with popularity and beating everybody. Same coach, same team, same everything except no Chronic Heroism Complex Bozo from Denver.

As I said at the beginning of the season, if the coach can't get the Offense Wrecker under control, the Knicks will just go back to 35 years of smelling up the place.

{sniff sniff... yep.... still smells like the Garden, coach can't control Anthony}

Average opponent winning percent during 7 game winning streak - 38%

Average opponent winning percent during 6 game losing streak - 60%

[PHaYze]

Average opponent winning percent during 7 game winning streak - 38%

Average opponent winning percent during 6 game losing streak - 60%
He won't reply to that.

[tpols]

Melo doesnt fit in the offense. Firing your coach and putting an interim guy in there wont solve anything. You cant tell Melo to spot up and play off of Lin's penetration.. he is just too spoiled, selfish and immature to fit into a role that doesnt involve him getting at least 10-12 isos a game.

[Shih508]

Average opponent winning percent during 7 game winning streak - 38%

Average opponent winning percent during 6 game losing streak - 60%

but Knicks winning % was 100% comparing to 0% now lol

[NoGunzJustSkillz]

Melo doesnt fit in the offense. Firing your coach and putting an interim guy in there wont solve anything. You cant tell Melo to spot up and play off of Lin's penetration.. he is just too spoiled, selfish and immature to fit into a role that doesnt involve him getting at least 10-12 isos a game.
it's a start.

[tpols]

So are the Bulls, but they are the 2nd best defensive team in the league ... each player at every position is at best average defender for their place on the floor. Most down right bad ...

Rose - Average
Hamilton - Average
Deng - Average
Boozer - Atrocious
Noah - Average

It's a team mind set, philosophy, and effort thing.

The Knicks two defenders in Shumpert and Chandler are better man and help defenders than ANYONE on the Bulls. Which begs the question why are they so terrible defensively?

It's an effort and philosophy thing.
lol Deng was the best SF defender in the entire league by defensive statistics.. and just watching him play. He's an elite defender. Noah is an elite defender because of his dedication and hustle. He's a top 3-5 big man defender/rebounder in the league. Hamilton has barely been playing and his replacement, Brewer, is a very good defender. Rose is an above average defender. Their bench is stacked with guys who all can play very good D.. Asik, Taj, Watson, Butler. They have a very good team of defenders. Calling Noah and especially Deng average is just :facepalm

[EveryManALion]

http://sports.yahoo.com/nba/news?slug=aw-wojnarowski_mike_dantoni_knicks_resigns_031412

[Blue&Orange]

http://espn.go.com/blog/new-york/knicks/post/_/id/14208/jeremy-lin-melo-and-i-are-fine




"He's always been really nice to me," Lin said. "He's always given me a lot of advice. Right now, we're actually learning to play with each other better in terms of chemistry. ... It's just we need to be able to use his strengths and to use it at the right time within the flow of the offense. And that's been a challenge for everyone in terms of, not just him, just finding the identity of the team in terms of how we're going to play."

What a sad day for the anti-melo mob.


:facepalm

[Droid101]

http://espn.go.com/blog/new-york/knicks/post/_/id/14208/jeremy-lin-melo-and-i-are-fine





What a sad day for the anti-melo mob.


:facepalm
LOL! It didn't take them long to find their "Identity" when it was Lin and Chandler running the high pick and roll every play and DOMINATING teams.

Now that Melo is back........ they are garbage. Trade his ass.

[Punpun]

Would you rather contend or be a first round exit Droid ?

[Sarcastic]

LOL! It didn't take them long to find their "Identity" when it was Lin and Chandler running the high pick and roll every play and DOMINATING teams.

Now that Melo is back........ they are garbage. Trade his ass.

They were beating teams with an average winning percent of 38%.

The losing streak is against teams with a winning percent of 60%.

Most of those wins were at home too. Most of the losses are on the road. Connect the dots from there.

[ronniec]

http://www.nydailynews.com/sports/basketball/knicks/carmelo-anthony-trade-sense-ny-knicks-wallet-garden-honcho-lead-on-court-success-article-1.1038532#ixzz1p3qczPmk

With Lin, they are making profit even losing games
Without Lin, they are just a shitty team

[inclinerator]

so this thead became a vouch for lin thead