Trade Rumour - Raps and Lakers

[heavensdevil]

The rumoured trade is Jose Calderon and Andrea Bargnani for Pau Gasol... not sure how I feel about this proposed deal. Apparently the Raptors are the frontrunners to land him if Gasol is traded.

[PyrrhusX]

Sources?

[White Mamba]

The rumoured trade is Jose Calderon and Andrea Bargnani for Pau Gasol... not sure how I feel about this proposed deal. Apparently the Raptors are the frontrunners to land him if Gasol is traded.

Raptors called, Wolves called, Lakers told them they are not dealing him before he play with Nash and they can see how the team look. Per ESPN.

[heavensdevil]

Sources?


Realgm.com - not sure if noting another site is frowned upon...

Yeah, Lakers promised Nash they wouldnt trade Gasol, but they could try and change his mind when he returns.

[bluechox2]

lakers shot it down, said they will wait and see how it goes with nash first

[Overdrive]

The criticism on Pau is that he plays to soft, camps the perimeter to much and now if it doesn't pan out with Nash of all players they'd trade him for Bargnani?

:biggums:

[el gringos]

No way lakers would turn that deal down. This is the ridiculous lakers point of view that toro tow getting the good deal here. If there was a Bargnani for pau deal it would have to be Bargnani, landy fields, and kleiza

[Qwyjibo]

I hope that the Raptors do this but only to flip Gasol to another team later on for long-term assets.

I like Pau and he'd clearly be the best player in this deal but what's the point of getting him for the Raptors? You go from a bad team to a mediocre at-best team. Big deal. Trade for him, hopefully let him build up some value the rest of the year and then trade him in the offseason to a contender. Hopefully the Raptors have a new GM by then that is allowed to properly rebuild this mess of a team.

Calderon is still a good player and would make a great backup for the Lakers. I've said for a long time he'd be a perfect fit in an offense where Kobe does the primary ball-handling, allowing the PG to play off the ball. He's just not a fit on the Raptors anymore.

I honestly don't see why the Lakers would want Bargnani. He is inferior in every single way imaginable to Gasol.

[millwad]

Why would the Raptors do this?

Bargnani is very soft but he's still only 27 years old and he can produce for years to come. Gasol is 5 years older and busted and is declining very quick now..

And Calderon is still a good back-up, one of the better in the league.

[oamjad13]

As a raptors fan, I'd be okay with that deal. Jose is a defensive liability and the less said about Bargnani, the better. I wish we could throw in Kleiza and Fields in this deal too.

[lilgodfather1]

Why would the Raptors do this?

Bargnani is very soft but he's still only 27 years old and he can produce for years to come. Gasol is 5 years older and busted and is declining very quick now..

And Calderon is still a good back-up, one of the better in the league.
I think Bargs was built to play MDA ball tbh. Good range for a big man, and that is what helped make the Suns succesful.

As for Jose he isn't one of the best PG's in the NBA, but he is above average imo. Good shooter, good passer, pretty good Steve Nash replacement when he goes to the bench. He's not the type to go out and lead the team in scoring, but he can nail a wide open jumper to say the least.

[IGOTGAME]

The Lakers will prob do this. I think they want to go all in with bad defense. If they do this trade I'm convinced that this franchise is officially in decline.

Im not denying they would score a lot with this lineup and it might look ok in the regular season. But is gonna flame out when good defensive teams start to gameplan and exploit these matchups.

[r15mohd]

who ever trades for the declining Mr Softee (Gasol) is an idiot...:facepalm

[heavensdevil]

I honestly don't see why the Lakers would want Bargnani. He is inferior in every single way imaginable to Gasol.

Bargs has more long term potential. still hasnt reached his prime... and is deadly from the field. The Lakers probably want to unclog the middle and surround Dwight with more shooters.

Id be sad to see Bargs go though... Ive alway supported him through the ups and downs. Hopefully we can somehow send Fields too... hate that guy.

[bmulls]

who ever trades for the declining Mr Softee (Gasol) is an idiot...:facepalm

He was beasting during the Olympics just a few months ago. It's clear the Lakers aren't getting the most out of him.

[Walker]

Lakers looking to trade one big, white, European scapegoat for another? :lol

[Qwyjibo]

Bargs has more long term potential. still hasnt reached his prime
Bargnani has no potential left. That word needs to never be used again when it comes to Bargnani. He is what he is. He's been the same player for 3years now. A inefficient volume scorer who is basically a negative on the floor when his jump shot is not going in. Unless it's a high school player, what a player does in his 3rd or 4th year is typically what you're going to see going forward.

And isn't the average "prime" for an NBA player generally in the 24-28 age range? Bargnani is right in the middle of his prime. 27 is not "young" in NBA terms.

Sure Bargnani might be around longer in the NBA due to the age gap between him an Gasol. If I'm a team wanting to win a championship in the near future, I'll take a declining Gasol for the next 2-3 years than what Bargnani has been giving the Raptors.

[takai]

Pau for K Love.

[heavensdevil]

Bargnani has no potential left. That word needs to never be used again when it comes to Bargnani. He is what he is. He's been the same player for 3years now. A inefficient volume scorer who is basically a negative on the floor when his jump shot is not going in. Unless it's a high school player, what a player does in his 3rd or 4th year is typically what you're going to see going forward.

And isn't the average "prime" for an NBA player generally in the 24-28 age range? Bargnani is right in the middle of his prime. 27 is not "young" in NBA terms.

Sure Bargnani might be around longer in the NBA due to the age gap between him an Gasol. If I'm a team wanting to win a championship in the near future, I'll take a declining Gasol for the next 2-3 years than what Bargnani has been giving the Raptors.


I agree with pretty much everything you said... hes a liability when hes not scoring and has been disappointing for years...especially as a top pick... but last year he was going OFF before the injury... thats where my little hope for him is coming from... he will blossom under a new system, seems like almost every Raptor that leaves, usually does.

[Zan Tabak]

Pau for K Love.

The sheer notion of this trade makes me laugh. Minnesota would have to be complete tards to do this trade.


As for Bargs/Gasol. As a Raptors fan - Whatever, I give up...

Seems this team will never get the proper rebuild it deserves.

[Whoah10115]

Bargnani has no potential left. That word needs to never be used again when it comes to Bargnani. He is what he is. He's been the same player for 3years now. A inefficient volume scorer who is basically a negative on the floor when his jump shot is not going in. Unless it's a high school player, what a player does in his 3rd or 4th year is typically what you're going to see going forward.

And isn't the average "prime" for an NBA player generally in the 24-28 age range? Bargnani is right in the middle of his prime. 27 is not "young" in NBA terms.

Sure Bargnani might be around longer in the NBA due to the age gap between him an Gasol. If I'm a team wanting to win a championship in the near future, I'll take a declining Gasol for the next 2-3 years than what Bargnani has been giving the Raptors.



A player's prime starts usually around 27. So he's actually getting into his prime. He most certainly has the ability to be better, but I just don't like him. And like I said in another thread, maybe he should be playing SF. Dirk is a subpar defender, but he's intelligent and knows how to play team defense. He's also a solid post defender. And, despite his rebounding totals the last few seasons, in that style defense, Dirk has always been a decent to solid to good rebounder. Bargnani gets good rebounds for a SG and OK for a SF. For a PF, even a stretch one, he's awful. And he hasn't had people taking his rebounds. It's his fault.


Before getting hurt last year, he did look great offensively. It wasn't just about shooting. He was a scorer, who got his own shot. He just plays for a jumpshot. Doesn't even move off the ball to get it.

[jbryan1984]

Seems like that has been the "rumor" for years now.

[heavensdevil]

A player's prime starts usually around 27. So he's actually getting into his prime. He most certainly has the ability to be better, but I just don't like him. And like I said in another thread, maybe he should be playing SF. Dirk is a subpar defender, but he's intelligent and knows how to play team defense. He's also a solid post defender. And, despite his rebounding totals the last few seasons, in that style defense, Dirk has always been a decent to solid to good rebounder. Bargnani gets good rebounds for a SG and OK for a SF. For a PF, even a stretch one, he's awful. And he hasn't had people taking his rebounds. It's his fault.


Before getting hurt last year, he did look great offensively. It wasn't just about shooting. He was a scorer, who got his own shot. He just plays for a jumpshot. Doesn't even move off the ball to get it.

THIS.

[Qwyjibo]

Before getting hurt last year, he did look great offensively. It wasn't just about shooting. He was a scorer, who got his own shot. He just plays for a jumpshot. Doesn't even move off the ball to get it.
That's my big problem with your argument. It was a 13-game stretch. That's a tiny sample size compared to looking at the 2,3 or hell even 4 years. You can't just pick out the absolute best stretch of his career.

Players' production generally doesn't improve much past their 4th year or so. There's always some exceptions but look at the majority of non-high schoolers and it's a strong trend.

Bargnani is what he is. 27 years old and in his 7th season in the NBA. That is an established veteran player. Unless you are banking on him being an exception to the rule, there most likely is no improvement left there.

[Whoah10115]

That's my big problem with your argument. It was a 13-game stretch. That's a tiny sample size compared to looking at the 2,3 or hell even 4 years. You can't just pick out the absolute best stretch of his career.

Players' production generally doesn't improve much past their 4th year or so. There's always some exceptions but look at the majority of non-high schoolers and it's a strong trend.

Bargnani is what he is. 27 years old and in his 7th season in the NBA. That is an established veteran player. Unless you are banking on him being an exception to the rule, there most likely is no improvement left there.



I'm not banking on him. Like I said, I don't particularly like him. He's as soft as it gets. And he's lazy even to get open or dribble. But this is his prime. He was playing center up until last season. Playing him at C is a bigger abomination than Arenas playing PG.


It's one thing to be hot for a stretch; it's another thing to see the improvement. It's been evident in DeAndre Jordan's game this year. Last year, he clearly looked different. He was initiating offense. It was thru his own scoring, but he clearly has a high ceiling as a scorer. I'm not gonna bank on a guy for that stretch, but it was clear that he has the talent.

[miggyme1]

Pau gasol for derozan

[Cermet]

I heard the wolves offered Pekovic and Derrick Williams if I was the lakers I would take that offer.
People forget that Pekovic is good.

[bih]

:roll: :roll: :roll: at anyone wanting Andrea

Hedo 2.0 no heart, cant run down floor, rebound, Kobe would ride his angus till Andrea either asked for buyout or quit basketball

Calderon on other hand would be perfect for Lakers.

[Levity]

I heard the wolves offered Pekovic and Derrick Williams if I was the lakers I would take that offer.
People forget that Pekovic is good.

pekovic is great. but wouldnt work in MDA's offense nor would he look comfortable next to dwight. Two big bodies that take up the paint.

If atl is interested, La should accept the minny deal, but instead use atl as a 3rd team (trade pek and dwill to the hawks) and take back josh smith

minny gets what they want

atl gets a legit center to pair up with horford in the front court. theyd easily become one of the best front courts in the east

la gets a player who can run in mda's system but more importantly, they get a player who can provide great D next to howard. not to mention, this would keep howard happy throughout the season.

[Real Men Wear Green]

D'Antoni is the ideal coach for Bargs if you feel the best thing for Bargnani is not to have his deficiencies challenged or grow in any way, just go out and shoot quick and don't worry about rebounding and D. If you just want to see him babied it's the perfect marriage.

[Levity]

D'Antoni is the ideal coach for Bargs if you feel the best thing for Bargnani is not to have his deficiencies challenged or grow in any way, just go out and shoot quick and don't worry about rebounding and D. If you just want to see him babied it's the perfect marriage.

and thats the exact reason i wouldnt want him to join la. offense is not the problem. though, having calderon as the back up pg would be great.

[Cermet]

pekovic is great. but wouldnt work in MDA's offense nor would he look comfortable next to dwight. Two big bodies that take up the paint.

If atl is interested, La should accept the minny deal, but instead use atl as a 3rd team (trade pek and dwill to the hawks) and take back josh smith

minny gets what they want

atl gets a legit center to pair up with horford in the front court. theyd easily become one of the best front courts in the east

la gets a player who can run in mda's system but more importantly, they get a player who can provide great D next to howard. not to mention, this would keep howard happy throughout the season.

Maybe Derrick Williams would fit but we still don't know what we have in him. Pekovic would be a backup center. But I guess I wouldn't want that for him. So yeah your 3 team idea is good.
But I just wonder why does Minny want to get rid of Pekovic?

[Levity]

But I just wonder why does Minny want to get rid of Pekovic?

I dont think its so much that they want to get rid of him, but more that they see potential in a rubio gasol tandem. gasols playing like shit. thats news to no one. but hes being underutilized in la and Minnesota knows this and is banking on his hopeful potential.

[bih]

D'Antoni is the ideal coach for Bargs if you feel the best thing for Bargnani is not to have his deficiencies challenged or grow in any way, just go out and shoot quick and don't worry about rebounding and D. If you just want to see him babied it's the perfect marriage.

And then you make playoffs somehow and you expect Andrea to defend Ibaka/Duncan?

[Levity]

And then you make playoffs somehow and you expect Andrea to defend Ibaka/Duncan?

dwight could guard both those players, considering their counter parts (perkins, diaw) arent the biggest offensive threats.

[Real Men Wear Green]

And then you make playoffs somehow and you expect Andrea to defend Ibaka/Duncan?
They don't really post Ibaka, he's a jumpshooter and finisher. That might not be so bad although he might drive you crazy on the glass. And you can also hide Bargs on Perk. Defending TD would be horrible, bu LA would keep him off Duncan as much as possible with Howard.

But I certainly am not going to say trading for Bargs is a good idea, especially not a good big like Gasol. To me the deal only makes sense for LA if they're majorly concerned with Nash's health.

[Kungfro]

And then you make playoffs somehow and you expect Andrea to defend Ibaka/Duncan?

Bargnani's man defense isn't the issue, it's his help defense that's terrible.

[Whoah10115]

And then you make playoffs somehow and you expect Andrea to defend Ibaka/Duncan?



Remember when the league had Patrick Ewing, Hakeem Olajuwon, David Robinson, Shaquille O'Neal, Alonzo Mourning?


How often do you think Patrick played 1v1 on defense? How often was Oak or Mase guarding Hakeem in that Finals? How often did they guard the other guys?


Forgetting that Duncan is playing C, why do you think that -if he was playing PF- that the Lakers couldn't have guard Howard him? Do you not think that's allowed if Duncan is listed at PF? Duncan often guarded Shaq when Duncan was actually playing PF, even with Robinson there. Why? Well, how about keeping Bargnani on him and both keep Howard out of foul trouble and to allow him to control the paint and come over on help. That's why Ewing did. That's what Robinson did a lot of when Duncan was in town, and a million others.


Besides, everyone is always obsessed with "well this guy is gonna kill him" and all that. They say it about Nash. They say it about everyone. I'm not saying go after Bargnani. But they should worry less about nullifying somebody and more about making themselves as good as they can be.

[andremiller07]

and thats the exact reason i wouldnt want him to join la. offense is not the problem. though, having calderon as the back up pg would be great.

My only concern with Cauldron as the back up is that this season hes struggled playing behind Lowry, his stats don't show it cause Lowry has been injured and Jose has got got mins but when he has played 25 mins or less this season hes really struggled in general. Cauldron has shown to be real effective as a starter but hes not quiet figured out the bench role.

[ILLsmak]

The rumoured trade is Jose Calderon and Andrea Bargnani for Pau Gasol... not sure how I feel about this proposed deal. Apparently the Raptors are the frontrunners to land him if Gasol is traded.

lol, I mentioned this before. This is what you call a great trade. Who knows if/when Nash will be injured, and Barg is basically the best player you could put beside Dwight. It'd be crazy to have him operating in that space. With a run n gun offense? ogod.

-Smak

[ILLsmak]

Remember when the league had Patrick Ewing, Hakeem Olajuwon, David Robinson, Shaquille O'Neal, Alonzo Mourning?


How often do you think Patrick played 1v1 on defense? How often was Oak or Mase guarding Hakeem in that Finals? How often did they guard the other guys?


Forgetting that Duncan is playing C, why do you think that -if he was playing PF- that the Lakers couldn't have guard Howard him? Do you not think that's allowed if Duncan is listed at PF? Duncan often guarded Shaq when Duncan was actually playing PF, even with Robinson there. Why? Well, how about keeping Bargnani on him and both keep Howard out of foul trouble and to allow him to control the paint and come over on help. That's why Ewing did. That's what Robinson did a lot of when Duncan was in town, and a million others.


Besides, everyone is always obsessed with "well this guy is gonna kill him" and all that. They say it about Nash. They say it about everyone. I'm not saying go after Bargnani. But they should worry less about nullifying somebody and more about making themselves as good as they can be.

Double post. Not to mention Barg would own them on the other end. And Dwight would help him on D. Barg is an amazing scorer. He's not Dirk, but he's got his own skill set.

-Smak

[Levity]

My only concern with Cauldron as the back up is that this season hes struggled playing behind Lowry, his stats don't show it cause Lowry has been injured and Jose has got got mins but when he has played 25 mins or less this season hes really struggled in general. Cauldron has shown to be real effective as a starter but hes not quiet figured out the bench role.

ye i noticed that too. when lowry was out for those handful of games, calderon put up monster numbers on the offensive end. Now... not so much. I do however think if he was to come to la (personally, im not a big supporter of this trade) MDA would try to limit nash's minutes as best he could, giving calderon a fair chunk of them. Would he produce better off the bench for la? That could go either way.

[boozehound]

The rumoured trade is Jose Calderon and Andrea Bargnani for Pau Gasol... not sure how I feel about this proposed deal. Apparently the Raptors are the frontrunners to land him if Gasol is traded.
actually, its them and kleiza based on the info from much earlier today.

[Kujo]

This deal would only make sense if the Raps plan to flip Gasol in the off-season to get younger. A 32-year old Gasol on this roster makes no sense. I'd rather have Gasol then AB, who clearly has worn out his welcome at this point, but not really at the expense of a full rebuild. I'm tired of the patch-work mediocre mentality. This ship to needs to be blown up.

Those who think AB still has potential are kidding themselves. He is what he is. A one dimensional player, who'll show flashes brilliance offensively, but is content to mainly just jack-up jumpers for better or worse. Plus, he doesn't rebound.

All that being said, he would probably flourish under MDA's system. Kobe would light a fire under-him as well.

Best thing about this is that BC does appear to be willing to part with AB, which I didn't think was possible.

[Nick Young]

Lowry+Bargnani for Gasol

DO IT MITCH

[rhythmic]

Lakers: Paul Millsap
Rockets: Gasol
Jazz: M.Morris, Eric Bledsoe, T.Thompkins, R.White & C.Aldrich
Clippers: D.Cook & Patterson (+ 1st round pick from Rockets)

Houston:

Asik, Gasol, Parsons, Harden & Lin

Cook, Patterson, Morris, White & Aldrich (+ 1st round pick) for Gasol

Lakers:

Howard, Millsap, World Peace, Bryant & Nash

Gasol for Millsap

Jazz:

Jefferson, D.Favors, Evans, Hayward & Bledsoe (plus Morris, White, Aldrich & Thompkins off the bench)

Millsap for Bledsoe, Morris, White, Aldrich & Thompkins

Clippers:

Receive an actual shooting guard and a pretty good prospect at PF in Patterson.

Bledsoe & Thomkins for Cook & Patterson

[Lakers_Kobe_Fan]

[QUOTE=rhythmic

[Skywalker]

Lowry+Bargnani for Gasol

DO IT MITCH

Lowry > Pau and Nash gtfo

[rhythmic]

salaries should work retard...you cant have 19mil going out and coming back only 8.5mil.....

there is no fcuking way Clippers trade bledsoe this year without knowing if CP3 would hang around

Salaries do work retard, If the Clippers don't want to hit the luxury tax threshold they'd have to send Willie Green to one of the three teams. Houston are under the cap...roughly 8 million in cap space remaining AFTER the trade. LOL

Learn something about the CBA before opening your mouth.
Bledsoe for Cook, Patterson & 1st round pick isn't bad value for LAC. They will have a solid shooter who can actually play the 2, a damn nice backup PF & Billups can backup Paul. Plus they'll get a 1st round pick out of the deal.

It's always hard to complete a four-team trade, but I think it makes sense for all four teams involved.

Millsap can spread the floor for the Lakers, as he is a far better mid-range shooter then Gasol. It'll allow Howard to operate in the low-post. Houston gets Gasol and completes a formidable starting five, by giving away a bunch of prospects. Jazz get Bledsoe plus a shit load of nice prospects for Millsap and the Clippers get a solid shooting guard, a nice prospect in Patterson plus a 1st round pick.

[Lakers_Kobe_Fan]

Salaries do work retard, If the Clippers don't want to hit the luxury tax threshold they'd have to send Willie Green to one of the three teams. Houston are under the cap...roughly 8 million in cap space remaining AFTER the trade. LOL

Learn something about the CBA before opening your mouth.
Bledsoe for Cook, Patterson & 1st round pick isn't bad value for LAC. They will have a solid shooter who can actually play the 2, a damn nice backup PF & Billups can backup Paul. Plus they'll get a 1st round pick out of the deal.

It's always hard to complete a four-team trade, but I think it makes sense for all four teams involved.

Millsap can spread the floor for the Lakers, as he is a far better mid-range shooter then Gasol. It'll allow Howard to operate in the low-post. Houston gets Gasol and completes a formidable starting five, by giving away a bunch of prospects. Jazz get Bledsoe plus a shit load of nice prospects for Millsap and the Clippers get a solid shooting guard, a nice prospect in Patterson plus a 1st round pick.

how the fcuk does it work..Jazz send 8.6mil and get back 19mil

lakers send 19mil and get back 8.6????

fcuking put some sh1t in your mouth before telling me about the new cba


Sorry, but this trade does not work.

here is the explanation ...



Due to the L.A. Lakers and Utah being over the cap, the 50% trade rule is invoked. the L.A. Lakers and Utah had to be no more than 150% plus $100,000 of the salary given out, or no more than $5,000,000 (whichever is lesser), for the trade to be accepted, which did not happen here (only the L.A. Lakers met the condition). This trade does not satisfy the provisions of the Collective Bargaining Agreement.


see if you can comprehend what it says.... it means lakers need to get back more then 8.6

I own you a little b!tch that you are...dont respond to my post unless you have some sense to talk about....

[Whoah10115]

[QUOTE=rhythmic

[Sharmer]

The rumoured trade is Jose Calderon and Andrea Bargnani for Pau Gasol... not sure how I feel about this proposed deal. Apparently the Raptors are the frontrunners to land him if Gasol is traded.

would be good for both teams.