The Wire vs The Sopranos

[AngelEyes]

For those who don't know these are two of the most acclaimed shows ever on television and they were both on HBO. I personally have seen the entirety of both series and enjoyed them both very much. I believe the first two seasons of the Sopranos were close to perfection, I do like the rest of the series, but I don't believe it was ever as good as the first two seasons. I felt the wire was consistently fantastic throughout its run and never really let me down. For people who have seen these series which do you think was the better show and which had the bigger impact?
http://static.guim.co.uk/sys-images/Media/Columnists/Columnists/2011/6/10/1307723798220/THE-WIRE---SEASON-ONE-007.jpg

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[LJJ]

I've seen a bunch of the Sopranos and while I think it's a good show, I never really understood why many people see it as the greatest show ever.

The Sopranos had some pretty serious issues with their characters. First of all, guys like Paulie Wallnuts and Dante seem like they were meant as parody or something. You take a couple of terrible actors and tell them to come up with the most stereotypical mobster they could think of and this is what you would get. Their acting was terrible, they were not believable as real people or as mobsters to begin with and that really didn't fit with the overall seriousness the show aspired to have.

A second thing I missed was character development. You have 60 hours worth of story and none of the characters have an arc. It's a character driven drama, I want to see the characters grow and their personalities develop.

[daballa13]

I've seen a bunch of the Sopranos and while I think it's a good show, I never really understood why many people see it as the greatest show ever.

The Sopranos had some pretty serious issues with their characters. First of all, guys like Paulie Wallnuts and Dante seem like they were meant as parody or something. You take a couple of terrible actors and tell them to come up with the most stereotypical mobster they could think of and this is what you would get. Their acting was terrible, they were not believable as real people or as mobsters to begin with and that really didn't fit with the overall seriousness the show aspired to have.

A second thing I missed was character development. You have 60 hours worth of story and none of the characters have an arc. It's a character driven drama, I want to see the characters grow and their personalities develop.

That's funny cause when they asked the cast who from the show is most like the character they portray everyone said Tony Sirico (Paulie Gualtieri). Paulie and Sil were awesome, Sil was a awesome side kick to Tony and really played the part very well. I don't know what you're talking about.

[miller-time]

I only finished The Wire for the first time the other day and I want to watch it again in a few weeks or months.

The Sopranos dug more into the characters minds and lives, and it took a more artistic and philosophical direction than The Wire. I thought The Wire was a solid show, but I really only enjoyed the 1st and 4th seasons, seasons 3 and 5 were good, and 2 was mostly forgettable. But like I said, I want to watch it again before I make my mind up (I've watched The Sopranos in its entirety 4 times since 2010 when I first saw it).

I really think Tony was far more fleshed out and interesting than any character on The Wire too. That isn't to say The Wire didn't have interesting characters, just that none of them were on Tony's level - which is to be expected since The Sopranos is basically Tony's story, while The Wire had a larger scope.

[LBJ 23]

Bigger impact I think The Sopranos

Better show The Wire

[SCREWstonRockets]

For me,

1A. Sopranos
1B. The Wire

[longhornfan1234]

Wire > Sopranos.


Marlo is a weak dude. He didn't have do Prop Joe like that. He taught him the game.

Killing Christopher was unecessary. He was the most loyal dude in the crew.

[Bano114]

Wire > Sopranos.


Marlo is a weak dude. He didn't have do Prop Joe like that. He taught him the game.

Killing Christopher was unecessary. He was the most loyal dude in the crew.

Killing Christopher was completely neccesary for Tony. Christopher was the only person left at that point who had any dirt on him that could be used against him. (Murders etc.)

Tony was getting rid of a potential threat.

[DonDadda59]

I only finished The Wire for the first time the other day and I want to watch it again in a few weeks or months.

The Sopranos dug more into the characters minds and lives, and it took a more artistic and philosophical direction than The Wire. I thought The Wire was a solid show, but I really only enjoyed the 1st and 4th seasons, seasons 3 and 5 were good, and 2 was mostly forgettable. But like I said, I want to watch it again before I make my mind up (I've watched The Sopranos in its entirety 4 times since 2010 when I first saw it).

I really think Tony was far more fleshed out and interesting than any character on The Wire too. That isn't to say The Wire didn't have interesting characters, just that none of them were on Tony's level - which is to be expected since The Sopranos is basically Tony's story, while The Wire had a larger scope.

My thoughts exactly. The 2nd season of the Wire was eh, and I hated the last season. Season 4 was as good as TV gets IMO. The Sopranos had its weak points (Season 6A, after the first 3 great episodes devolved into an annoying focus on side character Vito and his gay storyline). But you pointed out why its strange to compare their shows because even though on the surface they're similar- gangsters, cops, etc- they are pretty drastically different products. The Sopranos was more character driven and had a more artistic/experimental bent, the Wire was more of a broad study of a city as a whole that never really delved into any one particular character.


The Sopranos had some pretty serious issues with their characters. First of all, guys like Paulie Wallnuts and Dante seem like they were meant as parody or something. You take a couple of terrible actors and tell them to come up with the most stereotypical mobster they could think of and this is what you would get. Their acting was terrible, they were not believable as real people or as mobsters to begin with and that really didn't fit with the overall seriousness the show aspired to have.

And this is the point that a lot of people missed about the show- a lot of it was absurdist, dark comedy. Paulie Walnuts' main function on the show was to be comic relief (and the actor who played him, Tony Sirico, was an associate of the Colombo Family so he probably knows a thing or two about real life mobsters). If any show aspired towards 'seriousness', it was most definitely the wire.

As to the OP's question about which had the bigger impact- The Sopranos by a mile. The Wire was definitely a niche show and it was largely overlooked by the general public and the awards circuit (which is a tragedy IMO). The Sopranos on the other hand was a cultural phenomenon, a regular at the award shows. In addition it more or less began a revolution in cable television with channels like A&E, FX, and others creating shows in the same vein (with shows like 'Mad Men' and 'Boardwalk Empire' hiring show runners, writers, directors, etc who worked on the Sopranos).

[LJJ]

And this is the point that a lot of people missed about the show- a lot of it was absurdist, dark comedy. Paulie Walnuts' main function on the show was to be comic relief (and the actor who played him, Tony Sirico, was an associate of the Colombo Family so he probably knows a thing or two about real life mobsters). If any show aspired towards 'seriousness', it was most definitely the wire.

That's what I'm saying though.

You have a show that strikes a very serious drama tone when they have a realistic rape scene (or whatever, just an example), and then the next scene you have a guy like Pauly Walnuts or Dante who are clearly a (bad) parody characters. I couldn't really get into the seriousness of the story because of that.

[DonDadda59]

That's what I'm saying though.

You have a show that strikes a very serious drama tone when they have a realistic rape scene (or whatever, just an example), and then the next scene you have a guy like Pauly Walnuts or Dante who are clearly a (bad) parody characters. I couldn't really get into the seriousness of the story because of that.

And what I'm saying is that is what separates The Sopranos from the vast majority of shows on TV- its ability to balance heavy drama with farce/dark comedy. At the heart of the show was the philosophy of the absurd. Some shows try way too hard to be 'serious' and it makes for one dimensional, boring, forgettable characters. Paulie was there for comic relief, but he was also a murderous psychopath who it's made clear has clipped a ton of people during his lifetime (again, done with great comic storytelling during the seance bit in 'From Where To Eternity' http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kDxhBR2Tmes :oldlol: ). This was in the midst of Christopher dying in a hospital after being ambushed by his lackeys.

I don't see why any of the dramatic bits are in any way diminished in their 'seriousness' by the more comedic bits. I thought the writers did an excellent job of balancing the two, and other shows that strive to be like the Sopranos should take notes (Boardwalk Empire does this from time to time just nowhere near as effectively. see: Rosetti, Gyp)

[L.Kizzle]

Never really watched either except for a few episodes for each series.

How would y'all compare another HBO series which I kept up with, "Oz" to the two mentioned?

[Loneshot]

No comparison. The Sopranos comes off like a cartoon after having watched The Wire.

[LJJ]

And what I'm saying is that is what separates The Sopranos from the vast majority of shows on TV- its ability to balance heavy drama with farce/dark comedy. At the heart of the show was the philosophy of the absurd. Some shows try way too hard to be 'serious' and it makes for one dimensional, boring, forgettable characters. Paulie was there for comic relief, but he was also a murderous psychopath who it's made clear has clipped a ton of people during his lifetime (again, done with great comic storytelling during the seance bit in 'From Where To Eternity' http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kDxhBR2Tmes :oldlol: ). This was in the midst of Christopher dying in a hospital after being ambushed by his lackeys.

I don't see why any of the dramatic bits are in any way diminished in their 'seriousness' by the more comedic bits. I thought the writers did an excellent job of balancing the two, and other shows that strive to be like the Sopranos should take notes (Boardwalk Empire does this from time to time just nowhere near as effectively. see: Rosetti, Gyp)

Exactly. That is the problem. The one part of his character made the other part totally silly and unbelievable as drama.

[LBJ 23]

Never really watched either except for a few episodes for each series.

How would y'all compare another HBO series which I kept up with, "Oz" to the two mentioned?


I watched all 3 series mentioned, including ''Oz''. While ''Oz'' is still very good and way above average show it's just not on the same level as Sopranos and especially not The Wire.

The Wire
The Sopranos

Oz

[DonDadda59]

Exactly. That is the problem. The one part of his character made the other part totally silly and unbelievable as drama.

That makes absolutely no sense :oldlol:

How does for example Paulie going to see a psychic (comedy w/ dark undertones since the guy tells him he's being followed by everyone he's killed) effect Christopher dying in a hospital after being riddled by bullets (drama)? Are you saying that for a drama to be believable, the characters have to be serious all the time with no real distinguishable personalities, no humor, and they have to be one dimensional cardboard cutouts? Not surprising some think that way since a lot of shows, movies, etc are like that.

[LJJ]

That makes absolutely no sense :oldlol:

How does for example Paulie going to see a psychic (comedy w/ dark undertones since the guy tells him he's being followed by everyone he's killed) effect Christopher dying in a hospital after being riddled by bullets (drama)? Are you saying that for a drama to be believable, the characters have to be serious all the time with no real distinguishable personalities, no humor, and they have to be one dimensional cardboard cutouts? Not surprising some think that way since a lot of shows, movies, etc are like that.

You are creating an argument that isn't there. Nowhere do I say you can't have drama and comedy in one show, I just say that the Sopranos did that poorly. It's not the principle: it's the execution. The very obvious parody combined with very serious drama didn't work for me.

I also said I think the Sopranos was very good, but sorry if I hurt your feelings by saying I didn't think it did everything perfect. :lol

[DonDadda59]

You are creating an argument that isn't there. Nowhere do I say you can't have drama and comedy in one show, I just say that the Sopranos did that poorly. It's not the principle: it's the execution. The very obvious parody combined with very serious drama didn't work for me.

I also said I think the Sopranos was very good, but sorry if I hurt your feelings by saying I didn't think it did everything perfect. :lol

I was just pointing out your nonsensical 'logic' is all :cheers:

[miller-time]

You are creating an argument that isn't there. Nowhere do I say you can't have drama and comedy in one show, I just say that the Sopranos did that poorly. It's not the principle: it's the execution. The very obvious parody combined with very serious drama didn't work for me.

I also said I think the Sopranos was very good, but sorry if I hurt your feelings by saying I didn't think it did everything perfect. :lol

They weren't really using parody for their humor. I'd say it was broad satire, but personally I thought it worked. Even though sometimes Paulie or Christopher would do exaggerated things it made sense. It highlighted the absurdity of how gangsters go around killing and stealing yet are still prone to the same (or even worse) neuroses as the rest of us. They did the same thing with Tony but in a different way. He would have no trouble destroying other peoples lives while expecting his own life to be untouched - it wasn't funny but it was the same type of absurdity.

The comical parts had a purpose, they weren't in there just for a laugh or to fill up time.

[Segatti]

Breaking Bad will take the throne after the end of this season :pimp:

[highwhey]

Just finished watching the wire a few days ago, first time i have ever watched the series. Absolutely awesome. I really enjoyed it. Only problems i had with it were that Marlo Standfield is a lil b!tch, snoop lasted too long, dumb dike btch spoke like she had just finished off smoking a bowl.

I would have enjoyed omar killing marlo but instead they have a preschooler do him:facepalm

The last scene with marlo whooping ass on his.corner was pretty cool tho

[Derka]

No question in my mind: The Wire is the best television show I've ever seen.

[miller-time]

Just finished watching the wire a few days ago, first time i have ever watched the series. Absolutely awesome. I really enjoyed it. Only problems i had with it were that Marlo Standfield is a lil b!tch, snoop lasted too long, dumb dike btch spoke like she had just finished off smoking a bowl.

I would have enjoyed omar killing marlo but instead they have a preschooler do him:facepalm

The last scene with marlo whooping ass on his.corner was pretty cool tho

wasn't exactly the way i wanted to see omar go out, but i think the point is that he had built up a reputation and even though anyone could have taken him out pretty easily their fear held them back. the kid was really the only one who could have taken omar out 1 on 1. he had no fear and omar wasn't expecting him to come at him so he let his guard down.

[nek1477]

I would have to say the wire, the ending of the sopranos really pissed me off, i mean watching it for 6 seasons and it ends like that?

also in season 5 when tony talks to big ***** the fish, tells him he was talking to the feds, i was like wtf? http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Qo6cNQwN6LQ

one of my favorite scenes :bowdown: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=20G17K_0ghU

[miller-time]

also in season 5 when tony talks to big ***** the fish, tells him he was talking to the feds, i was like wtf? http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Qo6cNQwN6LQ

Exploration of Tony's subconscience and inner turmoil. I'd say the simplest way to divide the two shows is to say one takes a psychoanalytical approach and the other a sociological view. If The Wire had the talking fish scene then I would say "wtf?" too. But within the context of The Sopranos it made sense.

[nek1477]

Exploration of Tony's subconscience and inner turmoil. I'd say the simplest way to divide the two shows is to say one takes a psychoanalytical approach and the other a sociological approach. If The Wire had the talking fish scene then I would say "wtf" too. But within the context of The Sopranos it made sense.

It made sense but it just wasn't right in my opinion, later that episode they take him fishing and they kill him. easier to find out he was a snitch by him saying it, tonys finds out by the feds, source, etc, but a fish?

[DonDadda59]

It made sense but it just wasn't right in my opinion, later that episode they take him fishing and they kill him. easier to find out he was a snitch by him saying it, tonys finds out by the feds, source, etc, but a fish?

But Tony knew the entire time, he just didn't want to admit it. The fever dream was his subconscious yelling at him to face the truth. They hinted at it subtly earlier in the episode and previously in the season. It was also foreshadowing- Big ***** sleeps with the fishes. Tony's sixth sense was razor sharp, it's like Artie said "You saw this whole thing, didn't you? You knew exactly what was gonna happen. You can see twenty moves down the road. Please...I don't blame you, I envy you. It's like an instinct, like a hawk sees a little mouse movin' around a corn field from a mile up."


The last scene with marlo whooping ass on his.corner was pretty cool tho

Great and ironic thing about Marlo's ending was that he got everything Stringer ever wanted, but all he ever wanted was those corners and his name spoken with fear and respect on the streets.

[KevinNYC]

Overall I liked the Wire better. I loved the way it expanded the scope of the show season after season. The first four seasons are just fantastic. The last season was not as great.

However, I got into The Sopranos earlier. I remember watching the pilot of the Sopranos and thought it was the best pilot I had ever seen.....haven't watched it since then. The Wire took me several episode to get into. They were introduced many more characters and I didn't have any reference to the Baltimore drug world. It was about halfway through season one when I thought this show is great.

I will give you Steven Van Zandt not being a great actor, but Tony Sirico as Paulie Walnuts is a good actor and, in fact, knew more about the gangster life (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tony_Sirico)than any of the other actors.
Not believable? Ooofa! Minga, this guy!
http://i.ytimg.com/vi/ZuVwFrNV1BY/0.jpg
I knew a lot of guys who would point like this when I was growing up.

Yes, Paulie Walnuts was played for comedic effect, but he was hilarious because the acting was solid. If you think comedic acting is easier than dramatic acting, you don't really know acting. However, they were not the only characters who were played that way, they did that with most of the characters. When Tony wasn't the focus of the scene they would portray him as a buffoon or a real mamaluke as Paulie would say. Even Carmella was portrayed as a grasping materialistic Real Housewife of NJ, when the scene wasn't about her.

Also gangsters being unintentionally funny is a genre all of itself.


Fun fact: Tony Sirico and Woody Allen played baseball together as kids.

[kNicKz]

Sopranos > The Wire

I love both shows, but the last season of the wire DRAGGED with that fake serial killer plot.

Tony Soprano has to be one of my favorite characters of all time. The Sopranos was a lot more realistic than people think (The ridiculous shit they said and the way they all dressed was actually pretty spot on :roll: ) Obviously the crazy murders and shit weren't realistic but all of the little things were on point

[guy]

wasn't exactly the way i wanted to see omar go out, but i think the point is that he had built up a reputation and even though anyone could have taken him out pretty easily their fear held them back. the kid was really the only one who could have taken omar out 1 on 1. he had no fear and omar wasn't expecting him to come at him so he let his guard down.

I don't think thats what they were trying to show. I think they were trying to show that anyone can get got at anytime by anyone. It doesn't matter who it is and it doesn't matter how much build up, drama, and backstory there is behind it i.e. Stringer or Bodie's death. It can be as completely random as it was. IMO it captured that aspect about that environment and because of that I thought it was pretty brilliant.

[Money 23]

I knew most here would pick "the Wire" for obvious, or not so obvious reasons.

But The Sopranos is better, easily.

[LA Lakers]

Im going with The Wire. I think its the greatest tv show of all time. The Sopranos peaked in season 3 with the Italy trip for me. The show was never as good once Nancy Marchand passed away RIP. The Wire was the most complex, consistent and thought provoking show Ive ever seen. I think it could have kept going and hit every strata of Baltimore/Americas cities. Maybe the healthcare institutes would have been Season 6? And yeah, Omar Little was the Doc Holiday of Murdaland.

[eliteballer]

Game of Thrones is better than both.

[miller-time]

Game of Thrones is better than both.

Different type of show. But Breaking Bad is better than all!

[LA Lakers]

With Game of Thrones I dig the books over the tv series.

[Money 23]

Different type of show. But Breaking Bad is better than all!
God no.

Breaking Bad has it's moments, but jesus no ...

[SilkkTheShocker]

I love both, but its definitely The Sopranos. It's close, but season 5 of The Sopranos is my favorite of any show.

[SilkkTheShocker]

I knew most here would pick "the Wire" for obvious, or not so obvious reasons.

But The Sopranos is better, easily.

I just think the characters are more interesting on The Sopranos. Don't get me wrong, The Wire had great acting. But there was no Tony Soprano, Christopher, Ralph Cifaretto, etc.

[TheMan]

Italian mobsters>>>>black hoodrats

Fogedaboudit, Sopranos and it ain't even close.

[SilkkTheShocker]

Italian mobsters>>>>black hoodrats

Fogedaboudit, Sopranos and it ain't even close.

I have seen every episode of The Wire and The Sopranos, and The Wire doesn't come close to having The Sopranos rewatch factor.

[Nick Young]

That's what I'm saying though.

You have a show that strikes a very serious drama tone when they have a realistic rape scene (or whatever, just an example), and then the next scene you have a guy like Pauly Walnuts or Dante who are clearly a (bad) parody characters. I couldn't really get into the seriousness of the story because of that.
Sopranos was pretty Shakespearian like that, for me that was one of the best parts of the show.

[guy]

Sopranos isn't even close to the greatest show for me. In fact, I don't see how it could be for any other reason but that's it's the first of its kind. To each his own though.

[Bano114]

Breaking Bad.

I watched both shows twice, very closely. Once the hype of Breaking Bad dies down and people take a hard look at both shows, I feel like most people will agree that The Wire is better.

I do think Breaking Bad is better than the Sopranos though.

[Pointguard]

Originally Posted by miller-time
wasn't exactly the way i wanted to see omar go out, but i think the point is that he had built up a reputation and even though anyone could have taken him out pretty easily their fear held them back. the kid was really the only one who could have taken omar out 1 on 1. he had no fear and omar wasn't expecting him to come at him so he let his guard down.


I don't think thats what they were trying to show. I think they were trying to show that anyone can get got at anytime by anyone. It doesn't matter who it is and it doesn't matter how much build up, drama, and backstory there is behind it i.e. Stringer or Bodie's death. It can be as completely random as it was. IMO it captured that aspect about that environment and because of that I thought it was pretty brilliant.

I think it's a combination of what both of you are saying. There was a steady theme in the show of the ruthless younger generation coming up and their disregard of prior rules/standards/ways and how this made everything unmanageable. Check the links below:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1wmgghlEagA
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Yw_xy2kltvY
Herc and Carver pick on Poot to question how he is working for Marlo and Poot says "Uh, then you hear, the next generation is going to be the worse ever."
Marlo is also part of the theme.
Kinard always was doing things just to test how far it can go.

The biggest difference between the shows, to me, was that "the Wire" showed how societies outcast created an environment where a lot of people were locked into their universe and how their eat or be eaten world shaped the outside world. The dynamics of being being crazy had ramifications to the top man in the city. A true case of chaos affecting order and the delicate balance within. And how the inner city reality breeded an evolving culture of madness that was capable of genius.

Even with a keen eye you can't tell what twist and turns will make a Bunk, Omar, Marlo or Stringer and thats the reality of inner city characters.

[Loneshot]

I knew most here would pick "the Wire" for obvious, or not so obvious reasons.

But The Sopranos is better, easily.

the obvious reason being that the Sopranos comes off like a cartoon in comparison to the Wire.

[TheReal Kendall]

The Wire is definitely better.

I created a thread the other day about this.

Sorry I didn't know one was already created.

We need a search function on ISH