Are the Knicks simply a bad match-up for the Heat or are the Heat simply coasting?

[All Net]

Opinions? as thats the 2nd straight game where the Knicks have killed Miami from deep where Miami simply havn't had an answer for their game plan. Is this just down to Miami not playing with effort on D or are there bigger issues here?

[SpaceJammeR]

both.

Knicks are a bad match up and I think having jason kidd and chandler helps a lot. Knicks playing great team ball right now. Miami's lack of big and sh!tty D. idk miami doesn't have that same defensive impact they did like last year or the year before that. they've been trailing in almost all their games and luckily came back to take the w in most of them. spo needs to stop small balling and focus on defense now.

[Clutch]

I would say both.

Miami is better than they played in the first 2 meetings with the Knicks.
But this year's Knicks also match up well with them. Heat likes to run and what gives you a better chance to run than creating turnovers. Knicks are the best team in the league at taking care of the ball so that means less easy points for Miami.
Also the Heat don't have a defensive presence inside,so if you have a great floor spacing like the Knicks have you can really hurt them by either attacking the rim or kicking it out to an open man.
More so the Knicks play in one of the slowest paces in the league which also hurts Miami.

This Knicks team is very much alike the Mavs team that beat the Heat in 2010-11.
Veteran leadership,ball movement,shooting,defense,depth and a go to guy in Melo.

[I<3NBA]

This Knicks team is very much alike the Mavs team that beat the Heat in 2010-11.

not quite. Knicks still need to trade for Barea and Marion.

[pauk]

I would say both.

Miami is better than they played in the first 2 meetings with the Knicks.
But this year's Knicks also match up well with them. Heat likes to run and what gives you a better chance to run than creating turnovers. Knicks are the best team in the league at taking care of the ball so that means less easy points for Miami.
Also the Heat don't have a defensive presence inside,so if you have a great floor spacing like the Knicks have you can really hurt them by either attacking the rim or kicking it out to an open man.
More so the Knicks play in one of the slowest paces in the league which also hurts Miami.

This Knicks team is very much alike the Mavs team that beat the Heat in 2010-11.
Veteran leadership,ball movement,shooting,defense,depth and a go to guy in Melo.

I like that comparison... and oh, they do got that same Tyson Chandler aswell, the DPOY guy.. Knicks are definitely better than last year :)

[All Net]

Who knew Felton would be this good after last year?

[francesco totti]

that mavs team was very dirk dependant. Dirk had players that suit him perfectly though. During regular season without dirk that mavs team was 2 wins 7 losses.
In the stretch dirk was injured and not healthy they went on losing streak

[embersyc]

Miami's main interest right now is just staying healthy for the playoffs.

New York has to play hard every game to get a top seeding.

Miami I'm sure wants to be well seeded, but they aren't sweating losing a game right now.

New York wants to test themselves and prove they can beat the champions.

Miami could care less about the Knicks.

Therefore I wouldn't judge anything based on some regular season games just yet. I'd say Miami is as close to a lock to be repeat champs as there has been in the NBA in a while.

[Real Men Wear Green]

PGs are their kryptonite and something's wrong with Wade.

[All Net]

Wade is the key he has to play like a star otherwise miami will be in trouble. OKC will beat them if they get through the east.

[swi7ch]

Remember when BOS beat them 3x in the regular season? Yeah, look what happened in the playoffs.

As in ANY sport, regular season means nothing other than playoff seeding.

[niko]

Both. I'd be concerned the whole Heat team looks over at Lebron to save them rather than step up their own game.

[Real Men Wear Green]

Remember when BOS beat them 3x in the regular season? Yeah, look what happened in the playoffs.

As in ANY sport, regular season means nothing other than playoff seeding.
I'm not sold on NY either but they should be credited for their start and Wade is 6 points below his career average. Until/unless Wade rises to his normal level I can see NY beating them.

[STATUTORY]

I'm not sold on NY either but they should be credited for their start and Wade is 6 points below his career average. Until/unless Wade rises to his normal level I can see NY beating them.

u think Boston is still in the mix?

[Blue&Orange]

Miami could care less about the Knicks.

You know what? You're right they COULD CARE less, because they cared a lot.

Norris, Chalmers, Shane weren't healthy and they played. Knicks best player wasn't healthy either but he did not play, obviously Knicks were the team caring less.


:lol

[Real Men Wear Green]

u think Boston is still in the mix?
I have a little hope for internal improvement but the way they've played doesn't justify an argument. The rebounding has to get a lot better.

[niko]

Remember when BOS beat them 3x in the regular season? Yeah, look what happened in the playoffs.

As in ANY sport, regular season means nothing other than playoff seeding.
Yes but the key to catching the Heat is to catch the Heat. Which means we need to keep moving forward. Yesterday, we moved forward a little more. If we keep moving forward and enter the playoffs with a legit shot to beat them, even if we are underdogs that's a real good thing. Last year false bravado aside, we had no chance in hell.

I like the direction this Knicks team is moving. It's moving in a direction that if things stay the same, we have a legit (albeit small) chance at a title. That's more than i would have thought.

[ihoopallday]

The Knicks are a good matchup. Only thing I'd be worried about is when Amare comes back. They seem to have great chemistry right now and he could mess that up. Another thing is fatigue. Will they still be playing like this come playoff time? At least they'll most likely have a nice playoff seed so they could make a deep run.

[Clutch]

Who knew Felton would be this good after last year?
I sort of did. Look at my posts when we signed Felton,I thought he was still a good player and that he'll be a nice point guard for us. I didn't expect him to rape the defending champions but I did expect him to average something like 14/7 (16/7 so far in the season). I claimed he's as good as Lin but is a better fit for this team. It turned out that not only he's a better fit but he's also a better player than Lin (Felton plays better than most of us expected while Lin is now just a mediocre point guard/below average starter.)

[Blue&Orange]

The Knicks are a good matchup. Only thing I'd be worried about is when Amare comes back. They seem to have great chemistry right now and he could mess that up. Another thing is fatigue. Will they still be playing like this come playoff time? At least they'll most likely have a nice playoff seed so they could make a deep run.
Melo 35mpg, Chandler 30mpg, felton 33mpg, Jr 32mpg.

They will be fine. With Amare and Shumpert, they will rest even more.

[STATUTORY]

knicks are the deepest team in the east, playmaker everywhere on that team.

heat is overrated with wade's decline

that team is still predicated on lebron and wade ball and one half of the equation can no longer be counted on.

[francesco totti]

Remember when BOS beat them 3x in the regular season? Yeah, look what happened in the playoffs.

As in ANY sport, regular season means nothing other than playoff seeding.

I would say same for bulls 2 years ago. they won the heat in regular season, but failed playoffs...

Also indiana is counter-example.... last year during regular season miami had it easy with them.But they suffered more in playoffs.

[r15mohd]

The Knicks are a good matchup. Only thing I'd be worried about is when Amare comes back. They seem to have great chemistry right now and he could mess that up. Another thing is fatigue. Will they still be playing like this come playoff time? At least they'll most likely have a nice playoff seed so they could make a deep run.

That's my question with the Knicks...they are shooting lights out almost every game, and at some point it's going to get cold where they just cant make it rain like they do now. Whether that happens early and they recover in time for the playoffs, or it happens late in the year and ruins their playoff hopes, is what remains to be seen.

[r15mohd]

I would say same for bulls 2 years ago. they won the heat in regular season, but failed playoffs...

Also indiana is counter-example.... last year during regular season miami had it easy with them.But they suffered more in playoffs.


Key injury to Bosh was the reason to them "struggling" against the Pacers in the playoffs...had Bosh been healthy, 5 game seies easily

[STATUTORY]

That's my question with the Knicks...they are shooting lights out almost every game, and at some point it's going to get cold where they just cant make it rain like they do now. Whether that happens early and they recover in time for the playoffs, or it happens late in the year and ruins their playoff hopes, is what remains to be seen.

I doubt felton will be able to play that level in the playoffs, in the 2 most emotionally charged game this season, against lin and brooklyn, he came up small and let the moment get to him.

[r15mohd]

I doubt felton will be able to play that level in the playoffs, in the 2 most emotionally charged game this season, against lin and brooklyn, he came up small and let the moment get to him.

well you never know...these performances could gain him the confidence to stay steady with his game.

one thing that I noticed all night was the pick and roll miss-match that had Bosh defending Felton in the end, and either making a not so contested jumper or a drive to the basket off the crossover. :facepalm

Don't know what Spo is really thinking with this line-up but they need to adjust the starters to:

Joel
Bosh
Lebron
Allen
Chalmers

Wade is sucking it up right now, and the defense down low and rotation is struggling badly...i think trying this starting 5 can improve things overall. Have Wade come off the bench with the second unit, Battier, Cole, Lewis, Haslem

[BlueandGold]

damn why aren't knick fans shouting from the rooftops? Not only has NY beat Miami twice this season they have a better record, 14-4 - 12-5.

edit: not only that but the point differential margin has been by at least double digits both times.. I expect to see a lot of knicks hats and jerseys in my city. (transient city)

[ThunderKat]

Like in most sports, it's rare to see back to back champs. Once teams finally climb that high mountain a lot of the hunger is gone. Clearly, Miami is talented enough to repeat, but it will be difficult. I think we have seen some of that hangover complacency in them early this season.

[ripthekik]

Wade is the key he has to play like a star otherwise miami will be in trouble. OKC will beat them if they get through the east.
So Lebron needs to get another top 3 SG.:(

[Real Men Wear Green]

So Lebron needs to get another top 3 SG.:(
He needs a great teammate. No star in the game today can win without a great teammate.

[Nash]

I don't know, but give credit to Knicks for making Heat shit.

[bluechox2]

He needs a great teammate. No star in the game today can win without a great teammate.
see melo:pimp:

[lilgodfather1]

The Knicks are a pretty bad match up, but i'm not sure it really matters very much how they fare in the regular season.

Both of these teams might meet in the playoffs, and at that point we will find out who is better. There are countless examples of a team struggling in the regular season against a team, and then beating them in the playoffs. Of course there are examples of teams that dominate in the regular season, and playoffs, so as I said we will find out in the playoffs who is better.

[Real Men Wear Green]

see melo:pimp:
I'm looking at him. Don't see a ring though.

[pegasus]

If both teams are healthy in the playoffs, and assuming Wade has declined not is injured, I can see the Knicks knocking them out. But, just like Korver, I can't trust Novak in the playoffs. He just got completely shut down last year against the Heat but has been great in these two regular season games. You just never know with great, one-dimensional shooters like him.

Having Felton and Kidd instead of B-Diddy and Lin makes a huge difference. Even Prigioni has been pretty solid as a play maker.

I say if the refs let the Knicks play, they have a 50/50 chance.

[fpliii]

Personally I think they're coasting, but the Knicks look like could become very dangerous in the playoffs. I wouldn't be surprised if they gave Miami, Boston, or Chicago (if Rose is healthy) a long, hard series.

[nightprowler10]

Simply great thread.

















Simply.

[ripthekik]

He needs 3 great teammates.
fixed.
I honestly don't think anyone in NBA history as good as he is, has need of great teammates as much as he does. Many superstars have won playoff series with themselves as the main star, or perhaps 1 more complimentary star and of course great role players. Many have even won championships - see Hakeem or Dirk. But this guy.. not 1, not 2, but at least 3 great star teammates..

[Jolokia]

18/44 41% three point shooting? Who the heck does that? If it wasn't for Sheed bricking 3s after 3s, they'd be shooting 47%. (49 attempts is the record and they should have gunned for it)

But to answer your question, yes I think the Knicks got what it takes. They're kind of like the Mavs of 2011 with Chandler anchoring the defense and Melo filling Dirk's scoring role. JR as the Jet, Felton as Barea, Brewer as Marion, Kidd as Kidd, Shumpert as Stevenson, and even Novak was on that team. We all know what happened to the Heat that year.

[Spell&Grammar]

You know what? You're right they COULD CARE less, because they cared a lot.

Norris, Chalmers, Shane weren't healthy and they played. Knicks best player wasn't healthy either but he did not play, obviously Knicks were the team caring less.


:lol


http://incompetech.com/Images/caring.png




Spell&Grammar

[Real Men Wear Green]

fixed.
I honestly don't think anyone in NBA history as good as he is, has need of great teammates as much as he does. Many superstars have won playoff series with themselves as the main star, or perhaps 1 more complimentary star and of course great role players. Many have even won championships - see Hakeem or Dirk. But this guy.. not 1, not 2, but at least 3 great star teammates..
The Heat had three other great players? Can you go troll someone else, please?

[ripthekik]

18/44 41% three point shooting? Who the heck does that?
Bad defense does that.

[kuniva_dAMiGhTy]

He needs a great teammate. No star in the game today can win without a great teammate.

He has two good-great teammates.

[Real Men Wear Green]

He has two good-great teammates.
He should but Wade needs to raise his level back to normal. I don't see Miami beating OKC if he's in the teens and they'll struggle in the EC playoffs.

[IGotACoolStory]

Who knew Felton would be this good after last year?

Anyone who knows anything about Felton knows he likes to play when the spotlight is on him.

In his AAU days, he would single handedly beat teams with 3-4 D1 players knowing it was him versus the world. And he would do it on a consistent basis. He had one stint during the summer that was absolutely incredible what he accomplished. He would put up 50 + the game winner like nothing. Probably the hottest streak I have ever seen from a high school player.

He played on a so-so basketball team in high school and carried them them to state championships. On a nightly basis he would have to put up 35/8/8. Coach asks him to score all the points, dish all the assists, grab all the rebounds and he did.

Then he goes under arguably the brightest spotlight in college basketball, the PG position at UNC. 8-20. Players threatening to transfer. Fan base splitting over the coach. Parents getting in the coaches face. It was a complete mess. But he never threatened to transfer. He always backed up his game. Then he took a 8-20 team in three short years to a national championship.

It's not surprise that he plays well in New York. He wants the pressure on him. He needs it.

[Blue&Orange]

http://incompetech.com/Images/caring.png




Spell&Grammar


Miami could care less about the Knicks.



You know what? You're right they COULD CARE less, because they cared a lot.

Look closely Spell&grammar, not only i made fun of the grammatical failure, i used it to my advantage.


:lol

[Teanett]

knicks are well equipped to beat the heat.
but still, regular season means jack.

[Trentknicks]

For those questioning whether Knicks can keep up this hot shooting, wasn't such a magnificent shooting performance yesterday.

Brewer 0-3 FG
Kidd 4-12 FG
Wallace 4-13 FG (0-6 3PT)
JR Smith 4-15 FG

And they only shot 12-19 FT's

[Clutch]

For those questioning whether Knicks can keep up this hot shooting, wasn't such a magnificent shooting performance yesterday.

Brewer 0-3 FG
Kidd 4-12 FG
Wallace 4-13 FG (0-6 3PT)
JR Smith 4-15 FG

And they only shot 12-19 FT's
Knicks shot 41% for three last night which is right around their average.It's the volume that makes it look they were so lights out.

A lot of their threes came of good ball movement. To be fair the Knicks hit their threes when they needed it the most. Whenever Miami was on a verge of going on a run they responded (Novak with 5 points in 30 seconds late in the 2rd quarter,9-0 run to start the 3rd quarter by Kidd and Felton.then some threes by Novak and J.R. later in the game...).

Their defense in the 4th quarter was very good,they held Miami to just 12 points.

[DatAsh]

see melo:pimp:

His teammates just beat the defending champs by 20 on the road without him. I'd say he has multiple great teammates.

[Teanett]

Their defense in the 4th quarter was very good,they held Miami to just 12 points.

as it was at the end of the bobcats game, forced 6 straight turnovers!

[Trentknicks]

Knicks shot 41% for three last night which is right around their average.It's the volume that makes it look they were so lights out.

A lot of their threes came of good ball movement. To be fair the Knicks hit their threes when they needed it the most. Whenever Miami was on a verge of going on a run they responded (Novak with 5 points in 30 seconds late in the 2rd quarter,9-0 run to start the 3rd quarter by Kidd and Felton.then some threes by Novak and J.R. later in the game...).

Their defense in the 4th quarter was very good,they held Miami to just 12 points.
I know our dual pg lineup plays a large part in this and ensures a great offense. But Brewer and Novak have been excellent at moving without the ball and getting open.

[knicksman]

this goes to show that theres no cohesion on the team coz they cant beat lesser teams while coasting. Im sure most champions becomes lax after winning a championship but they are still good because of their offense is enough to win games. Most teams relax on defense because more defense=more injuries. While the heat just won on individual talent and defense. And once these guys start to break down they we may not see a dynasty on this team.

[nashwade]

First of all those 2 games were won with crazy 3pt shooting % lets see if that can be replicated consistently in the playoffs

Secondly Heat suck big time this season on 3pt defense. Seems to be spo experimenting with taking Joel out of the lineup. If you think about all the games they won this season with Bosh playing the 5 it sounds scary

[Clutch]

First of all those 2 games were won with crazy 3pt shooting % lets see if that can be replicated consistently in the playoffs

Secondly Heat suck big time this season on 3pt defense. Seems to be spo experimenting with taking Joel out of the lineup. If you think about all the games they won this season with Bosh playing the 5 it sounds scary
Knicks 3-pt % this season: .407
Knicks 3-pt % against the Heat on Thursday: .409

They didn't shot as well as it seemed,they were just shooting a lot and hitting when it mattered the most.

I think they should take less threes but most of them were good looks so I'm fine with that. As long as their threes come from ball movement instead of just jacking up contested threes I'm fine with that.
They hit some contested ones too but that goes on Miami's defense,when you let shooters catch fire then you're in for a bad time.

[Celtic_Pride]

LOL at people comparing this Knicks team with '11 Mavs. If I remember correctly, Melo averaged around 25% with Lebron guarding him last playoffs. Dirk during 2011 finals was unstoppable because Heat had no1 to guard him 1 on 1. Lebron can shut down Melo if needed. So Knicks fans can stop being delusional about beating Heat in the playoffs!

The only way to beat the Heat is your best player has to be a big and should be able to average more than 25 ppg like Dirk/Dwight/Bynum/Zbo and Marc etc.

So realistically only Lakers and Grizzlies can beat the Heat in a series right now.

[Blue&Orange]

Knicks 3-pt % this season: .407
Knicks 3-pt % against the Heat on Thursday: .409

Actually they were at .411 before the game, Heat game lowered their average.

[Grey Dawn]

LeBron's the only good player on the Heat.

Bosh is ok. Wade should retire. Allen is a good shooter but can't do anything else at this point. Everyone else is garbage.