Stats aside, is Rondo's attitude bad for team chemistry?

[Sharmer]

A lot of people think Rondo's Achilles heal is his poor jump shot, no doubt this is a weakness in his game, my biggest issue with Rondo, is not related to his stats ,there outstanding. I don't think he is good for team chemistry, look over the years of footage, when Pierce and KG had been involved in heavy arguments with Rondo, Ray had a lot of problems with Rondo, and Ray is known for being a classy player.

The Celtics won in 08 when he was role player, yes his play now is outstanding, but he's not good for team chemistry, and they came close but never won another title.

Listen to Rondo interviews, he always come across as very arrogant, in a recent interview he said he could beat Ray in race running backwards, I don't hear Ray saying comments like he could beat Rondo in a shooting competition with his eyes closed.

Great point guards in the league, Chris Paul, prime Nash, never came across as arrogant, if anything they're humble.

Thoughts?

[KyrieTheFuture]

I guess you didn't know every single player on that team besides Ray probably is in love with him.

[outbreak]

A lot of people think Rondo's Achilles heal is his poor jump shot, no doubt this is a weakness in his game, my biggest issue with Rondo, is not related to his stats ,there outstanding. I don't think he is good for team chemistry, look over the years of footage, when Pierce and KG had been involved in heavy arguments with Rondo, Ray had a lot of problems with Rondo, and Ray is known for being a classy player.

The Celtics won in 08 when he was role player, yes his play now is outstanding, but he's not good for team chemistry, and they came close but never won another title.

Listen to Rondo interviews, he always come across as very arrogant, in a recent interview he said he could beat Ray in race running backwards, I don't hear Ray saying comments like he could beat Rondo in a shooting competition with his eyes closed.

Great point guards in the league, Chris Paul, prime Nash, never came across as arrogant, if anything they're humble.

Thoughts?

Pretty much the entire celtics team minus kg and pierce have made comments about Ray being a liar in the media and not being good for the team's locker room. They've all made comments about how Rondo is great for chemistry, he checks in on players sent to the d-league/rehabbing, he looks after the rookies and he arranges all the off court meetings. He just doesn't like the media and doesn't work his image like Ray did.

So no, he isn't bad for the chemistry and your just a lame hater look for something to throw at a player who is putting up good stats for his team.

[I.R.Beast]

people look at the stats and love it, but as hes become more and more the controller of the offense and the assists have gone up we have won less and less games and we have slipped in offensive efficiency. Ball movement will always trump one player racking up assists.

[Sharmer]

I guess you didn't know every single player on that team besides Ray probably is in love with him.

It would only be logical that other players on the roster, would go and support there point guard. Therefore we can question the reliability of these accounts.

[outbreak]

It would only be logical that other players on the roster, would go and support there point guard. Therefore we can question the reliability of these accounts.

Or we can question your reliability when you have 0 interaction with anyone involved in the celtics? All you are using is his image in the media.

[Sharmer]

So no, he isn't bad for the chemistry and your just a lame hater look for something to throw at a player who is putting up good stats for his team.

Your not in a position to make any allegation against me, we have have freedom of speech, to ask any questions within reason, and it's only a fair question to ask. Hate has nothing to do with it.

Compare Rondo's behaviour to any other great point guard? If you're objective, he does come across as arrogant.

Arrogant leaders just don't work.

Of course the Celtics are going to defend him.

[Sharmer]

Or we can question your reliability when you have 0 interaction with anyone involved in the celtics? All you are using is his image in the media.

Do you have any interaction with the Celtics?

I have watched him play on the court, and you would have to be blind, not see the conflict. Its call observation- I don't need to be directly interacting with the Celtics organisation, to draw a inference from my observations.

[outbreak]

Your not in a position to make any allegation against me, we have have freedom of speech, to ask any questions within reason, and it's only a fair question to ask. Hate has nothing to do with it.

Compare Rondo's behaviour to any other great point guard? If you're objective, he does come across as arrogant.

Arrogant leaders just don't work.

Of course the Celtics are going to defend him.

There's a big difference between having no time for the media's games and between being arrogant and detrimental to your team mates. All the rookies love him. He made the trip down to their d-league city to watch and check up on Bradley when he was assigned there. He volunteered and organised on his own to go back and visit his old schools to teach classes. Just because he doesn't play the media's games and speaks his mind doesn't mean he is like that to his team mates. There is 0 evidence he acts like this to his team mates, the only evidence we have is all his team mates supporting him and telling stories about how he organises bowling parties and car clubs with his team mates.

[CTulc]

OP trying to use really convoluted arguments now to prove his point. Just admit you were wrong. The whole team loves each other with Rondo and KG being the leaders. They're both loyal and would do anything for their team.

[Euroleague]

Rondo is a total punk. He's a total punk just like Kevin Garnett and Chris Paul.

[Sharmer]

There's a big difference between having no time for the media's games and between being arrogant and detrimental to your team mates.

So now you're saying that he's not arrogant to his players, and he doesn't have any time for media, therefore he shows a level of arrogance to the media ?

I think being arrogant to the media and during interviews, is only going to be detrimental to your team mates, this creates a higher level of scrutiny and pressure on all players.

[Djahjaga]

So now you're saying that he's not arrogant to his players, and he doesn't have any time for media, therefore he shows a level of arrogance to the media ?

I think being arrogant to the media and during interviews, is only going to be detrimental to your team mates, this creates a higher level of scrutiny and pressure on all players.


Oh, I get it now. You're just wrong, then.

[RagingBull33]

Oh, I get it now. You're just wrong, then.
:bowdown:

[K.Koscik]

So now you're saying that he's not arrogant to his players, and he doesn't have any time for media, therefore he shows a level of arrogance to the media ?

I think being arrogant to the media and during interviews, is only going to be detrimental to your team mates, this creates a higher level of scrutiny and pressure on all players.

There's been a few guys who were very arrogant (I'd use confident) who have won a lot

Kobe
Jordan
Shaq
Bird

Rondo isn't detrimental to the team in any way

[Whoah10115]

So now you're saying that he's not arrogant to his players, and he doesn't have any time for media, therefore he shows a level of arrogance to the media ?

I think being arrogant to the media and during interviews, is only going to be detrimental to your team mates, this creates a higher level of scrutiny and pressure on all players.



There is a pretty high level of stupid going on in here...and I respect it!

[Sharmer]

All the rookies love him. He made the trip down to their d-league city to watch and check up on Bradley when he was assigned there. He volunteered and organised on his own to go back and visit his old schools to teach classes.

How do know all this? It's through the media, therefore you're contradicting yourself, you're trying to say don't believe the media, then you're using media accounts to say what a great guy Rondo is.

[Sharmer]

There's been a few guys who were very arrogant (I'd use confident) who have won a lot

Kobe
Jordan
Shaq
Bird

Rondo isn't detrimental to the team in any way

I didn't watch enough of Bird, to comment.

With regards to Kobe, Jordan, Shaq, yes these guys maybe perceived to be arrogant at times, however the fact is, they were all unstoppable during parts of their careers, I think they had a lot of belief in themselves, which could perceived to be arrogance, when if fact, they were just supremely confident.

Plus the guys played different positions, having a arrogant point, can really hurt the team, more than other position.

[PP34Deuce]

I believe that if Bradley returns to form...the perimeter d becomes top notch. Rondo and Bradley thrived off each otger as running mates

[Sharmer]

http://www.urbannewsroom.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/04/rondo-bumps-ref-thumb-400xauto-34820.jpg

Recall this incident? When he got suspended.

Rondo, showing arrogance towards refs, not exactly a good way to make your point.

[CTulc]

OP has to be a troll. Someone please shut this thread down it's ridiculous how dumb this is.

[KyrieTheFuture]

So what your saying is you're a Rondo hater and no amount of evidence contrary to your beliefs will change them? Got it.

[CTulc]

So what your saying is you're a Rondo hater and no amount of evidence contrary to your beliefs will change them? Got it.

:cheers:

[ballup]

A lot of people think Rondo's Achilles heal is his poor jump shot, no doubt this is a weakness in his game, my biggest issue with Rondo, is not related to his stats ,there outstanding. I don't think he is good for team chemistry, look over the years of footage, when Pierce and KG had been involved in heavy arguments with Rondo, Ray had a lot of problems with Rondo, and Ray is known for being a classy player.

The Celtics won in 08 when he was role player, yes his play now is outstanding, but he's not good for team chemistry, and they came close but never won another title.

Listen to Rondo interviews, he always come across as very arrogant, in a recent interview he said he could beat Ray in race running backwards, I don't hear Ray saying comments like he could beat Rondo in a shooting competition with his eyes closed.

Great point guards in the league, Chris Paul, prime Nash, never came across as arrogant, if anything they're humble.

Thoughts?
Let's ignore the fact that the Celtics have faced injury woes over the years and that their core has been declining.

Yes, it's Rondo's clash with his teammates that cost them titles. It's not like they had a pretty mediocre offense and little depth.

[Sharmer]

So what your saying is you're a Rondo hater and no amount of evidence contrary to your beliefs will change them? Got it.

When did I say, I hate Rondo?

What objective evidence has been provided to demonstrate, Rondo is not arrogant ? Posters have provided random opinions from Media reports from his own team mates, and these same posters, hypocritically argue that you can't rely on the media because they don't like Rondo.

Alternatively, on the balance of probabilities I would take Ray Allen word over Rondo, not because I hate Rondo, because Ray over a long period has demonstrated to be classy and respectful.

[CTulc]

When did I say, I hate Rondo?

What objective evidence has been provided to demonstrate, Rondo is not arrogant ? Posters have provided random opinions from Media reports from his own team mates, and these same posters, hypocritically argue that you can't rely on the media because they don't like Rondo.

Alternatively, on the balance of probabilities I would take Ray Allen word over Rondo, not because I hate Rondo, because Ray over a long period has demonstrated to be classy and respectful.

http://nesn.com/2012/10/keyon-dooling-says-rajon-rondo-is-most-underappreciated-leader-in-nba/

Read this article and then please shut up. This is one of his MULTIPLE teammates that love his leadership and positive attitude. So please stop talking about matters you know nothing about.

[outbreak]

When did I say, I hate Rondo?

What objective evidence has been provided to demonstrate, Rondo is not arrogant ? Posters have provided random opinions from Media reports from his own team mates, and these same posters, hypocritically argue that you can't rely on the media because they don't like Rondo.

Alternatively, on the balance of probabilities I would take Ray Allen word over Rondo, not because I hate Rondo, because Ray over a long period has demonstrated to be classy and respectful.

Sorry but the difference is we are using direct quotes from team mates where as your using Rondo's throw away lines to reporters. There's a big difference there.

[Sharmer]

http://nesn.com/2012/10/keyon-dooling-says-rajon-rondo-is-most-underappreciated-leader-in-nba/

Read this article and then please shut up. This is one of his MULTIPLE teammates that love his leadership and positive attitude. So please stop talking about matters you know nothing about.


I've previously read this article before, and it doesn't prove much, other than the fact, that some team mates are willing to stand up for him.

Alternatively there are hundreds of articles, which demonstrate that Rondo is arrogant and not liked by team mates, dating back over the last few years.

But this is not about, if I'm right or wrong, it's the question, if having a arrogant point guard, is good for team chemistry.

We have observed Rondo have conflict with team mates, refs, and its only reasonable to ask the question.

Not sure why, you need to start making personal insults. I just won't revert to personal insults.

[CTulc]

I've previously read this article before, and it doesn't prove much, other than the fact, that some team mates are willing to stand up for him.

Alternatively there are hundreds of articles, which demonstrate that Rondo is arrogant and not liked by team mates, dating back over the last few years.

But this is not about, if I'm right or wrong, it's the question, if having a arrogant point guard, is good for team chemistry.

We have observed Rondo have conflict with team mates, refs, and its only reasonable to ask the question.

Not sure why, you need to start making personal insults. I just won't revert to personal insults.

My mistake. Sorry for the insults I got out of hand. Realistically I think you're point guard needs to have a high level of confidence which he has. He's changed from the old conflicting days.

[outbreak]

I've previously read this article before, and it doesn't prove much, other than the fact, that some team mates are willing to stand up for him.

Alternatively there are hundreds of articles, which demonstrate that Rondo is arrogant and not liked by team mates, dating back over the last few years.

But this is not about, if I'm right or wrong, it's the question, if having a arrogant point guard, is good for team chemistry.

We have observed Rondo have conflict with team mates, refs, and its only reasonable to ask the question.

Not sure why, you need to start making personal insults. I just won't revert to personal insults.

Most stars in the league are pretty arrogant. You kind of have to be to make it to the top level. If you don't have that urge to win and self belief chances are you won't live up to your potential. His antics on court with the refs aren't really arrogance. He has a few anger issues which at times will hurt the team but at other times this can help fire them up and give them a sense of urgency. I don't recall seeing him conflict with any team mates though.

[Sharmer]

Most stars in the league are pretty arrogant. You kind of have to be to make it to the top level. If you don't have that urge to win and self belief chances are you won't live up to your potential. His antics on court with the refs aren't really arrogance. He has a few anger issues which at times will hurt the team but at other times this can help fire them up and give them a sense of urgency. I don't recall seeing him conflict with any team mates though.

I can see your point with stars being arrogant, however I think the role of the point guard is a little different, I think because they run the offense, they have more responsibility.

I like Rondo a lot, but I get frustrated with him at times, he could go down as all time great, if he develops his jump shot. But I think if he modified his attitude a little, it would help the team. Not that his team mates, don't look to him, as they do refer to him as the their leader now.

[Sharmer]

My mistake. Sorry for the insults I got out of hand. Realistically I think you're point guard needs to have a high level of confidence which he has. He's changed from the old conflicting days.

No problems, anyway I got to get to practice :oldlol: .

[BlackWhiteGreen]

http://nesn.com/2012/10/keyon-dooling-says-rajon-rondo-is-most-underappreciated-leader-in-nba/

Read this article and then please shut up. This is one of his MULTIPLE teammates that love his leadership and positive attitude. So please stop talking about matters you know nothing about.

Exactly what I was going to post. :bowdown:

[Wally450]

I see nothing wrong with Rondo's chemistry, honestly

[avonbarksdale]

you literally made all of this up


good job

[jdm_dc_fan]

We need more players like Rondo. This is a competitive sport. Imagine a league full of Jeff Green's. :facepalm

And to answer your question, I'll ask you a question. What happens with the Celtics chemistry when Rondo goes to the bench. :roll:

[Sharmer]

We need more players like Rondo. This is a competitive sport. Imagine a league full of Jeff Green's. :facepalm

And to answer your question, I'll ask you a question. What happens with the Celtics chemistry when Rondo goes to the bench. :roll:

The question was mostly retrospective, looking back over the last 5 years, obviously in the present moment he's the nucleus of the team.

Let's reopen the debate, later in the season, and we'll see how the team plays.

According to Rondo, the Celtics are stronger this year.

[Tking714]

http://www.urbannewsroom.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/04/rondo-bumps-ref-thumb-400xauto-34820.jpg

Recall this incident? When he got suspended.

Rondo, showing arrogance towards refs, not exactly a good way to make your point.

http://weknowmemes.com/wp-content/uploads/2011/10/your-whistle-is-awesome-michael-jordan.jpg
http://www.waitingfornextyear.com/wp-content/uploads/2009/02/lebron-argues-with-ref.jpg

[Sharmer]

The difference is Rondo, makes physical contact and gets suspended.

[Sharmer]

You are going off on a tangent, that picture was in context, with a number of other conflicts in the team, over the last 5 years.

As I said, lets what and see how the team plays. That will be the answer.

[Tking714]

As I said, lets what and see how the team plays. That will be the answer.

The teams gonna be play like crap of course because they're just not very good. Not Rondo's fault

[Sharmer]

The teams gonna be play like crap of course because they're just not very good. Not Rondo's fault

They came close to knocking off the Heat last year, the difference is, the Heat got stronger, and Celtics made some solid acquisitions on paper, but they're really lacking another inside presence.

They had a slow start last year, one thing I know about the Celtics, don't write them off, wait till the playoffs.

[RagingBull33]

They came close to knocking off the Heat last year, the difference is, the Heat got stronger, and Celtics made some solid acquisitions on paper, but they're really lacking another inside presence.

They had a slow start last year, one thing I know about the Celtics, don't write them off, wait till the playoffs.
Great that you acknowledge how early it is in the season. Now please, just shut the f**k up before you make more of an ass of yourself.

[Sharmer]

Great that you acknowledge how early it is in the season. Now please, just shut the f**k up before you make more of an ass of yourself.


Your posts has been reported, and if you swear at me one more time, I will make the recommendation, to have you banned.

Your real tough, making personal insults over a internet forum.

Well done.

[Sharmer]

Great that you acknowledge how early it is in the season. Now please, just shut the f**k up before you make more of an ass of yourself.


It's called freedom of speech, now if you don't believe in freedom of speech, go move to China or Cuba, and go live under Communism.

I will continue to say, what I want, when I want, as long as it's within forum guidelines.

[Sharmer]

RagingBull 33,

Obviously you haven't read the forum guidelines, have a read, you might learn something.


InsideHoops Forum Guidelines:

THE QUICK VERSION:

The InsideHoops forums are for intelligent, friendly basketball talk. Be cool. Be relaxed. Don't fight. Report posts that 'damage' our board (red/white triangle, left side of page). Put thought into your posts. Respect other people. Don't post/link anything that little kids or people surfing from a corporate office shouldn't see. Enjoy talking basketball. Help others. Have fun.

[iamgine]

The Celtics won in 08 when he was role player, yes his play now is outstanding, but he's not good for team chemistry, and they came close but never won another title.

How does that correlate? Are you saying that they don't win another title because Rondo was arrogant?


I can see your point with stars being arrogant, however I think the role of the point guard is a little different, I think because they run the offense, they have more responsibility.

I think you're mistaking arrogant for selfish. Arrogant PG is no different from any other position. Selfish, ball hogging PG on the other hand....

[stevieming]

As much as Rondo has improved, the Celtics aren't winning anything with him leading.

The team goes with PP, KG and Ray (in 2008 and 2009) Mostly with KG and PP. And now that both are too old, this team is done.

When KG and PP declining, so have Celtics title hopes.

Bottom line is I am not a huge fan of Rondo and his diva like sissy fits, and when he doesn't have the two HOFs to pass to, his production is going to drop big time.

[Sharmer]

How does that correlate? Are you saying that they don't win another title because Rondo was arrogant?



I think you're mistaking arrogant for selfish. Arrogant PG is no different from any other position. Selfish, ball hogging PG on the other hand....

Correlation is not the same as causation, not to make the issue more complex than it needs to be, I wouldn't say Rondo being arrogant directly caused the Celtics to lose.

A lot of this is not a exact science, and is subjective, however there was at least some contributory factors with Rondo's arrogance and team performance. The reason I consider this proposition, is on the basis how close the team came to trading both Allen and Rondo, because of internal conflict.

[iamgine]

Correlation is not the same as causation, not to make the issue more complex than it needs to be, I wouldn't say Rondo being arrogant directly caused the Celtics to lose.

A lot of this is not a exact science, and is subjective, however there was at least some contributory factors with Rondo's arrogance and team performance. The reason I consider this proposition, is on the basis how close the team came to trading both Allen and Rondo, because of internal conflict.
What about Pierce's arrogance? Saying he's the best. Surely that has "some contributory factor" too. How about Garnett being a dick making Glen Davis cry? Surely that has "some contributory factor" too?

So you are saying they have internal conflict because of Rondo's arrogance?

[Reverend Hoops]

Al Horford and Jeff Teague for Rondo

[swi7ch]

No, Isaiah Thomas won 2 titles with a horrible attitude. He and Rondo are universally hated by their peers.

[kNIOKAS]

RagingBull 33,

Obviously you haven't read the forum guidelines, have a read, you might learn something.
Live by the code, die by the code. My brother.

No, Isaiah Thomas won 2 titles with a horrible attitude. He and Rondo are universally hated by their peers.
Rondo is not hated by his peers. He's hated by scumbags like you. That's whole other story

[The_Yearning]

No, Isaiah Thomas won 2 titles with a horrible attitude. He and Rondo are universally hated by their peers.

Yea but Isaiah was actually good.

[Lebron23]

Rondo is the best passing PG in the NBA. He's very cocky just like 90% of the players in the NBA. The Celtics main problem right now is that their key players are getting older. They need to acquire a legit Center before the NBA Trading Deadline.

[Lebron23]

It's called freedom of speech, now if you don't believe in freedom of speech, go move to China or Cuba, and go live under Communism.

I will continue to say, what I want, when I want, as long as it's within forum guidelines.


He's Chinese.

[Nick Young]

Rondo is the best passing PG in the NBA. He's very cocky just like 90% of the players in the NBA. The Celtics main problem right now is that their key players are getting older. They need to acquire a legit Center before the NBA Trading Deadline.
He got booted off of team USA for his massive ego and bad attitude. It is no secret that Rondo has a bad attitude.

[Lebron23]

He got booted off of team USA for his massive ego and bad attitude. It is no secret that Rondo has a bad attitude.

I heard about that.

[Gotterdammerung]

Arrogance is a term I associate with insecurity, but Rondo is more of an ignoramus.

He does not demonstrate any inclination to learn about the history of the game, about his teammates before they joined the team. That level of comfort in his ignorance appears arrogant, because that is a mask of insecurity.

When I hear about guys learning from the older masters of the game, or the history of the game like Lebron, I'm elated.

When I hear about guys like Rondo display an incurious attitude about the wealth of knowledge that could help his game, I'm disappointed. :facepalm

[Money 23]

I LOVE his competitive-ness and fearless nature in regards to opponent, but he can absolutely be way too edgy and moody for my liking.

[kNIOKAS]

Arrogance is a term I associate with insecurity, but Rondo is more of an ignoramus.

He does not demonstrate any inclination to learn about the history of the game, about his teammates before they joined the team. That level of comfort in his ignorance appears arrogant, because that is a mask of insecurity.

When I hear about guys learning from the older masters of the game, or the history of the game like Lebron, I'm elated.

When I hear about guys like Rondo display an incurious attitude about the wealth of knowledge that could help his game, I'm disappointed. :facepalm
http://i1214.photobucket.com/albums/cc489/niokulis/23k5ksy.gif

[CelticBaller]

Booo Rondo boo