#65 NBA Player Of All-Time According to InsideHoops [Archive] - Message Board Basketball Forum

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Deuce Bigalow

10-13-2012, 02:29 AM

Pau Gasol was voted the #64 NBA Player Of All-Time According to InsideHoops.

18.7 PPG | 9.2 RPG | 3.2 APG

2

SourPatchKids

10-13-2012, 02:31 AM

http://www.cowbellkingdom.com/wp-content/uploads/2011/06/champion1.jpg

I spy dirk

Eric Cartman

10-13-2012, 02:43 AM

Dennis Johnson

KG215

10-13-2012, 02:54 AM

Making that video game cover finally was enough to put Gasol over the top. Good for him and good work MiamiThrice.

coin24

10-13-2012, 03:15 AM

Pau:bowdown: Beast:applause:

Lets get TMac in next:applause:

DirtySanchez

10-13-2012, 03:25 AM

I'll go with T-Mac now.....but I just can't help thinking what if with him.

Fudge

10-13-2012, 03:34 AM

Tracy McGrady

StateOfMind12

10-13-2012, 04:18 AM

I'm torn between Penny, Hill, and Tmac.

I think I'll go with Tmac just because he had the best peak. I liked his game in Orlando but I did hate it in Houston.

WillC

10-13-2012, 04:20 AM

blacknapalm

10-13-2012, 04:27 AM

Welcome to ISH, where Pau Gasol is better than Dave DeBusschere, Dennis Johnson, Bill Sharman, Earl Monroe, Robert Parish, Dave Bing, Alex English, Lenny Wilkens, Artis Gilmore, Bernard King, Bob Lanier, Dan Issel, Chris Mullin and other legends.

Pau Gasol shouldn't even be ahead of other recent All-Star power forwards such as Chris Webber (I'd take Webber over Gasol in a heart beat). I'd take Shawn Kemp over Gasol too.

esp. monroe, king, lanier, mullin imo. crazy that webber is ahead of him to me too...5x he was voted top 10 in MVPs. gasol's never finished in the top 10. don't get me wrong, i think gasol is one of the greatest second options ever but he's just not long-term, clear #1 option material.

give webber a prime kobe or shaq and i can just about guarantee he'd be a champion and looked upon much differently. webber was just never really in the posiiton aside from a couple seasons if everything fell into place. dude led the league in rebounding one year too while putting up 20 ppg. even with the injuries that really dropped his career stats, he finished as a near 21 ppg scorer and one of the best passing big men ever.

so there you go...i vote c-webb

MiamiThrice

10-13-2012, 04:32 AM

http://oi50.tinypic.com/8k9l.jpg

MiamiThrice

10-13-2012, 04:33 AM

WillC

10-13-2012, 04:34 AM

By the way, this is why many people hate Lakers fans; a bunch of fanboys who know nothing about the sport. So blinkered and biased, it's unreal.

WillC

10-13-2012, 04:36 AM

Get back to me when any of those needledicks are the best players on a NBA finals champion like Gasol was in 2010.

Dennis Johnson says 'hi'.

Legends66NBA7

10-13-2012, 04:36 AM

Welcome to ISH, where Pau Gasol is better than Dave DeBusschere, Dennis Johnson, Bill Sharman, Earl Monroe, Robert Parish, Dave Bing, Alex English, Lenny Wilkens, Artis Gilmore, Bernard King, Bob Lanier, Dan Issel, Chris Mullin and other legends.

Pau Gasol shouldn't even be ahead of other recent All-Star power forwards such as Chris Webber (I'd take Webber over Gasol in a heart beat). I'd take Shawn Kemp over Gasol too.

esp. monroe, king, lanier, mullin imo. crazy that webber is ahead of him to me too...5x he was voted top 10 in MVPs. gasol's never finished in the top 10. don't get me wrong, i think gasol is one of the greatest second options ever but he's just not long-term, clear #1 option material.

give webber a prime kobe or shaq and i can just about guarantee he'd be a champion and looked upon much differently. dude led the league in rebounding one year too while putting up 20 ppg. even with the injuries that really dropped his career stats, he finished as a near 21 ppg scorer and one of the best passing big men ever.

so there you go...i vote c-webb

Ben Wallace too. Maybe Dikembe.

By the way, this is why many people hate Lakers fans; a bunch of fanboys who know nothing about the sport. So blinkered and biased, it's unreal.

Except, one of the main guys voting for Gasol for like 10-15 straight times... isn't a Lakers fan.

Dennis Johnson says 'hi'.

Aside from him, I think Joe Fulks and Ben Wallace are the only ones left.

MiamiThrice

10-13-2012, 04:37 AM

Dennis Johnson says 'hi'.

Who?

WillC

10-13-2012, 04:38 AM

Who?

Don't worry, I wouldn't expect a Lakers fanboy to have heard of him.

You know absolutely nothing about the history of the game and shouldn't be allowed to vote in a poll like this. Not knowing who Dennis Johnson is proves my point.

Gasol getting in at number 64 is a complete joke and has ruined these rankings.

MiamiThrice

10-13-2012, 04:41 AM

Don't worry, I wouldn't expect a Lakers fanboy to have heard of him.

You know absolutely nothing about the history of the game and shouldn't be allowed to vote in a poll like this. Not knowing who Dennis Johnson is proves my point.

Gasol getting in at number 64 is a complete joke and has ruined these rankings.

Sorry I'm not some 40+ year old that spends all his time online or some ****er that sits there and jerks off to basketball-reference all day.

You don't even list out his credentials when bringing him up. Gasol is a NBA champion best player, yearly cover boy for NBA Live in Espana, and an international ambassador for the game. He is the Michael Jordan of his home country.

Never even heard of "Dennis Johnson". Guy probably isn't even alive anymore.

blacknapalm

10-13-2012, 04:45 AM

WillC

10-13-2012, 04:48 AM

Sorry I'm not some 40+ year old that spends all his time online or some ****er that sits there and jerks off to basketball-reference all day.

You don't even list out his credentials when bringing him up. Gasol is a NBA champion best player, yearly cover boy for NBA Live in Espana, and an international ambassador for the game. He is the Michael Jordan of his home country.

Never even heard of "Dennis Johnson". Guy probably isn't even alive anymore.

You're a lost cause.

Chris Webber was better than Pau Gasol at every single aspect of basketball.

Dennis Johnson was a better two way player than Pau 'Soft' Gasol and didn't need a superstar like Kobe Bryant by his side to win an NBA championship.

WillC

10-13-2012, 04:48 AM

this is why you're a troll and no one likes you

Yeah. He's a classy guy with comments like that. I chose to ignore it.

MiamiThrice

10-13-2012, 04:59 AM

Alonzo Mourning
http://ionenewsone.files.wordpress.com/2009/06/zo_saf1507-11.jpg
-7 Time NBA All-star
-NBA ****ing Champion on the 2006 Miami Heat
-2x DPOY
-550+ Bench Press
-Inspiration to kidney donors everywhere
-All NBA First Team in 99
-All NBA 2nd Team in 00
-Best defensive anchor in the best era for centers in the NBA History
-Has a high school named after him in Miami
-21.1 PPG 10.1 RPG 3.1 BPG career numbers prior to his kidney surgery

1987_Lakers

10-13-2012, 05:00 AM

Dennis Johnson

1987_Lakers

10-13-2012, 05:12 AM

Still don't know who Dennis Johnson is. Can't be too good if you cant even brag about any of his accomplishments.

'79 Finals MVP
9x All-Defensive Team
2x All-NBA Team
3x NBA Champion
5x All-Star

Dude had the mentality of Kobe on the court, dangerous player during crunch time, never backed down from anyone, & never lacked confidence.

WillC

10-13-2012, 05:13 AM

The only things Chris Webber is better than Pau Gasol at are microfracture surgery and sucking ****.

While Chris Webber is calling timeouts he doesn't have and cementing himself as one of the biggest chokers in sports, Gasol is winning champioinships in Spain and Los Angeles. Chris Webber couldn't win with a lineup in Sacramento that had a borderline all-star at every single position. There are no excuses for Webber coming up short, other than his own incompetency.

Gasol was dominating postseason play and owning the paint in a way Webber could only dream of. Don't even try to compare that smelly baboon to Pau.

Still don't know who Dennis Johnson is. Can't be too good if you cant even brag about any of his accomplishments. If casual fans dont even know him he's definitely not on the level of a guy like Gasol that was the main factor for his teams championship in a tough era.

In the same way that ingrates like you don't know who Dennis Johnson is, new fans in the future won't give a shit who Gasol was.

Webber was a better scorer, better rebounder, better passer and better defender than Gasol.

Webber's (and Sacramento's) peak coincided with the Lakers powerhouse team of the early 2000s. The West was stacked with the Lakers, Kings, Spurs and Blazers. As a Lakers fanboy, you should really know that.

As for Dennis Johnson, he won the Finals MVP award (how many of those has Gasol got?) with the Sonics and then went on to win 2 more championships with the Celtics.

Larry Bird once said "The best player I ever played with was Dennis Johnson".

But, hey, why should you care? After all, like you said, he probably isn't even alive any more :facepalm

MiamiThrice

10-13-2012, 05:26 AM

'79 Finals MVP
9x All-Defensive Team
2x All-NBA Team
3x NBA Champion
5x All-Star

Dude had the mentality of Kobe on the court, dangerous player during crunch time, never backed down from anyone, & never lacked confidence.

One of his titles was in the 70s which counts as like one-fifth of a championship won in any other era. The 70s were ****ing awful. Then the other ones looked like he was relegated to being a 4th option. Yeah on a real team in the 80s this guy is a 4th option if you want your team to be good. Doesn't sound like an alltime top 65 player to me. Give me Gasol.

In the same way that ingrates like you don't know who Dennis Johnson is, new fans in the future won't give a shit who Gasol was.

Webber was a better scorer, better rebounder, better passer and better defender than Gasol.

Webber's (and Sacramento's) peak coincided with the Lakers powerhouse team of the early 2000s. The West was stacked with the Lakers, Kings, Spurs and Blazers. As a Lakers fanboy, you should really know that.

As for Dennis Johnson, he won the Finals MVP award (how many of those has Gasol got?) with the Sonics and then went on to win 2 more championships with the Celtics.

Larry Bird once said "The best player I ever played with was Dennis Johnson".

But, hey, why should you care? After all, like you said, he probably isn't even alive any more :facepalm

-Wrong, Gasol will be known as one of the great pioneers along with Dirk, and Ginobili to really bring in the wave of international talent to the NBA. Once these guys picked it up things REALLY intensified. This guy changed the game globally.

-Webber the better scorer? Maybe if you want ***** jump shots, but I like having my 7 footer(Oh wait Webber isn't even 7 feet LOL) playing down low. Gasol has post moves Webber couldn't perform in his dreams.

Better rebounder?
Playoffs RPG Gasol: 9.6
Playoffs RPG Webber: 8.7

I don't think so chief.

-Both are excelent passers

-Chris Webber was just not good enough to lead a team to a title the same way Gasol did. Gasol dominated the paint against top20 player all-time KG and prime Dwight Howard to win his championships. All Webber did was bend over for the superior Western conference bigman(Shaq,Duncan,Dirk). If your not good enough to break through that barrier your not good enough to have your place in history.

WillC

10-13-2012, 05:36 AM

One of his titles was in the 70s which counts as like one-fifth of a championship won in any other era. The 70s were ****ing awful. Then the other ones looked like he was relegated to being a 4th option. Yeah on a real team in the 80s this guy is a 4th option if you want your team to be good. Doesn't sound like an alltime top 65 player to me. Give me Gasol.

-Wrong, Gasol will be known as one of the great pioneers along with Dirk, and Ginobili to really bring in the wave of international talent to the NBA. Once these guys picked it up things REALLY intensified. This guy changed the game globally.

-Webber the better scorer? Maybe if you want ***** jump shots, but I like having my 7 footer(Oh wait Webber isn't even 7 feet LOL) playing down low. Gasol has post moves Webber couldn't perform in his dreams.

Better rebounder?
Playoffs RPG Gasol: 9.6
Playoffs RPG Webber: 8.7

I don't think so chief.

-Both are excelent passers

-Chris Webber was just not good enough to lead a team to a title the same way Gasol did. Gasol dominated the paint against top20 player all-time KG and prime Dwight Howard to win his championships. All Webber did was bend over for the superior Western conference bigman(Shaq,Duncan,Dirk). If your not good enough to break through that barrier your not good enough to have your place in history.

You're so delusional and blinkered :roll:

Gasol would never have got to the Finals without Kobe by his side. You conveniently fail to mention Kobe in all of your posts. Kobe was the best player on that championship team, not Gasol.

Your rebounding numbers are misleading since they include Webber's final few years in Philadelphia and Detroit. Webber was the better rebounder of the two. There's no doubt about that.

Gasol was/is a good passer, but not on Webber's level. Chris Webber is probably the best passing power forward of all-time.

It's funny that you mention how Gasol changed the game globally. If we're going down the 'changed the game' route, then we need to vote in Joe Fulks (pioneer of the jump shot, the NBA's first big gate attraction, champion, All-Star and prolific scorer) or Earl Monroe. They changed the game far more than Gasol and had just as much success (if not more) in the league.

But hey, why should you care about those guys? One is dead (murdered) and the other retired before you were born.

Let's face it, you know jack shit about basketball history.

Miller for 3

10-13-2012, 09:11 AM

Dennis Johnson says 'hi'.

:facepalm

DJ wasnt the best player on any of his title teams you casual fan. Gus Williams (the real 1979 FMVP) and Jack Sikam were better in Seattle, and Bird/McHale/Parrish/Ainge were better in Boston. Look what happened to Seattle when Gus sat out a year. And then when Gus returned they were back to being borderline title contenders. DJ gets overrated by people with freckles because he is like the freckle GOAT, but plz go if you think he was better than Williams, Nixon, KJ, Price, Billups, etc.

Owl

10-13-2012, 09:18 AM

In the same way that ingrates like you don't know who Dennis Johnson is, new fans in the future won't give a shit who Gasol was.

Webber was a better scorer, better rebounder, better passer and better defender than Gasol.

Webber's (and Sacramento's) peak coincided with the Lakers powerhouse team of the early 2000s. The West was stacked with the Lakers, Kings, Spurs and Blazers. As a Lakers fanboy, you should really know that.

As for Dennis Johnson, he won the Finals MVP award (how many of those has Gasol got?) with the Sonics and then went on to win 2 more championships with the Celtics.

Larry Bird once said "The best player I ever played with was Dennis Johnson".

But, hey, why should you care? After all, like you said, he probably isn't even alive any more :facepalm
Not that it's central to the point but MT is (I believe), as his name suggests, a Miami fan. Not sure why you're slurring an entire fanbase anyway. There are some irritating Kobe fans on here but I wouldn't consider them representative of Laker fans (and, fwiw the Kobe boys tend to utterly diminish Gasol).

As to Webber versus Gasol, I think I'd take Gasol. Certainly your assertion that Webber is clearly better in number of areas is flawed.

Gasol scores a few less ppg, but Gasol has been significantly better in all measures of shooting efficiency (fg%, ft%, ts%) and gets to the line a lot more often. Webber even acknowledging his post prime numbers drag his career totals down, has a ts% which is very poor for a (supposedly elite) big man.

Rebounding wise their career reb% is presently equal (and Webber's didn't trail off that much in his post injury years). Gasol's last few years have been above his career number so there's a fair chance it goes up before it goes down. Gasol also has the higher peak in this area. It's pretty much a tie for me.

Defense wise Webber has the advantage numerically (indeed for all-round well rounded boxscore numbers, ignoring %s turnovers etc, Webber is one of the best) but I also recall scouting reports suggesting inconsistent effort and a desire to avoid foul trouble. Gasol meanwhile suffers from euro stereotypes and occasionally having to defend the 5. At the 4 he has consistently been a good defender.

Passing wise Webber is definitely better but not by a huge margin.

Finally there are other areas to look at, for example: whilst Gasol has been a model citizen Webber has been a distraction for many teams (fueded with Nelson in GS, including complaining at having to play center then demanding a trade when friend Billy Owens was sent away for center Rony Seikaly, Marajuana usage amongst other things in D.C., perjury charges in Sacramento, throwing Peja under a bus in Sacramento). Webber also has (not that I put huge weighting into such things) a relatively large fall off in playoff performance, whilst Pau's drop off is smaller (possibly about the typical level of drop off given the raise in standards of competition in the playoffs).

Gasol now already has the longer prime and remains highly productive.

So whilst I'm reticent to agree with MT after the Dennis Johnson post (either ignorant or deliberately flaming but in horrible taste either way), I would probably lean Gasol already and he should certainly have the better career when he's done.

All that said I wouldn't have had him this high. Pau above Artis Gilmore (I've posted his stats before, so this time I'll just go with winning the ABA MVP over Julius Erving and a prime Rick Barry) feels more than a tad off.

Nash

10-13-2012, 09:28 AM

How is Chris Webber still not picked?

Kblaze8855

10-13-2012, 09:39 AM

DJ wasnt the best player on any of his title teams you casual fan. Gus Williams (the real 1979 FMVP) and Jack Sikam were better in Seattle, and Bird/McHale/Parrish/Ainge were better in Boston.

Look what happened to Seattle when Gus sat out a year. And then when Gus returned they were back to being borderline title contenders.

Ignoring for now the absurd idea that Danny Ainge was better than Dennis Johnson.....you do know that Dennis Johnson was in phoenix(where he was alll nba first team by the way) when the sonics had that bad season right?

kurple

10-13-2012, 10:19 AM

Smush Parker

RRR3

10-13-2012, 10:20 AM

How is T-Mac still not picked?
Fixed. Tracy McGrady

kNicKz

10-13-2012, 10:27 AM

Adam Morrison (start the movement)

Miller for 3

10-13-2012, 10:36 AM

Ignoring for now the absurd idea that Danny Ainge was better than Dennis Johnson.....you do know that Dennis Johnson was in phoenix(where he was alll nba first team by the way) when the sonics had that bad season right?

Yes,and they didn't miss a beat when Gus returned and DJ was being the 5the option on the Celtics. Norm Nixon > DJ. If Norm had freckles he would be in the HOF too.

Kblaze8855

10-13-2012, 10:41 AM

Blocked an attempted game winner in the 79 finals in a game he had 32/10.
Got a steal and hit the resulting FTs vs the Lakers end of game game 7 in 84
Made the game winner in game 4 in the 85 finals.
Had 22/14 in game 4 of the 84 finals and hit the FTs to seal the game

In the 87 playoffs he averaged 19/9 after 13/8 in the regular season and in the finals:

7 points and 13 assists
20/9/4
26/7/4
15 points and 14 assists
25/11
33/10/5

And his career was winding down.

In the 86 finals

19/11/8
18/7/4
20/7/4
21/4/4
13/5/4
10/5/5/3 steals(they were up by 30 in the 4th)

17/6/5 in the finals in total.

Solid 5th optioning while also being an all time great defender.

Miller for 3

10-13-2012, 10:50 AM

Solid 5th optioning while also being an all time great defender.

He just didn't impact the game as much as true greats did. I could make a similar list for Shane Battier, just highlight a few big playoff games/moments and he looks like a top 100 player. That list is actually pitiful compared to what Gus, Billups, Nixon, and KJ have done

DJ leaves the Sonics, they don't get worse (if Gus were there, as we saw the next season). He joins the Suns, they barely improve. He joins the Celtics, they barely improve. He gets overrated for being a Celtic, having freckles, and winning an undeserved FMVP.

Kblaze8855

10-13-2012, 10:52 AM

Yea...done taking this serious.

Miller for 3

10-13-2012, 10:56 AM

Yea...done taking this serious.

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/5/50/Morton_Ether_1846.jpg

iDunk

10-13-2012, 11:11 AM

Earl Monroe

nycelt84

10-13-2012, 12:37 PM

Dave Debusschere

G.O.A.T

10-13-2012, 12:37 PM

Millerfor3 has convinced me

Dennis Johnson, by a hair over Shane Battier.

JellyBean

10-13-2012, 01:00 PM

I gotta stay with my Artis Gilmore pick. Gilmore spent his first five seasons in the ABA where he absolutely destroyed the league. He averaged something like 23 points and 17 rebounds over those five seasons. During his time in the ABA, Gilmore won the MVP, All-Star MVP, and Playoff MVP. Over 14 seasons in the NBA, Gilmore averaged 17 points, 10 rebounds and 2 blocks. He also had a phenomenal shooting % of .599 which is the best in NBA history!!! Gilmore deserves better and he is my pick. And y'all picked Gasol over Gilmore? :facepalm

MasterDurant24

10-13-2012, 01:06 PM

I don't se why T-Mac should be getting this many more votes than guys like Earl Monroe, Bernard King, and Adrian Dantley. Didn't win or produce any more than those guys. I guess I could see David Thompson, because he played such a short time even though imo he was better than T-Mac and Pistol Pete.

But I see absolutely no reason for him to be over Parish and DJ. I vote for Dennis Johnson.

DirtySanchez

10-13-2012, 01:17 PM

http://oi50.tinypic.com/8k9l.jpg

LMAO!!!!

DirtySanchez

10-13-2012, 01:21 PM

How is Chris Webber still not picked?

Because he makes dumb timeouts and disappears in clutch situations. Also probably because he left GS after his rookie season claiming he was afraid of Earthquakes and didn't want to stay in Sac because the city lacked soul food restaurants....just to name a few.

DirtySanchez

10-13-2012, 01:28 PM

Webber was a great player but name one time in his entire career he stepped up??? Pau stepped up in 2010 against a great Celtics defense that punished him in 2008. Webber has NOTHING like that in his career. LeBron was reminded me if Webber in the 4th but finally stepped up last season. Webber failed just watch game 7 ot against the Lakers he wanted no part of the pressure.

L.Kizzle

10-13-2012, 01:55 PM

Lol at Gasol being voted in at #64. Travesty.

I will rank a player like Gasol by what he did mostly on his first run with his first team. Moses Malone wona title when he joined The Sixers, but he was already a 2 time MVP and NBA finalist with Houston.

He was nice in Memphis, but not even considered a top ten talent ever. He made like one All-Star team.

DJ before he joined the Celtics, was already a NBA champ and Finals MVP winner.

BoutPractice

10-13-2012, 02:01 PM

I love Gasol and think he's underrated, but... what?

Anyway. My vote goes to Dennis Johnson.

Heavincent

10-13-2012, 02:16 PM

jlip

10-13-2012, 02:18 PM

Has Bob Lanier started getting any votes?

Miller for 3

10-13-2012, 02:20 PM

Has Bob Lanier started getting any votes?

No. He doesn't have freckles or won a Finals MVP as the 3rd best player on a title team so people don't know/refuse to vote for him

haji_d_robertas

10-13-2012, 04:25 PM

Tony Parker

fsvr54

10-13-2012, 04:31 PM

Dennis Johnson

pauk

10-13-2012, 04:42 PM

Dennis Johnson.

http://philaphans.com/sixers/files/2010/12/sonicschampions.jpg

KG215

10-13-2012, 05:52 PM

Sorry I'm not some 40+ year old that spends all his time online or some ****er that sits there and jerks off to basketball-reference all day.

You don't even list out his credentials when bringing him up. Gasol is a NBA champion best player, yearly cover boy for NBA Live in Espana, and an international ambassador for the game. He is the Michael Jordan of his home country.

Never even heard of "Dennis Johnson". Guy probably isn't even alive anymore.

If anyone was doubting whether this moron was trolling or not, and thought he might actually be serious about the stuff he posts, this thread should convince you.

I'd love to know how being the "yearly cover boy for NBA Live in Espana" makes Gasol a better basketball player. And stop pushing your stupid "Gasol led the Lakers to a championship in 2010" agenda. There's impressionable posters on here that may not know any better.

Heilige

10-13-2012, 07:24 PM

Dennis Johnson

Freedom Kid7

10-13-2012, 08:08 PM

MiamiThrice, your trolling is obvious.

I'll take Dennis Johnson. Team leader for the sonics and won a chip, good guard for a long time, solid defender, etc. I'll take Parish next.

RRR3

10-13-2012, 08:14 PM

T-Mac hate on ISH is so annoying. LOL @ Pau Gasol over him :facepalm

ripthekik

10-14-2012, 03:06 AM

Dennis Johnson

LakersReign

10-14-2012, 03:36 AM

Sorry I'm not some 40+ year old that spends all his time online or some ****er that sits there and jerks off to basketball-reference all day.

You don't even list out his credentials when bringing him up. Gasol is a NBA champion best player, yearly cover boy for NBA Live in Espana, and an international ambassador for the game. He is the Michael Jordan of his home country.

Never even heard of "Dennis Johnson". Guy probably isn't even alive anymore.

Child(miami lice) please:rolleyes:

You don't know who DJ is cuz you don't know a damn thing about basketball, just like ALL FAKE Heat fans aka Lebronytes. Big surprise:sleeping