JVG: "I Coached Russell Westbrook. His Name Was Steve Francis"

[B-Low]

I've made the comparison several times on here saying that Westbrook reminds me a lot of Steve Francis. An insanely athletic SG stuck in a PG's body, has a tendency to overdribble and chuck, an annual all-star and has an unfortunate tendency to let his emotions get the best of him way too often

Van Gundy said last night that his biggest regret about his stint in Houston is giving up on Francis' game and trying to change him COMPLETELY, and noted that Westbrook is Francis pt II, but the difference is Scott Brooks allowed Westbrook to maintain his basic style while tweaking it a little to fit it into a winning style of basketball.

Do you think it's an accurate comparison? Will Westbrook fade like Franchise did once his athleticism fails him? And on the flipside could Francis have been a "winning" player in the right environment?

[Rnbizzle]

Yeah I thought he was pretty much spot on. Interesting way to look at it. At first when he said 'I coached Russell Westbrook' I was like.. what? But then it kinda did make sense to me.

[Meticode]

It's a fair comparison. It's hard to tell if he'll fade because as he loses his athleticism he will have to depend more on skill. Right now he depends highly on his quickness and athleticism.

[eliteballer]

Van Gumbys biggest problem as a coach has always been that he tries to force players to fit his system, rather than the other way around.

[flipogb]

Westbrook is 3 inches taller tho

[Punpun]

Van Gumbys biggest problem as a coach has always been that he tries to force players to fit his system, rather than the other way around.

I know another guy like that. His name is Stan. Stan Van Gundy. Oh wait. :roll:

--

Westbrook is way more talented than this Francis. There is no contest here.

[DuMa]

Francis was insanely talented. he started on a couple of all-star teams in the west next to Kobe

[04mzwach]

Westbrook is much bigger and stronger. His decline won't be nearly as fast unless he gets injuries. He has proven he's not injury prone I think.

[Horatio33]

If Westbrook is Stevie Francis, then who is his Cuttino Mobley?

[Tarik One]

Westbrook is 3 inches taller tho

This. He doesn't always have to blow by defenders because of his height advantage.

[dunksby]

Westbrook is the perfect target of criticism right now, it is sad to see there is not one supposed basketball expert on TV who is brave enough not to succumb to blind dissing of Russel. Seriously the guy has been playing at an elite level since the beginning of the season and have become even better in the postseason but people jump at every little opportunity to diss this guy. STEVE ****N FRANCIS????????????????

[LJJ]

That's a very harsh on Westbrook. He's not nearly as selfish and as unambitious as Steve Francis.

[eliteballer]

Westbrook is 3 inches taller tho

Both 6-3.

[flipogb]

Both 6-3.
Francis sure doesn't look like it. who knows maybe Russel is actually even taller than 6'3

[Bigsmoke]

nah Westbrook is way better.

[Rowe]

Westbrook is 3 inches taller tho
:oldlol: :oldlol:

Steve Francis was 6'3 and weighed throughout his career between 200-210lbs.

[OldSchoolBBall]

Westbrook is 3 inches taller tho

Huh? They're both listed at 6'3".

[ZenMaster]

Westbrook is the perfect target of criticism right now, it is sad to see there is not one supposed basketball expert on TV who is brave enough not to succumb to blind dissing of Russel. Seriously the guy has been playing at an elite level since the beginning of the season and have become even better in the postseason but people jump at every little opportunity to diss this guy. STEVE ****N FRANCIS????????????????

Van Gundy is giving Westbrook credit with his quote.

[Rowe]

Francis sure doesn't look like it. who knows maybe Russel is actually even taller than 6'3

Probably because of his big head.

I've seen Francis multiple times in person and he's a legit 6'2/6'3 without the "basketball shoes". Hes put on more weight since his NBA career ended so his head doesn't look as huge on his body as it once did during his physical prime in the NBA.

Westbrook's got a small head & a long, athletic body that makes him appear like he's taller than he actually is.

[HorryIsMyMVP]

I'd think Francis was probably more explosive in his prime?

[2LeTTeRS]

I always said that if Francis were allowed to play the 2 and utilize his natural scoring ability he would have been a superstar. It's a pure shame he never got to really show what he could do on the NBA level.

[wang4three]

Being compared to Steve Francis is not disrespectful. Guy was very, very good.

[HorryIsMyMVP]

Being compared to Steve Francis is not disrespectful. Guy was very, very good.
Yeah. It's a shame his career ended in such a horrible way. Getting cut from the Beijing Duck's. :eek:

[B-Low]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DWoZ0J3DsmQ

History lesson for the younger post-2004 NBA fans

[(e)]

Gotta respect JVG for saying he was wrong with how he handle his situation, and how he gave props to Brooks for how he is handling Westbrook.

I'd say he is pretty spot on with the comparison.

[HorryIsMyMVP]

It is a spooky comparison because once Westbrook turns 30 he will be getting cut from china teams to. :oldlol:

[Rowe]

Yeah. It's a shame his career ended in such a horrible way. Getting cut from the Beijing Duck's. :eek:

His knees & ankles have been messed up for awhile.

He's still doing good for the community. He just spent like $20K on remodeling a public park in his hometown that he used to play at as a kid for future generations.

[andgar923]

Francis is a better passer, not as dumb and had a better post up game.

[RidonKs]

francis didn't have westbrook's midrange game though right? hitting that jumper is such an all important requirement for staying relevant in the league late in your career... that might wind up a crucial difference between how their careers wind up.

[Rowe]

francis didn't have westbrook's midrange game though right? hitting that jumper is such an all important requirement for staying relevant in the league late in your career... that might wind up a crucial difference between how their careers wind up.

Francis had a solid mid-range game overall tho.

When he was hot he could drill those pull-up jumpers back-to-back-to-back, but his shot selection was really his downfall as he lost his hops due to dealiing with tendinitis.

It could end up being the same way for Westbrook as he gets older if he doesn't adjust into learning when to take a shot and when to set teammates up for baskets.

[andgar923]

francis didn't have westbrook's midrange game though right? hitting that jumper is such an all important requirement for staying relevant in the league late in your career... that might wind up a crucial difference between how their careers wind up.

But he doesn't have a solid mid range.

He's 'streaky' as hell, and to make matters worse he has a bad IQ.

Francis>>>> Westbrook any day

[Scholar]

So Westbrook is a guy who will almost seemingly not pursue bettering himself as a basketball player, smoke crack & look 50 when he's in his mid-30's? I see the comparisons now.

[iggy>]

Westbrook is the perfect target of criticism right now, it is sad to see there is not one supposed basketball expert on TV who is brave enough not to succumb to blind dissing of Russel. Seriously the guy has been playing at an elite level since the beginning of the season and have become even better in the postseason but people jump at every little opportunity to diss this guy. STEVE ****N FRANCIS????????????????
Are u being serious? Steve Francis used to be one of the best players in the league, it's not a slight on Westbrook to be compared to him.

[Punpun]

But he doesn't have a solid mid range.

His, is better than Wade's ever was.

[LJJ]

Francis was so limited that as soon as he lost 5% of his athleticism he was done.

Shockingly bad fundamentals and insight for an all star guard. Might be the worst in that respect ever. Can you think of any all star who was already done in the league at age 28, without suffering career ending injuries? His fundamentals and understanding of the game were that bad.

[ultimateaggie]

Loved the Stevie Franchise (always hated that name) mix on youtube. Although they missed one of his best highlights, a reverse lay up from like 5 feet out where he ended up just throwing the ball up behind his head andddd swish. Against the Lakers in the playoffs if I'm not mistaken. Went for 44. Although I could be blending that whole series together, not sure.

[Clippersfan86]

People are retarded... making comments like "Westbrook is 3 inches taller" "Westbrook is stronger" etc. Did you guys even watch prime Franchise? He was 6'3 just like Westbrook. Not to mention he was a bull when he slashed to the rim much like Westbrook... so can't say Westbrook is stronger, they are similar in that regard.

Francis was just as athletic too. MUCH better ballhandler, passer and rebounder. Westbrook is the more gifted scorer that's about it. We are talking about a PG who averages 7 rebounds in one season. Look at his best all around season.

21.6 ppg, 7 rpg, 6.4 apg, 1.2 spg. Westbrook is more efficient on offense and in general a more gifted scorer but he's not quite as well rounded as prime Francis. Westbrook has never averaged 5.5 rpg let alone multiple seasons over 6.5 like Francis.

[Clippersfan86]

People need to stop writing stuff to bag on a player if they never watched them or at least studied footage. Francis had more raw talent than Westbrook in my mind. If this guy jacked up shots like Westbrook does he could no question have averaged somewhere around 23-25 ppg which is where Westbrook is at. Francis is one of those extremely unique and rare players that people tend to forget and underrate as time goes on.

Sure he was a headcase later in his career and injuries got the best of him but that doesn't mean he wasn't a great player at one point. Westbrook has the worst butterfingers and handle I have EVER seen from a star guard. Francis had the deadliest crossover in the game right next to Iverson and SICK handles.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KufCGlaxhAs&feature=related

[Punpun]

Westbrook is averaging 2 TO or sth like that. That's better than Rondo. Butterfinger my ass.

[Clippersfan86]

Westbrook is averaging 2 TO or sth like that. That's better than Rondo. Butterfinger my ass.

Westbrook has WEAK ASS handles. I don't give a shit if he's not turning the ball over right now. Even Thunder fans would admit the dude has slippery handles. Francis had some of the best handles I have ever seen. Watch this video. Stephon Marbury a king of the crossover is hyping Steve's handles. Not to mention other PG's like Mark Jackson talking about his handles making people look bad.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=X9_PCtGn6bk

[Clippersfan86]

Steve Francis ballhandling at the EBC.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=W69NIQj8Lts&feature=related

[Punpun]

What matters isn't how beautiful your handles are but how many times you turn it over. And WB has been phenomenal this post season on this department.

[Rowe]

People are retarded... making comments like "Westbrook is 3 inches taller" "Westbrook is stronger" etc. Did you guys even watch prime Franchise? He was 6'3 just like Westbrook. Not to mention he was a bull when he slashed to the rim much like Westbrook... so can't say Westbrook is stronger, they are similar in that regard.

Francis was just as athletic too. MUCH better ballhandler, passer and rebounder. Westbrook is the more gifted scorer that's about it. We are talking about a PG who averages 7 rebounds in one season. Look at his best all around season.

21.6 ppg, 7 rpg, 6.4 apg, 1.2 spg. Westbrook is more efficient on offense and in general a more gifted scorer but he's not quite as well rounded as prime Francis. Westbrook has never averaged 5.5 rpg let alone multiple seasons over 6.5 like Francis.



People need to stop writing stuff to bag on a player if they never watched them or at least studied footage. Francis had more raw talent than Westbrook in my mind. If this guy jacked up shots like Westbrook does he could no question have averaged somewhere around 23-25 ppg which is where Westbrook is at. Francis is one of those extremely unique and rare players that people tend to forget and underrate as time goes on.

Sure he was a headcase later in his career and injuries got the best of him but that doesn't mean he wasn't a great player at one point. Westbrook has the worst butterfingers and handle I have EVER seen from a star guard. Francis had the deadliest crossover in the game right next to Iverson and SICK handles.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KufCGlaxhAs&feature=related

:applause: :applause: :applause:

These are the times when you show why you're one of the most knowledgeable posters on this forum.

[Fiasco]

**** Steve Francis, man.

[HorryIsMyMVP]

What matters isn't how beautiful your handles are but how many times you turn it over. And WB has been phenomenal this post season on this department.
It's hard to turn it over a lot when you aren't being a play maker.

[Rowe]

Francis was so limited that as soon as he lost 5% of his athleticism he was done.

Shockingly bad fundamentals and insight for an all star guard. Might be the worst in that respect ever. Can you think of any all star who was already done in the league at age 28, without suffering career ending injuries? His fundamentals and understanding of the game were that bad.

Francis was done because he couldn't shake the tendinitis in his knee.

Yes, that is a career ending injury when you can't ever heal from it.

You can't get surgery to fix that like any other structural damage injury. Whenever he'd miss games to let it heal, he'd return to play again and the tendons would get inflamed and cause him pain.

Watching him on the Knicks and it was obvious he could still play when he was feeling 100% and give you 15-20 points, but his tendinitis would flare up and it would limit him soon after.

[Rowe]

So Westbrook is a guy who will almost seemingly not pursue bettering himself as a basketball player, smoke crack & look 50 when he's in his mid-30's? I see the comparisons now.

Steve Francis never smoked crack.

Its just a funny picture people use on the internet.

[Clippersfan86]

What matters isn't how beautiful your handles are but how many times you turn it over. And WB has been phenomenal this post season on this department.

As a PG ballhandling is arguably the most important attribute in my opinion. It allows you to get the defender off you and open up space for a shot or pass. I'm not talking about how flashy Francis' ballhandling was. I'm saying his ballhandling was his most dangerous weapon. I can't tell you how many times I see Westbrook bobble the ball around during games and many times it leads to sloppy passes and turnovers.

[Fiasco]

**** Steve Francis, man.

^^^

[Punpun]

Clippers, 2.2 TOPG. That's what Russel is averaging for the whole postseason. 2.2. For the Finals ? 2TOPG.

That's elite ball-handling. Your point on WB is moot.

http://espn.go.com/nba/player/_/id/3468/russell-westbrook

[Clippersfan86]

Francis was done because he couldn't shake the tendinitis in his knee.

Yes, that is a career ending injury when you can't ever heal from it.

You can't get surgery to fix that like any other structural damage injury. Whenever he'd miss games to let it heal, he'd return to play again and the tendons would get inflamed and cause him pain.

Watching him on the Knicks and it was obvious he could still play when he was feeling 100% and give you 15-20 points, but his tendinitis would flare up and it would limit him soon after.

Also people don't remember this.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tdxXvkMB6gA

This was yet another nagging injury that set him back as he was trying to make a comeback in NY. Reality is LJJ said it wasn't injuries that made him vanish but it was exactly that. Injuries is what cost Steve in the end.

[Clippersfan86]

Clippers, 2.2 TOPG. That's what Russel is averaging for the whole postseason. 2.2. For the Finals ? 2TOPG.

That's elite ball-handling. Your point on WB is moot.

http://espn.go.com/nba/player/_/id/3468/russell-westbrook

:facepalm low turnovers doesn't mean you are a great ballhandler dude. It means Westbrook is making significantly better decisions for the most part. I've watched him this post season and he STILL has ballhandling issues although he's been a little better. This is a PG that I've seen dribble the ball off his own foot many times.

Watch footage of Westbrook's handles right before or after a video of Francis and you'll understand the gap.

[Punpun]

YOU ARE CLAIMING WB's BAD BALLHANDLING SKILL ARE ****ING THE THUNDER BY MAKING A ****LOAD OF BAD PASS. Bad pass who would be counted as TO.

Which is untrue as I pointed it out. But hey, stay in your bubble, more power to you.

[Clippersfan86]

YOU ARE CLAIMING WB's BAD BALLHANDLING SKILL ARE ****ING THE THUNDER BY MAKING A ****LOAD OF BAD PASS (TO).

Which is untrue as I pointed it out.

The Thunder led the NBA in turnovers and were dead last in assists with Westbrook running the point. Yet you're using a what 13 game playoff run so far to say he's suddenly a good ballhandler? Westbrook has sloppy handles. Better than the average Joe? Obviously. Compare him to every other star PG in the game though and he's lacking big time in regards to ballhandling. Doesn't mean he's not a great player just means when I say Francis had significantly better handles it's valid.

[HorryIsMyMVP]

YOU ARE CLAIMING WB's BAD BALLHANDLING SKILL ARE ****ING THE THUNDER BY MAKING A ****LOAD OF BAD PASS. Bad pass who would be counted as TO.

Which is untrue as I pointed it out. But hey, stay in your bubble, more power to you.
4 assists in game 3. That is bad, yo.

[Clippersfan86]

4 assists in game 3. That is bad, yo.

Not to mention 5.5 apg to 3.6 topg. Nothing to brag about :confusedshrug: .

[Punpun]

Not to mention 5.5 apg to 3.6 topg. Nothing to brag about :confusedshrug: .

>Using reg season when we are witnessing WB's perf in the po. :biggums:

[Clippersfan86]

>Using reg season when we are witnessing WB's perf in the po. :biggums:

Just because he's having a great postseason doesn't mean we completely disregard the regular season and his previous years :facepalm. Sigh....

[imdaman99]

sorry, westbrook is getting loads better every year. i can see it in terms of athleticism, but in terms of heart and fire, no comparison whatsoever. westbrook wants to be the best and i got a feeling he will be 1 day

[305Baller]

Hmm, Im not sure if Westbrook would take it as a compliment or an insult.

[fatboy11]

Hmm, Im not sure if Westbrook would take it as a compliment or an insult.

If he had the intelligence of half the people that have posted in this thread, he'd take it as an insult. But he'd also be pretty dumb because of it.

It does not matter one bit which player was better, bigger, stronger, more athletic....whatever. It doesn't matter. So I don't know why people are even bringing stuff like that up. Fact of the matter is the two guys are very, very comparable stylistically and Van Gundy made an excellent point. That's the only issue of relevance here. People are just making themselves look dumb and ignorant by turning their noses up at the mention of Steve Francis.

By the way, Steve Francis is a former ROY, 3 time All-Star, has career averages of 18/5.6/6/1.5 steals and shot nearly 80% from the line. For anyone that wants to talk shit - He was a damn good player. Believe that. And one of the most athletic players the NBA has EVER seen to this day. He put up great numbers his 1st 6 seasons, and Van Gundy's right - he somewhat derailed Francis' career by trying to make him something he wasn't.

[D.J.]

There's no shame in being compared to Steve Francis. Francis had seasons of 21+/7/6, 21/6/6, and 21/7/6. He was also extremely explosive. Francis' shot selection was certainly questionable, but he was a very good player.

[Solid Snake]

Francis was insanely talented. he started on a couple of all-star teams in the west next to Kobe

He didn't deserve them. He only got in because there were no other "flashy" players for the idiot public to pick.

Gary Payton was the correct choice each time, he had better points and assists numbers.

[MiseryCityTexas]

It is a spooky comparison because once Westbrook turns 30 he will be getting cut from china teams to. :oldlol:

He better start learning how to play like a white man once his athleticism goes.

[TheBluest]

Listen JVG never had a chance with Steve because....


http://hiphopconspiracy.com/wordpress/wp-content/uploads/2012/02/86362__steve-francis-cocaine-addiction.jpg


Crack Kills



It eventually led to him doing things like this on the court on a regular basis

http://www.colombospace.com/Youtube/sJIoDdxByoY



And here's where we're at today

http://blacksportsonline.com/home/wp-content/uploads/2012/02/Steve-Francis-Struggle-Face.jpg

[TheBluest]

He didn't deserve them. He only got in because there were no other "flashy" players for the idiot public to pick.

Gary Payton was the correct choice each time, he had better points and assists numbers.


Yep GP got robbed both times it was clearly a A.I/Marbury/Kidd/Francis League then. Francis could dunk GP wouldn't and he no longer had Kemp as a means to keep the "That's Sick Fans Base"


Francis will forever and always be BUMCHISE to me

[L.Kizzle]

His game reminds me more of a prime Gilbert Arenas, just slightly more athletic, but jumper not near as wet.

[sick_brah07]

His game reminds me more of a prime Gilbert Arenas, just slightly more athletic, but jumper not near as wet.

they are the complete opposite lol?

[L.Kizzle]

they are the complete opposite lol?
hey are, both were considered chuckers at the point who should be playing 2 guard.

[no pun intended]

Russell Westbrook=Monta Ellis

/thread

[Teanett]

westbrook is taller and stronger than steve francis???
:oldlol: :oldlol: :oldlol:

sometimes it's hard to believe the stupidity on this forum.
people act as if nba basketball was invented in 2008.

[imdaman99]

Russell Westbrook=Monta Ellis

/thread
i can see it, but i think monta is more refined.
westbrook plays a lot better defense and will be a lot better than him as he keeps improving his game.

[lucky001]

Francis was possibly even more explosive than wb. But dumb as a bag of rocks. Always him dribbling the ball into the ground and waving away Yao ming. Totally killed the offensive flow. True, he was a beast on the open floor running with his boyfriend. Otherwise, just a minus player on offense.

[dbugz]

Derrick Rose is more like Steve Francis than Westbrook IMO. (Rose is way way better though)

Difference is:

-Rose and Francis are both using their ball handling skills when driving to the basket to avoid contacts.

while

-Westbrook loves to bang bodies when penetrating inside and solely using his athleticism and strength to do that.


Francis shooting range >>> Rose and Westbrook though.

[lbj23clutch]

Francis isn't more explosive then Westbrook. Westbrook was slightly quicker, faster, stronger and in terms of leaping ability it's dead even. Westbrook is arguably the most athletic point guard ever.

[G-train]

Francis isn't more explosive then Westbrook. Westbrook was slightly quicker, faster, stronger and in terms of leaping ability it's dead even. Westbrook is arguably the most athletic point guard ever.

I don't know how you judge that.
To me you can't really split them.

I think Westbrook has really benefitted from an elite organisation, in terms of his maturity. Had the potential to go the other way.

[Teanett]

But dumb as a bag of rocks. Always him dribbling the ball into the ground and waving away Yao ming. Totally killed the offensive flow. True, he was a beast on the open floor running with his boyfriend. Otherwise, just a minus player on offense.

if you replace "yao ming " with "kevin durant", which player fits the description?
see? see?
:D

[Lebron23]

Derrick Rose is Steve Francis.

[madmax17]

If Westbrook is Stevie Francis, then who is his Cuttino Mobley?Harden obviously, both left-handed?

[Teanett]

Harden obviously, both left-handed?
hard-on

[Punpun]

Just because he's having a great postseason doesn't mean we completely disregard the regular season and his previous years :facepalm. Sigh....

No. That's actually what we do. And 13 games is actually a greta sample size.

[TAZORAC]

Westbrook handles the ball better then Francis and he's wayyy stronger.

[BlueandGold]

I see the comparison but Westbrook may be even more athletic, possibly more talented (remains to be seen) if he continues to progress and also his wingspan appears to be longer as well.

[Clippersfan86]

Francis isn't more explosive then Westbrook. Westbrook was slightly quicker, faster, stronger and in terms of leaping ability it's dead even. Westbrook is arguably the most athletic point guard ever.

Complete load of crap. Francis matches him on EVERY SINGLE front athletically. Go watch more footage. Francis was the Shawn Kemp of the PG position athletically. He didn't dunk around people like Westbrook but he dunked ON people with power and went through defenders when he dunked. He has some posters Westbrook can't fu** with.

In terms of speed.. again Francis is just as fast and explosive. Just like Westbrook is arguably the most athletic PG ever... so is Francis.

[Clippersfan86]

If he had the intelligence of half the people that have posted in this thread, he'd take it as an insult. But he'd also be pretty dumb because of it.

It does not matter one bit which player was better, bigger, stronger, more athletic....whatever. It doesn't matter. So I don't know why people are even bringing stuff like that up. Fact of the matter is the two guys are very, very comparable stylistically and Van Gundy made an excellent point. That's the only issue of relevance here. People are just making themselves look dumb and ignorant by turning their noses up at the mention of Steve Francis.

By the way, Steve Francis is a former ROY, 3 time All-Star, has career averages of 18/5.6/6/1.5 steals and shot nearly 80% from the line. For anyone that wants to talk shit - He was a damn good player. Believe that. And one of the most athletic players the NBA has EVER seen to this day. He put up great numbers his 1st 6 seasons, and Van Gundy's right - he somewhat derailed Francis' career by trying to make him something he wasn't.


:applause: great post dude.

[Punpun]

WB has never missed a single game in his career. (College + NBA). He is just a whole another beast compared to Francis.

[gasolina]

A lot of people disrespecting or just plain don't know shit about stevie franchise, and it wasn't that long ago.

The only problem with Steve Francis was he pounded the ball so hard like Stephon Marbury does. I think it may be because he never played with a player he can P&R with. Kelvin Cato? Eddie Griffin? That fat guy with a three point shot, Yao Ming for a bit? He just sat back and pounded and pounded until he got an opening or if none he would just jack it up.

But he was that good skills wise. A complete headcase and didn't understand winning basketball, but very good.

[kentatm]

IMO Franchise pounded the ball way more than Westbrook.

[B-Low]

http://blacksportsonline.com/home/wp-content/uploads/2012/02/Steve-Francis-Struggle-Face.jpg

Good God...

[longtime lurker]

Good analysis by Jeff Van Gundy. Westbrook and Francis compare favourably to each other. Except I actually think Francis has better handles while Westbrook is a bit bigger. Francis being my 2nd favourite player the guy was an absolute beast. Its not an insult to compare Westbrook to him. The problem with Francis is that your team will go nowhere with him as your best player and he was always forced to play more of a pure PG role when that is not his game.

[CavaliersFTW]

Westbrook is 3 inches taller tho
http://i8.photobucket.com/albums/a4/sirenofchaos432/dumbbitch.jpg

http://www.draftexpress.com/profile/steve-francis-2466/
Steve Francis: 6-2.5

http://www.draftexpress.com/profile/Russell-Westbrook-5062/
Russell Westbrook: 6-2.25

If you had taken two seconds to look it up you'd have learned that Westbrook is 1/4 inch shorter than Francis.

[CavaliersFTW]

This. He doesn't always have to blow by defenders because of his height advantage.
See above post dumb ass. :oldlol:

[tpols]

Complete load of crap. Francis matches him on EVERY SINGLE front athletically. Go watch more footage. Francis was the Shawn Kemp of the PG position athletically. He didn't dunk around people like Westbrook but he dunked ON people with power and went through defenders when he dunked. He has some posters Westbrook can't fu** with.

In terms of speed.. again Francis is just as fast and explosive. Just like Westbrook is arguably the most athletic PG ever... so is Francis.
Francis had similar straight line speed, and he had style to go along with his ups which made his dunks look great. His handles were a lot more smooth than Westbrook's though which is why I see Westbrook as being a lot more explosive. Westbrook has the quickest first, second, and third step I've ever seen. His explosive ability is unmatched.. he never has to rely on lulling defenders to sleep because he could much easier run around them.

[OldSchoolBBall]

Francis had similar straight line speed, and he had style to go along with his ups which made his dunks look great. His handles were a lot more smooth than Westbrook's though which is why I see Westbrook as being a lot more explosive. Westbrook has the quickest first, second, and third step I've ever seen. His explosive ability is unmatched.. he never has to rely on lulling defenders to sleep because he could much easier run around them.

His first step isn't amazing - if it were, you would see him just blow by his initial defender more often, the way MJ or AI used to do. But his second and third step acceleration and speed is definitely all-time level. Dude just turns it up to another gear after that first step or two when he sees a lane.