Kobe to Gasol: Put Your Big Boy Pants On

[AngelEyes]

http://espn.go.com/los-angeles/nba/story/_/id/8704495/kobe-bryant-los-angeles-lakers-calls-pau-gasol-loss

After Gasol ended up on the bench at the end of the Lakers game against Orlando Kobe Bryant had this to say about Pau Gasol's frustrations:

"Put your big-boy pants on. Just adjust. Just adjust. You can't whine about it. You can't complain about it."Kobe Bryant

[tomtucker]

just fire the fukking coach......and everything will be fine.....never trust a man with a mustache

[Clippersfan86]

First Dwight, now this.:roll:

[AngelEyes]

More from Bean Bryant:

"There's no excuses to be made, there's no whining. No putting your head down. We're here, we have the talent to make adjustments, we have to make them. Period. &

"I'll kick everybody's ass in this locker room if that doesn't happen. That's the attitude that you have to have. Metta (World Peace) is the same way. Dwight (Howard) has that in him as well. Even though he smiles a lot, he still cares a lot about this thing. Like I said, come hell or high water, it has to get done."

[scandisk_]

More from Bean Bryant:

"I'll kick everybody's ass in this locker room if that doesn't happen.

:roll: :roll: :roll:

Pau has no respect for the Mamba :oldlol:

[BoutPractice]

Well, this is off to a great start. Good luck guys.

[francesco totti]

D'antoni is the wrong choice if keeps in not using gasol.
Lakers will only go far if the 4 of dwight pau gasol kobe and nash play it together.

[kNIOKAS]

As if Bryant has ever adjusted :roll: :roll: Oh well.

Pau is like that good hearted kid that everybody feels ok to pin their problems on. :hammerhead:

[AussieG]

I watched all the post game interviews.. the Lakers make for a good soap opera at the moment.

Dwight was clearly frustrated. Kobe never talked about defense once.. and talked more about the need for he and Dwight to take more load. ie.. more hero ball.

Jamison and Duhon's interviews were the best.

Kobe was right about Pau.. but there is a lot more to it, than that.

The Lakers are a mess. If they keep losing, they will implode.

[Sakkreth]

Yeah and if Kobe got benched instead he would ask for new coach.

[Teanett]

kobe should shut up and stop fukking around himself.
he basically gave away the lead when he re-entered the game at the end of the first half.
the lakers were playing well and had the lead, but then ol beanhead reemerges.
plays like shit himself and calls out his teammate. horrible.
:facepalm

[longtime lurker]

So you guys think 11 points and 7 boards from Gasol is acceptable?

[sipitri]

Everything is easy when you're not the one on the bench.

[IGOTGAME]

As if Bryant has ever adjusted :roll: :roll: Oh well.

Pau is like that good hearted kid that everybody feels ok to pin their problems on. :hammerhead:

he is adjusting right now. He was doing just fine in the Princeton and now he has to try and play pg, something that doesn't fit his skill set. He has to work way harder for his shots now too. This move was horrible for Kobe and Gasol as individual players.


So you guys think 11 points and 7 boards from Gasol is acceptable?

yes. when you are being put in situations to fail than it is expected. Blame the coach for not utilizing him properly and managing his knees. I hope Mike DAntoni is fair and plays everyone hard, I expect Nash playing 40 minute nights in the regular season just like kobe. This team has no chance of winning a title and i'm just hoping they blow the whole thing up at the end of this year or next.

This team doesn't do anything except spam pick and rolls. you can't win playing that way and also not playing defense.

[madmax]

because Kobrick always adjusts and changes his chucking ways, right?:sleeping
Dude is a cancer of a teammate to deal with with his constant ballhogging and hero complex...how about he starts playing more team ball instead LOL?

[I<3NBA]

Kobe Bryant: Just adjust, just adjust.

:lol oh the irony.

[IGOTGAME]

because Kobrick always adjusts and changes his chucking ways, right?:sleeping
Dude is a cancer of a teammate to deal with with his constant ballhogging and hero complex...how about he starts playing more team ball instead LOL?

did you watch the first 15 games of the season? he was playing team ball and playing efficiently. DAntoni came in and wants them to play this dumb brand of ball and it requires Kobe to pretend to be a point guard.

[kNIOKAS]

he is adjusting right now. He was doing just fine in the Princeton and now he has to try and play pg, something that doesn't fit his skill set. He has to work way harder for his shots now too. This move was horrible for Kobe and Gasol as individual players.


Kobe has never adjusted. Now tell he how he's finally started to do that in his 16th season?
He is also known for saying the team has to adjust to him, because he is shooting first.


Yea right. :hammerhead:

[kuniva_dAMiGhTy]

27 FG attempts? Horrible fg%. No one on his team attempted half that many shots. Dwight gets embarrassed in his homecoming by.....big baby? Nikola Vuvecic? All thanks to Slowbe. Face it Kobe stans, facts don't lie, the team is better when he plays a sidekick.

[kuniva_dAMiGhTy]

Kobe has never adjusted. Now tell he how he's finally started to do that in his 16th season?
He is also known for saying the team has to adjust to him, because he is shooting first.


Yea right. :hammerhead:

Exactly. :oldlol: Interesting to note: LA is now 1-6 when Kobe scores 30 or more this year. Wow, just wow. That says it all (but its nothing new). This is what people have been saying his whole career. Shoot less, Slowbe (if the nickname fits? guy gets dusted on the defensive end ad nauseam). Could you imagine all the wins, possibly more rings, better teammate and coach relationships he could have had if he played team ball? He's been blessed with some of the best and most skilled teammates throughout his career and he's squandering it for.......inefficient scoring? LA is realizing that firing Mike Brown was the wrong decision.

Taking the ball out of Kobe's hands is the answer.

[swi7ch]

Trade Gasol for Anderson or Amare.

[R.I.P.]

Kobe: Pau you need to adjust. I

[Reverend Hoops]

just fire the fukking coach......and everything will be fine.....never trust a man with a mustache

http://wagesofwins.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/11/692d46cabb822890fa83a06b972a1108.jpg

[TheFan]

and your useless cliche cowboy phrase of the day goes to...

[It's A VC3!!!]

Kobe is dead wrong on this one. Stop asking Pau to put his big boy pants on. The guy has been benched multiple times in the fourth quarter. If that was you how the hell would you feel. And better yet, Pau is watching Dwight play an entire fourth quarter despite missing 4-6 FT's which is a detriment to the team. Pau was brought in and being paid 19 million to produce. Benching him in the fourth quarter like 3 times since Dantoni has been here? Why not just trade him if you're not going to use him in crunch time:facepalm

[poido123]

Kobe is dead wrong on this one. Stop asking Pau to put his big boy pants on. The guy has been benched multiple times in the fourth quarter. If that was you how the hell would you feel. And better yet, Pau is watching Dwight play an entire fourth quarter despite missing 4-6 FT's which is a detriment to the team. Pau was brought in and being paid 19 million to produce. Benching him in the fourth quarter like 3 times since Dantoni has been here? Why not just trade him if you're not going to use him in crunch time:facepalm

Exactly. Kobe hasn't exactly adjusted away from his hero ball and chucking ways. Would love to see how he handles being benched, I know he woudn't handle it :coleman:

[longtime lurker]

he is adjusting right now. He was doing just fine in the Princeton and now he has to try and play pg, something that doesn't fit his skill set. He has to work way harder for his shots now too. This move was horrible for Kobe and Gasol as individual players.



yes. when you are being put in situations to fail than it is expected. Blame the coach for not utilizing him properly and managing his knees. I hope Mike DAntoni is fair and plays everyone hard, I expect Nash playing 40 minute nights in the regular season just like kobe. This team has no chance of winning a title and i'm just hoping they blow the whole thing up at the end of this year or next.

This team doesn't do anything except spam pick and rolls. you can't win playing that way and also not playing defense.

Contraty to popular belief Pau hasn't been turned into a jumpshooter. Even when he gets opportunities inside he can't finish or makes ill advised passes. He got his shot blocked by glen davis for christs sake and last week he was blocked 5 times in 1 game. Sorry but you don't tailor ur offensive game plan around your 4th best player at the expense of your two best players. Kobe's right he needs to adjust instead of just drifting around. And if his knee is the problem then he needs his minutes cut down to give Jamison and Hill some more burn until Gasol is healthy. People are making too many excuses for his poor play. Just man up and fuking play.

[IGOTGAME]

Contraty to popular belief Pau hasn't been turned into a jumpshooter. Even when he gets opportunities inside he can't finish or makes ill advised passes. He got his shot blocked by glen davis for christs sake and last week he was blocked 5 times in 1 game. Sorry but you don't tailor ur offensive game plan around your 4th best player at the expense of your two best players. Kobe's right he needs to adjust instead of just drifting around. And if his knee is the problem then he needs his minutes cut down to give Jamison and Hill some more burn until Gasol is healthy. People are making too many excuses for his poor play. Just man up and fuking play.
This offense is tailored around Steve Nash and shooters. It makes Kobe, Howard and Gasol less effective. So yes, the offense is currently tailored around the teams fourth best player. Gasol is better than Nash.

If anything the offense should either tailored around Howard and Kobe or it should be a motion with different reads like the triangle or Princeton.

[White Mamba]

So Melo shooting 12-27? MVP

Kobe shooting 12-27 (44% BTW) ? HORRIBLE FG%:roll:

Sad to read.

Of course LA win more when Kobe shoot less, He doesn't have to shoot much if the team is wining, But this team isn't wining right now. not even against Orlando at home.

To his credit you don't see him go for 27 shots in a blowout win, so I don't get what ppl wants from him? If the coach benched Howard when teams start to hack LA wins 4 out of those 6 loses that Kobe shoot more.

Guy is shooting 18 shots per game, way less than last year.

[Mr. I'm So Rad]

Exactly. :oldlol: Interesting to note: LA is now 1-6 when Kobe scores 30 or more this year. Wow, just wow. That says it all (but its nothing new). This is what people have been saying his whole career. Shoot less, Slowbe (if the nickname fits? guy gets dusted on the defensive end ad nauseam). Could you imagine all the wins, possibly more rings, better teammate and coach relationships he could have had if he played team ball? He's been blessed with some of the best and most skilled teammates throughout his career and he's squandering it for.......inefficient scoring? LA is realizing that firing Mike Brown was the wrong decision.

Taking the ball out of Kobe's hands is the answer.

Don't you realize that's because they're down and he's trying to bring them back? It's like that for any 1st option on offense. They'll usually score more in losses and shoot a worse FG%

So who's hands is the ball going to be in? Is Chris Duhon or Darius Morris going to get everyone to play defense? Is MWP going to create for everyone else? And playing team ball doesn't mean shit when the team is playing like ass. Kobe doesn't come out saying "Oh I just want to shoot." He gives things a chance to operate and if they don't then that's when he tries to take matter into his own hands. You all talk like his way of playing has cost the Lakers or something but he's been an integral piece 5 titles and 7 finals appearances. And you sure as hell can't place the blame or even the brunt of the blame on him for the Lakers' record. He's been playing the way you guys say he should for the first 12 games or so.

[daily]

Kobe is dead wrong on this one. Stop asking Pau to put his big boy pants on. The guy has been benched multiple times in the fourth quarter. If that was you how the hell would you feel. And better yet, Pau is watching Dwight play an entire fourth quarter despite missing 4-6 FT's which is a detriment to the team. Pau was brought in and being paid 19 million to produce. Benching him in the fourth quarter like 3 times since Dantoni has been here? Why not just trade him if you're not going to use him in crunch time:facepalm

Funny thing is, Lakers had the lead when Pau was benched. He had no hand in losing this game yet Kobe thinks Pau needs to man up:lol

[Teanett]

Don't you realize that's because they're down and he's trying to bring them back? It's like that for any 1st option on offense.

no.
wrong.
ever watch the spurs, celtics, heat and this years knicks?
if they are down and want to come back, they clamp down on d.

[Teanett]

Funny thing is, Lakers had the lead when Pau was benched. He had no hand in losing this game yet Kobe thinks Pau needs to man up:lol

exactly my thought.
kobe stunk up the joint. there were two horribly executed fast breaks when he didnt give up the ball in time.

[It's A VC3!!!]

Funny thing is, Lakers had the lead when Pau was benched. He had no hand in losing this game yet Kobe thinks Pau needs to man up:lol
That's the thing. As a real leader Kobe needs to say "it's on me". Even if it is or isn't that's what he needs to do. He keeps blaming Pau and I haven't once heard him say anything about Dwight's FT shooting. He should be saying "Dwight needs to make FT's or be sat in the 4th". I know if Pau was the one missing 10 ft's a game, Kobe would be all over him.

[Whoah10115]

Bryant can say whatever he wants. He's been as good as anyone in the league so far this year and while Gasol has been shitted on unfairly, he is flat out not playing hard and still finds time to jaw complaints every second he's on the court. He doesn't look down. He looks lame.

[necya]

it's always something when Kobe is talking about adjusting... -_-
dude just don't know the meanning of this word for sure. when you have the best paint of the league, just use the potential you don't need your guard jacking 27 shots. but no, kobe still needs his numbers...

[knickswin]

it's really rich to hear kobe talking about "adjusting" ... he's leading the league in fga's, but since he's not jacking it up as much as he did last year--which was some borderline historic shotjacking by the way--he's "adjusting." ... and big deal that he's playing more pick and roll, that's what he should have been doing anyway instead of isolating all the time

adjusting is a lot easier when the ball still gets to be in your hands

I feel bad for Pau, yeah he's paying lamely, but this whole team is a mess and he's never going to be able to thrive next to kobe and dwight. he needs a change of scenery in the worst way.

[NumberSix]

Good thing they didn't fire PJ. They really dodged a bullet.

[Yao Ming's Foot]

Gasol has been terrible this year. He is the least efficient starter and big man and is terrible defensively. When Ron Artest is a better offensive player than you, its time to adjust.

[Yao Ming's Foot]

it's really rich to hear kobe talking about "adjusting" ... he's leading the league in fga's, but since he's not jacking it up as much as he did last year--which was some borderline historic shotjacking by the way--he's "adjusting." ... and big deal that he's playing more pick and roll, that's what he should have been doing anyway instead of isolating all the time

adjusting is a lot easier when the ball still gets to be in your hands

I feel bad for Pau, yeah he's paying lamely, but this whole team is a mess and he's never going to be able to thrive next to kobe and dwight. he needs a change of scenery in the worst way.

Kobe is 3rd in FGA behind LMA and Melo.

Usage rate is down, efficiency is up, rebounding percentage is up, assist percentage is up...

What more do you want from Kobe? He should give more of his shots (as the most efficient starter on the team) to Pau Gasol (the least efficient starter). :confusedshrug:

[tmacattack33]

Kobe Bryant is 34 years old yet is still one of the most worst teammates in the league.

:roll:

[Bajanmale]

kobe should shut up and stop fukking around himself.
he basically gave away the lead when he re-entered the game at the end of the first half.
the lakers were playing well and had the lead, but then ol beanhead reemerges.
plays like shit himself and calls out his teammate. horrible.
:facepalm
:cheers: :lol

[tmacattack33]

Kobe is 3rd in FGA behind LMA and Melo.

Usage rate is down, efficiency is up, rebounding percentage is up, assist percentage is up...

What more do you want from Kobe? He should give more of his shots (as the most efficient starter on the team) to Pau Gasol (the least efficient starter). :confusedshrug:

I love how you just ignored the 4.0 turnovers per game, which is pretty terrible if you are only getting 5.1 assists per game.

[Magic 32]

This is like a time machine back to 2005-2007 Insidehoops. I thought you guys had learned your lesson.


http://cdn.bleacherreport.net/images_root/slides/photos/001/185/277/102671386_display_image.jpg?1313424809

[IamRAMBO24]

I am proud of half the posters in this thread for calling Kobe out like that.

Let's stop picking on poor ole Gasol when this f*cking diva has shown absolutely no team play nor chemistry when he rips and ridicules other people for the failure of the team.

This is not the act of a leader. This is the act of a child.

Sure it is ok to call someone out when they are not performing well, but at the same time, a leader needs to take responsibility for the team and help his teammates improve. The game doesn't end at the clock; team chemistry continues in the locker room and news conference.

Kobe's ego is the biggest cancer to the Lakers. This ego is the reason why Gasol and Howard are underperforming; this ego is preventing coaches from fully utilizing their players because Kobe dictates the play during clutch moments. This ego got rid of one of the greatest PF and Center of all time; this ego also scared away the greatest coach for a year; this is the same ego that ripped Gasol apart and turned him into a hasbeen; this ego made Howard weak; this ego has made this loser delusional because he thinks he is better than Jordan; the only person who has benefited from this ego is Odom who would love nothing more than to suck the ego's d*ck.

Kobe's team; his responsibility. PERIOD.

Anyone who disagrees is a f*ckin idiot.

[Yao Ming's Foot]

I love how you just ignored the 4.0 turnovers per game, which is pretty terrible if you are only getting 5.1 assists per game.

Kobe's current assist to turnover ratio is the same as it was last year. :confusedshrug:

[knickswin]

I am proud of half the posters in this thread for calling Kobe out like that.

Let's stop picking on poor ole Gasol when this f*cking diva has shown absolutely no team play nor chemistry when he rips and ridicules other people for the failure of the team.

This is not the act of a leader. This is the act of a child.

Sure it is ok to call someone out when they are not performing well, but at the same time, a leader needs to take responsibility for the team and help his teammates improve.

Kobe's ego is the biggest cancer to the Lakers. This ego is the reason why Gasol and Howard are underperforming; this ego is preventing coaches from fully utilizing their players because Kobe dictates the play during clutch moments.

Kobe's team; his responsibility. PERIOD.

Anyone who disagrees is a f*ckin idiot.

it is sickening that kobe is delusional enough to actually come out and say, "why can't pau come out and be as good a team player as I am." just unbelievable.

[Mr. I'm So Rad]

no.
wrong.
ever watch the spurs, celtics, heat and this years knicks?
if they are down and want to come back, they clamp down on d.

That doesn't disprove what I said. A team's best player will usually still take more shots and play more minutes in losses than wins. That doesn't mean a team won't play harder defense.

But either way, it's the coach's job to emphasize and prioritize defense.

[kizut1659]

Pau should put the big boy pants and either call out Kobe back or demand a trade. The amount of disrespect and shit he takes from Kobe is astounding (see e.g. Kobe saying he needs to be "black swan" or Kobe bitching at him last year during playoffs). The reality is that Pau in some ways saved Kobe's career, as without him Kobe would never have won in 2009 and 2010 and would be foreever known as a chucker who could not win without Shaq. Kobe is an ungrateful shit, but Pau should stand up for himself already, this is getting ridiculous.

[DuMa]

Pau should put the big boy pants and either call out Kobe back or demand a trade. The amount of disrespect and shit he takes from Kobe is astounding (see e.g. Kobe saying he needs to be "black swan" or Kobe bitching at him last year during playoffs). The reality is that Pau in some ways saved Kobe's career, as without him Kobe would never have won in 2009 and 2010 and would be foreever known as a chucker who could not win without Shaq. Kobe is an ungrateful shit, but Pau should stand up for himself already, this is getting ridiculous.
Pau is forever Kobe's bitch. I really believed Kobe this summer when he said: "As long as I'm there, (Gasol's) going to be there,"

[Yao Ming's Foot]

Pau should put the big boy pants and either call out Kobe back or demand a trade. The amount of disrespect and shit he takes from Kobe is astounding (see e.g. Kobe saying he needs to be "black swan" or Kobe bitching at him last year during playoffs). The reality is that Pau in some ways saved Kobe's career, as without him Kobe would never have won in 2009 and 2010 and would be foreever known as a chucker who could not win without Shaq. Kobe is an ungrateful shit, but Pau should stand up for himself already, this is getting ridiculous.

That's rich the guy who already had 3 titles career was saved by the guy who did not even have 3 playoff wins to his name. :oldlol:

When is the last time Pau Gasol outplayed his opposing PF in a playoff series? 2-3 years ago?

[IamRAMBO24]

Pau should put the big boy pants and either call out Kobe back or demand a trade. The amount of disrespect and shit he takes from Kobe is astounding (see e.g. Kobe saying he needs to be "black swan" or Kobe bitching at him last year during playoffs). The reality is that Pau in some ways saved Kobe's career, as without him Kobe would never have won in 2009 and 2010 and would be foreever known as a chucker who could not win without Shaq. Kobe is an ungrateful shit, but Pau should stand up for himself already, this is getting ridiculous.

Good job.

You got it right.

Kobe won because of Pau. Instead of congratulating him, he got into a heated locker room moment because of his slutty wife over some melodramatic bullsh*t.

From that moment on, Pau was never given the same respect on the team because the whole organization has Kobe's throbbing schlong so far up their ass they can no longer function properly as a professional team. Even the greatest coach of all time threw his hands in the air and gave up.

Too bad the organization and fans are too stupid to see this. If Pau speaks up, he is gone. He doesn't want to leave LA. It is his home and he knows he has to take it up the ass in order to stay there. This has not only hurt his game but reputation as well.

Let's call out the true culprit and give the credit to the people that gave them the ring: Shaq, Pau, and Phil.

Kobe hasn't done sh*t for the organization except being the biggest melodramatic cry baby in the history of the sport.

[kizut1659]

That's rich the guy who already had 3 titles career was saved by the guy who did not even have 3 playoff wins to his name. :oldlol:

When is the last time Pau Gasol outplayed his opposing PF in a playoff series? 2-3 years ago?

Thats not the point. Without Pau, Kobe would not have won in 2009 and 2010 period . . . and probably would have had another meltdown ala summer of 2007 and gotten traded. Kobe owes his status as top 10 GOAT to Pau.

[swag2011]

lol this thread is like a kobe hater's congregation lol.

carry on kobe haters, im quite entertained

[Yao Ming's Foot]

Thats not the point. Without Pau, Kobe would not have won in 2009 and 2010 period . . . and probably would have had another meltdown ala summer of 2007 and gotten traded. Kobe owes his status as top 10 GOAT to Pau.

The myth is that Kobe's legendary status relies on rings. The truth is that if you throw out all rings (since no player wins rings on their own) Kobe's resume is on par with anybody else's in the top 10.

Is the same true for Pau Gasol?

[The Mamba]

Gasol has needed to be traded since his performance in the 2011 playoffs. He clearly didn't give a damn, and hasn't in some time. Last time he played well was for Spain in this year's Olympics.

[IamRAMBO24]

Gasol has needed to be traded since his performance in the 2011 playoffs. He clearly didn't give a damn, and hasn't in some time. Last time he played well was for Spain in this year's Olympics.

Did you even know what happened?

He fell off his game because of some stupid drama with Kobe's wife. It had nothing to do with what happened on the court; from that point on, the team chemistry was killed and Pau was treated by Kobe as another hasbeen who belongs at the end of the bench.

[dazzer87]

Pau should put the big boy pants and either call out Kobe back or demand a trade. The amount of disrespect and shit he takes from Kobe is astounding (see e.g. Kobe saying he needs to be "black swan" or Kobe bitching at him last year during playoffs). The reality is that Pau in some ways saved Kobe's career, as without him Kobe would never have won in 2009 and 2010 and would be foreever known as a chucker who could not win without Shaq. Kobe is an ungrateful shit, but Pau should stand up for himself already, this is getting ridiculous.
This

[The Mamba]

Did you even know what happened?
You're not educating me, son.

What actually happened was Shannon Brown was going balls deep in soon to be Miss Gasol.

Kobe's wife spouted it out and the drama of losing his soon to be prize wife cause Gasol to go into a depression. Played like crap, was apathetic. And has never been the same since.

There was always clearly a love / hate on court relationship between Kobe and Gasol. What Vanessa did took things to another level.

That's why I said, he's needed to be traded for sometime now.

:facepalm

[IamRAMBO24]

You're not educating me, son.

What actually happened was Shannon Brown was going balls deep in soon to be Miss Gasol.

Kobe's wife spouted it out and the drama of losing his soon to be prize wife cause Gasol to go into a depression. Played like crap, was apathetic. And has never been the same since.

There was always clearly a love / hate on court relationship between Kobe and Gasol. What Vanessa did took things to another level.

That's why I said, he's needed to be traded for sometime now.

:facepalm

Why would the team leader let personal bullsh*t get in the way of the game, hence this supports my argument that Kobe is not a true leader. Thank you.

[The Mamba]

Why would the team leader let personal bullsh*t get in the way of the game
We're talking about Gasol. Are you dense? I wasn't even talking about Kobe.

Gasol let it get in the way of his game. And he's suffered ever since. He needs a change of scenery to get re-motivated. Or remain apathetic and debbie downer on the Lakers for things not going his way.


this supports my argument that Kobe is not a true leader. Thank you.
WTF are you talking about child? When were you and I having an argument about Kobe as a leader?

You sound like a stupid broken record. It wasn't even the topic of conversation which I posted on, and you felt the need to respond with facts we all know about.

Gasol needs to be traded, that was my point. Has nothing to do with Bryant, or his leadership (or lack there of) abilities.

Get off your high horse. Only good thing about seeing you post is your avatar. STFU

[kizut1659]

The myth is that Kobe's legendary status relies on rings. The truth is that if you throw out all rings (since no player wins rings on their own) Kobe's resume is on par with anybody else's in the top 10.

Is the same true for Pau Gasol?

Without 2009 and 2010 rings Kobe would still be a HOFer obviously and top 20 GOAT but not top 10. There is no other top 10 player who never won a championship as an undisputed alpha-dog - which Kobe did not untill 2009.

[Yao Ming's Foot]

Without 2009 and 2010 rings Kobe would still be a HOFer obviously and top 20 GOAT but not top 10. There is no other top 10 player who never won a championship as an undisputed alpha-dog - which Kobe did not untill 2009.

The only guards in the conversation are Jordan, Magic, Oscar and West and among them only Jordan and Magic have that mythical distinction. :confusedshrug:

[kizut1659]

The only guards in the conversation are Jordan, Magic, Oscar and West and among them only Jordan and Magic have that mythical distinction. :confusedshrug:

The consensus on top 10 are Jordan, Magic, Bird, Russel, Wilt, Bird, Duncan, Shaq, Olajuwan, and (not counting Kobe) M. Malone. All of them won as the leaders of the team.

[secund2nun]

Overrated Kobe never wins unless his teammates are playing at an elite or very good level. A dominant player, which Kobe has never been at any point of his career, can drag trash or subpar casts far.... very far- like to 55+ wins, the conference semifinals, the conference finals, sometimes even the finals. A player like Shaq, Lebron, Hakeem, Duncan, KG has done that. A player like Kobe, Wade, McGrady results in being knocked out in the first round if they attempt that.

[M.Bustly15A5RU8]

Overrated Kobe never wins unless his teammates are playing at an elite or very good level. A dominant player, which Kobe has never been at any point of his career, can drag trash or subpar casts far.... very far- like to 55+ wins, the conference semifinals, the conference finals, sometimes even the finals. A player like Shaq, Lebron, Hakeem, Duncan, KG has done that. A player like Kobe, Wade, McGrady results in being knocked out in the first round if they attempt that.

He's not an all time great impact player.

[Mr. Jabbar]

Overrated Kobe never wins unless his teammates are playing at an elite or very good level. A dominant player, which Kobe has never been at any point of his career, can drag trash or subpar casts far.... very far- like to 55+ wins, the conference semifinals, the conference finals, sometimes even the finals. A player like Shaq, Lebron, Hakeem, Duncan, KG has done that. A player like Kobe, Wade, McGrady results in being knocked out in the first round if they attempt that.

Lol Lebron couldn't even win DESPITE his teammtes playing very good in the 2011 Finals.

Troll better.

[Yao Ming's Foot]

The consensus on top 10 are Jordan, Magic, Bird, Russel, Wilt, Bird, Duncan, Shaq, Olajuwan, and (not counting Kobe) M. Malone. All of them won as the leaders of the team.

Now I remember. The common feeling when the Lakers won in 2009 was that finally Kobe can get past Moses freaking Malone on the all time charts. :oldlol: Not that he was chasing Shaq, Duncan, Magic and Jordan. Averaging nearly 30 points a playoff game might not mean anything to you but most people out of high school don't just throw out rings because they were not better than prime Shaq when they won them.

[Yao Ming's Foot]

Overrated Kobe never wins unless his teammates are playing at an elite or very good level. A dominant player, which Kobe has never been at any point of his career, can drag trash or subpar casts far.... very far- like to 55+ wins, the conference semifinals, the conference finals, sometimes even the finals. A player like Shaq, Lebron, Hakeem, Duncan, KG has done that. A player like Kobe, Wade, McGrady results in being knocked out in the first round if they attempt that.

Kobe has won 5 rings with only 1 all star/ HOF teammate per title team...

Unprecedented in history. :confusedshrug:

[secund2nun]

Lol Lebron couldn't even win DESPITE his teammtes playing very good in the 2011 Finals.

Troll better.

2007 NBA finals. Also the numerous ECF finals he dragged his mediocre supporting cast to.

Also in the 2004 NBA finals Shaq was insane but Kobe cost them that- but that's beside the point.

Prime Kobe could not even with a playoff series in he 3 chances he got which were the 3 seasons after Shaq and before Gasol. That is McGrady like- because that's the level of player Kobe is.

[clayton]

Publicly gives the team to Dwight, takes 28 shots anyways. :roll: :roll: :roll: :roll:

[secund2nun]

Kobe has won 5 rings with only 1 all star/ HOF teammate per title team...

Unprecedented in history. :confusedshrug:

He played with peak Shaq who can be argued as the GOAT peak player- one top 3 at least. Shaq was the top dog who drew the doubles on those 3 pete teams. Then the 2009-2010 teams were balanced talented teams with Gasol, Bynum, Odom.

When he had no all stars he could not get past the first round.

[kizut1659]

Now I remember. The common feeling when the Lakers won in 2009 was that finally Kobe can get past Moses freaking Malone on the all time charts. :oldlol: Not that he was chasing Shaq, Duncan, Magic and Jordan. Averaging nearly 30 points a playoff game might not mean anything to you but most people out of high school don't just throw out rings because they were not better than prime Shaq when they won them.

Well, the common feeling was that Kobe can now get past Moses, West, Robertson etc. I have always one of the biggest defenders of Kobe and always argued that it is not fair to compare his role's to Pippen's in 2001 and 2002. Noone is talking about "throwing out rings." All i was saying is that without the Gasol trade, Kobe would have been known as a great player who won with primetime Shaq in his early 20s and then spent the rest of his careers putting up big numbers but never again winning the big one. It would be a huge blight on his resume and he would not be considered a top 10 player by anyone but hus uber fanboys.

[TryToBeUnbias]

Interested in seeing how he continues to handle all this scrutiny.

[Yao Ming's Foot]

He played with peak Shaq who can be argued as the GOAT peak player- one top 3 at least. Shaq was the top dog who drew the doubles on those 3 pete teams. Then the 2009-2010 teams were balanced talented teams with Gasol, Bynum, Odom.

When he had no all stars he could not get past the first round.

Its not unusual for legends to not beat playoff teams on par with the Suns without any all star teammates.

Gasol was his single all star teammate. Bynum was a one legged part time player in the postseason and Odom was slightly above average. Those are just the facts.

Jordan had Pippen then Pippen AND Rodman. Bird had 3-4 HOFers per title team. Magic famously had Kareem AND Worthy. Wilt/West/Oscar/Kareem all played in various title winning combinations.

Where do you get this idea that you other legendary players win titles on their own, without a single all star teammate?

[secund2nun]

Its not unusual for legends to not beat playoff teams on par with the Suns without any all star teammates.

Gasol was his single all star teammate. Bynum was a one legged part time player in the postseason and Odom was slightly above average. Those are just the facts.

Jordan had Pippen then Pippen AND Rodman. Bird had 3-4 HOFers per title team. Magic famously had Kareem AND Worthy. Wilt/West/Oscar/Kareem all played in various title winning combinations.

Where do you get this idea that you other legendary players win titles on their own, without a single all star teammate?

Amare was out for the entire series in one of those years. The suns minus Amare are more than capable of being beat. And it wasn't just that season- it was 2 others as well- once they missed the playoffs and the other they lost to a full strength Suns. A dominant player would have won a few playoff series in 3 seasons in that situation, especially if they were in their prime like Kobe was then.

I did not say a legendary player should win a title by themselves. They should at least win a playoff series by themselves, let alone in 3 chances while they are in their prime. Kobe is not at that level which is why he could not do that.

Also even when he had great teammates, Shaq was by far the best players on those teams. On the 2009, 2010 teams Kobe was not the best by a large margin and did not even come close to consistently dominating in those playoffs and finals like Jordan, Duncan, Shaq, Magic, Hakeem, etc. He is just not at that level.

[Yao Ming's Foot]

Amare was out for the entire series in one of those years. The suns minus Amare are more than capable of being beat. And it wasn't just that season- it was 2 others as well- once they missed the playoffs and the other they lost to a full strength Suns. A dominant player would have won a few playoff series in 3 seasons in that situation, especially if they were in their prime like Kobe was then.

I did not say a legendary player should win a title by themselves. They should at least win a playoff series by themselves, let alone in 3 chances while they are in their prime. Kobe is not at that level which is why he could not do that.

Also even when he had great teammates, Shaq was by far the best players on those teams. On the 2009, 2010 teams Kobe was not the best by a large margin and did not even come close to consistently dominating in those playoffs and finals like Jordan, Duncan, Shaq, Magic, Hakeem, etc. He is just not at that level.

You don't find it a bit silly to be harping on three seasons in between 7 finals appearances and 5 rings?

Those Suns teams were 2 seeds and featured anywhere from 2-3 all stars including the MVP. If you can show me any history of legendary players defeating playoff teams of those caliber without any all star help not to mention mediocre team defense I'd be happy to look at it.

[bdreason]

Pretty sure Pau was on the bench when the Lakers were getting scorched in the 4th quarter.

[CAstill]

Pretty sure Pau played horrible all night which contributed
to the team losing and his ass sitting on the bench in the fourth

[chazzy]

Wrong forum. Stop posting unrelated Laker topics in the Wilt forum

[kizut1659]

Pretty sure Pau was on the bench when the Lakers were getting scorched in the 4th quarter.

Lakers were leading by 1 when he left. Thats just like Kobe scapegoating him after loss to Oklahoma in last year's playoffs when Kobe went like 12 for 30.

[kizut1659]

Its not unusual for legends to not beat playoff teams on par with the Suns without any all star teammates.

Gasol was his single all star teammate. Bynum was a one legged part time player in the postseason and Odom was slightly above average. Those are just the facts.

Jordan had Pippen then Pippen AND Rodman. Bird had 3-4 HOFers per title team. Magic famously had Kareem AND Worthy. Wilt/West/Oscar/Kareem all played in various title winning combinations.

Where do you get this idea that you other legendary players win titles on their own, without a single all star teammate?

You are improperly comparing different eras. Everyone knows that in the 70s-80s, before all the expansions, many teams had multiple HOFs. Thats just how it was. By the mid-90s it changed, but Rodman is very much a bordeline HOFer. With respect to 2000s, ALL teams had basically 1 or 2 all-stars/HOFers except for Boston and San Antonio. In winning his 2009 and 2010 championships, the only team Lakers beat who had more than 2 all-stars were Boston in 2010. . . where Kobe played like crapp for half the series and was saved by Gasol, Fisher, and Artest.

[Yao Ming's Foot]

You are improperly comparing different eras. Everyone knows that in the 70s-80s, before all the expansions, many teams had multiple HOFs. Thats just how it was. By the mid-90s it changed, but Rodman is very much a bordeline HOFer. With respect to 2000s, ALL teams had basically 1 or 2 all-stars/HOFers except for Boston and San Antonio. In winning his 2009 and 2010 championships, the only team Lakers beat who had more than 2 all-stars were Boston in 2010. . . where Kobe played like crapp for half the series and was saved by Gasol, Fisher, and Artest.

You could limit the conversation to just the top 10 players of this era if you wish. None of them had more success with lesser teammates than Kobe Bryant. :confusedshrug:

Kobe had Shaq or Gasol
Shaq had Kobe or Wade
Duncan had Manu AND Parker
Garnett had Pierce AND Allen
Lebron had Bosh AND Wade
Wade had Shaq or Lebron AND Bosh

The only team to win a title in recent memory without a couple HOFers or all stars were the 04 Pistons AKA one of the greatest defenses of all time.

[secund2nun]

You don't find it a bit silly to be harping on three seasons in between 7 finals appearances and 5 rings?

Those Suns teams were 2 seeds and featured anywhere from 2-3 all stars including the MVP. If you can show me any history of legendary players defeating playoff teams of those caliber without any all star help not to mention mediocre team defense I'd be happy to look at it.

Well many players could have defeated the Suns minus Amare. Then one season they failed to make the playoffs. So even ignoring the Kobe losing to the Suns with Amare and Nash that one season, the other 2 seasons are inexcusable.

No I don't because those 3 seasons prove it all. Also even on the title teams Kobe has never been dominant like Hakeem, Shaq, Magic, Jordan, Lebron, KG, Barkley. etc. He is just not at that level. He is at the McGrady, Wade level.

[Odinn]

Has not Kobe done with calling out his teammates on the media?:facepalm

What a great, true leader. Still not capable of being a team leader if it's not on the media.


PS: Let the guy obsessed with DRtg go. He's a proven delusional Kobe-stan.

[Yao Ming's Foot]

Well many players could have defeated the Suns minus Amare. Then one season they failed to make the playoffs. So even ignoring the Kobe losing to the Suns with Amare and Nash that one season, the other 2 seasons are inexcusable.

No I don't because those 3 seasons prove it all. Also even on the title teams Kobe has never been dominant like Hakeem, Shaq, Magic, Jordan, Lebron, KG, Barkley. etc. He is just not at that level. He is at the McGrady, Wade level.

The Suns featured up to 4 all stars Joe Johnson, Amare, Marion and Nash. The idea that losing Amare put their team on par with the Lakers is silly. The Suns just couldnt get past the Spurs (a legendary player teamed up with a couple HOF guards :confusedshrug: )

I don't have any idea what you believe the word "dominant" means :facepalm

[Mr. Incredible]

What a great leader :applause:

Humiliating his teammates in the media.

Kobe's a bitch

[secund2nun]

You could limit the conversation to just the top 10 players of this era if you wish. None of them had more success with lesser teammates than Kobe Bryant. :confusedshrug:

Kobe had Shaq or Gasol
Shaq had Kobe or Wade
Duncan had Manu AND Parker
Garnett had Pierce AND Allen
Lebron had Bosh AND Wade
Wade had Shaq or Lebron AND Bosh

The only team to win a title in recent memory without a couple HOFers or all stars were the 04 Pistons AKA one of the greatest defenses of all time.

Kobe and Gasol were 1A and 1B. Kobe played at the level of Gasol throughout those playoffs. It was not like Shaq- Kobe where Shaq was by far the best player and dominated or Jordan and Pippen where Jordan was clear top dog despite Shaq and Jordan taking up the doubles unlike Kobe. Kobe played like crap in many entire series and games like 6-24 in game 7 yet they still won because they are a balanced team.

Duncan was by far the best on the Spurs. Took up the doubles, was the defensive anchor, and he still dominated consistently...all unlike Kobe.

Lebron was playing with a one kneed Wade and Bosh was out for the Boston series for example yet Lebron still lead them past it. Lebron led trash to the 2007 finals and the ECF countless times.

The media can't rewrite the truth. Kobe and Gasol is not like Jordan and Pippen, Shaq and Kobe, Duncan and Manu/Parker. It is 1A and 1B.

[senelcoolidge]

The lakers are a mess. Why did they hire D'Antoni..terrible fit for that roster. Kobe needs to look at himself. He's part of the problem. Nash can't run and gun anymore. lakers are becoming an embarrassment. Gasol needs to ask for a trade. He could really help another team.

[scandisk_]

Pretty sure Pau was on the bench when the Lakers were getting scorched in the 4th quarter.

ether..

[DatAsh]

Kobe and Gasol were 1A and 1B. Kobe played at the level of Gasol throughout those playoffs. It was not like Shaq- Kobe where Shaq was by far the best player and dominated or Jordan and Pippen where Jordan was clear top dog despite Shaq and Jordan taking up the doubles unlike Kobe. Kobe played like crap in many entire series and games like 6-24 in game 7 yet they still won because they are a balanced team.

Duncan was by far the best on the Spurs. Took up the doubles, was the defensive anchor, and he still dominated consistently...all unlike Kobe.

Lebron was playing with a one kneed Wade and Bosh was out for the Boston series for example yet Lebron still lead them past it. Lebron led trash to the 2007 finals and the ECF countless times.

The media can't rewrite the truth. Kobe and Gasol is not like Jordan and Pippen, Shaq and Kobe, Duncan and Manu/Parker. It is 1A and 1B.

Kobe and Shaq were closer in both talent and impact than Kobe and Gasol; one series doesn't change that fact.

[G-train]

What do big boy pants look like?

[Heavincent]

Kobe and Gasol were 1A and 1B. Kobe played at the level of Gasol throughout those playoffs. It was not like Shaq- Kobe where Shaq was by far the best player and dominated or Jordan and Pippen where Jordan was clear top dog despite Shaq and Jordan taking up the doubles unlike Kobe. Kobe played like crap in many entire series and games like 6-24 in game 7 yet they still won because they are a balanced team.

Duncan was by far the best on the Spurs. Took up the doubles, was the defensive anchor, and he still dominated consistently...all unlike Kobe.

Lebron was playing with a one kneed Wade and Bosh was out for the Boston series for example yet Lebron still lead them past it. Lebron led trash to the 2007 finals and the ECF countless times.

The media can't rewrite the truth. Kobe and Gasol is not like Jordan and Pippen, Shaq and Kobe, Duncan and Manu/Parker. It is 1A and 1B.

:roll:

[Money 23]

Kobe and Gasol had the biggest point differential from a #1 and #2 scorer since MJ and Pippen.

[secund2nun]

The Suns featured up to 4 all stars Joe Johnson, Amare, Marion and Nash. The idea that losing Amare put their team on par with the Lakers is silly. The Suns just couldnt get past the Spurs (a legendary player teamed up with a couple HOF guards :confusedshrug: )

I don't have any idea what you believe the word "dominant" means :facepalm


The suns team is beatable even when healthy, especially without Amare. Prime Shaq would have wrecked that team. So would Hakeem, Jordan, Lebron, Magic etc.

Also it's not just that. Kobe and LA lost in 5 to a fully healthy Suns team. At least put up a fight not fall in 5 games if you are gonna lose. Lebron took a superior Boston to 7 in 2008 for example.

[Yao Ming's Foot]

The suns team is beatable even when healthy, especially without Amare. Prime Shaq would have wrecked that team. So would Hakeem, Jordan, Lebron, Magic etc.

Also it's not just that. Kobe and LA lost in 5 to a fully healthy Suns team. At least put up a fight not fall in 5 games if you are gonna lose. Lebron took a superior Boston to 7 in 2008 for example.

I don't know why you are listing hypothetical fantasy simulations. Im sure there is plenty of real NBA history for you to cite. Lets see all of these legendary players beating multiple all star teams without any all star teammates. Cite them. I'm sure you can come up with something better than Lebron losing in 7 games. :facepalm

[secund2nun]

Kobe and Gasol had the biggest point differential from a #1 and #2 scorer since MJ and Pippen.

Because Kobe takes all of the shots. There is more to the game than scoring. Also his efficiency in scoring is not that good (minus this season, but it will continue to go down to his averages), in the playoffs its even worse.

[kizut1659]

You could limit the conversation to just the top 10 players of this era if you wish. None of them had more success with lesser teammates than Kobe Bryant. :confusedshrug:

Kobe had Shaq or Gasol
Shaq had Kobe or Wade
Duncan had Manu AND Parker
Garnett had Pierce AND Allen
Lebron had Bosh AND Wade
Wade had Shaq or Lebron AND Bosh

The only team to win a title in recent memory without a couple HOFers or all stars were the 04 Pistons AKA one of the greatest defenses of all time.

Bulshit. 2006 Heat as you pointed, only had 2 all-stars. 2003 Spurs basically just had Duncan - Parker was a 2nd year 3 years removed from his 1st all-star team and Ginnobli was a bench player average 9.5 points on 38% shooting. 2011 Mavs just had Dirk.

[TheBigVeto]

kobe should shut up and stop fukking around himself.
he basically gave away the lead when he re-entered the game at the end of the first half.
the lakers were playing well and had the lead, but then ol beanhead reemerges.
plays like shit himself and calls out his teammate. horrible.
:facepalm

This.

[NumberSix]

Kobe is a phaggit for this.

[kuniva_dAMiGhTy]

Single-handedly made me quit being a Lakers fan. Well him and Shaq.

Guy is just a cancer. Always has been, always will be.

[Heavincent]

Single-handedly made me quit being a Lakers fan. Well him and Shaq.

Guy is just a cancer. Always has been, always will be.

If he's a cancer, then I wish my favorite teams had a cancer like him :lol

I don't get it though. You stopped being a fan because of the best or second best player in Lakers history? :confusedshrug:

[kuniva_dAMiGhTy]

If he's a cancer, then I wish my favorite teams had a cancer :lol

I don't get it though. You stopped being a fan because of the best or second best player in Lakers history? :confusedshrug:

I hate his attitude. He's a cocky/spoiled douchebag. The feud w/ Shaq was a huge turnoff (and the straw that broke the camels back, for me at least).

Because of Kobe, I simply cannot root for the Lakers.

[longtime lurker]

Single-handedly made me quit being a Lakers fan. Well him and Shaq.

Guy is just a cancer. Always has been, always will be.

Yes he's a cancer and one of the most successful NBA players in league history. lol you might want to get yourself reacquainted with the definition of team cancer.

[The-Legend-24]

Kobe and Gasol were 1A and 1B. Kobe played at the level of Gasol throughout those playoffs. It was not like Shaq- Kobe where Shaq was by far the best player and dominated or Jordan and Pippen where Jordan was clear top dog despite Shaq and Jordan taking up the doubles unlike Kobe. Kobe played like crap in many entire series and games like 6-24 in game 7 yet they still won because they are a balanced team.

Duncan was by far the best on the Spurs. Took up the doubles, was the defensive anchor, and he still dominated consistently...all unlike Kobe.

Lebron was playing with a one kneed Wade and Bosh was out for the Boston series for example yet Lebron still lead them past it. Lebron led trash to the 2007 finals and the ECF countless times.

The media can't rewrite the truth. Kobe and Gasol is not like Jordan and Pippen, Shaq and Kobe, Duncan and Manu/Parker. It is 1A and 1B.
:roll: :roll:

[NumberSix]

Kobes Brian needs to put on his big girl panties and play some D.

[kuniva_dAMiGhTy]

Yes he's a cancer and one of the most successful NBA players in league history. lol you might want to get yourself reacquainted with the definition of team cancer.

Problem I have w/ Kobe is also his super fans. All you idiots are blinded to reality by your homerism. Like he won 5 rings by himself or some shit. No teammates. No help. Just a 1v5 out there. :oldlol:

[NumberSix]

Problem I have w/ Kobe is also his super fans. All you idiots are blinded to reality by your homerism. Like he won 5 rings by himself or some shit. No teammates. No help. Just a 1v5 out there. :oldlol:
This dudes FIRST ring was a veterans ring. He barely did anything that entire finals series. He got a Juwan Howard ring in 2000.

[longtime lurker]

Problem I have w/ Kobe is also his super fans. All you idiots are blinded to reality by your homerism. Like he won 5 rings by himself or some shit. No teammates. No help. Just a 1v5 out there. :oldlol:

Yeah for sure that's exactly what I was getting at. :applause: Great reading comprehension you have

[chazzy]

This dudes FIRST ring was a veterans ring. He barely did anything that entire finals series. He got a Juwan Howard ring in 2000.
Fake Laker fan. He was a top 10 player that year despite his horrid finals. And even then, he had that huge overtime game. Juwon Howard ring?? :roll:

[kuniva_dAMiGhTy]

This dudes FIRST ring was a veterans ring. He barely did anything that entire finals series. He got a Juwan Howard ring in 2000.

I wouldn't go that far, but yeah, Shaq did some serious heavy lifting.

[SpecialQue]

At this point, even though he's my favorite player, I want the Lakers to trade Pau. They picked the worst coach for Pau to play under, and it's clear that he doesn't enjoy being on the team anymore and isn't being respected by his teammates and coach. I can't help but think he'd be doing better on practically any other team in the league right now.

Ideally, I'd like to see Pau in Minny or Miami, but who knows what the Lakers would want in return. Of course I want to Lakers to get good players in a trade so they don't look too pathetic when crashing and burning against the opposition, but some of the trade ideas bounced around seem inadequate.

Regardless of what happens, the constant scapegoating of Pau is disgusting, and shows how classless both the franchise and its fans are at times.

[NumberSix]

Fake Laker fan. He was a top 10 player that year despite his horrid finals. And even then, he had that huge overtime game. Juwon Howard ring?? :roll:
Lol. That's all I said. He had a bad finals. You obviously agree, so what's the controversy? :confusedshrug:

[Heavincent]

NumberSix is going full retard.

[NumberSix]

At this point, even though he's my favorite player, I want the Lakers to trade Pau. They picked the worst coach for Pau to play under, and it's clear that he doesn't enjoy being on the team anymore and isn't being respected by his teammates and coach. I can't help but think he'd be doing better on practically any other team in the league right now.

Ideally, I'd like to see Pau in Minny or Miami, but who knows what the Lakers would want in return. Of course I want to Lakers to get good players in a trade so they don't look too pathetic when crashing and burning against the opposition, but some of the trade ideas bounced around seem inadequate.

Regardless of what happens, the constant scapegoating of Pau is disgusting, and shows how classless both the franchise and its fans are at times.
They want to trade Jordan Hill too. If they do that, I'm fuqing done with the Lakers. Go right ahead Lakers. Trade Pau and Hill only to have your other big walk as a free agent at the end of this fiasco of a season.

[longtime lurker]

At this point, even though he's my favorite player, I want the Lakers to trade Pau. They picked the worst coach for Pau to play under, and it's clear that he doesn't enjoy being on the team anymore and isn't being respected by his teammates and coach. I can't help but think he'd be doing better on practically any other team in the league right now.

Ideally, I'd like to see Pau in Minny or Miami, but who knows what the Lakers would want in return. Of course I want to Lakers to get good players in a trade so they don't look too pathetic when crashing and burning against the opposition, but some of the trade ideas bounced around seem inadequate.

Regardless of what happens, the constant scapegoating of Pau is disgusting, and shows how classless both the franchise and its fans are at times.

:facepalm jesus Christ so there shouldn't be any accountability on Pau's behalf.

[NumberSix]

NumberSix is going full retard.
How come you NEVER talk about the Nets? Isn't that allegedly your team? Or is it the Sixers? One of those. It's strange, because all I ever see you doing is Kobetarding it up.

[NumberSix]

:facepalm jesus Christ so there shouldn't be any accountability on Pau's behalf.
Of course not. Having no accountability is Kobe's job.

[longtime lurker]

Of course not. Having no accountability is Kobe's job.

:confusedshrug: you keep posting like you're making any valid points.

[SpecialQue]

:facepalm jesus Christ so there shouldn't be any accountability on Pau's behalf.

Pau's been playing like shit lately, I'm not going to deny that. He's also the only one who is constantly bashed about it, and ignored when he plays well. Hell, Dwight's not getting enough shit about last night's loss, even though it's a fact that if he made more of his free throws, the Lakers would have won.

[poido123]

They want to trade Jordan Hill too. If they do that, I'm fuqing done with the Lakers. Go right ahead Lakers. Trade Pau and Hill only to have your other big walk as a free agent at the end of this fiasco of a season.

Shame, you shouldn't stop supporting the Lakers for any reason. Through thick and thin man. I do respect that you call out Kobe though without bias, wish some of the other Laker fans were able to do the same. Heavensent, Kennethgriffin, Alphawolf, fatal9, and co. defend kobe to the death, without any comprehension or commonsense.

[NumberSix]

Shame, you shouldn't stop supporting the Lakers for any reason. Through thick and thin man. I do respect that you call out Kobe though without bias, wish some of the other Laker fans were able to do the same. Heavensent, Kennethgriffin, Alphawolf, fatal9, and co. defend kobe to the death, without any comprehension or commonsense.
I don't believe in supporting a team blindly. I believe teams have to EARN their fans.

[longtime lurker]

Pau's been playing like shit lately, I'm not going to deny that. He's also the only one who is constantly bashed about it, and ignored when he plays well. Hell, Dwight's not getting enough shit about last night's loss, even though it's a fact that if he made more of his free throws, the Lakers would have won.

Whaaat? Kobe, Howard and D'Antoni are all getting criticism what the hell are you watching? The fact still remains that while Kobe and Dwight have had more brilliant games than completely god awful games while the same can't be said about Gasol. Gasol hasn't been championship Gasol for the past 3 years and I'm sorry but if he starts sulking because his teammates want him to play better than everyone questioning his toughness is right. Right now he's being outplayed by Metta World Peace, let that sink in Metta ****ing World Peace is the Lakers 3rd best player. No way is Pau to blame for everything the whole team needs to play better but that doesn't mean Pau should be immune to criticism.

[M.Bustly15A5RU8]

I don't believe in supporting a team blindly. I believe teams have to EARN their fans.

The complete opposite of the idiots that believe that they'll earn Kobe by worshiping him relentlessly.

[Shepseskaf]

Its to the point where I get mad for Pau when Kobe rips him publicly. What's the purpose of doing that, anyway?

Kobe is right, though. Pau needs to put his "big boy pants on" and fire right back at Kobe.

Enough is enough.

[daily]

Its to the point where I get mad for Pau when Kobe rips him publicly. What's the purpose of doing that, anyway?

Kobe is right, though. Pau needs to put his "big boy pants on" and fire right back at Kobe.

Enough is enough. I understand that feeling.


Here's the deal. Kobe is not Mr. politically correct, he doesn't choose his words carefully. Everyone knows it including Pau, Kobe says things that on the surface when read in print don't come off like they did when he said them outloud.

Go to Lakers.com watch the video, it's a whole lot different when you hear what he said about Pau in context with the whole post game session. and the question that was asked. What he says isn't anywhere near as gruff when you listen to the tone and get the context.

[dajadeed]

Not sure what the people defending Pau and killing Kobe are expecting. Anyone who has watched the Lakers for the past 3 years understands that there is a night and day different between Pau in 2010 and present day Pau. He has totally disappeared in the playoffs in 2 straight years.

Yes, there have been many systems. Yes, he might have been "misused." But there is no excusing the sever drop off in on court production from Pau. He is talented enough to "adjust" as Kobe says.

Kobe is "adjusting" just fine as well. I know it's a petty comeback "oh, Kobe just gets to shoot," but dude has bought into whatever system was in place and is doing most playmaking since we're starting a 2nd round PG or Chris Duhon.

Btw, Kobe was benched last year by Brown. He didn't say shit about it but to say he had always had "Brown's back" and came out and played with no effect in the next game. Pau is just too damn sensitive.

[NumberSix]

Not sure what the people defending Pau and killing Kobe are expecting. Anyone who has watched the Lakers for the past 3 years understands that there is a night and day different between Pau in 2010 and present day Pau. He has totally disappeared in the playoffs in 2 straight years.

Yes, there have been many systems. Yes, he might have been "misused." But there is no excusing the sever drop off in on court production from Pau. He is talented enough to "adjust" as Kobe says.

Kobe is "adjusting" just fine as well. I know it's a petty comeback "oh, Kobe just gets to shoot," but dude has bought into whatever system was in place and is doing most playmaking since we're starting a 2nd round PG or Chris Duhon.

Btw, Kobe was benched last year by Brown. He didn't say shit about it but to say he had always had "Brown's back" and came out and played with no effect in the next game. Pau is just too damn sensitive.

Nobody actually thinks Pau is playing well or that Kobe is playing bad. Just frustration with the obsessive Kobe apologists who can never admit to Kobe being even marginally to blame for anything. He can never share ANY of it. It's always anybody else.

[dajadeed]

Nobody actually thinks Pau is playing well or that Kobe is playing bad. Just frustration with the obsessive Kobe apologists who can never admit to Kobe being even marginally to blame for anything. He can never share ANY of it. It's always anybody else.

Well, Kobe sure is hearing about his defense in LA. Kurt Rambis touched on it postgame. That's all that matters.

I was just speaking to the fact that we all know Kobe and it's silly to expect him not to say something because it might hurt someone's feelings. Dude has pretty much been on "uncensored" mode for a few years now. He'll either keep it to himself or avoid talking about a certain player, but he won't sugarcoat what he does offer up.

I'm thinking Pau is gone by January. He is shooting in the 40%s. That is just unacceptable for someone so skilled. I'm hoping for shooters and a ball-handler :D

[Mr. Jabbar]

I don't believe in supporting a team blindly. I believe teams have to EARN their fans.

:facepalm Whatever happened to team fans? every new under-age nba fan on this board is a player dikrider these days. A team is the sports version of a country, you embrace their colors, like a flag. Soldiers come and go, their memory remains but the team will always be there. (srry sonic fans, didnt mean disrespect)

[NumberSix]

Well, Kobe sure is hearing about his defense in LA. Kurt Rambis touched on it postgame. That's all that matters.

I was just speaking to the fact that we all know Kobe and it's silly to expect him not to say something because it might hurt someone's feelings. Dude has pretty much been on "uncensored" mode for a few years now. He'll either keep it to himself or avoid talking about a certain player, but he won't sugarcoat what he does offer up.

I'm thinking Pau is gone by January. He is shooting in the 40%s. That is just unacceptable for someone so skilled. I'm hoping for shooters and a ball-handler :D
Kobe has been fine this season. I even personally had him #3 on my MVP race rankings.

Just remember. Most the negativity towards Kobe on ISH isn't as much about the actual person as they are a backlash to his over the top fans.

[TinselTime12]

Gasol should have said that to Kobe in Game 7 of the 2010 NBA Finals.

[chazzy]

It's sad watching Pau play like this. He looked so good in that gold medal game but he's been awful the past two playoffs and this regular season so far. Unfortunately it's not entirely mental/coaching and he has knee issues which takes away a lot of your natural aggression.

Look at this possession, 2010 Pau would've made an assertive move towards the basket on the first touch, but now he passes it out 3 times to Duhon.. http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_detailpage&v=a-1arpRTkmI#t=91s

[kNIOKAS]

Whaaat? Kobe, Howard and D'Antoni are all getting criticism what the hell are you watching? The fact still remains that while Kobe and Dwight have had more brilliant games than completely god awful games while the same can't be said about Gasol. Gasol hasn't been championship Gasol for the past 3 years and I'm sorry but if he starts sulking because his teammates want him to play better than everyone questioning his toughness is right. Right now he's being outplayed by Metta World Peace, let that sink in Metta ****ing World Peace is the Lakers 3rd best player. No way is Pau to blame for everything the whole team needs to play better but that doesn't mean Pau should be immune to criticism.
I absolutely cannot understand rants like this. You are talking how this player had better games than the other player on the same team! They are on the same team! You cannot expect players compete against each other while playing on the same team... What is this shit.
Now this is one imbecile technique Kobe stans use to attack everybody on the Lakers: But Kobe scores more than [him]! He should step up first!!

:banghead:
That's why you are respected by nobody,

[Shepseskaf]

Here's the deal. Kobe is not Mr. politically correct, he doesn't choose his words carefully.
That's exactly the problem. After nearly two decades in LA, no one knows better than Kobe how his words get blown up by the media. If he needs to go PC to keep peace in the locker room, that's what he should do.

At this point, he's just making himself look bad with this constant dissing of Pau. I don't want to hear the weak excuse that its for "motivation". Kobe is just a %#@% who likes to take shots at weaker people from his "exalted" no-fault position.

Kobe is a team cancer, and apparently Vanessa is no better. I thought they were both all about championships.

[ihoopallday]

Never thought Kobe could be more hated than LeBron, but it's starting to look that way. Come to think of it, has James ever thrown his teammates under the bus?

[Rolando]

Insulting your teammate's manhood = sure fire way to motivate him.:lol

Gasol is the Laker's scapegoat.

[HorryIsMyMVP]

Lol the Lakers would trade Kobe if they could. I bet they are regretting that no trade clause.

[Mr. Jabbar]

Insulting your teammate's manhood = sure fire way to motivate him.:lol

Gasol is the Laker's scapeostrich.

fixed