Peaks - Kobe Bryant vs. Dwyane Wade

[StateOfMind12]

Who do you guys think was better at their absolute peaks? i.e. their best season?

I'll go with Kobe but I've heard some good arguments on Wade before.

[TheMan]

Kobe and it isn't close, and I'm no fan of either.

[kuniva_dAMiGhTy]

Kobe and it isn't close, and I'm no fan of either.

Same. It's easily Kobe.

[Sleu27]

Kobe.

[Heavincent]

Kobe and it's not very close.

[kennethgriffin]

i think kobe could be argued as one of the greatest playmakers of all time. not just scorers or defenders

he was the main play maker for 5 world championships afterall

fisher played shooting guard for the last decade

kobe played point guard and just shot the ball allot

kobe would bring the ball up the floor half the time... set up the
offense... run the play... get the assist ( lead his team in assists )
and get maybe 10 other unofficial hockey assists as the initial
passer/drawing the double ( 3rd last man to touch the ball )

if hockey assists were kept in the NBA. kobe would be right up there with nash and the league leaders in assists.

he and nash would both be looking at 15 assists per game


jordan had pippen... kobe had kobe

and hes been doing it for over a decade at this level


wade has more 3rd,2nd team all nba's than 1st teams... no mvp award... how on earth is this guy even mentiond in the same sentence as kobe?

:confusedshrug: :confusedshrug: :confusedshrug:

[MiamiThrice]

Easy, Dwyane Wade.

All we have to do is look at the 2006 Finals. The biggest stage in basketball. With his team trailing 0-2 in Game 3 with a 13 point deficit with roughly 6 minutes left in the game the Heat were looking at an inevitable sweep. Then it happened....

Wade took over the ****ing game.....and the ****ing series. He averaged over 40 PPG in Games 3-6 of that series and carried his team harder than any player ever has. On the biggest stage of basketball. That Heat team was one of the weakest title teams of the new century(probably the weakest actually), but because of Wade they got the same accomplishment all those other teams got, a title and it counts just as much. Kobe has never taken over a Finals series the way Wade has.

Hell Kobe has never won as the underdog in the playoffs EVER. He only wins when he has stacked teams that are the favorite. Wade was a huge underdog in 2006 and again in 2012 when he won his titles. The difference between these two players is that Kobe rides cocks to titles, while Wade IS the ****.

[b1imtf]

As much as I like Wade, Kobe takes this

[fpliii]

I'm probably not going to post (again) in this thread :cheers:

[kennethgriffin]

Easy, Dwyane Wade.

All we have to do is look at the 2006 Finals. The biggest stage in basketball. With his team trailing 0-2 in Game 3 with a 13 point deficit with roughly 6 minutes left in the game the Heat were looking at an inevitable sweep. Then it happened....

Wade took over the ****ing game.....and the ****ing series. He averaged over 40 PPG in Games 3-6 of that series and carried his team harder than any player ever has. On the biggest stage of basketball. That Heat team was one of the weakest title teams of the new century(probably the weakest actually), but because of Wade they got the same accomplishment all those other teams got, a title and it counts just as much. Kobe has never taken over a Finals series the way Wade has.

Hell Kobe has never won as the underdog in the playoffs EVER. He only wins when he has stacked teams that are the favorite. Wade was a huge underdog in 2006 and again in 2012 when he won his titles. The difference between these two players is that Kobe rides cocks to titles, while Wade IS the ****.


the level kobe was on from 2001 still going as of 2012 and going into 2013

wade reached it... for about a week and a half back in 2006



thats wade in a nutshell

he aint kobe... he like tmac/vince and many others showed signs of greatness... but their peak lasted about as long as the time it takes to invade a country and take out their dictator

[red1]

2009 Wade is as good as any version of Kobe

[Kurosawa0]

When Wade was at his best, he was best player in the league, but Kobe's always been more consistent. I'll take Kobe, but for one game I'd rather have Wade at his best.

[1987_Lakers]

Easy, Dwyane Wade.

All we have to do is look at the 2006 Finals. The biggest stage in basketball. With his team trailing 0-2 in Game 3 with a 13 point deficit with roughly 6 minutes left in the game the Heat were looking at an inevitable sweep. Then it happened....

Wade took over the ****ing game.....and the ****ing series. He averaged over 40 PPG in Games 3-6 of that series and carried his team harder than any player ever has. On the biggest stage of basketball. That Heat team was one of the weakest title teams of the new century(probably the weakest actually), but because of Wade they got the same accomplishment all those other teams got, a title and it counts just as much. Kobe has never taken over a Finals series the way Wade has.

Hell Kobe has never won as the underdog in the playoffs EVER. He only wins when he has stacked teams that are the favorite. Wade was a huge underdog in 2006 and again in 2012 when he won his titles. The difference between these two players is that Kobe rides cocks to titles, while Wade IS the ****.

http://arodrive.com/wp-content/uploads/2009/09/NBA-Refs.jpg

[Sleu27]

Easy, Dwyane Wade.

All we have to do is look at the 2006 Finals. The biggest stage in basketball. With his team trailing 0-2 in Game 3 with a 13 point deficit with roughly 6 minutes left in the game the Heat were looking at an inevitable sweep. Then it happened....

Wade took over the ****ing game.....and the ****ing series. He averaged over 40 PPG in Games 3-6 of that series and carried his team harder than any player ever has. On the biggest stage of basketball. That Heat team was one of the weakest title teams of the new century(probably the weakest actually), but because of Wade they got the same accomplishment all those other teams got, a title and it counts just as much. Kobe has never taken over a Finals series the way Wade has.

Hell Kobe has never won as the underdog in the playoffs EVER. He only wins when he has stacked teams that are the favorite. Wade was a huge underdog in 2006 and again in 2012 when he won his titles. The difference between these two players is that Kobe rides cocks to titles, while Wade IS the ****.


damn ur stupid.

[MiamiThrice]

the level kobe was on from 2001 still going as of 2012 and going into 2013

wade reached it... for about a week and a half back in 2006



thats wade in a nutshell

he aint kobe... he like tmac/vince and many others showed signs of greatness... but their peak lasted about as long as the time it takes to invade a country and take out their dictator

Kobe dominated Finals series with a far inferior cast averaging over 40 PPG?

Tell me more. Don't worry i'll wait for the stats and box scores of these games. I look forward to them. This is the Finals, I could give two shits about regular season games vs the Toronto Raptors. :oldlol:

[kennethgriffin]

http://arodrive.com/wp-content/uploads/2009/09/NBA-Refs.jpg


:yaohappy:


this....




f*ck 2006

f*ck 2012


worst titles ever

[fpliii]

the level kobe was on from 2001 still going as of 2012 and going into 2013

wade reached it... for about a week and a half back in 2006



thats wade in a nutshell

he aint kobe... he like tmac/vince and many others showed signs of greatness... but their peak lasted about as long as the time it takes to invade a country and take out their dictator

griff - hit up this religion thread:

http://espn.go.com/nba/forum#!/topic/1345335499-497-367

[KG215]

i think kobe could be argued as one of the greatest playmakers of all time. not just scorers or defenders


No, he can't. He was a ball dominant SG without a true pass-first PG basically his entire career. Despite that, his career best in APG is 6.0, and his career best in the playoffs is 6.1. In fact, that's the one category I can say with confidence peak Wade has the advantage in over peak Kobe. Wade has averaged 6.2 APG for his career and has two seasons of averaging 7+ APG.

So, no, Kobe isn't even in the same atmosphere as the greatest playmakers of all-time, but good try.

[TheMan]

Easy, Dwyane Wade.

All we have to do is look at the 2006 Finals. The biggest stage in basketball. With his team trailing 0-2 in Game 3 with a 13 point deficit with roughly 6 minutes left in the game the Heat were looking at an inevitable sweep. Then it happened....

Wade took over the ****ing game.....and the ****ing series. He averaged over 40 PPG in Games 3-6 of that series and carried his team harder than any player ever has. On the biggest stage of basketball. That Heat team was one of the weakest title teams of the new century(probably the weakest actually), but because of Wade they got the same accomplishment all those other teams got, a title and it counts just as much. Kobe has never taken over a Finals series the way Wade has.

Hell Kobe has never won as the underdog in the playoffs EVER. He only wins when he has stacked teams that are the favorite. Wade was a huge underdog in 2006 and again in 2012 when he won his titles. The difference between these two players is that Kobe rides cocks to titles, while Wade IS the ****.
One word, chief...REFS.

Everyone outside a Heat homer knows the refs went to town for the Heat:facepalm

[Lebronn23]

No disrespect to Wade, love the guy but Kobe is way above his level.

[TheMan]

Easy, Dwyane Wade.

All we have to do is look at the 2006 Finals. The biggest stage in basketball. With his team trailing 0-2 in Game 3 with a 13 point deficit with roughly 6 minutes left in the game the Heat were looking at an inevitable sweep. Then it happened....

Wade took over the ****ing game.....and the ****ing series. He averaged over 40 PPG in Games 3-6 of that series and carried his team harder than any player ever has. On the biggest stage of basketball. That Heat team was one of the weakest title teams of the new century(probably the weakest actually), but because of Wade they got the same accomplishment all those other teams got, a title and it counts just as much. Kobe has never taken over a Finals series the way Wade has.

Hell Kobe has never won as the underdog in the playoffs EVER. He only wins when he has stacked teams that are the favorite. Wade was a huge underdog in 2006 and again in 2012 when he won his titles. The difference between these two players is that Kobe rides cocks to titles, while Wade IS the ****.
Wade rode refs and LeBron to titles, bruh

[kennethgriffin]

Kobe dominated Finals series with a far inferior cast averaging over 40 PPG?

Tell me more. Don't worry i'll wait for the stats and box scores of these games. I look forward to them. This is the Finals, I could give two shits about regular season games vs the Toronto Raptors. :oldlol:


dude... wade dominated a finals with 20 of his 35 points per game coming from the free throw line

it was the worst officiating ive ever seen in my life

i dont even count wades ring as official

[KG215]

I think some of you are missing the point of the thread. This is about each player at their peak. Whether it's their best 2-3 seasons or absolute best season. When you chip away everything else, and just put those 1-3 seasons of each player under a microscope, then I think it's much closer than a lot of people realize or want to admit. I still give the edge to Kobe, but I also think 2009 Wade is about as good as any single season version of Kobe.

Obviously, in terms of career, Kobe is on a different level than Wade.

[BruceLeeBowen]

Kobe easily.

[Rubio2Gasol]

This just brings back bad memories of Refs stealing a ring from Dirk.

[MiamiThrice]

http://oi50.tinypic.com/34ozpqd.jpg

Note: Donaghy says nothing about the 2006 Finals, but specifically mentions the 2002 Kings-Lakers series as fixed.

In reality Kobe has 5 "titles". 1 of them was admitted as fixed by an NBA Ref, 2 titles from a prime Shaq. the most unstoppable force in the history of basketball. So he has the same amount as Wade once this is factored in. One as the best player and one as the 2nd best. Gasol was the best player against the Celtics in 2010. Wades Finals performances were also infinity better. Kobe only wins on stacked casts.

[1987_Lakers]

http://oi50.tinypic.com/34ozpqd.jpg

Note: Donaghy says nothing about the 2006 Finals, but specifically mentions the 2002 Kings-Lakers series as fixed.

In reality Kobe has 5 "titles". 1 of them was admitted as fixed by an NBA Ref, 2 titles from a prime Shaq. the most unstoppable force in the history of basketball. So he has the same amount as Wade once this is factored in. One as the best player and one as the 2nd best. Gasol was the best player against the Celtics in 2010. Wades Finals performances were also infinity better. Kobe only wins on stacked casts.

Wade only wins on the help of refs & LeBron.

[LongLiveTheKing]

Kobe couldn't beat the Pistons with Shaq, a year later they would've win but Wase got injured, then two years later they did and won the title. Dwyane wade is more unselfish and efficient.

[TheMan]

http://oi50.tinypic.com/34ozpqd.jpg

Note: Donaghy says nothing about the 2006 Finals, but specifically mentions the 2002 Kings-Lakers series as fixed.

In reality Kobe has 5 "titles". 1 of them was admitted as fixed by an NBA Ref, 2 titles from a prime Shaq. the most unstoppable force in the history of basketball. So he has the same amount as Wade once this is factored in. One as the best player and one as the 2nd best. Gasol was the best player against the Celtics in 2010. Wades Finals performances were also infinity better. Kobe only wins on stacked casts.
Nice try, Wade wasn't even the best player on his 2nd title:lol

the fvck outta here, son

[fsvr54]

I'm not a fan of either, but peak Wade is better. His peak was just shorter.

[Quickening]

I'm not a fan of either, but peak Wade is better. His peak was just shorter.
This.

[Sleu27]

http://oi50.tinypic.com/34ozpqd.jpg

Note: Donaghy says nothing about the 2006 Finals, but specifically mentions the 2002 Kings-Lakers series as fixed.

In reality Kobe has 5 "titles". 1 of them was admitted as fixed by an NBA Ref, 2 titles from a prime Shaq. the most unstoppable force in the history of basketball. So he has the same amount as Wade once this is factored in. One as the best player and one as the 2nd best. Gasol was the best player against the Celtics in 2010. Wades Finals performances were also infinity better. Kobe only wins on stacked casts.

http://i827.photobucket.com/albums/zz194/saes329/BarrackObamagif__BarackObamaDidNotRead_d61f7e_3675 033.gif

[Rubio2Gasol]

http://oi50.tinypic.com/34ozpqd.jpg

Note: Donaghy says nothing about the 2006 Finals, but specifically mentions the 2002 Kings-Lakers series as fixed.

In reality Kobe has 5 "titles". 1 of them was admitted as fixed by an NBA Ref, 2 titles from a prime Shaq. the most unstoppable force in the history of basketball. So he has the same amount as Wade once this is factored in. One as the best player and one as the 2nd best. Gasol was the best player against the Celtics in 2010. Wades Finals performances were also infinity better. Kobe only wins on stacked casts.


My Kings :(

Shaq stole our title with the help of the refs :rant

[PJR]

Wade's 2008-09 season posted a 30 PER. Kobe's never had a 30 PER season. I'll take Wade.

[macpierce]

kobe by a fair margin

[Dwade305]

2009 Wade with any Laker team since 2009 and it's a guaranteed chip.

[Quickening]

Wade's 2008-09 season posted a 30 PER. Kobe's never had a 30 PER season. I'll take Wade.
This.

[Chief Keef]

Kobe easily.

[fsvr54]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wArrzRWheaQ

[Sleu27]

dwade <<<<<<<< kobe


Fixedidit

[LongLiveTheKing]

2009 Wade with any Laker team since 2009 and it's a guaranteed chip.
Agree.

[Rubio2Gasol]

05-07 Kobe would get a ring with a decent team as well though.

[Ne 1]

Kobe, pretty eaisly. I don't know exactly where most consider his peak to be because he's had some great seasons scattered all over the place but take your pick. 2006 Kobe was an unstoppable scorer and great defender, 2003 Kobe had his best all around season while putting up 30PPG, 2008 Kobe MVP season led the Lakers to the #1 seed in the West and the Finals.

[Rubio2Gasol]

01 Kobe was my fav.

I have bitterness toward him ever since 02.

He made Doug Christie disappear tho, shit was magical....his footwork is just too GOAT.

[magictricked]

Kobe easily. Wade actually isn't even in the conversation

[Sleu27]

1998-2012 kobe > wade

[KG215]

Kobe easily. Wade actually isn't even in the conversation

Yes, peak Wade is in the conversation with peak Kobe. Career wise, no, but their peaks (their best season or 2-3 seasons) are closer than all you Kobe stans may want to believe.

[KG215]

1998-2012 kobe > wade

We're not talking about their career! Peak means Wade's best season or best 2-3 seasons against Kobe's best season or 2-3 best seasons.

[Rubio2Gasol]

We're not talking about their career! Peak means Wade's best season or best 2-3 seasons against Kobe's best season or 2-3 best seasons.


Whatt do you consider Wades peak?


Didn't watch much of them in 09 so I won't comment , but 06....I'm inclined to say it's not close.

[BlackVVaves]

Easy, Dwyane Wade.

All we have to do is look at the 2006 Finals. The biggest stage in basketball. With his team trailing 0-2 in Game 3 with a 13 point deficit with roughly 6 minutes left in the game the Heat were looking at an inevitable sweep. Then it happened....

Wade took over the ****ing game.....and the ****ing series. He averaged over 40 PPG in Games 3-6 of that series and carried his team harder than any player ever has. On the biggest stage of basketball. That Heat team was one of the weakest title teams of the new century(probably the weakest actually), but because of Wade they got the same accomplishment all those other teams got, a title and it counts just as much. Kobe has never taken over a Finals series the way Wade has.

Hell Kobe has never won as the underdog in the playoffs EVER. He only wins when he has stacked teams that are the favorite. Wade was a huge underdog in 2006 and again in 2012 when he won his titles. The difference between these two players is that Kobe rides cocks to titles, while Wade IS the ****.

Says the guy who thinks there are more than 10 players in the league right now better than Kobe, including Kevin Love, Tyson Chandler, and Iguodala :roll:

Anyway, Kobe 10 times out of 10. Wade's "prime" was inconsistent at times, mostly due to injuries. And, in comparison to other All Time greats, seemed considerably short.

But let's just stick to facts, huh people? All that "refs gifted" this and "refs gifted" that, is irrelevant. We're not comparing careers, or rings, or accomplishments. Just pure performance. Is that really hard for you teenagers like Miami Thrice and Kennethgriffin to do do?

Wade's best 5 year stint resulted in 27 points, 5 rebounds, and 7 assists per game, on 48% shooting, 27% from the 3PT line, 77% from the free throw line.

Kobe's best 5 year stint, which ironically coincides with Wade's best 5 years, resulted in averages of 30 points, 6 rebounds, and 5 assists per game, on 46% from field. 35% from 3PT line. 85% from the free throw line.

If you want a player who is essentially a slasher who attacks the rim and dishes very well in his prime, by all means Wade is your guy.

If you want a player who can actually shoot the ball as a 2 from anywhere on the floor and is a very good rebounder at his position in his prime, Kobe is your guy.

[blood yes]

Kobe>>>>>>>>>Wade

Wade is a better shotblocker, but Kobe is a better passer, scorer, rebounder, and clutch player.

Also, I think wade and kobe fans should try to get along

Wade didnt deserve a ring in 2006 (finals were rigged)
Kobe didnt deserve a ring in 2002 (game 6 wcf)

Below is my opinion

2002-2007 Kobe>2007-2010 LeBron>2012 LeBron>2006 Wade>2012 Kobe>2012 Wade

[BlackVVaves]

I think some of you are missing the point of the thread. This is about each player at their peak. Whether it's their best 2-3 seasons or absolute best season. When you chip away everything else, and just put those 1-3 seasons of each player under a microscope, then I think it's much closer than a lot of people realize or want to admit. I still give the edge to Kobe, but I also think 2009 Wade is about as good as any single season version of Kobe.

Obviously, in terms of career, Kobe is on a different level than Wade.

This, this, aaaand this.

[jongib369]

http://lol-slike.com/en/wp-content/uploads/2012/05/black-mamba2.jpg

[BlackVVaves]

Wade's 2008-09 season posted a 30 PER. Kobe's never had a 30 PER season. I'll take Wade.

Using PER as your only argument is the exact reason why that metric is widely misused and viewed so poorly.

[KG215]

Whatt do you consider Wades peak?


Didn't watch much of them in 09 so I won't comment , but 06....I'm inclined to say it's not close.

2009 was his best season, but he was really good in the 2006 playoffs, help from the refs aside. His peak seasons, though were '05-'06 thru '08-'09 in my opinion. Kobe has easily had the best career but, like I've said, this is about each player's peak and it's much closer than all these Kobe stans want you to believe.

[BlackVVaves]

Kobe>>>>>>>>>Wade

Wade is a better shotblocker, but Kobe is a better passer, scorer, rebounder, and clutch player.

Also, I think wade and kobe fans should try to get along

Wade didnt deserve a ring in 2006 (finals were rigged)
Kobe didnt deserve a ring in 2002 (game 6 wcf)

Below is my opinion

2002-2007 Kobe>2007-2010 LeBron>2012 LeBron>2006 Wade>2012 Kobe>2012 Wade

First of all, provide evidence as to why and how Wade is a better passer than Kobe. I bet you won't, because all evidence, including just watching a ****ing basketball game, says Wade is by far the better passer.

Second, why are you bringing up LeBron? Who the **** mentioned LeBron? :facepalm

[Heavincent]

Wade's 2008-09 season posted a 30 PER. Kobe's never had a 30 PER season. I'll take Wade.

That might mean something if PER wasn't such a useless stat.

[Rubio2Gasol]

Kobe went through so many phases in his career....I'll say this, I'll take 01 Kobe over Dwade 06.

Might just be me, but 01 Kobe was a spectacle.

I think if they gave playoffs MVP instead of finals MVP , 01 Kobe might have just edged out Prime Shaq , which is all I can say really.

[Deuce Bigalow]

http://i.imm.io/xcrG.png

[blood yes]

First of all, provide evidence as to why and how Wade is a better passer than Kobe. I bet you won't, because all evidence, including just watching a ****ing basketball game, says Wade is by far the better passer.

Second, why are you bringing up LeBron? Who the **** mentioned LeBron? :facepalm
stfu wade homer

And im bringing up lebron because if i dont, then some kobe homer probably will.

[KG215]

Kobe>>>>>>>>>Wade

Wade is a better shotblocker, but Kobe is a better passer, scorer, rebounder, and clutch player.


Kobe the better passer? No. Better rebounder? Debatable.

Wade has had seasons of 7.5 apg, 7.5 apg, 6.9 apg, 6.8 apg, and 6.7 apg. His career AST% is 32.8. Kobe's best APG season is 6.0 and his career AST% is 23.9 with both players having similar usage percentages.

Rebound% wise, Kobe has the slight 8.2% to 8.1% edge over Wade; and he also has a slight 5.3 rpg to 5.1 rpg advantage over Wade.

[Heavincent]

Better rebounder? Debatable.

Rebound% wise, Kobe has the slight 8.2% to 8.1% edge over Wade; and he also has a slight 5.3 rpg to 5.1 rpg advantage over Wade.

So I guess that's not really debatable then.

[magictricked]

Kobe spent the majority of his career in the triangle offense which if you know basketball is notorious for low assist numbers.Using stats without using them in the proper context is a waste of time

[KG215]

So I guess that's not really debatable then.

Kobe has a 0.1% edge in REB% and 0.2 edge in career RPG so, yes, it's debatable. Wade has a much larger advantage over Kobe in assists numbers; and anyone that's watched both of them at their best will tell you Wade is/was the better passer and playmaker.

[KG215]

Kobe spent the majority of his career in the triangle offense which if you know basketball is notorious for low assist numbers.Using stats without using them in the proper context is a waste of time

Ok, then ignore the stats; Wade is still the better passer and playmaker.

[RaininTwos]

Kobe spent the majority of his career in the triangle offense which if you know basketball is notorious for low assist numbers.Using stats without using them in the proper context is a waste of time

One of the most reiterated excuses in ISH History. Congrats.

2009 Wade is pretty equal to Kobe in my opinion.

[Rubio2Gasol]

Kobe has a 0.1% edge in REB% and 0.2 edge in career RPG so, yes, it's debatable. Wade has a much larger advantage over Kobe in assists numbers; and anyone that's watched both of them at their best will tell you Wade is/was the better passer and playmaker.

Not sure.

Once again 01 Kobe was a hell of a playmaker....but passer and playmaker don't laways go hand in hand, Kobe working in the pinch always gave made him a facilitating advantage without necessitating that he be a great passer.

[Heavincent]

Kobe has a 0.1% edge in REB% and 0.2 edge in career RPG so, yes, it's debatable.

How? What case can you make for Wade in that regard?

[KG215]

How? What case can you make for Wade in that regard?

I'm not saying Wade is the better rebounder. I'm saying it's debatable. For one he's smaller than Kobe; not by a lot (just like their rebounding numbers are pretty close) but it can be something that is argued in his favor.

[KG215]

Not sure.

Once again 01 Kobe was a hell of a playmaker....but passer and playmaker don't laways go hand in hand, Kobe working in the pinch always gave made him a facilitating advantage without necessitating that he be a great passer.
Maybe so. I know when he wanted to be, Kobe could play the facilitator role. But now we're getting to where we're arguing (me included) about each player being at their best in one area one season, and at their best in another area in another season.

If we're going to go with peak Wade and peak Kobe (both from about 2005-2009) then that Wade was a better passer and playmaker. Now, if you think 2001 was the best Kobe, that's fine.

[magictricked]

One of the most reiterated excuses in ISH History. Congrats.

2009 Wade is pretty equal to Kobe in my opinion. Not an excuse, it's reiterated because it's a fact. Using APG to say who's a better "playmaker" is wrong in the first place. Even more so when one player plays in a system that is notorious for high ball movement that spreads the assist numbers across the board. Using that criteria of APG Wade is a better playmaker passer than Jordan ever was and we know that's laughable.

And yes 2009 Wade is close to Kobe, Wade's problem is and has always been consistency vs. a player in Kobe who's been at the top of his game for years and years, Kobe's peak was spread out over years with minor highs and lows Wade's not so much. In the end a peak that goes up and stays there and is one of the best the league has ever seen is better than a peak that last's a year or two at the most even if it's equal to the other players.

[Heavincent]

I'm not saying Wade is the better rebounder. I'm saying it's debatable. For one he's smaller than Kobe; not by a lot (just like their rebounding numbers are pretty close) but it can be something that is argued in his favor.

Him being smaller just works against him. I really don't see how that strengthens his case.

Not to mention Wade cherry picks a lot more than Kobe.

[Rubio2Gasol]

Maybe so. I know when he wanted to be, Kobe could play the facilitator role. But now we're getting to where we're arguing (me included) about each player being at their best in one area one season, and at their best in another area in another season.

If we're going to go with peak Wade and peak Kobe (both from about 2005-2009) then that Wade was a better passer and playmaker. Now, if you think 2001 was the best Kobe, that's fine.

Nah I don't think so , although 01 Kobe was my favorite version of him :cheers:

I'm just putting it out, I think 01 Kobe was better than 06 Wade by a fair margain (not conceivably huge, but not very close either)....won't comment on 09 , I really didn't see enough of him , his team didn't interest me sadly. :(

Was he in the playoffs?

Edit: Just checked, I vaguely remember that Hawk series, game 6 was awesome , but he wasn't that great otherwise. He was probably better over the course of the season.

[Heavincent]

Didn't the Heat lose to the Hawks in the first round in 09? :roll:

[MiamiThrice]

Says the guy who thinks there are more than 10 players in the league right now better than Kobe, including Kevin Love, Tyson Chandler, and Iguodala :roll:

Anyway, Kobe 10 times out of 10. Wade's "prime" was inconsistent at times, mostly due to injuries. And, in comparison to other All Time greats, seemed considerably short.

But let's just stick to facts, huh people? All that "refs gifted" this and "refs gifted" that, is irrelevant. We're not comparing careers, or rings, or accomplishments. Just pure performance. Is that really hard for you teenagers like Miami Thrice and Kennethgriffin to do do?

Wade's best 5 year stint resulted in 27 points, 5 rebounds, and 7 assists per game, on 48% shooting, 27% from the 3PT line, 77% from the free throw line.

Kobe's best 5 year stint, which ironically coincides with Wade's best 5 years, resulted in averages of 30 points, 6 rebounds, and 5 assists per game, on 46% from field. 35% from 3PT line. 85% from the free throw line.

If you want a player who is essentially a slasher who attacks the rim and dishes very well in his prime, by all means Wade is your guy.

If you want a player who can actually shoot the ball as a 2 from anywhere on the floor and is a very good rebounder at his position in his prime, Kobe is your guy.

Ill take guys like Love, Chandler, Iguodala over current Kobe Bryant and it's not far-fetchd at all to see why. Not one player listed in that conversation is able to be a number one best player on a title winner at this point. However guys like Love, Chandler, Iguodala bring distinct attributes that make them better complimentary stars than a guy like Kobe who at this point is just a high volume, low efficiency chucker. He is not a good defender anymore, and he cannot be relied on for easy points. He can get hot at times, but your relying on streaky play. Kobe Bryant doesn't get easy points anymore. I'll take guys like Chandler who can anchor my defense, Love who can rebound the hell out of the ball and give me high efficiency scoring and offball play, Iguodala who can be my defensive stopper over Kobe at this point.

What is this 5 year garbage? I don't see that criteria in the OP? Peak Wade is 2006 Finals and the 2009 regular season.
2009 Wade: 30.2 PPG 49.1% 7.5 APG 5.0 RPG 2.2 SPG 1.3 BPG

Now I'm looking at Kobe Bryants career stats and not once has he ever shot above 46% from the field. LOL. Peak Wade is a greater slasher and penetrator than Kobe EVER was. Kobe has also never averaged over 6.0 APG during his entire career!!!

You can pick any Kobe you want, but that Kobe will not have the playmaking ability on defense to block shots and create turnovers, elite slashing ability that is perhaps unrivaled by anyone in the history of the NBa, scoring 30 PPG on nearly 50% from the field from a 6'4 guard. Peak Wade is a monster and Kobe was never at that level at any point in time.

Now tell me, which Kobe are you willing to put up against my Dwyane Wade. He'll shit on whatever year you pick.

[arifgokcen]

When Wade was at his best, he was best player in the league, but Kobe's always been more consistent. I'll take Kobe, but for one game I'd rather have Wade at his best.
Exactly
Wade at his best is scary good even better than bryant.Though wade best only lasted a season.There is that too

[Odinn]

2005-06 Kobe vs. 2008-09 Wade

Kobe averaged in January 2006 (13 games);
43.4 ppg / 5.6 rpg / 4.1 apg / 1.8 spg / 0.1 bpg / 2.0 tpg / .470 fg / .397 3pt / .530 efg / .897 ft

Wade's best 13 game strecth in 2008-09 season;
37.2 ppg / 5.9 rpg / 10.4 apg / 2.9 spg / 1.4 bpg / 3.9 tpg / .553 fg / .419 3pt / .595 efg / .865 ft

[MiamiThrice]

Didn't the Heat lose to the Hawks in the first round in 09? :roll:

Yeah and Kobes Scoring peak blew a 3-1 series lead vs the Suns which included a Game 7 in which he gave up on his team. Kobe was famously butthurt in that game so he stopped shooting the ball. Too bad he didn't have that philosophy last year or LA might have been in the Finals.

Next.

[PJR]

Didn't the Heat lose to the Hawks in the first round in 09? :roll:

Didn't Kobe lose to the Amareless PHX Suns in the first round, with Boris Diaw as the starting center?

[KG215]

Didn't the Heat lose to the Hawks in the first round in 09? :roll:

That roster may not have been 2006-2007 Lakers bad, but it was pretty bad. It was Wade, 20 year old Beasley, old and bad Jermaine O'Neal, Haslem, James Jones, and a rookie Mario Chalmers. I mean the Hawks were what they have always been the last 5-6 years, but they were better than the Heat.

So if you want to discredit Wade's season because he didn't have much team success with a shitty supporting cast, then you almost have to do the same thing with Kobe in 2006 and 2007.

[Freedom Kid7]

Depends on the term "peak"
If by peak you mean the best regular season, than unfortunately I take Wade's '09 year is a bit better than Kobe's best.
If by peak you mean the best post season, than I take Kobe's best over Wade's best.
If by peak you mean a span of anything more than a year, than I take Kobe. Wade's peak/prime is the shortest prime since... Hell I don't know.

[MiamiThrice]

If by peak you mean the best post season, than I take Kobe's best over Wade's best.

Kobe has never done anything more impressive than Wades 06 Finals. Regular season or postseason included. Wade had an awful cast for champions, and willed his team to victory averaging 40 PPG in the final 4 games following an 0-2 deficit. oh and this was the NBA ****ing Finals. I'm still waiting for a Kobe fan to try and one individual act as more impressive. I know theres going to be that one guy who brings up scoring a bunch of regular season points on the Toronto Raptors. :oldlol:

[Freedom Kid7]

[b]Kobe has never done anything more impressive than Wades 06 Finals[b]. Regular season or postseason included. Wade had an awful cast for champions, and willed his team to victory averaging 40 PPG in the final 4 games following an 0-2 deficit. oh and this was the NBA ****ing Finals. I'm still waiting for a Kobe fan to try and one individual act as more impressive. I know theres going to be that one guy who brings up scoring a bunch of regular season points on the Toronto Raptors. :oldlol:
Crying and bitching to the refs is impressive to you? :biggums: . Also, 62 points in 3Q is pretty impressive (even moreso that it was against the Mavs, an actual contender)

[Anaximandro1]

Peak- Wade

Career - Kobe

[IGOTGAME]

2009 wade was on steroids imo

[MiamiThrice]

Crying and bitching to the refs is impressive to you? :biggums: . Also, 62 points in 3Q is pretty impressive (even moreso that it was against the Mavs, an actual contender)

There it is!

So someone is trying to say scoring 62 points in 3Q against a regular season game vs Dallas is more impressive than.....

Winning a ****ing title and single handily willing your entire city and franchise to victory averaging over 40 PPG in 4 straight wins on the biggest stage in basketball, the NBA Finals. Oh this was vs Dallas too, the same Dallas team.

Next

[Rubio2Gasol]

It's so so hard to respect that finals performance.

I think he shot like 20 free throws a game if I'm not mistaken.honest it was ridiculous...and Dirk was unfairly labeled a choker to add insult to it.

62 In 3 quarters was 1 game lmao.

Amazing game but pointless I. This conversation.

[Heavincent]

That roster may not have been 2006-2007 Lakers bad, but it was pretty bad. It was Wade, 20 year old Beasley, old and bad Jermaine O'Neal, Haslem, James Jones, and a rookie Mario Chalmers. I mean the Hawks were what they have always been the last 5-6 years, but they were better than the Heat.

So if you want to discredit Wade's season because he didn't have much team success with a shitty supporting cast, then you almost have to do the same thing with Kobe in 2006 and 2007.

I'm not discrediting anything.

But lets be real, Kobe was a lot better in that Suns series than Wade was against the Hawks. Kobe had that game in which he hit the game tying shot in regulation and then hit the game winner in OT. And then he dropped 50 points and still lost. Sure, Wade's team was kinda crappy, but definitely not as bad as Kobe's 06 team. Not to mention that Suns team was a lot better than the 09 Hawks.

[Freedom Kid7]

There it is!

So someone is trying to say scoring 62 points in 3Q against a regular season game vs Dallas is more impressive than.....

Winning a ****ing title and single handily willing your entire city and franchise to victory averaging over 40 PPG in 4 straight wins on the biggest stage in basketball, the NBA Finals. Oh this was vs Dallas too, the same Dallas team.

Next
I'm saying that scoring 62 points fairly is better than winning a championship unfairly a la refs, bitching and all.

[Heavincent]

Ill take guys like Love, Chandler, Iguodala over current Kobe Bryant and it's not far-fetchd at all to see why.

http://789chan.org/cwc/src/134468060861.gif

[MiamiThrice]

I'm not discrediting anything.

But lets be real, Kobe was a lot better in that Suns series than Wade was against the Hawks. Kobe had that game in which he hit the game tying shot in regulation and then hit the game winner in OT. And then he dropped 50 points and still lost. Sure, Wade's team was kinda crappy, but definitely not as bad as Kobe's 06 team. Not to mention that Suns team was a lot better than the 09 Hawks.

I'll take Lamar Odom over any combination of players on Miamis roster that year.

Here are the playoff numbers
Wade: 29.1 PPG 5.0 RPG 5.1 APG
Kobe: 27.9 PPG 6.3 RPG 5.1 APG

Not to mention Kobe had a 3-1 series lead and essentially quit on his team in that Game 7. He choked.

[Heavincent]

I'll take Lamar Odom over any combination of players on Miamis roster that year.

Here are the playoff numbers
Wade: 29.1 PPG 5.0 RPG 5.1 APG
Kobe: 27.9 PPG 6.3 RPG 5.1 APG

Not to mention Kobe had a 3-1 series lead and essentially quit on his team in that Game 7. He choked.

Sorry, I'm just not taking you seriously at all after this post:


Ill take guys like Love, Chandler, Iguodala over current Kobe Bryant and it's not far-fetchd at all to see why.

[Young X]

I'm saying that scoring 62 points fairly is better than winning a championship unfairly a la refs, bitching and all.
I hope you realize that Kobe shot 25 free throws in that game.

[MiamiThrice]

Sorry, I'm just not taking you seriously at all after this post:

Fair enough, from what I've seen all you're capable of is one-liners with nothing to back your statements with. I appreciate the self-conceding.

Next.

[Papaya Petee]

05-06 wade is better then any playoff version of kobe. 08-09 wade is better then any regular season version of kobe. Wade wins.

[Freedom Kid7]

I hope you realize that Kobe shot 25 free throws in that game.
Okay. Thanks for stating facts. I just can't logically say I'd take '06 Wade over prime Kobe because Wade wasn't fully developed, he had a hell of a lot help from Shaq double teams so he could get open shots, and most importantly Miami got the calls in their favor.

[longtime lurker]

05-06 wade is better then any playoff version of kobe. 08-09 wade is better then any regular season version of kobe. Wade wins.

And he has the MVP's and deep playoff runs to back it up

[WockaVodka]

But lets be real, Kobe was a lot better in that Suns series than Wade was against the Hawks. Kobe had that game in which he hit the game tying shot in regulation and then hit the game winner in OT. And then he dropped 50 points and still lost.
Cherry picking moments doesn't change the fact that like Wade, he lost the 1st round series 4-3 and he also blew a 3-1 lead.



Sure, Wade's team was kinda crappy, but definitely not as bad as Kobe's 06 team. Not to mention that Suns team was a lot better than the 09 Hawks.
Lamar Odom was better than all of Wade's teammates put together in 2009 so I'm really not sure how you could say Wade's team was actually worse when Wade had no 2nd option what so ever.

Suns were a better overall team than the Hawks but the Hawks were a better defensive team.

Kobe's series vs. the Suns was the same to me as Wade's series vs. the Hawks. You need to take those numbers into context. Kobe had superior numbers vs. an inferior defensive team and it wasn't even that much better.

[WockaVodka]

I'm not saying Wade is the better rebounder. I'm saying it's debatable. For one he's smaller than Kobe; not by a lot (just like their rebounding numbers are pretty close) but it can be something that is argued in his favor.
The best argument you could argue is that Wade played with better rebounders throughout his career than Kobe did or played further away from the basket which gave him a lesser chance to get the rebound.

I hate the he is smaller argument because it doesn't matter, all that matters is how many rebounds you pull down.

[Papaya Petee]

And he has the MVP's and deep playoff runs to back it up

Why don't we compare Wade's final averages to Kobe's?
Wade- 28 PPG 7 RPG 5 APG 46% shooting
Kobe- 25 PPG 5 RPG 5 APG 45% shooting
*Lets not mention Kobe's performances vs 2008 Celtics and 2004 Pistons:roll: Oh and how can we forget the 15\5\5 37% series vs the Pacers!

Playoff Numbers (career)
Wade-25 PPG 6 RPG 5 APG 48% shooting
Kobe- 26 PPG 5 RPG 5 APG 44% shooting

Or better yet, lets compare how they both performed against the same teams in the playoffs.

Wade vs 2009 Celtics- 33 PPG 7 RPG 6 APG 56% shooting 40% 3 PT shooting
Kobe vs 2009 Celtics- 28 PPG 8 RPG 4 APG 40% shooting, including a 6\24 game

Wade vs 2011 Mavericks- 28 PPG 7 RPG 5 APG 53% shooting
Kobe vs 2011 Mavericks- 22 PPG 3 RPG 3 APG 44% shooting

Wade vs 2005 Pistons- 23 PPG 5 APG 5 RPG 44% shooting
Wade vs 2006 Pistons- 28 PPG 6 APG 6 RPG 47% shooting
Kobe vs 2004 Pistons- 22 PPG 4 APG 4 RPG 4 TO 37% shooting

Wade on 2 Championships has 1 FMVP = 50% rate
Kobe on 5 Championships has 2 FMVP= 40% rate

Kobe averages 14.5 games played in each postseason
Wade averages 13.75 games played in each postseason

Wade averages 1 game less in the postseason, yet he hasn't showed deep playoff runs and Kobe has? :roll: Kobe is the better playoff performer HOW again?

[longtime lurker]

Why don't we compare Wade's final averages to Kobe's?
Wade- 28 PPG 7 RPG 5 APG 46% shooting
Kobe- 25 PPG 5 RPG 5 APG 45% shooting
*Lets not mention Kobe's performances vs 2008 Celtics and 2004 Pistons:roll: Oh and how can we forget the 15\5\5 37% series vs the Pacers!

Playoff Numbers (career)
Wade-25 PPG 6 RPG 5 APG 48% shooting
Kobe- 26 PPG 5 RPG 5 APG 44% shooting

Or better yet, lets compare how they both performed against the same teams in the playoffs.

Wade vs 2009 Celtics- 33 PPG 7 RPG 6 APG 56% shooting 40% 3 PT shooting
Kobe vs 2009 Celtics- 28 PPG 8 RPG 4 APG 40% shooting, including a 6\24 game

Wade vs 2011 Mavericks- 28 PPG 7 RPG 5 APG 53% shooting
Kobe vs 2011 Mavericks- 22 PPG 3 RPG 3 APG 44% shooting

Wade vs 2005 Pistons- 23 PPG 5 APG 5 RPG 44% shooting
Wade vs 2006 Pistons- 28 PPG 6 APG 6 RPG 47% shooting
Kobe vs 2004 Pistons- 22 PPG 4 APG 4 RPG 4 TO 37% shooting

Wade on 2 Championships has 1 FMVP = 50% rate
Kobe on 5 Championships has 2 FMVP= 40% rate

Kobe averages 14.5 games played in each postseason
Wade averages 13.75 games played in each postseason

Wade averages 1 game less in the postseason, yet he hasn't showed deep playoff runs and Kobe has? :roll: Kobe is the better playoff performer HOW again?

Well the genius that is Papaya Pete said this


05-06 wade is better then any playoff version of kobe. 08-09 wade is better then any regular season version of kobe. Wade wins.

So I don't know why you're bringing up career playoff numbers into an argument about playoff runs.

05-06 Wade Pts 28.4, Rebs 5.9, Assists 5.7
09-10 Kobe Pts 29.2, Rebs 6.0, Assists 5.5

How is Wade significantly better than anything Kobe's ever put up? Not to mention I didn't even pick one of Kobe's better playoff runs because if I did that it would just prove how completely stupid your argument is. I didn't even bring up the fact that one player has more than double the number of championships, more double the the number of finals appearances, Finals MVP's, regular season MVP, all NBA 1st team awards, defensive team awards, records, but hey if a Heat fans says it, it must be true.

[Dictator]

05-06 wade is better then any playoff version of kobe. 08-09 wade is better then any regular season version of kobe. Wade wins.


:biggums:

06 Wade: 27 5 8 49% 26% 4to

01 Kobe: 29 6 5 46% 31% 3to
02 Kobe: 30 7 6 45% 38% 4to
06 Kobe: 35 6 6 45% 34% 3to
07 Kobe: 32 6 5 45% 34% 3to

[amfirst]

Easily Kobe, his peak was unstopable. 1 vs. 4 every night and no one can stop him. Only by out scoring his team like the suns did.

[Doctor Rivers]

No disrespect to Wade, love the guy but Kobe is way above his level.

lol

[G-Funk]

kobe and is not even close

[WockaVodka]

kobe and is not even close
I like how all Kobe fans always say, "and it's not even close" when the comparison is close.

[Doctor Rivers]

my Dwyane Wade.

awwwww

[Doctor Rivers]

I like how all Kobe fans always say, "and it's not even close" when the comparison is close.

both sides say the same thing

[macpierce]

ill take kobe since he is a better freethrow shooter...........

[WockaVodka]

both sides say the same thing
I haven't heard a Wade say and it's not even close. It's always Kobe fans that say that anyways on any site.

[alleykat]

it depends....

people try to claim kobe did it himself, but not one championship he would have won without his cast....in lakers early championships he was second option to shaq

same thing goes with dwayne wayde...

to be fair tho, i feel kobe's prime has lasted far longer than dwayne wade, so I would also say kobe...

[MetsPackers]

Wade and it's not even close

[swag2011]

Kobe and it's not even close

[Doctor Rivers]

I haven't heard a Wade say and it's not even close. It's always Kobe fans that say that anyways on any site.


Easy, Dwyane Wade.

same thing


Wade and it's not even close

[BlackVVaves]

Peak refers to a period of time where a player was at his absolute best. When people say "peak Shaq" or "peak Jordan" they never cite merely one season, one playoff run, or one individual playoff series.

But Miami and Wade fans in this thread insist on making their own rules, using whatever sample size will fit their agenda best, instead of being impartial in their analysis.

Kobe, by shooting guard standards, had a better "best" 3 or 5 year stretch than Wade. It's not "not even close" like Kobe stans and Miami fans keep preaching. It's actually pretty close. But, Kobe still wins out. Again, that's unless you want a shooting guard that can't shoot (horrible 3PT and FT shooting numbers for a guard. Like, really bad), but is an elite slasher and very good passer. In which case, Wade would be your fit.

It also can't go unsaid that Kobe has a MVP, and spent 3-4 seasons as the best player in the NBA, while Wade only had one such year, and that in itself is highly debatable as Kobe and Bron had equally dominant seasons that year.

[Vertical-24]

Kobe couldn't beat the Pistons with Shaq, a year later they would've win but Wase got injured, then two years later they did and won the title. Dwyane wade is more unselfish and efficient.

STFU, your only co-signing Wade because you're a LeBron stan trying to fit in as a Heat fan. Fake-ass Heat bandwagoner. Your kind makes me sick. :mad:

:oldlol:

Anyway, Kobe without question. I was a big fan of Wade's during his peak-prime years (06-10), but I think Kobe without a doubt was always the better overall player. Wade's style of basketball while slightly more efficient (in terms of FG%) relied a lot more of athleticism and ref-swiveling than actual fundamental skill. Kobe has always been the more skilled player, and during his prime had combined both skill and athleticism with a kind of ease Wade has never sniffed.

Wade's 06 Finals Run was remarkable, no doubt about it, but when arguing Wade over Kobe that is the only thing imo that gives him any kind of edge.

Kobe is the 2nd Greatest SG of All Time, Wade is likely 4th (behind West albeit slightly, though they can be interchangeable for the 3rd spot).

[WockaVodka]

Peak refers to a period of time where a player was at his absolute best. When people say "peak Shaq" or "peak Jordan" they never cite merely one season, one playoff run, or one individual playoff series.


Who do you guys think was better at their absolute peaks? i.e. their best season? .

People are doing what the OP asked.

[EnoughSaid]

How are people saying things like "It's not even close"? :wtf: Wade is a better Finals performer, has had better games in the Playoffs, and his 08-09 season is on par with any season Kobe had.

[BlackVVaves]

People are doing what the OP asked.

Like I said, peak never refers to just one season.

Comparing a best season and comparing players' peak are not the same thing. Shaq's "peak" was from 2000-2002. Shaq's best season was 2000. See the difference?

[red1]

I laugh at anyone who tries to act like there is a clear gap between these two. Kobe will be remembered as the better player for the same reason that Kareem always ranks so high, and rightfully so because you have to give players credit for playing so well for so long.

That being said, D-wade's 09 season is insanely underrated and easily stacks up with any of kobe's best years (01,06,08). It's easy to forget just how much of a beast he was. That season he came back healthy and with a vengeance, fresh off of being the best player at the olympics. He was in his athletic prime and was insanely quick and got to the rim often making him as efficient as a shooting guard can be.

That year, d-wade was the most exciting player, he was a blur and was everywhere on the court, always making every huge play. Even though kobe finished before him in the mvp voting that year, he was more dominant

[TheNaturalWR]

How people saying "it isn't even close" is beyond me. This is as close as it possibly gets.

[Sleu27]

5 Rings/2 FMVP/1 MVP >>> 2 Rings/1Finals MVP

jus saying...:confusedshrug:

[RazorBaLade]

Its 30 8 5 on 57% TS vs 35 5 5 on 56% TS right? Are those the best years?

[KOBE143]

How people saying "it isn't even close" is beyond me. This is as close as it possibly gets.
Kobe and its not even close

u mad? :lol

[KG215]

5 Rings/2 FMVP/1 MVP >>> 2 Rings/1Finals MVP

jus saying...:confusedshrug:

What part of the word peak do you not understand? We're not saying Wade's career is close to being as good as Kobe's. People are saying his peak - HIS BEST COUPLE OF SEASONS - might be as good as Kobe's best 2-3 seasons.

And most of the people saying "Kobe, and it's not even close" are some of the more well-known Kobe stans. I've already said I'd take peak Kobe over peak Wade, but it's VERY close.

[Mr. Jabbar]

Peak kobe would dunk all over peak wade 24/7, not even funny.

[Sleu27]

Well looks like this thread made it pretty clear which peak was better....kobes

[NumberSix]

Close call. I'd say Wade because his peak stats give him the edge. Definitely close though.

[BrickingStar]

5 Rings/2 FMVP/1 MVP >>> 2 Rings/1Finals MVP

jus saying...:confusedshrug:
Do you know the difference between the 2 words Peak and Legacy? Do you forget to file mental retardation on your tax forms?

[NumberSix]

Do you know the difference between the 2 words Peak and Legacy? Do you forget to file mental retardation on your tax forms?
:roll:

Rep worthy.

[Sleu27]

Do you know the difference between the 2 words Peak and Legacy? Do you forget to file mental retardation on your tax forms?


http://i827.photobucket.com/albums/zz194/saes329/kobe-you-mad.jpg

:roll: :cheers: :cheers: :roll:

[AlonzoGOAT]

Do you know the difference between the 2 words Peak and Legacy? Do you forget to file mental retardation on your tax forms?


:lol :roll: :roll: :roll: omg :applause:

[NumberSix]

:lol :roll: :roll: :roll: omg :applause:
His rep should get flooded with green bars for that one.

[AlonzoGOAT]

His rep should get flooded with green bars for that one.
I would rep him but I just wasted my 2 negs on some f@gots on OTC one was some OP talking about how he can't get his dikk through a chicks v@gina and the other was some other f@got op calling his male fukk buddy and drowning in semen afterwards. Now I gotta wait 24 hrs to rep/neg :facepalm

[NumberSix]

I would rep him but I just wasted my 2 negs on some f@gots on OTC one was some OP talking about how he can't get his dikk through a chicks v@gina and the other was some other f@got op calling his male fukk buddy and drowning in semen afterwards. Now I gotta wait 24 hrs to rep/neg :facepalm
Who'd you neg? I'll neg them too. :roll:

[AlonzoGOAT]

Who'd you neg? I'll neg them too. :roll:



heres the first thread made by the f@got op on his quest to get through the wall of paradise http://www.insidehoops.com/forum/showthread.php?t=275061


and here's the second f@got op talking about his semen parade http://www.insidehoops.com/forum/showthread.php?t=275112

[Sleu27]

yeah im gay :facepalm

:wtf:

[eliteballer]

Wade can barely shoot past 15 feet and he's been playing in a joke JV conference his entire career...and you want to compare him to Kobe:oldlol: Even at his best Wade was saying Kobe was the best in the L.

Watch how they are defended. Entire teams defenses gear to stop him. Wade? Teams let him play on an island.

[White Mamba]

I will let wade close this thread:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PoYeFQ4Q1Go

I will take kobe over any SG not named MJ.

[Horatio33]

Kobe for reg season peak in 06. Wade had a higher playoff peak of the two in 06.

[sosolid4u09]

actually think these two are pretty close peak v peak. Wade during his 30/7.5/5/2.2
Season was as good, if not better than kobes prime. His finals performance in 06 is better than any of kobes.

Peak v peak its very close.

Kobe obviously beats him in longevity, durability and consistently having amazing seasons one after the other. Also he's a far more versatile scorer and all round player. I'd comfortably take kobe over wade

But there's no denying peak v peak wade is pretty close to kobe

[White Mamba]

only reason ppl think peak is close is cuz kobe played most of his peak with smush kawame and luke as starters= no deep playoff runs at his peak.

to me, its not even close. and i think wade is a great great player.

[SwayDizzle]

One is a GAWD the other is a mere mortal, you do the math.

[Rojogaqu11]

Hmm... Wade was excellent that year, but Kobe was a spectacle to behold for several years.
IMO only Lebron is a comparable talent to Kobe, in terms of perimeter players of the last 15 years.

Wade will be remembered as a brilliant player, but Kobe as the player of his generation.

[Odinn]

2005-06 Kobe vs. 2008-09 Wade

Kobe averaged in January 2006 (13 games);
43.4 ppg / 5.6 rpg / 4.1 apg / 1.8 spg / 0.1 bpg / 2.0 tpg / .470 fg / .397 3pt / .530 efg / .897 ft

Wade's best 13 game strecth in 2008-09 season;
37.2 ppg / 5.9 rpg / 10.4 apg / 2.9 spg / 1.4 bpg / 3.9 tpg / .553 fg / .419 3pt / .595 efg / .865 ft
I posted this before and here is my post which includes my opinion.

If we extend the strecth, the answer will be Kobe. I mean;
For a 13-15 game stretch, Wade can be better than Kobe and he proved it.
For a season, I'd take 2009 Wade over 2006 Kobe but they're almost equal imo.
For multiple seasons, I take 06-08 or 08-10 Kobe over any 3 year stretch of Wade. But I think this is much more of a prime talk. While prime wise Kobe >>> Wade, peak wise they are equal.

[RoundMoundOfReb]

actually think these two are pretty close peak v peak. Wade during his 30/7.5/5/2.2
Season was as good, if not better than kobes prime. His finals performance in 06 is better than any of kobes.

Peak v peak its very close.

Kobe obviously beats him in longevity, durability and consistently having amazing seasons one after the other. Also he's a far more versatile scorer and all round player. I'd comfortably take kobe over wade

But there's no denying peak v peak wade is pretty close to kobe
This.

[INDI]

Truth be told, though it's not disrespectful to match a player against another one. I think it's clear that kobe has the better career and peak, do there is not much to debate. It is a better comparison to debate wade and iverson (which he is slightly above IMO) or wade vs Jerry west (which he is slightly below IMO).

[Quickening]

Truth be told, though it's not disrespectful to match a player against another one. I think it's clear that kobe has the better career and peak, do there is not much to debate. It is a better comparison to debate wade and iverson (which he is slightly above IMO) or wade vs Jerry west (which he is slightly below IMO).
Stfu.

[Story Up]

Peak wise, it's pretty close but 06' Kobe I believe did things only Jordan has (scoring wise) it came so effortless for him.

[coin24]

Wade over Kobe??:roll: :roll: :roll: :roll:
Not even close!!!

Wades peak.. 1 week.

Kobe has been playing at a high level all through the 00s and is still going strong.. Wade is a SG thats whole game revolves around his athleticism, which is on a steep decline. He cant shoot for shit either so hes basically fu*cked after another season or two...

[b4uc.23]

Lebron > Kobe > Wade

[riseagainst]

http://i.imm.io/xcrG.png


:roll: :roll: :lol
omg stop omggggggggg

[jjayfive]

kobe...

[The Iron Fist]

Leading your team to 15 wins in your prime, while playing in the east, makes you better than kobe?:oldlol:

[The Iron Fist]

I would rep him but I just wasted my 2 negs on some f@gots on OTC one was some OP talking about how he can't get his dikk through a chicks v@gina and the other was some other f@got op calling his male fukk buddy and drowning in semen afterwards. Now I gotta wait 24 hrs to rep/neg :facepalm
You sound hurt. Get some sun.

[Gifted Mind]

Close and comparable

[PJR]

Leading your team to 15 wins in your prime, while playing in the east, makes you better than kobe?:oldlol:

I don't know. Prime Kobe missing the playoffs in 2004-05 with Lamar Odom and Caron Butler as teammates isn't too shabby either.

[riseagainst]

I don't know. Prime Kobe missing the playoffs in 2004-05 with Lamar Odom and Caron Butler as teammates isn't too shabby as well.

Definitely not even close to as bad as the 15 wins.

[DTreats]

Kobe's prime = 35/7/7 FOR THE SEASON

Wade's prime = 25/5/5


:roll:

[riseagainst]

Kobe's prime = 35/7/7 FOR THE SEASON

Wade's prime = 25/5/5


:roll:

.....

[kennethgriffin]

kobes prime = 2001, 2002, 2003, 2004, 2005, 2006, 2007, 2008, 2009, 2010, 2011, 2012, possible 2013


wades prime = 2008, 2009



kobes peak = 2006, 2007, 2008, 2009, 2010



wades peak = a few months of 2009



this is the difference


/thread

[Jolokia]

kobes prime = 2001, 2002, 2003, 2004, 2005, 2006, 2007, 2008, 2009, 2010, 2011, 2012, possible 2013


wades prime = 2008, 2009



kobes peak = 2006, 2007, 2008, 2009, 2010



wades peak = a few months of 2009



this is the difference


/thread
Stop hatin

If you're going to count the age of 22 when Kobe got into his prime, you'd have to count Wade's second year in the league (23 years old) averaging 24/7/5 in 04-05.

That's 04, 05, 06, 07, 08, 09, 10, 11, 12, and still counting. The big if with Wade is if he's going to be healthy because he can still dominate at both ends of the floor. Even though he was playing a lot injured in last year in a shortened season, his stats were still elite across the board in limited minutes with an improved free throw stroke towards the end of the year. He can only tweak his skills for the better from here on out.

Kobe's stats last year are extremely deceptive. He put up the most field goals per 36 minute ever since his 35PPG season at a lower percentage. His assists-to-turnover ratio has never been so bad. The Olympics shown that Kobe is in denial. He's declining. They could've done so much better last year if he didn't want to prove that he's still Kobe.

Kobe's peak is somewhere in 05-07 and Wade's is in 08-10 season. Both peaks are very close and might as well be a tie. Kobe's prime was longer but that isn't the question here.

[kennethgriffin]

Stop hatin

If you're going to count the age of 22 when Kobe got into his prime, you'd have to count Wade's second year in the league (23 years old) averaging 24/7/5 in 04-05.

That's 04, 05, 06, 07, 08, 09, 10, 11, 12, and still counting. The big if with Wade is if he's going to be healthy because he can still dominate at both ends of the floor. Even though he was playing a lot injured in last year in a shortened season, his stats were still elite across the board in limited minutes with an improved free throw stroke towards the end of the year. He can only tweak his skills for the better from here on out.

Kobe's stats last year are extremely deceptive. He put up the most field goals per 36 minute ever since his 35PPG season at a lower percentage. His assists-to-turnover ratio has never been so bad. The Olympics shown that Kobe is in denial. He's declining. They could've done so much better last year if he didn't want to prove that he's still Kobe.

Kobe's peak is somewhere in 05-07 and Wade's is in 08-10 season. Both peaks are very close and might as well be a tie. Kobe's prime was longer but that isn't the question here.


i wasnt lying

prime = all nba 1st team level

kobe = 10 time all nba 1st team in the last 11 years

wade = 2 time all nba 1st team in the last 9 years


peak is your absolute best

kobe had legendary years in 06,07,08,09,10

5 years
5 straight 1st team all nba's
5 straight 1st team all defense's
3 straight nba finals
2 straight nba titles
2 straight finals mvps
1 regular season mvp
1 olympic gold medal game mvp


wade blows. dudes prime lasted 2 pathetic years... nows hes a 3rd teamer and not on the all defensive 1st or 2nd

[riseagainst]

i wasnt lying

prime = all nba 1st team level

kobe = 10 time all nba 1st team in the last 11 years

wade = 2 time all nba 1st team in the last 9 years


peak is your absolute best

kobe had legendary years in 06,07,08,09,10

5 years
5 straight 1st team all nba's
5 straight 1st team all defense's
3 straight nba finals
2 straight nba titles
2 straight finals mvps
1 regular season mvp
1 olympic gold medal game mvp


wade blows. dudes prime lasted 2 pathetic years... nows hes a 3rd teamer and not on the all defensive 1st or 2nd


:bowdown: lord godbe. :bowdown:

[Bigsmoke]

they both are really good.

i dont give a **** about who's better

[greymatter]

Kobe's prime = 35/7/7 FOR THE SEASON

Wade's prime = 25/5/5


:roll:

http://www.nba.com/playerfile/kobe_bryant/career_stats.html
http://www.nba.com/playerfile/dwyane_wade/career_stats.html

Kobe: 35.4ppg, 5.3rpg, 4.3apg
Wade: 30.2ppg, 5.0rpg. 7.5apg (not to mention superior FG%)

Why would you compare a single season prime (wrong numbers too) with an overall prime? Oh yeah, because you're a Kobe-tard.

Any more fail you care to put out there?

[Papaya Petee]

Kobe's prime = 35/7/7 FOR THE SEASON

Wade's prime = 25/5/5
:roll:
wtf? Lol at insecure kobe fans. Its as close as it gets and peak wade gets the edge. Simple as that.

[INDI]

wtf? Lol at insecure kobe fans. Its as close as it gets and peak wade gets the edge. Simple as that.

25-5-5 is better than 35-7-7 ? whoa

[greymatter]

wtf? Lol at insecure kobe fans. Its as close as it gets and peak wade gets the edge. Simple as that.

So insecure that he made that shit up. Kobe at no point in his career ever broke 7.0 apg or rpg; only broke 6.0 apg once.

[greymatter]

25-5-5 is better than 35-7-7 ? whoa

It isn't, but since we're talking imaginary numbers we might as well make up shit like less is better.

[riseagainst]

So insecure that he made that shit up. Kobe at no point in his career ever broke 7.0 apg or rpg; only broke 6.0 apg once.

6.9 is pretty darn close, though. So i'd give him that 7rpg.

[INDI]

Stfu.

ya mama

[KG215]

Definitely not even close to as bad as the 15 wins.

Wade missed 31 games that year and his supporting cast was awful; probably worse than Kobe's since Kobe at least had Butler and Odom. Anyway, Wade's supporting cast that year: Ricky Davis, Udonis Haslem (missed 33 games), Daequan Cook (missed 23 games), Jason Williams (missed 15 games), Mark Blount, Dorrell Wright, and Christ Quinn. Shaq was traded by the deadline and only played about 30 games, and he only had Shawn Marion for the last 15-20 games of the season.

It's not as simple as looking at their record in 2007-2008 and saying "Oh, look, Wade's led his team to just 15 wins." You have to put it in context.

[The Iron Fist]

I don't know. Prime Kobe missing the playoffs in 2004-05 with Lamar Odom and Caron Butler as teammates isn't too shabby either.
Dont forget to add, in the western conference, with more than twice as many wins as 15.


Lol butler and odom, as if they're top tier talent or something. Do they even have an all star appearance between them?

[The Iron Fist]

Wade missed 31 games that year and his supporting cast was awful; probably worse than Kobe's since Kobe at least had Butler and Odom. Anyway, Wade's supporting cast that year: Ricky Davis, Udonis Haslem (missed 33 games), Daequan Cook (missed 23 games), Jason Williams (missed 15 games), Mark Blount, Dorrell Wright, and Christ Quinn. Shaq was traded by the deadline and only played about 30 games, and he only had Shawn Marion for the last 15-20 games of the season.

It's not as simple as looking at their record in 2007-2008 and saying "Oh, look, Wade's led his team to just 15 wins." You have to put it in context.
In context. He played in over 50 games, and only won FIFTEEN.

[KG215]

In context. He played in over 50 games, and only won FIFTEEN.

With a shit supporting cast and an ever changing cast of players.

[greymatter]

6.9 is pretty darn close, though. So i'd give him that 7rpg.

What part of "fake" do you not understand? His peak scoring season was coupled with 5.3/4.3 r/apg.

[The Iron Fist]

With a shit supporting cast and an ever changing cast of players.
Welcome to the nbas eastern conference. Where getting 15 wins makes you the best player.:lol

[KG215]

Welcome to the nbas eastern conference. Where getting 15 wins makes you the best player.:lol

Who's saying he's the best player? I don't know why I'm arguing with a Kobe stan, especially one as ignorant as you. All I'm saying is, that it's not as simple as "Oh look, Wade's team only won 15 games that year." Of course I don't expect you to look at it objectively because you've got Kobe's d*** shoved so far up your ass, it makes looking at anything objectively impossible.

[PJR]

You can't be objective with a Bryant stan. Don't waste your time.


The almighty Gawde! Better than Wade! Not even close!

Career averages speak for themselves!

Gawde 25-5-5 45% shooting

Wade 25-6-5 48% shooting


Not even close!

[longtime lurker]

You can't be objective with a Bryant stan. Don't waste your time.


The almighty Gawde! Better than Wade! Not even close!

Career averages speak for themselves!

Gawde 25-5-5 45% shooting

Wade 25-6-5 48% shooting


Not even close!

:oldlol: pot calling the kettle black

[crisoner]

Wade should not be in the convo and I think he would be the first to admit that.

[Vertical-24]

You can't be objective with a Bryant stan. Don't waste your time.


The almighty Gawde! Better than Wade! Not even close!

Career averages speak for themselves!

Gawde 25-5-5 45% shooting

Wade 25-6-5 48% shooting


Not even close!

Lmao even with Kobe's seasons as a 17-18 yr. old kid factored in, it's still close as shit :yaohappy:

GAWDbe doing what GAWDbe does :rockon:

[TheBigVeto]

Wade is overrated but he is much better than Kobe, peak or otherwise.

[ThatCoolKid]

If we are talking one season, Wade's 2008-09 looks tough to beat.

[Ikill]

kobes prime = 2001, 2002, 2003, 2004, 2005, 2006, 2007, 2008, 2009, 2010, 2011, 2012, possible 2013


wades prime = 2008, 2009



kobes peak = 2006, 2007, 2008, 2009, 2010



wades peak = a few months of 2009



this is the difference


/thread
There are arguments you can use to prove Kobe>Wade i don't know why you have to make up stupid shit like. I can't believe you listed 2008 as Wades prime shows how much you know :facepalm Wades prime is 05 06 07 09 10 11. 2012 Kobe was not his prime yeah he scored a lot but he shot a 53 ts which is a career low.

[RRR3]

Dont forget to add, in the western conference, with more than twice as many wins as 15.


Lol butler and odom, as if they're top tier talent or something. Do they even have an all star appearance between them?
Butler is a 2 time all star dumbass

[riseagainst]

kobe's definitely the gawd. People always include his first 2 years where he only started 1-6 games. :lol
1997: 8-2-1 in 15 minutes
1998: 15-3-3 26 minutes
those are peak bench player numbers. :bowdown: :bowdown:

[veilside23]

i'll take kobe...
consistency is greatness as well...

[RRR3]

kobe's definitely the gawd. People always include his first 2 years where he only started 1-6 games. :lol
1997: 8-2-1 in 15 minutes
1998: 15-3-3 26 minutes
those are peak bench player numbers. :bowdown: :bowdown:
He wasn't good enough to start over the legendary Eddie jones and nick ban exel. Why is this a good thing again?

[riseagainst]

He wasn't good enough to start over the legendary Eddie jones and nick ban exel. Why is this a good thing again?

he didn't enter the league as good players as Wade and Lebron obviously. But you can see his skills shoot up exponentially because of his work ethic and that's one of the things that makes kobe an all time great. It's meant to help his case or make his case worse, but haters always give him sh*t for not starting his 1st two years.
"A God doesn't start off as a bench player."

[RRR3]

he didn't enter the league as good players as Wade and Lebron obviously. But you can see his skills shoot up exponentially because of his work ethic and that's one of the things that makes kobe an all time great. It's meant to help his case or make his case worse, but haters always give him sh*t for not starting his 1st two years.
"A God doesn't start off as a bench player."
Should have used his work eethic earlier so he would be ready right away then.

[riseagainst]

Should have used his work eethic earlier so he would be ready right away then.

I don't know where you are trying to go with this....but
that's not even a reasonable statement, it sounds like ur trying to sh*t on him. :facepalm
Cause Kobe at 16 year old, or younger, had a lot of humility like EVERY other juvenile to work his ass off 24/7. :rolleyes: I suppose kids that come straight from HS are expected to avg 25+/6+/6+ in his rookie year right? Or else they are just lazy bums? :confusedshrug:

[RRR3]

I don't know where you are trying to go with this....but
that's not even a reasonable statement, it sounds like ur trying to sh*t on him. :facepalm
Cause Kobe at 16 year old, or younger, had a lot of humility like EVERY other juvenile to work his ass off 24/7. :rolleyes: I suppose kids that come straight from HS are expected to avg 25+/6+/6+ in his rookie year right? Or else they are just lazy bums? :confusedshrug:
Oh sob sob waaaah. I thought he was born with "Killah instinct"?

[Heavincent]

With a shit supporting cast and an ever changing cast of players.

Kobe got to the playoffs in the west with an even worse supporting cast in 06.

[pmj]

Would have been fairer to say who's best season was better. Wade's 08-09 was nuts and probably the best, but Kobe has years and years of peak, no weaknesses, No. 1 option scoring.

[Heavincent]

Wade's 08-09 was nuts and probably the best

Meh, I'd probably take Kobe's 01, 03, 05, 06, 07, 08, 09, and 10 seasons over anything Wade has done.

[Chrono90]

It's Kobe but it's close if you're talking about the absolute peak.


http://img593.imageshack.us/img593/5420/19536480.png (http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/593/19536480.png/)

Uploaded with ImageShack.us (http://imageshack.us)
Trying my best to simply say Kobe's peak is higher than Wade's by not too much but Kobe's career is overwhelmingly destroying Wade's career. Kobe has been playing top notch basketball for over a decade.

[KG215]

Kobe got to the playoffs in the west with an even worse supporting cast in 06.

And Kobe didn't miss 31 games and had a better second option that year than Wade in 2007-2008. I'm not even trying to say Wades supporting cast (overall) that year was worse than Kobe's in 2005-2006. I'm just saying it's not real fair to put a lot of blame on his team's 15 wins that season. Go look at that team's page on basketball-reference. Shaq was in and out with injuries and got traded by the deadline, and the only starter/rotation player that didn't miss 10+ games was Ricky Davis.

Wade - 51 GP
Haslem - 49 GP
Jason Williams - 67 GP
Dorrell Wright - 44 GP
Mark Blount - 69 GP
Daequan Cook - 59 GP
Chris Quinn - 60 GP

On top of the supporting cast being awful, there was no consistency that season because of all the injuries. I guess they probably went into tank mode at some point, too.

But yes, Kobe's supporting cast was pretty terrible the two years post-Shaq and pre-Gasol.

[Heavincent]

And Kobe didn't miss 31 games and had a better second option that year than Wade in 2007-2008. I'm not even trying to say Wades supporting cast (overall) that year was worse than Kobe's in 2005-2006. I'm just saying it's not real fair to put a lot of blame on his team's 15 wins that season. Go look at that team's page on basketball-reference. Shaq was in and out with injuries and got traded by the deadline, and the only starter/rotation player that didn't miss 10+ games was Ricky Davis.

Wade - 51 GP
Haslem - 49 GP
Jason Williams - 67 GP
Dorrell Wright - 44 GP
Mark Blount - 69 GP
Daequan Cook - 59 GP
Chris Quinn - 60 GP

On top of the supporting cast being awful, there was no consistency that season because of all the injuries. I guess they probably went into tank mode at some point, too.

But yes, Kobe's supporting cast was pretty terrible the two years post-Shaq and pre-Gasol.


Your point? Yeah, it obviously wasn't all Wade's fault, but it still was not a significant or good season for Wade and should not be counted as one of his peak seasons.

[WockaVodka]

Kobe got to the playoffs in the west with an even worse supporting cast in 06.
Sorry, but there is literally no way of proving that Kobe's cast in 2006 was worse than Wade's cast in 2009. There is no way of doing that because it's completely false.

[Heavincent]

Sorry, but there is literally no way of proving that Kobe's cast in 2006 was worse than Wade's cast in 2009. There is no way of doing that because it's completely false.

Kwame Brown, Smush Parker, and Luke Walton all got significant minutes.

There, I just proved it.

[WockaVodka]

Kwame Brown, Smush Parker, and Luke Walton all got significant minutes.

There, I just proved it.
He also had Lamar Odom on his team and he is better than everybody on the Heat minus Wade put together.

[Heavincent]

He also had Lamar Odom on his team and he is better than everybody on the Heat minus Wade put together.

You're severely overrating Odom. He was ridiculously inconsistent. The fact that he was the second option is just further proof of how atrocious that team was.

[WockaVodka]

You're severely overrating Odom. He was ridiculously inconsistent. The fact that he was the second option is just further proof of how atrocious that team was.
He averaged 20/10 in the 2006 post-season, nobody on the Heat was capable of doing that. He was easily better than everyone on the Heat and everyone on the Heat put together.

[The Iron Fist]

Who's saying he's the best player? I don't know why I'm arguing with a Kobe stan, especially one as ignorant as you. All I'm saying is, that it's not as simple as "Oh look, Wade's team only won 15 games that year." Of course I don't expect you to look at it objectively because you've got Kobe's d*** shoved so far up your ass, it makes looking at anything objectively impossible.
Actually, it is pretty simple. Wade isnt the first or last to lead a young team to a shitty record. The point you seem to overlook is that this was in the east.

Nothing to be objective about.

[Heavincent]

He averaged 20/10 in the 2006 post-season, nobody on the Heat was capable of doing that. He was easily better than everyone on the Heat and everyone on the Heat put together.

Yeah, like I said, you're overrating the shit out of Odom. He's really not that great.

[WockaVodka]

Yeah, like I said, you're overrating the shit out of Odom. He's really not that great.
You sure showed me why he is overrated. :facepalm

A guy put up 20/10 and also almost 5 assists per game in the post-season and is somehow overrated and is somehow not that good. That makes tons of sense.

[NUPE_1911]

Kobe spent the majority of his career in the triangle offense which if you know basketball is notorious for low assist numbers.Using stats without using them in the proper context is a waste of time

This is the same triangle that Kobe routinely breaks in order to chuck up numerous shots year after year. Kobe also has notoriously high usage. Kobe should average more assists but would rather gun and he's essentially admitted to this.

[KG215]

Your point? Yeah, it obviously wasn't all Wade's fault, but it still was not a significant or good season for Wade and should not be counted as one of his peak seasons.

Go back and see where this started. It began with someone :oldlol: because Wade's team only won 15 games in 2007-2008 to criticize him. I just pointed out you can't really look at that season in context, and put all the blame on Wade. I wasn't and I'm not saying it was a part of his peak. A player can't miss 31 games in a season and it be considered a part of a his peak.

[KG215]

Actually, it is pretty simple. Wade isnt the first or last to lead a young team to a shitty record. The point you seem to overlook is that this was in the east.

Nothing to be objective about.

:confusedshrug:

He missed almost half the season and, like I pointed out, his supporting cast on top of being awful was constantly changing the entire year because none of them could stay healthy. It shouldn't be a season Wade get's discredited for. It should just be one that's more-or-less ignored because he was hurt and the other circumstances I pointed out. And I'm not saying it should be ignored to prop Wade up, either. I'm just saying it's one that's hard to use against him due to everything I've already mentioned.

[NumberSix]

http://t.qkme.me/3p7u2r.jpg

[pmj]

Meh, I'd probably take Kobe's 01, 03, 05, 06, 07, 08, 09, and 10 seasons over anything Wade has done.

30 / 7.5 / 5.0 / 2.2 / 1.3 49% would statistically be at least as good as any of Kobe's seasons. One of the best all around stat lines ever from a guard.

[Kblaze8855]

Wade in 2009 was as good as ive ever seen Kobe.

[PJR]

Wade in 2009 was as good as ive ever seen Kobe.

Yep. This Nikka Wade put up a couple of near 50 point triple doubles post all star break. :biggums:

Vs The Jazz and Bulls If I remember correctly. Wade in 08-09 was essentially A
a 6'4" LeBron.

[The Iron Fist]

:confusedshrug:

He missed almost half the season and, like I pointed out, his supporting cast on top of being awful was constantly changing the entire year because none of them could stay healthy. It shouldn't be a season Wade get's discredited for. It should just be one that's more-or-less ignored because he was hurt and the other circumstances I pointed out. And I'm not saying it should be ignored to prop Wade up, either. I'm just saying it's one that's hard to use against him due to everything I've already mentioned.
He played 51 games in the east where teams under .500 routinely make the playoffs. No matter how you spin it, thats terrible for someone supposedly better than Kobe. Kobe, in the west, in an injury riddled season with a brand new cast, won more than twice what 15 is.

[DwadeOverLebron]

WADE and it's not even close

[riseagainst]

http://t.qkme.me/3p7u2r.jpg

"I don't always score 81, when I do, I go 28-46."

FIXED*

[Smoke117]

Wade in 2009 was as good as ive ever seen Kobe.

Wade in 2009 was better than Kobe ever was.

[NumberSix]

http://www.fornerds.org/wp-content/uploads/2011/06/hot-dog-salchicha-spanish.jpg

[OmniStrife]

LeBron.













http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/thumb/7/78/Trollface.svg/200px-Trollface.svg.png

[L.A. Jazz]

For me it's Kobe, but not by a big margin (peak). peakwise J.West may be better than both, but he almost always lost in the Finals.

[ShaqAttack3234]

Peak is pretty close, hell, they aren't THAT far apart in general when you really look at them year by year since '05, and their primes did overlap for a few seasons.

Wade was noticeably better to me in '09 than any other season. The reason is that he regained his explosiveness after that disastrous '08 season when he didn't look himself, but more importantly added to his game and matured as a player.

His mid-range game was better than ever, and he also became a capable 3 point shooter for the first time. Not only that, but he had his best defensive and imo, even did his best job as a playmaker.

It's rare to have your best season at both ends, but I also have to mention that Wade really learned how to pace himself and mix up his game more. He didn't have as many reckless drives and constantly hit the floor, instead, he still attacked the basket a lot, but used his vastly improved jump shot.

This is why peak vs peak, Wade is closer to Kobe than prime vs prime. Wade has only had a solid jump shot, even a mid-range jump shot in 2, maybe 2 1/2 seasons. Aside from his best shooting season as far as either mid-range or long shot shooting in '09, he was showing a nice mid-range game in '06, particularly the playoffs, and still had a pretty good mid-range shot in the first half of '07, iirc. But other than that, he's simply been a mediocre jump shooter.

Though that is irrelevant to peak vs peak. However, whether you go with '06 or '08 as Kobe's peak, he was still clearly the better shooter. A big advantage from 3 point range, an advantage as a mid-range shooter and a significant advantage as a free throw shooter. On top of that, he's just more skilled overall thanks to his footwork and post game. Wade has developed a nice post game in the big 3 era, but of course, he looked to be past his prime this past season and his post game still doesn't match Kobe's. On top of that, while Kobe never attacked the basket like Wade, he was still a great athlete as late as '08, more than capable of attacking and finishing.

Though those things primarily concern scoring, and not many dispute that Kobe was the better scorer. However, that is a significant advantage for a shooting guard, or a superstar for that matter. I also like that Kobe is the better off the ball player.

Even as far as all around game, I think some overstate Wade's advantages. Kobe is the better rebounder, while Wade could be argued as the better playmaker based on assists, but that's not the best way to go. Kobe did as well as a facilitator in '08 as I've ever seen Wade do. He also had to be the primary playmaker in the triangle, which not all players can do. As pure passers, I don't see a decisive advantage either, but Wade is clearly better in more of a ball-dominant do everything role, which I'll acknowledge is an argument for Wade's playmaking.

Individual defense goes to Kobe, while help defense goes to Wade. Though this is where peak becomes more complicated because Kobe's defensive peak was 2000, before he was even a true elite top 5 MVP caliber player. But he did really focus on defense again in 2008 with his best defensive season since the 3peat. And even in '06, while his effort wasn't always consistent due the ridiculous scoring load, Kobe would step up and take the challenge vs big scorers at his position and had some notable lockdown performances that year.

That does remind me how remarkable Wade's all around effort was in '09, though.

The bottom line is that I don't see a significant enough all around edge for Wade(if there is one) to outweigh Kobe's more obvious advantage as a scorer. While Kobe's all around game in '08 was comparable to Wade, imo.

Think about it, when Wade was at his absolute peak in '09, Kobe was still considered better by many, actually, the majority of players and people in the game considered him the best player. Most in the media probably did as well. And Kobe was not in his peak in '09, but actually the end of his prime. In fairness, I did rank Wade over Kobe in '09 myself, but it was close and worth noting that Kobe was still widely considered the best player in the game.


When Wade was at his best, he was best player in the league, but Kobe's always been more consistent. I'll take Kobe, but for one game I'd rather have Wade at his best.

I don't think Wade has ever been the best player in the league. I can see an argument for '09, but I still have to go with Lebron.

[magictricked]

Peak is pretty close, hell, they aren't THAT far apart in general when you really look at them year by year since '05, and their primes did overlap for a few seasons.

Wade was noticeably better to me in '09 than any other season. The reason is that he regained his explosiveness after that disastrous '08 season when he didn't look himself, but more importantly added to his game and matured as a player.

His mid-range game was better than ever, and he also became a capable 3 point shooter for the first time. Not only that, but he had his best defensive and imo, even did his best job as a playmaker.

It's rare to have your best season at both ends, but I also have to mention that Wade really learned how to pace himself and mix up his game more. He didn't have as many reckless drives and constantly hit the floor, instead, he still attacked the basket a lot, but used his vastly improved jump shot.

This is why peak vs peak, Wade is closer to Kobe than prime vs prime. Wade has only had a solid jump shot, even a mid-range jump shot in 2, maybe 2 1/2 seasons. Aside from his best shooting season as far as either mid-range or long shot shooting in '09, he was showing a nice mid-range game in '06, particularly the playoffs, and still had a pretty good mid-range shot in the first half of '07, iirc. But other than that, he's simply been a mediocre jump shooter.

Though that is irrelevant to peak vs peak. However, whether you go with '06 or '08 as Kobe's peak, he was still clearly the better shooter. A big advantage from 3 point range, an advantage as a mid-range shooter and a significant advantage as a free throw shooter. On top of that, he's just more skilled overall thanks to his footwork and post game. Wade has developed a nice post game in the big 3 era, but of course, he looked to be past his prime this past season and his post game still doesn't match Kobe's. On top of that, while Kobe never attacked the basket like Wade, he was still a great athlete as late as '08, more than capable of attacking and finishing.

Though those things primarily concern scoring, and not many dispute that Kobe was the better scorer. However, that is a significant advantage for a shooting guard, or a superstar for that matter. I also like that Kobe is the better off the ball player.

Even as far as all around game, I think some overstate Wade's advantages. Kobe is the better rebounder, while Wade could be argued as the better playmaker based on assists, but that's not the best way to go. Kobe did as well as a facilitator in '08 as I've ever seen Wade do. He also had to be the primary playmaker in the triangle, which not all players can do. As pure passers, I don't see a decisive advantage either, but Wade is clearly better in more of a ball-dominant do everything role, which I'll acknowledge is an argument for Wade's playmaking.

Individual defense goes to Kobe, while help defense goes to Wade. Though this is where peak becomes more complicated because Kobe's defensive peak was 2000, before he was even a true elite top 5 MVP caliber player. But he did really focus on defense again in 2008 with his best defensive season since the 3peat. And even in '06, while his effort wasn't always consistent due the ridiculous scoring load, Kobe would step up and take the challenge vs big scorers at his position and had some notable lockdown performances that year.

That does remind me how remarkable Wade's all around effort was in '09, though.

The bottom line is that I don't see a significant enough all around edge for Wade(if there is one) to outweigh Kobe's more obvious advantage as a scorer. While Kobe's all around game in '08 was comparable to Wade, imo.

Think about it, when Wade was at his absolute peak in '09, Kobe was still considered better by many, actually, the majority of players and people in the game considered him the best player. Most in the media probably did as well. And Kobe was not in his peak in '09, but actually the end of his prime. In fairness, I did rank Wade over Kobe in '09 myself, but it was close and worth noting that Kobe was still widely considered the best player in the game.



I don't think Wade has ever been the best player in the league. I can see an argument for '09, but I still have to go with Lebron.

Coffee alert! great post and worth the read. grab a cup of joe sit back and learn something everyone

[AlphaWolf24]

Kobe and it aint even close....

been watching basketball since Miami vice was relevant....

Wade has never been able to see Kobe.

[kuniva_dAMiGhTy]

Kobe and it aint even close....

been watching basketball since Miami vice was relevant....

Wade has never been able to see Kobe.

Wow. I actually agree with Alpha for once. :cheers:

If peak were just one season? Wade in 2009 was as good as Kobe's ever been; in the regular season at least.

[DTreats]

http://i1150.photobucket.com/albums/o614/tillyho12/3e379d9e.jpg

[riseagainst]

http://i1150.photobucket.com/albums/o614/tillyho12/3e379d9e.jpg

:roll: :roll:

omg these larry bird "quotes" are gold. :lol :lol

[D.J.]

Kobe at his peak averaged 30/7/6/2/1 on elite defense, 9 consecutive 40+ point games, and freakish consistency. Wade has never been on that level.

[Nick Young]

81 points. GOAT perimeter scorer. All NBA defense first team multiple times

Kobe>Wade's peak by a large margin