Kobe / Lebron fans: Do you feel that the 2012 Heat title should be asterisked?

[CavaliersFTW]

Just to be clear I'm NOT a Kobe fan, nor am I a Lebron, nor am I a Heat or Laker fan - but there seems to be a pretty noticeable rift between Lebron and Kobe fan opinion with both sides trying to get the upper hand on the other on how accolades need to be interpreted.

I'm interested to hear the Kobe fan, and then the Lebron fan take on the 2012 NBA title that the Heat won this past lockout season. Here's your chance to give a brief explanation as to why or why not asterisk the 2012 Heat title.

I want a good clean debate, no low-bows.

**Please denote whether you are a Lebron fan or Kobe fan at the end of your post** - (I dont want the debate in this thread to be too watered down by the opinions of unbias league fans)

http://celestonews.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/08/kobe-bryant.jpg

http://images.inquisitr.com/wp-content/2010/07/lebron-james.jpg

[TylerOO]

Nope. Heat still needed to win 16 games to win it all, just like every other champ.

/thread

[BankShot]

Why would/should/could there be an asterisk?

[scm5]

No. They won fair and square. The season was long enough so that it didn't matter. Do you really need the 20 or so extra games?

I did have a discussion with my friend about this before though. He said he thinks part of the reason Lebron was able to do so well in the Finals might be because he wasn't worn out by a longer season.

[wakencdukest]

Why an asterisk? The Heat had the same short season as every one else. What advantage did they have? BTW, not a Kobe fan, just a Laker fan.

[All Net]

Kobe fan or fanatic? There's a different.

Only idiots think there should be.

[IGOTGAME]

Kobe fan or fanatic? There's a different.

Only idiots think there should be.

this. everyone played under the same rules. they won fair, end of discussion.

[ripthekik]

Why an asterisk? The Heat had the same short season as every one else. What advantage did they have? BTW, not a Kobe fan, just a Laker fan.

it's not the fact that they had the same shortened season as every other team. It's not the fact that they still had to win 16 games in the playoffs.

It's the fact that the season was 66 games starting in January. What other NBA seasons have games that are not 82? Yeah.. just a few since the merger. Since 66 is different from 82 games in the other 30+ years, it's different, therefore *

basically, just because it was DIFFERENT from the USUAL NBA REGULAR SEASON.

people are thinking the asterisk is to differentiate from the other teams in the 2012 season, no. There is no need to differentiate the heat.
What we need to differentiate is the 2012 season from the other regular seasons. Not that there is any negative connotation, but just to signify that there is a difference, and there is, by fact.




note- I'm not a kobe fan btw. I just believe in the asterisk.

[CavaliersFTW]

this. everyone played under the same rules. they won fair, end of discussion.
I'm looking for Kobe / Lebron fan opinions, (not necessarily Laker / Heat, nor impartial league fans) if the most extreme supporters of Kobe's fanbase don't asterisk the season than I guess there is no debate - I just figured there would be some and this would be their opportunity to fairly make their case - no low blows - just debate

[DuMa]

extreme kobe fans have no merit in any discussion

[Levity]

No. Unless you asterisked the 99 lockout season, there's no reason to asterisk this one.

[Ne 1]

No. Unless you asterisked the 99 lockout season, there's no reason to asterisk this one.

In any record book you look at or NBA.com, for that year, is there any official asterisk next to the Spurs' name? If so then it will be the same thing for the '12 Heat.

[CavaliersFTW]

extreme kobe fans have no merit in any discussion
Do extreme Lebron fans?

[pauk]

Why are you looking for specifically Kobe fans responses? What does he or his fans have to do with this? You will be only looking for butthurt opinions with the risk of turning this into yet another Lebron vs Kobe flamewar...

Why is this even a question anyways unless you yourself consider it is an asterisk? Why? Everybody had to go through what Miami went through, a grueling schedule, injuries and competition... Miami came out on top and would have won no matter what scenario you would create, they (and specifically Lebron) was not gona be denied...

[Levity]

In any record book you look at or NBA.com, for that year, is there any official asterisk next to the Spurs' name? If so then it will be the same thing for the '12 Heat.

what the fucck did you just ask me?

[CavaliersFTW]

Why are you looking for specifically Kobe fans responses? What does he or his fans have to do with this? You will be only looking for butthurt opinions with the risk of turning this into yet another Lebron vs Kobe flamewar...

Why is this even a question anyways unless you yourself consider it is an asterisk? Why? Everybody had to go through what Miami went through, a grueling schedule, injuries and competition... Miami came out on top and would have won no matter what scenario you would create, they (and specifically Lebron) was not gona be denied...
I'm impartial, I don't think about an asterisk - and I'm also interested in Lebron fan opinion here not just Kobe fan. You called me out on the flamewar thing though.

Since this thread clearly has failed I'll come clean - basically - a flame war is what I was looking for - my plan was to keep u guys in here contained and distracted for long enough so that other ISH posters can go about their business in other threads and enjoy this coming weekend while all the LeKobe stans were busy fighting in this one but all the true Lakers / Heat / impartial fans flooded this thread and ruined it with wisdom before the Kobe fans and Lebron fans even had a chance to spark a fight.

Shame on you ISH, you should have left this trap alone. :mad:

[pauk]

I'm impartial, I don't think about an asterisk - and I'm also interested in Lebron fan opinion here not just Kobe fan. You called me out on the flamewar thing though, basically - a flame war is what I'm looking for - my plan was to keep u guys in here contained and distracted so that other ISH posters can go about their business in other threads while your all fighting in this one but all the Lakers / Heat / impartial fans flooded this thread and ruined it with wisdom before the Kobe fans and Lebron fans had a chance to spark a fight.

Shame on you ISH, you should have left this trap alone. :mad:

I see... :)

[Whoah10115]

Why would OP want to start one of these, when these things are exactly what suck so much?



Seriously, this should be closed?

[CavaliersFTW]

Why would OP want to start one of these, when these things are exactly what suck so much?



Seriously, this should be closed?
To keep them contained here and out of other threads - seemed like a good idea to me

[keepinitreal]

Hmmm. The amount of games played during the regular season has changed over the years... it was less back in the 60s and 70s, and I'm guessing it will change again in the future.

I wouldn't give it an asterisk because all of the teams and stars had their shot at it this year and the playoff format was legit. Game 2 vs Boston Celtics had some missed calls that favored Miami, but I don't think that it was enough to say it was fixed.

[Whoah10115]

To keep them contained here and out of other threads - seemed like a good idea to me



You think that will happen?

[red1]

it's not the fact that they had the same shortened season as every other team. It's not the fact that they still had to win 16 games in the playoffs.

It's the fact that the season was 66 games starting in January. What other NBA seasons have games that are not 82? Yeah.. just a few since the merger. Since 66 is different from 82 games in the other 30+ years, it's different, therefore *

basically, just because it was DIFFERENT from the USUAL NBA REGULAR SEASON.

note- I'm not a kobe fan btw. I just believe in the asterisk.
Phong you have literally exhausted every avenue you could use to discredit the heat winning this year. You complained about the lockout season, you complained about the refereeing, you complained about the players colluding to stack the team, and I am sure I am missing a shitload of your other complaints.

Even though your post about the asterisk season seems reasonable there is no way I can take it at face value because you have never posted anything on these forums that didn't support your agenda of kobe>lebron. Why do you think there should be a asterisk on this season? Do you think the champion heat had an unfair advantage this season that other champions didn't? Is 20 less regular season games really worthy of an asterisk?

Ultimately it all comes back to your lebron obsession/hatred. Remember how excited you got after the 2011 finals? Remember all the bullshit you were spouting all summer long? "Lebron will never win a championship, Lebron is a mentally weak quitter." This is what you were posting almost verbatim. After all of that blew up in your face this is the final thing you can cling to. Don't play dumb phong, you know what an asterisk means in sports. An asterisk is how you discredit something and this is the final option to maintain the anti-lebron and anti-heat delusions you have.

Let it go bro. Heat won, Lebron won, and none of that shit reflects poorly on kobe, and I don't know what it is on earth that makes you think so. Just let it go. This venomous hatred is probably not good for your health and it most definitely is not a good use of your energy. Just let it go.

[crisoner]

No....

The Heat had to face the same challenges that every other team had.
If it was a full season with full training camps I would argue the outcome could of been different because players would of have been in shape etc. And those three games in a row schedules killed a lot of players as well.
But to put a * on the Heat's title would just be some dumb hater sh*t.
They earned it the title straight up. It was just a different kind of year on when they won it.

[CavaliersFTW]

You think that will happen?
Well now we'll never know, everybody who wasn't a Lebron / Kobe fan came in here with logic and reasoning and ruined the opportunity :(

[hawke812]

No need for an asterisk. Every team had the same short season, and same amount of chances (games) in the playoffs.

[guy]

it's not the fact that they had the same shortened season as every other team. It's not the fact that they still had to win 16 games in the playoffs.

It's the fact that the season was 66 games starting in January. What other NBA seasons have games that are not 82? Yeah.. just a few since the merger. Since 66 is different from 82 games in the other 30+ years, it's different, therefore *

basically, just because it was DIFFERENT from the USUAL NBA REGULAR SEASON.

people are thinking the asterisk is to differentiate from the other teams in the 2012 season, no. There is no need to differentiate the heat.
What we need to differentiate is the 2012 season from the other regular seasons. Not that there is any negative connotation, but just to signify that there is a difference, and there is, by fact.




note- I'm not a kobe fan btw. I just believe in the asterisk.

The majority of NBA seasons have not been 82 games + 4 playoff rounds with all of them being best of 7. There's been plenty of seasons that were less then 82 games, less then 4 rounds, and/or with series that were best of 5 or best of 3. Should we asterisk the majority of seasons?

If you're not trying to apply some negative connotation to it, there's absolutely no reason to asterisk it.

[kNicKz]

Do extreme Lebron fans?

:roll: :roll: :roll:

[Mr. Jabbar]

it was a shortened season for every team so thats void. I do hate the way refs were favoring them though, pretty nasty. Game 1 against knicks is the most blatant rig i've seen since the 2002 lal/sac series.

[kNicKz]

Game 1 against knicks is the most blatant rig i've seen since the 2002 lal/sac series.

I know heat fans that said the refs favored them, I feel like the reason lebron fans are aggressively boastful about him is because they know deep deep down that it was getting harder and harder for the NBA to market a guy that kept getting beasted by ancient squads like the mavs and celtics so stern went in (just a theory). He is the best player in the world, but the combinations of skills of those teams were clearly superior to bosh/lebron/wade

[che guevara]

it was a shortened season for every team so thats void. I do hate the way refs were favoring them though, pretty nasty. Game 1 against knicks is the most blatant rig i've seen since the 2002 lal/sac series.
:oldlol: Wait, you actually think the refs rigged a 33 point blowout? Are you that ****ing stupid?

[pegasus]

:oldlol: Wait, you actually think the refs rigged a 33 point blowout? Are you that ****ing stupid?

You could have just said that you didn't watch the game.

[RRR3]

You could have just said that you didn't watch the game.
East side, West side, North side, South /peg's breath is so bad, his butt

[Pursuer]

Not an argument for an asterisk, but just throwing this out there.

There hadn't been a playoffs yet, where teams had to play back-to-back games.

[Miller for 3]

Yes they should. Every team besides the Heat was crippled with injuries. do people really think the Heat win if Rose, Howard, Bradley, Granger, Foster, Horford, Lin, Shumpert, Davis, Douglas, Maynor, Noah, Allen, Deng, etc. don't get hurt? About 85% of the players in the playoffs were hurt, injured, or too tired from a lockout season. The Bobcats at full health would have steamrolled through the playoffs. If the WCF wasn't rigged the Spurs sweep the Heat. There were too many injuries and fixed games for this past season to count. I give it one big

*

[LongLiveTheKing]

Yes they should. Every team besides the Heat was crippled with injuries. do people really think the Heat win if Rose, Howard, Bradley, Granger, Foster, Horford, Lin, Shumpert, Davis, Douglas, Maynor, Noah, Allen, Deng, etc. don't get hurt? About 85% of the players in the playoffs were hurt, injured, or too tired from a lockout season. The Bobcats at full health would have steamrolled through the playoffs. If the WCF wasn't rigged the Spurs sweep the Heat. There were too many injuries and fixed games for this past season to count. I give it one big

*
So Chris Bosh just missed 9 games cause he wasn't injured, and Dwyane Wade got knee surgery for fun?

[PJR]

So Chris Bosh just missed 9 games cause he wasn't injured, and Dwyane Wade got knee surgery for fun?


Quoted for emphasis.

[Miller for 3]

So Chris Bosh just missed 9 games cause he wasn't injured, and Dwyane Wade got knee surgery for fun?

Remember, there was a mysterious death at Bosh's house during the playoffs, and shortly after Bosh just happens to miss some games. Funny how there was never a real investigation or anything...... Wade getting his annual surgery isn't a big deal. If you really expected Wade not to get hurt you haven't been an NBA fan for long

[daily]

Hmmm. The amount of games played during the regular season has changed over the years... it was less back in the 60s and 70s, and I'm guessing it will change again in the future.

They've played the same number of regular season games since the early 60's

[kennethgriffin]

should be asterisked?


it has been

it is

there is no opinion towards the matter.


do people even know what an asterisk is? it is a seperate column dedicated to pointing out a change or difference in something.


the nba keeps its records for lockout years with an asterisk in their official books. it says it on every single information website that those seasons were less to that of a real one ( i.e. less games, shortened )


there already is an asterisk.

change the thread title to "do you think there shouldn't be an asterisk. then it would make sense"

[Deuce Bigalow]

"Lebron, you can charge into people and get a blocking foul call from me everytime, alright? I also won't call you for hacking people's arms when they shoot."

http://www.trbimg.com/img-4fa32503/turbine/sfl-photos-heat-knicks-game-3-014/600

[funnystuff]

should be asterisked?


it has been

it is

there is no opinion towards the matter.


do people even know what an asterisk is? it is a seperate column dedicated to pointing out a change or difference in something.


the nba keeps its records for lockout years with an asterisk in their official books. it says it on every single information website that those seasons were less to that of a real one ( i.e. less games, shortened )


there already is an asterisk.

change the thread title to "do you think there shouldn't be an asterisk. then it would make sense"
Thought you'd be on page 1 honestly.

[upside24]

Not an asterisk that is used to indicate LeBron didn't leave it all on the court every night to earn that title. An asterisk to denote a shortened season maybe.

[Nash]

Notice how the biggest trolls and Lebron haters on this forum, kennethgriffin, ripthekik and miller for 3 are the only ones sharing the same retarded opinion.

[Psileas]

Why would a LeBron fan want to give the title an asterisk?
Knowing how the Heat, or, better, LeBron's team, were among the favorites to win it all, I doubt there were many even in the beginning of the season who would claim anything like this.

Maybe it would be better to say "Kobe fans and/or LeBron haters".

[InfiniteBaskets]

it's not the fact that they had the same shortened season as every other team. It's not the fact that they still had to win 16 games in the playoffs.

It's the fact that the season was 66 games starting in January. What other NBA seasons have games that are not 82? Yeah.. just a few since the merger. Since 66 is different from 82 games in the other 30+ years, it's different, therefore *

basically, just because it was DIFFERENT from the USUAL NBA REGULAR SEASON.

people are thinking the asterisk is to differentiate from the other teams in the 2012 season, no. There is no need to differentiate the heat.
What we need to differentiate is the 2012 season from the other regular seasons. Not that there is any negative connotation, but just to signify that there is a difference, and there is, by fact.




note- I'm not a kobe fan btw. I just believe in the asterisk.

You just put an asterisk on 23 NBA seasons. 5 of which the Lakers won a title in.

[KOBE143]

*

As long as they have LeBsterisk.. Lock out or not, every title that they will get deserve an asterisk but I doubt they're win another one so congrats for their half/cheap ring.. To all bandwagon cHeat fans, enjoy your half title until it last coz there will be no more to come.. :lol

[ripthekik]

Phong you have literally exhausted every avenue you could use to discredit the heat winning this year. You complained about the lockout season, you complained about the refereeing, you complained about the players colluding to stack the team, and I am sure I am missing a shitload of your other complaints.

Even though your post about the asterisk season seems reasonable there is no way I can take it at face value because you have never posted anything on these forums that didn't support your agenda of kobe>lebron. Why do you think there should be a asterisk on this season? Do you think the champion heat had an unfair advantage this season that other champions didn't? Is 20 less regular season games really worthy of an asterisk?

Ultimately it all comes back to your lebron obsession/hatred. Remember how excited you got after the 2011 finals? Remember all the bullshit you were spouting all summer long? "Lebron will never win a championship, Lebron is a mentally weak quitter." This is what you were posting almost verbatim. After all of that blew up in your face this is the final thing you can cling to. Don't play dumb phong, you know what an asterisk means in sports. An asterisk is how you discredit something and this is the final option to maintain the anti-lebron and anti-heat delusions you have.

Let it go bro. Heat won, Lebron won, and none of that shit reflects poorly on kobe, and I don't know what it is on earth that makes you think so. Just let it go. This venomous hatred is probably not good for your health and it most definitely is not a good use of your energy. Just let it go.
Sorry but i'm really not Phong.

And to the others, how many season are there that are NOT 82 games since 1970??

http://voices.yahoo.com/nba-champions-1947-present-7895930.html

check out this list. There has been TWO seasons since 1970 (42 years data) that have less than 82 games.

That does not deserve a denotation? 2 special seasons that are not the regular, they deserve to have the asterisk, yes.

The 1999 season and 2012 season both need asterisks, not to differentiate the team from other teams, but to differentiate the season from other seasons.

The NBA has been pretty consistent with its regular season since 1970. 42 years and only 2 seasons have been irregular. 2/42 and that's less than 5% occurrence. That is a rarity, and therefore should be denoted.

*

When something irregular happens in a long existing consistency, you denote it so that you remember there is a difference. It's a technical matter of statistics and data keeping. Keep it professional.
Again, there would be no negative connotation with this asterisk. Why are you people so sensitive? Guilty of something?:confusedshrug:

[ripthekik]

The majority of NBA seasons have not been 82 games + 4 playoff rounds with all of them being best of 7. There's been plenty of seasons that were less then 82 games, less then 4 rounds, and/or with series that were best of 5 or best of 3. Should we asterisk the majority of seasons?

If you're not trying to apply some negative connotation to it, there's absolutely no reason to asterisk it.

No need for an asterisk. Every team had the same short season, and same amount of chances (games) in the playoffs.

Some people seem to think that because the champions played the same amount of games in the playoffs (16) as other seasons, this championship is regular.

Well guess what, WRONG. Do we throw out the regular season then? Are champions simply based on 16 games - if so we might as well just start with playoffs every April without the regular season. What is the regular season for? FOR PLACING of the playoffs. THEY AFFECT the playoffs, home court advantage, seedings, injuries, all of that. You can't deny that the regular season plays of big part of a championship.

So back to my post above about the regular reason being different. Is it true? Yes. The season was different. The placings and HCA for this playoffs had to be decided in 66 games between Jan and April. This is definitely something we need to remember and take note of. It's not something you sweep under the rug.

Again, for STATISTICAL reasons, for data keeping, we must put an asterisk for the 2012 season, just like the 1999 season, because they are different from the other 40 seasons since 1970.

[plowking]

I'm impartial, I don't think about an asterisk - and I'm also interested in Lebron fan opinion here not just Kobe fan. You called me out on the flamewar thing though.

Since this thread clearly has failed I'll come clean - basically - a flame war is what I was looking for - my plan was to keep u guys in here contained and distracted for long enough so that other ISH posters can go about their business in other threads and enjoy this coming weekend while all the LeKobe stans were busy fighting in this one but all the true Lakers / Heat / impartial fans flooded this thread and ruined it with wisdom before the Kobe fans and Lebron fans even had a chance to spark a fight.

Shame on you ISH, you should have left this trap alone. :mad:


I doubt that. You've asked this question before on here. Seems like you're still really sour about some things and mad about the fact Lebron is a champion.

[monkeypox]

I say yes, but it shouldn't be seen as a negative vs everyone else that year. It should only be there to make the distinction vs other seasons. It's like when the moved the 3pt line closer for those few years. If there was a 3pt record, it should have an asterisk. That player still did it against his peers who all used the same 3pt line, but it should be held separate from the other years where the line was farther.

[ripthekik]

I say yes, but it shouldn't be seen as a negative vs everyone else that year. It should only be there to make the distinction vs other seasons. It's like when the moved the 3pt line closer for those few years. If there was a 3pt record, it should have an asterisk. That player still did it against his peers who all used the same 3pt line, but it should be held separate from the other years where the line was farther.
Exactly. I don't know why people are so sensitive about it.

[Nero Tulip]

Asterisked? No. But I hope people will keep in mind how weak the East was in this era. The heat are basically in the finals every year by default, all they have to do is win one series to win it all.

[Baby Arm Johnso]

asterisks are for sore losers! every team faced the same condensed season

[ImmortalD24]

It's legit.. I'm not even sure why this needs to be said - it's that obvious.

[ripthekik]

asterisks are for sore losers! every team faced the same condensed season
AGAIN, very misinformed.
Asterisks are not to differentiate HEAT from other teams. It's to differentiate 2012 SEASON from the other 40 seasons.

It would be asterisked regardless of who the Champ was, because the 2012 Champ only played 66 games in the regular season, while the other 40 champions played 82.

[RRR3]

Rip is mad. Can't wait to hear his excuse next time Lebron wins.

[red1]

Sorry but i'm really not Phong.

Who do you think you're fooling? You popped up on these forums and started posting under this username with the exact same agenda and posting style the moment that phong had to banish himself in shame after the nba finals. If it walks like a phong, talks like a phong, me thinks it is a phong indeed.

[ripthekik]

Who do you think you're fooling? You popped up on these forums and started posting under this username with the exact same agenda and posting style the moment that phong had to banish himself in shame after the nba finals. If it walks like a phong, talks like a phong, me thinks it is a phong indeed.
Why wouldn't I just continue to post as Phong then? What's the point of lying? :facepalm. Look at my date of register. I just haven't been very active for the past few years that's all.

I see no point in acting as another poster or hiding my identity. I am not Phong, but if this poster posts like I do, I'd like to see him post more. And if you want to continue to think I'm Phong, then go ahead. I don't really care.

Anyhow, back to the topic.
I guess it's pretty clear to everyone now why NBA Season 2012 needs to be asterisked. Those who get pissed at the thought of an asterisk needs to ask themselves: Why? Ashamed of something? Who said the asterisk had a negative connotation? :confusedshrug:

[funnystuff]

They should ONLY put the * on the REGULAR SEASON for 2011 - 2012 apart from the playoffs. Because the playoffs were not changed at all, the regular season was. So no, Lebrons championship shouldnt have an *, only the regular season from that season should.

[ripthekik]

They should ONLY put the * on the REGULAR SEASON for 2011 - 2012 apart from the playoffs. Because the playoffs were not changed at all, the regular season was. So no, Lebrons championship shouldnt have an *, only the regular season from that season should.
Like I said above, the playoffs were AFFECTED by the irregular season.
2012 Season was played from Jan to April in 66 games (VERY rushed).
This played into the placing, homecourt advantage, and injuries. The regular season shaped the playoffs, so you can't really pull them apart.

The asterisk should stay with whatever is related with the 2012 season, including the NBA 2012 Champions - because they played 66 games in the regular season, and played in a playoffs that was determined by 66 games.

Also, didn't someone on the previous page said this is the first time back to back has happened in the playoffs? So the shortened season and schedule did affect into the scheduling of the playoffs as well.

[Baby Arm Johnso]

Like I said above, the playoffs were AFFECTED by the irregular season.
2012 Season was played from Jan to April in 66 games (VERY rushed).
This played into the placing, homecourt advantage, and injuries. The regular season shaped the playoffs, so you can't really pull them apart.

The asterisk should stay with whatever is related with the 2012 season, including the NBA 2012 Champions - because they played 66 games in the regular season, and played in a playoffs that was determined by 66 games.

Also, didn't someone on the previous page said this is the first time back to back has happened in the playoffs? So the shortened season and schedule did affect into the scheduling of the playoffs as well.

The reason I will still disagree is that every single team faced the same circumstances. Should Miami get an asterisk because OKC played really poorly in the finals?

[Ruutu]

So it was not a real NBA season ? WTF ? So it didnt matter ? If Lakers had won then Kobe wouldnt had 6 rings then ? Only 5 n half ?

This is stupid! Everybody had same amount of games. The season was even harder cos they had back to back to back games and teams which had bigger bench could avoid injuries better!

[Jax]

It SHOULD read like this:
*First NBA championship won by the GOAT.

[ripthekik]

The reason I will still disagree is that every single team faced the same circumstances. Should Miami get an asterisk because OKC played really poorly in the finals?
No, Miami shouldn't. They shouldn't get it because they are Miami. OKC also has nothing to do with it. It has NOTHING to do with the team, it only has to do with the SEASON.

Every single team faced the same circumstances THIS season. But they face DIFFERENT circumstances from the 40 other seasons since 1970. Hence the asterisk.


So it was not a real NBA season ? WTF ? So it didnt matter ? If Lakers had won then Kobe wouldnt had 6 rings then ? Only 5 n half ?

This is stupid! Everybody had same amount of games. The season was even harder cos they had back to back to back games and teams which had bigger bench could avoid injuries better!
It is a real NBA season, and Heat will get their rings. The asterisk is just to denote the difference and irregularity that the 2012 season had.

True, everyone had the same amount of games in 2012. But the 2012 teams didn't have the same amount of games as the other 40 seasons, get it? Let me make it clearer:


1970: 82 games
1971: 82 games
......
......
......
2001: 82 games
2002: 82 games
2003: 82 games
2004: 82 games
2005: 82 games
2006: 82 games
2007: 82 games
2008: 82 games
2009: 82 games
2010: 82 games
2011: 82 games
2012*: 66 games


Is there anything wrong with this? Most of the time we will only list that season's champions, and forgot that it was played in 66 games. Hence the asterisk is to remind us of the difference.

[longtime lurker]

Imagine if Lebron only wins 1 championship. :roll: :roll: good lord just think how much more emphasis would be placed on this championship being an asterisk.

[Freedom Kid7]

I don't see why it should be in my opinion. Yeah maybe there were a couple of sketchy calls and some injuries, but really, stuff like that happens a lot. And there wasn't a big enough injury/sketchy call to change everything. I think even with the Rondo call called correctly, heat win the series. I think if even Rose was healthy, Heat win.

[red1]

No, Miami shouldn't. They shouldn't get it because they are Miami. OKC also has nothing to do with it. It has NOTHING to do with the team, it only has to do with the SEASON.

Every single team faced the same circumstances THIS season. But they face DIFFERENT circumstances from the 40 other seasons since 1970. Hence the asterisk.


It is a real NBA season, and Heat will get their rings. The asterisk is just to denote the difference and irregularity that the 2012 season had.

True, everyone had the same amount of games in 2012. But the 2012 teams didn't have the same amount of games as the other 40 seasons, get it? Let me make it clearer:


1970: 82 games
1971: 82 games
......
......
......
2001: 82 games
2002: 82 games
2003: 82 games
2004: 82 games
2005: 82 games
2006: 82 games
2007: 82 games
2008: 82 games
2009: 82 games
2010: 82 games
2011: 82 games
2012*: 66 games


Is there anything wrong with this? Most of the time we will only list that season's champions, and forgot that it was played in 66 games. Hence the asterisk is to remind us of the difference.
You're right, this year's regular season was different from other seasons. Since this year was 20 games shorter how about we put an asterisk on the regular season.

Regular Season
2002: 82 games
2003: 82 games
2004: 82 games
2005: 82 games
2006: 82 games
2007: 82 games
2008: 82 games
2009: 82 games
2010: 82 games
2011: 82 games
2012*: 66 games <------ asterisk

Playoffs (number of games won by the champion)
2002: 16 games
2003: 16 games
2004: 16 games
2005: 16 games
2006: 16 games
2007: 16 games
2008: 16 games
2009: 16 games
2010: 16 games
2011: 16 games
2012: 16 games <----- no asterisk

How does that look?

[Freedom Kid7]

You're right, this year's regular season was different from other seasons. Since this year was 20 games shorter how about we put an asterisk on the regular season.

Regular Season
2002: 82 games
2003: 82 games
2004: 82 games
2005: 82 games
2006: 82 games
2007: 82 games
2008: 82 games
2009: 82 games
2010: 82 games
2011: 82 games
2012*: 66 games <------ asterisk

Playoffs (number of games won by the champion)
2002: 16 games
2003: 16 games
2004: 16 games
2005: 16 games
2006: 16 games
2007: 16 games
2008: 16 games
2009: 16 games
2010: 16 games
2011: 16 games
2012: 16 games <----- no asterisk

How does that look?
2002 actually had 15 wins.

[red1]

2002 actually had 15 wins.
Hey ripthekik, should we put an asterisk here?

[ripthekik]

You're right, this year's regular season was different from other seasons. Since this year was 20 games shorter how about we put an asterisk on the regular season.

Regular Season
2002: 82 games
2003: 82 games
2004: 82 games
2005: 82 games
2006: 82 games
2007: 82 games
2008: 82 games
2009: 82 games
2010: 82 games
2011: 82 games
2012*: 66 games <------ asterisk

Playoffs (number of games won by the champion)
2002: 16 games
2003: 16 games
2004: 16 games
2005: 16 games
2006: 16 games
2007: 16 games
2008: 16 games
2009: 16 games
2010: 16 games
2011: 16 games
2012: 16 games <----- no asterisk

How does that look?
I already answered this question.
The playoffs ARE AFFECTED by the 66 games in the regular season. 2012 Playoffs were affected by the short schedule of the 66 games - which determined the placing, HCA, and injuries in the playoffs. The schedule of the playoffs were even affected, and a back to back had to be played - the first time in NBA history.

So no, these playoffs weren't like previous playoffs. Past playoffs were determined by 82 games. The 2012 playoffs were determined by 66 games in a very hectic schedule.

[ripthekik]

Hey ripthekik, should we put an asterisk here?
So you want to bring up the fact that playoffs changed in 2002 from 5 games to 7 games in the first round.

Yes, this is a very obvious change and should be noted in NBA history. However, place an asterisk? How? There has been no occurrence in rarity of data. The change has been made - and it has stayed on til today. If it was changed for 1 season, and gotten rid of one season later, then yes you can asterisk it.

But for the current situation? No. It was a change, but it has been consistent:

1998: 15
1999: 15
2000: 15
2001: 15
2002: 16
2003: 16
2005: 16
2006: 16
2007: 16
2008: 16

People should know that there was a change in playoff format. However, an asterisk is not needed- because it was a change that is consistent til today, not an rarity, a one time occurrence. What happened in 2012 only happened 1 other time in the last 40 years. That is a rarity that deserves an asterisk.

And you don't split Regular season and Playoffs. The 2012 Champions include both seasons and playoffs -which were both affected, and that is where the asterisk should be.

[LakersReign]

The fact of the matter is, whether the FAKE Heat fans, aka Lebronytes want to admit it, or not, the Heat did benefit from the shortened season. Wade's knee began to be more of an issue during the Finals. It was even reported that it was going him trouble throughout the season. If it had been a regular 82 game season, the possibility of him going down before the Finals was a reality. Regardless of how "great" Lebron is, take away Wade and the Heat maybe lose to the Pacers or the Celtics.

[Burgz V2]

all this thread does is incite a flame war between Kobe and LeBron fans

[ripthekik]

all this thread does is incite a flame war between Kobe and LeBron fans
Not really.

It has nothing to do with Kobe or Lebron.
2012 is played in 66 games, an irregularity from the other 40 seasons since 1970, so an asterisk is necessary. I don't know why people keep going to the points of saying "every team went through the same thing" or "heat was special". No, none of that. It was asterisked simply because of data keeping.

2012 NBA Champions *

[Nash]

Affected? You do know that the schedule was even tougher in this regular season? Teams basically played back to back every night and sometimes even back to back to back. If anything, the shortened regular season was more of a bad thing than a good thing for the teams.

I think all players would much rather play a regular 82 games regular season than play 66 games the way they did this season. Every player was talking about how hard and tough this regular season was.

[ripthekik]

Affected? You do know that the schedule was even tougher in this regular season? Teams basically played back to back every night and sometimes even back to back to back. If anything, the shortened regular season was more of a bad thing than a good thing for the teams.

I think all players would much rather play a regular 82 games regular season than play 66 games the way they did this season. Every player was talking about how hard and tough this regular season was.
You're right. Thanks for proving my point. The asterisk isn't meant to say the season is easier or harder, it is meant to show that there s a difference between 66 games and 82 games. And you helped me by saying it is definitely very different from the 82 games schedule, that is it very tough and is bad thing for teams.

Because of its difference, and how hard it actually is, we need to denote the difference, hence the asterisk.

[Nash]

You're right. Thanks for proving my point. The asterisk isn't meant to say the season is easier or harder, it is meant to show that there s a difference between 66 games and 82 games. And you helped me by saying it is definitely very different from the 82 games schedule, that is it very tough and is bad thing for teams.

Because of its difference, and how hard it actually is, we need to denote the difference, hence the asterisk.
So according to you, does the asterisk make this championship less worth?

[DaSeba5]

:facepalm :facepalm :facepalm :facepalm :facepalm

[Baby Arm Johnso]

didn't San Antonio when a shortened season championship the last lockout?

[funnystuff]

I already answered this question.
The playoffs ARE AFFECTED by the 66 games in the regular season. 2012 Playoffs were affected by the short schedule of the 66 games - which determined the placing, HCA, and injuries in the playoffs. The schedule of the playoffs were even affected, and a back to back had to be played - the first time in NBA history.

So no, these playoffs weren't like previous playoffs. Past playoffs were determined by 82 games. The 2012 playoffs were determined by 66 games in a very hectic schedule.
You act like the players didn't know it was a 66 game season, you act like it was just the luck of the draw if they obtained good playoff spots. Wrong, they all knew what these seasons held for each and EVERY team, they planned for it. In fact I feel the asterick makes the ring even MORE valuable because they had to endure the back to back games and the exhaustion that hit EVERY team hard that season. And the fact that the Heat took the same injury blow (that other teams faced) to 2 of their top 3 players and still came out with the ring against a healthy Thunder just takes the cake.

[ripthekik]

So according to you, does the asterisk make this championship less worth?
No, the asterisk only has to do with the difference in the season. Whether this season is harder or easier, that's another discussion.


You act like the players didn't know it was a 66 game season, you act like it was just the luck of the draw if they obtained good playoff spots. Wrong, they all knew what these seasons held for each and EVERY team, they planned for it. In fact I feel the asterick makes the ring even MORE valuable because they had to endure the back to back games and the exhaustion that hit EVERY team hard that season. And the fact that the Heat took the same injury blow (that other teams faced) to 2 of their top 3 players and still came out with the ring against a healthy Thunder just takes the cake.
BOLDED part: so You finally agree with the asterisk.

But you still don't understand. The asterisk doesn't make the ring more or less valuable. It (asterisk) has no value. It is simply a data keeping device, to differentiate 2012 and 1999 from the other 40 seasons that have regular 82 games. No matter what happened this year, or who wins it, the fact that it was played in 66 games in a tight schedule means it's supposed to have an asterisk, so we know it's different.

Asterisk doesn't mean it's easier or harder, just means it's a difference. Most of you agree that it has an big impact, and it's a factual difference of 66 games. Therefore asterisk.