Ray Allen should be hated by all Celtics fans and here's undeniable proof

[nbarumorz]

http://celticshub.com/2012/07/11/ray-allen-forever-i-will-always-be-a-celtic/

He "didn't feel the same excitement" from the Celtics as the Heat, are you kidding me Ray Ray? We offered you TWO TIMES as much as Miami offered you. Just because we didn't kiss your ass like Pat Riley doesn't mean we don't value you.

"I'll always stay true to the city of Boston and their fans"....serious question: does Ray even know he just signed for the Heat? Did anyone tell him or does he thinking he is retiring or something. Dude, you just signed with the biggest rival of the entire NBA. That is the opposite of loyalty.

[FreezingTsmoove]

If you hate Ray now then you weren't a true C's fan IMO. He helped win your only ring since the 80's and you hate him?

[nbarumorz]

If you hate Ray now then you weren't a true C's fan IMO. He helped win your only ring since the 80's and you hate him?

....for.....leaving.....them.....for.....the...... enemy

see: Damon, Johnny

[LJJ]

Without Ray: No championship.


Like I said before: Ray Allen actually took significantly less money than Pierce and KG to be a part of that Celtics team, despite being pretty much as important as those two and being an irreplaceable part of the big three/four.

The Celtics organisation just didn't give Allen the same respect, so he felt it was time to seek something new.

[Kurosawa0]

Maybe he just doesn't view Miami like you do. Most players don't seem to. By the majority of accounts Wade, LeBron and Bosh are all pretty good guys. They certainly seem like they'd be more fun to play with than KG, Pierce and Rondo.

[The Ownage]

He helped your team win a title for the first time in 22 years. He got told he was traded on the deadline but then a few hours later, told he wasn't traded because the trade didn't go through. Continued to play his game after that and through the playoffs even with his bone spurs injury (albeit with less production).

Yet you want to talk about his loyalty? I hate the Heat as much as the next person but he should not be hated for leaving the Celtics. He still has a desire to win and his best option was to join the Heat for a better chance to contend for the title this upcoming season. Money isn't everything for some players, especially Ray who has made more than enough throughout his career.

[Q.E.C]

Celtics were talking about trading him if my memory serves me correct.

[nbarumorz]

He helped your team win a title for the first time in 22 years. He got told he was traded on the deadline but then a few hours later, told he wasn't traded because the trade didn't go through. Continued to play his game after that and through the playoffs even with his bone spurs injury (albeit with less production).

Yet you want to talk about his loyalty? I hate the Heat as much as the next person but he should not be hated for leaving the Celtics. He still has a desire to win and his best option was to join the Heat for a better chance to contend for the title this upcoming season. Money isn't everything for some players, especially Ray who has made more than enough throughout his career.

Reportedly he demanded THREE times more from the Celtics than Miami offered. Money was clearly a factor.

Also Doc never says a bad word about anybody ever. And he said that Ray made a mistake and that the Celtics pursued him HARD.

And as far as the point that without Ray the Celtics don't have a championship he also cost the Celtics by going ice-fvcking-cold in game 7 of the Finals in 2010, that all Celtics fans learned to forget since we love(d) the guy but now, what the hell, here is the forbidden stat line:

3-14 FG 2-7 from 3, 4 TO, 13 pts 2 assists 2 reb

[Kevin_Garnett_5]

Without Ray: No championship.


Like I said before: Ray Allen actually took significantly less money than Pierce and KG to be a part of that Celtics team, despite being pretty much as important as those two and being an irreplaceable part of the big three/four.

The Celtics organisation just didn't give Allen the same respect, so he felt it was time to seek something new.
:wtf:

[DuMa]

http://chzgifs.files.wordpress.com/2011/11/funny-gifs-have-ever-been-so-mad-that-you.gif

well said

[nbarumorz]

Celtics also offered him a No-trade-clause deal that he ignored...so don't bring up the fact that he was almost traded as a reason for him going to MIA. There would be 0% chance of him being traded if he signed back with Boston.

And if he really went to Maimi because he was ALMOST traded during last year then he needs to grow up and not be so damn sensitive. It absolutely shouldn't have an impact on where he decides to resign especially when the team that almost traded him offered a NTC !!

[TMT]

I'm not even a Celtics fan, but I think it was a major bitch move. You can sign with any of the other 29 teams in the league, but you choose one where it would be easiest to tag along, give a minimum effort and they will carry you to a couple rings anyway. Not to mention your biggest current rival in the same conference.

[SilkkTheShocker]

He wants to retire with multiple rings. Why would he have stayed with an inferior team?

[TMT]

He wants to retire with multiple rings. Why would he have stayed with an inferior team?

:rolleyes: A limping Celtics team almost knocked the Heat out of the playoffs. Let's not act like the Celtics weren't and haven't been in the picture every (healthy) year since 2008.

[Kevin_Garnett_5]

I personally appreciate his contributions to the championship & the deep Playoff runs over the years, but if he gets booed out of the building I won't feel sorry for him. He knew what he signed up for. He can't possibly be delusional enough to expect Celtic fans to be completely okay with his decision.

[NoGunzJustSkillz]

Lol at you fools. Fck ya celtics fans have a right to hate this mother****er. Who cares if he helped them win ONE championship. This ain't fcking Cleveland, fck the one championship ray helped them win. Dude went to Boston's main rival at this point in time. Miami got together to beat the celtics. Fck ray Allen and fck the one championship he helped Boston win. Dude is a disloyal fcking clown.

And about him possibly being traded? I thought the entire team was rumored to be on the trading block. The celtics were gonna rebuild, but at some point in time between the trading deadline and when they resigned kg, they changed their minds. get over it you douche bag. I hope seattle never gets a team so this clown never has his jersey retired ever. Then again Miami retired mj and Dan marino's jersey so who knows, maybe that weak assss franchise will retire ray Allen's jersey as well.

[nbarumorz]

Without Ray: No championship.


Like I said before: Ray Allen actually took significantly less money than Pierce and KG to be a part of that Celtics team, despite being pretty much as important as those two and being an irreplaceable part of the big three/four.

The Celtics organisation just didn't give Allen the same respect, so he felt it was time to seek something new.

Why do people think that without Ray Celtics don't win a championship.

Although they were dubbed the big 3, that doesn't mean they were all equally important. Pierce and KG were both much more critical to the Celtics than Ray ever was.

[nbarumorz]

I'm not even a Celtics fan, but I think it was a major bitch move. You can sign with any of the other 29 teams in the league, but you choose one where it would be easiest to tag along, give a minimum effort and they will carry you to a couple rings anyway. Not to mention your biggest current rival in the same conference.

At 1/2 price +++++

[LJJ]

:wtf:

He was. You could make a strong argument for him being the bets player during their won finals, but of course Pierce as the franchise face gets the nod. Not more deserving than Ray though, as equal a performance as you'll find. Good luck finding an off the ball scorer and clutch player as well as Ray Allen. A guy who plays within the offense and provides intangibles. A beacon of fitness save for the last months, and a true professional living for the game.

Sure, Paul Pierce averages slightly higher numbers across the board. But that's simply because he plays on the ball and closer to the basket.

KG provides some much needed defense and is still very skilled, but he's far from healthy and needs to have good back up around him. Offensively he's nowhere near what he once was, and especially during the championship run he was there for the defense mostly.

This just goes to show how under appreciated Ray Allen has been by Boston. That he's seen as clearly less important as those two. People are statsheet worshipers, they don't appreciate the refined but very real value Ray Allen brought to the table.

[nbarumorz]

I personally appreciate his contributions to the championship & the deep Playoff runs over the years, but if he gets booed out of the building I won't feel sorry for him. He knew what he signed up for. He can't possibly be delusional enough to expect Celtic fans to be completely okay with his decision.


[B]

[SilkkTheShocker]

:rolleyes: A limping Celtics team almost knocked the Heat out of the playoffs. Let's not act like the Celtics weren't and haven't been in the picture every (healthy) year since 2008.


And lets not act like Miami was healthy either.

[TMT]

At 1/2 price +++++

That just puts an exclamation point on the whole thing. The way Ray was acting it seemed he would have volunteered to play for free as long as he could ride the Heat train.

[Haymaker]

Allen just wanted to fukc the Celtics in the ass and he just did that. He took too many shots to his ego without saying much. He waited and waited and he's just acting out of anger.

[TMT]

And lets not act like Miami was healthy either.

Without Chris Bosh you still have two top 5 players, the advantage of having a super team. The Celtics had players missing and out of the guys that were playing there were injuries across the board. The Heat still shouldn't have even let them get that close, let alone at one point fall behind in the series to the point of elimination.

[Smoke117]

Reportedly he demanded THREE times more from the Celtics than Miami offered. Money was clearly a factor.

Also Doc never says a bad word about anybody ever. And he said that Ray made a mistake and that the Celtics pursued him HARD.

And as far as the point that without Ray the Celtics don't have a championship he also cost the Celtics by going ice-fvcking-cold in game 7 of the Finals in 2010, that all Celtics fans learned to forget since we love(d) the guy but now, what the hell, here is the forbidden stat line:

3-14 FG 2-7 from 3, 4 TO, 13 pts 2 assists 2 reb

How many times does it have to be said that Ron Artest kneed Ray Allen in the thigh in game 3 and gave him a deep bone bruise. Why don't you go out and play professional basketball when your primary role is to shoot jump shots and you can barely even jump. Shut your ass up. We real Celtic fans wish Ray the best and appreciate what he did for the team. For all this bullshit talk people like to say it was Ray Allen who was the best scorer during the finals in 2008.

[SilkkTheShocker]

Allen just wanted to fukc the Celtics in the ass and he just did that. He took too many shots to his ego without saying much. He waited and waited and he's just acting out of anger.

Agreed for the most part. But there was no chance in hell he was going back to Boston after talking with Riley.

[Kurosawa0]

It can't just be that Miami's better, right? Better team, players, organization, city, weather...

Ray's made a lot of money. His decision clearly wasn't about it. Miami wins on everything else.

[nbarumorz]

He was. Good luck finding an off the ball scorer and clutch player as well as Ray Allen. A guy who plays within the offense and provides intangibles. A beacon of fitness save for the last months, and a true professional living for the game.

Sure, Paul Pierce averages slightly higher numbers across the board. But that's simply because he plays on the ball and closer to the basket.

KG provides some much needed defense and is still very skilled, but he's far from healthy and needs to have good back up around him. Offensively he's nowhere near what he once was, and especially during the championship run he was there for the defense mostly.

This just goes to show how under appreciated Ray Allen has been by Boston. That he's seen as clearly less important as those two. People are statsheet worshipers, they don't appreciate the refined but very real value Ray Allen brought to the table.

You easily could've been describing Paul Pierce during that 1st paragraph haha. Replace "off" with "on" and that's pretty much PP.

Dude are you arguing Ray is an equal part in terms of TODAYs value or 2008s value. Because the idea that KG was mostly defense during 2008 is absolutely hilarious. Dude shot 49.5% averaged 20.5 PPG and 10 RBG during the playoffs.

Ray shot 42.8% during the playoffs and averaged 15 PPG

[SilkkTheShocker]

Without Chris Bosh you still have two top 5 players, the advantage of having a super team. The Celtics had players missing and out of the guys that were playing there were injuries across the board. The Heat still shouldn't have even let them get that close, let alone at one point fall behind in the series to the point of elimination.


Wade wasn't healthy either.

[SilkkTheShocker]

It can't just be that Miami's better, right? Better team, players, organization, city, weather...

Ray's made a lot of money. His decision clearly wasn't about it. Miami wins on everything else.


Some people must think Ray is Marcus Camby. Ray actually cares about winning. Miami gives him the best chance of that.

[b1imtf]

C'mon dude, just let it go...

[TMT]

Wade wasn't healthy either.

:blah

The point I was trying to make was there isn't as much a disparity between the two teams as you're making it seem. I swear every time I see you post you can't even mention any team in the same breathe as the Heat. Yet they struggled at various points in the weaker conference with teams also struggling with injuries. :confusedshrug:

[Kevin_Garnett_5]

He was. You could make a strong argument for him being the bets player during their won finals, but of course Pierce as the franchise face gets the nod. Not more deserving than Ray though, as equal a performance as you'll find. Good luck finding an off the ball scorer and clutch player as well as Ray Allen. A guy who plays within the offense and provides intangibles. A beacon of fitness save for the last months, and a true professional living for the game.

Sure, Paul Pierce averages slightly higher numbers across the board. But that's simply because he plays on the ball and closer to the basket.

KG provides some much needed defense and is still very skilled, but he's far from healthy and needs to have good back up around him. Offensively he's nowhere near what he once was, and especially during the championship run he was there for the defense mostly.

This just goes to show how under appreciated Ray Allen has been by Boston. That he's seen as clearly less important as those two. People are statsheet worshipers, they don't appreciate the refined but very real value Ray Allen brought to the table.
Ray was one of my favorite players on the Celtics, but absolutely no way was he as important to the team as KG or Pierce. KG was the anchor on defense and pretty much changed the culture of the team, while Pierce defended the other teams best wings while being the primary scorer on the team himself. Ray Allen was a very good 3rd option on offense and a clutch shooter, but Pierce and KG did it on both ends while being 1a and 1b on offense.

I don't see how it's under appreciating him by saying he was the 3rd best/most important player on the team, when he clearly was. Sure he had a great Finals series, but he wasn't particularly impressive in the Playoffs as a whole.


Offensively he's nowhere near what he once was, and especially during the championship run he was there for the defense mostly. KG led the Celtics in scoring in the 2008 Playoff run....

[nbarumorz]

Some people must think Ray is Marcus Camby. Ray actually cares about winning. Miami gives him the best chance of that.

Woah easy their Miami nut-hugger. A source close to Ray stated that Ray's motives for going to Miami were summed up in something to the extent of "rings, golf, and beaches"

Rings weren't the only thing on his mind:rolleyes:

[SilkkTheShocker]

:blah

The point I was trying to make was there isn't as much a disparity between the two teams as you're making it seem. I swear every time I see you post you can't even mention the Heat in the same breathe as them. Yet they struggled at various points in the weaker conference with teams also struggling with injuries. :confusedshrug:


I like how you ignore the Heat injuries. If you don't like what I say than ignore me. Its not hard.

[Mach_3]

He was. You could make a strong argument for him being the bets player during their won finals, but of course Pierce as the franchise face gets the nod. Not more deserving than Ray though, as equal a performance as you'll find. Good luck finding an off the ball scorer and clutch player as well as Ray Allen. A guy who plays within the offense and provides intangibles. A beacon of fitness save for the last months, and a true professional living for the game.

Sure, Paul Pierce averages slightly higher numbers across the board. But that's simply because he plays on the ball and closer to the basket.

KG provides some much needed defense and is still very skilled, but he's far from healthy and needs to have good back up around him. Offensively he's nowhere near what he once was, and especially during the championship run he was there for the defense mostly.

This just goes to show how under appreciated Ray Allen has been by Boston. That he's seen as clearly less important as those two. People are statsheet worshipers, they don't appreciate the refined but very real value Ray Allen brought to the table.

Is Kevin Garnett really this damn underrated? :banghead:

[nbarumorz]

Ray was one of my favorite players on the Celtics, but absolutely no way was he as important to the team as KG or Pierce. KG was the anchor on defense and pretty much changed the culture of the team, while Pierce defended the other teams best wings while being the primary scorer on the team himself. Ray Allen was a very good 3rd option on offense and a clutch shooter, but Pierce and KG did it on both ends while being 1a and 1b on offense.

I don't see how it's under appreciating him by saying he was the 3rd best/most important player on the team, when he clearly was. Sure he had a great Finals series, but he wasn't particularly impressive in the Playoffs as a whole.

+1
Well put

[Kurosawa0]

Woah easy their Miami nut-hugger. A source close to Ray stated that Ray's motives for going to Miami were summed up in something to the extent of "rings, golf, and beaches"

Rings weren't the only thing on his mind:rolleyes:

... And what's wrong with rings, golf and beaches? I know I'd stay in the cold, not win rings and play with lesser players for... wait, why would anyone do that?

[nbarumorz]

I like how you ignore the Heat injuries. If you don't like what I say than ignore me. Its not hard.

And you are ignoring the Celtics injuries. No Bradley the entire series and an extremely hobbled Allen.

[nbarumorz]

... And what's wrong with rings, golf and beaches? I know I'd stay in the cold, not win rings and play with lesser players for... wait, why would anyone do that?

Dude BOS/MIA was one game away from knocking Miami out of the playoffs this year. Without Bradley and without a healthy Allen.

Stop calling the Celtics lesser players. It is a team game, not individual as much as Heat fans want to think.

And I'm not knocking Allen for gravitating to a nicer city, I'm knocking him for having that information about his decision leak out immediately after he announced he was going to MIA. It never needs to be stated that he went to MIA for golf. No one cares.

[nbarumorz]

Wade wasn't healthy either.

Wah wah wah my team isn't 100% healthy wah wah wah. Stop saying the Heat are on a whole different level than the Celtics. Celtics were one game away from knockingn their ass out.

[LJJ]

Ray was one of my favorite players on the Celtics, but absolutely no way was he as important to the team as KG or Pierce. KG was the anchor on defense and pretty much changed the culture of the team, while Pierce defended the other teams best wings while being the primary scorer on the team himself. Ray Allen was a very good 3rd option on offense and a clutch shooter, but Pierce and KG did it on both ends while being 1a and 1b on offense.

I don't see how it's under appreciating him by saying he was the 3rd best/most important player on the team, when he clearly was. Sure he had a great Finals series, but he wasn't particularly impressive in the Playoffs as a whole.

KG led the Celtics in scoring in the 2008 Playoff run....

It is disrespectful. He was just as vital, he just played off the ball. It's a different role. Just like KG plays a different role as the defensive anchor, and Pierce plays a different role as the on the ball scorer. It's not less important at all though, it might translate a little less well to the stat sheet, but the Celtics never performed well without Ray playing well. And you can't really call him a third option when he almost always averaged more points than KG. Is there any season where KG scored more points for the Celtics than Allen?

And let's not forget: Allen was always the first guy the Celtics looked for in the clutch.


It's really shameful how quickly Celtics fans jump off the Allen wagon after half a season playing injured and leaving the team. No class at all in that fanbase. "Doesn't matter if you won a championship for us, you left so know we are going to wipe our ass with your legacy". Typical Celtics.

[nbarumorz]

And is everyone just ignoring one of the glaring quotes from his press conference:

"I'll always stay true to the city of Boston and their fans"

Could he be more off base there. I mean seriously.

[TMT]

I like how you ignore the Heat injuries. If you don't like what I say than ignore me. Its not hard.

Not ignoring, I clearly said even though they had injuries they struggled against teams who also had injuries. But considering the "super team" they constructed, they should be better regardless.

http://i50.tinypic.com/2l9p1co.png

[G-train]

swish

[SilkkTheShocker]

Allen also might have just wanted to play in a nice city for once.

[lilgodfather1]

Boston's a shithole, and is a crappy franchise. The fact that he took half the money to get the hell out of there tells us every thing we need to know. Good decision Ray now you can retire as the most successful member of the Big 3 :cheers: .

[Crown&Coke]

I hate the celtics, so I really couldn't care less

but the Celtics tried to deal him for almost 3 straight years. don't give me that "its a business" talk, because that talk can really get into a players head, especially when they are saying how much they love you, how much they need you. They wanted him so desparately but felt the need to try and deal him many times :rolleyes:

this is the new age of the NBA. If Shaq can move from LA to Boston during the course of his career. I think Shuttlesworth can go from Boston to MIA in his

[UConnCeltics]

Why hate on Ray Allen? He was the reason KG came to the Celtics. He was a huge part of the championship season. He put his heart into this team for 5 years. And its not like he completely destroys the Celtics, he probably makes them better. A Bradley/Terry platoon at the 2 is better than what you can get out of Allen at this stage of his career on the Celtics.

There is no loyalty in sports, and with the Celtics trying to trade him at the deadline the past few years why should we expect him to remain loyal to the organization? I'm sure he loved playing with KG and PP but the rift between Ray and Rondo as well as Ainge showing that basketball is a business overshadowed that.

He has conducted his 17 year career with class, which we don't really see these days. If he feels that getting another ring is important to him and that the Heat are his best option to do so, then good for him. I am disappointed that he left the Celtics, but whatever. Its his life and its great that he is doing things his own way.

[nbarumorz]

It is disrespectful. He was just as vital, he just played off the ball. It's a different role. Just like KG plays a different role as the defensive anchor, and Pierce plays a different role as the on the ball scorer. It's not less important at all though, it might translate a little less well to the stat sheet, but the Celtics never performed well without Ray playing well. And you can't really call him a third option when he almost always averaged more points than KG. Is there any season where KG scored more points for the Celtics than Allen?

And let's not forget: Allen was always the first guy the Celtics looked for in the clutch.


It's really shameful how quickly Celtics fans jump off the Allen wagon after half a season playing injured and leaving the team. No class at all in that fanbase. "Doesn't matter if you won a championship for us, you left so know we are going to wipe our ass with your legacy". Typical Celtics.

Wh

[Kurosawa0]

Dude BOS/MIA was one game away from knocking Miami out of the playoffs this year. Without Bradley and without a healthy Allen.

Stop calling the Celtics lesser players. It is a team game, not individual as much as Heat fans want to think.

Boston has been eliminated by Miami 2 straight years. Miami's the better team. It's not really a question.

I'll give you Allen and Bradley healthy if you give me a healthy Bosh and Miller.

Hmm, let's see, does Miami win in 4 or 5 games then? Tough to decide.

[nbarumorz]

Why hate on Ray Allen? He was the reason KG came to the Celtics. He was a huge part of the championship season. He put his heart into this team for 5 years. And its not like he completely destroys the Celtics, he probably makes them better. A Bradley/Terry platoon at the 2 is better than what you can get out of Allen at this stage of his career on the Celtics.

There is no loyalty in sports, and with the Celtics trying to trade him at the deadline the past few years why should we expect him to remain loyal to the organization? I'm sure he loved playing with KG and PP but the rift between Ray and Rondo as well as Ainge showing that basketball is a business overshadowed that.

He has conducted his 17 year career with class, which we don't really see these days. If he feels that getting another ring is important to him and that the Heat are his best option to do so, then good for him. I am disappointed that he left the Celtics, but whatever. Its his life and its great that he is doing things his own way.

Because he literally said that he feels he is loyal to the Celtics....AFTER signing with the Heat.

Quote:
"I'll always stay true to the city of Boston and their fans"

[LJJ]

Stats to prove that your stats are wrong:
KG 07/08: 1337 pts, 18.8 PPG
Allen 07/08: 1273 pts, 17.4 PPG
KG 11/12: 947 pts, 15.8 ppg
Allen 11/12: 655 pts, 14.2 ppg

Maybe do some basic research before you post next time.

I ended with a question mark for a reason. That means it was a question, not a statement.

But suspicion confirmed: One season where KG and Allen went toe to toe. One season (the single one Allen was significantly injured): KG the better scorer.

All the other seasons: Allen the better scorer. You put all those points together: Allen clearly the superior scorer for the Cs overall.

[Kurosawa0]

Because he literally said that he feels he is loyal to the Celtics....AFTER signing with the Heat.

Quote:
"I'll always stay true to the city of Boston and their fans"

They city and fans are different than the organization.

[UConnCeltics]

Basically like being dumped by your GF and just being "friends".

[Kevin_Garnett_5]

It is disrespectful. He was just as vital, he just played off the ball. It's a different role. Just like KG plays a different role as the defensive anchor, and Pierce plays a different role as the on the ball scorer. It's not less important at all though, it might translate a little less well to the stat sheet, but the Celtics never performed well without Ray playing well. KG and Pierce did more for the team than Ray did. They were the first two options on offense, and they were two of the teams best defenders.

And the Celtics made it through 2 and a half Playoff series with Ray playing awful in 2008.


And you can't really call him a third option when he almost always averaged more points than KG. Is there any season where KG scored more points for the Celtics

He was clearly the third option on offense in the Championship season, that's not even up for debate. And KG averaged more points than him both in the regular season and Playoffs that year.

Ray's averaged more than KG in most regular seasons since the championship season (after KG's injury), but he's rarely averaged more in the Playoffs and was definitely not ahead of KG as a scoring option.



And let's not forget: Allen was always the first guy the Celtics looked for in the clutch. Not true, the ball almost ALWAYS goes to Pierce on an isolation or pick and roll situation. Notice how on most of Ray's game winners in Boston, it's a catch and shoot off a pass from Pierce. He was the teams most clutch player though, I won't take that away from him.



It's really shameful how quickly Celtics fans jump off the Allen wagon after half a season playing injured and leaving the team. No class at all in that fanbase. "Doesn't matter if you won a championship for us, you left so know we are going to wipe our ass with your legacy". Typical Celtics.I've already said Ray was one of my favorite players and I still appreciate his contributions to the team, but I'm not going to all of a sudden act like he was any higher than the third most important player on the team when he simply wasn't.

[gabeh1018]

in response to that poster that said Miami lost to a beatup injured Celtics team, while you are correct. Do not forget to mention that Bosh wasn't at full strength and had just returned from an injury in that series and Dwayne Wade wasn't 100% and was hit or miss, game to game.

The Celtics definitely made it a great series and made Miami earn that ECF.

[UConnCeltics]

They city and fans are different than the organization.
I didn't look at it from that angle, you are 100% right. Pretty much told Ainge to f*ck himself there.

[LJJ]

More nonsense, this is just all Celtics fans throwing Ray under the bus.


It's going to be fun to see all the salty haters come out of the woodwork when Ray Allen takes a massive dump on the Celtics come the next post season. Ray is going to make JET cry for his mother and probably win another ring, maybe even more than one.

[nbarumorz]

I ended with a question mark for a reason. That means it was a question, not a statement.

But suspicion confirmed: One season where KG and Allen went toe to toe. One season (the single one Allen was significantly injured): KG the better scorer.

All the other seasons: Allen the better scorer. You put all those points together: Allen clearly the superior scorer for the Cs overall.

I'm sorry you must have not seen the bolded, size 5 font I quoted you on. Here it is again slightly larger:
And you can't really call him a third option when he almost always averaged more points than KG.

There we go. I don't see any question marks there....?

And Allen was superior statistically in the category of points 3/5 seasons. KG was better 2/5. You cannot say one of those guys is clearly better than the other.

[TMT]

http://i48.tinypic.com/517h9e.png

[Kurosawa0]

I didn't look at it from that angle, you are 100% right. Pretty much told Ainge to f*ck himself there.

I've been just joking in this thread, but in all seriousness, Allen clearly has bad feelings over how he was treated by the Boston front office. We can speculate as to why that is, but none of us really know.

In truth, it's on Danny Ainge and his staff. It's not up to players like Ray Allen to make sure teams want them enough. It's like having a hot girlfriend, there's always another guy that will want her.

Whatever happened, Ainge didn't do enough. That's really it. Would it really have been too much to offer 3 years, $18 million? Apparently so.

[nbarumorz]

KG and Pierce did more for the team than Ray did. They were the first two options on offense, and they were two of the teams best defenders.

And the Celtics made it through 2 and a half Playoff series with Ray playing awful in 2008.



He was clearly the third option on offense in the Championship season, that's not even up for debate. And KG averaged more points than him both in the regular season and Playoffs that year.

Ray's averaged more than KG in most regular seasons since the championship season (after KG's injury), but he's rarely averaged more in the Playoffs and was definitely not ahead of KG as a scoring option.


Not true, the ball almost ALWAYS goes to Pierce on an isolation or pick and roll situation. Notice how on most of Ray's game winners in Boston, it's a catch and shoot off a pass from Pierce. He was the teams most clutch player though, I won't take that away from him.


I've already said Ray was one of my favorite players and I still appreciate his contributions to the team, but I'm not going to all of a sudden act like he was any higher than the third most important player on the team when he simply wasn't.

Translation/TL;DR:

LLJ is an absolute moron and should be avoided at all cost.

[nbarumorz]

I've been just joking in this thread, but in all seriousness, Allen clearly has bad feelings over how he was treated by the Boston front office. We can speculate as to why that is, but none of us really know.

In truth, it's on Danny Ainge and his staff. It's not up to players like Ray Allen to make sure teams want them enough. It's like having a hot girlfriend, there's always another guy that will want her.

Whatever happened, Ainge didn't do enough. That's really it. Would it really have been too much to offer 3 years, $18 million? Apparently so.

No, no, no. Allen wouldn't have taken 3 yr/18M. He wanted 3 times the Heat offer of 3 mill a year. He wanted 3 yr/27M or 2 yr/18 M

[Kevin_Garnett_5]

More nonsense, this is just all Celtics fans throwing Ray under the bus.


It's going to be fun to see all the salty haters come out of the woodwork when Ray Allen takes a massive dump on the Celtics come the next post season. Ray is going to make JET cry for his mother and probably win another ring, maybe even more than one.
:oldlol: Oh look here, you have no response so you're going ignore my post, huh?

Apparently it's "throwing Ray under the bus" if you don't consider him higher than the 3rd most important player on the Celtics. Give me a break. From your posts in this thread it's clear you don't know anything about the Big 3 era Celtics.

[LJJ]

I'm sorry you must have not seen the bolded, size 5 font I quoted you on. Here it is again slightly larger:
And you can't really call him a third option when he almost always averaged more points than KG.

There we go. I don't see any question marks there....?

And Allen was superior statistically in the category of points 3/5 seasons. KG was better 2/5. You cannot say one of those guys is clearly better than the other.

Let me do your homework.

Ray Allen: 7397 points for Celtics
Kevin Garnett: 6622 points for Celtics

(wow, I can click my mouse on the size button too!)


See? Ray Allen was clearly the superior scorer for the Celtics and the second option. No question. Now go home and cry more over the Celtics management running Ray out of town towards their nemesis.

[nbarumorz]

From your posts in this thread it's clear you don't know anything about anything relating to basketball

FTFY

[Kurosawa0]

No, no, no. Allen wouldn't have taken 3 yr/18M. He wanted 3 times the Heat offer of 3 mill a year. He wanted 3 yr/27M or 2 yr/18 M

Why not do the 2 years $18 million? See, if they wanted to keep Ray, they would've. Miami has better players, team, weather, city etc. Boston needed to give him a reason to stay. He named his price and they didn't want him enough.

To me, that means Boston passed. Why should Ray want to stay there then?

[nbarumorz]

Let me do your homework.

Ray Allen: 7397 points for Celtics
Kevin Garnett: 6622 points for Celtics

(wow, I can click my mouse on the size button too!)


See? Ray Allen was clearly the superior scorer for the Celtics and the second option. No question. No go home and cry more over the Celtics management running Ray out of town towards their nemesis.

Yes, good LLJ. Maybe you aren't as stupid as I though. Classified under 'special' for now. Will revisit later.

[LJJ]

Well, we will all see how well the Celtics fare without Ray Ray on the team. First round exit anyone? Second round humiliation by the Heat, with Ray hitting daggers all over the Celtics?

We will see how important Allen was.

[nbarumorz]

Why not do the 2 years $18 million? See, if they wanted to keep Ray, they would've. Miami has better players, team, weather, city etc. Boston needed to give him a reason to stay. He named his price and they didn't want him enough.

To me, that means Boston passed. Why should Ray want to stay there then?

The reason to stay was that it's Boston. I believe that Allen actually wanted the 3yr at 9M a year, to feel equal to KG. He does have an ego, as quiet as he can be at times.

Considering on how broken down Allen was by the end of this season the Celtics offer of 2 yr/12 M was more than generous. If they give him 3 yr/27M they basically are saying they will not have any cap space next year or the year after.

[Kurosawa0]

The reason to stay was that it's Boston.

I know you're a fan, but that's never meant much to free agents.

[nbarumorz]

Well, we will all see how well the Celtics fare without Ray Ray on the team. First round exit anyone? Second round humiliation by the Heat, with Ray hitting daggers all over the Celtics?

We will see how important Allen was.

Dude the one point you thought you made is dead wrong. KG scored more PPG than Allen in the year they won their one championship, which is the year that matters if you are following the flow of this thread.

He scored more PPG during the regular season and the playoffs the year they won the championship.

[LJJ]

:oldlol: Oh look here, you have no response so you're going ignore my post, huh?

Apparently it's "throwing Ray under the bus" if you don't consider him higher than the 3rd most important player on the Celtics. Give me a break. From your posts in this thread it's clear you don't know anything about the Big 3 era Celtics.

I don't need to reply to your post, because we are going in circles.

You can talk about how Garnett was the 2nd option in regular season. I can point out how Allen was the most lethal scorer during the finals while Garnett withered at that stage offensively.

The truth is that Ray/KG/Pierce all had their better moments and worse moments. They were all unreliable at times, but at the same time the players were at enough of an equal level to fill in for each other lapses. That's why they were the big three, not the big two or the big one.


Celtics fans have stopped recognizing the minute Ray is off the team though. And then have to resort to argumenst like "haha you know no NBA, aharr". Lol.

Stay Classy, Celtics fans!

[nbarumorz]

I know you're a fan, but that's never meant much to free agents.

Maybe, but didn't the Celtics have something other teams rarely can achieve? The whole idea of ubuntu, no matter how cheesy it was?

I know Allen may have left because the Celtics went totally against ubuntu when they tried to trade him last season, but he didn't say that was the reason for leaving, which is why this is so frustrating.

If he just simply said that he left Boston because they tried to trade him and he felt betrayed this thread would not exist. Instead he went this other, weird route that is so aggravating to read about as a devout Celtics fan.

[LJJ]

Dude the one point you thought you made is dead wrong. KG scored more PPG than Allen in the year they won their one championship, which is the year that matters if you are following the flow of this thread.

He scored more PPG during the regular season and the playoffs the year they won the championship.

Kid, you sound like you are five years old since the very first sentence of the thread.


Have fun with your hobby of hating people you don't know based on a false sense of entitlement. That'll get old by the time you turn twelve, I'm sure.

[Kevin_Garnett_5]

:roll: @ LJJ ignoring me after I shattered his entire argument piece by piece. Now he has to resort to "well..um....well...we'll see how important Ray was to Boston when he's lighting it up in Miami!!!!!!". :rolleyes: Okay, Ray making a few open three's in Miami will prove he was the most important player to the Celtics championship. Forget about his mediocre Playoff run in 2008, his performance as the 4th option in Miami will tell the whole story.

[nbarumorz]

LJJ, I don't know if you are in the best position to judge who is and who is not classy. Nice touch mentioning Jason Terry's mother on the internet. Real class. Not even going to mention that this post has 0 value to this thread and just seems like a Miami ******ger doing their damn thing, per usual.


More nonsense, this is just all Celtics fans throwing Ray under the bus.
It's going to be fun to see all the salty haters come out of the woodwork when Ray Allen takes a massive dump on the Celtics come the next post season. Ray is going to make JET cry for his mother and probably win another ring, maybe even more than one.

[nbarumorz]

Kid, you sound like you are five years old since the very first sentence of the thread.
Have fun with your hobby of hating people you don't know based on a false sense of entitlement. That'll get old by the time you turn twelve, I'm sure.

OK, so you got beat up on the internet by a five-year old that used logic and statistics. Does that make you feel better now?

[nbarumorz]

And thanks for derailing this entire thread LJJ. Typical Miami fan can't even not butt their heads into everybody elses business, including a thread about the Celtics

[LJJ]

LJJ, I don't know if you are in the best position to judge who is and who is not classy. Nice touch mentioning Jason Terry's mother on the internet. Real class. Not even going to mention that this post has 0 value to this thread and just seems like a Miami ******ger doing their damn thing, per usual.

JET crying for his mother is about JET, not his mother.

Language isn't your strong suit either I see. Oh dear. I see a great future for you.

[nbarumorz]

JET crying for his mother is about JET, not his mother.

Language isn't your strong suit either I see. Oh dear. I see a great future for you.

Tsk tsk LJJ. I was joking. Take a joke. There ya go. You're doing it now. Who's a good boy?

[Kurosawa0]

Maybe, but didn't the Celtics have something other teams rarely can achieve? The whole idea of ubuntu, no matter how cheesy it was?

I know Allen may have left because the Celtics went totally against ubuntu when they tried to trade him last season, but he didn't say that was the reason for leaving, which is why this is so frustrating.

If he just simply said that he left Boston because they tried to trade him and he felt betrayed this thread would not exist. Instead he went this other, weird route that is so aggravating to read about as a devout Celtics fan.

Why does he have to say it? It's pretty obvious that he felt unwanted. Like I said, it's not up to a player of Ray Allen's caliber to make sure Boston wants him enough. It's the other way around.

Put it this way, do you think Pat Riley didn't know exactly what he was doing by going after Ray Allen like he was the end all be all?

Seriously, I would think the anger would be more appropriately placed at Danny Ainge's feet.

[LJJ]

Tsk tsk LJJ. I was joking. Take a joke. There ya go. You're doing it now. Who's a good boy?

Reading comprehension isn't a joke kid. You better learn it! Future not looking so hot for you right now, I feel bad for your mother. Take that shit seriously if you want to go somewhere in life.

Oh well.

Cleaning toilets is an honorable job too kid! I'm sure you can get a job scrubbing Pierce's shit off the porcelain at least.

[Kevin_Garnett_5]

I don't need to reply to your post, because we are going in circles.

You can talk about how Garnett was the 2nd option in regular season. I can point out how Allen was the most lethal scorer during the finals while Garnett withered at that stage offensively.

Oh, you mean the series where KG was doubled on the catch while Ray was hitting some of the most open shots he's had all season? Yeah, let's just focus on that when Ray was completely useless for over half of the Playoff run and Pierce and KG (who led the Celtics in scoring) carried the team offensively and were much better defensive players.


The truth is that Ray/KG/Pierce all had their better moments and worse moments. They were all unreliable at times, but at the same time the players were at enough of an equal level to fill in for each other lapses. That's why they were the big three, not the big two or the big one.


Celtics fans have stopped recognizing the minute Ray is off the team though. And then have to resort to argumenst like "haha you know no NBA, aharr". Lol.

Stay Classy, Celtics fans!
I agree with this for the most part, but KG and Pierce were clearly the two best players on the team, period. Ray Allen was the third best player on the team. I don't know why this is so hard to understand.

[nbarumorz]

Why does he have to say it? It's pretty obvious that he felt unwanted. Like I said, it's not up to a player of Ray Allen's caliber to make sure Boston wants him enough. It's the other way around.

Put it this way, do you think Pat Riley didn't know exactly what he was doing by going after Ray Allen like was the end all be all?

Seriously, I would think the anger would be more appropriately placed at Danny Ainge's feet.

When Doc says they pushed hard for a guy he is telling the truth. He specifically told reporters that they pushed hard for Ray Ray. If he was feeling unwanted, well, too damn bad. You are, correction were, loved by the entire Celtic fan base and he felt unwanted. The Celtic organization offered him a contract solely based on what he has done for the Celtics in the past instead of what he will do in the future.

A lot of fans love to blame Ainge. I'm on Ainge's side most of the time.

Can you see KG doing this though? Taking 1/2 pay to sit on the bench for THE rival team at the current moment, and do it because he likes the city better. Not in a million years.

[nbarumorz]

Reading comprehension isn't a joke kid. You better learn it! Future not looking so hot for you right now, I feel bad for your mother. Take that shit seriously if you want to go somewhere in life.

Oh well.

Cleaning toilets is an honorable job too kid! I'm sure you can get a job scrubbing Pierce's shit off the porcelain at least.

Do you have a point in this thread or are you just in hijacking because it isn't directly about the miami heat.

[LJJ]

Do you have a point in this thread or are you just in hijacking because it isn't directly about the miami heat.

Yes, I'm derailing your thread about Hating some dude you don't know.

Quality thread right there kid! Haha. Damn. You keep on going with them jokes right? Seems like your entire life is joke.

[RazorBaLade]

ive always disliked him for that look on his face he seemed like a jelly smirking dbag

and this decision proved it.

[nbarumorz]

Here is what elpres from Barstool had to say about it. It sums up sum of my thoughts pretty well about Ray now that he is with the Heat. Automatic boo, as he says:

Now unlike a lot of Celtics fans I’m not totally mortified by this decision. Maybe because the rumors had been floating around for weeks. Or maybe because the only time I even started caring about resigning him was when the Heat entered the conversation. Before that I honestly didn’t give a shit. It’s like being totally at peace breaking up with your long time girlfriend only to see her start dating your biggest rival and then you freak out. Like really? That’s how you’re going to do me after all these years? Just kick me right in the nuts? I thought we’d always be friends. I guess not. That’s pretty much what happened here.
So now the question becomes whether Ray deserves to get booed when he comes back to Boston? For me the answer is absolutely 100% yes. Total no brainer. He plays for the most hated franchise in sports right now. He accepted less money to go to Miami. He is willing to come off the bench for the Heat but not for us. He took the easy way out to try and win a cheap title. All that loyalty he earned with Celtics fans is gone. I’m no longer going to pretend that his 0-38483 shooting performance in Game 7 of the NBA finals vs. the Lakers didn’t cost us a title. I won’t pretend that he didn’t disappear time and time again in big playoff games. That he is brutally inconsistent. That he was slow as molasses on defense.
The bottomline is Ray Allen lost his job to Avery Bradley because Avery Bradley was a much better player at this point in their careers. So I understand that maybe it was time for Ray to move on, but not this way. Not by spitting in the face of Celtics fans everywhere and signing with the Heat. Like I said automatic boo. Automatic. I just hope Momma Allen has fun in her bedazzled Heat shirt wiping Gloria James asshole whenever she shits because that’s what her new life is going to be like. And when Ray’s career is over and he’s done playing with Miami I won’t hate him. I won’t boo him. I’ll just have apathy.

[Hank]

http://i225.photobucket.com/albums/dd123/pro--sports/aqkOVo.gif



:roll: :roll: :roll:





http://i225.photobucket.com/albums/dd123/pro--sports/dannystare-1.gif

[Kurosawa0]

When Doc says they pushed hard for a guy he is telling the truth. He specifically told reporters that they pushed hard for Ray Ray. If he was feeling unwanted, well, too damn bad. You are, correction were, loved by the entire Celtic fan base and he felt unwanted. The Celtic organization offered him a contract solely based on what he has done for the Celtics in the past instead of what he will do in the future.

A lot of fans love to blame Ainge. I'm on Ainge's side most of the time.

Can you see KG doing this though? Taking 1/2 pay to sit on the bench for THE rival team at the current moment, and do it because he likes the city better. Not in a million years.

Then blame Ainge for the damage done. This isn't something that just came up in the last couple of weeks.

Here's what I don't think you understand. It's not up to Ray Allen to want to play in Boston. It's up to Boston to make sure Ray Allen wanted to play there. They didn't do everything they could to do so. How do we know this? Because he's playing for Miami.

There, honestly, is not a damn thing wrong with Ray deciding to leave. It sucks for Boston, but it sucks for every team when good players leave. He went to a team that, right now, is probably the best place to play in the league. Nothing wrong with that. You can not like it, but it's not like Ray did something wrong or underhanded.

[LJJ]

Oh, you mean the series where KG was doubled on the catch while Ray was hitting some of the most open shots he's had all season? Yeah, let's just focus on that when Ray was completely useless for over half of the P'ayoff run and Pierce and KG (who led the Celtics in scoring) carried the team offensively.


I agree with this for the most part, but KG and Pierce were clearly the two best players on the team, period. Ray Allen was the third best player on the team. I don't know why this is so hard to understand.

I'm just saying, I don't want to cherry pick Allen's best moments and dog on Kevin Garnett's worst. So why are you people so intent on doing that to Allen?

When Ray Allen hits an open jumper that's because he got himself open at exactly the right place and the right time. He's made a career out of it with all kinds of different players, you can't just credit KG or Pierce for getting him open. And without it, these Celtics were nothing. Ray Allen is also there shouldering the weight when KG down with injuries. He does what the team needs with no regard for his own reputation. There is more to basketball than having the ball in your hands, the way I see it Allen's role was important to an extent that can't be diminished by saying he was "third most important at best". I prefer to say "just as important", because without it you are going nowhere.
I guess I just value Allen's contribution higher than both the Celtics fans and the Celtics management. And Ray Allen felt the exact same way and that's why he's gone now.

[nbarumorz]

Then blame Ainge for the damage done. This isn't something that just came up in the last couple of weeks.

Here's what I don't think you understand. It's not up to Ray Allen to want to play in Boston. It's up to Boston to make sure Ray Allen wanted to play there. They didn't do everything they could to do so. How do we know this? Because he's playing for Miami.

There, honestly, is not a damn thing wrong with Ray deciding to leave. It sucks for Boston, but it sucks for every team when good players leave. He went to a team that, right now, is probably the best place to play in the league. Nothing wrong with that. You can not like it, but it's not like Ray did something wrong or underhanded.

What do you mean it's not up to Ray Allen to want play in Boston? It was completely up to him. Boston looked around at other teams offer, saw Miami offering 3M a year for 2 yrs, and doubled that.

That is unprecedented. That should have locked up Ray with Boston right then and there.

Is two years at 6 mill per a lot for a guy in his mid-30s with a handful of health problems? Absolutely. But it was an offer that all but guarantees Ray would reitre in Celtic green. At the time it seemed impossible to envision a scenario where Allen would leave the ubuntu camaraderie for half-price. It seemed to be much smarter to stick around and be one of the highest paid sixth men in the league.

Again, maybe if Ray could just be honest and say why he really left Boston I would be alright. If he wants to be considered loyal to Boston fans and the town he owes us an explanation. And not just because he wanted to win a title because that's a slap in the face. The Celtics could very easily win a title next season.

[Kurosawa0]

Again, maybe if Ray could just be honest and say why he really left Boston I would be alright.

Why do you need him to SAY it? It's completely obvious.

[Hank]

The Celtics could very easily win a title next season.

http://i225.photobucket.com/albums/dd123/pro--sports/tumblr_m6boufy4N21qgqava.gif

[Kevin_Garnett_5]

I'm just saying, I don't want to cherry pick Allen's best moments and dog on Kevin Garnett's worst. So why are you people so intent on doing that to Allen? I'm not. I've never said a word about any of Ray's bad games/performances until you came in here claiming he was as good as KG and Pierce.


When Ray Allen hits an open jumper that's because he got himself open at exactly the right place and the right time. He's made a career out of it with all kinds of different players, you can't just credit KG or Pierce for getting him open. And without it, these Celtics were nothing. Ray Allen is also there shouldering the weight when KG down with injuries. He does what the team needs with no regard for his own reputation. There is more to basketball than having the ball in your hands, the way I see it Allen's role was important to an extent that can't be diminished by saying he was "third most important at best". I prefer to say "just as important", because without it you are going nowhere.
I guess I just value Allen's contribution higher than both the Celtics fans and the Celtics management. And Ray Allen felt the exact same way and that's why he's gone now.
I'm not taking any of that away from Ray (Although I disagree with the "without Ray the Celtics go nowhere" line. They basically played without Ray for 2 and a half series' in 08), but he was simply the teams third best player. I don't see how that's disrespectful or diminishing his role on the team. Chris Bosh was the third best player on the Heat, that doesn't mean he's not a great player, as was Parker to the Spurs, Worthy to the Lakers, etc. There is absolutely nothing wrong with being the third best player on a championship team.

[G-train]

The bottomline is Ray Allen lost his job to Avery Bradley because Avery Bradley was a much better player at this point in their careers.

Wrong. Bradley got the job because Ray got injured, and when Ray came back Doc wanted to experiment with having scoring punch off the bench like Manu, and it worked.
Ray Allen is a better player than Bradley, even at this point. Even if you disagree, its false to say "Avery Bradley was a much better player at this point in their careers."

[nbarumorz]

I'm just saying, I don't want to cherry pick Allen's best moments and dog on Kevin Garnett's worst. So why are you people so intent on doing that to Allen?

When Ray Allen hits an open jumper that's because he got himself open at exactly the right place and the right time. He's made a career out of it with all kinds of different players, you can't just credit KG or Pierce for getting him open. And without it, these Celtics were nothing. Ray Allen is also there shouldering the weight when KG down with injuries. He does what the team needs with no regard for his own reputation. There is more to basketball than having the ball in your hands, the way I see it Allen's role was important to an extent that can't be diminished by saying he was "third most important at best". I prefer to say "just as important", because without it you are going nowhere.
I guess I just value Allen's contribution higher than both the Celtics fans and the Celtics management. And Ray Allen felt the exact same way and that's why he's gone now.

Umm, without KG the Celtics have 0 chance at a title. Ray didn't shoulder shit when KG wasn't playing. While when Ray hobbled around this postseason they still were able to get to Game 7 of the Conference Finals.

In fact when KG was injured for the '09 playoffs Celtics got knocked off by the Magic 2nd round. Here were his "shouldering"-level stats for that series:

GM1 9 pts 2-12 shooting
GM2 22 pts 7-15 shooting
GM3 8 pts 3-13 shooting
GM4 12 pts 6-13 shooting
GM5 13 pts 3-11 shooting
GM6 5 pts 2-11 shooting
GM7 23 pts 9-18 shooting

He shoots and he......misses again. Good try LJJ!

[Mach_3]

I'm just saying, I don't want to cherry pick Allen's best moments and dog on Kevin Garnett's worst. So why are you people so intent on doing that to Allen?

When Ray Allen hits an open jumper that's because he got himself open at exactly the right place and the right time. He's made a career out of it with all kinds of different players, you can't just credit KG or Pierce for getting him open. And without it, these Celtics were nothing. Ray Allen is also there shouldering the weight when KG down with injuries. He does what the team needs with no regard for his own reputation. There is more to basketball than having the ball in your hands, the way I see it Allen's role was important to an extent that can't be diminished by saying he was "third most important at best". I prefer to say "just as important", because without it you are going nowhere.
I guess I just value Allen's contribution higher than both the Celtics fans and the Celtics management. And Ray Allen felt the exact same way and that's why he's gone now.

:roll: You make it seem like Ray Allen was carrying the Celtics when Garnett went down when Rondo was the actual one doing the heavy lifting.

And no matter how many times you try to drive home your point, Ray Ray's shooting at no point was more important then Garnett's defense, or Pierce's scoring abilities.

And it's not that we don't value Ray Ray's contributions but when someone is overrated like he's been over the past few weeks Celtics fans are going to say something. And he lost his starting job fair and square to Bradley who we were BEASTING with when he was healthy the last 3rd of the season. Allen might have been able to keep his starting job if he was able to guard something quicker than a tree sloth

I'll never forget what Ray did for us but please stop overrating him :banghead:

[nbarumorz]

Wrong. Bradley got the job because Ray got injured, and when Ray came back Doc wanted to experiment with having scoring punch off the bench like Manu, and it worked.
Ray Allen is a better player than Bradley, even at this point. Even if you disagree, its false to say "Avery Bradley was a much better player at this point in their careers."

Not my words, that was a quote from Barstool Sports.

[nbarumorz]

:roll: You make it seem like Ray Allen was carrying the Celtics when Garnett went down when Rondo was the actual one doing the heavy lifting.

And no matter how many times you try to drive home your point, Ray Ray's shooting at no point was more important then Garnett's defense, or Pierce's scoring abilities.

And it's not that we don't value Ray Ray's contributions but when someone is overrated like he's been over the past few weeks Celtics fans are going to say something. And he lost his starting job fair and square to Bradley who we were BEASTING with when he was healthy the last 3rd of the season. Allen might have been able to keep his starting job if he was able to guard something quicker than a tree sloth

I'll never forget what Ray did for us but please stop overrating him :banghead:


I'm glad someone else sees clearly besides me and Kevin_Garnett_5.

[taucesays]

I think it's pretty classless when your player gives the same reasons for leaving as a woman.

[nbarumorz]

I think it's pretty classless when your player gives the same reasons for leaving as a woman.

:lol :lol :lol I needed that laugh. I'd rep you if I could.

[G-train]

1. Boston agreed to trade him and it fell through.
2. Rondo is a douchebag and Ray can't stand him.
3. He can't run around screens in the Boston offence for another couple of years, but he can hit wide open treys playing off Big 3.
4. Miami with Bosh would have kicked Boston's ass and everyone with brain knows it. The Celtics are cooked and second round fodder.
5. The Heat will raise that trophy again within the next 2 seasons.

5 facts for Boston fans.

[NoGunzJustSkillz]

http://i225.photobucket.com/albums/dd123/pro--sports/tumblr_m6boufy4N21qgqava.gif
god, i hate fake asss nba fans. stick to the heat forum.

[LJJ]

:roll: You make it seem like Ray Allen was carrying the Celtics when Garnett went down when Rondo was the actual one doing the heavy lifting.

And no matter how many times you try to drive home your point, Ray Ray's shooting at no point was more important then Garnett's defense, or Pierce's scoring abilities.

And it's not that we don't value Ray Ray's contributions but when someone is overrated like he's been over the past few weeks Celtics fans are going to say something. And he lost his starting job fair and square to Bradley who we were BEASTING with when he was healthy the last 3rd of the season. Allen might have been able to keep his starting job if he was able to guard something quicker than a tree sloth

I'll never forget what Ray did for us but please stop overrating him :banghead:

Look, when Garnett went down: Ray Allen was still playing. I am by no means trying to say that Allen carried the Celtics by himself, but when a player regularly misses as many games as KG that needs to be taken into account.

When KG goes down while Ray Allen is playing every game, I guess that means nothing right? That's not valuable at all? I disagree strongly with that.

And the third paragraph is exactly what I've been saying. Ray Allen is injured for half a season and all the Celtics fans and the organisation is ready to throw him under the bus. It's just not classy at all.

[nbarumorz]

1. Boston agreed to trade him and it fell through.
2. Rondo is a douchebag and Ray can't stand him.
3. He can't run around screens in the Boston offence for another couple of years, but he can hit wide open treys playing off Big 3.
4. Miami with Bosh would have kicked Boston's ass and everyone with brain knows it. The Celtics are cooked and second round fodder.
5. The Heat will raise that trophy again within the next 2 seasons.

5 facts for Boston fans.

For #2 we prefer the word "moody" :oldlol:

And number four isn't a fact we've been over that. Pierce was injured, Allen was crippled, and Bradley was not playing.

[Hank]

1. Boston agreed to trade him and it fell through.
2. Rondo is a douchebag and Ray can't stand him.
3. He can't run around screens in the Boston offence for another couple of years, but he can hit wide open treys playing off Big 3.
4. Miami with Bosh would have kicked Boston's ass and everyone with brain knows it. The Celtics are cooked and second round fodder.
5. The Heat will raise that trophy again within the next 2 seasons.

5 facts for Boston fans.

so hard for them to admit, they'd rather live in denial

[Mach_3]

I'm glad someone else sees clearly besides me and Kevin_Garnett_5.

I don' agree with hating the guy for going to Miami (Although i label it a ***** move because he went to our biggest rival(s) for the last 5 years) I just thought he would have more fight in him to stay with the team that almost dethroned the champs this season and the Celtics themselves weren't even fully healthy

[Derka]

lol, its funny how the Heat bandwagon has to rush to Ray's defense when they were all mocking him in the ECF series thread and calling him washed up...until he decided to join the Heat.

[nbarumorz]

Look, when Garnett went down: Ray Allen was still playing. I am by no means trying to say that Allen carried the Celtics by himself, but when a player regularly misses as many games as KG that needs to be taken into account.

When KG goes down while Ray Allen is playing every game, I guess that means nothing right? That's not valuable at all? I disagree strongly with that.

And the third paragraph is exactly what I've been saying. Ray Allen is injured for half a season and all the Celtics fans and the organisation is ready to throw him under the bus. It's just not classy at all.

Dude stop. You literally just said that Allen shouldered the load when KG isn't playing and that is just not true. His play didn't elevate the slightest. Rondo and Pierce's play however is a different story

We know Allen was injured. We are saying that Bradley, healthy, was better than Allen, injured. Straight up fact. We aren't blaming him for being injured, we are wondering why he was reportedly angry after the season was over for not starting. Even though he literally stated during the year that he is OK with coming off the bench.

[G-train]

For #2 we prefer the word "moody" :oldlol:

And number four isn't a fact we've been over that. Pierce was injured, Allen was crippled, and Bradley was not playing.

Number 4 is the biggest fact.
See 2011, see 2012 when Bosh played.
See the history of the NBA, where old guys keep getting old and keep getting injured.
See the facts about Bradley, who is nothing more than an athletic defender role player who has learnt to play off Rondo.
Wade had sore knee too. Healthy Wade v healthy Bradley, in the playoffs?
No one can guard healthy Wade.

[nbarumorz]

lol, its funny how the Heat bandwagon has to rush to Ray's defense when they were all mocking him in the ECF series thread and calling him washed up...until he decided to join the Heat.

Now they overvalue the shit out of him. Make him sound like Michael Jordan or something. :roll:

[Mach_3]

Look, when Garnett went down: Ray Allen was still playing. I am by no means trying to say that Allen carried the Celtics by himself, but when a player regularly misses as many games as KG that needs to be taken into account.

When KG goes down while Ray Allen is playing every game, I guess that means nothing right? That's not valuable at all? I disagree strongly with that.

And the third paragraph is exactly what I've been saying. Ray Allen is injured for half a season and all the Celtics fans and the organisation is ready to throw him under the bus. It's just not classy at all.

1. Well if that's the case then i might as well credit every player on the team for playing when KG was injured then

2. I never said Ray Ray's shooting was not vaulable now did i? :hammerhead:

3. I wrote that 3rd paragraph because it's clear to any C's fan that we CANNOT win with Ray Ray as a starting 2 guard because he doesn't have the lateral quickness to stick the Dwyane Wade's of the NBA. Make no mistake i'd be doing fcuking backflips if Ray had accepted a bench role with the C's. But you don't ignore how stupidly efficient the Celtics were on offense and defense with Bradley as the starting 2 guard and ignore it. Hell i believe Ray himself said he wanted Bradley to start anyway

[Derka]

I don' agree with hating the guy for going to Miami (Although i label it a ***** move because he went to our biggest rival(s) for the last 5 years) I just thought he would have more fight in him to stay with the team that almost dethroned the champs this season and the Celtics themselves weren't even fully healthy

There was no rivalry until 2011. Lebron and Wade butts were so hurt from all the losing to us that they were doing that they had to team up just to have a shot at getting past us. To their credit, we got older and more injured and it worked.

[LJJ]

Dude stop. You literally just said that Allen shouldered the load when KG isn't playing and that is just not true. His play didn't elevate the slightest. Rondo and Pierce's play however is a different story

We know Allen was injured. We are saying that Bradley, healthy, was better than Allen, injured. Straight up fact. We aren't blaming him for being injured, we are wondering why he was reportedly angry after the season was over for not starting. Even though he literally stated during the year that he is OK with coming off the bench.

He partly shouldered the load when KG went down, simply by still playing and being more healthy.

It was a simple figure of speech really. But there we go with the language again. Not your strong suit, we found out quickly.

[Mach_3]

There was no rivalry until 2011. Lebron and Wade butts were so hurt from all the losing to us that they were doing that they had to team up just to have a shot at getting past us. To their credit, we got older and more injured and it worked.

I know, i meant more as in Lebron's Cavs/ Lebron's Heat. I should have specified. And yep we were the reason why he left for south beach in the first place :bowdown:

[nbarumorz]

Number 4 is the biggest fact.
See 2011, see 2012 when Bosh played.
See the history of the NBA, where old guys keep getting old and keep getting injured.
See the facts about Bradley, who is nothing more than an athletic defender role player who has learnt to play off Rondo.
Wade had sore knee too. Healthy Wade v healthy Bradley, in the playoffs?
No one can guard healthy Wade.

We will see. As for Bradley, I believe he is much more than a defender. Maybe you should see his game log for April last year when he got good PT:

http://espn.go.com/nba/player/gamelog/_/id/4240/avery-bradley

15.1 PPG 52% FG
54.5% 3-PT%

He can be more than a defender. And that is also the answer to a healthy Wade. Bradley can guard a healthy Wade, no question.

[LJJ]

1. Well if that's the case then i might as well credit every player on the team for playing when KG was injured then

2. I never said Ray Ray's shooting was not vaulable now did i? :hammerhead:

3. I wrote that 3rd paragraph because it's clear to any C's fan that we CANNOT win with Ray Ray as a starting 2 guard because he doesn't have the lateral quickness to stick the Dwyane Wade's of the NBA. Make no mistake i'd be doing fcuking backflips if Ray had accepted a bench role with the C's. But you don't ignore how stupidly efficient the Celtics were on offense and defense with Bradley as the starting 2 guard and ignore it. Hell i believe Ray himself said he wanted Bradley to start anyway

Yes, that should be a given. Players who stay healthy have that over players who don't.


So when comparing three very comparable players in talent. So comparable that they were even dubbed the big three, which of them is more healthy should be taken into account.

I hear you about Ray Allen squandering Boston's chances by being injured this past season. But you guys are not saying word one about KG doing the same before multiple times. That's called throwing a player under the bus. The standards for Ray Allen and KG aren't the same. KG gets a pass and a 32 million contract, Ray Allen gets hate and a boot to the face by the people he played for the past 5 years. Classy.

[Mach_3]

We will see. As for Bradley, I believe he is much more than a defender. Maybe you should see his game log for April last year when he got good PT:

http://espn.go.com/nba/player/gamelog/_/id/4240/avery-bradley

15.1 PPG 52% FG
54.5% 3-PT%

He can be more than a defender. And that is also the answer to a healthy Wade. Bradley can guard a healthy Wade, no question.

Hell yea he can be way more than just a on ball defensive beast! Especially with his cutting/athletic ability and Rondo's trickery with the ball. Those two worked perfectly with each other on defense and offense when Bradley was starting. Now if he can consistently hit that trey bomb we'll be in business :rockon:

[nbarumorz]

He partly shouldered the load when KG went down, simply by still playing and being more healthy.

It was a simple figure of speech really. But there we go with the language again. Not your strong suit, we found out quickly.

Dude, your point that has taken 5+ posts is that when KG went down, Allen's was valuable simply because he was playing. His play did not elevate at all. He shouldered nothing. Go back and look at your post, you literally said he "shouldered" the team.

That would mean that he put the team on his back or something to that extent. Now you are saying he partly shouldered the team after I proved you wrong.

He shouldered NOTHING. His play did not improve, he didn't perform any better than when KG was playing, he just merely stayed the same.

And considering that is exactly what you just said, then Pierce, Rondo, heck even Glen Davis at that time, all shouldered the load since they were still healthy. Even the benchwarmers were shouldering the load, am I right or am I right!

Please go away and go to the Miami ******ger's thread.

[LJJ]

Go have your hate party somewhere else kid. Not even the Celtics fans want you here, you are a shame to them. And that's saying something.

[nbarumorz]

I hear you about Ray Allen squandering Boston's chances by being injured this past season. But you guys are not saying word one about KG doing the same before multiple times. That's called throwing a player under the bus. The standards for Ray Allen and KG aren't the same. KG gets a pass and a 32 million contract, Ray Allen gets hate and a boot to the face by the people he played for the past 5 years. Classy.

Dude do you even understand the situation? KG IMMEDIATELY signed an extension with the Celtics, no question. Didn't even think about the Heat.

Allen on the other hand wanted to feel wanted. The Celtics offered 2X as much as the second best offer. We boo him because he left not because he was injured during the playoffs...come on man!

And Allen being injured didn't squander Boston's chances for this postseason. Bradley being injured and Pierce being injured had just as much of an impact.

[nbarumorz]

Go have your hate party somewhere else kid. Not even the Celtics fans want you here, you are a shame to them. And that's saying something.

Can you find a Celtics fan who doesn't want me here right now? Find one post and report back.

[MaxFly]

Without Ray: No championship.


Like I said before: Ray Allen actually took significantly less money than Pierce and KG to be a part of that Celtics team, despite being pretty much as important as those two and being an irreplaceable part of the big three/four.

The Celtics organisation just didn't give Allen the same respect, so he felt it was time to seek something new.

Woah... let's not go too far, now. Ray was solidly and unquestionably third in importance, and with Rondo's ascent... he's now 4th. He was never "as important."


Carry on.

[nbarumorz]

Go have your hate party somewhere else kid. Not even the Celtics fans want you here, you are a shame to them. And that's saying something.


LOL this is my thread!!! Where else am I supposed to have my "hate party" than in my thread that I created???? Or should we just never discuss anything besides how good LeBron is, as all MIA fans subscribe to.

:kobe:

[Mach_3]

Yes, that should be a given. Players who stay healthy have that over players who don't.


So when comparing three very comparable players in talent. So comparable that they were even dubbed the big three, which of them is more healthy should be taken into account.

I hear you about Ray Allen squandering Boston's chances by being injured this past season. But you guys are not saying word one about KG doing the same before multiple times. That's called throwing a player under the bus. The standards for Ray Allen and KG aren't the same. KG gets a pass and a 32 million contract, Ray Allen gets hate and a boot to the face by the people he played for the past 5 years. Classy.

Well considering i didn't credit anybody for stepping up outside of Rondo/Pierce who really did step their games up i guess i was more than fair then.

I never said anything about Ray Ray being the reason we lost to Miami. Our roster being completely injured imo was the biggest reason we lost, Ray was not the only injured player playing. KG gets a pass (and i didn't even really give him a pass in the first place) because over the past 5 years he's taken FAR fewer games off/had fewer overall bad games then Ray has and its clear to any C's fan that he was up until his knee injury our most important player.

We can survive a few games without Ray Ray's shooting/uber clutcheness and we've proven that before especially with his many hot and cold streaks, we CANNOT survive even one game without Garnett's monster presence in the paint, period. Our defense is infinitely better with Garnett out there which still amazes me in it's own because of how old the guy is. This is why he gets a "pass"

[nbarumorz]

Woah... let's not go too far, now. Ray was solidly and unquestionably third in importance, and with Rondo's ascent... he's now 4th. He was never "as important."


Carry on.

There's no point. This MIA fan is blind to this fact. You are the fifth person to try to tell him this and he still won't listen.

[LJJ]

So made he had to reply to the same post twice. Little kids are just too easy.

[LJJ]

Well considering i didn't credit anybody for stepping up outside of Rondo/Pierce who really did step their games up i guess i was more than fair then.

I never said anything about Ray Ray being the reason we lost to Miami. Our roster being completely injured imo was the biggest reason we lost, Ray was not the only injured player playing. KG gets a pass (and i didn't even really give him a pass in the first place) because over the past 5 years he's taken FAR fewer games off/had fewer overall bad games then Ray has and its clear to any C's fan that he was up until his knee injury our most important player.

We can survive a few games without Ray Ray's shooting/uber clutcheness and we've proven that before especially with his many hot and cold streaks, we CANNOT survive even one game without Garnett's monster presence in the paint, period. Our defense is infinitely better with Garnett out there which still amazes me in it's own because of how old the guy is. This is why he gets a "pass"

Well look, I can tell you Celtics fans see Ray's importance differently. I feel he's always been under appreciated by you.

But like I said, we'll just have to see how it goes this season. Everybody on the Celtics except Ray Allen will be back. I don't think this is a championship roster without a healthy Ray Allen. Time will tell.

[Mach_3]

Well look, I can tell you Celtics fans see Ray's importance differently. I feel he's always been under appreciated by you.

But like I said, we'll just have to see how it goes this season. Everybody on the Celtics except Ray Allen will be back. I don't think this is a championship roster without a healthy Ray Allen. Time will tell.

Well hopefully we can be healthy next season so we can prove exactly just that.

And make no mistake i've never underappreciated anything Allen's done for us. He's been one of my favorite players since ever especially since i started watching him way back in his Uconn days. I'm one of the biggest Ray Ray supporters on this board, (hell He Got Game is one of my favorite movies) but im a realist at the same time.

[G-train]

We will see. As for Bradley, I believe he is much more than a defender. Maybe you should see his game log for April last year when he got good PT:

http://espn.go.com/nba/player/gamelog/_/id/4240/avery-bradley

15.1 PPG 52% FG
54.5% 3-PT%

He can be more than a defender. And that is also the answer to a healthy Wade. Bradley can guard a healthy Wade, no question.


No one player can stop any superstar guard.

[Mach_3]

No one player can stop any superstar guard.


No but at this stage of the game there's as big a gap between the on ball D of Bradley and Ray Ray as their is Ray Ray's and Bradley's shooting ability.

And it never hurts to have a player who you can say "go stick that guy" and he'll do exactly just that

[Wally450]

Why do people think that without Ray Celtics don't win a championship.

Although they were dubbed the big 3, that doesn't mean they were all equally important. Pierce and KG were both much more critical to the Celtics than Ray ever was.

So if your saying that, then why is it a big deal to you that he left... Salty

[LA_Showtime]

Don't really blame Ray for leaving. He's always been the odd man out in terms of recognition and what not for sacrificing for the betterment of team. The Celtics also benched the guy for Bradley, offered him up at the trade deadline, and signed another shooting guard who would have inevitably taken some of his minutes. The icing on the cake was giving KG that contract and then low balling Allen. It sucks Ray won't retire with the other members of the big three, but shit happens.

[Connor B]

[QUOTE=nbarumorz]http://celticshub.com/2012/07/11/ray-allen-forever-i-will-always-be-a-celtic/

He "didn't feel the same excitement" from the Celtics as the Heat, are you kidding me Ray Ray? We offered you TWO TIMES as much as Miami offered you. Just because we didn't kiss your ass like Pat Riley doesn't mean we don't value you.

"I'll always stay true to the city of Boston and their fans"....serious question: does Ray even know he just signed for the Heat? Did anyone tell him or does he thinking he is retiring or something. Dude, you just signed with the biggest rival of the entire NBA. That is the opposite of loyalty.

[Mach_3]

Don't really blame Ray for leaving. He's always been the odd man out in terms of recognition and what not for sacrificing for the betterment of team. The Celtics also benched the guy for Bradley, offered him up at the trade deadline, and signed another shooting guard who would have inevitably taken some of his minutes. The icing on the cake was giving KG that contract and then low balling Allen. It sucks Ray won't retire with the other members of the big three, but shit happens.

I agree with most of what you said but KG absolutely deserved a bigger contract than Ray, I could easily argue the guy was our best player the last half of the season + playoffs

[Kevin_Garnett_5]

Don't really blame Ray for leaving. He's always been the odd man out in terms of recognition and what not for sacrificing for the betterment of team. The Celtics also benched the guy for Bradley, offered him up at the trade deadline, and signed another shooting guard who would have inevitably taken some of his minutes. The icing on the cake was giving KG that contract and then low balling Allen. It sucks Ray won't retire with the other members of the big three, but shit happens.
Low balling Allen? We offered him over double of what he's getting in Miami. The guy wanted the same contract as KG, who is a better player than him and deserves to be paid more than him.

[KyrieTheFuture]

Would you rather back up Dwyane Wade or Avery Bradley? There's your answer for why he left.

[Kevin_Garnett_5]

Would you rather back up Dwyane Wade or Avery Bradley? There's your answer for why he left.
That would be a valid reason if Ray didn't tell Doc that he was perfectly fine with backing up Bradley. If he didn't want to come off the bench, he should have spoke up instead of lying to Doc and acting like he was okay with it.

[KyrieTheFuture]

When he was injured maybe idk if he would be comfortable doing it healthy. Also things change don't expect people to have the same feelings for a situation forever.

[LA_Showtime]

Low balling Allen? We offered him over double of what he's getting in Miami. The guy wanted the same contract as KG, who is a better player than him and deserves to be paid more than him.

When I said that I meant from Ray's point of view. Probably felt really good to see KG get his contract, which by all accounts is quite a lot for a guy his age and with his knees, and then get offered what, $6 million a year? Not saying Ray's right by any means but it's understandable why he'd feel disrespected.

[coin24]

That would be a valid reason if Ray didn't tell Doc that he was perfectly fine with backing up Bradley. If he didn't want to come off the bench, he should have spoke up instead of lying to Doc and acting like he was okay with it.


So then you could have a reason to give him the Iverson treatment???
Ray wanted to start, not back up Bradley blah blah blah:facepalm

As if you wouldnt rather play in Miami than with those douchebags on the Celtics, hes not a lifelong Celtic so get over it... Too many fkn crybabys on here with there one sided morals...

[Kevin_Garnett_5]

So then you could have a reason to give him the Iverson treatment???
Ray wanted to start, not back up Bradley blah blah blah:facepalm

As if you wouldnt rather play in Miami than with those douchebags on the Celtics, hes not a lifelong Celtic so get over it... Too many fkn crybabys on here with there one sided morals...
The Iverson treatment? The Celtics played much better with Bradley starting and Ray said he was okay with coming off the bench. Don't see how this is anyway comparable to Iverson, but you don't seem to know much about basketball so I don't blame you.

And I'm fine with Ray leaving. I knew he would be leaving a long time ago. I'm still a fan of his and I don't hold anything against him. So I don't know who you're talking to with that "get over it" crap.

[NumberSix]

Boston and Miami aren't rivals.

[nbarumorz]

I stopped reading when I realized you are just a butthurt Celtics fan. Grow up, that's business. He wants rings and you guys can't provide that.

Why does everyone feel like the Celtics have no shot at getting a ring next season.

I know the Heats are favorites, but hey, shit happens.

Celtics have Rondo/Bradley/Pierce/Bass/Garnett as their starting lineup with Terry as sixth man. Add in bench players Green/Sullinger/Melo/Wilcox coming off the bench and that's a damn good team that can turn it on when it comes playoff time.

[G-train]

No but at this stage of the game there's as big a gap between the on ball D of Bradley and Ray Ray as their is Ray Ray's and Bradley's shooting ability.

And it never hurts to have a player who you can say "go stick that guy" and he'll do exactly just that

That has nothing to do with what I said.
Bradley is a good role player.

My point is if you want to say a healthy Bradley affects the playoff series, then I say a healthy Wade cannot be guarded by Bradley in said series.
The heat werent healthy either, and had improved more than the Celtics since 2011, when Miami comfortably dispatched them.

[Boston C's]

Don't really blame Ray for leaving. He's always been the odd man out in terms of recognition and what not for sacrificing for the betterment of team. The Celtics also benched the guy for Bradley, offered him up at the trade deadline, and signed another shooting guard who would have inevitably taken some of his minutes. The icing on the cake was giving KG that contract and then low balling Allen. It sucks Ray won't retire with the other members of the big three, but shit happens.


this... a lot of ppl are so quick to forget how disrespected ray has been his whole tenure here in boston...let me break it down for everyone...ray was the third best player in boston thats fact, however his importance on the team was all the same...k.g absolutely refused to come to boston but then when ray showed up he was completely on board with being traded there...you wanna play the loyalty card but k.g demanded out of Minnesota but nobody gave him crap for that... ray gets traded this yr only to be called and told it fell through and you wanna think that he should just be "loyal" and sign with boston...thats like having your girl cheat on you but you wanna show your loyalty and take her back... i knew ray was gone...ill reiterate that i hate him for going to miami but i completely understand his decision...btw boston fans all of you seem to forget that ray was pretty much our most consistent and arguably most important player in the 08 finals...ppl screaming that k.g should of won finals mvp need to go back and see how anemic he was on the offensive end while ray stepped up not only offensively but did a tremendous job on kobe (along with PP) and i remember every single media member talking about if ray or pierce deserved finals mvp and it probably would have been ray if pierce didnt go beserk on game 5...ray will be missed but boston should move on and it doesnt hurt our team that he left anyways so stop bashing the guy for making a good business decision

[stickfigure87]

I hate the Heat as much as the next guy, but you can't blame Ray for leaving. Boston fans..:banghead:

As a Laker fan, I wouldn't be upset if Pau decided to leave at the end of his contract. He also had to continue playing on a team that dealt him. It must not be easy to come out and play when you know management isn't completely committed to you.

If you want to blame anyone, you should blame Boston's front office for telling him he was traded before it was officially finalized.

[Hank]

Everyone should hate Boston for treating Ray like crap.

Everyone should hate the Cavs and their idiot owner for never building a good team around a generational talent like lebron james.

ditto for the craptors and Bosh... look at those idiots running that toronto franchise. I'd split in a heartbeat if i had a slight door open to split too.

those are the people/organizations to hate


http://i225.photobucket.com/albums/dd123/pro--sports/531351_388268991222914_370542387_n.jpg

http://i225.photobucket.com/albums/dd123/pro--sports/3peat.gifhttp://i225.photobucket.com/albums/dd123/pro--sports/3peat.gifhttp://i225.photobucket.com/albums/dd123/pro--sports/3peat.gif

[DKLaker]

....for.....leaving.....them.....for.....the...... enemy

see: Damon, Johnny

:roll: :roll: :roll:

[coin24]

The Iverson treatment? The Celtics played much better with Bradley starting and Ray said he was okay with coming off the bench. Don't see how this is anyway comparable to Iverson, but you don't seem to know much about basketball so I don't blame you.

And I'm fine with Ray leaving. I knew he would be leaving a long time ago. I'm still a fan of his and I don't hold anything against him. So I don't know who you're talking to with that "get over it" crap.


I disagree with you, so i must have no basketball knowledge:applause: Cool story...
Iverson treatment in regards to kicking up a stink about coming off the bench. Fair enough Ray was injured, but you really think he wants to be demoted to a bench role on that team?? Behind Bradley?? If he says anything about it he gets hammered by the media..

Fu*k that. Good on him for getting out of there. Imagine being around those douchbags Rondo, Pierce and Garnett everyday:facepalm


And the get over it comment is directed to half this thread crying about Allen signing with there supposed enemy..The Heat..

[livinglegend]

Nice job Ray!
Celtics fans are mad and hurt!!

[Scholar]

There's never a reason to be loyal to any one organization. When they see fit, they'll gladly replace a player, but if the player decides to leave on his own recognizance, he's suddenly immoral, disloyal, etc.

[nbarumorz]

That has nothing to do with what I said.
Bradley is a good role player.

My point is if you want to say a healthy Bradley affects the playoff series, then I say a healthy Wade cannot be guarded by Bradley in said series.
The heat werent healthy either, and had improved more than the Celtics since 2011, when Miami comfortably dispatched them.

Bradley is much much more than a role player. He performed incredibly well when Doc decided to start him in April . He's 21 years old. Dude oozes with potential, works his ass off, and has shown he can improve.

More than just a defender:
True Shooting % last year : 55.5%
ORating of 100 DRating of 102

In comparison, Ray Allen had an ORating of 111, DRating of 101, and TS% of 60.7%.

Paul Pierce had a 106/98 and TS% of 56.7% last year.

No reason to think Bradley is limited to being a role player.

And oh by the way here are the results between MIA/BOS the two times they faced off while Bradley and Wade were starting:

Wade: 6-17 shooting, 15 pts
Bradley 5-10 shooting, 13 pts
Game Score: 91-72 Celtics

Wade: 20 pts 9-21 shooting
Bradley: 11 pts 5-8 shooting
Game Score: 115-107 Celtics

No reason to think Bradley can't defend Wade from those #'s.

[Hank]

A Boston fan on your board at realgm summed it best:

I think you and other fans are reading this entirely wrong. And that piece was a pretty awful hit piece that was in fact entirely nonsensical.

1. Consumate professional does not imply team loyalty It's quite the opposite. It implies a guy who will do his job 100% properly for any team that hires him. It implies a guy that will DIVORCE himself from the particular situation and team.

Ray is the kind of guy that could score 20 points for the Celtics - get traded to the Lakers and score 20 points the next day. He is the kind of guy that could score 20 points in a summer league game. That's what consumate professionals do - their job. Which is for Ray - score 3 point buckets for the team that employs him without emotional attachement.

The idea that consumate professional = incredibly loyal player is nonsensical. It's irrational. Tommy Heinsohn bleeds green. I have grown to like Tommy he is fun - but you wouldn't call him a consumate proffessional as a broadcaster. Its quite the opposite he displays the kind of enthusiasm for the Celtics that would be far more closely associated with a high school or college program..

2. A class act does not imply any sort of loyal connection to the team. Again its about adhereing to personal code of conduct. Which includes - work really hard, show up for practice on time. say all the right things in news conferences and don't bad mouth the team you are on.

Guys who are NOT class acts would include our friend Ricky Davis (who I seriously liked and I suspect Danny Ainge did too) a guy who amazingly managed to party away his talent. (Haha) And another guy we almost acquired - Allen Iverson who gave his opposite of classy 'practice speech. (Which of course was absolutely hilarious). I might add that Paul Pierces humourous (in my view anyway) little bandage skit wasn't particularly classy or professional. And Rondo's pouting about Perkins wasn't classy or professional..

Both Rondo and Pierce are probably alot more attached to the idea of being a Celtic - since its all they have been and are considerably less 'professional' IMHO. I also happen to like them a bit more. You know when Rondo got fired up and pushed that ref. That's not classy or professional - but I liked him more. And I won't even really go into KG - crawling on the floor to mock guys. Hilarious. But not classy or professional..

Turns out that fans don't really like consumate professionals and class acts as much as they say they do. That's all we can say about this little incident IMHO. IThey want guys who bleed green but don't whine about being traded , which seems hypocritical.

[Hank]

hmm, last time I checked it's good to feel wanted, this is a natural human emotion.

first, that is a team that tried to trade you.

Secondly there was a bad rift between Rondo and Allen that we are getting more details on as we speak, why didn't the team try harder to mend this rift and trust the old pro being the classy vet he is ?

Why did Jason Terry leave Dallas to go sign with Boston?? Because Danny ainge called and made him feel wanted. Same goes for Nash feeling wanted by the guys in LA.

Lebron, Wade (you remember the tweets and i am sure there were phone convos included as well), Riley et al made Allen feel wanted.

The Heat did a great job of making him feel that way, the Boston organization didn't do the same through his time there.. it goes alot further than just money for Allen at this stage of his life, He has made well over $100 MIL

nothing else to see here

[Raz]

[QUOTE=nbarumorz]http://celticshub.com/2012/07/11/ray-allen-forever-i-will-always-be-a-celtic/

He "didn't feel the same excitement" from the Celtics as the Heat, are you kidding me Ray Ray? We offered you TWO TIMES as much as Miami offered you. Just because we didn't kiss your ass like Pat Riley doesn't mean we don't value you.

"I'll always stay true to the city of Boston and their fans"....serious question: does Ray even know he just signed for the Heat? Did anyone tell him or does he thinking he is retiring or something. Dude, you just signed with the biggest rival of the entire NBA. That is the opposite of loyalty.

[2swift4u]

I can see why Celtics fans are mad but give Allen some respect. I think he did a lot for the franchise and now he's leaving. It's obvious that he didn't go to a terrible team. I don't think it's that big of a deal that he went to Miami. I don't think Players hate other teams like fans do, so why wouldn't he pick the best team!? everybody would.. unless you have some personal issues with the franchise or it's team members.

[Optimus Prime]

Mad Celtics fans and bandwagon Heat fans arguing back and forth about Bad Ankles Shuttlesworth ... this thread delivers.:cheers:

Meanwhile in LaLa Land Kobe is a bad mofo preppin to get Nashty on the NBA. :kobe:

[#1SportsFan86]

I can see why Celtics fans are mad but give Allen some respect. I think he did a lot for the franchise and now he's leaving. It's obvious that he didn't go to a terrible team. I don't think it's that big of a deal that he went to Miami. I don't think Players hate other teams like fans do, so why wouldn't he pick the best team!? everybody would.. unless you have some personal issues with the franchise or it's team members.

The thing is you have most of these NBA players think the Heat are the only contenders in the NBA...you have OKC, Spurs, and even the C's but Allen took the easy way out and diss the C's by going to the Heat.

C's fans's should have seen this coming tho...Allen was the only C's player out there making sure he shook every Heat player hand when the rest C's Palyers gave there hand shakes and left the court...ALLEN WAS THE ONLY ONE STILL OUT THERE.

[Juges8932]

Celtics also offered him a No-trade-clause deal that he ignored...so don't bring up the fact that he was almost traded as a reason for him going to MIA. There would be 0% chance of him being traded if he signed back with Boston.

And if he really went to Maimi because he was ALMOST traded during last year then he needs to grow up and not be so damn sensitive. It absolutely shouldn't have an impact on where he decides to resign especially when the team that almost traded him offered a NTC !!

You know what the really sad part of all this is? The fact that you don't even realize the irony in your bold statement. Try taking some of your own advice.

Ray never quit and definitely gave the Celtics all he could and he really never got the respect of the organization at all. I don't blame him for leaving and if I were a Celtics fan, I would be happy for the years that he gave the team and the effort he put forth everyday.

[boozehound]

Without Ray: No championship.


Like I said before: Ray Allen actually took significantly less money than Pierce and KG to be a part of that Celtics team, despite being pretty much as important as those two and being an irreplaceable part of the big three/four.

The Celtics organisation just didn't give Allen the same respect, so he felt it was time to seek something new.
well, nor should they. Hes a pretty limited player, though obviously still an incredible shooter.

[Hank]

^ read the article

[Hank]

C's fans's should have seen this coming tho...Allen was the only C's player out there making sure he shook every Heat player hand when the rest C's Palyers gave there hand shakes and left the court...ALLEN WAS THE ONLY ONE STILL OUT THERE.


http://i225.photobucket.com/albums/dd123/pro--sports/7427515190_c176188040.jpg

http://i225.photobucket.com/albums/dd123/pro--sports/6df7ce18cb6911e1a94522000a1e8aaf_7.jpg

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[NumberSix]

Not a true Celtics fan. We don't need you. Ray deserves everyone's respect
Lol @ this guy. :roll:

Look at your location dumbass. You don't live in Boston, you live in Toronto. You have a home team in your city and you're telling someone else they aren't true Celtics fans. :roll:

[nbarumorz]

Not a true Celtics fan. We don't need you. Ray deserves everyone's respect

I'm sorry I'm not as polite as your typical canadien, eh? I respect Ray. I don't respect his decision to go to South Beach. But overall, I respect Ray.

[Boston C's]

this... a lot of ppl are so quick to forget how disrespected ray has been his whole tenure here in boston...let me break it down for everyone...ray was the third best player in boston thats fact, however his importance on the team was all the same...k.g absolutely refused to come to boston but then when ray showed up he was completely on board with being traded there...you wanna play the loyalty card but k.g demanded out of Minnesota but nobody gave him crap for that... ray gets traded this yr only to be called and told it fell through and you wanna think that he should just be "loyal" and sign with boston...thats like having your girl cheat on you but you wanna show your loyalty and take her back... i knew ray was gone...ill reiterate that i hate him for going to miami but i completely understand his decision...btw boston fans all of you seem to forget that ray was pretty much our most consistent and arguably most important player in the 08 finals...ppl screaming that k.g should of won finals mvp need to go back and see how anemic he was on the offensive end while ray stepped up not only offensively but did a tremendous job on kobe (along with PP) and i remember every single media member talking about if ray or pierce deserved finals mvp and it probably would have been ray if pierce didnt go beserk on game 5...ray will be missed but boston should move on and it doesnt hurt our team that he left anyways so stop bashing the guy for making a good business decision

this

[Keelyus]

I have no problems with NBA players chasing rings.... Miami gives him the best chance to a ring..... Whats the problem? Players aren't obligated to stay with teams.... Grow up, NBA is a business