How can New York Get Rid of Amare?

[Rubio2Gasol]

To Phoenix for Scola and Dudley :confusedshrug:

[christian1923]

Id rather keep Amare:rolleyes:

[NOHCP3]

Dont think anybody wants that contract. Especially PHX whom he already left.

[Horde of Temujin]

They should have resigned Lin way back then packaged him with Amare.

[ripthekik]

should get rid of melo first.

[TMacMagic]

Throw a bone to another state and tell him to go fetch.

[Rnbizzle]

Trade him for Joe Johnson? Does NY say no? :confusedshrug:

[Rubio2Gasol]

They are actually looking decent right now, somehow they need to find a way to trade Amare for someone like Illyasova ideally, or even Scola, and get a shooter like Dudley thrown in.

And hire Larry Brown ASAP.

I mean, why would you make Woodson your head coach , are you striving for mediocrity

[gasolina]

I'd rather play it out for a bit than get rid of Amare right now. People forget how good the Felton / Amare pick and roll was in 2010. Of course, Felton is now fat and D'Antoni isn't the coach, but I'd stay positive if I was a Knicks fan.

They need to get Shumpert back asap. They don't need JR Smith starting

[el gringos]

Amare and Felton and pick
For
Bargnani + kleiza + Amir


Amare + pick
For
Motiejunas and kmartin(trade Kmart for Villenueva + daye)


Ryan Anderson + Jason smith

The only plan for the Knicks should be to trade him for a stretch 4- he isn't as valueless as people think, even if one of these deals wouldn't work. It will prob take a good start to the season for amare and Felton to build value. If the Knicks could make one of those trades they'd be contenders

[NumberSix]

Kill him.

[NUPE_1911]

Why would NY want to get rid of Amar'e. This forum is crap.

[kNicKz]

:biggums:

[NYK_Stan]

Kill him.
:applause:

[HorryIsMyMVP]

NY is such a worthless franchise. :facepalm

[BlackVVaves]

No one is taking Amare off the Knicks' hands. If you haven't noticed this offseason, teams' front offices are not doing the Knicks any favors, in any capacity.

NYK has no quality draft pick to offer, so unless they package a Shumpert or Tyson Chandler, no team is touching Amare or his glass body and nauseating contract until and unless he is an expiring contract.

LoL @ a poster suggesting Amare and Felton for Bargnani. First off, Colangelo has illustrated he's more interested in screwing over NY than assisting them. Second, even if Colangelo was more inclined to help the Knicks, he'd never do that trade. Amare is an oft-injured, past his prime, power forward who can't defend, doesn't rebound, and, despite being in the league as a big man for 10 years, has absolutely no post game.

You're not getting a star, or potential star, for that kind of player. Not. at. all.

[coin24]

Why would they want to get rid of amare??:confusedshrug:
He's a decent pf and helped get the Knicks relevant again..

[el gringos]

Why would NY want to get rid of Amar'e. This forum is crap.
Not because he can't still be good, it's because he is the exact opposite of the player you need to put between Carmelo and chandler. Just a terrible fit- need a shooter there, a Bargnani/Ryan Anderson type.

[NUPE_1911]

Not because he can't still be good, it's because he is the exact opposite of the player you need to put between Carmelo and chandler. Just a terrible fit- need a shooter there, a Bargnani/Ryan Anderson type.


He will be fine on the Knicks. He typically has a good jumper. Last year was an off year and he still put up around 18 and 8. No need to get rid of him or trade him.

This reminds me of all the people claiming the Heat needed to trade Wade since he and LeBron could not coexist or win together. How did that turn out?!?!?!

Not saying Amar'e is as good as Wade but I do believe Amar'e & Melo can coexist and will coexist. You people just buy into whatever talking point ESPN spews.

[Bigsmoke]

that would be kind of heartless

Amare was the reason why the Knicks are even back in the playoffs. He was the reason why Melo wanted to come, like Melo was the reason Tyson Chandler and JR Smith wanted to come, so on and so on

Amare didnt play that well last year but still was more effective than Scola

[Sarcastic]

Why would they get rid of him? He is gonna come back strong next season, after working with Olajuwon on his post game. Something he was never encouraged to do under D'Antoni, who only wanted him to PnR.

http://c0014419.r32.cf1.rackcdn.com/x2_dd1c37e


http://c0014424.r32.cf1.rackcdn.com/x2_dd6a516



Day 1 @ Hakeem's ranch was unbelievable. @Amareisreal soaked in everything The Dream was teaching. #newweapons

[Bigsmoke]

Not because he can't still be good, it's because he is the exact opposite of the player you need to put between Carmelo and chandler. Just a terrible fit- need a shooter there, a Bargnani/Ryan Anderson type.

even if Amare doesnt fit to what the Knicks are trying to do, he would help the team out more than those guys would:rolleyes:

dont be stupid

[knickswin]

I hope that amar'e can redeem himself a bit this season. it's probably unreasonable of me.

I agree with el gringos that amar'e is a bad fit. you want a stretch four next to melo and tyson.

[NUPE_1911]

I hope that amar'e can redeem himself a bit this season. it's probably unreasonable of me.

I agree with el gringos that amar'e is a bad fit. you want a stretch four next to melo and tyson.

Melo & Amar'e have not played a full season together, have not had a training camp together and both were plagued by injuries last season. Where does this belief even come from. It is mostly baseless.

[JaggerCommaMick]

you need to put between Carmelo and chandler a shooter there, a Bargnani/Ryan Anderson type.


Why? So they can stand around wide open clapping their hands? Whos gonna pass to em, mate?

Knicks are a joke.

[gasolina]

Why is Amare wearing ******gers?

EDIT: SHORT SHORTS

[Scoooter]

There are maybe three guys in the league who can play stretch 4 well enough for the Knicks to contend with that model, and one of them is a reach in the "well-enough" regard.

Unless you think the Knicks have a shot at Kevin Love, the idea is a non-starter. Andrea Barnagni or Yi Jianlian are not making the Knicks into any more of a contender than they are now.

[v1ncelis]

Why would they get rid of him? He is gonna come back strong next season, after working with Olajuwon on his post game. Something he was never encouraged to do under D'Antoni, who only wanted him to PnR.

http://c0014419.r32.cf1.rackcdn.com/x2_dd1c37e


http://c0014424.r32.cf1.rackcdn.com/x2_dd6a516
This. Amare is crazy underrated on this board. Dude was dealing with back problems, brother dead ... give him a break. He will be ok next year.
Still my favorite Knick.

[NoGunzJustSkillz]

send him into a club with a planted gun.

[FireDavidKahn]

$18,217,705
$19,948,799
$21,679,893
$23,410,988

[ncrizzle]

Teams who would kill for anything close to a star could do a trade for Amare. Look at what Houston has tried to do to get dwight . Now im not comparing amare to dwight, but you get the idea.

[ihatetimthomas]

Teams who would kill for anything close to a star could do a trade for Amare. Look at what Houston has tried to do to get dwight . Now im not comparing amare to dwight, but you get the idea.


No I don't get the idea really. Its like day and night to even put those situations in the same sentence. One is a top 4 player, the best big man in the league, and the best defensive big man in the league who is in his prime. The other is the most overpaid player in the game with multiple years left on his deal who is out of his prime and injury prone.

Now I know you are not really trying to compare the 2, but no one is going to jump through hoops trying to get Amare and his contract. Teams will jump through hoops to get a superstar like Dwight.

Knicks will only get scraps or a worse contract in return for Amare. His value is at a ll time low. His contract is atrocious. They might be able to get Boozer, but still unlikely.

[longtime lurker]

If Joe Johnson was traded then *kg voice* ANYTHING IS POSSIIIBLLEEE!!!

[ihatetimthomas]

If Joe Johnson was traded then *kg voice* ANYTHING IS POSSIIIBLLEEE!!!

You might be right, but look at what they got for him. A absolute salary dump. You are def. not getting any better in return if you deal guys like JJ and Amare.

[ncrizzle]

No I don't get the idea really. Its like day and night to even put those situations in the same sentence. One is a top 4 player, the best big man in the league, and the best defensive big man in the league who is in his prime. The other is the most overpaid player in the game with multiple years left on his deal who is out of his prime and injury prone.

Now I know you are not really trying to compare the 2, but no one is going to jump through hoops trying to get Amare and his contract. Teams will jump through hoops to get a superstar like Dwight.

Knicks will only get scraps or a worse contract in return for Amare. His value is at a ll time low. His contract is atrocious. They might be able to get Boozer, but still unlikely.

Houston is willing to basically give their whole team away for dwight. Another team in need of some kind of star could certainly trade away a good portion of their team for amare. Or like someone said, the knicks could salary dump with a team in need of a star. We are not talking about a team getting better, but a team having more fans in the seats. Get it?

[JaggerCommaMick]

You might be right, but look at what they got for him. A absolute salary dump. You are def. not getting any better in return if you deal guys like JJ and Amare.


Knicks would probably best off if they could just salary dump him anyhow. They have no chance at even makin a conference final. Maybe theres nothin they could do with the extra salary room this year, but at some point in the next 4 there likely will be. Especially once they dump that loser Melo as well.

[Sarcastic]

Houston is willing to basically give their whole team away for dwight. Another team in need of some kind of star could certainly trade away a good portion of their team for amare. Or like someone said, the knicks could salary dump with a team in need of a star. We are not talking about a team getting better, but a team having more fans in the seats. Get it?


Of course he doesn't get it. He's a Knick hater, and to Knick haters every single Knick player has the trade value of herpes.

[JaggerCommaMick]

Houston is willing to basically give their whole team away for dwight. Another team in need of some kind of star could certainly trade away a good portion of their team for amare. Or like someone said, the knicks could salary dump with a team in need of a star. We are not talking about a team getting better, but a team having more fans in the seats. Get it?


Mate, Amare Stoudamire does not affect attendance figures. Please.

[BlackVVaves]

Melo & Amar'e have not played a full season together, have not had a training camp together and both were plagued by injuries last season. Where does this belief even come from. It is mostly baseless.

What are fans like you going to say towards the end of the season if and when Amare and Melo continue to play subpar of their individual capabilities due to the poor fitting the pair makes, along side Chandler?

Going to say "Melo and Amare didn't have an entire 12 months straight to build synergy cause Melo was in London for the Olympics, so that belief is baseless. Next year, watch!" ?

Tyson does what a center is supposed to do. Melo does what a small forward is supposed to do. Amare does not do a single thing a power foward's role is predicated on. He does not defend, he does rebound, he does not command the paint offensively OR defensively. He's not a superb passer, and consistently exhibits low ball IQ.

His offensive production was dictated by absurd athleticism, along with a solid mid-range jumpshot, and the occasional successful drive to the basket, all of which proved effective based on unconventional personnel use, placing Amare at the center position and providing superb floor spacing.

In comes Tyson Chandler, who lacks the (limited) offensive skillet Amare boasts, but in terms of the center position, offers every facet of the game a big man should present, except a reliable post game. Amare gets moved to his natural position - power forward - where his quickness and athleticism (which slowly declines) is not an advantage anymore as it was against bigger, slower centers. Because Tyson is a vastly better rebounder than Amare, and Melo is a vastly better player in the post than Amare, their interior presence is needed more than Amare's. Thus, Amare loses the floor spacing that his effectiveness requires. Pick and roll with him is more easily defended due to defenders now hanging around in the paint because of Chandler and Melo.

Amare just doesn't fit this more conventional, Knicks team. He doesn't do a thing a prototypical 4 man should, and does not offer the spacing a stretch 4 does. He's a player that's only improvements in the last 7 years were a (once) reliable 12-16 FT jump shot, nifty ways to finish around the rim (such as behind the backboard lay-ups to avoid his shot being blocked, (too bad it was SO very often this past season), and a better handle.

Do those sound like the priority improvements of a big man, or a shooting guard? I'll let you answer that question.

I used to follow Amare very closely. Anyone from ISH in the good ol days, back in 06, knows how fond I was of Amare. I saw a great amount of potential in him as a player, and defended him sternly, laughing at anyone who suggested Chris Bosh was better or L.Aldridge could be better. I foresaw Amare working hard on his game every year despite the injuries, and put forth effort on the court that would eventually show in defensive improvements.

But, he didn't. Derrick Rose. Kobe Bryant. LeBron James. Dirk Nowitzki. Chris Bosh. All players that each off-season assess weaknesses in their games, and work tirelessly to strengthen them, from Rose's outside shooting to Dirk's post game. That's what great players do.

Amare didn't. And now he's 10 years into his career, finally attempting to add to his game in a way correlated to his position, to hinder his notable fall into mediocrity.

Amare helped bring positive relevance back to New York basketball. And for that one half of a season, the Knicks owe it to him to keep him around. But, he'll still continue to be a misfit for that team, and still inhibit their progression into a contender.

[ncrizzle]

Mate, Amare Stoudamire does not affect attendance figures. Please.

And you are basing this off what mate?

[JaggerCommaMick]

Of course he doesn't get it. He's a Knick hater, and to Knick haters every single Knick player has the trade value of herpes.


My goodness, you Yanks in the rotten Apple are as bloody stubborn and retarded as the Kobe stans. Everyone is objectively telling you Amares trade value is shit. Why do purposely insist on being stupid about it? Do you take pride in defending the moves of your incompetent bloody owner? Or do you feel like admitting the Knicks screwed up takes away somethin from you personally, mate?

Youre too bloody self connected to a bloody sports team for the sake of the queen. Try using your brain instead of your heart and your vaginer.

[Rubio2Gasol]

I echo the sentiments of BlackVVaves , I may sound like I'm trying to hate here , but I just don't see Amare fitting into the offense. I liked him as a player once, when he banged with Duncan and such, but right now he's a poor poor fit, for a team which...with the right players could be very very good.

[JaggerCommaMick]

What are fans like you going to say towards the end of the season if and when Amare and Melo continue to play subpar of their individual capabilities due to the poor fitting the pair makes, along side Chandler?

Going to say "Melo and Amare didn't have an entire 12 months straight to build synergy cause Melo was in London for the Olympics, so that belief is baseless. Next year, watch!" ?


Hahaha, mate that is exactly what they will say. And it will be equally as ridiculous as every other poppyc0ck excuse theyve made along the way.

Such a silly and stupid lot, those bloody knickerbocker fans.

[ncrizzle]

Hahaha, mate that is exactly what they will say. And it will be equally as ridiculous as every other poppyc0ck excuse theyve made along the way.

Such a silly and stupid lot, those bloody knickerbocker fans.

Your schtick is getting old. How bout you log into your original handle and hang this one up?

[Sarcastic]

Buy low/sell high.


Why would the Knicks trade Amare away when his value is at the lowest point of his entire career? He's not even 30 yet, and he went though tons of shit last year with his brother, injuries, etc. Plus he has never had a training camp with a real coach, and Carmelo Anthony. He's had 7 different point guards the last 2 years. Just having a stabilized situation at the pg, will pretty much ensure that he has a better year.

[coin24]

Your schtick is getting old. How bout you log into your original handle and hang this one up?

This:applause:

[Blue&Orange]

What are fans like you going to say towards the end of the season if and when Amare and Melo continue to play subpar of their individual capabilities due to the poor fitting the pair makes, along side Chandler?
18-6, second best record in the NBA behind the spurs... I can ONLY HOPE they pick up where they left and CONTINUE with their SUBPAR performances...

:lol


Oh by the way, nice essay :oldlol:

[JaggerCommaMick]

Buy low/sell high.


Why would the Knicks trade Amare away when his value is at the lowest point of his entire career? He's not even 30 yet, and he went though tons of shit last year with his brother, injuries, etc. Plus he has never had a training camp with a real coach, and Carmelo Anthony. He's had 7 different point guards the last 2 years. Just having a stabilized situation at the pg, will pretty much ensure that he has a better year.


So he'll rebound and defend better with a 'stabilized point guard' and get some athletic explosiveness back in his knees playing under Mike Woodson and practicing with Carmelo for a few weeks?

:roll:



Public Service Announcement, mate: YOU ARE FUKKIN RETARDED.

[Sarcastic]

So he'll rebound and defend better with a 'stabilized point guard' and get some athletic explosiveness back in his knees playing under Mike Woodson and practicing with Carmelo for a few weeks?

:roll:



Public Service Announcement, mate: YOU ARE FUKKIN RETARDED.


HAHA. I knew it was you.


http://img522.imageshack.us/img522/7731/greenpolo.jpg

[JaggerCommaMick]

HAHA. I knew it was you.


http://img522.imageshack.us/img522/7731/greenpolo.jpg



What did you know was me, mate?

And for the bloody sake of the queen I hope thats not your photo you just posted. Keep it in the bloody homosexual marriage thread, mate! Nobodys keen to see that, this aint a bloody datin site. Or did you just post tht as our confirmation that you are 100% bloody retarded??

[JaggerCommaMick]

HAHA. I knew it was you.


http://img522.imageshack.us/img522/7731/greenpolo.jpg



:roll:

Who posts such a picture on a athletic website! I knew these Knickerbocker fans were dumb as bloody bricks but postin their ugly and queer photos in a basketball thread takes the cake and biscuits. Dear Lord. :roll: You are honestly the biggest f a ggot I've ever seen!

I think youre gonna regret this pretty swiftly mate.

[ihatetimthomas]

Knicks would probably best off if they could just salary dump him anyhow. They have no chance at even makin a conference final. Maybe theres nothin they could do with the extra salary room this year, but at some point in the next 4 there likely will be. Especially once they dump that loser Melo as well.

I think the Knicks would be pretty lucky to get a salary dump for Amare. they certainly are not getting value inreturn for him. But it is probably worth it to give it a go one more year and see what happens. Maybe a heathier Amare can help, but either way they ar not contenders.

[Horde of Temujin]

Do you think they would be willing to amnesty him next season?

[BlackVVaves]

18-6, second best record in the NBA behind the spurs... I can ONLY HOPE they pick up where they left and CONTINUE with their SUBPAR performances...

:lol


Oh by the way, nice essay :oldlol:

First off, what kind of incompetent individual enters a debate spurting random numbers and records without any context or purpose what-so-ever?

18-6. What is that? Is that the Knicks record after the All Star break? Is that their record with Amare and Melo playing together? Is that their record with Mike Woodson?

But of course, you don't care. As long as it's a favorable function that depicts the Knicks in a position that they surely have no rights to - a winner's position - it doesn't matter what it refers to our the circumstances that ride alongside it, does it?

:oldlol:

I find it so amusing, yet sad, that so many fans of a organization that has boasted one, '1,' uno, playoff win in the last decade can be so unbearably cocky, despite falling flat on your face, tripped up by the rug of lofty and unrealistic expectations based on flawed rationale every. single. year.

The Knicks are 29-37 since acquiring Melo and pairing him with Amare. A considerable chuck on those wins are due to the emergence of Lin, who your franchise deemed too expensive to keep. Nevermind signing and trading him while his value was peaked. Let's just replace the individual who single handely saved our season, that was doomed thanks to the laughable play of Amare and Melo together, with Fatboy Felton.

Oh you think you can just spew nonsense and not have it refuted because you think non-Knicks fans don't follow your team as closely so will be hesitant to respond. Wrong.

Thanks to MSG - which network on Time Warner was also saved by Lin and his break-out performance this past season - I watched a very large amount of Knicks games. Very Large. And I witnessed their horrendous offensive sets before Lin was given the reigns. And when I say horrendous, I mean vomit-worthy. Dribble, dribble, dribble, shot clock at 5, shoot - CLANK. Melo ISO - CLANK. Amare ISO - TURNOVER/BLOCKED SHOT/CLANK.

When did the Knicks play their best? When Lin was running the show solo, pick and roll with Chandler. When Lin was playing with Amare, Melo out because of injury. At times when Lin played with Melo, Amare sidelined due to family. Melo, with Lin and Amare out, backed by Woodson's give-the-ball-to-Joe-Johnson-and-let-him-iso tactics he brought to the Knicks offensive scheme.

Amare and Melo have won games together, but they have seldom looked exceptionally good together when they have, and usually either one player plays subpar, or both players play subpar.

They have lost more games than won together, and that is not an aberration. It is a well-documented story, especially out here in NY.

So save your homerism. It's misplaced and misguided.

[ihatetimthomas]

Do you think they would be willing to amnesty him next season?

I think he will need to have a god awful season season/post season for this to happen. If he is plays a injury riddled season, they will really consider it bc there wont even be takers even for a salary dump.

[JaggerCommaMick]

Do you think they would be willing to amnesty him next season?


Thy cant they amnestied billups, mate. They are stuck payin melo and mare 40 million each season for the next four seasons, mate! Truly theatre of the absurd. Only the Knicks, mates.

[ihatetimthomas]

Thy cant they amnestied billups, mate. They are stuck payin melo and mare 40 million each season for the next four seasons, mate! Truly theatre of the absurd. Only the Knicks, mates.

Oh yeah you are right, I totally forgot they used it on Billups...ouch

[Suckafree]

Gerald wallace + Kris Humphries for Amare?

Amare finds his mojo with D-will, Nets now have a big 3.
Slide Melo or Wallace to the 4. Mismatches galore, Humphries as first big off the bench?

lol phuk I dunno, just throwing it out there

[JaggerCommaMick]

Gerald wallace + Kris Humphries for Amare?

Amare finds his mojo with D-will, Nets now have a big 3.
Slide Melo or Wallace to the 4. Mismatches galore, Humphries as first big off the bench?

lol phuk I dunno, just throwing it out there

Brooklyn doesnt do it

[Y2Gezee]

They dont need to trade Amare, at least not now. He's one of the best options at power forward in the league for them because he can shoot the ball, even if last year wasn't his best display of that skill. However, what holds him back from being the weapon he has been in this offense is tyson takes some of his pnr opportunities, but that doesn't make him a detriment to the offense as his skills still fit.

But what will help him and the team the most is having a true pg, make that 2 in Kidd and Felton. 2 guys that can shoot, make entry passes, fit into the defensive mindset and run the pick and roll with Tyson, Amare, and Carmelo, who had to be the playmaker last year instead of the finisher or decoy. They are a complete, and versatile team well built to compliment both their stars. I think they'll win, Amare will be big in their wins and at least improve his trade value if they need to make a move.

They have the personnel to feature Amare in the pnr now, push the pace, and play Meloball when needed, and Amare is a fine iso player also.

[el gringos]

Teams who would kill for anything close to a star could do a trade for Amare. Look at what Houston has tried to do to get dwight . Now im not comparing amare to dwight, but you get the idea.
I honestly think Houston is a great fit for Amare. They have asik as a defensive center- need a # 1 scorer, and amare would expire before they had to pay a big contract to either rookie forward. Royce white and t jones could both develop and grow without being asked to be a focal point.

And for a fraction of what it would take for them to get Dwight. Would they really not do Kevin Martin and Motiejunas for amare and a pick?

Detroit gets Kmart for Villenueva and a daye - all 3 teams win

(shumpert)/Kidd/Felton
Jr smith/brewer
Carmelo/Novak
Motiejunas/Villenueva/daye
Chandler/Camby/k Thomas

That is the balance needed- its not trade amare just to trade him

[SevereUpInHere]

$18,217,705
$19,948,799
$21,679,893
$23,410,988

Not quite sure why you've shown last years salary, it's hardly relevant, but anyway. He's obviously not the ideal fit for us, hopefully he can develop a bit of a low post game and get the p+r running with Felton (and Kidd). After 13/14 he becomes a massive expirer. Could be better, but not the end of the world like everyone seems to hope.

[FireDavidKahn]

Edit: lol.

I just copied and pasted the salaries from a site that didn't update already. My bad.

[SevereUpInHere]

Edit: lol.

I just copied and pasted the salaries from a site that didn't update already. My bad.

Word :cheers:

[Fiasco]

Put him in a ring with a fire extinguisher.

[Rowe]

Not quite sure why you've shown last years salary, it's hardly relevant, but anyway. He's obviously not the ideal fit for us, hopefully he can develop a bit of a low post game and get the p+r running with Felton (and Kidd). After 13/14 he becomes a massive expirer. Could be better, but not the end of the world like everyone seems to hope.

His contract is impossible to trade because an expirer that size is only going to net you a collection of role players on longterm contracts who a team is desperatey trying to get rid of.

Look at Rashard Lewis's $23 Million salary being traded for 2 of the Hornets "worst" contracts in Okafor & Ariza.

Honestly, I think Amare finishes his career in NY and Dolan gives him a smaller contract after his current one runs out. Thats the Knicks way to always avoid rebuilding.

[Rowe]

I honestly think Houston is a great fit for Amare. They have asik as a defensive center- need a # 1 scorer, and amare would expire before they had to pay a big contract to either rookie forward. Royce white and t jones could both develop and grow without being asked to be a focal point.

And for a fraction of what it would take for them to get Dwight. Would they really not do Kevin Martin and Motiejunas for amare and a pick?

Detroit gets Kmart for Villenueva and a daye - all 3 teams win

(shumpert)/Kidd/Felton
Jr smith/brewer
Carmelo/Novak
Motiejunas/Villenueva/daye
Chandler/Camby/k Thomas

That is the balance needed- its not trade amare just to trade him

No.

Houston isn't doing that deal & neither is NY.

Dolan didn't spend a bunch of money adding old men so we can trade one of our core pieces for a rookie. Win or Lose we're trying to win a Championship and blowing this team up before we even make an attempt for it makes no sense at all.

[kobron23]

NY is such a worthless franchise. :facepalm


seriously what else can go wrong with this team like are the new clippers

[Kurosawa0]

I like the idea of a Joe Johnson trade. Would make a lot of sense for both teams.

[el gringos]

No.

Houston isn't doing that deal & neither is NY.

Dolan didn't spend a bunch of money adding old men so we can trade one of our core pieces for a rookie. Win or Lose we're trying to win a Championship and blowing this team up before we even make an attempt for it makes no sense at all.
Trading amare and a pick for 3 stretch 4's would not be blowing the team up. I get what you are saying, but still hoping a trade for players that would compliment Carmelo and chandler could be made.

I think with amare his struggles are as much or more mental than physical- do you not believe he would be a 20 ppg + focal point of a Houston team right now?

[NUPE_1911]

Amar'e is still one of the better 4's in the league and trading him for inferior players will not help the Knicks. LMAO at this dumb thread.

This is essentially a "propose idiotic trade scenarios" for the Knicks thread.

[Blu]

I like the idea of a Joe Johnson trade. Would make a lot of sense for both teams.

No it wouldn't. Nets would never do it. Joe Johnson's contract may be comparable to Stoudemire's but that's where it ends. Johnson does not rely on his athleticism or speed to score. However, Stoudemire does and its clear he is on the decline. You can easily squeeze 4-5 years with Joe Johnson without too much of a decline in performance whereas Stoudemire is done. No way Nets do this deal.

The knicks are an awful franchise and no one will help them out. Say hello to Alan Houston 2.0 (Stoudemire). Remember how that worked out?

[NUPE_1911]

No it wouldn't. Nets would never do it. Joe Johnson's contract may be comparable to Stoudemire's but that's where it ends. Johnson does not rely on his athleticism or speed to score. However, Stoudemire does and its clear he is on the decline. You can easily squeeze 4-5 years with Joe Johnson without too much of a decline in performance whereas Stoudemire is done. No way Nets do this deal.

The knicks are an awful franchise and no one will help them out. Say hello to Alan Houston 2.0 (Stoudemire). Remember how that worked out?

Amare has been better than Joe Johnson the last two years. This board has some warped perception of reality.

[el gringos]

Amar'e is still one of the better 4's in the league and trading him for inferior players will not help the Knicks. LMAO at this dumb thread.

This is essentially a "propose idiotic trade scenarios" for the Knicks thread.
I know you can't mean amare and a pick for the great Charlie Villenueva + daye and Motiejunas right?

This isn't a propose idiotic trades thread- its a "solve the one roster issue that's keeping the Knicks from taking the next step" thread.

[BlackVVaves]

Amare has been better than Joe Johnson the last two years. This board has some warped perception of reality.

Explain how Amare was better than Joe Johnson last year.

Don't worry, I'll wait.

[stephanieg]

If a player dies is their contract null and void or does it still get paid to their family?

[Blue&Orange]

First off, what kind of incompetent individual enters a debate spurting random numbers and records without any context or purpose what-so-ever?

18-6. What is that? Is that the Knicks record after the All Star break? Is that their record with Amare and Melo playing together? Is that their record with Mike Woodson?

But of course, you don't care. As long as it's a favorable function that depicts the Knicks in a position that they surely have no rights to - a winner's position - it doesn't matter what it refers to our the circumstances that ride alongside it, does it?

:oldlol:

I find it so amusing, yet sad, that so many fans of a organization that has boasted one, '1,' uno, playoff win in the last decade can be so unbearably cocky, despite falling flat on your face, tripped up by the rug of lofty and unrealistic expectations based on flawed rationale every. single. year.

The Knicks are 29-37 since acquiring Melo and pairing him with Amare. A considerable chuck on those wins are due to the emergence of Lin, who your franchise deemed too expensive to keep. Nevermind signing and trading him while his value was peaked. Let's just replace the individual who single handely saved our season, that was doomed thanks to the laughable play of Amare and Melo together, with Fatboy Felton.

Oh you think you can just spew nonsense and not have it refuted because you think non-Knicks fans don't follow your team as closely so will be hesitant to respond. Wrong.

Thanks to MSG - which network on Time Warner was also saved by Lin and his break-out performance this past season - I watched a very large amount of Knicks games. Very Large. And I witnessed their horrendous offensive sets before Lin was given the reigns. And when I say horrendous, I mean vomit-worthy. Dribble, dribble, dribble, shot clock at 5, shoot - CLANK. Melo ISO - CLANK. Amare ISO - TURNOVER/BLOCKED SHOT/CLANK.

When did the Knicks play their best? When Lin was running the show solo, pick and roll with Chandler. When Lin was playing with Amare, Melo out because of injury. At times when Lin played with Melo, Amare sidelined due to family. Melo, with Lin and Amare out, backed by Woodson's give-the-ball-to-Joe-Johnson-and-let-him-iso tactics he brought to the Knicks offensive scheme.

Amare and Melo have won games together, but they have seldom looked exceptionally good together when they have, and usually either one player plays subpar, or both players play subpar.

They have lost more games than won together, and that is not an aberration. It is a well-documented story, especially out here in NY.

So save your homerism. It's misplaced and misguided.
I'm sorry you just wrote two major essays about the Knicks and you don't know what is that? :lol :lol

Seriously how ****ing retarded are you? :facepalm


Keep writing, maybe we enough words, we will all forget how i made u look like a dumbass with just one measly paragraph. It must be painful...

[eliteballer]

Short answer: they can't.

[BlackVVaves]

I'm sorry you just wrote two major essays about the Knicks and you don't know what is that? :lol :lol

Seriously how ****ing retarded are you? :facepalm


Keep writing, maybe we enough words, we will all forget how i made u look like a dumbass with just one measly paragraph. It must be painful...

:oldlol:

Dude, if you want ignore every valid point I presented and continue to think Amare and Melo together will bring you anything remotely close to a championship, be my guess :roll:

But, everytime Amare passes the ball to a fan in the stands, or get's outrebounded by a guard, or get's embarrassed in the post by an opposing power forward, I want you to stand up. Walk to the closest mirror. Stare into it. And ask:


Seriously how ****ing retarded are you?

[highwhey]

I know you can't mean amare and a pick for the great Charlie Villenueva + daye and Motiejunas right?

This isn't a propose idiotic trades thread- its a "solve the one roster issue that's keeping the Knicks from taking the next step" thread.
lol @ trade proposals. classic ISH, vastly underrating anyone not proclaimed an all star player by espn or ISH's bandwagon knowledge.

amar'e might not be the best fit next to carmelo, but before melo came around, he was averaging 25+ ppg and making a huge impact on his team. last season was plagued by lingering injuries and the death of his brother but at least he managed to play a lot better than any of the scrubs being mentioned here.

as for joe johnson...i don't believe melo and jj would fit very well.

[el gringos]

lol @ trade proposals. classic ISH, vastly underrating anyone not proclaimed an all star player by espn or ISH's bandwagon knowledge.

amar'e might not be the best fit next to carmelo, but before melo came around, he was averaging 25+ ppg and making a huge impact on his team. last season was plagued by lingering injuries and the death of his brother but at least he managed to play a lot better than any of the scrubs being mentioned here.

as for joe johnson...i don't believe melo and jj would fit very well.
Had to read a couple times to see if your post made sense. So don't vastly under rate players that ESPn or ish doesnt love? Yet you know enough about Motiejunas and Austin daye to know they could never be good enough to trade amare for


And then your argument for amare even after admitting he and Carmelo don't fit well together is that without Carmelo he was doing great? That sounds like you are saying amare could still beast on another team built around him- that's what I'm saying too

[knickswin]

it really will be a shame if amar'e never gets it together again. he really was pretty great in 2010-2011 before melo arried. he's always had flaws, but 27/9 and 2 blocks with 50%+ fg% is too good to deny.

he would be better served on another team, unfortunately.

[swi7ch]

Amnesty him? :confusedshrug:

Lin > Amare

[swi7ch]

should get rid of melo first.

Melo at least won in college. Amare has not won anything in his life.

[Kiddlovesnets]

They can get rid of Amare easily, but its a different story if you mean 'How can NY become better by getting rid of Amare'.

[Rowe]

I know you can't mean amare and a pick for the great Charlie Villenueva + daye and Motiejunas right?

This isn't a propose idiotic trades thread- its a "solve the one roster issue that's keeping the Knicks from taking the next step" thread.

Amare is better than that trade package indicates.

I'd still turn it down even coming off of what he did last season.

You don't give up on a talented player who has proven he can be productive unless there is either a significant injury or it becomes obvious after multiple seasons that he can't get back to a certain level.

He's got 3 more years to figure something out.

Honestly, I think the Knicks would trade Tyson Chandler and move Amare back into a Center role just for the sake of trying to get something out of him close to what he did in 2010.

[ThyGreatOne]

Amnesty him? :confusedshrug:
Agreed. I don't see anyone taking on that contract with all the negative history (injuries) he's got surrounding him. On a side note, for what it's worth Amar'e played a whole lot better prior to Melo's arrival.

[bluechox2]

bring back this thread after 1 year

[b1imtf]

Amnesty him? :confusedshrug:

Lin > Amare
:facepalm

[Fiasco]

bring back this thread after 1 year

So we can laugh at New York all over again?

[el gringos]

Amare is better than that trade package indicates.

I'd still turn it down even coming off of what he did last season.

You don't give up on a talented player who has proven he can be productive unless there is either a significant injury or it becomes obvious after multiple seasons that he can't get back to a certain level.

He's got 3 more years to figure something out.

Honestly, I think the Knicks would trade Tyson Chandler and move Amare back into a Center role just for the sake of trying to get something out of him close to what he did in 2010.
3more years and then what? The worst thing that could happen is get way over the cap and let a player expire and leave

A chance at 2 young talents that ny might not be able to find again for a long while and another guy who is also low value right now in Villenueva who if he could regain it it would prob be in ny. All three of those players would be perfect skill type players for what ny needs.

Motiejunas and daye are 2 6'11 - 7'0 guys who can shoot and move with skills and could play for you 10 years or at least that look. And Villenueva is the same and could easily regain the form that would be a more than nice rotation player


I have a feeling if you really took a look at those 3 guys you'd rethink it. That's why a pick has to be thrown in. I really think this trade is better than good for all three teams.

Amare would be the perfect player for the rockets to center their offense on. If they don't you're putting too much on Lin and the 2 rooks Royce white and Terrence jones- hell you want to hope they can both play sf

And how could det not want k Martin to add to maggette as expiring pieces. For trade value for. They'd either have those 2 players trade value or 35 million in capspace and the Monroe/Drummond/knight to go along w stuckey/tayshaun prince would be pretty sweet

I could see a win from all 3 sides- isn't that supposed to be how a trade goes?

Would you do chandler for Motiejunas/daye/cv

[longtime lurker]

New York would be stupid to get rid of Amare now before seeing what him and Melo can do for a full season. I do agree though that this is his last chance, if he doesn't come into the season focused on his defensive intensity and rebounding they should look to move him. But they have to get an allstar player in return, anything less is retarded.

[Rubio2Gasol]

Rebounding, Defensive intensity , Amare

:roll::coleman:

[chains5000]

Rebounding, Defensive intensity , Amare

:roll::coleman:
IMO a good coach could make an Amare - Chandler combo look really good.
Let's give NY some time.

[Rubio2Gasol]

IMO a good coach could make an Amare - Chandler combo look really good.
Let's give NY some time.

They need some spacing man, at the very least both their guards need to have range.....Which they don't.....

If Amare played weakside and had a automatic 17 footer perhaps, but he's trying to develop a postgame :lol

[Blue&Orange]

:oldlol:

Dude, if you want ignore every valid point I presented and continue to think Amare and Melo together will bring you anything remotely close to a championship, be my guess :roll:

But, everytime Amare passes the ball to a fan in the stands, or get's outrebounded by a guard, or get's embarrassed in the post by an opposing power forward, I want you to stand up. Walk to the closest mirror. Stare into it. And ask:
Did i just missed something or u just went from Amare and Melo playing subpar because they don't fit, to Amare and Melo not bringing a champioship? Quite a leap.

So are you backpedaling like a mother****er or you really believe Amare and Melo are superstar championship caliber players that just don't fit.

can't wait to see u try to climb from the hole you dug yourself into

[longtime lurker]

IMO a good coach could make an Amare - Chandler combo look really good.
Let's give NY some time.

Defense is about 75% effort. Coming into the league with D'antoni as a coach really hurt Amares development. I have no doubt if the Knicks hired a coach like Thibs you'd see a more consistent effort for both him and Melo

[LakersForlife]

he cant rebound,cant play defense.i will trade him

[MeLO MvP 15]

Phoenix didn't re-sign Amar'e because they didn't want to guarantee the last two-three years of the contract... so why would they take him now?

And besides Scola and Dudley add up to about half of Amar'e's contract.

[Rowe]

3more years and then what? The worst thing that could happen is get way over the cap and let a player expire and leave

We're already way over the cap, so that is irrelevant.

Everyone expires in 3 years do you understand this?

If Amare expires in 3 years and leaves then that means 2 things:

1. The Knicks core as currently set never advances past a ECF

2. He has regressed so bad that the Knicks aren't interested in keeping him at a discounted salary so he can retire as a Knick.


A chance at 2 young talents that ny might not be able to find again for a long while and another guy who is also low value right now in Villenueva who if he could regain it it would prob be in ny. All three of those players would be perfect skill type players for what ny needs.

Motiejunas and daye are 2 6'11 - 7'0 guys who can shoot and move with skills and could play for you 10 years or at least that look. And Villenueva is the same and could easily regain the form that would be a more than nice rotation player
Wrong. Each guy has no low post game, defensive liability at PF, & still causes issues with spacing with Melo because each guy is more of a stretch 4 than Amare attempts to be. Amare is spending this offseason working on a post game to fix the latter issue, regardless even at his worst he is more productive than all 3 players. Donuts is a rookie but he's unproven beyond summer league, he might be good in 3 years or he might be out of the league in 2 years. He's not a player I'd gamble on until I see him actually playing NBA games because he plays such an interchangeable position at PF.

Austin Daye is not a valued commodity around the league, he's currently at the end of the bench in Detroit and they're debating whether to give him a new deal or let him go. If he has no value at the moment, then its entirely possible for us to go after him next summer for the BAE depending on the market he has. So why trade for him? Exactly.

Charlie Villanueva is one of the most overrated players in the NBA. You're telling me that he's supposed to regain his "old form" in NY as if that has ever happened to any bad contract we've traded for. :rolleyes: Even at his best he was a marginal role player who scored a bunch of points on bad teams while playing worse defense than Amare.






I have a feeling if you really took a look at those 3 guys you'd rethink it. That's why a pick has to be thrown in. I really think this trade is better than good for all three teams.
No, its not.

I dont want Villanueva at any price in NY, hes 28 already. Amare is 29. It makes no logical sense at all to make that trade.



Amare would be the perfect player for the rockets to center their offense on. If they don't you're putting too much on Lin and the 2 rooks Royce white and Terrence jones- hell you want to hope they can both play sf
Amare could be productive in Houston as a #1 option, but thats exactly the reason why I wouldn't have any interest in trading him for that collection that you suggested.

If he could do it in Houston as the "center" of their offense then there is no reason outside of pure laziness on his part to be equally productive as Option 1-B with another Forward keeping him from being double teamed.


And how could det not want k Martin to add to maggette as expiring pieces. For trade value for. They'd either have those 2 players trade value or 35 million in capspace and the Monroe/Drummond/knight to go along w stuckey/tayshaun prince would be pretty sweet

Works for Detroit. Remove the Knicks from the deal.



I could see a win from all 3 sides- isn't that supposed to be how a trade goes?

Would you do chandler for Motiejunas/daye/cv

No. In a Center-depressed market Chandler has far more trade value than Amare if he were to be traded during the season or during the offseason as he's fresh off of a DPOY and being an impact defender on a Championship team.

If he stays healthy, his contract with 3 more seasons left doesn't look as "overpaid" when it comes to the Knicks or another team trying to compete for a Championship.

[Rowe]

Defense is about 75% effort. Coming into the league with D'antoni as a coach really hurt Amares development. I have no doubt if the Knicks hired a coach like Thibs you'd see a more consistent effort for both him and Melo

Woodson has been preaching defense since he took over.

Its not as much about the coach as it is for establishing a team culture of hard work & effort. Thats primarily why we added veterans like Camby, Kidd, & Kurt Thomas as these guys may be too old to contribute on offense but they've lasted so long in the NBA because they understand hard work & effort on both ends of the floor. That rubs off on other players and keeps certain players from being "exposed" defensively, and I'm talking entirely about Amar'e Carsares Stoudemire.

[Scoooter]

If he could do it in Houston as the "center" of their offense then there is no reason outside of pure laziness on his part to be equally productive as Option 1-B with another Forward keeping him from being double teamed.
Or never getting the ball. You're forgetting how the Knicks ration out their shot attempts.

3 parts Melo, 2 parts JR, a dash of Stoudemire, Chandler, and Novak.

"It doesn't make sense for Stoudemire to be shooting layups or dunking when JR can be launching step back-jumpers off the dribble." - Actual Mike Woodson quote.

[el gringos]

Wrong. Each guy has no low post game, defensive liability at PF, & still causes issues with spacing with Melo because each guy is more of a stretch 4 than Amare attempts to be.
This is the whole point - Knicks need stretch 4's - that's how they get the spacing needed for Carmelo to play around the basket. I thought you knew that Carmelo is the best "power3" there is and that you want him around the basket as opposed to being a perimeter player

Yeah you'd be taking a big gamble on Motiejunas but he is a better shot at a big time pf than any player ny will be able to draft in the next 5 years

[Rubio2Gasol]

Motiejuanas has a low post game...but I want him in Houston, Mchale will make him the next great PF/C