#15 NBA Player Of All-Time According to InsideHoops [Archive] - Message Board Basketball Forum

crisoner

08-28-2012, 06:23 PM

As a Lebron hater i bet it is u loser.

As a knowledgeable legend around this parts it is.
Now sit down kid and learn something.

If LeBron retired today...with all of his accomplishments etc.
He would of not had a better career then the other 13 players on this list.
We are talking about career right now...what have you done.

His numbers are not there yet when it comes to statistic. Is he well on his way..yes...but NOT NOW. Anyone saying he already is, is a fool.

You want to argue why he belongs at 11 go ahead.
And state why LeBron has had a better career then any of the 13 legends on this list.

Legends66NBA7

08-28-2012, 06:31 PM

BlackVVaves

08-28-2012, 06:38 PM

It's between Karl Malone, Charles Barkley, and Bob Pettit.

Just haven't decided which I'd take here yet.

A little brief stat observation for those who are familiar with the play of all three already, either through watching directly or, in Pettit's case, research and game footage.

Karl Malone
1985-2004
25 PPG | 10 RPG | 4 APG | 52% FG
Best season: 29 | 12 | 3 | 53%
2 MVPs

Charles Barkley
1984-2000
22 PPG | 12 RPG | 4 APG | 54% FG
Best season: 28 | 12 | 3 | 59%
1 MVP

Bob Pettit
1954-1965
26 PPG | 16 RPG | 3 APG | 44% FG
Best season: 28 | 20 | 3 | 45%
2 MVPs, 1 ring (in 1958, leading the Hawks past Bill Russell and the Boston Celtics.

The battle of the Power Forwards. Hmmm...

Kews1

08-28-2012, 06:40 PM

Kevin Garnett

FreezingTsmoove

08-28-2012, 06:40 PM

Dr. J

brownmamba00

08-28-2012, 06:41 PM

Mikan

AlonzoGOAT

08-28-2012, 06:41 PM

As a knowledgeable legend around this parts it is.
Now sit down kid and learn something.

If LeBron retired today...with all of his accomplishments etc.
He would of not had a better career then the other 13 players on this list.
We are talking about career right now...what have you done.

His numbers are not there yet when it comes to statistic. Is he well on his way..yes...but NOT NOW. Anyone saying he already is, is a fool.

You want to argue why he belongs at 11 go ahead.
And state why LeBron has had a better career then any of the 13 legends on this list.

You have to take career and who's the better player to account. LeBron already has a better career/accomplishments then Jerry and IS BY FAR A BETTER PLAYER but of course people overrate the **** out of him because of damn ****ing Logo. And same can be said about Moses Malone only LeBron is still clear the better player or are you really that much of a hater and can't say other wise?

FatComputerNerd

08-28-2012, 06:42 PM

I honestly don't think Kobe is a top-10.

I have him around 11-13.

crisoner

08-28-2012, 06:53 PM

You have to take career and who's the better player to account. LeBron already has a better career/accomplishments then Jerry and IS BY FAR A BETTER PLAYER but of course people overrate the **** out of him because of damn ****ing Logo. And same can be said about Moses Malone only LeBron is still clear the better player or are you really that much of a hater and can't say other wise?

You are talking about CARRERS here when you talk about greatest players. We judge players on what they have accomplished in their careers.
How can you compare James to a Russel or West...really any of these players because they played in different era's and different positions. To much comes in to that account. But what sets true is what they accomplished in their careers and how is advanced the game over all. Simply saying LeBron is a better player hands down etc. is all based on opinion when it comes down to it. But when you look at a career it is black and white.

Get your hater BS out of here I don't like LeBron but I will give him a fair shake when it comes to this list. And it is way to early to have him at number 11. Waaaaaay to early. It's damn right disrespectful to the game to put him there at this time. I have him right outside the top 15 already...and putting him right there with his young career speaks volumes. But 11....that right there is none sense.

BlackVVaves

08-28-2012, 06:56 PM

For those voting for the other great forwards of All Time in Kevin Garnett and Julius Irving...

What do you believe their cases are over Karl Malone, Charles Barkley, and Bob Pettit?

FatComputerNerd

08-28-2012, 06:58 PM

crisoner

08-28-2012, 07:01 PM

Question:

Who would you have over Bron and where would you rank him instead ?

I would have Oscar...Moses...West...Karl Malone...and KG all in front of LeBron.

Ask this questin...LeBron retires today did he have a better career then these guys? Karl Malone 2nd in points all time etc. Hell no he would not.

And longevity...we don't know that with LeBron. His game at this moment relies so heavy on his speed and strength. The Speed will go soon...and when it does how good will he be? Remember other players had to adjust their games through out time and keep healthy.

Remember the downfalls of T-Mac and Vince Carter? Allen Iverson etc.
That sh*t doesn't last. With the great ones it does.

AlonzoGOAT

08-28-2012, 07:04 PM

You are talking about CARRERS here when you talk about greatest players. We judge players on what they have accomplished in their careers.
How can you compare James to a Russel or West...really any of these players because they played in different era's and different positions. To much comes in to that account. But what sets true is what they accomplished in their careers and how is advanced the game over all. Simply saying LeBron is a better player hands down etc. is all based on opinion when it comes down to it. But when you look at a career it is black and white.

Get your hater BS out of here I don't like LeBron but I will give him a fair shake when it comes to this list. And it is way to early to have him at number 11. Waaaaaay to early. It's damn right disrespectful to the game to put him there at this time. I have him right outside the top 15 already...and putting him right there with his young career speaks volumes. But 11....that right there is none sense.

Are you a ****ing dumbass? Look at the list we don't go completely on just accomplishments as no one should you have to take in how good the player was into account. At the end of the day LeBron is by FAR a better player has the same amount as rings as Jerry and more MVPs in a stronger ERA with several more accomplishments. Moses Malone have the same amount of rings/MVPs but all Moses has is 3 more ALL STAR Appearances (LeBron will end up with more) but lebron has more all nba first teams and nba 1st defensive teams. While LeBron is still a better player. SO WHERE ARE YOU GETTING AT F@GGOT. Edit nevermind you have KG over LeBron just because he's a good player and has been playing in the league along time. It's easy to say you're a ****ing troll and can't look at the facts.

IGotACoolStory

08-28-2012, 07:08 PM

http://i.cdn.turner.com/sivault/multimedia/photo_gallery/1007/pistons.1989.photos/images/isiah-trophy.jpg

BlackVVaves

08-28-2012, 07:12 PM

It is inappropriate to include Irving in this question, as he was a SF.

Compare position to position...

We are compiling an All Time list, not an All Time Power Forwards list. If players of different positions were incomparable, then we would have no list at all. Did you not see people comparing Jordan to Wilt, Magic to Bird, Kobe to Shaq?

Seriously, what are you even talking about?

Hittin_Shots

08-28-2012, 07:23 PM

Freedom Kid7

08-28-2012, 07:25 PM

As much as I wanna put either Hondo or Isiah, It's gotta be Dr. J. I can't deny his impact and skill. We might not even have fancy dunks if it wasn't for him.

crisoner

08-28-2012, 07:31 PM

Are you a ****ing dumbass? Look at the list we don't go completely on just accomplishments as no one should you have to take in how good the player was into account. At the end of the day LeBron is by FAR a better player has the same amount as rings as Jerry and more MVPs in a stronger ERA with several more accomplishments. Moses Malone have the same amount of rings/MVPs but all Moses has is 3 more ALL STAR Appearances (LeBron will end up with more) but lebron has more all nba first teams and nba 1st defensive teams. While LeBron is still a better player. SO WHERE ARE YOU GETTING AT F@GGOT. Edit nevermind you have KG over LeBron just because he's a good player and has been playing in the league along time. It's easy to say you're a ****ing troll and can't look at the facts.

F@ggot, Troll, blah blah.
Longevity...Career stats...stronger era?
If LeBron's career ended today he would not of had the vital impact that ANY of the players that I mention have had on the game. KG...changed the game....Jerry West...changed the game...Mosses...changed the game...Karl Malone...change the game. These players have influenced and put a stamp on the NBA with their careers while LeBron is just on his way to doing that with his first title and you want to jump the shark and put him already ahead of these guys? NO! You are disrespecting their legacy and the game.
And stop being freaking MAD and grow up when you debate with someone. You have some knowledge kid don't need to drop F bombs to show your point. That's what trolls do.

Again LeBron is well on his way if everything stays 100 with him in terms of health and luck. But putting him in front of any of the above i mention is disrespectful to the game itself.

F@ggot....just kidding.

SpecialQue

08-28-2012, 07:40 PM

Do I dare suggest...Scottie Pippen?

SpecialQue

08-28-2012, 07:43 PM

Mikan

Dammit, I forgot Mr Basketball. I take back my previous vote and say it should go to Mikan.

L.Kizzle

08-28-2012, 07:59 PM

Elgin Baylor, what the hell!

crisoner

08-28-2012, 08:00 PM

Mikan

Oh yeah...that's right I change my answer.

AlonzoGOAT

08-28-2012, 08:28 PM

F@ggot, Troll, blah blah.
Longevity...Career stats...stronger era?
If LeBron's career ended today he would not of had the vital impact that ANY of the players that I mention have had on the game. KG...changed the game....Jerry West...changed the game...Mosses...changed the game...Karl Malone...change the game. These players have influenced and put a stamp on the NBA with their careers while LeBron is just on his way to doing that with his first title and you want to jump the shark and put him already ahead of these guys? NO! You are disrespecting their legacy and the game.
And stop being freaking MAD and grow up when you debate with someone. You have some knowledge kid don't need to drop F bombs to show your point. That's what trolls do.

Again LeBron is well on his way if everything stays 100 with him in terms of health and luck. But putting him in front of any of the above i mention is disrespectful to the game itself.

F@ggot....just kidding.

No shit I have knowledge I actually got to see Most of these players play. I can't tell whether you're being a Homer and overrating Mr NBA logo but he hasn't done anything NBA CAREER WISE and Play level to be over LeBron. If he played in this era I'd easily take Wade who has more to his game then Mr Logo playing in the 70's. Moses has a big sausage and has Identical accomplishmets in terms of rings/Mvps, but like you said you want to base players of just accomplishments? LeBron has more and that's a fact. I don't overrate prior players to current players just because of how good they were back at the time. As far as talent lebron is top 10 and he's over Moses. But looks like were going to have to agree to disagree.

Give me your adress for I can woop your ass and shoot you f@ggot

In bold would be what I would say if I was lebron23

Kews1

08-28-2012, 08:38 PM

For those voting for the other great forwards of All Time in Kevin Garnett and Julius Irving...

What do you believe their cases are over Karl Malone, Charles Barkley, and Bob Pettit?

Personal opinion, i believe it goes KG>Charles>Karl

Just from watching them play. KG's defensive power is what pushes him above these two for me, hes a juggernaut on defense and that cant be discounted and it normally is defensive players arnt given the credit for their ability on both ends. And its also the difference between being a good defender and being a excellent all time defender as well. The only player given enough credit for his defense is Bill Russell, but even that is based more on his rings. There's not another player off the list i would put above KG, and MOSTLY every one above are people i agree with that are better.

pauk

08-28-2012, 08:49 PM

http://img6.imageshack.us/img6/970/juliuserving76erswallpa.jpg

Deuce Bigalow

08-28-2012, 08:50 PM

Eric Cartman

08-28-2012, 08:54 PM

Charles Barkley.

BlackVVaves

08-28-2012, 08:56 PM

Personal opinion, i believe it goes KG>Charles>Karl

Just from watching them play. KG's defensive power is what pushes him above these two for me, hes a juggernaut on defense and that cant be discounted and it normally is defensive players arnt given the credit for their ability on both ends. And its also the difference between being a good defender and being a excellent all time defender as well. The only player given enough credit for his defense is Bill Russell, but even that is based more on his rings. There's not another player off the list i would put above KG, and MOSTLY every one above are people i agree with that are better.

I hear you. I'd take KG over Chuck personally, but not over Malone. People forget the defensive beast Malone became later in his career.

Now, Dr. J is one of my three favorite players All Time. But, I don't see his case over Malone or Pettit.

Deuce Bigalow

08-28-2012, 08:57 PM

http://img6.imageshack.us/img6/970/juliuserving76erswallpa.jpg
Now that's a guy with a 40+" vertical. And Jlolber wants us to believe Wilt had a 50" one :oldlol:

pauk

08-28-2012, 09:01 PM

Now that's a guy with a 40+" vertical. And Jlolber wants us to believe Wilt had a 50" one :oldlol:

He sure had some kindof hops :D

http://i29.tinypic.com/2152pt.jpg

(the guy under him is a Center)

Legends66NBA7

08-28-2012, 09:02 PM

You can put any top PF at this spot from Garnett, Barkley, Dirk, Malone, and Pettit.

arifgokcen

08-28-2012, 09:02 PM

Dr.J

BlackVVaves

08-28-2012, 09:02 PM

[QUOTE=Deuce Bigalow]Julius Erving has a strong case as well

His NBA accomplishments:

NBA champion (1983)
NBA Most Valuable Player (1981)
11

Harison

08-28-2012, 09:03 PM

This guy:

http://images.picturesdepot.com/photo/k/kevin_garnett-4634.jpg

BlackVVaves

08-28-2012, 09:05 PM

My only question with Malone is, was his greatness more of a product of his individual ability, or his point guard Stockton.

BlackWhiteGreen

08-28-2012, 09:20 PM

My only question with Malone is, was his greatness more of a product of his individual ability, or his point guard Stockton.

It's difficult to answer that question properly as it is obvious from the list great players need great teammates to be even considered near the top of such a list. Just look at it - Kareem played with Magic. West played with Wilt. Kobe played with Shaq. These players won the bulk of their titles with another top 14 player of all time. That can't be a coincidence, which is what makes these lists so difficult to argue - everyone has their conceptions of players in their heads, but you have to consider records and accomplishments and the like. If LeBron James had been drafted by the Timberwolves, how many titles does he win with KG 2003-2012? 4 or 5, right? Where would that put him? Where would that put Garnett? Is it fair in these lists that Malone had Stockton, when Garnett's second best player until his 13th season was Sam Cassell?

Seems that you need to be put into a great position to be considered truly great.

RoundMoundOfReb

08-28-2012, 09:22 PM

Doctor J if we're talking basketball David Robinson if it's just nba.

Kews1

08-28-2012, 09:32 PM

You can put any top PF at this spot from Garnett, Barkley, Dirk, Malone, and Pettit.

To early for Dirk

BlackVVaves

08-28-2012, 09:49 PM

It's difficult to answer that question properly as it is obvious from the list great players need great teammates to be even considered near the top of such a list. Just look at it - Kareem played with Magic. West played with Wilt. Kobe played with Shaq. These players won the bulk of their titles with another top 14 player of all time. That can't be a coincidence, which is what makes these lists so difficult to argue - everyone has their conceptions of players in their heads, but you have to consider records and accomplishments and the like. If LeBron James had been drafted by the Timberwolves, how many titles does he win with KG 2003-2012? 4 or 5, right? Where would that put him? Where would that put Garnett? Is it fair in these lists that Malone had Stockton, when Garnett's second best player until his 13th season was Sam Cassell?

Seems that you need to be put into a great position to be considered truly great.

I think you misunderstood the context of my question. In terms of performance, not achievement in the sense of championships. Let me explain...

You brought up some of best tandems the NBA has ever seen. However, with each of them, it was clear and apparent one way or another what the level and quality of each individual's play was.

We saw Kareem dominate the league before Magic, collecting 5 MVPs and a championship. We saw Magic dominate the league with a far-past-his-prime Kareem, collecting 3 MVPs, and getting to the NBA Finals without Kareem.

We saw (heard, and read) how Wilt dominated the league individually, without Jerry West. We also saw (heard and read) West exhibit elite "clutchness," and elevate his game to a whole other level in the postseason as a guard.

We saw Shaq dominate the league in 2000 with a far-before-his-prime Kobe at his side. We also saw him destroy in the Finals from 2000-2002, and put on a MVP performance throughout the 2004-2005 regular season. Conversely, we saw Kobe dominate the perimeter alongside Shaq in 2001, 2002, and 2003, particularly in the second and third rounds of the postseason in 2001 and 2002. We've also seen Kobe dominate the league without Shaq from 2006-2010, collecting a MVP and two titles.

We all know what each of those players were capable of sans their partner in dominance. But, with Malone, it's truly unclear. As a player whose bread and butter was the pick and roll, which was executed with a top 3 point guard of All Time, the question hovers what Malone would have or could have done with Stockton feeding the ball. My question is more about what his individual production would have been, not how successful his team would have been.

I believe Malone and Stockton relied on each other more than any of the tandems you mentioned.

Round Mound

08-28-2012, 09:52 PM

Sir Charles Barkley:

Top 10 All Time EFFICIENCY
Top 10 All Time PLAYER EFFICIENCY RATING (Season)
Top 9 All Time PLAYER EFFICIENCY RATING (Play-Offs)
Top 8 All Time WIN SHARES Per 48 Min
Top 5 All Time In PLUS/MINUS (+/-)
Top 4 All Time SHOT MADE/MISSED DIFERENTIAL

Get Real People...

fsvr54

08-28-2012, 09:57 PM

Isaiah Thomas

BlackWhiteGreen

08-28-2012, 10:14 PM

I think you misunderstood the context of my question. In terms of performance, not achievement in the sense of championships. Let me explain...

You brought up some of best tandems the NBA has ever seen. However, with each of them, it was clear and apparent one way or another what the level and quality of each individual's play was.

We saw Kareem dominate the league before Magic, collecting 5 MVPs and a championship. We saw Magic dominate the league with a far-past-his-prime Kareem, collecting 3 MVPs, and getting to the NBA Finals without Kareem.

We saw (heard, and read) how Wilt dominated the league individually, without Jerry West. We also saw (heard and read) West exhibit elite "clutchness," and elevate his game to a whole other level in the postseason as a guard.

We saw Shaq dominate the league in 2000 with a far-before-his-prime Kobe at his side. We also saw him destroy in the Finals from 2000-2002, and put on a MVP performance throughout the 2004-2005 regular season. Conversely, we saw Kobe dominate the perimeter alongside Shaq in 2001, 2002, and 2003, particularly in the second and third rounds of the postseason in 2001 and 2002. We've also seen Kobe dominate the league without Shaq from 2006-2010, collecting a MVP and two titles.

We all know what each of those players were capable of sans their partner in dominance. But, with Malone, it's truly unclear. As a player whose bread and butter was the pick and roll, which was executed with a top 3 point guard of All Time, the question hovers what Malone would have or could have done with Stockton feeding the ball. My question is more about what his individual production would have been, not how successful his team would have been.

I believe Malone and Stockton relied on each other more than any of the tandems you mentioned.

Perhaps I went off on a tangent more than I'd like to have on that question. It is, in reality, impossible to say what Stockton was without Malone and vice-versa. You could also say the same about post-Shaq Kobe, would he have been the force that he was had he not been given the chance to play with Shaq? No one knows what Bird would be without McHale and Parish, or how Ewing would be remembered had he played with Drexler.

It is both the beauty of, and the infuriating limitation of sports.

TheBigVeto

08-28-2012, 10:39 PM

Dirk Nowitzki

KOBE143

08-28-2012, 10:40 PM

Dr. J

G-train

08-28-2012, 11:03 PM

Baylor

38/19/5 one year there

Dr J before Dr J

INDI

08-28-2012, 11:04 PM

Dr j ( I don't care if it says nba only. The man was a proffessional ball player and dominated both leagues)

lakersfan2046

08-28-2012, 11:24 PM

Dr. J

DaHeezy

08-28-2012, 11:32 PM

Julius Erving

MrWarrior

08-28-2012, 11:34 PM

Dr. J.

hangintheair

08-28-2012, 11:47 PM

CHarles Barkley

Noof

08-28-2012, 11:54 PM

Julius Erving, MD

Alan Ogg

08-29-2012, 12:08 AM

Dr. J.

joeyjoejoe

08-29-2012, 12:09 AM

The mailman

BlueandGold

08-29-2012, 12:18 AM

Dr. J, some would argue he should have been before West. Me personally i had west over Dr. J by a hair.

BlackVVaves

08-29-2012, 12:19 AM

No one voting Dr. J willing to plead his case over Malone and Pettit?

LoL @ Dirk getting a vote this high.

DaHeezy

08-29-2012, 12:21 AM

No one voting Dr. J willing to plead his case over Malone and Pettit?

LoL @ Dirk getting a vote this high.

well technically it was requested to just vote, but to answer your question dr.J was already argued over Oscar and West, to bring it up now is too repetative and almost irrelevant

BlackVVaves

08-29-2012, 12:41 AM

well technically it was requested to just vote, but to answer your question dr.J was already argued over Oscar and West, to bring it up now is too repetative and almost irrelevant

What type of logic is that? :roll:

A player is compared to the other legit players vying for the same ranking. You think because Dr. J's career was previously compared to West and Oscar's careers, it's "irrelevant" to assess it again when contrasting it to two completely different players?

:facepalm

DaHeezy

08-29-2012, 12:46 AM

What type of logic is that? :roll:

A player is compared to the other legit players vying for the same ranking. You think because Dr. J's career was previously compared to West and Oscar's careers, it's "irrelevant" to assess it again when contrasting it to two completely different players?

:facepalm

Is it that time of the month? I answered your question, no need to get pissy

I'm saying that the ame argument was used for the 10th, 11th, and 12th spot. don't you think it's repetative? Would you like the same poster to copy and paste their argument in each and every voting thread?

Use your head

maybeshewill13

08-29-2012, 12:54 AM

Dr J

BlackVVaves

08-29-2012, 12:56 AM

Is it that time of the month? I answered your question, no need to get pissy

I'm saying that he's been argued for the 10th, 11th, and 12th spot. don't you think it's repetative? Would you like the same poster to copy and paste their argument in each and every voting thread?

Use your head

No need to be simple minded.

His case was made for those rankings, and he ultimately lost to Bron, Oscar, and West. Clearly people felt there were greater players to be placed before him.

So, what makes you think that the debate doesn't need to be had for #15, #16, #17, ect.? We are comparing him to entirely different players in my assessment. How his ability and achievements fair against their own is independent of his previous comparisons.

Let's be cereal.

DaHeezy

08-29-2012, 01:04 AM

No need to be simple minded.

His case was made for those rankings, and he ultimately lost to Bron, Oscar, and West. Clearly people felt there were greater players to be placed before him.

So, what makes you think that the debate doesn't need to be had for #15, #16, #17, ect.? We are comparing him to entirely different players in my assessment. How his ability and achievements fair against their own is independent of his previous comparisons.

Let's be cereal.

Your voting a player to secure a spot in the ranking. So essentially you're making a case for why he should be there. A spot in which several players can be argued for the same spot. So if you're player doesn't get voted in you recycle that same info. It's a simple voting system, yes debate may break out and it has, but no need to repeat yourself when essentially you're repeating the same name until your player gets voted in. But don't get all willy nilly if no one want to challenge your argument in here.

Debating Dr.J over Pettit or Malone is a great argument, does it really need to be debated in this environment? when you're at town hall trying to pass a law where it's yay or nay do you ask every member why they voted yay or nay? Start a thread if you feel it's worthy.

L.Kizzle

08-29-2012, 01:11 AM

When did "Julius" become better than Elgin Baylor?

BlackVVaves

08-29-2012, 01:12 AM

Your voting a player to secure a spot in the ranking. So essentially you're making a case for why he should be there. A spot in which several players can be argued for the same spot. So if you're player doesn't get voted in you recycle that same info. It's a simple voting system, yes debate may break out and it has, but no need to repeat yourself when essentially you're repeating the same name until your player gets voted in. But don't get all willy nilly if no one want to challenge your argument in here.

Debating Dr.J over Pettit or Malone is a great argument, does it really need to be debated in this environment? when you're at town hall trying to pass a law where it's yay or nay do you ask every member why they voted yay or nay? Start a thread if you feel it's worthy.

Considering this thread is the base of that discussion, I'd think it would be more plausible to hold that debate within this thread rather than sprout a new one.

DTreats

08-29-2012, 01:27 AM

Ray Allen

daily

08-29-2012, 01:28 AM

Top 100 Greatest NBA Players Of All-Time According to InsideHoops
1. Michael Jordan (http://www.insidehoops.com/forum/showthread.php?t=275054)
2. Kareem Abdul-Jabbar (http://www.insidehoops.com/forum/showthread.php?t=275088)
3. Bill Russell (http://www.insidehoops.com/forum/showthread.php?t=275126)
4. Magic Johnson (http://www.insidehoops.com/forum/showthread.php?t=275165)
5. Larry Bird (http://www.insidehoops.com/forum/showthread.php?t=275200)
6. Wilt Chamberlain (http://www.insidehoops.com/forum/showthread.php?t=275236)
7. Shaquille O'Neal (http://www.insidehoops.com/forum/showthread.php?t=275265)
8. Kobe Bryant (http://www.insidehoops.com/forum/showthread.php?t=275312)
9. Tim Duncan (http://www.insidehoops.com/forum/showthread.php?t=275368)
10. Hakeem Olajuwon (http://www.insidehoops.com/forum/showthread.php?t=275442)
11. Lebron James (http://www.insidehoops.com/forum/showthread.php?t=275457)
12. Moses Malone (http://www.insidehoops.com/forum/showthread.php?t=275504)
13. Oscar Robertson (http://www.insidehoops.com/forum/showthread.php?t=275603)
14. Jerry West (http://www.insidehoops.com/forum/showthread.php?t=275708)

What is Lebron doing there at 11?

I haven't been following this at all so I have no right to complain but that's not right

DaHeezy

08-29-2012, 01:29 AM

When did "Julius" become better than Elgin Baylor?

Hodge? he's obviously never been better. Dr.J however has always been

DirtySanchez

08-29-2012, 01:35 AM

What is Lebron doing there at 11?

I haven't been following this at all so I have no right to complain but that's not right

People are ranking their opinion that his peak out ranks others.
Really they are disrespecting just disrespecting the game and jumping the shark. Oh well it's inside hoops.

ImmortalD24

08-29-2012, 01:55 AM

Kevin Garnett

Vertical-24

08-29-2012, 02:05 AM

Julius "Dr. J" Erving.

pauk

08-29-2012, 02:49 AM

What is Lebron doing there at 11?

I haven't been following this at all so I have no right to complain but that's not right

...............Lebron........Moses.........West... ....Oscar.....
MVP.............3................3...............0 ............1........
FMVP............1................1...............1 ............0.........
CHAMP..........1................1...............1. ...........1.........
ROTY...........Yes..............No.............No. ........Yes.......
All-NBA..........8................8..............10... ........9.........
All-Defensive...4...............1...............4..... .......0.........
All-Star..........8................12.............14.. ........12........
All-Star MVP....2................0...............1......... ..3.........

Lebron accomplished overall more than them, especially compared to West & Oscar... and also had the better championship run once again especially compared to West & Oscar... Oscar for example got that one and only championship way out of his prime being a 2nd fiddle to a 35-17-5 MVP&FMVP behemoth called Kareem... then there is that thing called player domination & impact, being the best player in the NBA for a couple of years (which none of those other players you see above were) and also his stats, milestones, records more than matches up any of those players....

So, would you be so kind to explain how that "is not right"?

DTreats

08-29-2012, 02:51 AM

Junk removed

Alan Ogg

08-29-2012, 04:17 AM

All Star MVP? I often see that on this site as a category when ranking players. That has to be one of the most meaningless achievements when comparing the greats. It just doesn't fit in with everything else.

Horatio33

08-29-2012, 04:18 AM

Dr J.

coin24

08-29-2012, 04:28 AM

arifgokcen

08-29-2012, 05:02 AM

Anything pauk can use to prop up bronzey he will do. Shameless:oldlol:
Dude i dont like pauk but even if you remove all star mvps and Player of the month awards lebron resume is more impressive than any other #11-20 player.

coin24

08-29-2012, 06:53 AM

Dude i dont like pauk but even if you remove all star mvps and Player of the month awards lebron resume is more impressive than any other #11-20 player.

Pippen>lebron:oldlol: 6>1:lol

Yeah in all honesty lebron will be up there at the end of his career, it's just a bit too early to call. Anything could happen. 1 decent year after a career of underachieving/choking and being on a super team in a depleted conference just isnt enough IMO.. If they can repeat then its a whole other story...

Kews1

08-29-2012, 06:59 AM

Pippen>lebron:oldlol: 6>1:lol

Yeah in all honesty lebron will be up there at the end of his career, it's just a bit too early to call. Anything could happen. 1 decent year after a career of underachieving/choking and being on a super team in a depleted conference just isnt enough IMO.. If they can repeat then its a whole other story...

I understand that he didn't win a championship up until this year but seriously you can't call 3 x MVP underachieving, if he hadn't of won a championship this year then maby but I'm fairly sure that he's on par with where he should be right now...

Rolando

08-29-2012, 08:17 AM

Dr. J

INDI

08-29-2012, 08:30 AM

well technically it was requested to just vote, but to answer your question dr.J was already argued over Oscar and West, to bring it up now is too repetative and almost irrelevant

You can't discredit a mans ability and take away some of his prime years because there was two leagues back then. He played for the nets which became a nba team anyway, so to say all nets players who played at this time career's don't count would be stupid. I view it as todays nfl conferences where alot of times teams don't even play against other teams. They are still in the same league but didnt get to meet.

also lets stop faking the funk, these threads are the greatest NBA players of alltime but I doubt most people even care if ABA statistics are included. Julius was that dude and lead a proffessional league in mvp's, championships etc....

A more fair comparison for those of you that refuse to use his ABA year is to take off the first 5 years of everyone that played and then see how they match up

SilkkTheShocker

08-29-2012, 08:30 AM

To early for Dirk

Dirk >>>>> KG

Give me the lead dog

Duncan21formvp

08-29-2012, 09:15 AM

Julius Erving

East_Stone_Ya

08-29-2012, 09:20 AM

Joe Dumars

PK3434

08-29-2012, 09:50 AM

Elgin Baylor...please read up on this man's career.

alenleomessi

08-29-2012, 10:12 AM

Dr J edges out Sir Charles

DaHeezy

08-29-2012, 10:19 AM

You can't discredit a mans ability and take away some of his prime years because there was two leagues back then. He played for the nets which became a nba team anyway, so to say all nets players who played at this time career's don't count would be stupid. I view it as todays nfl conferences where alot of times teams don't even play against other teams. They are still in the same league but didnt get to meet.

also lets stop faking the funk, these threads are the greatest NBA players of alltime but I doubt most people even care if ABA statistics are included. Julius was that dude and lead a proffessional league in mvp's, championships etc....

A more fair comparison for those of you that refuse to use his ABA year is to take off the first 5 years of everyone that played and then see how they match up

Umm...I've been trying to vote in dr.J since #11, why you picking on me?

INDI

08-29-2012, 11:02 AM

Umm...I've been trying to vote in dr.J since #11, why you picking on me?

lol. I meant to grab the quote from the poster you was debating with, sorry about that. I agree with your points

Colbertnation64

08-29-2012, 11:11 AM

Mikan

BoutPractice

08-29-2012, 11:14 AM

Elgin Baylor...please read up on this man's career.
> Baylor was a beast, but he was often mentioned as one of the best, not the best, contrary to Dr J (especially if you count his ABA years where he just dominated the league). Baylor was never voted MVP, nor did he win an NBA championship.

pauk

08-29-2012, 03:10 PM

raid09

08-29-2012, 03:21 PM

Do you guys think John Havlicek might be getting a bit underrated here?

8 x Champion
1 x FMVP
11 x All-NBA team
8 x All-Defensive team
13 x All-Star

Career Average: 21-6-5
Best season: 29-9-8 (thats almost a 30 point triple double right there)
Maybe, maybe not, don't really know how he is rated...but he doesn't deserve a vote over some of the greats that have left to be voted for. I'm pretty comfortable saying guys like Barkley, Malone, Erving (NBA), are ahead of him regardless of championship count.

Erving is my vote.

oolalaa

08-29-2012, 03:22 PM

> Baylor was a beast, but he was often mentioned as one of the best, not the best, contrary to Dr J (especially if you count his ABA years where he just dominated the league). Baylor was never voted MVP, nor did he win an NBA championship.

Baylor probably deserved the MVP in 62/63. He averaged a 34/14/5 on 45% and led the Lakers to 53 wins, even though West missed 27 games.

He also could very easily have been given the FMVP in the '62 Finals, after averaging a 41/18, including one of the greatest single games in playoff history in game 5 - 61 points, including 6 straight points with around a minute left that put L.A up by 3.