How does Michael Jordan struggle in today's game....

[bwink23]

When no other 2-guards or perimeter players are??? :confusedshrug:

[Calabis]

When no other 2-guards or perimeter players are??? :confusedshrug:

because the NBA is full of hyper athletes today, and all though Jordan's physical gifts would make him top tier today, his 40+ inch vertical leap, would be only 20 inches today

[Punpun]

because the NBA is full of hyper athletes today, and all though Jordan's physical gifts would make him top tier today, his 40+ inch vertical leap, would be only 20 inches today

He didn't have a 48 inch in reality. That was inflated. He had a sub 40.

[Bless Mathews]

The biggest thing everyone forgets is back in mj 's day, defenders could literally assault players with the ball.... Now you can't even touch em....


With todays rules, mj would average 40

[Yao Ming's Foot]

Media would call him out for quitting on his teammates to sit the bench for the Birmingham Barons.

[Inactive]

He didn't have a 48 inch in reality. That was inflated. He had a sub 40.48 is probably exaggerated, but what makes you say that he's sub 40? To get his head at rim level, at 6'6 he'd need to jump 42 inches, wouldn't he?

http://marshallmatlock.com/wp-content/gallery/2011-12-05-jordan-throws-down-newman-wins-a-staring-contest-manolo-costa-rolls-his-own/thumbs/thumbs_michael%20jordan%20dunk%20contest,%20the%20 always%20gentleman.jpg

[bwink23]

Media would call him out for quitting on his teammates to sit the bench for the Birmingham Barons.


They didn't call him out for being a "scoring champion who couldn't win", the "Jordan Rules" book, his gambling addictions??


:coleman:

[SlayerEnraged]

When no other 2-guards or perimeter players are??? :confusedshrug:

We aren't saying he'd struggle. He'd very unlikely but at minimum do as good as he was but probabaly worse because the players at his position are bigger and quicker than potential ones back then. Transport 1988 Jordans body in todays game and he is gonna average as good if not worse stats than he did in that league.

[bwink23]

48 is probably exaggerated, but what makes you say that he's sub 40? To get his head at rim level, at 6'6 he'd need to jump 42 inches, wouldn't he?

http://marshallmatlock.com/wp-content/gallery/2011-12-05-jordan-throws-down-newman-wins-a-staring-contest-manolo-costa-rolls-his-own/thumbs/thumbs_michael%20jordan%20dunk%20contest,%20the%20 always%20gentleman.jpg


Jordan was damn near eye level with the rim on his FT dunks at his peak. How high you think he'd get if he didn't have to take the ball with him, and went more up than out ??

[Calabis]

He didn't have a 48 inch in reality. That was inflated. He had a sub 40.
How is it a sub 40, when a poster just posted a video, that stated an opponent did a study of measuring his lift on his jump shot throughout the course of a game...he avg 30.8 inches....the vid is on you tube

Dude easily was getting 42-44 inches off the ground

[The Iron Fist]

because the NBA is full of hyper athletes today, and all though Jordan's physical gifts would make him top tier today, his 40+ inch vertical leap, would be only 20 inches today


Jordan was the lebron of his time. Not in the sense of how they approach the game, but in the sense of their physical abilities. People marvel at brons physical attributes as they should because he is a freak of nature, for this time.

Jordan, was the freak of nature for his time. No other players had his speed or strength or athletic ability. Fast forward to todays times, and many players are built physically just like Jordan.

Its called human evolution. He'd still be great but the one advantage he had over his 80s and 90s peers, wouldn't be as evident today.

[bwink23]

Jordan was the lebron of his time. Not in the sense of how they approach the game, but in the sense of their physical abilities. People marvel at brons physical attributes as they should because he is a freak of nature, for this time.

Jordan, was the freak of nature for his time. No other players had his speed or strength or athletic ability. Fast forward to todays times, and many players are built physically just like Jordan.

Its called human evolution. He'd still be great but the one advantage he had over his 80s and 90s peers, wouldn't be as evident today.


Jordan schooled Clyde Drexler who is every bit as athletic and big (probably bigger than most 2 guards) as the wings today.

Jordan would be surrounded by more-comparable wings, but that's not what separated him the most.

[Calabis]

http://1.bp.blogspot.com/_6Q68jlJBARo/THL9qUYImSI/AAAAAAAAAaU/joczMPfjTHE/s1600/Jordan+Sideways+dunk+1987.jpg

Analysis of video here (http://www.google.com/imgres?imgurl=http://1.bp.blogspot.com/_6Q68jlJBARo/THL9qUYImSI/AAAAAAAAAaU/joczMPfjTHE/s1600/Jordan%2BSideways%2Bdunk%2B1987.jpg&imgrefurl=http://videosportsanalysis.blogspot.com/&usg=__AElUVoi18pCOlW9uFgc2vi8RL_0=&h=504&w=673&sz=167&hl=en&start=5&zoom=1&tbnid=7sdt1rNJ4UXQHM:&tbnh=103&tbnw=138&ei=itOJT9DeMenM2gXTjsm_CQ&prev=/search%3Fq%3Dmichael%2Bjordans%2Bhead%2Bat%2Brim%2 6um%3D1%26hl%3Den%26sa%3DN%26rlz%3D1T4ADFA_enUS465 US466%26tbm%3Disch&um=1&itbs=1)

[Calabis]

Jordan was the lebron of his time. Not in the sense of how they approach the game, but in the sense of their physical abilities. People marvel at brons physical attributes as they should because he is a freak of nature, for this time.

Jordan, was the freak of nature for his time. No other players had his speed or strength or athletic ability. Fast forward to todays times, and many players are built physically just like Jordan.

Its called human evolution. He'd still be great but the one advantage he had over his 80s and 90s peers, wouldn't be as evident today.

Jordan's physical gifts today would be only rivaled by Lebron, so yes it would be evident today, just like Lebrons are, include the better technology and friendly wing player rules and he would display even more athleticism then he did.

[PP34Deuce]

MJ would have the quickest first step at SG today.

One thing I notice in MJ clips was how he scored... he truly scored in the flow of the game. He would score like 6-8 fast break points, 6-8 points on cuts to the basket, 15-17 on isolation alone.

[The Iron Fist]

Jordan's physical gifts today would be only rivaled by Lebron, so yes it would be evident today, just like Lebrons are, include the better technology and friendly wing player rules and he would display even more athleticism then he did.


Not when other guards are the same size, with the same speed and strength.

In 15 years, players with lebrons attributes will be the norm like players of today have the physical attributes of Jordan.


This is going down the line of the Wilt argument. People love to say he was dominant because of his physical attribute advantages.


So, why isn't that the case for every other guy after?


I'll tell you why,
selective reasoning.

[Disaprine]

Media would call him out for quitting on his teammates to sit the bench for the Birmingham Barons.
http://29.media.tumblr.com/tumblr_lltzgnHi5F1qzib3wo1_400.jpg

[Mach_3]

Not when other guards are the same size, with the same speed and strength.

In 15 years, players with lebrons attributes will be the norm like players of today have the physical attributes of Jordan.


This is going down the line of the Wilt argument. People love to say he was dominant because of his physical attribute advantages.


So, why isn't that the case for every other guy after?


I'll tell you why,
selective reasoning.

no

[The Iron Fist]

no

So athletes don't get bigger, faster and stronger as medicine and technology improves?

I guess thats why all the world records for athletic competitions come from the 1930s.

[Inactive]

Jordan was the lebron of his time. Not in the sense of how they approach the game, but in the sense of their physical abilities. People marvel at brons physical attributes as they should because he is a freak of nature, for this time.

Fast forward to todays times, and many players are built physically just like Jordan. If you mean in terms of physical appearance then okay. But there were players who were lean/ripped in Jordan's time as well. If you mean there are players today with Jordan's physical attributes, then no, there aren't. No one has his combination of speed, quickness, agility, and jumping ability.


Its called human evolution. No, it's not. What selection pressures are there, for people who jump high, and run fast? With larger populations, you might expect to get a few more freaks in every generation, but Jordan was 1 in a billion, in any era. There are just a few billion more people now.

Athletes today might have slightly better methods for training, recover, and nutrition. Maybe PEDs are a little bit better. There might have been some minor improvements, in tactics, and techniques for both coaches and players. That's all that athletes of today have over athletes of previous generations.

[BlackJoker23]

When no other 2-guards or perimeter players are??? :confusedshrug:
because he's overrated trash and played in a weak era

[veilside23]

Jordan would struggle and still average 35 everynight...

players get better?? no i dont think so flashier maybe...

IF your best center now is dwight or bynum ....

how are they better than ewing or robinson and they are not even the best center of the 90's ....

[bwink23]

So athletes don't get bigger, faster and stronger as medicine and technology improves?

I guess thats why all the world records for athletic competitions come from the 1930s.

How many 2-guards in the league today you know are 6'6", fast as point guards, strong as power forwards, 44+ vertical leap, hands the size of baseball gloves, and cat quick??

Name them.

[bwink23]

because he's overrated trash and played in a weak era


How weak must this era be when Richard Jefferson can average almost 25 points a game?? :confusedshrug:

Scoring is up in the 2-guard position...Jordan would still be the best, just surrounded by more scorers at his position. :coleman:

[Asukal]

I wonder how these idiots come up with the idea that athletes become BIGGER FASTER AND STRONGER as years go by? You mean to say athletes from the ancient times are midgets compared to today? What about Wilt who could easily block shots high above rim level? He was from the 60s ffs, yet very few athletes today could come close to his athletic ability. Bigger faster stronger yeah right.... :facepalm IDIOTS!

[OldSchoolBBall]

Not when other guards are the same size, with the same speed and strength.

There's your first mistake. There is no one over 6'4" today who even approaches Jordan's speed. Not sure where you get this nonsense from, acting like there are a ton of 6'6" or better players out there as quick or quicker than Jordan. :oldlol:

[SlayerEnraged]

There's your first mistake. There is no one over 6'4" today who even approaches Jordan's speed. Not sure where you get this nonsense from, acting like there are a ton of 6'6" or better players out there as quick or quicker than Jordan. :oldlol:

It doesn't matter if players are as fast or strong as Jordan at his position. The NBA in 2007 ( haven't investigated more recent years) has nearly the same weight and height average as the early 1990's despite a much larger composition of players being centers or center/forwards in the 9e's. Done the research. Mj's competition would be better and those guys aren't gonna be as good as mj but thats not the question. He's gonna have more trouble with the bigger and faster perimeter players than he saw in the past.

[madmax]

There's your first mistake. There is no one over 6'4" today who even approaches Jordan's speed. Not sure where you get this nonsense from, acting like there are a ton of 6'6" or better players out there as quick or quicker than Jordan. :oldlol:

LOL at this fool...
Rose, Westbrook and Wall are all faster than Jordan in his prime. Players like Gerald Green and John White jump higher than Jordan too. Those are just few obvious examples from today's game. MJ ******gers:facepalm

[veilside23]

He's gonna have more trouble with the bigger and faster perimeter players than he saw in the past.


MJ @ 40 was able to score more than 40 points vs bigger faster players... imagine what a 30 year old MJ would do to this league...

I feel sad because i think some ISH posters dont even play a pick up game they just play it in their PC's, Gadgets and those freaking slamdunks you can do with playstation.... LoL

[veilside23]

LOL at this fool...
Rose, Westbrook and Wall are all faster than Jordan in his prime. Players like Gerald Green and John White jump higher than Jordan too. Those are just few obvious examples from today's game. MJ ******gers:facepalm


LoL those players are not even better than a 35 year old kobe bryant...

who's the fool now? Gerald green john white.. all they can do is jump.. but they dont even have mcgee's brain..... WTF ...

[bwink23]

LOL at this fool...
Rose, Westbrook and Wall are all faster than Jordan in his prime. Players like Gerald Green and John White jump higher than Jordan too. Those are just few obvious examples from today's game. MJ ******gers:facepalm

Are Rose, Westbrook, and Wall over 6'6" ??

:confusedshrug:

[Rolando]

Another brilliant thread: Human evolution happening within 10-15 years.:hammerhead:

Morons have to start realizing that guys like Wilt and Jordan were the the real deal, freaks of nature. Lebron is right there too with them.

[CavaliersFTW]

We aren't saying he'd struggle. He'd very unlikely but at minimum do as good as he was but probabaly worse because the players at his position are bigger and quicker than potential ones back then. Transport 1988 Jordans body in todays game and he is gonna average as good if not worse stats than he did in that league.
:roll:

Tell that sh*t to Kevin Durant... beefcakes in the NBA are not better athletes than sinewy ones, they are merely more momentous on a drive and set better screens. And this comes at the expense of agility, quickness, and the long term health of your knees and joints. The big athletes in today's league genuinely look like stiffs when I watch 1980's basketball and watch how those guys could move. Take that "they would struggle" BS somewhere else. The athleticism of a wirey physique is IMO the perfect physique for the game of basketball, this "I wanna be big" stuff of today's league harms far more NBA players than it does help them. Bynum, Oden, Yao, now Dwight with his back... How many collective seasons were Bill Russell, Wilt Chamberlain, Walt Bellamy, and Nate Thurmond sidelined with serious injury in the 60's?

[juju151111]

Chris brownerEnraged]We aren't saying he'd struggle. He'd very unlikely but at minimum do as good as he was but probabaly worse because the players at his position are bigger and quicker than potential ones back then. Transport 1988 Jordans body in todays game and he is gonna average as good if not worse stats than he did in that league.[/QUOTE]
Samething like KD skinny ass dropping 29 ppg and West brook,Rose, 06 Wade before he bulkdd up

[CavaliersFTW]

Chris brownerEnraged]We aren't saying he'd struggle. He'd very unlikely but at minimum do as good as he was but probabaly worse because the players at his position are bigger and quicker than potential ones back then. Transport 1988 Jordans body in todays game and he is gonna average as good if not worse stats than he did in that league.
Samething like KD skinny ass dropping 29 ppg and West brook,Rose, 06 Wade before he bulkdd up[/QUOTE]
Or Kobe when he bulked up and ended up doing worse so he slimmed back down. Or Kevin Love, losing weight even as a PF, and now lighting everyone up more so than last season.

[bwink23]

:roll:

Tell that sh*t to Kevin Durant... beefcakes in the NBA are not better athletes than sinewy ones, they are merely more momentous on a drive and set better screens. And this comes at the expense of agility, quickness, and the long term health of your knees and joints. The big athletes in today's league genuinely look like stiffs when I watch 1980's basketball and watch how those guys could move. Take that "they would struggle" BS somewhere else. The athleticism of a wirey physique is IMO the perfect physique for the game of basketball, this "I wanna be big" stuff of today's league harms far more NBA players than it does help them. Bynum, Oden, Yao, now Dwight with his back... How many collective seasons were Bill Russell, Wilt Chamberlain, Walt Bellamy, and Nate Thurmond sidelined with serious injury in the 60's?


EXCELLENT post....it's mind boggling the minutes those guys were logging in that pace.

[CavaliersFTW]

So athletes don't get bigger, faster and stronger as medicine and technology improves?

I guess thats why all the world records for athletic competitions come from the 1930s.

:facepalm to your entire post

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DEt_Xgg8dzc

No. They don't. HELL no. The composition of a Track, the speed suits, the shoes, the laser precision timing, and the refinement of technique contribute that sh!t. Your DNA is not better than your fathers, or your grandfathers, or --------------------------------------- your ancestor from 2,000 years ago. Evolution aint that fast and nutrition in the 1960's, 70's, and 80's isn't any different than it is today. Americans eat junk food.

[The Iron Fist]

:facepalm to your entire post

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DEt_Xgg8dzc

No. They don't. HELL no. The composition of a Track, the speed suits, the shoes, the laser precision timing, and the refinement of technique contribute that sh!t. Your DNA is not better than your fathers, or your grandfathers, or --------------------------------------- your ancestor from 2,000 years ago. Evolution aint that fast and nutrition in the 1960's, 70's, and 80's isn't any different than it is today. Americans eat junk food.



Uh, I mentioned technology.


But lemme ax you dis,
So all of the records were done 80 years ago and still stand, right?

[juju151111]

It doesn't matter if players are as fast or strong as Jordan at his position. The NBA in 2007 ( haven't investigated more recent years) has nearly the same weight and height average as the early 1990's despite a much larger composition of players being centers or center/forwards in the 9e's. Done the research. Mj's competition would be better and those guys aren't gonna be as good as mj but thats not the question. He's gonna have more trouble with the bigger and faster perimeter players than he saw in the past.
Why isn't Kome struggling then? Phil jackson said MJ is stronger then Kobe. Robert Horry said Mj was like a brick wall. Lol so if Mj was so bothered more physical defender right? Why did bruce bowen say Mj was his toughest guard not prime Kobe. Why isn't Durant struggling? Mj had no problem dunking on 7 ft shot blockers Robinson,Parish,Hakeem,Mt, Shaq.

[CavaliersFTW]

Uh, I mentioned technology.


But lemme ax you dis,
So all of the records were done 80 years ago and still stand, right?
Literally, 80 years ago they competed in different events than today. The athletes themselves would not be incompetent in the similar events today, and the record smashers back then would be up there with record smashers from any era given technology (for the most part... the equipment they use) which is the one thing you did have correct. Bob Beamon in the 60's >>>>>> any long jumper who has competed in the past 20 years. Wilt Chamberlain as a physical specimen >>>>>> any big man in the game today. There isn't a disparity between athleticism like people think there is. Physical freaks trickle out of the woodwork in every era in some form or another and you don't see numerous clones of them that can match their performance in eras that follow. People say they aren't ahead of their time, they aren't ahead of their time they are genetically marvelous specimens - and u can't replicate that force feeding an average joe "better nutrition" and time at the gym. MJ is/was a rare specimen

[raiderfan19]

So Jordan avged 23/6/5/1.3 as a 38 year old coming off 3 years off in 2002 in a league with prime tmac, Kobe and Vince among others and without his athleticism but I'm supposed to believe that prime Jordan wouldn't be able to dominate this league? Who's the best non Kobe or wade 2 guard right now? Eric Gordon? Monta Ellis? James harden? Old ray Allen? Really guys?

I knew the "he would struggle against today's athletes arguments would come at some point but good lord this is way to fast. He'd still be without question the best player in today's game?

[madmax]

Are Rose, Westbrook, and Wall over 6'6" ??

:confusedshrug:

let me tell you one little secret pal - Jordan wasn't 6'6" either:cheers:
More like 6'4" with a change, not much taller than your average PG of today

[Owl]

Default How does Michael Jordan struggle in today's game....
The short answer is he doesn't. Not even remotely.

The longer answer is he'd get slightly less points (slightly lower raw numbers all round) than 80's model Jordan because of a slower pace. He'd still be the best player in the league (and all time). He'd still be one of if not the greatest defensive guards of all time. And the SG position might be slightly worse than it really is today because they wouldn't have been able to study MJ.

[Inactive]

let me tell you one little secret pal - Jordan wasn't 6'6" either:cheers:
More like 6'4" with a change, not much taller than your average PG of todayhttp://www.gacksports.com/wp-content/uploads/2010/10/kobe-jordan-7589571.jpg

Yeah...

[bwink23]

let me tell you one little secret pal - Jordan wasn't 6'6" either:cheers:
More like 6'4" with a change, not much taller than your average PG of today


In shoes he was 6'6, 6'4 3/4" without.

Players listed heights today are with shoes....:rockon:

[CavaliersFTW]

let me tell you one little secret pal - Jordan wasn't 6'6" either:cheers:
More like 6'4" with a change, not much taller than your average PG of today
let me tell you one little secret pal

w/o Shoes:

Michael Jordan 6'4.88
Kobe Bryant 6'4.75
Dwayne Wade 6'3.75
Russell Westbrook 6'2.25
Kyrie Irving 6'1.75
Derrick Rose 6'1.5
Chris Paul 5'11.75

Avg height of all NBA drafted point guards w/o shoes 6'1.02 - avg weight 198
Avg height of all NBA drafted shooting guards w/o shoes 6'3.76 - avg weight 205

http://www.draftexpress.com/nba-pre-draft-measurements/?page=avepos&year=All&source=All&draft=100&sort=

[/Ether]

[bwink23]

let me tell you one little secret pal

w/o Shoes:

Michael Jordan 6'4.88
Kobe Bryant 6'4.75
Dwayne Wade 6'3.75
Russell Westbrook 6'2.25
Kyrie Irving 6'1.75
Derrick Rose 6'1.5
Chris Paul 5'11.75

Avg height of all NBA drafted point guards w/o shoes 6'1.02 - avg weight 198
Avg height of all NBA drafted shooting guards w/o shoes 6'3.76 - avg weight 205

http://www.draftexpress.com/nba-pre-draft-measurements/?page=avepos&year=All&source=All&draft=100&sort=

[/Ether]


I wonder how many of those players can dunk from the FT line....


:coleman:

[raiderfan19]

let me tell you one little secret pal - Jordan wasn't 6'6" either:cheers:
More like 6'4" with a change, not much taller than your average PG of today
How many pgs today are 6-4?

[CavaliersFTW]

I wonder how many of those players can dunk from the FT line....


:coleman:
Every one of them and better than he could do it because they are so much bigger/faster/stronger due to nutrition/medical sciences/weight training

:coleman:

[che guevara]

Jordan was the lebron of his time. Not in the sense of how they approach the game, but in the sense of their physical abilities. People marvel at brons physical attributes as they should because he is a freak of nature, for this time.

Jordan, was the freak of nature for his time. No other players had his speed or strength or athletic ability. Fast forward to todays times, and many players are built physically just like Jordan.

Its called human evolution. He'd still be great but the one advantage he had over his 80s and 90s peers, wouldn't be as evident today.
You're an idiot. Evolution works over hunderds of thousands of years, not 2 decades. A genetic freak in the year 1500 is still a genetic freak today, the difference being better training and technology. Transport 80's Jordan into today's league without the benefit of better training, and he would still be the single most athletic player in the league today - name a single current player who's a superior athlete?

Wait, I'll try to use your logic for a bit. Kobe may have been able to win titles back in the 2000's, but he can't compete with the athletes of the 2010's. That's why he's having his worst season since 1999.

[Inactive]

Every one of them and better than he could do it because they are so much bigger/faster/stronger due to nutrition/medical sciences/weight training

:coleman:Not to mention evolution. You know, cause we're going to randomly "evolve" into super intelligent mutant psychic incredible hulks any day now. Just like on pokemon. You do believe in evolution, don't you, bro?

[Lebron23]

I think MJ will still average 32-35 ppg in today's NBA.

[CavaliersFTW]

How many pgs today are 6-4?
OJ MAYO IS 6'5 CAUSE HIS LIST HEIGHT SAys oh wait no he's only 6'3.25 and he's pretty much the tallest PG in the NBA :lol

http://www.draftexpress.com/profile/O.J.-Mayo-238/

:facepalm @ pg's averaging 6'4 in height

[Lebron23]

Is Livingston still playing in the NBA?

[DonDadda59]

Not when other guards are the same size, with the same speed and strength.

Name one 2 guard today with Jordan's physical ability and attributes. I'll wait :lol


In 15 years, players with lebrons attributes will be the norm like players of today have the physical attributes of Jordan.

Just like every center today has Shaq's unique combination of size, speed, quickness, etc that was so rare in the 90s right?

Please stop. Freak players like Jordan, Shaq, Lebron come along once a generation, if that. There are no 2 guards like Jordan, there are no centers like Shaq, and you'll have to wait a very long time to find another player like Bron.

[CavaliersFTW]

Not to mention evolution. You know, cause we're going to randomly "evolve" into super intelligent mutant psychic incredible hulks any day now. Just like on pokemon. You do believe in evolution, don't you, bro?
:lol oh of course, we can evolve at will! And we only go up the ladder of progress, humans of the past are simply worse than us!

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/science/science-news/6372432/Usain-Bolt-would-have-been-outrun-by-our-ancestors-claims-anthropologist.html

[The Iron Fist]

Name one 2 guard today with Jordan's physical ability and attributes. I'll wait :lol



Just like every center today has Shaq's unique combination of size, speed, quickness, etc that was so rare in the 90s right?

Please stop. Freak players like Jordan, Shaq, Lebron come along once a generation, if that. There are no 2 guards like Jordan, there are no centers like Shaq, and you'll have to wait a very long time to find another player like Bron.
Kobe Bryant

[The Iron Fist]

Literally, 80 years ago they competed in different events than today. The athletes themselves would not be incompetent in the similar events today, and the record smashers back then would be up there with record smashers from any era given technology (for the most part... the equipment they use) which is the one thing you did have correct. Bob Beamon in the 60's >>>>>> any long jumper who has competed in the past 20 years. Wilt Chamberlain as a physical specimen >>>>>> any big man in the game today. There isn't a disparity between athleticism like people think there is. Physical freaks trickle out of the woodwork in every era in some form or another and you don't see numerous clones of them that can match their performance in eras that follow. People say they aren't ahead of their time, they aren't ahead of their time they are genetically marvelous specimens - and u can't replicate that force feeding an average joe "better nutrition" and time at the gym. MJ is/was a rare specimen

So there was no 100 meters in the Olympics?
No 4 X 100 relays?
No long jump?

I guess Jesse Owens never existed.

I guess the world really did start in 1984.

[raiderfan19]

What's funny about this thread is there is less talent at the 2 then there has been at any point in the last 20 years.

[Calabis]

Kobe Bryant

So a guy who copied Jordans game, but is less efficient, not as smart, and not as athletic, can have success, but Jordan would suffer....now I get it...:wtf:


yet a guy who has played against all of these guys and is still playing today doesn't know what he's talking about, when asked who's the best he's played against right?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KDfGaV6Da_g&feature=related

[Calabis]

Not when other guards are the same size, with the same speed and strength. In 15 years, players with lebrons attributes will be the norm like players of today have the physical attributes of Jordan.


This is going down the line of the Wilt argument. People love to say he was dominant because of his physical attribute advantages.


So, why isn't that the case for every other guy after?


I'll tell you why,
selective reasoning.

Name another 6'6 guard with Jordan's ability.....Kobe? a slightly less athletic version.....I don't see him struggling, but Jordan would:banghead:

[Nevaeh]

:roll:

Tell that sh*t to Kevin Durant... beefcakes in the NBA are not better athletes than sinewy ones, they are merely more momentous on a drive and set better screens. And this comes at the expense of agility, quickness, and the long term health of your knees and joints. The big athletes in today's league genuinely look like stiffs when I watch 1980's basketball and watch how those guys could move. Take that "they would struggle" BS somewhere else. The athleticism of a wirey physique is IMO the perfect physique for the game of basketball, this "I wanna be big" stuff of today's league harms far more NBA players than it does help them. Bynum, Oden, Yao, now Dwight with his back... How many collective seasons were Bill Russell, Wilt Chamberlain, Walt Bellamy, and Nate Thurmond sidelined with serious injury in the 60's?

Great post. Plus,it wasn't like 88-89 MJ was a stick figure either:



http://a.espncdn.com/media/pg2/2001/0921/photo/s_young_mj_i.jpg
http://blacksportsonline.com/index/lebron_mj.jpg



For those who don't think MJ could handle physical play, especially in today's " No touching Allowed" league:
http://www.sneakerfiles.com/wp-content/uploads/2006/12/8889detroitsalley.jpg

[kuniva_dAMiGhTy]

So a guy who copied Jordans game, but is less efficient, not as smart, and not as athletic, can have success, but Jordan would suffer....now I get it...:wtf:


yet a guy who has played against all of these guys and is still playing today doesn't know what he's talking about, when asked who's the best he's played against right?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KDfGaV6Da_g&feature=related

Like most of his fans, Kobe is insecure. Both are scared to death that he won't be recognized as on Jordan's level.

[CavaliersFTW]

So there was no 100 meters in the Olympics?
No 4 X 100 relays?
No long jump?

I guess Jesse Owens never existed.

I guess the world really did start in 1984.
In the U.S. 100 yards 220yards 440yards, in Europe meters, tracks were cinders, shoes were canvas, times were stopwatched, high-jumpers landed in sand and sawdust, come on dude, seriously. At this point your arguing about Olympic events 80 years ago in an MJ thread... as if your initial point hasn't already been destroyed. Just stop, you've been ethered. Athleticism in humans has not gotten progressively better. Do you think Roman Gladiators had worse training and physique for combat than MMA fighters, do you think early humans who actually depended on their abilities to catch their food by running animals down (over long distances) were in any way whatsoever inferior runners to joe blow who drank a gatoraid and a protein shake and drives back home to watch tv? Come on.

[Calabis]

LOL at this fool...
Rose, Westbrook and Wall are all faster than Jordan in his prime. Players like Gerald Green and John White jump higher than Jordan too. Those are just few obvious examples from today's game. MJ ******gers:facepalm

So you had to grab 5 different guys, take their best attribute and somehow that makes them better than Jordan :wtf: :biggums:

[Calabis]

In the U.S. 100 yards 220yards 440yards, in Europe meters, tracks were cinders, shoes were canvas, times were stopwatched, high-jumpers landed in sand and sawdust, come on dude, seriously. At this point your arguing about Olympic events 80 years ago in an MJ thread... as if your initial point hasn't already been destroyed. Just stop, you've been ethered. Athleticism in humans has not gotten progressively better. Do you think Roman Gladiators had worse training and physique for combat than MMA fighters, do you think early humans who actually depended on their abilities to catch their food by running animals down (over long distances) were in any way whatsoever inferior runners to joe blow who drank a gatoraid and a protein shake and drives back home to watch tv? Come on.

:cheers: :bowdown: :bowdown:

[CavaliersFTW]

Kobe Bryant

http://www.annenbergspaceforphotography.org/files/slide-images/JordanHand2.jpg
http://mens-haircuts.net/wp-content/uploads/2009/08/521518_f260.jpg
http://2.bp.blogspot.com/_Xd7W6OPSCuI/SNv2uNZU-RI/AAAAAAAABOU/cvIlg6M4gkw/s400/Michael_Jordan_NBA_Owner.jpg
http://rockstarfresh.com/wp-content/uploads/2011/10/jordannba2k12.jpg


http://lakers.topbuzz.com/gallery/d/278748-2/Kobe+Bryant+puts+both+hands+next+to+his+head.JPG
http://dalje.com/slike/slike_3/r1/g2011/m02/ox281258995421326959.jpg










Kobe has small hands.

[Legends66NBA7]

How does Michael Jordan struggle in today's game.... When no other 2-guards or perimeter players are?

He doesn't struggle. Greatness transcends any era.

/thread.

[Calabis]

Jordan @ 34, league wide vote for the quickest first step

[I]Not too long ago this poll of one representative from each of the league's 29 teams would have been a waste of time. Only one player would have received votes: Chicago's Michael Jordan, of course. But while Jordan's reign as the NBA's most explosive player continues

[eliteballer]

He wouldnt struggle but he wouldnt put up the numbers he did back then obviously.

The wing players now are longer, more athletic, bigger 3 point threatsm better ballhandlers,(all because of Jordans influence ironically). Jordan would have to expend more energy playing man D .

[bwink23]

He wouldnt struggle but he wouldnt put up the numbers he did back then obviously.

The wing players now are longer, more athletic, bigger 3 point threatsm better ballhandlers,(all because of Jordans influence ironically). Jordan would have to expend more energy playing man D .


yet Lebron and Wade have put up excellent numbers year-in and year-out......:facepalm

[AMISTILLILL]

So athletes don't get bigger, faster and stronger as medicine and technology improves?

I guess thats why all the world records for athletic competitions come from the 1930s.

Quickly becoming one of the most LOL-worthy posters on here.

[Calabis]

He wouldnt struggle but he wouldnt put up the numbers he did back then obviously.

The wing players now are longer, more athletic, better ballhandlers. Jordan would have to expend more energy playing man D .

So the fact that his body would take a less punishment and face less resistance = he would expend more energy :confusedshrug:

Yes his defense would suffer, but his offense would be every bit as good, if not better

Something guys who faced him stated was probably his greatest strength, he never seemed to get tired

[kuniva_dAMiGhTy]

yet Lebron and Wade have put up excellent numbers year-in and year-out......:facepalm

Naw bro, if Kobe can't do it no one can! :lol

[Calabis]

yet Lebron and Wade have put up excellent numbers year-in and year-out......:facepalm

This is what I don't get, he's like Wade on PEDS imo, yet he couldn't do better than Wade, Kobe has copied his game, but he's less athletic and not as smart, yet they call him the greatest and the best of his generation...translation Jordan would struggle:wtf: Its damn near comical

[bwink23]

This is what I don't get, he's like Wade on PEDS imo, yet he couldn't do better than Wade, Kobe has copied his game, but he's less athletic and not as smart, yet they call him the greatest and the best of his generation...translation Jordan would struggle:wtf: Its damn near comical


Lebron took 3's out of his game and he's putting up Jordan-like efficiency this year...Lebron has been damn near a 53%FG shooter inside of 3 for the last several years.

And these kids talk about how he has a suspect jumper and just gets run-outs and dunks..


They don't even realize they are shitting on the defensive abilities of their era when they bag on Lebron's offensive game??

:lol :lol

[eliteballer]

So the fact that his body would take a less punishment and face less resistance = he would expend more energy :confusedshrug:

Yes his defense would suffer, but his offense would be every bit as good, if not better

Something guys who faced him stated was probably his greatest strength, he never seemed to get tired

His body wouldnt take less punishment, the players now carry way more muscle mass.

[bwink23]

His body wouldnt take less punishment, the players now carry way more muscle mass.


Hell yeah he would....:rockon:

Hard fouls and off-the-ball knocks were normal in Jordan's time.

Fools today are more likely to flop when Jordan hits them coming across the lane.... :lol

[CavaliersFTW]

He wouldnt struggle but he wouldnt put up the numbers he did back then obviously.

The wing players now are longer, more athletic, bigger 3 point threatsm better ballhandlers,(all because of Jordans influence ironically). Jordan would have to expend more energy playing man D .
Big crock of shit right there. Shooting guards are not bigger and longer than they were in his era. :facepalm

If you think they are, name them, and I'll put the numbers right in front of your eyes. Jesus f*cking Christ I'm not even an MJ jocker but the same myths about "MJ and his era" are already sounding identical to the myths about Wilt Chamberlain's era :wtf:

I guess the NBA today is a bunch of Wilt Chamberlains and Michael Jordans? I can't wait for 20 years when every small forward in the NBA becomes athletically identical to Lebron James in addition to all the Jordan's and Wilt's that the league will be stacked with :roll:

[gengiskhan]

When no other 2-guards or perimeter players are??? :confusedshrug:

:coleman: :coleman:

Reg Sea Stats for Today

40-42ppg
8 apg
6-7 rpg
2.9 spg
1.4 bpg

FG% = 58-61

[CavaliersFTW]

His body wouldnt take less punishment, the players now carry way more muscle mass.

MJ and his peers taking less punishment in the league of "less muscle mass"
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XSPIQiFAe6U&


Lebron taking more punishment in the league of muscle mass.
http://www.sportsgeekery.com/wp-content/uploads/2011/06/lebron-flop-2.gif

[bwink23]

MJ taking less punishment in his league of "less muscle mass"
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XSPIQiFAe6U&t=5m28s


Lebron taking more punishment in his league of muscle mass.
http://www.sportsgeekery.com/wp-content/uploads/2011/06/lebron-flop-2.gif


These kids are acting like today's players aren't going out of their way to fall on the floor if you breath in their direction

:lol

[tmacattack33]

because the NBA is full of hyper athletes today, and all though Jordan's physical gifts would make him top tier today, his 40+ inch vertical leap, would be only 20 inches today

Except that your argument here falls flat.

Jordan had a ridiculously higher vertican than his peers.

Presumably, you are saying that today's players have higher verticals than in the past because of advanced training/diet/supplements (if you are not saying this, then you are saying that the higher verticals of today are due to magic or something ridiculous like that).

Thus, if Jordan had today's training/diet/supplements, his vertical would go up just as the average NBA player's vertical has gone up.

Or, well, you could be saying today's players have higher verticals because athleticism is more looked at today than it was in 1990. Well then, Jordan's great fundamentals which were 90th percentile in his day would be 99.99th percentile in today's game.


You people have to think your arguments the whole way through before posting.




Also, Jordan played as a 40 year old in 2003 and was able to put up 22 points a game on 45% FG shooting. 2003 was not that long ago.

[CavaliersFTW]

These kids are acting like today's players aren't going out of their way to fall on the floor if you breath in their direction

:lol
bu bu bu but modern nutrition and training.... :roll: :lol :oldlol: :facepalm :lol :oldlol:

[bwink23]

bu bu bu but modern nutrition and training.... :roll: :lol :oldlol: :facepalm :lol :oldlol:


How stacked would past players be if they were put on training regimens as top recruit college freshman in D-1 programs??

Shit how about starting in high school like most top prospects do now..

Fair to say Jerry West would be 10-15 pounds heavier as a rookie ??

Wilt probably 265, 270??

[eliteballer]

Jordan taking a real hard "foul" against the Bad Boys:roll:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hkPK9sGa7Y8&t=2m20s

[bwink23]

Jordan taking a real hard "foul" against the Bad Boys:roll:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hkPK9sGa7Y8&t=2m20s


Are you saying that wasn't a foul?? :confusedshrug:

[SlayerEnraged]

Are you saying that wasn't a foul?? :confusedshrug:

I'm just wonderin..all u jordan loons do is quack and moo about hand checking...In the finals who exactly was "hand checking" mj? Watched the videos and most of the time guys like CLyde weren't even within 5 feet of him...

[CavaliersFTW]

How stacked would past players be if they were put on training regimens as top recruit college freshman in D-1 programs??

Shit how about starting in high school like most top prospects do now..

Fair to say Jerry West would be 10-15 pounds heavier as a rookie ??

Wilt probably 265, 270??

Yeah but lifting weights doesn't = better athletes, Wilt and West were both in as good a shape as any players can when they both entered the NBA, modern or not.

Jerry West ran in the mountains of WV deliberately to keep himself in peak physical condition... since highschool...
https://lh5.googleusercontent.com/-dvZcnlTcByM/T2Tgh2KVO_I/AAAAAAAADO0/D6NJrfhvUXA/s800/West-Pitt-126.jpg
https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/-nsB61p2V-6A/T2TahyO3BcI/AAAAAAAADOU/VPzYXyTHkag/s640/West%2520blocks.jpg



Wilt strength trained with weights and was always conditioned and active in a multitude of off-season sports... since high school... As skinny as he was he was already 258lbs before he even stepped on the floor as a rookie, and strong as an ox. He looks lean but so does anyone with a 7'8 wingspan and a (truthfully) 7'1 frame Javale McGee (6'11) has been in the NBA how long now? He still doesn't isn't as heavy as Wilt was as a rookie. Heck, 258 is 3lbs less than Lebron was entering this season I recall he weighed 261 back in November for some sports article.

http://4.bp.blogspot.com/-1kuMHUCIVMM/TVRQf_fSkkI/AAAAAAAAAMA/KTZQS-jaTsY/s1600/DM2477A.jpg







I said this earlier in the thread, in the game of basketball a long wirey physique >>>> a heavy physique. Just ask the doctors of Greg Oden, Andrew Bynum, Yao Ming, and now... Dwight Howard.

[Calabis]

His body wouldnt take less punishment, the players now carry way more muscle mass.

Yup after seeing this list, Jordan would look like Spud Webb complared to these Giants (http://www.fantasybasketballdaily.com/2011-2012-nba-fantasy-basketball-shooting-guard-player-draft-rankings/5518/)

[OldSchoolBBall]

LOL at this fool...
Rose, Westbrook and Wall are all faster than Jordan in his prime. Players like Gerald Green and John White jump higher than Jordan too. Those are just few obvious examples from today's game. MJ ******gers:facepalm

John Wall barely 6'4", Westbrook and Rose are 6'3" if they're lucky. Like I said, there's no one 6'6" or taller in today's league who even approaches Jordan's speed and quickness. Deal with the statements that were made, asshat. And no, those guys don't cover ground as fast as 23-28 year old Jordan, though Westbrook and Rose might be more explosive in terms of acceleration while already moving.

[Calabis]

Jordan taking a real hard "foul" against the Bad Boys:roll:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hkPK9sGa7Y8&t=2m20s

Kobe getting fouled hard today

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7urNzqB6iV4

:roll:

[CavaliersFTW]

John Wall barely 6'4", Westbrook and Rose are 6'3" if they're lucky. Like I said, there's no one 6'6" or taller in today's league who even approaches Jordan's speed and quickness. Deal with the statements that were made, asshat. And no, those guys don't cover ground as fast as 23-28 year old Jordan, though Westbrook and Rose might be more explosive in terms of acceleration while already moving.

w/o shoes

MJ 6'4.88


Wall 6'2.75
Westbrook 6'2.25
Rose 6'1.5

They aren't even close in size, plus Jordan's hands are some of the largest of any player that has ever played plus:

http://26.media.tumblr.com/tumblr_ls76p4cJH71r3gup8o1_r1_400.gif

Which one of those guys can do that again? :lol

draftexpress.com/measurements

[DonDadda59]

Yup after seeing this list, Jordan would look like Spud Webb complared to these Giants (http://www.fantasybasketballdaily.com/2011-2012-nba-fantasy-basketball-shooting-guard-player-draft-rankings/5518/)

Truly, these Herculean giants would dwarf and bully tiny, unathletic Jordan.

[CavaliersFTW]

Truly, these Herculean giants would dwarf and bully tiny, unathletic Jordan.
dang he undersized next2 modern nutrient fed CP3 :eek:

http://cdn.static.telepixtv.com/photos/essencegallery2/system/images/gallery/000/014/391/full/nba-all-star-wknd-michael-jordan-chris-paul_src.jpg

dayum modern NBA athletes u scary!

:lebronamazed:

[DonDadda59]

dang he undersized next2 modern nutrient fed CP3 :eek:

http://cdn.static.telepixtv.com/photos/essencegallery2/system/images/gallery/000/014/391/full/nba-all-star-wknd-michael-jordan-chris-paul_src.jpg

dayum modern NBA athletes u scary!

:lebronamazed:

Look at the modern muscle bound hyper athlete Kobe has to face in the playoffs (also notice the Mavs playing 5 on 1 zone vs the GAWD):

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ayIynMatcys

No way Jordan scores on that beast. :no:

[blacknapalm]

the bigger, better, stronger, faster angle is comically overblown. a lot of it comes down to genetics. this isn't mma where technique, gyms and actual trainers are much more accessible than what they were even 10-15 years ago

the only clear thing you can say is that players have better facilities, equipment and nutrition

actual average height?

1986: 6' 7.36"
1993: 6' 7.06"
1998: 6' 7.11" (average weight of 223)
2008: 6' 6.98" (average weight of 221)

the game is more perimeter oriented but the guys are not taller

so let's recap...elite athlete in any era? check. guys are actually smaller on average than when he played? check. loosened rules to help out perimeter players even more? check. an era where almost everyone agrees that bigs are not what they were in the 80s and 90s? check.

you'd have a better shot at arguing more advanced defensive disguises and strategies...

[j3lademaster]

Athleticism arguments aside, all I know is 40 yo MJ came into this league after 2 years of being away from playing against NBA speed, and put up 20+ppg at decent efficiency. I'd imagine it'd be even more inflated after handchecking (it's not a coincidence the top perimeter scorers had massively inflated numbers out of nowhere that season), and even more inflated if you magically give MJ back his prime physical traits. Prime MJ in today's league would utterly dominate it.

I mean, we can all agree that Hakeem, Robinson, Ewing, Mutombo, Mourning etc are as good as the best(if not superior) to the interior defenders today, right? Now take out the defensive 3 second rule. You would think that'd hurt a slashing type game that MJ played more than anything right?

[andgar923]

48 is probably exaggerated, but what makes you say that he's sub 40? To get his head at rim level, at 6'6 he'd need to jump 42 inches, wouldn't he?

http://marshallmatlock.com/wp-content/gallery/2011-12-05-jordan-throws-down-newman-wins-a-staring-contest-manolo-costa-rolls-his-own/thumbs/thumbs_michael%20jordan%20dunk%20contest,%20the%20 always%20gentleman.jpg

I believe it was that dunk or another, in which he had to 'duck' his head to keep it from hitting the rim, and he had jumped from outside the paint while making a move.

And we've seen MJ duck his head many other times as well.

[TheMan]

Jordan was the lebron of his time. Not in the sense of how they approach the game, but in the sense of their physical abilities. People marvel at brons physical attributes as they should because he is a freak of nature, for this time.

Jordan, was the freak of nature for his time. No other players had his speed or strength or athletic ability. Fast forward to todays times, and many players are built physically just like Jordan.

Its called human evolution. He'd still be great but the one advantage he had over his 80s and 90s peers, wouldn't be as evident today.
Human evolution? He didn't play 1000 years ago, there are still a lot of players Jordan played against still playing today and doing just fine:facepalm ...

If players are bigger, faster and more athletic today because of "human evolution", why is there a dearth of quality centers, wouldn't there be more rather than less today? Dwight Howard wouldn't be a top 5 center in the 80s or 90s

[Deuce Bigalow]

He's a poor man's Tony Allen. He would struggle greatly.
lol

[CelticBaller]

Jordan was the lebron of his time. Not in the sense of how they approach the game, but in the sense of their physical abilities. People marvel at brons physical attributes as they should because he is a freak of nature, for this time.

Jordan, was the freak of nature for his time. No other players had his speed or strength or athletic ability. Fast forward to todays times, and many players are built physically just like Jordan.

Its called human evolution. He'd still be great but the one advantage he had over his 80s and 90s peers, wouldn't be as evident today.
evolution?
:roll: :roll: :roll:

[CavaliersFTW]

Human evolution? He didn't play 1,000,000 years ago, there are still a lot of players Jordan played against still playing today and doing just fine:facepalm ...

If players are bigger, faster and more athletic today because of "human evolution", why is there a dearth of quality centers, wouldn't there be more rather than less today? Dwight Howard wouldn't be a top 5 center in the 80s or 90s
Fixed. Genetically and anatomically modern Homo sapiens already existed 100,000 years ago much less 1,000 which is not to criticize your comment - but rather reinforce it :lol

[bwink23]

Fixed. Genetically and anatomically modern Homo sapiens already existed 100,000 years ago much less 1,000 which is not to criticize your comment - but rather reinforce it :lol


I think i've just evolved sitting in this chair the last several hours....:lol :lol :lol

[TheMan]

evolution?
:roll: :roll: :roll:
That shit was funny, I guess around the year 2030, PGs will be 6'10 and centers will be 7'6 and run a 40 yard dash in less than 4 seconds, I'm waiting to see those dunks starting from the 3 pt line:lol

[DonDadda59]

Fixed. Genetically and anatomically modern Homo sapiens already existed 100,000 years ago much less 1,000 which is not to criticize your comment - but rather reinforce it :lol

:coleman:

Son, pretty much all biological anthropologists and scientists are in agreement that the human race experienced the greatest period of singular evolution in the year between Jordan winning his last championship and Kobe riding Shaq's nuts to his first.

NBA players went from pygmies to indestructible hyper athletes during this brief period. It's science son.

[TheMan]

Fixed. Genetically and anatomically modern Homo sapiens already existed 100,000 years ago much less 1,000 which is not to criticize your comment - but rather reinforce it :lol
Yeah, I know evolution takes a loooong time, I was off by a few hundred thousand years, lol.

This kids think evolution is by gen:lol eration

[ralph_i_el]

Jordan was the lebron of his time. Not in the sense of how they approach the game, but in the sense of their physical abilities. People marvel at brons physical attributes as they should because he is a freak of nature, for this time.

Jordan, was the freak of nature for his time. No other players had his speed or strength or athletic ability. Fast forward to todays times, and many players are built physically just like Jordan.

Its called human evolution. He'd still be great but the one advantage he had over his 80s and 90s peers, wouldn't be as evident today.


wait...you're serious? Evolution in humans has been negligible for a long time. You must be trolling

[CelticBaller]

That shit was funny, I guess around the year 2030, PGs will be 6'10 and centers will be 7'6 and run a 40 yard dash in less than 4 seconds, I'm waiting to see those dunks starting from the 3 pt line:lol
:oldlol:

[rfoster24]

because the NBA is full of hyper athletes today, and all though Jordan's physical gifts would make him top tier today, his 40+ inch vertical leap, would be only 20 inches today

Dumbest thing i've ever heard.

[Kobe 4 The Win]

Didn't read but,

In today's game Jordan would only struggle to make enough room for trophies on his shelf.

[CavaliersFTW]

:coleman:

Son, pretty much all biological anthropologists and scientists are in agreement that the human race experienced the greatest period of singular evolution in the year between Jordan winning his last championship and Kobe riding Shaq's nuts to his first.

NBA players went from pygmies to indestructible hyper athletes during this brief period. It's science son.

:lol it's time to re-assess humanities entire understanding of the evolutionary tree

[CavaliersFTW]

https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/-qqIPBr2Hq2k/T4phDWCPMNI/AAAAAAAADXw/8PcV1NpgJVQ/s0/nbaevolution.jpg

[gilalizard]

He probably wouldn't be able to jump as high because gravity weighs more than it used to from all the meteorites that hit the planet and make it bigger.

[Floppy]

he's like Wade on PEDS imo
An oxymoron if I ever saw one. :D

[NumberSix]

In 15 years, players with lebrons attributes will be the norm like players of today have the physical attributes of Jordan.
First of all, you're a ****ing retard for thinking humans evolve in like 15 years. People that lived in areas of Africa 5,000 years ago are identical to the people that still live in the same areas today. Humans are not subject to natural selection in the modern world. If anything, humans in the modern world are weakening due to the weak that would die off being able to survive and pass on their weak genes.

Second, why aren't there a bunch of Shaq's running rampant? There are tons of 7 footers. Why don't any of them have his strength and agility?

[Calabis]

Dumbest thing i've ever heard.

Dude its called sarcasm, the point was how does a athletic freak like Jordan, somehow become ordinary today. He would be the best athlete now

[Scholar]

First of all, you're a ****ing retard for thinking humans evolve in like 15 years. People that lived in areas of Africa 5,000 years ago are identical to the people that still live in the same areas today. Humans are not subject to natural selection in the modern world. If anything, humans in the modern world are weakening due to the weak that would die off being able to survive and pass on their weak genes.

Second, why aren't there a bunch of Shaq's running rampant? There are tons of 7 footers. Why don't any of them have his strength and agility?

Because Shaq only retired recently. Duh, fool! Don't you understand common ISH sense?

[Hittin_Shots]

Dude its called sarcasm, the point was how does a athletic freak like Jordan, somehow become ordinary today. He would be the best athlete now

Another guy called you out on that post as well lol, but the other guy wrote paragraphs, how people didn't realise the joke is beyond me.

[Asukal]

BIGGER!!!!! FASTER!!!!! STRONGER!!!!!

:hammerhead: :hammerhead: :hammerhead:

[Calabis]

BIGGER!!!!! FASTER!!!!! STRONGER!!!!!

:hammerhead: :hammerhead: :hammerhead:

Next they will claim Marvin Gaye can't hold a note to Justin Bieber, with his evolved wind pipes

[miggyme1]

He doesn't struggle. Greatness transcends any era.

/thread.

couldnt have said it better myself homie.no matter what era he played in he would still be the greatest.he had it all.mental toughness,the determination,god given athletic ability.alot of people dont realize how physically gifted he was.its almost like he was built like a machine.he had a jumpers body and then when he put the muscle on his frame he became in a way a dominant offensive force sorta how lebron is today.i feel like athletes these days have benefited from different methods of training and advanced medicines.u can tear your acl in these times and be back on the court in as little as three months.if u did that in the 90's that was a season ending injury.

[jstern]

Considering that the NBA the rules to make the game easier for perimeter players, and the fact that the stats of perimeter players went up afterwards, Nash shooting over 50% for the first time in his career for example, then I would say Jordan would murder the league. And it's not a conspiracy that the rules were changed to make it more perimeter friendly, tougher on the defense, because that was the reason given by the league for the new rules. As a result of these rule changes, now we have this flopping epidemic. Like Van Gundy said a few minutes ago, softer rules.

[jstern]

And about evolution. Only a moron would think that humans evolve in such a short period of time. And remember also that these newer kids have been saying that way before 2012, like back in 2005 when Jordan had been out of the league for a couple of years.

But yeah, in terms of genetics, if there was a way to measure any .0001 difference in people from 100 years ago, I would imagine that they would be slightly more athletically capable under similar circumstances simply due to medical science keeping a vast amount of people alive that otherwise would have been dead. I see intelligence getting better, which isn't saying much, but not physical.

[CountDracula]

https://i.ibb.co/XDWjd2w/0-FCEAB3-D-A210-45-D3-A5-AE-3-D999-B965914.jpg (https://ibb.co/8bmNRKh)

https://i.ibb.co/NtxxMJT/71068-E74-89-D2-4-BA5-ABD2-F501-BE02320-E.jpg (https://ibb.co/7jvvqZk)

https://i.ibb.co/qC3stwp/C199-BBA9-F8-F9-414-E-80-F1-C069328-E37-F4.jpg (https://ibb.co/687P35F)

https://i.ibb.co/zhFKvHZ/69725927-6-DAD-4010-88-BF-0-B1-E6-A4-E7-EFD.jpg (https://ibb.co/Gv9gS3R)

[Lebron23]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9JDiIZuD8B4