Michael Jordan's work ethic overrated?

[Heilige]

Do you feel Michael Jordan's work ethic is overrated in general?

We always hear stories about him golfing, playing cards, gambling, going to the casinos, etc,etc and not so much about him working very hard in the off-season or during the in-season.

Compared to the likes of Jerry West, Larry Bird and Kobe Bryant who all seemed obsessed with the game and obsessed with being the best player they could be.

Could you see Bird or Kobe going to the casinos and gambling late at night on the day before a crucial play-off game like Jordan did, instead of watching game tape or doing anything you can to prepare for the game?

[Horatio33]

Or maybe he didnt have his "people" leak stuff about his "tremendous work ethic" like Kobe does?

[Heilige]

Or maybe he didnt have his "people" leak stuff about his "tremendous work ethic" like Kobe does?


I mentioned Larry Bird and Jerry West as well.....

[Kblaze8855]

One could argue that all really huge stars have their work ethic overrated because nobody wants to hear what the Steve Kerrs or Earl boykins have to do to even get a spot. Ask for the hardest working QB in the NFL you hear Brady and Peyton....Brees. Guys who are great. You think many guys guys who arent dont watch film? dont work their asses off to make it?

In that way...perhaps all famous players work ethic gets overrated. I remember scott Skiles said the hardest working player hes seen in his life was Ben Gordon. But that isnt a story. Its not gonna catch on or be remembered. so his name doesnt come up in those discussions. Bird/MJ/Kobe do. But I suspect it took a hell of a lot of work for some of these small name guys to get where they got.

So in that way...that"Big name gets the most love" way? Maybe.

In the way you mean? Hell no. Night before a playoff game isnt where you learn to play. Its the million hours that it took to get there.

If MJ wasnt playing cards all night he would just be asleep...which isnt a work ethic issue.

Its an energy issue. He had a lot of it. Thats all.

[Harison]

Jordan's work ethics were incredible, he had to work VERY hard to get to the Top, hell - MJ had to work very hard just to get to his HS team (from which he was cut). He wasnt prodigy then, he became one by his endeavors.

Misconceptions about MJ by OP is because of Jordan's stamina - he could play golf in the evening, cards all night, shoot video the next morning, and kill opponents in the afternoon.

Such phenomenal stamina doesnt mean he wasnt working very hard - he did, and actually more than Kobe, whose work ethics are All-time great as well.

[wang4three]

Jordan's work ethics were incredible, he had to work VERY hard to get to the Top, hell - MJ had to work very hard just to get to his HS team (from which he was cut). He wasnt prodigy then, he became one by his endeavors.

If anything, his being cut from the high school team is one of the more overrated stories out there.

[9erempiree]

I think MJ's work ethic is very overrated because we hear more stories about him gambling and golfing than we do about him hitting the weight room.

MJ was a great player based on talent and skill. Heck, he got lazy and decided to play baseball.

[Harison]

In that way...perhaps all famous players work ethic gets overrated.

You have a point that hard working "nobodies" arent remembered, however it doesnt mean guys at the very top didnt worked as hard if not harder than the hardest working non-stars.

Only few Top20 players All-time werent giving their 110% in training, like Shaq. Most of them were spilling gallons of blood to get where we remember them now. Kobe wouldnt be anywhere as great if not work ethics, we wouldnt know Jordan or Bird. Or lets take Ray - would he be Top1 3PT shooter All-time if not his OCD work ethics? I dont think so.

Not everyone is born like Shaq or Lebron, some had talent, but it took an insane amount of endeavors to shine at the Top.

[Heilige]

Jordan's work ethics were incredible, he had to work VERY hard to get to the Top, hell - MJ had to work very hard just to get to his HS team (from which he was cut). He wasnt prodigy then, he became one by his endeavors.

Misconceptions about MJ by OP is because of Jordan's stamina - he could play golf in the evening, cards all night, shoot video the next morning, and kill opponents in the afternoon.

Such phenomenal stamina doesnt mean he wasnt working very hard - he did, and actually more than Kobe, whose work ethics are All-time great as well.


I guess that makes sense.

I don't know if he did more than Kobe though, since Kobe doesn't really to seem to have much interests outside of basketball....

How did Jordan get such a great amount of stamina?

[Heilige]

You have a point that hard working "nobodies" arent remembered, however it doesnt mean guys at the very top didnt worked as hard if not harder than the hardest working non-stars.

Only few Top20 players All-time werent giving their 110% in training, like Shaq. Most of them were spilling gallons of blood to get where we remember them now. Kobe wouldnt be anywhere as great if not work ethics, we wouldnt know Jordan or Bird. Or lets take Ray - would he be Top1 3PT shooter All-time if not his OCD work ethics? I dont think so.

Not everyone is born like Shaq or Lebron, some had talent, but it took an insane amount of endeavors to shine.


What do you mean when you say spilling gallons of blood? Sorry if that is a dumb question.

[Yao Ming's Foot]

Quits the game after winning a mere 3 championships because he's "burned out"

:oldlol:

[OldSchoolBBall]

Quits the game after winning a mere 3 championships because he's "burned out"

:oldlol:

A "mere" 3 championships? How many titles has your boy won as the best player on his team? Let me answer that for you: 2. And he won't win any more as the best player with Dwight there, since Dwight overtook Kobe back in '11.

[Yao Ming's Foot]

A "mere" 3 championships? How many titles has your boy won as the best player on his team? Let me answer that for you: 2. And he won't win any more as the best player with Dwight there, since Dwight overtook Kobe back in '11.

What does that have to do the mythology surrounding Jordan? If you wanted to keep it remotely on topic Kobe would never get the complete pass Jordan did for missing a season because he was "burned out". Nor would Shaq.

[Punpun]

-snip-

There is some truth here. VUJAVIC is known as a guy that never stops training. And yet he isn't even in the NBA anymore.

[Harison]

How did Jordan get such a great amount of stamina?

Genes, as well as intense working out.


What do you mean when you say spilling gallons of blood?

Its an expression, like "working out till you sweat the blood." In some cases it was literal, since training/playing hard also means sometimes bleeding too.

[Replay32]

So now Jordan didn't work hard and his work ethic is overrated. So he's the greatest SG in the history of the NBA just because...

He liked to gamble and play golf. So what? It's not like he was developing his jumper, improving his defense, or improving his footwork in the post. I guess lifting before games when many players at the time weren't doing it is not working hard to get stronger. It's not like MJ didn't have a motor and energy on offense and defense or was DPOY.

To be the best at anything you have to have a great work ethic. So... :coleman:

I swear there are some ignorant kids on this site.

[midatlantic09]

It's not all that difficult to work hard as a pro athlete. An athlete that spends 40 hours a week working out during the offseason is classified as hard working, but considering the fact that there are 168 hours in a week and have no other job, that still leaves a lot of time to hang out, go to casinos, etc.

[Haymaker]

Quits the game after winning a mere 3 championships because he's "burned out"

:oldlol:

Ask the Lakers how mentally and physically draining it is to be on the finals and win 2 years in a row. By the time LA got back the next year to go for the threepeat, they ran out of gas/motivation. It takes a toll on the stars more than anyone.

[Myth]

If anything, his being cut from the high school team is one of the more overrated stories out there.

Seriously. They make it sound like he had to sit out the whole year and didn't play organized ball, when in reality he just barely missed out on varsity his freshman year, so instead he dominated the JV teams for 1 year before playing 3 years of varsity.

[Yao Ming's Foot]

Ask the Lakers how mentally and physically draining it is to be on the finals and win 2 years in a row. By the time LA got back the next year to go for the threepeat, they ran out of gas/motivation. It takes a toll on the stars more than anyone.

Kobe and Gasol were just in a 3 finals in a row run including deep Olympic team runs for their respective countries. Neither of them took the next season off to rest up. :confusedshrug:

[Nevaeh]

So now Jordan didn't work hard and his work ethic is overrated. So he's the greatest SG in the history of the NBA just because...

He liked to gamble and play golf. So what? It's not like he was developing his jumper, improving his defense, or improving his footwork in the post. I guess lifting before games when many players at the time weren't doing it is not working hard to get stronger. It's not like MJ didn't have a motor and energy on offense and defense or was DPOY.

To be the best at anything you have to have a great work ethic. So... :coleman:

I swear there are some ignorant kids on this site.

Really though. Quietly "bumping" Kobe to #8 Status, calling Shaq lazy, even though he was the most consistent player on the team from regular season to finals year after year (including 2004), while he was Laker, and now Jordan, who apparently "didn't work hard", even though he was embarrassing Players left and right, inspiring a whole generation of "Next Jordans" to step their game up.

Next week I look forward to Griff informing us, with another whining ass Thread, that Shaq and MJ actually never existed, and that we all imagined the years they played in the League.
http://www.insidehoops.com/forum/images/smilies/rolleyes.gif

[Heavincent]

A "mere" 3 championships? How many titles has your boy won as the best player on his team? Let me answer that for you: 2. And he won't win any more as the best player with Dwight there, since Dwight overtook Kobe back in '11.

Why the insecurity? Yes we all know Jordan is the GOAT. You don't have to get all riled up when someone questions something he did.

[jstern]

When I'm playing in the playgrounds, really tired a story of Jordan pops into mind. It's when he was in college or something. Or the Olympics, where after hours of playing, all the guys would take a break except for Jordan. And Jordan said that it's because he didn't want anyone to say that they worked harder than him. That's more or less the story. I think about that when I'm really tired.

And all the stories about when he came back, he was determined to win another championship. Something about practice. I can't remember. So since he's obsessive like that, and has that focus. I don't think it's overrated.

[RaininTwos]

What isn't overrated about this guy?

[poido123]

Was about to say another blow-by looking for a headline, and then I saw hes been registered for 6 years and has green bars?

I Don't know what is up with the pointless threads, but if your gonna look for a player to pick apart, maybe start with a player who isnt the GOAT? Then you wont look so dumb... :facepalm

[andgar923]

Do you feel Michael Jordan's work ethic is overrated in general?

We always hear stories about him golfing, playing cards, gambling, going to the casinos, etc,etc and not so much about him working very hard in the off-season or during the in-season.

Compared to the likes of Jerry West, Larry Bird and Kobe Bryant who all seemed obsessed with the game and obsessed with being the best player they could be.

Could you see Bird or Kobe going to the casinos and gambling late at night on the day before a crucial play-off game like Jordan did, instead of watching game tape or doing anything you can to prepare for the game?

WE DO HEAR stories of MJ working out tho.

Not sure where you get this notion from.

From players, to trainers, staff and MJ himself, all we hear is how hard he worked out and how he pushed others.

Look up Tim Grover and he'll still say MJ was the hardest working player he ever trained. Go back to his college days and players like Kenny Smith would say how hard he worked out. There is a huge deal made on how he improved every off season to add a new dimension to his game or just improve in general. His work ethic is legendary, that's all he talks about, he even has a commercial about it.

I think you're confusing the other stories with him not concentrating solely on basketball. But HE can do what he does, others can't. Like some mentioned, they don't have the stamina that he did. They're bodies aren't like his.

[lefthook00]

He did partake in a lot of extracurricular activities, not b/c of was slacking on his game, but b/c he possibly had more energy than any other player in the history of the NBA. He was literally the energizer bunny. He had the capacity to be the hardest worker in the league AND play golf and cards all night.

[scandisk_]

Watch the Dreamteam documentary on youtube and let the hall of famers answer your question.

[thelucifer69]

This prove MJ was superior compare to Kobe

He didn't work much still better player than Kobe who work extremely hard.

[inclinerator]

larry bird worked harder

[KOBE143]

One thing I noticed about MJ, he was very Poor 3 point shooter.. If he have time for gambling and golfing why not work with his 3 point shot.. He was a SG and it compulsory for a 2 guard to be at least a decent 3 point shooter..

I know people here will defend him and makes excuses that it will destroy his game.. fak it! How can a good 3 point shooter will destroy his game.. Mostly it will improve his game and add some weapon from his offense..

MJ was really overrated in terms of work ethic.. Cant even work to improve his 3 point shooting.. :facepalm

[Asukal]

One thing I noticed about MJ, he was very Poor 3 point shooter.. If he have time for gambling and golfing why not work with his 3 point shot.. He was a SG and it compulsory for a 2 guard to be at least a decent 3 point shooter..

I know people here will defend him and makes excuses that it will destroy his game.. fak it! How can a good 3 point shooter will destroy his game.. Mostly it will improve his game and add some weapon from his offense..

MJ was really overrated in terms of work ethic.. Cant even work to improve his 3 point shooting.. :facepalm

Yah he was such a poor 3 point shooter he shot 6 in a row in a finals game. :rolleyes:

He is a very poor 3 point shooter indeed, his career 3pt fg is .1 less than Kobe's. Jordan is terrible in 3 point shooting zomfg! :rolleyes:

[JaggerCommaMick]

His work ethic is legendary, that's all he talks about, he even has a commercial about it.


Why didn't he work hard as an executive? He was/is notoriously absent and negligent of day to day responsibilities.

Why do people not mention that when discussing his "relentless work ethic and uncompromising competitiveness?"

As a general manager and probably as an owner, he barely worked at all. His team sucks. He hardly cares.

[scandisk_]

One thing I noticed about MJ, he was very Poor 3 point shooter.. If he have time for gambling and golfing why not work with his 3 point shot.. He was a SG and it compulsory for a 2 guard to be at least a decent 3 point shooter..

I know people here will defend him and makes excuses that it will destroy his game.. fak it! How can a good 3 point shooter will destroy his game.. Mostly it will improve his game and add some weapon from his offense..

MJ was really overrated in terms of work ethic.. Cant even work to improve his 3 point shooting.. :facepalm

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=c2CyJdCq-zU

see?

[LT Ice Cream]

A lot of guys said he never seemed to sleep. In that case, that frees up 33% more time to play gold, gamble, and train. That's a lot of time.

[JaggerCommaMick]

A lot of guys said he never seemed to sleep.

Perhaps, mate, this tendency wasn't 100% au naturelle and his mid-career 'retirement' was actually an imposed sanction for failing a drug test.

The expulsion length for 'substances of abuse' is two years, mates...


I'm just sayin.

[KOBE143]

Yah he was such a poor 3 point shooter he shot 6 in a row in a finals game. :rolleyes:

He is a very poor 3 point shooter indeed, his career 3pt fg is .1 less than Kobe's. Jordan is terrible in 3 point shooting zomfg! :rolleyes:
3ptfg will not tell you the whole story dude.. Kobe take more and most of them were contested and tougher shot.. And in Jordan era the 3point line was shorter..

[KOBE143]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=c2CyJdCq-zU

see?
Making excuses.. That's prove my point.. He's a lazy bum..

[Indian guy]

I do find it disappointing that there's pretty much nothing out there on what his offseason workouts consisted of. If you have followed his career, you can see a gradual improvement in his skill level and polish year-after-year. To the point where he went from VERY raw(84-87) to someone who pretty much perfected the game by 92-93. The guy was clearly working on his game, but there isn't any written material on it. MJ never talks about it either. In fact, listening to him, you'd think all he did during the summer was play golf. I've read almost every book about him too, yet the extent of talk concerning his work ethic is how "hard" he worked. That's all. No details.

I wish somebody would've just sat down with him once and discussed his GAME. Just his basketball ability, nothing more. Would've been a fascinating interview.

[ihoopallday]

You can only work hard at something to a certain extent. If you don't, you'll start losing the love for it.

[Asukal]

3ptfg will not tell you the whole story dude.. Kobe take more and most of them were contested and tougher shot.. And in Jordan era the 3point line was shorter..

Yah Kobe is so great he takes so many 3s while having a hand on his face everytime. Kobe's IQ is zoooooomg so great he can't get a better shot than a contested 3. In Jordan's era the 3 point line was shorter only in 2 years, he played 15 seasons but yeah he sucked. Jordan could get easy shots while Kobe couldn't so Kobe sooo much greater. Kobe da GAWD! :rolleyes:

You idiots are amusing really. :roll:

[KOBE143]

Yah Kobe is so great he takes so many 3s while having a hand on his face everytime. Kobe's IQ is zoooooomg so great he can't get a better shot than a contested 3. In Jordan's era the 3 point line was shorter only in 2 years, he played 15 seasons but yeah he sucked. Jordan could get easy shots while Kobe couldn't so Kobe sooo much greater. Kobe da GAWD! :rolleyes:

You idiots are amusing really. :roll:
In Jordan era, they played no defense thats why Jordan gets easy shot.. If he play today, he's lucky to avg over 45fg% and 25fg% from three.. Fact..

[andgar923]

Yah Kobe is so great he takes so many 3s while having a hand on his face everytime. Kobe's IQ is zoooooomg so great he can't get a better shot than a contested 3. In Jordan's era the 3 point line was shorter only in 2 years, he played 15 seasons but yeah he sucked. Jordan could get easy shots while Kobe couldn't so Kobe sooo much greater. Kobe da GAWD! :rolleyes:

You idiots are amusing really. :roll:

Shut up you Jordan nut hugger.:oldlol:

MJ couldn't sniff Kobe's Playoff 3pt stats :no:

81 pts baby!!!

How great is our gawd :bowdown: :bowdown: :bowdown:

[scandisk_]

Making excuses.. That's prove my point.. He's a lazy bum..

:applause: :applause: :applause:

[KG215]

In Jordan era, they played no defense thats why Jordan gets easy shot.. If he play today, he's lucky to avg over 45fg% and 25fg% from three.. Fact..

:roll:

You make up FG% and 3P% numbers out of thin air and follow it up by stating "Fact." You do realize how stupid that is, don't you?

[BoutPractice]

Agree with KBlaze's point, the guys with the biggest work ethic once in the NBA are probably among those struggling to stay in the league.

To them, practicing and playing 200% at all times is a question of survival. Michael Jordan can coast through regular season practices and games, and no one will give a damn, he's still Michael Jordan, he's so good people won't even notice. He might put 30 points on the board on cruise control.

Human beings are naturally lazy... even those we call the hardest workers. If you're more naturally talented, you don't HAVE to go hard on every possession of every scrimmage. We're almost biologically bound to take it easy and rely on our know-how from time to time.

In fact, I'd argue that the reason we admire the big star's work ethic more is because they have to overcome the natural tendency to be lazy their superiority allows. They have to make a conscious effort to improve, even though it's not necessary for them to keep on making millions.

[andgar923]

Agree with KBlaze's point, the guys with the biggest work ethic once in the NBA are probably among those struggling to stay in the league.

To them, practicing and playing 200% at all times is a question of survival. Michael Jordan can coast through regular season practices and games, and no one will give a damn, he's still Michael Jordan, he's so good people won't even notice. He might put 30 points on the board on cruise control.

Human beings are naturally lazy... even those we call the hardest workers. If you're more naturally talented, you don't HAVE to go hard on every possession of every scrimmage. We're almost biologically bound to take it easy and rely on our know-how from time to time.

In fact, I'd argue that the reason we admire the big star's work ethic more is because they have to overcome the natural tendency to be lazy their superiority allows. They have to make a conscious effort to improve, even though it's not necessary for them to keep on making millions.

Exactly.

MJ always mentioned how hard it was to stay motivated. He always mentioned how he looked for anything to get him going, whether it be in the off season, practice during games etc.etc. Hell

[Cali Syndicate]

:roll:

You make up FG% and 3P% numbers out of thin air and follow it up by stating "Fact." You do realize how stupid that is, don't you?

Meh, let him be. He lives in Kobe's heart. Probably some heart worm or some shit. Worms are by nature stupid.

[jchu]

Meh, let him be. He lives in Kobe's heart. Probably some heart worm or some shit. Worms are by nature stupid.

:applause: Well said.

[jstern]

Yah Kobe is so great he takes so many 3s while having a hand on his face everytime. Kobe's IQ is zoooooomg so great he can't get a better shot than a contested 3. In Jordan's era the 3 point line was shorter only in 2 years, he played 15 seasons but yeah he sucked. Jordan could get easy shots while Kobe couldn't so Kobe sooo much greater. Kobe da GAWD! :rolleyes:

You idiots are amusing really. :roll:

Actually Jordan only played 28 more games than Kobe with the shorter 3 point line. Kobe's first season the line was short.

[Calabis]

3ptfg will not tell you the whole story dude.. Kobe take more and most of them were contested and tougher shot.. And in Jordan era the 3point line was shorter..

:facepalm ^^^^Kobe fans embarrassing themselves by basically telling the world that Kobe has a ton of trouble, beating his man off the dribble, therefore leading too more contested shots


In 89-90 Jordan took 245 three point attempts(standard distance), the most of his career at this point....he ended up shooting 37%....is it coincidence that the more he took the better his percentage was/ Kobe's best years from three, are when he shot more of them:confusedshrug:

Also its a shame that this great three point shooting by Kobe has only landed him two scoring titles in 16 seasons:roll: .....but, but he's the best scorer in history....his three 30 PPG seasons are insane(5 out of 15 times in playoffs), compared to MJ's eight(13 out of 14 times in playoffs):wtf:

Is my math wrong or did Kobe fans make 2 greater than 10 and 25ppg greater than 30ppg? :biggums:

[Calabis]

Oh look at this

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=peibLmDfOeE

let me guess, he's lying about film and preparation...Jordan was a lazy bastard

[Absolut Prince]

This Kobe over MJ stuff is the same reason I stopped posting regularly after the transition from ezboard to vbulletin. Laker fans are horrible human beings.

[SFMF]

Come on now... everyone who got in the NBA during the competitive years must have above average work ethic.

Michael Jordan is a player that has evolved throughout his basketball career... getting muscular, developing jump shot, developing the post game, developing the turnaround fade-away, developing defense, etc... there aren't too many names in the history of NBA who has shown such progression in their career...

kblaze's point is spot on as always.

[guy]

What does that have to do the mythology surrounding Jordan? If you wanted to keep it remotely on topic Kobe would never get the complete pass Jordan did for missing a season because he was "burned out". Nor would Shaq.

Kobe wouldn't get the same pass cause he wasn't as successful and wasn't as likeable at that stage of his career like Jordan was and didn't have a horrible tragedy in his family occur. Part of the reason Jordan said he was retiring was cause he felt he had nothing left to prove, which was a legit thing to say after going on what was probably the most successful 3-year run any basketball player has ever had. If Kobe retired in 2005, which was after his 9th season like Jordan, after winning 3 rings where he wasn't the best player, going through a rape trial that his organization stood behind him for, running Shaq out of town basically saying he wouldn't come back if he was there, and then retired saying he had nothing left to prove, he would come across as the most arrogant, ignorant, and ungrateful athlete ever. Even if he did it at 30, which was after the 08 Finals loss to the Celtics, it would've also been right after he demanded a trade and then the Lakers got him some help on top of everything else I mentioned. If he retired after that and said he had nothing left to prove, people would think all of those things I said plus him being fearful and afraid that he couldn't win without Shaq and even more help then he had at the time. Thats why he wouldn't get that pass.

[Heavincent]

Kobe wouldn't get the same pass cause he wasn't as successful and wasn't as likeable at that stage of his career like Jordan was and didn't have a horrible tragedy in his family occur. Part of the reason Jordan said he was retiring was cause he felt he had nothing left to prove, which was a legit thing to say after going on what was probably the most successful 3-year run any basketball player has ever had. If Kobe retired in 2005, which was after his 9th season like Jordan, after winning 3 rings where he wasn't the best player, going through a rape trial that his organization stood behind him for, running Shaq out of town basically saying he wouldn't come back if he was there, and then retired saying he had nothing left to prove, he would come across as the most arrogant, ignorant, and ungrateful athlete ever. Even if he did it at 30, which was after the 08 Finals loss to the Celtics, it would've also been right after he demanded a trade and then the Lakers got him some help on top of everything else I mentioned. If he retired after that and said he had nothing left to prove, people would think all of those things I said plus him being fearful and afraid that he couldn't win without Shaq and even more help then he had at the time. Thats why he wouldn't get that pass.

What if he retired after 2010? You know, when he carried his team to 2 straight titles.

[OldSchoolBBall]

I love how some people think that the most skilled player in history just became that way without working on developing those skills. As others have noted, people are confusing MJ's other activities and his inhuman stamina (many players have commented on this, such as DRob and Magic in the Dream Team documentary, about how MJ could go from the game, to golf, to nightlife to cards til 6 AM, to practice without sleeping).

[2LeTTeRS]

Seriously. They make it sound like he had to sit out the whole year and didn't play organized ball, when in reality he just barely missed out on varsity his freshman year, so instead he dominated the JV teams for 1 year before playing 3 years of varsity.

If you are going to try to correct something at least get your facts straight. MJ did not play varsity in his first 2 years and during his sophomore year a person in the same class made the team while he was stuck on JV. Explain to me how that is not being cut?

[guy]

What if he retired after 2010? You know, when he carried his team to 2 straight titles.

I have huge doubts that people would criticize him for that with the type of things I said.

[Heilige]

WE DO HEAR stories of MJ working out tho.

Not sure where you get this notion from.

From players, to trainers, staff and MJ himself, all we hear is how hard he worked out and how he pushed others.

Look up Tim Grover and he'll still say MJ was the hardest working player he ever trained. Go back to his college days and players like Kenny Smith would say how hard he worked out. There is a huge deal made on how he improved every off season to add a new dimension to his game or just improve in general. His work ethic is legendary, that's all he talks about, he even has a commercial about it.

I think you're confusing the other stories with him not concentrating solely on basketball. But HE can do what he does, others can't. Like some mentioned, they don't have the stamina that he did. They're bodies aren't like his.


:cheers:


Thanks man. You make good points. I just found this article:

[QUOTE]The following is conversation between Coach Roy Williams, then an assistant at the University of North Carolina and a young freshman named Michael Jordan:

When Michael Jordan first got to UNC, we were sitting at the track one day after conditioning. It was just the two of us.

[Heilige]

I love how some people think that the most skilled player in history just became that way without working on developing those skills. As others have noted, people are confusing MJ's other activities and his inhuman stamina (many players have commented on this, such as DRob and Magic in the Dream Team documentary, about how MJ could go from the game, to golf, to nightlife to cards til 6 AM, to practice without sleeping).


That is why I was probably confused originally.

How many hours a sleep do you think he got each night?

[Heavincent]

So which type of big cat did Jordan wrestle with his bare hands?

[riseagainst]

So which type of big cat did Jordan wrestle with his bare hands?

http://4.bp.blogspot.com/_dedcXqzPdxo/TT7hyqZ1ANI/AAAAAAAAB84/obtKlgh61-g/s1600/kittens-pic5.jpg


<3333

[Heilige]

So which type of big cat did Jordan wrestle with his bare hands?


huh?

[lilgodfather1]

Everything about Jordan, Wilt, KAJ, Bird, West, Russ, Magic, etc is overrated by the people of that were big fans of theirs. It is really simple just like Kobe sexuals over rate everything that he does, etc. If you're a fan of a player you over rate the hell out of him, and the media has a big effect on that because they are always looking for a way to get the dumb average fans like many found on this board interested. The media says edgy things to get ratings, and fans take it as gospel, and they spout it. Jordan's the GOAT, but it isn't by the margin his fans would have you believe that is for sure.

It's not like we're talking about the Great One here, just Air Bud Jordan...

[Heilige]

I do find it disappointing that there's pretty much nothing out there on what his offseason workouts consisted of. If you have followed his career, you can see a gradual improvement in his skill level and polish year-after-year. To the point where he went from VERY raw(84-87) to someone who pretty much perfected the game by 92-93. The guy was clearly working on his game, but there isn't any written material on it. MJ never talks about it either. In fact, listening to him, you'd think all he did during the summer was play golf. I've read almost every book about him too, yet the extent of talk concerning his work ethic is how "hard" he worked. That's all. No details.

I wish somebody would've just sat down with him once and discussed his GAME. Just his basketball ability, nothing more. Would've been a fascinating interview.


OldSchoolBBall, do you have any info. on Jordan's workout routines and what they consisted of?

[guy]

So which type of big cat did Jordan wrestle with his bare hands?

Ummm, someone having amazing stamina is not anywhere near as unbelievable as someone killing a mountain lion with his bare hands. Jordan isn't even the only one that has had those type of stories about him. Dennis Rodman and Allen Iverson have had similar stories told about them.

[riseagainst]

Everything about Jordan, Wilt, KAJ, Bird, West, Russ, Magic, etc is overrated by the people of that were big fans of theirs. It is really simple just like Kobe sexuals over rate everything that he does, etc. If you're a fan of a player you over rate the hell out of him, and the media has a big effect on that because they are always looking for a way to get the dumb average fans like many found on this board interested. The media says edgy things to get ratings, and fans take it as gospel, and they spout it. Jordan's the GOAT, but it isn't by the margin his fans would have you believe that is for sure.

It's not like we're talking about the Great One here, just Air Bud Jordan...

-__________________________________-


































ok I laughed. :applause:

[Heilige]

Ummm, someone having amazing stamina is not anywhere near as unbelievable as someone killing a mountain lion with his bare hands. Jordan isn't even the only one that has had those type of stories about him. Dennis Rodman and Allen Iverson have had similar stories told about them.


Agreed. How was Jordan able to have such incredible stamina? Did he train for it, or was it all genetics?

[riseagainst]

Agreed. How was Jordan able to have such incredible stamina? Did he train for it, or was it all genetics?

here's the thing about genetics vs hard training.
You need to put a good amount of effort into training and reach a certain level before you can make a clear judgment on whether you have good or bad genetics (compared to others who put forth the same amount of effort as you).

[scandisk_]

Agreed. How was Jordan able to have such incredible stamina? Did he train for it, or was it all genetics?

Like LeBron MJ was an athlete who's one of a kind.

[Heilige]

here's the thing about genetics vs hard training.
You need to put a good amount of effort into training and reach a certain level before you can make a clear judgment on whether you have good or bad genetics (compared to others who put forth the same amount of effort as you).


How much is considered a good amount of effort into training?

[TheMan]

I think MJ's work ethic is very overrated because we hear more stories about him gambling and golfing than we do about him hitting the weight room.

MJ was a great player based on talent and skill. Heck, he got lazy and decided to play baseball.
:facepalm

[TheMan]

:facepalm ^^^^Kobe fans embarrassing themselves by basically telling the world that Kobe has a ton of trouble, beating his man off the dribble, therefore leading too more contested shots

:confusedshrug:

:biggums:
:bowdown:
Great point.

Kobe klowns are actually proud that Kobe takes a lot of tough contested jumpers:oldlol: :facepalm , that explains why== his FG% is shit:lol The whole point of basketball on the offensive side of the ball is to get the most high percentage shot that's available you numbnuts

lay up=high percentage shot
contested 24 foot shot=low percentage shot

We might need to break it down kindergarden style to these Kobetards:oldlol: they are really an ignorant lot.

[RRR3]

:bowdown:
Great point.

Kobe klowns are actually proud that Kobe takes a lot of tough contested jumpers:oldlol: :facepalm , that explains why== his FG% is shit:lol The whole point of basketball on the offensive side of the ball is to get the most high percentage shot that's available you numbnuts

lay up=high percentage shot
contested 24 foot shot=low percentage shot

We might need to break it down kindergarden style to these Kobetards:oldlol: they are really an ignorant lot.
True story. One of the more hilarious "Kobetard-isms" I've heard is that LeBron's points aren't impressive because he has so many dunks, and "dunks aren't shots". :hammerhead: As if we should hold it against LeBron that he can drive in and dunk on people :lol If it was so easy to score the way LeBron does, why doesn't everyone do it? :confusedshrug: Heck why doesn't Kobe do it? Surely, such a simple way of scoring would be child's play for "the Gawd"? :confusedshrug:

[TheMan]

True story. One of the more hilarious "Kobetard-isms" I've heard is that LeBron's points aren't impressive because he has so many dunks, and "dunks aren't shots". :hammerhead: As if we should hold it against LeBron that he can drive in and dunk on people :lol If it was so easy to score the way LeBron does, why doesn't everyone do it? :confusedshrug: Heck why doesn't Kobe do it? Surely, such a simple way of scoring would be child's play for "the Gawd"? :confusedshrug:
Kobe is a chucker, LBJ isn't. Kobe was putting up a gang of ugly shots in the olympics, I was embarrassed for him. LBJ gets hammered by kobetards because he rarely chucks away:facepalm

[Heavincent]

Ummm, someone having amazing stamina is not anywhere near as unbelievable as someone killing a mountain lion with his bare hands. Jordan isn't even the only one that has had those type of stories about him. Dennis Rodman and Allen Iverson have had similar stories told about them.

I know, I was kidding. But I feel like it's only a matter of time before we reach that point though. Jordan is already looked at as some completely uncontainable basketball God that never once ****ed up in his career. Can you imagine what it will be like 20 years from now? I bet there will be all kinds of looney myths about Jordan. Like something about Jordan returning to his hometown as an NBA player to **** his high school basketball coach's wife.

[Heavincent]

:bowdown:
Great point.

Kobe klowns are actually proud that Kobe takes a lot of tough contested jumpers:oldlol: :facepalm , that explains why== his FG% is shit:lol The whole point of basketball on the offensive side of the ball is to get the most high percentage shot that's available you numbnuts

lay up=high percentage shot
contested 24 foot shot=low percentage shot

We might need to break it down kindergarden style to these Kobetards:oldlol: they are really an ignorant lot.

How is Kobe's FG% shit? 45% is fine for an elite SG. Jordan shot 49% for his career, just 4% better than Kobe. So what would you consider his FG%? Mediocre?

[TheMan]

How is Kobe's FG% shit? 45% is fine for an elite SG. Jordan shot 49% for his career, just 4% better than Kobe. So what would you consider his FG%? Mediocre?
What was Kobe's FG% last year again?

[Heavincent]

What was Kobe's FG% last year again?

43%, just 2% worse than his career average. Big whoop. People make such a big deal out of that when a 2% difference doesn't really mean shit.

[guy]

I know, I was kidding. But I feel like it's only a matter of time before we reach that point though. Jordan is already looked at as some completely uncontainable basketball God that never once ****ed up in his career. Can you imagine what it will be like 20 years from now? I bet there will be all kinds of looney myths about Jordan. Like something about Jordan returning to his hometown as an NBA player to **** his high school basketball coach's wife.

Eh, doubt it. I think "myths" in general will not nearly be as prevalant 20 years from now because of how everything has been so much better documented over the past 20-30 years.

[TheMan]

43%, just 2% worse than his career average. Big whoop. People make such a big deal out of that when a 2% difference doesn't really mean shit.
He's treading on volume scorer there...not a good trend.

[ralph_i_el]

it's well documented that Jordan had an inhuman amount of energy and stamina. He probably worked his ass off and partied his ass off because he could